Bat bi hiru lau
Watch your back, watch your back
Ertzainza's gonna get you
Watch your back, watch your back
Ertzainza's gonna get you
Watch your back, watch your back
Oh, there's a crime here
It's a coming from the Euskal Herria
Gotta wash those red hands
It's the crimes of the basquelands
Sad, sad, sad, sad, sad
Some very nice quince gin
My sister, by the way
My mom tried it, it was very nice, she loved it
So welcome to our podcast
Yes, we cover crimes in the Basque lands
Which means here in the Basque country
Or around the world
Everywhere in the world
Where there might be Basque people
Either committing crimes or being victims of crimes
Exactly, yeah exactly
Anywhere they went
Like that funny little line says
Have you seen the world map of Popao?
Yes
Popao is just a little part of the whole Basque world
Yes
Alright, well this week's episode
If we shall get into it, shall we?
Let's
This week's episode is a part two
So if you haven't listened to part one
You can go back and listen to that
So just a little disclaimer before we begin
This story involves sexual assault
And child sexual abuse
And of course murder
So listen with discretion
This story also has a lot to do with the Catholic Church
And I don't know if Douglas, do you want to tell us anything about
The Catholic Church's presence here in the Basque country?
Yeah, I mean it is always very complicated
When we think about it specifically
But in general, it's a southern European country
And like most southern European countries
The Catholic Church is the most powerful church
Reign supreme, yeah
And has been that for centuries
You know, there has not been a lot of protestant movements
In the Basque country
Like perhaps we have seen in France or other areas like that
But there's also a lot of ambiguity
When we start to look a bit closer at the Basque country
Because the fact that the mountains protected the language
Also protected the Basque people over history
From a lot of those kind of outside influences
Like we might not have paid so much attention
When we were talking about the witches episode, for example
But that was a very interesting kind of side story
Towards the story of the Catholic religion here in the Basque country
Where people were accusing the women of being witches
In a way because they weren't sure how Christian they were, right?
In the sense that also there were leftover pagan beliefs in the mountains
Let's say, you know, because they were harder to reach
Yeah, it's hard to say how embedded it was until let's say the 18th century
Even in the 18th century, as we already talked as well in that episode
There was happening this...
Inquisition?
Thank you, Inquisition, exactly
When we read about it, there's like a whole lot of reasons
Why you could have the Inquisition, right?
One of the reasons is of course to strengthen the Catholic Church
Kind of its power over people
But it's hard to take that apart, for example
When we're talking about a kingdom that's formed of different kingdoms
And where they're trying to impose their power on those other kingdoms
Just after having conquered them
If we think about like the 13th or...
Well, 14th or 15th centuries basically
So there's a lot of layers and as you can see the Basque country is kind of central in it
Over the centuries of course after Inquisition
Because it was so strong here and it lasted for so, so long
I think it finished I think in 1820s I think is when they officially finished it
Ended the Inquisition, okay
You know, so after this process everybody wants to be as Christian as possible
That's number one priority
Let's not get killed by some crazy people
Right, let's hold on to our property and our...
Yeah, yeah, and so again the Basque country, you know
Over the centuries like today we hear like
It was the purest of the purest of Christians
Right
Well, what was that? That was clearly a reaction to that initial kind of accusation
That we weren't Christian enough that we were practicing
Religion, paganism in the mountains and things like that, right?
So it's a direct kind of response to that
Over the centuries what's also very complicated when we think about
The Basque country is we have kind of that political power
And so when the king tries to take away power from the Basque country
A number of times the Basque country used the church to protect them
Themselves, saying no we're good Christians
We shouldn't be treated unfairly
So you see there's lots of issues already
Right
So clearly yes
Like everything
Very complicated
Yeah, but it has been a very, very big force in the Basque country
And you know maybe to wrap up this section in a slightly positive note
We have to remember that it ended up being quite important during the dictatorship
In terms of the survival of Basque language
Yeah
So they were able to preach in Basque at church
And people at least were able to sing always in Basque in church
As long as it had to do with church, right?
Yeah
So and you know, it wasn't all bad let's say
Okay
And the reason I asked Douglas to go into that is because you know this story
If you haven't listened to part one
The Catholic Church is very large in this story and
One of the protagonists
Yeah
All right, well we're going to conclude the story today of the death of Irene Garza
When we left off, Irene Garza had gone missing after attending confession on April 16th, 1960
The Saturday before Easter Sunday at the Sacred Heart Church in McAllen, Texas
Her body was discovered floating in an irrigation canal in the outskirts of town six days later
Yeah, terrible
It was clearly a murder and it appeared as though she'd also been sexually assaulted
But now I'm going to take a little turn
So now let's go to Edenbert, Texas
Okay
A small town 12 miles from McAllen at another Catholic Church also called Sacred Heart
Oh my gosh, I'm holding on to my chapella already
Okay, so it's March 23rd, 1960
Three weeks before Irene was killed
And a 20-year-old college student by the name of Maria America Guerra
Wow, that's a cool name
Right
She went into the church
I mean for those anglophones listening, guerra means war
War, right
Yeah
It's a
America Guerra, right
Yeah, it's a surname in Portuguese as well
But like the whole name is pretty cool
All right, so she went into the church
She must have been there for some quiet time or she just wanted to pray because it was virtually empty
when she knelt down in one of the pews near the front of the church
I say virtually empty because she did notice a young man with dark hair and horn-rimmed glasses sitting alone in one of the back pews
What was it, the 40s or 50s again? I forget
1960
60s, very 60s
Yeah, the horn-rimmed glasses
Yeah
She thought this was the same man she had seen earlier that afternoon
She'd caught him watching her in the parking lot from his blue and white sedan
Torji
Mm-hmm
She dismissed any creepy vibes she was getting because she assured herself she was in the house of God
Sorry, I'm still shocked by the blue and white sedan
It's like again, 60s, no?
