just in case. I do. Yes. That is servant leadership right there at its best. I love that. Let's
see here. So, all right. So again, we got jflowersmarketing.com, which is so cool because
I had JCal Digital before transforming to what I'm doing first class business. But I
love that. I love your approach to AI and how you're going to be talking about the humanity
aspect of that. We're going to co-collab. Co-collab? I'm excited. We're just going to
co-collab on that. I think you're doing one co-necessary. But as we get ready to dive
into AI, marketing, what's going on in the world, there's just so many dangers with it
right now. I can't help but point that out. It's like giving toddlers an automatic rifle,
a tank, and a nuclear bomb at the same time. People don't realize how dangerous AI can
really be. But we all believe the quote. I don't know. If you don't believe this and
you're listening in, argue with me. But there's a quote that the pen is mightier than the
sword. And if the pen is mightier than the sword, then what the heck does that make AI?
So I'd love to just talk to you about, hear your thoughts on that.
Yes, I actually agree with you because with the pen, you're really laying out the foundation
for what's going to happen next. And so for me, when it comes to AI, there are, yes, benefits
of it, but there are also so many downfalls of it that I think nowadays, especially in
the land of marketing, people have kind of leaned into it a little bit more and kind
of reliant on it versus still bringing their humanity forward in their marketing. Because
ultimately, no matter what industry you're in, your potential buyer, customer audience
is looking to connect with you as the human versus how effective and pretty things can
come that AI has been able to generate for you. And there's been a lot of talk with clients
that I've been working with recently that, well, I heard there was this AI program that
I could create all these videos. I don't really have to be in it, but it'll form my voice.
And I was like, but does that feel true to you? Does that feel like the representation
you want to have with those potential clients who are going to be working with you one on
one? Because I work with a lot of entrepreneurs, small business owners, coaches that are the
forefront. They're the ones that are having that connection one on one with the clients
that they're working with. So if you're taking out that element of you, which is one part
of that, where are we going to go? What kind of substance are we going to create for them?
Absolutely. And, you know, we all, we all are super intelligent human beings. We are
all idiots in some form or fashion. We all make stupid decisions. So what I say next,
I guarantee somebody is going to cut this someday and say, wow, Jackson's real narcissistic
or rude. But the mass market is a market of idiots, right? That is the reality. And this
AI fad that has come and all the buzz associated with it is taking advantage of that reality.
Those who typically listen to the show, they're more intellectual in nature. They like to
dive into more detail. So we're going to dive into the nuances of how to use this superpower
well. But we also need to, we can't just throw caution to the wind and forget that, you know,
if you automate something that, that can influence everybody at once, if you make a grave mistake
with that, it has a powerful ripple effect on your reputation in the market. And that
can't be ignored if you want to be a leader who stands the test of time. And in addition
to that, I hate to burst your bubble, all you AR marketing bros out there, but AI has
existed for a very, very long time. It is not new. Email is AI. The ability to send
emails through the cloud to people, we take that for granted. Pandora has been using AI
for well more than a decade. Google is an AI in and of itself. So I understand that
I like it cuts, you know, it cuts those people who are so focused on it that then there's
this celebration that should exist around it too, because there are good things, but
we have to be responsible as marketers, as leaders and saying, you know, the it's not
bad to have these tools in our hands until we start using them irresponsibly. And so
we'll, again, we're going to tie more back into that. Before that, though, I think of
a greater value and importance right now as a human being who's in front of us and Jocelyn
Powers. Jocelyn, you've we've worked a lifetime to build everything that you've built to where
you are today. I hope nobody takes that for granted. And we look at that and say, OK,
well, what are the three resources? What are the three resources you recommend for visionary
leaders out there?
Absolutely. So the most important one that I would say is finding mentorship, because
though I have thankfully been able to have my business and be successful in it for over
eight years now, full time is I wouldn't be able to do that without having multiple mentors
along the really kind of set forth the path of their experiences that allowed to make
the journey a little bit easier, because we all know as leaders and entrepreneurs that
it's not for the faint of heart to be a business owner. And so you really have to know kind
of what your intention behind the work that you're doing, who you want to serve, what's
the impact you really want to have and know that moving forward and again know that's
going to change at each stage that you get through life, through your business, whether
it's just you as the individual or you are able to bring on a team that supports you
to continue scaling is having mentorship. And I've had mentorship in, you know, the
typical business of how do we create the foundation, things like that. I've had mentorship in money
because when I first started, my money story was I don't know if I can ask for that because
do I have the true value to give to that, that number that they're looking at? And so
being able to have mentorship on how to frame that and how to pivot and saying, no, I can
ask for that number because I know that they're not only getting deliverables from me, but
they're getting an experience and they're going to see an impact in their audience from
the things that we do in our partnership together. So that would be number one for me. And it's
tried and true. I've gone through different levels of mentorship as a group. And so that
I will always say if you can have a mentor, whether it's a paid mentor or not, because
I'm going to add an S on that. I have to, I can't let it go any longer. I'm like, give
my hair so right. So my and look as bad of an of a rap as we give as as normal human
beings, the athletes of the world, the musicians of the world, the celebrities of the world,
these are people that we can name and universally recognize because of the power that they've
been able to create in their life and how many mentors are they all surrounded by? They
are uplifted by hundreds of mentors along their way. So getting into finding mentorship
and using that as a means of like, wow, how can I find greater and greater mentors? People
who align with more and more of what I'm doing. If we are, if we ever turn that off and say,
Hey, good. I'm done. I got my mentor. Like we're setting ourselves up for an extreme
lack versus the abundance of having multiple influences. And again, finding the focus on
who is the right type of person, right? But how can I find as many of those right type
of people as possible? That humility has got to be exercised as a leader and entrepreneur
to win. So I love that you hit that as point number one.
