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Hi, I'm John Schmidt from the Piano Guys.

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Hi, I'm Forrest Kenny.

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My name is Christopher.

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I'm Tim Topham.

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My name is Melanie Bowes.

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Hi, this is Andrea Voll.

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I'm Jennifer Fox.

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I'm Glory St. Germain.

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My name is Christina Lopriori.

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I'm Leela Viss.

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I'm Lindell Kennedy.

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Hi, this is Sarah Campbell.

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Hi, Fraser Myers, we'll be your host.

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The technique, foundation.

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An introduction to SEO.

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How you can set up your group lessons.

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And one of those tools is notation software.

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I'd like to share with you a lot about chorus.

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We want to get teachers off on the right foot.

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Playing by ear and improvising.

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Growing a group teaching studio.

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Pop music.

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The 12 bar blues.

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How to build a website from scratch.

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We didn't want to follow just one particular technique,

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ideology or methodology or philosophy.

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Just get to know them before you do anything

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to do with music.

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I think it's one of the most important things.

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It's fundamental.

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And it's about building rapport and a relationship

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with your students.

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How to make the most popular chords.

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How to style them in a variety of ways.

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How to add color tones to them.

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How to use them to reharmonize melodies in a fresh way.

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You're going to have the clear understanding

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and the resources you need to develop your own oral skills

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and help your students to do the same.

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We're going to look at the different kind of business

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aspects of setting up group lessons

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and how they differ to your private lessons.

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And I use it for all my students, classical, contemporary,

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any student at all.

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Circle of fifths is absolute gold.

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Music

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Welcome back to another episode of the PianoPod,

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here, tradition meets innovation.

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We bridge the timeless beauty of the piano

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with the dynamic pulse of today's world.

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I am your host, Yukimi Song.

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So for this episode, I invited Tim Topham,

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founder, director of Top Music Co., Music Educator,

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and author of a recently published book titled

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No Book Beginners, Step-by-Step Framework for Creative Piano

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Teaching, right from lesson one.

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A leading text demonstrating the many benefits

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of delaying reading in beginner piano teaching.

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Tim has been helping to reshape and recharge

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the traditional landscape of instrumental music education

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since 2010.

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Tim's vision of a more creative, modern, and integrated approach

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to teaching has seen him speak on stages from US to UK

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and Australia.

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Tim is the founder of Top Music Co.

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And when he is not in the studio,

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he enjoys cycling, coffee, and traveling with his family.

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Before getting started with this episode,

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I want to welcome all our first timers to the PianoPod.

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I'm a classical pianist and educator from New York City

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whether diving deep into a piano career,

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working professionally in the classical music scene,

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or simply having a passion for piano tunes,

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this podcast is your backstage pass

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to the fascinating piano world.

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I also want to welcome back and thank you

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to amazing TPP fans and faithful listeners

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for tuning in today.

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Please rate and review the show on your favorite podcast

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platform because every rating review

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will help people find the show.

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I am thrilled to welcome Mr. Tim Topham to start

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our conversation.

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So stick with us for a reflecting discussion

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on keeping music education relevant in today's changing

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world.

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Please enjoy the show.

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["Piano from the Piano Pod"]

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You are listening to the PianoPod

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where we talk to the brightest minds in the industry

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about how they are bringing the piano into the 21st century.

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Welcome, Tim, to the PianoPod.

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Yank.

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Thanks, Yikimi, for having me.

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It's great to be here.

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I've been a listener of your show.

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And the thing I really love as another podcaster

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is that you have all these guests who I've never heard of.

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So I'm learning so much about from new people, which

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is great.

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Oh, thank you.

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Yeah, I am learning so much by doing this.

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And I also listen to your podcast.

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It's great.

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We're going to talk more about your podcast as well.

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Anyway, thanks for really being here

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and participating in the conversation today.

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It means so much.

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And you're right now in Melbourne, Australia, correct?

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That's right.

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Yep, nice warm summer.

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Oh, how nice.

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I'm jealous.

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So today is a really bitter cold winter here in New York City.

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So I'm very, very envious of that.

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Anyways, congratulations on your new book.

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You sent me actually the copy of it.

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But I actually bought it because I'm enjoying reading it.

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So I was like, instead of reading on PDF format,

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I really wanted to get the copy.

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So I downloaded on my phone.

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And I have it in the Kindle.

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I honestly still need to finish reading it.

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But it's the sort of book where I feel like you can just

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go back and forth, you know what I mean?

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And use it as a resource instead of just reading it

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through once.

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And it covers everything from the inspiration

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behind writing this book to the current state of music

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education, focusing on obviously piano

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and musical instrument instructions and lessons.

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And also, you're providing a historical background

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to explain how we got where we are in our industry.

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And it's very interesting.

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I love that sort of thing.

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And then also a practical framework

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for teaching beginners without relying

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on typical method books.

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So I kind of briefly explain what that book is all about.

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But in your words, in a nutshell,

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tell us what this No Book Beginners book is all about.

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Sure, well, I'll answer it perhaps slightly unusually

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in saying to your audience, when you had, and to you,

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you give me now, when you had your first piano lesson,

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if you think right back, if you can remember,

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did your piano teacher open a method book

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and point to middle C and show you

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where to put your thumb on middle C?

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And they were probably held for two counts each.

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And you would be playing middle C, one, two, one, two.

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If you're lucky, you might use your left hand, one, two.

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And that was kind of lesson one.

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Was that lesson one for you?

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Oh, yes.

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So I wanted to get out of it.

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And then I did, actually.

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I moved to a group lesson.

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And that was actually, they didn't teach me

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how to read notes.

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So that was really fun.

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But the first lesson was really the traditional reading-based.

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Well, if I asked that question to,

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I was in fact speaking at a conference yesterday,

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it was about 35 teachers.

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And yes, about 90% of their hands

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went up to say, yes, that is how I was taught.

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So my question in answer to your question is, well,

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keep your hand up if you think that's

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the most imaginative, creative, musical, fun, exciting,

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enjoyable way that you could possibly start a music lesson

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with a student today.

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And of course, all the hands go down.

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I mean, no one in their right mind

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would think that's a good way to engage students

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and excite them in this journey they're starting

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when they are the most enthusiastic they'll ever

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be in that first lesson.

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So the book answers the question, well,

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if we all agree with that, and most people do,

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what do I do instead?

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And so I know that most teachers,

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if they've had some formal training,

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it will be fairly traditional, fairly classical.

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And they will generally teach to some extent

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how they were taught, which will tend to be quite traditional

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as well.

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And so while teachers might listen to what I've just said

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and go, yeah, I could kind of get on board with that.

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It probably makes sense.

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I could probably do something different.

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The question is, what do I do?

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And so that's really the fundamental part of this book.

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It's to say, well, we're all on the same page together.

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My goal for the book is I want more students in the world

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continuing their piano instruction.

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I want more teachers enjoying the process of teaching

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so they do more of it and they have fun with it.

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And I want these students to stick around

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because they've had this incredible experience

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at the start.

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So here is your framework.

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Here are your lesson plans.

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Go for it.

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Have fun with it.

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You can do it, by the way.

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Anyone can do it.

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Regardless of how little creativity you think

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you have inside you, you can do it.

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So that's what the book's all about.

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So the title is No Book Beginners.

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Literally, you're going to start without a book.

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Correct.

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Yeah, well, the only book you're going to start with

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is my book, which you're going to have on the side.

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You're going to be preparing with it.

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But yes, the goal is to not have a method

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book for anything up to 10 weeks, if you want to, or more,

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or fewer.

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There are many teachers who've used this approach

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and maybe just use it for three weeks

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to kick off the right lessons with students.

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And then they'll start adding their method alongside.

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So it's really, really flexible.

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I don't call it a method.

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I call it a framework for that fact.

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The fact is you, as a teacher, are in charge of your lessons.

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And you can choose to use this how

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you want for however many students you want,

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for how long you want, alongside the method you want.

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Before the method you want, it's really up to you.

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But I hope, I guess, the first half of the book, which really

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explains the reasoning behind it,

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helps teachers understand the power

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that they could have by implementing this.

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I actually really enjoy reading the first part of the book,

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the reason behind it.

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And I couldn't agree more in many, many aspects

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because I've been teaching too.

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And also, I feel like reading notes comes to me much later.

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I'm saying this.

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I'm a classical pianist.

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So I don't want to get kicked out from the industry

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that I'm familiar with.

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And I am in.

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But the thing is, for a beginner,

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especially for those who are just really starting out

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and getting to know this black and white instrument,

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and then thinking, as a teacher, to start from the notation

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just sounds really horrible.

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And then that's not how you learn the language anyway.

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And in music, we usually associate music

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as one of the languages.

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I'd be really shocked to hear you say,

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I don't want people in the classical area

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to be against this or my approach if I was to use it.

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Because in actual fact, what I want to make clear

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is that this approach will help students

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build their musical skills that will help them in whatever way

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they take their music, whether that's

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a fairly classical route, whether it's

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more of a pop route or a composing route, whatever it is.

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But we don't know.

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We're not going to know for a few years,

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if we take on a seven-year-old, where they might end up,

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what their passion actually is.

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This just lays the groundwork for the musical skills

267
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and fun and enjoyment, but primarily the musical skills,

268
00:10:55,560 --> 00:10:58,920
which method books so often leave out,

269
00:10:58,920 --> 00:11:02,880
which are things like the singing, chanting, clap backs,

270
00:11:02,880 --> 00:11:06,280
play backs, rhythm tapping, singing tonic and dominant,

271
00:11:06,280 --> 00:11:08,800
feeling home keys, understanding the difference between 3, 4,

272
00:11:08,800 --> 00:11:10,600
4, 4 meter.

273
00:11:10,600 --> 00:11:11,720
And the list goes on.

274
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These are just critical musical skills

275
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that students should have.

276
00:11:15,400 --> 00:11:17,280
But unfortunately, when we just go straight

277
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to middle C in the book, we miss out on that opportunity.

278
00:11:20,400 --> 00:11:22,840
So this will help classical students in the future.

279
00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:23,560
And it has done.

280
00:11:23,560 --> 00:11:25,840
And there's no question about it.

281
00:11:25,840 --> 00:11:27,120
Absolutely, you're right.

282
00:11:27,120 --> 00:11:30,040
So why did you write this book?

283
00:11:30,040 --> 00:11:34,000
It seems like you developed this framework.

284
00:11:34,000 --> 00:11:36,720
And then you have a company, which

285
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we're going to talk about later.

286
00:11:37,920 --> 00:11:41,160
And you have a course that you offer.

287
00:11:41,160 --> 00:11:46,000
But you decided to write a book, which was written last year.

288
00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:47,080
So yes.

289
00:11:47,080 --> 00:11:51,000
The reason is I'm passionate about it.

290
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It really saddens me to hear of students quitting too soon.

291
00:11:57,000 --> 00:12:00,440
But no other reason than the way they were taught,

292
00:12:00,440 --> 00:12:03,480
or a lack of connection with their teacher,

293
00:12:03,480 --> 00:12:05,360
or teachers just not understanding some

294
00:12:05,360 --> 00:12:08,280
of the things that they can do without much change

295
00:12:08,280 --> 00:12:14,280
to really appeal to 2024, 2023, modern students

296
00:12:14,280 --> 00:12:16,400
and their learning and their need for a slightly

297
00:12:16,400 --> 00:12:17,640
different approach.

298
00:12:17,640 --> 00:12:19,800
So I really wanted to, I mean, I've

299
00:12:19,800 --> 00:12:22,880
been writing the blog, I started blogging in 2010

300
00:12:22,880 --> 00:12:24,360
and podcasting in 2015.

301
00:12:24,360 --> 00:12:26,200
So I've been doing this all for a while.

302
00:12:26,200 --> 00:12:30,720
And out of that came this concept.

303
00:12:30,720 --> 00:12:32,320
The first time I tested it, and I

304
00:12:32,320 --> 00:12:36,000
share the story in the book, was 2015.

305
00:12:36,000 --> 00:12:39,840
And it's been tested by well over 1,000 teachers now

306
00:12:39,840 --> 00:12:41,680
all around the world who have used this.

307
00:12:41,680 --> 00:12:42,960
And there's a lot of testimonials

308
00:12:42,960 --> 00:12:44,500
you'll read in the book about the ways

309
00:12:44,500 --> 00:12:47,040
that they've seen this impact their teaching.

310
00:12:47,040 --> 00:12:49,920
So the long story short is really, I just

311
00:12:49,920 --> 00:12:51,960
wanted to get it into the hands of more teachers.

312
00:12:51,960 --> 00:12:56,240
I want more teachers to know that there's an alternative here.

313
00:12:56,240 --> 00:12:59,960
You said something about this modern teaching, modern,

314
00:12:59,960 --> 00:13:07,440
let's say market or students, the different, I'd say,

315
00:13:07,440 --> 00:13:11,200
ways of learning or I don't know.

316
00:13:11,200 --> 00:13:14,120
What do you see in them?

317
00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:17,020
What's so different about this modern teaching?

318
00:13:17,020 --> 00:13:18,960
Or modern students?

319
00:13:18,960 --> 00:13:24,040
Well, I mean, there's so much that's changed in 10, 15 years.

320
00:13:24,040 --> 00:13:26,960
Family dynamics have shifted, have changed.

321
00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:29,160
Students' leisure time has changed.

322
00:13:29,160 --> 00:13:31,200
Technology has impacted everything.

323
00:13:31,200 --> 00:13:35,720
And it's changed things like students' ability to focus

324
00:13:35,720 --> 00:13:38,720
and what students expect of their learning.

325
00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:41,440
And this goes to classrooms as well.

326
00:13:41,440 --> 00:13:44,160
Classrooms having to shift their approach away

327
00:13:44,160 --> 00:13:46,300
from the teacher just dictating everything

328
00:13:46,300 --> 00:13:47,640
and students writing it down.

329
00:13:47,640 --> 00:13:48,480
That doesn't happen.

330
00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:50,240
That happened for our parents' generation.

331
00:13:50,240 --> 00:13:51,360
It doesn't happen anymore.

332
00:13:51,360 --> 00:13:53,080
Well, if it does, it's not working.

333
00:13:53,080 --> 00:13:56,400
And it's starting to shift more to inquiry-based learning.

334
00:13:56,400 --> 00:14:01,640
And so one of the key factors we believe at Top Music,

335
00:14:01,640 --> 00:14:04,560
and one of our pillars is, and I'd encourage all teachers

336
00:14:04,560 --> 00:14:08,200
to consider this, is having a student-first approach,

337
00:14:08,200 --> 00:14:12,160
giving students autonomy and agency in their learning.

338
00:14:12,160 --> 00:14:13,280
Now, that's going to vary.

339
00:14:13,280 --> 00:14:15,900
If they're a six-year-old, the teacher's

340
00:14:15,900 --> 00:14:17,280
going to have most of the autonomy,

341
00:14:17,280 --> 00:14:19,200
going to be directing most of what's going on.

342
00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:21,800
If they're a 16-year-old, then that

343
00:14:21,800 --> 00:14:23,720
is flipped around right around the other way.

344
00:14:23,720 --> 00:14:25,560
Because a 16-year-old comes to lessons

345
00:14:25,560 --> 00:14:26,960
for a very particular purpose.

346
00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:29,440
And you need to know that purpose and help them with it,

347
00:14:29,440 --> 00:14:31,600
or they're going to quit very, very quickly.

348
00:14:31,600 --> 00:14:33,840
So we believe really strongly in the student-centered

349
00:14:33,840 --> 00:14:35,680
or student-first approach.

350
00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:39,160
And that's just one element of what I believe

351
00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:41,480
has changed more recently.

352
00:14:41,480 --> 00:14:45,640
Another one is just students crave interactivity.

353
00:14:45,640 --> 00:14:50,200
So the integration of technology into lessons,

354
00:14:50,200 --> 00:14:53,320
even if that's just you recording them and playing it

355
00:14:53,320 --> 00:14:56,000
back in slow motion and watching movements and things like that.

356
00:14:56,000 --> 00:14:58,240
There's very easy ways to integrate technology.

357
00:14:58,240 --> 00:15:01,760
Again, it's not a whole rebirth of your teaching.

358
00:15:01,760 --> 00:15:05,360
Just adding things in can be very powerful.

359
00:15:05,360 --> 00:15:08,760
And there's a lot about collaboration

360
00:15:08,760 --> 00:15:12,440
that students really value these days.

361
00:15:12,440 --> 00:15:14,000
I mean, there will always be, you

362
00:15:14,000 --> 00:15:18,200
can be the 1% of students who will sit alone at a piano

363
00:15:18,200 --> 00:15:20,560
for two hours a day and practice and move up

364
00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:22,400
through the grades if you're in a grading system

365
00:15:22,400 --> 00:15:25,280
or work towards the advanced literature.

366
00:15:25,280 --> 00:15:31,320
But my experience is that the 99%ers,

367
00:15:31,320 --> 00:15:33,720
they won't respond in the same way to that.

368
00:15:33,720 --> 00:15:36,280
And so we have to look, OK, how can we

369
00:15:36,280 --> 00:15:37,840
get collaboration happening?

370
00:15:37,840 --> 00:15:39,720
Where's the social element, particularly

371
00:15:39,720 --> 00:15:40,640
for piano students?

372
00:15:40,640 --> 00:15:43,520
Oh my goodness, piano students are so alone

373
00:15:43,520 --> 00:15:44,600
and solo.

374
00:15:44,600 --> 00:15:48,720
Let's work ways to get them together, to play together,

375
00:15:48,720 --> 00:15:50,880
to play at least with a backing track or with you

376
00:15:50,880 --> 00:15:53,480
in the studio at a second piano or duetting

377
00:15:53,480 --> 00:15:55,600
or anything that means that they're

378
00:15:55,600 --> 00:15:56,880
playing in a collaborative sense.

379
00:15:56,880 --> 00:16:00,160
Because of course, that gives them a much stronger sense

380
00:16:00,160 --> 00:16:00,680
of rhythm.

