during my school and all that.
So it was like, I definitely felt like
it was a huge career mover.
And then Brad saw that and he immediately reached out.
He was like, hey, I saw you on social media examiner.
I wanna have you on my podcast.
So then I met with him, he was super chill.
And he sent me an email with y'all and I'm like,
okay, Brad, I'm not gonna turn that down.
So yeah, and I appreciate you having me on by the way.
I really do.
And thanks for having me by the way.
Oh, of course, man, so social media examiner.
That's one of my favorite places to turn.
When I wanna find like a case study,
I'll go to Google and I'll start Googling.
And then I'll be like, you know what, this is stupid.
So I'll type social media examiner
and then I'll look for the same case study
because they're so transparent.
They're so good about striving to give you
everything you need to know.
So they had you on their show how long ago?
It's hard to remember, but I think it's been like
a year and a half or two years.
Oh, that's not long at all.
So a year and a half, two years ago.
In content language, it feels very long.
Every week is two posts a day.
Yeah, it starts to feel like it's adding up.
But no, it was like a year and a half, two years ago.
And then Mike really liked me.
So he even invited me out to go to San Diego
and speak at Social Media Marketing World,
which was just like the next big step.
But yeah, by the end of the call, I mean, after the podcast,
Mike stayed on with me for like 55 minutes.
No one sees that stuff.
Like he stayed on with me for like an hour
after that podcast and just chatting with me.
And I was like, this is really cool.
You know, like you're taking time out of your day.
You're like a person I've looked up to within the industry.
And so it was just, it was very, very, what's the word?
It was very validating.
And then when I went out to San Diego,
I was a deer in the headlights, terrified and beyond belief,
but it went amazing.
I had a great talk, you know,
in front of like 2000 plus people technically,
but 500 plus in real life.
And it should have been a lot more terrifying,
but given the fact that I'd been on like 20 plus podcasts
and been geeking out about LinkedIn for the last,
you know, two, three, now four years,
it was just, it was like reading the back of my hand.
It was no big deal, you know?
So it was a lot of fun and a huge,
a huge triumphant moment for me
as somebody trying to grow as an individual.
So.
Dude, that's a huge test.
I'm so grateful for that because, and here's why,
my stark contrast,
I've been on stages since I was a kid.
Oh, cool.
And because of that,
I don't necessarily have that same correlation
as to how to transition,
but you're saying you had only been on podcasts
and you had done like 20 podcasts
and you got on stage in front of 500 people
and didn't melt down.
Like you felt, you know, and you know your subject too.
That's certainly a big factor there.
That's awesome, dude.
That's super helpful.
Anybody who's listening,
that means that there's no reason
why you can't also go onto stages
and allow this online world,
this online interaction where it's a little awkward
to talk to this little camera, you know,
but when you can remember that there's people behind it
that you're delivering value to
and you can think about them,
you don't have to think about them being naked.
You know, just realizing that people are going to see you.
That's so awkward.
Isn't that like,
that's so awkward.
I never would have liked that.
No, I mean, really what helped the most
was that right before I went out on stage,
Mike came and found me.
He was like, hey, you're about to go up, right?
And I'm like, you know, you know, you know, I'm going up.
Yeah, I'm about to go up.
And he's like, come with me.
And he like takes me to this back room
and he's like, you know, here's what you wanna do.
You wanna walk left, you wanna walk right.
You wanna really work the room.
Like you're in a house at your friend's house
and you're, he gave me this whole
like really down to earth example.
And I was like, that's exactly what I do.
I'm like, I'm just, so I went out there
and I was like, before I got up there,
I was just like, I got this.
I'm like, I'm good.
I can get up there.
I can just talk about what I normally talk about.
Come and find me right before that
and give me that like handoff, like here you go.
You got this dude.
So.
Dude, that's awesome.
Okay.
What were your favorite two things
about social media marketing world?
My favorite two things, obviously being a speaker.
I mean, it definitely,
it definitely comes with its perks, right?
I mean, I've never stayed in that nice in a hotel
in my entire life, for sure.
But, but it was, I would say it was a lot to like
little in between moments.
It was like being back at the skate park again.
You know, like I grew up on a skateboard,
you know, like you go to the park,
you hang out with your friends,
you try hard stuff, you challenge each other.
You're surrounded by a squad of people
who have been vetted by the severe fact
that they're a skateboarder, you know?
And so it's like all these people are here,
they're all marketers, they're all in the trenches.
So like when I went to the cocktail party afterwards,
I'm all jived up from my talk,
people are like, I saw your talk, that was amazing.
I have like 10,000 questions for you.
And then they're like, you know,
you have that like Gary V moment
where you're like just chatting it up with people
and you're wishing you had like that whole camera crew
with you while you're doing it.
But it feels so cool though.
And I was just like having so much fun,
having endless conversations with people.
It was like I had my LinkedIn feed in real life with me
at one time and I met a ton of great people.
I met a guy named Morgan Ingram,
who's a huge name on LinkedIn now.
And he came up and found me ahead of time
and was like, you got to talk today.
You know, like there's just a lot of community to it.
And I think that's probably what I enjoy the most.
Oh man, that's amazing.
I look forward, I got to get my butt out there.
If I either haven't applied
to social media marketing world to speak,
or I applied and got rejected,
but now I've got my insider who can hook me up, right?
I got you.
All right, welcome in to Vision Pros Live.
With Jackson Calame, I'm your show host.
We'll be doing interviews for visionary entrepreneurs
and guest leaders who are building
fantastic visions out there.
Hey, what's up and welcome in to Vision Pros Live.
I'm your show host, Jackson Calame,
founder and CEO of First Class Business.
And I'm excited to have Daniel Kading here today,
who's a referral from Brad Powell of Awesome Video Makers.
And Brad also has an excellent show
called the Standout Business Show.
Always want to give credit where credit's due.
Brad and I, by the way, have done a mastermind together,
just a private one, him and I every Wednesday
for the better part of a year.
Granted, we like to take our vacations and our time off too,
so we skip some of those once in a while.
But he's been very fun to build with.
So in addition to the other sponsors,
quick plug and shout out to Awesome Video Makers
with what Brad does with helping business owners
get their content created super fast.
In fact, I believe Daniel is also a client
with his, and has worked with him on his services.
