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I think forever, 20 plus years, 20 plus years and probably some marketing

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instincts before that is my guess as well.

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Yes.

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Yeah.

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That's exactly right.

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Yeah.

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Most of us that have been in marketing, uh, didn't realize that until we

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went through some training, right?

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And we're like, Oh, this is like, I was loved.

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Yes.

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Marketing and sales and kind of went back and forth between the two.

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Awesome.

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And what's been, uh, what, what was your favorite job?

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Did you have, do you have a job that you really liked in marketing?

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They were all so different.

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Okay.

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I will say my first job actually was I worked for AT&T.

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My first job out of college and it was awesome because huge company.

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We had multimillion dollar budgets and I got kind of thrown into marketing

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and getting to work with some of the top advertising agencies, getting to film

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commercials, and one of the, um, there was a product that was AT&T broadband

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in Espanol and I had a degree in marketing and a degree in Spanish and the woman who

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was running the product marketing did not speak Spanish, interestingly.

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And so every time the marketing communications would come back, whether

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it was TV commercials, radio spots, you know, direct mail, email, I would end up

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reviewing it all and eventually they put me over that product.

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And so I got to do product marketing for that, which was really fun.

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And, um, getting to go down to Miami and film commercials in Spanish.

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And, and, uh, so I would say that was my favorite job.

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Wow.

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Uh, and the depth that comes from that, what does that, what I've never

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managed a budget like that.

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I mean, you're talking tens of millions of dollars, um, probably are more.

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What is that like?

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It was.

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All right.

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Welcome in to Vision Pros Live with Jackson Calame.

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I'm your show host.

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We'll be doing interviews for visionary entrepreneurs and guest leaders who are

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building fantastic visions out there.

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Hey, what's up Vision Pros.

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Welcome into Vision Pros Live.

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My name is Jackson Calame, your show host, founder and CEO of First Class Business.

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I am excited to have Stacey Danheiser on board who not only is a marketing

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specialist who's going to talk about unleashing the exponential growth within

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businesses by anticipating customer needs, which I'm really excited about

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because so many people overlook so many big needs of their customers and they

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think they're serving them to their best capacity, but there's so much more you

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can do and once you cover those needs, the loyal fans come in droves.

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So I'm very bought into this concept.

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We're going to be tag teaming this together.

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Um, she's going to be leading the way on it.

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And she speaks Spanish too, which is really cool because you don't meet a lot

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of people on that have that capacity.

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And it is a huge unfair advantage in the market because the amount of Latinos

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who are in our country, especially for the North American companies, specifically

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right now, the Latinos are underserved.

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They're not spoken to, um, according to their needs and according to what's,

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what's comfortable for them from a language standpoint that allows them to

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understand that you actually care about them.

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And if you don't know their language, how can you claim that you care?

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So anyway, I'm gonna get off my tangent.

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I'm excited about it.

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I'm excited for Stacey to be joining us in the show before we dive into

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Stacey's background, who she is and bring her on stage and talk about her vision.

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I of course want to give a shout out to the sponsors up here.

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These sponsors are not paid for sponsors.

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There are companies that I support.

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Um, and I believe in and cold click, for instance, is our

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provider for LinkedIn automation.

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Um, I believe that at the top, I don't believe this at the top of the funnel.

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If you look at marketing funnels and you're new to marketing, the top is

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distribution and distribution is often overlooked by entrepreneurs.

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Um, most of us want to talk to one to two or three people and consider

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a distribution complete, we need a massive audience of people that we can

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sort through so that natural relations progress rather than forcing the issue

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and trying to convert every single person along your path.

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Automation does just that for me.

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It connects me to more people, the right people fall into place.

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The other people marinate, they take their time, the relationship builds.

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I don't have to force, um, you know, there's stranger danger and that's real.

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So this helps me with that process of, of helping people acclimate to who I am

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as a stranger and then move forward more naturally with us when the timing is right.

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Uh, then there's simply fast websites.

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This is not a solution that I use because I'm well past the stage of needing it.

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But what I love about simply fast websites is that Shane Michael is

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offering a website package at $179.

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When I was starting a business, I did not pay $179.

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I spent hours and hours building on Wix, building on Space, building on Weebly,

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um, building on all the free platforms I could, which cost me all sorts of time.

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And in addition to that, when I did consult with web developers, web designers

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and try to figure that whole process out, I again was overwhelmed.

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It was a convoluted process and I spent thousands of dollars.

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Establishing my first few websites.

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If I had had somebody like this to kind of guide me through the process, um, it

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would have saved me so much, so much hassle and time.

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And no, I wouldn't have ended up with a Disney.com or Nike.com and one of the

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best websites in the world, but I would have ended up with a starting point that

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was stronger, much faster, so I could have focused on building my business.

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And as they say, you got to be outside your business, working with others, not

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in your business, stuck within the walls of it and confined.

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Um, this is a great way to make sure that the web presence starts on the right foot.

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So I'd take this opportunity.

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I compare it against your other options, of course, don't just take my word for it.

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But I hope that resource helps somebody today.

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In addition to that, we also want to give back to the world.

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I'm a big fan of the water project.

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The water project helps people get access to clean drinking water.

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Um, and I would be remiss not to take the opportunity.

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I was like down during this part, hoping my water bottle's right there and I

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forgot it, but I mean, imagine having to send your kids miles from, from home.

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To go get water from a source that is not necessarily clean.

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There are millions of people in this world, maybe billions who don't have access

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to the resources that we take for granted.

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I can go in my kitchen and get water when I want it.

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Um, these communities, you get to see the community that you're going to impact.

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You get to choose it.

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Um, you get to see how many people are affected by it.

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Then through their social media efforts, this organization shows you the before

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and after of what has occurred and you get to know that that community now has

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a resource that's going to affect them for generations.

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Kids are going to be in school.

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Parents are no longer going to have to miss work, um, to get water for the

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families and the amount of community, uh, fighting that can occur when your,

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your family needs water and somebody else does.

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And you've got a line of 30 people, um, you know, those who are all waiting on

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the important resource, um, and the most important resource in the world, just

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to survive, um, we have the opportunity to impact that if you know of another

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cause that you'd rather see us support, don't hesitate to drop by and say,

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don't hesitate to drop that in the comments.

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We've got 8 billion people on this earth to help.

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Um, and, uh, our goal is to just make as much impact as we can throughout this

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process of creating some awareness and of course, driving some, uh, some

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donations to said entities.

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So thanks for being willing to participate in that.

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Um, as far as Stacey Danheiser goes, um, she's got a company, um,

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called shake marketing and she's helping elevate senior B2B marketing leaders

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and gain more influence with the C-suite.

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She's a fractional CMO as well.

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And she does of course, strategy assessments, just like most marketers,

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um, as a fractional chief marketing officer, um, she's going to, she's

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going to unlock for us again, some of those hidden secrets about

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anticipating customer needs.

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And so I can't wait to have her on board to talk about that and all sorts of

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vision aspects of what she does.

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Stacey, thank you for joining us on Vision Post.

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Yes.

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Amazing.

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Thanks for having me.

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Absolutely.

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Um, so as we, as we dive in it, you know, you've, you've got the ability

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to work with the a hundred million dollar budgets.

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You also have the ability to work with smaller companies.

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So I want to make sure we quantify that really well.

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Who do you feel should be listening today and why do you feel they should listen to you?

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Yeah.

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So, so really my focus and, and, um, expertise is in B2B, the B2B space.

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So pretty much any company, whether it's a startup or a Fortune 100 company,

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that sells to another business is who I can help.

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And it's because the principles of marketing really are the same

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and the foundation is the same.

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It gets generally more complex and difficult as we move upstream, mostly

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because of internal barriers and issues.

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So working at a Fortune 100 company has a bunch of internal dynamics and political,

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um, savviness required to navigate through that versus at a startup.

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It's a little bit faster to make decisions and to go.

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But that's pretty much who I help is B2B organizations, um, who are,

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who are looking to grow.

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Absolutely.

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And I'm, I'm glad that you talked about the principal aspect.

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Um, most of us, all of us to some degree follow principles, but we often get

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confused in the tactics and the fads and the principles, right?

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Tactic and fad, um, would be like one threads, uh, TikTok, Snapchat, anything

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that's that hasn't been around for 20 years, I would consider a fad.

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Um, and in terms of non principles, you know, think of the pickup line guy.

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Um, did you fall from heaven or, you know, or did that hurt?

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Did you, did that hurt, you know, when you fell from heaven that I see

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I'm not even good at the line, but people, people fall into these

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circumstances or the LinkedIn one that's most commonly used that I see is.

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Hey, it looks like we have mutual connections.

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Um, you know, we, we should talk.

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Um, and I'm like, Oh my gosh, like, what are you doing with your automation?

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Like there's nothing authentic about that.

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That's, that's a fad.

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That's a trend.

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That's not a principal principles.

