1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:29,000 This is Jimmy and Annette and we are excited to be with you today. 2 00:00:29,000 --> 00:00:34,280 Of course we always have our sidekick Chevy. Mr. Chevy and he is in true form 3 00:00:34,280 --> 00:00:38,480 right now, isn't he? He sure is. His eyes are absolutely closed. He saw me setting up the 4 00:00:38,480 --> 00:00:42,400 chairs and he went nuts. And we're doing this a little early. He's kind of 5 00:00:42,400 --> 00:00:48,520 confused. He is confused because what is today? What is today? It's Thursday. We normally 6 00:00:48,520 --> 00:00:53,200 do our podcast on Mondays. But we'll still air it on Monday. Of course Monday 7 00:00:53,200 --> 00:00:58,600 evening. Monday PM like always. But anyway. We have a special guest. We do. So the 8 00:00:58,600 --> 00:01:02,920 reason we're doing this early is we have a very special guest. And we've mentioned 9 00:01:02,920 --> 00:01:07,800 Pastor Chris who is our son who pastors a great church in Houston called City 10 00:01:07,800 --> 00:01:14,040 Life Church. And he and our youngest Jackson. Youngest grandson. Youngest 11 00:01:14,040 --> 00:01:17,040 grandchild. Yeah I know y'all can't believe we have grandkids but we 12 00:01:17,040 --> 00:01:21,240 actually do. And he's here as well and we've got him visiting the other room. 13 00:01:21,240 --> 00:01:26,360 We may hear from him later in the show. We'll see. But if he does that's great. So 14 00:01:26,360 --> 00:01:29,800 it's great to have Chris with us. He pastors a great church. City Life Church. 15 00:01:29,800 --> 00:01:37,080 And they're knocking it out in Houston, Texas. Been there 13 short years. Brief 16 00:01:37,080 --> 00:01:41,200 years. Would you say short or would you say long? You know sometimes it feels 17 00:01:41,200 --> 00:01:47,000 longer and sometimes it feels shorter. It's weird. That is true. Yeah. So you're 18 00:01:47,000 --> 00:01:51,200 on sabbatical as well. We've been sharing the beginning of our sabbatical 19 00:01:51,200 --> 00:01:54,600 journey which we started on Monday. And now we've got him working. We have him working on his 20 00:01:54,600 --> 00:01:59,760 sabbatical. This isn't work. Oh okay. Okay. This is us having a conversation around the 21 00:01:59,760 --> 00:02:04,560 dinner table when Chris was 17. Oh okay. Well he's not 17 anymore. Usually work you get 22 00:02:04,560 --> 00:02:10,600 paid so it's not worth it. No doubt. No doubt. Well Chris thanks for being with us today. 23 00:02:10,600 --> 00:02:13,360 I'm glad to be here. We were hanging out and enjoying a great afternoon. 24 00:02:13,360 --> 00:02:18,000 Beautiful day here in the Texas Hill Country. And I had I thought let's just 25 00:02:18,000 --> 00:02:21,960 do a podcast today since Chris is here and let's have Chris on the show. So 26 00:02:21,960 --> 00:02:25,680 we're thrilled that you're here. Yeah glad to be here. How's your sabbatical going? 27 00:02:25,680 --> 00:02:29,320 We've been sharing our journey. We're gonna continue to do that over the next 28 00:02:29,320 --> 00:02:34,160 few weeks. So how's it going? Yeah I'm doing an eight week sabbatical as well. This is the first time 29 00:02:34,160 --> 00:02:39,240 I've ever done it. And I've been doing full-time ministry for almost 23 years. 30 00:02:39,240 --> 00:02:45,000 Almost as long as I've been married. And so yeah it's been it's been really 31 00:02:45,000 --> 00:02:50,480 great. I'm in week five right now. So you know it takes a good week, week and a 32 00:02:50,480 --> 00:02:56,400 half maybe to wind down. Get out of work mode so to speak. But yeah really 33 00:02:56,400 --> 00:03:01,320 enjoying it right now. And you know when you love what you do you don't you do 34 00:03:01,320 --> 00:03:06,480 miss it. So it's kind of it takes work to get out of work. Yeah a little bit. 35 00:03:06,480 --> 00:03:11,000 It took a lot of work to prepare for it. Yeah yeah to prepare for it and then to 36 00:03:11,000 --> 00:03:16,080 wind down and then to you know just make sure that your identity is not wrapped 37 00:03:16,080 --> 00:03:21,320 up in your work. And that's one of the best things about taking off I think. And 38 00:03:21,320 --> 00:03:26,040 so just trying to be a human being and not a human doing right. So one of our 39 00:03:26,040 --> 00:03:29,960 pastors that was helping us with our sabbatical said you've got to break the 40 00:03:29,960 --> 00:03:33,960 addiction of work. Sure. Because it can become an addiction and if it becomes an 41 00:03:33,960 --> 00:03:42,160 addiction it it's harder to to disconnect. Yeah. From work and so you're right. 42 00:03:42,160 --> 00:03:47,480 That's it's good. What you said is right on. So yeah yeah it's it's overdue for 43 00:03:47,480 --> 00:03:53,320 me but you always have that feeling of well I don't want to be looked at in a 44 00:03:53,320 --> 00:03:58,680 certain way or I don't want to not contribute. Like I know with my staff I'm 45 00:03:58,680 --> 00:04:02,880 like I feel bad that I'm not there helping out because they're there but 46 00:04:02,880 --> 00:04:07,400 then also what does that say about me? And wanted to make sure like no they 47 00:04:07,400 --> 00:04:11,840 could do without me. In fact it's better to empower them and and frankly I just 48 00:04:11,840 --> 00:04:17,320 needed need some rest and kind of let the ground just grow whatever grows 49 00:04:17,320 --> 00:04:21,840 instead of constantly going and going. Right. So well I did some reading and 50 00:04:21,840 --> 00:04:25,600 pastor Eddie Freeman from Getway Church who's been kind of coaching and mentoring 51 00:04:25,600 --> 00:04:32,480 us into this and helping our church as well. He pointed out the scriptures in 52 00:04:32,480 --> 00:04:36,480 the Old Testament. There's two scriptures that refer to a command from 53 00:04:36,480 --> 00:04:40,760 God that every seven years they would let the land rest and so there's that 54 00:04:40,760 --> 00:04:44,840 pattern of sevens. We see sevens all through scripture and then of course you 55 00:04:44,840 --> 00:04:49,400 know God worked six days rested on the seventh and then declared that Sabbath 56 00:04:49,400 --> 00:04:52,600 was going to be a day it's going to be holy it's the fourth commandment out of 57 00:04:52,600 --> 00:05:00,680 ten and so what our revelation was is that we had been violating Sabbath for 58 00:05:00,680 --> 00:05:06,920 years. Sure. Not taking a Sabbath not leaning into it and basically and when I 59 00:05:06,920 --> 00:05:11,680 say violating what I mean is we didn't receive the gift that God was trying to 60 00:05:11,680 --> 00:05:16,400 get to us and that's the gift of rest and recovery and restoration but the 61 00:05:16,400 --> 00:05:23,920 thought of taking eight weeks off really I struggled with that until I heard 62 00:05:23,920 --> 00:05:28,520 another pastor say it this way he says you're not taking a sabbatical you're 63 00:05:28,520 --> 00:05:32,880 receiving a sabbatical. That shifted my thinking about it we're not taking eight 64 00:05:32,880 --> 00:05:37,800 weeks off we're receiving the gift that God's put in front of us with gratitude 65 00:05:37,800 --> 00:05:43,920 with humility but also what what can what does God want to say to us during 66 00:05:43,920 --> 00:05:52,280 this time? Right. Is there pressure on that? Well there is but the thing the thing is is you do need to take some time off so you can hear from God 67 00:05:52,280 --> 00:05:58,360 because we go go go we're like a what do you call that? A hamster. A hamster yes 68 00:05:58,360 --> 00:06:03,760 that just is going on the wheel just continually going and we hardly stop 69 00:06:03,760 --> 00:06:08,320 because it's not just something we do physically it's our mind. That's right. And 70 00:06:08,320 --> 00:06:13,400 people you know there's needs our church has so many needs because people have 71 00:06:13,400 --> 00:06:19,040 needs and you feel obligated to return every text every call but there's a time 72 00:06:19,040 --> 00:06:27,640 when we need this they need us well we need to just unplug and rest and this is 73 00:06:27,640 --> 00:06:33,640 really it's really yesterday was our was it yesterday was our first really 74 00:06:33,640 --> 00:06:38,800 official day. Technically speaking because Monday is our Sabbath so that was kind of we always do Monday. And Tuesday was a 75 00:06:38,800 --> 00:06:43,040 holiday. It's my fourth which is a holiday so it really felt like yesterday was our 76 00:06:43,040 --> 00:06:48,720 first day to say we're engaging this. Right no work and that