Amazon and Thrive Market.
And then we have a few, some especially retailers, mostly outside of the US.
So we'll be getting into more as we move forward.
But right now,
What was that like?
Um, so you guys launched, did you launch with big plans for physical locations?
Or did you launch with big plans for direct to consumer?
The plan was always direct to consumer and eventually go under retail.
One of the things we did was, um, when we launched, we had to
pivot some of our, our products.
Um, we had, we had a hand sanitizer that we were planning to launch in 21.
Um, it was already formulated and just better for you.
Everything that we do on us is creating really high quality products, um, with
the best ingredients you can find, um, products that are better for you.
Cause what you put on your body, you're putting in your body and most hand
sanitizer, it dries you out because it's all alcohol based.
Well, ours is as well.
We've added additional herbs and things like that.
So it is moisturizing as well as, um, just, just cleansing and not trying out.
So we had planned to launch that in a spring of, or winter of 2021, but then
when COVID happened, um, we were about to launch a dry shampoo and we couldn't
get some of our components, like our cardboard tubes or composable cardboard
tubes because of the supply chain issues.
So we had to pivot and we launched the hand sanitizer instead.
And so that was when couldn't find it and everything.
And so that was, that did really well.
And it also almost got our Shopify store shut down.
Because they reached out and said, you are price gouging because I mean, it's
a higher price product, it was 10, 10 bucks, um, a bottle, I think.
And I was like, are you kidding me?
Price gouging?
We have the worst margins on this of any of our product.
Look at this, look at the ingredients we're using and we're using glass, um,
tubes or glass bottles that are recyclable or reusable as well.
And so after I sent all this info, um, they're like, okay, it's fine.
But I'm like, you're telling me you're going to make a unilateral decision.
Then you're going to shut down our company.
Because you think that we're price gouging and that so, yeah, it's interesting
to see when companies, publicly traded companies on the less are trying to make
a value decision on your business when they know nothing about it.
So that was right.
Oh, it makes it hard.
Okay.
That's interesting.
So, I mean, a lot of people got into that space because of the incident, but
you're saying that you guys were already, that was already on your roadmap.
That was in a roadmap.
Here's just, we had to, we had to speed it up because it was, we had planned to
launch the hand sanitizer.
Cause it was, we had planned to launch that in like a year later, um, or less
than a year and then COVID happened, which we had no idea that was coming down the
pipe until we just pivoted.
And so we launched our dry shampoo, um, six months later, I guess.
So one of the idea for, um, the second business, free wild gear.
When was that incubated?
Oh man, that was over a decade ago.
That was me and my brothers.
Yeah.
That was me and my brother sitting around a campfire drinking bourbon
and comparing knives.
And we've always been gear heads and just, um, love the outdoors.
And so we're just comparing our knives and asking the question, if you were
going to design your own, what would it look like?
What would you do differently than the knife you have on your knives?
Cause we all had multiple knives with us.
Yeah.
Um, you know, sitting there drinking bourbon, chatting, telling stories,
whittling or whatever.
And so we kind of had this idea of one day we'll make our own knives, we'll
create our own knife company.
And then when COVID rolled around, I had this realization that, uh, with all
the lockdowns and everything, the one thing that people could do was still
get in nature and go camping and hunting.
And, you know, cause you're, you're isolated, you're, you're in nature,
you're away from people.
And like, there's no time like the present to start it, so actually push
this thing forward and create it.
So, um, we did that and then, uh, we launched in August of 21.
Nice.
So you and your brothers, you're, you're stuck in the wilderness for the rest of
your life, who's the last man standing?
Oh, that's definitely me.
All right.
Welcome in to vision pros live with Jackson Calame.
I'm your show host.
We'll be doing interviews for visionary entrepreneurs and guest leaders who are
building fantastic visions out there.
Hey, what's up and welcome into vision pros live.
I'm your show host Jackson Calame founder and CEO of first-class business.
I'm excited to have Seth Spears on today.
We're going to be talking about sustainability entrepreneurship, quality
over quantity with a gentleman who has a, uh, a direct to consumer store called
wellness, as well as rewild gear.
One of them in, in, uh, well, both of them in physical product space and with
missions that overlap, um, for what I would call that he's not gonna like this word,
but self care.
Uh, when I say that taking care of ourselves, so making sure that we're living
holistically, that we're paying attention to both what we need in the world, as
well as the world itself.
Um, and I think it's really cool and inspiring.
So we're going to get into that in just a minute.
Um, but before we do always to help those of you who are in your growth processes,
we use cold click for LinkedIn automation.
Um, and this helps us get in front of excellent people, just like Seth, um, on
a daily basis and ensures that my systems never, I mean, one thing about having
automation in places, it never gets sick.
Um, the internet could go down, I guess.