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On the other hand, um, when you, when you can utilize them, it doesn't matter

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matter where they're using a phone, a social media channel or, uh, email

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marketing or some other means, if you know the principles, you can be

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effective at any one of those mediums.

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That's what I would say.

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What would you add to that?

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I'm just, I'm just curious your perspective on principles versus fads.

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Yeah.

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I mean, I think I like to think of it as like the, um, I think of

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marketing as the architect versus the builder.

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And so it's, it's like, are you doing, do you have your plan?

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The architectural drawings, do you know what the blueprint looks like?

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Do you, do you know what you're actually building before picking up the

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hammer and starting to build walls?

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I think a lot of companies just kind of focus more specifically on, oh, there's

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a new brand of hammer or a new brand of nail, and we're going to go try that

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without going back to remembering what it is that they're building in the first

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place and maybe the hammer and the nail isn't even appropriate.

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So it's to me, that's, it kind of comes, comes back to that, um, understanding

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and to, to be grounded, right.

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And what it is that you really want to achieve.

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I love that.

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And so let's talk about your vision for those of you who are

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working with you, what does that look like?

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What, what do you hope people achieve by working with you?

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Yeah.

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So, so I help, I mean, I have kind of two, two missions, but I'm a

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marketer at heart.

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So, so lately I've been working with professional marketers to help them

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earn and keep a seat at the leadership table by becoming hyper-focused on

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customers and the CEOs love that message too, flipping it around to, to

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CEOs and to entrepreneurs is I help businesses grow exponentially.

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In a, in a safe way.

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That's not leading to extreme burnout by hyper-focusing on their customers

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and going back to kind of the fundamentals.

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Um, many, I found many of the CEOs that I work with are engineers by

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training or finance professionals.

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And so they are going with this engineering led approach to marketing,

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which doesn't work or resonate with the audience that they're trying to sell to.

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And so, um, that's, that's what I'm hoping to fix.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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That's that makes perfect sense.

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And let's shift gears to your personal vision.

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So moving outside of, uh, it could be outside of work too.

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Um, but what do you see for yourself over the next five, 15, 20?

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Don't let me define this.

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It could be a hundred years if you want to.

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Um, but what's on your horizon?

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Yeah.

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So, so as I've been doing this work, I think one of the things I've discovered

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and have become really passionate about is helping women leaders specifically

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become more confident and to step in and kind of own their value.

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And I think this is very prevalent because I work with marketers.

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I mean, no other function of the business has to deal with more opinions

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than the marketing department.

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And there's a lot more women, I think, in these roles than men.

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And, and if you don't have somebody that's kind of an assertive personality

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or that has extreme, um, confidence in what they're doing, then they

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tend to kind of get burnt out.

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They become feeling like an order taker.

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Um, and so really that's the thing that I want to help impact is

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that the role is valuable.

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Your career is valuable.

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What you're doing is valuable.

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You know, don't let other people define that for you and, and help kind of

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learn, um, how to show up with confidence and not take things so personally.

253
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I love that.

254
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Um, we're going to dive a little bit deeper on that one, um, because it

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is one of those aspects that becomes a lose lose situation for both the

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chief marketing officers or the women executives in that position, as

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well as the company itself.

258
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Um, and it's usually created, um, well, one, I would say there's an internal

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aspect of confidence and lack of confidence that has to be addressed

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in order to not get steamrolled.

261
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But when you're working with an entrepreneur and entrepreneurs tend

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to be extremely alpha in nature, very self-assured, very committed

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to what it is they're doing.

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And so even if we're working with somebody who's confident, if we're not

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good at learning listening skills, we will end up creating a team of yesmen

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or force in the hands of our teams to move into a position to where they

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cater to our desires rather than creating what our business needs.

268
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Um, I would love to hear you talk about that.

269
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Yeah.

270
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I think that's a really big one.

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Um, it's interesting because it requires, you know, let's look at the entrepreneur,

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the business owner, the CEO requires a level of self-awareness, um, as to kind

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of what, what type of leader you are and what type of culture you want to create.

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I've worked with CEOs and business leaders who will say with their words,

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I want my team to feel empowered.

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I want my team to have ownership.

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I want my team to be accountable.

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And then, but their actions are, I got to attend every single meeting that

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they're going to, I'm going to talk for 80% of the time, um, compared to, I'm

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not going to let my team make decisions or take over.

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And so there, your, your words really have to match up with your actions and you

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have to really understand what type of culture it is that you want to create.

283
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Um, so that's kind of on, on the CEO side, I think order takers, you know, are

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never going to drive the growth that you want or that you envision because

285
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that's assuming that you know, everything.

286
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Right.

287
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You know, that our knowledge is so small and limited that you may be an expert in

288
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your product that does not make you an accounting expert and a legal expert, you

289
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know, and a product expert and a marketing expert and a sales expert.

290
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And so, you know, you have to have, like I said, a level of self-awareness to

291
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admit that and to know like, what are your strengths and where do you want to play?

292
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And then where do you need to bring other people in and let them do their thing?

293
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And what their passion and excited about.

294
00:15:54,560 --> 00:15:59,240
Um, I think on the, on the marketer side, I think it's important to

295
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know that it's going back to what you said.

296
00:16:02,000 --> 00:16:05,040
There's definitely like a mindset piece, right?

297
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That, you know, confidence, um, starts with, with that, with

298
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the, that belief in yourself.

299
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And then you can pair it up with knowledge.

300
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Um, and so we, we become more confident.

301
00:16:19,640 --> 00:16:23,040
This is like one of the skillsets that I always say every marketer means is, is

302
00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:26,240
that you have to be very committed to continuous learning.

303
00:16:26,240 --> 00:16:30,440
And so, you know, the way that marketing is changing all the time and, you know,

304
00:16:30,680 --> 00:16:34,840
there's the way customers are buying is changing the way salespeople

305
00:16:34,840 --> 00:16:38,280
are selling is changing the way people consume information is changing.

306
00:16:38,840 --> 00:16:43,320
And you as the marketer have to be constantly at the forefront of that and,

307
00:16:43,360 --> 00:16:46,560
and learning, and so that you're absorbing that knowledge, because the worst case

308
00:16:46,560 --> 00:16:50,560
scenario, and I've seen many marketers work themselves out of a job when the

309
00:16:50,560 --> 00:16:55,720
CEO or the salesperson or the, um, the product leader comes into the room with

310
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no marketing or more knowledge about a particular channel or tactic, um, than

311
00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:04,440
the marketer themselves, and all of a sudden their credibility is kind of being

312
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questioned because they haven't kept up with what's going on.

313
00:17:07,320 --> 00:17:11,480
So we're seeing this happen right now actually with AI, um, you know, and how

314
00:17:12,120 --> 00:17:14,440
CEOs are like, yes, let's, let's go.

315
00:17:14,480 --> 00:17:16,040
I mean, everybody should be jumping on this.

316
00:17:16,040 --> 00:17:17,960
Why isn't our marketing team using AI?

317
00:17:18,000 --> 00:17:23,760
Why are they driving more of the AI, um, implementation in our organization?

318
00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:26,960
And marketers are kind of sitting that maybe a little bit more hesitant to adopt

319
00:17:27,040 --> 00:17:29,920
the technology, but it has to be flipped.

320
00:17:30,200 --> 00:17:34,320
Um, otherwise, yeah, they might find themselves out of a job.

321
00:17:35,040 --> 00:17:35,360
Right.

322
00:17:35,360 --> 00:17:36,120
Absolutely.

323
00:17:36,200 --> 00:17:37,360
Um, I'd agree with that.

324
00:17:37,360 --> 00:17:42,080
And, uh, that, by the way, if I ever ask you a question or steer you towards

325
00:17:42,080 --> 00:17:44,960
something and you're like, Jack's not really agree with that, go for it.

326
00:17:45,000 --> 00:17:48,080
Just so you know, you're welcome to, uh, be the contrarian.

327
00:17:49,240 --> 00:17:49,640
Awesome.

328
00:17:49,640 --> 00:17:52,880
I didn't get an issue with it, but I want to make sure cause you're obviously very

329
00:17:52,880 --> 00:17:57,520
diplomatic, um, and you have really great communication skills for both sides of

330
00:17:57,520 --> 00:18:01,480
the spectrum, but I also just want you to be able to clash if you need to.

331
00:18:01,840 --> 00:18:03,520
Um, marketing is all about that.

332
00:18:03,520 --> 00:18:04,760
It's about healthy debates.

333
00:18:04,760 --> 00:18:10,680
Um, you know, and, and with, you know, we'll, we'll exemplify that because the

334
00:18:10,680 --> 00:18:14,400
entrepreneur, again, you've got to make space for that in your brand, um, if

335
00:18:14,400 --> 00:18:18,040
you're going to win, so there's this, there's this AI debate going on right now.

336
00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:21,840
And, and I stayed out of it a little bit longer than I probably should have.

