softened your senses ways to become a better speaker listener and
follower. This episode brought to you by Sauermann Group at a
digital edge to your combustion analysis. Learn more at
sauermanngroup.com. All right. Hello, everyone. Thank you for
hanging out with us. Once again, we are still here at the
National HVACR education conference. Tyler, I think I
probably went through like 30 35. I'm sure you have and I'm
surprised you actually have vocal cords left and brain
matter for that matter. You know, that is the insane part
about this conference is that yeah, the whole brain matter
because it's, it's almost like that kid walking into the great
big candy store. And then you're like, oh, it's all this visual.
And then they say, oh, and by the way, it's all here for you.
Take what you want. It's like it's like too much stimulation.
And then you're having shiny objects in about the same time.
You just pivot from one thing to the next one thing to the next
you're like, I got to keep myself on a little bit of a path
and get a little bit of a focus. Oh, it's yeah, that is a great
way to present it. So you did that you did a class and I've
heard so much about it already from people coming in here and
I go, Oh, you don't know you don't know Tyler Nelson from
sourman yet. And they're like, Oh, I had no idea. You're just
one of the most passionate people I just love hanging out
with you. Honestly, I love watching you like when when I
sat in that class at AHR, it's like, oh, man, this is my kind
of dude. He is he's 100% in.
Well, thank you. I appreciate it. I enjoy my position in the
industry. I enjoy my obviously my position with my company with
sourman, and the opportunities that have been provided to me
and to be able to pay back and give back to those that have
helped me. Yeah. And to and to do it unlike fashion to pay
forward has been a one of the highlights of my career for sure.
And it's an opportunity that I savor. And it's a path that I'm
on now. And that's the trajectory that I'm on. And I
feel very confident with it and comfortable with it. And I feel
very honored to be selected to do it.
Now you're definitely the guy for it. So let's talk about your
passion. Let's dive a little bit deeper. And let's help shed some
light into some not always well educated topics.
Sure. So for us and for me the way that I look at it, I look at
training now differently than I did in the past. Training when I
was a contractor was something that we barely made time for not
had time for me time for we did not make it a priority. And we
slowly watched our competition surpass us. And then when I get
out of contracting and I went into this side of the business,
and I visited other companies as I was training them, I got to
see how important it was for them and to see where it took
them in a standing in our industry and how the best
companies out there trained. And they also had the best
employees. And it got me to thinking, you know, the path, the
path upward and the path onward for us as an industry going
forward revolves around training. It needs to be a
priority. You can see it in your conference here and how it's
grown exponentially year by year. We topped out at 1200
people this year this conference. And it's everybody
going after the same educational thirst and hunger for everything.
You know, it's become a movement into itself. So when we approach
it now myself and the other trainers, we I think we're
seeing that now it's a growing trend and it's a way to generate
business if you're a if you're a manufacturer, you're an
equipment manufacturer or tool manufacturer like myself to
provide training. But it's also a way to educate but it's also
a way if you're a contractor, if you're going to train it's a
way for you to increase your bottom line because you're
going to attract better employees that are going to want
to work for you because you're providing them a proper
platform for training.
You know, that's such a good point when we talk about the the
attraction of those, you know, high providing employees, those
those hungry employees that are out there because there are a
lot of them and some of them get in places where they don't feel
like they're developing and it's such a shame that people are in
those environments and then they realize that man, I'm just I'm
not getting to where I feel like I should be because I know that
there's more to learn. And so we have to be aware of you know,
what that training looks like and high quality training,
right?
Right. And I think in the past with our industry, people looked
at us a little bit differently because we would come home with
the end of the day with our fingers a little bit dirty and
they always thought that we're the ones that sat in the back of
shop class and failed. Well now with the technology that we're
utilizing and the technology that's in their homes for them
to take advantage of and be comfortable with, I think
they're slowly starting to realize that hey, these people
are a lot smarter than we thought they pay because we pay
our taxes just like they do. Our kids play sports next to their
kids. So we're no different, but we're not the ones that sat in
the back of shop class and failed and we're the ones that
actually want to do well. The people in this industry have been
fixing things since they were kids. They're a very humble
group. They don't know that what they're doing is something that
most people can't do, which is great because it keeps us humble.
However, it is an interesting position to be in now, especially
with technology. So now with the technology we're utilizing and
using, we are meeting our customer base where they're at.
So now the playing field has been leveled. There is
significant sophistication in everything that we're
installing and everything we're working with and the tools that
we're using, as it is in our customers lives in their own
vocations and in their own professional endeavors. And I
think that that's kind of drawn, that's been the linchpin to
kind of draw everybody together, where now the HVAC contractor is
not looked upon as a necessary evil that lives under the steps
that nobody wants to pay attention to and just call them
out twice a year if you even call them out twice a year for
meetings.
You know, we've seen this year in particular at the conference,
a very high amount of distributors and contractor
trainers that are here. I've even seen the my one of the local
contractor trainers from my own area. I'm like, wait a minute. I
know you guys, you've got your own training program. Then I
went, of course they're here. Because we have contractors that
are elevating their professionalism. They're aware of
the technological transitions, the refrigerant transitions,
they're aware of the importance for high efficiency service,
right, not just a clean and go a let's take a look at this
system and get the maximum performance out of it. Like we
probably should have been doing the entire time, but we really
didn't and tools and technology have made that so much faster
that it has become to the point where it is absolutely able to
be common practice during a standard service.
