1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:10,000 Welcome back to Teaching the Unteachables, where we dive into methods for teaching and learning for professionals like you. 2 00:00:10,000 --> 00:00:19,000 This episode brought to you by the National Oil Heat Research Alliance. Learn more at norahweb.org. 3 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:36,000 One of the misconceptions that we hear a lot in the industry is decarbonization and electrification being held into the same teeter like they're the exact same component. 4 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:42,000 And that's really not the scenario. So today we're going to spend some time with Bob O'Brien. Bob, how are you today? 5 00:00:42,000 --> 00:00:43,000 Hey Clifton, how are you? 6 00:00:43,000 --> 00:00:53,000 Fantastic, from NORA. And we want to spend a little bit of time helping clarify and understand what the decarbonization actually is and understand that not all fuels are going away. 7 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:59,000 We're not going completely electric. There are many ways to be able to complete this decarbonization movement. 8 00:00:59,000 --> 00:01:07,000 So if we spend a little bit of time talking about what decarbonization is, it is a global effort to reduce our carbon footprint. 9 00:01:07,000 --> 00:01:13,000 To be able to sustain the life that we know on this planet, we have to reduce our carbon emissions. 10 00:01:13,000 --> 00:01:20,000 Now we have the ability to do that in many ways, things like recycling and controlling waste and fuels and gases. 11 00:01:20,000 --> 00:01:29,000 But we also have the electrification. And now we have that component that is feared the most, especially by those living up in the Northeast, is what about fuel? 12 00:01:29,000 --> 00:01:33,000 Because not all regions of the world are right for heat pumps. 13 00:01:33,000 --> 00:01:43,000 Yes, we are building and we are sponsoring competitions for new technologies to be able to get higher capacity, lower ambient condition working heat pumps. 14 00:01:43,000 --> 00:01:46,000 But it's not exactly the solution for everyone. 15 00:01:46,000 --> 00:01:56,000 So Bob, let's spend a little bit of time talking about your side of this effort because there's a lot happening in your spectrum of the industry. 16 00:01:56,000 --> 00:02:00,000 Sure. NORA is the National Oil Heat Research Alliance. 17 00:02:00,000 --> 00:02:05,000 At this point, we're heavily focused on renewable liquid fuels, primarily biodiesel. 18 00:02:05,000 --> 00:02:08,000 Renewable diesel to a somewhat lesser extent. 19 00:02:08,000 --> 00:02:18,000 NORA is a congressionally authorized checkoff program, similar to most of the ones you're familiar with are probably agricultural, got milk, beef, it's once for dinner, pork, the other white meat. 20 00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:22,000 NORA is the same exact thing. So it's industry requested, industry funded. 21 00:02:22,000 --> 00:02:28,000 And there's three major areas of focus, technician education, consumer education, and research and development. 22 00:02:28,000 --> 00:02:36,000 All three of those at the moment are heavily weighted towards transitioning to renewable liquid fuels. 23 00:02:36,000 --> 00:02:39,000 Petroleum products have a finite lifespan ahead of them. 24 00:02:39,000 --> 00:02:42,000 Yeah, absolutely. We have a limited amount of use. 25 00:02:42,000 --> 00:02:47,000 People don't understand that we're starting to siphon off from that well that is not endless. 26 00:02:47,000 --> 00:02:57,000 So we have to be able to move forward as a planet, as an entire civilization, and look for our other alternative fuel resources. 27 00:02:57,000 --> 00:03:02,000 NORA is National Oil Heat Research Alliance. It's congressionally authorized, so unfortunately there's no name change possible. 28 00:03:02,000 --> 00:03:07,000 We'd love to get away from oil heat to liquid fuels or renewable liquid fuels. 