1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:13,880 Hey beautiful, welcome to my new podcast, Queerly Having Issues. 2 00:00:13,880 --> 00:00:18,100 I believe we all have our issues because we all have a story. 3 00:00:18,100 --> 00:00:22,800 My name is Jafeth and it's time to tell you about mine. 4 00:00:22,800 --> 00:00:27,460 As this is the first episode of my podcast, I'd like to explain to you the intention 5 00:00:27,460 --> 00:00:29,360 of this podcast. 6 00:00:29,360 --> 00:00:36,480 I think it's important to address things that are difficult, things that are heavy, stuff 7 00:00:36,480 --> 00:00:37,600 that's intense. 8 00:00:37,600 --> 00:00:41,320 In other words, just issues we don't usually talk about. 9 00:00:41,320 --> 00:00:46,600 And as a queer person, I'll be speaking from a queer perspective, which is also the reason 10 00:00:46,600 --> 00:00:52,360 why as the cover of this podcast, I've chosen a picture of myself as a child, as you know, 11 00:00:52,360 --> 00:00:58,360 the fact that I grew up in a heteronormative society and in a non-affirmative environment 12 00:00:58,360 --> 00:01:04,440 were the ingredients basically for me to grow up and to experience the things that I'm experiencing 13 00:01:04,440 --> 00:01:07,720 or the things that I have experienced, these so-called issues. 14 00:01:07,720 --> 00:01:12,760 And of course, I'm aware that it's my responsibility to work through them and, you know, to do 15 00:01:12,760 --> 00:01:18,680 the inner work and to create a better life for myself and for the people around me. 16 00:01:18,680 --> 00:01:24,480 And with that, I'd also like to share things that have helped me tremendously in this process 17 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:29,400 and on my journey towards becoming my best self. 18 00:01:29,400 --> 00:01:33,840 In this first episode, I'd like to talk about religious trauma. 19 00:01:33,840 --> 00:01:40,000 For a lot of us queer people, religion is quite an issue or more likely the cause of 20 00:01:40,000 --> 00:01:41,860 a lot of our issues. 21 00:01:41,860 --> 00:01:47,080 I think for most of us, religion has been more bruising and damaging than it has been 22 00:01:47,080 --> 00:01:49,120 healing and transformative. 23 00:01:49,120 --> 00:01:54,440 Because of this reason and because I've experienced firsthand how much damage religion can 24 00:01:54,440 --> 00:02:01,200 cause on a person's mental health, I've decided to do a master's degree in peace, trauma, 25 00:02:01,200 --> 00:02:02,420 and religion. 26 00:02:02,420 --> 00:02:08,700 And within my studies, I'm mainly focusing on religious trauma and the queer community, 27 00:02:08,700 --> 00:02:15,040 but I'm also interested in how to find meaning in life, how to find inner peace, especially 28 00:02:15,040 --> 00:02:17,600 in the aftermath of religious trauma. 29 00:02:17,600 --> 00:02:21,480 So for me, I would call it a life after faith. 30 00:02:21,480 --> 00:02:25,120 That is the stage where I'm in right now. 31 00:02:25,120 --> 00:02:30,040 And even though every individual has a different story and you know, you can still be religious 32 00:02:30,040 --> 00:02:31,660 and queer. 33 00:02:31,660 --> 00:02:37,720 So I'm from a evangelical Christian background, and I'll probably explain their views on the 34 00:02:37,720 --> 00:02:40,460 queer community in another episode. 35 00:02:40,460 --> 00:02:47,180 But basically, within my environment, it was not possible to be both queer and evangelical 36 00:02:47,180 --> 00:02:53,600 and so you basically had to choose which led to a conflict within myself when it came to 37 00:02:53,600 --> 00:02:57,500 my religious identity and my sexual identity. 38 00:02:57,500 --> 00:03:05,240 I also wrote a thesis about conflicting identities for queer people coming from evangelical backgrounds, 39 00:03:05,240 --> 00:03:10,320 but I'll probably devote another episode to that because that's a whole other topic. 40 00:03:10,320 --> 00:03:14,700 I did realize that there's still a lot of good things that we can learn from religion 41 00:03:14,700 --> 00:03:20,480 and that it's sort of a shame that often we throw everything away because we think that 42 00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:24,840 it is not compatible to the life that we live right now or it's not beneficial in any way, 43 00:03:24,840 --> 00:03:28,760 or maybe just too traumatizing to even go back there. 