Hey, Frugal Firearms listeners. This show was
recorded while Anderson Manufacturing was still
the predominant manufacturer of value -centric
AR -15 related parts in the United States. After
the show was recorded, Ruger purchased outright
Anderson Manufacturing, killed the name, and
shut down the business. They did keep the manufacturing
facility for their own needs. But some of the
survivors of Anderson Manufacturing, including
our guest today, Kyle Wade, moved on to another
company that is now redefining the space in terms
of value, and that's One Horse. So everything
we said with Kyle, except for the discussion
about Anderson's pistol, is completely valid
and applicable to One Horse. Same great people,
great products. Probably better, actually. So
get yourself over to theonehorse .com. And again,
theonehorse .com. And find yourself the stuff
that we talk about in here. Have a great listen.
Like I've used your lowers. Ken's used your lowers.
I have six of your lowers. Dude, six? you guys
don't even want to know i don't even know how
many i have but i have okay i don't have six
because i had no place to store six but anyway
Welcome to Episode 7 of the Frugal Firearms Podcast,
the podcast that you want to listen to if you
want to shoot and save money, because we all
have other bills to pay. Well, at least most
of us do. We all have other expenses. We all
have other priorities in life. Well, most of
us do. And today we're going to bring on a guest
from Anderson Manufacturing, if you're familiar
with them, the manufacturer of... most of the
lower receivers that you're going to come across
if you're doing an ar -15 build and they represent
value and we're going to talk about that value
proposition so i'm here with my co -host ken
ken say hello to our listeners hello welcome
listeners thank you for joining us again this
week and ken why did we want to bring on anderson
manufacturing well anderson has for many years
now basically been a a very good value For me,
I own a number of them. I like them. I've used
them for some of my builds. I have some that
I have not yet built on. And I just think that
what our show focuses on, frugal, being able
to get value for the lowest amount of dollars,
I believe that Anderson is an excellent manufacturer
for helping the average person get there. So
with that closet full of lowers that you haven't
built yet, Ken, what sort of plans do you have
for those? Oh, just some different ones. I'd
like to do a longer barrel version, probably
like a 24 -inch sometime target one at some point
in time. And I think I mentioned to you one time,
I'd like to build a 458 SOCOM version. I'm going
to let you shoot that first. Absolutely. I'll
let you shoot that first, and then I'll take
a couple shots on it. So the conversation that
we're going to enter into here was one that was
started at the SHOT Show when I met Mr. Kyle
Wade from Anderson Manufacturing. I had a really
long... and fruitful conversation at the show.
And we want to bring him on to let Anderson tell
its story. And we wanted to get their perspective
on value, of course, which is the center of the
show, but understand how a company starts and
maintains their market presence in a challenging
environment. So Kyle, welcome to the show. And
why don't you tell us who you are and how you
got to where you are? Hey, Craig. First off,
thanks for having me on the show. It's an honor
and I really appreciate that. Like you said,
my name is Kyle Wade. I'm a content creator here
at Anderson Manufacturing. I do public affairs
and marketing as well. All right, so I started
at Anderson in 2020 amidst the COVID -19 pandemic.
I was a full -time student at the time working
at a local construction hardware store, kind
of physical labor, whatnot. When everything shut
down, I got laid off. And, you know, back in
a past life, And, you know, still have the title.
I was a United States Marine. Thank you for your
service. Thank you. So with that being said,
being a full -time student and working at the
construction shop was awesome because it kept
me busy. It kept me, gave me purpose, all that.
And when COVID -19 hit, part of the pandemic
a lot of people don't talk about is what it did
to people mentally. Me being inside my house
and not having anything to do. You can only do
so much around the house until you get a little
stir crazy. And I feel like my story really speaks
volumes as to who the Andersons are and what
Anderson manufacturing is all about. And here's
why. I got to a point to where it was getting
pretty dark for me. I was just, you know, staying
in bed all day and, you know, really not being
myself. I'm a pretty active guy. And I was sitting
there and I was, you know, you know how it goes.
You're in bed, you're scrolling your phone, you're
checking social medias, watching YouTube, whatever.
I happened to catch an Anderson video and I was
like, man, Anderson's right in my backyard. I
grew up in Hebron, Kentucky. It's right in my
backyard. Is that the way to say it? I always
thought it was Hebron. No, it's Hebron. Okay.
All right. I learned something. There you go.
