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["Pomp and Circumstance"]

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["Pomp and Circumstance"]

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["Pomp and Circumstance"]

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Welcome back to another episode.

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In the last episode of season three of The Piano Part,

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I am your host, Yukimisou.

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This is the last one until I return

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for season four in mid-September.

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For this season finale, I interviewed Ms. Mariam Raya,

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concert pianist, entrepreneur,

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and once described as a complete artist of the 21st century.

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I wanted to invite her as a guest speaker

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for the season three finale episode

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because I thought it was timely and appropriate

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to finish this fantastic season with a pianist like Mariam,

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who is not only an incredible artist,

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but also she is an entrepreneur,

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has a degree in literature,

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and also another degree in business management from Italy.

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She also collaborates with professionals

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from the film industry.

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Yeah, she is living the life.

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Anyway, you know, I first started this podcast

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with my colleagues at the height of the pandemic.

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And in the last three years,

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I got to interview many incredible pianists and composers,

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educators, and entrepreneurs who are thinking outside the box

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to engage with the 21st century audiences creatively.

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Honestly, it's been interesting

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because each season has its own sort of theme.

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And season one was mostly about

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how we could get through isolation, right?

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And what we were learning through unusual circumstances

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that were happening globally.

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We were in survival mode at the time.

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Then season two was mostly about what they discovered

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through the pandemic life.

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And now at the end of season three,

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this entire season has been a growing experience

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for me as a podcaster, educator, pianist,

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and most importantly, as a person.

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I've learned so much through each guest

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and content creation.

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Anyway, this season's theme,

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without much intention on my end,

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has been all about audience engagement.

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I guess three plus years of pandemic

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really forced us to think about who we are

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and rediscover and redefine our mission

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as artists and music educators.

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So to complete this series of audience engagement,

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Miriam is the perfect guest to end it on the high note

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so that I can reset the mindset for the next season,

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which is season four.

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And I cannot wait to meet the future guests of the piano pod

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through interesting conversations

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and learn how they will lead the new season's pathway.

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So before getting started,

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I want to welcome everyone who is listening

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or watching the piano pod for the first time.

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I'm a classical pianist and educator from New York City,

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passionate about creating a thriving

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and meaningful community of the classical music industry

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through this podcast.

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Please visit ukimisongstudio.com

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to find out more about my work.

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In each episode of the piano pod,

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I interview a guest speaker

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who has been breaking exciting new ground in the industry.

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Before getting started,

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I want to thank everyone for tuning in.

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Please rate the show and review it

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on wherever you get your podcast

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because every rating review will help people find my show.

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So here we go, dear friends,

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the season finale of the piano pod

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with a guest, Miriam Raya.

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Please enjoy the show.

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["Piano Pod"]

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You are listening to the piano pod

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where we talk to the brightest minds in the industry

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about how they are bringing the piano into the 21st century.

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["Piano Pod"]

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I am honored to welcome Miriam Raya,

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American-born international concert pianist,

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entrepreneur, and complete artist of the 21st century

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as a season finale of the piano pod.

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Welcome, Miriam.

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Thanks for being here.

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Thank you so much.

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Thank you.

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I'm very excited to be able to interview you

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and then really hear your stories.

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So your videos and photos showed up

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in my social media feed quite often.

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I think obviously you're both pianists

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and they were both from New York City.

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So probably we have quite a lot of mutual friends.

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And I noticed your performances on social media,

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photos, very beautiful professional photos.

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And then also from what I understood,

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I think you went to NYU or you taught there.

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Yes, the kind of professional certificate.

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And then, yes, two years teaching there

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about 20 hours a week, I remember.

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Oh, yeah.

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I did the same thing, professional degree at NYU.

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So I don't think we crossed paths with each other

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because I think I graduated first.

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I'm much older.

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But yeah, I think that's one of the reasons

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I see you quite often and I knew of you.

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Then also you used to be, I think, in the fashion model.

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And then you were into visual art.

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That got me really interested because I love visual art too.

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And then, for example, even like fashion, to me,

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fashion designers are artists.

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And people often associate fashion with luxurious things.

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But actually they are artists in any other art form,

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like paint and sculpture.

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And so they're basically displaying their art

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on the human bodies.

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But I can talk about fashion forever.

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But anyways.

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You can talk about fashion as much as you want.

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It's really fun.

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Anyway, so you were described as a complete pianist

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of the 31st century by this French magazine.

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And I really love that.

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And then I usually ask this philosophical questions

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toward the end of the show.

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But I wanted to start with you with this.

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What is a complete pianist of the 21st century like?

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I'm looking at her right in front of my eyes

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through this computer screen right now.

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But in your words, how do you describe it?

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What does it mean to you?

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I think kind of going back to that interview I had

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with that magazine, I remember talking a lot

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about how piano is sort of the medium

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with which I feel I want to not only express myself,

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but be able to achieve a sense of craftsmanship.

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I think that piano and music in general

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is such an abstract art form.

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And I think part of that contrasting to something

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that's visual or like going to a gallery

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is that when you're kind of looking at something visual,

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it's a lot more immediate.

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And as pianists, we have to think about

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how do we make this abstract form that immediate?

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And so for me, piano is just the starting point

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to achieve that.

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And the sort of completeness that I really strive towards

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as an artist is being inspired by like, you are fashion.

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I'm also very inspired by fashion, also literature.

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And I think that's very much in line

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with the tradition of these great composers that we play

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because they were in their own respective times

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very much impacted and very much in conversation

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with other artists of their own times

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in every single time period

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and all of classical music history

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and other types of music as well.

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So I think it's really important in the 21st century

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that we keep that tradition of being open

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and always using the text as a kind of starting point

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to think about, okay, this was written

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maybe a couple of hundred years ago or 100 years ago

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or maybe 500 years ago.

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How do we reinterpret that for today?

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So I think I never really think about,

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I mean, of course, being, it's interesting

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because we talk so much as pianists

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about being honest to the text,

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but funnily enough, part of that is also being honest

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to the context of the text

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and realizing that we are constantly reinterpreting

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every time we perform.

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I mean, I know you as a performing artist as well,

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I'm sure you've had pieces in your repertoire

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that you've played for many years.

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And for me, every time, every time I practice,

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every time I prepare for a new performance

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is totally different.

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So it's a completeness of these works are very much alive.

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I think that's really the job,

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one of the jobs or responsibilities as a pianist, right?

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Like what this piece of music from 300 years ago,

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for example, means to us or how we can relate

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to this piece of music written so many decades

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or hundreds of years ago.

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Absolutely.

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And I think even, especially with 20th century compositions,

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a lot of these composers dedicated their compositions

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to pianists who were living.

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They were written for pianists to perform at the time.

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But even then, even though it's so close,

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it's within the same context,

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pianist is still interpreting.

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Everything is really an interpretation.

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And for me, that's part of why I respect teachers so much

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because it's so difficult to be able to teach that sense

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of continual discovery to a student.

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I mean, I know it's so difficult to,

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as a performer to embody that.

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It's almost like you have to live it.

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Right, right, absolutely.

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And living in the tradition.

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Right, living in the tradition,

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but in the 21st century time zone.

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Right, yeah.

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Definitely.

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That's the challenging part.

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So for my listeners, let me reintroduce Miriam Raya

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by citing her brief bio.

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Miriam has performed at world renowned concert halls

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such as Carnegie Hall, the Kennedy Center,

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Lincoln Center, and among many others,

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dazzling audiences with her virtuosity

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and exuberant energy for their arts.

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Her passion for the interconnectivity of all art forms

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has led her to perform in places outside

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of the traditional recital halls,

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such as art galleries and museums and film festivals

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and fashion festivals as well.

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And additionally, she has collaborated

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with New York's leading industry professionals in the film.

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Alongside with her studies at the piano,

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Miriam has obtained degrees in literature with honors.

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And recently she completed her business management degree

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from the Bocconi School of Management.

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Miriam is passionate about making classical music

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accessible to younger audiences with upcoming performances

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and exciting new projects on the horizon.

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Miriam is enthusiastic about connecting with audiences

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around the globe through her performance and social media.

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So here we are continuing our conversation

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to learn more about Miriam's adventurous life

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and exciting career as a concert pianist and entrepreneur,

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which will later lead us to a more philosophical discussion

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about her vision for the classical piano industry.

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So Miriam, let's start with this.

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How did you discover the love for piano?

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Is your family musical?

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It's funny you ask when I saw that first question.

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My parents are not musicians.

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I am the first musician in my family.

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My parents felt that it was very important for me

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to have an early childhood music education.

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They felt that that's part of the general education.

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They felt that artistic and musical education

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can help in so many other subjects

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and that the discipline it takes to practice piano every day

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can really translate to everything in life.

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So they started me at a very young age.

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I think I was maybe four years old

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and I kind of took off with it,

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which is something that they never expected,

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but they were very supportive.

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So that was very interesting for them.

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And now they're very much into classical music.

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My mom loves opera, Broadway.

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My dad loves classical music as well.

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So it's a journey for us all, let's just put it that way.

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You seem to have bases in multiple locations worldwide.

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You are a world traveler.

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Every time I try to connect with you

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00:13:12,240 --> 00:13:13,880
and you're like, oh, I'm traveling.

269
00:13:13,880 --> 00:13:15,840
So did you grow up in an environment

270
00:13:15,840 --> 00:13:19,320
where you travel quite often, like your family business?

271
00:13:19,320 --> 00:13:22,320
Well, so I was born in Washington, DC,

272
00:13:22,320 --> 00:13:25,280
and I did do many performances,

273
00:13:25,280 --> 00:13:27,120
especially in my teenage years

274
00:13:27,120 --> 00:13:29,440
that were at so many festivals.

275
00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:33,040
I had the opportunity to travel for those.

276
00:13:33,040 --> 00:13:35,280
And then I guess more recently,

277
00:13:35,280 --> 00:13:38,680
because I decided to do my business administration degree

278
00:13:38,680 --> 00:13:42,760
abroad in Milan, that was a really fantastic location

279
00:13:42,760 --> 00:13:44,920
to study because it's very central to Europe.

280
00:13:44,920 --> 00:13:49,800
So that gave me the opportunity to be able to easily travel,

281
00:13:49,800 --> 00:13:52,240
especially for concerts from there.

282
00:13:52,240 --> 00:13:54,800
Born in DC and now based in New York City.

283
00:13:54,800 --> 00:13:56,840
So totally East Coast.

284
00:13:56,840 --> 00:13:57,680
That's right.

285
00:13:57,680 --> 00:13:59,480
Tell me about your musical training

286
00:13:59,480 --> 00:14:01,480
and maybe your mentors.

287
00:14:01,480 --> 00:14:05,760
Yeah, so as I mentioned, I studied quite early.

288
00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:06,600
Started quite early.