Um, you know, and, and then pretty much everything that you're doing in the
digital marketing space is going to also struggle, but we have a very consistent
flow of leads and people who either want to work with us or want to come onto our
show.
Thanks to this process, it also builds up our brand awareness and our followership
and our reach.
Um, and that's really one of those things that, uh, you just, you gotta keep
building consistently, reliably be out in the market, showcase what you're up to.
And it can lead to amazing things.
In addition to fine tuning the message that allows people to warm up to you and
say, huh, this person is intriguing.
They're inviting.
They, they have an attractive profile.
You really want to work on those things before you go straight for the conversion.
And I see most people, and this, this hurts my heart.
Most of the entrepreneurs I see out there, they're using these very wild, um,
tenacious, aggressive messages that some conversion expert has taught you to use.
And the bulk of your best leads, the ones who know what you're doing are avoiding
you and saying, no, I don't, I don't really want to work with this person who's
just trying to manipulate me into a business transaction.
So be aware of that.
Um, you know, and consider maybe backing off a little bit and starting over with
something like, hi, how are you?
That would be far better than trying to force case studies down people's
throat in most cases.
All right.
Simply fast websites.
Shane Michael built this.
When I saw it, I was like, man, I wish I'd found something like somebody like him
back in the day, he's on websites starting $179.
If I was starting over from scratch right now, I didn't have a team.
I didn't know where to go.
That's one of the first places I'd go is see if I could, if I could find out from
him what he's doing for those $179 and he'd probably win the bid.
I wouldn't waste any time on Squarespace anymore or on Wix or on Weebly or on
more on WordPress.
I kind of dated myself there.
Um, but I wouldn't, I wouldn't waste time building the website.
I go out into the market and talk to people about my solutions and what I'm up to.
Um, that's productivity leads to profitability.
Being busy with things like trying to build a website that you're going to
change anyway, being busy leads to being broke.
So it's very important to be doing the right things.
That's one of those great tips that can help a lot of you entrepreneurs with.
Try to avoid micromanaging your website and move right into your service
model and how to create something of high quality.
And again, that's fierce.
Is it going to be talking with us about just that too?
The water project.
I will always talk about the water project or something similar on this show.
We've been talking about the water project for two years now.
And the big reason why is because I have not seen an organization that is easier
for me to catch the vision of supporting.
There are millions of people in this world who don't even have access to clean
drinking water.
And that's one of our base needs.
When you look at something like Mazzo's hierarchy of needs, if you haven't heard
of that, I highly recommend checking it out.
It can be very influential and knowing how to assist and help people transpire
and achieve their best life.
These individuals, you know, you notice these kids on the screen right now.
They're celebrating water as though it were Christmas day.
Um, and while that's a beautiful reality and I'm, I'm glad that they have that
sense of gratitude, it also hurts my heart to think about my own kids.
And if my own kids had to celebrate that much just for having water in their life.
So if you're in a position to where you can, you can contribute to that, please do.
And you're going to get a notification updates from them about what's going on
with the project, what's being built, as well as the completion of the project.
You get to see these lives transformed.
If you're not in a position to donate, then we ask that you just share that
information with somebody else who might be able to, and that could be a full on
share for your group that could be tagging somebody, a specific person that
you know also aligns with that type of mission.
If you are passing through difficult times, or you know somebody who is, and
you've got a different cause to support.
And we also recommend dropping that in the comments.
We want to create a community of people who are open to sharing with each other
and helping each other out.
And we, uh, we want to support your missions as well.
So without further ado, let's dive into Seth Spears background a little bit.
Um, my, uh, my LinkedIn page is not loading properly.
Um, so I won't be, I won't be sharing his, uh, his exact story on LinkedIn,
but you will have the access to share, uh, his, his story on LinkedIn in our
show notes to see where he comes from.
I always love to see where entrepreneurs come from, what it is that they did in
the past that led them to where they are today.
Um, but without further ado, let's just bring them in on stage and talk to him
about his actual, uh, current, current companies, Richard Branson.
Um, all right, Seth, good to have you on the show, man.
Thanks Jackson.
You know, something you said when you were talking about one of the ads, it
just really struck with me.
I actually got a note down here being busy leads to being broke.
I'm going to be thinking about that quite a bit over the next few days.
Cause that's really interesting.
Cause I do find myself being very busy at times and not always doing those
things that are the most focused or that are best serving to me and my businesses.
So thank you for bringing that up and giving me some food for thought there.
Absolutely.
And Cynthia, thank you for saving the day.
She's got that LinkedIn profile pulled up that will not load on my screen.
Um, so anybody who's watching in, of course, you'll be able to, to
scroll along and look through that.
Maybe it's listening.
You can see that later.
Uh, you know, Seth, that, that quote is one that I, it's one of those quotes
that I like to remember regularly.
Um, you know, it's so easy in the world of, of abundance to be busy.
