I'm like, oh my gosh. It's a
little blast. Uh what was funny
is that her cousin, her lifelong
Houstonian, he was his first
plane trip ever and uh he's
talking about he wants to be
out here at nine degree
weather. I'm like, okay, wait
till it actually touch you, you
know, so when you're when you're
touristy, right? You can come
in and get you a little bit of
this cold and get back to the
warmth. Man, when it's nine,
ten, eleven, day after day
after day, whoo, that's
something else but uh too much
of a blast. Uh we got like four
pies. I ate two of them by
myself. So, I I'm working
furiously to pay myself back
for that. Uh but absolutely had
a blast uh with family and just
really thankful. How about
yourself? Good for you, man. It
was great. Low Key had my
littlest which was awesome. Uh
we went to my aunt's house
along with most of of that side
of the family. So, we had about
50 people there probably. Uh
and my aunt's got a she's got a
golden retriever. She breeds
golden retrievers too. So, my
daughter was in heaven playing
with the dogs. So, that's
beautiful. That's beautiful.
That's all you can ask for
these days is really to be able
to take a step back and see
these small smiles that remind
you life used to be something
more than just making money and
all the other things we have to
do as parents. That's right.
Absolutely, man. So, um Chamber
Capital Ventures, five years in
the running um and what have
you been doing? Oh, okay. So,
let's let's start at the
beginning. Was actually finding
my market fit. I think that was
one of the most exciting uh
things. So, I started sixteen
years after being in corporate
America, client solutions,
business development, product
marketing, and product
management gave me the four
years that I was like, I can go
out and do this. What I
recognized was that the thirteenth
to fifteenth hire in a startup
is typically your first product
person, typically your product
manager. They typically need to
be your third person because
they're your first principles
and technology companies. So,
my favorite was that I got my
first brand. I branded it
product exec, short for product
executive and I went on to the
market offering startup
founders being basically their
first product leader. Instilling
product principles whether it
was pragmatic or the optimal
product process into the
business and it had a lot of
uplift. I use Angel List to
find my particular uh you know,
so they had to be hiring for
the need which helps me
understand what I was trying to
do. I was finding that first
niche and uh it took off a bit.
It it really did. Uh I was very
very excited with the way the
market perceived the value of a
product person saying, hey, I
need to be third or fourth in
line, not fifteenth. Nice and
what puts that that product
leader in the the thirteenth to
fifteenth position? Well,
because typically what you're
right, welcome in to Vision
Pros Live with Jackson Calame.
I'm your show host. We'll be
doing interviews for visionary
and creative people and
fantastic visions out there.
Yeah.
Hey, welcome to Vision Pros
Live. I'm your show host,
Jackson Calame, founder and
CEO of First Class Business.
I'm excited to have Chris
James Chambers, Chris Chambers
on stage today. Let me say it
for a third time so you don't
miss it. Chris Chambers on the
show today. We're going to be
talking about venture capital,
which is a very important
topic for people considering.
We also had Sam Raynon today
talking about government
contracts with the Department
of Defense. So, it is a funding
and finance day which is
probably one of the areas that
most visionaries struggle with
is knowing how to access
funding, how to talk about it,
how to do the right hires, how
to invest. All those aspects
can be overwhelming and scary
for for the entry level
entrepreneurs. My hope is that
those of you who are at that,
you know, you're you're limited
mindset is has been opened to
understanding what your
opportunities are that that
you're listening in to what's
going to be thrown down today
because Chris and I are going
to go at it. We're going to be
talking about equity and
capital and and how to raise
and when to hire and and he is
super high IQ. Um I recommended
the book that Emeth to him and
within like twenty, I don't
know if it's 24 hours or 48
hours. It's pretty close. The
book was pretty good and gave
me credit a little bit for for
pointing in his way but I cannot
take credit for him diving in
that diligently and really
hitting that book hard. It was
one of the coolest things to
see. Um so, we're we're going
to be in great hands today.
Before we bring Chris on stage,
I want to talk about the
sponsors of course because
these are tools that one is a
tool that I rely on and one is
a tool that I would have
definitely been interested in
when I started my venture. So,
I'm going to talk about LinkedIn
Automation. LinkedIn Automation
is how we get in front of such
amazing executives like Chris.
That's in fact, that's how we
met. Um was through that
experience of of our outreach
on LinkedIn and helping him
understand that we had a show
that he could come on and share
his vision through, right? Now,
part of the the success that
you have when you're using
automation comes from how
attractive is your message? Does
your message align with the
needs of those that you're
serving or are you trying to
make your message more
attractive? And there's cheesy
lines like my least favorite of
all time. Hey, it looks like we
have some mutual friends. Do you
want to connect? That is the
most unethical commonly used
line I've seen on LinkedIn
because you don't know if you
have mutual friends or not.
They're just robots connecting
to each other in most cases. So,
stop using it. That's my hand.