289
00:14:06,600 --> 00:14:08,680
Actually, my parents first put me

290
00:14:08,680 --> 00:14:12,160
in a group class called Music Mind Games.

291
00:14:12,160 --> 00:14:15,680
I'm not sure it's a, I think Suzuki method.

292
00:14:15,680 --> 00:14:18,440
And that was when I was three or four.

293
00:14:18,440 --> 00:14:21,200
And then they started me with private piano lessons.

294
00:14:21,200 --> 00:14:26,200
And as a teenager, growing up in the sort of DC metropolitan

295
00:14:26,240 --> 00:14:31,040
area, I was very lucky to study with a piano faculty

296
00:14:31,040 --> 00:14:33,480
on the University of Maryland campus.

297
00:14:33,480 --> 00:14:35,160
His name was Mikhail Valkchuk.

298
00:14:35,160 --> 00:14:37,640
So I did my pre-college studies with him.

299
00:14:37,640 --> 00:14:41,960
And then I went to the Eastman School of Music

300
00:14:41,960 --> 00:14:45,320
for my bachelor's and master's.

301
00:14:45,320 --> 00:14:47,800
And I studied with Natalia Antonova.

302
00:14:47,800 --> 00:14:51,440
So I'm very much of the Russian piano school.

303
00:14:51,440 --> 00:14:55,600
And that, you know, that's, I love a lot of Russian pianists.

304
00:14:55,600 --> 00:14:57,920
I play a lot of Russian composers.

305
00:14:57,920 --> 00:15:01,480
So those two were really my main teachers

306
00:15:01,480 --> 00:15:03,720
after my master's at Eastman.

307
00:15:03,720 --> 00:15:07,000
I moved to New York 2015 and I've been pretty much

308
00:15:07,000 --> 00:15:09,840
solidly based from here ever since.

309
00:15:09,840 --> 00:15:13,320
I've had, you know, I've had the opportunity to study

310
00:15:13,320 --> 00:15:15,960
especially through youth festivals

311
00:15:15,960 --> 00:15:17,080
and kind of competitions.

312
00:15:17,080 --> 00:15:21,040
I've had the opportunity to study with so many, you know,

313
00:15:21,040 --> 00:15:24,480
living concert artists through master classes.

314
00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:29,480
And it's always so inspiring to, from an early age,

315
00:15:29,480 --> 00:15:32,320
just gain the wisdom from someone who's, you know,

316
00:15:32,320 --> 00:15:35,120
doing the thing and just like, just like my mentors.

317
00:15:35,120 --> 00:15:38,040
I was always very inspired by those teachers in my life.

318
00:15:38,040 --> 00:15:40,480
I mean, larger than life personalities.

319
00:15:40,480 --> 00:15:41,320
So.

320
00:15:41,320 --> 00:15:46,160
And also you are interested in different things, you know,

321
00:15:46,160 --> 00:15:50,320
not only music and probably you excelled in them too.

322
00:15:50,320 --> 00:15:52,280
So for example, literature.

323
00:15:52,280 --> 00:15:55,360
So you are a literature enthusiast.

324
00:15:55,360 --> 00:15:56,600
And I love literature.

325
00:15:56,600 --> 00:15:59,160
That's actually why I went to Eastman

326
00:15:59,160 --> 00:16:02,800
because it was very difficult for me when I was 15

327
00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:05,560
because I really wanted to study both.

328
00:16:05,560 --> 00:16:07,640
And, you know, so I was looking at a lot

329
00:16:07,640 --> 00:16:10,520
of dual degree programs, but you know, more importantly

330
00:16:10,520 --> 00:16:13,320
I was really looking for something not,

331
00:16:13,320 --> 00:16:17,720
that would be 95% conservatory, 5% academics

332
00:16:17,720 --> 00:16:20,520
but I was really looking to have a solid like BA

333
00:16:20,520 --> 00:16:23,040
in literature alongside my piano studies.

334
00:16:23,040 --> 00:16:26,880
And what I really loved about Eastman was that its program

335
00:16:26,880 --> 00:16:30,520
with the University of Rochester really enabled me

336
00:16:30,520 --> 00:16:33,920
to study, you know, piano obviously at a very high level

337
00:16:33,920 --> 00:16:36,640
with Natalia Antonova, who was just incredible.

338
00:16:36,640 --> 00:16:39,280
And then also have a really solid education,

339
00:16:39,280 --> 00:16:41,920
undergraduate education and something academic.

340
00:16:41,920 --> 00:16:45,000
So that's really why I was very, you know,

341
00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:47,000
grateful to have had that opportunity

342
00:16:47,000 --> 00:16:49,000
because I really wanted to have, especially

343
00:16:49,000 --> 00:16:51,560
as an undergraduate, that kind of base.

344
00:16:51,560 --> 00:16:52,400
Right.

345
00:16:52,400 --> 00:16:55,200
Now, do you ever marry these two together

346
00:16:55,200 --> 00:16:58,760
as a musical training to your knowledge

347
00:16:58,760 --> 00:17:00,560
and interest in literature?

348
00:17:00,560 --> 00:17:01,400
I do.

349
00:17:01,400 --> 00:17:04,320
And it's in terms of marrying them,

350
00:17:04,320 --> 00:17:07,520
that's really reflected mostly in the sort of repertoire

351
00:17:07,520 --> 00:17:08,960
that I choose to play.

352
00:17:08,960 --> 00:17:11,160
I can maybe give an example of that.

353
00:17:11,160 --> 00:17:15,680
Liszt has his years of pilgrimage that were, you know,

354
00:17:15,680 --> 00:17:19,080
inspired by his travels and also the literature

355
00:17:19,080 --> 00:17:21,560
and the artwork of so many different cultures.

356
00:17:21,560 --> 00:17:25,400
And I performed the Italian one most recently

357
00:17:25,400 --> 00:17:29,920
and I really enjoy sharing when I perform, you know,

358
00:17:29,920 --> 00:17:33,360
for audiences, I really enjoy sharing that this,

359
00:17:33,360 --> 00:17:34,840
for example, the Petrarch sonnets,

360
00:17:34,840 --> 00:17:37,800
this is based on these poems.

361
00:17:37,800 --> 00:17:40,840
And it's not even that it's just based on them,

362
00:17:40,840 --> 00:17:43,240
it's literally the musical version of them.

363
00:17:43,240 --> 00:17:46,800
Like he wanted to be so honest with the literary source.

364
00:17:46,800 --> 00:17:50,960
And so the way I married my two loves of life,

365
00:17:50,960 --> 00:17:53,520
my two passions is that I go back

366
00:17:53,520 --> 00:17:54,920
to what we were talking about earlier,

367
00:17:54,920 --> 00:17:56,800
that everything is just so connected.

368
00:17:56,800 --> 00:18:01,520
And embodying that is, I think, our challenge as artists

369
00:18:01,520 --> 00:18:04,640
because it's so easy to split them apart,

370
00:18:04,640 --> 00:18:06,440
but that's not entirely honest.

371
00:18:06,440 --> 00:18:08,840
Right, it's very easy to split them apart

372
00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:12,760
because sometimes we have to shut off some noise

373
00:18:12,760 --> 00:18:17,120
in order for us to be able to practice for hours, hours, right?

374
00:18:17,120 --> 00:18:19,720
So, yeah, that's a whole other conversation

375
00:18:19,720 --> 00:18:22,720
we should actually have because, you know, pianists,

376
00:18:22,720 --> 00:18:26,560
we're so, it's like, it's a high barrier to entry,

377
00:18:26,560 --> 00:18:28,240
you know, just from the beginning,

378
00:18:28,240 --> 00:18:30,320
because, I mean, you know, vocalists, for example,

379
00:18:30,320 --> 00:18:33,240
I don't think they can practice more than one hour

380
00:18:33,240 --> 00:18:34,280
or an hour and a half.

381
00:18:34,280 --> 00:18:35,640
Right, yeah, absolutely.

382
00:18:35,640 --> 00:18:39,120
Yeah, it's very physical, but as pianists,

383
00:18:39,120 --> 00:18:44,120
it's so much time just to be able to master the medium.

384
00:18:44,720 --> 00:18:47,680
And so to go further as an artist

385
00:18:47,680 --> 00:18:51,520
and really realize that the piano is a medium

386
00:18:51,520 --> 00:18:53,400
and it's not just the end,

387
00:18:53,400 --> 00:18:55,160
but it's actually just the tool

388
00:18:55,160 --> 00:18:58,080
to express something so much larger is really difficult

389
00:18:58,080 --> 00:19:00,840
when mastering the tool itself takes a lifetime

390
00:19:00,840 --> 00:19:02,720
and more than a lifetime.

391
00:19:02,720 --> 00:19:06,440
I know, we can never accomplish all the piano

392
00:19:06,440 --> 00:19:09,040
and the literature out there in one life, right?

393
00:19:09,040 --> 00:19:12,120
Yeah, well, that's, yeah, it's a blessing and a curse.

394
00:19:12,120 --> 00:19:14,040
I mean, I know that's super cliche,

395
00:19:14,040 --> 00:19:16,320
but there are so many works

396
00:19:16,320 --> 00:19:19,520
that I just randomly will discover on YouTube

397
00:19:19,520 --> 00:19:22,960
played by also new pianists that I've discovered

398
00:19:22,960 --> 00:19:25,120
that have fortunately left recordings.

399
00:19:25,120 --> 00:19:27,000
And I'll be able to,

400
00:19:27,000 --> 00:19:29,640
it's just completely something new every day,

401
00:19:29,640 --> 00:19:32,280
not only with the pieces in the repertoire

402
00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:33,680
that we've been playing for years,

403
00:19:33,680 --> 00:19:36,240
but just in general, it's like very vast.

404
00:19:36,240 --> 00:19:37,880
Yeah, absolutely.

405
00:19:37,880 --> 00:19:40,720
In continuation with that conversation,

406
00:19:40,720 --> 00:19:42,120
as being pianist,

407
00:19:42,120 --> 00:19:45,400
basically being stuck in the practice room hours and hours.

408
00:19:45,400 --> 00:19:48,800
And also it takes certain personality to become pianist,

409
00:19:48,800 --> 00:19:51,680
because if you are always outgoing

410
00:19:51,680 --> 00:19:54,080
and always with people, that's very difficult.

411
00:19:54,080 --> 00:19:56,080
It's a very difficult profession.

412
00:19:56,080 --> 00:20:01,080
However, I feel like we have to be engaged with more people,

413
00:20:01,080 --> 00:20:02,480
more audience engagement,

414
00:20:02,480 --> 00:20:04,520
of which we will discuss in a minute.

415
00:20:04,520 --> 00:20:08,520
So after graduating with music degrees

416
00:20:08,520 --> 00:20:09,880
and in the literature too,

417
00:20:09,880 --> 00:20:11,760
what was it like to be in the real world

418
00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:13,000
as a concert pianist?