381
00:16:00,680 --> 00:16:02,880
I mean, not only is it social and that's positive,

382
00:16:02,880 --> 00:16:04,280
but it helps their musicality.

383
00:16:04,280 --> 00:16:05,400
They're listening better.

384
00:16:05,400 --> 00:16:06,360
They're following.

385
00:16:06,360 --> 00:16:07,880
They're getting balance.

386
00:16:07,880 --> 00:16:09,760
I mean, so many things come from it.

387
00:16:09,760 --> 00:16:13,840
So I think there's just two examples or three

388
00:16:13,840 --> 00:16:17,120
of some of the changes that I feel

389
00:16:17,120 --> 00:16:19,360
we need to consider in our studios.

390
00:16:19,360 --> 00:16:23,120
When I was a child compared to that time and then

391
00:16:23,120 --> 00:16:28,040
now as a music educator, our responsibility

392
00:16:28,040 --> 00:16:30,120
have completely shifted.

393
00:16:30,120 --> 00:16:33,760
My teachers probably, I mean, they

394
00:16:33,760 --> 00:16:35,640
were all traditional way of teaching.

395
00:16:35,640 --> 00:16:39,600
And if it's the piano lesson, it was just

396
00:16:39,600 --> 00:16:41,720
everything was focused on piano playing,

397
00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:45,400
from piano technique to notation to everything.

398
00:16:45,400 --> 00:16:49,560
And then obviously, I'm one of those people

399
00:16:49,560 --> 00:16:50,880
who wanted to study piano.

400
00:16:50,880 --> 00:16:54,040
So it got more serious.

401
00:16:54,040 --> 00:16:57,920
But then these days, I'm teaching serious students.

402
00:16:57,920 --> 00:17:02,840
Some perform at Carnegie Hall several times a year.

403
00:17:02,840 --> 00:17:08,960
Yeah, as opposed to I have other students who, one,

404
00:17:08,960 --> 00:17:13,920
I'm proud to say she wrote a song during COVID shutdown

405
00:17:13,920 --> 00:17:16,600
and collaborated with her friend.

406
00:17:16,600 --> 00:17:20,240
So she produced a song and then available on Spotify.

407
00:17:20,240 --> 00:17:21,440
Oh, that's amazing.

408
00:17:21,440 --> 00:17:22,200
I know.

409
00:17:22,200 --> 00:17:24,720
But it's interesting.

410
00:17:24,720 --> 00:17:29,440
So which means I feel like I am required to know

411
00:17:29,440 --> 00:17:34,800
a lot more than my traditional way of teaching

412
00:17:34,800 --> 00:17:38,240
or the traditional way of learning

413
00:17:38,240 --> 00:17:43,240
or the traditional way that I was taught.

414
00:17:43,240 --> 00:17:44,960
And then it was kind of easy.

415
00:17:44,960 --> 00:17:46,160
Let's be honest.

416
00:17:46,160 --> 00:17:48,360
It was kind of easy teaching back then.

417
00:17:48,360 --> 00:17:49,600
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

418
00:17:49,600 --> 00:17:51,880
If you knew the repertoire and could play it and could teach

419
00:17:51,880 --> 00:17:55,600
it, everyone came in, expected you to help them with the notes,

420
00:17:55,600 --> 00:17:59,120
correct their mistakes, and go home and practice and repeat.

421
00:17:59,120 --> 00:18:01,600
Yeah, great.

422
00:18:01,600 --> 00:18:04,840
And maybe, again, that worked for some students.

423
00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:07,840
But it's working for fewer and fewer students.

424
00:18:07,840 --> 00:18:09,440
With all the work and the conversations

425
00:18:09,440 --> 00:18:10,840
I have around the world.

426
00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:12,240
But you know what, though?

427
00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:14,040
I would have found, sorry to interrupt you,

428
00:18:14,040 --> 00:18:15,920
I would have found that so boring.

429
00:18:15,920 --> 00:18:16,880
So boring.

430
00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:17,520
Oh, my goodness.

431
00:18:17,520 --> 00:18:18,880
Same method, same pieces.

432
00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:20,600
I can picture that they're going to forget

433
00:18:20,600 --> 00:18:22,080
that C sharp in that scale.

434
00:18:22,080 --> 00:18:26,120
And they're going to miss the E flat in this Bergmüller piece.

435
00:18:26,120 --> 00:18:28,800
I don't want to even teach like that.

436
00:18:28,800 --> 00:18:30,080
So dull.

437
00:18:30,080 --> 00:18:33,440
That's a missing part in our industry.

438
00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:35,240
And then you decided to write a book?

439
00:18:35,240 --> 00:18:35,760
Oh, yeah.

440
00:18:35,760 --> 00:18:38,600
I mean, it's obviously a bigger picture.

441
00:18:38,600 --> 00:18:45,040
Because we can improve teaching at all levels of ability

442
00:18:45,040 --> 00:18:48,960
and have an impact by taking the student first approach.

443
00:18:48,960 --> 00:18:51,560
But I really wanted to write a book that

444
00:18:51,560 --> 00:18:52,880
focused on those first lessons.

445
00:18:52,880 --> 00:18:54,880
Because they are just so critical.

446
00:18:54,880 --> 00:18:57,280
And because most students will start

447
00:18:57,280 --> 00:18:59,360
between the ages of 6 to 10, I wanted

448
00:18:59,360 --> 00:19:02,280
a framework which would really suit that age category.

449
00:19:02,280 --> 00:19:06,720
And so, yeah, I really wanted to go back to the beginning

450
00:19:06,720 --> 00:19:09,240
and say, OK, how do we get this right?

451
00:19:09,240 --> 00:19:12,040
And you may have read in the book as well.

452
00:19:12,040 --> 00:19:15,280
In the first part, I also say really clearly

453
00:19:15,280 --> 00:19:16,840
what the goal of this is.

454
00:19:16,840 --> 00:19:18,840
What are the skills that we want students

455
00:19:18,840 --> 00:19:21,440
to have at the end of their first 10 weeks with us?

456
00:19:21,440 --> 00:19:23,480
And that's probably something that a lot of teachers

457
00:19:23,480 --> 00:19:24,520
don't think about.

458
00:19:24,520 --> 00:19:26,560
And so I challenge them in the book to think about it.

459
00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:28,520
There's a space in the book to write down,

460
00:19:28,520 --> 00:19:30,760
before you read my ones, what do you

461
00:19:30,760 --> 00:19:33,600
want your students to be able to do?

462
00:19:33,600 --> 00:19:35,720
And what do you want their mindset to be

463
00:19:35,720 --> 00:19:37,360
at the end of their first 10 lessons?

464
00:19:37,360 --> 00:19:38,920
Write them down.

465
00:19:38,920 --> 00:19:41,320
And listeners could pause this and do that right now.

466
00:19:41,320 --> 00:19:43,280
What would you write down?

467
00:19:43,280 --> 00:19:44,840
And then come and have a look at the book

468
00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:46,800
and see what my ones are, which is where

469
00:19:46,800 --> 00:19:48,920
this framework takes students.

470
00:19:48,920 --> 00:19:50,840
Because it's just so critical to get

471
00:19:50,840 --> 00:19:52,560
that right at the beginning.

472
00:19:52,560 --> 00:19:53,560
Yeah, absolutely.

473
00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:54,360
Yeah.

474
00:19:54,360 --> 00:19:57,960
So what does this book ultimately provide?

475
00:19:57,960 --> 00:19:59,040
Yeah.

476
00:19:59,040 --> 00:20:03,720
So teachers getting the book, the first half of the book

477
00:20:03,720 --> 00:20:08,160
is the background on how this came about

478
00:20:08,160 --> 00:20:10,760
and why you should consider whether this

479
00:20:10,760 --> 00:20:13,240
might be something that suits you and your teaching.

480
00:20:13,240 --> 00:20:15,320
So really, the goal was to make the case for it

481
00:20:15,320 --> 00:20:17,920
and also to explain to some extent how we got to where

482
00:20:17,920 --> 00:20:19,600
we are right now.

483
00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:22,240
And then the second part is the true framework,

484
00:20:22,240 --> 00:20:25,240
which is to say, I provide you in the book

485
00:20:25,240 --> 00:20:30,160
the first five weeks of this framework, dot by dot,

486
00:20:30,160 --> 00:20:31,280
step by step.

487
00:20:31,280 --> 00:20:32,480
Here's what to say.

488
00:20:32,480 --> 00:20:34,000
Here's what to do.

489
00:20:34,000 --> 00:20:37,400
Everything you need from that first lesson up to the fifth

490
00:20:37,400 --> 00:20:39,680
lesson is in the book given to you.

491
00:20:39,680 --> 00:20:42,360
And I give an overview of lesson six to 10.

492
00:20:42,360 --> 00:20:44,200
And we have a companion website where

493
00:20:44,200 --> 00:20:45,280
there's more information.

494
00:20:45,280 --> 00:20:48,280
So there's videos of me actually teaching all of these steps.

495
00:20:48,280 --> 00:20:52,240
There are backing tracks and accompaniment parts

496
00:20:52,240 --> 00:20:55,440
that teachers can play and practice instruction.

497
00:20:55,440 --> 00:20:58,200
So what does a student actually do week to week at home?

498
00:20:58,200 --> 00:20:59,480
So all of this is provided.

499
00:20:59,480 --> 00:21:01,000
That's what the framework gives you.

500
00:21:01,000 --> 00:21:02,360
And I call it that framework again

501
00:21:02,360 --> 00:21:06,040
because you can choose how long you want to try this out for.

502
00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:08,720
We have a lot of teachers who might just try it out

503
00:21:08,720 --> 00:21:12,560
with one student and commit, OK, I'm

504
00:21:12,560 --> 00:21:14,880
going to do three weeks to start or five weeks just

505
00:21:14,880 --> 00:21:15,600
with one student.

506
00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:17,440
And I'm going to try it out and see how it goes.

507
00:21:17,440 --> 00:21:19,040
And then very quickly, most of them

508
00:21:19,040 --> 00:21:20,600
will start integrating this and using it

509
00:21:20,600 --> 00:21:22,600
for the rest of their students as well.

510
00:21:22,600 --> 00:21:25,520
In your book, you mentioned your discovery

511
00:21:25,520 --> 00:21:30,000
of late Dr. Edwin Gordon's written presentation

512
00:21:30,000 --> 00:21:33,000
because I think he wasn't able to attend the presentation

513
00:21:33,000 --> 00:21:34,040
at the time of something.

514
00:21:34,040 --> 00:21:36,840
And then of course about music learning theory,

515
00:21:36,840 --> 00:21:39,520
which is his theory.

516
00:21:39,520 --> 00:21:44,280
And then I got to learn about MLT through podcasting.

517
00:21:44,280 --> 00:21:48,920
And then one of the MLT specialists, Christa Yajiro,

518
00:21:48,920 --> 00:21:49,840
I got to interview.

519
00:21:49,840 --> 00:21:54,480
And then that's when I actually learned about MLT.

520
00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:59,000
Before then, I never knew of this theory before.

521
00:21:59,000 --> 00:22:00,880
And you mentioned in the book, it

522
00:22:00,880 --> 00:22:03,840
says it affirmed everything I knew about the music teaching

523
00:22:03,840 --> 00:22:05,160
landscape.

524
00:22:05,160 --> 00:22:07,600
What does that mean?

525
00:22:07,600 --> 00:22:09,400
That's a great question.

526
00:22:09,400 --> 00:22:13,320
I think listening to this presentation,

527
00:22:13,320 --> 00:22:15,960
and we can go into what that means if you'd like,

528
00:22:15,960 --> 00:22:18,840
what the content of MLT is.

529
00:22:18,840 --> 00:22:24,560
But listening to it aligned with what I subconsciously knew.

530
00:22:24,560 --> 00:22:29,160
I knew the way I was teaching these first lessons

531
00:22:29,160 --> 00:22:31,880
and reading in particular, I knew there was something

532
00:22:31,880 --> 00:22:33,560
that we could do better.

533
00:22:33,560 --> 00:22:34,680
I just had a feeling.

534
00:22:34,680 --> 00:22:35,880
It's such a struggle.

535
00:22:35,880 --> 00:22:38,880
Music reading is a really complex brain activity,

536
00:22:38,880 --> 00:22:41,000
really complex.

537
00:22:41,000 --> 00:22:43,600
One hand alone, but add two hands and pedals.

538
00:22:43,600 --> 00:22:46,640
And oh my goodness, I don't know how any of us have ever learned it.

539
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:48,280
I mean, it's so difficult.

540
00:22:48,280 --> 00:22:50,920
But I felt when I was teaching students,

541
00:22:50,920 --> 00:22:54,440
it just seemed drudgery and hard work.

542
00:22:54,440 --> 00:22:56,960
And I'm like, why is this so difficult?

543
00:22:56,960 --> 00:22:59,120
And so that's what I meant by kind of affirmed.

544
00:22:59,120 --> 00:23:02,480
It affirmed in me that there was potentially something wrong

545
00:23:02,480 --> 00:23:03,920
with what we're doing, or something

546
00:23:03,920 --> 00:23:06,240
that could be improved about how most of us

547
00:23:06,240 --> 00:23:07,680
were teaching reading.

548
00:23:07,680 --> 00:23:11,280
And so when I heard about this language model of learning

549
00:23:11,280 --> 00:23:14,360
or sound before symbol, as some people call it,

550
00:23:14,360 --> 00:23:17,640
I'm like, ah, that makes sense.

551
00:23:17,640 --> 00:23:19,880
That makes so much sense.

552
00:23:19,880 --> 00:23:22,680
And that's when I started to go, all right,

553
00:23:22,680 --> 00:23:24,640
I think I can restructure what I'm

554
00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:27,240
doing with one of my students.

555
00:23:27,240 --> 00:23:29,200
And I think I talk in the book about Josh.

556
00:23:29,200 --> 00:23:31,040
I actually found a picture of Josh who

557
00:23:31,040 --> 00:23:35,040
was the first, the guinea pig student.

558
00:23:35,040 --> 00:23:37,240
And yeah, I talk in the book about the story

559
00:23:37,240 --> 00:23:41,520
of how I basically compiled everything

560
00:23:41,520 --> 00:23:46,200
I had learned over the preceding five years of blogging

561
00:23:46,200 --> 00:23:49,320
and interviewing and master classes and all of that stuff.

562
00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:50,640
I went on a true deep dive.

563
00:23:50,640 --> 00:23:53,480
I got so obsessed by piano teaching.

564
00:23:53,480 --> 00:23:56,040
I went to every single thing that I could possibly go to.

565
00:23:56,040 --> 00:23:56,680
I took notes.

566
00:23:56,680 --> 00:23:57,800
I read books.

567
00:23:57,800 --> 00:24:01,400
I learned about Suzuki and Orphan Del Crows and Alexander

568
00:24:01,400 --> 00:24:04,680
Technique and Kodai, all of these.

569
00:24:04,680 --> 00:24:05,560
I had experience.

570
00:24:05,560 --> 00:24:07,320
I went to courses.

571
00:24:07,320 --> 00:24:09,160
And then music learning theory came along.

572
00:24:09,160 --> 00:24:11,520
I'm like, aha, I think this is going to pull it all together.

573
00:24:11,520 --> 00:24:14,000
And that's kind of what it did.

574
00:24:14,000 --> 00:24:19,040
But specifically, what attracted you to me?

575
00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:23,840
Let's say I compare MLT learning a language.

576
00:24:23,840 --> 00:24:28,400
Let's say, honestly, obviously, English is my second language.

577
00:24:28,400 --> 00:24:32,480
And I didn't learn to speak till I came here as a college

578
00:24:32,480 --> 00:24:33,120
student.

579
00:24:33,120 --> 00:24:34,400
And I was already 20.

580
00:24:34,400 --> 00:24:36,160
Yeah, I was already 20 years old.

581
00:24:36,160 --> 00:24:40,560
And I aced everything in English classes in Japan.

582
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:41,800
I'm originally from Japan.

583
00:24:41,800 --> 00:24:42,320
I'm Korean.

584
00:24:42,320 --> 00:24:45,680
But then I got all A's.

585
00:24:45,680 --> 00:24:49,200
But I couldn't speak a word of English.

586
00:24:49,200 --> 00:24:50,080
What a shame.

587
00:24:50,080 --> 00:24:52,480
I was able to sort of read.

588
00:24:52,480 --> 00:24:54,880
I was able to sort of spell things.

589
00:24:54,880 --> 00:24:56,240
And then I got A's.

590
00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:59,840
And I was prepping to go to a really good school,

591
00:24:59,840 --> 00:25:01,600
a major in English language.

592
00:25:01,600 --> 00:25:04,800
But I struggled to speak.

593
00:25:04,800 --> 00:25:09,360
And I really wanted to say one sentence perfectly

594
00:25:09,360 --> 00:25:10,880
to express my feelings.

595
00:25:10,880 --> 00:25:14,360
But that didn't come till I came and jumped right

596
00:25:14,360 --> 00:25:17,520
into college classes as a college student.

597
00:25:17,520 --> 00:25:22,480
So then when I really learned about MLT, I was like, aha.

598
00:25:22,480 --> 00:25:27,800
So it made sense about music learning too.

599
00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:31,640
It's really not about learning to read the notes.

600
00:25:31,640 --> 00:25:35,440
Because these black dots just don't say anything much.

601
00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:39,920
Because it really depends on the context,

602
00:25:39,920 --> 00:25:44,920
if it's a triple clef, obviously this line, this dot changes.

603
00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:48,440
And if it's a base clef, obviously same note

604
00:25:48,440 --> 00:25:51,600
on the same line changes.

605
00:25:51,600 --> 00:25:52,560
It's so abstract.

606
00:25:52,560 --> 00:25:55,040
Yeah, I can imagine that once you

607
00:25:55,040 --> 00:25:57,480
are immersed in the language, that's

608
00:25:57,480 --> 00:26:00,160
when it starts to click and when you're starting to speak it.

609
00:26:00,160 --> 00:26:01,840
And for those listening, and perhaps

610
00:26:01,840 --> 00:26:04,960
have heard it on your previous episode with Krista,

611
00:26:04,960 --> 00:26:08,920
the simple premise is that we should

612
00:26:08,920 --> 00:26:12,040
match the way we teach reading to the way language

613
00:26:12,040 --> 00:26:13,680
is acquired by a child.