Yeah
Hilarious
So Maria went up to the altar, knelt at the communion rail and began to pray the rosary
Seconds into her rosary, she felt someone grab her from behind who was trying to put a damp rag over her mouth
Oh my gosh, yuck
She screamed and fell backward and as she struggled with her attacker, she realized it was the man from the back of the church
He tried to muffle her screams by putting his hands over her mouth, but she fought him and bit down on his fingers drawing blood
Good girl
Angered, he threw her into a wall and she took this opportunity to escape
So she ran out of a side door crying and screaming for help
Poor thing
She went to the police to report this attack and what she felt was an attempt at a sexual assault
Mm-hmm
While being interviewed for her sworn statement to investigators, Maria felt ashamed to admit to them that she thought her attacker might have been a priest
Oh wow
Yeah
He was wearing the black pants the priest wore and it was just her general impression of him
Mm-hmm
Maria's case stalled until the murder of Irene at another church piqued their interest
Yeah, 16 kilometers away, oh sorry, miles
12 kilometers away, or 12 miles away
Maybe I was right in kilometers
Miles
So maybe, yeah, who knows, I didn't do the math
No, I wasn't either, I was just a misremembered
Not only did the two cases coincide at a Catholic church, but a priest with dark hair and horn-rimmed glasses came forward to claim the slide viewer they'd found in the canal where Irene's body was dumped
The glasses
Yeah
I want him to look at his hand now
Yeah
The investigators now started to think that the two cases might be linked
Whispers around McAllen and Edenburg among townsfolk were also pinning both crimes on a priest, but everyone involved in both the rumor mill around town, or sorry, the rumor mill around town, and within the police department couldn't bring themselves to imagine that a man of God could possibly be the culprit
A friend of Irene's who attended mass after her funeral said, quote, the feeling was that if you wanted to remain Catholic you better not discuss it, end quote
In fact, at that very mass the parishioners were sternly warned to not, quote, bear witness against any member of the clergy
She went on to add that, quote, the priest at Our Lady of Sorrows said he knew that rumors were going around about a priest being involved in Irene's murder
He told us it is impossible that a priest would commit a crime like this, don't speak of it, don't even let yourselves think it
That's so bullying
Well, yeah, it's horrible
Totally
Yeah, because, yeah
Totally, it's like, no, no, no, don't even talk about it, don't even think about it
If you want to maintain like an authoritarian hold on a community you also don't want them to talk, bad against the hierarchy, right?
Very good point, very good point, that's exactly what they are, right?
Instead of the, I mean, I'm not a Christian so my interpretation of it is suspect at least, but you know, definitely the Protestant
It's a way to maintain control, right?
Yeah, but like, yeah, from the beginning if you just look at the basis the Protestants are people who believe that you are allowed to read the Bible and decide what the word is saying
Whereas the Catholics rule is no, you don't interpret it, the priest interprets it
We interpret it, yeah
You just shut up and accept it
Yeah
Which is very, what was the word you used?
Authoritarian
Ouch
Okay, so, however, this did not stop the detectives on the case from doing their jobs and they began looking more closely at the town's newest member of the clergy
Ten points, detectives
Bueno, bueno
I mean, at least so far
You say that now, but just wait
At least so far
So, John Fite was a 27 year old priest who had just finished up his seminary training in San Antonio, Texas
They knew very little about him, but his name just kept popping up in their investigation
He'd come to the Rio Grande Valley for a year of pastoral training where he would perform communions and baptisms
He was described as polite, intelligent, and could easily perform his sermons in fluent Spanish
Oh
But to the parishioners at the Sacred Heart, he came across as a bit standoffish and as someone who kept to himself
This was in stark contrast to the assistant pastor, Father Joseph O'Brien, who was warm and amiable and seemed to rather enjoy his duties at the church
Fite seemed quite ambivalent about his calling as a priest
When he was asked why he joined the priesthood, he said, quote, I just wanted to give it a try
Sounds like an American
No offense
None taken
I'm all for trying things
I'm not sure if I'm up for trying a Catholic church though
Let's give it a try
Hey, he's an adventurous soul
In the days following the disappearance of Irene, he, along with his fellow priests and parishioners present that Saturday night, were questioned by police
He was assisting the clergy that night, listening to confessions and taking part in the midnight mass
He admitted to speaking privately with Irene in the rectory, claiming that she had wanted to take confession in a more private setting
The other priests viewed this conduct as rather inappropriate
Several churchgoers recalled that Fite's confessional line was very slow going and that he seemed to be absent for long periods of time
His fellow priests gathered after the midnight mass to have coffee and noticed that Fite had scratches on his hands and arms
Oh
In early May, they summoned John Fite for questioning
When asked about his slide viewer, or asked him about how his slide viewer ended up in the canal, he couldn't give them an explanation
So they questioned him about the night that Irene went missing
He gave them a rather meticulous account of his actions that night
He confirmed that he had gone to hear Irene's confession in private, but that he last saw her around 7.15 when they both left the rectory
He then said that he spent the rest of the evening hearing confessions and returning to the rectory twice to smoke cigarettes
Nice
Yeah, a brief spec in the day
There's a few photos of him with cigarettes in his hand
Oh, really?
Yeah
He went on to say that his glasses broke at some point because he had a habit of fiddling with them while listening to confessions
So he left again to retrieve his other pair back at his residence, which was at the Pastoral House of the Oblate Fathers, five miles away in San Juan
As for the scratches on his arms and hands, he explained this away by saying that when he arrived, he found himself locked out
So he had to climb up the wall to a second-story balcony by propping a wooden barricade against the building
Oh my gosh
He said it was then that he scratched up his arms and hands and received an even deeper cut on his index and middle finger from the bricks on the building
He's not used bricks very much in his life, has he?
He's usually scratchy
He's climbing a wall
He don't fricking cut you, he's scratchy
He told police that he'd been troubled after finding out that the woman he'd taken to the rectory for confession had gone missing
Easter Sunday was a busy day for him. He'd performed two masses that morning and another in the late afternoon, followed by baptisms
When he returned to the rectory to retrieve his suit and collar, he ran into a priest who asked him if he would speak with Irene's parents, Josephina and Nicholas
They were desperate for information about their missing daughter and had heard that he was the priest who had heard her confession the night before
Oh my gosh, I mean, I already, he's guilty
And like to think of that situation, it's so cruel, right?
Their parents are talking to the killer of their daughter and he's just pretending to be a nice little boy
I mean, it's so fucked up, so fucked up
It gets worse
Oh my gosh
I don't have more chapella to hold on to
Yeah, hold on, hold on to that chapella tight
I need three chapella's right now
Jesus
So he told police, quote, they wanted to know if I had perhaps said anything which might have upset or disturbed their daughter
I replied in the negative, end quote
He claimed that he didn't return to his residence in San Juan after speaking with them
He said, quote, my talk with the girl's parents had disturbed me
Perhaps I had said something unintentionally that might have upset this girl
At any rate, it seemed that no one had seen or heard from her since she left the rectory that Saturday night since she talked to me
I was worried and drove around aimlessly for a while, end quote
As if, as if, he's trying to look for an escape
Alibi, alibi
You should have thought of that first
He doesn't listen to our podcast
No, there was no True Crime podcast back in the day, 1960s
Fait was given a series of polygraph tests and initially the McAllen police said that he had passed them
But it later came out that the results were inconclusive
They go back and forth whether that is believable or not, right?
Well, yeah, it can't be used in court because it's not concrete evidence
Because it could be someone's...
