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Why do you think leaders hide from funding their vision?

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I think that there's a few different ways that we could answer that.

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First is the time and effort that they put towards it.

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So initially that's how you have to get anything off the ground.

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Even if that's you're going out and trying to raise money from day one, you've got to

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put time and effort into doing that and put risk behind it.

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And that can be very confronting.

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From the very start you're dealing with rejection and people turning down your vision.

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But I think that's stage one.

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Then stage two is there's a lot of people who start without funding in a traditional

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sense at the beginning.

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And they go out and they start building.

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And I think that one thing that we see happen incredibly often is people get safe.

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They get to a certain level of comfort and then their vision sort of takes a back seat

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to that comfort.

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And oftentimes as we work with many, many founders, we have founders that come to us

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and they talk about how focused they are.

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And we have to actually point out that that's not focus, that's fear.

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You're so focused on doing things a certain way that you're not actually taking the risks

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to attempt to see out what your vision truly could be.

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If you're building a business and you're growing 10%, 20%, even 30% year over year, it may

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sound great, but look at where your vision is and if you're actually in line with where

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your vision really could go.

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Now I think then when it comes to actually putting financial resources behind it, this

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is a little bit of a double-edged sword because on one hand you've got people who are afraid

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to go out and raise money, especially if they've built up sort of a bit of, again, comfort

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around what it is that they were building, right?

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Where they've reached a certain level of success because then if you go out and try to fund

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it or even when people go try to sell their business, they realize that people don't see

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the same value in what they're doing as they may see internally or what they're getting

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from their staff or from their clients directly.

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The other thing that happens is people go out and they fund, but what they end up doing

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is they start what they think is building towards a vision, but it often allows them

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to bypass many of the core steps that they need to build a solid foundation in the business.

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This is one of the reasons why you see such high failure rates with people who do take

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money because they take money and then it allows them to sort of, an easy example is

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somebody who's been very successful selling in founder led sales, then they raise money

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to build out a sales and marketing team and they see at best, hepid success in that because

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they haven't laid the foundation for somebody to actually come in and sell on their behalf.

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So I think funding, when we talk about it, it's sort of a double edged sword.

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On one hand, you have to put in the effort.

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On the other hand, there's more of an art than a science to understanding when to actually

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bring in money to apply towards that vision.

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Nice.

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That's awesome.

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Have you had any experiences, I'm sure you've had, where you're like, my gosh, maybe I funded

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this, maybe I should have funded this more or maybe this was the wrong way to go.

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I would love to hear more about that.

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Yeah.

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I've taken money from investors over the years.

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In fact, I remember vividly getting cocktails after the very first hundred thousand dollar

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check I ever got from an investor.

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That seemed like one of the biggest sort of triumphs at that point that somebody bought

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into my vision at that point.

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This was in a company that when I started it, my parents, my family, everybody thought

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I was insane.

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I mean, to the point that they almost disowned me over it.

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So having that level of support from someone who we went on to do millions of dollars of

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business together and we're able to, in fact, there was one time where I called this guy

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up and basically said, we need a little over a million dollars for a deal.

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And he wired me the money without any contract or anything in place because we'd built up

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that level of trust.

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However, what I tend to find is like funding and putting money behind something comes down

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to decisions.

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And ultimately you have to just look at the quality of your decisions.

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And I actually have gotten to a point where I enjoy figuring out how to build something

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without taking outside funding because it causes a very different type of decision making.

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It causes you to have to make harder decisions and the earlier that you start making those

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hard decisions within a business, I guarantee you the faster that you're going to mature

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as an entrepreneur and ultimately the farther you're going to get in business.

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If you go out and try to fund your way through problems, it allows you to really just sort

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of smooth over some of the challenges in your business rather than solve them fundamentally.

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Wow, that's awesome.

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That's very, very insightful information.

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Thank you, Pashena.

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But that being said, funding, you can't get away.

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There's certain businesses and certain niches that you need to have funding.

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So that comes with a disclaimer, guys.

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Well there is and there isn't, right?

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Just in the same way where if you look at where you are today and you say, okay, how

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do I 2X, you're going to think about that decision in a certain way.

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If you instead ask yourself, how do I 20X or 50X, you're going to think about that decision

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in a completely different way.

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So if you start looking at whatever business you're trying to build and take funding off

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of the table, you're going to start thinking much more creatively about how to build that

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business and it's going to open up opportunities to create a business structure that maybe

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nobody has created before.

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But if you go straight to funding, you're going to sort of fall in line and start building

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things in a way that probably other people have built before.

