Welcome to Cultural Connections Lab. I'm your host Dr. Kelly Forbes. We are here to talk with educational professionals around the world to impact and influence the education system as we focus on cultural connections and the education of multilevel diverse students.
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Welcome to another podcast episode of Cultural Connections Lab with myself, your host, Dr. Kelly Forms. I am excited to be here with a new friend that I am meeting today.
Thank you to the amazing president and CEO of EdgeSkills, Dr. Taylor Tribble, who will be our co-host today. I'm fortunate that I have been connected with Alejandra Vazquez-Bauer.
Alejandra Vazquez-Bauer is a fellow at the Century Foundation where she manages the Bridges Collaborative, an initiative that champions school integration.
In 2022, she co-founded the National Newcomer Network, a coalition that brings together educators, researchers, and advocates invested in developing systemic solutions to address newcomer student inequity in K-12 schools.
Under Alejandra's leadership, the network released a policy platform in February of 2024, representing the priorities of over 150 members representing over 30 U.S. states.
An inaugural Obama USA leader and former high school teacher, her work has been featured by several media outlets, including Chalkbeat, the 74 Million, K-12 Dive, Education Week, Gotham Gazette, and Politico.
Alejandra is a proud granddaughter of Mexican farm workers and holds degrees from Claremont McKenna College and Columbia University.
Adik, bienvenida y gracias por estar aqui con nosotros.
To Alejandra, thank you so much for being here with us today.
Muchisimas gracias Kelly. Wow, the way you read that bio, I was surprised that that was me.
Thank you.
I'm here to remind you how amazing you are.
He always makes everybody look better.
What?
I said I'm just here to remind you how amazing you are.
How amazing we all are.
Thank you for the invitation Kelly and Taylor. I'm so grateful to be here.
Well, I'm really grateful as well and I really appreciate being able to, it's a really huge honor, and it's very humbling experience to be able to participate in this podcast and get to meet so many amazing people out in the field of multilingual and multicultural education, leaders, educators,
all of us leading in our own way and I truly am always very thankful to Dr. Tribble for these connections as well and for the service that we're all doing.
So to have you come and to bring your knowledge, your past, your experiences, your authenticity and all of that excitement and joy and to just to help spread that to all of our listeners, we are very appreciative.
And so sinceramente gracias por estar aquí con nosotros. Thank you.
So, before we get in and dive into some of the questions, you want to tell us a little bit more about who you are, your past and kind of how, where you got to be this big estrella that you are today, this big star.
I love it.
Sure, thank you for asking that. I think it's really important that we talk about how we get to the work that we're doing because so much of this work is personal for so many people.
And it's part of our story, it's part of our narrative and so I come up from a mixed status family, my family's from Mexico, from outside of Guadalajara from a small pueblo, and that is where our roots are and where they remain, in fact.
I am a second generation American, but my family members in my community in New Mexico, where I grew up, northern New Mexico, many of my family members came while I was growing up.
So even from the very beginning, I was in schools, everyone was an English learner in northern New Mexico. I was an English learner, and we had new immigrants coming to our schools all the time.
That was normal. I had cousins who were moving to Santa Fe and to the surrounding area frequently coming into the schools and I was young, but you could see the difference between the educational experience.
There was one experience for students who were learning English but had kind of grown up there, so we'd been around English and the education was adjusted for the New Mexican students who had grown up there.
And then there was a totally different process for welcoming new immigrant students, many of whom were my own cousins, moved in there 14, 15, who experienced a very different system. They were put into sort of different schools or different classes.
We saw that early. We were young, we didn't really know what was going on, but we thought, oh, that was weird.
And so that was an early indication of what was happening. This isn't all that different from that experience. My own parents had my mom and her siblings when they were in Mexico, in California.
Their parents were farm workers. They were young kids integrating into the schools in central California, and they too didn't speak any English, were put into different classrooms.
Their needs as new immigrants were not quite met, but we were raised in a big family. We had actually very big new migrant Mexican community in central California that my family was a part of, so they sort of adjusted and got that through the community, but we know that that's not always the case.
So I think this big community, big loving Mexican community in northern New Mexico and California is part of what makes me who I am, because I'm driven by community.
And that is what's rooted in the coalition work that I do. But also I think these experiences led me to education, because I saw education on equity from a young age.
Going to a private college, I definitely felt unprepared and wanted to do, started a Latino club, did a lot of work in our private, you know, PWY college to help ensure that the Latino students who were coming from low income backgrounds like my own were prepared to succeed in our community.
And that's what led me to teaching. And when I got to Miami, where I was teaching, I was thinking, okay.
Do you mind explaining how, you know, how did it happen that you got from New Mexico to Miami? Sorry to interrupt.
Oh yeah.
A pretty big jump, you know, all of a sudden we're in New Mexico, now we're in Miami.
It was lots of moving. Yeah, I got a scholarship to go to school in California. That's where my college was in the LA area, Claremont McKenna.
And when I was trying to figure out what I wanted to do, I initially thought more government work, which is ironic that I kind of ended up back here in policy, but I wanted to go into education.
And so I applied to Teach for America and I was assigned to Miami because I'm bilingual and because I had an advanced math degree.
So they felt, okay, we don't have a lot of bilingual women who could teach math at AP calculus level, for example.
So they sent me to Miami to teach high school math. And so that's how I got to Miami.
You're smarter than I am already. I'm sorry? I said to yours. I can tell you already. I can already tell that you're smarter than I am.
You got the doctorate. I just have a piece of paper.
So when I got to Miami, I was working in a community much like my own. There were many new immigrants coming into the school community.
Lovely students who were put in my classroom and because I was bilingual, they were like, okay, you'll teach all the Spanish speaking kids.
So that's not really how it works. Right. Like I don't have a certification. I'm not I'm not a translator or interpreter professionally.
I wouldn't even say like many of us who grew up in bilingual communities, I'm not 100 percent bilingual.
And so, you know, I can do a lot of Spanish. Of course, trans languaging is really normal in my classroom.
But there were certain things I knew I was unprepared to support with. And the school just threw the kids in my class.
They said, oh, you speak Spanish. We don't even know what math level they were.
But they were coming. They were putting them in my classroom and saying, Miss Vasquez has got you.
And we know that that's just not how it works. And I was seeing every day how that was wrong.
I had students coming up to me saying, Miss, I took this class. I had a student from Venezuela, I remember.