29 00:03:07,000 --> 00:03:13,000 Not much of a future in the oil heating business at this point, or any fossil fuel for that matter. 30 00:03:13,000 --> 00:03:15,000 But there's still a lot of fuel oil out there. 31 00:03:15,000 --> 00:03:21,000 Five million homes and businesses, which is a lot of work from anybody's perspective. 32 00:03:21,000 --> 00:03:27,000 As you know, it's a fraction of nationwide. It's about 6-7% of the nationwide. 33 00:03:27,000 --> 00:03:33,000 They use it for both heating and domestic hot water. More heavily weighted into the Northeast, but it's scattered everywhere. 34 00:03:33,000 --> 00:03:38,000 States can opt in to participate in NORA. 23 states do participate in NORA currently. 35 00:03:38,000 --> 00:03:45,000 So it's not quite half, but pretty close. Mostly Northeast, mid-Atlantic, up through Maine. 36 00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:51,000 But there's pretty strong concentrations scattered out in the Pacific Northwest. Alaska, obviously, quite strong. 37 00:03:51,000 --> 00:03:52,000 Yeah, I'm sure. 38 00:03:52,000 --> 00:03:54,000 Yeah, it's tough to run a pipeline up there. 39 00:03:54,000 --> 00:03:55,000 Yeah, absolutely. 40 00:03:55,000 --> 00:04:01,000 A natural gas one anyway. But we're rapidly transitioning to renewable fuels that moves away from heating oil. 41 00:04:01,000 --> 00:04:06,000 There's state mandates in a lot of the Northeast states. New York, Connecticut, Rhode Island, Massachusetts. 42 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:10,000 And those are the heaviest users, the heaviest concentrations. 43 00:04:10,000 --> 00:04:11,000 Primary sectors. 44 00:04:11,000 --> 00:04:16,000 So biodiesel has been the main focus. It's a little more readily available. 45 00:04:16,000 --> 00:04:22,000 Renewable diesel, which they call it HVO in Europe, has kind of not reached the market yet. 46 00:04:22,000 --> 00:04:26,000 But it's hopefully going to be here pretty soon. So we're doing a lot of research. 47 00:04:26,000 --> 00:04:28,000 Okay, so that's the Eurodiesel that I keep seeing. 48 00:04:28,000 --> 00:04:31,000 Yes, you'll see it talked about particularly in the UK. 49 00:04:31,000 --> 00:04:32,000 Sure. 50 00:04:32,000 --> 00:04:35,000 Yeah, it's heavily used here in California for transportation use. 51 00:04:35,000 --> 00:04:36,000 Oh, okay. 52 00:04:36,000 --> 00:04:41,000 But it's starting to work its way into the East Coast and into the heating market. So we want to be ready for it when it arrives. 53 00:04:41,000 --> 00:04:42,000 Yeah, absolutely. 54 00:04:42,000 --> 00:04:45,000 Yeah, all these fuels aren't exactly the same as petroleum. 55 00:04:45,000 --> 00:04:49,000 So that's really the education efforts are focused towards the technicians to get them used to. 56 00:04:49,000 --> 00:04:53,000 It's not exactly the way it was. Pretty close, but not exact. 57 00:04:53,000 --> 00:05:00,000 Yeah, here in the Midwest. So I'm in central Indiana. And fuel oil used to be utilized very heavily here, especially for farming purposes. 58 00:05:00,000 --> 00:05:04,000 A lot of grain bins were dried with fuel oil tanks. And we still have some. 59 00:05:04,000 --> 00:05:10,000 So when I first got into the industry, we had some particularly old farms that still used a lot of fuel oil. 60 00:05:10,000 --> 00:05:17,000 So it is a industry that has changed, but is definitely still here. And so how do you supplement those fuels? 61 00:05:17,000 --> 00:05:22,000 You know, we hear a lot about the diesel industry, you know, for transportation and locomotion. 62 00:05:22,000 --> 00:05:27,000 But what about for heating in our residential and our commercial industrial applications? 63 00:05:27,000 --> 00:05:33,000 So we still have that entire sector that we have to cater to in this decarbonization movement. 64 00:05:33,000 --> 00:05:36,000 Actually, Indiana is a state that participates in NORA. 65 00:05:36,000 --> 00:05:40,000 There are still quite a few oil heated businesses and homes in Indiana. 