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Where did your vision come from?

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My vision has changed.

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Well, I suppose what happened was I realized that the vision of wanting to get,

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to enable people to get unstuck has shifted a bit because I'm doing that.

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So I suppose I've achieved my original vision, which was just working in full-time employment.

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It's like the number of people I could affect and make a difference in was restricted.

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So it's as if, you know, the more I work with the same team, it's like,

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well, I've done my work here with this team.

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So yeah, so I suppose the vision to leave was to take landscaping your life into the world,

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allow more people access to it, which I now have done.

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So the new vision is to support a rewilding effort that's happening here in the UK,

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in Scotland. And so that motivates me and sort of adds to the,

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yeah, well, I can see that vision being something I can do until I die,

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because some of the vision is not actually going to be realizable until I'm no longer here,

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because some of the things that we want to do to rewild Scotland may take decades to happen.

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So I think it's the changing the vision to something that I can then,

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yeah, see myself doing when I'm 70 or 80. I've always said, I don't think I'll retire

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because I like writing, I like podcasting. So long as I've still got the energy for that,

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I'll keep doing it.

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I get that. So your vision initially was just to get landscaping your life out there and into the

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world, and you're now in your 20 years. And now, since the vision is changing,

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you're pretty much just, it sounds like you might just be going with the flow of what you'll be able

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to get through and do for the rest of your life. Like you said, you were in the 60s. So if you had

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to put your vision into words right now, what would that be?

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Rewild Scotland, because I think as we, so I suppose the bigger picture is the fact that as

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we rewild nature, then more of us will reconnect to nature and therefore may pay more attention to

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looking after nature rather than treating it as a sort of a commodity to be used.

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Yes.

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So perhaps the bigger, perhaps the bigger vision is, yeah, that we'll start taking seriously our

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connection with nature and responsibility for it.

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Got it. That is, that's, that's awesome because I know a lot of people don't care for nature too

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much, you know, but it is such a beautiful thing. I was doing a, a meditation and of course they're

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often saying, you know, visualize you near the trees and all these things. And one thing that I

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really found out, Alison is they were saying, have you really gone on a walk and actually looked at

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where you were walking? You know what I mean? Like the trees, do you realize that there are

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individual leaves on the branches of that tree? And so they say we utilize walking to think more,

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which it actually doesn't, it doesn't help us to think more on the walk. We're supposed to be

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thinking about the walk and what we're walking into. Is that sort of kind of the,

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Yeah. I mean, if you went for a landscaping, your life walk, you might very well, you might do a bit

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of thinking in terms of, you might say, I'm taking this problem on the walk with me and I'm going to

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notice patterns in the walk that helped me understand, oh, I've come to a dead end. Oh,

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but this dead end in nature isn't as much as a dead end as I think. Oh, look, I'm going to

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think, oh, look, actually, I just need to look a different direction. And there are ways out of

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this dead end. And therefore it might very well be that that's an exact mirror for what's happening

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in York, because you'll notice the pattern that mirrors the situation that you're struggling with.

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So it's so interesting, again, actually, a lot of people don't, it's really interesting observing my

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reaction when you said a lot of people don't value nature, because for me, that means they don't

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value themselves either. Yeah. So it's a, if we, you know, so what we're seeing, how we relate to

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nature is how we relate to ourselves. So I could argue that a lot of my coaching is about helping

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people rewild themselves, helping them let go of the must-sorts and shoulds and to do the right

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thing. And so many people in organisations know they're not doing the right thing, but think,

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well, this is how it is. Yes. Well, you know, it's not right. You know, you know,

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doing something at the expense of somebody else where somebody else is going to lose or come to

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harm as a result of your actions is wrong. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And so it's that, so you think that's

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okay. And I don't know, but perhaps as I'm getting older, it's, I'm more likely to just speak out and

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go, really? And I think that interesting you say that is because the fact that you have been doing

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it so long, you can definitely change the vision because now you have more experience and now

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there's more wisdom. And now, like you said, you can speak out more and definitely be like,

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no, that's not the way it could be. You know what I mean? So take me through a day of, or a

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conversation that you would have someone who's choosing to get coaching with you or an initial

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conversation. Yeah. Let's go with the coaching conversation. So the initial conversation might

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be, you know, if we can meet up, we'll meet up. Otherwise we'll have a conversation about where

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they might be able to go in nature whilst they, we do the coaching conversation. If I'm with them,

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then we'll meet somewhere. And what I don't want is a lot of the content of the problem because

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otherwise really I read somewhere recently about we become an expert in the problem, not the solution.

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And so I don't want to know about the problem because you already know about the problem. You

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already are an expert in the problem and talking about it just makes you more of an expert in the

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problem. And so I don't want to know about it. So you might just give me the top line that says,

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I've got a decision to make about work or I've got a problem. You know, I'm demotivated. So it should

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be really top level. Okay. And then either we'll walk together or you will walk at the other end of

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the phone. Quite often if somebody's at the other end of the phone, so I've had people around the

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world, they turn the videos off just because it's easier for them to walk without having to pay

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attention to looking at me so they can pay attention to looking at the trees and the leaves.