And she said, Miss, I'm I took like trigonometry in Venezuela just because I just got here doesn't mean I don't know math.
I was teaching remedial algebra. She did not need to be in my class.
She should have been assessed and put into the appropriate class, but she was not assessed.
They assumed that because she was a migrant, because she had just recently come into the country,
and because she spoke Spanish, she was from Venezuela, she needed to be in remedial math. She did not.
I had students who had way more gaps in their education who weren't even prepared necessarily for Algebra 1.
This is how it is. And our school just wasn't doing the work to understand the students' experiences.
They just assumed that the Spanish-speaking teachers got you, will put you in her class.
And they were failing to engage the parents, discouraging students from showing up on test days.
The things that we know now to be illegal. At the time, I didn't quite understand the law, but I said, OK, this feels wrong.
My students don't feel welcome. Some of my kids say they want to drop out.
There's a lot of weird energy in the school around our new immigrant students. And I want to figure out what to do.
I'm calling parents. I'm showing up to school, the school hearings, school board hearings to talk about this.
And I felt like my advocacy within the school was being sort of was threatening our leaders.
And so I left to become an advocate. And that's what led me to New York for grad school.
And so the policy work that I do now. Oh, my gosh. I wish I could reach through here and give you a huge hug.
Like, I love this story. And I'm so thankful that you're sharing it.
And I'm so excited about this because this is so unfortunate.
But everything that you just said, like that is happening right now. It's happening today right now.
And it's so funny that you it's well, I mean, it's not funny, but it's ironic how you said like what we used to know as being illegal.
And then I'm like, yeah, but here we are still trotting along. I feel like doing the exact same things because I'll get phone calls from people who are advocating for a student who is in second grade trying to go, you know, a newcomer student who's in second grade.
And then they're going to be in third grade. But then they want to hold them back for a year before they've even started because they don't want them to be on their state testing for the third grade reading test.
Yeah, I mean, and then you can share all the information all of the you know all of the law, the policy all the everything but yet it somehow still keeps on happening and you mentioned that there's this weird sensation that we have with our newcomer students about like this.
A fear, a worry, a concern. We're not involving their parents. We think that just because they speak Spanish perhaps become another country and the other language will just put them in that class instead without realizing that we've taken trigonometry and could be teaching this class, actually.
Why is that? Why is that still such an issue and a concern that we have whenever we know better and we should do better but yet we know better and we do what we did historically before.
I think there are a couple things. One, I think generally there is a fear of the unknown. This feeds into xenophobia. This feeds into racism. This fear of what doesn't seem familiar to us is really what drives a lot of the anti-immigrant rhetoric that we see, pushbacks on DEI, and changes and sort of community responses to changing demographics.
And I think that's so much of what we see actually in our schools because it's a broader underlying societal issue that exists in our communities. Our schools are our communities. They're a microcosm of the broader issues in society.
And so we're seeing that play into our classrooms. We're seeing that play into enrollment decisions. An incredible investigation just came out the other day by the 74 million on Tuesday by Jonah Politano, a wonderful reporter who has been doing this work specifically around
immigrant students for a very long time. And the report found that out of about 600 high schools, as she called at random, across the country in almost every state, at least one high school in every state, over 50% of them denied a student, an immigrant student.
The reporter had come up with a profile for an immigrant student and called these schools just to see how to enroll them or if they could enroll them. And the enrollment officers denied that student.
And so the reporter had combined in all the different responses and sort of categorized them. Sometimes it was misinformation. So they'd say things like, oh, you know, I don't I think they're too old to enroll, even though technically the state would allow them to enroll based on their age.
Other people would say, oh, you know, do they even speak English?
Things like, well, but are they citizens? Like, can we enroll them? So misinformation, not knowing and also not knowing the rights of kids as an enrollment officer.
This is the this is the job of the enrollment officer to know what the law is to know how to respond to requests to enroll new students.
And that's what the investigation found. If we know and 600 schools out of random across the country, all 35 and 35 of the states that they called allow students to enroll up to 20 or at least the age of 20, these enrollment officers were denying them randomly.
And so we saw for the benefit of our listeners, do you have a way to like, like a website you can direct them to to find this report?
Yes. How can they find that easily? Absolutely. Go to the 74 million.
I think it's dot com. I don't don't know.com.org. But it is an education news website and 74 million dot org.
Thank you for correct me. Dot org. Jonah Poletano is the author of this investigation. So look up her work. It should be at the top. Denying immigrants. Yes. Hundreds of high schools wrongfully refused entry to older immigrants. Yep.
So we see this is happening all the time. And we know those those comments by the enrollment officers are if they don't know that information, they're driven by fear.
So I think that's one of the biggest to answer your question underlying issues. And then I also think that schools because of our education system, the way that.
So far, accountability has worked, especially since no child left behind. Schools are scared to try things they're not sure will work. Schools are very there's, you know, two motives to deliver on results.
And so denying students, new students enroll is part of making sure, OK, our test scores needs to stay up. We need to get funding so we can stay open so we can keep doing what we're doing.
It's a very complicated thing. And I think.
I worked in the Title One school. I saw that our leaders were just trying to keep the doors open. They were trying to get as much funding as possible.
And they felt that new students who could have turn out low test scores because they assumed they didn't know the material because they assumed because they don't speak English, they can't succeed.
Those assumptions led them to think, OK, we need to find a way to exclude them so that we can get the right test scores so we can keep getting the funding to stay open.
What a terrible system. What a terrible system.
And that has that's built into the process. Of course, we have bad actors. Of course, I disagreed with my leaders and I pushed back on our on our school leaders, maybe too much, obviously.
But I don't think that's what you are kindled spirits right there.
Yes, yes, yes, I did. And I remember making a PowerPoint about about students rights and stuff like that was great.
But they you can see how, yes, the bad actors are there, but this is also baked into the system.
And that's wrong. And so a lot of our work is, yes, we're attacking the smaller policies. We're talking about those those small things.
But it's also rooted in huge, huge societal issues that we can't tackle alone. And that's what led me to coalition work.
We know we can't do I as one advocate, I could get as many degrees as I want. Like, like Dr. Tribble said, I can get a piece of paper that says I'm an expert in this.
I can write a million think pieces and testify in Congress and do this and that.