We'll confirm that in a little bit.
But without further ado,
let's dive into some of these other resources.
You guys can do your own research on that.
That's always important.
I love, by the way, quick tip and trick.
When you're writing notes,
and I always put a little column on my notepad.
I learned this from one of the smartest people
I've ever met.
And on the right-hand side, I keep my action items.
On the left-hand side, I keep my notes.
This particular meeting with Justin Brayn
had a ton of action items, by the way.
So that's why it looks even.
That's almost, that's very rare.
Usually your right-hand column has one to two things
that you're gonna do with the information you write down.
Let's go from there to Patrick Creighton
of Laidback Languages.
Patrick has inspired me as somebody who can,
speaking of Daniel, I was just talking about Spanish.
And he's got a desire to learn Spanish.
Well, if that desire is like super strong
and you like really wanna master it, Daniel,
then Patrick Creighton is one of the master teachers
of learning a foreign language.
He can really help speed that process up.
And I don't know that because I've worked with Patrick.
I know that because I learned Spanish
in four and a half months myself.
It took me 18 months to realize and claim fluidity
with the language, but in four and a half months
is when I was up to the point
where I was actually speaking fluently
and just didn't quite give myself credit.
Now, Patrick understands how to teach the principles
that are necessary for driving that type of growth
and language learning fast.
So if you have a professional reason
or a personal reason to want to learn it,
I highly recommend Patrick, he's amazing.
And moving on to sponsors, Deteo Publishing.
They are other sponsor.
That would be Ashley Democ De Teo.
She is a phenomenal founder.
One of the fastest growing students
I've ever had in my program.
She took our passions assessment years ago.
She realized, oh my gosh, I know exactly what I wanna do.
She launched the Teo Publishing,
went through some incredible life hurdles,
such as her husband getting a mountain biking accident,
going into a coma for several months
while also managing her family and moving her family forward.
I've been very impressed with who Ashley is as a person.
She's actually one of my top 20 favorite people on earth.
And I have a family of more than a hundred people.
So you can take that for what it's worth.
She's absolutely incredible.
From an R&D perspective,
I've never met somebody who's more thorough either.
Now research and development is the key
to laying a foundation for a solid campaign.
So to end up with a book that's published super, super well,
you want somebody like her on your team
and author out there a few other names
if you are in the process of writing a book.
And that would be Chandler Bolt's program,
self-publishing school.
Very informative and helpful for me.
He also works with Jake Larson at Video Power.
Again, references to write down.
Rakeshia Pittman based out of Dallas.
She's also one of my favorite book publishing individuals.
And of course you can go to any of the top publishing
companies in the world too,
and just Google those and find those real quick.
But those are alternatives, options for you
as entrepreneurs, professionals that want to solidify
your legacy and get your message out there
in a more formal format that can give you authority
and credibility and social proof in the market.
It's a fantastic way to do just that.
Now let's talk about the water project real quick
before we dive in.
The water project has big goals to help millions of people
gain access to clean drinking water.
We're talking about people who celebrate water
as though it's the best Christmas gift on earth.
And my heart feels for them.
I can imagine my kids not having clean drinking water
or having to leave school and walk a couple miles
to go find a source of water that may or may not be safe
for them and their peers.
I love what this project does.
They allow you to invest in a specific community.
And then you're able to see the results
of that community move forward.
You get to see what they're working on.
You can see how they do it.
I'm a bit analytical.
I like to dive into the details and see those things.
But if you're in a position to give, please do.
If you're not and you're just in a position to share,
don't underestimate the value of doing that.
If you can share this message, please feel free.
Get it out there.
Let the world know you might inspire somebody
to change hundreds of lives.
In addition to that, if there's a cause that
is near and dear to your heart right now
and you'd like us to contribute to it,
just drop it in the show notes.
Let us know.
Maybe there's a crowdfunding thing that you're working on.
Maybe there's so many things going on in the world
right now that can be heavy on the heart.
But if you leave it in the comments,
it gives us a chance to perhaps promote it,
contribute to it, and speak out on it.
Now, Daniel Cating has a program about ghostwriting,
about getting your copy out there.
And in addition to that, one of the things
that struck me about his vision was the desire
to make sure that the process of entrepreneurship
is lean, simple, valuable, and approachable.
So we're going to bring him on stage to talk about that.
I'm on the opposite end of that, helping
people realize that business is a lot more complicated
than it looks.
But that doesn't mean that we shouldn't
be looking to streamline it as much as possible
and make the path as easy as we can for those
who are following in our wake.
And so without further ado, Daniel, thanks for joining me
on Vision Pros Live, man.
Yeah.
Thanks for having me.
I really appreciate you bringing me on.
Absolutely.
So my last guest pointed something out.
I'm going to have to change this as we talk, OK?
Because he said, I don't use the S-H-O-U-L-D word,
the should word.
And I don't either.
So it's surprising.
I've had this darn word in my podcast for about 150 episodes
now, somewhere around that.
So if you were to quantify, though,
who's going to benefit from listening
and why they should listen to you today,
what would that look like?
The should word.
OK, OK, I got you now.
So yeah, the why you should listen.
We don't tell people what to do on our show.
Yeah, why you should listen, yeah, or why you
should feel inspired to listen.
I guess I could say that I've been a floundering millennial.
A lot of people.
I went through my 20s, and it was really challenging.
I went to school.
I dropped out of school.
I went and worked in endless industries.
I tried so many different things, from sales
to manufacturing to management to online marketing
to even working for little startups here and there
along the way.
I even charged bird scooters.
I've done a bunch of random stuff.
But I got through school.
I finished up what I was doing.
I knew no matter what, I wanted to do something
bigger with my life.
And I wanted to actually take what was in front of me
and turn it into some sort of opportunity,
make what was nothing and make it into something.
Maybe it was Escobar that said that.
I can't remember.
But it was a cool line.
And it definitely, definitely resonated with me
where it's like, yeah, I had my laptop in front of me.
I knew I knew how to write.
I knew that there was opportunity on this platform.
And there was people that wanted to spend money.
I knew that when I had top CEOs at some of the biggest SaaS
companies in the world commenting on my content,
that there was something magical here.