66 00:05:40,000 --> 00:05:47,000 And the biofuels really make it a nice circular economy for Indiana where you do grow soybeans, not as many as Illinois or Iowa. 67 00:05:47,000 --> 00:05:50,000 But there's quite a bit of soybeans in Indiana. 68 00:05:50,000 --> 00:05:55,000 So they can actually be grown, processed and completely used entirely within the state. 69 00:05:55,000 --> 00:05:58,000 So it's an American product. It's a Midwest product, mostly soy. 70 00:05:58,000 --> 00:06:05,000 The canola are the feedstocks they use to produce it. So it's a completely circular economy in those states, in the Midwest states. 71 00:06:05,000 --> 00:06:11,000 OK, now, so when we start talking about doing like retrofits, are we mainly talking about burner assemblies and orifices? 72 00:06:11,000 --> 00:06:15,000 There's actually none. It's typically referred to by percentage. 73 00:06:15,000 --> 00:06:19,000 So when people say B20, B50, B100, B means biodiesel. 74 00:06:19,000 --> 00:06:24,000 And the number is the percentage of the of the fleet fuel that is biodiesel. 75 00:06:24,000 --> 00:06:30,000 So B20 would be 20 percent biodiesel, 80 percent petroleum. B100 is 100 percent biodiesel. 76 00:06:30,000 --> 00:06:34,000 At the B20 level, there's really no changes at all. It's a drop in. 77 00:06:34,000 --> 00:06:37,000 It's listed under ASTM 396, the spec for heating oil. 78 00:06:37,000 --> 00:06:38,000 Oh, wow. OK. 79 00:06:38,000 --> 00:06:40,000 Up to B20. So there's really not much changes. 80 00:06:40,000 --> 00:06:44,000 All the burners available new on the market are already B20 compatible. 81 00:06:44,000 --> 00:06:45,000 Huh. 82 00:06:45,000 --> 00:06:51,000 So there's probably four or five hundred thousand of those five million using B20 at the moment. 83 00:06:51,000 --> 00:06:54,000 And the vast majority have had no changes whatsoever. 84 00:06:54,000 --> 00:06:59,000 Yeah, that's the blend level increases is where the difference has become more pronounced. 85 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:01,000 But at that level, it's it's minuscule. 86 00:07:01,000 --> 00:07:04,000 Is it a BTU factor or is it a velocity factor? 87 00:07:04,000 --> 00:07:07,000 There were slightly less BTUs per gallon. 88 00:07:07,000 --> 00:07:09,000 OK. A little less than 10 percent difference. 89 00:07:09,000 --> 00:07:12,000 OK. Biodiesel versus conventional heating oil. 90 00:07:12,000 --> 00:07:14,000 Makes sense. OK. 91 00:07:14,000 --> 00:07:17,000 All right. So we're definitely seeing some transitions here in the Midwest. 92 00:07:17,000 --> 00:07:19,000 Definitely see them on different areas. 93 00:07:19,000 --> 00:07:23,000 Kind of talked about this a little bit. We know that it is a checkoff program. 94 00:07:23,000 --> 00:07:27,000 So would you consider it a federal initiative for the oil sector? 95 00:07:27,000 --> 00:07:30,000 The industry actually lobbied Congress to approve this. 96 00:07:30,000 --> 00:07:37,000 These are self initiated. The chicken guys and the milk guys and the California cheese guys, they're in it too. 97 00:07:37,000 --> 00:07:43,000 Lobby Congress to have these checkoff programs created to promote the industry, to fund the promotion of the industry internally. 98 00:07:43,000 --> 00:07:51,000 OK. It's nice to see that is actually designed from the ground up as a evolution to an industry. 99 00:07:51,000 --> 00:07:56,000 Yeah, it's not from Congress down. It's from the all these industries up there, primarily agricultural bio heat. 100 00:07:56,000 --> 00:07:58,000 It's a trademark for blends. Yeah. 101 00:07:58,000 --> 00:08:00,000 Below B100, obviously. 102 00:08:00,000 --> 00:08:08,000 And it's about the benefits of approaching decarbonization by changing fuels rather than by going to a clean fuel rather than altering the whole system. 103 00:08:08,000 --> 00:08:10,000 In the northeast is a lot of hydronic systems. 