But no, I seen it. And then I'm like, you know
what? Something spurred inside of me. Go to andersonmanufacturing
.com. Find a way to contact them and just shoot
your shot. Say, hey, here's my situation. Here's
my background. Here's why I'd be a good fit for
Anderson Manufacturing. And then without going
into detail what that email said, it was pretty
heartfelt just because of the state of mind I
was in at the time. And the very next day, something
I was not expecting, the owner's wife, Teresa
Anderson, sent me an email from her personal
email and said, when's the soonest time you can
get in here for an interview? fill out an application
anything she just wanted to interview me on the
spot I guess from what the context of the email
said so they pulled me in did the interview everything
went well and I started an assembly and literally
just started at the bottom rung of the ladder
and just ever since then been going hard and
trying to do what I can to thank the Andersons
for all that they've done for me and really that's
giving me a purpose and you know just kind of
let me come in here and be be a part of this
company they sound like really good people they
really yeah this is a great story we've never
had a guest who's actually kind of gone that
direction you know with with his personal experience
and and how you know company gave him gave him
purpose in life i mean when did you leave the
core what was it right before the pandemic uh
2017. okay so not not right before but close
enough Close enough, yes. Yeah. And by the way,
what was your specialty in the Corps? I was a
combat engineer, 1371. Nice, nice. So, okay,
so you referenced the type of people, you know,
the owner's wife, for example. Tell us about
how the company got going and, you know, what
their kind of their mission statement. You know,
you being a Marine, you understand, you know,
mission statements, you know, and you understand
vision statements as well. Yeah. So Anderson
Manufacturing, and I want to say 1957 would be
the exact date, but I know sometime in the 50s
for certain. Anderson Manufacturing started as
Anderson Tool and Die. Anderson Manufacturing
is currently ran by Charles and Carl Anderson,
and it was actually their grandfather who started
Anderson Tool and Die after he retired. So Carl
and Charles had always been around the tool and
die shop, and they overtook it. And Anderson
Tool and Die stayed around until around 2005,
2006 time frame when they were approached by
a rifle manufacturer who asked them to do some
OEM work and make lowers since they had the machining,
the tools, and the machinist to get that done.
So they took that on. and the rifle manufacturer
happened to go bankrupt and left Anderson Tool
and Die with all these stripped lower receivers
on hand and didn't know what to do with them.
Was it an unpaid order? It was. Oh, my. Oh, boy.
So after that happened, with a little bit of
research, a little bit of legwork, the Andersons
found out how to... make these things legal with
the ATF, all that, to get them out to people.
And that is how Anderson Manufacturing got started
and really went full -fledged into it in 2007.
So from that point forward, from 2007, you had
a large unwanted inventory of lowers. How long
did it stay lowers before the company started
branching out? Because reviewing your website
today, I saw the new Kiger Dime, which I didn't
know existed. And it surprised me that the, maybe
it shouldn't surprise me, but it did surprise
me that the company is now not just about lowers,
because I think that's what most people think
of you as. Yeah. No, the stripped lowers lasted
for a while, a couple years. And then just meeting
the right people and bringing the right people
on in the business aspect, we slowly started
manufacturing all of our own parts. eventually
to get to where we're at today where we have
multiple options for multiple rifles if you want
to do a 308 build we got you if you want to go
762 by 39 300 blackout i mean the options are
endless we can go on and on but yeah it was just
taking steps and kind of seeing what we're good
at and just keep growing from there do you kind
of have an idea of how much of the market you
guys own at least in lowers because i know it's
substantial but i i mean i quipped earlier that
i thought that it was the majority and and i
still think that that's maybe not you don't have
51 of the market or maybe you do but at least
you make more than anyone else does i wouldn't
quite say 51 um i did bring some numbers today
just to kind of go off the show notes and be
prepared um so when i started here in 2020 anderson
manufacturing produced and this is according
to the ATF, 439 ,559 loader receivers. And that's
not including the 80s. Wow. That is significant,
man. It is. Okay, so the 80s. So before you go
any further, I know that's something I wanted
to ask about. So you guys weren't hurt by the
upsurge of the 80 % product. You participated
in that. We did. Okay. I didn't know that because
I hadn't seen yours as an 80 % product. That's
just my own ignorance. But you're all good. But
you managed to actually capitalize on that as
well. Yes, sir. Yep. In 2020, we held 33 % of
the lower receiver mark. Anderson Manufacturing
versus everybody else. That's huge. That's huge.
And do you OEM for the companies? We do. Okay.
