You're gonna get me into trouble! My wife is gonna listen to this!
But how do you always get... I need to know man! How do you always have all these babes surrounding you? What do you do?
Hi everyone and welcome back to this episode of the Chris Hansen conversation and I have flanking me. I have people who I will call the old spin doctors.
So this is the one with the old spin doctors. And to my left I have Kenneth Mark and to my right I have the party man Clifford.
And these guys have been in the game and that would be the club DJing scene like forever since I was in fucking diapers.
So these guys... Oh we can use obscenities. Of course you can. But I'm only 22. Oh really? I'm 36. Oh you're 36 huh? And then I must be 15.
And then these guys have been around for such a long time and that's the reason why I asked them to be here as my khakis for this particular episode.
And for those of you in and around the world, khakis would mean buddies. Okay? To have them here as my buddies on the show for me to ask them some questions.
First of all let me just start this way guys. Kenneth, how long have you been in this game?
I started about 14 plus. I'm 36 now.
That's freak. I would ignore the 36 bit. 14? That would be illegal right?
No. Back then we could do home parties, mobile discos. Functions. House functions. Where people are more tolerant.
So you started actually doing stuff for house parties? Yeah for house parties. Okay but not in a club at that time?
Then this guy came along. He saw me spinning at a house party and he asked me, hey you want to spin in a club?
It's my house right? Yeah it was his house. I did a birthday party for his sister.
And here comes this little guy. He said, hey you want to spin in a club? I said, hey why not?
No wait. He was spinning for your sister's party. But you spin. Why didn't you spin?
Because it was my sister's birthday so we had invited and then... it's a long story.
Hello. That's the reason why you're on this show. Because I want to listen to long stories.
Okay he was dating back then one of my sister's best friends. If I'm not wrong.
So he happened to be at the party and I was slightly older. So I was in the background partying.
And then all the music was going on. So I was like, hey this guy can play. So I went and said hi.
But why again? Why didn't you spin? I think what happened was I was doing the early warming up for him.
Then after a few beers he took over. And you were underage? I think I was 17 and he was 14.
No he wasn't underage. You were underage. Yeah 14 plus.
When did you start? Around the same time as Kenneth I reckon.
How old were you? I think I was about maybe 15 or 16.
Holy shit. Another illegal one. Just before the army.
So we were all DJing using cassettes and our own house equipment. Our Akai amplifier, our cassette deck.
And then we never had a mixer. We just get ready to change one, two, flip the switch.
So it's chopping in? Just chopping in here and there.
But then at that time when we were at my house I think we already had mixers and we had the Mark IIs already.
Right, the Mark II turntables.
So why so young, 14, 15, got on to the DJing business so to speak? Why?
I think it was basically a passion for music and I was influenced by my dad who was collecting Hi-Fi stereo systems
and he was playing like Vinyls in the background. Elvis, Carpenters, Rita Coolidge.
And not necessarily club music. Not necessarily club music but it got me into music.
So then I was staying in Serangoon Gardens and we had gangs. I'm sorry not gangs, cliques.
Cliques. What the fuck. And we hung out and we just did cool things.
So you're one of those Serangoon Garden guys? Yeah.
Gardens boy. Because I remember way back when the gardens seemed to be producing quite a lot of DJs coming out for that neighborhood.
And naughty boys. As well as that.
Where's school you're from man? St. Gabriel's.
Oh yeah St. Gabriel's boy of course. How about you? Josephine.
But I used to hang out in St. Gabriel's. I called Juan theater. I was the only SGI boy that used to be hanging out there.
So why did you start? Because it was cool.
No shit. Is that really the truth or there's more to it?
No, no. I said hey this is cool stuff man. So you know every time we organized a party we were in charge of our own music.
So in the end so many people always wanted to come to our functions.
So we decided to like, there were four of us at that time. I remember four of my good friends.
So we decided to do this on a weekly basis. One day at my house, one day at your house.
So every month we used to have functions. We used to clear the furniture out of our living room.
All the tables and chairs out, put a lift and then you know we just invite the whole neighborhood show up and then we just party and dance.
And all this without any money to be earned.
Without money because we used to dismantle our hi-fi in the hi-fi cabinet.
You know we used to dismantle everything and then take the parts that we wanted out.
And then you know if I didn't have enough speakers or you got the equalizer you would bring it.
You know and then we would put a fan on the amplifier and then we just borrow everybody's speaker and then join the black and red cable.
Join, join, join, join. And then we have eight speakers and then it would last for about one hour.
Then after that everything would get distorted.
Because the amplifier was underpowered.
So when you started was it for no money as well?
It was for money. We did house parties. We got maybe three, four hundred dollars.
Wow that's quite a lot of money back then right?
And then we saved the money so that we could buy the techniques.
Okay, okay guys let's stop being such fuckers about our age.
So when we talking about three, four hundred bucks back then and we're saying because our listeners and viewers they'll be wondering about this shit right?
Yes.
That was in which year?
I think that was 81.
1981.
Yeah.
81, 82.
Yeah.
Three, four hundred bucks is a lot of money back then.
Yeah it was.
A whole lot of money. That's pretty decent.
When did you start earning money doing this?
After a while when we, you know the four of us we decided to hey you know since it's working out so well.