Um, you know, to end up doing what is good or what is comfortable versus
what is great and what is driving my growth forward.
Um, so I appreciate your humility on that.
Uh, you, you are also, um, you know, from what I've, what I've learned about you,
we've had two conversations and both conversations you've been super on point,
very clear about what it is that you do.
Um, so I'd say you, you live this productivity thing quite well, but
definitely don't sit back on rest on your laurels as they say, because I'm,
I'm complimenting you.
I know you won't.
So who should be listening today?
Who do you think is going to get the most out of this conversation?
And Seth, based on, you know, your background, do me a favor, interlace
some of what you can't see online about you into the reality of, of why we're
talking about sustainability, quality and entrepreneurship.
Oh man.
That's a great question.
Um, at my core, I'm a big picture thinker.
I connect dots.
I'm always looking for meaning and how do we do things?
What drives us?
What, what pushes us as people, as humanity forward?
Um, my motto for most of my life has been quality over quantity.
And I want the best.
I want to work with the best people, the highest quality ones, those
who are doing amazing things.
And so that's kind of everything that I've done over the years is to look at
what's the long-term outcome and not just the short-term way to make
money or to get something.
Um, I've been called a Renaissance man, uh, just because I have so many
varied interests and I always have.
When I was a child, I read through the entire encyclopedia of
cover to cover just because I was so just fascinated with wonder about the world.
Wow.
Um, you know, what, what makes me tick?
Um, what makes people tick and who they are.
And so I just have this fascination and curiosity with the natural world,
with business, with, with people and the human condition.
Um, and for a long time, I got away from that just, and I think that was
some of the projections based on culture, society, religion, family,
just, okay, this is what we should do.
This is the path you should go on.
And over the past few years, as I went through a divorce and massive life
changes and just rediscovering who I am at my core, what makes me me?
What is intrinsic?
What is true to my very being, my inner child and letting that come
forth to figure out where am I going in this next iteration of Seth?
And that just gets back to my core of just curiosity.
Uh, and quality and just connecting with people and learning more about them.
And how can I be of service and value?
Love that.
When, uh, when CNN or Fox get ahold of this interview and they decided to
twist what you said with a headline, it's going to really, it's going to read.
Religion pulls man away from encyclopedia.
Uh,
so what's your vision for those that you serve?
My vision for those that I serve is be a light to look at things differently,
to get outside of the very narrow worldview that most people have.
Uh, it's very easy in business, in family life, and so many things
were so inundated by being busy, you know, and so many things were so
inundated by being busy, you know, um, by everything that we have going on
to just focus on one thing, we get tunnel vision in a lot of ways.
And so my vision for those is to take a step back, let's slow down and let's
look at a top-down approach to everything.
How can we think outside the box?
How can we think differently?
How can we connect dots that other people aren't seeing to create a better world,
to create better products and services, better families, just a better
environment in all that we do.
I like that.
And, uh, let's talk about your vision a bit.
Um, so what does your vision look like on the horizon?
Yeah.
My vision is to continue to create amazing quality products
that are better for you.
Um, so for example, my company, wellness, we make all natural personal
care products that are better for you.
We use the cleanest ingredients.
Um, we're B Corp certified.
We are really pushing the envelope as far as sustainability goes with our
packaging, because we use, um, composable packaging.
And so we want to make sure that everything that we're putting on our
body is perfectly safe because what you put on your body, put in your body,
that all of our packaging and everything that we use is better for the environment.
Um, because we are doing so much destruction, um, on that end to we're
extracting and just not looking at that long-term vision at that long-term
picture of, of how is everything that we're doing affecting ourselves
in the natural world?
Um, the consulting that I do to work with conscious entrepreneurs who are
making a difference, who want to create the best quality products and service,
who have a bigger vision than just making money that they want to make a
difference, they want to serve others as well.
And how can I be a light, um, and create a positive impact on every
person that I come in contact with.
That's awesome.
Um, I wanted to dive in a little bit deeper on something that caught me.
You said you, uh, as part of your vision, it, you really like the product creation
process, um, and that's unique, um, and unique.
It's inventor style almost.
Talk to me about that.
I've never thought of myself as a natural creative.
If you give me a blank canvas and say, create something, I draw a blank.
I'm like, uh, I don't know where to start.
What I'm good at is spotting patterns of pulling from here and here and combining
things into something much better, something that, um, there's already,
there's already an example of a product that I like, but I can see how it could be better.
Um, do you remember that commercial, um, BASF, we don't make a lot of the products
you buy, we make a lot of the products you buy better.
And that's always struck with me as that's kind of what I do is not
creating an entirely new thing where I just conceptualize it, but taking things
and how can it be improved upon and maybe pulling from other industries and things
and just alchemizing it into something that is much better than what was already there.
Yeah, absolutely.