It's basically measuring your blood pressure and stuff
So you could just be nervous because you're talking to the cops
The investigation hit many roadblocks
Particularly because their main suspect was a man of the cloth in a deeply Catholic community
And Fait knew it
One US Border Patrol agent, Harry Cecil, questioned Fait about the murder for 12 hours
Fait told him, quote, you'll never convict me of anything, end quote
Oh my gosh, no, he's bragging about it
What a dick
Yeah
When Irene's parents became frustrated by the lack of progress in the case
They confronted the priests at the Sacred Heart Church where they were told by Father O'Brien
That if Fait had done anything wrong, the church would punish him
And that, quote, church punishment was greater than any sentence he would receive in court
Yeah, he'd be moved to another state
Poor boy, fucking dickheads, oh my gosh
So, McCallan's chief of police, Clint Moosey, believed Fait to be guilty of the murder
But he was transferred to an out-of-town precinct before completing the investigation
And the lead investigator on the case simply wouldn't believe that a priest could have committed such a crime
How far, how long after?
These are the months following
So, 34, 35 months, okay
So, shall we take a break here?
Sure, let's do this, I mean, OMG
OMG
See you guys in a minute
We're back
So, you know, hitting a wall in the Irene Garza case
They brought Fait in again to ask him about his movements on the day that Maria was attacked in Niedenberg
Oh, yeah, good move
So, in his sworn statement, he admitted to being in the very church on the day that Maria was attacked
He's cocky now
He claimed that he had gone there to speak with a priest at the church's rectory before entering the church to kneel at a back pew to say his rosary
When asked about the car he was driving, he said it was a 1956 blue and white Ford sedan
Oh my gosh
He insisted that he had left Niedenberg at least an hour before Maria had been attacked because he needed to return to the Pastoral House in San Juan to ring the 530 bell
He had a job to do
Supposedly
Investigators had learned from other interviews that around this time Fait's finger had been badly cut
When asked about it, he said that on the day before going to Niedenberg, he had gotten it caught in a mimeograph machine
Mime? What does that again?
I had to look it up myself
Thank you
Thank you for asking because I thought Douglas is probably going to ask me what the hell a mimeograph machine is
So it's like a way of doing like quick printing
It's like quick printing press
Right
Sort of thing
You could put like a stenciling type thing machine where you have to have the rollers like slide out whatever you want
I remember what it is
My aunt used to use that
It mines whatever you want to graph onto something
To make pamphlets and shit
Yeah
Okay, so detectives went to check on Fait's alibis on the day in question
Several priests interviewed told them that Father Fait had not returned on time to ring the 530 bell
And that his finger wasn't injured until after the night of Maria's attack
Remember she bit his fucking finger
Yeah, at least these priests are not lying out their elbows like they would normally
Yeah
Good to hear
In addition, they corroborated Maria's description of the clothing he was wearing
As did another witness who had seen the attacker fleeing the church
Oh, the pieces are getting together
All falling into place
So good, so good
When detectives brought Maria and the eyewitness in to see if they could pick the assailant out of a police lineup
They both chose John Fait out of a lineup
So it was the girl who was attacked and who else?
And then the witness that saw the attacker fleeing the church
Fleeing, oh, excellent
Yeah
So probably saw Maria run out screaming and like what, what's going on there?
And then saw him run out
And get into his blue and white sedan and drive away
I can picture one of these crazy things with like the fins at the back
Yeah
And the pointy red lights
Those are cool cars though
They look gorgeous to me
Those cars from the 60s, yeah
On August 10th, 1961, the Hidalgo County grand jury indicted John Fait for the assault with the intent to rape Maria Guerra
Good
But when they went to the headquarters of the Oblates of Mary Immaculate
There's lots of these names in here, right?
Sure, I mean
To inquire as to his whereabouts, you know, to arrest him
They were told by church officials that he had left the state and they declared him a fugitive
What?
He did, however, surrender himself weeks later, stating that he'd been hospitalized after having suffered from a nervous breakdown
Brought on by all the police interrogations
Poor baby
Well, he's going to try out jail soon
See how that feels as opposed to the Catholic Church
Hold on to your chapella, Douglas
Hold on to your chapella
Oh, oh
I can see the ending of this episode also being
Now he is a bishop in the Vatican, blah, blah, blah
Okay, okay, I'm going to readjust my expectations
So, a fight went on trial on September 12th, 1961
This trial was declared a mistrial because the jury was deadlocked, nine to three, in favor of conviction
So, sidebar, okay?
Yeah, why the fuck do we not just kill these last three people?
Nope, you have to have the unanimous
They have to have the unanimous, that's ridiculous
So this is my sidebar, so comparison to the American judicial system and that of Spain
Okay
I learned from my legal consultant and friend of the pod, Gisela
Hi, Gisela, if you're listening
Yeah
That the juries in Spain are made up of nine members and two alternates
In order to convict on a guilty verdict, you need a seven to nine vote
So, a majority
Seven out of nine
Yep
Not two nine, no
But on a non-guilty verdict, which I guess they make a difference between, the verdict, it has to be five to nine
So, if you're
Five out of nine
Yes
Five to nine seems like it's five votes against nine votes
Five voting in one way, nine, out of the nine
Yeah, yeah
Out of nine
You say it in a weird way
Sorry
So, in the American system, you're declared guilty or not guilty, right?
And in the verdict, and it must be unanimous among all jury members
Okay, wow
If it's not, it's a mistrial, so they have to try it again
Oh my gosh
They have to do the whole trial all over again
It just smells like another waste of money
The US is great at that, eh?
They're good at spending money, yeah
Yeah, that's what they're doing
Okay, I didn't work
Let's try it again
Let's do it again
All right
Pun intended
So, in the case of our priest, he received a mistrial as the verdict wasn't unanimous
And rather than face another criminal trial, on March 28th, 1962, while in his black priest habit, Father Fite pled no contest
So, what is a no contest plea, you might ask
Yeah, I mean, I've never heard of that
I'll tell you
I mean, I'll read you the official definition from Wikipedia
Let's go
So, a no contest plea is also known as a no lo contendere plea
Which is one in which the defendant does not admit guilt but accepts punishment as if they had pled guilty
This type of plea is often used when the defendant wants to avoid a lengthy trial or a public admission of guilt
So, basically, it's like, do you have enough evidence to convict me?
Sure
And I am not able to fight it
Okay, so his plea of no contest was to the reduced charges of aggravated assault
And his defense stressed that in taking this deal, it was by no means an admission of guilt
So, it was only related to Maria Guerra
Yeah
That's terrible
Yeah, that's what the trial was about, was this attack on Maria Guerra
So, what, like, that's nothing, like what, like a few months in jail?
So, no, what do you think happened to him?
Community service
No, not even that
Not even?
Not even that
What?