337
00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:28,200
Um, you know, and at the same time, uh, I've used it in many ways without

338
00:18:28,200 --> 00:18:31,920
realizing that chat GPT is not the first AI that's out there, right?

339
00:18:32,160 --> 00:18:35,760
So part of the challenge as well, and again, you mentioned this is the

340
00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:41,480
marketers having that strength, you know, to realize to say like, no, um, you

341
00:18:41,480 --> 00:18:45,400
know, like, well, yes, you've now learned you, you now watch the two hour Ted

342
00:18:45,400 --> 00:18:49,920
talk on, on chat, on chat GPT and all the videos that came after it.

343
00:18:49,920 --> 00:18:50,280
Great.

344
00:18:50,280 --> 00:18:54,000
You know more about the foundation of that new tool that doesn't change

345
00:18:54,000 --> 00:18:56,600
the fact that I've studied the principles for 15 years.

346
00:18:57,400 --> 00:18:57,640
Right.

347
00:18:58,240 --> 00:19:00,560
We again have to find us our centeredness.

348
00:19:00,560 --> 00:19:03,800
That's where every marketer needs to do some training on sales too.

349
00:19:04,120 --> 00:19:07,680
Um, but you've, you still, you've talked about some important points.

350
00:19:07,720 --> 00:19:09,360
Maybe it leads into the next question.

351
00:19:09,360 --> 00:19:10,000
Maybe it doesn't.

352
00:19:10,800 --> 00:19:15,280
So as far as the next question goes, um, this can be your worst business experience

353
00:19:15,280 --> 00:19:19,920
ever, or the worst business experience you've been a part of, um, but you

354
00:19:19,920 --> 00:19:23,760
know, I don't even mind if it's one that you've read about because the goal is to

355
00:19:23,760 --> 00:19:28,200
help the audience learn from our most impactful experiences, whether they were

356
00:19:28,200 --> 00:19:29,400
ours or ones we learned from.

357
00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:33,880
And, and I think a lot of people listening in, uh, they go, they've been

358
00:19:33,880 --> 00:19:35,560
through some stuff, right.

359
00:19:35,560 --> 00:19:37,960
And we've become a beacon of hope for them by answering this.

360
00:19:37,960 --> 00:19:40,880
So what would you say your worst business experience ever?

361
00:19:42,040 --> 00:19:44,200
Worst business experience ever.

362
00:19:44,240 --> 00:19:44,680
Okay.

363
00:19:45,480 --> 00:19:48,240
Yeah, that's interesting.

364
00:19:48,240 --> 00:19:52,600
Um, the first one that comes to mind, I'll, I'll probably have like a couple,

365
00:19:52,600 --> 00:19:56,200
just cause I, so I, before I became an entrepreneur and did my own thing, I

366
00:19:56,200 --> 00:19:57,760
worked in corporate for a very long time.

367
00:19:57,760 --> 00:20:00,680
So I have empathy really for both sides of the house.

368
00:20:00,680 --> 00:20:05,160
And I will remember that being said, my personality and the way that I look at

369
00:20:05,160 --> 00:20:08,280
things, um, is always as learning experiences.

370
00:20:08,400 --> 00:20:12,840
So I think I shifted, you know, it doesn't happen necessarily in that moment,

371
00:20:12,840 --> 00:20:16,360
but when I go back and reflect on it, I'm like, that was really great because I

372
00:20:16,360 --> 00:20:17,280
learned all these things.

373
00:20:17,280 --> 00:20:22,080
So that experience for me, the first, the first time was, um, actually getting

374
00:20:22,120 --> 00:20:24,680
some feedback, going back to that concept of self-awareness.

375
00:20:25,160 --> 00:20:29,480
I thought I was doing this great job as a, um, director of marketing in house.

376
00:20:29,480 --> 00:20:32,960
I was, you know, juggling all these projects and working with the sales

377
00:20:32,960 --> 00:20:35,920
team and working with our PR team and working with our product team.

378
00:20:36,520 --> 00:20:39,240
I thought pretty efficiently and pretty great.

379
00:20:39,240 --> 00:20:43,240
Um, and I remember getting called into the office of our, um, chief

380
00:20:43,240 --> 00:20:46,120
communications officer, and this is a big fortune 500 company.

381
00:20:46,120 --> 00:20:50,800
Uh, he called me and I was thinking to go, you know, get some praise for all

382
00:20:50,800 --> 00:20:52,560
of this great work that I was doing.

383
00:20:52,560 --> 00:20:56,800
And he said, uh, yeah, I just want to give you some feedback.

384
00:20:56,800 --> 00:20:59,320
My team is finding it difficult to work with you.

385
00:20:59,640 --> 00:21:01,640
And the team was the PR team.

386
00:21:02,160 --> 00:21:06,280
Um, and I think in my mind, you know, marketing and PR, I was like, they,

387
00:21:06,320 --> 00:21:08,240
you know, that's not a priority right now.

388
00:21:08,240 --> 00:21:09,760
I got more important things to do.

389
00:21:09,760 --> 00:21:13,000
And they felt that they felt that I had kind of neglected them and

390
00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:14,080
deprioritized them.

391
00:21:14,080 --> 00:21:17,320
And I remember sitting in his office as he's giving me this feedback.

392
00:21:17,320 --> 00:21:22,240
And I was like, my first reaction was to go defense, like, you know, that

393
00:21:22,240 --> 00:21:24,760
gut reaction of like, that's not even true.

394
00:21:24,760 --> 00:21:27,880
And let me tell you all the 50 ways that I'm actually being a great partner.

395
00:21:28,520 --> 00:21:29,880
But I took a deep breath.

396
00:21:30,040 --> 00:21:33,400
I looked away, I took a deep breath and I looked back and I said,

397
00:21:33,880 --> 00:21:34,920
thank you for that feedback.

398
00:21:35,320 --> 00:21:39,680
You know, I was not prepared to hear that obviously today, but I got to go reflect

399
00:21:39,680 --> 00:21:41,480
on it and I appreciate it.

400
00:21:41,480 --> 00:21:42,160
I really appreciate it.

401
00:21:42,160 --> 00:21:45,520
I got to go reflect on it and I appreciate it or whatever.

402
00:21:45,520 --> 00:21:49,680
And I kind of walked back like still a little fuming, but immediately

403
00:21:49,680 --> 00:21:53,840
called the PR team and like figured out how do we fix this?

404
00:21:54,080 --> 00:21:55,360
Let's get regular meetings.

405
00:21:55,360 --> 00:21:56,800
You know, what do you guys need for me?

406
00:21:56,800 --> 00:21:59,680
What do you feel like I'm doing that can help you?

407
00:22:00,320 --> 00:22:03,000
And years later, this is interesting.

408
00:22:03,000 --> 00:22:06,200
So, so that guy, the chief communications officer was so impressed

409
00:22:06,200 --> 00:22:13,120
with the reaction that he told, you know, his, his peers, and then I kind of got

410
00:22:13,640 --> 00:22:18,080
internal promotions and projects and things because of just that level of,

411
00:22:18,680 --> 00:22:19,680
of self-awareness.

412
00:22:19,680 --> 00:22:23,040
And even years later, I ran into him and he said, I still remember that how

413
00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:27,840
impressed I was with how you reacted, because most people don't react that way

414
00:22:27,840 --> 00:22:30,600
when they're getting, you know, negative feedback about their performance.

415
00:22:31,280 --> 00:22:34,360
And he's like, and you just kind of like immediately turn it around and fixed it.

416
00:22:34,360 --> 00:22:38,320
And I think it was like a, you know, a poor experience in the moment, but then

417
00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:43,360
ended up being a great lesson for me to be able to, to take feedback.

418
00:22:43,360 --> 00:22:48,040
And I took that as an entrepreneur because, you know, it's, and, and when I

419
00:22:48,040 --> 00:22:52,120
work with clients and as a, as a consultant to really ask them honestly,

420
00:22:52,120 --> 00:22:53,480
like, how are things going?

421
00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:54,720
What could I improve?

422
00:22:54,720 --> 00:22:58,080
And to be prepared to listen to that, to that feedback.

423
00:22:58,080 --> 00:23:02,040
And it doesn't feel good a lot, you know, if you're getting negative feedback,

424
00:23:02,040 --> 00:23:06,360
but it's kind of like putting yourself in a humbling experience and recognizing

425
00:23:06,520 --> 00:23:10,000
this is the lesson I learned from this is perception is reality.

426
00:23:10,480 --> 00:23:15,040
So whatever their perception is does not matter what, what mine is.

427
00:23:15,520 --> 00:23:19,320
If those things don't match up, like, then I have an opportunity to fix it.

428
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:23,720
And so I always like to give an opportunity for people to provide feedback

429
00:23:23,760 --> 00:23:25,960
and, you know, to listen to that.

430
00:23:25,960 --> 00:23:29,560
And it just helps make, make me a better entrepreneur and a better

431
00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:31,080
consultant as it is.