So I took that initial push and decided
LinkedIn is a good place to invest my time.
I love writing.
It's easy to scale.
It's easy for people to do.
And you don't have to get stuck in the video world
of having to edit videos and all that stuff.
It's easy.
It's simple.
It was right in front of me.
So I took my laptop.
I started freelancing.
I made very, very little money in the beginning
because I didn't know how to value my work.
I didn't know what to price myself at.
But I just kept going.
I kept moving through it.
I kept meeting more and more people who helped me scale up
one day at a time.
Mike was another person I met that helped me scale up.
But there are plenty of other examples of people along the way
that just gave you that helping hand.
They're like, hey, I know how you're doing.
I know how difficult this is.
Here's a few things you can do.
So if anybody's listening to this that feels like they're
floundering and they don't have a damn clue what they're doing
and they feel lost.
And the world of entrepreneurship,
and you think there's so many Alex Hormozis out there
that are building these amazing agencies with amazing
thundercabs and whatnot.
And it's like, think to yourself, I can't be that guy.
I can't be Alex Hormozis.
My sign is to certainly work a lot better.
But at the end of the day, it's one of those things
where we have this image of entrepreneurship.
And it's very, very like, oh, it's like, I'm going to wake up.
I'm going to eat nothing but raw egg yolk.
And I'm going to work out.
And I'm going to eat my AG1.
And I'm going to go crush it at my job.
And I think for a lot of people, a more approachable way
of looking at it is useful.
And so I hope if anybody's listening to it,
that stands out.
Oh my gosh.
I love the fire and the light roasting.
I love Alex.
The light and win-win roasting.
Absolutely.
Now, you dig everything that you just said.
That was beautiful.
You'd be like, oh, you've been paying attention.
Exactly, right?
Exactly.
So what's your vision for those that you serve?
Yeah, I want to help people figure out
how to not only build their own message
and tell a really, really impactful story surrounding
their brand, who they are, their industry,
but also help them grow on a platform like LinkedIn that's
incredibly snooty and button tie and really professional.
And that's changed a lot over the years.
But it's still slowly changing.
And so I really want to help people figure out
that vision for how they can actually build something real
on that platform and do something substantial
for themselves and not have to suffer through the process,
essentially.
So I would say that's my vision for that.
I mean, it's bigger visions, right?
Well, that's good, Noah.
I teach you up to talk about the journey.
I wanted to know that as well, the journey.
Now that we've gone through the journey,
let's talk about the vision of what it looks like for those
who serve once they get to the other side.
What's that going to look like for them?
Yeah, so it's a killer brand with an amazing profile,
of course, and something they can be proud of,
something that tells their story.
But beyond that content, they actually
can be proud of AI imagery that is just amazing,
carousels that they want it.
Not only that, but the words themselves
have been pulled from their brain.
I have a client that's a safety consultant,
and he's in the upper Alberta, Canada.
And he's in a really obscure industry,
and he had no idea what was possible.
And when we got started, I had no idea either.
And as soon as we started posting,
he started realizing, wow, there is a real world of people
out here that want to talk about safety,
they want to talk about leadership.
And it's inspired the living crap out of him.
And so he's having a ton of fun getting 7,000 to 10,000
to 20,000 views on his posts.
And so I want him to come out the other side with a brand,
with momentum.
Even if he only works with me for the 90 days
that we've agreed, I hope I can hold on to him for longer.
But at the end of the day, I want him to have a system
that's in place that he can take and keep running with.
And even if my clients decide they don't want to keep
having me write for them, I want them to see
what's been possible so that they can take it from there.
And if they want to build their business
for the next nine months all by themselves
and continue forward, I think that's awesome.
And I'm happy I helped inspire them to do that.
That's awesome, man.
I like that.
I like the competitive nature and the edge of wanting to,
I don't know, there's just something genuine
and authentic about you, Daniel.
I can't pin it down.
Maybe somebody can articulate this in the comments for me,
but there's just something different.
You got this.
It's like that X factor that just exists.
So we're gonna move on.
Thanks.
I can't pin it, but it's cool, man.
Appreciate that.
Thank you.
What's your vision?
What do you see for yourself?
Yeah, a profitable business that makes really,
really good money that is easy to do for not only my clients
or myself, that's easy to scale,
that's in a place where it's not overly bloated.
And yeah, life is good in that regard.
But I also want to have a good life at home
with my five-year-old daughter.
I might want to have another child with my wife.
I want to make sure that my wife doesn't have to work a ton
in her therapist practice to pay the bills
that I could help pay.
I want to be able to get by.
I live in a very expensive state.
I want to make sure that I'm, of course,
getting into that place that's very solid in that sense.
But I also really want to make sure
that my daughter has a great life for herself.
I love being able to be at home and work in this office
and be able to be a laptop entrepreneur
and be able to drop what I need to do
and go pick her up and take her to and fro
and also help my wife with whatever she needs
in that regard too.
I like being a caregiver and I like being able
to support my family in that domestic sense
where it's like, yeah, I love doing the dishes
and listening to a podcast or learning something on YouTube.
I consider those moments where you can level up
and you can build yourself in those micro moments
where normally you're just wasting your time.
And so I feel like I get to live a really good life
because of that, I'm able to be more involved
and have a higher yield on my time
because I'm not stuck in a manufacturing job
working 12 hours a day for pennies on the dollar
for some rich guy in a different country to,
it just didn't work for me.
And I got away from that.
And so that's ultimately my goal is to stay on that path
and continue building this into something
and finally make back some of those years
I wasn't able to take advantage of in my 20s
and really turn my 30s into something
I can be super proud of and make a nest egg for my family,
all that good stuff, right?
So.
Yeah, I like that.
So there's two different thought leaders who come to mind.
You mentioned Alex Hermosy who talks about Grand Slam offers
for those of you who are new to his subject
or who don't remember, he talks about the best thing
about entrepreneurship.
The reason why we're crazy enough to go after the sacrifice
is that in baseball, when you hit a Grand Slam,
you're limited to four points.
But in entrepreneurship, when you hit a Grand Slam,
the return can be exponential.
You could hit a trillion dollar Grand Slam.
You can hit a billion dollar multimillion, et cetera.
Then there's the Tim Ferriss style.
There's the Tim Ferriss of the four hour work week.