has been already 77 00:06:48,720 --> 00:06:54,680 difficult for me I'll just say so but I'm gonna get there I'm gonna get there 78 00:06:54,680 --> 00:07:00,480 it's just my mind you know is wondering what's going on at work you know has 79 00:07:00,480 --> 00:07:04,280 something happened that they need you know it's just one of those things it's 80 00:07:04,280 --> 00:07:10,040 just gonna happen. The analogy I heard and then actually saw like a YouTube 81 00:07:10,040 --> 00:07:14,520 video of a cruise ship that would that would come into port and they would 82 00:07:14,520 --> 00:07:18,640 every once in a while they have to raise it in order to clean the bottom of it 83 00:07:18,640 --> 00:07:21,560 because it's collected so much just from going and going it's just collected so 84 00:07:21,560 --> 00:07:25,400 much and so in order to take care of it it needs to be raised out of the water 85 00:07:25,400 --> 00:07:30,120 for a little bit so that they can scrub everything down and get all the 86 00:07:30,120 --> 00:07:35,000 barnacles yeah everything out and then it's ready to set sail again and that's 87 00:07:35,000 --> 00:07:39,400 I think that's a that was a good picture for me thinking about okay you know it's 88 00:07:39,400 --> 00:07:42,240 one thing to take a vacation and jump right back in but you're always thinking 89 00:07:42,240 --> 00:07:46,600 about what's coming up or the next plan or and being in the people business 90 00:07:46,600 --> 00:07:50,920 wanting to shepherd people well take care of people well you know if you 91 00:07:50,920 --> 00:07:55,920 don't have rhythms in your normal life you're gonna be in big big trouble but 92 00:07:55,920 --> 00:08:00,280 especially if you don't take these moments right that are gifts as you said 93 00:08:00,280 --> 00:08:03,280 to be able to take off and just get out of the water a little bit so we're 94 00:08:03,280 --> 00:08:06,720 getting the barnacles cleaned off of our hull so to speak and that's a great 95 00:08:06,720 --> 00:08:12,360 metaphor one of things pastor Eddie told our team he said that if pastor Jimmy 96 00:08:12,360 --> 00:08:17,520 and pastor Annette had not already been practicing Sabbath I would not even have 97 00:08:17,520 --> 00:08:22,480 considered going there on sabbatical yeah and he said he won't he won't coach 98 00:08:22,480 --> 00:08:26,680 pastor because he oversees a lot of pastors yeah he says I won't coach or 99 00:08:26,680 --> 00:08:31,760 mentor a pastor into a sabbatical unless they're already practicing Sabbath if 100 00:08:31,760 --> 00:08:36,720 they're not doing that we've got to back up a step and get that as an ongoing 101 00:08:36,720 --> 00:08:42,040 you know ritual yeah routine in their life a rhythm in their life the micro 102 00:08:42,040 --> 00:08:46,040 habits so you can have macro habits exactly there you go you're so smart 103 00:08:46,040 --> 00:08:52,280 good he's my son he's my son brilliant well words of Kevin York he's genius 104 00:08:52,280 --> 00:08:58,880 genius well if everybody's a genius so we can talk more about that but I also 105 00:08:58,880 --> 00:09:01,880 like to revisit a little bit and that night and you know this because you've 106 00:09:01,880 --> 00:09:06,080 actually listened some of the podcast and we've we've told our story along the 107 00:09:06,080 --> 00:09:09,880 way for one one of the things this is called living up in a down world by the 108 00:09:09,880 --> 00:09:12,920 way this is episode number 26 can you believe it 109 00:09:12,920 --> 00:09:17,160 Wow yeah I know it's crazy it's hard of going by really fast yeah so if you 110 00:09:17,160 --> 00:09:21,080 think about it that's literally six months that's half a year yeah 52 weeks 111 00:09:21,080 --> 00:09:25,880 we've done 26 here we are we're already down the road in this and loving it and 112 00:09:25,880 --> 00:09:29,600 we also love what we're hearing back from you and I'll share some of the some 113 00:09:29,600 --> 00:09:33,560 feedback a little bit later but so great to hear your comments to your emails 114 00:09:33,560 --> 00:09:37,240 thank you for the donations we'll share a little bit about that just to say 115 00:09:37,240 --> 00:09:41,580 thanks and always keep listening share with your friends that helps us get the 116 00:09:41,580 --> 00:09:45,960 word out that there's these two crazy people who love Jesus dramatically and 117 00:09:45,960 --> 00:09:52,520 and love each other and love each other even more hugely and for 30 years of 118 00:09:52,520 --> 00:09:57,440 wow that we've been going but we've talked about our story Chris along the 119 00:09:57,440 --> 00:10:00,840 way of course you're you're a massive piece of that story you're a great part 120 00:10:00,840 --> 00:10:05,920 of that story and so I want to share what it was like when you met Jimmy for 121 00:10:05,920 --> 00:10:09,320 the first time and I told you I was I was seeing him do you remember if you 122 00:10:09,320 --> 00:10:15,280 recall well how real are we gonna get here I remember the first time I met you 123 00:10:15,280 --> 00:10:22,560 too you had an emergency I had an extreme emergency so I was in seventh 124 00:10:22,560 --> 00:10:30,080 grade I believe and I just come away from a youth camp it might have been my 125 00:10:30,080 --> 00:10:35,540 first youth camp ever with Bunky yeah yeah after David Bond Claire pastor 126 00:10:35,540 --> 00:10:41,720 David Bonclair and went on a youth game it's a pretty big youth camp and I had 127 00:10:41,720 --> 00:10:46,560 just gotten back and you I called you to come pick me up and I had my bags and 128 00:10:46,560 --> 00:10:53,600 everything and the thing about seventh grade Chris was Chris did not like to 129 00:10:53,600 --> 00:10:59,160 use the restroom outside of his own private domain and so public restrooms 130 00:10:59,160 --> 00:11:10,040 or no no so I had held in about movement it was a different kind of movement I 131 00:11:10,040 --> 00:11:13,080 would have to go to the hospital if that happened to me okay yeah I don't know 132 00:11:13,080 --> 00:11:17,340 how I did it but you know what you can do a lot when you're in a lot of pain 133 00:11:17,340 --> 00:11:22,180 when I met I was so I called and said mom I need you to pick me up somebody's 134 00:11:22,180 --> 00:11:28,160 got to get me and you came and Jimmy was in the car with you and you're on your 135 00:11:28,160 --> 00:11:31,400 way to a date and if I you can correct me but if I remember correctly y'all 136 00:11:31,400 --> 00:11:38,020 were gonna go to Taco Villa how funny so I remember being in the back of the car 137 00:11:38,020 --> 00:11:42,760 or in the back seat and I'm just like mom I gotta go you know and so I'm like 138 00:11:42,760 --> 00:11:48,520 oh hi whatever your name is great great to meet you and you drop me off and I 139 00:11:48,520 --> 00:11:54,080 the rest is history but then you thought I was but you thought I was crazy 140 00:11:54,080 --> 00:11:59,240 because after about a couple of weeks I'm telling you I'm gonna marry this guy 141 00:11:59,240 --> 00:12:04,760 what were your thoughts after just a couple of weeks I mean you could be 142 00:12:04,760 --> 00:12:08,920 honest it's okay you know I don't have total recall so I don't remember my 143 00:12:08,920 --> 00:12:14,120 exact thoughts but the higher remember the whole process and the feeling was 144 00:12:14,120 --> 00:12:20,760 just like what is it what is going on this is quick no but I don't know it 145 00:12:20,760 --> 00:12:26,440 wasn't well I think it was fast but it wasn't like absurd necessarily I was 146 00:12:26,440 --> 00:12:30,680 just like oh yeah okay you're in the seventh grade I was pretty yeah we were 147 00:12:30,680 --> 00:12:36,200 pretty flexible and our you know we had been through a lot in that season I 148 00:12:36,200 --> 00:12:41,960 dated someone that was yeah cheating on me you know yeah and I warned you I told 149 00:12:41,960 --> 00:12:48,360 you not yes and then I did and I found out and then I'm I meet him weren't you 150 00:12:48,360 --> 00:12:55,000 a little Ronnie yes wow wow remember that he does remember he's 43 and still has a 151 00:12:55,000 --> 00:12:59,240 good memory some scars I remember I just didn't like memory yeah I did not like 152 00:12:59,240 --> 00:13:03,120 that guy something about it didn't you think the same thing could happen with 153 00:13:03,120 --> 00:13:07,800 Jimmy or did you automatically think no this seems like a good guy I didn't have 154 00:13:07,800 --> 00:13:14,120 the same vibes with Jimmy right away but most of the vibes I was