Just stop. Just stop. Find
something of value to place in
front of people even if it's
asking them their opinion about
leadership which is also one of
our successful messages we used
to say, optimize, optimize is
the key when it comes to your
messaging. Listen to what your
audience wants and needs. Now,
moving on to simply fast
websites. If I were at the
stage where I needed to launch
a brand new website from
scratch and and needed some
help, well, I would I would
probably hire Shane because at
179 bucks for starting a
website and granted, I've got
years of experience interviewing
web developers and web designers
and understanding UX and UI and
all the ins and outs. I do have
a lot of experience looking for
but if you have a business to
run, you don't need to be
tinkering with your website all
day long. In fact, the less you
tinker with it, the better. Get
your concepts written out, get
in the hands of somebody like
that. Um I don't know. Maybe
chat GPT's designing websites
these days and you can just
drop it in there but the point
is, don't spend a ton of time
and a ton of money on that
before getting out there
productively, promoting your
services, and and really
understanding what it is that
you're putting out of the world
and the whole series of
iterations. It's important to
start with a small investment
with as clear of a vision as
possible and hit the ground
running and know that you are
the microphone for your brand
while your website and brand
while your website and brand are
still getting established. Then
there's the water project. The
water project is something that
is near and dear to my heart.
You know, in fact, I don't
really know why it's so near
and dear to my heart. All I
know is that I've never had a
glass of water and I've never
ever had to worry about where
my children are going to get
water from or how many of water
I just get to take it for
granted and I think that might
be just what what impacts me as
it's kind of an empath and a
healer in nature. It just it
deserves me. There are millions
of people who do not have
access to clean drinking water
and the way that it it disrupts
their lives. Um they have to go
and look for it and and they
they don't know if the source
they're getting water from is
going to save their family or
their children from a dream.
And I know that's kind of heavy
but there's a lot of heavy
things in this world. There's
8 billion people who need help.
If you've got another cause
that you want to see supported,
please drop it in the comments.
It doesn't hurt to give other
people the opportunity to give
back with the water project. I
love that I get to see where my
contribution is going. I get to
see the outcome as well occur
for the people who who need it
and like I said, I just I just
can't imagine myself what it
would be like to not have access
to that. Um we just we just
passed through Thanksgiving. So
in efforts of of gratitude,
let's extend that gratitude
with our actions and and find a
cause that we can either share
to support or give back to
support. Uh you you know you
and where you're at in life. So
I'm just here to try to motivate
that a little bit. Anyway,
without further ado, let's
bring Chris Chambers on board.
Um Chris, welcome to Vision
Pros Live, man. I'm happy to
have you here. Great to be on
the show, brother. Venture
development. Thank you.
Absolutely. So, the best way to
do it is describe it in flow.
So, a founder will typically
come to me with an idea that
they've either gotten some
traction on or they believe
they have traction on. My
responsibility from that point
is to architect the venture and
that could be anything from
creating a resource model,
developing business plans,
helping them understand what
their competitive advantage is.
So, really think of it in terms
of business or venture could be
interchangeable but what I
specialize in and have
people come together as teams
or spin up concepts fairly
quickly and then put the
framing, the operation framing
behind them. Ah man, awesome.
So, spin out teams, put them
together or if I'm over
simplifying the process. Now,
you mentioned something that
you're really excited about too
regarding regarding AI and
maybe chat GPT. You might not
have mentioned that name. Um I'm
not sure. Can you can you dive
into that man? You were so
excited. Absolutely. Absolutely.
I could not believe the
extraordinary luck we have as a
company. I mean, in the Eastern
countries, they're a little bit
different about AI but for us,
it's it's a chat GPT and chat
GPT has given the AI community
a bridge that we did not have
previously. If you think about
it in terms of consumerization,
right? There's a reason the
iPhone is now a corporate
approved device. I've been
working in technology for 17
years. It used to be Blackberry.
The consumer pushed iPhone into
the pockets of businesses and
now, what the platform will
allow for us to do is we now
have a champion. We have our
version of iPhone into the
business market. It's open AI.
Uh whether you're choosing to
build on the open AI platform
or not, what that what it does
and what it has created is the
ability to proof out concepts
using AI and then rapidly scale
and integrate them. You can use
the open AI platform or you can
have a custom AI environment
built but I mean, just thinking
about the open AI. Now, you
know, coincidentally, they're
partnered with Microsoft but we
need somebody to be the
standard. We all learned how to
use computers by Windows and
that's what we need from an AI
perspective. We need something
simple, clean, that businesses
can get behind and that's why
I'm excited about open AI. I'm
excited. I'm excited about it
too and I'm glad that you you
put in that that frame of mind.
Um in fact, I'll I'll share my
screen a little bit and and
I'll share my screen with you
Chris. Um Chris but this uh this
folder right here where you can
see us right now. Do you see
this folder on your screen?
Yep. I recognize the
illustrations. That's Dolly.
So, my kids have been uh they
wrote their manuscripts for
their books and yes, we use
Dolly um in order to start
creating the the imagery and my
son and I were playing around
with it for his book about big
foot. Let's see. Not those
plans. Here we go. Pull this
up. Um you know, we we've asked
okay, Google are okay, Google.