419
00:20:13,000 --> 00:20:15,720
Was it like a red carpet ready?

420
00:20:15,720 --> 00:20:17,440
Everybody is ready for you?

421
00:20:17,440 --> 00:20:20,880
No, no, I don't think that's the case for, no.

422
00:20:20,880 --> 00:20:21,960
When you study something,

423
00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:23,600
and this is the case, I think, in any field,

424
00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:25,760
that when you study something

425
00:20:25,760 --> 00:20:27,240
and then you wanna apply it to the real world,

426
00:20:27,240 --> 00:20:28,880
it's like a total wake up moment.

427
00:20:28,880 --> 00:20:32,680
Because in school, in any conservatory

428
00:20:32,680 --> 00:20:35,480
or any obviously university music program,

429
00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:38,080
you're really working on, in my case,

430
00:20:38,080 --> 00:20:41,480
it was one or two serious programs a year

431
00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:42,960
preparing for a jury.

432
00:20:42,960 --> 00:20:45,240
And as pianists, most of us are naturally

433
00:20:45,240 --> 00:20:47,880
extremely detail-oriented, so that's great.

434
00:20:47,880 --> 00:20:50,280
We really get to go deep into these works

435
00:20:50,280 --> 00:20:54,080
and we usually graduate after bachelor's or after master's

436
00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:57,000
with this kind of serious collection.

437
00:20:57,000 --> 00:21:01,000
I should say, of serious works of the literature

438
00:21:01,000 --> 00:21:02,720
that we can play really well.

439
00:21:02,720 --> 00:21:04,520
And then when we go out in the real world,

440
00:21:04,520 --> 00:21:08,400
we don't necessarily realize that sometimes,

441
00:21:08,400 --> 00:21:11,360
sometimes those super serious pieces

442
00:21:11,360 --> 00:21:15,080
are not necessarily accessible naturally to an audience.

443
00:21:15,080 --> 00:21:20,080
I definitely went through a huge learning curve,

444
00:21:20,080 --> 00:21:22,280
and I don't think I'm the only one,

445
00:21:22,280 --> 00:21:25,800
trying to figure out how to learn to play

446
00:21:25,800 --> 00:21:28,120
how to learn to adapt.

447
00:21:28,120 --> 00:21:31,600
Because it's kind of just this totally different muscle

448
00:21:31,600 --> 00:21:34,640
that you have to learn and I'm still learning.

449
00:21:34,640 --> 00:21:39,640
I had a concert recently that I didn't realize,

450
00:21:39,640 --> 00:21:42,000
just in terms of the venue,

451
00:21:42,000 --> 00:21:43,640
I needed to make a last minute change

452
00:21:43,640 --> 00:21:44,880
in the program essentially,

453
00:21:44,880 --> 00:21:46,960
because sometimes you don't realize like,

454
00:21:46,960 --> 00:21:50,040
oh, this program maybe is too heavy for the occasion,

455
00:21:50,040 --> 00:21:52,200
or maybe I need to add something else,

456
00:21:52,200 --> 00:21:54,480
or it's too much virtuoso stuff,

457
00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:56,280
or it's too much Chopin wallets,

458
00:21:56,280 --> 00:21:57,520
like mellow sentimental stuff.

459
00:21:57,520 --> 00:22:00,800
So you just never know and you have to be so flexible.

460
00:22:00,800 --> 00:22:03,920
And it's very, very difficult,

461
00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:08,520
because I think even pianists who have been performing

462
00:22:08,520 --> 00:22:13,520
for three, four decades, they still have their surprises.

463
00:22:14,040 --> 00:22:18,040
And so, I think the most challenging thing about it

464
00:22:18,040 --> 00:22:21,320
is that no one can really teach that.

465
00:22:21,320 --> 00:22:22,720
I mean, like so much in the real world,

466
00:22:22,720 --> 00:22:25,800
like nobody, you just have to go out and you learn,

467
00:22:25,800 --> 00:22:28,600
like every occasion, how to program,

468
00:22:28,600 --> 00:22:31,120
like how to, I know we're gonna talk about marketing,

469
00:22:31,120 --> 00:22:34,180
but like how to sell a program, what to say.

470
00:22:34,180 --> 00:22:36,120
Even with talking to audiences,

471
00:22:36,120 --> 00:22:38,500
what's interesting to me about a composer

472
00:22:38,500 --> 00:22:41,320
might not necessarily be interesting to the audience.

473
00:22:41,320 --> 00:22:42,480
Right.

474
00:22:42,480 --> 00:22:45,240
So it's this constant process

475
00:22:45,240 --> 00:22:49,080
of seeing what you're doing objectively.

476
00:22:49,080 --> 00:22:51,520
And in the same way that we kind of listen to ourselves

477
00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:53,400
in the practice room to figure out like, okay,

478
00:22:53,400 --> 00:22:56,960
this details, this needs improvement, et cetera, et cetera.

479
00:22:56,960 --> 00:22:58,920
We do that all our lives,

480
00:22:58,920 --> 00:23:01,760
and like constantly just getting outside ourselves

481
00:23:01,760 --> 00:23:03,480
and trying to figure out what works.

482
00:23:03,480 --> 00:23:05,160
Sure, sure.

483
00:23:05,160 --> 00:23:08,080
But that's, I guess, interesting part

484
00:23:08,080 --> 00:23:12,520
of actually going out there and become the person, right?

485
00:23:12,520 --> 00:23:15,180
Rather than just stuck in the practice room

486
00:23:15,180 --> 00:23:17,340
and hoping for something to happen.

487
00:23:17,340 --> 00:23:19,440
So now let's talk about your career

488
00:23:19,440 --> 00:23:23,800
as an international concert pianist performing at venues,

489
00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:27,760
from let's say Carnegie Hall, Kennedy Center.

490
00:23:27,760 --> 00:23:32,200
And also you do perform at venues

491
00:23:32,200 --> 00:23:35,320
outside of this traditional recital halls.

492
00:23:35,320 --> 00:23:40,040
So tell me, do you have any interesting experience?

493
00:23:40,040 --> 00:23:42,120
Yeah, so actually today I just was looking

494
00:23:42,120 --> 00:23:43,900
at the Facebook memories.

495
00:23:43,900 --> 00:23:47,560
And so one year ago today was a favorite experience actually.

496
00:23:47,560 --> 00:23:50,480
And that was in Italy where I got to collaborate

497
00:23:50,480 --> 00:23:54,080
with the stained glass museum.

498
00:23:54,080 --> 00:23:56,160
And it's Venetian stained glass.

499
00:23:56,160 --> 00:24:00,280
It's like a very much Italian craftsmanship.

500
00:24:00,280 --> 00:24:04,160
Yeah, it was a conference with this glass making artist.

501
00:24:04,160 --> 00:24:07,380
And they really wanted to have that complimented

502
00:24:07,380 --> 00:24:08,900
with just a short program.

503
00:24:08,900 --> 00:24:10,680
So that was so inspiring

504
00:24:10,680 --> 00:24:14,720
because it was a pretty good sized audience.

505
00:24:14,720 --> 00:24:15,560
They're just interested.

506
00:24:15,560 --> 00:24:18,240
It was like a cultural kind of organization.

507
00:24:18,240 --> 00:24:20,040
There were about 60 people there.

508
00:24:20,040 --> 00:24:23,160
And they put the piano in the center

509
00:24:23,160 --> 00:24:26,640
and just these kind of tables with the open books,

510
00:24:26,640 --> 00:24:29,520
just showing the glass art and you can read about it.

511
00:24:29,520 --> 00:24:31,600
And the glass artist was there,

512
00:24:31,600 --> 00:24:33,960
is originally from Venice.

513
00:24:33,960 --> 00:24:36,840
That was so moving to me

514
00:24:36,840 --> 00:24:40,560
because something I really like to talk about

515
00:24:40,560 --> 00:24:42,640
and like to think about is the fact

516
00:24:42,640 --> 00:24:44,960
that pianists were really just craftsmen.

517
00:24:44,960 --> 00:24:49,080
And it was so inspiring to be alongside someone

518
00:24:49,080 --> 00:24:51,240
and just contribute to a conference

519
00:24:51,240 --> 00:24:53,840
where they're sort of showing how valuable that is,

520
00:24:53,840 --> 00:24:57,040
especially now when everything is slowly becoming

521
00:24:57,040 --> 00:24:58,560
so much more digitized.

522
00:24:58,560 --> 00:25:01,140
I think it's really important and really precious

523
00:25:01,140 --> 00:25:03,400
when we can just appreciate what's actually done

524
00:25:03,400 --> 00:25:04,880
with the human hand, literally.

525
00:25:04,880 --> 00:25:05,720
Yeah, I'm sure.

526
00:25:05,720 --> 00:25:08,360
I mean, but you're really living the dream.

527
00:25:08,360 --> 00:25:11,520
You get to perform in these interesting venues

528
00:25:11,520 --> 00:25:14,420
and not just in Italy and New York,

529
00:25:14,420 --> 00:25:18,080
but also you formed in Dubai, I think, no?

530
00:25:18,080 --> 00:25:21,040
Yeah, when I was quite young,

531
00:25:21,040 --> 00:25:24,560
I got the opportunity, I'm thinking along the lines of DC,

532
00:25:24,560 --> 00:25:26,320
I got the opportunity in the Polish embassy

533
00:25:26,320 --> 00:25:28,200
to play Petarewski's piano.

534
00:25:28,200 --> 00:25:29,800
Wow, really?

535
00:25:29,800 --> 00:25:32,560
Yeah, I played the third ballad of Chopin.

536
00:25:32,560 --> 00:25:34,680
I remember it because that was my first time

537
00:25:34,680 --> 00:25:37,480
performing the third ballad and I was very nervous.

538
00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:38,360
You know, when we're younger,

539
00:25:38,360 --> 00:25:40,000
I think I would have been even more nervous now

540
00:25:40,000 --> 00:25:42,840
because when we're younger, we don't know it, we don't know.

541
00:25:42,840 --> 00:25:44,660
Exactly.

542
00:25:44,660 --> 00:26:13,460
🎶

543
00:26:14,660 --> 00:26:44,260
You seem to also play not only the regular well-known pieces, but also I've

544
00:26:44,260 --> 00:26:50,500
seen your performance of let's say Joseph Hoffman, which you know not a lot of

545
00:26:50,500 --> 00:26:58,300
people would play those pieces. I loved allergy, vision, and some other pieces by

546
00:26:58,300 --> 00:27:03,220
Hoffman. Now what's your obsession or attraction toward Joseph Hoffman?

547
00:27:03,220 --> 00:27:05,420
Oh, it's an obsession. I'm worried I'm gonna talk too much.

548
00:27:05,420 --> 00:27:08,100
Okay, no, no, no. I actually want you to talk a lot.