Absolutely. And the primary drivers of what we bring are
simply this comfort and safety. Everybody wants to be
comfortable. Clifton, they're they're spending more times in
their houses than they've ever spent before. You know, COVID,
notwithstanding, everybody wants to be comfortable. Everybody
wants proper humidity, proper this, proper that, and they're
googling, how do I get my house more efficient? All these things
the HVAC contractor is able to do, but the contractor
themselves has to look beyond the bridge of their nose and
understand there is a three initial word, IAQ, indoor air
quality, that they have to pay attention to. They have to
understand the IAQ side of things. They have to understand
the whole comfort. They have to understand the house as an
envelope, as an ecosystem where things function in an ecosystem,
not mutually exclusive unto themselves. They have to behave
nice in the sandbox with the way that the house is designed. They
can't have a house too tight. They can't have a house too
loose. They have that proper, you know, duct sizing and
everything else. We have to look at it that way. It can't just be
as you had said, just a quick clean and check and get the heck
out of there. It has to be a proper evaluation. And one of
the things that these instructors here, and then when
they were contractors and the contractors to be, or that are
coming to these classes, they're inheriting new customers every
day. When you're inheriting a new customer, you're inheriting
that previous contractor's craftspersonship for better or
for worse. If they're making a pitching change, it's usually
for the worse. So I would encourage anybody taking on a
new customer to do a full assessment of that equipment.
Show them not to point the finger, but show them what was
missed in the past. Show them what they can do to improve
their system and become more comfortable. If you go onto the
auspices of hands above the table and doing it the right way
and showing how you can increase their comfort, I think you're
going to have a long lasting relationship with your customer.
Yeah, that is such a good point. And as we start seeing those
migrations, as we start seeing those new opportunities, you
know, let's think about just that the whole combustion
analysis side of a gas furnace. You know, if that new customer
has had a skill level that may not have been sufficient in the
past, can you imagine taking that first opportunity with that
new customer and go, by the way, because it's an uncomfortable
transition sometimes. You know, we've seen a lot of private
equity purchasing and investing into smaller contractors,
bringing them into larger contractor groups. And many of
those groups actually have incredibly high standards and
practices. And so if we look at that as, okay, we got a homeowner
that has been very comfortable with their contractor for a
long period of time. Now, all of a sudden, they're going to be
making a transition into a larger company, and they may
feel like they're not getting, you know, the service that they
had in the past. But in reality, they actually have a potential
to have a higher level of service. Well, certainly
agreed. And it's and they get the ability to have their the
actual needs analysis done on all their equipment. And that's
one of the things that's been lacking is that we're not
properly assessing equipment. A unique take on this I heard
yesterday, and when you're talking about educating home
owners, Donald Baker, who's a very supportive person, he's
actually here at the convention or conference and right and
he's up based up in Canada. And I just saw him last week at the
CMPX as well. So last week, he had said to interesting
concept would be for us as trainers to go to some of these
home shows like for me for combustion and instructor put
on a class for homeowners, they listen, if your contractor
isn't doing this, you're missing the boat, they're
contract are doing that if you want, we can give you a list or
we can put you a point in the right direction. So that when
they come when the contractor comes out the house, and they're
not doing combustion, the homeowners like, are you aren't
you missing a tool? Are you supposed to have an analyzer
with you? Why are you not doing that? I went to an educational
presentation that they told me that that's what should be done
in my system. It's going to be properly diagnosed because
the bushing analysis is like doing the blood work on a body.
The blood work doesn't lie. It tells you the state and health
of you when the blood work is done in you, but despite outward
appearances, standing with combustion analysis, you cannot
deny that it shows the state of the health of that piece of
equipment, despite outward appearances and despite how it
sounds. Man, think about that. If, if we actually took a
moment to start focusing towards the contractors, and
start focusing towards the consumers about the benefits of
it, it changes the whole structure. It does. It does. And
that was a great when he brought that up. That was like an
aha moment for me. Yeah, I see that. And I've had a lot of
them. But for me to bring it up on a podcast like this, it
that's how big it was. So kudos to Donald for bringing that
up. It was it was interesting. And so it, I think that that's
something that we can that we can look to run with and it
might be it might open doors for everybody. I think it's
supposed to happen because I keep getting this from
different perspectives. I'm sitting down with Chris
Halshields yesterday when we're talking about carbon
monoxide safety. And she said, you know, we have a canary suit
that we do for educational outreach. I could see you doing
a consumer based video on the importance of utilizing it. And
I went, my my son's a firefighter. And he actually
wore their own costume to the football games, you know,
trying to promote fire safety. Right. Is it time we start
focusing towards the consumer, consumer awareness from our own
industry perspective? Yeah, for sure. And in carbon monoxide
safety is a very important topic nowadays, but everybody
spending more time indoors, you know, and I am I'm part of the
National Coalition for carbon monoxide awareness now. And I
had asked them because years ago, my stepfather passed away
in 2003 from glioblastoma, which is brain cancer. And he
worked in the Navy, in the in the boiler rooms and
everything else got all those licenses and then did that as
a professional and we were free utility when he got out. And
when he passed away, some people had approached my mother
saying, you know, he worked in areas where he didn't have the
proper PPE. We think there might have been an issue there
with the things that he was taking into his body. And she
goes, Listen, I just want to bury my husband, the whole nine
yards. So fast forward to December of this year, I asked
the coalition I said, any relationship to this and their
jaws dropped because we're on a team score, their jaws dropped.