feeling was 155 00:13:14,120 --> 00:13:19,880 your feeling I get me home now exactly so but I'll talk to him later but to be 156 00:13:19,880 --> 00:13:26,640 honest after that especially because of seeing that experience with that other 157 00:13:26,640 --> 00:13:31,840 guy I like Jimmy much better and I remember even telling Lisa like yeah 158 00:13:31,840 --> 00:13:38,400 this is a great guy and I would watch him take care of you yeah you saw and 159 00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:45,120 I'd never seen a man hold your door hold your hand like there was a genuine care 160 00:13:45,120 --> 00:13:52,960 and love and sensitivity and you know growing up with you as my mom with my 161 00:13:52,960 --> 00:13:57,800 dad before y'all divorced there's there was never it was very there was no 162 00:13:57,800 --> 00:14:03,500 respect yeah it was it was not not good and so there wasn't respect and and so 163 00:14:03,500 --> 00:14:08,480 to me that alone was like no this this is great and you know and you walked me 164 00:14:08,480 --> 00:14:13,480 down the aisle I did I gave you a was cool that was amazing was it was yeah 165 00:14:13,480 --> 00:14:18,360 little suit on yeah I always joke about it because my voice hasn't changed to 166 00:14:18,360 --> 00:14:23,200 what it is now and so you were short and now you're taller who gives this bride 167 00:14:23,200 --> 00:14:31,440 away her sister and I you know yeah that wedding was so that wedding was amazing 168 00:14:31,440 --> 00:14:35,080 because if you remember all the all the kids from Buckner Children's Home where 169 00:14:35,080 --> 00:14:39,160 I was working at the time they brought the whole campus to the wedding yeah and 170 00:14:39,160 --> 00:14:43,640 that was so special to this day I'll go through some of those pictures and just 171 00:14:43,640 --> 00:14:47,520 tears me up in a good way where are you seeing the pictures we have them in a 172 00:14:47,520 --> 00:14:52,800 in a in a bin a plastic bin okay it's been a lot while I haven't seen them 173 00:14:52,800 --> 00:14:58,240 okay but I would look at through those pictures and see these it's amazing and 174 00:14:58,240 --> 00:15:03,160 just and I also have some on my I took pictures of pictures have them oh right 175 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:06,160 so that you could have them on your computer yeah and so when I'm going 176 00:15:06,160 --> 00:15:11,600 through the old pictures but it was so special because you gave me away no he 177 00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:17,320 gave me away you're right you gave her away nobody gave me I just stepped in 178 00:15:17,320 --> 00:15:23,560 but I also I recognized how weird this must be for y'all too I mean I'm not I 179 00:15:23,560 --> 00:15:29,200 mean I had a good upbringing a great parents I had a good situation I just 180 00:15:29,200 --> 00:15:32,120 happened to go through a divorce so I wasn't I didn't have a lot of the trauma 181 00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:36,760 issues that were going on in the family and I knew I was stepping into a family 182 00:15:36,760 --> 00:15:43,360 that sure it was real clear and yet God gave me such a piece I mean I can't even 183 00:15:43,360 --> 00:15:49,640 explain how I just knew I knew here you were my rescuer and you showed me what a 184 00:15:49,640 --> 00:15:55,920 true man how a true man is supposed to treat a woman I appreciate my kids saw 185 00:15:55,920 --> 00:16:00,440 that yeah but don't think I saw you as a project no I know you never did I knew 186 00:16:00,440 --> 00:16:06,040 God was in it exactly felt God was in it and so I went with it yes yes yeah 187 00:16:06,040 --> 00:16:12,120 worked out pretty good 30 years later 30 years of Wow and then Chris start 188 00:16:12,120 --> 00:16:18,280 follows in Jimmy's footsteps yeah I mean even back then though I remember I 189 00:16:18,280 --> 00:16:24,160 wasn't I was kind of out of church in and out you know since the divorce and 190 00:16:24,160 --> 00:16:28,320 my dad wasn't really going and I'd stay with him some and you were going so I'd 191 00:16:28,320 --> 00:16:32,880 go with you every once in a while but and then I remember going to that youth 192 00:16:32,880 --> 00:16:37,240 ministry that you were part-time with I think at the time and and kind of seeing 193 00:16:37,240 --> 00:16:42,640 you and your element and that that passion and and you know I'd been around 194 00:16:42,640 --> 00:16:46,320 other I have other ministers and stuff in my family and been around some of 195 00:16:46,320 --> 00:16:51,640 that but I think Jimmy was the first like genuine yes I think like this guy 196 00:16:51,640 --> 00:16:56,800 actually really loves God and believes this stuff and that yeah that changed 197 00:16:56,800 --> 00:17:00,720 the trajectory of all of our lives you sure did I'll remember our journey 198 00:17:00,720 --> 00:17:05,240 together because we knew we were we jumped into a blender together and just 199 00:17:05,240 --> 00:17:10,040 hit you know maximum power you know and here we are and this trying to figure 200 00:17:10,040 --> 00:17:14,080 it out you know and two as we've all grown older we've read a lot we've 201 00:17:14,080 --> 00:17:18,760 studied a lot and talked about family dynamics and systems family systems and 202 00:17:18,760 --> 00:17:22,960 and to with all of us being in ministry that's what's really interesting about 203 00:17:22,960 --> 00:17:28,880 our family is that God took this really broken group of people and said oh I'm 204 00:17:28,880 --> 00:17:33,200 gonna use you to show my glory because no different from the people in the 205 00:17:33,200 --> 00:17:39,040 Bible exactly no perfect people allowed right exactly and so we I think that I 206 00:17:39,040 --> 00:17:45,160 think our tenacity to not let go of the call of God on all of our lives through 207 00:17:45,160 --> 00:17:51,200 the dysfunction through the brokenness through the ongoing life drama has you 208 00:17:51,200 --> 00:17:55,800 know the scripture in Jude 1 says this it says that we are called we are loved 209 00:17:55,800 --> 00:18:01,720 and we are kept by Jesus Christ called loved and kept and I think that his call 210 00:18:01,720 --> 00:18:08,600 on our life his love of us for us with us and also he's kept us he's protected 211 00:18:08,600 --> 00:18:13,280 us and I looked I did a little study on that word kept and it doesn't only mean 212 00:18:13,280 --> 00:18:18,760 keeping the predators from the outside but it also is that he has kept us from 213 00:18:18,760 --> 00:18:23,960 the inside we he's kept us he doesn't he doesn't want to let us go he won't let 214 00:18:23,960 --> 00:18:28,560 us run out from under that that beyond that fence of grace so to speak and so 215 00:18:28,560 --> 00:18:34,300 that is really marked our lives and continues to so proud of you I've said 216 00:18:34,300 --> 00:18:38,280 that so many times that I don't ever want it to sound rote or anything but I 217 00:18:38,280 --> 00:18:42,760 really mean that because I've watched your journey as well your faith journey 218 00:18:42,760 --> 00:18:48,080 and I remember we were it was in Southern California when things really 219 00:18:48,080 --> 00:18:51,680 begin to take shape for you and you begin to own your own faith you weren't 220 00:18:51,680 --> 00:18:57,320 coasting on us or a former youth ministers or or anyone else you begin to 221 00:18:57,320 --> 00:19:00,920 own that can you tell us a little bit about that part of your journey yeah I 222 00:19:00,920 --> 00:19:04,440 mean I had moved with you guys out to Southern California Appa Valley 223 00:19:04,440 --> 00:19:08,360 California took you six months to come with us because you wanted to stay back 224 00:19:08,360 --> 00:19:17,240 because you had a girl girl yeah yeah yeah yeah yeah God delivered but ended up 225 00:19:17,240 --> 00:19:21,100 yeah ended up with you guys and I well the hardest part I moved in in the 226 00:19:21,100 --> 00:19:26,560 summer so it's like June and so I didn't know anybody but thankfully you know we 227 00:19:26,560 --> 00:19:31,000 are in the youth group so you know especially at that age the social aspect 228 00:19:31,000 --> 00:19:36,000 right your identity as a young person teenager but you know I had always been 229 00:19:36,000 --> 00:19:42,600 a good kid but I I wouldn't I didn't say I really knew God it's kind of like you 230 00:19:42,600 --> 00:19:47,040 hear you know stories about God your whole life and but I never had a real 231 00:19:47,040 --> 00:19:52,160 