614
00:26:13,680 --> 00:26:16,960
Which is to say that the first thing they do is speak and make

615
00:26:16,960 --> 00:26:22,240
sounds and babble and what we'd call improvise on the piano

616
00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:24,120
or the instrument.

617
00:26:24,120 --> 00:26:27,320
And then they'll start to, well, hopefully get them listening.

618
00:26:27,320 --> 00:26:30,480
So audiation, so being able to hear music inside their head

619
00:26:30,480 --> 00:26:32,840
before it's, or without it being sounded out loud.

620
00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:35,960
But just being able to hear and understand

621
00:26:35,960 --> 00:26:37,680
before they get to reading.

622
00:26:37,680 --> 00:26:39,800
And where do method books start?

623
00:26:39,800 --> 00:26:42,880
They start that process at step four, reading.

624
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:44,920
The only other step after that's writing.

625
00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:50,280
But all of that beautiful immersion has been missed.

626
00:26:50,280 --> 00:26:53,120
And that's what the notebook beginner's approach

627
00:26:53,120 --> 00:26:53,960
is based around.

628
00:26:53,960 --> 00:26:56,680
So I took these concepts and went, OK, well,

629
00:26:56,680 --> 00:27:00,640
how do we get to this desired goal in 10 weeks time?

630
00:27:00,640 --> 00:27:02,040
All right, let's start.

631
00:27:02,040 --> 00:27:03,440
Let's look at these activities.

632
00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:05,720
OK, so we can do some pitch matching

633
00:27:05,720 --> 00:27:07,760
where we play on the piano and they have to hum it.

634
00:27:07,760 --> 00:27:09,440
Or they hum it and they have to find it on the piano.

635
00:27:09,440 --> 00:27:12,040
Simple activity, something that's rarely missed.

636
00:27:12,040 --> 00:27:13,680
Lots of singing.

637
00:27:13,680 --> 00:27:17,400
Singing is so, so important for musicality generally.

638
00:27:17,400 --> 00:27:20,080
And regardless of your instrument.

639
00:27:20,080 --> 00:27:24,080
And most piano students are not encouraged to sing.

640
00:27:24,080 --> 00:27:28,000
In fact, they're almost discouraged from singing.

641
00:27:28,000 --> 00:27:31,400
And it's such a skill, it's such a helpful skill

642
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:33,960
for phrasing down the track, for being able to play by ear,

643
00:27:33,960 --> 00:27:36,320
being able to sing what you hear before you can play it.

644
00:27:36,320 --> 00:27:37,960
All of those things.

645
00:27:37,960 --> 00:27:42,800
So I am so passionate that we normalize singing

646
00:27:42,800 --> 00:27:43,800
from the start.

647
00:27:43,800 --> 00:27:47,960
First lesson, let's sing as a natural part of music making.

648
00:27:47,960 --> 00:27:51,360
And of course, Suzuki does this and Orf does it.

649
00:27:51,360 --> 00:27:52,240
Kadaya does it.

650
00:27:52,240 --> 00:27:53,760
There's chanting, there's tapping,

651
00:27:53,760 --> 00:27:55,360
there's singing all the time.

652
00:27:55,360 --> 00:28:00,320
Body movement, so feeling the music in your whole body

653
00:28:00,320 --> 00:28:01,360
and in your voice.

654
00:28:01,360 --> 00:28:05,320
Even just speaking rhythms, which is an Orf technique.

655
00:28:05,320 --> 00:28:11,320
All of these things are just fundamental and so, so helpful

656
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:13,480
for the future development of the musician.

657
00:28:13,480 --> 00:28:16,280
And that's why I brought it into these first few lessons.

658
00:28:16,280 --> 00:28:20,000
Now, what do you think about music learning theory?

659
00:28:20,000 --> 00:28:26,040
So I got to listen to several podcasts about MLT.

660
00:28:26,040 --> 00:28:30,920
And I read some books about MLT.

661
00:28:30,920 --> 00:28:35,920
And then you talk about in your book, one author, Paul G.

662
00:28:35,920 --> 00:28:43,200
Woodford, he says, Gordon's system is too prescriptive

663
00:28:43,200 --> 00:28:46,640
and proscriptive.

664
00:28:46,640 --> 00:28:48,760
Yeah, it was just interesting as I

665
00:28:48,760 --> 00:28:51,400
was doing my research for the book,

666
00:28:51,400 --> 00:28:53,800
I wanted to try and give both sides of the story.

667
00:28:53,800 --> 00:28:58,120
And I like the concept behind music learning theory,

668
00:28:58,120 --> 00:29:03,200
but the implementation of it was much harder

669
00:29:03,200 --> 00:29:04,200
to get my head around.

670
00:29:04,200 --> 00:29:06,560
So I found very quickly music moves

671
00:29:06,560 --> 00:29:12,480
for piano, which is the method created by Marilyn Lowe

672
00:29:12,480 --> 00:29:13,640
based on music learning theory.

673
00:29:13,640 --> 00:29:17,440
And I tried desperately to use this,

674
00:29:17,440 --> 00:29:18,960
but it was a step too far.

675
00:29:18,960 --> 00:29:20,240
It was too hard.

676
00:29:20,240 --> 00:29:23,400
It was too different to how I'd been teaching

677
00:29:23,400 --> 00:29:24,800
for me to understand.

678
00:29:24,800 --> 00:29:25,960
I tried so hard.

679
00:29:25,960 --> 00:29:26,520
Oh, my goodness.

680
00:29:26,520 --> 00:29:29,480
I interviewed her, other people.

681
00:29:29,480 --> 00:29:30,320
I practiced.

682
00:29:30,320 --> 00:29:34,320
I got all the books and the DVDs and the backing tracks,

683
00:29:34,320 --> 00:29:35,320
all that stuff.

684
00:29:35,320 --> 00:29:37,960
It was just a bit too hard.

685
00:29:37,960 --> 00:29:39,480
And then as I was researching, I did

686
00:29:39,480 --> 00:29:43,200
find that quote from Paul Woodford

687
00:29:43,200 --> 00:29:44,960
that it's almost too prescriptive.

688
00:29:44,960 --> 00:29:49,360
It's too proscriptive, which is why I've taken the concept,

689
00:29:49,360 --> 00:29:51,160
let's use the language acquisition model

690
00:29:51,160 --> 00:29:55,880
to teach reading, rather than the because he outlines

691
00:29:55,880 --> 00:30:01,160
in as much depth as you want to go to, to the nth degree

692
00:30:01,160 --> 00:30:04,240
about how you should go about teaching the language

693
00:30:04,240 --> 00:30:06,760
acquisition model, down to tonal centers,

694
00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:08,680
the syllables you use, all of this.

695
00:30:08,680 --> 00:30:11,840
And if you're happy with that and you can do it, fantastic.

696
00:30:11,840 --> 00:30:13,280
I'm not disparaging at all.

697
00:30:13,280 --> 00:30:15,920
It's great if you can do it.

698
00:30:15,920 --> 00:30:19,400
It just didn't work for me.

699
00:30:19,400 --> 00:30:21,000
And I knew that if it didn't work for me,

700
00:30:21,000 --> 00:30:23,760
it probably would be a step too far for a lot of other teachers

701
00:30:23,760 --> 00:30:25,640
as well, which is why I thought, I'm

702
00:30:25,640 --> 00:30:26,920
going to use the concepts.

703
00:30:26,920 --> 00:30:30,080
And I'm going to put all of those other approaches,

704
00:30:30,080 --> 00:30:33,200
the Suzuki's and Kada's and things, in a melting pot.

705
00:30:33,200 --> 00:30:35,600
And I'm going to come up with something that I think,

706
00:30:35,600 --> 00:30:37,760
having worked with teachers for a long time,

707
00:30:37,760 --> 00:30:41,440
that they can understand and feel confident using.

708
00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:43,600
Because there's no point having a theory

709
00:30:43,600 --> 00:30:46,440
if the practice of it is too hard to understand.

710
00:30:46,440 --> 00:30:50,360
Yeah, I don't oppose to MLT at all.

711
00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:52,440
I love the concept of it.

712
00:30:52,440 --> 00:30:58,640
But do I want to go back from scratch and learn to teach?

713
00:30:58,640 --> 00:31:00,480
I am getting older.

714
00:31:00,480 --> 00:31:02,920
It's a big ask.

715
00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:05,560
Yeah, I don't know if I want to do that.

716
00:31:05,560 --> 00:31:07,800
So that's the struggle, one thing I had.

717
00:31:07,800 --> 00:31:10,440
And then to me, it was very specific,

718
00:31:10,440 --> 00:31:12,880
as you said, the method.

719
00:31:12,880 --> 00:31:16,160
So I got lost in the middle.

720
00:31:16,160 --> 00:31:20,880
So I felt like I may have to go back to college

721
00:31:20,880 --> 00:31:23,280
and get a degree in MLT or something.

722
00:31:23,280 --> 00:31:25,240
Otherwise, I don't think I can catch up.

723
00:31:25,240 --> 00:31:26,920
And I listened to some of the podcasts.

724
00:31:26,920 --> 00:31:29,800
And they were saying, do they do, do they, do they?

725
00:31:29,800 --> 00:31:30,800
Yes.

726
00:31:30,800 --> 00:31:32,080
Yeah.

727
00:31:32,080 --> 00:31:34,040
Yeah, and you've hit the nail on the head.

728
00:31:34,040 --> 00:31:35,960
I was hearing that from other teachers as well,

729
00:31:35,960 --> 00:31:38,240
lots of other teachers who were listening to my podcast

730
00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:39,560
about, because I got all excited.

731
00:31:39,560 --> 00:31:41,760
So I'm like, OK, I'm going to interview everyone about MLT

732
00:31:41,760 --> 00:31:43,560
and see what I can learn, which is probably

733
00:31:43,560 --> 00:31:45,840
what you enjoy doing as well about podcasting.

734
00:31:45,840 --> 00:31:49,280
And I just kept hearing from teachers,

735
00:31:49,280 --> 00:31:52,560
it's just there's something about it.

736
00:31:52,560 --> 00:31:54,440
Like you said, it's a step too far.

737
00:31:54,440 --> 00:31:55,320
It's a bit too hard.

738
00:31:55,320 --> 00:31:57,000
I don't quite get it.

739
00:31:57,000 --> 00:31:59,120
And Krista's been creating courses

740
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:02,880
about it, which is great, so helpful.

741
00:32:02,880 --> 00:32:04,440
So yeah, I agree.

742
00:32:04,440 --> 00:32:05,720
I think the concepts are great.

743
00:32:05,720 --> 00:32:08,360
And if it resonates with you and it feels authentic,

744
00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:11,640
which is super critical for any teaching approach you use,

745
00:32:11,640 --> 00:32:12,680
does it feel authentic?

746
00:32:12,680 --> 00:32:14,440
Because students will know instantly

747
00:32:14,440 --> 00:32:16,040
if it's inauthentic.

748
00:32:16,040 --> 00:32:18,360
If it's authentic for you, and you understand it,

749
00:32:18,360 --> 00:32:20,440
and you like it, and you're getting good results,

750
00:32:20,440 --> 00:32:23,560
then fantastic, go for it.

751
00:32:23,560 --> 00:32:26,200
As much as I have advanced students who perform Carnegie,

752
00:32:26,200 --> 00:32:29,560
but then I have little kiddos too, like six-year-old,

753
00:32:29,560 --> 00:32:30,280
so cute.

754
00:32:30,280 --> 00:32:34,040
And then it's like brand new student.

755
00:32:34,040 --> 00:32:36,800
It's just starting from scratch.

756
00:32:36,800 --> 00:32:41,920
So it's really my responsibility to expose them

757
00:32:41,920 --> 00:32:46,840
to good musical habit, to everything.

758
00:32:46,840 --> 00:32:51,760
I also don't like so much starting from reading notes,

759
00:32:51,760 --> 00:32:53,720
opening the first page.

760
00:32:53,720 --> 00:32:56,880
Of course, I cover the basics, how to sit,

761
00:32:56,880 --> 00:33:02,560
how to form a good way to play the piano, and so forth.

762
00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:03,840
But where do I start?

763
00:33:03,840 --> 00:33:05,440
So that's the question.

764
00:33:05,440 --> 00:33:10,320
So although I can teach them playing by ear,

765
00:33:10,320 --> 00:33:14,000
I can use the lead sheet eventually,

766
00:33:14,000 --> 00:33:15,280
and I teach them chords.

767
00:33:15,280 --> 00:33:17,120
But they're not there yet.

768
00:33:17,120 --> 00:33:20,480
And that's exactly why I've put this together.

769
00:33:20,480 --> 00:33:23,760
And I also hear from teachers that there

770
00:33:23,760 --> 00:33:27,280
is an overwhelm of information coming at them

771
00:33:27,280 --> 00:33:29,240
about all the different things that they can do.

772
00:33:29,240 --> 00:33:31,520
And in some ways, that's great, because 20 years ago,

773
00:33:31,520 --> 00:33:34,880
there wasn't much about creativity in music education.

774
00:33:34,880 --> 00:33:36,920
Now there's almost too much.

775
00:33:36,920 --> 00:33:40,240
And in fact, one of the things that teachers

776
00:33:40,240 --> 00:33:43,280
have loved best about the book are the self-assessments.

777
00:33:43,280 --> 00:33:46,120
I'm not sure if you tried one of these out.

778
00:33:46,120 --> 00:33:48,360
Basically, you get to rank yourself.

779
00:33:48,360 --> 00:33:50,840
I give you about 20 check-in statements

780
00:33:50,840 --> 00:33:52,600
in three different assessments.

781
00:33:52,600 --> 00:33:54,680
And you rank yourself, yes, this applies to me,

782
00:33:54,680 --> 00:33:56,680
or no, this doesn't describe me.

783
00:33:56,680 --> 00:33:57,200
I saw it.

784
00:33:57,200 --> 00:33:58,280
And yeah.

785
00:33:58,280 --> 00:34:02,280
And one of them is about how student-centered

786
00:34:02,280 --> 00:34:04,200
is your teaching right now.

787
00:34:04,200 --> 00:34:07,840
Another one is just how creative are your beginner lessons.

788
00:34:07,840 --> 00:34:11,120
And you add up your total, and I put you

789
00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:13,440
into one of three buckets, and then explain what I think

790
00:34:13,440 --> 00:34:15,320
is happening and what you should do.

791
00:34:15,320 --> 00:34:18,600
And one of them for the first, how creative are your lessons,

792
00:34:18,600 --> 00:34:20,880
or what are your beginner lessons like,

793
00:34:20,880 --> 00:34:24,840
one of the last ones is, if you're in the last bucket,

794
00:34:24,840 --> 00:34:26,560
I tell you to watch out for shiny objects,

795
00:34:26,560 --> 00:34:28,680
because it's really easy.

796
00:34:28,680 --> 00:34:30,760
You're quite creative, probably, if you've

797
00:34:30,760 --> 00:34:32,520
ended up with this score.

798
00:34:32,520 --> 00:34:36,200
But the challenge is actually that you can be so enthusiastic

799
00:34:36,200 --> 00:34:38,080
and you want to learn and try new things,

800
00:34:38,080 --> 00:34:39,720
that you try too much, and you completely

801
00:34:39,720 --> 00:34:41,120
overwhelm your student.

802
00:34:41,120 --> 00:34:43,800
And as I describe in the book, that this actually happened

803
00:34:43,800 --> 00:34:46,200
to me, I almost lost an amazing student,

804
00:34:46,200 --> 00:34:48,720
because I was just trying to do too much.

805
00:34:48,720 --> 00:34:53,120
So I guess there's that balance that we try and find as teachers

806
00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:57,880
between keeping current and following the traditions at work

807
00:34:57,880 --> 00:35:00,200
without overwhelming students.

808
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:02,240
But it's really hard to do that without a structure.

809
00:35:02,240 --> 00:35:05,360
And again, that's what the book tries to do.

810
00:35:05,360 --> 00:35:08,280
Each lesson builds upon the learning of the one before.

811
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:10,680
We revisit things from the week before.

812
00:35:10,680 --> 00:35:14,520
So I hope that it helps teachers not have to worry so much,

813
00:35:14,520 --> 00:35:16,760
like you're doing.

814
00:35:16,760 --> 00:35:19,640
I know I should do this and that, and how do I structure it?

815
00:35:19,640 --> 00:35:20,400
Don't worry about it.

816
00:35:20,400 --> 00:35:22,320
I've done it for you.

817
00:35:22,320 --> 00:35:23,240
Oh, that's great.

818
00:35:23,240 --> 00:35:29,080
Also, I don't necessarily want to abandon the things

819
00:35:29,080 --> 00:35:30,200
that I already have.

820
00:35:30,200 --> 00:35:31,040
Does it make sense?

821
00:35:31,040 --> 00:35:36,000
As a teacher, I've been teaching over 20, 25 years.

822
00:35:36,000 --> 00:35:36,960
Oh my gosh.

823
00:35:36,960 --> 00:35:40,200
Then it's like, do I have to break all these things

824
00:35:40,200 --> 00:35:41,360
that I've developed?

825
00:35:41,360 --> 00:35:46,000
And then that's the impression I got from MLT.

826
00:35:46,000 --> 00:35:51,280
That's why I was a little bit depressed.

827
00:35:51,280 --> 00:35:54,120
I felt like all these years of blood and sweat.

828
00:35:54,120 --> 00:35:58,520
And I thought I did my research, I did my work,

829
00:35:58,520 --> 00:36:00,880
and then do I have to abandon everything

830
00:36:00,880 --> 00:36:02,440
and start from scratch?

831
00:36:02,440 --> 00:36:05,800
That is quite overwhelming and devastating.

832
00:36:05,800 --> 00:36:07,880
I did what I know the best.

833
00:36:07,880 --> 00:36:11,000
Yeah, yeah, and it's unnecessary, I really think.