But if it's not me and a ton of other people, especially those currently in the classroom, especially the students and the families and the advocates that lead in communities and know exactly what their specific communities mean,
then we're not going to make any change. This is how to tap ins. And so that's how we started the National Newcomer Network.
A really good friend of mine, Dr. Popo. Well, said that it's so unfortunate that oftentimes people who who try to advocate and an ally, you know, for underrepresented populations often find themselves underrepresented as well.
No matter how, you know, educated you are, how maybe loud you need to be, how informative you are, how many presentations you prepare with all of the data, all of the research, all of the law, all of the policy, all of the things that we know the examples of the DOJ resolutions that we see through the Office of Civil Rights.
I mean, all these things. And yet sometimes it's almost as if we just have to find a way to connect to people's hearts that can help change their minds and continue what we're doing at the same time, because I have found myself in similar situations where I was full throttle in my interview.
I mean, they knew who they were going to get with Kelly Kelly, the forms they knew I was going to be an advocate. They knew it was going to be loud. They knew I wanted to make it right. Legally, morally, we have this moral imperative.
I mean, they knew that. And then as soon as you get in there into the position, sometimes it's like, well, well, well, well, well, well, we don't really want to do it, though.
I mean, we know that the majority of the population is EL. The majority is doing this, but we're still going to do a very Eurocentric monolithic. This is what the certain curriculum offers, and we're just going to do it this way.
And I don't ever change, and I just sit back and I get confused by that. And it's so interesting because whenever we're talking about, and I was reading on some notes here, like how personal this is, right, and how it comes from like our roots and where we are,
the community, much like my own, like, and so we all have that sense of, of belonging, right, wanting to be a part of this greater, bigger conversation.
And so we have ways that we can have more parents than badges, but oftentimes we have more badges than parents at some of these, you know, meetings that we have for, you know, family engagement, but we're not responding to it there all the time.
And so I just want to encourage, I want to say thank you for your service and what you've been doing. Thank you to, you know, organizations like the 74million.org website, go and visit that website for sure.
It's a great place for you. But I think that going through and continuing these conversations is a must.
Because here specifically in Oklahoma we're also combating with the same DEI issues. It's an, you know, English only state, but yet we have pockets of really great things happening in dual language schools and dual language education.
And so, you know, organizations and agencies that are nonprofits that are bringing in help and support and guidance and helping our refugee students and really putting, you know, wrapping our arms around our, our newcomer students, our refugee students, our immigrant, our migrant families, all of that.
But it seems like this is this constant battle. And at the same time though, you know, we,
I say this all the time, like, why do we go to, you know, they're going to church on Sunday and can do all things through Christ and then on Monday we're not doing those same things that we know we're supposed to be doing.
So whether it's not Christianity that's your religion or any other religion, I'm encompassing of all of world religions. But I think if we're going to be preaching this and practicing this and doing this, and then using that same thing to build walls and barriers and these obstacles, I think we need to really reevaluate and stop and look at ourselves in the mirror and say what are we doing?
What are we doing? Because we have, if we ourselves feel like this is personal for me, I have my roots, a community like mine, other people are feeling that exact same thing and they need that.
And we need to really open up ourselves and to find ways where we can be true listeners and work with our communities, because it's through our diversity that we find so much more unity.
Absolutely. Absolutely. There's so much fear mongering around this issue and we see it especially because it's an election year and because this is politically, both sides see this as politically smart to act on immigration.
Our students are being used as pawns and our families are being used as pawns and it's really hard to watch, coming from an immigrant family, but also as a teacher, right? As a community who cares to see your kids' rights be debated.
That's really hard. We know what that feels like and we know what that looks like. We're seeing it play out in the classrooms and we see day by day how, I mean, those who have taught know what we see on TV, the kids see it.
They see it, they hear it and they repeat it in their classrooms. I've heard those things when I was teaching. I've heard different slurs or different comments made at students because I was teaching in
between 2017 and 2019. They were seeing what was going on on TV. They heard those things, they sent them to the kids back and forth and that's what creates a hard, I mean, what we assume kids don't hear, kids don't understand, they hear.
Oh, they hear.
Yeah. Alejandra, in light of your experience as a teacher and kind of the environment that we're in now, what do you think that teachers can practically do to help kind of mitigate some of the challenges that the students are facing today?
Specifically with being newly enrolled and adjusting to a new school.
Yeah, just thinking more, I mean, about that but broadly too, just your experience, what have you seen that works practically? You know, I'm always thinking about, you know, obviously the theory but in practice for the listeners, educators, administrators, what can they do on, you know, daily, weekly or monthly basis that, you know, can kind of combat some of the things that we're talking about today.
Absolutely. I think it'll be, there'll be slightly different advice if you can speak the language that your students speak and not. I know that for most of my students, they spoke Spanish, and maybe another language, maybe an indigenous language, maybe another language and so what I did was I, because I was able to speak Spanish, I connected with their families immediately, and for many of them sort of became the liaison.
I wasn't paid for that, but I became the liaison. Of course not. Between them and the school and it did, that was really important to me because the parents, as we all know, want to be connected to the school community.
There's fear, there's so much, there are so many nerves when engaging, especially as an asylum seeker, especially in this climate with a public institution in the US. There's also fear of hospitals, you know, using this because of public charge.
And so being a sort of connector and being able to say, I hear you, I understand you, you can trust me, here's my phone number, you can call me, helps to sort of bridge that and that's a big part of it, I think, that the family feels like, okay, there's someone here, there's a safe, we're safe, and it's okay, and we can call her if our daughter needs to miss school because we have an immigration hearing, things like that.
So I mean, all teachers know building family relationships, but especially I think for those new families where you know there might be some disconnect, and they're brand new to the community and there could be just adjustment gap for some time, try and make the extra effort to connect with them.
And if you don't speak the language you can find it, an interpreter, the school should provide one, so we know that to be true.
Do you have a specific, like, if you don't, it's okay, I'm just wondering, you have a specific example of one of your, a student or some of your students and an experience that you had with them to help them overcome some of these challenges that you might feel comfortable sharing that might resonate with the listeners?
Oh yeah, I can think of so many.
One of my students, she had been here for a year by the time she joined my classroom, so, but she was still struggling, her parents were working multiple hours a day, she rarely saw her parents because they were working so much, it was actually hard to get in contact with her
parents because they were working, she was sort of the parent for her younger siblings, the middle school down the street, she came in late some days because she would take her siblings to school, she sometimes left early so she could go pick them up if they were sick, it was that sort of dynamic.