Yes, absolutely. And my next one is, I don't know if it's necessarily a resource, but it's
something that I truly believe in has gotten me to where I am now is the avid excitement
for learning something new because there are so many ways out there to do pretty much everything.
Marketing is not new. I know you and I were talking about this before we got started that
there's so many different approaches to marketing. There's so many different levels and areas
of marketing that can be a bit overwhelming. But for myself, I take a look at it and say,
okay, I want to learn this, but is it more for the opportunity that I may need that later
for someone else coming in to say, Oh, I have experience with this. I may not be the expert
in it, but I do have experience with it versus am I just doing it to kind of get those new
certifications and so on. That may be, you may have a balance of the two, but I love
learning new ways. I'm also a productivity specialist. So any way that I can make things
work efficiently and not as much time and getting things out there and being more effective
with it, I'm all in. And so for me, there's a lot of different software. There's a lot
of different approaches to things that I have found value in. Do I use them all the time?
No, but they all have their own purpose and intention when I do need them.
I love that. Again, I got to just up level what you said, because what you said is so
powerful, but you said it so humbly that people may miss it. And that is your resource, you
said was actually excitement for learning something new. And I want to focus on it.
Because I don't know. Yeah, our emotions, those are absolutely resources. The emotions,
I mean, that drives a marriage. The emotions are that drives two people to commit to each
other for their entire life. That's crazy. You know, like that, that takes, it's an incredible
superpower. So if we, if we leave that out of the equation and Glenn Moore shower, he's
a, he's a celebrity as well. He was in transformers and like a hundred something things, Star
Trek, et cetera. Best speech I've ever seen in my life. It was so beautiful. And he centered
it all around the, the value, the emotion of celebrating celebration. And that goes
hand in hand to me with excitement. It's like that genuine side of excitement. And if we
leverage that it's amazing how, especially for learning, like you said, right, that the
ability to progress, the ability to improve, like that's just such a critical thing that
I think so many people overlook or they deem as boring or they try to ho hum about it's
like, why not get excited? Why not be, why not celebrate your opportunities in life?
It just feels better. Absolutely. Well, and kind of tying into that is with the learning
aspect don't feel that you have to stay in one lane. Really the one thing book. I hate
that book, but I love that. Yes. Thank you. How niche is this?
Again, bringing it back to the humanity piece for me, what viewers will see if they connect
with me on any platform that I'm on is that one, I'm a goofball. I love to be funny. I
love to bring comedy in because that's who I am as an individual. I also am an avid hockey
fan. So I'm sorry, but you're going to see different hockey videos. You're going to see
different memes. That's a part of me while also seeing the resources and services that
I offer through my agency. I'm also a dog lover. I mentioned this earlier. I have three
dogs. I call them my coworkers. They're always sleeping on the job though. So we got to work
on that part, but they're going to see all of those elements because when we bring the
humanity piece, people are getting to know who I am as the individual on a deeper level
because there's going to be something in that that they connect with, not just what you're
providing for them. They're not hiring you solely on what you can provide for them. They're
solely hiring you on the connection you can build with them because you have that mutual
thing and building on that. And that's really how you do build that brand trust along the
way. And all of my clients, majority of them have been with me from the beginning and they
just continue to grow with me because they've seen my growth and it's urged them and excited
them to want to continue to grow their businesses. So we really do collaborate in that partnership
together. That's amazing that it takes a tremendous strength and dedication to relationships,
but the byproduct of such right is that you get to really enjoy the thorough nature of
those results and those long stent. You said trust, loyalty, right? Being able to really
drive raving fans. So many people are focused on driving many, many fans right now that
they are sorting through endless buckets of people who are in and out and in and out and
in and out. I don't know why. Well, you got to create depths for that to take place and
excitement, true genuine celebration, all that. That's a fantastic way to do that. Thank
you. You shared so many wonderful points in that. Do you want to share a third? Because
you've already shared like a 3000, but. Oh, let me see. I guess more of a true resource
that I use. There's a book and I know we're going to talk a little bit more about some
others later, but it's this book by Maura Neville Thomas. It's called Attention Management,
how to create success and gain productivity every day. What I love about this is it also
kind of goes against the grain and the normal viewpoint of productivity and how you can
have the perfect systems in place. You can have the perfect habits in place, but if you're
not focusing on your attention in those moments, you can still be less productive than if you
are focusing on that. This was a great resource. There's a lot of great insight and exercises
in there that for me were just really exciting because I love productivity as well. I know
it's different for everybody. I love learning different modalities for how to promote productivity
because each client I work with is different. Each one has a different work pattern and
what are things that I can recommend to them and systems I can help create for them that
are going to make them more productive and efficient in their business? Ultimately, bring
them in more money because that's one of the big goals. Money is part of everything. How
can we continue to have that success in the business and bring that revenue in and create
the life we want? I love it. Absolutely. Money is a resource.