relationship with the Lord and then got there and started going to church 232 00:19:52,160 --> 00:19:57,280 regularly which you know just shows you the value of community yes you know 233 00:19:57,280 --> 00:20:00,920 scripture says that bad company corrupts good morals so what is good company 234 00:20:00,920 --> 00:20:06,440 do right so you get around the positive area and it just starts to change how 235 00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:10,280 you think how you feel a part of something a lot of people say you know a 236 00:20:10,280 --> 00:20:14,880 lot of times we need to belong before we believe and I felt like I started 237 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:19,080 finding a belonging a little bit and and and then it was interesting because I 238 00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:25,080 thought I was believing well but I still it was I don't know how to put it was 239 00:20:25,080 --> 00:20:29,840 still like like you believe I believe the earth is round and if some people 240 00:20:29,840 --> 00:20:33,800 might not but I believe that the earth is round but that doesn't affect my life 241 00:20:33,800 --> 00:20:39,080 mm-hmm it doesn't mean anything exactly I don't believe the moon is cheese okay 242 00:20:39,080 --> 00:20:43,480 great so I believe and it reflects off the Sun but that I don't know what that 243 00:20:43,480 --> 00:20:48,080 means to me personally and so going through the personal relationship with 244 00:20:48,080 --> 00:20:55,020 Jesus the catalyst for me was actually this one to my right and my mother we 245 00:20:55,020 --> 00:21:00,520 were driving to youth in our truck and we're saying a lot of great things there 246 00:21:00,520 --> 00:21:05,280 are a lot of hard things too we don't want to paint a picture like it was all 247 00:21:05,280 --> 00:21:10,680 the other ways to get yeah just ugly so what we want to make sure we're staying 248 00:21:10,680 --> 00:21:15,680 real yeah yeah because there's a lot of reality of the hard things and the 249 00:21:15,680 --> 00:21:19,680 yelling or the frustration when you know you got a new stepdad and you're like 250 00:21:19,680 --> 00:21:23,520 who do you think you are you know my dad and step kid and I'm like who do you 251 00:21:23,520 --> 00:21:28,760 think yeah I'm not your dad yeah there was never a big rebellion but there was 252 00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:33,160 always that tension just like any any relationship there's conflict if you 253 00:21:33,160 --> 00:21:35,720 don't have conflict you're not really trying it's the truth there's no 254 00:21:35,720 --> 00:21:40,800 relationship exactly so so we've had plenty of that but this moment was a 255 00:21:40,800 --> 00:21:45,160 conflicting moment for me I'm driving on my way to youth and I'm gonna be 256 00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:53,320 drumming for the the little youth band and and you looked at me and you said do 257 00:21:53,320 --> 00:21:56,320 you when are you gonna really have a relationship with Jesus and you kind of 258 00:21:56,320 --> 00:22:00,200 called me out but it wasn't in like a what's wrong with you you know wouldn't 259 00:22:00,200 --> 00:22:05,840 condescending no it was just like I I see how you act and I see like you feel 260 00:22:05,840 --> 00:22:09,960 apart but it was it was kind of a crossroads moment like are you are you 261 00:22:09,960 --> 00:22:14,960 really gonna go after God and not just after his stuff or his gifts or 262 00:22:14,960 --> 00:22:20,000 the abilities to be able to play drums and show people your muscles and you 263 00:22:20,000 --> 00:22:27,280 know and I was offended they really offended me and but it was one of the 264 00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:31,000 best offenses right because it was a truth in it and I had to look inside 265 00:22:31,000 --> 00:22:34,800 yeah and you know in our culture we're so afraid to offend everybody and 266 00:22:34,800 --> 00:22:38,760 there's there's the right way to do things there's a right way to talk to 267 00:22:38,760 --> 00:22:44,200 people there's a right way as one of my favorite Proverbs it says he who blesses 268 00:22:44,200 --> 00:22:48,440 his neighbor early in the morning his neighbor will consider it a curse I love 269 00:22:48,440 --> 00:22:51,240 that because he's trying to say the right thing but he did it in the wrong 270 00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:58,840 time in and in the wrong way he shouted early in the morning and so there's a 271 00:22:58,840 --> 00:23:04,800 time to speak the right thing to people and fortunately that was a good time 272 00:23:04,800 --> 00:23:09,120 because after that I just remember being frustrated like I do know God then you 273 00:23:09,120 --> 00:23:16,640 know but I didn't realize where I was and so for me I ended up really I 274 00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:19,800 remember that even that night just thinking about like do I really know God 275 00:23:19,800 --> 00:23:24,680 and then started diving to my word and and honestly between that between the 276 00:23:24,680 --> 00:23:30,120 example that was being said the church community I started getting in the 277 00:23:30,120 --> 00:23:34,640 scripture myself and it just started penetrating my heart and it might have 278 00:23:34,640 --> 00:23:42,120 been one of the first time I really felt it's crazy both the conviction of God 279 00:23:42,120 --> 00:23:46,960 like my need for a Savior something that's on me and the love of God at the same time 280 00:23:46,960 --> 00:23:51,800 Wow that's that's what scripture says he brings not just grace but truth he 281 00:23:51,800 --> 00:23:57,000 brings both full of grace and truth and so I felt like before I could rationalize 282 00:23:57,000 --> 00:24:02,720 and justify well at least I'm not Hitler like my dad yeah you were really not 283 00:24:02,720 --> 00:24:06,920 like mine you know this bully and you could always rationalize and 284 00:24:06,920 --> 00:24:10,000 compare yourself to other people and it was the first time I just looked in and 285 00:24:10,000 --> 00:24:14,120 like who am I comparing myself to and when I started reading scripture and 286 00:24:14,120 --> 00:24:19,560 looking in the Gospels I'm supposed to be like Jesus and then and then the 287 00:24:19,560 --> 00:24:23,680 conviction I'll never be that way but that's where I love what Timothy Keller 288 00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:30,920 has brought to us he always says that you are far more loved than you could 289 00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:37,200 ever dream and yet far more sinful than you could ever imagine at the same time 290 00:24:37,200 --> 00:24:42,280 and the more you actually realize both are true then you realize wow even 291 00:24:42,280 --> 00:24:49,640 though I'm that way God has chosen to love me yeah that creates just a love 292 00:24:49,640 --> 00:24:54,840 not to get something from God but for God right and your gratitude just 293 00:24:54,840 --> 00:25:01,560 explodes off the charts because I heard Pete Greg say he's heads up 24-7 prayer 294 00:25:01,560 --> 00:25:07,120 in in UK and he said that someone made a comment on a podcast to him that I was 295 00:25:07,120 --> 00:25:11,160 listening to recently and he they said I just wish I was so holy like you are I 296 00:25:11,160 --> 00:25:15,240 mean you're so immersed and he said whoa whoa whoa he said he said first of all 297 00:25:15,240 --> 00:25:21,880 he said the longer I'm in this the more unholy I feel mm-hmm the more true more 298 00:25:21,880 --> 00:25:27,760 the more I realize how unlike him I am he said I don't live under condemnation 299 00:25:27,760 --> 00:25:34,160 at all right because we need to realize where we are not in a way to put us down 300 00:25:34,160 --> 00:25:39,400 or to to oppress or you know guilt or shame us humble but to walk in humility 301 00:25:39,400 --> 00:25:45,040 he was going with that is to be humble and not ever compare ourselves with 302 00:25:45,040 --> 00:25:48,720 other people and say well at least I'm not doing that or I do this more than 303 00:25:48,720 --> 00:25:53,160 them I think one of the things that might have been almost an enemy in a 304 00:25:53,160 --> 00:25:58,240 sense or maybe a hindrance to your your growth track early on was that you were 305 00:25:58,240 --> 00:26:03,880 that good kid you did things right you didn't get in trouble you were you were 306 00:26:03,880 --> 