104 00:08:10,000 --> 00:08:14,000 It's heavily weighted towards hydronic. A lot of window shakers still here. 105 00:08:14,000 --> 00:08:20,000 A lot of old buildings, particularly in the cities, you know, Philadelphia, Boston, New York, that long stretch there. 106 00:08:20,000 --> 00:08:26,000 These are tough buildings to decarbonize. They don't lend themselves to split heat pump systems very well. 107 00:08:26,000 --> 00:08:31,000 In Europe, they've been doing a hybrid with air to water heat pumps in the hydronic systems. 108 00:08:31,000 --> 00:08:36,000 They typically use lower water temperatures than we do here. Unfortunately, they have radiant panel rats. 109 00:08:36,000 --> 00:08:42,000 Typically, we're in tube that needs higher water temperatures. That's really not an answer for us. 110 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:45,000 This makes it pretty easy for somebody to decarbonize. Sure. 111 00:08:45,000 --> 00:08:52,000 At a minimal investment and very rapidly. So the consumer education is focused towards that. 112 00:08:52,000 --> 00:08:57,000 So that's where this conversation kind of started, looking through different topics that we need to cover. 113 00:08:57,000 --> 00:09:04,000 I seen an article from Nora about the biofuels and the decarbonization efforts of Nora. 114 00:09:04,000 --> 00:09:09,000 And I went, wait a minute, decarbonization from a fuel oil perspective. 115 00:09:09,000 --> 00:09:16,000 Now, I need to know more. And then because it really changes that philosophy of decarbonization. 116 00:09:16,000 --> 00:09:21,000 You know, we think about decarbonization. We think we're just getting rid of everything that's carbon fuel based. 117 00:09:21,000 --> 00:09:25,000 And we're going with whatever we can to supplement that. But it's not the scenario. 118 00:09:25,000 --> 00:09:32,000 When we think about these boilers and these heating systems that were designed for, you know, specific temperature rises and volume of flow 119 00:09:32,000 --> 00:09:36,000 that cannot be done with some of these air source systems, exactly like Bob was just saying. 120 00:09:36,000 --> 00:09:45,000 And the cost of doing complete retrofits and redesigning these systems for higher BTU, higher capacity heating loads is not particularly feasible. 121 00:09:45,000 --> 00:09:48,000 May not even have the space to do such thing. 122 00:09:48,000 --> 00:09:58,000 So when we start talking about these alternative fuels, I had recognized biofuels in the agricultural because it's become very popular here in the Midwest for agricultural purposes. 123 00:09:58,000 --> 00:10:01,000 But I hadn't looked at it from the heating perspective. 124 00:10:01,000 --> 00:10:11,000 So it opened up my own perspective of what decarbonization is and the vast efforts that are happening right now from many different avenues. 125 00:10:11,000 --> 00:10:19,000 So it was very enlightening for myself. That's why I wanted us to talk about this and share it a little bit, because I've even had some of our own educators ask, well, what do we do about fuel oil? 126 00:10:19,000 --> 00:10:26,000 Am I supposed to really dump the entire fuel oil design system and go with a cold climate heat pump in the north? 127 00:10:26,000 --> 00:10:31,000 And I went, wow, that's a that's a big investment and that's a lot of redesign. 128 00:10:31,000 --> 00:10:38,000 So it opens up our thoughts a little bit to the options that we actually have, because as an industry, we all have to do that. 129 00:10:38,000 --> 00:10:46,000 You know, we keep talking about how much we need to impact the HVAC refrigeration industry by using new technologies and new innovations. 130 00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:52,000 And this is to show that it really is in every sector of our industry, even the oil guys. 131 00:10:52,000 --> 00:10:57,000 If you don't want to end up like Kodak, you go right. You have to evolve. 