549
00:27:08,100 --> 00:27:10,100
Yeah, I want to talk about Hoffman.

550
00:27:10,100 --> 00:27:11,100
Okay, good. About Hoffman.

551
00:27:11,100 --> 00:27:12,100
Yes.

552
00:27:12,100 --> 00:27:18,700
So my first experience with Hoffman was actually during my undergrad at Eastman.

553
00:27:18,700 --> 00:27:22,820
It was in Kilbourne Hall, which is one of the recital halls there. It was a concert,

554
00:27:22,820 --> 00:27:29,940
a guest artist, and he came out and just didn't even wait for the audience to stop

555
00:27:29,940 --> 00:27:36,380
clapping and just started this piece that made such an impression on me. And nobody,

556
00:27:36,380 --> 00:27:40,780
I mean, you people looked at the program obviously, but nobody recognized the piece. And what

557
00:27:40,780 --> 00:28:02,100
it was was Hoffman's kaleidoscope.

558
00:28:02,100 --> 00:28:05,780
If people know that Hoffman composed, they probably know it from kaleidoscope. It's the

559
00:28:05,780 --> 00:28:12,620
most played of the not very much played. And his student, Shura Cherkasky, has a pretty

560
00:28:12,620 --> 00:28:17,700
famous recording of that, which definitely helped increase the attention, increase the

561
00:28:17,700 --> 00:28:23,540
marketing, if you will. I think he was a, he had been like a formal, a former doctoral

562
00:28:23,540 --> 00:28:31,780
student at the school. He had such a command and a freedom that was so inspiring to me.

563
00:28:31,780 --> 00:28:39,580
And so I never really started studying Hoffman's work seriously until 2020, when all of a sudden

564
00:28:39,580 --> 00:28:45,860
so much of us have a lot more practice time. And I remember I was, I was reading a lot

565
00:28:45,860 --> 00:28:52,380
about him because I knew that of course many pianists know that even Rachmanoff himself,

566
00:28:52,380 --> 00:28:58,140
when Rachmanoff would be approached and told, you're just the greatest pianist ever, like

567
00:28:58,140 --> 00:29:02,140
of all time. And all of these, you know, compliments, Rachmanoff would be just like, actually there's

568
00:29:02,140 --> 00:29:08,380
one above me. And that's, you know, Joseph Hoffman. I was reading so much about his life,

569
00:29:08,380 --> 00:29:10,380
about his inventions and his...

570
00:29:10,380 --> 00:29:16,140
He was a, yeah, innovator. Like he invented a lot of things, right? I know. And you know,

571
00:29:16,140 --> 00:29:23,460
I got to interview this artist, Hannah Ryman. She is actually the advocate for narrow key

572
00:29:23,460 --> 00:29:29,540
piano. Yes, it's called streta piano. And there's like a really strong, like really

573
00:29:29,540 --> 00:29:36,420
firm community of this small, small sized keys and the legit. And then some people get

574
00:29:36,420 --> 00:29:38,780
piano degrees using streta pianos.

575
00:29:38,780 --> 00:29:39,780
Really?

576
00:29:39,780 --> 00:29:45,460
Oh yes. Yes. There's a community now. And then the background of this piano being this

577
00:29:45,460 --> 00:29:52,500
size, you know, the one of them is 6.5 inch has its own story. It started around like

578
00:29:52,500 --> 00:30:00,020
Franz Liszt, him being the six feet tall, you know, male, then as opposed to, you know,

579
00:30:00,020 --> 00:30:05,300
because piano keys used to be narrow. Anyway, so Joseph Hoffman, I think I believe he's

580
00:30:05,300 --> 00:30:08,060
a, he was a small sized man, right? Compared.

581
00:30:08,060 --> 00:30:09,060
Yes.

582
00:30:09,060 --> 00:30:12,980
Yeah. So then Rachmanoff being really big, you know.

583
00:30:12,980 --> 00:30:15,220
That's an interesting contrast. Yeah. I never...

584
00:30:15,220 --> 00:30:21,460
Right. Yeah. Then the Hoffman actually, Mr. Hoffman invented or created this narrow key,

585
00:30:21,460 --> 00:30:27,700
reinvented this narrow key piano. Yeah. So it's interesting. Yeah.

586
00:30:27,700 --> 00:30:32,380
I like so much. I know we're going to get into the kind of marketing and making, you

587
00:30:32,380 --> 00:30:36,360
know, classical music sort of accessible, which is always a touchy topic that depending

588
00:30:36,360 --> 00:30:40,620
on how you kind of phrase it. But the thing that I do like about Hoffman, the first thing

589
00:30:40,620 --> 00:30:46,260
that struck me about his compositions was that they're generally miniatures. I would

590
00:30:46,260 --> 00:30:51,860
say generally five to seven minutes. I mean, his elegy is like two and a half minutes,

591
00:30:51,860 --> 00:30:59,100
but they're generally shorter, smaller scale works. And they have these titles that are

592
00:30:59,100 --> 00:31:07,500
so like, I recently for a live broadcast, I recorded his penguins, which is so humorous

593
00:31:07,500 --> 00:31:08,980
and so quirky.

594
00:31:08,980 --> 00:31:09,980
Wow.

595
00:31:09,980 --> 00:31:15,380
Yeah. And it's just, it's, this is like, this is even the compositions themselves, you know,

596
00:31:15,380 --> 00:31:21,500
their titles are evocative of something else. So this is something that in a way is kind

597
00:31:21,500 --> 00:31:29,060
of not surprising because he was primarily a concert artist and he performed, I mean,

598
00:31:29,060 --> 00:31:37,380
like crazy. I think he had some, maybe the most concerts of any pianist ever. So of course

599
00:31:37,380 --> 00:31:43,100
he would understand that, you know, what works and what doesn't because he's out there doing

600
00:31:43,100 --> 00:31:47,500
the thing. Yeah. He's there. There are some, there are some, you know, technically difficult

601
00:31:47,500 --> 00:31:52,620
ones, but in general, they're very pianistic because they're written by a pianist.

602
00:31:52,620 --> 00:31:57,340
This episode is presented in collaboration with our good friends at Forte, a free alternative

603
00:31:57,340 --> 00:32:02,940
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604
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605
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606
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free today at ForteLessons.com or click the link in the description.

612
00:32:49,620 --> 00:32:57,500
Let's talk about pianists, classical pianists being creative, creative process. Now, first

613
00:32:57,500 --> 00:33:03,540
of all, I get this from students, parents a lot. Oh, you classical pianists, you just

614
00:33:03,540 --> 00:33:10,060
read notes from the score as opposed to pianists of other genres. They improvise, so they are

615
00:33:10,060 --> 00:33:15,140
more creative. So classical musicians, you guys are not. That's what I hear. So that's

616
00:33:15,140 --> 00:33:21,980
why some of the parents shows a little bit of a resistance or hesitant about putting

617
00:33:21,980 --> 00:33:29,380
their kids into classical music training. So are we classical pianists creative or can

618
00:33:29,380 --> 00:33:30,500
we or should we?

619
00:33:30,500 --> 00:33:37,620
I think we should be. And I think that inherently we can be, but that the tradition was more

620
00:33:37,620 --> 00:33:43,620
improvisatory. For example, when I was just listening, not recently, actually, this was

621
00:33:43,620 --> 00:33:50,180
some time ago, I was listening to one of Liszt's students playing his 12th Hungarian Rhapsody,

622
00:33:50,180 --> 00:33:57,380
obviously very old recording. And the way he improvised on it and he improvised on it

623
00:33:57,380 --> 00:34:03,060
so much and he took so many liberties that it was almost as if the text itself was just

624
00:34:03,060 --> 00:34:08,300
a skeleton, wasn't there was not supposed to be the finished product and the product

625
00:34:08,300 --> 00:34:12,940
was supposed to be done by the performer. I don't know if I would say that it needs

626
00:34:12,940 --> 00:34:18,020
to be brought back in its entirety, but I think the thought behind the tradition is

627
00:34:18,020 --> 00:34:23,780
essential because going back to what we were talking about earlier with pieces we've had

628
00:34:23,780 --> 00:34:30,900
in our repertoire for so many years, I never like to be locked into the mindset like, oh,

629
00:34:30,900 --> 00:34:34,700
I'm just bringing this back. I'm just bringing this back for another performance.

630
00:34:34,700 --> 00:34:40,540
My teacher when I was, I think, 11 or 12 told me every time you look at the score, you need

631
00:34:40,540 --> 00:34:46,040
to see something different. Like no matter, you need to find something different. You

632
00:34:46,040 --> 00:34:52,500
always need to go deeper. So we are improvising because we're recreating in the moment, but

633
00:34:52,500 --> 00:34:55,780
it's just, again, so much more abstract.

634
00:34:55,780 --> 00:35:01,060
Yeah, even the interpretation takes imagination sometimes. Of course, you get information

635
00:35:01,060 --> 00:35:07,820
from the score, but also information from reading the biography or all these research

636
00:35:07,820 --> 00:35:15,140
that was made by scholars and everything. But in the end, as you say, just every time

637
00:35:15,140 --> 00:35:19,780
you see the score, every time you go through the passage is different. That is actually

638
00:35:19,780 --> 00:35:23,740
the creative part of being a musician, right?

639
00:35:23,740 --> 00:35:25,060
Totally.

640
00:35:25,060 --> 00:35:31,300
So I've been doing this podcast for three years and then last season, I think most of

641
00:35:31,300 --> 00:35:37,700
our conversations with most of the guests went towards this interdisciplinary work as

642
00:35:37,700 --> 00:35:44,620
a pianist, classical pianist and collaboration, how important it is. And then when times like

643
00:35:44,620 --> 00:35:50,660
this during pandemic made us really realize about the importance of connecting to other

644
00:35:50,660 --> 00:35:56,860
people. And then especially that's when we realized, oh, connecting to people that are

645
00:35:56,860 --> 00:36:05,080
not just within our industry or within the classical piano industry, but beyond that.

646
00:36:05,080 --> 00:36:10,860
So you are interested in many things and without even collaborating with others, you have your

647
00:36:10,860 --> 00:36:18,340
interdisciplinary sort of work and maybe even genre. I want to know. But also you do like

648
00:36:18,340 --> 00:36:26,180
a collaborate with film and visual artists. And I watched actually this video you play,

649
00:36:26,180 --> 00:36:31,700
oh, Stravinsky etude. And then I think you collaborated with a videographer.

650
00:36:31,700 --> 00:36:38,220
Yes, it was one of his etudes, I think, if I'm remembering correctly.

651
00:36:38,220 --> 00:36:39,220
Yes, yes.

652
00:36:39,220 --> 00:36:47,140
And yeah, a friend of mine, it's a very, you know, early Stravinsky to me is quite mystical.