Yeah.
And then that time there was a growing demand for mobile discos so we started our own mobile.
I'm sure most of the old DJs started their mobile disco.
Yeah.
Ours was called Aces because there was Arthur, Clifford, Edmund and Sam.
Right.
So you know ours was Aces mobile disco and his was called.
Cats.
Yeah.
And then ours was about 20 we had Cats music productions.
So isn't it amazing you guys started out in a DJing scene, well house functions.
Yeah.
Because you love music.
Right.
You guys love music, love putting things together.
You say let's have a party.
Yeah that's right.
You sell these parties.
You get paid for it.
Well you didn't get something.
Yeah after a while we got paid for it.
Yeah that's right.
Yeah he got paid for it.
Smarter guy.
Smarter guy got paid first.
Of course of course.
And then both of you started as early entrepreneurs.
Yeah.
Yes.
Yeah.
And how long did those businesses respectively last?
It lasted me until you know when I went to NS we were doing all our company functions
and his company functions and then the sergeants and the captains were like, hey you all are
very good can you all do one for you know.
So we started doing everything for the army.
Yeah.
Same.
Passing out bread party.
Yeah.
All the parties.
So we in NS.
Yeah.
So we could get out of camp very easily.
Yeah.
Because there's such a joy isn't it.
Yeah.
And I was playing at NCO club as well.
Oh you were?
Yeah.
Oh wow.
Yeah $1 in kerb beer.
Yeah.
What happened to those businesses then after NS?
Were they still in existence?
Did you come back to running the show?
Um we had a business and then after which there was competition but then because I was
also in the army.
Right.
Um I kind of like moonlighted at night.
Right.
And I was spinning to survive from my $90.
Do you do know that that's also illegal right?
Yes it was illegal.
Yeah illegal.
So then we were playing like tavern on the square.
It was kind of you know.
Oh wow.
Yeah.
And then morning back to camp and the cast.
Oh tavern on the square.
Were you at tavern on the square?
Yeah you know I was at uh I was at this place in Park Lane.
It was called Park Lane disco.
Holy shit.
It was at another place called The Trap.
The Trap yeah yeah.
Yeah that was The Trap.
It was a high end KTV.
I cannot mention who used to go there because I would get arrested.
And I will not ask because I don't want to get arrested either.
Tavern on the square man shout out to Gingerbread.
Shout out to my dear dear Dato Jason Shahul and Mam and Hussein.
Wow these guys.
He was spinning in Tavern.
How the fuck.
When you were there spinning in Tavern on the square.
How old were you?
Well 20, 21.
No freaking way man.
21 yeah.
No freaking way.
I'm not that much younger than you.
You know why?
This is this story I've I've I've mentioned this to Jason Shahul who's for those of you
who don't know Gingerbread was quite an iconic band.
Yeah.
Back in the day in the 80s when Singapore was in my opinion we were rocking it.
The band scene was really really rocking.
And Gingerbread wrote a song and it was an original number it's called Roses.
That's the reason why the band leader is a guy named Jason Shahul and he owns Gingerbread
recording studios now and his wife is the illustrious and Hussein.
And these guys were part and parcel of the band.
Yeah.
And they wrote a song called Roses.
It was an original number.
And that's the reason why they are featured in a national museum.
Because that song hit the charts.
Yeah I remember that.
Yeah Roses is an amazing song and Kenneth Mark used to spin at a place where they but
Gingerbread used to play called Tavern in the Square in Singapore's East Coast Park
way back when.
And when at that time if memory serves me correctly it was what 84.
Yeah you couldn't have been 20 something man because I was like 14, 15 and I was trying
to get my way into the club illegally to watch them play.
Maybe 20.
You can't be that much older than me come on.
We don't have a calculator here.
Oh Jesus.
You can't be all that much older than me.
Well really old cocks man you guys.
Where did you spin man?
Way back around that time.
Okay my first when I first started being paid for playing I believe it was for a mobile
disco company.
I believe it was Disco World.
Oh no.
At Shaw Centre.
Remember they had that shop Disco World and then it was Mr Goh and the wife.
So I used to run all their mobile discos for them for this guy called Ajit.
Ajit yeah.
I don't know if you all can remember him or not.
So they used to send me to all these places and then I had one turntable and two turntables
and one cassette and then they used to give me recorded CDs, recorded cassettes.
Recorded cassettes alright cassettes.
Five recorded cassettes you know to play.
I can play one record and then after that when it finishes I switch to the CD and then
switch back to the record.
But what do you call that?
What do you call that?
What do people call that now?
You know when you have cassettes and you recorded it.
What's it called?
There's a name for it right?
Cassette player?
Mixed tape.
We used to have all the mixed tapes ready to go.
Seven to eight, eight to nine, nine to ten.
Was it really hard work?
Yeah because we couldn't carry the records back then so what we did was we did mix tapes
and we had timings on them and we used to record three records before we go.
So every time we wanted to change the mix tape we would switch back to one record or
we would sing the birthday song and then we quickly switch back to the mixed tape.
So you know now that we're talking about that subject of mixed tapes, back when you had
Mark IIs, turntables.
No that time not yet.
Oh then what was it?