You don't have to name them if you don't want
to. But I mean, is it like... two companies or
is it like lots of companies or how many of the
companies you know roughly you know is it a lot
or is it a couple or is it like one all i'll
say on that is it's more than two because that's
the only number you listed there but it's more
okay so it's plural it's a plural value that's
good that's good and and what kind of challenges
have you faced sort of along the way i mean you
know keeping in the context of you know let's
dial this back to what's the purpose of the show
the purpose of the show is to find as we talked
about at the shot show you and i um we're finding
the best value for people in the shooting community
and we're revealing it and we're revealing it
in ways that i think other podcasts don't uh
because we're focused on the value proposition
and and you know everyone i think thinks of you
either either positively or perhaps sometime
you know, not positively, you know, almost disrespectfully
as being, you know, the value leader in the area.
And I'd kind of like you to address that because
everything I've seen from your stuff is quality.
Just as, yeah, it's just as good as for all practical
purposes is just as good as everyone else's.
Right, and I've always, the things I've seen
over the years, you know, it's a quality product
at a reasonable price, and if you particularly
are going to do your own build, it is an excellent
platform to start on. So, yeah. Yeah, what do
you have to say about that? Because I think that's...
you know maybe getting the elephant out of the
room you know that the the term that was used
you know a couple episodes ago by the owner of
air15discounts .com i mean he wasn't being pejorative
at all he was complimenting your quality control
and your processes but he did throw out the term
poverty pony which i i had never heard that term
and i thought man that's really undeserved yeah
It's a term we see everywhere. We get it a lot
on social media and all the different platforms.
And, you know, I can't sit here and say I turn
a blind eye to it. You see it. That's definitely
a challenge that we face. A lot of people tend
to associate price with quality. And that's not
the case with Anderson Manufacturing. Anderson
Manufacturing's belief systems and kind of our
mission statement, like you were mentioning earlier,
you always hear it from Mr. Anderson. He just
wants the blue -collar. hard -working man to
have the ability to get that get out there and
express the second amendment freedoms that's
all he's out there dude now if we wanted to we
could build high price high dollar firearms and
we'd love to do that but we try to get it to
that level but at a reasonable price something
budget friendly that your standard like i said
blue collar man can get out there and build his
own ar if he wants to or you know buy his next
hunting rifle Fill the freezer, you know what
I'm saying? That's basically where we are. That's
where you are, Ken, because you're the one always
filling the freezer and the safe and the garage
and the trunk of the car and everything else.
Everything else, yeah. Yeah, that's not as much
me. Okay, so to that point, do you think that
people who spend more on parts and it doesn't
have to we don't have to limit this to lower
receivers but you know where's the tipping point
where's the return on investment are they getting
you know if i'm spending twice as much as an
anderson you know serialized lower um am i getting
twice the value let me interrupt here this is
where i like to rise craig here because see Craig
is not your sub -minute target shooter. Sure,
you can handle him. I saw that. Three MOA, man.
You can hand him a quarter MOA rifle, okay? And
it's not going to really perform that much better
than a two MOA rifle in Craig's hands. Well,
okay, since you're getting into my skill or lack
thereof, co -host ken then i will remind you
that i don't think as an engineer not now i'm
putting on my engineer hat because i am one that
the lower receiver doesn't have a lot to do with
accuracy you got it well okay i mean the barrel
does the the trigger does the barrel does the
the interaction between the upper and the lower
any movement between the upper and the lower
okay i'll give you that but well why are we talking
so much this is Ken's thinking the same thing.
Like, damn it, Craig, be quiet. It's Kyle's show.
So, Kyle, you jump in, man. Yeah, so, no, you're
not necessarily always getting the better product
paying twice as much. We hold all of our products
to a very high quality standard before it even
gets out the door. Every complete firearm that
leaves this place is test fired and tested for
cycling just to ensure that everything's fine
by the time it gets to you. And we have so much
pride in the product that we put out that we
guarantee it with a lifetime warranty. So is
that a transferable warranty or not? Yes, it
is. As long as it's an Anderson manufacturing
product, we will either work on it or replace
that part. Great. And that's generous of you
because I could imagine that it would be perfectly
legitimate to only warranty to the original owner,
which is... a common practice but you're extending
that so that speaks to your quality assurance
i'm assuming that you hit at least mil spec standards
if not better without going into the actual numbers
yeah without selling the farm we do hold to a
very tight mil spec tolerance tell us about finishes
uh what kind of finishes do you do you use or
finishing process do you use salt bath nitride
for our lowers I'm sorry for our barrels. I apologize.