00:26:07,040 not aggressive you were passively aggressive you weren't sure aggressive 307 00:26:07,040 --> 00:26:12,720 sarcastically exactly so all of that so you know we couldn't point to you and go 308 00:26:12,720 --> 00:26:16,720 Chris man you really well no you didn't really mess up well Chrissy no you didn't 309 00:26:16,720 --> 00:26:20,840 we didn't at least we didn't know when you messed up because you didn't wait 310 00:26:20,840 --> 00:26:24,840 yeah it went outward well well and that's the thing about the covert like 311 00:26:24,840 --> 00:26:30,560 the good kid you know the bad kid decides I'm gonna be bad just you know 312 00:26:30,560 --> 00:26:34,680 to be back so I don't get what I want the good kid learns I can be good in 313 00:26:34,680 --> 00:26:40,120 order to get what I want same so it's still very well but they're still can 314 00:26:40,120 --> 00:26:44,920 have real pitfalls to them yeah and I think sometimes good can be the enemy of 315 00:26:44,920 --> 00:26:48,400 great we've heard that a million times through our life and so I think it just 316 00:26:48,400 --> 00:26:54,640 took a point where you begin to see that if I'm called to be like Jesus I may be 317 00:26:54,640 --> 00:26:59,040 better than this guy or whatever how you're comparing but I can't I'm not 318 00:26:59,040 --> 00:27:03,440 that and then that's that awareness comes over yeah well and one of the 319 00:27:03,440 --> 00:27:07,720 things I noticed about you after you really committed to the Lord was your 320 00:27:07,720 --> 00:27:12,080 you were a voracious reader of the word and definitely I remember we had a 321 00:27:12,080 --> 00:27:18,080 gentleman come to our church Greg Berson and he he prophesied over you and he 322 00:27:18,080 --> 00:27:22,440 said I see a sword in his mouth and if you know what a sword is the sword in 323 00:27:22,440 --> 00:27:27,400 in Ephesians is the Word of God and he said it's just coming out and I'm 324 00:27:27,400 --> 00:27:32,600 thinking yes because it's going in yeah and we saw a huge change in you 325 00:27:32,600 --> 00:27:38,120 immediately we knew there was a call of God on your heart on your life just 326 00:27:38,120 --> 00:27:43,280 immediately there was God was gonna use you in such a mighty way and he and he 327 00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:48,640 has so when did you recognize the call of God to go into ministry yeah I've had 328 00:27:48,640 --> 00:27:53,400 people ask me that before I feel like you know what I was little little mm-hmm I 329 00:27:53,400 --> 00:27:57,280 know I wanted to be a pastor for whatever reason I mean my uncle was a 330 00:27:57,280 --> 00:28:03,320 pastor and I'd see him and I think I wanted that and I remember your your 331 00:28:03,320 --> 00:28:11,000 grandmother on your dad's side buying you a suit and you would I remember it's 332 00:28:11,000 --> 00:28:17,040 a blue velvet suit with a white little shirt and you would walk around and but 333 00:28:17,040 --> 00:28:20,520 you would walk around and say I'm gonna be a preacher I'm gonna be a preacher 334 00:28:20,520 --> 00:28:25,040 and you were probably two or three years old yeah yeah so but the actual you know 335 00:28:25,040 --> 00:28:33,200 call I like to say the call comes in two forms and you need both you think about 336 00:28:33,200 --> 00:28:38,240 a foundation the scripture says that our foundation is built upon the the 337 00:28:38,240 --> 00:28:41,520 apostles and prophets with Jesus being the chief cornerstone you need to hear 338 00:28:41,520 --> 00:28:45,720 a word from the Lord from Jesus telling you you are but that's not enough either 339 00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:49,680 I don't think because you also need the rest of the foundation of the church you 340 00:28:49,680 --> 00:28:53,600 need people recognizing your gifts and if you have one without the other 341 00:28:53,600 --> 00:28:58,960 something's wrong you say God called me but people around you're going you're 342 00:28:58,960 --> 00:29:03,920 or you're not ready maybe you are but you there's some character because you 343 00:29:03,920 --> 00:29:07,040 know you could start helping people right away as a Christian you don't have 344 00:29:07,040 --> 00:29:10,480 to be this tall to ride this ride you need to start loving people but there's 345 00:29:10,480 --> 00:29:16,120 a difference between loving people and shepherding people and so that call came 346 00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:20,280 not only through feelings of sensing something from the Lord and the Lord 347 00:29:20,280 --> 00:29:25,120 speaking to me and that desire like who wants to do ministry it's that's a crazy 348 00:29:25,120 --> 00:29:35,720 desire so so that idea but then it being encouraged and seen from other people 349 00:29:35,720 --> 00:29:39,520 people recognizing that on your life yeah and having both and I think both 350 00:29:39,520 --> 00:29:46,640 takes humility I was probably about 17 18 when I started feeling that since that 351 00:29:46,640 --> 00:29:50,360 and then going to college to start kind of testing now what does that mean what 352 00:29:50,360 --> 00:29:53,840 does ministry mean there's a lot of different it's like saying I want to be 353 00:29:53,840 --> 00:29:58,060 a doctor well which which area do you want to go into which field and so 354 00:29:58,060 --> 00:30:02,680 there's a lot there's a lot to explore but it's just you know doing doing the 355 00:30:02,680 --> 00:30:05,760 next right thing and it's just taking that that's why I love scripture like 356 00:30:05,760 --> 00:30:11,360 the lamp to my feet God is a lamp to my feet right now being down the street 357 00:30:11,360 --> 00:30:17,560 that's my little preacher colloquialism right so it's a lamp not the halogen 358 00:30:17,560 --> 00:30:22,120 right and so we just got to do the do the next step yeah so yeah and then 359 00:30:22,120 --> 00:30:27,800 obviously once you got out of school you immediately started as a youth pastor 360 00:30:27,800 --> 00:30:33,400 for us right worship and youth and then college you've kind of did several 361 00:30:33,400 --> 00:30:37,720 different ministry areas yeah in college we were we y'all planted that church in 362 00:30:37,720 --> 00:30:41,720 Brownwood yeah and so just helping out really doing whatever me me and my 363 00:30:41,720 --> 00:30:47,680 girlfriend at the time he's my wife now of coming up on 23 years she we would 364 00:30:47,680 --> 00:30:51,600 clean the church is our church our students would come around clean the 365 00:30:51,600 --> 00:30:57,640 church and we would do worship kids I mean just whatever that's when you know 366 00:30:57,640 --> 00:31:02,080 you love the church when you're just whatever yeah just here clean toilets 367 00:31:02,080 --> 00:31:05,280 you know you're you love the church if you're gonna clean toilets for sure oh 368 00:31:05,280 --> 00:31:09,920 you all did it all we did everyone of us wore hats and yeah it was a beautiful 369 00:31:09,920 --> 00:31:13,680 time though looking back on it you know we made a lot of mistakes so those rookie 370 00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:17,600 mistakes and yet there was a purity in it all I mean even the mistakes were not 371 00:31:17,600 --> 00:31:23,040 committed out of malignancy or anything you know anything malevolent in turn 372 00:31:23,040 --> 00:31:27,200 those terms it was always you know overzealous usually overshooting the 373 00:31:27,200 --> 00:31:31,880 runways typically right mistakes that we made out of out of passion and out of 374 00:31:31,880 --> 00:31:36,920 man just think back even I so remember the music from each of those eras you 375 00:31:36,920 --> 00:31:41,320 know from the California you know Cadman's call jars of clay and all that 376 00:31:41,320 --> 00:31:45,560 and then with the Brownwood world the music would then was more like the 377 00:31:45,560 --> 00:31:49,640 passion movement got really big and worship really began to come on strong 378 00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:53,920 during that time and you taught late 90s Chris how to play the guitar at a young 379 00:31:53,920 --> 00:31:59,360 age and you're an amazing guitar player and a drummer really he could do 380 00:31:59,360 --> 00:32:03,160 anything in the church and we knew that he could lead worship he could be a 381 00:32:03,160 --> 00:32:07,920 youth pastor he could lead college and then eventually pastor which is what 382 00:32:07,920 --> 00:32:11,840 you're doing now and it's just it's