Tell me about your business for Shift Focus. My apology.
My pleasure. I'm happy to talk about it. My vision for the business is really to help
everyone enjoy their work, have fulfilling work so they can have and build rewarding careers,
rewarding relationships, and enjoy a fulfilling life. And I do that by empowering managers.
Okay.
Managers have the biggest impact on how people feel about work.
Absolutely. And so I want to empower managers to lead themselves,
lead their teams, and lead their organizations.
Oh, that's amazing. And I tell you, that is one big thing. I was in the, of course,
the corporate world. I'm now an entrepreneur myself. However, I realized when the managers
were being affected, I was affected. And so if they couldn't manage their emotions, the business,
their lifestyle, then it actually came to the employees. And it was a very hard day most of
the time. So when you do meet with managers, are they coming to you as new managers or they've
been managers before? It's a couple of things. Sometimes they're coming in as new managers and
they're looking for, you know, they're kind of feeling overwhelmed. Like I've got these
new responsibilities. How do I do that? And we've worked with people like that. Other times,
they come when they're feeling stuck or stagnant, you know, managers typically like feel like they're
really good. And then all of a sudden they realize like, my career is not developing. I don't know
how to progress. I'm not feeling like I'm having the success I did before I became a manager.
Maybe this isn't the role for me. And so I want to help them overcome that because I really do
think managers are the ones that can really help, you know, drive culture change and really improve
the organization. So it's really kind of those two points that are typical and inflection points
for people. Absolutely. So feeling stuck, like in that plateau, not feeling like they're progressing
and being a new manager, getting into that role and trying to fulfill that role. What is your,
which one do you find easiest to work with? That's a random question, of course.
You know, in some ways the new manager is easier to work with because, you know, they're coming in
excited and hungry. But often the stuck manager is the one where, like I've been that person.
Right. So that's the one like I have the most empathy for and want to help. And I feel like
it has the greatest rewards. Where did this vision come from? Well, as I mentioned, I've
been that person. So partly it was born out of that. I, you know, realizing like, what did I need
at that point in my career and who would have been the perfect person to help me and what could they
have done? I spent 25 years in IT consulting and did a lot of projects where I would go on site and
work to implement technical solutions. And so I also saw the difference good managers made.
Like when we'd go in and do a project and I'd work with a manager and they were a good manager,
it made everything so much better, not just for our project, but for the employees, for the
organization. So that's really, it was kind of twofold. One, what did I need? And two, where do I
really see the impact being made in organizations at the manager level? Makes all the sense in the
world. And when you mention a good manager, what are the characteristics of a good manager?
Well, I like to quote Russ Leroway, who wrote the book, When You Win, They Win, or When They Win,
You Win. And he boils it down to two things, which I love the simplicity. One, it's ensuring
the success of your team members. And two, delivering an aligned result. So helping the
organization succeed. And then even though it's kind of embedded in there, I add a third one,
which is manager fulfillment, feeling good about your job and what you're doing. Those are really
what I'd say the three criteria for success are as a manager. Makes all the sense in the world. And
I applaud you for those three, because it definitely helps out the, sets the tone for the team, if I may
say. As you manage or as you coach these managers, what's the pushback that you get? Do you, or do
you get any pushback?
Ideally, no. Like, when we do coaching, you know, one of the things we want to kind of talk about at
the beginning is coachability and where, kind of what are they trying to achieve and making sure,
you know, my role as a coach is to support them in their goals. And so I'm not, I'm not coming in as
a, whatever, a directive influence as much as a supportive influence. So hopefully we're not
getting a lot of pushback. I think the challenge managers have is when they are, are challenged to
kind of go outside of their comfort zone, they realize, you know, that, that takes a lot of
courage and also some, some humility to, to really like start kind of seeing yourself as subservient
to your employees, which manage, you know, great managers, I believe that's kind of how they view
themselves. So, you know, I think it's just more of like that uncomfortable self discovery that we
all go through if we're really going to change and grow in ourselves. Absolutely. And you, you, you
said background of IT. Yep. So you pretty much had the knowledge to be able to figure out the systems
to make this work. I also see that you have a seven, is it seven steps? Yeah, yeah. Seven pillars or
modules. Yep. Okay. Okay. So I think that in my mind, you have in that background, it made it
easier to have some, some steps and pillars. And when it boils down to it, the ultimate goal is for
you to have a quote unquote, or, or for that manager to feel like they're doing better in their
position. Do you have like a community or a group where they can all come back to and have these
discussions or, you know, need more after your coaching? That would be great. I think that's maybe
in the future. I do not have that. Okay. I have that yet. Yeah, I was thinking after, you know,
once you get all these people together, because Brian, I'm sure you, you have some successful
leaders due to the pillars that you've created, it would be great to have that feedback and that,
you know, coming to each other to see what tools and techniques did they find the most useful in
your strategies. Just a thought. Yeah. Yeah. That was a great one. Yes. Yes. And, and so how many,
how many managers have you helped? We've had, I've been, I've been technically doing this for a couple
of years. And, you know, I don't know what the count is, but say about 20, you know, kind of had
some groups that have gone through as an organization and then a bunch of individual ones. Okay. I see
that. And so when you decided to do this and shift focus, I mean that, when you decided to do and go
into business for yourself and make this change, how did you get started? My entrepreneurial journey
was probably not how I'd advise somebody else to do it. You know, I spent 25 years at the same IT
firm and it was a consulting firm. We grew up, grew it from 25 to over 200. And that's where I got a
lot of my experience. The organization was going through some change and I'm, you know, entering
kind of what people refer to as a second half career and kind of was looking ahead as to what
do I want to do the rest of my life? And so I just decided to make a change as opposed to what some
people do and maybe what I'd advise is be a little bit more methodical and, and cultivate the kind of
the landing pad, so to speak. I didn't do that. I decided it was time to make a change. And so I did.