653
00:36:47,140 --> 00:36:54,660
And I think I uploaded a video of me just kind of practicing it. And I have a friend

654
00:36:54,660 --> 00:37:00,500
at the time, videographer, really into like nature and to think that video featured a

655
00:37:00,500 --> 00:37:08,060
lot of water. And he wanted to sort of set that. And I was really inspired by the way

656
00:37:08,060 --> 00:37:14,740
he set that piece, because for two reasons. One, I think any sort of collaboration always,

657
00:37:14,740 --> 00:37:18,940
you know, adds to the adds to the greater impact. So I think it made it much more effective

658
00:37:18,940 --> 00:37:27,380
than playing alone ever could. And two, because in the same way as when you have, you know,

659
00:37:27,380 --> 00:37:31,740
you play something for a great artist and you walk away from that meeting with this

660
00:37:31,740 --> 00:37:36,700
so inspired with this new perspective, that's also possible with these kind of collaborations,

661
00:37:36,700 --> 00:37:43,940
the way he felt that piece made me see it in a completely new light. So I really value

662
00:37:43,940 --> 00:37:49,020
when I can learn. Ultimately, it's about learning from other people, regardless of

663
00:37:49,020 --> 00:37:53,940
the medium. And I think the challenge as artists is to just make sure we remain open.

664
00:37:53,940 --> 00:38:00,020
Hey, TPP friends and listeners, the piano part is in its third season. Thanks to all

665
00:38:00,020 --> 00:38:05,620
of you for watching or listening to every episode since its launch in 2020. I started

666
00:38:05,620 --> 00:38:11,300
this show with a simple question I had in mind for quite some time, which is how can

667
00:38:11,300 --> 00:38:16,580
we as classical pianists and music educators present the beautiful classical music tradition

668
00:38:16,580 --> 00:38:21,860
to the 21st century audience in a fun, contemporary and engaging way. It's been an incredible

669
00:38:21,860 --> 00:38:27,240
journey for the last three years. I love what I do through this podcast, providing a platform

670
00:38:27,240 --> 00:38:33,340
for pianists and educators to reflect and discuss freely how we can keep the classical

671
00:38:33,340 --> 00:38:40,020
music industry thriving and relevant in this rapidly changing world. Now more than ever,

672
00:38:40,020 --> 00:38:45,220
I need your support so that I can continue my work by bringing you highly valuable content

673
00:38:45,220 --> 00:38:50,780
bi-weekly by interviewing groundbreakers in the industry. Your support will go directly

674
00:38:50,780 --> 00:38:57,100
to all the costs of the piano part, such as a yearly subscription to the podcast hosting

675
00:38:57,100 --> 00:39:03,700
platform, the software I use for high quality recording sessions and tech gear, as well

676
00:39:03,700 --> 00:39:10,300
as all the hours I spend researching and audio and video editing. You can make a one-time

677
00:39:10,300 --> 00:39:15,900
donation or monthly pledge by clicking the PayPal link in the show notes or going to

678
00:39:15,900 --> 00:39:22,320
TPP's website at the piano part.com. As a thank you, you will receive the piano parts

679
00:39:22,320 --> 00:39:29,860
fun logo sticker in the mail. So please support my show today and don't forget to subscribe,

680
00:39:29,860 --> 00:39:34,920
continue listening and tell your friends and colleagues about the piano part. Let's now

681
00:39:34,920 --> 00:39:41,540
talk about music business. You went to school in Italy, right? Yes, it's a, Stabacone is

682
00:39:41,540 --> 00:39:48,140
the business school in Milan. And it says one of the 5% of business schools in the world

683
00:39:48,140 --> 00:39:53,780
to hold a triple down accreditation. So what is this triple down accreditation, first of

684
00:39:53,780 --> 00:40:00,420
all? So it's, it's a very international school. So fortunately, you know, the, the program

685
00:40:00,420 --> 00:40:06,820
was in, was in English, so I had more time to learn my Italian off hours, but it's one

686
00:40:06,820 --> 00:40:13,220
of the best, one of the top five in Europe in terms of business schools. So speaking

687
00:40:13,220 --> 00:40:18,380
of, you know, collaborating and meeting other people, my students were from a very international

688
00:40:18,380 --> 00:40:24,060
background. I wasn't the only American, but there were also, you know, many other nationalities

689
00:40:24,060 --> 00:40:29,500
represented. So it was a great learning experience. Did you go to this school during pandemic?

690
00:40:29,500 --> 00:40:38,860
So kind of, I went from 2021 and I graduated in 2022. So not 2020, but it was still, there

691
00:40:38,860 --> 00:40:43,620
were still some restrictions, I think in New York City and some in Italy, although as we

692
00:40:43,620 --> 00:40:49,180
know, Italy was hit the hardest. Right. Yes, I remember. Now, what made you decide to pursue

693
00:40:49,180 --> 00:40:54,940
a business degree? Did this idea come during the pandemic where we all have to think about

694
00:40:54,940 --> 00:41:03,940
our future? Yeah, that was, I think for all of us, a time to really reflect. I felt the

695
00:41:03,940 --> 00:41:08,820
first thing I felt I really need to broaden my skills as much as I love being at the piano

696
00:41:08,820 --> 00:41:16,380
and as obsessive of a practicing person I was, you know, during my teenage years and

697
00:41:16,380 --> 00:41:21,500
during my undergrad and my master's, I felt like there had to be something more. I really

698
00:41:21,500 --> 00:41:27,340
wanted to learn the sorts of skills that would essentially help me, you know, whatever I

699
00:41:27,340 --> 00:41:32,880
end up doing. And the good thing, the reason I chose Stavocconi was that they have kind

700
00:41:32,880 --> 00:41:39,140
of specializations within the school. You can specialize in the luxury sector, for example,

701
00:41:39,140 --> 00:41:43,980
if you want to work for luxury companies or you can specialize in the cultural sector,

702
00:41:43,980 --> 00:41:49,340
which is what I did, even, you know, hospitality. So they have these ways that you can make

703
00:41:49,340 --> 00:41:56,100
it more targeted or customized to ultimately how you want to use these skills. Right. What

704
00:41:56,100 --> 00:42:02,940
specifically you felt like you were missing out from your life that ultimately pursued

705
00:42:02,940 --> 00:42:07,340
this degree? Because it's very different from music itself, playing the piano, right?

706
00:42:07,340 --> 00:42:17,740
It is. So music has such a large impact as a medium. However, the market itself is extremely

707
00:42:17,740 --> 00:42:24,980
small. And for me, when I saw, you know, a classical market had already been struggling

708
00:42:24,980 --> 00:42:30,820
even before the pandemic. And when I saw how many changes needed to happen during the pandemic,

709
00:42:30,820 --> 00:42:36,100
I mean, especially digital wise, recording industry, whether or not live performances

710
00:42:36,100 --> 00:42:39,940
would even be consistently possible again, you know, we were all thinking that in 2020,

711
00:42:39,940 --> 00:42:46,340
I just felt like I needed to have the option to broaden and to be able to see, okay, how

712
00:42:46,340 --> 00:42:51,300
do other markets work and how can this be applied to classical music? We talk so much

713
00:42:51,300 --> 00:42:56,220
about in business school about like, you know, the actual product, right. And that really

714
00:42:56,220 --> 00:43:03,180
applies to every field. And I think that if you understand the business side of things,

715
00:43:03,180 --> 00:43:08,140
you can ultimately make a better product, make a better experience that will reach more

716
00:43:08,140 --> 00:43:13,060
people. Right. I don't subscribe to the view that classical music, just because of tradition,

717
00:43:13,060 --> 00:43:18,860
is immune to market forces. I think we all we wish it would be that way, but it's not.

718
00:43:18,860 --> 00:43:25,260
It's very interesting with this two year, I guess, two years of being abroad in Italy,

719
00:43:25,260 --> 00:43:29,100
this international business school, what did you gain? So in terms of the program was very

720
00:43:29,100 --> 00:43:35,060
accelerated. So I really learned how to balance a lot because I was also playing not so much

721
00:43:35,060 --> 00:43:39,860
in the beginning, but towards the tail end, that was that was difficult. It was very,

722
00:43:39,860 --> 00:43:45,300
very concentrated with many projects. And many projects, not only that were individually

723
00:43:45,300 --> 00:43:49,700
based, but many projects that were group based. And so I learned just working with people.

724
00:43:49,700 --> 00:43:54,500
I equally got a lot of the experience and things that were sort of extrinsic to the

725
00:43:54,500 --> 00:44:00,740
program, just living abroad. And it's just being immersed in a totally new culture. I

726
00:44:00,740 --> 00:44:08,420
mean, I had to learn Italian very quickly. Being forced to adapt is what keeps artists

727
00:44:08,420 --> 00:44:15,180
creative. Absolutely. I agree. Yeah. I actually wanted to there's just an anecdote. So we

728
00:44:15,180 --> 00:44:20,100
had this CEO, or I guess I think technically the term is superintendent of La Scala come

729
00:44:20,100 --> 00:44:27,460
to talk to the business school students. And one thing that he said, Dominique Meyer is

730
00:44:27,460 --> 00:44:32,220
his name. One thing that he said to all of us was almost to force ourselves to kind of

731
00:44:32,220 --> 00:44:37,900
change our surroundings, because we learn so much when we just keep active and keep

732
00:44:37,900 --> 00:44:44,620
moving. Not I not only as creatives, but just as business people. I thought that was really,

733
00:44:44,620 --> 00:44:50,300
really inspiring, especially from, you know, someone who's stands at, you know, the greatest

734
00:44:50,300 --> 00:44:56,380
opera house and then the world. Because that really does apply not only to us business

735
00:44:56,380 --> 00:45:00,140
school students that he was talking to, but also to artists.

736
00:45:00,140 --> 00:45:06,140
So let's talk about really business itself, and marketing and branding. So let's start

737
00:45:06,140 --> 00:45:12,580
with this word business. So among our fellow classical musicians, when I use the word business,

738
00:45:12,580 --> 00:45:17,820
sometimes people correct me, oh, I'm not doing any business, or let's say, oh, you're such

739
00:45:17,820 --> 00:45:23,680
an entrepreneur, as in I was complimenting this person, because she has done so much

740
00:45:23,680 --> 00:45:31,020
with this, you know, creating this organization. And but then they often express themselves

741
00:45:31,020 --> 00:45:37,580
as such, like with that such a disgusted expression on their faces, then they deny. And then some

742
00:45:37,580 --> 00:45:43,020
of these people say, I don't do business, I'm an artist, and music is a holy thing,

743
00:45:43,020 --> 00:45:47,500
and making a business out of something so sacred, like playing Bach is not my thing.