And our lowers and uppers are anodized. Type
3 hard black anodized. So now expanding the spectrum
a little bit here, I mentioned earlier that I
looked on your website and saw a product I'd
never seen before, which is the Kiger 9, which,
by the way, we're not reviewing that here because,
well, this is California and that's not a California
-compliant gun, so you can't send it to me for
review. Officially, Ken and I have no comments
on whether we like it or not, but that kind of
shows that the company is reaching out. So what
opportunity space are you guys trying to fill
now? Yeah, so it really started off with us branching
off in the AR -10 platform, getting away from
the AR -15. Like you talked about earlier, kind
of what growing pains, what challenges we faced.
We tried the AR -10 platform before and it failed
miserably. We could not figure it out. So the
AR -10s that you see from Anderson now, the AM
-10, is Generation 2, and we've got all the kinks
worked out. And that kind of led us like, hey,
what else can we do? So that got us into the
handgun game there for a little bit, and we plan
on expanding that handgun line. And then the
what's next, we're getting into the bolt action
game. Oh, wow. Yeah. When you talked about OEM
work, we do OEM work for some companies that
do PRS -type rifles. And we've worked on a lot
of bolt actions, manufactured a lot of parts
for bolt actions. And we decided that we want
to try our hand at that. So, you know, by the
end of this year, you will see an Anderson bolt
action rifle on the market. So you're not talking
about making parts for like the Remington 700
or something. You're talking about a ground up
new creation that's specifically an Anderson
product. Yes, sir. Do you, and you're doing your
own barrels as well? Yes. Okay. That's interesting
because I didn't know that either. But there
was something that you mentioned in our exchanges
before we actually got a schedule to have you
on about RF -85 technology. Can you talk about
that? Yeah. What that is? Yeah. Yeah. RF -85
technology, a lot of people think it's a coding.
It's not. It's a treatment. And I am no scientist,
so if I flub this up, you're going to have to
forgive me. But it is a nanomolecular calcium
injection into the actual metal that releases
when it heats up. And then that gives you the
lubricity so that you don't need oil. What we
do recommend is that you fire 300 rounds out
of it to kind of get everything worked out of
it, because we do put a coating of oil on it
coming out of the shop. Once you get those 300
rounds down range, we want you to either use
your bathtub or your dishwasher and clean that
rifle really good with soap and water. And then
you're done. Let that thing dry out and you will
not have to oil that rifle for the life of the
rifle. I know it's hard to believe. Sounds like
a lot of people. A lot of people say that. But
if you do some YouTube YouTube research, you
can see the proof in the pudding right there
before your eyes. As an audio only podcast. um
the listeners could not see my eyes go up when
you said put it in the dishwasher okay so i was
like are you kidding me okay hey you can clean
your brass in the dishwasher we talked about
that last time but brass isn't reloading brass
isn't well by the way what okay so what parts
does the rf -85 technology apply to is it a bcg
is it the upper is it the barrel all those Good
questions. So the lower receiver, the fire control
group, so the trigger, the hammer, the springs,
the disconnector, your bolt carrier group, including
the bolt, your charging handle, and your barrel
are all RF85. RF85 stands for reduces friction
by 85%, and it will actually make your action
faster by 23 % as well. Interesting. Okay, is
that effectively, now I'm going to, talk engineer
stuff here so you know if you have to defer go
ahead is this effectively uh like a case hardening
application where after you know thousands of
rounds that effect has literally worn off and
now you have to start treating it like you know
a regular gun that you lubricate or is the penetration
deep enough into the metal that that's not practically
ever going to happen for the life of the rifle
It won't happen. It wears away with the metal.
Okay. So it is essentially in the matrix of the
metal. Yes. Is that proprietary to Anderson?
Yes. Okay. RF85. Does it go to any of your other
products that if I just buy a lower or if I just
buy an upper, I've got that? Okay. Yeah, you
can buy a RF85 bolt carrier, RF85 barrel. Those
are the two that I recommend to pair with each
other for sure. Well, that's interesting because
I've been, that dry lubrication metal treating,
I have been hearing about since the early 80s.
You know, back when Craig and I were, you know,
doing hot rod cars, I was working on my 1967
GTO, which I still have. I'd like to point that
out. You know, and you're rebuilding the engine.
You're like, oh, this dry lube thing that they
had, it was a coating, a permanent coating on.
anything, you know, camshaft and all of that
type of stuff. And they were given phenomenal
reduced friction things. So that technology has
obviously advanced in the last 40 years. And
now we're up to this. So I'd be very interested
in looking at that. If that's your bleeding edge
of technology right now, which sounds pretty
significant, honestly, and interesting how it's
going to dovetail with one of our previous guests
from Modern Spartan Systems talking about lubrication
products, obviously for guns that don't have
RF85 technology. kind of what's in the pipeline
i mean again with nothing proprietary here no
trade secrets you know our listeners are not
signing non -disclosure agreements but but what
are we looking for in the future here from anderson
in the nearest future look for that bolt action
rifle and barreled actions and in the distant
future start looking for that handgun lineup
to evolve and expand these are going to be pistols
or revolvers Pistols. Semi -automatic Striker
5 pistols. That's fine. I'm a wheel gun guy.