834
00:36:11,000 --> 00:36:13,880
There's also, I interviewed the founder of Simply Music,

835
00:36:13,880 --> 00:36:16,960
which you may have heard of some time ago now.

836
00:36:16,960 --> 00:36:21,440
And that is a method, and it's a very structured method,

837
00:36:21,440 --> 00:36:22,840
and it's a licensed method.

838
00:36:22,840 --> 00:36:25,760
So it's really, if you choose to go down this route,

839
00:36:25,760 --> 00:36:27,960
then you are not to teach any other way.

840
00:36:27,960 --> 00:36:30,280
And so you learn a new approach.

841
00:36:30,280 --> 00:36:32,280
And again, that works for some teachers.

842
00:36:32,280 --> 00:36:33,160
That's fine.

843
00:36:33,160 --> 00:36:35,760
I didn't want to produce something like that, though,

844
00:36:35,760 --> 00:36:37,800
just as I didn't want to produce something that meant you

845
00:36:37,800 --> 00:36:39,520
had to revolutionize your teaching.

846
00:36:39,520 --> 00:36:41,760
So any of the activities in there,

847
00:36:41,760 --> 00:36:43,720
teachers wouldn't be like, what?

848
00:36:43,720 --> 00:36:46,000
I don't, what is that?

849
00:36:46,000 --> 00:36:48,640
What is this, these syllables, or what is the ideation,

850
00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:49,960
or whatever it is?

851
00:36:49,960 --> 00:36:53,360
It's all really doable stuff that any teacher

852
00:36:53,360 --> 00:36:56,480
can do without, again, revolutionizing or going back

853
00:36:56,480 --> 00:36:58,720
to basics.

854
00:36:58,720 --> 00:37:03,440
I really want to talk about you, your background and everything.

855
00:37:03,440 --> 00:37:05,800
But before that, do you have any other things

856
00:37:05,800 --> 00:37:08,840
that you want to talk about from your book?

857
00:37:08,840 --> 00:37:12,080
Well, I mentioned just two concerns

858
00:37:12,080 --> 00:37:14,520
I get from teachers, which I do speak to in the book.

859
00:37:14,520 --> 00:37:17,800
One is teachers that say, I can't do this.

860
00:37:17,800 --> 00:37:18,960
I'm not creative.

861
00:37:18,960 --> 00:37:20,800
And it's so sad to hear that.

862
00:37:20,800 --> 00:37:23,680
And there's a lot of teachers, maybe they don't say it,

863
00:37:23,680 --> 00:37:26,440
but perhaps some of you listening are thinking,

864
00:37:26,440 --> 00:37:28,160
I'm really, I'm just not creative.

865
00:37:28,160 --> 00:37:29,480
I was traditionally trained.

866
00:37:29,480 --> 00:37:32,760
I can teach beautifully how to phrase and pedal

867
00:37:32,760 --> 00:37:34,760
and play Bach and Beethoven.

868
00:37:34,760 --> 00:37:36,920
But I'm not creative.

869
00:37:36,920 --> 00:37:39,840
So there's no point trying.

870
00:37:39,840 --> 00:37:43,640
And I just want to speak to you guys and say, well,

871
00:37:43,640 --> 00:37:45,880
I believe that's rubbish, a lot of rubbish.

872
00:37:45,880 --> 00:37:50,200
You and everybody else out there can be creative, are creative.

873
00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:52,800
It's just a bit latent or dormant.

874
00:37:52,800 --> 00:37:56,200
You would have been, as a child, incredibly curious,

875
00:37:56,200 --> 00:37:59,240
full of imagination and creativity.

876
00:37:59,240 --> 00:38:02,360
And unfortunately, just as adults, particularly in music,

877
00:38:02,360 --> 00:38:04,360
we lose it over time.

878
00:38:04,360 --> 00:38:07,400
And I want to bring that back to you and prove to you

879
00:38:07,400 --> 00:38:09,520
and show you how you are creative.

880
00:38:09,520 --> 00:38:12,000
You are innately creative and can

881
00:38:12,000 --> 00:38:17,760
have such a large amount of fun doing these creative activities

882
00:38:17,760 --> 00:38:18,840
with students.

883
00:38:18,840 --> 00:38:20,760
And if you're not convinced, grab the book,

884
00:38:20,760 --> 00:38:23,960
because there are examples after examples of teachers

885
00:38:23,960 --> 00:38:25,680
who thought they weren't creative, who

886
00:38:25,680 --> 00:38:27,880
have used this approach, and then gone on

887
00:38:27,880 --> 00:38:29,400
to make it even more creative.

888
00:38:29,400 --> 00:38:32,160
So they've taken an animal improv story

889
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:34,720
or around the world improv activity,

890
00:38:34,720 --> 00:38:36,680
which is a multi-week program where

891
00:38:36,680 --> 00:38:38,680
they get a motif from different parts of the world

892
00:38:38,680 --> 00:38:40,240
and they create stories around it.

893
00:38:40,240 --> 00:38:42,880
And I've had teachers then go steps further

894
00:38:42,880 --> 00:38:46,400
to create videos around it or headdresses and outfits

895
00:38:46,400 --> 00:38:47,960
to go when they perform these things.

896
00:38:47,960 --> 00:38:52,480
I mean, it's a great, the book and the framework

897
00:38:52,480 --> 00:38:56,040
is a great spark for most teachers' creativity.

898
00:38:56,040 --> 00:38:59,640
I'll challenge you and say, I reckon

899
00:38:59,640 --> 00:39:03,640
you'd be hard pressed not to go, hmm, what if we did this?

900
00:39:03,640 --> 00:39:06,880
And go off on a little tangent, and that's great.

901
00:39:06,880 --> 00:39:10,720
The second concern is, what are parents going to think?

902
00:39:10,720 --> 00:39:12,840
Because so many parents have been brought up

903
00:39:12,840 --> 00:39:14,440
with this method book approach.

904
00:39:14,440 --> 00:39:16,000
So what am I going to say to them

905
00:39:16,000 --> 00:39:18,640
when they're not using a method book?

906
00:39:18,640 --> 00:39:20,720
How do I reach them?

907
00:39:20,720 --> 00:39:22,400
And so there's just one quote.

908
00:39:22,400 --> 00:39:26,680
I'll read a short quote in the book about this.

909
00:39:26,680 --> 00:39:30,600
When Elisa Milne, she's an Australian pedagogue,

910
00:39:30,600 --> 00:39:33,520
talks about this, just being modern and progressive

911
00:39:33,520 --> 00:39:35,400
and creative and imaginative in your teaching.

912
00:39:35,400 --> 00:39:37,480
And she says, if parents find this strange,

913
00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:40,040
tell them that it's much more important that you explore

914
00:39:40,040 --> 00:39:42,840
rhythm, pulse, creativity, and improvisation

915
00:39:42,840 --> 00:39:44,280
before they start reading.

916
00:39:44,280 --> 00:39:46,800
I've never had a parent anything but thrilled

917
00:39:46,800 --> 00:39:49,480
to see their child exploring lots of sounds on the piano,

918
00:39:49,480 --> 00:39:52,760
using all the keys and pedals, and having a ball.

919
00:39:52,760 --> 00:39:55,360
And in fact, there's another teacher I quote in here

920
00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:59,280
who says that the parents of the child she was teaching this

921
00:39:59,280 --> 00:40:01,840
to couldn't get the child off the piano

922
00:40:01,840 --> 00:40:03,400
because they were having so much fun.

923
00:40:03,400 --> 00:40:05,720
I mean, isn't that exactly what we want?

924
00:40:05,720 --> 00:40:06,360
Wow.

925
00:40:06,360 --> 00:40:08,480
Absolutely, absolutely.

926
00:40:08,480 --> 00:40:13,200
Now, it seems like you're really thoroughly researched

927
00:40:13,200 --> 00:40:14,120
and studied.

928
00:40:14,120 --> 00:40:18,200
And you invested your time and even money

929
00:40:18,200 --> 00:40:20,200
to books and courses.

930
00:40:20,200 --> 00:40:25,520
And so I would like to know your background.

931
00:40:25,520 --> 00:40:28,400
So how did you get to where you are?

932
00:40:28,400 --> 00:40:31,720
Well, it's a very roundabout story.

933
00:40:31,720 --> 00:40:37,480
I had a very not normal route through music education.

934
00:40:37,480 --> 00:40:39,720
And in fact, any of your listeners

935
00:40:39,720 --> 00:40:43,160
who are members of the MTNA in America,

936
00:40:43,160 --> 00:40:46,080
I was interviewed and featured in there

937
00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:49,280
about the upcoming conference coming up in March.

938
00:40:49,280 --> 00:40:52,320
And the title of it was something like sliding in

939
00:40:52,320 --> 00:40:55,280
through the side door, how Tim Topham came

940
00:40:55,280 --> 00:40:57,400
to be doing what he's doing, or something like that.

941
00:40:57,400 --> 00:40:59,160
And it's by my great friend Leela Vis, who's

942
00:40:59,160 --> 00:41:01,320
an amazing teacher in Colorado.

943
00:41:01,320 --> 00:41:03,160
And anyway, long story short, yeah,

944
00:41:03,160 --> 00:41:06,320
it was a very unusual sort of path.

945
00:41:06,320 --> 00:41:07,480
I studied music.

946
00:41:07,480 --> 00:41:09,840
I started learning piano at age eight

947
00:41:09,840 --> 00:41:11,880
with an amazing teacher called Miss Mack, who

948
00:41:11,880 --> 00:41:13,400
I speak about in a lot of my videos.

949
00:41:13,400 --> 00:41:15,640
She was an incredible influence on me.

950
00:41:15,640 --> 00:41:18,960
But drifted away very quickly from the traditional music.

951
00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:22,320
I did a couple of grades up to grade six.

952
00:41:22,320 --> 00:41:24,600
And then I went into jazz.

953
00:41:24,600 --> 00:41:28,720
And then I also did some study at school

954
00:41:28,720 --> 00:41:31,200
before I finished school.

955
00:41:31,200 --> 00:41:35,240
And then I went in a completely different direction.

956
00:41:35,240 --> 00:41:37,440
I wanted to be a classroom teacher,

957
00:41:37,440 --> 00:41:39,800
but I wanted to teach what we call over here

958
00:41:39,800 --> 00:41:41,040
outdoor education.

959
00:41:41,040 --> 00:41:44,120
So it's taking students away out of doors,

960
00:41:44,120 --> 00:41:48,520
outward bound, maybe more relevant term,

961
00:41:48,520 --> 00:41:51,600
where you're absolutely in climbing and canoeing

962
00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:53,760
and cooking and all those kinds of things in tents.

963
00:41:53,760 --> 00:41:55,640
And I just loved that.

964
00:41:55,640 --> 00:41:59,280
And that was what I did for the next six years or so

965
00:41:59,280 --> 00:42:00,320
of my life.

966
00:42:00,320 --> 00:42:02,400
That is super Australian.

967
00:42:02,400 --> 00:42:05,200
Sounds like that is awesome.

968
00:42:05,200 --> 00:42:07,080
It's part of the curriculum over here.

969
00:42:07,080 --> 00:42:08,240
It's a choice.

970
00:42:08,240 --> 00:42:08,960
Yeah, yeah.

971
00:42:08,960 --> 00:42:10,520
And all schools run camps.

972
00:42:10,520 --> 00:42:13,720
And I just thought it was a cool way to live my early 20s.

973
00:42:13,720 --> 00:42:15,400
Like, who would want to do that?

974
00:42:15,400 --> 00:42:16,640
I want to do it.

975
00:42:16,640 --> 00:42:17,280
Yeah.

976
00:42:17,280 --> 00:42:17,800
Yeah, right.

977
00:42:17,800 --> 00:42:19,960
So I did that for many years.

978
00:42:19,960 --> 00:42:22,640
All through that, I was always still playing piano,

979
00:42:22,640 --> 00:42:25,080
but I never taught it.

980
00:42:25,080 --> 00:42:28,480
But I would accompany musicals.

981
00:42:28,480 --> 00:42:30,040
I would conduct a few musicals.

982
00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:32,280
I would accompany singers who were friends.

983
00:42:32,280 --> 00:42:35,440
So I always kept in with the music side of things.

984
00:42:35,440 --> 00:42:37,440
Anyway, long story short, I kind of

985
00:42:37,440 --> 00:42:39,800
had enough of all of that out direct after, I don't know,

986
00:42:39,800 --> 00:42:41,320
six or seven years of it.

987
00:42:41,320 --> 00:42:42,520
I was getting old.

988
00:42:42,520 --> 00:42:44,040
And so I thought, right, I'm going

989
00:42:44,040 --> 00:42:47,160
to be a music producer, which meant for me

990
00:42:47,160 --> 00:42:50,160
becoming a DJ, effectively, making music that

991
00:42:50,160 --> 00:42:51,880
could be played in nightclubs.

992
00:42:51,880 --> 00:42:53,760
And I gave myself a year.

993
00:42:53,760 --> 00:42:54,920
Was it a year or three years?

994
00:42:54,920 --> 00:42:57,160
I can't remember now.

995
00:42:57,160 --> 00:42:59,480
But look, I couldn't make money from it.

996
00:42:59,480 --> 00:43:00,560
And so I started teaching.

997
00:43:00,560 --> 00:43:02,960
I thought, well, why don't I start teaching?

998
00:43:02,960 --> 00:43:07,080
And the teaching, I just became incredibly passionate about.

999
00:43:07,080 --> 00:43:07,840
I just loved it.

1000
00:43:07,840 --> 00:43:08,800
It was heaps of fun.

1001
00:43:08,800 --> 00:43:13,240
And then so I reconnected with Miss Mac, who had long retired,

1002
00:43:13,240 --> 00:43:15,000
but who was only too happy to help me.

1003
00:43:15,000 --> 00:43:18,400
And she mentored me for a year or two,

1004
00:43:18,400 --> 00:43:21,720
taught me everything she knew, gave me all her resources,

1005
00:43:21,720 --> 00:43:25,040
and gave me the confidence to go, all right,

1006
00:43:25,040 --> 00:43:27,560
I haven't been formally taught piano pedagogy.

1007
00:43:27,560 --> 00:43:30,440
I've been taught how to teach in a classroom setting.

1008
00:43:30,440 --> 00:43:32,640
I have a teaching degree, but not pedagogy.

1009
00:43:32,640 --> 00:43:34,200
But I'm going to go out there, and I'm

1010
00:43:34,200 --> 00:43:36,160
going to share what I know and what I've learned

1011
00:43:36,160 --> 00:43:36,880
with the world.

1012
00:43:36,880 --> 00:43:38,680
And I'm going to do things differently.

1013
00:43:38,680 --> 00:43:40,920
And that was how the blog began.

1014
00:43:40,920 --> 00:43:43,760
And I just kept, I just deep dived.

1015
00:43:43,760 --> 00:43:47,400
I just kept learning and learning and learning and sharing,

1016
00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:48,080
importantly.

1017
00:43:48,080 --> 00:43:49,920
I think that's, I mean, there's lots of people in the world who

1018
00:43:49,920 --> 00:43:51,560
go on deep dives into topics.

1019
00:43:51,560 --> 00:43:54,880
But I started sharing it on YouTube and on the blog.

1020
00:43:54,880 --> 00:43:57,560
Every book I read, I'd review it.

1021
00:43:57,560 --> 00:44:00,680
Every master class I went to, I'd talk about it.

1022
00:44:00,680 --> 00:44:04,080
And slowly that got traction from people.

1023
00:44:04,080 --> 00:44:08,160
And that's how Top Music came to be.

1024
00:44:08,160 --> 00:44:08,720
Great.

1025
00:44:08,720 --> 00:44:11,600
So we'll talk about Top Music Co.

1026
00:44:11,600 --> 00:44:14,040
So what is it?

1027
00:44:14,040 --> 00:44:16,000
Who is this for?

1028
00:44:16,000 --> 00:44:19,960
So Top Music Co. is for music teachers, predominantly piano

1029
00:44:19,960 --> 00:44:20,960
and guitar teachers.

1030
00:44:20,960 --> 00:44:24,320
But I hope we do serve teachers and will serve in the future

1031
00:44:24,320 --> 00:44:26,760
teachers of all instruments.

1032
00:44:26,760 --> 00:44:34,120
It's a place to go for community and content learning

1033
00:44:34,120 --> 00:44:39,560
and a place to, I guess, to have as a hub or a home.

1034
00:44:39,560 --> 00:44:41,760
That's what I want it to be.

1035
00:44:41,760 --> 00:44:44,800
Even for teachers, we have a membership site as well,

1036
00:44:44,800 --> 00:44:45,600
a paid membership.

1037
00:44:45,600 --> 00:44:49,040
So that's the core of our organization.

1038
00:44:49,040 --> 00:44:52,600
But for those who aren't in that, we have a YouTube channel,

1039
00:44:52,600 --> 00:44:54,560
lots on social media, and our blog,

1040
00:44:54,560 --> 00:44:58,640
which still gets many, many views and lots of downloads.

1041
00:44:58,640 --> 00:45:02,280
The amount of free things I've given away,

1042
00:45:02,280 --> 00:45:09,200
I mean, we have, I don't know, well over 100 free downloads.

1043
00:45:09,200 --> 00:45:12,840
How to teach modes, how to teach the blues, all of these things,

1044
00:45:12,840 --> 00:45:16,240
all over our website that people can find through Google.

1045
00:45:16,240 --> 00:45:20,080
And about 600 or 700 blog articles,

1046
00:45:20,080 --> 00:45:22,720
I did five, seven years of podcasting.

1047
00:45:22,720 --> 00:45:24,520
There's almost 400 episodes of podcasts.

1048
00:45:24,520 --> 00:45:29,920
So I've just wanted to give people, just give, give, give

1049
00:45:29,920 --> 00:45:30,880
content.

1050
00:45:30,880 --> 00:45:33,880
Because when I started teaching in school,

1051
00:45:33,880 --> 00:45:35,720
so soon after reconnecting with Ms. Mack,

1052
00:45:35,720 --> 00:45:37,760
I started teaching in schools.