They said we just had data combat that said out of when
when people that have been in the service industry like this
like yours, or HVAC, if they have brain cancer, it's
glioblastoma and the leading cause of which which has been
ascertained is from exposure to carbon monoxide that they were
not aware of. No way. So it was very, very spooky to me to hear
that because when they looked at me, it's as if I was
eavesdropping on their meeting that they had just had. They're
like, what's that? And they told me they said that whatever
they told your mother back in 2003 has a lot of weight to it.
And we would basically agree the fact that that is a high
potential that that's what happened to him and contracting
firms need to understand that they have to provide the proper
PPE. If a technician gets sick, OSHA standards and legal
proceedings state that they can actually pursue the contractor
because you did not give your staff member the proper
protective gear, whether it's an analyzer or a personal CEO
monitor, because you're supposed to provide them with
proper protective gear to actually do their job. That's a
whole other show. It's a whole other show. Wow. And and and
the folks at NCI had alerted me to that. I was not aware of
that. I was either. So compliments to David Holt for
mentioning that to me that that is with OSHA standards, they
have to provide the proper PPE to the employee and to their
technicians to be able to do their job. You know, we now
lead the field in carbon monoxide, poisons in all the
service industries, it with issues with it, and it used to
be oil and gas. Oil and gas is very much open air now. So it's
not as prevalent than oil and gas as it was before. And a lot
of those people already have to have a personal protective
monitor on their person when they do when they do their job.
But in here, it's like passe and everybody is reliant often on
the customer's carbon monoxide detector to keep them safe. Not
crazy. People are going to choose the cheapest one always
because they get no social mileage out of it. It's not a
nice car. It's not a nice lawn. It's not something they can
show to their friends. It's Starbucks. It's on their wrist
or on their finger. It's the dirty secret, as I said before,
with maintenance that lives under the steps. They're going
to pick the cheapest thing out there. They're going to get out
of the big box store and it's going to be ineffective. And
the customer technicians are reliant on that to keep them
safe. And they're going after the wrong breast ring if
they're doing that. They need to protect themselves, take
personal responsibility as do the contracting firms. I think
we could just sit and talk for hours. We can. We've had these
conversations before and that's why I guess you could say
vibe well together. Oh my gosh. Because there's so many layers
to what we do. And that's the other thing. When we talk about
how our industry has evolved. Just look at the layers of the
conversation that we've started this morning. That's nothing
compared to the other conversations that are being had
by everybody that's out there in front of us and going into
these different conference rooms. And there's a lot to it.
It's like we're all speaking the same language and we're
finally sitting around together going oh my goodness. We've all
been speaking the same language. We need to speak this
together. Right. Yeah. It's like we didn't know it. Yeah. We
didn't know it. And it was interesting to hear or see
somebody from Dyken on stage this morning and somebody from
Fujitsu on stage this morning which are competitors of one
another. Yeah. Absolutely. But playing very well. Very nicely
in the sandboxing having fun together. Yeah. You know I've had
fun with my fellow competitors that have been here. They've
been very gracious to me and I've been very gracious to them
and we all realize there's a very large pie out there and
there's enough pie for everybody. And as long as we
spill no blood and speak you know kindly and gently of one
another that that's how we should conduct ourselves as
as professionals out there that you know the whole industry
will be a better place because it starts with us and then it
trickles its way down to how people see us behave. And you
know it's like leading the charge you know and they say to
themselves I'm sure the contractors see it and they say
you know if if if I'm talking to Louise from from UEI or I'm
talking to the folks at Crocon you know if these two can talk
together and have nice conversations and have smiles
on their faces then we can actually get along as
contractors in competitive firms better. Yeah. And we can you
know be nicer to one another kinder to one another. Tyler
Nilsen, Saruman. How do people connect with Saruman? We have
well we connect with Saruman. We have our Saruman.com I should
believe. Saruman I think it's Ford slash US caught me off
guard there for a second. So on online and then we have my
LinkedIn. We also have our own LinkedIn, Saruman Americas.
We're on LinkedIn as well and then my LinkedIn profile as
well to connect with me. So we have that and then we have you
know the trainings that we do so there's information on our
site for different trainings and feel free to to reach out to
me on LinkedIn to to set up a training for your for your
company. My territory is all the Americas. So depending where
you're listening to this at where wherever you're listening
to this I could probably travel to you and and I also do this
virtually for other people around the world as well. So
globally awesome. Thank you so much for joining us. Thank
you Clifton. I appreciate the opportunity.