1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:29,920 Well, welcome back to another episode of Your Mom on Drugs. 2 00:00:29,920 --> 00:00:34,160 I am the son, Joshua Klaus. 3 00:00:34,160 --> 00:00:37,240 And I'm the mom, Jennifer Seltzer. 4 00:00:37,240 --> 00:00:38,520 And we're going to be on Drugs today. 5 00:00:38,520 --> 00:00:39,560 Well, kind of today. 6 00:00:39,560 --> 00:00:43,440 This is a very interesting episode. 7 00:00:43,440 --> 00:00:46,380 We're going to be doing an episode on Lyme disease. 8 00:00:46,380 --> 00:00:52,800 Now the reason I wanted to do this episode in Austin, Texas, where I live, there's this 9 00:00:52,800 --> 00:00:56,960 music festival called Austin City Limits. 10 00:00:56,960 --> 00:01:01,680 And one of the performers there was the one and only Shania Twain. 11 00:01:01,680 --> 00:01:07,400 And apparently, I didn't know this, but someone brought it up to me that she suffered from 12 00:01:07,400 --> 00:01:09,720 chronic Lyme disease. 13 00:01:09,720 --> 00:01:14,420 I think for about 20 years, her vocal cords were kind of shot from this condition. 14 00:01:14,420 --> 00:01:16,560 And I didn't even know that was a thing. 15 00:01:16,560 --> 00:01:22,720 I just thought that you kind of got bit by a tick and you got Lyme disease and something 16 00:01:22,720 --> 00:01:24,480 happened, but I had no detail. 17 00:01:24,480 --> 00:01:29,560 So the idea that something like that could stick around in your system was really interesting 18 00:01:29,560 --> 00:01:30,560 to me. 19 00:01:30,560 --> 00:01:31,560 And I didn't know how prevalent it was. 20 00:01:31,560 --> 00:01:34,720 I didn't know how bad it could be. 21 00:01:34,720 --> 00:01:39,000 So obviously, I called up my favorite mom on drugs and I said, Mom, we need to do an 22 00:01:39,000 --> 00:01:43,880 episode on Lyme disease because I think it'd be really interesting. 23 00:01:43,880 --> 00:01:47,400 And you know, Mom, I want you to let people know what you found out. 24 00:01:47,400 --> 00:01:50,240 Like, what are some of the basics of Lyme disease? 25 00:01:50,240 --> 00:01:52,680 OK, here we go. 26 00:01:52,680 --> 00:01:58,520 So it was really interesting to look into this subject matter because it was not something 27 00:01:58,520 --> 00:02:03,560 that I knew a whole lot about. 28 00:02:03,560 --> 00:02:09,400 Lyme disease is actually the most common vector borne disease in the United States. 29 00:02:09,400 --> 00:02:12,680 And you say, what's a vector borne disease? 30 00:02:12,680 --> 00:02:21,040 Well, a vector is something is a life form that serves as an intermediary. 31 00:02:21,040 --> 00:02:26,760 I'm sorry, it's a life form that serves as an intermediary to transmit an infectious 32 00:02:26,760 --> 00:02:29,320 germ from animals to humans. 33 00:02:29,320 --> 00:02:31,860 So they will. 34 00:02:31,860 --> 00:02:36,800 So this vector organism can get infected by disease causing pathogens. 35 00:02:36,800 --> 00:02:42,880 So maybe it's a rodent that they may get infected by. 36 00:02:42,880 --> 00:02:50,400 And then once they're infected, then they can transmit that germ to a human host throughout 37 00:02:50,400 --> 00:02:54,200 their life whenever they come in contact with a human host. 38 00:02:54,200 --> 00:02:57,620 So there are about three. 39 00:02:57,620 --> 00:03:03,360 So you say, OK, well, what are some of the more common vector organisms that we're familiar 40 00:03:03,360 --> 00:03:06,480 with are going to be mosquitoes and ticks. 41 00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:13,680 And the types of diseases that we see from this are malaria, dengue fever, yellow fever, 42 00:03:13,680 --> 00:03:14,960 plague and Lyme disease. 43 00:03:14,960 --> 00:03:22,120 OK, so it's not the actual insect or arachnid that is giving you the disease. 44 00:03:22,120 --> 00:03:27,200 They actually carry a disease inside of them that then gets inside of your body. 45 00:03:27,200 --> 00:03:28,800 That's what it means to be a vector. 46 00:03:28,800 --> 00:03:29,800 Well, yes. 47 00:03:29,800 --> 00:03:32,700 So basically, they're the go between. 48 00:03:32,700 --> 00:03:41,360 So they went and they fed on a mouse or something that had Lyme disease, the bacteria for Lyme 49 00:03:41,360 --> 00:03:46,400 disease, and then they then ultimately bite you. 50 00:03:46,400 --> 00:03:49,200 And then you are able to get Lyme disease at that point then. 51 00:03:49,200 --> 00:03:50,480 And so does that make sense? 52 00:03:50,480 --> 00:03:52,400 So they're so they're here. 53 00:03:52,400 --> 00:03:56,280 So they didn't initially that the tick didn't initially have Lyme disease. 54 00:03:56,280 --> 00:04:01,440 But as we get into their lifestyle, we'll understand why they would then be more vulnerable 55 00:04:01,440 --> 00:04:06,640 to get Lyme disease as a result of feeding on a rodent and then ultimately bringing it 56 00:04:06,640 --> 00:04:07,640 to us. 57 00:04:07,640 --> 00:04:08,640 Gotcha. 58 00:04:08,640 --> 00:04:10,460 But they're not actually carrying Lyme disease. 59 00:04:10,460 --> 00:04:14,400 They're carrying a pathogen that presents itself as Lyme disease. 60 00:04:14,400 --> 00:04:17,080 They carry the bacteria for Lyme disease. 61 00:04:17,080 --> 00:04:18,080 OK, all right. 62 00:04:18,080 --> 00:04:22,040 Well, this reminds me of a fun story. 63 00:04:22,040 --> 00:04:25,200 I remember learning about this in my undergrad degree. 64 00:04:25,200 --> 00:04:27,360 There is trying to even remember the name. 65 00:04:27,360 --> 00:04:32,320 I think it's called like trypsinosis or something like this. 66 00:04:32,320 --> 00:04:37,780 I can't remember the name, but I remember that mice or rodents are naturally scared 67 00:04:37,780 --> 00:04:38,780 of cats. 68 00:04:38,780 --> 00:04:39,780 They'll see cats. 69 00:04:39,780 --> 00:04:43,360 And actually, a lot of times it's actually the there's a chemical in the cat's urine 70 00:04:43,360 --> 00:04:46,960 that they smell it and like, oh, don't go near there because there's going to be a feline 71 00:04:46,960 --> 00:04:48,740 nearby. 72 00:04:48,740 --> 00:04:54,820 But there's this pathogen that infects rodents that basically changes the neurological structure 73 00:04:54,820 --> 00:04:59,640 of their brain to actually be attracted towards this urine to be like, oh, this is nice. 74 00:04:59,640 --> 00:05:00,640 What is this? 75 00:05:00,640 --> 00:05:02,280 They want to get curious towards it. 76 00:05:02,280 --> 00:05:07,480 And obviously, this leads them to the feline, which then eats the rodent. 77 00:05:07,480 --> 00:05:11,720 But actually, the parasite within the rodent wants to get inside of the cat that actually 78 00:05:11,720 --> 00:05:18,240 completes its life cycle to go inside and to actually become, you know, as we all know, 79 00:05:18,240 --> 00:05:22,760 organisms have life cycles to go from eggs to, you know, infants and some variety to 80 00:05:22,760 --> 00:05:25,720 adults and then to complete the cycle. 81 00:05:25,720 --> 00:05:27,620 So I thought that was really cool. 82 00:05:27,620 --> 00:05:33,720 So it seems like in this case, the rodent was the vector to get itself to get this thing 83 00:05:33,720 --> 00:05:35,600 inside of the tick is the vector. 84 00:05:35,600 --> 00:05:36,600 No, in the example. 85 00:05:36,600 --> 00:05:37,600 Oh, you're pardon me. 86 00:05:37,600 --> 00:05:38,600 Yes. 87 00:05:38,600 --> 00:05:39,600 OK, yes. 88 00:05:39,600 --> 00:05:40,600 Yes. 89 00:05:40,600 --> 00:05:41,600 Yes. 90 00:05:41,600 --> 00:05:42,600 So to go back to the tick example. 91 00:05:42,600 --> 00:05:45,120 Yeah, the tick would be the the go between, like you said. 92 00:05:45,120 --> 00:05:46,120 Yes. 93 00:05:46,120 --> 00:05:47,120 Yes. 94 00:05:47,120 --> 00:05:50,680 So life seems to have these really interesting pathways like I'm living here, but I need 95 00:05:50,680 --> 00:05:51,800 to get here. 96 00:05:51,800 --> 00:05:53,200 So how do I do it? 97 00:05:53,200 --> 00:05:54,200 Yeah, that's amazing. 98 00:05:54,200 --> 00:05:55,200 It is. 99 00:05:55,200 --> 00:06:02,360 And interestingly, so so in the United States, there are anywhere from three hundred thousand 100 00:06:02,360 --> 00:06:11,320 to four hundred and seventy five thousand or so cases of Lyme disease every year. 101 00:06:11,320 --> 00:06:19,600 Most of them are are located in the northeast eastern part of the United States or the Midwest 102 00:06:19,600 --> 00:06:23,360 or the or some of the states in the northwestern part of the United States. 103 00:06:23,360 --> 00:06:26,400 It's not that common in Texas. 104 00:06:26,400 --> 00:06:32,120 So be like if people from Texas, since we live in Texas, you and I, but people may be 105 00:06:32,120 --> 00:06:34,360 traveling to the northeast. 106 00:06:34,360 --> 00:06:35,880 Yes. 107 00:06:35,880 --> 00:06:39,480 Where would they encounter these organisms? 108 00:06:39,480 --> 00:06:42,360 So so let me just backtrack just a little bit. 109 00:06:42,360 --> 00:06:53,560 So the Lyme disease disease is called caused by a bacterium called Borrelia burgdorferi 110 00:06:53,560 --> 00:06:55,840 burgdorferi. 111 00:06:55,840 --> 00:06:58,120 We're just going to call it Lyme disease. 112 00:06:58,120 --> 00:07:02,280 Borrelia burgdorferi, that sounds right. 113 00:07:02,280 --> 00:07:05,800 So I probably don't have the enunciation exactly correct. 114 00:07:05,800 --> 00:07:09,240 And I should have listened to how people say that. 115 00:07:09,240 --> 00:07:10,640 So so that's the bacteria. 116 00:07:10,640 --> 00:07:12,880 So it's a bacterial disease. 117 00:07:12,880 --> 00:07:20,260 And it like I said, it's transmitted to humans through the bite of the black legged tick. 118 00:07:20,260 --> 00:07:24,280 And this tick is in the eastern United States, like I said. 119 00:07:24,280 --> 00:07:28,880 And it also can be found in the Midwest and mid Atlantic states. 