The Mark IIs were new in the market so we were just starting to, it wasn't really very
available everywhere.
Not everybody could afford it.
I think he's still going back to the time when he was 16.
Yeah.
So at Disco World we used to have very limited turntables.
So when they had two or three mobile discos going out on the same day, only one team would
get the good stuff.
Then the rest of us would get cassettes.
So you started in an era before the Technics Mark II came on board.
Yeah, yeah, more or less.
Fuck me.
That's paleolithic man.
That's like way before Jurassic dude.
Yeah, the mixer had a knob.
You know you turn left and right.
Left, right.
You were lucky if you could get Hitachi with a small little knob and you could have a little
pitch control.
Yeah, yeah.
Yeah, that was considered lucky with smaller pitch control.
Gosh.
Okay, again I'm going to come back to this topic.
When we're talking about mixed tapes, comparing to the DJs of the time, I think the DJs of
today, when we're talking about mixed tapes, comparing to the DJs of today, using computers,
right?
BPMs are actually done for you.
Am I right to say that?
Correct.
And you have, you either use Tractor or Serato, right?
Correct.
Okay, the DJ controllers.
Yes.
Back when guys, when you were using mixed tapes and then you have your turntables, let's
say you're given the good stuff back way back when.
You still had a party going.
Yes.
You still could hold the crowd on the floor, right?
Yes.
Skill sets compared to back then to those today.
If you get those guys today who spin, right now the younger generation, to do what you
guys did, do you think they can do it?
It would be a little bit difficult for them because back then like I said, you don't have
the advantage of the computer, the laptop.
Yes.
But then again, we also had the advantage because we knew how to use the mics.
Yes.
And the DJs that are playing today don't really use the microphones.
So you can relate to what Clifford said.
Yes, that's right.
So what Clifford just said is that, let me try and get this right, okay?
Okay.
You guys had the skill sets.
Correct.
Yes.
Behind the microphone.
Yes.
And how would you define what Clifford just said, since you agree?
What does it mean, skill set behind the microphone?
I mean, if we have a gig, we are the entertainers.
Right.
We spin our music.
Right.
And we use the mic to hype the crowd, party.
Okay.
Can you have an example of how you would hype the crowd behind the microphone?
Could you do something?
You want me to take off my clothes now?
Behind the microphone, dude.
Not visually.
It's kind of difficult because you don't have the atmosphere here.
Yeah, I understand.
But give an example.
We don't have to really do it to hype out the crowd.
But example, what would you say behind the microphone?
You know, last time it was easy.
It was like, you know, it's more or less what the DJs are saying today.
But the only difference I reckon is that the DJs of today have what's called a hype man who does the hyping for them.
Most of the DJs nowadays can't speak on the mic.
When they see a microphone, they get terrified.
They're like, oh, wow.
Really?
Okay, what the fuck is a hype man, man?
What the fuck is a hype man do?
Okay, so now in modern generation, you got a guy playing the digital music.
Uh-huh.
All right.
He sees the DJ playing the music.
Then you have another guy holding the microphone.
Hey, put your hands up.
That's all he does.
Hands up.
Five, four, three, two.
Everybody jump.
Okay, okay.
I'm trying to relate to this because I remember back in the 90s being in the business, right, though I've never been in the club scene in terms of spinning.
I don't spin.
Yeah, I know.
I don't spin.
Oh, gosh.
Too many things for me to do to dabble in and then I go to spinning.
No.
But I do respect DJs a whole lot.
Yeah.
That's one thing for sure.
Yeah.
You say hype man back when I was doing events.
Yes.
We had this guy that had a role to play and we called this guy a Mikey.
Exactly.
So it's the same concept.
Same concept.
Okay.
But then again, that came a lot later in the 90s when we got the Mikey thing happening because the DJ, even for private events, they will know how to hype up a crowd without having a need to have a Mikey or a hype man.
Exactly.
They get everything.
So basically what you're saying to me is that today's generation of jocks don't have the knack for being behind a mic.
Yes, they don't.
And the funny thing is that I've had some so-called DJs who I'm trying to teach them to use a microphone, right?
It's not easy.
Really?
They look good.
They can play music very well.
I give them the microphone and I go like, hello everybody, I take my name, you see what I mean?
And then I go like, what the?
Everybody ready?
Yeah, exactly.
No.
I swear to God.
Look good.
And some of the girls look so good.
And then when you give them the microphone, they go, hello, thank you for coming.
It's real.
It's really real.
So this is, okay, why do you think attributed to this issue?
Why?
In your opinion.
Because it's easier to start becoming a DJ now because of all the equipment that you have,
you know, the modern technology, right?
It's easier to learn how to become a DJ.
It's much easier.
Yeah, the computer works for you.
Okay, so it's because of technology that these guys can just become a DJ.
Correct.
The more important thing would be how much you have in your library, in your software.
Yeah, correct.
How many songs you have accumulated, right?
Correct.
Right.
But you guys must have thousands.
Yep, back from the 70s.
But do you guys use digital now?
I still do.
Yes.
You're using digital now.
For Clifford is using digital.
I'm still analog.
You're still analog.
So I still collect thousands of records and play them.
Oh crap.
But I'm in the process of going digital.
So there's nothing wrong with digital.