1053
00:45:37,760 --> 00:45:39,560
That's not really done in America so much,

1054
00:45:39,560 --> 00:45:42,440
but students will come out of a lesson, like their math class,

1055
00:45:42,440 --> 00:45:44,440
and have a one-on-one piano lesson for 30 minutes,

1056
00:45:44,440 --> 00:45:45,480
and then go back to class.

1057
00:45:45,480 --> 00:45:47,240
And that happens in Australia.

1058
00:45:47,240 --> 00:45:49,440
That's the standard way, and in England,

1059
00:45:49,440 --> 00:45:51,680
for people to be taught.

1060
00:45:51,680 --> 00:45:53,960
So I started teaching in a school in that way.

1061
00:45:53,960 --> 00:45:57,520
And I would just get teachers knocking on my door going,

1062
00:45:57,520 --> 00:45:58,720
what are you, that is so cool.

1063
00:45:58,720 --> 00:45:59,280
What is that?

1064
00:45:59,280 --> 00:46:01,240
You've got to show me what you're doing.

1065
00:46:01,240 --> 00:46:02,880
And that's when I really started going,

1066
00:46:02,880 --> 00:46:04,960
hmm, OK, maybe there's something in this

1067
00:46:04,960 --> 00:46:06,720
that teachers aren't doing.

1068
00:46:06,720 --> 00:46:10,280
And my studio, the numbers at the school built,

1069
00:46:10,280 --> 00:46:12,680
I had to hire another teacher.

1070
00:46:12,680 --> 00:46:14,760
It just sort of confirmed with me

1071
00:46:14,760 --> 00:46:17,760
that there's a lot of need for information.

1072
00:46:17,760 --> 00:46:20,040
There's teachers out there who want to get better,

1073
00:46:20,040 --> 00:46:22,080
and they want to do things differently.

1074
00:46:22,080 --> 00:46:24,160
But it's really isolated, as we all know.

1075
00:46:24,160 --> 00:46:26,760
So hence, wanting to bring everybody

1076
00:46:26,760 --> 00:46:28,520
together in a community.

1077
00:46:28,520 --> 00:46:32,040
Wow, I'm impressed, really.

1078
00:46:32,040 --> 00:46:36,200
And what a resourceful person you are.

1079
00:46:36,200 --> 00:46:39,800
With all, I think it comes down to your curiosity, right?

1080
00:46:39,800 --> 00:46:44,720
Yeah, I'm just as curious about business and marketing,

1081
00:46:44,720 --> 00:46:46,720
and how do I attract teachers?

1082
00:46:46,720 --> 00:46:47,960
How do I get in front of them?

1083
00:46:47,960 --> 00:46:49,200
How do I help them?

1084
00:46:49,200 --> 00:46:52,800
As for helping my students and developing

1085
00:46:52,800 --> 00:46:54,600
these resources for teaching.

1086
00:46:54,600 --> 00:46:57,080
So yeah, I am a very curious person.

1087
00:46:57,080 --> 00:46:59,680
I am quite entrepreneurial.

1088
00:46:59,680 --> 00:47:04,240
I like asking questions, solving problems, connecting,

1089
00:47:04,240 --> 00:47:06,040
networking, all of that stuff.

1090
00:47:06,040 --> 00:47:09,840
So yes, that's always been part of my DNA, I think.

1091
00:47:09,840 --> 00:47:10,520
Wonderful.

1092
00:47:10,520 --> 00:47:15,360
Now, so then your company offers a membership site,

1093
00:47:15,360 --> 00:47:19,320
and also a course as well?

1094
00:47:19,320 --> 00:47:21,160
Yeah, over 50 courses, actually.

1095
00:47:21,160 --> 00:47:23,760
So it all started with one course.

1096
00:47:23,760 --> 00:47:28,880
So I mentioned earlier, I was building up content.

1097
00:47:28,880 --> 00:47:31,320
I was just sharing content, and I was collecting people's email

1098
00:47:31,320 --> 00:47:32,600
addresses.

1099
00:47:32,600 --> 00:47:35,680
And I eventually emailed all these people,

1100
00:47:35,680 --> 00:47:39,720
and I think there's maybe 1,000, between 1,000 and 2,000 people

1101
00:47:39,720 --> 00:47:40,760
on the list at that stage.

1102
00:47:40,760 --> 00:47:43,240
And I said, you're following what I do.

1103
00:47:43,240 --> 00:47:44,640
What would you like me to create?

1104
00:47:44,640 --> 00:47:47,040
What is your biggest problem?

1105
00:47:47,040 --> 00:47:51,040
And the biggest number one pain point

1106
00:47:51,040 --> 00:47:54,360
was how to teach a student a pop song.

1107
00:47:54,360 --> 00:47:57,560
Because no one teaches that in pedagogy school,

1108
00:47:57,560 --> 00:47:59,680
if anyone even goes to pedagogy school.

1109
00:47:59,680 --> 00:48:01,400
No one knows how to do that.

1110
00:48:01,400 --> 00:48:03,680
And there are some tricks to it.

1111
00:48:03,680 --> 00:48:07,040
Because teaching it by notation is more often

1112
00:48:07,040 --> 00:48:09,720
than not impossible, but also frustrating,

1113
00:48:09,720 --> 00:48:10,960
but also not very musical.

1114
00:48:10,960 --> 00:48:13,000
There's so much more you can learn by teaching it

1115
00:48:13,000 --> 00:48:13,800
through the courts.

1116
00:48:13,800 --> 00:48:16,760
So I put together a course at the end of 2014

1117
00:48:16,760 --> 00:48:18,560
on that to answer that question, because I

1118
00:48:18,560 --> 00:48:20,520
knew it was a burning issue.

1119
00:48:20,520 --> 00:48:24,200
That led to the start of the membership,

1120
00:48:24,200 --> 00:48:26,200
because I started after I released that course,

1121
00:48:26,200 --> 00:48:27,080
and I did very well.

1122
00:48:27,080 --> 00:48:29,520
I started getting lots of questions from teachers going,

1123
00:48:29,520 --> 00:48:30,760
oh, how do I do this?

1124
00:48:30,760 --> 00:48:32,120
Or what did you mean by that?

1125
00:48:32,120 --> 00:48:35,680
I'm like, I can't keep up with all these one-on-one emails.

1126
00:48:35,680 --> 00:48:37,800
So how about I build a community,

1127
00:48:37,800 --> 00:48:40,520
and everyone post your things to the group

1128
00:48:40,520 --> 00:48:42,680
so that I can share with everybody?

1129
00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:46,160
And then that developed into, well, I should probably,

1130
00:48:46,160 --> 00:48:47,680
what course should we do next?

1131
00:48:47,680 --> 00:48:49,120
And that has just built over time.

1132
00:48:49,120 --> 00:48:51,640
And now there's courses from lots of other specialists,

1133
00:48:51,640 --> 00:48:52,600
not just me.

1134
00:48:52,600 --> 00:48:54,120
Wow, that's incredible.

1135
00:48:54,120 --> 00:48:59,600
I tried, but building a course is maybe it's not my thing.

1136
00:48:59,600 --> 00:49:00,120
It's hard.

1137
00:49:00,120 --> 00:49:01,520
Not for the faint of heart.

1138
00:49:01,520 --> 00:49:02,840
Yeah, I know.

1139
00:49:02,840 --> 00:49:03,640
It's hard.

1140
00:49:03,640 --> 00:49:07,040
Anyway, through your community, what's the common struggle

1141
00:49:07,040 --> 00:49:10,040
you see from your members?

1142
00:49:10,040 --> 00:49:11,080
That's a good question.

1143
00:49:11,080 --> 00:49:13,440
So people come in.

1144
00:49:13,440 --> 00:49:15,800
One of the challenges we have in serving our members

1145
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:19,040
is that they all come in with different challenges

1146
00:49:19,040 --> 00:49:23,400
and different goals and different approaches

1147
00:49:23,400 --> 00:49:25,000
and different everything.

1148
00:49:25,000 --> 00:49:28,680
So to pull on a couple of common threads,

1149
00:49:28,680 --> 00:49:30,920
I would say isolation is a big one.

1150
00:49:30,920 --> 00:49:34,480
So a lot of our teachers come for the community aspect,

1151
00:49:34,480 --> 00:49:37,440
just having a place that's a hub and a home where they can ask

1152
00:49:37,440 --> 00:49:40,840
questions without fear of reprimand,

1153
00:49:40,840 --> 00:49:44,280
which does happen in Facebook groups, sadly.

1154
00:49:44,280 --> 00:49:49,800
Get support, be looked after, and also in that space

1155
00:49:49,800 --> 00:49:52,600
be able to find ideas, fresh ideas.

1156
00:49:52,600 --> 00:49:57,480
So I think a lot of teachers, they know perhaps,

1157
00:49:57,480 --> 00:49:59,640
and I've heard from them in testimonials

1158
00:49:59,640 --> 00:50:02,560
before, they've said, look, I was just close to quitting.

1159
00:50:02,560 --> 00:50:03,240
I'm just bored.

1160
00:50:03,240 --> 00:50:05,080
I'm burned out, and I was bored.

1161
00:50:05,080 --> 00:50:08,040
And we came in, and my eyes were opened.

1162
00:50:08,040 --> 00:50:10,240
And I'm like, oh my goodness, I could do that?

1163
00:50:10,240 --> 00:50:11,960
Oh, OK, I'm going to go and try that.

1164
00:50:11,960 --> 00:50:13,440
I didn't know that was allowed.

1165
00:50:13,440 --> 00:50:16,800
Giving them almost confidence, yeah, definitely confidence,

1166
00:50:16,800 --> 00:50:19,560
that they not only can do something fresh and new,

1167
00:50:19,560 --> 00:50:21,680
but that it's OK to do that.

1168
00:50:21,680 --> 00:50:23,080
You're not breaking any rules.

1169
00:50:23,080 --> 00:50:24,280
You're not upsetting anybody.

1170
00:50:24,280 --> 00:50:25,320
It's OK.

1171
00:50:25,320 --> 00:50:28,360
And people do say, oh, I've found my group.

1172
00:50:28,360 --> 00:50:30,000
I finally feel like I've found my group,

1173
00:50:30,000 --> 00:50:33,280
because you're making me feel like it's OK that I do things

1174
00:50:33,280 --> 00:50:36,360
a little bit differently to the traditions and the norms.

1175
00:50:36,360 --> 00:50:43,680
So yeah, it is hard to find one or two really strong threads

1176
00:50:43,680 --> 00:50:46,760
that go through everybody, because so many people come

1177
00:50:46,760 --> 00:50:48,960
in at different stages in their career.

1178
00:50:48,960 --> 00:50:51,880
Some want to build a big studio and hire 10 teachers

1179
00:50:51,880 --> 00:50:52,960
and have 1,500 students.

1180
00:50:52,960 --> 00:50:55,640
Others want five students, and they're really happy doing that

1181
00:50:55,640 --> 00:50:56,480
as just a hobby.

1182
00:50:56,480 --> 00:51:00,320
So yeah, we try and cater for everybody.

1183
00:51:00,320 --> 00:51:04,240
What are the trends you see or hope to see in piano teaching?

1184
00:51:04,240 --> 00:51:09,600
Trends, OK, so I think we are seeing a trend,

1185
00:51:09,600 --> 00:51:14,240
the creativity, the adding creative aspects to lessons.

1186
00:51:14,240 --> 00:51:17,160
And that could be anything from doing some improvising

1187
00:51:17,160 --> 00:51:21,800
to helping students write a song to taking out

1188
00:51:21,800 --> 00:51:24,080
the left hand of a piece and playing chords instead,

1189
00:51:24,080 --> 00:51:25,400
to any of those aspects.

1190
00:51:25,400 --> 00:51:27,600
I call it all that being creative.

1191
00:51:27,600 --> 00:51:30,880
We have seen, since I first spoke at a conference, which

1192
00:51:30,880 --> 00:51:34,800
was 2015, which is when I heard the MLT speech,

1193
00:51:34,800 --> 00:51:40,920
we've seen a huge shift towards people and organizations

1194
00:51:40,920 --> 00:51:44,360
embracing creativity and the explosion in podcasts and blogs

1195
00:51:44,360 --> 00:51:46,120
and people creating resources around this.

1196
00:51:46,120 --> 00:51:50,560
So that is a trend that I'm super delighted

1197
00:51:50,560 --> 00:51:54,120
that is happening, because I really

1198
00:51:54,120 --> 00:51:58,240
do believe that only good will come from being more flexible

1199
00:51:58,240 --> 00:52:02,040
and adding more creativity into music lessons.

1200
00:52:02,040 --> 00:52:03,440
So that's been a great trend.

1201
00:52:03,440 --> 00:52:05,800
There's definitely a trend towards group teaching.

1202
00:52:05,800 --> 00:52:08,200
I don't know if you've seen that as well or in people

1203
00:52:08,200 --> 00:52:12,000
that you've interviewed.

1204
00:52:12,000 --> 00:52:14,240
There's now quite a few different conferences

1205
00:52:14,240 --> 00:52:18,560
based online and in person based around group teaching.

1206
00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:21,600
And there's a lot of teachers who I think

1207
00:52:21,600 --> 00:52:23,320
are looking at this for two reasons.

1208
00:52:23,320 --> 00:52:24,720
One is because I think we mentioned

1209
00:52:24,720 --> 00:52:28,320
that before that social aspect of student learning

1210
00:52:28,320 --> 00:52:29,840
is so important.

1211
00:52:29,840 --> 00:52:32,360
And group teaching is a great way to do that.

1212
00:52:32,360 --> 00:52:34,760
Secondly, income.

1213
00:52:34,760 --> 00:52:38,240
So when I created Top Music Pro, I

1214
00:52:38,240 --> 00:52:40,640
didn't want it to just be a pedagogy resource.

1215
00:52:40,640 --> 00:52:42,200
It is pedagogy and business.

1216
00:52:42,200 --> 00:52:44,040
And we have always included resources

1217
00:52:44,040 --> 00:52:46,560
on both those topics, because ultimately, if you're not

1218
00:52:46,560 --> 00:52:48,560
running a sustainable business, you're not

1219
00:52:48,560 --> 00:52:49,640
going to do this for very long.

1220
00:52:49,640 --> 00:52:51,240
And you'll burn out and you will quit.

1221
00:52:51,240 --> 00:52:53,360
And then we've lost all of that great goodwill

1222
00:52:53,360 --> 00:52:54,360
with all your students.

1223
00:52:54,360 --> 00:52:59,040
So we want to support teachers to run a business better,

1224
00:52:59,040 --> 00:53:00,720
to have enough students.

1225
00:53:00,720 --> 00:53:04,040
And group teaching is an option for that.

1226
00:53:04,040 --> 00:53:07,960
And even if it's just two people with a 15 minute crossover

1227
00:53:07,960 --> 00:53:11,080
having 45 minute lessons with 15 minutes shared,

1228
00:53:11,080 --> 00:53:13,480
there's so many different ways that you

1229
00:53:13,480 --> 00:53:15,440
can structure group lessons.

1230
00:53:15,440 --> 00:53:18,080
So if you're kind of new to this approach,

1231
00:53:18,080 --> 00:53:20,080
when I say group teaching, don't necessarily

1232
00:53:20,080 --> 00:53:22,560
picture a room with eight students all at keyboards.

1233
00:53:22,560 --> 00:53:26,320
It can be three students with different variations

1234
00:53:26,320 --> 00:53:26,920
of overlapping.

1235
00:53:26,920 --> 00:53:30,480
It could be buddies, so two people at once.

1236
00:53:30,480 --> 00:53:32,160
Or it could be a classroom of eight people.

1237
00:53:32,160 --> 00:53:34,160
And there's plenty of people in Australia,

1238
00:53:34,160 --> 00:53:36,440
and I know Texas is really strong on this as well,

1239
00:53:36,440 --> 00:53:37,880
who do that.

1240
00:53:37,880 --> 00:53:41,280
So that's definitely a trend that I'm seeing at the moment.

1241
00:53:41,280 --> 00:53:45,080
And I think for teachers who are keen on it and happy to do it

1242
00:53:45,080 --> 00:53:47,160
and it works for them, I think that's fantastic.

1243
00:53:47,160 --> 00:53:49,960
And it definitely does have a positive impact

1244
00:53:49,960 --> 00:53:53,000
on income if you'd like to go down that route.

1245
00:53:53,000 --> 00:53:54,640
So those two trends anyway.

1246
00:53:54,640 --> 00:53:55,600
Wow.

1247
00:53:55,600 --> 00:53:57,160
Now, I'm sold.

1248
00:53:57,160 --> 00:54:02,560
So help me sign up for whatever you offer.

1249
00:54:02,560 --> 00:54:07,400
So where's a great way to start a person like me who's

1250
00:54:07,400 --> 00:54:10,280
been teaching for 20, 25 years or so,

1251
00:54:10,280 --> 00:54:14,920
and then maybe want to belong to the community

1252
00:54:14,920 --> 00:54:19,080
or maybe want to follow some of the blog posts you do?

1253
00:54:19,080 --> 00:54:20,640
What's the best spot?

1254
00:54:20,640 --> 00:54:24,600
Well, we're kind of on just about any platform

1255
00:54:24,600 --> 00:54:26,160
that you might want to hang out on.

1256
00:54:26,160 --> 00:54:27,880
So if you're a Facebook kind of person,

1257
00:54:27,880 --> 00:54:29,760
then search for Top Music Co.

1258
00:54:29,760 --> 00:54:30,800
Find our group.

1259
00:54:30,800 --> 00:54:33,280
We've got a group called Teachers of Beginner

1260
00:54:33,280 --> 00:54:35,800
and Intermediate Students or something.

1261
00:54:35,800 --> 00:54:39,400
We do link that from our website if I got that wrong.

1262
00:54:39,400 --> 00:54:42,320
So if you'd like that, yes, come and do that.

1263
00:54:42,320 --> 00:54:46,120
If you want to just check out the blog, go to topmusic.co.

1264
00:54:46,120 --> 00:54:49,760
Up the top, there's a number of menus.