Well, and you know, some people would use the, uh, the R and D term ripoff and
duplicate, um, as, as an example of, of what you're doing there, but at the same
time, when you look more holistically, right.
Good rich, they didn't invent the wheel.
Um, right.
Uh, firestone didn't invent the Michelin didn't invent the wheel.
Um, so you're, you're taking, you're seeing an opportunity to optimize and
you're following through, which is what really surprises me about that.
When I was, when I was in kindergarten, this is going way back to pager days.
I was in, I was in the mall and I saw this kid running around and he was, he was
looking at this pager over and over.
It probably just thought he was really cool, you know, going back and forth.
Looking at this pager and I'm sitting on a bench waiting for my sisters.
Probably got up like Victoria secret or something.
Um, and so there he's, he's going back and forth and I just had it dawn on me.
I said, those little car clickers, right?
What if somebody was breaking into our car right now?
We would have no idea.
Why not send a signal to the car clicker that beeps like a pager so that we would
know that something's happening and we could take action immediately and like
call the police.
Um, you know, or go and see what's happening.
Yeah.
And it, it blew my mind.
That was in 1993.
Um, that to this day, we still don't have clickers that do that.
I'm like, heck, I know I should, I should have pursued it.
I'm busy.
But that's, let's see the reality though.
The difference in me is I like to think about concepts like that.
I like to, I like to, I don't, I don't really do the physical product thing.
You've taken physical products and you've, you've actually turned them into solutions
kind of like a chef and like an inventor.
Um, so do you mind walking us through that process?
What does that look like?
Yeah.
Well, I really got my start in digital marketing.
So it was on the digital side, um, both in content creation and, and marketing
and finding new ways to get information out there and then products as well.
Um, and then it just kind of evolved into the physical product space.
Um, there's something that's just fascinating about creating something from scratch, you
know, the tangibility of something that you can touch and you can feel, and you can hold
and smell.
So, um, my, my process though is like, if there's a product that I like or a product
that, so for rewild gear, um, when I started that, I was like, I'm going to do a product
that I like and then I started that.
That process was how that got started was me and my brothers sitting around a campfire
drinking bourbon and comparing knives.
And we were just asking the question, what do we like about this knife that we have?
And we all had a different one.
What do we like?
What are we not like?
What features is it missing?
How would you improve upon it?
And so it's just an iterative process of asking those questions.
How could this be better?
What would you do to grow and improve it?
Well, now I'm seeing that there were so many personal care products on the market that
worked really well, but the ingredient quality was not very good.
And so what you put on your body, you're putting in your body.
So if you are using products or ingredients that are unhealthy for you, well, that's going
to have a long-term side effect, a negative side effect.
So how could this be improved and what can we use that people aren't using maybe because
it the cost is higher and there are other companies are just looking at how can they
maximize profits, but they're not looking at what's best for you or the packaging or
materials because it's cheaper, but it's worse for the environment.
So it's just asking the questions of what could, how could we do things differently?
What is not being done and where is there an opportunity?
Because if I'm asking these questions and probably others are too.
And I think the difference is that I'm willing to take action on it where others aren't.
Absolutely.
So in the product creation phase, pulling these ingredients together, sourcing and all
of that, is that something that you get involved with or do you have that delegated?
Yeah, that's so I am not a formulator.
I actually started this company with my ex-wife and she, we had another company together
called wellness mama.com, which I use when I ran a boutique to digital marketing agency.
And I used that website that I convinced her to start.
She was a, she was a journalism major, journalist and nutritionist.
And so it was kind of like her passion, just researching health and wellness topics for
our family.
And I convinced her to start a blog, just documenting that.
And so I used that site that I built out for her as a testing ground for my paying clients.
And just it grew and grew and became like the major thing.
And so we leveraged that all the, we had a lot of DIY personal care products that she
had created in our kitchen.
And the audience really liked them, but they got tired of making it themselves.
And so because of that, we saw an opportunity of creating products and selling them to an
audience that we already had.
And so that made it very easy than just creating something entirely from scratch and trying
to, trying to sell them something or trying to find an audience.
And in full transparency, that has been a major challenge with Rewild Gear because I
went into an industry that I did not already have an audience.
And so trying to gain new customers just with cold traffic or for an industry that I didn't
have past experience in, that's been a much more challenging process than in the health
and wellness space.
Absolutely.
I'm going to dig into that personal side a little more.
So are you and your ex still working on wellness together?
So we both have a financial stake in both businesses.
She's not actively involved on the wellness side.
I'm not actively involved on the wellness mama side, but we still have a great co-parenting
and working relationship.
We just separated things out.
I have a request for you for that.
I know how hard that is and we won't dive into the details, but just the fact that y'all
are trying is something to absolutely honor, man.
Thank you.
Yeah.
Thanks for sharing that.
There is hope for any divorces out there who are going through the struggles.