44 00:03:28,760 --> 00:03:33,760 There's a lot of research that has been done on how religion can transcend trauma, how 45 00:03:33,760 --> 00:03:36,400 you can heal and thrive because of religion. 46 00:03:36,400 --> 00:03:40,840 At the same time, it's very interesting to see how little research has been done thus 47 00:03:40,840 --> 00:03:44,020 far on how religion can be the cause of trauma. 48 00:03:44,020 --> 00:03:49,440 So even if you are queer or an ally without a religious upbringing or a religious experience, 49 00:03:49,440 --> 00:03:54,560 I think it's good for you to be aware of the fact that in 67 countries being queer is still 50 00:03:54,560 --> 00:03:59,760 criminalized and in 11 countries you can get the death penalty for being queer. 51 00:03:59,760 --> 00:04:04,920 And sadly, they use religious convictions to justify discrimination and violence against 52 00:04:04,920 --> 00:04:06,220 queer people. 53 00:04:06,220 --> 00:04:10,280 So this shows how important this topic is and that there's a lot of people out there 54 00:04:10,280 --> 00:04:16,040 who are living in non-affirmative, suppressed environments where they cannot be themselves. 55 00:04:16,040 --> 00:04:22,160 And I read today in a newspaper that even if they are not being criminalized by law, 56 00:04:22,160 --> 00:04:25,760 it doesn't mean that it's easier for them there because the article said that once they 57 00:04:25,760 --> 00:04:33,800 are in custody, they are often raped or tortured and pressured into confessing to immorality 58 00:04:33,800 --> 00:04:35,280 or prostitution. 59 00:04:35,280 --> 00:04:40,720 So this shows how important this topic is because we cannot or at least I cannot imagine 60 00:04:40,720 --> 00:04:46,960 what it's like to be living under these circumstances. 61 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:52,280 At the same time, when I read about these kinds of stories and when I hear those numbers, 62 00:04:52,280 --> 00:04:58,120 I feel like, okay, I'm aware of the fact that I'm so privileged to be living in a country 63 00:04:58,120 --> 00:05:05,120 where I can be myself and where I can speak my mind, even though my path hasn't been easy, 64 00:05:05,120 --> 00:05:10,120 still compared to these numbers and their circumstances, I feel like my situation isn't 65 00:05:10,120 --> 00:05:11,120 that bad. 66 00:05:11,120 --> 00:05:16,040 But in order for change to happen, I think we have to speak our minds and I could be 67 00:05:16,040 --> 00:05:20,080 silent, but I don't think that is going to help anybody. 68 00:05:20,080 --> 00:05:28,880 So hopefully, step by step, we will see change and improvement and there will be more peace 69 00:05:28,880 --> 00:05:34,020 for all these people who are living in suppressive environments, really. 70 00:05:34,020 --> 00:05:38,460 When we talk about religious trauma, of course, it does not only apply to queer individuals 71 00:05:38,460 --> 00:05:43,160 because there are so many other minority groups that have been suppressed and are suppressed 72 00:05:43,160 --> 00:05:44,640 by religion. 73 00:05:44,640 --> 00:05:48,420 And there's a lot of interpersonal trauma that's going on within religious settings. 74 00:05:48,420 --> 00:05:54,560 But I'm here to talk about the theory of religious trauma and then link it to my own experience. 75 00:05:54,560 --> 00:05:55,560 So let's dive in. 76 00:05:55,560 --> 00:06:05,120 In 2011, the term religious trauma syndrome was coerced by a psychologist named Marlene 77 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:10,940 Winell, even though the phenomenon was recognized long before that, as the term had circulated 78 00:06:10,940 --> 00:06:17,560 among psychotherapists, former fundamentalists, and others recovering from religious indoctrination. 79 00:06:17,560 --> 00:06:22,280 So basically, religious trauma occurs when an individual struggles to leave a religion 80 00:06:22,280 --> 00:06:25,880 or a set of beliefs that has led to their indoctrination. 81 00:06:25,880 --> 00:06:31,240 It begins in toxic religious environments, which are centered around two basic narratives. 82 00:06:31,240 --> 00:06:34,400 You are not okay, and you are not safe. 83 00:06:34,400 --> 00:06:41,200 These ideas are often enforced with theology, such as, if I look at my own Christian background, 84 00:06:41,200 --> 00:06:44,600 it was the doctrine of original sin and hell. 85 00:06:44,600 --> 00:06:49,680 So you might be able to imagine how this kind of religion requires rigid conformity. 