I have to embrace it.
Right.
Because that's the new generation.
Sure, sure.
I made the switch when I was playing.
I can't remember.
But I made the switch when I was with Juliana.
I think we switched to CDs, first of all, before the Serato.
So I think when I first switched from the record turntable to the CDs, that was in Pornado.
That was my first switch.
I went there and said, okay, this is your all new.
I'm like, oh, oh.
And it was tough with the CDs because for a record, we could see where the breaks are.
And we could start from the...
We could put the needle where it is.
Yeah.
But for the CD, you would have to really forward.
Tap, tap, tap.
Yeah.
And then you have to tap and then you have to memorize because you had the counter.
So oh, this CD track one, I have to play, get ready at 0.23 seconds.
Yeah.
So quite a nightmare.
Yeah.
And then the sound was also different.
It was a totally different...
It took me one week to get used to it.
Get the hang of it.
Yeah.
So Monday we went in, they said we switching, you got no more turntables.
Your CD players now.
I said, wow.
But you know, you mentioned two names that really brought back memories.
One, you said Julianas.
Julianas of London.
Can you tell everyone that's watching the show who and what Julianas of London was all
about?
Julianas was one of the biggest agencies that looked after a lot of clubs and disc jockeys
and entertainment managers in Southeast Asia, in London, Oslo, everywhere.
So in Asia, they were based at Clemenceau Avenue and they ran all the major clubs in
Singapore, usually at all the hotels.
The Hyatt Hotel was at Shunrasari.
Xanadu was at the Shangla.
Scandals.
Black Velvet was at...
Scandals.
Scandals was at Raffles.
Raffles.
And then we had...
Malaysia Hotel had My Place.
Mandarin Hotel had the library.
The library, yeah.
43 Scots was at the Sheraton Towers.
Oh man, we were rocking, you know, back then.
Yeah.
So those were the days when you had a pure, proper club.
Club.
Yeah.
Including Xanadu.
In Shangla.
Can you imagine that?
We were a real jumping, jumping, jumping country, man.
Tuesday, ladies night, let me tell you, back in the days, right, Tuesday night, ladies
night at Xanadu, the queue used to be unreal.
Yeah.
And the ladies did not get free drinks.
Yeah.
Yeah, they just got free entry and that's it, you know.
But they were relying on the guys who were customers to buy drinks in the area anyway.
Correct.
Nowadays, ladies night is like ladies night, no free drink, I don't want to go.
But back then, I think everyone was walking into a club for the main purpose to just have
damn good time.
Dancing.
That's right.
And we were sweating, right?
Yeah.
I mean, it was an amazing way back when.
Then you mentioned, wow, you mentioned so many.
I wanted to pick out that name, Tornado.
Tornado.
Yeah.
Wow.
Tornado was actually part of Backers.
Backers somehow rather bought some shares, if I'm not wrong, into Julianas and Tornado
was one of the first clubs that was under Backers.
It was at the Phoenix Hotel.
So me, I think I was posted there together with the late Andy, DJ.
He passed on a couple of years ago.
So we were the first two there.
And that was when, you know, Backers started getting rid of the turntables.
So all Backers clubs had CDs.
Julianas clubs still ran on the vinyl.
Right.
So all the clubs that Backers took over had CD players.
So that was a change.
The momentum changed.
So when did you actually start actually coming into the club scene?
Which was the first club?
The first club was I was a relief DJ at My Place at the Malaysia Hotel.
Wow.
I think now it's the Boulevard Hotel right behind Hard Rock Cafe.
It used to be the place where all the SQ girls, you know, who's who, you know, they had a
carpark right in front.
Everybody used to drive up with the fancy cars and, you know, nice place called My Place.
Where did you start?
Which club did you start off?
So because he introduced me to the night scene and at about 15, I was like an apprentice at Mamota.
Mamota?
Yes.
Where is that?
That was a Kalang Leisure Room.
Kalang Leisure Room.
It was the biggest.
Biggest.
One of the biggest clubs and they had the biggest boys night out every Sunday.
Yes.
So Sunday was gay night.
I've got nothing against that.
I've got a lot of friends against that.
So Sunday was gay night or Sunday afternoon.
We used to play there.
I used to play with William Armstrong for the gay parties there.
We would lock ourselves into the DJ's console and then there would be like 700 men dancing,
throwing oil.
Oh man, shout out to William Armstrong.
Shout out to William Armstrong, man.
Dude, I have not seen that guy except on Facebook.
I have not seen that guy in years.
I think William's running a dance studio now.
Right?
Yeah, that's right.
Specialized in tango.
So if you guys want to go back, way back, give William Armstrong a shout out.
Alright?
Guys, before we go on any further, first of all, as usual on the Chris Hansen Conversations,
on CHC, I would like to thank Gordon's Vadez once again for sponsoring these wonderful,
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Gordon's Vadez, thanks once again.
And guys, please have the one you have bit just now.
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Once again, thank you Gordon's Vadez.
Now back to my question.
You guys started 14 years old, 15 years old, got to the club scene eventually.
We heard about all that.
Throughout your life, as DJs, I know you are still doing this.
Have you ever done anything else besides being a DJ?
Oh yes.
For me, I kind of left the line when I was about 34.