120 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:32,880 And it's also in northern California, Oregon and Washington. 121 00:07:32,880 --> 00:07:40,680 And so but we do get that by traveling there, not knowing we got bit by a tick and then 122 00:07:40,680 --> 00:07:43,880 coming back and get and then starting to become symptomatic. 123 00:07:43,880 --> 00:07:48,560 And then you'll get part of the statistics for your particular state. 124 00:07:48,560 --> 00:07:55,360 Interesting, so you could be diagnosed in Texas as having Lyme disease, but if have 125 00:07:55,360 --> 00:08:00,880 contracted Lyme disease from a tick, and maybe a place that you traveled, right, just because 126 00:08:00,880 --> 00:08:06,760 a lot of these species don't necessarily reside predominantly in our state, they kind of live 127 00:08:06,760 --> 00:08:09,840 more in these maybe more northern woody areas. 128 00:08:09,840 --> 00:08:10,840 That's correct. 129 00:08:10,840 --> 00:08:11,840 Okay. 130 00:08:11,840 --> 00:08:16,280 So it's really it's really I found this so fascinating this lifecycle of this tick. 131 00:08:16,280 --> 00:08:21,060 So like you said, Josh, some organisms have multiple life cycles. 132 00:08:21,060 --> 00:08:26,960 So the tick is is falls into that category as being an organism with multiple life cycles. 133 00:08:26,960 --> 00:08:33,440 They have four life stages, the egg, the larva, the nymph, and the adult. 134 00:08:33,440 --> 00:08:38,300 And the so fascinating the adult ticks are the size of a sesame seed. 135 00:08:38,300 --> 00:08:42,560 So think about when you go get that bagel, the sesame seed on there, that's the size 136 00:08:42,560 --> 00:08:43,560 of the tick. 137 00:08:43,560 --> 00:08:48,920 But then all the nymph stage, which is the one before the adult stage is the size of 138 00:08:48,920 --> 00:08:50,160 a poppy seed. 139 00:08:50,160 --> 00:08:54,220 So those little poppy seeds on your on your bagel are smaller than that. 140 00:08:54,220 --> 00:08:59,640 So you can imagine it being very hard to know sometimes that you've actually been bitten 141 00:08:59,640 --> 00:09:03,680 by a tick because they're so small. 142 00:09:03,680 --> 00:09:12,120 Interestingly too, after the eggs hatch, those larva and nymph stages have to have blood 143 00:09:12,120 --> 00:09:15,480 to develop to the next stage. 144 00:09:15,480 --> 00:09:20,760 So there we have the reason why we've got to have, you know, a they become a vector 145 00:09:20,760 --> 00:09:24,580 because they're looking for something to feed on that has blood. 146 00:09:24,580 --> 00:09:28,080 And most of the time they're going to find a rodent to do that. 147 00:09:28,080 --> 00:09:34,960 Also to before Josh, I know you want to say something, but also to the mama, the female 148 00:09:34,960 --> 00:09:40,240 ticks have to also feed on blood to be able to lay eggs. 149 00:09:40,240 --> 00:09:48,520 The male ticks, no, they don't have to, but the females have to eat blood to lay their 150 00:09:48,520 --> 00:09:56,120 eggs and then the larva and the nymph stages have to feed on blood to go to the next stage. 151 00:09:56,120 --> 00:09:57,120 That's really interesting. 152 00:09:57,120 --> 00:10:02,780 And one of the things I read about this type of tick is that they only feed really a couple 153 00:10:02,780 --> 00:10:04,080 of times in their lifetime. 154 00:10:04,080 --> 00:10:07,400 They actually have a two year lifespan. 155 00:10:07,400 --> 00:10:12,160 So to go from egg to adult and all the stages in between is about two years. 156 00:10:12,160 --> 00:10:14,760 And I think they only need to feed four or five times. 157 00:10:14,760 --> 00:10:15,760 Okay. 158 00:10:15,760 --> 00:10:16,760 That's interesting. 159 00:10:16,760 --> 00:10:17,760 I did not read that. 160 00:10:17,760 --> 00:10:18,760 So that's real. 161 00:10:18,760 --> 00:10:19,760 Yes. 162 00:10:19,760 --> 00:10:24,280 They're mostly active in the spring summertime, like April, the nymphs are April to July when 163 00:10:24,280 --> 00:10:30,220 they're most active and the adults are most active in spring and fall time. 164 00:10:30,220 --> 00:10:38,560 So and interestingly too, the female ticks, if they're infected, they don't pass it onto 165 00:10:38,560 --> 00:10:41,240 their offspring to the eggs. 166 00:10:41,240 --> 00:10:44,320 So that's the interesting way that it is. 167 00:10:44,320 --> 00:10:50,480 And this is another, this is kind of a misunderstanding. 168 00:10:50,480 --> 00:10:53,120 Yes. 169 00:10:53,120 --> 00:11:01,560 Ticks definitely feed on deer to get blood from deer, but deer are not a source of the 170 00:11:01,560 --> 00:11:03,040 Lyme disease pathogen. 171 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:05,140 They don't carry that bacteria. 172 00:11:05,140 --> 00:11:11,720 So while the ticks can use the blood from the deer to go to the next stage, they did 173 00:11:11,720 --> 00:11:14,000 not get Lyme disease from the deer. 174 00:11:14,000 --> 00:11:15,000 So that was really interesting. 175 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:16,000 Gotcha. 176 00:11:16,000 --> 00:11:22,300 So the reservoir for this bacteria, the Borrelia burgdorferi is going to be a rodent. 177 00:11:22,300 --> 00:11:25,060 So they'll bite the rodent, maybe get the blood from that. 178 00:11:25,060 --> 00:11:29,080 And then if they have blood inside of them to bite a human, that's most likely going 179 00:11:29,080 --> 00:11:30,800 to be the way it transfers. 180 00:11:30,800 --> 00:11:31,800 Right. 181 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:37,120 But remember that the larva and the nymph stages have to have blood to go to the next 182 00:11:37,120 --> 00:11:40,520 stage so they could feed on the blood from a deer. 183 00:11:40,520 --> 00:11:45,520 But I mean, primarily I guess the nymph stage would because the larva would have already 184 00:11:45,520 --> 00:11:47,320 had to have gotten it from a rodent. 185 00:11:47,320 --> 00:11:55,280 Because the nymph could or the or the momma could feed on blood from a deer, but they 186 00:11:55,280 --> 00:11:56,280 didn't get it from the deer. 187 00:11:56,280 --> 00:11:58,440 They'd already gotten it from someplace else. 188 00:11:58,440 --> 00:12:00,080 So yeah, that's a good point. 189 00:12:00,080 --> 00:12:05,500 And maybe people are thinking like, well, how does something so small get on something 190 00:12:05,500 --> 00:12:07,080 so large? 191 00:12:07,080 --> 00:12:12,800 You know, and the thing that's so large, either a rodent, deer or human, not notice it. 192 00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:20,240 And like my mom said, I think it's really crucial to consider how small these things 193 00:12:20,240 --> 00:12:21,240 are. 194 00:12:21,240 --> 00:12:26,840 Like I saw a picture of a dime, like a dime, like a coin and the letter E on like United 195 00:12:26,840 --> 00:12:32,640 States, the nymph of this tick is smaller than that letter E on your dime. 196 00:12:32,640 --> 00:12:39,120 So if you're looking at a coin, let's say from far away, can you see the letter E? 197 00:12:39,120 --> 00:12:42,140 And if you can't, you probably can't see this nymph. 198 00:12:42,140 --> 00:12:49,680 And also imagine that if it bites you, the mouth of this tick is so small that your nervous 199 00:12:49,680 --> 00:12:55,140 system, you know, to signal pain is probably too small for you even to register that you're 200 00:12:55,140 --> 00:12:56,140 getting bit. 201 00:12:56,140 --> 00:12:57,680 Oh, and I've got so much more information about that too. 202 00:12:57,680 --> 00:12:58,680 It's so cool. 203 00:12:58,680 --> 00:12:59,680 Hold on. 204 00:12:59,680 --> 00:13:05,600 Let me just add one other thing is that also the tick has to be normally attached to a 205 00:13:05,600 --> 00:13:11,860 human for 36 to 48 hours before the bacteria can actually be transmitted. 206 00:13:11,860 --> 00:13:17,800 So removing a tick quickly, if you actually can see it within 24 hours is going to help 207 00:13:17,800 --> 00:13:21,120 prevent getting Lyme disease. 208 00:13:21,120 --> 00:13:22,880 But so this is so fascinating. 209 00:13:22,880 --> 00:13:28,840 So you talk about how on earth can this tick get onto these larger animals? 210 00:13:28,840 --> 00:13:30,920 So they can't fly or jump. 211 00:13:30,920 --> 00:13:35,880 So they will instead maybe rest on grass or shrubs. 212 00:13:35,880 --> 00:13:38,060 And they call that questing. 213 00:13:38,060 --> 00:13:43,180 So they've got their positioned and so they can hang there and they hang on there by their 214 00:13:43,180 --> 00:13:44,680 lower legs. 215 00:13:44,680 --> 00:13:48,480 And then their upper legs, their upper pair of legs are outstretched waiting to climb 216 00:13:48,480 --> 00:13:50,360 onto a passing host. 217 00:13:50,360 --> 00:13:55,680 And then when the host brushes by, there they are, they climb aboard and then they find 218 00:13:55,680 --> 00:13:57,600 a suitable place to bite the host. 219 00:13:57,600 --> 00:13:59,840 So this is a whole process. 220 00:13:59,840 --> 00:14:06,640 So they will then, they're getting ready to feed can take anywhere from 10 minutes to 221 00:14:06,640 --> 00:14:08,120 two hours. 222 00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:13,480 So they find a feeding spot, they grasp onto the skin and they cut into the surface of 223 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:17,240 the skin and then they insert a feeding tube. 224 00:14:17,240 --> 00:14:24,540 And sometimes they'll also, they can, they can secrete a cement like stuff substance 225 00:14:24,540 --> 00:14:27,000 so that that helps them to stick there. 