432
00:23:31,080 --> 00:23:37,680
So I'm keeping my jaw from dropping the, the humility and power with which you

433
00:23:37,680 --> 00:23:40,800
share that story alone is, is, is a masterpiece.

434
00:23:41,120 --> 00:23:44,720
I'm just going to own that right now for you.

435
00:23:45,000 --> 00:23:46,120
I'm like, Whoa.

436
00:23:46,360 --> 00:23:51,160
And to go back to that experience, I mean, you said self-awareness,

437
00:23:51,160 --> 00:23:52,520
certainly you had to have that.

438
00:23:53,120 --> 00:24:00,160
You also exercise a maturity that most people don't have the ability to do.

439
00:24:00,160 --> 00:24:03,520
And so there's a framework that you followed right there that most people

440
00:24:03,520 --> 00:24:06,120
aren't aware of one is you actually didn't react.

441
00:24:06,760 --> 00:24:09,840
You responded to the individual, right?

442
00:24:09,840 --> 00:24:15,160
Instead of reacting and being defensive, you responded to him in a appropriate

443
00:24:15,160 --> 00:24:18,480
way to show that you were willing to make adjustments, but then you

444
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:19,600
took it to the next level.

445
00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:24,080
And the next level is you listen to understand you didn't do it in the moment.

446
00:24:24,120 --> 00:24:25,440
You didn't do it with that person.

447
00:24:26,240 --> 00:24:27,880
You, you said, I need some time.

448
00:24:27,880 --> 00:24:31,000
You put a healthy boundary, so I need to take some time to think.

449
00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:35,000
And then you went to the PR team though, and you went and found out what can I do.

450
00:24:35,400 --> 00:24:35,640
Right.

451
00:24:35,640 --> 00:24:38,800
And that's, that's that next, again, there's a third level that most

452
00:24:38,800 --> 00:24:40,000
people have never even heard of.

453
00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:43,920
Um, and if we were all to practice that more often, I mean, I know levels and

454
00:24:43,920 --> 00:24:47,640
sometimes I find myself reacting like a child, um, in situations.

455
00:24:47,680 --> 00:24:51,280
So, uh, no, thank you so much for sharing that story.

456
00:24:51,280 --> 00:24:56,400
And it's, it's really cool how, how you can express that in a way that.

457
00:24:56,400 --> 00:24:57,840
You didn't make it all about you.

458
00:24:58,040 --> 00:25:00,120
You made it all about the value of the lesson.

459
00:25:00,320 --> 00:25:03,880
Um, so let's talk about your best experience in business.

460
00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:06,360
So, um, what, what does that look like?

461
00:25:06,400 --> 00:25:11,040
Um, and specifically, let's talk about your best experience related to, um,

462
00:25:11,080 --> 00:25:15,000
anticipating customer needs or a company that has made that shift that we're

463
00:25:15,000 --> 00:25:17,040
going to be talking about for exponential growth.

464
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:19,560
Um, that would be, that'd be fantastic to unlock.

465
00:25:19,800 --> 00:25:20,320
Yeah.

466
00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:24,160
Well, I mean, a couple, um, things pop up.

467
00:25:24,160 --> 00:25:33,480
So I would say it's very exciting to go from a corporate career and to

468
00:25:33,480 --> 00:25:34,680
start doing your own thing.

469
00:25:35,000 --> 00:25:38,320
And there's a lot of advice, you know, start a side gig, make a full business

470
00:25:38,320 --> 00:25:38,800
plan.

471
00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:39,880
I didn't do any of that.

472
00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:43,400
I just knew one day I was done working in the corporate world.

473
00:25:43,400 --> 00:25:44,920
I always wanted to start my own thing.

474
00:25:45,560 --> 00:25:50,760
And I decided that I was going to announce this to my, um, my boss at the

475
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:53,000
time I was working at a financial service company.

476
00:25:53,000 --> 00:25:55,960
And I had this idea right before I went to her office.

477
00:25:55,960 --> 00:25:59,720
And I, I thought, I want to, I want to see if I could pitch them being my first

478
00:25:59,720 --> 00:26:00,200
client.

479
00:26:01,080 --> 00:26:07,160
And so I went in and I said, Hey, um, I'm resigning to start my own thing,

480
00:26:08,280 --> 00:26:09,040
but I have an idea.

481
00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:10,440
I want you guys to be my first client.

482
00:26:10,920 --> 00:26:13,360
And she made it was like, yeah, let's go.

483
00:26:13,440 --> 00:26:15,280
I mean, we don't want to lose you.

484
00:26:15,280 --> 00:26:21,080
So, and it was great because I got a transition period to then go, you know,

485
00:26:21,080 --> 00:26:27,600
basically work part time for my previous company, um, and to help really like

486
00:26:27,600 --> 00:26:30,880
leave on a high note and establish a framework.

487
00:26:31,040 --> 00:26:36,880
And I was at the time leading a pretty significant, um, integrated campaign

488
00:26:36,880 --> 00:26:42,200
that involved literally like 10 or 12 different departments, um, and

489
00:26:42,200 --> 00:26:44,160
coordinating this whole entire effort.

490
00:26:44,560 --> 00:26:48,560
Um, ultimately leading to, you know, multi-millions of dollars worth of

491
00:26:48,560 --> 00:26:53,600
assets under management that the sales team ended up selling, but it was, it

492
00:26:53,600 --> 00:26:58,520
was a great experience, you know, one, like getting to sell something on my

493
00:26:58,520 --> 00:27:00,000
own for the first time, right.

494
00:27:00,000 --> 00:27:03,400
And it was, it was me and my services and not really even having that defined.

495
00:27:04,000 --> 00:27:05,640
Um, but then it was just validating.

496
00:27:05,640 --> 00:27:07,080
Cause I was like, I am on the right path.

497
00:27:07,120 --> 00:27:08,240
This is what I'm going to do.

498
00:27:08,480 --> 00:27:12,920
And giving, you know, getting to have that opportunity to really define

499
00:27:12,920 --> 00:27:14,320
like, what is my process?

500
00:27:14,320 --> 00:27:14,840
What are my.

501
00:27:14,840 --> 00:27:15,480
Packages.

502
00:27:15,520 --> 00:27:19,680
And while I was working in that, that gig, um, another opportunity

503
00:27:19,680 --> 00:27:22,280
came from my, my employer before that.

504
00:27:22,720 --> 00:27:26,000
And so then they called me and said, Hey, we want you to, um,

505
00:27:26,040 --> 00:27:27,560
help work on this project.

506
00:27:28,440 --> 00:27:35,720
And so it was, it was, um, a great, I guess, validating experience, um, to,

507
00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:39,000
to be able to, to move, to make that transition.

508
00:27:39,000 --> 00:27:42,840
So since then I have worked with four different departments, um,

509
00:27:42,840 --> 00:27:45,440
all around helping to come in.

510
00:27:45,440 --> 00:27:49,080
And what I, what I see is that many organizations start with execution.

511
00:27:49,320 --> 00:27:53,120
I mean, it's very easy to go start a LinkedIn page, start a TikTok page,

512
00:27:53,160 --> 00:27:57,480
start a, um, you know, threads page, just like, but what they don't really

513
00:27:57,480 --> 00:28:01,800
realize is like the amount of effort required and the consistent execution

514
00:28:01,800 --> 00:28:03,840
are required to, to keep that up and running.

515
00:28:03,840 --> 00:28:09,360
And so while it looks easy and simple at the onset, it's not that easy.

516
00:28:09,360 --> 00:28:14,400
While it looks easy and simple at the onset, typically companies call me in

517
00:28:14,440 --> 00:28:18,400
when they have been doing this for one or two years and they realize we did

518
00:28:18,400 --> 00:28:22,240
all the stuff, all the silver bullet, you know, techniques that these marketing

519
00:28:22,240 --> 00:28:25,000
people are telling us to do, and it's not working now.

520
00:28:25,000 --> 00:28:26,160
We don't trust anybody.

521
00:28:26,480 --> 00:28:28,280
We don't trust any marketing agency.

522
00:28:28,480 --> 00:28:31,720
Can you please come in and help us make sense of it all?

523
00:28:32,080 --> 00:28:37,960
And so the growth that I help kind of orchestrate is really all about alignment

524
00:28:37,960 --> 00:28:41,320
to, um, first understanding what do customers really want?

525
00:28:41,840 --> 00:28:45,880
And many of them, it's interesting, don't even have agreement on who is

526
00:28:45,880 --> 00:28:47,680
our ideal customer and who are we targeting.

527
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:54,000
And so, you know, it's like all these little wins when I, when I come into a

528
00:28:54,000 --> 00:28:57,440
company that that's like, okay, we're going to make some decisions and we're

529
00:28:57,440 --> 00:29:01,440
going to make like move some of these hurdles out of the way, starting with

530
00:29:01,960 --> 00:29:05,240
who are our customers, who do we want to be our customers?

531
00:29:05,240 --> 00:29:07,320
You know, what are these people want?