Why did you leave?
I have kids, so I wanted to make sure that I was there for them.
Growing up days and all.
So I left the line and did my normal work.
I was running Thai Express Group as a general manager.
Oh wow, okay.
I joined Sincere Watch as a manager as well.
And of course, I was in the mobile gaming scene for quite a while, traveling and all.
And I only recently got back to the scene because the same guy sitting next to you.
Come on, come on, come on!
He's quite an influence.
Don't tell his wife.
You are quite an influence, Party Man.
The Party Man speaks, can of girls.
Because he's taking care of Sands Bar in Sentosa, and he says,
Hey, why don't you come and spin? Jam for a while and all.
So of course I'm playing vinyl.
I'll bring my turntables there, hook it up and then play that.
But you were, I know for a fact that, you guys gotta hear this,
for those of you old enough to know, we had the hottest, probably the hottest disco Singapore had ever seen.
I'm fucking saying it.
Fire disco.
And this guy was spinning at Fire Disco.
And after that you were spinning in Sparks, right?
Yes, after which Sparks, yeah.
I tell you something, young people watching the show, I don't know whether you'll be watching the show,
honestly I don't give a flying fuck,
but if you're watching the show, you guys don't know what you've missed.
Because we had great times way back when Singapore had Fire Disco,
then after that, the owner, Dean Shahul.
He opened up Sparks.
Dr. Dean, still moving around and enjoying his life.
Yeah, I think I've seen him around as a matter of fact, moving around the block.
You know Dean gave me some very good advice once about being a DJ.
I just need to share this with the rest of the DJs out there.
He told me once, if you put a track on, if it clears the downflow, throw it away.
Yeah.
So I threw a couple of records away because of him.
It's not working.
So being a DJ is not really all that easy, isn't it?
It seems to me that in these last couple of years perhaps,
especially now after the pandemic,
that a lot of club owners or bar owners seem to think that a DJ's job is kind of easy.
Yeah, I think they think that it looks easy.
Okay, so let's tell the people right now that being a club DJ,
don't scoff at these guys because it's not easy in the least.
You got to hold the crowd.
You got to make sure they stay on the dance floor.
Yes, that's right.
So you see... Well, you don't want to keep them on the dance floor all the time.
You want them to go back to the bar and buy drinks also.
But if they get freaking thirsty from dancing, they won't order some more drinks.
Yeah, so you need to have the right balance of...
First of all, maybe you need to break the crowd up into three different groups.
I got the younger group, I got the older group, and I got that.
So if I get the older group dancing, the younger group is at the bar drinking,
then the older group's been dancing for 20 minutes, they're going to get tired.
Let's get the younger crowd back and then chase the older crowd.
Well, that's how you do it.
Yeah, so you need to have that balance to keep your dance floor and the bar busy,
not only the dance floor busy.
You got to look beyond, look behind the dance floor at the bars.
There's no point.
You have a full dance floor and your bars are empty.
Your boss is not going to like that.
Okay, so the way he said it, the way Party Man just said it,
it's like DJs are integral in the revenue generation
of a club business.
Well, to a certain extent, he's correct.
Depending on the club concept, for where I'm spinning out,
I'm a resident with Tin Box Group, we don't have a dance floor.
So people just move their bodies wherever they are.
Our job is to make sure they keep their bodies moving and drinking
and having a good time.
So how would you work, because I see, for example,
it's interesting what I just heard Party Man just say,
I get the old guys off the dance floor back to get the younger ones back.
So they're shooing the older ones back to getting drinks and stuff.
But in your position, how would you, when people stand,
dance where they stand, how would you get people to generate revenue
for their respective clubs or bar?
I mean, if they're having a good time, they will be drinking and drinking.
I mean, it's just natural.
So we naturally play the hits, and we naturally look at the crowd,
the response, facial expressions.
And if something's not working out, quickly switch the song, make it happen.
I want to throw the same question back to you,
the one I threw to Kenneth earlier on.
Did you ever leave the scene and do something else?
I did. I actually left, I think, for about six years.
I went into the water sports business because I was quite an avid wakeboarder.
So I decided to actually quit the nightlife for a while.
And then me and a couple of friends, we had a wakeboarding business.
It was called Max Out. We were operating from Pongo.
We bought like 10 boats, and we started renting boats and wakeboarding.
So I went into the water sports for about six or seven years.
And then after that, being Singapore, again, you know, restriction here,
cannot do this, cannot do that, cannot wakeboard here, cannot wakeboard there.
You only can wakeboard here.
And they give you such a small area to wakeboard, and then the sport was growing so fast,
and then you have 20 or 30 boats all in that same area.
It was a big headache.
So in the end, I said, OK, enough of this.
I found a small bar and some friends on Sentosa,
and we started setting up a place called Sunset Bay, started partying there.
Oh, wait a second. Sunset Bay is partly owned by you?
No, no, I was working for, I was with Gary and Paul Volandier.
In that time, I think we just got back from Bali.
Me and Tim Tan came back from Bali, and we told the brothers.
The brothers had a canoe business on Sentosa.
I said, why don't we take over the bar over there?
And then we joined, and then, you know.
You remember the foam parties?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
That's what I was asking.
That was Ash.