86 00:06:49,680 --> 00:06:54,960 They need to conform in order to survive in the group, but also because they otherwise 87 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:57,200 don't have hope for the afterlife. 88 00:06:57,200 --> 00:07:02,400 Such religion has a closed system of logic and a strong social structure to support an 89 00:07:02,400 --> 00:07:04,600 authoritarian worldview. 90 00:07:04,600 --> 00:07:07,600 In other words, you don't question, you just obey. 91 00:07:07,600 --> 00:07:12,240 So this eventually leads to problems with self-worth and fear of terrible punishment 92 00:07:12,240 --> 00:07:14,860 once the individual wants to leave. 93 00:07:14,860 --> 00:07:20,240 So I remember myself, I've been lying awake at night while I was already deconstructing 94 00:07:20,240 --> 00:07:26,120 my beliefs, but still I was crippled by fear that I might go to hell if I didn't wake up 95 00:07:26,120 --> 00:07:27,120 the next day. 96 00:07:27,120 --> 00:07:29,600 And that has led to a lot of anxiety. 97 00:07:29,600 --> 00:07:32,760 And you have to understand that I wasn't even gone yet. 98 00:07:32,760 --> 00:07:38,260 You know, I was just broadening my perspective and reading certain things that would change 99 00:07:38,260 --> 00:07:40,640 my convictions about certain topics. 100 00:07:40,640 --> 00:07:46,200 And even though at that time I would still call myself a Christian, I already had that 101 00:07:46,200 --> 00:07:48,280 fear, which is crazy. 102 00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:52,720 Growing up, our truth at home was always very solid, very black and white. 103 00:07:52,720 --> 00:07:56,960 There was not a lot of room to discuss or ask questions because there were always very 104 00:07:56,960 --> 00:07:58,840 clear biblical answers. 105 00:07:58,840 --> 00:08:04,120 And on top of that, once I started thinking for myself and share my ideas with my family, 106 00:08:04,120 --> 00:08:08,920 for example, they would often disagree and question my newfound ideas. 107 00:08:08,920 --> 00:08:13,120 And that is also the reason why they speak of a different social context when it comes 108 00:08:13,120 --> 00:08:17,840 to religious trauma compared to other trauma recovery situations. 109 00:08:17,840 --> 00:08:23,400 For example, if we look at natural disaster experiences, childhood sexual abuse or family 110 00:08:23,400 --> 00:08:26,800 violence, which are all horrible. 111 00:08:26,800 --> 00:08:31,160 These are mostly understandable to friends and professionals who are likely to be sympathetic 112 00:08:31,160 --> 00:08:32,560 and supportive. 113 00:08:32,560 --> 00:08:37,640 But in the case of religious abuse, these individuals are often pressured by family 114 00:08:37,640 --> 00:08:39,880 and church members to return. 115 00:08:39,880 --> 00:08:45,400 And they are reminded in many ways that if they do not return to their community or their 116 00:08:45,400 --> 00:08:49,200 sets of beliefs, they will be condemned otherwise. 117 00:08:49,200 --> 00:08:55,180 So in essence, that means that they are pressured to return to the perpetrator of their abuse. 118 00:08:55,180 --> 00:09:00,240 And according to Weinal, this social rejection is an added layer of serious injury that is 119 00:09:00,240 --> 00:09:03,240 absent from other varieties of trauma. 120 00:09:03,240 --> 00:09:06,320 So as you can imagine, it hasn't been an easy path for me. 121 00:09:06,320 --> 00:09:11,240 Coming from an environment where conformity was key, it's been very hard for me to come 122 00:09:11,240 --> 00:09:14,360 to terms with my own truth and speak it. 123 00:09:14,360 --> 00:09:18,960 But that's a part of religious trauma as well, because of the indoctrination, you constantly 124 00:09:18,960 --> 00:09:21,460 feel like you're doing something wrong. 125 00:09:21,460 --> 00:09:26,160 Like I said before, these narratives are implanted in your mind. 126 00:09:26,160 --> 00:09:29,720 Like once you leave, you are not okay, you are not safe. 127 00:09:29,720 --> 00:09:34,980 And I guess for me, that is also a reason to start this podcast to address these kinds 128 00:09:34,980 --> 00:09:38,640 of issues, to voice my authentic truth. 129 00:09:38,640 --> 00:09:42,640 Even though I've grown tremendously, now and then this fear can get to me when I'm tired 130 00:09:42,640 --> 00:09:46,160 or if I'm awake at night, you know, which is crazy. 131 00:09:46,160 --> 00:09:52,320 But basically, as I see it, my body has been used to fight and flight mode all these years. 