And I read the first couple of chapters of that book.
Loved the book.
I just tend to be a, I tend to read a few chapters
and move on from all books.
But in his book, he talks about the new, the NR, the new rich.
The new rich being the ones who don't
want to be chained to a job, whether it's manufacturing
or a cushy desk job.
But you don't necessarily get all the benefits
of being able to have your cake and eat it too,
being having the full balance of appreciating everything
that life has to offers.
And new rich is all about not necessarily
having a massive bank account saved up,
but being able to have the experiences
that you want in life, the lifestyle components.
And I hear you kind of gravitating towards that message
a bit and what you talk about.
Let me box you in.
But I would say that in essence, both of those realities
represent what I thought growing up was the American dream.
Would you say you're living the American dream?
I'm pretty close to it.
Yes, for sure.
I think even if I'm still in that, in the trenches,
I'm not that six-figure ghost rider yet.
I mean, maybe, yeah, maybe soon.
But like you said, the wind can be huge,
even if the climb up takes a long time.
The result is there if you continue at it
and you actually have the skill set and the desire
and the willingness to pivot and change and evolve.
But yeah, I do feel like I'm,
even if it's a small fraction of it,
I do feel like I'm living that dream.
And I do feel when I'm able to wake up
and not have to get up at five o'clock in the morning
to get to the factory floor by six,
and not even have time to do anything in the morning
that I'm not done with my job until 6 p.m.
And then it takes all the way until about seven o'clock
until I'm home.
And then within three hours, I gotta be able to bed.
You start to feel really, really awful at a certain point.
And so it was like, I went through this really rough period
before my daughter was conceived and then therefore born.
And that was the ultimate catalyst
that forced me to get back into school
and start taking my life more seriously.
I was like, I could become a UPS driver
or I could move in this other direction.
And my wife inspired me to believe in myself
and I'm grateful for her.
I luckily married my high school sweetie.
And so I think there's a lot of my successes owed
to the fact that I've had her to bounce ideas off of.
And yeah, just keep me centered on what I need to do
and also challenge me to say, yeah, you know what?
You're better, you can do more than that.
You can do more than just deliver packages.
You have something to offer.
And here I am and I found some way to offer it.
And so I look back and I couldn't feel more happy about that.
And I can't be more excited for the future.
Man, I would say that's the definition of the American dream
and its fullest right there.
And that's, again, recognizing that change,
optimization, opportunities, cultivating,
you got several decades ahead
and you'll be able to continue to do that.
And those who are listening in,
I'm not trying to box Daniel in as much as I am,
highlighting for all of your sakes
that defining your success,
appreciating the journey as you go,
that's an individual experience.
And while the world can judge you
and the people who like to be critics
tend to be louder than people who like to support as it is
and washing that out, realizing that,
you know what, with an abundant mindset,
we really can have it all.
We really can.
If it's designed for us and we pursue it, then we can.
On the flip side, if I had to choose, right?
If I had to choose and I could only have a lifestyle
where I made between 60,000 and 80,000 a year,
but had the ability to do the things that I want and love
versus make a ton of money
and be successful in a career beyond six figures,
beyond blah, blah, blah, blah, blah,
whatever you wanna put on that out, no way, man.
I would 100%, it'd be so happy.
And that's also why in my roughest of years going this route,
I have been very happy and centered and peace and joy
and realizing, man, what an abundant life we have.
So you resonate with that, Daniel?
Oh, yeah, I mean, you're waxing philosophically to me
at this point.
I mean, that's my journal right there.
Yeah, I mean, and both my parents are entrepreneurs
in very small ways.
My dad ran an HVAC company, pretty boring, right?
But hey, those boring businesses make good money
and I had an opportunity to take it over when I was 20.
But I'm 32 now and I was such an idiot 12 years ago.
I mean, I can't even begin to describe how-
How did you?
You and I were hanging out virtually.
Yeah, I mean, I just felt like I had it all figured out.
Like we all do.
And you look back and you're like,
at the time you're like, no, no, I'm humble.
I got this down, like, you know?
And then you look back and you're like,
wow, I was such an idiot.
And I'm so glad that I turned my dad down
when he offered that business to me.
He said, you can take this over
and you can have it be your own.
His knees were giving out on him.
He was, you know, life is hard on those mechanics, right?
And so he ultimately decided,
tried to sell it to my half brother.
He turned it down too.
And so he sold it to another guy named John
who ended up being his best friend and life is good.
But either way, at the time, if I had taken that business,
it wouldn't have been something I was passionate about.
It would have been yet another thing that I did
because someone else wanted me to do it.
I also would have had to go to class with my dad
at the local community college
because he was an adjunct professor there
for the first six months.
So I didn't wanna do that either.
That would have been just too hard.
So yeah, I look back on those.
I'm grateful I didn't do it.
And as much as at the time I felt like an idiot,
I still sit down, I can tell my dad is disappointed,
but he's happy I'm doing something now.
Even if I didn't take his dream,
I'm creating something for myself that's way better.
I like writing.
I don't like fixing the HVAC equipment.
And so it's just, you're cut out for different things.
So that's my little tangent on that one.
But yes, I think that there's something to be said
for just listening to your intuition and saying,
no, this is not my dream.
And I hate to disappoint you pops,
but I'm gonna figure it out one day
and hopefully I'm there.
Right, dude, no, I love that self-awareness because
that's also liberating to realize that
you may not have had the capacity, right?
I had the same type of opportunities.
And all my parents had an 18-wheeler parking lot
and twice the ice machine.
They sold that recently,
but it started with just the parking lot.
And they did really, really well with that.
Really, really well, meaning again,
the, that's not an Alex or Mozi dream by any means,
but it definitely provided.
And they also owned several, they own several different
houses and they wanted me to buy into a fourplex
when I had the opportunity, I would have blown it.
I did not have the disciplines in place to maintain.
They wanted me to take over the business perhaps too.
I would have blown it.
I did not have those disciplines in place.
It wasn't my passion.
It wasn't my purpose.
It, yeah, I couldn't have done it.
Did you go through a similar thought process?
You can recognize that.
I was just gonna say,
did you go through a similar thought process?
You were in my journal.
Yes, you were 100% in my journal as well.