Ah, now we know where the damn foam came from.
Yeah, his mouth.
There we go.
Party man Clifford, foaming in the mouth, he's got a foam party.
OK, what's the craziest thing, if you guys can tell me?
Has everything happened to you on the gig?
Me?
Yeah, both of you.
I go first.
You go ahead.
OK, the craziest thing that happened to me was,
back in the days when I was just out from the army,
I think it was my second or third gig,
those days we used to rent a pickup and put our equipment and all our stuff in,
and then go to the party.
So we have that blue Datsun pickup, you remember that one?
That blue Datsun pickup, it went for $18 a gig.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
So the pickup broke down, and that time I was riding a bike.
So, believe it or not, I had to put the amplifier speaker,
turn tables and everything else on that bike, one person.
I had three speakers in the back, amplifier in the front.
Everything on one bike, and I had to ride to the spot.
While the guys were trying to fix the pickup,
I had to go there first and try to set everything up first because we didn't want...
So it was quite crazy.
When I arrived there, they were like, what the...
Are you the mobile disco?
I said, yes.
Can you help hold my bike for me?
So that was quite funny.
The show went on.
The show went on, the show must go on, don't stop the party.
The show must go on.
And then the balance of the speakers came later, about 45 minutes later.
Oh yeah, that was for a mobile party.
Yeah, that was a mobile party.
How about you?
Too many to mention actually.
Pick one.
Then it would be when I had my own company, Katz,
and we had this van Volkswagen Combi back then.
Cool man.
Yeah.
You still got one today.
You just bought one last week.
Really?
Really? Did you?
Yeah, I just brought one in from Indonesia.
You're in the vintage car business.
Yeah, I'm in the vintage car business.
Yeah, right man.
So it was after party, and then my driver drove all the equipment home.
We had all the speakers and turntables and all that.
And suddenly my phone rang.
He drove the whole vehicle right into Bukit Timah drainage in the center.
What?
Yeah, the whole vehicle just went in.
And it's total loss.
But he survived. He survived.
Okay, he survived. That's important.
Poor Combi.
But the van, the Combi van was completely totaled.
Yeah, totaled right. But saved his life.
Yeah.
So a solid vehicle.
And the equipment all survived.
So tell me about your new Combi van, man.
Well...
It's from Brazil.
Brazil.
And you're going to soup it up?
In a little while.
I'm trying my best to make it into the bank bus.
Yeah.
I'm trying to instigate, instigate, instigate.
You're lucky it's a podcast.
Instigate, railroad roof, waterbed, disco ball, song system.
And should that happen, we expect to be invited for that.
Oh yes, of course.
Okay.
And we will drive into a booktube around.
No, no, no. Let's avoid that one.
How has club culture evolved?
You guys have been around, you've been around a block, man.
Club culture has evolved. I tell you, very easy to...
It's very weird.
A long time ago, people on the dance floor would dance with each other.
Facing and talking to each other.
Now, the new generation, they all dance and they stare at the DJ.
What?
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
And I'm like, can you all stop looking at me?
And dance, communicate, enjoy yourself and put your handphone down.
Actually, actually, if we look at pictures today, anywhere in the world,
it's like the lights of David Guetta and all that.
And you look at the audience, they're always facing DJs.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
It's freaking weird, right?
And the handphone's like...
And they'll take the handphones out.
Oh, for fuck's sake.
Oh, man.
So it has evolved. There are different kinds of clubs now.
You have the festival club where you get big name DJs
and then all the audience wants to do is look at the DJ
and put the handphone up and go, yo, yo, yo, yo, yo, you know?
And then you have some smaller clubs.
I don't call them clubs anymore. I call them dance bars.
Dance bars, yeah.
So the dance bars usually have a smaller dance floor.
And the people at these dance bars still listen to the music,
but they don't really have the visual.
Because at festivals, you have a very big light show.
Without the light show, the DJ is going to look really bad, right?
So the light show nowadays plays a very important part, the visual.
But in the dance bars, it's more cozy, compact,
and I believe that a lot of...
You know, there's more interaction between customers.
People go there to mingle, to meet, you know, boy-mate-girl,
girl-meet-boy, boy-and-man, and then...
That hasn't changed, huh?
Yeah, that's what I like about it.
I don't like the festival feel where you go there
and you look at the DJ,
and then you don't even look left and right.
You're just looking up.
And the music is the same for two hours.
Yeah.
The beats, the drop.
Yeah, it sounds the same.
And then the blackout.
One, two, three, four, then the lights come on, and then you do that for two hours.
That's why I don't really like to go to festivals.
It's not that I don't want to.
Once in a while, once in a while.
It's a bit monotonous.
Yeah, once in a while.
It's a bit monotonous having that kind of stuff.
It's the same damn beat all the time.
How about you?
How do you think the club scene has evolved?
I think what Clifford mentioned is correct.
And also, smaller clubs are coming up.
Clubs that does a little bit of Thai concepts and all this kind of stuff now.
Little small bars.
Dance bars.
Dance bars, you're right.
It used to be clubs.
They used to be bars.
Clubs, maybe you define 250 people or more.
Now you have, now it's more of an early hour, happy hour thing.
I believe that the crowd likes to come out early.
They come out seven to eight.