So, used to that. Um now, it's
gonna start talking to me,
darn it. Um but we asked uh
Dolly to go ahead and give us
a give us an image of that's
designed for nine to nine to
eighteen-year-old kids of Fox
skateboarding with his dog
friend and with Bigfoot at the
X Games and next thing you
know, we got these images
that were set up to life and
allowed us to to get a frame of
reference for what we want from
artists. Now, there was
limitations like you know that
that and this is for a book
about a little girl who made a
wish on a dandelion and we're
like, well, we don't want a
movie. Um like this looks
realistic and so then we start
going back towards like uh make
it look a little bit more like
Disney. Um yes. Yes. Like it
was it was insane. The the
concepts and there's there's so
many things that bring in
forward a little boy instead of
two little girls. Um you know,
at least that's what we we
thought the child looked like.
Um so anyway, it's it's blowing
my mind. What what it's capable
of doing? Um and that's that's
just for children's books. What
are some of the uh real world
applications that you're
excited about? Well, we don't
even have to change it. You
just built a design studio.
Now, if if the human condition
is that humans need to be 100%
creative in their content, then
we would still be stuck pre
Henry Ford in the production
line. And so, what you just
showed is that if you are in
if you're a book writer, you're
creative content uh but you're
not necessarily a designer and
you don't necessarily have the
capital to hire a designer or
the aptitude to understand if
the designer is really good.
Now, design is a little bit
different. You can see it
visually and and determine
quality but where this goes is
is that now you've got two
pieces to the puzzle. Now, you
can't just say, I'm going to
do this. I'm going to do that
and and of course, AI can do
that as well. What I have
always preached with AI is that
it's a multiplier, not a
subtractor. I think if if
anything, what chat GPT has done
to the business community is
that I've seen too many the
layoffs. Why would you lay a
human off if you could train an
AI model to cover, let's say,
four X their productivity. What
they're limited by is their
ability to do that. But if you
were to train an open AI model
and I'm just using open AI just
for example, we could use
Claude, we could use, you know,
your metal llama but I'm going
with with open AI right now and
and really take that person and
say, hey, there are your tasks
that you need to be focused on
that execute in the short term.
We're going to train this AI
model to support you in the
long term. And so, every time
there's a long term insight
derived, every time there's a
long term decision to be made,
you're going to see a lot of it
as having a department in your
pocket. Yeah. That's the thing
that I believe AI is going to
revolutionize business. The
minute we get away from
subtraction and we start
thinking in multiplication. We
do it ourselves. We have the
same strategy. We use it in
biological intelligence. So,
biological intelligence, you
and I on the on this podcast
right now, we're exchanging
biological intelligence. That
everybody loves about chat GPT
is it's linguistic intelligence.
It's a language that's
artificial intelligence. Right.
What you do in business, the
thing that you thrive on is
intellectual property,
intellectual capital, and human
resources. That's just the way
business is structured until it
will not be. And so, as a
result, intellectual property
and intellectual capital can be
developed in concert with your
human resources using AI. You
know, stop using open AI for
those of you who are like, I
hate JVT, which is artificial
intelligence. We can say IBM
is a very logical. Well, you
you've brought up a great point
though. Um that's the general
consumer is going to go after
the general consumer good. Um
you know, and that's that's
chat GPT. Um you know, and so,
that's fine if you know, if you
learned how to how to use a
computer on a Mac, you know,
and you want to fight, well,
that's just your nature of
wanting to fight, you know, but
you use what you want to. Um
we're just going to speak for
those who are kind of getting
into the game and you know,
again, I'm glad you threw out
some of the references. We'll
talk about that in a minute.
So, I wanted to bring up
another point with with some of
the limitations I'm seeing
right now. It sounds like you
may have some capacity and not
only some capacity but you have
the drive to influence what's
going on. So, here's some of
the challenges that we ran into
with the chat GPT uh Dolly
process of the chat GPT. Uh
you know, we're going to be
talking about the chat GPT
process. We're going to be
talking about the chat GPT
process. Uh Dolly process of
of creating those images. Let
me pull them back up. So, we
were able to get the the
program to tell us enough about
uh like to understand the story
itself and the concept of the
story and to tell us the images
that it thought would be best
and we're like, yeah, like we
we agree like we knew that
those are the exact images that
we wanted but we could not get
it to stay consistent with the
the art concept. It was it was
you can see the dramatic
changes that we made. We keep
retelling it what things we
wanted and so it would get back
to a kind of consistency but it
would also forget the character
that it was creating. It does
not have the capacity at this
time to maintain the the
character and then when you
close your session, it forgets
everything altogether and you
kind of have to start over but
if you upload the particular
image, um then it says, we
know, we know that, you know,
may have uh intellectual property
or copyright issues. Um so, I
was like, golly, well, we're
we're kind of limited in these
anyway. I'm just going to show
some of these interesting like
look at this button on Santa's
11. What the heck? And so, so
I've got it. I've got it. So,
are you using, are you using
Dolly exclusively or are you
using chat GPT in concert with
Dolly? I think in concert, I
think. Okay. So, the thing that
I'm trying to do is let's let's
just use it in terms of how AI
works with AI. So, there's got
to be, let's say, this is your
draftsman, right? So, they're
coming up with the drafts. I
mean, of course, Santa, I don't
know what Santa must be
lactose intolerant right now.
First lactose intolerant Santa.
