1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:22,480 Hey everybody, KMO here. 2 00:00:22,480 --> 00:00:25,520 This is the KMO Show, but this is not a numbered episode. 3 00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:27,920 I don't have extensive comments that I've prepared. 4 00:00:27,920 --> 00:00:30,480 I don't have an interview to share. 5 00:00:30,480 --> 00:00:35,920 What I have is feedback from a listener, which was obviously written over a long period of 6 00:00:35,920 --> 00:00:36,920 time. 7 00:00:36,920 --> 00:00:41,080 And then he expended the time and effort to create a recording of his prepared text. 8 00:00:41,080 --> 00:00:43,120 So I'm going to share that with you. 9 00:00:43,120 --> 00:00:47,680 This is JD, also known as Static Warpshell, somebody who has been listening to my podcast 10 00:00:47,680 --> 00:00:53,140 for many, many years and somebody with whom I have corresponded extensively. 11 00:00:53,140 --> 00:00:55,880 And I've even met in person. 12 00:00:55,880 --> 00:01:02,840 He wrote to me asking me to spend three hours on the RFK Joe Rogan interview. 13 00:01:02,840 --> 00:01:11,040 I not only declined, but I read his email on a podcast and then explained why this whole 14 00:01:11,040 --> 00:01:14,280 topic of conversation is... 15 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:15,680 I'm just allergic to it. 16 00:01:15,680 --> 00:01:21,400 You know, when I first met James Howard Kunstler, he used to say he's allergic to conspiracy 17 00:01:21,400 --> 00:01:22,400 theories. 18 00:01:22,400 --> 00:01:27,000 He absolutely would not entertain any discussion whatsoever about 9-11. 19 00:01:27,000 --> 00:01:31,800 He accepted the official story point blank, including Building 7, which fell on its own, 20 00:01:31,800 --> 00:01:33,720 wasn't pulled, wasn't demolished. 21 00:01:33,720 --> 00:01:37,240 It just fell on its own. 22 00:01:37,240 --> 00:01:40,600 And I remember at the time, you know, I was talking to people about 9-11 from time to 23 00:01:40,600 --> 00:01:41,600 time. 24 00:01:41,600 --> 00:01:46,780 I used to make a show, put out a podcast episode every year on the, you know, the Wednesday 25 00:01:46,780 --> 00:01:52,480 that fell closest to September 11th, looking into the various conspiracy theories. 26 00:01:52,480 --> 00:01:56,880 And I remember, you know, talking to Jim Kunstler face to face and him just telling me point 27 00:01:56,880 --> 00:02:01,880 blank, yes, I believe that Building 7 collapsed on its own. 28 00:02:01,880 --> 00:02:06,580 That's where I just said, hey, okay, you know, if that's your position, that's very useful 29 00:02:06,580 --> 00:02:07,640 information to me. 30 00:02:07,640 --> 00:02:11,000 It tells me there's really no interesting discussion that we can have on this topic. 31 00:02:11,000 --> 00:02:12,840 Let's talk about something else. 32 00:02:12,840 --> 00:02:17,460 So in episode 16, I read JD's email and I responded to it. 33 00:02:17,460 --> 00:02:21,180 In episode 18, I read an email that was about as long. 34 00:02:21,180 --> 00:02:24,280 It was equally, you know, well-crafted. 35 00:02:24,280 --> 00:02:29,480 I could see that it had been written and then refined and, you know, proofread, probably 36 00:02:29,480 --> 00:02:32,160 rewritten in parts before being sent. 37 00:02:32,160 --> 00:02:38,240 And it was an invitation to delve into seemingly the same topic matter, you know, the same 38 00:02:38,240 --> 00:02:39,240 subject. 39 00:02:39,240 --> 00:02:43,840 The vaccine debate and COVID. 40 00:02:43,840 --> 00:02:47,960 But this listener had an opposite experience to JD's. 41 00:02:47,960 --> 00:02:54,000 This listener had been ridiculed by people close to him, most importantly his wife, for 42 00:02:54,000 --> 00:02:59,740 believing that the vaccines are worth taking and believing any government statements whatsoever 43 00:02:59,740 --> 00:03:03,600 about the pandemic, about the virus, about its origin. 44 00:03:03,600 --> 00:03:06,640 And this listener I identified as Tom. 45 00:03:06,640 --> 00:03:11,080 Tom's wife, you know, she ridiculed him as a government stooge for believing the official 46 00:03:11,080 --> 00:03:17,880 line and then she also adopted the moon landing hoax conspiracy. 47 00:03:17,880 --> 00:03:22,340 This is the idea that the United States, you know, the missions which supposedly landed 48 00:03:22,340 --> 00:03:26,480 astronauts on the moon starting in 1969 and then a few more times in the 70s, that that 49 00:03:26,480 --> 00:03:28,160 was all faked. 50 00:03:28,160 --> 00:03:31,160 And Tom asked me to comment on science denialism. 51 00:03:31,160 --> 00:03:35,480 Now, I've studied the history of science and the philosophy of science. 52 00:03:35,480 --> 00:03:40,600 I'm not a practicing scientist by any stretch, but I do understand a bit about the scientific 53 00:03:40,600 --> 00:03:41,720 method. 54 00:03:41,720 --> 00:03:46,800 And I noticed that during COVID, the people who gravitated to the official pronouncements 55 00:03:46,800 --> 00:03:51,320 from the government, people who fetishized figures like Anthony Fauci, that they often 56 00:03:51,320 --> 00:03:56,400 talked about science the way people who are obsessed with climate change talk about science. 57 00:03:56,400 --> 00:04:02,760 They're saying the science is settled, as if to say that science is this secular god 58 00:04:02,760 --> 00:04:07,160 substitute which just offers up these perfect pronouncements, these perfect statements of 59 00:04:07,160 --> 00:04:12,560 truth and they don't understand that science is a messy process that often, yeah, it's 60 00:04:12,560 --> 00:04:14,280 self-correcting. 61 00:04:14,280 --> 00:04:18,400 Often it will reject positions that it held earlier, you know, that it endorsed earlier, 62 00:04:18,400 --> 00:04:20,440 but it takes a long time. 63 00:04:20,440 --> 00:04:25,280 It's not a clean process and it is certainly not some secular oracle which just hands out 64 00:04:25,280 --> 00:04:32,720 uncomplicated true statements that should be accepted on faith or on authority. 65 00:04:32,720 --> 00:04:37,200 That people who say they respect the science, and that's a trigger for me, you know, this 66 00:04:37,200 --> 00:04:44,720 phrase the science, are as bad as people who gravitate to a flat earth model or people 67 00:04:44,720 --> 00:04:49,320 who say that the moon landings were hoaxed or people who say that the COVID pandemic 68 00:04:49,320 --> 00:04:52,200 was caused by 5G phone towers. 69 00:04:52,200 --> 00:04:55,600 And when I say as bad, I mean it irritates me as much. 70 00:04:55,600 --> 00:05:01,800 This misunderstanding of science, this idea that science is a god that hands out true 71 00:05:01,800 --> 00:05:07,240 statements, only true statements which must be accepted on authority. 72 00:05:07,240 --> 00:05:12,900 There's somebody who sends me stuff all the time on COVID and honestly, I stopped reading 73 00:05:12,900 --> 00:05:15,060 it a long time ago. 74 00:05:15,060 --> 00:05:20,480 And he ends every email with this statement, if you can question it, it's science. 75 00:05:20,480 --> 00:05:23,840 If you can't question it, it's propaganda. 76 00:05:23,840 --> 00:05:25,640 And I agree. 77 00:05:25,640 --> 00:05:30,240 A statement which cannot be questioned, a statement which cannot be examined critically 78 00:05:30,240 --> 00:05:33,280 and with skepticism is not a scientific statement. 79 00:05:33,280 --> 00:05:39,500 And if you think it is, then, you know, your scientism is to me as unhinged and as divorced 80 00:05:39,500 --> 00:05:45,140 from reality as the person who is advocating a flat earth worldview. 