226 00:14:27,000 --> 00:14:32,640 And then they also can have out of their saliva, there's something in their chemical saliva, 227 00:14:32,640 --> 00:14:37,040 a chemical in their saliva that kind of serves as an anesthetic so people might not even 228 00:14:37,040 --> 00:14:38,040 feel the bite. 229 00:14:38,040 --> 00:14:40,920 I mean, it's just fascinating and stuff. 230 00:14:40,920 --> 00:14:47,640 So you've got, I'd say if you're a person that is, I'm thinking, we think about hunters 231 00:14:47,640 --> 00:14:51,600 a lot because they're going to be looking for, they're going to be out with deer a lot. 232 00:14:51,600 --> 00:14:55,400 That would be something that you want to be watching for is having your buddies search 233 00:14:55,400 --> 00:15:01,600 your bodies for, you know, ticks after you're done to make sure that you don't see anything 234 00:15:01,600 --> 00:15:05,040 like that, even something such as small little dot and stuff. 235 00:15:05,040 --> 00:15:06,040 Yeah. 236 00:15:06,040 --> 00:15:12,040 It almost seems like seeing it would almost be borderline impossible. 237 00:15:12,040 --> 00:15:15,920 So maybe just making the natural assumption that if you go outside, you might have a tick 238 00:15:15,920 --> 00:15:21,160 on you and to take preventative, I'm sure we'll get to preventative measures later on. 239 00:15:21,160 --> 00:15:22,160 Yes. 240 00:15:22,160 --> 00:15:27,060 I, you know what your description, I think people forget that ticks are a type of arthropod 241 00:15:27,060 --> 00:15:32,400 called an arachnid and people might be familiar with one type of arachnid called a spider. 242 00:15:32,400 --> 00:15:38,120 Then spiders have eight legs or eight appendages and so do ticks. 243 00:15:38,120 --> 00:15:43,320 So it's really, I picture a tick waiting on this leaf very much like a spider waits in 244 00:15:43,320 --> 00:15:49,500 its web, you know, to wait for its prey to come by and then it enacts its predatory act. 245 00:15:49,500 --> 00:15:54,320 So I like that it has a kind of a similar strategy as well. 246 00:15:54,320 --> 00:15:55,320 That's amazing. 247 00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:56,320 It really is. 248 00:15:56,320 --> 00:16:00,520 And they feed for several days, you know, to get enough, you know, of their nourishment. 249 00:16:00,520 --> 00:16:05,080 And their anesthetic obviously is great for, you know, not letting the host know. 250 00:16:05,080 --> 00:16:09,760 I mean, it's so similar to like when a virus goes inside of you and you don't want to let 251 00:16:09,760 --> 00:16:15,200 the host know of the symptoms right away or the host immune system because that would 252 00:16:15,200 --> 00:16:16,400 alert it to the presence. 253 00:16:16,400 --> 00:16:20,920 So you kind of want to be a little sneaky at first before you kind of take over. 254 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:21,920 Yeah. 255 00:16:21,920 --> 00:16:22,920 That's really interesting. 256 00:16:22,920 --> 00:16:26,280 So once they produce this feeding process, they'll drop off and then they'll prepare 257 00:16:26,280 --> 00:16:33,040 for the next life stage and then they'll transition into the next life stage and then whoever 258 00:16:33,040 --> 00:16:39,560 they feed on next, because they can obviously get our blood as well too to go to the next 259 00:16:39,560 --> 00:16:40,560 stage as well too. 260 00:16:40,560 --> 00:16:48,180 So yeah, so throughout its life, once they're infected, they can transmit Lyme disease. 261 00:16:48,180 --> 00:16:53,720 But like Josh said, they usually have a lifespan of only around two to three years and stuff. 262 00:16:53,720 --> 00:16:57,600 So I still think that's really remarkable for something as small as an insect or sorry, 263 00:16:57,600 --> 00:17:01,080 not an insect and, you know, a tiny little arachnid. 264 00:17:01,080 --> 00:17:04,400 Because sometimes I think about there are certain insects that only live to be like 265 00:17:04,400 --> 00:17:05,400 a week old. 266 00:17:05,400 --> 00:17:06,400 Yes. 267 00:17:06,400 --> 00:17:10,440 So the fact that one of these small things can live to be, you know, two years is pretty 268 00:17:10,440 --> 00:17:11,440 incredible. 269 00:17:11,440 --> 00:17:12,440 Right. 270 00:17:12,440 --> 00:17:17,640 So remember too, that, you know, removing them quickly can reduce the chances of getting 271 00:17:17,640 --> 00:17:24,280 Lyme disease because it can take some time for the bacteria to move from the tick to 272 00:17:24,280 --> 00:17:25,280 the host. 273 00:17:25,280 --> 00:17:26,280 All right. 274 00:17:26,280 --> 00:17:27,280 All right. 275 00:17:27,280 --> 00:17:32,000 So we've talked about the tick and how it can bite and essentially get our blood. 276 00:17:32,000 --> 00:17:38,880 But I imagine within the transfer of our blood going into their body, they're also transferring 277 00:17:38,880 --> 00:17:41,020 things inside of us. 278 00:17:41,020 --> 00:17:46,000 And I think that is the potentially the bacteria that you were mentioning. 279 00:17:46,000 --> 00:17:47,000 Right. 280 00:17:47,000 --> 00:17:49,280 The bacteria that causes Lyme disease. 281 00:17:49,280 --> 00:17:50,280 Right. 282 00:17:50,280 --> 00:17:56,040 When they are feeding, they're also like, that's how the bacteria gets into us as well. 283 00:17:56,040 --> 00:17:57,040 Yes. 284 00:17:57,040 --> 00:17:58,040 Okay. 285 00:17:58,040 --> 00:18:02,720 So do you want to kind of go into, you know, I wish maybe, I don't know if you just want 286 00:18:02,720 --> 00:18:09,960 to give a brief, you know, summary of, you know, just kind of basic infection, like why 287 00:18:09,960 --> 00:18:12,440 a bacteria entering inside. 288 00:18:12,440 --> 00:18:13,440 We don't have to do that. 289 00:18:13,440 --> 00:18:14,440 Don't worry about it. 290 00:18:14,440 --> 00:18:15,440 Or you can do that. 291 00:18:15,440 --> 00:18:16,440 Yeah. 292 00:18:16,440 --> 00:18:24,200 Well, I mean, we've talked about this before with viruses and, and, um, you, you have to 293 00:18:24,200 --> 00:18:30,480 remember that your body, it doesn't feel like much, but to the outside world and all the 294 00:18:30,480 --> 00:18:33,160 creatures, it's a reservoir for a lot of yummy things. 295 00:18:33,160 --> 00:18:38,040 So the reason the tick wants your blood is that your blood is full of a lot of nutrients, 296 00:18:38,040 --> 00:18:42,400 a lot of glucose, especially if you've eaten some of my mom's amazing cookies. 297 00:18:42,400 --> 00:18:44,500 So they hope to catch me on that day. 298 00:18:44,500 --> 00:18:48,560 So there's a lot of nutrients in the human body. 299 00:18:48,560 --> 00:18:51,200 And so a lot of creatures are trying to take advantage of that. 300 00:18:51,200 --> 00:18:55,240 And your body has developed a lot of defenses against that, whether it's your skin or your 301 00:18:55,240 --> 00:18:57,160 immune system. 302 00:18:57,160 --> 00:19:03,360 And so when a lot of those barriers have been broken, um, then you essentially open yourself 303 00:19:03,360 --> 00:19:06,960 up to being a buffet for a lot of these organisms. 304 00:19:06,960 --> 00:19:13,080 So this bacteria will basically enter into the skin where it's been cut open, get into 305 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:14,360 the bloodstream. 306 00:19:14,360 --> 00:19:18,840 And as you know about the bloodstream, it, or maybe you don't, it's essentially just, 307 00:19:18,840 --> 00:19:24,680 just connection of intricate plumbing that's pumped by your heart to essentially go through 308 00:19:24,680 --> 00:19:30,760 all about your body to deliver two main things, you know, nutrients and oxygen. 309 00:19:30,760 --> 00:19:36,000 And there are certain areas of your body where certain bacteria thrive and do well. 310 00:19:36,000 --> 00:19:40,400 And some of those bacteria are quite helpful, um, especially in your gut. 311 00:19:40,400 --> 00:19:43,120 Uh, but there are some places where they're not helpful. 312 00:19:43,120 --> 00:19:46,840 Um, like your brain, you don't want a lot of bacteria up there because it can cause 313 00:19:46,840 --> 00:19:48,640 things like sepsis. 314 00:19:48,640 --> 00:19:55,960 Um, and, uh, you know, crazy enough, you know, the, one of the reasons why these ticks can 315 00:19:55,960 --> 00:20:01,960 actually carry these bacteria and not have Lyme disease themselves is that they've actually 316 00:20:01,960 --> 00:20:06,520 kind of developed this cooperative relationship where the tick, the tick actually has this 317 00:20:06,520 --> 00:20:14,040 genetic profile where it's able to kind of tampen down the population of, uh, B. burgdorferi. 318 00:20:14,040 --> 00:20:18,040 And, but when it goes into a human, we don't have this genetic profile. 319 00:20:18,040 --> 00:20:20,520 Cause last time I checked, I'm not a tick. 320 00:20:20,520 --> 00:20:26,240 Um, and so we, we basically don't have this innate immunity against it. 321 00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:32,040 So it goes into our bloodstream and then it goes to an area of our body where it essentially 322 00:20:32,040 --> 00:20:35,480 presents itself potentially as a disease. 323 00:20:35,480 --> 00:20:40,560 And so I'm going to pass it over to my mom on drugs to kind of present the, the description 324 00:20:40,560 --> 00:20:43,200 of this disease, which we call Lyme disease. 325 00:20:43,200 --> 00:20:45,000 Once this bacteria is inside of us. 326 00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:46,000 Okay. 327 00:20:46,000 --> 00:20:50,040 But what, one other piece of information, let me share, um, before we, I'm going to 328 00:20:50,040 --> 00:20:55,720 start talking about signs and symptoms of Lyme disease is that, uh, being in Texas, 329 00:20:55,720 --> 00:21:00,240 we really do have a low incidence rate of Lyme disease. 