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Hi Fox! Hey Nova! How's it going? Pretty good! Welcome back to Mindful Poly! Yeah! It's a very

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special episode. It is, I mean they're all special episodes. I'm gonna say that every

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time. Yeah, it's true. I wouldn't say it if it wasn't true. Yeah, right. You're a beacon

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of honesty and truth. And purity. Pure of heart. Yes. Well, the reason why it's special

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is this episode will share a bit of why this podcast is named what it is. How we already

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had the domain name before we even started this podcast. So, to fill listeners in on

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a little backstory, Nova used to do a mindfulness and meditation presentation that you named

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Mindful Poly. Yeah. And that you also developed a website for. Right. Which was really awesome.

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I thought it was one of the coolest things that I'd ever seen when you first introduced

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me to it. Oh! And I was like, oh my god. Not only are you a badass coder and you can make

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websites out of nothing. Well, I can do that, that's true. You're a sorcerer. Okay. I'm

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getting shy now. Okay. Sorry, I'm talking you up. I'm trying not to put you too much

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on the spot. Anyway, I was very impressed. Thank you. So the reason I was inspired to

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start doing this presentation was because I did a mindfulness and meditation course

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a while back. And it happened to be around the same time that I was learning a lot about

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polyamory. And I realized that the two skills really overlapped. Like the things I was learning

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about mindfulness and meditation really helped me in my poly journey. And I thought that

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was kind of a cool intersection and I wanted to explore it. So sometimes, you know, if

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you make a project for yourself, it kind of helps you dive in even deeper and explore

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it even further. So I was like, why don't I, you know, I've been to a lot of poly conferences

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and I've really enjoyed them. And I was like, I wonder if I might have something to offer

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there. So as part of my pitch to do the presentation, I made the website and then use that to kind

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of come up with what the presentations would cover. And now I've done it at Beyond the

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Love and I did it at Southwest Love Fest. I did it at Southwest Love Fest. And I've

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done a couple online ones. I've actually done the presentation a bunch of times now. And

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I almost I think I've kind of decided I'm going to retire it because just because it's

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been really fun and I'd like to challenge myself on something new and do something new

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for the next one. But one last time, bring it to this episode and share just one small

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piece of it. I've come up with lots of versions of this and they're usually much longer than

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our short little episodes tend to be.

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This will just be a little taste. A little slice. But the main point of it is that you

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can use mindfulness meditation practices to help you. Like the presentation talked a lot

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about how it applied to how these can be helpful for Polly people in navigating their emotions.

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Yeah. And the website still exists if you want to go find it. It's actually it's on

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our mindfulpoly.com. It's one of the links at the bottom. You can still find it. I didn't

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take it down. So if you just...

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I'm glad it's still there. It will be there forever.

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If you feel like peeking through it.

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So great. Well, what we're going to do is Nova is going to lead us through a section

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of it. Kind of a sample. And I'm going to... And you at home can play along. I'm going

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to be the one as if I'm in her session. Yeah. And we're going through the presentation.

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So how should I prepare? Shoes off?

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Shoes off?

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Well, I'm about to meditate, I think.

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Oh, you only do that barefoot?

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Is that what... What are you supposed to do?

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Oh, we'll get there. We'll get there.

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Okay.

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So one of the things I realized as I was putting together this presentation is that part of

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what I connected with when it comes to mindfulness and meditation was I realized that I've got

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this history of sort of being... I come from what I would characterize as hippie and engineering

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roots. Like hippie engineers. And that's kind of what I've become in my own life. And so

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mindfulness is kind of hippie. It's kind of... There are some people who have a hard time

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connecting with it because it just seems a little too squishy, a little too... I don't

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know.

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Crunchy?

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Maybe that's a word for it. Yeah. But to be honest, the engineering side of me is fascinated

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by the studies they've done and the research they can do on brains that actually can track

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the changes that happen when you practice mindfulness. And that's like... I'm just like...

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I gobble that up.

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Data. All the stats.