He walked away with a $500 fine
So, $500, what do you think it is today? I want you to guess
A laptop
But in dollars, give me in dollars
A good laptop, let's say $3,000
$5,000
It's a better laptop but it's still a laptop
Yeah
Fucking bastards
I know
Sorry
When the court asked if he had anything to say, he said, quote, nothing
And he even claimed that he hadn't understood what he had pleaded to
He understood it
I'm assuming that the church paid his fine
But, you know, I could
On top of that
No, no, no, I don't have
This is my own assumption
No, you're probably right
You're probably right
Because I couldn't find any information to find, to confirm that, either way
But, you know, he's a priest, so what money is he earning? He's not earning money
He doesn't have money
I'm sure you do
I don't think you earn money
You get a salary
Do you think? I don't know, do you think?
As far as I know, yeah
Like, how do you go get a coffee?
They have little Pope cards
Well, they probably give you like a stipend, or I don't know
Exactly, that's a salary
Okay
Right?
I guess so
Like a minimum living, what is it, like
Yeah, I guess he had to put gasoline in his
Exactly
His blue and white sedan
Yeah
So, maybe, yeah
I can just imagine this, like, white credit card
It says Pope in front of it and just pays for everything
It's got a picture of the Pope on it
Yeah, yeah
Do you accept
You accept God? Yeah, pay for it
Boom, boom, cha-ching, cha-ching
No offense to all the believing Catholics
I believe it's beautiful
That's a given
And goodness is lovely
But the institution is a bit fucked up
Agreed
Sorry to say
So, yeah, I'm assuming they paid for it
Because, you know, we know the Church has a history of taking their, you know, taking care of their own
To avoid any public, you know, bad publicity
Oh, yes, oh, yes
So, this very conduct by the Church will lead us into the next part of our story that I'll tell you about
Okay
So, post John Fite's conviction for the assault on Maria Guerra
The Church stepped in to, quote, handle this problem with one of their priests
What do you think they did?
Transfer
They normally do, boom, you guessed it
I got that, like, I guessed that 10 minutes ago
Yeah
So, Fite was sent to the Trappist Monastery, New Malory Abbey in Dubuque, Iowa
And then on to the Assumption Abbey, another Trappist Monastery in Ava, Missouri
Oh, he didn't last long
A monk at this last abbey by the name of Dale Takney was assigned to counsel Fite about all his misdeeds in Texas
And to determine whether or not Fite would be fit for the life as a monk
Fit for a life as a monk
Oh, I think they're definitely going to approve him
How am I to believe in those institutions?
After some months of counseling with Takney, Fite found that the lifestyle of a monk was not to his liking
Oh
So, in 1966 he was sent to a treatment retreat for troubled priests in Jemez Springs, New Mexico
I hope there's no population around them
This center was run by the servants of the Paraclete
And after his quote treatment, he ended up joining the order as a staff member and working his way up to a supervisory role
Oh my gosh
So, in this position he was to supervise sexually abusive priests and to determine when they were fit to be placed back into contact with children
So, one sexual predator deciding the fitness of another sexual predator
Okay, now I have the perfect
Now your chapella is flying into the atmosphere
It's in pink flames
It's becoming a supernova
Alright, so one of these troubled priests that John released and deemed fit was a priest who had been caught sexually abusing children starting in the 1960s in Massachusetts
A one father, James Porter
John Fite, in his supervisory role, cleared him for placement at least four times in New Mexico parishes
And Porter was sent back to the treatment center each time because he'd been abusing boys
Mostly Hispanic boys, aged 7 to 10
That is sick
Like the fact, even just the fact that the Catholic Church has a position for a guy
And that this guy came from, oh sorry, go ahead
Yeah, you know, to assess whether it's okay to put abusive priests back into the community
I know
It's like, yeah
I know
You know, I mention their race because it probably makes them more vulnerable, right?
Because they're less likely to be taken seriously
Yeah
They went to police
And maybe language issues
Yeah
A lot of, yeah
So, Porter, having been sent back four separate times, is then moved on to Houston, where he continues to be a predator in another parish
After being cleared over and over again to serve in various parishes around the country, this priest was finally arrested 20 years later
20 years later
He pleaded guilty to abusing 28 children and received a sentence of 18 to 20 years in prison
He later admitted to having abused more than 100 children
There were two contradictory statements from Fite concerning James Porter in letters to Porter's home diocese
In one he laments that Porter had, quote, lapsed into his former failings
But in another he wrote, there's been no occurrence of the problem that plagued Father Porter in the past
So he was just all over the place in his, you know, his analysis of whether or not he was fit, right?
Yeah
The head of the servants of Pericleat at the time claimed to be shocked, absolutely shocked, that a priest with a criminal past of sexual misconduct was put in the position to make decisions about priests concerning the very same crime
So do you think they were really shocked?
No
I also don't think they were very shocked
I don't understand the word shocked
They're using it incorrectly
Like
Using the word incorrectly
Yeah
Okay, so in the 1970s, John Fite left the priesthood for good
He married a woman he'd met in New Mexico and had three children
He held several jobs in Chicago before moving and settling in Phoenix, Arizona where his brother was a pastor at the St. Teresa Church
He became the director of volunteers for the Society of Vincent de Paul, becoming an advocate for the poor
He once said of the homeless, quote, many can't fend for themselves, most are in pitiful shape, hundreds need help and few are getting it, end quote
The director of the St. Vincent de Paul Society in Phoenix said that, quote, John went beyond what anyone would remotely imagine a man doing
He truly lived his beliefs and his passion motivated many others to do more than they otherwise would have done, end quote
Yes
It was even reported that at one point a colleague of his was experiencing financial difficulties and John requested that his own salary be reduced so that this money could be given to his co-worker
In 2002, John Fite retired but continued to dedicate his time to helping the poor
He established the Just Faith Program to assist other Catholics in putting their faith into action for social causes
Locally, he had a reputation as a faith-driven and compassionate man
At one point, the publication Arizona Republic asked him to comment on the revelations concerning the sexual abuse cover-ups, sexual abuse and cover-ups within the Catholic Church
The outrage from the public had prompted the American bishops to change tactics and that from then on all future cases would be turned over to the civil authorities
Do you know that you have an approximate year for this?
2002 when he retired so it must have been around that time
Fite stated about this
It's four years later already
He stated, it has to be that way. It means that if someone's doing something wrong, they're above the law simply because they're an ordained minister
Well, this would come back to haunt him
Okay
So, shall we take a break?