He comes with age, I guess but
what what this would allow for
you to do is now you're on the
investigation for how do I take
a conceptual art that has the
right set of characteristics,
right? And how do I find an AI
that can create a storyboard
out of that concept? Because
what the limitations are is
that I can understand is
there's a forgetfulness in
transition but there are going
to be other AI platforms that
are going to be a specific
around design that can take
that and storyboard it. I'm
sure if you just Google AI
storyboarding and see if there
are those are the ways that you
would do at that particular
thing or you could do the great
things that you can do. Every
single one of the AI
applications right now where
there's a front end is driven
off of prompt engineering,
right? So, the limit with Dolly
and I'm not sure if they've
made an update is 400
characters. It's hard to get
400 characters and get the
preciseness of every single
design. But maybe it's the
first set of concepts that you
get as a business. Then you
turn it over to an actual
designer because then you can
guarantee consistency. And so
there so so what this is is
now now what we're talking
about and we can do this
ubiquitously across markets,
right? We're developing a proof
of concept. So, what Open AI
has allowed you to do because
you're building a children's
book factory whether you are
aware of it or not and it's
really cool to hear you going
down this path is is that if
you guys can get to a point
where you have a proof of
concept, then the a human
designer can intercede and
take that proof of concept
there and begin the
storyboard. And so, from there,
the elements, you don't have to
communicate them. So, the thing
that would be hard for you and
that's what I would be hard for
I is that I would never be able
to to explain and design
detail exactly what I expect to
happen. I just expect it a
certain way. A human can take
that picture and expand it into
a set of stories in a way AI
needs me to damage every
single prompt has to have.
Remember, you know, it's a
stylistic modern. Uh you know,
there's a certain gradient. You
have to have too many details
if you're looking for
consistency. So, that's where I
would be. So, that's the final
design phase, the human element
and then everybody eats. If I
want to break it back to you,
what AI is allowing you to do
is we'll look at the designers
that are impacted. Now,
designers have work. Where
everybody's like, wow, AI is
taking design and vague. No,
it's not. We are in an idea
economy. We have to shift away
from labor and that's really
the biggest opportunity and
I'll get off my soapbox for the
follow up but I would implore
you to think about thinking and
ideas. I will give you real
world business. Open AI on track
last year minus 540 million
dollars. Lost. Lost. 200 million
sales. 10 billion dollar
investments Microsoft because
the idea is that powerful. If
we get to the ideas concept,
not only will capital markets
open up but then the idea of
people always having to follow
the ideas creating these
pockets of commerce. No, if you
think about it, you know, the
global economy, 21 trillion
dollars, it's immeasurable in
terms of how many million that
is and because there's so many
of those millions, start at
10, 000. Then, bring you
another 100, 000. Then, a
million. Stay at a million and
move to the other idea but
everything has to be built
around teams and concepts of
using AI in place of human
resource constraints, training
your existing human resource to
build a new technology. So,
we're and we're multiplying
markets in essence. Uh the
expenditure growth that's going
to occur due to people's
ability to compete with a with
a much smaller budget is what's
ultimately going to, I believe,
drive the economy of designers.
Design will shift. Um you know,
the types of of things that
you're doing will shift but
that's that's only going to be
bad for people who tend to see
the glass half empty. Um so,
that's that's the difference
between the two sets. Um you
know, and that's you know,
here here's all explained
through my own experience. I
fired my first three designers
as a young business owner. I
was so mad. Um they they did an
awful job, right? Here I am
pointing the finger. Um you
know, at all these individuals
that all have fantastic
reviews and on the third
occasion, well, on the fourth
hiring experience that dawned
on me, I was like, wait a
second, I heard the saying when
I'm pointing my finger at
somebody else, there's three
pointing back at me. In this
case, I'm going to do it
different times in a row. It's
like I gotta accept some
responsibility, right? So, I
go look and the first design
concept that I requested, I'm
embarrassed to even look again
at my project description. It
was awful. I didn't even know
what I meant. Um when I went
back to the reddit, I was like,
wow, no wonder why I did a bad
job. Um I gave horrible
instructions. Two, I go back
and look. My instructions were
better but they still didn't do
a great job. Third one, my
instructions were still, they
were better but I realized
that I was going to be
disappointed. Um for and I'll
get to how this ties to the the
the chat GBT and the ability to
design in just a second but I
had to first learn as a
business owner how to
appreciate people. How to stop
treating people like a
transaction at Payless Shoes
and realize that I was hiring
an individual and I started to
ask good questions about, you
know, what's your favorite
holiday? Um you know, what do
you want to do outside of
design for your career? And I
wanted to become a bridge for
myself. I'll tell you what, I
still had to be very patient
with the design process in a
way that was uncomfortable and
I wasn't, I wasn't a bad
business. I wasn't a mean guy
but I had certain expectations
and like you said, I could not
communicate what my
anticipations were and what I
was trying to get out of these
projects because I did not have
the training to work in a
design department. That was not
my role. Insert chat GPT and
what has happened on this
project is that I can exist. I
can take this design instead of
going to a designer, having
them conceptualize it on a
budget I don't have. I'm
publishing books for my
children. This is not a
for-profit opportunity up from
maybe in the back end, we'll
make some money but this is not
the point. The point is the
purpose of the project itself.