744
00:45:47,500 --> 00:45:54,960
And so what do you think about this? I understand their perspective, because the way I see it,

745
00:45:54,960 --> 00:46:00,220
if you're looking at, I guess, products and markets, classical music is something that's

746
00:46:00,220 --> 00:46:07,340
such a human experience, that it's you cannot really, it's incredibly subjective, you obviously

747
00:46:07,340 --> 00:46:17,420
cannot quantify it. At the same time, we live in the real real world. And I think we have

748
00:46:17,420 --> 00:46:24,620
to be able to communicate that, I would say, unique selling proposition that that like

749
00:46:24,620 --> 00:46:30,560
incredible value, we have to be able to communicate it to more people, because there is a market

750
00:46:30,560 --> 00:46:37,180
for it. And it all depends on how much we can adapt the sort of experience we provide.

751
00:46:37,180 --> 00:46:43,340
That makes sense. Yes, I have so much respect in general for, you know, just obviously classical

752
00:46:43,340 --> 00:46:46,980
musicians, you know, being one I know how much how much work it takes. And so I really

753
00:46:46,980 --> 00:46:52,500
I respect the hesitancy, because it's almost like it doesn't feel sort of pure to think

754
00:46:52,500 --> 00:46:57,420
of it from a business perspective. I think that's probably the source. Yeah, when you

755
00:46:57,420 --> 00:47:00,260
talk to like the examples you're giving me, that's probably the source that they feel

756
00:47:00,260 --> 00:47:08,380
like this is something that's so much higher. But it is. Yeah, it absolutely is. But nobody's

757
00:47:08,380 --> 00:47:12,380
going to know that if it doesn't reach the real world, right? Right, right. Absolutely.

758
00:47:12,380 --> 00:47:17,420
Yeah. Nobody's gonna know that if it's just in the practice room. So when the pandemic

759
00:47:17,420 --> 00:47:24,160
started, I started thinking well, even before I just felt the huge disconnect between the

760
00:47:24,160 --> 00:47:29,540
general audience and then the classical musicians, this is one of the reasons I wanted to start

761
00:47:29,540 --> 00:47:37,660
this podcast just to really explore and discover what's missing and how we can fill the gap.

762
00:47:37,660 --> 00:47:43,360
It's a part of the branding marketing in general. So it's different to brand an artist versus

763
00:47:43,360 --> 00:47:48,420
branding the actual music itself. One thing that makes me really happy to see that's a

764
00:47:48,420 --> 00:47:53,160
lot of progress is that more musicians are more comfortable talking about the works they

765
00:47:53,160 --> 00:47:59,520
play. I think that that's in terms of a movement towards change from what I can see.

766
00:47:59,520 --> 00:48:05,100
That's the number one change that's been happening. And I think people love it because, you know,

767
00:48:05,100 --> 00:48:11,420
as performers, I mean, it's even we're actors in a way. I mean, we have the piano as a medium,

768
00:48:11,420 --> 00:48:17,180
but essentially we are actors. We're communicating something else. And I think that if we can

769
00:48:17,180 --> 00:48:22,580
actually talk directly to an audience that that contextualizes a lot and that's something

770
00:48:22,580 --> 00:48:28,220
that's a very it's effective and it doesn't require so much more than just two minutes

771
00:48:28,220 --> 00:48:33,340
before before a piece, you know, or before like a collection of pieces. But in terms

772
00:48:33,340 --> 00:48:40,220
of branding, I think the challenge really relates to a lot of what I was talking about

773
00:48:40,220 --> 00:48:46,540
at the outset of the interview, which is programming, figuring out what pieces work when and for

774
00:48:46,540 --> 00:48:55,460
what occasion. For example, some Hoffman pieces are so virtuosic and so difficult. And maybe

775
00:48:55,460 --> 00:48:59,980
an audience just wants to hear, you know, Moonlight Sonata. And that's fine. You know,

776
00:48:59,980 --> 00:49:05,860
I think there's a reluctance among pianists to it's like it's like almost like it's too

777
00:49:05,860 --> 00:49:13,340
cliche to play. So I think that we we have to be aware of how the incredibly high value

778
00:49:13,340 --> 00:49:18,900
of our art can also distance ourselves. And that it's again, it's always a double edged

779
00:49:18,900 --> 00:49:24,460
thing. Yeah, but I also feel like giving the audience some sort of a context, right, rather

780
00:49:24,460 --> 00:49:31,100
than just playing those obscure pieces or pieces that are just too high end. But then

781
00:49:31,100 --> 00:49:38,100
we can bring that high end piece to the place where it's approachable by giving them the

782
00:49:38,100 --> 00:49:42,660
context. Right. And it's yeah. And again, it's much more difficult with music, because

783
00:49:42,660 --> 00:49:50,620
for example, with a museum, you know, I could see in a collection some really unknown artist

784
00:49:50,620 --> 00:49:54,900
using a really sophisticated and incredible technique. And I just see it and I form an

785
00:49:54,900 --> 00:49:58,900
impression. It's like, that's amazing. And I move on with music because it's something

786
00:49:58,900 --> 00:50:04,060
that's more abstract, that's unfolding in time. It's almost like we have to work harder

787
00:50:04,060 --> 00:50:08,380
to make a statement. We have to work harder to make it more accessible. And I really I

788
00:50:08,380 --> 00:50:14,120
admire so much artists that know really have a really strong grasp on how to program for

789
00:50:14,120 --> 00:50:20,140
different people and not just about what the you know, the artist likes to play, but what

790
00:50:20,140 --> 00:50:24,740
the audience might appreciate and is able to kind of navigate. It's almost like a you

791
00:50:24,740 --> 00:50:30,820
know, a chef. It's very much it's like you have to like curate a menu in a way.

792
00:50:30,820 --> 00:50:37,420
Definitely. Well, that's a good analogy. Absolutely. Absolutely. I think this is something that,

793
00:50:37,420 --> 00:50:43,980
you know, as the 21st century pianist, we all have to do, you know, because the audience

794
00:50:43,980 --> 00:50:50,060
are not really created for you anymore. You have to go and get them. Do you think? Absolutely.

795
00:50:50,060 --> 00:50:56,820
Yeah. By getting this venue to perform doesn't mean the audience will come automatically.

796
00:50:56,820 --> 00:51:02,420
You actually have to go out and get them. And they are there as in like audiences are

797
00:51:02,420 --> 00:51:04,940
waiting for you, right? Somewhere in the in the world.

798
00:51:04,940 --> 00:51:10,220
They're there. And I mean, but it's the same in any even okay, like look at technology.

799
00:51:10,220 --> 00:51:15,260
Everybody uses technology. There are always tech products coming out. Even if a tech product

800
00:51:15,260 --> 00:51:22,620
is amazing and great and stylish, it still needs to be sold. It still needs to be marketed.

801
00:51:22,620 --> 00:51:28,940
We all know Apple. We all like a lot of us, you know, have like iPhones, love iPhones,

802
00:51:28,940 --> 00:51:32,700
but we wouldn't know about how incredible it was unless it was marketed, unless it was

803
00:51:32,700 --> 00:51:37,180
sold. It's not just because of its superior design and superior quality that we're just

804
00:51:37,180 --> 00:51:42,140
going to go out and experience it. Right. So, you know, that's what I mean by the fact

805
00:51:42,140 --> 00:51:46,780
that it's like, yeah, class, you know, classical music has this incredible tradition and it's

806
00:51:46,780 --> 00:51:51,780
almost like an elite sport, but we also live in the real world and we need to like we need

807
00:51:51,780 --> 00:51:57,300
to work within those parameters in a way. Right. So what's what's the secret there?

808
00:51:57,300 --> 00:52:02,580
Where is that? Does the magic happen when you finally discover your audience and really

809
00:52:02,580 --> 00:52:08,100
sync with them? You know, just like you mentioned about Apple, it's they're not just this wonderful,

810
00:52:08,100 --> 00:52:13,340
highly designed products. Right. But there is a magic that happened and it's like, well,

811
00:52:13,340 --> 00:52:18,260
I have this Apple iPhone or Apple products. How does this magic can happen?

812
00:52:18,260 --> 00:52:24,500
Well, I think the one thing and this maybe is a controversial opinion, but I think pianists

813
00:52:24,500 --> 00:52:30,620
need to not be so reliant on how do I say this, the infrastructure of the industry,

814
00:52:30,620 --> 00:52:38,100
like not be reliant on Asians, managers, venues. Social media has been something that's I've

815
00:52:38,100 --> 00:52:42,500
found really great success with. When I when I say venues, I don't mean I mean, I think

816
00:52:42,500 --> 00:52:48,820
artists need to be artists need to be able to just contact on their own. So many times

817
00:52:48,820 --> 00:52:53,660
we think that an Asian, if we play, you know, amazingly, an Asian is just going to kind

818
00:52:53,660 --> 00:52:58,540
of pick us up or a manager will pick us up. Or, I mean, even like if we win a competition,

819
00:52:58,540 --> 00:53:02,500
even, you know, winning winning an international competition, I mean, it does not guarantee.

820
00:53:02,500 --> 00:53:08,940
Right. Absolutely. And the reason for that is because careers aren't made by competitions.

821
00:53:08,940 --> 00:53:14,900
They're made by other people. Amen. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. Yeah. It's really by people.

822
00:53:14,900 --> 00:53:19,340
Right. Yeah. Everything is a people profession. That's like this is like the revelation I

823
00:53:19,340 --> 00:53:24,180
honestly had, like in the pandemic, because we go to school and we're sort of boxed in

824
00:53:24,180 --> 00:53:27,740
in music school to think like this is what the career is and this is what the career

825
00:53:27,740 --> 00:53:32,420
is going to be. But we don't really realize that the career is made by people who are

826
00:53:32,420 --> 00:53:37,620
the same as us just on the other side of things. And we need to be able to communicate as people

827
00:53:37,620 --> 00:53:43,820
what our product as much as I know, probably some people hate that. But we need to be able

828
00:53:43,820 --> 00:53:48,100
to communicate what that is. It's not going to speak for itself is basically what I'm

829
00:53:48,100 --> 00:53:53,260
trying to say. Right. So, you know, by doing our work in a plane beautifully, it's just

830
00:53:53,260 --> 00:53:58,860
a display of the product. But to connect this product to the general audience, that's another

831
00:53:58,860 --> 00:54:04,100
that's the marketing. That's the branding. Right. I would say so. Now, I want to know

832
00:54:04,100 --> 00:54:10,020
your thoughts on being present and having a footprint in the digital world. You are

833
00:54:10,020 --> 00:54:16,180
very much active on social media. I enjoy your posts. And I do as much as I can to and

834
00:54:16,180 --> 00:54:20,980
then I'm gaining some momentum right now. It's not about popularity, but creating your

835
00:54:20,980 --> 00:54:25,980
own audience. Some people are hesitant about still having to have the footprint in the

836
00:54:25,980 --> 00:54:30,860
digital world. So, you know, including music streaming services and of course, the social

837
00:54:30,860 --> 00:54:35,980
media from Instagram to TikTok to so many others. So it's interesting you mentioned

838
00:54:35,980 --> 00:54:40,260
sorry, social media because I honestly wish I started earlier. I again, I didn't start

839
00:54:40,260 --> 00:54:46,260
until 2020. Two reasons I will the first reason I was saying videos of me playing is because

840
00:54:46,260 --> 00:54:50,020
I needed to hear myself objectively. And the second reason was like, OK, I should probably

841
00:54:50,020 --> 00:54:54,180
share this to someone because I have no live concerts anymore and I want to feel like I

842
00:54:54,180 --> 00:54:58,940
have goals. Sometimes, especially with live stream, it's great to have the pressure of

843
00:54:58,940 --> 00:55:05,620
people watching in real time to just keep you in shape. So that's kind of how it started.