330 00:21:00,240 --> 00:21:04,500 So you're again, you're talking about why on earth, I mean, so Shania Twain is not going 331 00:21:04,500 --> 00:21:07,560 to come, you know, visit us, you know, every week or whatever. 332 00:21:07,560 --> 00:21:12,440 But the thing is most of the cases in Texas are going to be what we call imported. 333 00:21:12,440 --> 00:21:18,240 Um, and that means that someone has trans has, has traveled to one of those areas that 334 00:21:18,240 --> 00:21:21,240 is more where Lyme disease is more prevalent. 335 00:21:21,240 --> 00:21:30,280 Went on a hunting trip, went on a hiking vacation and got exposed and then came back and then 336 00:21:30,280 --> 00:21:32,040 got diagnosed after that. 337 00:21:32,040 --> 00:21:34,740 So that's why we talk about that. 338 00:21:34,740 --> 00:21:39,340 Probably everybody should be aware of what it looks like if you develop signs and symptoms 339 00:21:39,340 --> 00:21:44,680 of Lyme disease, especially if you're a traveler, you like the outdoors and that kind of thing. 340 00:21:44,680 --> 00:21:51,400 So, so, um, moving into the signs and symptoms of Lyme disease, the signs and symptoms will 341 00:21:51,400 --> 00:21:57,720 develop anywhere from three to 30 days after the tick bite starts out with some non-specific 342 00:21:57,720 --> 00:22:03,720 symptoms, things like fever, chills, headache, malaise, which is kind of, you know, feeling 343 00:22:03,720 --> 00:22:06,400 tired and just kind of draggy. 344 00:22:06,400 --> 00:22:09,000 You can have some muscle and joint aches. 345 00:22:09,000 --> 00:22:16,560 You can have some swollen lymph nodes, but the key, um, the key diagnostic clinical symptom 346 00:22:16,560 --> 00:22:19,480 is what we call erythema migrans. 347 00:22:19,480 --> 00:22:25,640 And it's a skin manifestation that is going to occur in the 70 to 80% of people who have 348 00:22:25,640 --> 00:22:28,760 been infected with Lyme disease. 349 00:22:28,760 --> 00:22:33,800 Usually the average onset of erythema migrans is within seven days of being bit by the tick. 350 00:22:33,800 --> 00:22:36,960 And it would, it looks kind of like a bullseye. 351 00:22:36,960 --> 00:22:43,440 So you've got kind of a red center area, then the bacteria, the symptom will start clearing, 352 00:22:43,440 --> 00:22:46,080 but then you've got this outer ring as well too. 353 00:22:46,080 --> 00:22:52,960 Now not everybody is going to get this classic erythema migrans, um, uh, skin manifestation, 354 00:22:52,960 --> 00:22:56,120 but like I said, it happens in about 70 to 80% of people. 355 00:22:56,120 --> 00:23:00,000 And it may not also look exactly classically because that's just the way the human body 356 00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:01,000 is. 357 00:23:01,000 --> 00:23:06,840 It can feel warm to the touch, but it's not itchy or painful. 358 00:23:06,840 --> 00:23:11,680 And it can appear on any part of the body, but it's most commonly seen in your thigh 359 00:23:11,680 --> 00:23:17,840 area, your groin area, or actually, actually your axilla, which is under your arms as well. 360 00:23:17,840 --> 00:23:20,400 Um, and it can occur in multiple places. 361 00:23:20,400 --> 00:23:29,480 In two to 18% of cases, people can have more than one, um, um, uh, demonstration of erythema 362 00:23:29,480 --> 00:23:30,480 migrans. 363 00:23:30,480 --> 00:23:35,600 Um, this, like I said, this classic rash is not present in all patients or it could look 364 00:23:35,600 --> 00:23:41,540 somewhat different, but just be aware of that, that that's going to be a real key diagnostic 365 00:23:41,540 --> 00:23:48,340 tool if you have this particular rash when you manifest as Lyme disease. 366 00:23:48,340 --> 00:23:52,560 So those are kind of the things that you look at early on. 367 00:23:52,560 --> 00:23:59,600 And if by chance this gets missed or you don't manifest the typical symptoms, if you have 368 00:23:59,600 --> 00:24:04,440 later signs and symptoms that are anywhere from days to months after the tick bite, then 369 00:24:04,440 --> 00:24:09,040 you can have some more serious issues associated with Lyme disease. 370 00:24:09,040 --> 00:24:12,480 You can have a severe headache or neck stiffness. 371 00:24:12,480 --> 00:24:18,280 You can have other, my, uh, those erythema migraine rashes all over the body as well. 372 00:24:18,280 --> 00:24:21,120 You can have some neurologic symptoms. 373 00:24:21,120 --> 00:24:24,760 So one of the things that we see, I think more in children, but you can also see in 374 00:24:24,760 --> 00:24:29,800 an adult is called facial palsy, which means there's some weakness on one or both sides 375 00:24:29,800 --> 00:24:30,800 of your face. 376 00:24:30,800 --> 00:24:34,520 You have a lot loss of muscle tone or kind of a droopy look. 377 00:24:34,520 --> 00:24:36,500 Um, also you can get arthritis. 378 00:24:36,500 --> 00:24:41,880 So you, this bacteria can get in your joints and cause the pain and the swelling associated 379 00:24:41,880 --> 00:24:47,280 with an arthritis, especially in the knees or other large joints like your shoulder or 380 00:24:47,280 --> 00:24:50,300 your elbow or your ankle. 381 00:24:50,300 --> 00:24:53,980 You can have intermittent bone joint and muscle pain. 382 00:24:53,980 --> 00:24:55,760 You can also have, this is pretty serious. 383 00:24:55,760 --> 00:25:00,480 You can also have Lyme carditis where that bacteria gets into your heart muscle and that's, 384 00:25:00,480 --> 00:25:01,480 that's really not good. 385 00:25:01,480 --> 00:25:05,480 And again, some other neurologic symptoms are, uh, I should have included those when 386 00:25:05,480 --> 00:25:09,080 I talked about the facial palsy, but you can have some dizziness. 387 00:25:09,080 --> 00:25:12,020 You can have brain and spinal cord inflammation. 388 00:25:12,020 --> 00:25:13,580 You can have meningitis. 389 00:25:13,580 --> 00:25:18,840 You can also have some nerve pain, shooting pains and numbness that that are tingling 390 00:25:18,840 --> 00:25:21,380 that go out to your hands and feet as well too. 391 00:25:21,380 --> 00:25:27,400 So again, catching it earlier and managing it earlier is pretty much what we want to 392 00:25:27,400 --> 00:25:33,520 do, but there are, so to avoid some of these more serious, uh, uh, manifestations of the 393 00:25:33,520 --> 00:25:34,520 disease. 394 00:25:34,520 --> 00:25:35,520 Yeah. 395 00:25:35,520 --> 00:25:39,960 I think it seems like the main prevention is to prevent the, from bacteria from getting 396 00:25:39,960 --> 00:25:44,620 inside the bloodstream in the first place, which is to essentially, as mom mentioned 397 00:25:44,620 --> 00:25:48,960 earlier, ticks can be feeding up to you said, 48 hours, 48 hours. 398 00:25:48,960 --> 00:25:54,080 So within 48 hours of going on a hike, you know, maybe somewhere in the Northeast or 399 00:25:54,080 --> 00:25:59,040 the Northwest, it would be good to maybe do a check and see what's on you. 400 00:25:59,040 --> 00:26:00,040 Yeah. 401 00:26:00,040 --> 00:26:03,100 It's, uh, we've talked a bit about this in other episodes, but there are these things 402 00:26:03,100 --> 00:26:09,040 in your, um, near, near your, you know, basically in your head called cranial nerves. 403 00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:13,360 And there's, uh, I can't remember how many there are 12 of them. 404 00:26:13,360 --> 00:26:17,560 And yeah, if you get infected in some of these, then they're going to present themselves as 405 00:26:17,560 --> 00:26:23,260 neurological symptoms, which I believe led to, you know, Ms. Twain's, uh, inability to 406 00:26:23,260 --> 00:26:24,680 use her vocal cords. 407 00:26:24,680 --> 00:26:29,240 Cause basically one of those nerves got affected by this bacteria. 408 00:26:29,240 --> 00:26:32,840 And uh, yeah, if it infects that and chronically infects it, then you're not going to be able 409 00:26:32,840 --> 00:26:34,240 to have access to that. 410 00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:39,600 Um, then basically becomes a game of diminishing that inflammation to a point where you can 411 00:26:39,600 --> 00:26:40,700 be functional again. 412 00:26:40,700 --> 00:26:42,360 So that's scary stuff. 413 00:26:42,360 --> 00:26:43,360 It is. 414 00:26:43,360 --> 00:26:44,360 It is. 415 00:26:44,360 --> 00:26:51,380 I'd say, you know, I'd say they're most probably preventive way to, if you are someone that 416 00:26:51,380 --> 00:26:57,120 goes outside is to make sure you wear protective clothing, um, to, to keep the tick, you know, 417 00:26:57,120 --> 00:27:00,440 as a barrier between you and the tick. 418 00:27:00,440 --> 00:27:02,680 I I'm not, I apologize. 419 00:27:02,680 --> 00:27:04,560 I did not look this up. 420 00:27:04,560 --> 00:27:10,840 I don't know if there are repellents that can be used to repel ticks. 421 00:27:10,840 --> 00:27:12,600 I didn't look up that. 422 00:27:12,600 --> 00:27:13,880 So I'm not sure of that. 423 00:27:13,880 --> 00:27:16,960 There are, um, struggling to name, find the name. 424 00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:20,280 We can post it in our notes, but there are certain sprays that you can spray on your 425 00:27:20,280 --> 00:27:28,200 clothing that essentially act as a mild nerve agent against the, uh, the insect or tick 426 00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:29,200 itself. 427 00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:31,120 And remember, this is just one type of tick. 428 00:27:31,120 --> 00:27:35,720 There's many other types of tick that carry other types of diseases, things like a Rocky 429 00:27:35,720 --> 00:27:37,440 mountain spotted fever. 