132 00:10:57,000 --> 00:11:01,000 They held on to that film for way too long. 133 00:11:01,000 --> 00:11:07,000 Where do we learn? Where do we become more familiar with moving into these new types of fuels, Bob? 134 00:11:07,000 --> 00:11:15,000 Sure. One third of three of the legs of Nora, one of them is technician education and probably the most important. 135 00:11:15,000 --> 00:11:22,000 So there's a three tier certification system. So this is in place nationwide. Entry level would be the bronze. 136 00:11:22,000 --> 00:11:26,000 It's a formal 80 hour class followed up by a test. 137 00:11:26,000 --> 00:11:31,000 Technicians who have three years experience and 100 hours of seat training could be virtual or physical. 138 00:11:31,000 --> 00:11:39,000 Doesn't doesn't matter. Are eligible to be silver certified and gold would be five years of silver and four separate gold classes. 139 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:48,000 Kind of like grad level, very specific focus, combustion, controls, airflow, you know, six hour classes strictly on that one topic. 140 00:11:48,000 --> 00:11:56,000 There is a test for the bronze. It's a closed book test. The Nora Silver certification is a license in the states of Vermont and New Hampshire. 141 00:11:56,000 --> 00:12:03,000 That's what I was looking for. Well, as a county in New York. So we take the integrity of the test and the curriculum very seriously. 142 00:12:03,000 --> 00:12:10,000 Sure. These states would not accept this as a license if that were lax at all. So it's taken quite seriously. 143 00:12:10,000 --> 00:12:22,000 Passing. It's not a tough test, but passing is 78 for that reason, not a 65 or 70. Certification lasts for five years and CUs required to renew annually over the five years. 144 00:12:22,000 --> 00:12:29,000 OK. Yeah. So you need CUs to renew it. Decisions made to go with CUs versus retesting, which some people do. 145 00:12:29,000 --> 00:12:34,000 A lot of people do not much of a point in taking the same test over and over again every five years. 146 00:12:34,000 --> 00:12:39,000 Just make sure you know what's new. Yeah. And the CUs are, you know, can change day to day. 147 00:12:39,000 --> 00:12:49,000 It's we just feel it's really important that tech stay on top of this stuff, that the CUs are very important to, you know, continue education, to keep to move forward. 148 00:12:49,000 --> 00:12:57,000 Well, we look at some of the comparable items. You look at your EPA 608, you know, unfortunately, a lot of times that's a one and done. 149 00:12:57,000 --> 00:13:06,000 So wherever you entered the industry and you acquired your 608, because there are not those continuing education units or that re certification, 150 00:13:06,000 --> 00:13:10,000 you're never really staying up to date what has changed based on those regulations. 151 00:13:10,000 --> 00:13:15,000 And so that is another sector of our industry. I really hope to see change in the near future. 152 00:13:15,000 --> 00:13:19,000 And I know, I know you go ahead and send the you can put it out there in the chat messages right now if you'd like to. 153 00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:26,000 You can start throwing the virtual hammer at me. It really is very important to have those continuing education opportunities so you can see what those changes are. 154 00:13:26,000 --> 00:13:33,000 I mean, think about that. If I would have taken that test and it was a one and done 30 years ago and I was still working in the industry, 155 00:13:33,000 --> 00:13:42,000 I may not even be aware of the changes for biofuels and the new technologies that are now becoming part of my daily routine in my career. 156 00:13:42,000 --> 00:13:48,000 Absolutely. That's why the decision was made to require CUs and eliminate retesting altogether. 157 00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:53,000 So it's important the instructors will have to be certified and the instructors need CUs also. 158 00:13:53,000 --> 00:14:01,000 That's a big reason for us hosting the National HVACR Education Conference is to bring light to our educators. 