81 00:05:45,140 --> 00:05:50,840 So I'm answering in advance a question that JD is going to pose in the segment I'm about 82 00:05:50,840 --> 00:05:51,840 to play for you. 83 00:05:51,840 --> 00:05:57,080 He asked, you know, why ask for feedback from people and then when you get it, burn it down? 84 00:05:57,080 --> 00:05:59,000 I'm not burning it down. 85 00:05:59,000 --> 00:06:03,920 I'm telling you why these topics which you each find compelling but, you know, from Yin 86 00:06:03,920 --> 00:06:06,200 and Yang perspectives, I'm not interested. 87 00:06:06,200 --> 00:06:08,840 I'm not interested in the conflict. 88 00:06:08,840 --> 00:06:11,280 I'm not interested in participating. 89 00:06:11,280 --> 00:06:17,840 And I'm not interested in spending three hours listening to RFK Jr. 90 00:06:17,840 --> 00:06:23,800 And to both JD and Tom, I ask, you know, if you're not looking to recruit me, why spend 91 00:06:23,800 --> 00:06:30,040 so much time and effort trying to get me to look at and comment on this topic when I've 92 00:06:30,040 --> 00:06:33,440 expressed my disinterest repeatedly? 93 00:06:33,440 --> 00:06:34,900 What's the goal? 94 00:06:34,900 --> 00:06:36,520 What's the desired outcome? 95 00:06:36,520 --> 00:06:44,280 All right, with that extensive preamble, here is a message that I received just this morning 96 00:06:44,280 --> 00:06:49,400 from JD, aka Static Warp Shell. 97 00:06:49,400 --> 00:06:56,360 Hi KMO. 98 00:06:56,360 --> 00:07:00,520 Thanks for your responses via email and in the KMO Show 16. 99 00:07:00,520 --> 00:07:04,120 I appreciate your engagement with the discussion. 100 00:07:04,120 --> 00:07:08,440 As I listened to the episode, I realized that the intent of my email was not made clear. 101 00:07:08,440 --> 00:07:12,400 This resulted in my feedback getting lumped in with that of someone who wants you to join 102 00:07:12,400 --> 00:07:17,480 their side of some politico-intellectual battle, namely the vaccine or the COVID debates. 103 00:07:17,480 --> 00:07:20,100 I assure you that was not my intent at all. 104 00:07:20,100 --> 00:07:24,560 Like you, I'm pretty sick of the partisan battles being waged over practically everything. 105 00:07:24,560 --> 00:07:28,120 Seems there's always something to fight about these days and I want no part of it. 106 00:07:28,120 --> 00:07:31,400 Also, I know you don't have a problem with Joe Rogan. 107 00:07:31,400 --> 00:07:35,200 I've only expressed that the episodes are too damn long for you. 108 00:07:35,200 --> 00:07:39,640 So I knew it was a long shot that you would engage with the material that I recommended. 109 00:07:39,640 --> 00:07:42,600 But I recommended it for exactly the reason I said I did. 110 00:07:42,600 --> 00:07:46,640 RFK makes a compelling case for the link between the growth of the vaccine schedule and the 111 00:07:46,640 --> 00:07:49,520 utter demise of the working class in this country. 112 00:07:49,520 --> 00:07:52,360 And I just watched you say in a video that you were interested in the condition of the 113 00:07:52,360 --> 00:07:54,400 working class. 114 00:07:54,400 --> 00:07:58,920 As the quote attributed to Freud says, sometimes a cigar is just a cigar. 115 00:07:58,920 --> 00:08:02,680 I also felt it was a long shot that you'd read my initial email on this topic if I made 116 00:08:02,680 --> 00:08:03,680 it too long-winded. 117 00:08:03,680 --> 00:08:07,720 So I didn't get too deep into why I felt you made such a compelling case or why you might 118 00:08:07,720 --> 00:08:11,720 be interested in hearing it, outside of the long-standing C-realm affinity for discussion 119 00:08:11,720 --> 00:08:13,400 of class in general. 120 00:08:13,400 --> 00:08:16,760 Since we've got the conversation started, I'll do so now. 121 00:08:16,760 --> 00:08:20,280 Quick note here, as I wrote this over the course of a few weeks and listened to more 122 00:08:20,280 --> 00:08:25,280 of RFK Jr.'s speeches, I realized that my assertion that, quote, RFK makes a compelling 123 00:08:25,280 --> 00:08:29,880 argument that vaccines in the material conditions of the increasingly diminished working class 124 00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:33,640 are inextricably linked, end quote, was not really accurate. 125 00:08:33,640 --> 00:08:37,360 He doesn't link those two things together specifically in any of his talks. 126 00:08:37,360 --> 00:08:40,640 I made that link myself, for reasons I'll try to clarify later. 127 00:08:40,640 --> 00:08:43,200 That's the end of this quick note. 128 00:08:43,200 --> 00:08:47,080 Presidential campaigns in the US are a time when the Overton window seems at its most 129 00:08:47,080 --> 00:08:48,800 pliable. 130 00:08:48,800 --> 00:08:52,480 As everyone in the media and politics thinks about what they're unsatisfied with and tries 131 00:08:52,480 --> 00:08:56,680 to project their hopes onto one candidate or another, the news cycle becomes pervious 132 00:08:56,680 --> 00:09:00,240 to people and narratives that would otherwise be ignored. 133 00:09:00,240 --> 00:09:03,720 Folks like Ross Perot get to talk to large audiences about tax reform. 134 00:09:03,720 --> 00:09:06,640 Ron Paul got to talk about ceasing war and ending the Fed. 135 00:09:06,640 --> 00:09:10,600 Bernie Sanders normalized the idea of student debt relief. 136 00:09:10,600 --> 00:09:13,520 Andrew Yang popularized UBI, etc. 137 00:09:13,520 --> 00:09:16,920 The intellectual interest in these candidates for me is not around whether or not they'll 138 00:09:16,920 --> 00:09:20,000 win, but in how much they can alter the national conversation. 139 00:09:20,000 --> 00:09:24,360 I wish I had an older example than Ross Perot, but I was 8 when he ran for office. 140 00:09:24,360 --> 00:09:29,000 If you have any examples of pre-Perot outsiders who influenced the national conversation by 141 00:09:29,000 --> 00:09:31,200 running for president, I'm interested. 142 00:09:31,200 --> 00:09:33,640 I've never really paid much attention to the vaccine debate. 143 00:09:33,640 --> 00:09:36,320 I don't think most people have. 144 00:09:36,320 --> 00:09:40,840 Like conspiracy theory, anti-vax is a very powerful thought stopper. 145 00:09:40,840 --> 00:09:44,520 The conventional wisdom is that we used to be really sick all the time from viral plagues 146 00:09:44,520 --> 00:09:47,820 and one day vaccines came along and fixed all that. 147 00:09:47,820 --> 00:09:51,960 And if we stopped taking vaccines, the whole world would be a plague-ridden hellhole once 148 00:09:51,960 --> 00:09:52,960 again. 149 00:09:52,960 --> 00:09:55,360 Everybody agrees on that, right? 150 00:09:55,360 --> 00:09:59,320 Well, my mom didn't agree with that when I was a kid. 151 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:02,600 I don't know my total vaccination status, but I know that I don't have all the shots 152 00:10:02,600 --> 00:10:04,640 my brother and sister got. 153 00:10:04,640 --> 00:10:07,300 This is because they went to a lot more public school than I did. 154 00:10:07,300 --> 00:10:10,160 My mom pulled me out in second grade for a number of reasons. 155 00:10:10,160 --> 00:10:13,240 And I wonder how much weight vaccine hesitancy had in her decision. 156 00:10:13,240 --> 00:10:15,320 I should ask her about that. 157 00:10:15,320 --> 00:10:18,280 Even though I'm always willing to hear out or read about a conspiracy theory, I never 158 00:10:18,280 --> 00:10:19,640 bothered to look into this one. 159 00:10:19,640 --> 00:10:21,660 My mom never talked to me about the details either. 160 00:10:21,660 --> 00:10:25,240 She just said that she didn't think vaccines are as safe as everyone thinks they are. 161 00:10:25,240 --> 00:10:29,320 I mention my mom here because that's how RFK found himself in the middle of the vaccine 162 00:10:29,320 --> 00:10:30,320 debate. 163 00:10:30,320 --> 00:10:34,520 Not because of my mom specifically, but because mothers of vaccine injured children kept approaching 164 00:10:34,520 --> 00:10:37,960 him at the end of his talks on mercury emissions from coal-fired power plants. 