Yes, I'm looking forward to the haunting
Okay, we're back
Alright, so in April of 2002, a call came in to the Homicide Division of the San Antonio Police Department
The man on the line was one Dale Takney
He'd been struggling for some years at this point with a question of conscience
And he could no longer keep it to himself
Takney was a former priest living in Oklahoma City
He told Detective George Sadler that he had information about a murder that had occurred in the 1960s
He explained that he had left the priesthood a long time ago, but that when he was living at a Trappist monastery in Ava, Missouri in 1963, he was tasked with counseling another priest by the name of John Fite
Who'd come from San Antonio
He said, quote, he told me that he had attacked a young woman in a parish on Easter weekend and murdered her
What the fuck
Detective Sadler was skeptical of what he was hearing, but the caller was insistent
So Sadler requested that Takney put everything that he remembered in writing, took his number, and told him that they would get back to him when they had something
He read and re-read the letter from the ex-priest, but couldn't make sense of it
The priest took her to the parish house to hear her confession
After hearing her confession, he assaulted her, bound her, gagged her
And like a good detective, he scrutinized hundreds of old newspaper articles from the 60s and the very few police records that had survived from that time
But he could find no murders that matched the details from the letter
And as he had a backlog of over a hundred, no, fourteen hundred unsolved murders to investigate in San Antonio, he soon forgot about the phone call and the letter and moved on to other cases
Man
AI, where is AI when we need it?
So that was in April, right?
April 22, 2002
2002
His poor family is freaking languishing for 40 years
Sorry, just had to pop that into them
In early November of that year, Texas Ranger Rocky Millican
Love that name, right Rocky?
That's a good one
He stopped by Sadler's office to collect some evidence for a case he was working on
They discussed the case he was working on and while chatting, Millican, or Rocky, he mentioned that the Texas Rangers newly established cold case unit had been very busy as of late
He commented to Sadler how incredible he found it to be that some of the cases were so old
He said, quote, They've got one out of the valley that dates all the way back to 1960
Millican was murdered on Easter weekend and the main suspect was a priest
Ten points, he got the necessary information, well done
Sadler was shocked by what he was hearing and pressed Rocky for more details
So Millican, or Rocky, relayed all of what he knew about the case and told the detective that he should confer with the detective in charge of the case
Rudy Jaramillo is how they pronounce it here, but perhaps it's Jaramillo
In America
I guess so, yeah
Jaramillo
So, Jaramillo, I don't know how I should pronounce it
Great surname, I'm loving it, it's not Basque, but it's great fun
So he was one of eight detectives on the Texas Ranger cold case unit
And in the spring of that year when Sadler had received the call from Dale Takney, he had just started reinvestigating Irene Garza's murder at the request of the McAllen Police Department
Jaramillo, or Jaramillo, and Sadler happened to live in the very same small town outside of San Antonio, Texas
The two had never met, but they met up that evening, compared notes, and realized their two investigations were one and the same
Oh wow
So
That's so many coincidences
Right, like this is the only reason
Just take forty fucking years
Chances, just chances
Better late than never I suppose
It seems Jaramillo had also hit a wall on the case
DNA testing of Irene's clothes turned up nothing new, and nearly all of the original detectives and people with any knowledge of the case had since died
giving him no one to re-interview
He did find that the 1960 case was meticulously documented, but when it came to bringing the case to be tried, they couldn't answer the most basic questions that a jury would have
For example, where was she murdered? What was she killed with? When was her body dumped?
But that is until Dale Takney came forward
Oh
Jaramillo had reopened the case in the spring of 2002, and was pleased to find that Father O'Brien, who was at the church working with Fite on the night Irene went missing, was still alive and living in a retirement facility
O'Brien had given an interview on TV in 2000, where he claimed that he knew nothing about Irene's murder
But when Jaramillo went to interview him again in 2002, he admitted that in the summer of 1960, he confronted Fite about his involvement in Irene's death, having suspected him from the start
Fite confessed to him that he had murdered her
So now we have two priests with confessions from Fite
Now he's an enabler because he's covered it up for so many years
They contacted Fite. They informed him that the case had been reopened, and asked him if there was anything else he'd like to share with law enforcement
Anything that someone who was there the night she disappeared would want the police to know
He simply replied, quote, that man doesn't exist anymore
Oh, how convenient
So the DA of Hidalgo County, René Guerra, would be the one who would decide if the case could be tried in court
So the DA is the district attorney, and they are the ones that decide which cases go to court
They're going to be heard, yeah
So he had held his position as DA from the 1980s to 2014, so that was how long his stretch was as the DA
1980s to 2014
So this is in 2002, right?
So when investigators brought the case to him, he declined to convene a grand jury
The grand jury would decide if there was enough evidence to indict John Fite
His reasoning was that he didn't find the new witness Dale Takney credible
And that there was a lack of physical evidence connecting him to the crime
He believed the case was unsolvable and was quoted as saying at the time, quote, her killer got away
Where are you going to find the evidence? I reviewed the file some years back, there was nothing there
Can it be solved? Well, I guess if you believe pigs can fly, anything is possible
Why would anyone be haunted by her death? She died, her killer got away
What the fuck telling her freaking family that? Why would they be haunted? That is so callous
I know
I mean
Yeah, he sounds like a real dick
Totally, totally
Linda de la Vina, a cousin of Irene Garza, pushed Guerra to indict and prosecute Fite for her cousin's death
Good
She reported that he put his finger in her face and screamed at her, you'll never get an indictment, you'll get one when pigs fly
Let's start
To the family
Let's start taking some, I mean, yeah
So to the family interface and yelling at her with his finger in her face
I mean, rude, callous, I mean, yeah
So he would not budge, despite the fact that there were new witnesses and some physical evidence
So you remember the slide viewer they found in the canal that belonged to Fite
And of course a ton of circumstantial evidence
Yeah
Right
So in March of 2004, he finally relented
Irene's family and friends had held a vigil in front of the courthouse
The media and the public in general placed enormous pressure on the DA
And law enforcement insisted they had enough to convict Fite
What it took them to organize vigils and freaking protests to get justice
That is
Yeah
It's not even to get justice
It's to get justice to hear the freaking case
It's not even, yeah
I mean, hey, we don't live in a fair world, as they say
Yeah
So Guerra relented and asked two of his prosecutors to present the evidence to a grand jury over the course of 15 weeks
So grand juries, I'm going to tell you about that
Go for it
From Wikipedia
Grand juries are composed of 16 to 23 members
And that 12 members must concur in an indictment
So 12 out of those 16 to 23
Okay, so that's a grand jury
And the previous one is a normal jury
They have enough to take it to court
A jury is the one that would sit on the case at trial
Oh, really
So grand juries, they call them together to go, here's the evidence we have
Is this enough to take it to court?
So that's how many out of 16?