So, what's happening now is any
parent or any guide, even any
child with the capacity to
create their own bookmaking
factory and now has the power
to say, you know what? I don't
want to spend $20 on
Minecraft today. I want to spend
$20 hiring an illustrator with
these chat GPT concepts that
I've got and now our
relationship is going to be
more holistic and I'm going to
be happier with the output that
occurs because I just became an
infinitely better communicator
and I'm really proud of the
purpose of trying to study
design communication on my own.
It it creates a massive influx
of of opportunity within the
economy and in my humble
opinion. Absolutely. So, I I
love what what you said. I love
the insight and and the
self-awareness. I have that
same problem and one of the
things that I absolutely love
about what you just said is
that's what led me to found
product exact short for product
executive. It was my first
venture up under Chambers
company and the thing about
being a product manager was
that I was in everybody's
meeting room. We're talking
about client configuration,
sales solutions, you know,
providers, design, marketing.
I'm in every room because I
have to understand as a product
manager, I'm basically the CEO
of the product. I have to
understand everything that's
going on. Customer support.
Well, there are only but so
many of those types of
professionals and there are
only but so many ways for
every single person to
understand every single bit of
the AI application is you want
to do exactly what you're
doing here which is that AI can
help you understand the
intricacies of a particular
function. So, let's use venture
architecture and talk about
your children's book business
so we can we can integrate this
all together. So, if you were
to come to me and give me that
exact scenario, well, the
number one operation I would
create for you is a a
conceptual design operation.
See, because you're creating
a set of components but what I
would want to make sure is
there are sets of processes and
there are sets of systems in
place for outputs. Connect that
to your illustrator so that
there's now a consistent flow
of output illustration. Now,
there's feedback which then
creates the final draft of the
book. Now, you have an
operation. That's design
operations. That now with a set
of processes integrated is one
of the things that you need in
your company. The next thing is
whether or not you want to do
it in, let's say, Amazon or you
want to use an independent book
publishing, right? So, you
publish a PDF and you just e
books. Get it out there. Well,
then, perfect. What you need
next is a marketing operation.
Okay, well, typically,
marketing operations can be
manned by the founder and what
are the right technology tools
to market, right? So, then,
that becomes your market
operation. So, now, I've
graded together your design
operation with your marketing
team outside of your
illustrator who helps on a
finished project basis. Well,
when it gets to the point where
the book is actually starting
to make some money, now, you
figure out who you need to run
the marketing side of the
business. That's the next step.
So, the plan is foundation,
structure, system, person.
Foundation, structure, system,
person, and in that in that
model, what you find is you're
now and you know, to use the
emit. I love the fact that you
gave me a little bit of credit
there. You are taking it from
technician to manager to
entrepreneur and you're
consistently, it's that same
formula over and over and over
and then what you have once you
have, you know, four or five,
let's say in in a in a book
publishing business, it's going
to be, you know, public
relations, marketing operations,
your design operations, and then
of course, you as the leader of
the organization, your children
being the CEOs, that's PR by
the way. That's the book
business. Yeah, I love it. The
energy that you bring to to a
vision that quickly too is it's
just what a blessing. What a
gift, Chris. Let's dive into
some of the more pragmatic
questions we we go into into
the show. I don't know if I have
time to get to them all but
maybe we can speed through them
or maybe we decide to slow down
and just realize, you know what?
What we get to, we get to.
What's your vision for those
that you serve? I really want
to build. Uh so, I have on my
vision board. I want to create
a vision board that's
audacious but it's it's really
about the concept of a million.
I'm not talking about a million
in cash. I'm talking about a
million valuation. What it
takes to get to a million
valuation of an asset because
what happens when you have a
valuation, you have a sellable
asset. Now, most people in
America, most people around the
world, the largest single asset
you will ever own is a home.
I'm not going to get into
whether or not that's a good or
bad investment. What I'm here
to talk about is if you can't
buy a million dollar home, you'll
never see what a million dollars
can do in your life. That's
right. But if you can build a
million dollar idea and turn it
around and let's say sell it on
the capital market because
somebody believes they can put
the infrastructure, the people
in place to take that idea to
the next level. Well, let's say
you get, you know, 250 thousand
out of the sale after you
profit everything. Well, now
you've learned how to make
million dollar concepts over
and over. What my vision is is
that if you have a business
studio, the venture studio,
they are built into a way that
they can turn them around. Let
the business builders that, you
know, the people who want to,
the operators, excuse me, let
me, let me delineate. The
operators of society take over
ideas and you know, it's just
like the flavors of CEO. There's
the visionary CEO and there's
the operator, the person you
bring into the business when
you have to turn it around. The
best example is when Warren
Buffett had to be CEO of
the company, the market was in
turmoil. Warren Buffett because
of his genius and business and
his and his personality was
able to turn the business
around and then he brought
another CEO in. If we can help
the society split themselves
between the idea creators and
the operators and we bring
those together, we will have
deeper pools of commerce for
all groups represented. You
know, underrepresented,
nonrepresented, everybody can
have a different mindset than
creators. 100%. You just have
to marry the two. Well, it's
different phases. Um you know,
we we all focus in phases of
life. The the best examples of
that to me are the E myth and
then the book that built off
the E myth which is Rocket
Fuel and and and you know, they
talk more about the integrator
operator but I digress back to
the E myth and you already
alluded to the concept for those
of you who have not read that
book, it is a life changing
concept and you know, it's part
of it. He talks about the three
different personalities that
exist when all of us. We have
an entrepreneur with us. We
have a technician within us and
we have the manager within us.