amazing what I mean we always said 383 00:32:11,840 --> 00:32:17,120 because Jimmy can do all those things too that we could we have our own church I 384 00:32:17,120 --> 00:32:22,520 mean we built in church built in church plan church in the box yeah family yes 385 00:32:22,520 --> 00:32:27,160 and to even this day now faith is on our staff our youngest she's on our staff as 386 00:32:27,160 --> 00:32:33,080 our digital creator and her husband is on our staff part-time cameras camera 387 00:32:33,080 --> 00:32:36,480 work I said hey if you're gonna marry my daughter you gotta join the family 388 00:32:36,480 --> 00:32:43,520 you're married into the passage yeah your kids are following down that path 389 00:32:43,520 --> 00:32:48,160 yeah yeah that's right Addison's at Abilene Christian University studying 390 00:32:48,160 --> 00:32:53,100 for ministry and is doing ministry at camp your wife Casey is preaching this 391 00:32:53,100 --> 00:32:58,040 week both to middle school and high school oh man boy that brings back I get 392 00:32:58,040 --> 00:33:03,720 a little trauma-informed response and I know for you you never like you 393 00:33:03,720 --> 00:33:07,800 have to do this or there was never an expectation to follow in my steps 394 00:33:07,800 --> 00:33:11,800 sometimes parents put those expectations because we try to live vicariously 395 00:33:11,800 --> 00:33:15,880 through our kids and we want what's best for them but also we're trying to you 396 00:33:15,880 --> 00:33:21,120 know recreate our past and through them a lot of times and sometimes it's good 397 00:33:21,120 --> 00:33:25,560 motives sometimes it's not but y'all never pressured that so it was a call 398 00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:29,840 from the Lord the church and you guys help be instruments to that and the same 399 00:33:29,840 --> 00:33:34,160 thing for my kids like I'm trying to talk my son out of it not in a bad way 400 00:33:34,160 --> 00:33:38,240 if I can talk you out of it now that's right it's gonna get hard you're gonna 401 00:33:38,240 --> 00:33:43,160 be tested it's not easy yeah and I don't say ministry is harder than any other 402 00:33:43,160 --> 00:33:47,360 job you know people that I don't like it's just different that's right just 403 00:33:47,360 --> 00:33:52,080 different lane and so but but that's like every job right you know everybody I 404 00:33:52,080 --> 00:33:55,360 know a lot of parents doing youth ministry they have the expectation for 405 00:33:55,360 --> 00:33:58,680 their kids and I want you to be this and be this be this and scripture says train 406 00:33:58,680 --> 00:34:01,980 your child on the way that they should go so we're looking at what God has done 407 00:34:01,980 --> 00:34:07,600 in them and helping launch so into their area and so yeah to me if a child sees 408 00:34:07,600 --> 00:34:13,920 everything that the parents go through over time in the ministry the hurt the 409 00:34:13,920 --> 00:34:19,680 betrayal all and they still want to be in ministry you know it's a god thing 410 00:34:19,680 --> 00:34:23,800 because you've seen the good bad and the ugly sure and all we ever did in your 411 00:34:23,800 --> 00:34:28,660 case Chris was watch your life begin to watch the fruit is boy you really your 412 00:34:28,660 --> 00:34:33,120 senior year just exploded in your faith life you started that Bible study at our 413 00:34:33,120 --> 00:34:37,080 house with a bunch of kids a bunch of young people from school and things we 414 00:34:37,080 --> 00:34:42,000 were doing at school as well and just watched all that and we did not ever you 415 00:34:42,000 --> 00:34:46,440 know choose that for you we just simply affirmed what we saw God doing right 416 00:34:46,440 --> 00:34:50,080 that's really confirmation and affirmation together a really powerful 417 00:34:50,080 --> 00:34:53,840 in person's life but it wasn't just us it was others it was a Greg Berson 418 00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:57,320 coming all the way from Auckland New Zealand to say hey 419 00:34:57,320 --> 00:35:00,920 it's all over you know you've got something on you so we've watched God 420 00:35:00,920 --> 00:35:06,120 take you on that journey and like I said I would never I would never wish anything 421 00:35:06,120 --> 00:35:10,400 upon someone that they're not called and prepared for because who God calls he 422 00:35:10,400 --> 00:35:15,320 equips right right right points he anoints and but who he doesn't he doesn't 423 00:35:15,320 --> 00:35:20,200 so it could be dangerous everybody's called to pastor there are people called 424 00:35:20,200 --> 00:35:25,960 to to to be Jesus in their workplace we've got a heavy businessmen and women 425 00:35:25,960 --> 00:35:30,720 who love the Lord and our example so yeah we just happen to be called to a 426 00:35:30,720 --> 00:35:35,680 church yeah we had to navigate some tricky waters early on though I mean the 427 00:35:35,680 --> 00:35:39,080 first year just to back up a little bit because I don't want this to be like pie 428 00:35:39,080 --> 00:35:44,240 in the sky moment sure you know rainbows and unicorns and pixie dust so that 429 00:35:44,240 --> 00:35:48,680 first year was really difficult for all of us because when we first got married 430 00:35:48,680 --> 00:35:53,560 we first got married because here we you and I both were still coming off of our 431 00:35:53,560 --> 00:35:58,280 own traumas we were still just reeling from everything that was happening then 432 00:35:58,280 --> 00:36:05,120 you know your dad your ex lived a few doors down in the same apartment complex 433 00:36:05,120 --> 00:36:08,960 do you remember that not at first but yes he later moved to the same one that was 434 00:36:08,960 --> 00:36:12,440 that was interesting so would be make it easier for y'all to come home from school 435 00:36:12,440 --> 00:36:17,400 and be able to go to each of our homes I think that was the idea I don't know you 436 00:36:17,400 --> 00:36:22,120 might know something different no I do is it's brilliant but but but when you're a 437 00:36:22,120 --> 00:36:27,240 teenager you're going to take advantage of the parent of course and you're gonna 438 00:36:27,240 --> 00:36:32,320 they're using you and you're using them and it was yeah it was it was very very 439 00:36:32,320 --> 00:36:37,220 interesting first year is rough I just remember a lot of dinners when you or 440 00:36:37,220 --> 00:36:40,920 Alicia would bring up I remember Christmas four years ago and we all went 441 00:36:40,920 --> 00:36:45,880 and I'm sitting over there going no I don't actually you know and did you put 442 00:36:45,880 --> 00:36:48,920 it out of your mind because it was so bad there were those no there were those 443 00:36:48,920 --> 00:36:56,880 dynamic no no no no it wasn't that like that but I can imagine people that are 444 00:36:56,880 --> 00:37:01,920 listening today who have gone through their own breakups their own divorces 445 00:37:01,920 --> 00:37:07,600 their own pain or maybe they had a stepdad who was a jerk dangerous right 446 00:37:07,600 --> 00:37:12,960 abusive and so if you're listening I mean we only tell our story and show our 447 00:37:12,960 --> 00:37:18,440 scars in the hopes that it will help others find life and find hope and grace 448 00:37:18,440 --> 00:37:24,080 and so and know this I'll never forget so right after I went through my divorce 449 00:37:24,080 --> 00:37:29,740 I had been part of a group been invited to do a children's camp lead the music 450 00:37:29,740 --> 00:37:33,200 for it the worship for it and I knew all the kids songs you know I've got a river 451 00:37:33,200 --> 00:37:37,040 of life flowing out of me all those I knew all those songs and I'd done that 452 00:37:37,040 --> 00:37:41,220 for like six or seven years and then they called me to come back and I had 453 00:37:41,220 --> 00:37:46,000 to say and in shame I said I don't think I can do it now I went through a 454 00:37:46,000 --> 00:37:50,360 divorce they're like well do you have June something something open us yeah 455 00:37:50,360 --> 00:37:54,520 and they said well come on can you get loose up yeah I can be there so I ended 456 00:37:54,520 --> 00:37:58,480 up going and doing that camp and honestly I think that camp was probably 457 00:37:58,480 --> 00:38:02,440 more explosive than any that I've done well we had you know several hundred 458 00:38:02,440 --> 00:38:06,680 kids it was a big deal out at Lake Brownwood Baptist Encampment there and 459 00:38:06,680 --> 00:38:11,600 a lady walked up to me and she's she just stood