532
00:29:07,320 --> 00:29:08,320
What are they motivated by?

533
00:29:08,320 --> 00:29:09,520
What are their pain points?

534
00:29:09,520 --> 00:29:13,600
And do we all agree from the marketing organization, the product organization,

535
00:29:13,920 --> 00:29:16,680
the executive team, the sales team?

536
00:29:17,280 --> 00:29:18,960
So that's kind of step one.

537
00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:23,400
And then step two for alignment is what, what does our company want to achieve?

538
00:29:23,920 --> 00:29:27,640
So this is also interesting because most companies will have like, let's say a

539
00:29:27,640 --> 00:29:28,840
high level revenue target.

540
00:29:29,560 --> 00:29:31,720
Um, but then I like to give, get deeper.

541
00:29:31,720 --> 00:29:35,600
Well, how does that break out by then the customer segments we want to go after?

542
00:29:35,600 --> 00:29:37,120
How does that break out by geography?

543
00:29:37,120 --> 00:29:38,560
How does that break out by products?

544
00:29:38,560 --> 00:29:39,680
You sell more than one product.

545
00:29:39,680 --> 00:29:40,320
That's important.

546
00:29:40,960 --> 00:29:45,480
And so looking at it and just starting to put some strategy around this, because

547
00:29:45,480 --> 00:29:48,800
then when they come up and they say, we want to start a TikTok, we can go back

548
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:50,760
and look at, well, what are our goals here?

549
00:29:50,760 --> 00:29:56,000
Our goals are to sell to CEOs at fortune 500 companies that, you know, in this

550
00:29:56,040 --> 00:30:01,360
highly sophisticated market, like TikTok does not align that does literally go

551
00:30:01,360 --> 00:30:02,560
literally does not make sense.

552
00:30:02,600 --> 00:30:08,440
So stop listening to your niece or whatever in college, you know, like, and

553
00:30:08,440 --> 00:30:13,240
let's go back to who we're trying to attract and what our goals are so that we

554
00:30:13,240 --> 00:30:19,000
can make those tactical decisions and, and really focus our, our energy and our

555
00:30:19,000 --> 00:30:20,960
efforts versus trying to do everything.

556
00:30:22,480 --> 00:30:22,800
Hmm.

557
00:30:23,680 --> 00:30:25,400
There was a lot of gold in that.

558
00:30:25,480 --> 00:30:30,720
Um, there, there, I just, again, I, I feel like I'm like, I don't know,

559
00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:34,240
becoming too strong as an advocate for you right now, but like, there's, I

560
00:30:34,240 --> 00:30:36,320
got to ask a couple of very pointed questions.

561
00:30:36,320 --> 00:30:36,960
Number one.

562
00:30:37,520 --> 00:30:44,720
Um, do, do you know how you became as good of a communicator as you are?

563
00:30:44,800 --> 00:30:45,960
Do you know where that came from?

564
00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:49,080
I don't know.

565
00:30:49,080 --> 00:30:53,400
I mean, maybe years in marketing and it's for, I think it's deeper.

566
00:30:53,480 --> 00:30:54,480
I think it's further than that.

567
00:30:54,520 --> 00:30:56,560
I want to figure that because Stacy, there's only one of you.

568
00:30:57,360 --> 00:30:57,760
Okay.

569
00:30:58,440 --> 00:30:59,720
There's hundreds.

570
00:30:59,720 --> 00:31:03,520
There's millions of companies, um, that, that could use it.

571
00:31:03,520 --> 00:31:06,800
And you, you do, you have this way of communication that shows that you're

572
00:31:06,800 --> 00:31:10,240
very clear, um, about what it is that you know can be done.

573
00:31:10,280 --> 00:31:13,120
You have the, and you know, granted we're in an interview.

574
00:31:13,240 --> 00:31:16,480
Um, so we've got our interview voices on, um, the, the two of us.

575
00:31:16,800 --> 00:31:20,680
Do you, do you find yourself clashing those environments sometimes when

576
00:31:20,680 --> 00:31:24,040
you're, when you're, when you're going to edit is, or is it, or do you keep this

577
00:31:24,120 --> 00:31:27,840
bed of sunshine and roses with you as you go through these explanations

578
00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:32,320
with these entrepreneurs because you're, you are so on point, but you,

579
00:31:32,320 --> 00:31:37,720
some, you just have this aura when you talk about the, those aspects of clarity

580
00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:42,760
that so many of us as marketers and so many entrepreneurs can get so frustrated with.

581
00:31:44,760 --> 00:31:45,040
Yeah.

582
00:31:45,040 --> 00:31:46,480
I mean, I think it's interesting.

583
00:31:46,680 --> 00:31:50,480
So reflecting back, I think I've always been curious.

584
00:31:50,840 --> 00:31:54,480
And in fact, before I went into marketing, I wanted to be a journalist.

585
00:31:54,480 --> 00:31:58,280
Now the principles of journalism, I was always a writer, took newspaper

586
00:31:58,280 --> 00:32:02,440
in your book and learned how to ask questions and dig deeper.

587
00:32:02,920 --> 00:32:06,120
And so I was always interested in the why behind things.

588
00:32:06,120 --> 00:32:10,520
So not taking, you know, a problem for face value, but really trying to understand

589
00:32:10,520 --> 00:32:14,760
it, dig a little deeper as to why this problem persists or what is getting

590
00:32:14,760 --> 00:32:15,800
in people's way.

591
00:32:16,080 --> 00:32:22,400
And I think having worked with, um, when I transitioned from B2C marketing, so I

592
00:32:22,400 --> 00:32:27,080
worked, you know, at three or four different companies on the B2C side.

593
00:32:27,920 --> 00:32:29,680
And then I switched over to B2B.

594
00:32:29,720 --> 00:32:33,040
And the one thing that was massively different that I had to learn right away

595
00:32:33,040 --> 00:32:36,840
was working with the sales organization and B2C marketing is sales.

596
00:32:36,880 --> 00:32:38,200
There is no separate department.

597
00:32:38,680 --> 00:32:42,880
And in B2B, the marketing team has a tiny little budget and they have

598
00:32:42,880 --> 00:32:44,360
to work with the sales team.

599
00:32:44,360 --> 00:32:47,760
And I think I figured out pretty quickly that I had to build a relationship

600
00:32:47,760 --> 00:32:51,120
with the sales team and really get into their world.

601
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:53,200
To understand what their job is.

602
00:32:53,200 --> 00:32:56,240
If I was going to be successful, I needed to get them on my side.

603
00:32:56,640 --> 00:32:59,880
And so I started, you know, getting out of my comfort zone a little bit.

604
00:32:59,880 --> 00:33:01,840
I asked to attend sales training.

605
00:33:01,880 --> 00:33:03,360
I asked to travel with the sales team.

606
00:33:03,360 --> 00:33:06,480
I asked to go to customer meetings and customer events to listen to how the

607
00:33:06,480 --> 00:33:07,800
sales team was doing their job.

608
00:33:08,280 --> 00:33:11,760
And all of that helped give me credibility because now I could speak

609
00:33:11,760 --> 00:33:14,240
the language of salespeople.

610
00:33:14,280 --> 00:33:16,320
And by the way, this is the job of a marketer.

611
00:33:16,640 --> 00:33:18,000
So this is really what I was doing.

612
00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:21,200
I was just applying it to my internal audience.

613
00:33:21,240 --> 00:33:24,360
So here I was like, what does the CEO care about?

614
00:33:24,360 --> 00:33:25,640
What does the salesperson care about?

615
00:33:25,640 --> 00:33:27,280
What does the product person care about?

616
00:33:27,520 --> 00:33:32,720
I was always kind of like conscious of that lens when I was talking

617
00:33:32,720 --> 00:33:34,280
to or presenting to them.

618
00:33:34,680 --> 00:33:40,320
And then I think I've refined over time, you know, going from the corporate

619
00:33:40,320 --> 00:33:44,080
world where, by the way, I was surrounded by professional marketers,

620
00:33:44,080 --> 00:33:48,320
people who had trained in marketing to then going over to becoming a

621
00:33:48,320 --> 00:33:49,160
consultant.

622
00:33:49,160 --> 00:33:53,680
And I remember being shocked at one of the Inc 5000 companies that I was

623
00:33:53,680 --> 00:33:54,920
talking to the CEO.

624
00:33:55,560 --> 00:34:00,600
And we went out for coffee and he said, I'm just really confused.

625
00:34:00,840 --> 00:34:03,320
I don't really understand the difference between marketing and sales.

626
00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:05,520
And I was like, what?

627
00:34:05,520 --> 00:34:08,760
You're the CEO of this massively successful software company.