I think this goes back to one of the keywords we were talking about titles before this.
And one of the big things you wanted to hit on was the importance of being kind.
And so before we go into the worst leadership experience ever, do you mind just talking
about your dedication, the kindness and why that's so important to you?
Yeah.
That's something that I've had to learn a lot over the years.
Me too.
I need to learn myself in there real fast because that's not my favorite attribute.
I wasn't necessarily raised in a family environment that was kind.
There was a lot of black and white thinking and projection as far as what one should do
or right and wrong, good and bad.
And as I've grown up, I've realized that most of the world is a lot of gray, not just black
and white.
And then when I went through divorce and the hardest thing I've ever gone through
and just massive heartbreak.
And when that happens, you can either get better or get better.
And I've used that to transform me into a much better person.
And so one of the things that I have established for myself is rules for life.
How do I want to live?
And there's four rules as of right now that could change and evolve, but it's be kind,
be curious, have fun, and don't waste.
And so kindness is the first one.
How can we be kind to everyone we can do?
You can have boundaries, you can have standards, you can make those known to people you're
working with or family or whatever, but just do it kindly.
You don't have to be an asshole, you know?
Be curious.
I'm intrinsically curious about everything.
And I think that just goes back from an early age when I learned to read and just read
everything that I could get my hands on because I just wanted to learn.
I wanted to know how does the world work?
How does the world work?
Where is, what is truth?
Where is truth?
What makes things tick?
What makes people tick?
And so just that intrinsic curiosity informs everything that I do in life
about products, about people, about business, et cetera.
Have fun.
I think it's very easy to, as children, that's what we're all about.
Let's have fun.
What's fun?
What do we enjoy?
And as adults, we get away from that.
And that's why we get bored.
Why we hate our jobs.
Why we do all these things that we think we're supposed to do, but we don't actually enjoy it.
What if we got rid of that?
What if we changed the paradigm and just looked at things?
Am I having fun with this?
Am I curious?
And if you're being curious, I think that's where fun comes from.
Because then you're learning and growing and exploring.
And then the last one is don't waste.
We do so much of that in our modern world.
We're so wasteful.
We're so wasteful with our time, for one.
Time is the most precious asset we have.
It's the only one that we cannot get more of.
We can always make more money.
We can always sleep and get more energy.
We can't get more time.
And we don't know how much time that we have on this earth.
So let's not waste it.
Let's make the most of every moment we have.
And so don't waste time or resources.
And I think this is one of the things, as Americans, that we're the most guilty of,
is wasting resources.
Just we buy the cheapest thing and just throw it out.
We don't think long term.
We are just looking at everything is throw awayable.
We live in a microwave culture where we just want the thing and then we just waste.
So how can we be more long-term thinking, more sustainable, and not waste time or resources?
So be kind, be curious, have fun, and don't waste.
I like that.
I also love your holistic approach to that.
That's a big piece of following that recipe the right way.
Again, not meaning to box people in with the right way, wrong way, or project.
But if we take a step back and we look at what you just mentioned about not going after that fast
and easy solution, fast and easy solutions are marketed to us all over the place.
And when you're marketing, your goal is to portray something as exciting or fun
or something that creates pleasure, removes pain.
And we can become very manipulated very quickly into thinking what we're doing is fun,
even though it's just been accepted into us.
I'm going to use a couple of examples.
One, Matthew Perry recently passed away.
We don't know what happened there.
I do know that he struggled tremendously with substance abuse.
I do know that he struggled tremendously with depression.
And there's Robin Williams going back much, much further, who was probably one of the
funnest people on the planet.
You know, in terms of being labeled as such, I don't think anybody would ever say he wasn't fun.
And inspired so many of us.
I had a friend in high school, super depressed, known as a comedian, would get up on stage.
He'd sing anything too, blah, blah, blah.
And one of the most, again, depressed but fun people.
Yet his fun was so disconnected from happiness.
And he couldn't see that.
He saw it as a synonym.
He saw it as the exact same thing.
And I said, man, you know, this doesn't make you happy.
He's like, what are you talking about?
It's exactly what fun is.
He responded in the most unhappy voice probably ever heard.
And I felt bad.
Wasn't catching it yet.
Right.
Later in life, thank goodness, he started to catch the difference and the available
what's available for both.
So I would just throw down a new color and shade for the audience on exactly what you're talking about.
Fun's fantastic when you're doing the right things for fun.
The things that actually drive a good, positive, productive, sustainable energy within yourself.
And you seem to have that locked in.
So, you know, maybe I'm wrong on this.
Do you spend a ton of time doing drugs and binge drinking in order to have fun?
Or what does fun look like to you?
Yeah, that's a great question.
You know, I have gone down multiple different paths over my life.
I've never been, what is a drug?
You know, that's a bunch of very rough.
Right.