So I started calling the parents a lot to first understand what was going on, to communicate with my student, and we set up a couple systems, there were some times where we coordinated her with other students to get picked up from school so she wouldn't have to walk, so she and her siblings could get where they needed to go faster so she wouldn't have to miss as much school.
So there were those types of things, just meeting her and talking to her parents, understanding what their needs were and sort of coordinating with other students, how they could get to and from school so they can miss as little as possible was one thing.
I grew, I mean, with this family particularly, I think of this one because this student came to school, aside from maybe missing a little bit at the beginning, the end, had perfect attendance the entire year.
This narrative that immigrant students don't come to school or this or that, we know that's not true. She came to school every single day, she tried in all of her classes, even as there was no linguistic support in all of her core content classes, she tried extremely hard and she'd come to me and say,
Mies, can you help me with this science thing? I'm no science expert. I'd be like, okay, sure, let's do it. And she ended up having a quinceañera and the family invited me. And I helped pass out dinner plates to everybody.
I had my own quinceañera many years ago, so I handed out the plates with the whole family. A lot of the students were there and it was sort of the end of the year and they were dancing across the dance floor in the backyard of their little home down the street from the middle school where her siblings went to.
And it was just such a beautiful sight to see how those small little efforts make a difference. So, I mean, this is not, you know, there are people who are experts at really specific teaching strategies.
I never got that type of training. Before I left, I never got to really get the training. I was seeking to be a better teacher. I was translanguaging. I was trying my best in the classroom. There are people who are making sure the teachers are prepared.
But what I know I am proud of is the small things to build community like that. Like starting a club in the school for all of our new immigrant students, whether they were Latino, we had a lot of Haitian students too. So, building a space in the school where they felt they were safe to come speak their home languages and support each other with their homework.
So, I didn't speak Haitian Creole, but I learned a couple words and I just was like, here's space. You all can study here. This is your room after school. So, doing those little things. That's what I'm proud of.
And again, I'm so envious of the teachers that I meet who are experts at doing this. Teachers from the International Network, teachers from these incredible schools like Fugees Academy and other programs that do such good work with immigrant students.
That was not my teaching experience. And I envy that they get the training to be able to be proud of their teaching with their students.
But I do know that there are people like me who maybe don't have the formal training but are trying their best. And those are the people we're trying to reach. We want to get them the training because they're there doing the work anyway.
And that's where policy fits in. I think policy is to say, there are lots of people who have the best intentions. Let's give them the tools to do what they want to do.
We have accountability built in to make sure that those who don't have the best intentions do it anyway because it's the right of kids. It's built into our system. We have laws that say these are the rights of kids. You have to deliver a quality educational experience.
We hold them accountable. So for the good actors, give them what they need to succeed like I wish I had. And for the bad actors, well, here's the law.
I think that the accountability part just, I think we can do better on the accountability side of things to have it be not just a document that you submit for accreditation purposes or something, because anyone can write anything on those.
I've seen it happen plenty of times and people just send in whatever as opposed to I think true accountability where we're really, really following through with all the things that you were just right there discussing.
And we will be right back.
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And now back to the show. Dr. Tribble, go ahead. I was just going to say it's a good segue into more detail on what National Newcomer Network does and the Century Foundation and how listeners can get involved.
But before you describe that, I do want to emphasize, you know, one of the reasons I was excited to connect you and Kelly is the, I, we have a mutual connection that I heard that Kelly was looking for a job teaching.
And so I helped connect him. I didn't even know him, but I helped him connect with a principal at a school who was looking for a newcomer teacher. And the first time that I saw Kelly, Kelly's class, I go in and you know, it's students, all different languages from all different countries.
And he's got his, he's got his little chihuahua and like they are so engaged and they had so much fun. And he, I think like you will attest to the fact he didn't have that training any either.
And that that obviously is important, but the most important thing is the type of stuff that you're talking about is the connection, building relationships.
And until you have that, like all the training in the world doesn't matter. And so I think it's important that that's emphasized those those things that you did while you're kind of downplaying your ability as a teacher, that ability to build the relationship is so much more important than all the training that you could get in the world.
And also just wanted to highlight for you, try to give you a picture of the classroom that Kelly ran where he didn't have training either. And maybe he could speak to that a little bit, but definitely one of the best educators I've ever seen in practice.
Oh, I'd love to hear more.
Well, we'll have to, we'll have to do a part.
I will say though, starting starting as an educator, as a newcomer teacher, and the other listeners and friends and family know this, I was going to be a dancing bilingual veterinarian, there was no desire to become an educator and so all I knew was show business.
I was bilingual in English and Spanish, and I had a chihuahua that was a therapy dog. Let's go. And so we just had the best time possible but I'm sure that you probably recognize that apart from having the pedagogical background and the you know how do you use the
certain graphic organizer, or, you know, how do you put your kids in certain groups.
I don't know what it was the same thing like we were doing project based learning but I didn't know that's what it was. We were doing trans language and but I didn't know that's what it was. We were doing all these things I didn't know that's what it was, but the reason why I was doing
that is not because I knew what to do it was the intuition of me stopping to listen and to learn from my students who were letting me know what they needed in order to be successful.
So, I mean, of course I appreciate so much what I've learned since then I apply it and I use it and it's helped me become a better educator, but I don't think that it replaces the moments to sit back and just take in what our students are teaching us.
And then we apply that into our lessons and that's where now the graphic organizer will really work.
Because you did that. Yeah, absolutely. I wanted to quickly say I also am a dancer a group dancing.
So, we need to build community within our school for across across different so a lot of our new Latino students were new to the school and so we would, I would teach salsa, bachata, merengue. They'd come in and it was a way for the community to see, oh, are these, these kids.
And they didn't see already all this, all the strengths and beautiful culture that our students were bringing to the community. They saw because our students were standing up there being like, oh yes I'll teach you, you know, English thing like, do you want to dance with me and then they dance together you know so it was such a way to bring sort of another
kind of a culture that I knew my students had to, because we did this growing up in our home parties and stuff that. And then we share and we shared that with the, with the broader school community and I saw so many of my kids, my other students who are very shy maybe, and maybe had never really
heard any sort of Latin music before be like, oh, cool and they sort of opened up as well it was such a great way and I love that you also brought that into your classroom movement is is so important, and I would do little dance breaks and stuff in my classroom
I love it. Bringing that in my my salsa partner, Marty Marty Rickman she's from Palmira by Columbia, you know, and so she by the time in the salsa cali so she dances salsa cali which is such a fun fast on a sun combi and things like that and anyhow I'm so fortunate.