I was like, whoa, man, we get each other on.
I think a lot of the people listening again get that.
But if you're where I was, you know,
when you were in like your twenties or earlier years on that,
like give some grace to yourself.
It's okay.
You know, you, you know, you got to figure out you
and find the right mentors along the way.
That's what this is all about.
So Daniel, what, let's switch gears completely.
What's the worst leadership experience
that you've ever seen or been part of, either one?
Well, I love to dovetail stuff in.
So let's, let's just stay on the manufacturing topic here.
Okay, let's do it.
So yeah, cause I, cause I left,
I left in not in the best terms with my last job.
And, and you know, rightfully so.
They, they took about 18 months
to hire me on as a full-time employee.
You know, it was already terrible work.
It was already very low pay.
It was hours that were so brutal,
but it was, it was a classic 1980 style company.
And they were, they were the type to,
as soon as things got difficult, they got scared.
They started laying people off.
And if you had even the slightest blip on your record,
you were done.
It didn't matter who you were.
And so all this fear would start to crescendo
across the whole entire company.
And I know this is a very common story
for a lot of tech companies,
but for me, it was a new experience night.
And I know that that's, that's,
I'm very privileged in that sense, but,
and I know that's just like how life is for some people.
And a lot of the engineers I worked with
had been laid off multiple times
and brought back and thrown around like a rag doll.
It was unbelievable what they were putting up with.
And so I had a boss and she,
for some reason did not like me.
I don't really know what I did wrong along the way.
I really tried to be as heartfelt and appreciative
that she gave me a step up.
I was able to run the machines finally,
and I was excited about that.
But I, but as time went on,
I started to figure out that she had,
she had it out for me.
And she was not listening to the things I was saying.
She was, she was actively valuing
other people's opinions over mine.
The other people were making stuff up about me
and I was finding out about it.
And I had corroborating, I had to like,
I had to develop a whole entire like collection of stuff
because then I had to take my boss to HR
because she was threatening to fire me
if I did not, if I was not at work
for a specific amount of time.
And my daughter was about to be born
and I was starting to stress out
that I was gonna lose my job
if I went to see the birth of my daughter.
There was some sort of weird conflict
in the, in the, some weird red tape basically.
And that was what was causing this problem.
And she would not allow me the grace to understand
that I was not actually gonna get laid off
if I had left for a specific,
at a specific time at some unforeseen moment.
And so I had to take her to HR
and sit down with the top boss
of the entire like 3000 person organization
and my HR lady, her boss and my boss.
And I had to sit down and give this whole presentation
with all these emails that I collected,
all these screenshots, all these different witnesses
and sign-offs.
I found a bunch of people who were willing to speak for me
because I did not wanna lose my job.
I was about to have my daughter.
I wanted to make sure I had money coming in.
I was already not gonna be able to take very much time off.
And so anyways, I took her to HR.
I ended up getting her and she was like the last straw
was like the 12th complaint she had gotten
or something like that.
And I was the final straw.
When I was walking out of there,
the main boss looked at me and said,
can you shut the door?
Me and your boss have something we need to talk about.
And so from that point forward,
I was promised I wouldn't lose my job.
But at that point, I was just so upset with that place.
I went on FMLA.
I started driving Uber and Lyft full-time
while my daughter was very, very young
and my wife was recovering from her C-section.
And I realized I could make just as much money
driving Uber three nights a week,
as I could at that previous job.
And I started to realize,
wow, the healthcare wasn't that great either.
And so I could not believe how horrid that lady
had ran that team and how she had basically created
a entire and toxic environment of nepotism and favoritism
and people just telling tattles on each other.
It was like a corrupt government with a bunch of people
that were all trying to get each other in trouble.
It just felt horrible.
And I will never wanna work on a team like that again,
or in an environment like that again,
where you not only don't like the work,
but you're constantly worried you're gonna lose your job.
And you have people making up stuff about you
who are only interested in their own needs
at the end of the day.
So yeah, long story short,
that was one of the worst experiences.
And it was-
Did she get let go?
She got demoted to a office job at that same place.
So she didn't get fired,
but she got demoted out of leadership
because I think they realized
that she just wasn't cut out for it.
And the lady that was making up stuff about me
eventually got fired for the exact same thing.
But I basically pulled the thing, chucked the grenade in,
and I headed out to go have my daughter.
And I was just getting all these rumors from everybody.
They're like, dude, things are crazy.
Roxanne got demoted, blah, blah, blah.
And I'm like, oh man, dude, I don't know what to tell you.
That place is such a mess.
So yeah, I looked back at that.
It was just the perfect sort of like send off.
And when I told my other boss that I was quitting
and I was leaving, I was gonna go back to school,
I was expecting him to give me some sort of sob thing.
He was like, oh, that's a great idea, man.
I kinda wish I had done that.
And then I get off the phone with him.
And I'm like, all right, I think I did the right thing.
There you go.
Yeah, that's cool that he supported you on that.
And that's in such a tough environment.
And it's always great to find those
who are diplomatic enough to go through that.
But I think he's kind of speaking to you
through his own experience.
I mean, he said it directly.
We shouldn't mince words.
He said, I kinda wish I had done that.
Yeah.
Right?
It was very eye-opening, right?
I'm like, okay, yeah.
I think I'm good.
And you brought it up.
You said some people, this is their norm.
And we hear the words.
You hear things like, oh man, millennials.
They're so dramatic.
Or Gen Z doesn't work, blah, blah, blah.
There's these labels that are placed
by the generations who just accept that.
But while I can't say you're Rosa Parks
or you're Martin Luther King,
you're not leading a civil revolution by any means,
there's still an element of leadership
that's occurring throughout the US
of people who are saying, you know what?
It's important that we have healthy cultures
in the workforce.
And thank God, people are speaking up.
Then they're willing to approach that
and say, we really can make things better.
That's what it's about.
So speaking of making things better,
what's the best leadership experience you've ever had?
I would say Mark from Social Media Examiner
did really, really well by priming you
to get on stage and putting you on there.
But let's find a new one.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, life is such a rich mosaic, right?
I feel like I could go in almost any direction.
Let me think for just one second, one more second.
I feel like I have a really good one on the tip of my tongue.
Yeah, I don't know.