430 00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:44,040 Um, there is, um, what's another one I'm thinking of is like babbiosis or basically, 431 00:27:44,040 --> 00:27:45,040 yes. 432 00:27:45,040 --> 00:27:48,000 Yeah, there's, there's many different types of diseases because different types of ticks 433 00:27:48,000 --> 00:27:53,080 carry different bacteria because those ticks are, you know, they, they've, they've evolved 434 00:27:53,080 --> 00:27:56,880 to essentially have different bacteria live inside of them. 435 00:27:56,880 --> 00:28:02,320 Um, so sometimes something even manifesting itself, if you don't have, that's why the 436 00:28:02,320 --> 00:28:07,200 understanding that big target ring, you know, arithmetic migrans is, is really a big indicator 437 00:28:07,200 --> 00:28:12,880 for Lyme disease because if you just have the malaise or fatigue, um, after being bit 438 00:28:12,880 --> 00:28:17,480 by a tick, it could be one of these other types of diseases that do present similar 439 00:28:17,480 --> 00:28:20,640 symptoms to Lyme disease, but might actually be Lyme disease. 440 00:28:20,640 --> 00:28:24,440 But Lyme disease is definitely the most prevalent, which is why we're talking about it. 441 00:28:24,440 --> 00:28:25,440 Right. 442 00:28:25,440 --> 00:28:28,400 And so like, like Josh said, there are different types of ticks. 443 00:28:28,400 --> 00:28:32,600 This, this is like we said, the black leg tick, or it can sometimes be called the deer 444 00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:38,280 tick, which is a little bit of a misnomer, but you know, they do, you do find them on 445 00:28:38,280 --> 00:28:41,800 deer, but deer are not the, the, uh, cause of the Lyme disease. 446 00:28:41,800 --> 00:28:42,800 Yeah. 447 00:28:42,800 --> 00:28:46,040 I think it's their main source of blood, but it's definitely not the source of the, the 448 00:28:46,040 --> 00:28:47,040 bacteria. 449 00:28:47,040 --> 00:28:48,040 Right. 450 00:28:48,040 --> 00:28:51,760 So let's talk then, I know we've talked a little bit about some prevention, but now 451 00:28:51,760 --> 00:28:55,600 let's talk about if you, if you have some of these symptoms, how on earth do you get 452 00:28:55,600 --> 00:28:58,680 diagnosed with Lyme disease? 453 00:28:58,680 --> 00:29:01,560 Most of the time it is going to be a clinical diagnosis. 454 00:29:01,560 --> 00:29:04,000 So we're looking at those signs and symptoms. 455 00:29:04,000 --> 00:29:09,280 So for sure, if you've got this erythema in migrants, it's going to be a pretty good diagnostic 456 00:29:09,280 --> 00:29:11,240 tool that you have Lyme disease. 457 00:29:11,240 --> 00:29:18,200 Um, if you, if you, you're going to, you're going to also people who are evaluating you 458 00:29:18,200 --> 00:29:23,120 for your signs and symptoms, healthcare professionals will also be wanting a history of where you've 459 00:29:23,120 --> 00:29:24,120 been. 460 00:29:24,120 --> 00:29:27,320 Did you have a chance to be exposed to this black leg tick? 461 00:29:27,320 --> 00:29:32,120 Um, do they're going to rule out other illnesses that have similar symptoms? 462 00:29:32,120 --> 00:29:38,880 And then it, so then it gets down to, are there any lab tests that you can do to identify 463 00:29:38,880 --> 00:29:41,320 whether or not you have Lyme disease or not? 464 00:29:41,320 --> 00:29:42,760 And it's kind of tricky. 465 00:29:42,760 --> 00:29:51,640 Um, basically you're again, you're there, you're, if you have a really low kind of, 466 00:29:51,640 --> 00:29:59,920 uh, present low, low risk presentation, like you've got fever and body aches, but nothing 467 00:29:59,920 --> 00:30:04,720 else, you're not going to run a diagnostic test. 468 00:30:04,720 --> 00:30:09,960 And if you have erythema migrants, which is pretty highly specific, then you're not going 469 00:30:09,960 --> 00:30:11,560 to run diagnostic tests. 470 00:30:11,560 --> 00:30:18,640 We're, we're looking to run diagnostic tests in that middle ground area where maybe people 471 00:30:18,640 --> 00:30:21,680 have just some more non-specific symptoms. 472 00:30:21,680 --> 00:30:24,480 Maybe they've got some joint pain or whatever and stuff. 473 00:30:24,480 --> 00:30:29,240 So you're going to, you're, you may then pick that there are those, those patients out to 474 00:30:29,240 --> 00:30:31,480 do this diagnostic testing with it. 475 00:30:31,480 --> 00:30:34,360 And it's a two step testing process. 476 00:30:34,360 --> 00:30:41,600 The first part of the testing is going to be what we call a, um, they call it an ELISA 477 00:30:41,600 --> 00:30:42,600 test. 478 00:30:42,600 --> 00:30:49,360 And basically what the ELISA test E L I S A test is doing is it's measuring antibodies 479 00:30:49,360 --> 00:30:52,800 to Borrelia or Dauphiri. 480 00:30:52,800 --> 00:30:58,480 And so, uh, and it, but it can take a little bit of time for those antibodies to develop 481 00:30:58,480 --> 00:31:00,240 to the bacteria. 482 00:31:00,240 --> 00:31:04,480 So if you measure it too early, you're going to get a negative test. 483 00:31:04,480 --> 00:31:09,120 So you may have to wait a couple of weeks to, until you've got an antibody level that's 484 00:31:09,120 --> 00:31:11,360 going to measure on this test. 485 00:31:11,360 --> 00:31:16,600 And if you get kind of a equivocal kind of like a plus one is maybe it's positive or 486 00:31:16,600 --> 00:31:21,920 positive tests from this ELISA test, then you run the second test, which is usually 487 00:31:21,920 --> 00:31:25,120 a, what they call a Western blot test. 488 00:31:25,120 --> 00:31:36,240 And this test is actually measuring immunoglobulins in our circulation, primarily IgM, immunoglobulin 489 00:31:36,240 --> 00:31:42,480 M and IgG, immunoglobulin G. These are the ones that are going to manifest when the Lyme, 490 00:31:42,480 --> 00:31:48,600 when you have Lyme disease, but they're not, there is within the first 30 days, you can 491 00:31:48,600 --> 00:31:50,640 measure both of those immunoglobulins. 492 00:31:50,640 --> 00:31:55,920 And if you get a positive test with that ELISA test, and then you get the positive measurements 493 00:31:55,920 --> 00:32:01,240 of these immune globulins with the Western blot, then you have a pretty definitive diagnosis 494 00:32:01,240 --> 00:32:03,080 of having Lyme disease. 495 00:32:03,080 --> 00:32:11,720 But know too that after 30 days, the IgM is no longer as reliable because IgM can be elevated 496 00:32:11,720 --> 00:32:14,320 in other kinds of infections as well too. 497 00:32:14,320 --> 00:32:20,360 And it also can stay around in someone's body for a long time after they've had Lyme disease. 498 00:32:20,360 --> 00:32:27,280 So, so you might be looking for IgG in a 30 to 60 day time period after you've manifesting 499 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:30,800 symptoms, but IgM won't be a good monitor anymore. 500 00:32:30,800 --> 00:32:36,560 And also these, these immune globulin levels, you can't measure to determine cure because 501 00:32:36,560 --> 00:32:40,480 they can hang around or they can be elevated with other disease states as well too. 502 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:46,120 So it can be in this little window, they can help diagnose it, but after that, they're 503 00:32:46,120 --> 00:32:47,120 not as useful. 504 00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:53,360 Yeah, it almost seems to be like an ancillary tool to help along with the ELISA diagnosis 505 00:32:53,360 --> 00:32:54,360 as well. 506 00:32:54,360 --> 00:33:00,360 Kind of reminds me of like when you got COVID tested for PCR or even the antibody tests, 507 00:33:00,360 --> 00:33:05,080 it was the, sometimes you would get these false positives, especially the PCR because 508 00:33:05,080 --> 00:33:10,880 that DNA of the SARS-CoV-2 virus could, could stick around for a really long time. 509 00:33:10,880 --> 00:33:16,240 So even when you weren't infectious anymore, you could still register positive as well. 510 00:33:16,240 --> 00:33:19,480 So you're kind of looking for, I mean, the thing with science, a lot of people think 511 00:33:19,480 --> 00:33:25,160 it's like it's a lucid alien truth, but science is really about eliminating possibilities. 512 00:33:25,160 --> 00:33:29,880 So that's, it's always just kind of saying like, all right, does this test say this thing? 513 00:33:29,880 --> 00:33:30,880 It doesn't. 514 00:33:30,880 --> 00:33:31,880 Okay, let's move on to the next test. 515 00:33:31,880 --> 00:33:34,920 So, cause there's a lot of things that can make you sick. 516 00:33:34,920 --> 00:33:38,880 And you're trying to isolate which thing is the actual cause. 517 00:33:38,880 --> 00:33:41,780 And the way to do that is by eliminating possibilities. 518 00:33:41,780 --> 00:33:45,680 So you don't want to treat somebody for a condition that they don't have, cause you 519 00:33:45,680 --> 00:33:51,360 could, one, make something worse or two, basically waste your time. 520 00:33:51,360 --> 00:33:52,360 So there's a lot. 521 00:33:52,360 --> 00:33:55,520 And I'm sure they're not cheap to run these tests as well either. 522 00:33:55,520 --> 00:34:01,320 So, so you're looking for that patient that has been potentially exposed to this black 523 00:34:01,320 --> 00:34:05,120 lead tick, black legged tick. 524 00:34:05,120 --> 00:34:11,000 And then they're showing some of the symptoms, but they've got maybe some, maybe they don't 525 00:34:11,000 --> 00:34:14,280 have that classic erythema migrans rash. 526 00:34:14,280 --> 00:34:18,880 They've got some other things going on and you've got to try to decide whether or not 527 00:34:18,880 --> 00:34:21,640 am I ruling Lyme disease in or am I ruling it out? 528 00:34:21,640 --> 00:34:23,400 And so you would choose those patients. 529 00:34:23,400 --> 00:34:28,440 Primarily it's patients that have arthritic, arthritis type symptoms is what I read a lot 530 00:34:28,440 --> 00:34:30,280 about that that would use, you would use this. 531 00:34:30,280 --> 00:34:31,280 That makes sense. 