And she always says I'm clearly to like your adult pal, and so I just like, you know, as adopted me into the to the culture and the family and everything and I just love it so much I'm so thankful but with that though, going out to different events and schools and
sharing culture through dance is just so magnificent we love it so much, but we were you'll love this we were able to go to a middle school.
It was during Hispanic Heritage Month so they were celebrating all these different countries and they invited us to come, and I was doing some professional development training there, and then they found out that I was a dancer also and so long story short, they knew
my salsa partner they knew me we brought it together we did a little performance for them one day. And the cool part was is that there was a newcomer student to just arrived from Columbia that week, and for him to be there in this new school this new
atmosphere and hear las Asa Carina de Colombia, the, the, the cumbia the music to see like last part of this in the color is and like the like their, their bandera their flag represented there as well as part of what makes, you know, the United States
the United States through through immigration and etc but I mean just what a moment for that child to feel so excited and truly that sense of belonging because he was seeing his country celebrated and therefore he was being celebrated right there in that moment.
That makes for a great learning space.
And those are the things you can't write in a policy, I'm in policy. And the, the unique ways that individuals bring those things you can't really write that into policy.
And so you can write me in a pop, write me in one of your policies and I'll go everywhere.
You must work for one dance training per year.
I love that you'll be booked and busy be ready.
But yeah, you know and that's, that's one of the interesting things about policy is so much of the things I see on the ground that are the best work are things that when you're writing policy that is that is broad, especially at the national level but even at the state level.
It's not that granular.
My challenge is being like how can we make sure those things happen. How do we write something, how do we build in systems that are flexible enough for local creativity.
Right, because maybe it's dancing doesn't work for everybody. Maybe it's music. Maybe it is theater. Maybe it's, I don't know, a book drive or this or that or it's all the things.
How do you sort of build that in, while also still maintaining a high like high accountability for partnerships with community based organizations for just building belonging and inclusion in schools that that's really hard and especially right now it's a it's a theme of the advocacy
world, but building into policy can be more complicated and it's something I'm wrestling with and figuring out how I can do a better job of putting it into writing that those things can happen in more places.
I don't, and I know we circled around we gotta get, get back to the, I know to the, to the national newcomer network but I also, I, you know, as you're talking about this and I'm, you know, just going back and looking at your, your bio again and considering all the work that
you've been doing. And I don't know this is just a thought and so I'm anxious to get your insight.
I feel like okay so I have just been very fortunate very privileged in the aspect that my, my, my grandparents, my papa and Kiki, if they ever listen shout out to them.
But they, they, they had me travel so many places and took me around the country and so many places and then encouraged me to travel abroad and to go live abroad and to go do things and I've just been fortunate to go to way beyond Spanish speaking countries but just really
have some amazing places in the world that you know you do Dr. Triple you travel and been able to experience and see things. And whenever you go and you travel it's so much fun, but there's that time when you maybe get a little homesick and you miss something and so whenever
you see something or speak to someone that that that comes from your culture and your background and you can share something or you're living in another country but yet you have a small group of friends and you get together to celebrate a certain holiday or a tradition
that maybe represents your home country that no one else is doing.
It just feels so good and you're right that's not a written down in policy, but I wonder if part of it though is that the majority of people, even in my family I'll say, and so I'll make it you know personal if in friends, even whenever we do travel, it typically comes with,
you know, an all inclusive price to it. So it's not necessarily like traveling and like really being in the culture and in the community, living as if the people are living, you know, alongside the people that live there every single day and I wonder if there's that
disconnect because we have, you know, newcomer students who are coming here, and they are like this is what you're doing like you're now becoming at least a bicultural person. It's just going to be happening. Whereas, other of us who travel and maybe don't travel extensively,
or for extended amounts of time beyond, which you know I think everyone would love an all inclusive resort like we would if we won that we would love it and love to be able to go but I just don't think you're getting that same experience there necessarily.
So then therefore I don't know how to bring I don't know how to do that granular part.
I don't know how to bring in the culture. And a lot of people are surprised that that I do because I'm born in Tulsa, Oklahoma blonde hair blue eyes no one else in my family speaks in Spanish, everyone only speaks English like we have a German background,
like there's nothing about that in there so people are like obviously just like, what do you know but it's because I've been fortunate to travel beyond an all inclusive resort.
I've sat at tables lived in homes woke up took the public transportation eight in the restaurants had you know how to get bills pay bills do these different things. And then, you know, and been able to come back here and share that I've had these different experiences
and I wonder, from your point of view if that's some of the stuff, because I've always thought I wish everyone could travel at least once in college, not even for language, necessarily, but just for architecture for like whatever your profession is but just leave the country
and go live somewhere to live in a different place have an experience at least for a semester something that is different from what you do here which is what you see on TV.
And if somehow, there's a connection between maybe lack of traveling overall among policymakers and educators in those ways to be able to identify those granular components that really are the glue to bring together the great work that we do see in policy today.
I mean I think I think you're right, travel exposure.
Exposure. Yes.
Those are really, really big parts of sort of understanding others and being able to appreciate differences and appreciate others and see their cultures and their, what they bring as assets, which is a big part of the work that we do.
But I also think, you know, yeah, it is really, it is really limiting, even just, you know, being able to go to college for some is really is really limiting much less like being able to participate in study abroad, for example, and I too am very privileged
to study abroad and feel so grateful for that experience it shaped who I am. But I think you know like in the classroom okay so we can't, at least in my policy area that's less less of what I'm able to do is being able to provide travel experiences for all teachers, for example,
but I think you know, not a university policy.
They just pay for it and have everyone.
Yes, exactly. Everybody free study abroad programs tied in.
But I think for classrooms, you know, the biggest thing you don't need to be an expert you can get a student, especially with newcomers this is really important you can get a student from a country you've, you know nothing about, you don't know their language you
don't know anything. This could be true of people who are well traveled. There are places we have blind spots, I don't think that the policy necessarily needs to be around places like you have to know the place to be good at building belonging.