Oh, well said.
Netflix, right?
Yeah.
So I think the bigger question here is addiction.
What are you addicted to?
And someone could do drugs, but they are using that in a responsible manner that is actually
helping their growth and evolution.
For example, psychedelics.
Now, granted, if you're doing that every day, then there may be a problem there.
There may be an addiction.
If you're doing that, say, once a month in like a closed container, like a journey capacity
where you're using that to grow and evolve and learn, is that a problem?
I don't think so.
So I think it's changing the question here.
I have always loved to party, you know, in college, I was the guy that was the first
one at the bar and the last one to leave.
And I drank quite a bit, you know, but then I would also not drink for like a week at a time.
And so never had an issue there.
But I just like to have fun.
And so I've also loved the outdoors.
I mean, if there's a sport, I'm playing it.
If there's a ball, count me in.
I'm competitive.
I love to win.
And so I also hate to lose.
So things that I do for fun are moving my body, being active, you know, doing, teaching
my kids, playing sports, going skiing, backpacking, hunting.
I find fun just in spending time with people and learning about them, having deep conversations,
brainstorming about business, traveling.
I think fun can be found in many different ways.
If there's only one or two things that we like to do for fun, that feels kind of limiting
to me.
I have such a myriad of interests and those just keep expanding.
And so it's just being curious and trying new things and being interesting and trying
new things and being interesting and interested.
I love that.
I love so much about what you said.
The most thing that draws my attention the most is the fact that I use a fairly polarizing
example, right?
And you manage to find the harmony and balance and that just feels right to me.
And that's usually what I'm looking for in life is what draws harmony and balance.
Well done, Seth.
Let's move into that worst leadership experience.
So what's the worst leadership experience you've ever had, you've ever been a part of,
you've ever seen go in any direction with this?
Go ahead.
Now you got it.
Yeah, great.
So let me give two examples.
One from when it was passed on to me and then one where I was in the leadership capacity.
So the last real job that I had, I was working at a university and the president of the
university had called me into the office about something.
I don't want to get into a whole lot of the specifics, but there was an accusation that
was made against me that was entirely false.
It was nothing big.
It was just some minor little thing about moving some decorations around or something.
And I had mentioned, yeah, I'd moved this or it was not a big deal.
I was talking with one of the other principals at the school and I got blamed.
I was blamed for something and made to feel vastly inferior.
Like there's something wrong with me.
And I'm asking the question, what did I actually do wrong?
And was there some bigger issue here?
And like, well, you didn't ask like, okay, why did I need to ask about this?
It seems like such a minor thing.
And it came from a very wounded and controlling person.
And this individual, she came from a very privileged past and was very much in her
masculine and there was no sense of humility or anything.
It was just trying to, I'm the leader, I'm the boss and you're going to do what I say.
And I don't care what you have to say or the questions that you're asking.
And I learned what not to do then.
There was no example of servant leadership.
And so I'd say that was one of the worst leadership experiences that I personally
been a part of her experience.
And then for myself, with the company that I was involved with, my ex-wife,
we got involved in a competition.
It was an affiliate competition where we're promoting someone else's products or services.
And then, you know, we promoted a lot of products or services that were a fit
for the audience.
And that was what we always did.
And then we promoted one, it was a book launch and it wasn't necessarily the best fit for
the audience.
And so we over promoted that.
And so we had a lot of people that unsubscribed from the audience.
And then there was pushback and it caused some additional issues downstream and from
with the person whose product we were promoting because we had a retraction.
And so it caused all kinds of issues, both with our audience, both with friends.
And what came up for me there was that just because you can do something doesn't mean
you should.
And you don't have to win at all cost if it's not in the best fit for everyone.
So let's be transparent.
Let's communicate better and take that feedback to heart and not just keep pushing through
because because we want to win.
Yeah.
So I think that really taught me to look even more long term and ask those questions and
make sure that that it's a fit for everyone involved with what we're doing.
Yeah.
I hear that as being one of the catalysts.
You know, you learn from your own your own your own failed experiences, right?
Where you failed your your own heart in terms of like what you wanted to do.
And now you're the guy talking about quality over quantity, you know, and it's cool to
see you make that shift.
Go ahead.
And, you know, as part of that, what I realized was that when I neglect my own intuition,
that's when things go awry.
Because that was something that happened because I'm like, oh, this is what we should
do.
I'm paying attention to my head in order to make a good decision.
It takes three things.
You got to listen to your head, your heart and your gut.
And if those aren't in alignment, then the answer is probably no.
And, you know, that was an example of, you know, just paying attention to the head, but
not the heart and not the gut.
And so everything that I do now in business and relationships, it's looking at all three
of those aspects and making sure that you're in alignment.
It's huge.
That's a big principle for us as well.
We talk about, I always say that, you know, if you're more feminine, you're going to call
it your heart.