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So I think one of the trickiest things about putting together this presentation is that

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any given audience can have a very different understanding of mindfulness and meditation

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going into it. Some people have been meditating a long time. Some people have been practicing

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mindfulness in many ways. And some people are still kind of new to the concepts. So

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that was always a really challenging aspect is to try to guess what level makes the most

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sense. So I've kind of picked a middle ground that hopefully is still interesting to people

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who practice it all the time and also still approachable for people who are brand new

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to it.

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Great. That's me.

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So mindfulness is really... It's just a very simple concept. It's really just about being

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in the moment, being present. More often than we... If we're not aware of it, it's very

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easy for us to get caught up in thoughts about the future and thoughts about the past and

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not really even be in the moment we're in right now. Some of the good examples I've

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heard many times are if you're at dinner and you're planning what restaurant you should

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all go to next and you're kind of missing the fact that you're already at a restaurant

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enjoying a meal. Or if you think about the last time you took a shower and were actually

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present for the sensations of what the soap smells like and feels like on your body and

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what the water feels like. So often we just kind of go into autopilot when we do certain

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types of tasks. So mindfulness, that's really all it is, is being present, being in the

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moment.

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Breaking you out of autopilot.

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Yeah. Yeah. And so meditation is just a tool that can help you be more mindful. And there

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are so many kinds of meditation. The one that most people are familiar with are closing

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your eyes and paying attention to your breath in some way or another. So meditation is just

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one of many tools that can help support your ability to think mindfully. So it's really

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all about training your awareness. And once you train your awareness, you can be more

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in the moment. I think of meditation a lot like working out in the sense that you can't

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just do it once and suddenly have amazing muscles. It's something you've got to do

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over and over and over to get practice. It's something you build slowly over time. Which

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I think is one of the challenging things about it is that it's easy to do it once or twice

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and be like, man, I'm awful at it. And it's like, yeah, you'd probably be awful at running

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six miles if you just were sitting on the couch and decided to try it one day.

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So yeah, takes practice. Yeah. But the nice thing about it is that built into it is sort

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of an opportunity to give yourself some patience and some space.

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Compassion.

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Yeah, some compassion. And so meditation, I think sometimes people have a kind of mistaken

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idea that it's about sitting there, sitting and breathing and clearing your mind of all

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thoughts. And that's really not the goal. It's to bring awareness to the thoughts that

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you're having and noticing them. The idea that you're just going to push all the thoughts

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out of your brain is really kind of going against it. I like to think of it, meditation,

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as being on a river, on the bank of a river. And so when you're going about your normal

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day, you're usually in the river. So you're in with all your thoughts, you're caught up

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in the stream of things, you're going along with it all. And meditation is about sort

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of sitting on the bank and you're still, all those thoughts are still happening and they're

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still going by. You're just noticing them and seeing them and being aware of them.

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Observing.

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Yeah. And you're just that little distance of being on the banks can make such a dramatic

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impact in how you react to all those thoughts going by.

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I remember you talking about that in one of your presentations and it hit me really hard.

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Yeah, I remember you sharing that.

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Well, because I can just really feel my imagination of the pull of the current on my ankles or

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on my legs, like when you're deeper in the middle of the river. And when you walk to

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the shore, that pressure eases off. You're not swept away by powerful emotions. You can

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feel them because your feet are still wet, like you're still in it. But you can observe.

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Cool. Yeah, I like that. Being able to connect with that sense of how much power the river

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has over you by how much it's kind of pulling on you, the sensation.

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And I don't think it's helpful to just banish thought and if you're having an uncomfortable

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emotion to just stop, try to make yourself stop. So that river analogy just feels so

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good at acknowledging its existence, allowing it to pass through you without sweeping you

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away.

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Right. And the part that I've always connected with, I like that you're describing what you

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connected with is the pull of the river itself. I always enjoy thinking of my thoughts as

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like fish because it's such a different relationship. You have such a different relationship when

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you're imagining your thoughts that way. You can think of them as kind of like, oh, they're

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kind of cute or they're kind of playful or they're kind of active or they're kind of,

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you know, you can get all these adjectives in your own mind. And it's such a different

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relationship than when you're just like, I'm just angry. You know, you're like, oh, there's

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the angry fish. Look at him.