The entrepreneur lives in the
future. Um you know, and only
looks at things in the future
typically. The technician is in
the present. They're the ones
who handle the technical
components of today's work. The
manager manages the past.
What's happened? The reports
and things like that and we
don't, we all have the capacity
to to hone in and channel those
things. So, what I want to
point out what you're talking
about is the same thing that I
know about my business first
class business. I'm not
designed nor do I want to run
first class business once it's
a 100 million dollar company.
Um even a 10 million dollar
company, I will probably not be
the operator to any extent. The
goal is to replace me in that
capacity so that I can continue
to function as you talked about
kind of chief ideologist if you
will. I need to be creating
projects and other things I need
to be creating outside the
scope of first class business.
So, we will probably have
ideologists within the company
itself that are built more
around the types of ideas that
that set entity that first
class business needs to create
that liberates me. It doesn't
steal my baby from me. It
allows me to move on and it
allows the business to evolve
much like your child does from
the beginning and pursue what
they need to pursue. The
business entity is you know,
when you look at it as your
baby, same thing. The goal is
to get it out of the nest. The
faster you can do that
responsibly, the better I
think. Absolutely. Absolutely.
I think what it what it what it
boils down to is the mindset of
really understanding what a CEO
does. I think one of the things
that really hurts us in society
is we use titles ubiquitously
and they don't denote the same
thing. So, when you think about
the title, you just think we're
supposed to use them. Yes.
Yes. So, we're like, I'm the
original creator creator of the
idea. I might be the chief
visionary officer. Hold on to
that. That might be yours. I
actually game theory to a couple
of AI models and they came up
with those titles. Chief
visionary officer might be your
thing. And what what I can see
is that when you see a CEO, so
if you're working in a company
of small business, let's say 200
employees, you see the CEO come
in doing work and depending on
where you are in the
company, you see him and you
see him working. So, you see
them as a technician. That's not
even true. When that CEO walks
into a room with their
executive team, he is talking
to or he or she, excuse me, as
the managers of the operation.
Now, let me break down what the
manager concept truly means. In
the manager, I want you to
think of McDonald's and I want
you to think of Starbucks and I
want you to think of everywhere
you've ever been where there's a
McDonald's everywhere where
you've ever been there's a
McDonald's. It's fundamentally
different. I mean, the food
tastes different, the coffee
tastes different, the
experience is different. You let
me know. That is the
quintessential operation of a
business is to have managers in
place. So, the way that we see
entrepreneurship, we do not
think in terms of having people
who oversee systems that
produce outcomes. What we see is
there's work to be done. We see
our former bosses working. We
see nothing but work. The very
same way that we see it. Amy
Diamond of JP Morgan Chase. The
amount of business units,
managers, factories that he
oversees is the reason why the
company is as successful as it
is. The scary thing for us as
entrepreneurs is we don't really
have an understanding of how to
quickly build teams together
and that's one of my visions for
the future is that somebody can
come and I can create that
McDonald's factory or we can
create the McDonald's factory
and I can think about, well,
I've never built a customer
support department before. I
have no idea who I should hire.
What systems I should put in the
place? What should be my
philosophy of the department?
Those are the types of things
that always hold us back from
being able to scale our idea
past the original technician
concept which I've gotten
trapped in several times in my
venture career. Absolutely and
and it's it's kind of a it can
be a very painstaking process
too for the visionary to have
to do that. I think it's sad how
many people feel like they need
to do that alone. You know, or
with a small team or with, you
know, their their excited
friend who wants to support
them but doesn't really have
the qualifications to do so.
It's like they can come along
for the ride and they can they
can participate in a lot of
ways but the moment you start
putting lab coats on people
that aren't scientists, you
know, or stethoscopes around
people's necks that aren't
doctors is usually the moment
your brand begins to fail
because of your failures. What
has been your worst leadership
experience ever, Chris? I I
will take full ownership of my
failure. Uh so, as as I was
venturing, I I got to the point
a couple of years in uh 2018,
early 2020, I'm the chief
strategy officer for several
companies. Now, I'm in the
present. I'm absolutely loving
everything I'm doing,
recommending uh direction and
I failed every single business
that failed because I didn't
see the pandemic coming. Now,
in the national market, the
pandemic was disrupting
businesses as early as October
of 2019. There was something
coming and I've lost the
ability to look forward
because I got trapped looking
downward and for me as a
leader, I took that. I mean, I
took that exceptionally hard
uh because that was my that was
my charter and so from a
leadership perspective, it
ended up being a great
teaching opportunity. So, as
soon as that they start
cratering, I went back to
business school. I went and
I went back to business school
and I was able to upgrade my
understanding of my
responsibilities in business.