159 00:14:01,000 --> 00:14:06,000 We're all educators. We've all been to this point where we've been in the field. We've gotten certified. 160 00:14:06,000 --> 00:14:11,000 We start teaching. And then at some point we go, do I need to go back and re check on my certifications? 161 00:14:11,000 --> 00:14:14,000 Because I just had to do it for myself for my own electrical license. 162 00:14:14,000 --> 00:14:19,000 I couldn't find my electrical license and I had to go. Oh, my. Have I paid my dues? 163 00:14:19,000 --> 00:14:23,000 Have I done my CEUs? And so I had to make a phone call for that. 164 00:14:23,000 --> 00:14:29,000 But the education part of it, that's why we all joined together to be able to talk about the things that are happening in the industry, 165 00:14:29,000 --> 00:14:34,000 to be more aware of how we need to stay up with technology for an industry. 166 00:14:34,000 --> 00:14:36,000 I mean, think about these things that are changing. 167 00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:42,000 I didn't even know that we had these opportunities, these changes, these advancements in our oil industry until just a few weeks ago. 168 00:14:42,000 --> 00:14:45,000 And I had to go, oh, my, I'm so far behind. 169 00:14:45,000 --> 00:14:49,000 I'm so far behind. I need to reach out. And that's how I found Bob. 170 00:14:49,000 --> 00:14:54,000 And that's how this whole conversation started. So we all need our continued education for sure. 171 00:14:54,000 --> 00:14:58,000 Absolutely. So Nora doesn't actually deliver this material ourselves. 172 00:14:58,000 --> 00:15:08,000 We have trade school partners, public high schools, for profit trade schools, community colleges, state associations that run private trade schools. 173 00:15:08,000 --> 00:15:12,000 So we partner with approximately 50 or so. Sure. Across the country. 174 00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:19,000 We'd love to expand if anybody's out there and would be interested in being able to add Nora certification for their students as a little value add. 175 00:15:19,000 --> 00:15:23,000 Love to have you. But we depend upon these partners, which is great. 176 00:15:23,000 --> 00:15:27,000 I mean, it's really the only way to do it, to spread it over such a huge footprint. 177 00:15:27,000 --> 00:15:28,000 Absolutely. 178 00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:33,000 A little bit of the drawback is the instructors themselves. 179 00:15:33,000 --> 00:15:37,000 How much do you really know about them? They have to be certified. We check them every so often. 180 00:15:37,000 --> 00:15:42,000 But we want to step up the level of that also. So most of them have come from the technical side. 181 00:15:42,000 --> 00:15:47,000 They've come out of the field. So they usually have great technical skills. They know the material. 182 00:15:47,000 --> 00:15:55,000 Classroom skills. I got to deal with people now. Yeah, it's the classroom skills in some cases maybe lacking. 183 00:15:55,000 --> 00:16:03,000 So we're right. We're doing some work in that. But we partner with all these schools and their different constituencies, public high school kids. 184 00:16:03,000 --> 00:16:08,000 We're really not going to do much with them. They're licensed by the state. It's a public high school. 185 00:16:08,000 --> 00:16:14,000 It is what it is in that situation. The state's vetting all these teachers. And they're high school kids. 186 00:16:14,000 --> 00:16:18,000 We can't treat them as we do the adults. So we're going to focus more of it on the adults. 187 00:16:18,000 --> 00:16:22,000 The community college is in the trade school. So this is a two week curriculum. 188 00:16:22,000 --> 00:16:26,000 Doesn't have to be done in one shot, but basically it's about 80 hours or so. 189 00:16:26,000 --> 00:16:31,000 So most of the two year community colleges just folded into their bigger two year. 190 00:16:31,000 --> 00:16:36,000 It's a couple of weeks within their two year or 18 month program. Yes. Sure. 191 00:16:36,000 --> 00:16:39,000 Now what about equipment? Are they actually working on live equipment? 