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He's so grumpy.

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Yeah. He's going to overbite.

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Yeah, one of those like snaggle tooth like deep sea fish.

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Yeah.

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Fox made fish faces at Nova.

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Yeah, they were great. Sorry you missed them.

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So we've talked a lot about mindfulness and meditation, but we haven't talked a lot about

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poly and that's kind of the main thing that we're trying to connect it up to.

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That's why we're all here.

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Yeah. So I'm going to start with a quote that I really love. That's from stranger in a strange

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land. Mike doesn't have technique, but when Mike kisses you, he isn't doing anything else.

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You're his whole universe and the moment is eternal because he doesn't have any plans

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and he isn't going anywhere. Just kissing you.

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Hot.

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Yes. Like I aspire to Mike. Oh my God.

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I want to kiss Mike.

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Well, I mean, I would love to kiss Mike and I want to be Mike. I want to be the kind of

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person that is described in that way that is kissing people in that way, leaving them

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with the impression that like I'm doing nothing else but being there with them in that moment.

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Mike is incredibly mindful.

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So for this podcast, I just chose one particular topic out of all the ones I go into in my

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presentation and the one I chose is being in the moment with a partner because one thing

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that every poly person seems to connect on is the idea that we have a very busy calendar

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and we tend to be juggling a lot of things and we have a lot of people that we want to

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make time for. And I think when you have done all that work, you've carved out this time,

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you've agreed upon a location and you've set aside this moment to share with each other.

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The most important thing is to be there, to be mentally there, not just physically there,

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but mentally be there in that moment, to be connected to that time and that place and

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that person. And I think when you practice mindfulness, it can help you do that.

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I find that so helpful. I am the target audience.

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And so there are a lot of, there's a lot of options for how to practice being more mindful

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and being more present with a partner. I think senses meditations are really good ways to

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connect with the moment. And obviously you can do any type based on each of your senses.

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I personally am most drawn to sound meditation. So that's the one I'm going to focus on today,

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but you can really choose any of them that you think you enjoy the most.

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So we're going to try something out here. I don't know how well meditation over podcasting

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works, but we're going to explore going through a really quick one. I'm going to keep it as

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short as I can, just so you get a taste for what it's like and you can practice it on

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your own if you'd like to and do a more extended version. So the first step of any meditation

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is really just to get into a comfortable position. So usually that involves sitting up straight

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or standing straight, kind of rolling your shoulders, getting kind of relaxed in your

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body. And once you get settled in, you're going to start focusing on your breath and

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notice what it feels like as you breathe in and as you breathe out and just take a couple

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slow breaths that way. You really kind of want to be curious about your breath each

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time about what it feels like as it goes in and out. And now I want you to notice the

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sounds in the room you're in. Obviously one of the first sounds is going to be my voice

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since you're listening to this podcast, but we're going to take just a moment and see

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if you can identify some other sounds in the room, in the space that you're in. And if

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you can pick just one of them, spend a little time being curious about it. Is it loud or

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is it soft? Is it near or far away? What kinds of things can you notice about the sound?

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And then see if you can pick another sound, see if there are other sounds in the room,

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even if it's really quiet or maybe even just notice the silence and explore the sound of

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silence. And we'll take a brief moment to be curious about that new sound. And then

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see if you can connect with all of the sounds together. It kind of gives you an idea of

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the soundscape of this moment. You know, explore what it's like to be right here, right now,

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and all the sounds that come along with being in this space that you're in. And just let's

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take a couple of breaths noticing all the sounds around us. And now we'll come back

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and talk a little bit about that experience. I kept that one much, much faster than I would

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normally do them, just for the sake of giving you a taste of what it's like. And I normally

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check in and see what people have to say about that experience. Do you have anything you'd

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like to share, Fox? That was really nice. Even the abbreviated version just felt good.