1265
00:54:49,760 --> 00:54:52,480
And you can choose to learn and have a look through our blog

1266
00:54:52,480 --> 00:54:54,560
articles, or you can search for something.

1267
00:54:54,560 --> 00:54:59,520
Or if you have a particular question or concern

1268
00:54:59,520 --> 00:55:03,640
or something, then just Google that question

1269
00:55:03,640 --> 00:55:05,840
with Top Music in the search.

1270
00:55:05,840 --> 00:55:07,760
And you'll find whatever we might have on it.

1271
00:55:07,760 --> 00:55:10,600
So maybe you're like, how do I teach a pop song?

1272
00:55:10,600 --> 00:55:14,720
Or how do I get group teaching started?

1273
00:55:14,720 --> 00:55:19,240
Or how do I best teach beginners?

1274
00:55:19,240 --> 00:55:19,960
Whatever it is.

1275
00:55:19,960 --> 00:55:23,560
And it'll lead you to any number of downloads.

1276
00:55:23,560 --> 00:55:26,280
And yeah, jump on our email list.

1277
00:55:26,280 --> 00:55:28,240
If you download something and put your email in,

1278
00:55:28,240 --> 00:55:29,840
you'll be on our email list.

1279
00:55:29,840 --> 00:55:31,560
And we keep up to date with our people

1280
00:55:31,560 --> 00:55:34,720
every week with what's new, what's happening,

1281
00:55:34,720 --> 00:55:38,640
any sort of trends, as you say, and upcoming webinars

1282
00:55:38,640 --> 00:55:39,240
that we've got.

1283
00:55:39,240 --> 00:55:41,760
So we try and do training, free training webinars

1284
00:55:41,760 --> 00:55:44,000
every month or so.

1285
00:55:44,000 --> 00:55:47,880
We're releasing a course this month in February,

1286
00:55:47,880 --> 00:55:50,600
all about teaching neurodivergent students.

1287
00:55:50,600 --> 00:55:53,040
So we've had a course already on this for some time.

1288
00:55:53,040 --> 00:55:57,480
But we've got a completely updated and rebuilt course.

1289
00:55:57,480 --> 00:55:58,360
It's amazing.

1290
00:55:58,360 --> 00:55:59,600
It's so epic.

1291
00:55:59,600 --> 00:56:01,080
And we're doing a webinar on that.

1292
00:56:01,080 --> 00:56:02,720
So teachers can ask questions, and we

1293
00:56:02,720 --> 00:56:03,800
can answer their questions.

1294
00:56:03,800 --> 00:56:05,080
So yeah.

1295
00:56:05,080 --> 00:56:06,280
That's a hot topic.

1296
00:56:06,280 --> 00:56:06,800
Yeah.

1297
00:56:06,800 --> 00:56:09,760
And we want to give confidence to teachers on that.

1298
00:56:09,760 --> 00:56:12,280
Because yes, there are challenges involved.

1299
00:56:12,280 --> 00:56:15,320
But if you've got a few strategies,

1300
00:56:15,320 --> 00:56:17,760
and again, you've got a framework behind that you

1301
00:56:17,760 --> 00:56:20,520
can work towards, you can have so much more success

1302
00:56:20,520 --> 00:56:22,080
and confidence in that area.

1303
00:56:22,080 --> 00:56:25,160
So our course is called Unfazed, How to Teach

1304
00:56:25,160 --> 00:56:27,200
Neurodivergent Students Confidently.

1305
00:56:27,200 --> 00:56:28,200
So you can look that up.

1306
00:56:28,200 --> 00:56:30,080
But yeah, just explore the website.

1307
00:56:30,080 --> 00:56:33,240
And if you are interested in joining our community,

1308
00:56:33,240 --> 00:56:35,360
it's at topmusicpro.com.

1309
00:56:35,360 --> 00:56:36,640
topmusicpro.com.

1310
00:56:36,640 --> 00:56:37,640
OK.

1311
00:56:37,640 --> 00:56:38,480
We'll do that.

1312
00:56:38,480 --> 00:56:40,800
Yes, and I will list all the links in the show notes

1313
00:56:40,800 --> 00:56:42,040
as well.

1314
00:56:42,040 --> 00:56:43,960
Hey there, TPP family.

1315
00:56:43,960 --> 00:56:47,160
The PianoPod is now into our fourth season.

1316
00:56:47,160 --> 00:56:49,440
And it's all thanks to you.

1317
00:56:49,440 --> 00:56:53,200
Since 2020, you've been with my journey with the TPP,

1318
00:56:53,200 --> 00:56:55,480
exploring this burning question.

1319
00:56:55,480 --> 00:56:59,000
How do we make classical music resonate with today's audience

1320
00:56:59,000 --> 00:57:01,600
in fresh and captivating ways?

1321
00:57:01,600 --> 00:57:03,520
Four years in, and the journey has

1322
00:57:03,520 --> 00:57:05,560
been nothing short of magical.

1323
00:57:05,560 --> 00:57:07,800
The PianoPod isn't just a podcast.

1324
00:57:07,800 --> 00:57:11,600
It's a movement, a space where pianists, composers,

1325
00:57:11,600 --> 00:57:14,200
and educators brainstorm, debate,

1326
00:57:14,200 --> 00:57:18,560
and reimagine classical music's place in our fast-paced world.

1327
00:57:18,560 --> 00:57:21,000
We're together on a mission to ensure

1328
00:57:21,000 --> 00:57:23,480
classical music doesn't just survive,

1329
00:57:23,480 --> 00:57:25,680
but thrives in our modern age.

1330
00:57:25,680 --> 00:57:26,920
But here's the thing.

1331
00:57:26,920 --> 00:57:30,880
To keep bringing you these insightful biweekly episodes,

1332
00:57:30,880 --> 00:57:32,040
I need your help.

1333
00:57:32,040 --> 00:57:35,560
Every bit of support goes into the podcast essentials,

1334
00:57:35,560 --> 00:57:38,840
from hosting to high-quality recording tech

1335
00:57:38,840 --> 00:57:41,800
and the countless hours behind the scenes.

1336
00:57:41,800 --> 00:57:43,960
So do you want to be part of this journey?

1337
00:57:43,960 --> 00:57:46,200
Click the PayPal link in the show notes,

1338
00:57:46,200 --> 00:57:49,080
or head to thepianopod.com to donate.

1339
00:57:49,080 --> 00:57:52,960
And as a token of appreciation, I will personally

1340
00:57:52,960 --> 00:57:57,160
mail you the PianoPod's snazzy logo sticker.

1341
00:57:57,160 --> 00:58:00,520
So hit the Subscribe button, spread the word,

1342
00:58:00,520 --> 00:58:02,760
and let's continue our mission and journey

1343
00:58:02,760 --> 00:58:04,800
as classical musicians.

1344
00:58:04,800 --> 00:58:06,760
Now let's continue with the show.

1345
00:58:06,760 --> 00:58:09,640
Now, you're a fellow podcaster, so how am I doing

1346
00:58:09,640 --> 00:58:12,200
as a host so far, and how are you feeling

1347
00:58:12,200 --> 00:58:16,200
on the other end of this podcast?

1348
00:58:16,200 --> 00:58:17,040
It's different.

1349
00:58:17,040 --> 00:58:18,200
I really, yeah, it is.

1350
00:58:18,200 --> 00:58:22,160
I really enjoy actually being on the other side sometimes.

1351
00:58:22,160 --> 00:58:23,400
Yeah, for sure.

1352
00:58:23,400 --> 00:58:25,440
And I've been interviewed about the book

1353
00:58:25,440 --> 00:58:28,280
a few times recently, and it's good

1354
00:58:28,280 --> 00:58:31,440
because it forces you to think and clarify.

1355
00:58:31,440 --> 00:58:34,480
In fact, writing the book itself was one of the best

1356
00:58:34,480 --> 00:58:38,160
exercises I've done in clarity of thought,

1357
00:58:38,160 --> 00:58:41,640
formulating ideas, and structuring things.

1358
00:58:41,640 --> 00:58:43,520
And so now being interviewed about it

1359
00:58:43,520 --> 00:58:45,360
just sort of backs that up and supports it.

1360
00:58:45,360 --> 00:58:48,640
So you're doing an absolute cracker job,

1361
00:58:48,640 --> 00:58:50,680
as we might say in Australia here.

1362
00:58:50,680 --> 00:58:51,880
Cracker job. Well done.

1363
00:58:51,880 --> 00:58:53,400
Oh, me?

1364
00:58:53,400 --> 00:58:54,240
Yes.

1365
00:58:54,240 --> 00:58:56,560
Oh, that's a very kind of you.

1366
00:58:56,560 --> 00:58:58,160
It means so much.

1367
00:58:58,160 --> 00:58:59,000
Yes, go ahead.

1368
00:58:59,000 --> 00:59:01,400
And I can tell you've put a lot of thought into it.

1369
00:59:01,400 --> 00:59:05,400
You've read the book or parts of it.

1370
00:59:05,400 --> 00:59:08,120
And I think that's really important for anyone

1371
00:59:08,120 --> 00:59:10,720
that's interviewing and doing a podcast.

1372
00:59:10,720 --> 00:59:14,720
So tell us just briefly about your podcast.

1373
00:59:14,720 --> 00:59:15,800
Yeah, so my podcast is called

1374
00:59:15,800 --> 00:59:17,560
the Integrated Music Teaching Podcast.

1375
00:59:17,560 --> 00:59:20,840
And it's actually on a pause just at the moment.

1376
00:59:20,840 --> 00:59:24,600
I got to episode 370 or something,

1377
00:59:24,600 --> 00:59:27,280
and I just needed to have a little break.

1378
00:59:27,280 --> 00:59:29,600
So we've actually launched a new podcast

1379
00:59:29,600 --> 00:59:31,880
called the Top Music Piano Podcast

1380
00:59:31,880 --> 00:59:35,280
with a new host specifically to look at piano.

1381
00:59:35,280 --> 00:59:38,400
And my show will, I'm sure it will come back at some stage

1382
00:59:38,400 --> 00:59:41,720
and it will be more general music, music teaching,

1383
00:59:41,720 --> 00:59:44,400
instrumental music teaching, but not necessarily piano,

1384
00:59:44,400 --> 00:59:47,320
because we also have a guitar podcast too.

1385
00:59:47,320 --> 00:59:52,320
And I use the word integrated because I believe

1386
00:59:52,680 --> 00:59:57,680
that creativity and creative activities are best done

1387
00:59:57,680 --> 01:00:02,200
or explored in lessons when they're connected somehow

1388
01:00:02,200 --> 01:00:06,160
with a learning outcome and a concept

1389
01:00:06,160 --> 01:00:07,440
that you're trying to teach.

1390
01:00:07,440 --> 01:00:09,760
So it's super fun just doing some 12 bar blues

1391
01:00:09,760 --> 01:00:11,080
at the end of a lesson.

1392
01:00:11,080 --> 01:00:14,040
But I want teachers to start thinking,

1393
01:00:14,040 --> 01:00:16,120
is there a way that I can connect that work

1394
01:00:16,120 --> 01:00:17,520
that I'm doing on the 12 bar blues

1395
01:00:17,520 --> 01:00:21,000
with their understanding of theory or history

1396
01:00:21,000 --> 01:00:22,520
or whatever it is?

1397
01:00:22,520 --> 01:00:26,760
And that's the sort of integration that I try and talk about

1398
01:00:26,760 --> 01:00:28,760
and have done for a couple of years now.

1399
01:00:28,760 --> 01:00:29,920
So it's going one step further.

1400
01:00:29,920 --> 01:00:31,560
It's about not just being creative,

1401
01:00:31,560 --> 01:00:33,440
but it's about integrating creativity

1402
01:00:33,440 --> 01:00:36,800
and not just creativity, but connecting multiple parts

1403
01:00:36,800 --> 01:00:38,560
of a lesson together for a student.

1404
01:00:38,560 --> 01:00:41,720
So I'll just give you one example, which would be,

1405
01:00:41,720 --> 01:00:45,520
I have teachers come up and say,

1406
01:00:45,520 --> 01:00:48,640
how do I, my students hate playing scales.

1407
01:00:48,640 --> 01:00:52,160
How do I make scales more interesting or valuable?

1408
01:00:52,160 --> 01:00:53,960
Have you ever had students say that?

1409
01:00:53,960 --> 01:00:54,800
Or have you heard about it?

1410
01:00:54,800 --> 01:00:56,880
Yeah, yeah, all the time, yeah.

1411
01:00:56,880 --> 01:00:59,120
Yeah, so my question is,

1412
01:00:59,120 --> 01:01:02,560
what is the purpose of learning scales?

1413
01:01:02,560 --> 01:01:07,000
And most teachers will say, well, it's a technical exercise,

1414
01:01:07,000 --> 01:01:10,120
builds agility and finger independence and blah, blah, blah.

1415
01:01:10,120 --> 01:01:12,240
And all of that is true.

1416
01:01:12,240 --> 01:01:17,040
But, and here's where the integration can be really powerful.

1417
01:01:17,040 --> 01:01:21,000
Students should know, or you should help them understand

1418
01:01:21,000 --> 01:01:25,840
that the notes of a scale are built around the key area.

1419
01:01:25,840 --> 01:01:28,760
So if you're a D major scale, you're in the key of D

1420
01:01:28,760 --> 01:01:31,040
and pieces of music are also in keys.

1421
01:01:31,040 --> 01:01:33,240
So a piece of music in the key of D

1422
01:01:33,240 --> 01:01:36,240
will use the notes in the melody of the D major scale.

1423
01:01:36,240 --> 01:01:38,600
We're simplifying, of course, we're just talking

1424
01:01:38,600 --> 01:01:41,200
fairly simple music, but that's the basis.

1425
01:01:41,200 --> 01:01:43,600
Most students won't know that.

1426
01:01:43,600 --> 01:01:48,040
So having them know that is one step,

1427
01:01:48,040 --> 01:01:49,480
but that's not really the integration.

1428
01:01:49,480 --> 01:01:51,880
The integration is finding and asking yourself,

1429
01:01:51,880 --> 01:01:54,320
okay, what activity could I do

1430
01:01:54,320 --> 01:01:56,800
that actually cements that for a student

1431
01:01:56,800 --> 01:01:59,040
that makes it come alive?

1432
01:01:59,040 --> 01:02:01,760
And so a really easy way to do that,

1433
01:02:01,760 --> 01:02:05,160
to make this connection between scales and key

1434
01:02:05,160 --> 01:02:07,040
would be to say, all right,

1435
01:02:07,040 --> 01:02:09,920
let's use the notes of the scale that you've learned,

1436
01:02:09,920 --> 01:02:11,800
the D major scale, we've been playing it for weeks,

1437
01:02:11,800 --> 01:02:13,000
you know, inside and out.

1438
01:02:13,000 --> 01:02:16,040
Let's now use that to make up a melody

1439
01:02:16,040 --> 01:02:19,120
over a simple chord progression in D major.

1440
01:02:19,120 --> 01:02:21,320
So that they can start going,

1441
01:02:21,320 --> 01:02:24,320
oh, okay, now when I'm learning a new piece,

1442
01:02:24,320 --> 01:02:25,280
okay, what case is this in?

1443
01:02:25,280 --> 01:02:27,080
I'm gonna, that's gonna be the first thing I ask myself

1444
01:02:27,080 --> 01:02:29,040
because I should probably know that scale.

1445
01:02:29,040 --> 01:02:31,200
Oh, I've got a key of a piece of music in G,

1446
01:02:31,200 --> 01:02:32,560
I better learn the G scale.

1447
01:02:32,560 --> 01:02:34,560
And wow, wouldn't you know it?

1448
01:02:34,560 --> 01:02:36,600
The notes are all the G major scale,

1449
01:02:36,600 --> 01:02:37,520
there's an F sharp there.

1450
01:02:37,520 --> 01:02:38,360
Why is that there?

1451
01:02:38,360 --> 01:02:39,200
Because it's in G major.

1452
01:02:39,200 --> 01:02:42,760
You know, so we start unpacking connections for students.

1453
01:02:42,760 --> 01:02:46,240
And this does, the research says it,

1454
01:02:46,240 --> 01:02:47,480
and I've talked about it,

1455
01:02:47,480 --> 01:02:49,880
there's information on integrated music teaching on my site,

1456
01:02:49,880 --> 01:02:51,760
if anyone wants to look at it.

1457
01:02:51,760 --> 01:02:55,280
This does strengthen and solidify knowledge for students,

1458
01:02:55,280 --> 01:02:59,160
making connections with unique creative activities.

1459
01:02:59,160 --> 01:03:00,520
Yeah, absolutely.

1460
01:03:00,520 --> 01:03:04,000
That almost like really giving them the context

1461
01:03:04,000 --> 01:03:05,840
of why do I have to learn this sharp keys

1462
01:03:05,840 --> 01:03:08,800
or how many keys in certain scales?

1463
01:03:08,800 --> 01:03:10,720
Yeah, and you know, what,

1464
01:03:10,720 --> 01:03:13,360
and that's what you want students to do

1465
01:03:13,360 --> 01:03:14,800
is ask you those questions.

1466
01:03:14,800 --> 01:03:17,720
So, you know, the key of the piece is G.

1467
01:03:17,720 --> 01:03:21,080
All right, now the, now we're,

1468
01:03:21,080 --> 01:03:26,000
now the left hand has moved to E, E, and it sounds sad.

1469
01:03:26,000 --> 01:03:28,320
So what's going on here?

1470
01:03:28,320 --> 01:03:30,840
Well, it looks like we're in the B section

1471
01:03:31,880 --> 01:03:35,560
and maybe we're in E minor and those two keys are related.

1472
01:03:35,560 --> 01:03:36,400
Why are they related?

1473
01:03:36,400 --> 01:03:37,800
Like, and you know, off you go,

1474
01:03:37,800 --> 01:03:40,680
circle of fifths comes out and let's do some chords playing.