132 00:09:52,320 --> 00:09:56,840 As I was growing up, I was trying to protect myself in order to survive, especially once 133 00:09:56,840 --> 00:09:59,980 I started developing my own ideas. 134 00:09:59,980 --> 00:10:06,040 And when I started coming out to people, I constantly had to deal with people's opinions 135 00:10:06,040 --> 00:10:11,560 about it and I had to protect myself and I had to, you know, really fight to survive. 136 00:10:11,560 --> 00:10:16,000 And even though in my mind, I know I'm safe now and I'm a good person, after all these 137 00:10:16,000 --> 00:10:20,680 years, sometimes it's like my body still thinks that I'm not safe or it feels like you have 138 00:10:20,680 --> 00:10:26,200 to fight, you have to fight to survive, which for me results in anxiety or panic. 139 00:10:26,200 --> 00:10:31,200 And this is also the reason why the development of religious trauma is compared to the development 140 00:10:31,200 --> 00:10:39,080 of complex PTSD, which is defined as a psychological disorder that can develop in response to prolonged, 141 00:10:39,080 --> 00:10:44,120 repeated experience of interpersonal trauma in a context in which the individual has little 142 00:10:44,120 --> 00:10:45,920 or no chance of escape. 143 00:10:45,920 --> 00:10:51,320 And in the wake of such trauma, religious trauma survivors will likely experience post-traumatic 144 00:10:51,320 --> 00:10:58,960 symptoms which might include anxiety, depression, numbing, dissociation and intrusive memories 145 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:02,000 and it might even lead to contemplating suicide. 146 00:11:02,000 --> 00:11:09,040 So like I said, I dealt with anxiety and panic, but also depression. 147 00:11:09,040 --> 00:11:12,600 And I've also been to that point where I was contemplating suicide. 148 00:11:12,600 --> 00:11:14,440 That was about 10 years ago. 149 00:11:14,440 --> 00:11:21,880 And luckily I immediately sought help and I found a affirming therapist. 150 00:11:21,880 --> 00:11:25,680 I think that was the beginning of that healing journey. 151 00:11:25,680 --> 00:11:32,320 When I look at my own situation, I'm very lucky that I have a brother that has always 152 00:11:32,320 --> 00:11:35,480 been supportive and we've been supportive of one another. 153 00:11:35,480 --> 00:11:40,600 But there was a time where I thought that if he wouldn't have been in my life, I'm 154 00:11:40,600 --> 00:11:43,360 not sure if I would be, if I would still be here. 155 00:11:43,360 --> 00:11:49,400 I mean, it's that important that you have support in your life in these kinds of situations. 156 00:11:49,400 --> 00:11:53,880 And luckily he was there while a lot of other people weren't. 157 00:11:53,880 --> 00:11:57,960 But just that one person that can already make such a difference. 158 00:11:57,960 --> 00:12:04,920 Sadly, there's a lot of stories about queer people who experience conflict in their family 159 00:12:04,920 --> 00:12:11,240 and rejection inside of their families, even to the point where they are being disowned, 160 00:12:11,240 --> 00:12:18,560 where the parents no longer recognize or want to recognize their child, their own child. 161 00:12:18,560 --> 00:12:24,160 And that is one of the reasons why the rate of individuals who contemplate suicide are 162 00:12:24,160 --> 00:12:26,560 that high within our community. 163 00:12:26,560 --> 00:12:30,960 Because I have experienced that myself, I wrote a song called Broken Hearted, which 164 00:12:30,960 --> 00:12:37,200 I basically created for the queer community in order to find encouragement. 165 00:12:37,200 --> 00:12:44,520 I wanted all of us to know that we are worthy and we are enough and that we shouldn't run 166 00:12:44,520 --> 00:12:46,760 away from who we really are. 167 00:12:46,760 --> 00:12:53,760 And I will leave a link to the song in the description. 168 00:12:53,760 --> 00:13:00,880 So members of the queer community are at particular risk of religious trauma because a lot of 169 00:13:00,880 --> 00:13:07,640 these people who are inside of repressive religious environments, they over an extended 170 00:13:07,640 --> 00:13:13,680 period of time, try to alter their sexual orientation and gender identity in order to 171 00:13:13,680 --> 00:13:18,520 fit the expectations of authoritarian religious communities. 172 00:13:18,520 --> 00:13:24,240 So that results in them chronically living in fear of eternal damnation and lifelong 173 00:13:24,240 --> 00:13:30,480 separation from loved ones and religious communities, which can induce long term symptoms of religious 174 00:13:30,480 --> 00:13:31,480 trauma. 