165 00:10:37,960 --> 00:10:41,680 I found an article from 2018 where he talks about this, and this is essentially how he 166 00:10:41,680 --> 00:10:43,960 began the story on Rogan's podcast too. 167 00:10:43,960 --> 00:10:46,960 Quote, I was dragged kicking and screaming into this brawl. 168 00:10:46,960 --> 00:10:51,440 By the early 2000s, I was fighting multiple lawsuits on behalf of Riverkeeper and Waterkeeper 169 00:10:51,440 --> 00:10:53,360 against coal-fired power plants. 170 00:10:53,360 --> 00:10:56,720 I was touring the country speaking about, among other things, the dangers of mercury 171 00:10:56,720 --> 00:11:01,640 emissions, which by then had contaminated virtually every freshwater fish in America. 172 00:11:01,640 --> 00:11:04,160 Following many of these appearances, mothers would approach me. 173 00:11:04,160 --> 00:11:06,680 Their tone was always respectful, but mildly scolding. 174 00:11:06,680 --> 00:11:09,960 They said that if I was serious about eliminating the perils of mercury, I needed to look at 175 00:11:09,960 --> 00:11:10,960 the demyra-sol. 176 00:11:10,960 --> 00:11:15,840 Demyra-sol, as I cut in here, is a mercury-based preservative used in vaccines. 177 00:11:15,840 --> 00:11:20,120 Vaccines, these mothers claimed, were the biggest vector for mercury exposure in children. 178 00:11:20,120 --> 00:11:24,160 I really didn't want to get involved because vaccines were pretty remote from my wheelhouse. 179 00:11:24,160 --> 00:11:25,160 I'd always been pro-vaccine. 180 00:11:25,160 --> 00:11:28,880 I had all my kids vaccinated and got my annual flu shot every year. 181 00:11:28,880 --> 00:11:30,720 But I was impressed by these women. 182 00:11:30,720 --> 00:11:32,040 Many of them were professionals. 183 00:11:32,040 --> 00:11:35,880 Doctors, lawyers, scientists, nurses, and pharmacists. 184 00:11:35,880 --> 00:11:40,320 They were overwhelmingly solid, well-educated, extraordinarily well-informed, rational, and 185 00:11:40,320 --> 00:11:41,320 persuasive. 186 00:11:41,320 --> 00:11:42,320 End quote. 187 00:11:42,320 --> 00:11:46,000 When he started telling this story on Rogan's podcast, my brow started to furrow a little. 188 00:11:46,000 --> 00:11:51,200 If what he's saying is true, I said to myself since no one else was around, then the basement-dwelling, 189 00:11:51,200 --> 00:11:55,360 tinfoil hat-wearing, anti-vax cranks who want to give us all the plague again are actually 190 00:11:55,360 --> 00:12:00,160 a group of concerned mothers whose children have been gravely injured, possibly by vaccines, 191 00:12:00,160 --> 00:12:01,960 which are supposed to be safe and effective. 192 00:12:01,960 --> 00:12:05,440 I should mention at this point that RFK Jr. is a fantastic storyteller. 193 00:12:05,440 --> 00:12:08,680 Where other political candidates have talking points, he has stories. 194 00:12:08,680 --> 00:12:11,980 And as he continued to tell his story about how he came to be a part of this debate, my 195 00:12:11,980 --> 00:12:15,920 jaw slowly dropped open, my eyes bulged out of my head, and they stayed like that for 196 00:12:15,920 --> 00:12:16,920 the rest of the interview. 197 00:12:16,920 --> 00:12:21,040 Save for the times I stopped to blink and say, oh my fucking god. 198 00:12:21,040 --> 00:12:23,440 I've seen it had this effect on other people too. 199 00:12:23,440 --> 00:12:28,200 This guy at a New Hampshire town hall is wrapped with incredulity as RFK Jr. explains what's 200 00:12:28,200 --> 00:12:32,040 happening with everything from pig farms to the border situation. 201 00:12:32,040 --> 00:12:37,000 And here I've got a link to a YouTube video and a incredulous looking man in the audience 202 00:12:37,000 --> 00:12:38,840 with his mouth hanging open. 203 00:12:38,840 --> 00:12:43,360 The incredulity these folks feel is caused by the true story of agency captures so absolute 204 00:12:43,360 --> 00:12:46,840 that the government has not only been allowing big corporations to poison us in the world 205 00:12:46,840 --> 00:12:50,520 we live in, they've been actively helping them by shielding them from liability and 206 00:12:50,520 --> 00:12:53,880 giving them taxpayer dollars in exchange for royalties and dividends. 207 00:12:53,880 --> 00:12:57,080 This of course goes far beyond the pharma industry. 208 00:12:57,080 --> 00:12:58,440 You and I know that. 209 00:12:58,440 --> 00:12:59,440 But does my grandmother? 210 00:12:59,440 --> 00:13:01,200 Do my younger siblings? 211 00:13:01,200 --> 00:13:03,640 Does the general public know about this stuff at all? 212 00:13:03,640 --> 00:13:07,640 I don't have to go into the rest of RFK's position on vaccines to justify this regulatory 213 00:13:07,640 --> 00:13:09,720 agency capture narrative. 214 00:13:09,720 --> 00:13:13,240 If you're interested in reading his whole story on this, I found a congressional transcript 215 00:13:13,240 --> 00:13:18,480 from 2005 where a congressman from Indiana pleads with his colleagues to read RFK Jr.'s 216 00:13:18,480 --> 00:13:22,480 article on this topic, which at the time was published in Rolling Stone. 217 00:13:22,480 --> 00:13:26,600 In addition to Congressman Burton's sad comments about his grandson becoming autistic after 218 00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:31,960 receiving nine shots in one day, the transcript contains the entire article titled Deadly 219 00:13:31,960 --> 00:13:33,280 Immunity. 220 00:13:33,280 --> 00:13:37,360 This article is probably a better representation of the argument for vaccine safety than Rogan's 221 00:13:37,360 --> 00:13:38,560 interview ever could be. 222 00:13:38,560 --> 00:13:43,000 The short version of the rest of that story is that in 1989, the vaccine schedule exploded 223 00:13:43,000 --> 00:13:47,360 in this country and we started giving kids 70 plus doses of various vaccines from birth 224 00:13:47,360 --> 00:13:48,720 to 18 years of age. 225 00:13:48,720 --> 00:13:52,080 All RFK Jr. and the concerned parents that pulled him into this argument have been saying 226 00:13:52,080 --> 00:13:54,720 is we don't believe that these are safe. 227 00:13:54,720 --> 00:13:58,520 We have evidence of the vaccine manufacturers admitting that they are quote unavoidably 228 00:13:58,520 --> 00:14:00,120 unsafe unquote. 229 00:14:00,120 --> 00:14:04,240 We have the evidence right in front of us of our own children being harmed. 230 00:14:04,240 --> 00:14:05,600 Make the vaccine safe. 231 00:14:05,600 --> 00:14:09,560 It's telling that instead of advocating for vaccine safety on behalf of consumers, the 232 00:14:09,560 --> 00:14:14,680 FDA, NIH, CDC, and the media instead scream the anti-vax pejorative as loudly as they 233 00:14:14,680 --> 00:14:15,680 can. 234 00:14:15,680 --> 00:14:18,880 In the case of the media, then they go on to the commercial break brought to you by 235 00:14:18,880 --> 00:14:19,880 Pfizer. 236 00:14:19,880 --> 00:14:22,400 Now, how does this relate to the plight of the working class? 237 00:14:22,400 --> 00:14:25,120 Let's consider the general health of this country since 1989. 238 00:14:25,120 --> 00:14:31,200 Today, around 72% of adults in the US are overweight, 54% have one or more chronic diseases, 239 00:14:31,200 --> 00:14:35,680 autism has gone from one case in 10,000 to one in 166, and allergies have become more 240 00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:36,680 common. 241 00:14:36,680 --> 00:14:39,960 There's a strong correlation between these things, especially autism, and the explosive 242 00:14:39,960 --> 00:14:43,940 growth of the vaccine schedule that takes some serious intellectual dishonesty to dismiss 243 00:14:43,940 --> 00:14:44,940 out of hand. 244 00:14:44,940 --> 00:14:49,280 But even if it is one day conclusively disproven that the ingredients and vaccines are to blame 245 00:14:49,280 --> 00:14:53,600 for any of this, the working class is still utterly sick and demoralized in a way that 246 00:14:53,600 --> 00:14:55,520 they were not prior to that year. 247 00:14:55,520 --> 00:14:57,960 This is because it's not just vaccines. 