You know, especially the older crowd, the 35, where the money is,
35 to 55, they come out about eight o'clock.
12 o'clock, they all want to go home.
Yeah, they want to go home.
Huh?
Yeah, probably.
Yeah, we just have four hours, one, eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve.
That's morning and I'm okay.
I had it by.
See you tomorrow.
I survived.
Tomorrow, I wake up, I'm still alive.
Yeah, yeah.
Oh, gosh.
So, which means guys like you now, what, spin up to 12?
Yeah.
That's it?
Kind of like 12, yeah.
That's it?
We start early, we go home early.
Yeah.
I mean, good for you, but that's just no fun in going out for a weekend, right?
Oh, weekend, I mean, sometimes if you are still alive at 12, 13, we call the party bus,
the bus picks us up and we go out on the three, four, five, and then...
Yeah, we go to clubs.
That opens right up to six.
Yeah, we go out to six, you know, but then after that you lose the next day,
in fact, you lose the next two or three days.
The recovering.
Yeah, the recovery period for us is now two or three days.
It used to be like a few hours now, it's all, it take you two days.
But how's the music these days?
I mean, you guys, as I've been saying from the get-go,
you guys have been around the block a lot of times, right?
Music today, you play in clubs, and versus through the years that you've been watching
and playing, music has evolved.
I think for Clifford, he's diversified.
Yeah.
For me, I'm more known as a retro specialist, 80s, 90s music.
Right.
Yeah, so where I'm working right now, that suits me because we play vinyls only.
Right.
And basically playing 80s and 90s music.
Yeah, sure, but you specialize in that.
Which one do you personally prefer?
80s and 90s music.
So basically when you were clubbing, or you were wrong, when you were spinning in clubs,
as compared to today, you find no difference because you're still playing the same thing.
Yes, that's right.
Right, okay.
How about you?
Party Man, if you can tell me, all the music you've played through the years,
from your mixtapes to the genres, to the 80s and 90s, to the 2000s, and then now today,
and you're still spinning at the sandbar, and you still have young people coming up,
and you kept yourself updated, we all know that.
Of all these periods of music in the club scene, which period do you prefer the most?
Of course the early 80s.
I'm actually a very big Bob Marley fan.
Legalize it.
I'm a very big Bob Marley fan.
Bob Marley, yeah.
You know, Bobby's been one of my main influences in music,
especially when I used to play overseas in Bali and Kosomuy, right?
So I'm a Rasta boy, right?
But then again, I don't have any objection to any kind of music because I believe that music is music,
and I play to please the crowd.
That means whatever you want, I play.
I never say I do not accept a request.
If you have something, you come and see me.
If I have it, I'll play it.
So I'm open to all kinds of music.
I mean, from disco, I mean, even from rock and roll to disco to funk to techno to house to EDM,
and now hardstyle as well, and mania.
What's mania?
Just like Chinese music with...
Techno beats.
Euro, Euro, techno.
It's very hard to describe.
But anyway, yeah, no choice.
Because if you want to be in the business, you must always remember,
there are many kinds of DJs, you know, house DJ, this DJ, that DJ.
If you want to go down one road, it's going to be harder for you to get a gig.
So you've got to be versatile.
You get more gigs.
Thank God I am not a DJ.
Anyway, we talked about music, right?
Let's talk about the kind of clubbers.
I know we talked about how different club scene is involved, how things there compared to before.
Let's talk about the average clubber.
From the clubbers you've experienced when some of them are older today, right?
Some of them you're still having today as well as the current bunch of clubbers you have,
and the people from before, from yesterday.
Of the years that go by, and please speak the truth and shame the devil, okay?
Which type of clubber do you prefer?
The ones way back when or the ones today?
I would actually take it back to maybe about eight years ago.
Not even eight years.
Sorry, when was Muhammad Sultan?
That was a long time ago.
That was when?
Yeah, yeah.
That was when?
In the 2000s.
I actually like the Muhammad Sultan days.
Really?
Yeah, because we had Muhammad Sultan.
I mean we had...
Long sons.
We had...
Tham Saran, Tacher, Wang San, Orange...
That whole stretch.
Yeah, and then across the road you've got Eastside, Seng Super Cloud, Ami Bar,
and then down the road you had Double O, and then it goes on, right?
And that was really cool because you could spend the whole night in Muhammad Sultan,
and you could bar hop.
You could bar hop, you know, you go here, have one drink,
enjoy a bit of music with the army boys, and then, you know, in Tham Saran,
and then you skip over to Knox, you get to hang out with the cool people, house music.
Then you go to Wang San, you hang out with the older, and then you move down the road,
and then after that you move back to the top.
So it was one of the best nightlife scenes in Singapore that I actually would like to bring back.
Right.
You know?
A one-stop entertainment outlet.
So do you think that could happen again?
No.
Why do you say that?
Because of location and also because of a lot of restrictions that nowadays, you know, the landlords.
Right.
Right?
The landlords are the most...
Pain in the asses.
Correct.
That's...
Right.
The words are, I'm not, pain in the ass.
Really.
You know, they see you making money, right?
And they up their rent.
And then they go, okay, you know what, you have to sign another next six months,
and then this is a new...