So, I would say the pandemic
coming along and me not having
enough education on the
strategy side to bolster my
teams, right? So, I'm serving
as chief strategy officer for
several companies and I'm
expecting the teams to have a
certain level of like, hey,
this is the way we're going to
navigate this incredibly tough
situation. None of us have
dealt with that before and I
would be at the very top of the
organization saying in crisis
management, I'll be the one to
steward the ship. Rather than
do that, I focused on
stewarding my ship which was
poor leadership. I come out the
other side but then I lose my
startups who did not have as
strong of a of a team in place
at the very beginning of the
pandemic. Well said. There's a
there's a lot of great lessons
in there and the the humility
to own such a disaster and and
look at that from a self self
perspective, you know, you're
not just a leader of a company
versus just you know, washing it
over. Um you know, and say,
well, everybody would have had
a bad experience here. Um it
takes a an important amount of
character and virtue to do that.
So, appreciate that. The
example. What's your best
leadership experience look like?
Okay. So, my favorite leadership
experience of all time was
working for Don Smith at Black
Night Financial. So, he was the
chief technology officer and he
was in a lot of operations and
so I'm you know, 2015, I'm a
year and a half in the product
management but I explained him
with things that I was doing and
he was like, okay, come on in.
We own a Saturday shook hands.
I'm in on a Monday and he gave
me everything I needed which
was to be left to figure the
problems out. What I found out
about leadership over my career.
Now, that was the ending of my
sixteen-year career. I had
worked under some great rich
fantasy at Insight. I've worked
with a lot of CEOs but in the
organizations of Robert Half
International, I've been at
CarMax, a lot of Fortune 500
companies. When I got to Black
Night, what I realized is that
the best leaders are people who
understand how to hire people
who will own whatever it is
you're asking them to do and
ownership looks completely
different than work. Ownership
is looking for opportunities to
improve, creating plans,
basically being a complete and
total control of presenting the
best leadership possible. And
so, I believe that Don Smith's
leadership who I believe is
Tom Sanzone who's the CEO of
the parent company had that
same leadership which is finding
a capable person who will take
complete ownership of the
success and failure of the set
of initiatives they're
responsible for and I think more
leaders if they could
understand that if you hire the
right type of ownership
mindset, that's what people mean
by owner, entrepreneurial
mindset. They should say
ownership mindset. Ownership
sounds different, right? So,
if I say owner, think of team
owner, think of a football team
owner, a basketball team owner.
They have a completely
different relationship to their
organization. So, if we stop
using entrepreneurial mindset
and use ownership mindset.
Insight into that though. You
have some unfair advantage
insight into the ownership of
of sports teams. Uh remind me
of your background. So, so my
uncle, my uncle, when the
Arizona Cardinals made it to
the the Super Bowl, my uncle
was the general manager. Uh
he was the first player
personnel for the uh the
Chicago Bears. My grandfather
was one of the first African
American directors of player
personnel for the Philadelphia
Eagles. So, I have always
understood the way that
business works from the
ownership of a team
standpoint. So, what is that?
And and break that down for us
because I don't think a lot of
us understand or know what the
owners, I mean, I think a lot
of people think they just sit
around and own the team.
Absolutely. I've also heard
that like people like Mark
Cuban, they've been there every
single year to thank them for
being season ticket holders
and that's a lot of phone
calls in addition all the
businesses he runs. So, what
does it look like? What does
an owner actually do? Let's
let's look at Mark Cuban.
We'll use Mark Cuban. That's a
perfect example. The very first
thing Mark Cuban does is he
splits his business between two
halves. You're going to have
the administration side of the
business. Let's call it the
business of basketball and
then the actual team
operations. That's the coach,
the players, and that type of
respect. So, you're going to
have a coach. The basic would
be if we're going to use the
San Antonio Spurs, that's
Greg Popovich. Typically, you
have two different people there
and then you're going to have a
a coach of the team. Typically,
what you then have is a set of
operations below them. If we're
going to use football for an
example over basketball because
it's complex, it resembles
business more. Right. Okay. So,
when you hire a coach as an
owner of the the Houston
Texans, what do they have to
hire next? They have to have
offense and defensive
coordinators. Now, that's two.
You have the football, football
operations. Now, you're an
offense and defensive
coordinators. Now, they have
their respective set of coaches
that they have to put into
place. Quarterback coach, your
wide receiver coach, your
tight end coach, and your
running back coach. That's the
offense side. Defenses,
defensive line, defensive backs,
linebackers, safety. Okay. So,
now, you have four coaches, two
coordinators, one head coach.
That's an entire operation. Now,
you fill in the players and so
what that does is and then you
look on the football operation
side. You have a marketing
department, you have a
technology department, no
different than any other
business, right? Liabilities of
the stadium and hundreds of
thousands of fans. Absolutely,
absolutely. So, what Mark Cuban
does as an owner is he leads
the brand. See, those those
phone calls, that's a brand
experience. Mark Cuban is a
genius brand manager. One of
the best I've ever seen in the
history of branding. He
understands. When you told me
that, has he ever called you?
He's like, hey, what do I
immediately think? Wow, that's
cool. Now, I want to look up
Mark Cuban. Now, I'm into what
happens when you look up Mark
Cuban. Do you immediately go
to Alice Mavericks? No.