248 00:14:57,960 --> 00:15:00,840 Vaccines just happen to be a very useful wedge to divide people. 249 00:15:00,840 --> 00:15:05,080 But since 1989, this sick and demoralized population has been trying to raise a generation 250 00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:09,700 of even sicker children while their jobs disappear and the cost of everything goes up. 251 00:15:09,700 --> 00:15:13,360 As the Cold War ended and the Soviet Union collapsed, Bush and Thatcher's promise of 252 00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:17,800 a peace dividend gave way to the reality and expense of endless war. 253 00:15:17,800 --> 00:15:21,480 This endless war immensely benefited certain oligarchs and corporations at the expense 254 00:15:21,480 --> 00:15:23,280 of the blood and treasure of the many. 255 00:15:23,280 --> 00:15:27,440 These few externalized their costs onto the people and natural resources of the USA and 256 00:15:27,440 --> 00:15:28,440 beyond. 257 00:15:28,440 --> 00:15:31,120 They were able to get away with this because they had successfully captured the federal 258 00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:34,640 agencies that are supposed to prevent this type of abuse from being committed, at least 259 00:15:34,640 --> 00:15:35,640 on US soil. 260 00:15:35,640 --> 00:15:39,960 These few created new forms of media like talk radio and cable news to convince a population 261 00:15:39,960 --> 00:15:44,040 which had so recently voted for the anti-war narrative of JFK that the corporations and 262 00:15:44,040 --> 00:15:45,920 agencies were not the problem. 263 00:15:45,920 --> 00:15:47,440 That war was not the problem. 264 00:15:47,440 --> 00:15:51,400 Yes, the problem is over there and we'll drop more bombs to solve it. 265 00:15:51,400 --> 00:15:53,760 Moreover, the problem is with the other party and those in it. 266 00:15:53,760 --> 00:15:56,360 And so it went for around two generations. 267 00:15:56,360 --> 00:16:00,600 Everyone getting sicker, sadder, more addicted to, and dependent on the chemicals, media, 268 00:16:00,600 --> 00:16:03,560 and consumer products sold by the companies in charge. 269 00:16:03,560 --> 00:16:07,780 During and even before this time, RFK Jr. was winning cases against the EPA and certain 270 00:16:07,780 --> 00:16:11,920 private companies for their role in poisoning the land with mercury from coal-burning power 271 00:16:11,920 --> 00:16:16,140 plant emissions and polluting water with runoff from landfills and chemical plants. 272 00:16:16,140 --> 00:16:20,080 He helped run the Riverkeeper and Waterkeeper organizations that changed the Hudson from 273 00:16:20,080 --> 00:16:23,680 one of the most polluted waterways in the world into one of the few places in the US 274 00:16:23,680 --> 00:16:26,080 where one could catch a fish and eat it safely. 275 00:16:26,080 --> 00:16:29,080 And he helped those organizations expand worldwide. 276 00:16:29,080 --> 00:16:32,440 He proved in court time and again that big businesses were conspiring with local and 277 00:16:32,440 --> 00:16:36,500 federal agencies to break the law and to cover up the harm they were causing in the interest 278 00:16:36,500 --> 00:16:37,960 of padding their bottom line. 279 00:16:37,960 --> 00:16:41,200 Proving agency capture in court had become a specialty for him. 280 00:16:41,200 --> 00:16:44,740 This is all long before the early 2000s when he published the Rolling Stone article about 281 00:16:44,740 --> 00:16:50,200 his findings on vaccine safety and the cozy, profitable relationship between pharma, NIH, 282 00:16:50,200 --> 00:16:51,600 CDC, and FDA. 283 00:16:51,600 --> 00:16:55,680 Despite the 25 plus years of environmental and social activism that made him famous, 284 00:16:55,680 --> 00:16:58,400 that one article changed him forever in the public eye. 285 00:16:58,400 --> 00:17:02,400 He was now labeled as anti-vax and summarily banished from the public narrative. 286 00:17:02,400 --> 00:17:05,880 If ever someone mentioned his name or talked with him on their show, the anti-vax spell 287 00:17:05,880 --> 00:17:10,220 would be chanted again and again until everyone knew the sad truth about the kooky conspiracy 288 00:17:10,220 --> 00:17:13,020 theorist anti-vaxxer RFK Jr. 289 00:17:13,020 --> 00:17:17,720 So two generations go by, during which time RFK Jr. takes up the vaccine safety fight 290 00:17:17,720 --> 00:17:19,920 and helps found children's health defense. 291 00:17:19,920 --> 00:17:23,200 Even though the establishment has successfully discredited him in the public eye, he continues 292 00:17:23,200 --> 00:17:26,080 his successful advocacy in public speaking. 293 00:17:26,080 --> 00:17:29,800 Along comes COVID and suddenly the vaccine debate is on everyone's screen during a 294 00:17:29,800 --> 00:17:32,260 time where more screens exist than ever. 295 00:17:32,260 --> 00:17:35,520 Even those among us who don't normally pay attention to socio-political issues couldn't 296 00:17:35,520 --> 00:17:39,120 help but notice that something was seriously wrong with the response to the pandemic and 297 00:17:39,120 --> 00:17:42,240 that the COVID narrative presented by the establishment was questionable. 298 00:17:42,240 --> 00:17:46,360 Over the ensuing three-ish years, a lot of the claims initially made about the COVID 299 00:17:46,360 --> 00:17:47,920 vaccine were walked back. 300 00:17:47,920 --> 00:17:51,280 The escalating number of shots recommended kept rising to the point where more people 301 00:17:51,280 --> 00:17:55,800 than ever started to notice that maybe this vaccine thing was, at least in part, a money 302 00:17:55,800 --> 00:17:57,080 grab. 303 00:17:57,080 --> 00:18:01,760 The vax vs anti-vax issue became a vector that is helping ordinary people figure out 304 00:18:01,760 --> 00:18:05,900 that regulatory agency capture is a grave threat to public health. 305 00:18:05,900 --> 00:18:09,280 Because of COVID, more people than ever are primed to step out from under the spell of 306 00:18:09,280 --> 00:18:11,480 the anti-vax thought stopper. 307 00:18:11,480 --> 00:18:15,760 Some of them will take sides and fight about it online, sure, but most of them will not. 308 00:18:15,760 --> 00:18:19,480 They'll begin to live their lives with the knowledge that the FDA, NIH, and CDC have 309 00:18:19,480 --> 00:18:21,840 been lying to them about vaccines. 310 00:18:21,840 --> 00:18:24,560 They're going to ask themselves, what else is the government lying about? 311 00:18:24,560 --> 00:18:27,680 Of course, this won't seem to make much of a difference at first, but calls for truth 312 00:18:27,680 --> 00:18:30,040 and reform can only be ignored for so long. 313 00:18:30,040 --> 00:18:34,040 Lots of seemingly intractable situations in this country have eventually changed, and 314 00:18:34,040 --> 00:18:37,920 we as a culture now look back on certain times in our history with disbelief that we could 315 00:18:37,920 --> 00:18:39,640 ever have been so stupid. 316 00:18:39,640 --> 00:18:45,320 CFCs, lead paint, asbestos, cigarettes, etc. were once thought to be perfectly safe. 317 00:18:45,320 --> 00:18:48,680 It used to be completely accepted for a doctor to prescribe some bloodletting and a change 318 00:18:48,680 --> 00:18:50,600 of air to treat lung cancer. 319 00:18:50,600 --> 00:18:54,940 After listening to RFK Jr.'s recent talks and speeches, I've decided not to be pessimistic 320 00:18:54,940 --> 00:18:59,360 about a properly skeptical American people's ability to stand up for themselves and change 321 00:18:59,360 --> 00:19:00,360 things for the better. 