That's what it is. If we don't pay attention to our resources or we downplay the value
of our resources, then we set ourselves up for not being able to use the resources that
we could have. It's very important. Productivity is also one of those things that nobody wants
and I don't think people walk around admitting they're lazy or admitting that, oh man, I'm
not very productive. In the world of progress, the world of visionary leaders, there's a
different subsector of people that thrive on that. In the world of productivity, it's
amazing how few people know how to become effective at actually producing results. I
had to go through a very stiff learning process of my business partner calling me out years
ago and saying, Jackson, you are busy and you do all these busy things and none of it
produces results. When are you going to start focusing on the things that actually produce
and drive results? He said it patiently, but it was a very powerful story that hit me so
hard. I was like, oh, he's right. I was excited about that and dove into learning about production.
Just having that seed planted the way you planted seeds right now, it put me on a trajectory
that changed my life. I know you just did that for several people right now. We're going
to come back. We're going to dive into Joss and Flowers Vision. We'll talk about, again,
avoiding AI pitfalls. This is incredibly important. Feel free to check that out while we cut for
a quick break. We're going to talk about retaining our humanity, making sure that our marketing
tactics or marketing mannerisms, whatever we're doing in marketing, is healthy. Then healthy
can drive an even greater depth of success that you can be happy with for your brands.
We'll be right back. All right. Welcome in to Vision Pros Live with Jackson Callum. I'm
your show host. We'll be doing interviews for visionary entrepreneurs and guest leaders
who are building fantastic visions out there. Hey, what's up, everybody? Welcome into another
episode of Vision Pros Live. I am super stoked today. I have a real live, authentic human
being on the show. Her name is Jocelyn Flowers. I'm not exaggerating. I'm actually very much
appreciating the fact that she's goofy. She's fun. She knows how to build deep relationships.
There's just so much opportunity for us to learn. You can check out what she's doing
at jflowersmarketing.com as well while we talk and catch up. We need to dive into this
incredible subject of AI that has taken the world by storm. It's not a problem unless
we allow it to be. It's an opportunity for all of us. How do we discipline ourselves
to make sure that we leverage the opportunity so that we get the most out of it and it doesn't
replace our humanity or replace us or cause a disaster of reputation for our businesses?
We need to talk about those things. Before I bring her on and we dive in deeper into
her vision and what we're going to do with this, I always want to give more resources.
That's just what we do. This comes in the form of our sponsors and the Water Project.
We're going to start with hardtokill.org with Dave Morrow. We've been working with
Dave for I think around five months now. Phenomenal leader by the way. He's helping 100,000 veterans
lose two million pounds collectively. The veteran community, come and join us guys.
Come and jump in these groups. He's got free groups. He's got paid for groups. He's got
the world's easiest fitness program and he's got his beast program as well. I've gone from
doing, yep, I only did one pushup the first day. I was embarrassed. 36 years old. How
did I let that happen? I'm doing between 100 and 120 pushups per day now and nobody's been
able to motivate me to do that for like nine years. I am living evidence of the value of
this program. I just love the way he leads with love and serves the community that he's
part of. Go check out his podcast, the Hard to Kill Podcast as well and let's change veteran
lives. In addition to that, we got opportunities. Opportunities for Latinos specifically. I'm
so proud of our Latino team. We have two Latinas here helping me right now on the back end
of this production. Diana and Vicky do a fantastic job of supporting. We've created a program
to help Latinos get free job training. I'm talking about completely free training to
become virtual assistants and digital ambassadors. A lot of these individuals have no idea that
LinkedIn exists. They don't know about Fiverr, Upwork, Beyond. They don't realize there's
opportunities that are out there. We teach them about it and we teach them a little bit
of the English skills too and how to make sure that they learn how to do interviews
properly. We have an incredible workforce thanks to this program and that's something
that you're welcome to tap into as well. My hope though is if you know a Latino leader
that you tag them on this and you send them as a potential guest for our Latino show opportunities
as well because we're looking for Latino guests who become a beacon of hope and a light and
inspiration to other Latinos who are coming through our program and learning. Check that
out and know that we also launched opportunities for the Philippines and opportunities for
India in the last couple of weeks as well. More to grow. There's 8 billion people to
help on this planet. Speaking of, one of the entities that I feel is doing an even better
job than we are at doing that is the water project. The water project is something that
I just won't ever take for granted. I have taken water for granted my entire life. I've
never ever been thirsty and not been able to do something about it. When I learned that
these people, they don't have access to clean drinking water. I imagine the risks the kids
might have to take in those circumstances, how scary that must be as a parent. I've allowed
myself to meditate on this a lot over the years since I found out about it. What was
really cool is if you just donate $5, you actually get to see the outcome of the exact
project that you contributed to. You get to pick the project that you're helping out.