in front of me and she said I 460 00:38:11,600 --> 00:38:15,480 understand that you've gone through a divorce course the shame just just here 461 00:38:15,480 --> 00:38:19,160 in the word come out of somebody because you're a pastor and I'm up there leading 462 00:38:19,160 --> 00:38:23,520 worship feeling so unworthy and broken and she said well let me tell you 463 00:38:23,520 --> 00:38:27,920 something and she told me about her going through a divorce 20 30 years ago 464 00:38:27,920 --> 00:38:33,160 and she said I want you to know there's life after divorce and then she said God 465 00:38:33,160 --> 00:38:38,800 wants you to know there's life after divorce and she just it's like I got 466 00:38:38,800 --> 00:38:42,920 permission to live again just from those words yeah and that really was a 467 00:38:42,920 --> 00:38:47,080 catalyst for healing for me yeah because I was living in shame I thought I can 468 00:38:47,080 --> 00:38:51,560 never minister I could never how can I tell anybody how to live well I've 469 00:38:51,560 --> 00:38:55,600 learned we don't tell people we point people to Jesus and he tells them how to 470 00:38:55,600 --> 00:38:59,080 live we don't I've learned it but I didn't know it then I was young sure and 471 00:38:59,080 --> 00:39:03,760 and I just want that to be a message to anyone listening today that there's life 472 00:39:03,760 --> 00:39:08,960 after trauma there's life after pain it's not over and Chris had Chris and 473 00:39:08,960 --> 00:39:12,960 Alicia both had their own pain absolutely of us going through a divorce of course 474 00:39:12,960 --> 00:39:19,040 prior to the divorce the way we lived y'all were in pain perpetually yeah there's 475 00:39:19,040 --> 00:39:26,560 a lot of just this hard and dysfunctional yeah yeah tough times yeah and you know 476 00:39:26,560 --> 00:39:30,880 blending families is a whole thing and so there's listeners that have that 477 00:39:30,880 --> 00:39:35,020 situation that's hard yeah and so again even when you're hearing a lot of the 478 00:39:35,020 --> 00:39:39,920 great things and the respect and honor a lot of that was built trust was built 479 00:39:39,920 --> 00:39:45,960 and sometimes it's two steps forward one step back between all of us and so there 480 00:39:45,960 --> 00:39:49,800 are a lot of a lot of times where it you know it didn't happen overnight so if 481 00:39:49,800 --> 00:39:55,360 anybody is in a blended family or or has that recall in their life you know that 482 00:39:55,360 --> 00:39:59,680 the level of grace that is needed for everybody involved and just patience 483 00:39:59,680 --> 00:40:09,120 love is patient and yeah and so it just it yeah it took time but but God and his 484 00:40:09,120 --> 00:40:14,840 grace you know really really did the work in the end but but we just stayed I 485 00:40:14,840 --> 00:40:19,560 like the idea the potter's wheel you just the goal he wear the clay we just 486 00:40:19,560 --> 00:40:23,900 stay just stay on the wheel stay on the wheel that's all your job is stay on the 487 00:40:23,900 --> 00:40:29,200 wheel and he will craft and we try to jump off so quick and do our own thing 488 00:40:29,200 --> 00:40:34,880 surely yeah so you know that's good that's good that's rich I think about 489 00:40:34,880 --> 00:40:40,040 how things could have gone a lot of different ways when you look back over 490 00:40:40,040 --> 00:40:44,620 your life I think we all do that and we'll reflect and think that decision 491 00:40:44,620 --> 00:40:47,760 hadn't been made there then this wouldn't have and I see the connectivity 492 00:40:47,760 --> 00:40:51,880 thank you dr. Wallace Roark yeah I see the connectivity of everything in this 493 00:40:51,880 --> 00:40:57,240 life how it's hard to have a regret over something when you see where you are now 494 00:40:57,240 --> 00:41:02,320 yeah I mean a legitimate painful regret I'm not to say we don't think wish we'd 495 00:41:02,320 --> 00:41:07,200 done something different not even saying that but to live with that regret where 496 00:41:07,200 --> 00:41:12,800 it becomes you know a pain point in your life but had you not have gone through 497 00:41:12,800 --> 00:41:15,600 that or had you not have made that decision you wouldn't be where you are 498 00:41:15,600 --> 00:41:18,960 and you wouldn't be surrounded by the community you have now because you 499 00:41:18,960 --> 00:41:23,160 wouldn't be here you'd be somewhere else and so when I think back about that I 500 00:41:23,160 --> 00:41:30,040 think about how God orders our steps yes I'm 37 sure does 23 in delights in every 501 00:41:30,040 --> 00:41:33,920 detail of our lives details of our lives it's a new living translation version of 502 00:41:33,920 --> 00:41:37,760 that and that's exactly what he does and for you listening I mean you're hearing 503 00:41:37,760 --> 00:41:43,360 pieces of our story here and we want to encourage you we would all sit here 504 00:41:43,360 --> 00:41:49,160 today and tell you life is not perfect still it's just not in fact all of us 505 00:41:49,160 --> 00:41:54,920 have kind of figured this little keynote out it won't be on this side right now 506 00:41:54,920 --> 00:41:59,600 I mean we're being perfected but we're not perfect right God is continuing to 507 00:41:59,600 --> 00:42:03,800 heal all of us as we grow we're all wounded healers at the end of the day 508 00:42:03,800 --> 00:42:09,680 live in a fallen world but we have hope because of who Christ is and what he's 509 00:42:09,680 --> 00:42:14,320 done for us absolutely in our life and that's the difference you know in a 510 00:42:14,320 --> 00:42:20,160 marriage that lasts is because the two people involved the husband and the wife 511 00:42:20,160 --> 00:42:24,880 in the marriage have hope in Christ and they're living for Christ if you have 512 00:42:24,880 --> 00:42:30,040 one that is and one that isn't it's it's really difficult but when you have two 513 00:42:30,040 --> 00:42:35,240 people who love the Lord more than they love each other boy you've got a recipe 514 00:42:35,240 --> 00:42:40,640 for a great great marriage and yet not without bumps and bruises and not 515 00:42:40,640 --> 00:42:45,860 without bumps and bruises for sure well Chris who as we're gonna close this 516 00:42:45,860 --> 00:42:48,680 section out and I'd like for you to just say something to our listeners I mean 517 00:42:48,680 --> 00:42:53,440 you just just share your heart with them we've got people here who grew up in 518 00:42:53,440 --> 00:42:56,880 church but they're not there anymore for whatever reason life has happened they 519 00:42:56,880 --> 00:43:01,280 there's a breach in that relationship got people who love Jesus at an early 520 00:43:01,280 --> 00:43:05,360 point in life and now they don't even know if he exists anymore you know so 521 00:43:05,360 --> 00:43:09,080 would you just speak a brief word into that and then I'll land the plane on some 522 00:43:09,080 --> 00:43:15,680 shout-outs yeah I think I would just you know encourage anyone that's struggled 523 00:43:15,680 --> 00:43:19,040 with your faith first of all everyone struggles with their faith at some point 524 00:43:19,040 --> 00:43:24,720 process of belief yeah everyone and you and you should because anything worth 525 00:43:24,720 --> 00:43:30,720 having you have to struggle for right we become entitled a lot easily that's that 526 00:43:30,720 --> 00:43:36,480 entitlement spirit comes when we just handed things and we take advantage of 527 00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:43,160 them so you're at a good place it's not a bad thing to have some struggle and 528 00:43:43,160 --> 00:43:49,320 have some doubt at the end of the day the encouragement is there are people on 529 00:43:49,320 --> 00:43:54,360 the other side of your pain that have not only gone through that pain but also 530 00:43:54,360 --> 00:43:58,760 are authentically following God following Christ trying to do the right 531 00:43:58,760 --> 00:44:03,400 thing as much as it's easy just to see the people that have it or the people 532 00:44:03,400 --> 00:44:07,440 that have failed you whether it's a parental figure a sister or brother a 533 00:44:07,440 --> 00:44:12,520 church member you know that's going to happen and like you said on the other 534 00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:16,080 side I don't need I don't even know what perfection looks like on the other side 535 00:44:16,080 --> 00:44:22,040 because Genesis doesn't say God made the world perfect he made it good but 536 00:44:22,040 --> 00:44:26,360 there's