322 00:19:00,360 --> 00:19:01,840 At least in the long run. 323 00:19:01,840 --> 00:19:05,880 I'll end this segment by paraphrasing one of my favorite quotes from RFK Jr. 324 00:19:05,880 --> 00:19:09,760 Quote, I've been trying to get the mercury out of fish for 50 years. 325 00:19:09,760 --> 00:19:10,760 Nobody calls me anti-fish. 326 00:19:10,760 --> 00:19:15,400 How does asking for a safe, metal-free vaccine make me anti-vax? 327 00:19:15,400 --> 00:19:25,160 End quote. 328 00:19:25,160 --> 00:19:28,600 Now that we have the whole vaccine thing out of the way, I want to return to RFK Jr.'s 329 00:19:28,600 --> 00:19:30,240 power as a storyteller. 330 00:19:30,240 --> 00:19:32,280 I watched his New Hampshire speech. 331 00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:35,720 It was like no other political speech I've seen in my lifetime. 332 00:19:35,720 --> 00:19:39,400 He projected a calm and heartfelt concern for the country and the planet. 333 00:19:39,400 --> 00:19:43,200 He called on people to put aside their differences, which is a stark contrast to the escalatory 334 00:19:43,200 --> 00:19:46,600 rhetoric of the rest of the presidential candidates. 335 00:19:46,600 --> 00:19:49,640 Bringing this back around to the working class, when he's asked about what he'll do to help 336 00:19:49,640 --> 00:19:54,380 them, he usually starts by talking about ending inflation and stopping the wars and regime 337 00:19:54,380 --> 00:19:58,920 change ops, reallocating the military budget towards rebuilding our capacity to make and 338 00:19:58,920 --> 00:20:03,480 grow things here at home, prioritize public health and addiction recovery, stuff like 339 00:20:03,480 --> 00:20:04,480 that. 340 00:20:04,480 --> 00:20:07,200 In a lot of these interviews I've listened to, he doesn't get much time to talk about 341 00:20:07,200 --> 00:20:10,800 these things because all anyone wants to ask him about is vaccines. 342 00:20:10,800 --> 00:20:15,080 Even if RFK Jr. doesn't win, he will have succeeded in widening the Overton window such 343 00:20:15,080 --> 00:20:18,560 that ordinary people will become aware of injustices of the type that you and I have 344 00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:22,680 been thinking about for decades, injustices that continue to directly and negatively impact 345 00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:25,640 the quality of life of the working class in this country. 346 00:20:25,640 --> 00:20:29,260 Most importantly, he seems poised to make sure that within that window is a discussion 347 00:20:29,260 --> 00:20:31,040 of national peace and healing. 348 00:20:31,040 --> 00:20:34,420 The more that people become aware of this, the more likely it is that some positive change 349 00:20:34,420 --> 00:20:41,480 can happen in the future. 350 00:20:41,480 --> 00:20:46,460 It's taken me a while to write this and I've since listened to CRV 460 where another listener 351 00:20:46,460 --> 00:20:51,320 reacted in agreement with your vehement unwillingness to engage with the topic of COVID. 352 00:20:51,320 --> 00:20:54,880 This reminded me even more of RFK Jr.'s story. 353 00:20:54,880 --> 00:20:58,120 Everyone calls him an anti-vaxxer and they say he's against vaccines. 354 00:20:58,120 --> 00:21:02,520 RFK Jr. has never said that he's against vaccines, not even once. 355 00:21:02,520 --> 00:21:06,640 But it's so easy to misunderstand someone's viewpoint during an asynchronous conversation 356 00:21:06,640 --> 00:21:09,800 or misrepresent their viewpoint when they're not around to correct you. 357 00:21:09,800 --> 00:21:13,440 It's especially easy to take something they say the wrong way when you're actually reacting 358 00:21:13,440 --> 00:21:16,120 to something else or someone else. 359 00:21:16,120 --> 00:21:20,320 I was a little taken aback during the KMO Show episode 16 where you continually asked, 360 00:21:20,320 --> 00:21:24,120 why would JD ask me to listen to this Joe Rogan episode? 361 00:21:24,120 --> 00:21:28,880 And then you would respond, something like, to get me involved in the COVID fight? 362 00:21:28,880 --> 00:21:31,880 To get me to join his side of some battle? 363 00:21:31,880 --> 00:21:34,600 What in my email ever gave you that impression? 364 00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:38,220 Ask yourself, who or what were you really reacting to there? 365 00:21:38,220 --> 00:21:39,880 Was it really me and my email? 366 00:21:39,880 --> 00:21:43,680 These questions are rhetorical, used in my attempt to illustrate a problem with discourse 367 00:21:43,680 --> 00:21:47,000 which I myself have fallen victim to. 368 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:49,160 It's easy to misunderstand someone. 369 00:21:49,160 --> 00:21:52,440 Easier still to argue with them if they're not in the room and spin a whole narrative 370 00:21:52,440 --> 00:21:56,840 around what they said and what they stand for that can turn out to be completely false. 371 00:21:56,840 --> 00:22:00,800 And that false narrative can inspire others to jump on the bandwagon. 372 00:22:00,800 --> 00:22:03,360 Here's why this situation reminds me of RFK Jr. 373 00:22:03,360 --> 00:22:07,760 He never studies against vaccines, yet everyone believes that he is anti-vax. 374 00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:11,320 And they revel in hurling this pejorative at him and putting him beneath them in the 375 00:22:11,320 --> 00:22:13,520 hierarchy for his backward, harmful views. 376 00:22:13,520 --> 00:22:14,920 But it's not true. 377 00:22:14,920 --> 00:22:19,520 And in the face of all that, he's largely unfazed by this, always willing to calmly 378 00:22:19,520 --> 00:22:23,040 state his side of the story if someone else will listen. 379 00:22:23,040 --> 00:22:26,760 And to listen to their reactions and responses and keep the dialogue going in kind. 380 00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:29,480 This makes him a very different kind of political figure. 381 00:22:29,480 --> 00:22:33,480 Regardless of whether or not he wins, he will have, at least for a time, forced the topics 382 00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:37,160 of meaningful dialogue, understanding and respecting one another, and finding common 383 00:22:37,160 --> 00:22:39,320 ground into our national conversation. 384 00:22:39,320 --> 00:22:43,200 A famous person with moral authority forcing attention on the topic of healing the divide 385 00:22:43,200 --> 00:22:46,840 in this country could have just as much of a long-term impact on our lives as the next 386 00:22:46,840 --> 00:22:48,360 big thing in AI. 387 00:22:48,360 --> 00:22:52,340 I'm not asking you, or at this point the C-Realm audience, to check out RFK Jr. because 388 00:22:52,340 --> 00:22:56,640 I have a dog and some ridiculous fight about COVID or vaccines or the presidential election 389 00:22:56,640 --> 00:22:59,600 or the daily news cycle or anything else. 390 00:22:59,600 --> 00:23:03,440 I genuinely feel that he's an important political figure who will have a lasting effect on the 391 00:23:03,440 --> 00:23:05,720 national conversation in this country. 392 00:23:05,720 --> 00:23:16,240 And that's worth talking about. 393 00:23:16,240 --> 00:23:20,440 Since it's taken me so long to finish writing this, KMO Show episode 18 has come out. 394 00:23:20,440 --> 00:23:23,800 I was again dismayed at hearing the glee with which you associated my name with something 395 00:23:23,800 --> 00:23:24,800 I never said. 396 00:23:24,800 --> 00:23:28,120 I also got a sense of dread when I saw the episode description. 397 00:23:28,120 --> 00:23:32,640 I was incredulous that you were doing another takedown piece on a listener's feedback. 398 00:23:32,640 --> 00:23:35,360 There's a lot that you've said about my email that felt personal. 