There's millions of people who don't even have access to our most basic resource. If
the economy has been hard for you and you don't have the financial means to give back
right now, my hope is that you'll think of somebody. Take the time to just think in your
heart and your mind, who could possibly give back to this or what social media platform
could I share the water project on and do that because you never know the ripple effect
of the good that you do. There might be somebody who donates $10,000 to that because of you.
That would provide water to hundreds of people for generations. The impact of that one act
of goodness can go so far. Again, let's jump in the game. Let's help the 8 billion people
out in the world. Right now, let's get down to helping each of you. Jocelyn Flowers, thanks
for joining me on Vision Pros Live.
Thanks for having me.
Absolutely. Let's dive in with the... I want to know, I mean, you shared so well about
this already, but maybe we can dive in at a deeper level or find some new angles on
it because the depth is where it's at. What does that vision look like for those that
you're serving?
Absolutely. I would say that majority of the audience that I serve now and have, again,
gone through the journey of finding these people who I really do connect with on that
deeper level is more of those entrepreneurs and business owners and leaders that are more
driven by the impact that they're having with those that they're in front of than the monetary
value they're bringing in with that. When I work with the clients that I have, it's
really more about what is that bigger vision? What are the things that... Generally, a
lot of it is giving back. How can I make this piece of my life and business successful enough
for me to do this bigger mission that I have in giving back and having more of an impact
in the future generations that are coming? For me, that's really where my vision lies
is how can I keep amplifying that and bringing more voices to those members and audience
that are following me and needing that support and the skillset that I have that I can bring
to the table to make it a little bit easier for them and also get them in front of more
people?
I love that. I'm going to add some of your formulas that you gave me with the right mentors,
with excitement and with the right attention, combining that with my favorite self-made
quote which is, you can have your cake and you can eat it too, and you can have a conveyor
belt of cakes. That is what it's all about, maximizing the life, living abundantly, and
you're helping people achieve just that. I can see it in your demeanor. It would be fun
to look at your testimonials. We might dive in there and talk about some specifics. Before
we go on to those, I guess, tell me about your vision. What are some of the other things?
There's so many things you can envision like the cows outside my window, for instance,
but I'm curious, what are some of the bigger projects that you're headed towards? Because
I imagine you have some on your mind and heart as well.
Yes. Well, I mentioned this a little bit earlier is I'm an avid dog lover. There are a few
organizations that I've been able to get my foot in a little bit here locally where I'm
based and I want to be able to give back more to them and how can I do that? I've done pro
bono marketing work for them to help get their exposure out, really clear the shelters. That's
a big important piece for me. If I could have a million dogs, I would have a million dogs,
but we don't have the space or the resources for that. I want to be able to give people
the opportunity to have the love and companionship that I've been lucky enough to have from a
young age having dogs my entire life because there are deeper connections you can build
with having a pet than you can build with a human, I believe. They just have a little
bit more understanding and they don't fight back as much. But there's a lot of organizations
in that space that I really want to be able to support, but I'm also an aunt to 12 nieces
and nephews. So youth programs and being able to provide more resources to them and
make it known to them that it's okay to go off the beaten path and have more of a creative
style career versus the typical when I was growing up, oh, you can be a doctor, you can
be a lawyer, which there's nothing against us. I love them. We need them, but it's also
okay to go kind of out of the box a little bit and have more of a creative career or
design something that's brand new that people haven't heard of because that's something
they're passionate about. So those are two different areas that really are driving me
to continue keep going. And I love connecting with people. I love conversations, as you
can see, I love to talk. So it's these all kind of go hand in hand together because they're
things that I'm truly passionate about. And I would say big high level goal slash vision.
I would love to work with a hockey player someday just because I think it'd be fun.
We could create creative things together. But that's, you know, it's up there. We're
getting closer.
You know, it's funny. People with less vision might say that, oh my gosh, like you're so
busy. You know, like you're so scattered. You're so like, you know, when do you have
no balance, right? Those could be the types of of worldly accusations that come at people
like us. Right. And I think you've made it to the stage. And I know I've made it to the
stage too, where what I heard you just say was you have an extreme appreciation for balance
and you've managed to create balance that is also productive and fruitful. So therein,
it's like you saying projecting, you know what, I also would like to talk, you know,
and work with that hockey person that brings that other passion into your life and fold
with an extreme purpose that magnifies your ability to do it all.
Absolutely. Well, I've had clients call me the boundary queen, because I know there's
no true definition to work life balance. I choose to design what that looks like for
me. And that is bringing all of these different passions into my day to day because yes, my
agency and my company and my team takes up a large portion. I'm very busy with that.