192 00:16:39,000 --> 00:16:44,000 One of the requirements to be a partner is that you have live fire equipment. You need hands on. 193 00:16:44,000 --> 00:16:50,000 Would you want a surgeon who never was in the operating room or a lawyer who never stepped foot in the courtroom? 194 00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:57,000 I mean, during COVID it was great with the Zoom, but I mean, it really brought it home that this is a hands on business. 195 00:16:57,000 --> 00:17:02,000 A lot of techniques, they're tactile learners. You need that hands on. I think it's vital. 196 00:17:02,000 --> 00:17:07,000 So it is one of the requirements to be certified that there is a functioning piece of equipment. 197 00:17:07,000 --> 00:17:11,000 At least one. Most have multiple, in some cases dozens. 198 00:17:11,000 --> 00:17:17,000 Now you were mentioning earlier an opportunity to actually do some of the live fire at a conference and expo. 199 00:17:17,000 --> 00:17:20,000 Is that something that you host as well, additional opportunities? 200 00:17:20,000 --> 00:17:28,000 Yes. In addition to the consumer education and technical education, research and development is a big part of what Nora does. 201 00:17:28,000 --> 00:17:35,000 And almost all of that research for the last 10 years or so has been focused on transitioning to biofuels, 202 00:17:35,000 --> 00:17:40,000 eliminating the technical barriers to adoption of high blends of biofuel. 203 00:17:40,000 --> 00:17:44,000 So as part of that, we have a quartz cylinder, which is basically a glass tube, 204 00:17:44,000 --> 00:17:50,000 but it's made of quartz crystal clear with a burner in it and we can fire from different fuels on site. 205 00:17:50,000 --> 00:17:52,000 This is going to be the Eastern Energy Expo in May. 206 00:17:52,000 --> 00:17:54,000 Oh boy, I like that idea. 207 00:17:54,000 --> 00:17:58,000 Actually some videos up on the website too. You can see it from last year's. 208 00:17:58,000 --> 00:18:07,000 But we can transition from fuel to fuel from B0 petroleum to B5, 5% bio, B20, B50 and up to B100. 209 00:18:07,000 --> 00:18:11,000 We have a combustion analyzer on it so the techs can see exactly what happens. 210 00:18:11,000 --> 00:18:13,000 The differences in the fuel mixture. 211 00:18:13,000 --> 00:18:17,000 Yeah, when you change it. The tubing is clear so you can see when the transition happens. 212 00:18:17,000 --> 00:18:18,000 Man, I want to see this myself. 213 00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:21,000 Yeah, it's pretty cool. It always draws a crowd. 214 00:18:21,000 --> 00:18:27,000 If I'm a school and I'm looking for opportunities to expand and maybe become part of this program, 215 00:18:27,000 --> 00:18:31,000 is the best way through the website or is it through contacting somebody direct? 216 00:18:31,000 --> 00:18:38,000 They can contact me directly or through the website, either one. There's a tech school application box on the website. 217 00:18:38,000 --> 00:18:44,000 It's not that tough. Especially in the states where we're underrepresented, we'd love to expand the footprint. 218 00:18:44,000 --> 00:18:45,000 Sure. 219 00:18:45,000 --> 00:18:48,000 Hopefully the schools would find it a benefit to offer certification to their students. 220 00:18:48,000 --> 00:18:50,000 And education for those programs. 221 00:18:50,000 --> 00:18:56,000 Absolutely. Yeah, there's five million out there. Somebody's going to fix them. 222 00:18:56,000 --> 00:18:58,000 They're going to be around for a while. 223 00:18:58,000 --> 00:19:04,000 Alright everyone, have a wonderful day. We thank you so much for spending your time hanging out with us. 224 00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:08,000 So thanks again. We'll see you next week.