So it's 16 to 23 is the numbers
And 12 of those members must concur for an indictment
Okay, so then after it has to be unanimous, but not the grand jury beforehand
Yeah, no
Under federal law, a grand jury must be randomly selected from a fair cross section of the community
In the location where the grand jury will convene
The names of potential jurors are drawn at random from a list of voters
The people whose names were chosen, unless exempt or excused, must appear before the court
The judge will then direct the selection of the 23 qualified people who will become the final jury
So that's how they create these grand juries
So, many following the case found the proceedings of the grand jury to be odd
Oh my gosh
Law enforcement wasn't called to testify until the 11th week
So there were 15 weeks getting together
And not until the 11th week did law enforcement come forward to show what evidence they had against FITE
Like the slide viewer
Where's the rest of the evidence coming from?
The car tracks, you know, all the other evidence they found
That's ridiculous already
Or all the circumstances shared about he was the one that was last seen with her, etc.
And then the two main witnesses who had confessions from FITE, Dale Takney and Father O'Brien, weren't even called to testify at all
The only witness from Sacred Heart Church from the night she disappeared that was called to testify was Elena Sanchez
She was the church's secretary and she was a witness for the defense in John FITE's criminal sexual assault case
So she was there on behalf of his defense
And that was the only witness they called to talk about
So who decided this would be the public prosecutor, right?
The district attorney
Oh, it was the Dixie's attorney who decided that
Yeah, he's the one that would send his prosecutors to present evidence to the grand jury
So he's in charge of what they're presenting, right?
What the prosecution side would present against FITE
I thought he would just decide if it would be heard or not
That's just too much power for this guy
And of course, strangest of all is that John FITE himself was never even subpoenaed to appear in front of the grand jury
So he was never indicted and the police closed the case again
A very good expression for this in the Basque Country is me cago en la ostia
Explain to our listeners what la ostia is
Do we really need to go there?
But what is la ostia? I love that that is a curse word
It is great
Because it is very linked to the Catholic Church, right?
Totally
So what is la ostia?
And this is very Basque, it's a very Basque swear word
It's like when you say it, people think you're from Bobo
Oh really?
Yeah, yeah, it's not like...
Oh, I didn't know, it wasn't widespread
No, no, no
So like in Quebec where there's a lot of swearing related to the Catholic Church
This one literally means I'm shitting on the Holy Host
The Host, yeah
Which is the body of Christ
When you take communion
So saying what the F, you say I'm shitting on the Hosts
Which is... yeah, I mean it's a crazy image when you think about it
Which you're not supposed to do
You're just supposed to say it and express disgust and horror
Yeah, and ostia can be used too to be like an exclamation of shock or like...
Like fuck!
Ostia, ostia, or like surprise or...
So you just yell host
Yeah, and it can be either ostia or ostias
Ostias, yeah, plural
Yeah, yeah
Okay, so when media organizations asked to see the investigative file
Good, good, good
You know, behind the evidence they presented
Guerra threatened to prosecute McAllen Police Chief Victor Rodriguez if he revealed the material
Stating, quote, there are some things that have to be kept secret that just cannot be put into print, end quote
But that material did find its way into the hands of the media
Ten points, American media, for once
And reporters contacted Takni and O'Brien forcing Guerra to respond
He said that he felt both men were unreliable witnesses about the two priests
Despite not having interviewed them himself
He dismissed O'Brien on the grounds that he had a delicate mental and physical state
And as for Takni, he believed that he might have, quote, an axe to grind with the church
And was just seeking a book deal
Oh really? Is that what happened? He wanted a book deal
He went on to say that the Texas Rangers had basically fed these two men all the information they needed to make out their statements
Wow, this guy
When asked why Fite wasn't called before the grand jury, Guerra replied, if I make him a target, he's got the right to tell me to go to hell
So it seemed that many of the participants in the case were hung up on what it would mean for them to go after a man who represented their faith
Much like when Irene was killed back in 1960, they just couldn't bring themselves to get between their faith and the demands of justice
Guerra said at the time, quote, if John Fite did this, I hope he will atone for his sin
And as to Irene Garza, he said, quote, I think if she died leaving the church after confession, that she died in a state of grace
And she should be in heaven as I believe in God
Well, even Garza's sister, Josie Cavazos, so she must have married him in 2002
She did not want the murder case to be investigated or the killer apprehended
She said, quote, I feel like that's between the person who murdered my sister and God
If he's asked God for forgiveness, he's going to heaven just as much as anyone else
So what's the point in all this? The Lord takes care of all things
She added that, quote, it was my parents wish as well as mine that the person who did this asked for forgiveness
Because we don't want him to be damned for eternity
We want him to go to heaven
That's her sister
I mean, it's a beautiful sentiment, I have to say
And it's a very...
Yeah, and it's like having to...
It's a very Christian sentiment
For like victims, like the family members of victims too, it's like such a horrendous thing to go through
Yeah, because 40 years with nothing, you kind of deal with it somehow
And then you're reliving it all over again
And that's a very fair attitude to have 40 years later
Make your peace with it, I guess
But other members of the Garza family, like the cousin that went after the DA, right?
Good, yeah, I like her
They reported that they had been chastised for seeking justice for Irene
And had been threatened, quote, if we were truly Christian, we should forgive and forget
Victims of clergy, sexual abuse were regularly told the same thing
That they should forgive and forget, as it says in the Bible
It's a perverse system
Another standstill, right?
Yeah
Again, it goes cold
Oh my gosh
Right, okay, ready?
Sure, I'm holding all my...
So, in 2014
14, Jesus
10 years later
A new DA, Ricardo Rodriguez, was elected in Hidalgo County
And during his campaign, he promised to look into the case of Irene's death
Oh, because now it's a media thing and everybody wants... nice
So he used it to his advantage to win the campaign and he is now the new DA
But also, I mean, you know, from a let's take five or ten steps back
It's, you know, just highlighting how important the media is a part of democracy
If we don't have the media, we don't really have democracy
It just falls and breaks
Agreed, agreed
So...
Journalists, we love you
We love you very, very much
You do great work
Shout out to all my journalist friends
And not friends
As in, let's include everybody
Yeah
So, look into the case he did
And in February of 2016
In Scottsdale, Arizona
John Fite, aged 83, was finally arrested and charged with the murder of Irene Garza
Okay?
Yeah
2016
So, the prosecutor in the case, Mike Garza, no relation to Irene
56 years later-ish
He said at the time, quote, there may be people who don't understand why an old man is being prosecuted
But make no mistake, this man is evil
He was a predator
He's a wolf in priest's clothing, looking to attack
By this time, Father O'Brien had since died in 2005
So, the prosecution's main witness for the details of the crime was Dale Takni
After much stalling by the defense for various reasons, like requests for change of venue, bond hearings to release Fite for health reasons, scheduling conflicts, blah, blah, blah
Fite finally went on trial November 28th of 2017
My gosh
Obviously, our biggest witness was Dale Takni
He was now 85 years old
Wow
He testified in court that in 1963, when he was a monk at the Trappist Monastery in Ava, Missouri, the abbot presented him with an unusual assignment
He was told that, quote, there's a priest who murdered a woman
What?