no perfection necessarily otherwise there wouldn't have to be toil 537 00:44:26,360 --> 00:44:32,120 and work and so God wants us to do that work but when we do it with him it's a 538 00:44:32,120 --> 00:44:37,600 labor of love and so coming to a place to recognize that God is good and 539 00:44:37,600 --> 00:44:42,500 trusting in him is really hard when you've been burnt and hurt but at the 540 00:44:42,500 --> 00:44:47,520 end of the day that's some of the best thing that tests your faith because at 541 00:44:47,520 --> 00:44:53,120 the end of the day it's about who he is and if you build your life on what other 542 00:44:53,120 --> 00:44:57,860 people have done good or bad at the end of the day it's not going to serve the 543 00:44:57,860 --> 00:45:02,180 purpose very well for you because if they're down you're down if they're up 544 00:45:02,180 --> 00:45:06,880 you're up that's not a very strong faith and so I think for me that's what I've 545 00:45:06,880 --> 00:45:11,120 learned you see people that people that have fallen or done something wrong and 546 00:45:11,120 --> 00:45:15,240 then have this crisis of faith because of that and the question is is your 547 00:45:15,240 --> 00:45:20,840 faith in that person mm-hmm I like what Tim Keller says if a big pastor or 548 00:45:20,840 --> 00:45:24,000 somebody has fallen I say what does that have to do with the resurrection of 549 00:45:24,000 --> 00:45:29,220 Jesus Wow is that not true anymore and that's a very spiritual religious 550 00:45:29,220 --> 00:45:34,480 answer a question but that is what we base our faith on who is Jesus what has 551 00:45:34,480 --> 00:45:39,800 he done and is he dependable yes is he loving yes did that person fall who said 552 00:45:39,800 --> 00:45:43,500 they followed him yes but that doesn't have as much to do with me and I want 553 00:45:43,500 --> 00:45:49,160 my faith to be built on him wow that's great see I'm so proud to have two 554 00:45:49,160 --> 00:45:54,760 amazing godly men in my life it's just you have no idea as a mom what what it 555 00:45:54,760 --> 00:46:01,200 feels like to have you here talking to our listeners and with with Jimmy and 556 00:46:01,200 --> 00:46:06,040 as iron sharpens iron I could do this all day long every day but Chris you 557 00:46:06,040 --> 00:46:12,320 have to move here so sorry you know well it makes a better podcast when we're all 558 00:46:12,320 --> 00:46:16,220 three together I'm telling you it's beautiful thanks for being with us today I want to give some 559 00:46:16,220 --> 00:46:19,960 shoutouts before we go so just hang on just a minute first of all want to 560 00:46:19,960 --> 00:46:24,960 always encourage our listeners to listen to Adam and Tina Curry they have a 561 00:46:24,960 --> 00:46:28,840 wonderful podcast you know Adam has a podcast called no agenda with John 562 00:46:28,840 --> 00:46:34,080 Dvorak and they it's a big deal I mean they they deconstruct media they they 563 00:46:34,080 --> 00:46:38,560 try to bring truth where there's been lies and misinformation and that's just 564 00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:43,640 a huge whole big thing but that but Adam also wanted to do a podcast with his 565 00:46:43,640 --> 00:46:47,600 wife to say hey there's another side to me I'm there's a human side to me there's 566 00:46:47,600 --> 00:46:51,920 a guy I'm a dude I'm a husband and I'm learning and we're on a faith journey 567 00:46:51,920 --> 00:46:56,920 together and so currying the keeper is a podcast where they they talk about their 568 00:46:56,920 --> 00:47:01,720 faith journey and we're so privileged in it and I have a 50-yard line seat on 569 00:47:01,720 --> 00:47:05,560 that journey and to get to walk with me here today if it weren't for them that's 570 00:47:05,560 --> 00:47:09,160 true I mean we get to walk with them and do life with them we're still gonna do 571 00:47:09,160 --> 00:47:14,480 a crossover podcast with them they're getting everything lined out in their 572 00:47:14,480 --> 00:47:17,360 weekly show because they were doing every other week but now they're doing a 573 00:47:17,360 --> 00:47:21,520 weekly show so now if they found their legs on that that's gonna be coming and 574 00:47:21,520 --> 00:47:26,320 it'll be a live show so it'll be live not it'll be a recorded no editing so 575 00:47:26,320 --> 00:47:29,960 it's gonna be fun looking forward to it but we always want to just say hey if 576 00:47:29,960 --> 00:47:34,080 you're listening our show and you've not given currying the keeper a shot give 577 00:47:34,080 --> 00:47:37,480 them a shot they're on all platforms we always encourage you listen on fountain 578 00:47:37,480 --> 00:47:42,240 where you can earn satoshis while you're listening and that'll be a blessing not 579 00:47:42,240 --> 00:47:45,080 only to you but it'll be a blessing to you because you can bless that forward 580 00:47:45,080 --> 00:47:48,240 to the whoever you're listening to through boosts and boostograms speaking 581 00:47:48,240 --> 00:47:52,040 of those I want to say a big thanks to all of you who've been boosting us and 582 00:47:52,040 --> 00:47:57,080 sending us boostograms but also those of you that have jumped on and have been 583 00:47:57,080 --> 00:48:01,200 blessing us through PayPal just a couple new donors this week Eric thank you so 584 00:48:01,200 --> 00:48:05,160 much what a blessing to hear from you Trinity also want to say thank you for 585 00:48:05,160 --> 00:48:09,360 your donation I also want to read kind of a follow-up that we mentioned Megan 586 00:48:09,360 --> 00:48:13,200 last week and that she was having some struggles and she actually asked us to 587 00:48:13,200 --> 00:48:17,320 talk on the show about family dynamics family systems especially when they 588 00:48:17,320 --> 00:48:22,040 break down and some unforgiveness and some tension and family so she wrote a 589 00:48:22,040 --> 00:48:25,560 response to our show just want to share it with you and I've edited this Megan's 590 00:48:25,560 --> 00:48:29,640 don't panic if you're listening hi thank you so much for the episode today it was 591 00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:34,520 so needed so today could not have been more perfect timing for the show I love 592 00:48:34,520 --> 00:48:39,840 the quote giving up the right to be offended part wow that is so complex and 593 00:48:39,840 --> 00:48:43,940 challenging thank you for being real and for reminding me of your compassion you 594 00:48:43,940 --> 00:48:49,160 share for your father and that path it took you to get there and then given my 595 00:48:49,160 --> 00:48:53,160 profession I can only imagine how challenging that must have been I love 596 00:48:53,160 --> 00:48:57,160 these episodes and look forward to listening each Tuesday thank you again 597 00:48:57,160 --> 00:49:01,960 blessings to y'all on the sabbatical as she writes yes I am from Texas and so 598 00:49:01,960 --> 00:49:07,060 we're so thankful to have you as a part and we have so many amazing amazing 599 00:49:07,060 --> 00:49:12,640 listeners that are blessing us Sir by his grace absurdient I love sushi one of 600 00:49:12,640 --> 00:49:19,600 my favorite names for our handle RGB TC again Sir by his grace we are so 601 00:49:19,600 --> 00:49:27,680 thankful Adam Adam 1999 who could that be and so Adam the pod father curry and 602 00:49:27,680 --> 00:49:33,080 then sir Brian with a with an eye and sometimes he puts wine instead of I in 603 00:49:33,080 --> 00:49:40,040 there some of the wine as in WH I NE heard from you lately sir Brian loved 604 00:49:40,040 --> 00:49:44,480 to hear back from you that's our show today and that thank you so much for 605 00:49:44,480 --> 00:49:47,960 jumping on this oh you want me to push the button well you're just sitting 606 00:49:47,960 --> 00:49:51,800 there who's the producer here oh my goodness you're the talent oh is that 607 00:49:51,800 --> 00:49:55,640 right yeah right is this a good time right now Chris you can chime in now 608 00:49:55,640 --> 00:50:01,480 well I'm not gonna intervene we need intervention Chris thanks for being 609 00:50:01,480 --> 00:50:06,560 yes thank you so much what a fun show energy but a lot of wisdom brother yeah 610 00:50:06,560 --> 00:50:11,240 always been wise beyond the years well not really when you're 13 awesome but 611 00:50:11,240 --> 00:50:14,880 anyway yeah so proud of you and we love you thanks for being with the state you 612 00:50:14,880 --> 00:50:29,200 all we love you we're out 613 00:50:44,880 --> 00:50:47,920 you 614 00:51:14,880 --> 00:51:17,920 you