And I love my clients and my team. But there's other things that I want to be able to have
time in and be able to focus in as well. That just make me feel balanced as the human. And
those are all things that I'm really passionate about. And if I can bring them into my day
to day, I want that. That's a way. Yeah, absolutely. I love that quote, by the way, there's no
true definition of work life balance. And it's such a respectful way to put it for those
again who don't, the arguers will find a way to argue. But the reality, right, language
is all made up. And so every word has its open into definitions. And so the way you
skillfully play with these topics without coming across as pompous or without like controlling
the narrative is just a lot of fun. So let's dive into a typically dark subject. We'll
try to hit that route. Oh, no, I'm just kidding. But one that I think you're going to, again,
have a lot of experiences to consider that might help our audience deal with some of
their own challenges. So what is the worst leadership experience that you've ever had?
So before I started my agency, I learned very early on that I knew I wanted to own my own
business, I wasn't quite sure which avenue I really wanted to go to. And I, I've worked
in a lot of different types of jobs, majority customer service. But I think that's also
gave me such a skill set for communication and being able to connect with people that
are maybe that middle class all the way up to million and billionaires and talk to them
like regular people that just because they're at a certain status, that it doesn't mean
you can't have a normal conversation with them. So my worst leadership experience, I
was working for a company where it was kind of that back and forth of we want your input
to help grow the end make this a better place to work, have more experiences for moving
up in the organization. And then it's kind of pulling back on that. So it was kind of,
where do we sit that unknown factor of, okay, finally, I get to be heard, they want my input.
And then it just still being silenced. And so it, for me, that really did come from high
leadership. And it just kind of, I kept seeing that in every organization that I was working
in that you got to a point and it just, they shut the door, they didn't want to hear anymore.
They said they did, but they really didn't want to take any of it in. And so for me,
I think that was kind of the breaking point, because I started my business six months later,
that I knew that was something I wanted to change. Because if I was able to grow to having
a team that works under me, I want every single person on my team to know that their voice
is just as important as mine. Just because I'm the owner of the company, the leader,
so to speak, that does not make my voice more important than theirs. And so I do value anything
that my team can bring in their insight, because we all have our own experiences in our life
that can bring a new approach to something that can open our eyes to a different avenue
that we maybe never would have experienced. But we have to have the platform to do that.
And the comfort and safety of that, and knowing that you're not just going to be kind of shut
down afterwards.
Huge. I, again, blown away by the simple and powerful nature of the quote. To want, to
hear a leader on stage talk about how important it is that their team has just as much influence,
as much voice as they do. Without limits. I'm not going to put it as like about this
company or about Work Life Balance or what it does. You didn't put any limits on that.
You opened the reality that we're all equals and we can appreciate that and allow that
to flourish. There's a special result that can come from it. And I'm not going to define
it, because I think it's different for everybody. But there's a balance and a piece that hits
my heart and my mind in ways that just makes me want to smile. So thank you.
And I think a big piece of it too is that, again, I worked in so many different organizations.
I got to see all different levels, all different industries. And, you know, when I was heard,
I wanted to do more than ever for that organization because I knew they stood behind what they
were saying. And the ones that didn't, I was ready to check out and see, OK, where am I
going to work next? Because this isn't the atmosphere I want to be in. And so it's created
not only, you know, the loyalty of, oh, this is an organization I want to work for and
really know that I can make an impact in, but also continue to grow and have that opportunity
that a larger organization may not give me. Because I still consider myself a bootleak
agency. And I love that close knit feel. And whenever I bring a new client, they're coming
into my family. And that's really kind of how we approach it, because I want us to have
those honest conversations. If something's not working, let's talk about it. If something's
working, let's celebrate it. Let's keep going. You know, and everybody's voice is going to
be heard. And that's really important for me. And just to be able to spread that out
as well.
Awesome. It's huge. And, you know, it's funny, it's kind of humorous to me that the people
with healthy boundaries, they leave companies in that situation, right? You have the power
and the certainty in yourself to know I'm not going to tolerate this and you move on.
So they lose the best of the best of the best of their workforce. But who stays typically?
The quiet quitters. The ones who stay are the ones that are just like, ah, all right,
whatever. We'll just deal with this. You know, I'll get home and watch Netflix to feel better.
You know, and so you create an economy, a company that is going to eventually collapse
in the worst of ways. And meanwhile, you're driving everybody's spirits down into the
mud too. It's a nasty situation to be in. So good choice on worst leadership. Now, let's
dive into the best leadership experience. What's the best leadership experience you've
ever had?
So this is going to take it back even outside of the workplace. I was an athlete all through
school and I would say the best leadership I had was my high school swim coach because
for him, it really instilled in me that you can push and you can get more if you feel
hungry enough for it without being kind of the aggressive, like trying to think of the
best way to put it, but I'm an aggressive, tenacious individual. Like I love to play
in the fourth quarter and to play in overtime. Like I'm ready to go on that, but there's
a difference and I want to hear it because I kind of learned to tone that down in the
workplace.