Who's in the guest house
He wants to become a monk
We're instructed to take him in
During his counseling of Fite, Takni said that Fite told him that he was bothered and made anxious by, quote, women with high heels who walked on hard floors, end quote
He also testified to Fite's confession of the murder of Irene, but without naming her
So, Fite never said her name
But he did so without showing any signs of remorse
Fite said that he, quote, had a sexual compulsion to attack women from behind, especially when he knelt behind them in church, end quote
Takni asked him why he wasn't in prison for this crime
And Fite replied that, quote, the church is behind me
Because the higher-ups didn't want the faithful to be scandalized by learning that a priest had murdered one of their flock
He then went on to detail what had happened to Irene
Fite told Takni that he convinced Irene to give her confession in the rectory
And after hearing it, he subdued her, took part of her clothes off from the waist up, and fondled her breasts
He then took her to the rectory basement, tied her up, and returned to the church to hear confessions
He returned to the rectory basement, retrieving her, and then moved her to his living quarters
So this is probably when he went back to his house
Yeah, he said he was going to get his glasses
To get his glasses
Mmm, bastards
The next day, Easter Sunday, he put her in the bathtub of his bathroom and placed a bag over her head
I think it was a plastic bag
As he left, he heard her saying, I can't breathe, I can't breathe
When he returned between the Easter services, because there was like two in the morning, one in the evening, she was dead
He put her in the car, and this is a quote from Dale, what he said to him
Patting her on the breast, telling her everything will be okay
Then he presumably dumped her body in the canal
Disgusting
Yeah
So Takni felt that women were safe as long as he was in the monastery
But when Fite decided that the life of a monk didn't suit him, his job at this point was to assist John in dealing with his impulses
To test this, he sent Fite on unsupervised visits to churches in Chicago and Missouri, telling him to kneel behind women to see if he felt the urge
Oh my gosh, I think our producer is going to explode
That is fucking ridiculous
I know
Fortunately for these women, Fite no longer had these impulses, or so he said
At least that's what he told Takni
And that was the end of the matter
So the Trappists could not keep Fite against his will, so when he said he didn't want to be a monk
So the Oblates sent Fite to Chemez Springs, to that treatment center, where he was to receive further treatment
And then went on to pursue his career as a supervisor at the center
Of people
Where he released pedophiles out to the world
Great system
Hey Catholic Church
So should we take another break here?
Quick little break
AYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAYAY
So we're back
Mm-hmm
That was Dale's testimony, right?
Yes
Another notable testimony in the trial came from a childhood friend of Garza's,
Anna Maria Hollingsworth, who testified about a time during Holy Week in 1960
when Garza spoke to her about the new priest at the church, John Fite. She said
to her, it's not the same going to confession anymore because I don't get
to stay in the confessional. He comes to pull me out and says, oh this place isn't
good enough for you. Let's go to the rectory where you'll be more comfortable.
How icky already. Sorry to say. And then they would walk off and go to the
rectory, Hollingsworth said. Another witness stated that she too had had a
creepy encounter with Fite in 1960. She was walking down the street when Fite
pulled up in his car and asked her if he could take pictures of her dressed in
black in the cemetery. She luckily declined. And if you see the photos of
these women they all have a look like he had a type. They all look very similar.
So Maria, the one that was attacked in the church, Irene, and then this woman. So he
had a type. Most damning of all, no pun intended, was the evidence presented at
his trial concerning the Catholic Church's involvement in covering up and
derailing law enforcement efforts in solving Irene's murder. Thomas Doyle, a
Catholic priest and expert on sexual abuse and church law, testified. He read
a letter in court recovered via subpoena from the Archdiocese of San Antonio,
dated August 1st, 1960. The letter sent between clergy officials Joseph
Wapaliki, these names, a pastor at the church at a church outside
Austin wrote to Lawrence Seidel, the head of the Oblates of Mary Immaculate, the
order to which Fite belonged. In it he expressed concerns that if a
priest was charged in Garza's death, Kennedy's presidential campaign and the
reelection chances of the local Catholic sheriff would be at stake.
What year was that? 1960. It was 60. So he was running for president. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
yeah, I know it's sad. And as a Catholic, Kennedy was like, yeah, was like a
Catholic. Yeah, was he the first? Yeah. But Biden's the second then? Yes. Okay.
In addition, he insisted that Seidel hire a private investigator to find quote
loopholes in Fite's case. This letter provided some clues as to why for decades
Fite's case went cold. Yeah, and so many others because if that's their modus
operandi. Mm-hmm. Thomas Doyle testified, quote, in my experience in the thousands
of documents I've studied, it's the first time I've seen an organized plan of
obfuscation, collusion, and cover-up played out step by step in coordination
with the civilian law enforcement. So shall I read the letter? Okay, I'll interrupt
if I have to. All right, dated August 1st, 1960. Father Seidel, last week I had the
opportunity of speaking with the sheriff about the case. His observations are not
only keen and based on much experience in such matters, but seem to be the
course we should follow. I gave this same set of observations to Bishop Reichter,
and he too is impressed with the saneness and practicality of the
sheriff's conclusions. After outlining to the sheriff the many facts I had
received from Father Nash, the sheriff is of the opinion that the case is quite
weak for the prosecution. He's also of the opinion that the prosecution must be
made to see just how weak their case is, lest they go off half-cocked and set the
wheels into motions that would bring this out in public print and give the
opponents of the Catholic Church a field day. He's also the opinion that the case
would be tried here and would not be judged by on logic, but on the prejudices
of the jury. There are also political implications to this that could make this
a juicy scandal for the opposition to Kennedy. And last of all, there are the
Masons whom the basic bishop feels smell a chance to hurt the church, just as the
H.E.B. Baptist paid for the prosecution of the priest in East Texas who was
killed by the lad he befriended. Don't know that story. What to do of all this?
First, the sheriff said that we should follow the idea of not hiring a lawyer
for the reasons given by Father Nash. Second, we should not put a detective on
the case hired by us, since that would mean he'd be snooping around,
re-questioning witnesses, and stirring up things again. However, he does feel that
we should hire a person, something like a first-class private detective, who would
be able to sit down with Father Nash and Father Pastor of McAllen to get all the
information on this case. Then let him write it up and present it on paper in
such a way as to highlight the loopholes that are so numerous in this case. Once
this is done, arrange a meeting with the police chief of McAllen, the prosecuting
attorney, and the sheriff, plus four priests. At this meeting, the whole
situation is brought out and the prosecution will be able to see how
strong the opposition is to their charges. They can also be brought to
realize in a nice way that the church will not be take this sitting down.