If you're more masculine, you're going to call it your gut.
You know, and so I like that you just combine the three.
I'm like, no, all three of these are part of the same.
So that's good.
That's a lot of therapy.
Yeah.
Well, and most of us need it, you know, and most of us benefit from what most people that
have never done therapy before or haven't gone that route is you're just missing out
on another set of mentorship, right?
You're missing out on an opportunity to gain more clarity on communication from a coach
who's willing to help with you.
So I think it's awesome.
What's your best leadership experience ever?
What's that look like?
So the best one that I personally experienced, that was the last boss that I had, like the
direct boss at that same university, who was my direct overhead.
She just consistently showed an example of servant leadership.
She was not willing to ask someone under her to do anything that she wasn't willing to
do herself.
And she was a specific example is not coming to mind, but it was just that everything that
she did and how she lived her life.
And in contrast to her boss, who was the one who I set an example of very poor leadership.
So and so my direct boss, she ended up leading just because of how she was treated as well.
So I was in stark contrast.
In my own life, as far as my own leadership, leadership is something that I'm constantly
learning and how to be more conscious in everything that I do and how I lead.
Giving my team the autonomy to make decisions and not micromanaging, but having an open
door where they can ask questions and receiving feedback constructively and not taking it
personally.
So I'm having a hard time of coming up with a very specific example of something that
I've done where I felt like I did a great job of it.
I think that's a better question for some of the team.
I agree with that.
That makes sense.
I think it's great.
You honored your boss.
You gave us a great one.
You gave us some principles as well.
And what better way anybody who's listening in that's evaluating potentially working with
Seth as well.
When they say reference check, there's so many entrepreneurs who skip that stage when
they're hiring somebody and they don't call the references, which is a travesty in most
cases.
And you also have an opportunity as the person being hired to do a reference check.
And sometimes the best way to do that is to call existing employees as well as former
employees.
And thank goodness with social media and all that, you have so much more access to being
able to find information when you're considering different opportunities.
Seth if this was your last opportunity to share a powerful lesson, this was it for visionaries
so they could learn from your experience, what would it be?
Wow, that's a powerful question.
I would say question your assumptions.
Any assumptions that we have about in our business, in our life, in our relationships,
be more curious.
Ask the hard questions.
Can we do things completely differently that could change the world?
That could change ourselves?
What can we do that can affect more people in a positive way?
And so don't just go with the status quo.
Don't just look at what our competitors are doing.
But how can we think outside the box and take examples from other industries that we can
apply into our own industry so that it can make a drastic difference and it may piss
off some people and that's okay because if you stand for everything, you stand for nothing.
So I think it's just taking a bigger approach to it and looking at things way different
than how everyone else's.
I love the idea of questioning our assumptions.
I've been very much focused on that over the last probably two years or so and you also
said earlier too that you're constantly learning about leadership as am I.
I've got so much to learn in relation to how to guide and lead people.
And including myself with the assumptions, I have had three different guests who came
on to our show.
All three of them, I just, I just had this feeling they're not going to like this.
They're not going to like me, not going to get along with me.
They're already hating this process.
This is getting so awkward.
And they're three of my favorite episodes.
Three people who became really good friends and I was like, wow, I was completely off
on this.
And then there's that flip side.
I've had a few that I thought were going to be amazing and then I thought we're really
going to enjoy the process and they didn't very much like the process.
And so as I've, as I've learned to step back and give people space and not make those assumptions
that I know how that experience is going to turn out, it makes more sense.
And by the way, because of that too, the three who didn't have the best experience, we still
had a solid relationship because they didn't allow my assumptions to, to ruffle the feathers
further.
I was able to step back.
Right.
And make space for the, the indifference that may have occurred.
You know, so I love your, your example on that.
I think it is one of those big power lessons that only comes from somebody who's willing
to slow down.
Like you said, too.
So you know, something along those lines I, and this is a lesson that I need to learn
more and more of is how much the weight of expectations can, is really the cause of most
unhappiness, discomfort and anxiety.
And you know, I'm just as guilty as everyone else around this of making, making assumptions,
of setting expectations and getting tied into that outcome.
And so that's been my learning process and my work is how can I release those expectations
and still push forward for those things that I want or desire, but not be so tied into
it so that I'm not willing to accept what is and just be open to new experiences.
Be open to the exploration of things and not just saying it has to be this way and then
being upset when it's not.
Okay.
This is probably my favorite segment of all my shows right now, Seth.
And I'm, and I don't go the hyperbole route very often, like this is so important to me.
Shakespeare said it, expectation is the root of all heartache.
And I'm a big, big fan of that quote.
We live in a business world right now where expectations are what drive almost every decision
too.
And I need more leaders like you in the world because we need to help them understand there's
a massive difference between letting, like when you let go of expectations, you can still
have aspirations and goals and hope and holistic growth.