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Brian, that's a very intriguing point.

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I would love to hear the story behind that point.

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I mean I've done this with many, many businesses now.

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When we work with clients, we tell them from the outset that funding is sort of a last

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option outside funding.

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And so that means that, for instance, if you're building software, which is one of the areas

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that a lot of people go out and look for funding, how do you perhaps create a partnership with

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someone to get to MVP and get that MVP cash flowing to where you can continue to fund

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the growth of that software and understand that yes, there may come a point, but typically

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if you can get that business up to a point where you're already doing eight figures,

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then when you go out for funding, it's a completely different scenario and you have a lot of other

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options on your plate.

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When you're cash flowing, you're no longer looking at equity financing and you're not

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looking at destroying your cap table early on.

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Instead, what you're looking at is oftentimes debt financing and other ways to even just

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cash out and take some money off of the table.

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It's a very, very different process.

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And honestly, the difference in a considerable change in your net worth as a result could

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be as little as 12 to 24 months of work.

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And so you have to decide, is it worth working with a client right now that the best offer

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that they got, it was a sizeable amount, but they wanted 53% of their company.

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So the question was, is it best to do that or is it best to continue, build up the cash

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flow and get to a point where you could get likely within about 12 months, a similar amount

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of money or about 10%.

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And at that point, it puts him in a much, much different scenario where actually at

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that point he wouldn't need the money any longer.

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And this is a software driven company.

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And so I think quite often this is a much longer conversation about how the VC world

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works.

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As soon as you start raising money, you cease to be building a business and now you're building

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an investment vehicle.

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And then you get on that train of having to raise money again and again and again.

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But if you can get to a point where you're looking at options like debt financing, PE

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financing, and so forth, you actually have a lot more options on the table and it can

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put you in a much more advantageous space.

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The challenge is the decisions that you have to make to get there.

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And most people just don't really have the fortitude to do that.

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And they love that, hey, I got funded by so and so.

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That sounds great.

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But the moment that you do that, you're no longer building for your success.

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You're building in the vision of someone else.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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That's a very, very different way of putting it.

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In a bad, it probably opens up entrepreneurs to some of the blind spots that they're not

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seeing that you can see through your eyes, but they are not able to see it.

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So yeah, thank you for sharing that.

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That goes to my next question right next to what you just mentioned.

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You talked about success.

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What is success to you, Brian, if you could define that in a few sentences?

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Success is ultimately freedom, right?

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Freedom to do the things you want to do when you want to do them.

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And that ends up looking very differently to different people.

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So to some people, that may be living under a bridge and having absolutely no responsibilities

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at all.

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Other people, that success is the freedom to make a massive impact in the world.

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And with that does come responsibilities, but those are responsibilities that you freely

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choose.

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So I think that fundamentally, success is freedom.

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And that's why for me, that also aligns with the value of authenticity.

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Because when you think about how you can show up and be completely free, if you can be 100%

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authentic in every interaction that you have, that is ultimately the core expression of

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freedom in our society as we know it today.

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So I think the freedom of choice and the freedom of expression are ultimately what we're looking

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for when all of us say what does success look like to you?

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I think that where that starts to get misaligned is when you start using other people's versions

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of success, where you start basing your success off of how expensive your watch is or your

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car or where your house is located.

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And that's why I think it's so important to develop and take time to understand your own

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vision and how you see the world.

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In fact, I've got it tattooed right there, see clearly, be clear.

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As long as you show up in the world that way, that's going to give you the clarity of vision

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to understand how you see things, show up, build towards that thing that you see.

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And the moment that you start building on someone else's vision, you cease to make nearly

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as big of an impact on the world as you possibly could because the most unique thing in the

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world is you, your story, your experience.

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And when you stop expressing that and adapting to someone else's, you cease to be able to

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reach the levels of success you otherwise could.

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Brian, what was the moment or what was the...could be a story, could be a moment when you realized

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that this was success to you?

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It's one of those things where there's a lot of events that you go through that then lead

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up and then you look back and you expect there to be one particular inflection point.

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But I lived...I went to grad school, I got a master's degree, I went into investment

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banking, I got out of that.

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I got into building businesses, initially in commercial real estate and money is huge

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in that industry, right?

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Like you can't do anything unless you've got money.

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And so I was for quite some time very fixated on the idea of making money.

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And I lived in Manhattan Beach, I drove the fancy cars, wore the Panerai and the Persoles

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and all of that.

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I even used to own loafers.