I cut over and switched and started trying to figure out what I was going to do and really
it just came, you know, kind of bore from some introspection and kind of understanding who did I
want to serve? Who did I want to help? Where did I really feel called to make a difference? And where
did I think I could make a difference? And, you know, it took a little while to kind of figure that
out, like I think all the businesses go through. And so I just started, just started kind of doing
it. Okay. And what is, what's your, what's your goal for the remaining of the year? Did you set one?
Yeah, one, the thing I'm really leaning into is, you know, I've done a lot of individual coaching
and some group facilitation. I really want to start building more group coaching programs
within an organization. So part of the, the methodology that you mentioned, the seven
pillars there is really a methodology that when an organization implements it can help to build
their leadership pipeline. And the start of that is starting with a group of managers and taking
them through a group coaching program. So that's my goal for this, this year, for the remainder of
the year is get a couple of groups launched on that. That would be awesome. And so you would
guide the managers and then the managers would actually take that back to their company and be
able to implement that within their company. Yep. They, without going too deep into the methodology,
it starts with, you know, an onboarding process. So we, we kind of co-create an agenda, but generally
following the methodology, which is really like starting with yourself, making sure you've got the
right motivation and you're moving forward, making sure you understand how to support your career as
a manager, and then implementing, uh, like a continuous improvement process for your department.
So you're able to improve things in your department. You're starting to see, you know,
how can you support your team? How can you make things better? And then if you've got a manager
that's got a good career and feeling good about where they're going, they're making changes and
improving things in their department, they're going to be growing. And, uh, and suddenly talk,
what we call gearing for growth. And, uh, and that's really like, now you're really leading your team
and talking about recruiting and retention and, and helping build people's careers. Um, and so
that would all be part of the group coaching program. And, you know, the group dynamic is really
important because then you get the opportunity for peer support, peer learning. They're sharing some
of these ideas, uh, outside of just the coaching that I'm giving. Absolutely. And then that, as you
said, that peer support and that group sharing, you're learning from each other, you know, that
takes a little bit of work off of you just to be in the chair. Yes. Yeah. And it's more like, they
know their context, right? They know the environment and the subtleties. So, uh, that's why,
that's why coaching is so much more powerful than just training, because coaching is so much more
important because coaching is, you know, helping apply an idea to their specific environment in a
way that feels powerful and right to them. Absolutely. Absolutely. And also taking their
personality, um, and being able to adjust it, uh, according to who they are and how they speak and
things like that. You know, I think about this because as, of course, I think about my managers
and I actually am not a manager and I don't think I ever really wanted to be one because I knew the
headache that they were receiving. However, it was, it was just really important that they had all
the knowledge that I needed them to have. When truth be told, I think that we over, overthink
the thoughts that, that managers have the answers to everything. And so do you have managers feeling
they need to have the answer for, for their employees and their staff and how do you work
with that if you, if you do get that situation? Yep. I think that is a huge, uh, barrier in manager
effectiveness because they get the title and now all of a sudden everybody's, uh, looking at them as
like, just like you said, like, oh, they must have the answer. And of course they feel like, well,
maybe I should, maybe, you know, what if I don't have the answer? Am I going to lose my job or am
I going to get in trouble? So they're afraid to, to kind of speak up. And so one of the things we do
is when we talk about a manager, um, a manager progression in their role, we start, actually
start out with a practice stage, which is really acknowledging, no, there's, there, a manager has
to learn on the job. And when they go through that practice stage, I think it builds a little bit more,
uh, of that muscle of not always having to feel like you're right, being able to solicit input
from your team and from other peers and your boss in a way that's, uh, empowering as opposed to, um,
you know, fearful and, uh, and, and making those things explicit. So hopefully that answered your
question, but I think your point is a hundred percent right. And that's one of the things that
coaching can really help them kind of overcome. Definitely. Because I tell you, and the word I
could not think of is this misconception that they are to know everything, you know? And, and I tell
you, when I went to my manager, if they didn't know in my mind, I'm like, well, what are you here for?
You know? And that's so unfair. It's totally unfair. So I'm glad it's someone like you who's
able to be like, yeah, don't, don't conform to them thinking, you know, everything because
you're not supposed to. So when it also boils down to what I've realized in the, in the positions of
managers is that some may delegate too much and some may not delegate enough. How do you have that
discussion when you're speaking with one? Yeah, that's a great question. The, when you talk about
delegation, people often focus on the what and the how, right? Like what, what do I need to delegate?
What do I want to get off my plate? And, and then how do I do that? Do I give them, you know, the
tasks? Do I, do I give them the responsibility? Do I, what level of follow-up do I need? And what I
coach them to start with is the who. So think about your team, who's ready for more, who might need,
you know, who isn't ready for more, but might be, and what do they need to get ready for more?
And then what do they, what do they want to go? Like if I, if you were my employee and you didn't
want to go into management, then I'd be talking to you about, well, what, what is your career,
you know, what is a meaningful career for you? What do you want to do? That's going to inform
then what do I delegate to Javonka? Right. And so you have to know your employees, where they're at
and so that delegation discussion starts internally with who are, who are my employees? Do I know them?
And from there, then the kind of the what and the how becomes a lot more seamless, a little more
easy to manage. Thank you for being here today. I'm really happy that you tuned into Vision Pros
Live. I'm looking forward to seeing your reactions as these episodes continue to move forward. This
is going to get more and more fun. We'll have more and more engagement as well. We'll invite
people to participate in the show and thank you for giving us your time and attention.
Have an excellent time building out your vision and becoming a Vision Pro yourself.