399 00:23:35,360 --> 00:23:40,160 You set me up as a straw man, pinned someone else's idea to me, and let the barbs fly. 400 00:23:40,160 --> 00:23:42,440 Now I don't want you to think that I take it personally. 401 00:23:42,440 --> 00:23:44,200 Even though some of it hurt, I'm a big boy. 402 00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:45,200 I can take it. 403 00:23:45,200 --> 00:23:48,320 I know that you're attacking an idea, not me. 404 00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:51,520 But this string of episodes seems in conflict with your long-held habit of never scoring 405 00:23:51,520 --> 00:23:54,160 points on a guest after the interview is over. 406 00:23:54,160 --> 00:23:57,080 Can this be extended to listener feedback as well? 407 00:23:57,080 --> 00:24:00,700 You never even gave me a chance to respond, yet my name has been brought up in a self-righteous 408 00:24:00,700 --> 00:24:03,120 tone in three episodes now. 409 00:24:03,120 --> 00:24:05,240 You ask us for feedback. 410 00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:08,080 Of course there's no guarantee that you'll agree with us or even entertain what we have 411 00:24:08,080 --> 00:24:09,080 to say. 412 00:24:09,080 --> 00:24:12,600 But it's a very strange and disturbing turn for the show when it becomes more about attacking 413 00:24:12,600 --> 00:24:15,040 that feedback than trying to understand it. 414 00:24:15,040 --> 00:24:17,480 You're under no obligation to engage with any of it. 415 00:24:17,480 --> 00:24:20,920 Why set it up and then burn it down in front of everybody? 416 00:24:20,920 --> 00:24:24,960 That said, I was really happy to hear the end of KMO Show episode 18 when you ended 417 00:24:24,960 --> 00:24:26,840 on a more empathetic note. 418 00:24:26,840 --> 00:24:28,640 I sincerely thank you for that. 419 00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:32,240 I knew that you would, eventually. 420 00:24:32,240 --> 00:24:35,320 I think it's also important for me to note that I'm not presenting myself with any moral 421 00:24:35,320 --> 00:24:38,640 authority here on how discussions like this ought to go. 422 00:24:38,640 --> 00:24:42,160 A few months ago, I had what I thought was a typical intellectual debate with a friend 423 00:24:42,160 --> 00:24:43,160 of mine. 424 00:24:43,160 --> 00:24:47,900 We've had many such in the past and they at times became heated, but we always found 425 00:24:47,900 --> 00:24:49,760 some sort of common ground by the end. 426 00:24:49,760 --> 00:24:53,200 However, at the beginning of this discussion, I noticed that he kept using these talking 427 00:24:53,200 --> 00:24:56,240 points and shibboleths that were right out of the resistance propaganda. 428 00:24:56,240 --> 00:24:59,600 I knew he spent a lot of time on left-wing Reddit, so I wasn't surprised, but it had 429 00:24:59,600 --> 00:25:03,560 gotten to a point where I felt like his ideas were no longer his own and I resolved to help 430 00:25:03,560 --> 00:25:06,040 him see that during our discussion. 431 00:25:06,040 --> 00:25:10,220 I presented what I felt was a reasoned, practical view of the situation and tried to highlight 432 00:25:10,220 --> 00:25:14,560 how the media he was taking in was weaponizing his empathy against him, using his emotions 433 00:25:14,560 --> 00:25:17,720 to sway him to positions which were not in his best interest. 434 00:25:17,720 --> 00:25:21,600 I challenged his epistemology and asked him to justify his positions in a way that satisfied 435 00:25:21,600 --> 00:25:25,720 me, while at the same time trying my best to do the same for him. 436 00:25:25,720 --> 00:25:28,480 But something was different this time and I didn't realize it until a few weeks later 437 00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:31,480 when he hadn't responded to any of my calls or texts. 438 00:25:31,480 --> 00:25:35,320 This time, he had a deep emotional connection to the topics we were discussing. 439 00:25:35,320 --> 00:25:39,120 They were providing him with something I didn't understand, something he values very much. 440 00:25:39,120 --> 00:25:43,200 In my quest to get to the objective truth of the situation, I trampled all over his 441 00:25:43,200 --> 00:25:44,920 feelings and emotions. 442 00:25:44,920 --> 00:25:48,160 Instead of butting heads with his ideas, I should have asked him more about why he felt 443 00:25:48,160 --> 00:25:49,160 the way he did. 444 00:25:49,160 --> 00:25:53,320 I should have accepted his positions as his and simply heard him out before offering my 445 00:25:53,320 --> 00:25:56,920 thoughts and trying to find common ground on which to move the conversation into a more 446 00:25:56,920 --> 00:25:58,480 pleasant territory. 447 00:25:58,480 --> 00:26:01,480 The topic was Kyle Rittenhouse and gun control. 448 00:26:01,480 --> 00:26:02,480 Real fun stuff. 449 00:26:02,480 --> 00:26:05,720 A couple days ago I did the same thing to another friend of mine and pissed her off 450 00:26:05,720 --> 00:26:06,960 as well. 451 00:26:06,960 --> 00:26:11,760 The super fun topic this time was whether or not cisgender is a slur. 452 00:26:11,760 --> 00:26:15,440 Before I stepped on all the argumentative landmines I could, she ended by confirming 453 00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:19,160 that the other friend I debated with was deliberately avoiding me because of the conversation with 454 00:26:19,160 --> 00:26:20,600 him that I described above. 455 00:26:20,600 --> 00:26:24,640 The algorithms are severely weakening our ability to find common ground. 456 00:26:24,640 --> 00:26:27,440 We're going to have to fight hard to keep it. 457 00:26:27,440 --> 00:26:30,340 Now that I've realized how badly I screwed up, I'm going to apologize to both of them 458 00:26:30,340 --> 00:26:32,680 and tell them what I learned. 459 00:26:32,680 --> 00:26:36,600 I have to find a way to peacefully navigate these insane conversations I find myself in 460 00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:39,360 as a result of algorithmic rage baiting. 461 00:26:39,360 --> 00:26:47,880 We all do. 462 00:26:47,880 --> 00:26:52,080 I feel inspired to end this with an excerpt I pulled from the YouTube transcript of RFK 463 00:26:52,080 --> 00:26:55,000 Jr.'s recent Peace and Diplomacy speech. 464 00:26:55,000 --> 00:26:57,560 Since his voice is hard to listen to, I'm going to read it. 465 00:26:57,560 --> 00:26:59,800 The full speech is linked here. 466 00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:02,160 It's about 30 minutes long and very inspiring. 467 00:27:02,160 --> 00:27:04,280 This is what I love about the guy. 468 00:27:04,280 --> 00:27:10,160 The positive, inspiring, practical political message he's sharing with us. 469 00:27:10,160 --> 00:27:14,640 President Kennedy understood that peace begins with our basic attitudes and beliefs. 470 00:27:14,640 --> 00:27:18,800 He spoke of the futility of passively waiting for the other side to become enlightened. 471 00:27:18,800 --> 00:27:24,840 We must examine our own attitudes, he said, as individuals and as a nation, for our attitude 472 00:27:24,840 --> 00:27:27,480 is as essential to theirs. 473 00:27:27,480 --> 00:27:29,480 He said we should begin by looking inward. 474 00:27:29,480 --> 00:27:33,440 Yes, back in 1963, a politician really said that. 475 00:27:33,440 --> 00:27:38,720 A political leader voiced what would be considered today a spiritual maxim or a spiritual principle. 476 00:27:38,720 --> 00:27:43,680 Let's take up that call from 60 years ago and ask Americans, all of us, to reexamine 477 00:27:43,680 --> 00:27:46,560 our attitude. 478 00:27:46,560 --> 00:27:50,280 We've been immersed in a foreign policy discourse that is all about adversaries and threats 479 00:27:50,280 --> 00:27:52,760 and allies and enemies and domination. 