It's, I think this one stands out a lot to me
because it was a turning point in my own life.
I got into a little bit of trouble in high school.
I got expelled for a couple of things.
I won't mention what, but it was a rough time in my life
and I was getting into trouble at school.
And I just, my grades went to shit.
I had to go to either,
my parents basically gave me an option of military school
or alternative high school.
And I was like, all right,
I'm gonna go to alternative high school.
I wanna get done with school.
I don't wanna go there.
That would be horrifying.
I think they may have just been joking,
but I thought they were serious.
So I was like, okay,
I'm gonna go to alternative high school.
We had a really good one here in my town.
It was very small, like 130, 150 kids, not very big,
very, very different.
They had this like discovery program
you had to do at the beginning.
So you have to learn life skills, eye messages,
how to communicate, how to be a reasonable individual.
Basically.
Things that 90% of high school students
should already be in and miss.
Yeah, yeah. Great.
Yeah, okay, awesome.
It's a great thing.
You just solved what's broken with our system.
Yeah, every high school should have this discovery program.
It's actually quite universal.
And I think my dean even went out
and did some public talks on it
and how useful it was to the student population.
So anyways, I remember my dean, Eric,
he was this real brash, like old school dude,
but he also liked to meditate.
And he looked like a classic conservative guy,
but he was also into all this Eastern philosophy.
And so he was very interesting,
but he had a very big impact on my life.
And in a lot of ways,
he was just very good at creating a metaphor.
And I had just gotten in a ton of trouble.
And I was on probation at the time.
I was going through a lot in my high school era.
My parents thought I was gonna end up in jail, whatever.
It was a rough patch in my life.
But I got through it.
And I got through it because of people like Eric,
because Eric talked to us,
there was a whole classroom of people,
but I felt like I was really engaged.
So I was like, you know what?
I messages, yeah, I need to communicate in a way
that the world doesn't react poorly to.
Then he starts talking about a lot of these different things
where a lot of people crash the plane.
And he starts talking about the plane.
He's like, a lot of times you're in the process
of getting through this thing called discovery,
which was the class we were doing,
but it's also life.
You're in the middle of building something big,
like me going out to San Diego
to talk in front of 2000 plus professional marketers.
I could have easily crashed that plane.
I could have gone up on that stage and I could have tripped.
I could have said something horrible.
I could have flopped and I could have stuttered, whatever.
And none of that happened.
And I look back on experiences like that with Eric,
where he talks about how, you know,
like don't crash the plane, just complete the trip.
You know, like don't get to the very tail end of a project
and decide that you're just done and that you bail out.
There was so much of that in high school
where kids just dip out, tune in, turn off and drop out.
You know, Timothy Leary or whatever.
And it's like, a lot of people do that stuff
and it really is not good.
And it happens so often.
And across generations, across demographics,
people just give up.
And it's like, if you just went that extra 10%,
you would have succeeded and you would have crushed it
and you would have been so proud of yourself.
And so I think I always look back to Eric
and the things he taught me in high school
and how he kind of helped me decide
that I was not gonna be another deadbeat.
I was gonna get some things done.
I got done with probation.
I got out of trouble.
I was fine.
I finished my college degree and life is good.
But it was looking a little rocky there.
But thankfully for people like Eric and his leadership,
I was able to move forward.
That's amazing.
I'll leave that right where it's at.
Perfectly, perfectly succinct.
So what powerful lesson can other visionaries learn
from your experience?
And this would be, if this is the last lesson
that you could share ever, what would it be?
Yeah, I think you should believe,
I don't know, that sounds almost too cliche.
You should truly believe that you have the ability
to actually complete what you do.
I mean, I remember when I first got started freelancing,
I thought, this is a joke.
I'm like, no one's ever gonna hire me.
Hell no.
What?
No, I'm offering services on LinkedIn.
What is this?
At the time, I was a content checker.
I wasn't even doing ghost writing.
I didn't have any of that in the game plan.
I was just trying to figure it out.
And within five days, I wrote a few posts.
And this guy, Juan Pico, out of the East Coast,
hired me for pennies on the dollar.
And I worked for him for a little bit.
But either way, that first stepping stone
was the exact thing I needed.
So I think a lot of times, if you're a visionary,
that's great.
But how do you actually get started?
And how do you keep moving down that path
and continuing that momentum towards actually succeeding
at the goal you had a vision about to begin with?
And I think it's harnessing those moments and understanding
when they're happening and being able to build on top of that
and create calluses and create understanding and realize
that confidence comes with time.
And if you don't have the confidence yet,
you've got to do a few small things before you're
going to have it.
And if you don't believe in yourself yet,
well, you've got to do more stuff to actually believe
in yourself.
And so I think not giving up and just continuing
forward down that path and realizing
that you have exactly what you need from all the experiences
that you've gone through to understand something
new that's coming at you, if you just pull back
your own lens and your own ego and try to understand it
for what it is.
I'm a big Breaking Bad fan.
And it's like Waltz would have never
been found out if Hank hadn't removed his ego
and realized that the bad man was right in front of him
the entire time.
And it was once he got stuck in that wheelchair
and he was stuck at home and he couldn't think
about anything else, he figured out who Heisenberg was.
And so I think there's a lot of that in what we're doing,
where it's like pull back your ego,
listen to what's going on, pivot as you go
and as you learn more and more feedback
and as you get more and more input from the outside world
and just keep building on that vision until you get there.
And it's like people don't believe it's possible
until it's possible, right?
So until all of a sudden it's in front of them
and you're looking at it.
One of the key things that you just did there too
that I'm going to highlight for other visionaries
is that you spoke directly to your specific audience.
You went into a language that I don't speak
and that's a beautiful thing.
That's what really connects people.
You talk about Breaking Bad for instance.
I don't know, I never finished that series.
I won't be too hard on you.
Right?
But if you're a visionary
and you're wanting to connect to people,
telling stories like that, going into the lingo
that other people don't have is critical.
Also recognizing the value of your own cliches, right?
Now, if I had a multimillion dollar podcast,
what we would have done right now
is we would have thrown the song,
Believe by Josh Groban behind you
just to lightly roast you a little bit as you shared that.
But I'm also a big fan of the concept.
So if we could just believe in ourselves, right?