844
00:55:05,620 --> 00:55:09,740
I'm not as consistent as I probably should be. I really admire people who are able to

845
00:55:09,740 --> 00:55:16,480
post even every week, let alone every day. I like to kind of just post a lot of my favorites

846
00:55:16,480 --> 00:55:20,780
and some kind of more famous pieces. One thing I love to do is, especially with pianists

847
00:55:20,780 --> 00:55:24,340
who follow me, is I love to post something that's a little bit unknown and have people

848
00:55:24,340 --> 00:55:28,940
kind of guess, you know, just make it really interactive. That's always fun. But the most

849
00:55:28,940 --> 00:55:34,060
rewarding thing about social media for me actually goes back to Hoffman because I had

850
00:55:34,060 --> 00:55:37,820
some pianists tell me that they never knew Hoffman composed and they really like his

851
00:55:37,820 --> 00:55:43,660
pieces and they're starting to look at his pieces. And that just made me so happy because

852
00:55:43,660 --> 00:55:47,940
it makes me feel like I can... It's not just about the fact that I like it and other people

853
00:55:47,940 --> 00:55:55,060
like it too. It's about the fact that I shared something that was new. And so that's been

854
00:55:55,060 --> 00:55:57,860
really rewarding.

855
00:55:57,860 --> 00:56:05,440
And I think it's really more relevant these days to have this as one of the ways to create

856
00:56:05,440 --> 00:56:07,980
your community and audience, right?

857
00:56:07,980 --> 00:56:13,780
Yeah. So what are you going to do with your music business degree? Are you going to build

858
00:56:13,780 --> 00:56:19,420
your own business? I mean, being a pianist is almost like having to have your own business

859
00:56:19,420 --> 00:56:22,540
anyway. But what would you like to do with your degree?

860
00:56:22,540 --> 00:56:29,220
So it was definitely more strictly a business degree, not really music business, but I definitely

861
00:56:29,220 --> 00:56:30,220
feel...

862
00:56:30,220 --> 00:56:32,220
Oh, that's right. I'm sorry. Yeah, it's a business degree.

863
00:56:32,220 --> 00:56:36,300
No, no. I was going to say that I definitely feel that being a pianist is already very

864
00:56:36,300 --> 00:56:44,180
entrepreneurial, be able to create your own opportunities. So ultimately, I feel that

865
00:56:44,180 --> 00:56:50,300
the business skills I learned, and especially the sales and the marketing skills are going

866
00:56:50,300 --> 00:56:55,740
to help me in their own vein, but also going to help me figure out how to contextualize

867
00:56:55,740 --> 00:56:59,260
my piano playing into more broadly what I want to do.

868
00:56:59,260 --> 00:57:01,900
It's funny because I feel like I'm starting to see, especially since the pandemic, a lot

869
00:57:01,900 --> 00:57:05,860
of musicians are getting business certificates and that kind of thing. And so if you're listening,

870
00:57:05,860 --> 00:57:08,620
I highly recommend because I learned a lot.

871
00:57:08,620 --> 00:57:15,980
You know, honestly, I was studying during pandemic about marketing. So I read all Seth

872
00:57:15,980 --> 00:57:23,220
Golden's book, Purple Cow and everything. And then also I took some free courses online,

873
00:57:23,220 --> 00:57:30,300
like Coursera offers free courses, like intro classes. And also I had so many marketing

874
00:57:30,300 --> 00:57:35,100
coaches. I don't know how much money I spent on learning about marketing.

875
00:57:35,100 --> 00:57:36,420
For your studio.

876
00:57:36,420 --> 00:57:42,380
For my studio and for my own sake. And then also, yeah. And then I learned a lot. And

877
00:57:42,380 --> 00:57:48,700
then it really, because learning from scratch. So I went through this ups and downs of learning

878
00:57:48,700 --> 00:57:54,700
curve, right? If you know what I mean. Yes. Yeah. It's completely a new territory for

879
00:57:54,700 --> 00:58:01,060
me. And then I thought marketing, I thought of one marketing was this way, but it was

880
00:58:01,060 --> 00:58:05,660
completely different. It was really about people. It was all about, you know, having

881
00:58:05,660 --> 00:58:11,420
them understand what you do. And wow, boy, I was an eye opening thing.

882
00:58:11,420 --> 00:58:15,340
So something else I wanted to say that you're actually, that might be interesting for our

883
00:58:15,340 --> 00:58:20,920
listeners is that I think part of the reason that it's especially difficult is because

884
00:58:20,920 --> 00:58:29,320
our art and elite artists are so perfectionist. And so what we do is we spend like three years

885
00:58:29,320 --> 00:58:35,660
before performing a program for the first time. And this is the opposite to more business

886
00:58:35,660 --> 00:58:40,940
like more business oriented fields where you just have to like learn on the go. Like there,

887
00:58:40,940 --> 00:58:45,580
I mean, you can try to prepare for three years. You can try. You can try to do as much as

888
00:58:45,580 --> 00:58:49,220
possible, but you're never going to get all the information. You're never going to have

889
00:58:49,220 --> 00:58:56,020
all the data. You just have to adjust as you go. And that is the absolute opposite of piano

890
00:58:56,020 --> 00:59:02,300
playing, the absolute opposite of classical music. And so that's, it's, you know, it's

891
00:59:02,300 --> 00:59:06,100
so, and then sometimes when I think about it, and maybe this again will help some of

892
00:59:06,100 --> 00:59:11,820
our listeners. When I think about it, sometimes I learned the most when I performed a piece

893
00:59:11,820 --> 00:59:17,360
that was not that ready. You know, like I gave myself permission to fail. I gave myself

894
00:59:17,360 --> 00:59:21,780
permission to fall flat on my face, just leave the ego out of it. Just, this is a learning

895
00:59:21,780 --> 00:59:26,860
experience and nobody cares in a way. And that's kind of the attitude that you have

896
00:59:26,860 --> 00:59:31,300
to, that you have to have. That's so difficult. So that's just something I want. I, yeah.

897
00:59:31,300 --> 00:59:35,340
I wanted to say when you're talking about the marketing learning curve, right. But also,

898
00:59:35,340 --> 00:59:40,980
yeah, you, once again, you inspired me to say this, but I feel like we practice so much

899
00:59:40,980 --> 00:59:48,420
and perfect our artistry so much that we forget about audience. We are really constantly concerned

900
00:59:48,420 --> 00:59:52,980
about our performance, right? You know, make it perfect for, to play this phrase, this

901
00:59:52,980 --> 00:59:59,780
fingers, this, this tempo. Then we forget our audience. Then, you know, I ended up being

902
00:59:59,780 --> 01:00:06,220
just play, bow and leave and not thinking about them, not engaging them at all. You

903
01:00:06,220 --> 01:00:11,340
don't have to necessarily speak to them, but there is gotta be some sort of like a web

904
01:00:11,340 --> 01:00:16,460
and flow in a relationship to your audience, no? Rather than just, right. Yeah.

905
01:00:16,460 --> 01:00:21,940
Well, it reminds me of a comment my teacher made when I was, I was running through a master's

906
01:00:21,940 --> 01:00:27,100
program and I remember this was actually a master class and something that the artist

907
01:00:27,100 --> 01:00:32,420
said that was very insightful was that, you know, I understand, you know, you have a more,

908
01:00:32,420 --> 01:00:37,900
some, sometimes more introverted interpretation, introverted approach. And I, it's some people,

909
01:00:37,900 --> 01:00:41,140
they don't believe this about me, but I am very introverted. You know, like, I mean,

910
01:00:41,140 --> 01:00:45,780
I can talk a lot, I can talk to people, but at the end of the day, that's just my personality.

911
01:00:45,780 --> 01:00:49,260
And so one thing he said was that you need to remember that you're playing for people.

912
01:00:49,260 --> 01:00:53,060
It's not about changing your interpretation, but it's just about playing for them, playing

913
01:00:53,060 --> 01:00:59,900
to impact them, not just to, not just to live in your own world of ideas. And so it's, yeah,

914
01:00:59,900 --> 01:01:02,900
that's something that's very relevant. I mean, if we forget about marketing and business

915
01:01:02,900 --> 01:01:08,220
for a second, that's very relevant to us as, as performers, for sure.

916
01:01:08,220 --> 01:01:13,380
Now we're really getting into this philosophical question. So first one, what is your thought

917
01:01:13,380 --> 01:01:19,940
on keeping the classical music industry or classical music itself relevant and thriving

918
01:01:19,940 --> 01:01:26,980
in this fast paced society? And then especially in this post pandemic era?

919
01:01:26,980 --> 01:01:30,780
I think that house concerts are going to become a lot more relevant. They already kind of

920
01:01:30,780 --> 01:01:36,220
are. I think that people are going to be less inclined to sit through the official concert

921
01:01:36,220 --> 01:01:40,620
hall experience. I mean, still, if it's like, you know, especially, I mean, we're in New

922
01:01:40,620 --> 01:01:44,560
York city, like there's still Lincoln center, Carnegie hall. I mean, they're still bringing

923
01:01:44,560 --> 01:01:50,180
in people, but I think a lot of patrons are wanting to host people independently and they

924
01:01:50,180 --> 01:01:54,740
want more intimate experiences. And two things that are going to be really necessary for

925
01:01:54,740 --> 01:02:00,700
artists with that. One is the programming. Okay. So one A is programming. One B is being

926
01:02:00,700 --> 01:02:06,380
able to play with people 10 feet away from you. The whole like state, I mean, the idea

927
01:02:06,380 --> 01:02:10,860
of really the venue and the stage. I mean, I'm not saying it's dying. Like I'm not,

928
01:02:10,860 --> 01:02:15,660
I'm saying people still go to concerts, obviously, but there are so many more house concerts

929
01:02:15,660 --> 01:02:20,300
that are going on than before the pandemic. And so many more opportunities with that.