1475
01:03:40,680 --> 01:03:44,160
And I mean, there's just, if you can, yeah,

1476
01:03:44,160 --> 01:03:47,280
open your mind to possibilities like this,

1477
01:03:48,240 --> 01:03:49,760
you can have so much fun

1478
01:03:49,760 --> 01:03:51,960
and just build such deep connections

1479
01:03:51,960 --> 01:03:53,440
and knowledge for students.

1480
01:03:53,440 --> 01:03:55,880
And I just sort of want to say as well,

1481
01:03:55,880 --> 01:03:58,160
that if you do take up some of these ideas

1482
01:03:58,160 --> 01:03:59,840
from the notebook approach,

1483
01:03:59,840 --> 01:04:04,360
you will naturally be more inclined to think this way

1484
01:04:04,360 --> 01:04:06,200
for your other students as well,

1485
01:04:06,200 --> 01:04:08,200
because this will get you thinking a little bit more

1486
01:04:08,200 --> 01:04:09,920
about beat and meter and harmony

1487
01:04:09,920 --> 01:04:12,120
and tonal centers and those things.

1488
01:04:12,120 --> 01:04:14,760
And next time you have your student

1489
01:04:14,760 --> 01:04:17,720
who's doing some early intermediate work,

1490
01:04:17,720 --> 01:04:22,280
you'll go, huh, I did this in the notebook thing

1491
01:04:22,280 --> 01:04:23,760
with my beginner the other day.

1492
01:04:23,760 --> 01:04:25,920
We should just tap out this rhythm

1493
01:04:25,920 --> 01:04:27,400
or we should play this chord progression

1494
01:04:27,400 --> 01:04:28,920
because this is an E minor.

1495
01:04:28,920 --> 01:04:30,880
And you'll start to think a little bit differently.

1496
01:04:30,880 --> 01:04:34,000
So if what I was saying about the integrated music teaching

1497
01:04:34,000 --> 01:04:36,840
is like, oh, over the head, that's, whoa,

1498
01:04:36,840 --> 01:04:39,800
that's a step too far, totally understand.

1499
01:04:39,800 --> 01:04:42,520
But if you do take on some of these ideas

1500
01:04:42,520 --> 01:04:44,120
from the notebook approach,

1501
01:04:44,120 --> 01:04:46,160
I think it'll become a little bit more natural

1502
01:04:46,160 --> 01:04:48,160
for you to think in those ways.

1503
01:04:49,120 --> 01:04:49,960
Well, thank you.

1504
01:04:49,960 --> 01:04:50,800
Wow.

1505
01:04:50,800 --> 01:04:53,920
You know, I'm learning so much from this conversation.

1506
01:04:53,920 --> 01:04:56,120
I don't want to stop, but it's, you know,

1507
01:04:56,120 --> 01:04:59,000
we are coming to almost close to the end of the,

1508
01:04:59,000 --> 01:05:00,520
toward the end of the conversation,

1509
01:05:00,520 --> 01:05:02,040
but I have few more questions.

1510
01:05:02,040 --> 01:05:03,360
So just bear with me.

1511
01:05:03,360 --> 01:05:04,960
What does it take to be considered

1512
01:05:04,960 --> 01:05:06,840
a 21st century music studio?

1513
01:05:06,840 --> 01:05:10,440
Or how can a music studio be recognized as a 21st century

1514
01:05:10,440 --> 01:05:12,040
music studio, you think?

1515
01:05:12,040 --> 01:05:14,000
Well, I think the first thing you need is a website

1516
01:05:14,000 --> 01:05:16,160
that wasn't built in the nineties.

1517
01:05:16,160 --> 01:05:20,000
And is mobile responsive, looks great on phones,

1518
01:05:20,000 --> 01:05:23,440
doesn't use copper plate, gothic fonts.

1519
01:05:24,520 --> 01:05:27,520
Like, so you need to present yourself.

1520
01:05:27,520 --> 01:05:29,600
I'm talking, this is putting my business hat on.

1521
01:05:29,600 --> 01:05:32,160
You need to present yourself as a modern,

1522
01:05:32,160 --> 01:05:36,720
positive, practical, fun studio online.

1523
01:05:36,720 --> 01:05:38,800
And on social and wherever else you choose

1524
01:05:38,800 --> 01:05:42,360
to spread the message about your studio.

1525
01:05:42,360 --> 01:05:45,680
So that's one super critical factor.

1526
01:05:45,680 --> 01:05:49,920
I think another critical factor is just in your pedagogy,

1527
01:05:50,840 --> 01:05:53,560
having the flexibility and the student first approach.

1528
01:05:53,560 --> 01:05:56,760
These are all, they're just really a given now.

1529
01:05:56,760 --> 01:06:00,600
Teachers listing, again, for the 99 percenters,

1530
01:06:00,600 --> 01:06:01,960
you need to be flexible.

1531
01:06:01,960 --> 01:06:05,880
You need to have your students have some autonomy

1532
01:06:05,880 --> 01:06:07,400
in what they're learning.

1533
01:06:07,400 --> 01:06:10,040
You need to, as much as you can,

1534
01:06:10,040 --> 01:06:12,040
bring in some of these concepts

1535
01:06:12,040 --> 01:06:13,560
that the students are listening to.

1536
01:06:13,560 --> 01:06:16,280
So can you add elements of popular styles

1537
01:06:16,280 --> 01:06:19,280
and things into lessons without sort of groaning

1538
01:06:19,280 --> 01:06:21,960
and making it like the five minutes at the end?

1539
01:06:21,960 --> 01:06:25,240
Because if you haven't already sort of picked this up

1540
01:06:25,240 --> 01:06:29,840
from what I've said, I'm very, a very big believer

1541
01:06:29,840 --> 01:06:33,800
in the power of using creative things,

1542
01:06:33,800 --> 01:06:38,640
popular styles, pop music to teach fundamentals of music.

1543
01:06:38,640 --> 01:06:40,880
This isn't the junk food of music lessons.

1544
01:06:41,840 --> 01:06:43,640
Yes, classical music is important.

1545
01:06:43,640 --> 01:06:45,000
I love playing classical music

1546
01:06:45,000 --> 01:06:48,040
and I love teaching classical music, 100 percent.

1547
01:06:48,040 --> 01:06:49,960
But I tell you what, a student will learn more

1548
01:06:49,960 --> 01:06:51,760
about harmony and chord progressions

1549
01:06:51,760 --> 01:06:53,600
through an Ed Sheeran song

1550
01:06:53,600 --> 01:06:55,840
than they will through a Beethoven sonata

1551
01:06:55,840 --> 01:06:56,660
or something like that.

1552
01:06:56,660 --> 01:06:57,500
It's too complex.

1553
01:06:57,500 --> 01:06:59,080
We need to use some simple music.

1554
01:06:59,080 --> 01:07:00,640
And yeah, maybe it's only got four chords.

1555
01:07:00,640 --> 01:07:01,480
That's okay.

1556
01:07:01,480 --> 01:07:04,280
That's actually really good teaching point.

1557
01:07:04,280 --> 01:07:08,200
So I have a course and a program,

1558
01:07:08,200 --> 01:07:10,720
another framework called Four Chord Composing,

1559
01:07:10,720 --> 01:07:13,160
which I highly recommend.

1560
01:07:13,160 --> 01:07:15,400
Anyone listening can try it out.

1561
01:07:15,400 --> 01:07:19,160
You can try it out for free, topmusic.co slash chords.

1562
01:07:19,160 --> 01:07:20,520
Check it out, try it out.

1563
01:07:20,520 --> 01:07:23,120
These are just, this is part of being a modern studio

1564
01:07:23,120 --> 01:07:25,520
that you do bring in these elements of new music.

1565
01:07:25,520 --> 01:07:29,120
And it doesn't matter if you don't listen to it yourself.

1566
01:07:29,120 --> 01:07:30,040
That's what YouTube's for.

1567
01:07:30,040 --> 01:07:31,720
Jump on it with your student.

1568
01:07:31,720 --> 01:07:32,720
Go and explore it.

1569
01:07:33,640 --> 01:07:35,160
YouTube, let's talk about YouTube for a second.

1570
01:07:35,160 --> 01:07:36,000
You can.

1571
01:07:36,000 --> 01:07:36,840
Yeah, yeah, yeah, sure.

1572
01:07:36,840 --> 01:07:39,220
YouTube is not your enemy.

1573
01:07:39,220 --> 01:07:41,440
YouTube is your friend and needs to be your friend

1574
01:07:41,440 --> 01:07:43,240
because every student is on it.

1575
01:07:43,240 --> 01:07:44,280
And in fact, you know what?

1576
01:07:44,280 --> 01:07:47,520
I don't know about you, but when I was a kid,

1577
01:07:47,520 --> 01:07:50,760
my miss Mac was very open to teaching me things

1578
01:07:50,760 --> 01:07:53,240
that I wanted to learn, even it was too hard for me.

1579
01:07:53,240 --> 01:07:56,360
And, but I still play, mucked around.

1580
01:07:56,360 --> 01:07:59,480
I played stuff on the radio and recorded it on a cassette

1581
01:07:59,480 --> 01:08:01,600
and played it back and over and over and tried to play it.

1582
01:08:01,600 --> 01:08:03,560
And I had a synthesizer and I tried making things up.

1583
01:08:03,560 --> 01:08:05,320
Like we all do this.

1584
01:08:05,320 --> 01:08:07,280
Lots of students will do this anyway.

1585
01:08:07,280 --> 01:08:08,120
They'll be on YouTube.

1586
01:08:08,120 --> 01:08:09,800
They'll be teaching themselves stuff.

1587
01:08:09,800 --> 01:08:11,840
So use it, bring it into lessons.

1588
01:08:11,840 --> 01:08:13,760
Get them to show you what they're doing.

1589
01:08:13,760 --> 01:08:15,600
Help them improve the fingering

1590
01:08:15,600 --> 01:08:17,720
because it's probably gonna be a mess.

1591
01:08:17,720 --> 01:08:19,700
Help them improve the musicality and the dynamics.

1592
01:08:19,700 --> 01:08:20,960
There's so much you can do.

1593
01:08:20,960 --> 01:08:22,320
So that's another element, I think,

1594
01:08:22,320 --> 01:08:25,280
of being a professional studio now.

1595
01:08:26,840 --> 01:08:28,280
Oh, look, there's probably lots more,

1596
01:08:28,280 --> 01:08:30,000
but hopefully that's a few to get started.

1597
01:08:30,000 --> 01:08:30,840
Oh, yeah.

1598
01:08:30,840 --> 01:08:31,800
Oh, well, thank you for that.

1599
01:08:31,800 --> 01:08:33,200
Yes.

1600
01:08:33,200 --> 01:08:36,040
I don't necessarily teach Ed Sheeran,

1601
01:08:36,040 --> 01:08:39,440
but I use Taylor Swift, plenty of Taylor Swift.

1602
01:08:39,440 --> 01:08:40,360
Perfect, yes.

1603
01:08:40,360 --> 01:08:42,440
Oh, yes, she's fine with.

1604
01:08:42,440 --> 01:08:44,760
I've just started recording videos

1605
01:08:44,760 --> 01:08:47,960
for me reacting to a pop song

1606
01:08:47,960 --> 01:08:50,800
that has been listed by one of our members

1607
01:08:50,800 --> 01:08:53,680
and then working out how on earth I would teach it.

1608
01:08:53,680 --> 01:08:55,800
And so these are called pop song solutions.

1609
01:08:55,800 --> 01:08:57,800
These are videos inside our membership.

1610
01:08:57,800 --> 01:08:59,760
So people can just sort of scan through

1611
01:08:59,760 --> 01:09:01,680
or just search for, oh crap,

1612
01:09:01,680 --> 01:09:04,600
someone wants to learn Ariana Grande something,

1613
01:09:04,600 --> 01:09:06,080
type it into Top Music Pro.

1614
01:09:06,080 --> 01:09:07,080
Oh, there's Tim teaching it.

1615
01:09:07,080 --> 01:09:08,800
Okay, I've got some ideas.

1616
01:09:08,800 --> 01:09:10,320
And that's something that I really enjoy doing.

1617
01:09:10,320 --> 01:09:11,400
I've got to do some more, actually.

1618
01:09:11,400 --> 01:09:13,440
I think we're about time for another batch.

1619
01:09:13,440 --> 01:09:16,120
Okay, I'll make sure to follow.

1620
01:09:16,120 --> 01:09:18,440
Now, so why music education?

1621
01:09:18,440 --> 01:09:23,440
So how does music education contribute to our lives?

1622
01:09:23,640 --> 01:09:26,880
Well, it just enriches everything, doesn't it?

1623
01:09:26,880 --> 01:09:31,800
I mean, imagine the world with all the music gone.

1624
01:09:31,800 --> 01:09:36,800
I mean, and I think students may miss this fact

1625
01:09:37,240 --> 01:09:38,480
because they've got headphones in all the time,

1626
01:09:38,480 --> 01:09:40,240
but there's music everywhere,

1627
01:09:40,240 --> 01:09:45,240
behind movies, for advertisements, in shopping centers.

1628
01:09:46,000 --> 01:09:49,360
I mean, music, we're absorbing music all the time.

1629
01:09:49,360 --> 01:09:51,000
And I'm really glad that we are

1630
01:09:51,000 --> 01:09:53,800
because it's just such a magical thing.

1631
01:09:53,800 --> 01:09:56,080
And so to, you know, we're in a very lucky position

1632
01:09:56,080 --> 01:09:59,840
to be able to bring this experience to students.

1633
01:09:59,840 --> 01:10:01,280
We're really privileged.

1634
01:10:01,280 --> 01:10:03,720
And that's another reason why I want to support teachers

1635
01:10:03,720 --> 01:10:05,600
to do this, because if you have made this choice,

1636
01:10:05,600 --> 01:10:07,040
you're not doing it for the money.

1637
01:10:07,040 --> 01:10:08,840
There's no way you're doing it for the love

1638
01:10:08,840 --> 01:10:10,080
and the passion that you have

1639
01:10:10,080 --> 01:10:11,760
and the belief that music can change lives

1640
01:10:11,760 --> 01:10:14,280
and the belief that there is power in music.

1641
01:10:14,280 --> 01:10:16,480
And that's not to even start on the research

1642
01:10:16,480 --> 01:10:20,000
behind music learning, which we like,

1643
01:10:20,000 --> 01:10:21,520
so I was at this conference yesterday

1644
01:10:21,520 --> 01:10:24,120
and one of the speakers, Paul Myatt from Australia,

1645
01:10:24,120 --> 01:10:28,280
who's an amazing teacher and consultant,

1646
01:10:29,720 --> 01:10:32,560
he gave a quote, oh, I wish I could remember it exactly,

1647
01:10:32,560 --> 01:10:36,640
but it was to say the power of music learning.

1648
01:10:36,640 --> 01:10:39,720
So students that learned a musical instrument,

1649
01:10:39,720 --> 01:10:42,400
on average, I'm gonna bungle this,

1650
01:10:42,400 --> 01:10:46,840
but on average achieve, you know,

1651
01:10:47,920 --> 01:10:52,600
90% better results or something in exams across the board

1652
01:10:52,600 --> 01:10:53,440
or something.

1653
01:10:53,440 --> 01:10:54,280
I'm not quite right,

1654
01:10:54,280 --> 01:10:56,240
but I hope your listeners will understand.

1655
01:10:56,240 --> 01:10:59,800
The point I'm trying to make is that there is lots

1656
01:10:59,800 --> 01:11:03,920
of research about the power of music learning

1657
01:11:03,920 --> 01:11:06,800
to enrich and strengthen students' abilities

1658
01:11:06,800 --> 01:11:08,040
in other subjects.

1659
01:11:08,040 --> 01:11:11,560
And it teaches resilience and it teaches perseverance

1660
01:11:11,560 --> 01:11:16,560
and it teaches repetition and practice and thinking

1661
01:11:16,560 --> 01:11:19,520
and, you know, all so many different areas.

1662
01:11:19,520 --> 01:11:20,880
So yeah.

1663
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:23,480
What advice do you have for someone starting

1664
01:11:23,480 --> 01:11:25,040
to build a music studio?

1665
01:11:25,040 --> 01:11:26,600
Oh, that's a good question.

1666
01:11:27,560 --> 01:11:30,680
I think when you're first starting,

1667
01:11:31,560 --> 01:11:35,840
you're going to teach just about anybody

1668
01:11:35,840 --> 01:11:37,760
and that's great and you should

1669
01:11:37,760 --> 01:11:38,920
because you're just starting out.

1670
01:11:38,920 --> 01:11:42,040
You're not gonna quite know who you want to teach,

1671
01:11:42,040 --> 01:11:44,120
but over the course of time,

1672
01:11:44,120 --> 01:11:47,720
I want you to start thinking about how you can specialize

1673
01:11:47,720 --> 01:11:50,320
and differentiate yourself from other teachers.

1674
01:11:50,320 --> 01:11:51,160
Who can you be?

1675
01:11:51,160 --> 01:11:52,520
What's gonna be special about you?

1676
01:11:52,520 --> 01:11:54,520
Is it the fact that you do use a particular method

1677
01:11:54,520 --> 01:11:56,320
or approach or backing tracks

1678
01:11:56,320 --> 01:12:00,720
or that you're the best competition preparation winner?

1679
01:12:00,720 --> 01:12:03,440
Or are you the teenage transfer student,

1680
01:12:03,440 --> 01:12:05,160
which is what I was?

1681
01:12:05,160 --> 01:12:06,240
Send me a transfer student.

1682
01:12:06,240 --> 01:12:08,120
That's what I love doing the most.

1683
01:12:09,120 --> 01:12:11,400
So try and start as soon as you can

1684
01:12:11,400 --> 01:12:15,520
when you begin your studio to refine who you like

1685
01:12:15,520 --> 01:12:17,280
and go back to that word authentic.

1686
01:12:17,280 --> 01:12:18,440
What is authentic to you?

1687
01:12:18,440 --> 01:12:23,440
What gives you the most joy in teaching

1688
01:12:23,440 --> 01:12:24,640
and try and work that out

1689
01:12:24,640 --> 01:12:29,640
and then use that as the copy on your website

1690
01:12:30,200 --> 01:12:31,680
and the posts that you do on social media

1691
01:12:31,680 --> 01:12:34,640
to try and attract more of those students to you.