In fact, it will come more often because you're not putting a vice grip on the experience.
So you just nailed it.
And I hope more business owners start to look at it because we got quarterly expectations
and expectations laced into everything.
And yet we wonder why we have a 96% failure rate and a 4% survival rate in business.
We're out of balance with virtue in that regard.
So I think that's a base of it.
Thank you for hitting that.
Sorry, it's still the thunder on it, but I'm like doubling down because I'm like, I want
this talked about more.
It's never talked about.
And even when it is, people shy away from it too quickly.
They don't, they don't want to hear, don't have expectations, right?
They hear, don't be successful.
Often success isn't what we expect it to be.
It doesn't look like the assumptions or the expectations that we have.
Often the best ideas, they came out of something else entirely.
Like how many companies that have grown and seen massive success, it was based on a pivot
and a totally different business model than what they originally had gone into it as.
So I think that's, I had an experience over the summer.
It was a psychedelic trip and my, my ethos, I love adventure.
I just love exploring and discovering new things.
But then there's also this need in me to control, to want to know the outcome.
And I'm a planner and to make sure everything is set in stone.
And I had this realization that those can't live in the same world.
You can plan and you can do those things.
But if you have to know the outcome in advance, then there is no adventure because the nature
of the direction is the unknown.
And so when you're trying to make everything known beforehand, then the fun and the adventure
is gone.
And so it's letting go of that need to know and control and to just being open to the
exploration and the adventure of it.
And then that's where the excitement and the joy and everything lives.
That's all, you know, whatever reminds me of we've talked about a couple of times,
Richard Branson and his surfing, right?
Because when you're surfing, you don't control the outcome, right?
You're trying to catch the wave.
And then it's, it's a very much a flow state of improvisation, you know, of where you go,
what you do with it.
You don't always make the right decision.
But there's there's so many realities and business where that's what that that's kind
of the state you want to be in.
I shouldn't I'm not gonna say you have to.
You can get swallowed by the wave.
You know, you can fail to catch the wave to that's that's it comes back to letting go
of that expectation, right?
That I'm going to be the Kelly Slater, you know, on this wave, you know, without having
put in the 20,000 reps, right?
You've got to, you know, if you're going to get the type of experience you want to have,
you got to be willing to flow with it as much as you you want to plan it out.
So, yeah, I think another example of that.
I love one.
I always want to keep going with you.
I keep I keep dating you into moving forward.
I know we're gonna wrap up.
I'm here for it one more time.
Yeah, you know, one of my very favorite activities is camping, just strapping on a backpack going
into the backcountry and just spending time in nature.
And I think one of the reasons is it's the unknown around every trail around every corner.
You see something new and beautiful and amazing, like look at how that tree's growing.
Oh, my gosh, I wonder what caused it to do that.
Look at these rocks.
It's not a fossil.
It's the unknown.
It's that example that we're seeing.
And so for a while gear, our mission is to get more men back into the great outdoors,
to spend time in nature, to disconnect from technology in this digital world that we live
in and get more analog, to reconnect with our souls, to spend time with family and friends
in the great outdoors.
And so that we can think differently without having those constant dopamine hits from our
notifications from our phones and computer and everything else.
And so we can just drop in into that more natural space and that heart space and just
learn more about ourselves and the natural world so that we can protect it.
But then also, it's my belief that when we do that, when we disconnect from technology
and get back into that analog natural world in which we were all born into, that when
we do go back into the default world, then we're better humans.
We're better husbands, fathers, business owners, friends, lovers, everything.
We're just better people because we're more connected with everything.
Well said, man.
All right.
There's been so many great entrepreneurship lessons in Here Vision Pros.
Sustainability is a long-term mindset.
If you feel like we didn't talk about that, it's because it's not a 45-minute opportunity.
It's something that you dedicate yourself to, according to what Seth said, according
to my own humble beliefs as well.
And quality over quantity is a pretty simple concept to be able to master.
It's that dedication to value versus the need to rush things out and to hustle things out,
making sure that we take care of ourselves, making sure that we take care of others in
the process.
This is awesome.
The landing page will have more information for how to connect with Seth.
You can, of course, go and get products with Wellness and Rewild here through those links
or go look it up on Google and find them as well.
If you want to share your own vision on Vision Pros Live, there's also a link on there to
apply to be a guest.
We'd love to have you on the show.
Seth, thanks for being here today.
Everybody have a fantastic rest of your day.
Thanks, Jackson.
Great chatting.
Thank you for being here today.
I'm really happy that you tuned in to Vision Pros Live.
I'm looking forward to seeing your reactions as these episodes continue to move forward.
This is going to get more and more fun.
We'll have more and more engagement as well.
We'll invite people to participate in the show.
And thank you for giving us your time and attention.
Have an excellent day.