And then you look, it's times nine what the original rental is,
and then you know, then you work so hard and see...
And you earn...
Yeah.
So your revenue...
Yeah, it kills.
Revenue is very acute, but it kills your profit.
Yeah.
It kills.
Yeah, and I've always said, man, the problem with this, with any place, anywhere, not just in Singapore, right,
it's not about the supply chain disruption, blah, blah, blah.
It's the fucking landlords, man.
I believe in every kind of business, like, it's the same.
Yeah.
And we're all feeling it and reeling it and suffering right now.
Yeah, yeah, I can understand that.
How about you?
Which generation would you prefer in terms of the average clubber, man?
I think, if you ask me, it's quite close to the Muhammad Sultan days,
but when I was in fire and sparks, sparks would be around that period.
Yeah.
I think sparks was kind of a little bit before that, right?
Just a little bit, yeah.
Yeah.
We could play music and the people would accept it,
and we call it education, where we play the music and the people would still dance to it.
Yeah.
Today, you need to just give them the hits.
Yeah.
If you don't give them the hits and you try and bring something that's just average,
they'll just look at you, you know, because they like to look at the DJs, right?
Yeah, interesting what you just said.
It's like before, if you remember, we would listen to a new hit, or maybe it's not even a hit yet.
Yes.
And we listen to it on air, on radio, right?
And we go, you know, that sounds pretty good, huh?
Yeah.
Or if you go to a club and you've got a good DJ behind the decks,
and he plays something, hey, check this one out, this sounds really good, you know?
Yeah.
And no one has heard it before.
And guys like you play it.
Yeah.
And we in the audience, or we as the customers, we're there, we're there to have a good time,
and go, hey, that sounds pretty good, that's a damn cool beat, right?
And we learn to like it.
Yes, that's right.
Right?
But today, as you said, what?
They ask for just play me the song, or just play these bunch of hits that everyone has heard about.
Yeah.
And we'll be happy.
Right.
So you prefer back then, back to the Sparks days.
Yes, that's right.
Right.
Clubbers from the Sparks scene back then.
Yes, back then.
Right.
Wow.
Well, you know, we've been chatting actually for an hour already, guys.
Really?
Yeah.
One hour?
It's been an hour, man.
Oh, crap.
Yeah, it's been an hour.
See how time flies when we have that is, and we're having fun.
I've had fun, guys.
Thank you so very much for being on CHC.
It's really nice having you guys here.
Once again, people, for those of you watching the Chris Hansen conversation, I've got with
me Kenneth Mark, and I've got with me the party man Cliff Chua.
I can tell you something, man, these guys, they still rockin' the land.
Tin box?
Which nights?
Depends on the rostering, because now we have two tin boxes, Simply Retro at Chimes, and
also Clark Key.
So like for Friday, we are opening up Clark Key.
Right.
Yeah, grand opening, and I'll be there.
Wow.
Wow, wow.
Okay, so catch Kenneth Mark on Friday nights at the new tin box in Clark Key, and opening
real soon, so watch out for that.
But we've got the party man, and you know, I've always, I tell you something, man, I get
so freaking envious, because when I check out this man's Facebook every freaking weekend,
and he's always surrounded by the ladies.
Yeah.
I don't know how the fuck you do it, man, but you can always, there is no way you will
see Clifford in a picture without gorgeous babes around him.
It hasn't changed.
Yeah.
It's been like that since he started off.
Like what the fuck?
It's different.
Like dude, you're a chick magnet, man.
Nowadays, being a DJ, SM social media is very, very, very important.
We forgot to talk about that.
Yeah, sure.
DJing and social media.
Okay.
You have, if you still want to be in the scene, you need to up your game on social media.
That means you need to have your Facebook for 35 to 55, you need to have your TikTok
for 25 to 45.
I'm sorry, you need to have your Instagram, your IG from 25, and then you need your TikTok
from for 18 to 28.
So you need to have all three.
Yeah, but that's still not the point.
The point is how the hell do you get-
You're going to get me into trouble.
My wife is going to listen to this.
Yeah, but how do you always get, I need to know, man.
How do you always have all these babes surrounding you?
What do you do?
Well, not only girls, the guys are also with me, so you know, throughout the years.
Throughout the years.
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Tai Chi, man.
Tai Chi, that shit.
Okay, after we say cut, I'm going to ask you, you're going to give me the answer, okay?
Because I just can't stand this anymore.
The guys only play poker with him, that's all.
I always see babes and bikinis surrounding this man, and he's so great.
He's like, what the fuck?
What does he do?
How does he get that?
But anyway, good for you, man, good for you.
Party man Clifford spins at a sandbar in Sentosa practically every night.
Every Saturday.
Here we go, okay, every Saturday.
Okay, so if you want great music, you would have a great freaking time, head down to the
sandbar and look for this guy.
You know why?
Because he always has the babes around him, so make sure you're there.
Anyway, it's been nice having you guys on my show again, and I hope to see you next
time.
Make sure that you subscribe, you hit that notification button, and you follow us also
on Facebook.
Don't forget to subscribe to the At CCB TV podcast on YouTube, and we are also on Instagram
at ccb.tv underscore.
This is Chris Hansen.
I'll see you next time.
Bye everyone.
Cheers.