I think it's like, yeah, well, appreciation, again, for difference but also and a commitment to building belonging and inclusion. But beyond that I think it's just like listen to the kids. And this is where the work that I've been doing in school integration fits into the newcomer
space, because a lot of new schools are receiving newcomers maybe they've never done it before. And so much of what they try and do is fit these new students into their existing.
They're existing. Well yeah but like that you know they they're like oh we have a school culture, and we're going to keep it this way, we're going to try and make you fit in so you got to learn English you got to come to all the existing sports games, and our, you
know, this is how our pep rallies work and you're just going to fit in and you're going to make it work and if you don't understand what's going on you know sit in the corner or whatever. That's so much of what's happening in schools right now that this attitude that the culture does not
change with the students. No, the culture must change with the students, because what is the purpose of education, if we're not serving the students currently in the classroom.
Well whose school is it? As we see demographic shifts, exactly, whose school is it? As we see demographic shifts in schools across the country, you know there's so, like I was saying there's sort of a sphere of difference, xenophobia, this is where racism comes in.
As you see demographic shifts in communities there's a lot of fear and pushback and that's where this like no this is how it's always been this is how the school needs to be forever.
Why not add something new? Why not ask the kids, how do you do, if you were in school in your home country, what was school like for you? How did you do celebrations?
Where you're, you know, like maybe some sort of cultural celebration they did fits into the pep rally where it's okay you do some of the things that we've done before in pep rallies, band, cheer, music and then you add in a different music or you add in a cultural dance or you do this
I mean, how can we add to the community, because as it grows as it changes it should respond and reflect the students that are there. And the kids have that expertise you don't as the teacher have to be the expert do your research you know, but ask them and they'll tell you what they need like you said.
And I think that's, that's what we have to see happen more and what I wrote about in that in the my the future of Brown Brown v Board of Education I was referencing the future of Brown is multiracial. Our schools, as we look at the future of school integration, the push to ensure that we are not segregating our schools
from any longer, that all students feel welcome in, in every school that they attend. That is means also responding to the cultural changes and seeing students as assets and asking them what they need and adjusting your programming, your curriculum, accordingly.
Yeah, it's just, it's so important to always just consider that and of course if you can't travel, you know, across another border to another country you can travel to another part of the city where maybe you haven't traveled before or even to another state or something like that.
I think that the power of exposure the power of experiences helps better inform us whenever we're trying to now not just articulate certain things but to implement and apply certain policies, etc.
And to do that I know that you had mentioned about the article, which, you know, I have a question or two we can talk around that but Dr. Trill well I know that you were wanting to dig in deep, more about the national newcomer network which I love the
website looking at it and everything and I have many plans to. Well, fortunately I've shared it before but I didn't realize that this connection that we're having now so it's, it's fun meeting, meeting someone famosa.
But anyhow I do want to hear more about what the national newcomer network is and Dr triple if you can give us some background into your experience with the national newcomer network.
You know it's it's pretty pretty new to me I think it was through social media. I guess I got I mean, I may all of like a month you know.
So, I, I'm not one to speak to it I I am excited to learn more you know obviously I've read information on the website but that was part of why I wanted to have you here all 100 is to be able to educate myself and all the listeners on the wonderful work that
you're doing at the national newcomer network. What is it, what do you guys do. And then how does that fit into the century foundation what is this entry foundation and then how can we support the work that you're doing, how can listeners support the work
you're doing and become engaged with the national neck newcomer network.
Yeah, thank you for that question. Um, so we, like I said when I got into my policy work I was like, all right, I can write as many reports as I want. This will not be the way that we make change.
And so, I was thinking about coalition building I'd worked in places where we ran collisions or, you know, convenings of people at the local level here in New York City and had done some of that in Miami as well so when I got to a sort of national level work
at the century foundation through next 100, which is a project of the century foundation.
Can you tell us more about like the process from vision to implementation so like you were thinking about this you're the one that made it happen you're the visionary like, so you had this idea how did you go about actually like getting people around that
idea getting these organizations that you've been involved with to move forward with your idea. Well I was thinking, national policy change I was writing some reports and I said okay well we need to bring some people together to start talking about some of the
policy change we need to see get more folks that I'm not exposed to directly. And so I started reaching out to other folks. There are not a lot of people who do newcomer work at the national level.
So much of the newcomer work happens locally. So we are, I started reaching out to some of the community based organizations, researchers at universities who were doing this work.
People who I knew worked at the state level who ran their title three program title three is a part of the elementary and secondary education act that funds English learners and immigrant students, so they run those programs at the state level in different
states I was reaching out to those folks who do they know.
And we started to just sort of build. I started to build sort of like a book of people.
Okay, and we I was coordinating with Oakland unified to put together a newcomer convening in April of 2022 so yeah two years ago, and we had a convening of about 90 people at that time from across the country talking about what we need and one of the things
that they said, they said we need more research on newcomers and outcomes. We need data, and we need more advocacy. And I said great you know what, I know how to do advocacy, maybe not you know I'm learning
and I'm young in my career but I really passionate about this and you know what I can also do I'm good at organizing people. So we, I coordinated with Californians together it's an advocacy organization that does state work in California, and said,
Why don't we do this together. I have the time, I get paid to do this work. I will do the back end work, and together we can bring our networks together to say to bring to all the folks that we know, and start to build a working group we called it at first of folks
out of curiosity who was paying you said you mentioned you were paid to do this work.
Yeah, at Next 100, the Think Tank I was at before, which is within TCF, the Century Foundation is a progressive policy think tank.
We work on a number of issues. And there's an arm of the Century Foundation called Next 100 focused on bringing young directly impacted people into policy because policy and think tanks are very white, male.
And so it's trying to disrupt that by bringing directly impacted people into the into the space and so that's what I and my, my fellowship there was I could do whatever I want, focusing, as long as it's bringing indirectly impacted people and my lived
experience and their lived experiences to inform policy work and so I used my time to build the coalition I was paid to do what I want to do with it and half of my time was really building this coalition so I said California's together join me.
We can bring our networks together, you have legitimacy, I'm new but I can put the time in and we did it. We had a couple meetings where we had a handful of people. And we said hey we all we all said that we care about newcomers.
We want to many of you do this on the local level we want to coordinate so that no matter whether students are lucky enough to end up in a state where they might get what they need, because it's a blue state or because they're friendly to immigrants or because
they're having great curriculum there. We want to make sure that's also happening in red states, or, you know, maybe, maybe it is a blue state but they don't get what they need.