480 00:27:52,760 --> 00:27:56,440 We've become addicted to comic book good versus evil narratives that erase complexity and 481 00:27:56,440 --> 00:28:00,280 blind us to the legitimate motives and the legitimate cultural and economic concerns 482 00:28:00,280 --> 00:28:03,680 and the legitimate security concerns of other peoples and other nations. 483 00:28:03,680 --> 00:28:07,440 We've internalized and institutionalized a reflex of violence as a response for any 484 00:28:07,440 --> 00:28:09,120 and all crises. 485 00:28:09,120 --> 00:28:13,800 Everything becomes a war, a war on drugs, a war on terror or on cancer or on climate 486 00:28:13,800 --> 00:28:14,920 change. 487 00:28:14,920 --> 00:28:19,860 This way of thinking predisposes us to wage endless wars abroad, wars and coups and bombs 488 00:28:19,860 --> 00:28:23,800 and drones and regime change operations and support for paramilitaries and juntas and 489 00:28:23,800 --> 00:28:25,280 dictators. 490 00:28:25,280 --> 00:28:28,640 None of this has made us safer and none of it has burnished our leadership or our moral 491 00:28:28,640 --> 00:28:29,640 authority. 492 00:28:29,640 --> 00:28:34,120 But more importantly, we must ask ourselves, is this really who we are? 493 00:28:34,120 --> 00:28:36,020 Is this what we want to be? 494 00:28:36,020 --> 00:28:38,760 Is this what America's founders envisioned? 495 00:28:38,760 --> 00:28:42,200 Here's another spiritual principle, one that my uncle also referred to when he said, 496 00:28:42,200 --> 00:28:46,040 We're both caught up in a vicious and dangerous cycle with suspicion on one side breeding 497 00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:49,380 suspicion on the other, and new weapons begetting counterweapons. 498 00:28:49,380 --> 00:28:52,680 When we hold others in the belief that they are implacable enemies, they tend to mold 499 00:28:52,680 --> 00:28:54,480 themselves accordingly to our view of them. 500 00:28:54,480 --> 00:28:58,600 It is a self-fulfilling prophecy or prediction that launches all players into a cycle of 501 00:28:58,600 --> 00:28:59,880 suspicion. 502 00:28:59,880 --> 00:29:02,500 My uncle warned against inhabiting the role of an enemy. 503 00:29:02,500 --> 00:29:06,840 We empower hardliners in places like Russia, China, Cuba and Iran. 504 00:29:06,840 --> 00:29:11,760 We invite them into the drama of conflict, the drama of provocation and counter provocation, 505 00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:12,760 weapon and counter weapon. 506 00:29:12,760 --> 00:29:16,800 Is it any wonder that as America has waged violence throughout the world, violence has 507 00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:18,800 overtaken us in our own nation? 508 00:29:18,800 --> 00:29:21,720 It has not come as an invasion, it's come from within. 509 00:29:21,720 --> 00:29:25,840 Our bombs, our drones, our armies are incapable of stopping the gun violence on our streets 510 00:29:25,840 --> 00:29:29,000 in schools or domestic violence in our homes. 511 00:29:29,000 --> 00:29:33,300 I see the same link here as my father and Martin Luther King saw about the Vietnam War. 512 00:29:33,300 --> 00:29:36,760 They saw that war and they believed that we could not have warfare abroad without bringing 513 00:29:36,760 --> 00:29:40,800 that violence home to our streets, to our attitudes, to our communities. 514 00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:43,720 Foreign violence is inseparable from domestic violence. 515 00:29:43,720 --> 00:29:47,960 Both are aspects of a basic orientation and a basic set of priorities. 516 00:29:47,960 --> 00:29:52,460 Waging endless wars abroad, we've neglected the foundation of our own well-being. 517 00:29:52,460 --> 00:29:54,540 We have a decaying economic infrastructure. 518 00:29:54,540 --> 00:29:57,720 We have a demoralized people, a despairing people. 519 00:29:57,720 --> 00:30:00,880 We have toxins in our air and our soil and our water. 520 00:30:00,880 --> 00:30:03,360 We have deteriorating mental and physical health. 521 00:30:03,360 --> 00:30:05,280 These are the wages of war. 522 00:30:05,280 --> 00:30:07,080 What will be the wages of peace? 523 00:30:07,080 --> 00:30:10,440 It will be healing of all the symptoms of America's decline. 524 00:30:10,440 --> 00:30:13,040 None of these are beyond our capacity to heal. 525 00:30:13,040 --> 00:30:17,000 We can restore America to the awesome vitality of the original Kennedy era. 526 00:30:17,000 --> 00:30:18,500 My uncle said it well. 527 00:30:18,500 --> 00:30:21,680 He said that no problem of human destiny is beyond human beings. 528 00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:25,320 He warned us that too many of us think that peace is impossible. 529 00:30:25,320 --> 00:30:27,440 Too many of us think it is unreal. 530 00:30:27,440 --> 00:30:31,680 But that is the dangerous and defeatist belief that leads to the conclusion that war is inevitable, 531 00:30:31,680 --> 00:30:35,680 that mankind is doomed, that we are gripped by forces that we cannot control. 532 00:30:35,680 --> 00:30:37,320 We need not accept that view. 533 00:30:37,320 --> 00:30:40,600 Our problems are man-made and therefore they can be solved by man. 534 00:30:40,600 --> 00:30:41,900 How do we actually do that? 535 00:30:41,900 --> 00:30:46,560 We start by replacing the vicious cycle of suspicion with a virtuous cycle of trust-building. 536 00:30:46,560 --> 00:30:48,560 We reverse escalation. 537 00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:51,640 It takes courage to make the first move towards peace. 538 00:30:51,640 --> 00:30:55,560 Let's see what happens when we stop the provocation and the escalation and offer instead an olive 539 00:30:55,560 --> 00:30:56,920 branch. 540 00:30:56,920 --> 00:31:01,280 Each step we take invites those who we call our adversaries to take a step further. 541 00:31:01,280 --> 00:31:02,920 Maybe Russia won't respond. 542 00:31:02,920 --> 00:31:05,400 Maybe they won't respond in kind or in any way. 543 00:31:05,400 --> 00:31:08,700 But at least we will know that we tried and the whole world will know it too. 544 00:31:08,700 --> 00:31:11,840 That step comes from a changed attitude and from courage. 545 00:31:11,840 --> 00:31:16,220 Speaking in the midst of the Cold War, John Kennedy asked us not only to see the distorted 546 00:31:16,220 --> 00:31:20,720 and desperate view of the other side, not to see the conflict as inevitable, accommodation 547 00:31:20,720 --> 00:31:24,960 as impossible and communication as nothing more than an exchange of threats. 548 00:31:24,960 --> 00:31:27,840 Let's take a moment to allow that to sink in. 549 00:31:27,840 --> 00:31:31,960 Today America has broken off practically all diplomatic contact with Russia so that communication 550 00:31:31,960 --> 00:31:35,080 has indeed become little more than an exchange of threats and insults. 551 00:31:35,080 --> 00:31:36,600 FDR met with Stalin. 552 00:31:36,600 --> 00:31:38,720 JFK met with Khrushchev. 553 00:31:38,720 --> 00:31:40,360 Nixon met with Brezhnev. 554 00:31:40,360 --> 00:31:42,240 Reagan met with Gorbachev. 555 00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:45,080 Can't Biden meet with Putin? 556 00:31:45,080 --> 00:31:47,720 There's more to that speech but you get the idea. 557 00:31:47,720 --> 00:31:50,960 You can watch the speech or read the transcript here, I've left a link. 558 00:31:50,960 --> 00:31:52,840 And thank you KMO for the continued discussion. 559 00:31:52,840 --> 00:31:55,880 I hope that you'll stay well. 560 00:31:55,880 --> 00:31:58,840 All right. 561 00:31:58,840 --> 00:32:01,120 That was JD's message. 562 00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:02,120 Thank you for providing that. 563 00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:06,760 Thank you for taking the time for not only writing it but also recording it so that I 564 00:32:06,760 --> 00:32:09,960 could share it with other people in a way that, you know, it'll reach more people this 565 00:32:09,960 --> 00:32:10,960 way. 566 00:32:10,960 --> 00:32:14,520 That said, COVID's not my issue. 