532 00:34:31,280 --> 00:34:34,800 And even things like meningitis, cause there's a lot of bacteria or viruses that can cause 533 00:34:34,800 --> 00:34:35,800 meningitis. 534 00:34:35,800 --> 00:34:37,920 So you're wondering which thing is causing it. 535 00:34:37,920 --> 00:34:38,920 Right. 536 00:34:38,920 --> 00:34:39,920 You could do that. 537 00:34:39,920 --> 00:34:40,920 Yes. 538 00:34:40,920 --> 00:34:46,840 So, so let's, let's move on to like, okay, so we've got some signs and symptoms. 539 00:34:46,840 --> 00:34:52,160 We know we were exposed to this tick because we were out in the Northeast hunting or hiking. 540 00:34:52,160 --> 00:34:54,920 How do, how on earth do we treat this disease? 541 00:34:54,920 --> 00:35:00,360 So it is actually because it's a bacteria, it can be treated with the antibiotics and 542 00:35:00,360 --> 00:35:05,760 the earlier you do it, the earlier your diagnosis and the earlier you receive the proper antibiotic 543 00:35:05,760 --> 00:35:14,780 therapy, it can, it's going to help prevent those late Lyme disease symptoms or presentations. 544 00:35:14,780 --> 00:35:20,200 It's not a hundred percent though, because people can get treated and then they can end 545 00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:22,640 up with some persistent symptoms afterwards. 546 00:35:22,640 --> 00:35:24,520 It's a, it's a nasty disease. 547 00:35:24,520 --> 00:35:27,320 So, so, but you want to try to catch it earlier on. 548 00:35:27,320 --> 00:35:33,920 And so if you're just targeting people that just have the rash with the erythema migrans, 549 00:35:33,920 --> 00:35:38,640 with non-specific symptoms, there are three key antibiotics that are used. 550 00:35:38,640 --> 00:35:43,040 It's doxycycline, amoxicillin, or cefuroxine. 551 00:35:43,040 --> 00:35:46,960 And one's a tetracycline, one's a penicillin, and one's cephalosporin. 552 00:35:46,960 --> 00:35:51,800 And they can be given orally, usually for two weeks. 553 00:35:51,800 --> 00:35:56,000 The doxycycline can be given for about 10 days and you use, you use these same antibiotics 554 00:35:56,000 --> 00:35:58,760 in both adults and children. 555 00:35:58,760 --> 00:36:04,040 And again, the treatments, the dosages can be modified based on the age of the patient, 556 00:36:04,040 --> 00:36:08,880 whether or not they're pregnant, other underlying health conditions or allergic or allergy, 557 00:36:08,880 --> 00:36:09,880 you need allergies to medication. 558 00:36:09,880 --> 00:36:11,760 So you would modify it accordingly. 559 00:36:11,760 --> 00:36:16,560 Are things like doxycycline, amoxicillin, are those the brand names? 560 00:36:16,560 --> 00:36:18,080 No, those are the generic names. 561 00:36:18,080 --> 00:36:19,080 The generic names. 562 00:36:19,080 --> 00:36:23,760 All the, the doxycycline, amoxicillin, and cefuroxine are all generic names. 563 00:36:23,760 --> 00:36:24,760 Okay. 564 00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:28,040 They're, they're older drugs, so I'm not even sure they have a brand name drug to them anymore. 565 00:36:28,040 --> 00:36:30,240 But you said they're derivatives of penicillin. 566 00:36:30,240 --> 00:36:35,800 Well, amoxicillin is a penicillin, but doxycycline is what we call a tetracycline. 567 00:36:35,800 --> 00:36:36,800 Okay. 568 00:36:36,800 --> 00:36:39,600 And cephalo, cepheuroxine is a cephalosporin. 569 00:36:39,600 --> 00:36:41,320 Those are just classes of drugs. 570 00:36:41,320 --> 00:36:42,320 Gotcha. 571 00:36:42,320 --> 00:36:43,320 Classes of antibiotics. 572 00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:49,120 And it, most patients, if you treat them early on with Lyme disease, they will recover rapidly 573 00:36:49,120 --> 00:36:51,720 and completely. 574 00:36:51,720 --> 00:36:57,020 So that's going to be your basic Lyme disease patients. 575 00:36:57,020 --> 00:37:03,160 If you have some neurologic symptoms associated with Lyme disease, let's take, for example, 576 00:37:03,160 --> 00:37:06,000 the facial palsy, so that drooping face. 577 00:37:06,000 --> 00:37:11,680 You also can treat patients orally with doxycycline, both adults and children, for up to three 578 00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:12,680 weeks. 579 00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:18,360 And hopefully you'll get some improvement and, and, and cure in that. 580 00:37:18,360 --> 00:37:23,120 As you know, and, and, and then, but if you have something like Lyme meningitis or you 581 00:37:23,120 --> 00:37:28,480 have more of those neurologic symptoms, like you've got fainting, tingling in your hands 582 00:37:28,480 --> 00:37:35,560 and feet or kind of nerve pain kind of feeling and stuff, then you can also use oral therapy 583 00:37:35,560 --> 00:37:40,880 with doxycycline for up to three weeks in adults and children, or you may need some 584 00:37:40,880 --> 00:37:42,880 intravenous antibiotic therapy. 585 00:37:42,880 --> 00:37:47,420 The drug that's used typically is another cephalosporin called ceftriaxone, which is 586 00:37:47,420 --> 00:37:50,080 a parenteral or an intravenous antibiotic. 587 00:37:50,080 --> 00:37:54,120 And again, you'd use that for three weeks. 588 00:37:54,120 --> 00:37:59,760 Most patients, if you treat with both these, in these neurologic symptoms can be, they 589 00:37:59,760 --> 00:38:04,600 can recover, but if you delay treatment again, and we can understand why treatment can be 590 00:38:04,600 --> 00:38:12,560 delayed because you might not manifest the symptoms, you know, like, like a textbook 591 00:38:12,560 --> 00:38:15,880 or it could take some time to figure out, oh, let's do this. 592 00:38:15,880 --> 00:38:19,720 Cause they, you're going through a whole long, what, well, what could it be this or could 593 00:38:19,720 --> 00:38:20,720 it be this? 594 00:38:20,720 --> 00:38:26,520 And so then they may have some permanent nervous system damage as a result of the effects on 595 00:38:26,520 --> 00:38:29,160 the nervous system from this bacteria. 596 00:38:29,160 --> 00:38:33,480 So trying to catch it early, trying to keep that at the forefront of if you've got some 597 00:38:33,480 --> 00:38:36,360 of these symptoms or, you know, you've been to these places, you just want to be aware 598 00:38:36,360 --> 00:38:37,360 of that. 599 00:38:37,360 --> 00:38:43,360 I think it's really important to re to emphasize to when, when you've been diagnosed with any 600 00:38:43,360 --> 00:38:50,880 type of bacterial infection, you're not taking the treatment to match the symptoms. 601 00:38:50,880 --> 00:38:54,600 So for example, if you're taking it for three weeks and let's say after two weeks, you feel 602 00:38:54,600 --> 00:38:55,600 better. 603 00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:56,600 Should you stop? 604 00:38:56,600 --> 00:38:57,600 No. 605 00:38:57,600 --> 00:38:59,920 And why is that? 606 00:38:59,920 --> 00:39:05,680 The reason that you don't stop is that maybe there are still a few bacteria hanging around 607 00:39:05,680 --> 00:39:12,680 and if you stop, they could then develop some mechanisms within their little bacterial cell 608 00:39:12,680 --> 00:39:16,240 wall that would cause resistance to antibiotics. 609 00:39:16,240 --> 00:39:21,040 So that if you then try it, started taking it again, those antibiotics might not work. 610 00:39:21,040 --> 00:39:25,800 So even if you've diminished the bacteria down to 1% of its original population, that 611 00:39:25,800 --> 00:39:34,600 1%, if not taken care of, then just like mom said, that 1% will have a resistance to the 612 00:39:34,600 --> 00:39:38,680 antibiotic and then those become multiply and they then they'll kind of take over and 613 00:39:38,680 --> 00:39:40,400 that's, that's a, that's a problem. 614 00:39:40,400 --> 00:39:45,480 So it's really important to complete your regimen of antibiotics if you've been prescribed 615 00:39:45,480 --> 00:39:47,240 them. 616 00:39:47,240 --> 00:39:51,240 Those patients that develop heart symptoms associated with Lyme disease, that's a pretty 617 00:39:51,240 --> 00:39:53,400 serious thing. 618 00:39:53,400 --> 00:39:58,160 You can have, you know, arrhythmias, you can have heart block. 619 00:39:58,160 --> 00:39:59,560 So it's pretty serious. 620 00:39:59,560 --> 00:40:03,360 So the recommendation is that you're going to treat those patients immediately and you're 621 00:40:03,360 --> 00:40:08,120 not going to wait for any type of test results because you do the test results, but you're 622 00:40:08,120 --> 00:40:11,600 going to go ahead and already start them in their antibiotic therapy. 623 00:40:11,600 --> 00:40:16,360 And if you need to stop it because the tests are negative, that's much better than waiting 624 00:40:16,360 --> 00:40:20,800 because they could get far worse if they, if they don't know that this is specifically 625 00:40:20,800 --> 00:40:26,160 because these symptoms can get more severe and anything with your heart can be, you know, 626 00:40:26,160 --> 00:40:29,280 kind of troubling and stuff. 627 00:40:29,280 --> 00:40:35,000 So again, you can do, you can actually treat it milder heart symptoms with the oral that 628 00:40:35,000 --> 00:40:41,800 those either any of those three antibiotics orally in kids and adults for 21 days, the 629 00:40:41,800 --> 00:40:44,880 doxycycline, amoxicillin, or staphyroxine. 630 00:40:44,880 --> 00:40:49,560 But if you have more serious heart symptoms, then you're going to use the intravenous therapy 631 00:40:49,560 --> 00:40:53,600 with the ceftriaxone up to up for three weeks. 632 00:40:53,600 --> 00:41:01,640 The last area of, you know, target or the last targeted area that the Lyme bacteria 633 00:41:01,640 --> 00:41:08,240 can interfere with is going to be our joints, so Lyme arthritis. 