628
00:34:08,760 --> 00:34:13,360
And that's when I think I learned how to start talking in a different way

629
00:34:13,360 --> 00:34:17,760
that wasn't so marketing ish, you know, in corporate speak, because I was like,

630
00:34:17,760 --> 00:34:22,280
wow, this is, I have to like really go back to kind of the beginner mindset

631
00:34:22,320 --> 00:34:26,600
and load that this guy's an engineer and maybe he's never even taken a

632
00:34:26,600 --> 00:34:27,360
marketing class.

633
00:34:27,360 --> 00:34:31,160
And so how do you talk to somebody who doesn't have really any familiarity

634
00:34:31,160 --> 00:34:32,240
with the subject?

635
00:34:32,840 --> 00:34:35,720
You know, you've got to kind of refine that, that, that approach.

636
00:34:35,720 --> 00:34:40,520
If you've done strengths finder 2.0, then I would, I would assume you

637
00:34:40,520 --> 00:34:41,960
ranked fairly high for woo.

638
00:34:42,960 --> 00:34:45,800
But did it turn out as one of your top five?

639
00:34:46,120 --> 00:34:47,280
Have you ever done that before?

640
00:34:47,600 --> 00:34:49,320
I have, I want to say it to you.

641
00:34:49,320 --> 00:34:50,720
Woo is over.

642
00:34:50,720 --> 00:34:51,720
Yes.

643
00:34:51,720 --> 00:34:52,720
Okay.

644
00:34:52,720 --> 00:34:53,720
You've got that.

645
00:34:53,720 --> 00:34:54,720
You've got that.

646
00:34:54,720 --> 00:34:55,720
Yeah.

647
00:34:55,720 --> 00:34:56,720
Thank you.

648
00:34:56,720 --> 00:34:59,120
My number one actually was strategy.

649
00:34:59,120 --> 00:35:00,120
That was my number one.

650
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:02,120
I believe that too.

651
00:35:02,120 --> 00:35:03,120
And that's what I'm talking about.

652
00:35:03,120 --> 00:35:07,320
Number one, I believe that too naturally as a, as a marketer, you're

653
00:35:07,320 --> 00:35:10,640
going to have that too, but no, it's, it's just my, it's mind blowing to me.

654
00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:16,160
I had a, I had a VP of, of cells that, um, used to talk about woo cause he was

655
00:35:16,160 --> 00:35:17,520
so disappointed he didn't have it.

656
00:35:17,520 --> 00:35:18,400
And his wife did.

657
00:35:18,400 --> 00:35:20,080
And he was like, man, I wish I had a woo.

658
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:24,600
I, I remember looking at that and I was a young, I would torch anything that

659
00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:28,320
got in my way type of guy and I had no woo whatsoever.

660
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:30,600
So I was like, I would do want that, you know?

661
00:35:30,600 --> 00:35:33,080
And now I realized like, oh my gosh, like I wish I had that.

662
00:35:33,080 --> 00:35:35,800
That one, when he put that on my radar.

663
00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:36,800
Um, okay.

664
00:35:36,800 --> 00:35:42,200
So, um, we're going to go into, uh, one, one, we'll go into one powerful lesson.

665
00:35:42,200 --> 00:35:45,840
Let's make this one a little bit shorter because I, because I want to dive into that

666
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:47,320
anticipation of customer needs.

667
00:35:47,320 --> 00:35:49,960
I know you got some, some gold in there for that.

668
00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:55,200
Um, but if you had, you know, I don't know, this is your last 90 seconds to talk to us

669
00:35:55,200 --> 00:35:58,840
and you can only give us one powerful lesson as visionaries.

670
00:35:58,840 --> 00:36:00,440
What would it be?

671
00:36:00,440 --> 00:36:01,440
One powerful lesson.

672
00:36:01,440 --> 00:36:09,360
Um, I would say, I mean, I'm, I'll probably tie it back to, um, marketing, of course.

673
00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:16,560
Um, but I would say it's, it's that we don't have to measure everything and that sometimes

674
00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:20,800
it's like, you've got to trust your intuition and your gut.

675
00:36:20,800 --> 00:36:28,280
And I know that feels uncomfortable, especially for the engineers and the finance professionals

676
00:36:28,280 --> 00:36:32,660
among us, but we all have this, um, innate ability to do it.

677
00:36:32,660 --> 00:36:36,320
And I think, especially, you know, if we realize marketing is really just about connecting

678
00:36:36,320 --> 00:36:42,040
to other people and that's really what marketing and sales is, um, that when you start to kind

679
00:36:42,040 --> 00:36:46,160
of pay attention to all of the signals and things around it, not just staring every day

680
00:36:46,160 --> 00:36:48,600
at the data and looking and kind of becoming obsessed.

681
00:36:48,600 --> 00:36:53,680
Cause I think our, our culture and especially this profession has become kind of ultra obsessed

682
00:36:53,680 --> 00:36:56,520
with this data driven approach.

683
00:36:56,520 --> 00:37:03,840
And we are forgetting this whole other side of human nature, um, psychology, intuition,

684
00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:08,360
you know, things that we don't really learn anymore in school, um, in favor of let's just

685
00:37:08,360 --> 00:37:10,840
look at the statistics and the math and the data.

686
00:37:10,840 --> 00:37:13,120
And I think we're, we're missing that whole piece.

687
00:37:13,120 --> 00:37:16,660
Oh, it's thank you so much for that there.

688
00:37:16,660 --> 00:37:19,880
And it's, it's the marketers justification, right?

689
00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:23,640
Of our, of our livelihoods and we feel forced to do it.

690
00:37:23,640 --> 00:37:25,400
We're not, we have to back back up.

691
00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:27,000
We have to help people to back off, right?

692
00:37:27,000 --> 00:37:30,880
We have to set the boundary and realize that, no, it's not.

693
00:37:30,880 --> 00:37:32,560
You can't measure everything.

694
00:37:32,560 --> 00:37:36,640
Um, you know, I think of this poster that the spurs is handed San Antonio spurs have

695
00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:41,800
in the locker room and it's about a person, uh, who's taking a pickaxe to a rock.

696
00:37:41,800 --> 00:37:42,800
Um, right.

697
00:37:42,800 --> 00:37:47,940
And he hits it hundreds of times with seemingly no effect whatsoever.

698
00:37:47,940 --> 00:37:50,360
You cannot see any ding in this rock.

699
00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:55,240
And it's not until he actually hits where it breaks through after the 200th blow that

700
00:37:55,240 --> 00:37:56,240
the effect happens.

701
00:37:56,240 --> 00:38:02,400
Um, you know, and that's, that's their discipline for their culture of the sport is you have

702
00:38:02,400 --> 00:38:06,120
to just keep going and trusting in those principles.

703
00:38:06,120 --> 00:38:08,880
You cannot measure that process.

704
00:38:08,880 --> 00:38:11,680
So it's so important.

705
00:38:11,680 --> 00:38:14,360
Now you also talked about something else important.

706
00:38:14,360 --> 00:38:19,520
You said, um, you just started, um, you didn't do any of that when you were referring to

707
00:38:19,520 --> 00:38:23,720
move, you know, switching into the entrepreneurial role.

708
00:38:23,720 --> 00:38:27,040
And you're right, a lot of us think we have to take that course or we have to get certified

709
00:38:27,040 --> 00:38:30,000
by X, Y, or Z, or we have to have this in order.

710
00:38:30,000 --> 00:38:33,400
And we forget about the universal laws, right?

711
00:38:33,400 --> 00:38:38,080
If we go back to the basics, uh, I've never met somebody who was born in their due date.

712
00:38:38,080 --> 00:38:41,760
And I actually asked that kind of often because I got curious after I had kids.

713
00:38:41,760 --> 00:38:46,920
Oh, I was like, are you born in your, were your kids born in their, no, we, we just happens,

714
00:38:46,920 --> 00:38:47,920
right?

715
00:38:47,920 --> 00:38:49,160
The kid comes out when it's ready to come out.

716
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:50,640
You can jump on a trampoline.

717
00:38:50,640 --> 00:38:51,640
You can breathe.

718
00:38:51,640 --> 00:38:54,880
You can do all the yoga exercises, swimming, whatever you want to do, but the kids going

719
00:38:54,880 --> 00:38:56,960
to come out when the kids going to come out.

720
00:38:56,960 --> 00:38:59,160
And then you're going to learn how to walk.

721
00:38:59,160 --> 00:39:00,160
How?

722
00:39:00,160 --> 00:39:01,160
Not with a book.

723
00:39:01,160 --> 00:39:04,920
Just, you're just going to do it one day.

724
00:39:04,920 --> 00:39:06,200
It's just going to happen.

725
00:39:06,200 --> 00:39:07,640
We can't force that child.

726
00:39:07,640 --> 00:39:09,600
And the same is true with business.

727
00:39:09,600 --> 00:39:17,060
There is healthy measuring, but 99.9% of us, I'll include myself in that don't know how

728
00:39:17,060 --> 00:39:21,220
to measure what we're trying to measure.

729
00:39:21,220 --> 00:39:24,120
And so it's healthy to let go and look at the principles.