Yes. And for me, he knew where to be that tough love and where to really hold, okay,
what's the space? Where are we at right now to get us to the goal that we have? I was
a decent athlete and my goals at that time were this is what's going to get me into the
college that I want to go to, to be able to have the opportunity to get the job that I
want down the line. And so there was a lot of weight on that and there was a lot of pressure
on that, but we were able to again, find that balance between the two, because I'm an extremely
competitive person. And so if you put a goal in front of me and you tell me I have this
much time to get to it, I'm going to get to it and try to pass it. My goal is to try to
pass it. So he really instilled in me that there's okay times to really push hard and
go all in. And also there's time that you need to slow down because you're not going
to be able to keep going to that goal if you don't slow down a little bit. So having that
balance between the two and he was also a goofball. So it was really great to connect
with that and kind of kindred spirit that way.
It's fun. It's hard to find people with that appreciation for balance. And some of the
most important things in our life are hard to do. They're hard to pursue and it's worth
it. So this is the last chance that you had to share a powerful lesson with the world.
What powerful lesson can other visionaries learn from your experience?
I think the most important lesson is be intentional in everything that you do and be okay with
the outcome that comes from that. Sometimes our intention doesn't always get us the outcome
we want and that's okay because we do get lessons from that and how to approach it differently,
how to have those conversations a little bit differently. And put that relationship and
humanity first because once we lose that, I don't think there's hope for really anything
to continue growing.
That is a tremendous segue to talking about the AI pitfalls. I think a lot of it has to
do with individuals being lackadaisical, not taking it seriously, not understanding the
repercussions of the tool because it just feels like everybody's doing it. It's not
regulated. It feels like it's okay to just kind of toy with. So let's talk about intentionality
in relation to AI. What are some of the pitfalls that entrepreneurs are falling into? Because
unless it's like a serial killer, it's not making the news or like a political hype thing,
it's not going to make the news. And unless it's an ultra successful reality, it's not
going to make the news. So what are the most common pitfalls that entrepreneurs are falling
into related to AI?
Absolutely. I think one of the biggest ones is they look at, oh, it's making my job easier
in whatever form that looks like for you. And there's again pros and cons to it. But
I would say the biggest pitfall with that is it may be making it easier, but it's also
taking away the key elements for people to connect to. And so if you're not being intentional
with how you're using it and what level of control or activity it has in getting your
message out there, then you're going to lose that ideal audience you want to be connecting
with. The ones that are truly going to be those loyal brand followers that are going
to stick with you through every time, every growth, every ups, every down, you're going
to lose that because it's going to start looking like everything else. It's going to start
to melt. There's no individuality there. There's no personality there. It really takes away
that element. And I am again, all for again, having things that help make things move a
little bit quicker, because time is money, as we know. But I also want to make sure that
it's intentional and I have as much control in the path of how that AI is going to work
to make sure it still has that personal element. Obviously, in marketing, we use scheduling
systems that cuts down on a lot of time versus manually posting because they can automate
that. But I want to make sure that it's still presenting the way it would if I manually
posted it to a platform. I don't want any of these random codes or file names that come
up with sometimes with schedulers. That's an important piece for me.
I'll give an example on that. So a tangible example that I see happening in the market
is people are trying too hard to pre-qualify the condition or the experience related to
said event. One of the nastiest ones I see is they'll say things like, are you ready?
Are you sure you are ready to invest in an opportunity like this? And it's like, really?
Do you really think that helps anybody feel safe or feel like they're appreciated as a
human being by filling this form out? It's such a manipulative, coercive, aggressive
approach to trying to force a closed scenario that it's going to piss normal people off
or turn normal people off. I say, no way. And I see a lot of good human beings accidentally
turning to tactics like that to automate or rush forward relationships based on coaches
or mentors that don't have healthy relationships. They just have a lot of crazy relationships.
Absolutely. And that's why I'm very intentional with the pieces of AI that I use within the
work that I do, because I always make sure there's a human element along the journey.
So if I'm, I produce a weekly newsletter, email newsletter, and I always make sure that
there is a personal element in there, whether it's a personal story and statement from me
in every single one, or there's a video of me greeting and talking about something so
that they can still connect with me, even if I'm not on a call. But there's always that
invitation for us to have a casual conversation that has no strings attached. I am open to
having a conversation with anyone who wants to know a little bit more about marketing,
have insight, want to look for resources. And that's what that platform is for me. My socials
and my email is nothing but resources because yes, there are those out there that are ready
to invest. They're ready to jump in. I need someone to do this for me. Great. There's
an avenue for that. But then there are those who, again, avid learners that want to know
how to do it. We're still somewhere down the line. They may look for support, but they
know the basics. They know the ins and outs a little bit, be able to guide whoever they
are having to support them. That I think would be one of the biggest lessons that I would
tell entrepreneurs or leaders is learn it first, get a framework of it so that you know
how to articulate to the person down the line that is going to support you in actually implementing
it more effectively. Because I run into a lot of those conversations of, well, this
is kind of what I'm thinking, but I don't really know how to...