634 00:41:08,240 --> 00:41:15,920 And so again, the doxycycline, amoxicillin, or staphyroxine oral therapies can be used 635 00:41:15,920 --> 00:41:18,600 in adults and children for this night. 636 00:41:18,600 --> 00:41:23,480 Now we've got to increase it for four week therapy, 28 days. 637 00:41:23,480 --> 00:41:29,200 If you have improving but persistent symptoms in your joints, you could end up needing an 638 00:41:29,200 --> 00:41:32,560 additional 28 days of therapy, of oral therapy. 639 00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:39,440 Sometimes what healthcare providers will do if after that first 28 days of therapy, you've 640 00:41:39,440 --> 00:41:43,640 got some improvement but not great, they may switch you to intravenous therapy. 641 00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:48,200 And for sure, if you did not have a response to oral therapy in the first 28 days, they 642 00:41:48,200 --> 00:41:55,560 will change you over to ceftriaxone for 28 days to try to see if that's going to help 643 00:41:55,560 --> 00:41:56,560 manage those symptoms. 644 00:41:56,560 --> 00:42:02,880 Again, if you don't deal with this promptly, then you can have permanent joint damage as 645 00:42:02,880 --> 00:42:04,520 a result of the Lyme disease. 646 00:42:04,520 --> 00:42:05,520 Okay. 647 00:42:05,520 --> 00:42:12,840 And I imagine intravenous is just, it helps get those drugs to the location, maybe more 648 00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:13,840 effectively. 649 00:42:13,840 --> 00:42:16,000 Faster and more effectively. 650 00:42:16,000 --> 00:42:19,760 You bypass having to have a drug absorbed through your gut and all that stuff, so it 651 00:42:19,760 --> 00:42:20,760 does. 652 00:42:20,760 --> 00:42:26,320 It's more, you might get more higher concentrations of medication to those targeted areas. 653 00:42:26,320 --> 00:42:27,320 Absolutely. 654 00:42:27,320 --> 00:42:28,320 Okay. 655 00:42:28,320 --> 00:42:34,240 So, Josh alluded to, I mean, some patients can have persistent symptoms despite being 656 00:42:34,240 --> 00:42:36,280 treated. 657 00:42:36,280 --> 00:42:42,160 The jury's kind of out as to whether or not giving additional antibiotic therapy helps. 658 00:42:42,160 --> 00:42:48,840 And so there's no bottom line recommendation for that as far as that's concerned. 659 00:42:48,840 --> 00:42:54,600 So that's kind of a persistent infection, but there is also another condition that can 660 00:42:54,600 --> 00:42:58,840 happen with patients that have had Lyme disease, and they call it post-treatment Lyme disease 661 00:42:58,840 --> 00:43:02,320 symptom. 662 00:43:02,320 --> 00:43:06,880 Post-treatment Lyme disease syndrome, or PTLDS. 663 00:43:06,880 --> 00:43:13,480 And these are patients that can have persistent disabling symptoms despite having had appropriate 664 00:43:13,480 --> 00:43:15,120 antibiotic therapy. 665 00:43:15,120 --> 00:43:21,040 So it's symptoms that may sound familiar to people, fatigue, pain, and neurocognitive 666 00:43:21,040 --> 00:43:22,040 disturbances. 667 00:43:22,040 --> 00:43:27,040 They're going to sound very similar to the first disease like this that I remember learning 668 00:43:27,040 --> 00:43:29,560 about was chronic fatigue syndrome. 669 00:43:29,560 --> 00:43:33,840 And then after that, you had fibromyalgia, and then you had long COVID syndrome. 670 00:43:33,840 --> 00:43:40,400 They all have kind of that similar type of nondescript symptoms where you're not 100% 671 00:43:40,400 --> 00:43:43,120 and you don't feel well and you're not exactly sure why. 672 00:43:43,120 --> 00:43:47,400 And note, there's nothing that can be actually identified when you go to your healthcare 673 00:43:47,400 --> 00:43:50,680 provider that's like, well, it could be this or it could be this. 674 00:43:50,680 --> 00:43:52,600 It's really frustrating. 675 00:43:52,600 --> 00:43:57,880 Some of the theories as to why this happens with Lyme disease as with these other conditions 676 00:43:57,880 --> 00:44:03,520 is that it could be an autoimmune response that your body's having to those symptoms 677 00:44:03,520 --> 00:44:06,200 after the infection is completely gone. 678 00:44:06,200 --> 00:44:12,800 Or one theory was that you could have a persistent but very difficult to identify infection. 679 00:44:12,800 --> 00:44:15,480 That's kind of like, yeah, maybe. 680 00:44:15,480 --> 00:44:24,320 Also, it could be that certain patient characteristics may be more prone to have this persistent 681 00:44:24,320 --> 00:44:30,360 Lyme disease syndrome, or it also could potentially be associated with certain behavioral characteristics 682 00:44:30,360 --> 00:44:32,280 such as depression or anxiety. 683 00:44:32,280 --> 00:44:35,040 But there's no 100%. 684 00:44:35,040 --> 00:44:39,760 Absolutely if you have this, you're going to get this long Lyme disease syndrome, instead 685 00:44:39,760 --> 00:44:42,640 for post treatment Lyme disease syndrome. 686 00:44:42,640 --> 00:44:44,280 Yeah, that's well said. 687 00:44:44,280 --> 00:44:55,840 We forget that we are a giant ecosystem, our bodies, and just like a jungle or a city, 688 00:44:55,840 --> 00:45:00,240 it kind of all looks the same on the outside, but if you really analyze the interior contents, 689 00:45:00,240 --> 00:45:01,600 it could be a bit different. 690 00:45:01,600 --> 00:45:08,700 I remember reading a paper one time that 95% of humans are infected with Epstein-Barr virus. 691 00:45:08,700 --> 00:45:12,600 It's a virus that is prevalent in most people. 692 00:45:12,600 --> 00:45:21,000 But for some population, the combination of Epstein-Barr virus along with an immune response 693 00:45:21,000 --> 00:45:26,680 to a pathogen led to more autoimmune events, especially things like multiple sclerosis. 694 00:45:26,680 --> 00:45:30,200 Honestly, it just seems like a bit of bad luck. 695 00:45:30,200 --> 00:45:34,000 Certain people's immune systems just tend to... We saw this a lot with long COVID, 696 00:45:34,000 --> 00:45:40,780 just some people had a prolonged immune response even though the signal was gone from the infection 697 00:45:40,780 --> 00:45:42,360 being inside. 698 00:45:42,360 --> 00:45:47,500 As my mom alluded, could it be that there's a persistent infection or is the signal from 699 00:45:47,500 --> 00:45:53,480 our body being sent to basically constantly be in an immune response state? 700 00:45:53,480 --> 00:45:58,840 I think the jury's still out on that, but I think with almost the entire globe being 701 00:45:58,840 --> 00:46:06,160 subjected to SARS-CoV-2, hopefully we'll have some answers about autoimmune diseases because 702 00:46:06,160 --> 00:46:09,860 we have members of our family who suffer from these things. 703 00:46:09,860 --> 00:46:16,080 It's so difficult to see someone suffer and have no idea how to relieve them. 704 00:46:16,080 --> 00:46:21,140 It could be from Lyme disease or some of those things, but we forget that you can be infected 705 00:46:21,140 --> 00:46:23,000 with a lot of things at once. 706 00:46:23,000 --> 00:46:28,880 Sometimes the combination of those things can lead to outcomes you didn't expect. 707 00:46:28,880 --> 00:46:30,640 Biology can be a mystery. 708 00:46:30,640 --> 00:46:31,640 Yeah. 709 00:46:31,640 --> 00:46:32,640 Yeah. 710 00:46:32,640 --> 00:46:35,320 Diagnosing people sometimes can be quite a challenge. 711 00:46:35,320 --> 00:46:44,000 I say to this, this post-treatment Lyme disease syndrome is frustrating for the patients that 712 00:46:44,000 --> 00:46:48,640 end up getting this because there's no specific treatment for this. 713 00:46:48,640 --> 00:46:51,680 You're going to treat patients, additional antibiotic therapy. 714 00:46:51,680 --> 00:46:55,040 They've done several studies looking to see whether or not if you give them additional 715 00:46:55,040 --> 00:46:57,720 antibiotics, if it'll help and it doesn't. 716 00:46:57,720 --> 00:47:01,400 Giving additional antibiotics is not the answer for these patients. 717 00:47:01,400 --> 00:47:04,480 Usually again, it's one of those things you're going to manage that particular patient's 718 00:47:04,480 --> 00:47:15,680 symptoms that are present and encouragement, maybe support groups to help get through that. 719 00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:20,680 Usually these patients will get better over time, but what that time is, it can be years 720 00:47:20,680 --> 00:47:22,160 in some patients. 721 00:47:22,160 --> 00:47:24,360 That's frustrating, I know. 722 00:47:24,360 --> 00:47:28,400 I did not see a percentage of patients as to who get this. 723 00:47:28,400 --> 00:47:34,320 I don't think it's a huge number of patients, but again, it's still there. 724 00:47:34,320 --> 00:47:39,000 It's something to just keep aware of in patients that have had Lyme disease that you're hoping 725 00:47:39,000 --> 00:47:47,800 that your therapies work, but if they come back and say, I still don't feel 100%, that's 726 00:47:47,800 --> 00:47:50,080 certainly part of the disease state as well. 727 00:47:50,080 --> 00:47:54,040 Yeah, that's really well said. 728 00:47:54,040 --> 00:48:00,800 Let me tell you a couple of misunderstandings or myths or little pearls about Lyme disease. 729 00:48:00,800 --> 00:48:02,880 I thought these were really interesting. 730 00:48:02,880 --> 00:48:09,040 I alluded to this earlier, the male tick does not engorge or eat on blood. 731 00:48:09,040 --> 00:48:13,520 Although they're infected like the female, they're not involved in transmitting the infection 732 00:48:13,520 --> 00:48:17,240 as they don't require a blood meal to survive. 733 00:48:17,240 --> 00:48:20,440 Then they die after mating. 