We want to make sure this happens everywhere. It's a systemic change. And so that's what was sort of driving this coalition work at the start we built our.
And then, every other month, and we started thinking about what are our values shared values across this large and growing community. What is our mission so we workshop the mission.
And then we started breaking into like what are our priorities what is our problem statement, what are the things we see in our communities in our classrooms that are wrong, that we can identify for other folks that they know what what we see is the
problem, and we can articulate that. And then how are we working on solutions and so we started to then after we put out our we launched, we put out our mission and vision.
We then started to break into groups to identify solutions and out of that, a year after we launched a year of working on this policy platform where we identified three key issues, civil rights and services.
And then we started to wrap, since we had so many teachers or former educators in the room.
That was one of the big issues we saw. And then finally, sort of like the funding and accountability piece, this sort of more traditional policy, and we split into three groups and we created in those three groups our members went through and said,
What do you see and this is what I would like to see done about it. This is the type of recommendation we workshopped all of those in small groups and then big groups and then we published this in February after a full year of iterative small group and big group
feedback from at the time, about 150 people.
And we launched in February, so that's the policy platform that you see on our website.
And again represents a year of work, the commitment from folks all over the country at the time I believe 32 states.
We now represent 37 states.
Ever since, since we put that out. And at the time we had about 150 members we now have 225.
So, we're growing, and we see this as a, as a living document, we hope to update this in two years again, go through the same process, because we know that policy has to change it responds to things happening in the world there are new leaders is there's
an election this year there's going to be new needs and also the communities change again so there's going to be.
While some of the some of this might carry over there might be some updates, and so our plan is to update this in two years but we did the work to sort of one learn how to put out this type of me it was a big project, it was hours and hours of work
organizing and trying to hear from people. Lots of educating to because as a teacher I didn't know how policy worked or like how to write a policy or what ideas could be policy and I always tell teachers everything that you think is wrong.
And that you do about it that's a policy. How do we make that broader so I can fit across the country. But those things like, oh, it's really unfair that students.
You know you can come up with an attendance thing or an enrollment thing. It's unfair the students are denied enrollment because they're, they maybe live with an aunt or uncle and they're not on the lease. Okay, that's a policy actually it's a policy that exists but it's a policy right so we can translate that
into a policy. And so every teacher every person in our community and big part of our work is telling them you all have ideas. You could all influence policy, every single one of you because you know the issues.
And so let's bring that into our platform.
And that's what we did.
We're bringing in the cultural knowledge as we're having the conversation centered around the policy because that's because because you're right what ends up happening is that these think tanks. And this isn't everywhere, of course, and so I know that we have listeners from all over and I'm coming from an Oklahoma
perspective, in my world of working in the field of education as an employee in school districts but to your point earlier that typically our think tanks don't necessarily reflect or resemble those that we're serving.
So I think it's truly important to have people who have had the experience, or in the experience.
And please by all means have an interpreter and someone else doesn't speak English in those conversations to really, really be able to have what I feel like would be a more authentic and realistic conversation for implementation purposes.
I would say thank you for all your dedication and hard work that you have done thus far, how can our listeners become more engaged with national newcomer network and the work that you're doing.
Yeah, there are so many people that need these services and need these supports, again, across the nation we have so many newcomers that are that are that are present and I think it's exciting it's it's it's thrilling to have a newcomer student walk into your school into
your classroom, but it is can be very daunting and scary for for the families and for the for the child coming in here so yes I'm excited to, to find ways to keep sharing this information through local organizations and then beyond because this is a very important
topic in our country.
And what I hear I mean I travel now all the time to visit schools and write about them to go to conferences and speak on what we're doing. And what I hear from so many people, when I meet them.
They see our booth at a conference. They say, I thought I was the only one.
They might be in a school in rural Montana, they could be in a city, somewhere, anywhere.
And I feel like they're the only voice at their school that is saying, Hey, my kids aren't getting what they need or like hey our newcomers matter hey can we get this.
And we saw them, I felt the same way. And that's why we're doing this. You are not alone, even if you think you're the only one in your school who is doing this and saying that you're not alone.
And that's what we're building in our community.
So, you can, we're, we're always welcoming new members, we could grow to 600, that'd be great. I would need a lot more capacity to be able to support 600 members to make sure they all feel welcome and you know
Sorry, are you telling the listeners to hold off a little bit maybe?
No, I'm saying join us.
I know.
Come help us. But we, but we, my vision is that everyone who wants to support newcomers can join us so that we can continue to push the work, they can provide their perspective that maybe pushes us in a different way or updates it or improves the work
that we're doing to better understand how to meet the needs in all these different contexts because every context is different.
How can we learn from those experiences? What expertise are they bringing because what somebody, what somebody's doing in rural Oklahoma might actually help the teacher in the middle of LAUSD, right?
They're, because they've had to come up with solutions or write their own curriculum or figure, you know, figure it out, come up with programs that work.
We see this as every member has something to contribute, both to our advocacy as well as to the knowledge community that we're building. And so we're welcoming anybody and so I would say if you are
listening and you either work in a school where you're supporting newcomers or you work in a district and you feel like you want to join this community or you're a community member, you work in a, in a community based organization that supports immigrant families,
join us.
Yes, we, like I said, it's, you can join us anytime our website is TCF.org slash nnn short for the National Newcomer Network, TCF.org slash nnn.
You can see our policy platform on that page you can see some of our members. And then if you scroll to the bottom it says do you want to join our movement.
There is a link there for our new member survey.
On that new member survey, click that, and that will give us your information will automatically add you to our email list.
My emails also on that page. So if you can't find the link, that's okay.
You can email me, ask me questions. We are my inbox is always open, and I like to respond to anybody who can who emails me with interest with questions.
If I'm not the expert on that thing I will point you to the person again we have a network of almost 250 now, people who are doing this work in different states and who are focused on different parts of the new comer experience so I always say okay you know what,
I'm not the expert at writing that curriculum.
Let me point you to the person who I know writes curriculum. Here you go, or this person who works at the state level in this state boom here's the person who leads Oregon here's the person who does this.
Here's a teacher who's excellent at this.
So, I can't be the expert of everything, but are we in our community we have experts on almost everything. And that's what we're building and we're welcome we're welcoming more experts to join us.