930
01:02:20,300 --> 01:02:24,700
A lot of these people want you like the artist to pitch to them, to pitch the program, to

931
01:02:24,700 --> 01:02:27,820
pitch, you know, everything. So that's going to be a lot more relevant. And that's going

932
01:02:27,820 --> 01:02:33,580
to push a lot of artists to definitely become more entrepreneurial. It's, it's, it's also,

933
01:02:33,580 --> 01:02:37,500
you know, a collaborative because you're collaborating with the presenter more closely. Like again,

934
01:02:37,500 --> 01:02:41,740
a lot of this, I call it like infrastructure because it's just so like, it's just the way

935
01:02:41,740 --> 01:02:45,620
you think the way you're taught to think things are supposed to be with like winning a major

936
01:02:45,620 --> 01:02:50,900
competition and like just touring. Like you expect, I mean, you expect someone to, you

937
01:02:50,900 --> 01:02:53,980
know, when you get to that level, just take care of that for you. But that just doesn't

938
01:02:53,980 --> 01:02:59,940
always happen. But that's a great thing because that house concerts give more, you know, performance

939
01:02:59,940 --> 01:03:06,100
opportunities for artists. I think, I think, I think classical music will never die. Classical

940
01:03:06,100 --> 01:03:12,140
music will always be in fashion. It's classic. It's timeless. But I think that artists are

941
01:03:12,140 --> 01:03:17,340
going to have to be a lot more flexible in order to reach the kind of audiences they

942
01:03:17,340 --> 01:03:18,340
want.

943
01:03:18,340 --> 01:03:23,020
So maybe you already answered this question, but how can we as classical musicians reach

944
01:03:23,020 --> 01:03:26,420
out to the 21st century audience in a creative way?

945
01:03:26,420 --> 01:03:31,820
Can I just say something funny that I was thinking about? I think so often like artists,

946
01:03:31,820 --> 01:03:37,260
they don't want to cut their pieces into like 15, 30 second segments. But something that

947
01:03:37,260 --> 01:03:41,420
I was thinking about is that, I mean, how long are the auditions we go through? They're

948
01:03:41,420 --> 01:03:45,780
like 10 minutes and we play like five pieces. The jury is like, you know, listening, you

949
01:03:45,780 --> 01:03:49,340
know, you can tell so much about someone from just 30 seconds. So I really don't understand

950
01:03:49,340 --> 01:03:54,260
this like hesitancy to post just excerpts on social media. It's just kind of, I really

951
01:03:54,260 --> 01:03:58,700
like what you're doing with in terms of the podcast, in terms of, you know, outside of

952
01:03:58,700 --> 01:04:02,940
the piano, just accessing people. I did an interview series during the pandemic. There

953
01:04:02,940 --> 01:04:09,340
was a written blog, just interviewing other pianists who did things outside of the piano.

954
01:04:09,340 --> 01:04:15,580
I had a pianist who worked a lot with dancers. I had a pianist who was also a magician.

955
01:04:15,580 --> 01:04:21,060
Wow. Yeah, yeah, it was really awesome. So that was cool. So I think taking ownership

956
01:04:21,060 --> 01:04:26,380
of the conversation is what I think. And that is so much outside of the piano and like what

957
01:04:26,380 --> 01:04:29,140
you're doing and what I'm doing. It's very important.

958
01:04:29,140 --> 01:04:34,940
Well, thank you. Now, what sort of skill set is required as a pianist of the 21st century

959
01:04:34,940 --> 01:04:39,860
and particularly in the, yeah, once again, post pandemic era?

960
01:04:39,860 --> 01:04:47,100
The ability to spot opportunities. I think that's for anything though. I think, and I

961
01:04:47,100 --> 01:04:52,820
would say more broadly, an entrepreneurial skill set is really essential. And in the

962
01:04:52,820 --> 01:04:58,220
same way that every day we practice, we have to look at the text like it's new. Every day

963
01:04:58,220 --> 01:05:02,780
we have, you know, our own endeavors. I mean, there's so much that's just changing in our

964
01:05:02,780 --> 01:05:08,140
world and in the market that we have to be able to be flexible.

965
01:05:08,140 --> 01:05:11,140
Advice for young musicians?

966
01:05:11,140 --> 01:05:15,020
From a musical point of view, learn as much as possible because literally everything I

967
01:05:15,020 --> 01:05:20,540
learned from before the age of 16 is like, I wish I learned more. Because we have so

968
01:05:20,540 --> 01:05:24,620
much, so much to literally learn as much as possible.

969
01:05:24,620 --> 01:05:35,020
From a more life standpoint, don't be afraid to study something else in college or in conservatory.

970
01:05:35,020 --> 01:05:42,540
I think conservatories are doing such an amazing job of adding sort of these peripheral programs.

971
01:05:42,540 --> 01:05:47,140
Like a lot of conservatories now have programs to teach musicians how to record themselves,

972
01:05:47,140 --> 01:05:52,220
sort of like audio engineering programs. A lot of music schools now have these entrepreneurship

973
01:05:52,220 --> 01:05:57,580
departments. Just things that are more, that really place what we're doing in the practice

974
01:05:57,580 --> 01:06:04,060
room in the broader context. Don't be afraid to do that because I was, remember as an undergrad,

975
01:06:04,060 --> 01:06:09,860
I was very stressed because I was really the only pianist that was doing a dual degree.

976
01:06:09,860 --> 01:06:16,180
And I was very insecure about feeling, I really felt a little bit judged for that. Like I

977
01:06:16,180 --> 01:06:21,420
wasn't as serious about just doing piano or like I didn't think that I would quote unquote

978
01:06:21,420 --> 01:06:27,360
make it. So I was taking another degree and looking back, I'm really glad I did that.

979
01:06:27,360 --> 01:06:31,780
And so I think just you have to be able, you have to be able to see what other skills you

980
01:06:31,780 --> 01:06:38,860
have and how that can sort of broaden your impact as a musician. Does that make sense?

981
01:06:38,860 --> 01:06:40,820
Yeah, totally.

982
01:06:40,820 --> 01:06:46,260
And I, yeah, I just think that you shouldn't, like we're so hard on ourselves, especially

983
01:06:46,260 --> 01:06:51,020
as pianists. And I think that the amazing thing is that if we look at ourselves as a

984
01:06:51,020 --> 01:06:58,020
person, all the combination of skills that help us to play so well, if we nurture some

985
01:06:58,020 --> 01:07:02,660
of those other skills, that can actually lead to a more fulfilling career in the long run,

986
01:07:02,660 --> 01:07:08,020
both as a pianist and as an entrepreneur. So don't ever feel like you have to be put

987
01:07:08,020 --> 01:07:10,140
in a box is kind of what I'm trying to say.

988
01:07:10,140 --> 01:07:11,900
So what's your next step?

989
01:07:11,900 --> 01:07:17,540
I have a lot of music to learn. I have a lot of music to learn this summer. I have a couple

990
01:07:17,540 --> 01:07:24,700
actually, the very next step is I have a couple of video collaborations. I work with a couple

991
01:07:24,700 --> 01:07:32,820
wonderful piano centers, one in Manhattan, one in New Jersey. So I'm just producing video

992
01:07:32,820 --> 01:07:39,620
content, which obviously helps my portfolio. So I'm always preparing for that. And it's

993
01:07:39,620 --> 01:07:44,140
a little bit stressful recording for me. I definitely prefer live, but we're in the digital

994
01:07:44,140 --> 01:07:47,820
age. So I've been practicing a lot.

995
01:07:47,820 --> 01:07:52,540
Wonderful. Miriam, this has been a fun and inspiring conversation.

996
01:07:52,540 --> 01:07:55,100
Likewise. Thank you for inviting me.

997
01:07:55,100 --> 01:07:59,660
Well, thank you. It was very educational too. So, but before I let you go, we have one more

998
01:07:59,660 --> 01:08:05,740
thing to do. It's called the piano pause rapid fire questions. And this is a part of the

999
01:08:05,740 --> 01:08:10,460
show where I get to ask questions to each guest. Now here's a little warning. As silly

1000
01:08:10,460 --> 01:08:16,740
as these questions may sound, your answers may reveal who you truly are. So are you ready?

1001
01:08:16,740 --> 01:08:17,740
I think so.

1002
01:08:17,740 --> 01:08:23,040
All right. So please answer them with the shortest responses as possible. No, no explanation

1003
01:08:23,040 --> 01:08:26,620
is needed. Question number one, what is your comfort food?

1004
01:08:26,620 --> 01:08:27,620
Coffee.

1005
01:08:27,620 --> 01:08:30,540
Well, next one, how do you like your coffee?

1006
01:08:30,540 --> 01:08:31,540
Black.

1007
01:08:31,540 --> 01:08:34,420
Oh, wow. Cats or dogs?

1008
01:08:34,420 --> 01:08:35,420
Cats.

1009
01:08:35,420 --> 01:08:38,660
What is your word or words to live by?

1010
01:08:38,660 --> 01:08:43,220
Make the most of today. You might. Yeah, today is all you have. Let's go.

1011
01:08:43,220 --> 01:08:47,780
Now what is the most important quality you look for in other people?

1012
01:08:47,780 --> 01:08:48,780
Authenticity.

1013
01:08:48,780 --> 01:08:52,320
Name three people who you who inspire you living or dead.

1014
01:08:52,320 --> 01:08:56,140
My parents. That's two. My piano mentor.

1015
01:08:56,140 --> 01:08:59,460
Now name one piece in your current playlist.

1016
01:08:59,460 --> 01:09:01,120
Mendelssohn Mendelssohn Scherzo.

1017
01:09:01,120 --> 01:09:05,660
This is the last question. So fill in the blank. Music is blank.

1018
01:09:05,660 --> 01:09:06,660
Fabulous.

1019
01:09:06,660 --> 01:09:13,180
Thank you. So this concludes this episode, the season finale of the piano part. Thank

1020
01:09:13,180 --> 01:09:18,500
you, Miriam, for joining my show today and sharing your stories and insights and expertise.

1021
01:09:18,500 --> 01:09:24,340
You can learn more about Miriam through her website at maria piano dot com and her social

1022
01:09:24,340 --> 01:09:31,060
media at Maria Piano. You can also find her music on YouTube. The links are listed in

1023
01:09:31,060 --> 01:09:34,980
the show notes. Thank you to my wonderful audience and fans for tuning in. If you enjoyed

1024
01:09:34,980 --> 01:09:40,220
today's episode, please rate and review it on whatever podcasting platform you use. Remember

1025
01:09:40,220 --> 01:09:44,300
to hit the thumbs up button and subscribe to my YouTube channel if you are watching

1026
01:09:44,300 --> 01:09:50,300
this episode. Follow the piano part on social media to get the latest piano news via Facebook,

1027
01:09:50,300 --> 01:09:55,860
Twitter, Instagram and LinkedIn. I hope to see you for the next well next season of the

1028
01:09:55,860 --> 01:10:01,860
piano pod. Bye everyone and thank you so much, Miriam. Thank you for having me. Pleasure

1029
01:10:01,860 --> 01:10:21,260
to speak. Thank you.