730
00:39:24,120 --> 00:39:25,720
So thank you for that.

731
00:39:25,720 --> 00:39:26,720
All right.

732
00:39:26,720 --> 00:39:32,720
Anticipating customer needs and unlocking that, that exponential growth.

733
00:39:32,720 --> 00:39:35,640
We have about five minutes if you're, do you have five minutes?

734
00:39:35,640 --> 00:39:37,300
Okay, great.

735
00:39:37,300 --> 00:39:40,520
And I would love to dive into that at a greater depth.

736
00:39:40,520 --> 00:39:44,920
So what are, we can start with red flags that people are overlooking with the process or

737
00:39:44,920 --> 00:39:48,640
we can start with the green check marks of what we should do.

738
00:39:48,640 --> 00:39:53,800
Well, let's start with red flag number one, which is that companies aren't doing customer

739
00:39:53,800 --> 00:39:54,800
research.

740
00:39:54,800 --> 00:40:01,080
Now this was shocking to me also moving from B2C to B2B because in B2C when you're managing

741
00:40:01,080 --> 00:40:06,560
multi-millions of dollars worth of one second, when you said customers aren't doing research,

742
00:40:06,560 --> 00:40:09,120
did you mean like your clients, business owners?

743
00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:10,120
Yeah.

744
00:40:10,120 --> 00:40:14,000
So yeah, B2B organizations, basically companies are not doing customer research.

745
00:40:14,000 --> 00:40:15,560
That's that's problem number one.

746
00:40:15,560 --> 00:40:18,160
They don't budget for it.

747
00:40:18,160 --> 00:40:24,120
And then if they do think it's a priority, they are relying, let's say on the salesperson

748
00:40:24,120 --> 00:40:29,240
to do customer research or pay the executive talk to a customer and therefore that's customer

749
00:40:29,240 --> 00:40:30,400
research.

750
00:40:30,400 --> 00:40:33,440
But like anything, customer research is a skillset.

751
00:40:33,440 --> 00:40:35,600
Not everybody has the ability to do it.

752
00:40:35,600 --> 00:40:40,120
You know, I would highly encourage everybody to budget for some formal research at least

753
00:40:40,120 --> 00:40:48,080
once per year and, and or send your marketing person to training on how to do customer research.

754
00:40:48,080 --> 00:40:53,280
Because it's not it is a skillset like you have to be kind of a little bit of a journalist

755
00:40:53,280 --> 00:40:54,280
mindset, right?

756
00:40:54,280 --> 00:40:57,520
To be able to dig, dig the story out.

757
00:40:57,520 --> 00:41:00,400
And so that's that's problem number one.

758
00:41:00,400 --> 00:41:06,080
Number two is that I find that companies aren't doing this because they think they are the

759
00:41:06,080 --> 00:41:10,200
customer or quote, we know our customer, we know exactly what they want.

760
00:41:10,200 --> 00:41:16,920
And I'm working with a company right now who sells technology devices and they are engineers.

761
00:41:16,920 --> 00:41:21,360
And so when I see, tell me what you know about your customers and how are you communicating

762
00:41:21,360 --> 00:41:27,340
the value of what you do, it's all very engineering, technical feature driven.

763
00:41:27,340 --> 00:41:28,720
And people don't buy that.

764
00:41:28,720 --> 00:41:31,120
They buy the problem.

765
00:41:31,120 --> 00:41:33,220
You know, they buy the solution to their problem.

766
00:41:33,220 --> 00:41:38,960
And so being able to present customer, the whole purpose of doing customer research and

767
00:41:38,960 --> 00:41:43,740
diving deeper into understanding customer needs is so that you can present your offering

768
00:41:43,740 --> 00:41:47,280
through a lens and into a world that they understand.

769
00:41:47,280 --> 00:41:52,440
And example of that, by the way, is Kleenex and describing the fibers and the tissues

770
00:41:52,440 --> 00:41:55,760
that go with it or saying this will make your nose feel better.

771
00:41:55,760 --> 00:41:56,760
Yes.

772
00:41:56,760 --> 00:41:57,760
Right.

773
00:41:57,760 --> 00:41:58,760
What people want.

774
00:41:58,760 --> 00:42:02,760
The other one is stuff that mumble jumbo gargant.

775
00:42:02,760 --> 00:42:03,760
So yes.

776
00:42:03,760 --> 00:42:04,760
Yes.

777
00:42:04,760 --> 00:42:08,720
Well, and what I found too is in that that example, you're going to have maybe some of

778
00:42:08,720 --> 00:42:14,120
the nerdy people that want to know all of that information about the fibers and how

779
00:42:14,120 --> 00:42:15,120
it's made.

780
00:42:15,120 --> 00:42:16,120
And that's great.

781
00:42:16,120 --> 00:42:17,120
Make it available for those people.

782
00:42:17,120 --> 00:42:18,120
But not everybody wants that.

783
00:42:18,120 --> 00:42:24,720
And so you have to know what kind of buyer you're talking to and what they care about.

784
00:42:24,720 --> 00:42:25,720
And that's research.

785
00:42:25,720 --> 00:42:26,720
Exactly.

786
00:42:26,720 --> 00:42:29,160
So how much budget would you dedicate towards the formal research process?

787
00:42:29,160 --> 00:42:31,800
I know it's different case by case, but what is that?

788
00:42:31,800 --> 00:42:32,800
What do you try to look at?

789
00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:38,120
I mean, it's literally it could be all over the board, but it's generally like around

790
00:42:38,120 --> 00:42:46,840
ten thousand dollars depending on this is for like, you know, highly technical, maybe

791
00:42:46,840 --> 00:42:47,840
more sophisticated products.

792
00:42:47,840 --> 00:42:50,800
If we're talking about consumer research, you can actually do that.

793
00:42:50,800 --> 00:42:56,180
A lot of that on your own or with surveys or even hire somebody that's pretty inexpensive

794
00:42:56,180 --> 00:42:57,560
on an hourly basis to.

795
00:42:57,560 --> 00:42:59,840
I like what you said, though.

796
00:42:59,840 --> 00:43:00,840
You did.

797
00:43:00,840 --> 00:43:04,740
You talked about having your person go and learn this right.

798
00:43:04,740 --> 00:43:08,080
You can do an hour's worth of research or have an executive assistant do that.

799
00:43:08,080 --> 00:43:10,120
And you can get that person in a program.

800
00:43:10,120 --> 00:43:12,240
It's probably not going to be the best program in the world.

801
00:43:12,240 --> 00:43:13,320
That's OK.

802
00:43:13,320 --> 00:43:16,600
At least get them in some type of program to you talked about the sales team doing the

803
00:43:16,600 --> 00:43:17,680
research.

804
00:43:17,680 --> 00:43:20,640
The problem is the bias that exists in that regard.

805
00:43:20,640 --> 00:43:22,600
There's no objectivity.

806
00:43:22,600 --> 00:43:25,080
So we look at modern journalism.

807
00:43:25,080 --> 00:43:27,280
The goal is to drive the click, right?

808
00:43:27,280 --> 00:43:28,620
It's to get people interested.

809
00:43:28,620 --> 00:43:32,780
That's not journalism from a background standpoint of objectivity.

810
00:43:32,780 --> 00:43:34,600
We're not trying to influence.

811
00:43:34,600 --> 00:43:38,840
We're trying to create and uncover.

812
00:43:38,840 --> 00:43:39,840
Thank you.

813
00:43:39,840 --> 00:43:40,840
You know this better than I do.

814
00:43:40,840 --> 00:43:47,140
So you uncover the realities that exist so that you can speak to what people actually

815
00:43:47,140 --> 00:43:48,720
need and anticipate that.

816
00:43:48,720 --> 00:43:51,240
Yeah, those are interesting.

817
00:43:51,240 --> 00:43:56,600
Like when I do, I do research for my for my clients and when I go through this process,

818
00:43:56,600 --> 00:44:01,920
there's always this moment with how customers are talking.

819
00:44:01,920 --> 00:44:02,920
I always do.

820
00:44:02,920 --> 00:44:04,080
This is what the exercise I do.

821
00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:08,880
I interview already internally, salespeople, executives, anybody who's kind of in a customer

822
00:44:08,880 --> 00:44:09,880
facing capacity.

823
00:44:09,880 --> 00:44:14,640
And then I interview customers and I show them the discrepancy between the two.

824
00:44:14,640 --> 00:44:19,080
You guys are presenting value like this and this is what your customers said.

825
00:44:19,080 --> 00:44:26,240
And 99% of the time, it's different.

826
00:44:26,240 --> 00:44:32,120
And the reason it's different is because the company does not.

827
00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:37,680
The company assumes that the customer is living and breathing and obsessing about their product

828
00:44:37,680 --> 00:44:41,840
and that decision that they have to make and they're not.

829
00:44:41,840 --> 00:44:46,680
And so when you ask customers, what drove you to make this purchase?