And I do like the instance of using the word should there.
You should believe in your vision, in your purpose,
in your passion, what you got going on, right?
And if you could crack that mindset, that'd be huge.
You also mentioned confidence.
Dan Martell, I heard him speak about how,
for his sales team, if his sales team's having a rough time
or rough moment, he'll go in there and he'll say,
okay, everybody, 10 pushups.
Right?
You think that's kind of like authoritarian
and like totalitarian.
Why is he?
No, it's because when you,
confidence is the process of completing
what you say you're going to do.
And so when you tell yourself, I'm gonna do,
I don't care if it's three pushups, you know,
or three squats, if you will tell yourself to do something
and then do it, you then gain confidence
because you're completing the actions
that you set out to do.
I was like, that's a brilliant life hack.
So your-
Dan Martell, Dan Martell.
You followed him too?
Yeah, he actually even reached out to me in the DMs
and I was chatting with him one time.
I'm like, wow.
That's pretty cool.
This rose quill is so small, you know?
He was trying to vet me to bring me on his client.
I was very polite about it, but I was like, yeah.
Anyways, I had bad respect, mad respect.
But-
That's cool, I wonder if it was his assistant or him.
Go ahead.
At first it was, and then he took over
and I was like vetting his whole entire sales process.
Nice.
Cool.
I was like, what are you doing, man?
But I was just gonna say one more thing,
like, you know, skateboarding, you know,
jumping down stair sets.
I always try to bring it up
and especially is applicable to this, you know?
Like there were times when I thought I couldn't land a trick
and my parents thought I was just goofing off
at the skate park, you know, smoking weed,
doing nothing with my time.
But I actually was learning how to be growth-minded.
I was learning how to do a trick, you know,
somewhat blackout in the middle of doing it.
And then all of a sudden I'm riding away
from something I thought I could not do.
And now I know I can do that.
And now I'm starting to think what else can I do?
And now I'm doing more tricks
and now I'm going to the park and I'm learning five tricks
every time I go there rather than one,
or now I'm learning 10 and you start to level up.
And so the skateboard is a great microcosm for,
and it's that language, right?
You know, skateboarders,
there's so many in my generation, right?
And it became the cool thing during the millennial era.
Now it's not even that cool anymore.
But you know, like it's so mainstream, right?
Everybody's wearing a Sarraschur hoodie is what I mean.
But at the end of the day, it's, yeah.
So there's something to that where it's like, you know,
just allowing yourself to believe you can do it,
committing to it.
And like you said,
knowing that you actually completed the task
and looking back at that task and saying,
I can do that again and I can do it even better, right?
So sorry to interrupt.
Sorry to interrupt.
No, dude, no, I loved it.
Flow, hit it, Flow.
So let's take a few extra minutes if you're okay with that.
We're a little bit over,
but I do wanna make sure we honor people who are tuned in
to talk about this lean, simple, valuable,
and approachable entrepreneurship path.
What does that look like to you, Daniel?
How do you, do you have like a process streamlined for that?
Or is it more of a mantra that you're looking to help people
build and solidify?
Curious.
I think it's more of a mantra.
I wish I could say I had like it lined up.
I just think the world is so,
it's just there's so many things that you can do
that to have a specific grid or structure to me
just feels almost limiting.
Cause for me, it was like the only reason
I chose ghost writing is because I'm a writer.
I started out writing at 17 years old.
I've been doing it ever since then.
Eventually I got bored with the whole poetry
and going to slams and performing and stuff.
So to bring that back to,
I do have a little bit of performance experience,
but it's not in that exact same way.
But I think that there's something to be said
for that experience and those things
that you've done throughout your life.
So if you started out as a designer,
or if you're doing something that you've already
have experience with,
I think it's good to pick up on those things
and take them further.
And it's like, if you're really good at messaging
and copywriting, you're really great at figuring out
what makes something valuable.
If you're able to see through the trees
to see the actual forest or whatever that phrase is,
you're not blinded by all this other stuff
and you can actually tell the human emotion
behind something, lean in on that, get better at that,
turn that into a sellable asset that you can pitch
to an audience of people that actually wanna pay for it.
And the list goes on from website to,
maybe you're good with numbers
and you wanna be an accountant,
but you don't wanna be a traditional accountant.
So you wanna do it online or whatever else.
I think that there's a certain mantra of like,
AI is changing the world right now.
We haven't discussed that because it's such a big topic,
but I think that AI offers a lot of people online
the ability to scale up so much faster
and do things that they were never able to do before.
Like me with Mid Journey, all of a sudden
I look like I'm a designer or something,
but I can prompt something because I'm a copywriter.
I'm really good at imagining things.
And so now that I know how to use Mid Journey
and I can do AI generated art,
and now that I'm able to add that
to what I'm able to do with my clients,
I don't have to hire a designer
to do a bunch of random pictures.
I can actually generate that with a set of prompts
in a matter of a minute.
So that's just one example.
And then beyond that,
like using AI to transcribe my meetings.
Before I used to type everything out my clients were saying,
or I'd record the call and then come back through.
It was daunting.
But now I just have Otter AI and it does the whole thing
and life is totally different.
That was what my post was about today.
And so I think there's a lot to the world right now
that's allowing people to skip all the hassle
and just use the software to solve a problem
and then provide a better result
for the person on the back end.
My client up in Alberta is amazed
that these loom recordings I send him
where I'm recording myself on the screen,
I'm showing him his results.
And he's just so amazed.
He's like, this is so cool.
I love this.
And I'm like, to me, it's just normal daily stuff.
But that stuff, as you build it into your processes
makes you way more competitive.
So I think keeping it lean,
understanding there's so many things there
that cost less than a Netflix subscription
to just add to your portfolio
that make you way more valuable.
And so if you're able to bring all that stuff in
and continue to build into your processes
and just make it so that you don't even necessarily
need a team, I have a whole bunch of other people
I'm connected with, a LinkedIn profile designer,
a carousel designer, a blog writer, an email writer.
I have all these different people.
They don't work for me, but I'm connected with them.
And so I work almost as like a giant agency
even if I don't have all the headaches
of a traditional agency.
I can provide those results
without having a giant bloated team
that's waiting for a paycheck.
I have just other freelancer friends
that work white label for me.