1692
01:12:34,640 --> 01:12:36,520
Make sure you've got a good website.

1693
01:12:36,520 --> 01:12:38,840
Make sure it's modern and up to date and looks great.

1694
01:12:38,840 --> 01:12:40,880
It's got smiling, happy children on there,

1695
01:12:40,880 --> 01:12:43,800
preferably ones that you've taught with their permission

1696
01:12:43,800 --> 01:12:47,600
and that you've got a relatively strong

1697
01:12:47,600 --> 01:12:51,640
relatively structured approach to how you go about teaching

1698
01:12:51,640 --> 01:12:56,320
that you know works and is successful and can be repeated.

1699
01:12:56,320 --> 01:12:59,320
And there's lots of different ways that we all teach.

1700
01:12:59,320 --> 01:13:01,280
There's lots of different resources around it.

1701
01:13:01,280 --> 01:13:04,000
But yes, I think the crucial ones.

1702
01:13:04,000 --> 01:13:06,680
Oh, and I would just say on the business side,

1703
01:13:06,680 --> 01:13:08,480
if you're just starting out,

1704
01:13:08,480 --> 01:13:10,960
make sure you look at what you're doing as a business.

1705
01:13:10,960 --> 01:13:13,080
That means have a separate business account.

1706
01:13:13,080 --> 01:13:18,080
It means thinking business-mindedly in regard to marketing,

1707
01:13:20,360 --> 01:13:21,680
knowing that you're in charge of things.

1708
01:13:21,680 --> 01:13:22,760
You need to make a profit.

1709
01:13:22,760 --> 01:13:25,680
You're not doing this just because it's fun,

1710
01:13:25,680 --> 01:13:27,760
although some people do, of course.

1711
01:13:27,760 --> 01:13:29,040
Most people need to make a profit.

1712
01:13:29,040 --> 01:13:31,200
So think about it as a business

1713
01:13:31,200 --> 01:13:35,440
because you are a business owner and good luck, I say.

1714
01:13:35,440 --> 01:13:36,280
And come and join us

1715
01:13:36,280 --> 01:13:37,720
because we love helping beginner teachers.

1716
01:13:37,720 --> 01:13:39,560
We've got courses, Beginner Teacher Blueprint,

1717
01:13:39,560 --> 01:13:40,960
one of our most popular courses.

1718
01:13:40,960 --> 01:13:43,360
Oh, wow, yes, great.

1719
01:13:43,360 --> 01:13:46,640
Now, any message, advice for young piano students

1720
01:13:46,640 --> 01:13:48,200
and their parents?

1721
01:13:48,200 --> 01:13:49,960
Ooh, okay.

1722
01:13:49,960 --> 01:13:52,160
Yes, stick at it.

1723
01:13:53,480 --> 01:13:54,320
Keep it up.

1724
01:13:55,200 --> 01:13:56,280
I know it's hard.

1725
01:13:56,280 --> 01:14:00,840
I was a bit of a bad student for some of my time.

1726
01:14:00,840 --> 01:14:02,720
If I was enjoying the music I was playing,

1727
01:14:02,720 --> 01:14:04,560
I tended to work really hard on it.

1728
01:14:04,560 --> 01:14:09,560
And so I would say to parents of students,

1729
01:14:09,560 --> 01:14:11,520
try and work with your teacher.

1730
01:14:11,520 --> 01:14:13,960
If they're not the kind of teacher that is flexible

1731
01:14:13,960 --> 01:14:16,240
and has this kind of modern approach,

1732
01:14:16,240 --> 01:14:19,360
then try and encourage them to do some research

1733
01:14:19,360 --> 01:14:21,720
and to look up some of the articles that we supply

1734
01:14:21,720 --> 01:14:26,000
and things to make sure that they're gonna be covering

1735
01:14:26,000 --> 01:14:28,720
what your child actually wants, what their goals are.

1736
01:14:28,720 --> 01:14:31,600
Because ultimately a teacher will have a goal in mind.

1737
01:14:31,600 --> 01:14:33,600
The student will have a goal in mind.

1738
01:14:33,600 --> 01:14:35,920
And if there's not crossover and alignment,

1739
01:14:35,920 --> 01:14:38,080
then that's when we have student drop-off.

1740
01:14:38,080 --> 01:14:41,000
So we really have to make sure that there is alignment

1741
01:14:41,000 --> 01:14:43,000
between those two things.

1742
01:14:43,000 --> 01:14:44,680
And parents, I've been a parent.

1743
01:14:44,680 --> 01:14:48,000
I think I'm a bit of a failure as a parent in some ways,

1744
01:14:48,000 --> 01:14:51,640
because both my children have stopped learning music,

1745
01:14:51,640 --> 01:14:52,680
breaks my heart.

1746
01:14:53,680 --> 01:14:57,680
But we know that my younger one is incredibly musical

1747
01:14:57,680 --> 01:15:00,520
and he will pick up any instrument and can play it

1748
01:15:00,520 --> 01:15:02,000
and he can sing and it's really annoying

1749
01:15:02,000 --> 01:15:03,600
because he's really good at all this stuff.

1750
01:15:03,600 --> 01:15:04,840
He doesn't try.

1751
01:15:04,840 --> 01:15:07,880
But the thing I do notice is that he will wander around

1752
01:15:07,880 --> 01:15:10,200
and just pick up a guitar and start playing it for a while.

1753
01:15:10,200 --> 01:15:11,280
So he's not having lessons,

1754
01:15:11,280 --> 01:15:14,040
but he's still musical and enjoying it.

1755
01:15:14,040 --> 01:15:17,360
And so to the parents, I would say, last comment,

1756
01:15:17,360 --> 01:15:18,600
there's gonna be times when your child

1757
01:15:18,600 --> 01:15:22,720
isn't gonna wanna practice and may wanna quit.

1758
01:15:22,720 --> 01:15:26,600
And I can't give you the advice as to which way to go,

1759
01:15:26,600 --> 01:15:29,520
whether you keep pushing them or whether you let them quit.

1760
01:15:29,520 --> 01:15:32,360
It's so hard and I feel for you.

1761
01:15:32,360 --> 01:15:33,600
And I know it's really tricky,

1762
01:15:33,600 --> 01:15:35,800
particularly if you are a musician yourself,

1763
01:15:35,800 --> 01:15:38,800
but hang in there and keep encouraging

1764
01:15:38,800 --> 01:15:43,000
and keep helping the teacher as much as you can

1765
01:15:43,000 --> 01:15:44,840
to keep your child engaged.

1766
01:15:44,840 --> 01:15:47,200
Yes, without mom and dad,

1767
01:15:47,200 --> 01:15:50,000
teachers cannot do by ourselves.

1768
01:15:50,000 --> 01:15:52,320
It's definitely a triangle.

1769
01:15:52,320 --> 01:15:53,160
Oh, definitely.

1770
01:15:53,160 --> 01:15:54,000
Well, thank you.

1771
01:15:54,000 --> 01:15:55,960
So for those of who are listening,

1772
01:15:55,960 --> 01:15:57,800
so Tim has a book,

1773
01:15:57,800 --> 01:16:02,800
No Book Beginners available on everywhere, Amazon, Kindle.

1774
01:16:02,800 --> 01:16:04,960
Amazon, Kindle.

1775
01:16:04,960 --> 01:16:06,720
And if you want the,

1776
01:16:06,720 --> 01:16:09,600
you can grab a download of it if you prefer a PDF

1777
01:16:09,600 --> 01:16:11,320
and you just wanna flip through it on your iPad or something,

1778
01:16:11,320 --> 01:16:13,920
you can get that at topmusic.co slash book.

1779
01:16:13,920 --> 01:16:16,480
And if you grab that, you can also get the audio book.

1780
01:16:16,480 --> 01:16:18,720
So I have recorded the full audio book as well.

1781
01:16:18,720 --> 01:16:19,960
Oh my goodness.

1782
01:16:19,960 --> 01:16:20,800
If you're listening.

1783
01:16:20,800 --> 01:16:23,800
So that's all on the website or yes, as you said,

1784
01:16:23,800 --> 01:16:26,640
Amazon for Kindle or paperback.

1785
01:16:26,640 --> 01:16:27,480
Great.

1786
01:16:27,480 --> 01:16:29,040
And then also Tim's podcast.

1787
01:16:29,040 --> 01:16:31,560
Well, it used to be the integrated music teaching podcast,

1788
01:16:31,560 --> 01:16:33,480
but now it's the piano.

1789
01:16:33,480 --> 01:16:34,960
The top music piano podcast.

1790
01:16:34,960 --> 01:16:37,040
So search for the top music piano podcast.

1791
01:16:37,040 --> 01:16:37,880
Great.

1792
01:16:37,880 --> 01:16:41,600
And also of course, topmusic.co

1793
01:16:41,600 --> 01:16:45,240
to learn more about Tim's business and community.

1794
01:16:45,240 --> 01:16:48,720
So this has been a really fun inspiring conversation Tim.

1795
01:16:48,720 --> 01:16:50,200
So, but before I let you go,

1796
01:16:50,200 --> 01:16:53,080
we have to do this TPP rapid fire questions.

1797
01:16:53,080 --> 01:16:53,920
It's a ritual.

1798
01:16:53,920 --> 01:16:54,760
Oh no.

1799
01:16:54,760 --> 01:16:55,600
You have to get there.

1800
01:16:55,600 --> 01:16:56,440
Oh yes.

1801
01:16:56,440 --> 01:17:00,120
Oh, and these are actually really silly,

1802
01:17:00,120 --> 01:17:01,560
but tough questions.

1803
01:17:01,560 --> 01:17:02,480
So get ready.

1804
01:17:02,480 --> 01:17:04,360
So we'll start with something easy.

1805
01:17:04,360 --> 01:17:07,920
So level one, what is your comfort food?

1806
01:17:07,920 --> 01:17:09,720
Roast mom's roast chicken.

1807
01:17:09,720 --> 01:17:11,160
How do you like your coffee?

1808
01:17:11,160 --> 01:17:13,480
Strong cappuccino.

1809
01:17:13,480 --> 01:17:15,080
So with some milk.

1810
01:17:15,080 --> 01:17:16,200
Cats or dogs?

1811
01:17:16,200 --> 01:17:17,600
Cats, I've got two.

1812
01:17:17,600 --> 01:17:19,320
Oh, how sweet.

1813
01:17:19,320 --> 01:17:20,800
Sunrise or sunset?

1814
01:17:20,800 --> 01:17:23,880
Oh, I'm a morning person.

1815
01:17:23,880 --> 01:17:25,440
So sunrise, I think.

1816
01:17:25,440 --> 01:17:26,280
Okay.

1817
01:17:26,280 --> 01:17:27,120
Summer or winter?

1818
01:17:27,120 --> 01:17:28,880
Definitely summer.

1819
01:17:28,880 --> 01:17:30,360
Paper book or ebook?

1820
01:17:30,360 --> 01:17:34,120
Ooh, ebook, I think, yeah.

1821
01:17:34,120 --> 01:17:34,960
Okay.

1822
01:17:34,960 --> 01:17:36,480
Now level two.

1823
01:17:36,480 --> 01:17:37,760
Oh gosh.

1824
01:17:37,760 --> 01:17:40,360
What skill have you always wanted to learn,

1825
01:17:40,360 --> 01:17:42,200
but haven't had a chance to?

1826
01:17:42,200 --> 01:17:44,040
Easy one, helicopter pilot.

1827
01:17:44,040 --> 01:17:45,680
I've had like two first lessons

1828
01:17:45,680 --> 01:17:46,960
and I've never got any further

1829
01:17:46,960 --> 01:17:49,160
because it's too expensive.

1830
01:17:49,160 --> 01:17:51,040
Well, you know, maybe you'll-

1831
01:17:51,040 --> 01:17:52,720
One day, I'm gonna do it.

1832
01:17:52,720 --> 01:17:53,920
Yep, I will.

1833
01:17:53,920 --> 01:17:54,760
Okay.

1834
01:17:54,760 --> 01:17:59,520
What is your word of words to live by?

1835
01:17:59,520 --> 01:18:01,720
Try anything once.

1836
01:18:01,720 --> 01:18:03,280
What is the most important quality

1837
01:18:03,280 --> 01:18:04,880
you look for in other people?

1838
01:18:04,880 --> 01:18:06,200
Kindness.

1839
01:18:06,200 --> 01:18:11,200
And name three people who inspire you, living or dead.

1840
01:18:11,240 --> 01:18:12,080
Okay.

1841
01:18:13,080 --> 01:18:15,360
My parents, most definitely.

1842
01:18:16,360 --> 01:18:17,840
My husband, David.

1843
01:18:17,840 --> 01:18:19,760
And I'm gonna choose a business person

1844
01:18:19,760 --> 01:18:21,920
because my whole business started

1845
01:18:21,920 --> 01:18:23,320
on the back of one book,

1846
01:18:23,320 --> 01:18:26,920
which was a book called.com secrets

1847
01:18:26,920 --> 01:18:29,120
by a guy called Russell Brunson,

1848
01:18:29,120 --> 01:18:30,520
who some of your listeners may know

1849
01:18:30,520 --> 01:18:34,760
is huge in internet marketing circles.

1850
01:18:34,760 --> 01:18:36,440
And he, without his book,

1851
01:18:36,440 --> 01:18:38,880
I'm not sure I would have got where I am.

1852
01:18:38,880 --> 01:18:41,840
Now name one piece in your current playlist.

1853
01:18:41,840 --> 01:18:42,720
Ooh, okay.

1854
01:18:42,720 --> 01:18:45,040
That's easy because it's on my stand.

1855
01:18:46,520 --> 01:18:47,360
Which one I'll choose.

1856
01:18:47,360 --> 01:18:54,360
I'll choose the fantasy in F minor by Chopin.

1857
01:18:54,400 --> 01:18:57,880
Now level three, two more questions to go.

1858
01:18:57,880 --> 01:19:00,360
So I'm getting scared now.

1859
01:19:00,360 --> 01:19:02,320
If you could meet your future self,

1860
01:19:02,320 --> 01:19:05,160
what question would you ask?

1861
01:19:05,160 --> 01:19:09,520
I would ask, oh my gosh, I really don't know.

1862
01:19:09,520 --> 01:19:11,440
Cause I was thinking like,

1863
01:19:11,440 --> 01:19:14,880
I would ask how do you feel you lived your life?

1864
01:19:15,680 --> 01:19:17,040
And I'd like to think that, yes,

1865
01:19:17,040 --> 01:19:19,240
I've had an impact and I've left a legacy.

1866
01:19:20,440 --> 01:19:23,160
No, maybe that's probably the thing that comes to mind.

1867
01:19:23,160 --> 01:19:24,000
Great.

1868
01:19:24,000 --> 01:19:25,720
What a wonderful, great answer.

1869
01:19:25,720 --> 01:19:27,440
Last question, fill in the blank.

1870
01:19:27,440 --> 01:19:28,680
Music is blank.

1871
01:19:29,840 --> 01:19:32,160
Could be so many things, couldn't it?

1872
01:19:32,160 --> 01:19:34,960
Well, first thing that came to my mind is music is life.

1873
01:19:34,960 --> 01:19:37,040
That's like the favorite answers.

1874
01:19:37,040 --> 01:19:37,880
Is it?

1875
01:19:37,880 --> 01:19:38,720
Yeah.

1876
01:19:40,360 --> 01:19:41,520
Well, you know what?

1877
01:19:41,520 --> 01:19:44,440
With the book we get in front of you, music is fun.

1878
01:19:44,440 --> 01:19:45,280
Music is fun.

1879
01:19:45,280 --> 01:19:46,280
Oh, indeed.

1880
01:19:46,280 --> 01:19:47,120
Great.

1881
01:19:47,120 --> 01:19:49,200
That's that perfect answer.

1882
01:19:49,200 --> 01:19:51,920
So that concludes this episode of the PianoPod.

1883
01:19:51,920 --> 01:19:54,080
Thank you, Tim, for joining my show today

1884
01:19:54,080 --> 01:19:56,640
and sharing your stories, insights and expertise.

1885
01:19:56,640 --> 01:19:58,560
So for the PianoPod listeners and viewers,

1886
01:19:58,560 --> 01:20:01,720
please visit topmusic.co to learn more

1887
01:20:01,720 --> 01:20:03,400
about his community and courses

1888
01:20:03,400 --> 01:20:08,160
and check out his insightful resource and resourceful podcast.

1889
01:20:08,160 --> 01:20:10,080
And of course you can purchase his book

1890
01:20:10,080 --> 01:20:11,480
on his website as well.

1891
01:20:11,480 --> 01:20:13,760
So all the links are listed in the show notes.

1892
01:20:13,760 --> 01:20:15,440
Thank you to my wonderful audience fans

1893
01:20:15,440 --> 01:20:16,360
for tuning in today.

1894
01:20:16,360 --> 01:20:17,840
If you enjoyed today's episode,

1895
01:20:17,840 --> 01:20:19,000
please rate and review it

1896
01:20:19,000 --> 01:20:21,280
on whatever podcast platform you use.

1897
01:20:21,280 --> 01:20:22,840
Remember to hit the thumbs up button

1898
01:20:22,840 --> 01:20:24,560
and subscribe to my YouTube channel

1899
01:20:24,560 --> 01:20:27,280
if you are watching this episode on YouTube.

1900
01:20:27,280 --> 01:20:31,040
Follow TPP on social media to get the latest piano news.

1901
01:20:31,040 --> 01:20:34,200
I will see you for the next episode of the PianoPod.

1902
01:20:34,200 --> 01:20:35,240
Thank you, Tim.

1903
01:20:35,240 --> 01:20:36,080
Bye everyone.

1904
01:20:36,080 --> 01:20:36,900
Thank you so much, Ikimi.

1905
01:20:36,900 --> 01:20:37,740
Bye bye everyone.

1906
01:20:37,740 --> 01:20:38,580
Thank you.

1907
01:20:38,580 --> 01:20:49,200
Fei.