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I think there are so many moments where we're reacting on instinct and gut reaction, and

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all it takes is five seconds to just pause. Yeah, I think that's a really good point.

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Sometimes when I see meditation spoken about, there's an idea that it needs to be for a

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really long time, or it's not going to be meaningful. And yeah, I mean, that's a really

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good... Skeptical.

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Yeah. I mean, obviously it's great if you can invest that kind of time into it. But

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even if you only have a couple of minutes, or what I've found, if you're in a date and

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you realize that you're really focused on what you just did before the date, or what

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you need to do next, or trying to plan what's going to happen the next time you see this

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person, you can just take, like you said, five seconds, take a breath. And for me, I

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like to notice the sounds in the space I'm in. And it's a quick way for me to be like,

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right, I'm here now. I'm here in this time and space.

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You know what this made me think of was with my partner River on our video call dates.

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Sometimes there will be some breaks in the conversation where neither of us are talking.

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And like, I don't think I've been able to experience this with almost any other person

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in my life. But with River on those video calls, that I'm able to feel comfortable in

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those silences. Yeah. Like we're able to just let them happen.

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I think that's really cool. I feel like silence is often a source of anxiety in relationships

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for people. Right? We feel the pressure to feel it.

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Yeah. Yeah. And I think it really speaks highly when you can just like, be comfortable in

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silence. You're comfortable enough with another human to be silent together. So that's just

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a really brief idea of one of the gifts that I think mindfulness and meditation can offer

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to Polly people is just a different way to connect with your in-person time with another

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human or even not in-person, virtual time with another human. Long distance time.

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And one of the other skills that meditation and mindfulness can cultivate that I think

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is also really powerful in Polly is curiosity. Because if you notice during that meditation,

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we were curious about the sounds around us. I liked it.

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Yeah. Which is really fun. I think curiosity is something that's very natural to us as

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kids. And we over time kind of lose touch with it. We're so often taught not to be curious

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to accept what's told or how someone else presents things instead of saying, well, why

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is it this way? Or why should it be like that? Or what are you feeling about that? And I

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think anytime you start applying curious thinking to other people, it can be kind of amazing

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because you can be curious about yourself. You can be curious about who you are on a

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given day at a given time during a given date. You can even like, who am I right now in this

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moment? Yes, I've been this way with this partner before, but who am I today? And what

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kind of energy am I bringing right now? And who are they? I know what we've been like

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in the past. I know how our dates have been, but what is this date going to be like? What's

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it going to feel like? What are we going to share together? And even, I think you can

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take it further. There's a lot of situations where you might, I've heard so many times

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people say, well, I know they're going to react this way, or I know my partner's going

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to feel this way about this thing. And I'm like, but do you?

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I've done that so many times. Maybe you should be curious about that. Give them an opportunity,

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give them space to be whatever they are. It's possible you're right, but you might not be.

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And even when you give off the energy that you already know the answer, they're going

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to pick up on that. You might be kind of pushing them towards feeling a way that they wouldn't

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have otherwise. Kind of taking away an opportunity for them to be present with you. Yeah. Yeah.

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Versus just saying, how do you feel? Tell me how you feel. I'd love to know. I'm curious

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about you. I'm curious about what your reaction is to this.

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So that is just a very mini little tidbit of one of my presentation topics. If you're

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curious or you thought it was kind of fun, feel free to check out the website and explore

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some of those areas that I didn't get to talk about. I have done a presentation about self-love

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and how mindfulness and meditation can help you with that. And obviously self-love is

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like huge in the Pali world. There's one about conflict and breakups that I personally have

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found really helpful in my own life. So that was mindful Pali, the presentation. Before we let you

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go, I want to remind everyone that we are doing our audience discussion prompt again this season.

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This season, the question is what makes you feel secure in a relationship? Record a voice

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answer or write to us at podcasts at mindfulpali.com and we may use it in that episode at the end of

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the season. We're doing the audience participation. I bumped my microphone. How embarrassing.

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How embarrassing. Oh my God. I am so embarrassed. I am so embarrassed. That's my Grover voice.