And so I think that there's a lot in the mentality
of thinking really lean, how can I do this
but not commit a ton of money and hire a bunch of people
that I may have to fire in three months?
Cause I've been hired for agencies like that twice.
And it's like, do I really need to be here?
So I think that's a big part of it.
So I hope that answers your question to some degree
or it's like, it's a mindset thing.
Yeah, absolutely. And you know, we're,
take this with a grain of salt, Daniel,
also the visionaries that are listening in to everything
that we share is gonna be imperfect.
Everything that I share is gonna be imperfect.
It's my truth.
And I'm learning as I go, Daniel's learning as he goes too.
Being simple, valuable, approachable,
I'm a big fan of all of these concepts.
And I'm a big believer that all of them do apply
to the entrepreneur's journey.
One of the words that I'm not a fan of though
that we used early on was easy.
And the reason why is I just,
I believe that the best things in life
take a great deal of effort.
Skateboarding being one,
I highly doubt skateboarding was easy at first.
Maybe it's still not, right?
It depends on what you're after.
Michael Phelps, for instance, breaking his world record.
That's not an easy thing to do, you know,
but he, you know, he goes, and he knows how to swim.
So swimming easy for him?
Probably at this point, you know,
but is it easy to achieve what he wants to achieve?
Not necessarily.
And so, and again, taking these words as a grain of salt,
also knowing that your family or your circumstances,
you're gonna face certain risks
no matter which path you go down as visionaries,
again, who are listening in.
And so careful not to put your family in jeopardy
by taking these concepts and oversimplifying them, right?
Or putting them into place
without realizing there's more formulas
that work behind the scenes on this.
I'd hate to see somebody do that.
And then later be like, well, you guys, you know,
said it was easier, simple.
It is, but there's still complexities that exist
within the realities of becoming a visionary
that should be accounted for.
So one of the things I'm referring to right now,
and that would be that while you can do it alone,
the abundance mindset says that, you know,
you don't need a team,
but could a team empower you
and make your processes that much better?
Possibly, it's possible.
J.K. Rowling, I would have done her a disservice
that I told her, hey, don't write that book on a napkin.
That's not a smart formula, right?
She became a billionaire by doing that.
So while the formulas and the strategies,
they also make sense,
we still have to recognize that the visionary
is going to have fantastic intuition,
comes to their heart and mind and helps them on their path.
And if we can supplement that with strategies
just as she did with the publishers that she went to,
then we're more susceptible
to the opportunities of winning than losing.
So there's a whole lot of different channels
we can look at on that.
What I want everybody to know is that I believe wholeheartedly
in these virtues that Daniel has talked about
and shared about, lean, simple, valuable, approachable.
Those are all concepts to dive into deeper
and potentially learn about.
Anything else you want to add, Daniel?
No, I really appreciate the reframe.
I think I'm looking back and like, yeah, it is not easy.
I think that I want there to be a system there
that my clients can tap into.
And I think that's what I mean by easy,
but yeah, it's not easy.
There is that 20% of like, yeah,
we're gonna 40% run your content,
we're gonna do 40% email,
but the other 20% is you being on the platform
and crushing it and actually communicating
and doing those touch points.
So you're totally right.
No matter what,
nothing is another good line to look at on this.
I don't want to forget this.
I want to honor your wife on this regard too,
and you.
Justin Breen was on earlier today
and he's been married for 20 plus years.
I'm twice divorced.
I mean, I get a lot to learn about relationships.
I mean, we all do, but,
what's there?
And your wife works as well, you mentioned.
So we also have to be accountable
and aware of our own life circumstances
and how anybody giving advice,
if Daniel's giving advice to me,
I need to be aware of his variables
and whether he's aware of my variables or not, right?
If you're the sole provider for your family
and you don't have somebody else bringing in,
being a breadwinner with you,
then again, you've got to look at the formula and say,
okay, again, my variables are different than this advisor's.
So I have to be aware,
and I can blame Daniel all day long for telling,
no, Daniel, you said this would work for me too.
I could take that victim's mentality approach
and put that on him,
but it's my responsibility to hear what is necessary
for my vision to move forward
and to realize that he's speaking to me from his truth,
not necessarily a universal paradigm at all times.
So, dude, this was super awesome.
I appreciate you bringing all the wisdom
that you've brought into place,
especially for young entrepreneurs,
meaning young minds that are looking
to expand their skill sets,
get out in the market and test the waters.
I don't think there's ever been a better time in life,
in the world for you to have all the assets necessary
to streamline the process.
There's a lot of overwhelm to those.
So use that with prudence,
find some mentors as Gary Vee talks about,
find five to 10 people who you admire,
who are 10 years ahead of you in the process,
and go start asking them what they would do
if they were in your shoes,
and make sure they don't have anything in return,
like to gain out of that process too.
You want people who have unbiased opinions
coming into your life.
The biased ones matter too,
but all young people listening,
I hope that helps you.
Thanks for letting me be the old guy for a minute
and preach at you.
But dude, this is awesome.
And we look forward to seeing,
I look forward to having you back on the show,
but for the power take,
it's a different show that we have.
Oh, really?
I've been into some news,
and picking your brain about LinkedIn and copyrighting.
I love that.
That would be fun.
Sign me up, sign me up.
I've appreciated this, it's been good.
And it's nice to talk about the bird's eye.
Everybody's always like,
how do you build a perfect profile,
or what's your ideal post?
And I'm like, yeah,
as much as my opinion matters,
it's like, I also think that you can do whatever you want,
and you can build it in whatever system you want.
And as much as there is a layout,
it's an art form,
and anything, when it comes to art,
there's always some room for malleability.
So I appreciate you,
and thanks for having me on.
I really have had a good time.
Yeah, man.
And Vision Pros, if you wanna apply for the show,
feel free to do so.
Also on the landing page,
we will have links for reference
so you can get in touch with Daniel,
and we will see you on the next episode.
Take care, everybody.
Thank you for being here today.
I'm really happy that you tuned in to Vision Pros Live.
I'm looking forward to seeing your reactions
as these episodes continue to move forward.
This is gonna get more and more fun.
We'll have more and more engagement as well.
We'll invite people to participate in the show,
and thank you for giving us your time and attention.
Have an excellent.