175 00:13:31,480 --> 00:13:36,840 The study shows that the majority of queer individuals face adverse religious experiences 176 00:13:36,840 --> 00:13:38,920 manifested in different ways. 177 00:13:38,920 --> 00:13:45,640 So for example, you have this term called microaggression, which is a statement, action 178 00:13:45,640 --> 00:13:51,960 or incident regarded as an incident of indirect, subtle or unintentional discrimination against 179 00:13:51,960 --> 00:13:54,800 members of marginalized groups. 180 00:13:54,800 --> 00:14:00,320 And especially the word unintentional is something that I can really relate to when I look back 181 00:14:00,320 --> 00:14:04,400 at my past, but it still happens now and then. 182 00:14:04,400 --> 00:14:09,080 For example, I've always known my family members that they never chose to intentionally hurt 183 00:14:09,080 --> 00:14:10,640 my feelings. 184 00:14:10,640 --> 00:14:14,560 Often they had good intentions without knowing the pain it caused. 185 00:14:14,560 --> 00:14:18,440 And they would say things to me because they loved me, because they wanted to save me because 186 00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:23,200 they didn't want to see me burn in hell and they didn't want me to live a life without 187 00:14:23,200 --> 00:14:24,400 God. 188 00:14:24,400 --> 00:14:29,200 And with that, they're also pressuring you without really seeing it. 189 00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:34,480 They're pressuring you to go back to your old ways, which obviously didn't work for 190 00:14:34,480 --> 00:14:38,160 you because otherwise you would have stayed there. 191 00:14:38,160 --> 00:14:44,160 One important thing to know is that religious trauma is not an actual diagnosis and it is 192 00:14:44,160 --> 00:14:50,080 not yet included in the most recent version of the Diagnostic and Statistical Manual of 193 00:14:50,080 --> 00:14:51,440 Mental Disorders. 194 00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:57,940 However, this does not mean that it is non-existent or that it does not impact millions of individuals 195 00:14:57,940 --> 00:14:59,360 every year. 196 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:05,600 Sadly I know too many people, queer but also non-queer, whose life has been impacted in 197 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:13,120 a negative way because of religion and who are dealing with shame and a loss of identity. 198 00:15:13,120 --> 00:15:18,040 Because it's such a huge thing actually if you think about it because often we've built 199 00:15:18,040 --> 00:15:24,920 our entire identity upon these ideas and these indoctrination and once you step away slowly, 200 00:15:24,920 --> 00:15:28,840 everything starts crumbling, that's the thing with these toxic religious environments is 201 00:15:28,840 --> 00:15:35,320 that you give your whole life and once you step away or once you start deconstructing 202 00:15:35,320 --> 00:15:41,480 it's like the whole foundation of your life because we were taught, I was taught that 203 00:15:41,480 --> 00:15:47,440 my identity was in God, in Christ, you know, and once you step away from that, then who 204 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:49,080 are you? 205 00:15:49,080 --> 00:15:53,680 I realized that this topic is very big and that I'm probably going to return to this 206 00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:58,680 topic and dive more into my own personal story without the theory behind it. 207 00:15:58,680 --> 00:16:03,840 I hope you got a sense of what religious trauma is and how it is caused and if you've experienced 208 00:16:03,840 --> 00:16:08,480 religious trauma or if you are going through a tough time at the moment, know that you 209 00:16:08,480 --> 00:16:11,680 are not alone, we are in this together. 210 00:16:11,680 --> 00:16:15,800 And if you have any questions that you would like me to answer in another episode, please 211 00:16:15,800 --> 00:16:16,940 do let me know. 212 00:16:16,940 --> 00:16:21,320 You can send me a DM on Instagram at queerlyhavingissues. 213 00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:26,040 And if you enjoyed this episode, please click the follow button and I hope to have you here 214 00:16:26,040 --> 00:16:28,840 with me again on my next episode. 215 00:16:28,840 --> 00:16:51,720 Take care.