830
00:44:46,680 --> 00:44:51,800
Because we have to grow and I only have three months to prove myself in this role.

831
00:44:51,800 --> 00:44:55,480
So we had to make a decision quickly and they were the fastest ones.

832
00:44:55,480 --> 00:44:59,040
It's like something that would never come up in a sales.

833
00:44:59,040 --> 00:45:03,160
They chose us because of this unique feature that we have.

834
00:45:03,160 --> 00:45:05,680
And most customers will never say that.

835
00:45:05,680 --> 00:45:10,560
And the other thing I love about the formal research is that what customers say verbatim

836
00:45:10,560 --> 00:45:14,280
is what you end up using in a lot of your marketing communications.

837
00:45:14,280 --> 00:45:20,120
So you can write articles based on this and testimonials and talk in a plain English way

838
00:45:20,120 --> 00:45:24,560
about what it is that you do and the value you provide directly from the mouths of your

839
00:45:24,560 --> 00:45:26,000
customers.

840
00:45:26,000 --> 00:45:30,480
And there's no better source for doing that work than customers.

841
00:45:30,480 --> 00:45:31,480
Well said.

842
00:45:31,480 --> 00:45:37,160
And so to dive in a little bit on another level of that too, here's the important takeaway

843
00:45:37,160 --> 00:45:39,240
of VisionPros.

844
00:45:39,240 --> 00:45:40,620
You want to do this research.

845
00:45:40,620 --> 00:45:43,240
You want to get these fundamental principles in place.

846
00:45:43,240 --> 00:45:48,720
And at the same time, you also as a visionary have to trust your own heart and your mind

847
00:45:48,720 --> 00:45:52,160
in this process because it's not always applicable.

848
00:45:52,160 --> 00:45:56,160
The way you learn the research process does not always 100% of the time apply.

849
00:45:56,160 --> 00:45:59,880
For instance, Restaurant Connect.

850
00:45:59,880 --> 00:46:02,480
When I was running Restaurant Connect, we did a ton of different things for research

851
00:46:02,480 --> 00:46:03,680
and development.

852
00:46:03,680 --> 00:46:07,040
As Stacey pointed out, we launched a video knowing that all of our customers were going

853
00:46:07,040 --> 00:46:09,400
to obsess over the video and share it.

854
00:46:09,400 --> 00:46:10,600
We were going to be viral the next day.

855
00:46:10,600 --> 00:46:12,400
We woke up, we had 17 views on the video.

856
00:46:12,400 --> 00:46:15,120
It was the most discouraging thing we'd ever experienced.

857
00:46:15,120 --> 00:46:19,360
And we were like, wow, okay, we got that wrong.

858
00:46:19,360 --> 00:46:24,760
And as we continued to work very hard to uncover our own R&D, it also became apparent that

859
00:46:24,760 --> 00:46:29,560
restaurant owners, they wanted to provide great and chefs, they wanted to provide great

860
00:46:29,560 --> 00:46:33,360
food and great experiences to people, but they didn't necessarily understand the day-to-day

861
00:46:33,360 --> 00:46:35,060
operations.

862
00:46:35,060 --> 00:46:44,320
And so as we catered less to what it was they thought they needed and wanted and more to

863
00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:49,920
solutions that the people who actually ran the restaurant, the host team needed and the

864
00:46:49,920 --> 00:46:55,000
assistant managers needed, we ended up creating an army of support that drove our software

865
00:46:55,000 --> 00:46:57,080
into their restaurants.

866
00:46:57,080 --> 00:47:02,760
And it had very little to do with the top level needs of the decision makers of the

867
00:47:02,760 --> 00:47:03,760
process.

868
00:47:03,760 --> 00:47:09,200
And so like Stacey said, you can always measure the results.

869
00:47:09,200 --> 00:47:13,440
You also can't always predict what somebody needs and people don't always know what they

870
00:47:13,440 --> 00:47:14,760
need or want.

871
00:47:14,760 --> 00:47:19,280
And that's what makes this whole process kind of chaotic if you don't have somebody who

872
00:47:19,280 --> 00:47:21,680
understands the principles behind it working with you.

873
00:47:21,680 --> 00:47:26,920
And Stacey, you've done an excellent job of revealing a lot of those realities.

874
00:47:26,920 --> 00:47:30,480
You mentioned asking internally and then asking the clients.

875
00:47:30,480 --> 00:47:34,120
I'm excited to see more people do that.

876
00:47:34,120 --> 00:47:40,160
And oh man, I would love to just continue to borrow your unpaid time as much as possible,

877
00:47:40,160 --> 00:47:42,800
but I won't do that to you.

878
00:47:42,800 --> 00:47:45,840
Daisy, what's the best way for people to get in touch with you?

879
00:47:45,840 --> 00:47:46,840
Yeah.

880
00:47:46,840 --> 00:47:50,000
So I would say LinkedIn, connect with me on LinkedIn.

881
00:47:50,000 --> 00:47:52,880
That's the most active platform.

882
00:47:52,880 --> 00:47:54,200
My website, of course.

883
00:47:54,200 --> 00:48:00,960
And then I do offer a free marketing scorecard that I would encourage people to take just

884
00:48:00,960 --> 00:48:06,040
to help identify where might you have some strengths and where might some gaps be in

885
00:48:06,040 --> 00:48:07,760
your marketing approach.

886
00:48:07,760 --> 00:48:10,880
And so this can help you figure out where you should focus.

887
00:48:10,880 --> 00:48:15,680
But also if you're bringing on team members or you have a marketing team already, you

888
00:48:15,680 --> 00:48:17,680
can start to direct them a little bit more.

889
00:48:17,680 --> 00:48:22,240
And it can give you some words to basically articulate that problem.

890
00:48:22,240 --> 00:48:26,160
Even the marketing teams that have the ego, that think they have it all together or know

891
00:48:26,160 --> 00:48:30,320
they have it all together, love taking a little assessments like that and learning.

892
00:48:30,320 --> 00:48:34,600
Oh, you know, even if they're comparing and saying, I'm better than this, there's little

893
00:48:34,600 --> 00:48:37,080
audit pieces that they can get out of those processes.

894
00:48:37,080 --> 00:48:38,760
So I definitely recommend doing that.

895
00:48:38,760 --> 00:48:39,760
We'll drop the...

896
00:48:39,760 --> 00:48:40,760
Well...

897
00:48:40,760 --> 00:48:46,880
I was going to say on that note, going back to my self-awareness story, I love that.

898
00:48:46,880 --> 00:48:50,920
I would say for the marketers, especially that fill this out and they're like, yeah,

899
00:48:50,920 --> 00:48:54,960
I'm like a 95% and I'm practically a hundred.

900
00:48:54,960 --> 00:49:00,840
The next step would be to send that to some peers and have them take it and answer this

901
00:49:00,840 --> 00:49:07,520
for you because it's pretty revealing that your perception might not match up with your

902
00:49:07,520 --> 00:49:08,520
peers.

903
00:49:08,520 --> 00:49:09,520
So...

904
00:49:09,520 --> 00:49:10,520
Absolutely.

905
00:49:10,520 --> 00:49:11,520
Yeah.

906
00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:12,520
Well said too.

907
00:49:12,520 --> 00:49:14,320
And then the rest of the marketers, I mean, I think more people are more holistic than

908
00:49:14,320 --> 00:49:15,320
I described.

909
00:49:15,320 --> 00:49:18,760
And so when they receive a resource like this and they go through it, sometimes a breath

910
00:49:18,760 --> 00:49:22,080
of fresh air and they're like, oh my gosh, this is a resource that I needed in order

911
00:49:22,080 --> 00:49:24,120
to unlock the next level of understanding.

912
00:49:24,120 --> 00:49:25,440
And none of us are perfect.

913
00:49:25,440 --> 00:49:26,560
We all got so much to learn.

914
00:49:26,560 --> 00:49:29,920
So Stacey, thank you for hitting us with all the knowledge that you did.

915
00:49:29,920 --> 00:49:34,760
Just, I think a lot of businesses are going to flourish if they listen to the advice that

916
00:49:34,760 --> 00:49:35,840
you gave.

917
00:49:35,840 --> 00:49:37,960
And Vision Pros, we'll see you on the next episode.

918
00:49:37,960 --> 00:49:38,960
Take care.

919
00:49:38,960 --> 00:49:39,960
All right.

920
00:49:39,960 --> 00:49:40,960
Thanks for being here today.

921
00:49:40,960 --> 00:49:43,160
I'm really happy that you tuned in to Vision Pros Live.

922
00:49:43,160 --> 00:49:47,960
I'm looking forward to seeing your reactions as these episodes continue to move forward.

923
00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:49,600
This is going to get more and more fun.

924
00:49:49,600 --> 00:49:51,600
We'll have more and more engagement as well.

925
00:49:51,600 --> 00:49:55,360
We'll invite people to participate in the show and thank you for giving us your time

926
00:49:55,360 --> 00:50:10,360
and attention.