567 00:32:14,520 --> 00:32:16,360 It's not going to be my issue. 568 00:32:16,360 --> 00:32:20,120 I believe it was Isaac Asimov, but maybe not. 569 00:32:20,120 --> 00:32:21,120 Somebody. 570 00:32:21,120 --> 00:32:26,720 Somebody said, "A fanatic is somebody who can't change his mind and won't change the subject." 571 00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:30,360 Well, I'm pretty fixated on a subject right now. 572 00:32:30,360 --> 00:32:31,360 It's artificial intelligence. 573 00:32:31,360 --> 00:32:36,760 And as JD pointed out, I'm particularly interested in its impacts on working people, the so-called 574 00:32:36,760 --> 00:32:38,200 working class. 575 00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:43,560 I'm concerned that many people will lose jobs or they'll lose good jobs and then be forced 576 00:32:43,560 --> 00:32:47,240 into substandard employment in terms of, you know, what they're paid and the benefits that 577 00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:52,520 they get or the status that they have, you know, full-time versus part-time. 578 00:32:52,520 --> 00:32:58,720 Typically people who lose a job to technology, they don't stay out of the labor force forever. 579 00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:02,880 Some do, but not in the first job loss. 580 00:33:02,880 --> 00:33:08,440 But typically they don't go from losing a pretty decent job to getting a great job. 581 00:33:08,440 --> 00:33:12,820 Usually they lose a pretty good job and get a shittier job. 582 00:33:12,820 --> 00:33:15,080 That's the direction of the economy. 583 00:33:15,080 --> 00:33:21,320 And I don't see, you know, other than feeble cries for universal basic income, which I 584 00:33:21,320 --> 00:33:25,960 think even most of the people in the tech world who are advocating this know that it's 585 00:33:25,960 --> 00:33:26,960 not likely to happen. 586 00:33:26,960 --> 00:33:29,600 And if it does happen, that it's going to go badly. 587 00:33:29,600 --> 00:33:32,320 But you know, that's just their way of saying, hey, we understand. 588 00:33:32,320 --> 00:33:36,440 Yes, we're, we're really wrecking everybody's show here, but we're making a lot of money 589 00:33:36,440 --> 00:33:38,840 and we can't stop. 590 00:33:38,840 --> 00:33:39,840 And they're right. 591 00:33:39,840 --> 00:33:40,880 They can't stop. 592 00:33:40,880 --> 00:33:46,040 If you are the CEO of Microsoft, it is not within your power to say, you know what, we 593 00:33:46,040 --> 00:33:49,320 see that this is a harmful path and we're just not going to, we're not going to be a 594 00:33:49,320 --> 00:33:50,320 participant. 595 00:33:50,320 --> 00:33:54,320 Well, the CEO of Microsoft doesn't get to say that because he will be replaced by the 596 00:33:54,320 --> 00:33:59,220 board with another CEO who is willing to go where the money is. 597 00:33:59,220 --> 00:34:05,840 Do environmental contaminants, do the products of modern chemistry affect our lives on a 598 00:34:05,840 --> 00:34:07,640 biological level? 599 00:34:07,640 --> 00:34:08,640 Yes. 600 00:34:08,640 --> 00:34:11,120 Yes, they do. 601 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:15,340 Not just in vaccines, environmental contaminants, they pervade our environment. 602 00:34:15,340 --> 00:34:18,160 They pervade our bodies. 603 00:34:18,160 --> 00:34:21,560 Harms certainly come via this vector. 604 00:34:21,560 --> 00:34:24,640 And this is really a number of vectors. 605 00:34:24,640 --> 00:34:25,960 It's a serious topic. 606 00:34:25,960 --> 00:34:28,640 It's a topic I've interviewed people on in the past. 607 00:34:28,640 --> 00:34:30,880 It's not a topic I'm interested in right now. 608 00:34:30,880 --> 00:34:32,640 You won't hear me talking about it. 609 00:34:32,640 --> 00:34:36,440 So you could say I'm, I'm half the fanatic in that I won't change the subject. 610 00:34:36,440 --> 00:34:40,600 I'm interested in artificial intelligence and I'm interested in it in these particular 611 00:34:40,600 --> 00:34:42,240 domains. 612 00:34:42,240 --> 00:34:47,120 I'm not interested in tales of AI doomsday. 613 00:34:47,120 --> 00:34:52,320 I'm not interested in, you know, talk of protecting ourselves from artificial as super intelligence. 614 00:34:52,320 --> 00:34:57,000 I think that the damage that AI is going to do it's doing right now. 615 00:34:57,000 --> 00:35:03,920 And it is very narrow, but competent AI deployed to the meta task of concentrating wealth. 616 00:35:03,920 --> 00:35:07,840 I think that these, these systems are all excellent at what they do. 617 00:35:07,840 --> 00:35:12,460 And what they do is concentrate wealth in the hands of fewer and fewer people. 618 00:35:12,460 --> 00:35:17,080 And in the process, they degrade the ability of the vast majority of people to support 619 00:35:17,080 --> 00:35:18,800 themselves. 620 00:35:18,800 --> 00:35:20,760 And I think that we are early in this process. 621 00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:25,580 And if that doesn't interest you, that's okay. 622 00:35:25,580 --> 00:35:29,160 If the thing that does interest you compels you to reach out to me and say, you should 623 00:35:29,160 --> 00:35:31,440 be interested in this too. 624 00:35:31,440 --> 00:35:32,560 I'm just not. 625 00:35:32,560 --> 00:35:37,080 And you could say it's fanaticism if you like, but I'm willing to change my mind on the topic 626 00:35:37,080 --> 00:35:38,080 of AI. 627 00:35:38,080 --> 00:35:43,060 I approach AI with a number of unresolved questions in my mind, but I'm not changing 628 00:35:43,060 --> 00:35:45,120 the subject right now. 629 00:35:45,120 --> 00:35:49,960 And if you really want me to broaden my approach to include this thing that you're really interested 630 00:35:49,960 --> 00:35:55,880 in my question to you is why aren't enough people talking about that. 631 00:35:55,880 --> 00:35:57,680 I'm not just talking to static warp here. 632 00:35:57,680 --> 00:35:58,680 I'm talking to Tom. 633 00:35:58,680 --> 00:36:03,560 I'm talking to everybody who keeps trying to get me into this conversation about COVID 634 00:36:03,560 --> 00:36:04,560 and vaccines. 635 00:36:04,560 --> 00:36:09,120 I'm not interested. 636 00:36:09,120 --> 00:36:11,220 My lack of interest is not a condemnation of you. 637 00:36:11,220 --> 00:36:16,240 You are welcome to be interested, but why do you keep reaching out to me on this topic? 638 00:36:16,240 --> 00:36:19,080 I'm telling you, I'm not interested. 639 00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:20,080 All right. 640 00:36:20,080 --> 00:36:22,880 Well, my quiet recording environment is about to be disrupted. 641 00:36:22,880 --> 00:36:28,160 So I will just say I recorded a podcast interview yesterday with Kevin Lin of Progressives for 642 00:36:28,160 --> 00:36:34,240 Immigration Reform and also with a retired scientist slash engineer with a very impressive 643 00:36:34,240 --> 00:36:36,520 career. 644 00:36:36,520 --> 00:36:41,800 And we were talking about AI and related issues about the fate of the working class and in 645 00:36:41,800 --> 00:36:44,560 particular the fate of men. 646 00:36:44,560 --> 00:36:51,360 I have posted a link to that in the description of this episode, which you can find at KMO.show 647 00:36:51,360 --> 00:36:55,200 and also on Patreon and also on YouTube. 648 00:36:55,200 --> 00:37:01,080 All right, everybody, thank you for listening to this irregularly unscheduled episode of 649 00:37:01,080 --> 00:37:03,080 the KMO Show. 650 00:37:03,080 --> 00:37:08,800 I will talk to you again in a more standard fashion this coming week. 651 00:37:08,800 --> 00:37:25,560 Stay well.