The sheriff does not want more than the number mentioned, and he
thinks that this will quiet things considerably. Once this is done, then
after three or four months, or even less if possible, have this young
man transferred to another part of the country as a normal obedience. He feels
that everyone knows that the priests are always being transferred around, so this
would not be strange. After some time in this new place, a year or two, then we
have him sent out to a foreign mission. The reason for this first move is to get
him out of the area of suspicion. If something happens, the officers of the
area will always be suspicious of him. The sheriff concludes that the longer
time we have, the weaker the case gets, and so he suggested all this forgoing.
He has much experience in such things, and I believe this is extremely
wise. He's also a Catholic, and he also stands to lose materially by such a
scandal here in such a non-Catholic area. You see? I feel that he has rendered us
in invaluable service. I submit these ideas after having consulted with
Bishop Reigter, who is also in agreement with this course. The bishop wishes to
see you, Father, at your convenience. Let me know if I can do anything in the
future to help this thing along. Your worries are ours, since we fight the same
evil one who has concocted this thing in his ceaseless fight against the church,
and to stop the good being done by your wonderful congregation. My prayers and
mass intentions are with you, Father. I'm sure our priests will pray hard for a
special intention mentioned as such to them." The way they talk. Father Palbuci. He's
actually referring to the devil. Evil one, yeah. It's in capital letters. Wow.
Wow. All right, so the final testimony that I will mention in this case is that
of a former reporter who in 1962 was called to an off-the-record meeting
between reporters and the district attorney's office. In that meeting, the DA
said that they knew that Fite had killed Irene, and that they had struck a deal
with the church. In exchange for his no-contest plea in the Maria Guerra sexual
assault case, they would not prosecute him for Irene's murder, and that no one
in the community should be worried as Fite would be sent off to a monastery.
That sounded weird when you said it. Yeah. Cover up. Because like that's why we'd
never heard of this term, because it never happens. It was for
Kennedy. Was it worth it, Julie? I mean he did a lot of good things. On December 7th,
2017, Fite was convicted of Irene Garza's murder. During the sentencing phase of
the trial, Fite's lawyers requested probation, considering his lack of felony
convictions after Garza's death. The prosecution asked for a sentence of 57
years, symbolizing the period of time that had since passed since she was
killed. See, I like that. That's beautiful for me. On December 8th, 2017, the jury
did them one even better, giving Fite life in prison. I mean, he was 87. So 57 years he
wasn't likely to live. I would prefer him to give 57. He was incarcerated at the W.J. Estelle Unit, 10 miles or 16 kilometers north of Huntsville, Texas. He died of natural causes on February 12th, 2020. So in the 48 hours episode on this case that I watched, there's an amazing clip of Irene's cousin, Linda de La Vina, when she was leaving court after his
conviction. Go watch, go watch. She sounds like a cool girl. She was, you know, the one that continued to pressure the former DA, Rene Guerra, for an indictment on Fite. She's a hero. Back in the early 2000s. And he angrily pointed in her face, yelling, You'll never get an indictment. You'll get one when pigs fly. Well, pigs fly. So, Linda is being interviewed by TV reporters outside the courthouse, and she says, quote, After 57 years, we have found justice for Irene. And for today, pigs are flying.
And that's the end.
Yeah, it's beautiful.
All right. So Douglas, did you want to share any stories about Catholic cover-ups that you may have found?
Well, you kind of asked me to kind of, kind of contrast it with the best country, right?
Right.
A little bit.
Yeah.
And so scandals, Catholic Church, Spain.
Okay.
Right. That was my search.
Okay.
The result is from, this is a very long name for an association, the Federacion Espadañola de Asociacion de Profesionales de los Archivos, las Bibliotecas, los Centros de Documentación de Informacion de Interpretacion, los Museos y los Yacimientos Arqueológicos.
Oh my God.
And this place is called...
What a name.
Anabads.org.
Okay.
So anabads.org estimates, I had never heard of this before I came here.
And I think maybe you neither.
The kids that were taken from their parents and given new families by the Catholic Church when they were given birth in Catholic hospitals and things like that.
Mm hmm.
300,000 babies over, I'm not sure how many years, maybe 20.
Yeah.
And then the second story was very cute.
It was like, I don't like to give a lot of credit to Il País, but you know, it's a reasonable source of information.
And it was very cute kind of how they put it.
They were like, oh, you know, it was just a few, I'm sorry, I don't have a date here.
The thing is from 2023.
Okay.
But they were saying like, oh, initially we wanted to know how many cases of abuse, like sexual abuse, there were in a church.
And then they were like, so we contacted the Catholic Church.
To find out what the numbers they had.
Yep.
They admitted.
They were like zero, zero.
No, well, they admitted to four.
Four.
Yep.
And then they say we searched the internet or, you know, they didn't quite say that.
We're like on a first initial search, we found 34 cases.
Oh God.
Right.
And then they have a list going and right now there are 1027 accused.
Accused.
Yeah.
With 2000, well, basically 2200.
When did they start taking these stats?
Anybody who's alive, Julie.
Anybody who's alive, basically.
I mean, no, not.
Like starting from when to when have they come up with like 2000 cases?
2000 victims.
Right.
From 1027 accused people and it just goes, any case they can find.
Okay.
Any case.
Documented case.
In Spain.
That's what their, you know, outlook was.
So I'm going to say they're very powerful.
And I'm going to say they fucked up a lot of lights.
That's all I'm going to say.
So yeah, pretty powerful.
Yeah.
I mean, even researching a cheeky so one time I came across the story about a priest who
got moved around to different schools.
Yeah.
Here in Vizcaya.
Oh my gosh.
Yeah.
It's already smelling bad.
Yeah.
I hope all of our listeners enjoyed.
Yeah.
And yeah, contact us at crimes of the Basque lands, gmail.com.
If you want to give us like story ideas or just send us an email.
Yeah.
Little like smiley faces or mini crime times.
We would love that.
And see you next time.
Yes.
So we bid you a good.
Good.
Crimes of the Basque lands is written and produced by Douglas de Carvalho, Julie Garcia,
and Megan Dooley.
The sound and editing for each episode by Douglas de Carvalho.
I'm Megan Dooley.
Theme song written by.
Douglas de Carvalho.
Julie Garcia.
I'm Megan Dooley.
Sung by the choir with no name and produced by Tom Squires.
Podcast art by Distinct Signal.
Follow us on Instagram and Facebook at crimes of the Basque lands and contact us at crimes
of the Basque lands at gmail.com with story ideas worldwide which have a connection to
the Basque country or any rave reviews.
If you like our podcast, please subscribe, like, rate and review wherever you get your
podcasts.
Until next time.
Agur.