734 00:48:20,440 --> 00:48:27,000 That's their job is to mate and then they're done and stuff. 735 00:48:27,000 --> 00:48:32,240 The male blackleg ticks are not going to give you Lyme disease, only the females, the nymphs 736 00:48:32,240 --> 00:48:35,680 and the larva, the larva and the nymphs. 737 00:48:35,680 --> 00:48:41,760 You cannot acquire Lyme disease through touching, kissing or sexual activity with a Lyme infected 738 00:48:41,760 --> 00:48:42,760 person. 739 00:48:42,760 --> 00:48:43,760 That's not how you get the disease. 740 00:48:43,760 --> 00:48:48,880 Remember, it's through the bite of an infected tick. 741 00:48:48,880 --> 00:48:55,400 Untreated Lyme disease in pregnancy can lead to placental infection, but the spread from 742 00:48:55,400 --> 00:48:59,720 the mom to the fetus is actually really rare. 743 00:48:59,720 --> 00:49:06,000 The appropriate antibiotics that can be given to the mom, there have been no cases of showing 744 00:49:06,000 --> 00:49:11,840 increased adverse fetal outcomes at this point with moms that might acquire Lyme disease. 745 00:49:11,840 --> 00:49:17,000 If they're treated, then the baby's going to be okay. 746 00:49:17,000 --> 00:49:18,600 This was really interesting. 747 00:49:18,600 --> 00:49:23,000 Lyme disease can survive in blood stored for donation. 748 00:49:23,000 --> 00:49:25,680 Patients with Lyme disease should not donate blood. 749 00:49:25,680 --> 00:49:31,280 That might be a screening question because as of now, in the data that I read, there 750 00:49:31,280 --> 00:49:34,360 have been no cases associated with blood transfusions currently. 751 00:49:34,360 --> 00:49:39,800 I'm sure that must be a question when you're going to donate blood as far as whether or 752 00:49:39,800 --> 00:49:43,640 not you've been currently diagnosed with Lyme disease. 753 00:49:43,640 --> 00:49:44,640 Yeah. 754 00:49:44,640 --> 00:49:51,120 I wonder if they'll do one of those Western blot or ELISA tests on the blood before they 755 00:49:51,120 --> 00:49:52,120 transfer. 756 00:49:52,120 --> 00:49:53,120 They could. 757 00:49:53,120 --> 00:49:55,840 They could say, well, we might as well check this before we donate it. 758 00:49:55,840 --> 00:49:58,680 Yeah, they could. 759 00:49:58,680 --> 00:50:04,320 Interestingly too, dogs and cats can get Lyme disease, but they don't transmit the disease 760 00:50:04,320 --> 00:50:07,480 to their owners. 761 00:50:07,480 --> 00:50:12,360 The dog or the cat itself cannot transmit the disease to the owner, but remember, dogs 762 00:50:12,360 --> 00:50:14,920 and cats can bring ticks in. 763 00:50:14,920 --> 00:50:21,760 You're going to want to still be inspecting your animal for ticks, even though these things 764 00:50:21,760 --> 00:50:27,480 are really small, or treat your animal or do prevention for ticks with your animal to 765 00:50:27,480 --> 00:50:32,120 reduce your chance for getting Lyme disease. 766 00:50:32,120 --> 00:50:33,120 Wash that dog. 767 00:50:33,120 --> 00:50:41,480 Wash that dog, treat that dog, a little tick collar, whatever might be the norm up in the- 768 00:50:41,480 --> 00:50:42,880 Yeah, I've read those are really effective. 769 00:50:42,880 --> 00:50:48,680 I think between 70 and 80% reduction in ticks on the animal because as you know, animals 770 00:50:48,680 --> 00:50:49,680 just get everywhere. 771 00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:50,680 That's right. 772 00:50:50,680 --> 00:50:51,680 They do. 773 00:50:51,680 --> 00:50:53,360 That's another interesting little pearl. 774 00:50:53,360 --> 00:50:58,040 Lyme disease cannot be acquired by eating game meat, but we always want to make sure 775 00:50:58,040 --> 00:51:01,680 that we cook game meat sufficiently. 776 00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:05,880 Interestingly too though, you got to keep, so your game meat can't give you Lyme disease, 777 00:51:05,880 --> 00:51:10,640 cook it great, but because you're a hunter, you're going to be out exposed with potentially 778 00:51:10,640 --> 00:51:11,640 deer. 779 00:51:11,640 --> 00:51:16,200 You're going to want to do preventive measures or make sure you're checked for ticks because 780 00:51:16,200 --> 00:51:18,160 of that particular activity, hunting activity. 781 00:51:18,160 --> 00:51:24,000 Yeah, I've read that if you obviously wear clothing that covers most of your skin or 782 00:51:24,000 --> 00:51:28,920 the area that the tick would want to bite on, but if your clothes have ticks on them, 783 00:51:28,920 --> 00:51:32,160 you know, obviously by touching them, you can transfer, but I read if you throw your 784 00:51:32,160 --> 00:51:37,680 clothes in the dryer for 10 minutes, the heat from the dryer will kill the ticks. 785 00:51:37,680 --> 00:51:42,420 So if you put those clothes on again, you kind of reduce the risk greatly of having 786 00:51:42,420 --> 00:51:43,640 the ticks on your clothes. 787 00:51:43,640 --> 00:51:48,440 So against any mother's advice as far as laundry, you put them in the dryer first and then in 788 00:51:48,440 --> 00:51:49,440 the washing machine. 789 00:51:49,440 --> 00:51:52,600 That's yeah, I guess if you don't want to wash it, I mean, you could obviously just 790 00:51:52,600 --> 00:51:54,520 wash it and then put it in the dryer. 791 00:51:54,520 --> 00:51:59,080 But if you're like, I just want a quick kick till kick, kick, tick kill tick. 792 00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:00,080 Yeah, we go. 793 00:52:00,080 --> 00:52:01,080 There you go. 794 00:52:01,080 --> 00:52:02,400 Then you just do that. 795 00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:03,840 There you go. 796 00:52:03,840 --> 00:52:09,560 And then the last, no, so I then one other pearl is that there are no reports of Lyme 797 00:52:09,560 --> 00:52:17,280 disease being transmitted through the air, through food, through water or mosquito bites, 798 00:52:17,280 --> 00:52:19,000 fly bites or lice. 799 00:52:19,000 --> 00:52:23,080 So we're getting it specifically through this particular tick. 800 00:52:23,080 --> 00:52:26,920 And then as Joshua has alluded to, there are other tick types. 801 00:52:26,920 --> 00:52:32,080 There's specifically the Lone Star tick, the American Dog tick, the Rocky Mountain Wood 802 00:52:32,080 --> 00:52:35,560 tick, the Rocky Mountain Wood tick or the Brown Dog tick. 803 00:52:35,560 --> 00:52:40,340 They don't transmit Lyme disease, but there are other tick borne diseases. 804 00:52:40,340 --> 00:52:44,720 Like he said, Rocky Mountain spotted fever is one, tularemia is another one. 805 00:52:44,720 --> 00:52:46,680 There are several other ones as well too. 806 00:52:46,680 --> 00:52:48,560 So there are other. 807 00:52:48,560 --> 00:52:54,560 So if you are exposed to any ticks, you definitely want to remove them to minimize getting other 808 00:52:54,560 --> 00:52:56,960 tick borne diseases. 809 00:52:56,960 --> 00:52:57,960 That's well said. 810 00:52:57,960 --> 00:52:58,960 Yeah. 811 00:52:58,960 --> 00:53:00,680 Disease is not great. 812 00:53:00,680 --> 00:53:04,680 So we've kind of come to the end of this discussion about Lyme disease. 813 00:53:04,680 --> 00:53:10,760 So the takeaways that I have come up with for this are that Lyme disease is not common 814 00:53:10,760 --> 00:53:16,280 in Texas and it's usually diagnosed in patients who have acquired it outside of Texas. 815 00:53:16,280 --> 00:53:21,840 But it's something to put in a differential diagnosis for those patients that travel and 816 00:53:21,840 --> 00:53:26,560 that there's a potential risk for having been exposed to this black-legged tick. 817 00:53:26,560 --> 00:53:30,240 Deer are not infected with Lyme disease and don't transmit Lyme disease to humans, but 818 00:53:30,240 --> 00:53:34,440 serve as a blood source for infected ticks. 819 00:53:34,440 --> 00:53:39,000 Lyme disease could be difficult to diagnose as the tick stage involving and transmitting 820 00:53:39,000 --> 00:53:40,800 the disease is very small. 821 00:53:40,800 --> 00:53:45,280 So we've just got to be aware of that when we go hunting or hiking. 822 00:53:45,280 --> 00:53:49,280 And then patients with symptoms of Lyme disease should be treated as soon as possible with 823 00:53:49,280 --> 00:53:53,000 antibiotics to minimize long-term complications. 824 00:53:53,000 --> 00:53:54,480 I think that's a great summary. 825 00:53:54,480 --> 00:53:55,480 Yeah. 826 00:53:55,480 --> 00:53:58,220 So because we don't want to prevent people from going outside, it's one of the best things 827 00:53:58,220 --> 00:53:59,220 you can do. 828 00:53:59,220 --> 00:54:03,240 But if you are going to go outside in the Northeast or somewhere in a wooded area, and 829 00:54:03,240 --> 00:54:07,280 if you're going up against some brush, remember how small these ticks are. 830 00:54:07,280 --> 00:54:12,360 So just kind of assume that you're getting a tick on you and then just take precautions 831 00:54:12,360 --> 00:54:13,360 to get them off. 832 00:54:13,360 --> 00:54:16,680 And then if you start noticing symptoms, it'd be nice to get checked out by a healthcare 833 00:54:16,680 --> 00:54:18,680 professional. 834 00:54:18,680 --> 00:54:19,680 Thank you so much, Josh. 835 00:54:19,680 --> 00:54:20,680 Oh, thank you so much. 836 00:54:20,680 --> 00:54:22,880 It was another wonderful discussion today. 837 00:54:22,880 --> 00:54:24,960 So yes, I agree. 838 00:54:24,960 --> 00:54:29,120 This is such an interesting organism and we hope you'll stay safe out there while also 839 00:54:29,120 --> 00:54:30,120 having fun. 840 00:54:30,120 --> 00:54:32,160 This has been another episode of Your Mom on Drugs. 841 00:54:32,160 --> 00:54:33,280 My name's Josh. 842 00:54:33,280 --> 00:54:34,560 I'm Jennifer. 843 00:54:34,560 --> 00:54:35,560 And we will see you next time. 844 00:54:35,560 --> 00:55:02,360 Bye bye.