And we can include the link somewhere in the.
I know you're out in the community a lot to and attending conferences.
Where can they find Alejandra, ask us about to come if they're at a conference what's what are some of the conferences that you'll be attending.
So, I've attended not be the last two years the National Association for bilingual education conference where we have presented on newcomer work my research as well as some of the national newcomer network research or work that we're doing.
I have, I went to South by Southwest edu this year I was at the Education Writers Association conference at the Latino Justice convening in New York City.
And I'm starting to go to school integration related conferences to talk about how newcomers fit into this conversation around integration and supporting all students.
This year I will be at Alice, I am and we're waiting on a couple others but I will be out I hope to see you at La Cosecha to in your home state.
Crossing fingers because yes that is my home I would love to do my work in my home state.
I hope I will be there so I hope you'll be there too. I have to, I have to make sure to catch up I'm going to be we're definitely going to have this link in there so you can join I'm going to make sure I fill it out and.
Yeah, so thank you for, for, for sharing that as well.
I'm excited about it.
And I just want to say, you know to anyone who's out there listening right now.
You're not alone. It is hard to be that one person. I was, I was, you know, new in education, I didn't, again, you know I would that wasn't my goal to be an educator and now I'm just elated that that's what happened and so it was what was meant to be.
But nevertheless I you know I was the teacher that was downstairs in the basement with the newcomer students and while everyone else was up on you know, on the other level it was the it was a school that was might as well been the Titanic, you go down here and everyone
else is up here like it's the real deal like, and we scraped off the mold on the wall, had to repaint it as like this is not how we're coming like welcome to America and you're coming to school like this is not what we're doing so my grandparents helped me and, but then
I just want to back to the point of just like thanking you and thanking everyone else out there listening, who is that advocate. It can be hard sometimes but you know I respectfully so you stand up and you know to the cafeteria manager and let them know that just
because they didn't have this one form filled out on this day. There was a way that we can still provide some sort of nutrition for this student I'm sure that with some masters or doctorate degree in that building we can figure out a way to get a kid, a peanut
butter jelly sandwich, at least if they can eat peanut butter, if I mean, be careful about pork right I mean with something you don't think about these things and so there's all these different considerations, but to the point though is that I was that person
that had to go and talk with the cafeteria manager and that cafeteria manager went and complained to the principal but I had already met with the principal prior to the man because I already knew it was going to happen, but I wasn't going to have eight of my students in this class, not be able to have food,
whenever this is probably one of the only meals that they're, they're getting. And so whenever you're trying to consider that plus I still need a lesson from, you know, prep and plan for what I'm doing we don't always think about it because it may just not be our problem and there might be
someone out there who's doing this work and so I'll just focus on my lesson. And I just want to remind people, if it's crossed your mind to be the advocate that was meant to happen.
They need you as that advocate, because the most likely is not someone else right down the hallway, thinking about what you're thinking about and so find it as something that that is a very special sense of intuition whenever you recognize and know that there's a child
who needs help, a child who needs an advocate and a child who needs an ally, someone who will stand up and be able to speak for them if they do not have the language yet, if they don't have the cultural understanding yet, if they just need someone to be there.
So, you're not alone, be that person and whenever you walk next to that child and help them and you look at their eyes, then you know you're definitely not alone.
Don't worry about the rest just do your best and forget the rest, but when if you feel it, do it, be the advocate for them. Definitely.
Absolutely.
Again, I know we have a list of these prepared questions, but I do I, and we, I've had a great conversation with you I've really enjoyed getting to meet you and I want to say thank you again Dr triple for for always creating these amazing moments that I get to experience
and to share this with our listeners but before we leave and we have time I would just love to leave the last word to you, Alejandra. Again, you're a beacon of hope, truly, in a world that needs more people like you and so I want to encourage you on behalf of so many that
are listening right now I want to say thank you for everything that you have done you've taken time you've taken moments to be incredibly vulnerable to share, I'm sure, very vulnerable moments to share your experiences in order to help change policy to create an impact
that can be better for all of our students so with that, is there anything that you would like to leave us with our listeners with or any of our students out there listening perhaps with.
I would just say that everyone has the power to influence policy influence change policy can seem so opaque and so Tarek and really distant and what we see on TV makes us feel that way.
Every person whether you're a teacher community member, a parent, a student has a voice. Our schools should be responding to student and community needs like we said earlier who is the school for it's for them.
And as advocates it's our job to work with the people closest to the problems to inform the work that we do, and to uplift them themselves we're not speaking for people. My goal is not to speak for people, right, I'm an advocate.
That's why we build this coalition. That's why we're bringing in those teacher voices in our meeting later this afternoon we have a National Newcomer Network member meeting, we're doing storytelling training.
And we're talking with our members about why storytelling is an important part of advocacy, because changing hearts and minds is just as important, and maybe more convincing than the data, the research that comes with it, especially when it comes to policy work.
So, everybody has a story to tell if you're on the ground if you're teaching in a classroom with students if you were formerly an immigrant, if you work in the community in a community based organization your school leader, whatever your role is you're connected to this
and you care, you have a role to play you can change policy. And we have a space where you can do that with us with others who care. So yes, join us. But beyond that, your voice matters.
And use your voice to make that change that you see. Well, thank you and thank you to all of the other teachers, teacher leaders, district leaders, anyone out there who's really trying to do this work and helping so much.
And then I just want to encourage you go go tell your other friends about this about this work as well. I think many times, it's just, it's ignorance it's it's being unaware of things that need to be happening I think many of our leaders in education, want to
do the very very best and just maybe are unaware at times. And then for those who are aware. Just, you know, and thank you for keep doing what you're doing and for anyone that needs help advocates out there.
Keep on advocating, keep on aline.
Keep on being able to be advocating. Sure, for sure. Well hey, Alejandra, thank you for being here with us. It was a real pleasure. It was such a pleasure. I'm glad I got to meet you. I'm going to sign up right now.
And all the listeners you sign up to, to be a member and to be able to get information will have all the links in the description of the podcast, Dr. Taylor Tribble president and CEO of edges skills our sponsor thank you for being here with us today.
And also, thank you to our team producer who helps make a sound so good. So I appreciate you all. I'm Alejandra, you are a superstar and truly made my day so much better and I hope for all the listeners.
I wish you all the best and until next time, I'll see you then.
Adios.