I think too, Jocelyn, though, I'm going to defend you on this in a very good way and
hopefully help people realize that when I had a back surgery, there's no way I was going
to find out everything I needed to know in order to really know what I was doing and
know what I was getting myself into or what needed to happen. I needed to let go of my
desire to know everything and trust the doctors at hand to take care of me. Business ownership
is no different. It is hard. We cannot escape that. There are lots of simple things that
can be done and that need to be done, but the expert that knows how to pull all those
variables together, you take three times three, it's nine, but you take nine times three,
it's something else, and then you take that times three. It can be as simple as that.
It still doesn't make it any less hard to understand how it all comes together. I hope
that we can inspire the ones who want to know it all to learn how to recognize the mentor
or the person, the team member who can help with the process, entrust them with the opportunity
to implement these systems knowing, hey, I finally found somebody who makes me feel good
about using these types of systems.
And so, give me a favor. Think of one more pitfall. While you're doing it, I'm going
to showcase one, and I might really piss some people off with this one because I'm going
to showcase actual live names, but one of the worst pitfalls I see people using AI for
is automatically connecting with other profiles on LinkedIn and on Facebook. The problem is
not the automation. The problem is the lack of sincerity in the messaging or the lack
of messaging that occurs. And when you're actually trying to contact successful people,
it doesn't do you a lot of favors. It puts you in a position to where you'll probably
be reverse sold if in the best case scenario, but you're usually just going to get ignored.
So here I get an invitation from somebody that doesn't have a message. I don't know
who it is. I'm not going to look at it. My assistant might, but my assistant's trained
to help those people get help from us because they don't know what they're doing. We moved
down here. I love what you're doing. I love what you're doing as an agency owner. They've
even got a typo in their automation. I know it's automated because they get the same message
from hundreds of people. And you don't love what I'm doing. You don't know what I'm doing.
We've never talked before. We're a zero upfront. This is professional begging right here. We're
a zero, but please just give us money. Please just come and give us a chance. And no, I'm
not going to pay attention to that. Jackson, you're killing it. Am I really killing it,
Jordan? Do you really know what I'm doing in business? And is that my lingo as a nurturer
who was raised by six women? Do I really want to kill it in this life? My favorite, oh,
here's another one. A marketing representative at OutreachGenius.ai. Is there anything genius
about doing this type of outreach? No, there's not, Brian. I'm so sorry, my friend. I'm not
trying to say you're not a bad person, but these are not working. And so here's the most
famous one of all. All of us get this on a daily basis. I see we have mutual connections
and we are both members of... Oh my gosh, John. Everybody who starts AI starts with
this outreach message. And my goal is not to roast or to hose these people. I've been
through that process as well. I also at one point made the mistake of thinking that that
was going to somehow unlock success and great relationships would somehow stem from this
really awkward outreach process by hiring people who are cheap and hiring people who
love to claim fame based on vanity metrics. And I will get off my pedestal of talking
about my soapbox, but that is one of the greatest AI pitfalls is people are doing that. And
then, no, your first impression isn't everything, but man, it's really hard to recover from
when you screw it up. Absolutely. And I get those messages a lot. So it made me giggle.
I was like, yep, I've gotten that one too. And that's why... You get those messages,
let us know. Drop it in the comments. Tell us which ones are your favorite ones to see.
Drop a screenshot. And hopefully these people realize we're not coming at them. We're actually
trying to come to them and say, just stop doing the bad stuff. Just stop doing the bad
stuff and get back into being the good person that you are. Well, and my next pitfall actually
kind of tags onto that a little bit is that AI is still a technology. Technology is not
perfect. Technology does not always work. Yes, we are now in the land of technology being
kind of mostly the forefront. It does not always work. So do you really want that to
be kind of that lasting statement that you get? That's me.
This is a statement you want, guys. Or wait, let me go that way. This is the statement
that you want is I'm a person. I'm a human being. I love that you talk about... You don't
talk about even building a culture. You just talked about being able to show up vulnerably
and know that you're going to be appreciated by those that you're working with. That is...
Why can't it be that simple for all of us? And that's really where working with the clients
that I do and having the team that I have is that I have a person, an actual human being
that is supporting in those messaging, in those automations to where it's still personalized.
You're still getting a response from an actual human. It's not an automated system because
again, one of the things I always like to stress to the clients is, well, are you going
to do it just like me? I'm going to always say no because I am not you. I am my own individual.
But we are going to bring as much of your essence into this structure that's going to
make it more efficient for you.
Here's a growth hack related to that exact reality that we use. We call it magic message.
And what we do is the initial automation is designed around a universally applicable campaign
that gets people's attention and gets them to say, oh my, this is different. This feels
good. But if somebody responds and they want an appointment with me and typically their
message back has human nature in it, it'll say something like, hey, Jackson, I'm located
in Palm Springs. Have you ever been? A virtual assistant cannot handle that. They have no
capacity to politely respond to that and give context and build that relationship. Yet I
see so many entrepreneurs who are like, well, why didn't they just book the appointment?
And if you just dive right past that question and ignore it, you ruin the entire purpose
of connecting. And so what we do is magic message is a channel in our Slack and my virtual
assistant or my team member, the person who I work with, they take a screenshot of that
and drop it. I don't have to manage my inbox at all. I just go to my magic message channel.