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And I think for me, I've lost everything a couple of times and I think the last time

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that I went through that I realized that at the end of the day, money is just energy.

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It comes and goes and your capacity for money is also your capacity for making positive

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change in the world because if you consider money to just be energy, if you can go out,

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have somebody pay you and they then see a positive ROI on that, you actually are creating

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positive energy, positive change in the world.

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And as soon as I flipped that and realized that really what it comes down to is my ability

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to make change in the world, that was I think the biggest shift in terms of how I see it.

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How I saw success.

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And I'll add two more quick stories.

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When I was younger, I was really into the outdoors.

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I still am.

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I was a wilderness EMT.

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I did search and rescue, back country guiding, all of that.

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I prided myself on being able to be dropped anywhere in the world and I'd be able to survive.

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And then through a series of events, I basically arrived in Baja California Sur in Mexico with

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less than $7,000 of which most of that was actually spent on the trip down there as well

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as rent and deposit for our house when we first arrived in Baja California Sur.

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And our first few weeks living in Mexico, me and my family were eating bean and cheese

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tacos.

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We weren't going out and eating fish tacos and having fun and doing all of that because

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literally just dead broke in a foreign country.

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And the business I have today, I started from that position and learning that it doesn't

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come down to money.

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Money is going to come and go, but it's the ability to go out there and do it yourself

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and not have any support.

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We had zero support in doing that.

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And once I recognized that it really is just about the challenge, it's about the journey

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and enjoying that.

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I enjoy the struggle.

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I enjoy the discomfort.

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I enjoy that painful side of building a business.

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And as soon as I started to really embrace that, that's where my view of success completely

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changed.

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It's like hanging out with fishermen, right?

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It's all about the stories.

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If you don't get good stories out of it, both positive and negative, then it's just not

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worth doing.

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It doesn't matter how much money they give you.

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And that switch, that really, I think was that sort of turning point for me for now.

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Money is great.

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I'm fortunate to have enough to take care of my family, live very well, but I'm 100%

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okay losing it all because I know I'm going to come back and I'm going to have a hell

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of a story doing it too.

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Yeah.

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Thank you for sharing that.

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That was very authentic of you.

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I love to hear it.

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I have one more question for you, Brian.

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That question is, is incomplete without who people are thinking of a great leader?

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To you, what defines a great leader?

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To me, a great leader is somebody who shows up so deeply in their own truth that people

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can't help but be changed by just their mere presence.

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We've all met people that the tone of a room changes when somebody walks in, where people

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are inspired just by seeing how someone acts.

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We oftentimes think about leadership as a role.

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We think about it as a... We think of speeches.

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We think of all of the great things that people do.

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If we think of... One of my favorite stories is Alexander the Great and the Gordian Knot.

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If you think about that story, the Oracle had said, whoever released this ox cart would

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go on to take over Asia.

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There was many, many people, great soldiers, great leaders, philosophers.

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They all came and they were pulling and trying to untie this knot.

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Alexander walks up and what does he do?

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He pulls out his sword and he slices through it.

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While people were still arguing over whether or not he released that ox cart in the right

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way by breaking the expected status quo, he went on to conquer Asia and become Alexander

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the Great.

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I think that when you understand what leadership is, it is the capacity to disrupt status quo.

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If you're unable or unwilling to do that, you cannot lead.

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That needs to be at every level of what you do.

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That doesn't mean necessarily that you have to go out and on one end, there's just being

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a punk just for the sake of being a punk.

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There's different forms of disrupting status quo.

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Somebody who stands up and yells fire in a movie theater is disrupting the status quo.

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If there's actually a fire, that can be seen as great leadership.

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If they're just doing it for the sake of disruption, then they're seen as a nuisance.

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Understanding that fine line, that's why it goes back to that.

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I think the last time we spoke, we talked about the saying, never give a sword to a

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man who can't dance.

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There's different dances, but if you follow the rules specifically and exactly, it doesn't

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look like dancing.

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You learn the rules and then you learn how to break them and which ones to break.

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That's where great leadership comes from, is learning when and where to disrupt the

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status quo.

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One of the most fundamental ways that you can do that is in how you show up.

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When you show up authentically, you invite other people to do the same.

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Thank you for being here today.

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I'm really happy that you tuned in to Vision Pros Live.

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I'm looking forward to seeing your reactions as these episodes continue to move forward.

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This is going to get more and more fun.

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We'll have more and more engagement as well.

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We'll invite people to participate in the show.

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Thank you for giving us your time and attention.

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Have an excellent time building out your vision and becoming a Vision Pro yourself.