Shark Tank. From there, it's
Yahoo. From there, it's
broadcast me and then you see
this incredible, incredible
outline of a person who
understands how to take a
concept, find the people, get
the people moving towards all.
And getting them to own that
concept. Thank you for the
insight on that. And so, if you
only had one opportunity to
share one more lesson, one
powerful lesson with visionaries
based on your experience and
this was it. What would it be?
Focus on systems. Focus on
owner, on people who own
systems. If you are not a
great system, stank or find one
who is. Focus on system or you
focus on anything else because
the most important thing in a
hundred company is business
processes, workflows, systems.
They are and people who are
interchangeable. Not that
they're not valuable. Don't
mistake that statement. What
I'm saying is is that over the
hundred plus years that Lehman
Brothers was in business before
fail, they had had thousands of
employees cycle through
hundreds and thousands of
positions. And so, if you focus
on the structure of the
business, putting structure in
place, you can find the right
people to fit into these
structures. So, that would be
the key to the success of the
systems and structure.
Absolutely. That's what provides
the stability as well for
people who care tremendously
about security, stability,
making sure that, you know, they
they know what to expect day in
and day out without systems,
that workflows, that processes,
that becomes a very a very
challenging reality that most
people don't want to deal with
it and that's that's totally
fine. In fact, I think that's
that's something that as an
entrepreneur, I had to learn to
do it by having children and
growing up. Um that's where I
was like, oh, okay. Security is
a kind of a cool thing. Um then
it became, oh my gosh,
security is like everything I
live for now. Um so, it's it's
it's the it's the aspect of
maturity. Alright. Um so, we've
we're about out of time but
before we wrap up, Chris, um
one one final thought on either
chat GPT, private equity
principles, in fact, no, let's
start with the AI. What are
some of the principles you
throw out that these
entrepreneurs should be looking
to develop? Absolutely. So,
number one, look for existing
operations that you can take
over. So, the thing that I
would say that I want to close
out with is AI, I want you to
think of AI operations and
think about how you can
integrate AI into each of the
systems of an existing business
and maximize profitability. So,
on the private equity front, if
you have a a business that's
already AI end to end for
business intelligence and
process optimization, you just
stay in those two lanes across
all of the different respects
of that business. You can drive
profitability without having to
increase expendability.
Expenses don't rise and so I
would say on the private equity
market, AI operations and
things like that. Love it. Now,
if you're that type of person
who's like, man, I wish I
understood that and I wish I
could do that. What do you
recommend people do? I mean, I
mean, I'm not going to be like
you and and or somebody like
you said, hiring somebody. How
do they go about that?
Absolutely. So, you're going to
be looking for three types of
people. You're going to be
looking for an AI advisor,
somebody who is a chief
technologist or a chief data
officer. You want people who
have had experience turning
technology concepts into
operations or you're going to
want people who understand AI
very well. You're going to want
to understand people who
understand AI very well. You
want to decide first because
then what that allows you to do
is understand what assets you
actually have inside of this
business and then you can begin
to create from that particular
business. So, I'd say it's
either a head of AI, a chief
technology officer who has some
AI or operations background,
and then a chief data officer
would be the three people I
would reach out to and start
building relationships. Awesome.
Well said, man. And another
another tip on that front
visionaries is to make sure
that your recruiting process is
very consistent. I see a lot of
business owners skipping that
step even if they have the
budget to dedicate towards it.
They don't realize that great
people want great processes.
LeBron James didn't go to the
Lakers on accident. You know,
uh Greg Poppins is an amazing
uh market where the the small
ball market and they had to put
certain elements into place in
order to become attractive to
the players who have joined
them as well. We as you know,
as the uh coaches, as the
business owners, we've got to
create cultures that people
want to belong to. Otherwise,
you know, you're either going
to pay top dollar and have
somebody who doesn't actually
own their role but if you
create that type of a culture
where they want to belong and
where they know that their
values are appreciated, now
you got somebody who's coming
in to play with that ownership
mentality that Chris is talking
about. So, Chris, thank you for
uh sharing all the wisdom that
you did today. If you want to
connect with uh Chris Chambers,
uh well, I was successful
connecting with him on LinkedIn
and he's got a website coming
out too. Um in the next couple
of weeks, we'll be putting that
in the show notes once the
landing pages is available. Um
our landing page is available
for the show and uh Vision Pros
if you if you want to share
your own vision, don't hesitate
to apply. It's an awesome
opportunity to go to Vision
Pros live.com to share your
vision. There's a there's a
guest button to fill out your
application and get on the
show. Uh Chris, thanks for
being here today, man. This was
awesome. Thank you so much. One
final note, teach ownership
to your friends and your
friends. Share at the top.
Don't always look at people
this competition and you will
see massive growth in
everything that you do. Well
said, my friend. Thank you for
being here today. I'm really
happy that you tuned in to
Vision Pros live. I'm looking
forward to seeing your reactions
as these episodes continue to
move forward. This is going to
get more and more fun. We'll
have more and more engagement
as well. We'll invite people to
participate in the show and
thank you for giving us your