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What's your why of what you do?

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Why did you choose to be a,

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and call yourself a biologist

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and get into this profession per se?

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Yeah, that's a great question.

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It's one of the most common questions I get is,

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you're a psychologist, how did you end up in marketing?

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And it really relates to my why.

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I love psychology.

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I studied psychology for many, many years.

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And realized that I didn't love being a therapist.

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And so I wanted to find some other avenues

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for applying what I know and what I do.

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And about 30 years ago or so, I led my first focus group

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and I really fell in love with that process.

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The ability to understand people,

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in particular, I think the thing I didn't love

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about being a therapist was the focus on pathology.

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What I enjoy is focusing on really understanding people,

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putting ourselves in their shoes,

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understanding their situation, their lives,

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their dreams, their challenges,

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and then creating, working with teams to create approaches

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that are better, faster, more efficient,

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more enjoyable for people.

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So that's when I really made my transition into marketing.

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And specifically, about 20, boy, 24, 25 years ago,

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started working in what's now known as shopper marketing

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or commerce that is really focused on consumer behavior,

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purchase behavior, and understanding why people choose

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and buy what they do,

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and understanding how we can help make experiences,

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products, brands better for them.

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And so for me, it really is about using what I do

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to go beyond insight, go beyond data,

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to really understand people from their own perspective,

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on their own terms, so that we can be as effective

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in helping them as possible.

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Do you have a particular story or something

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that you'd like to share behind you or why?

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Yes, I think there's a couple.

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I'm gonna start with one that was a success.

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We can maybe talk about one that I learned from

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as a failure later, but one that was really a success

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is we had a, you know, in the early days,

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particularly of shopper marketing

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and shopper and consumer psychology,

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we had to do a lot of teaching,

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a lot of explaining what we do and why it's so important.

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And I recall we had a large CPG company

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coming to visit our offices,

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and they weren't really convinced

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that this was something they needed to focus on.

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And so they said, we're gonna give you one day.

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And in that one day, we expect you to convince us

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and make a compelling case that we should invest

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in these services.

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And I'll never forget, I was in the room

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with my CEO at the time, and he's like,

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yeah, absolutely, we can do that.

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Chris, it's on you.

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I was like, oh my gosh, all right.

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And so I was really tasked with coming up with something

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that would have a real impact

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to really help these high level,

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I mean, these were C level, VP level folks

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really understand what was going on

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with their consumers and their shoppers

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in a way that would be compelling and impactful for them.

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And we batted around some ideas,

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maybe we could do some store walks with them

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and go check out the shelves,

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or maybe we could bring in some shoppers

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that they could kind of shop along with.

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But I really thought that that wouldn't have the impact

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that we needed.

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It's one thing to talk about issues and challenges,

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it's an entirely other thing to have to be in the shoes

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of that person and struggle with the same things

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they struggle with.

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And so I really racked my brain around like,

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how can we do that?

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And so I created something called Chopper Passport.

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And Chopper Passport essentially is a role playing game.

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We put together shopper profiles.

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So we had different profiles,

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some based on the company that we were working with

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and others were a little bit looser.

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And we broke them into teams of two.

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And we did that for a very specific reason

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because when you're in a team like that,

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you have to communicate your choices.

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You have to argue, have conversations,

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make your case for why we wanna choose one item

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over another.

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Thank you for being here today.

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I'm really happy that you tuned in to Vision Pros Live.

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I'm looking forward to seeing your reactions

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as these episodes continue to move forward.

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This is gonna get more and more fun.

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We'll have more and more engagement as well.

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We'll invite people to participate in the show

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and thank you for giving us your time and attention.

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Have an excellent time building out your vision

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and becoming a Vision Pro yourself.