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But quite often what happens and sometimes bandwidth and battery also mean that turning off the

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video is a good thing. But what then happens is they'll go, oh, guess what? Guess what? Let me show

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you, let me show you. So quite often at some point I'll go, you know, stop, have a look around. What

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do you notice? So people might notice, I had one person who noticed in the middle of a wood, there

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was this big wall and that wall reflected everything that they were looking at. And they

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reflected everything that they were annoyed about in this particular situation. And then we just

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keep walking. And so the walk is a conversation about the patterns. So it might be the wall,

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it might be, oh, I've come to a crossroads. Okay. So how are you going to make a decision about which

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direction you go? Is it, oh, that route looks easier? Is it because there's a signpost and

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you know where you want to get to? And so even going to a crossroads in nature, I mean, if you're

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unsure how to make decisions or you've got a big decision to make, go out into nature and pilot it,

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have a test run, just go somewhere that's got lots of paths that cross over. So we've got

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botanical gardens in Edinburgh and that's got so many paths that cross. So I had somebody,

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we've got a decision to make. And so every crossroads, I'm like, okay, which direction

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do you want to go? And we just explored the decision-making criteria they were using to

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decide which path. And then it became quite clear that their decision-making was a great

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mirror for how they were making decisions in life, what was important to them. And therefore,

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then they were able to go, oh, I see. So basically their decision-making in business

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had been the complete opposite to how they were wanting to make decisions in nature. And it was

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like, oh, I need to go back and ask for a completely different job because I'm asking the wrong

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question. So the decision I've got is a decision I don't want to make because I've got two jobs I

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don't want. I want a third job that is paths on traveled, new product development, taking the

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business in new directions. And they didn't realize that until they'd done a landscaping in life walk.

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Sometimes it might just be, so I had somebody where they were, felt like they were going

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around in circles in a situation. So anybody listening could have a think about that. And then

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either get a piece of paper or pen out or go out into nature and walk the circle. So I had somebody

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walk in the circle. And so I sort of say, quite often I'll say, change direction, make this

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circle smaller, let it get bigger, quicker, faster, and then break free of the circle.

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But in this particular instance, and quite often one of those things will get the person to think

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and stop and go, oh, no, it's not really. So somebody once said, they said, go around in squares.

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And they went, oh, squares is better because it's as if I can do one side of the square and then stop

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and then the next side of the square and stop. And so it just, oh, I'm just pushing myself,

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pushing myself, never stopping. What I need to do is stop. Other people, I mean, just

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drawing the circling just disrupts our thinking enough when we start changing it. So with this

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particular person, I said, where do you want to go? And they went straight in front of me, I want

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to go there. And so I said, well, so they'd been doing the circling, but they knew where they

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wanted to go. And so I said, well, go ahead in that direction. And what they discovered was,

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oh, but I'm scared that I might have made the wrong decision. I said, but which direction do you want

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to go? I want to go straight in front. So they knew which direction they wanted to go. But as

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soon as they started heading in that direction, the fear of missing out, the fear of making the

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wrong decision, even though they absolutely knew where they wanted to get to. So it was a, well,

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that's why you're not doing anything. You know, that's, that's why you're not making progress

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towards your goal because you're scared of, of, of making the wrong decision. Have you made the wrong

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decision? Is that the wrong goal? No. Okay. So just need to dispense and let go of that fear.

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Yeah. So interesting enough is you, you were in corporate before you got into this.

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Where, and I don't know if I, if I missed it, where did the nature come into your life? Where

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did that, were you always one for nature? Like what's the why behind the landscaping part and the

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nature? The nature bit, well, the answer I've got may not be true. But the answer I've got is the

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first time I ever used metaphor was in business and was, I was in purchasing. We were wanting to

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get people to think about supplier management in organizations. They weren't, they were a bit bored

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with us coming with all the theory about why they needed to manage their suppliers better. But as

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soon as I started saying, well, how would you look after a garden? How would you have a flourishing

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garden? Oh, well, we need to water them, prune them, mow them. Plants need to be in the right

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location. You know, some plants need different soil. Some might need shady spots. Some might need

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more sun. So as soon as you open their minds to the fact that, oh, supplier management really like

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having a garden. Oh my God, I'm just plonking a supplier in the corner and thinking that they're

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going to grow and all will be well. So that's when I first realized that metaphors worked. And of

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course, I was using a nature one. And then I realized that, oh, it didn't have to just be

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gardening. It could be nature's landscapes more generally. And it didn't have to be supplier

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management. It could be life, which is where landscaping your life came from. And I think

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it's just continued. It's like, I do do metaphor. I do notice metaphor in other people's language

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that are sports related or so maybe other metaphors, but quite often people are using it.

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And I think it's my it's where I go to be to ground myself. So, you know, if I'm out of

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sorts, I'll go to nature. So I think there's something about even being in nature is going to

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help us find a solution, even if I'm then saying, well, there's more things from a metaphor point

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of view. Then the other thing is, is we all understand nature. So and it's available 24 7

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365. So, you know, so the thing is, is that we can all either even on an internet go and find a

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location and travel through it. And all we could go out into nature, or we can imagine nature.

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And we understand the patterns we understand. All right. There aren't four seasons in every

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part of the world. But, you know, spring, then summer, then autumn, then winter, you know,

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sunrise, midday, sunset. So there's lots of patterns that we can then relate to. Because,

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you know, a flourishing landscape, a flourishing individual need the same characteristics and

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same conditions. So I think for me, it's just a it's a metaphor that keeps on giving. Absolutely.

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And I mean, because I can go out into nature and do these, you know, the landscaping your life

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podcast is me in nature embodying the saying. So if you're stuck between a rock and a hard place,

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I go to a rock and a hard place and then explore what the solutions are.

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Thank you for being here today. I'm really happy that you tuned in to Vision Pros Live. I'm looking

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forward to seeing your reactions as these episodes continue to move forward. This is going to get

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more and more fun. We'll have more and more engagement as well. We'll invite people to

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participate in the show. And thank you for giving us your time and attention. Have an

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excellent time building out your vision and becoming a Vision Pro yourself.