I see there's a personalized response. Now I can open up LinkedIn and I typically respond
with an audio clip. And then the audio clip, I say, hey, Jocelyn, Palm Desert. I haven't
been to Palm Springs since I was getting crushed by multi-level marketing and made a really
dumb trip there, but it was a lot of fun and I loved Palm Springs. I will dive into that
with all of the personality that is within me that my VA or that human being cannot possibly
do on my behalf. So the automation matters and it helps, but only if I'm also willing
to apply the healthy relationship component to it. I know we're over time too. Am I interrupting?
You have to run, Jocelyn.
No, we're good. I actually want to kind of add to that point.
I got an extra 10 minutes, so happy to.
Perfect. I'll be brief with it. But adding on to that is when I work with the clients,
yes, I provide these services. Yes, I get their exposure out there, but I never take
them out of the equation because that is the person, again, that someone is looking to
connect with. So in the messaging side of things, yes, I have team members that are
in there engaging, activating, sending out messages, but monitoring the inbox in, there
will be messages that come in and we'll say, oh, Janet, we had a message come in, lovely
person, kind of give insights and background on it and have them go in and respond the
way that they want to because you can't take that out. I can never speak to a business
coach's level of this is my approach to it. This is that because that's not what I'm trained
in. I'm trained in taking what you've done and what you can provide and getting it out
to as many people as possible in the most effective way. And with that too, and this
is where I go a little bit against the grain of the traditional marketing is it's very,
and you mentioned it a little bit earlier about the vanity metrics is follower count.
I still always get the question of how do I get as many followers as fast as possible?
Well, do you want as many followers who aren't going to be your ideal buyer, they're not
going to engage with your content, but they're just going to be a number sitting there in
the queue that you're never going to connect with? Or would you have a lower number? Obviously,
we're going to still keep growing that, but we're going to fill it with the value of those
connected individuals who truly want to know more about who you are, more about what you're
offering and built that relationship that is going to last to the end of time.
Which one feels more valuable and more impactful for you? And that's been a big shift and we've
seen a lot more growth in my clients have seen 30 to 40% increases in their revenue
coming in monthly because we focused on the people who want to actually make the connection
versus those vanity followers coming in just so that they have a nice pretty number up
there.
So, let's leave that beautiful result of 30 to 40% increase aside just for a minute and
pretend that that didn't even exist, even though it does, even though you're driving
that. I bet your conversations with your clients are far more enjoyable when you're dealing
with people who appreciate what you just talked about. Am I right or am I right?
In majority, I would say 90% of my clients have exactly the same passions as I do. I've
had client meetings and we each have a dog in our lap and we're just talking. We're out
on walks with the dogs. I've had meetings at hockey games and I'm like, oh, hold on.
What's going on? And then they're asking, well, what's the score? We have those connections.
My clients mean my kids, not my dog.
I show up for them as long as they're showing up for themselves in this equal partnership.
Yeah, it's huge. It's such a good feeling. I spent a long time in my career being willing
to take on not having healthy boundaries. I just wanted to simplify it. I just did not
have healthy boundaries and I didn't have healthy definitions on what I really wanted
and how I really wanted things to go. We've shifted towards that as a discipline that
we pretty much require. Now we have all these people surrounding us and working with us
we resonate with and that we're grateful for and that are grateful for us. It changes your
life in ways that you almost can't describe without just, I mean, people can't feel that.
I'm sorry, like you're missing out. And best wishes to you. So thank you. You shared so
much value today. I would love to potentially circle back on this. Maybe someday we bring
back together and we dive in even more into those pragmatic realities. Entrepreneurs and
visionaries, if we could bridge every gap possible for you right now, I think Jocelyn
and I both would. The reality is there's so many ways that AI is affecting your business
and there's so many ways that you could be possibly using it. And if you haven't spent
10,000 hours preparing and studying and becoming an expert with that specific tool, then be
wise enough to check yourself and think through, uh-oh, if it were that easy, wouldn't everybody
who has access to that same tool be ultra successful? That's not to shame you. That's
saying call people like Jocelyn, reach out and get the help from the experts and set
the ego aside. And what will happen is then you will be empowered to have the time to
actually focus on what you're best at as a visionary and then you can thrive. So we'll
have the action steps of how to connect with Jocelyn below this video on the landing page
for the episode. Below that, we'll have the list of resources that we talked about as
well. And in the top right corner of the show, you'll see a button that says, be our guest.
If you've got a guest, if you've got a vision, a guest, if you've guessed it, you know, to
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something that uplifts and builds and help others, then please apply. Come on the show.
We look forward to hosting you. I hope everybody has a fantastic rest of their day. Thanks
for joining us today.
Thank you for being here today. I'm really happy that you tuned into Vision Pros Live.
I'm looking forward to seeing your reactions as these episodes continue to move forward.
This is going to get more and more fun. We'll have more and more engagement as well. We'll
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attention. Have an excellent time building out your vision.