At least, I have a lot of wheel guns. That's
because you're old, damn it. Hands up. I'm a
wheel gun guy as well. Yeah, that's what my grandpa
taught me. I mean, Ken, you're a full year older
than me. I know. I'm living in the modern age
here, and you're still bringing up the rear.
I just bought two more revolvers. Yes, I know.
You said that. Yeah, because you buy things in
pairs. So challenges going forward. What sort
of, you know, supply chain issues? I mean, maybe
in a post -COVID environment, those aren't really
challenges anymore. Legislative challenges. What
sort of things stand in the way of, you know,
Anderson becoming the world -dominant manufacturing
firm? Hey, that is where we want to be at, Craig.
But as far as challenges go, you know, legislation
is a challenge every day. um to sit here and
say that the pistol brace ruling did not hurt
us it did and you know that takes rifles off
the shelf that makes things illegal that are
just sitting on the shelf and that to me is um
i'm not going to go into politics here but uh
right this isn't a political show but but there's
always underpinnings of politics yeah and you
know that definitely hurt and i feel like a lot
of people who are um Justifying legislation or
approving legislation, a lot of times don't necessarily
know what they're talking about. I feel like
firing a pistol without a pistol brace is more
dangerous. Yeah, no doubt. No doubt. I've always
thought, why do they ban safety equipment? And
I view safety equipment, like California tries
all the time to ban safety equipment, but they
don't want people to have bullet -resistant vests.
If you work in a 7 -Eleven or you work in a pawn
shop, I'm sorry, you want to wear one of those
for your personal protection? Absolutely. Or
you go to the range, and you may be perfectly
safe in a range with 20 people in a row, but
what about that guy three lanes over? I don't
know him. And he's the first -time shooter who
doesn't know the range rules or doesn't follow
them if he does know them. Right. So me having
safety equipment on is important. Right. Exactly.
What stories you got for us? Something funny,
something different. Funny stories. Gosh, let
me think here. Anything that you can tell us
that doesn't give away a trade secret and doesn't
make the show become explicit. Yeah, yeah. No,
that's the hard part is thinking of one of those
funny stories that's not explicit. Well, you
can paraphrase all you want. Because you got
a lot of guys. All right, just imagine this.
And this is where I started at in Anderson. You've
got a crew of eight guys, and we're on night
shift this time. So we're coming in at 6. We're
leaving at 4 a .m. A bunch of guys just in a
building, building rifles. All night, because
this is during the peak of COVID, everyone's
got their stimulus checks and they're buying
rifles. Anderson rifles, specifically, in this
instance. So, you know, we're pumping out 400
-something rifles a night. There's literally
been times where, by the end of my shift, I'm
out in my car and, you know, I'm calling the
wife or whatever, and I'm falling asleep. You
know, just right there in the parking lot, because
there's such a high... And you're calling her
at four in the morning? oh yeah like why is she
up like waiting for you to call it four in the
morning man hey shout out to my wife she's a
rock star and she just wants me to do things
like that she asked him to um but no that would
be the most unvulgar story i could divulge to
you is and also i was a full -time student at
the time so i was going to school during the
day but uh falling asleep in the parking lot
that will forever be and i was woke up by the
sunrise there so yeah I mean, and I imagine that
a lot of the guys who are working there are probably,
you know, former military as well. Oh, yeah,
yeah. We have a huge veteran presence here. I
think we have right now 23 veterans working on
the daily here. And, you know, like I said, you
get those guys together in what we call the gun
cage, building guns, you definitely get some
interesting conversations going. Oh, yeah, yeah.
I mean, it's lucky they don't break out the beers
during manufacturing time because then I imagine
your quality would suffer. Your production rates
would go down at least a little bit. Yes, most
definitely. Yeah, so anything else you got for
us? Anything you want to impart? Websites, YouTube
channels, things like that that you want to share
with our listeners? Yeah, most definitely. Guys,
thanks for listening. If you find some time in
your day, visit us at all the social media platforms
at Anderson Manufacturing. And then give our
website a look, andersonmanufacturing .com. We
keep a pretty cool blog, constantly putting content
into that. This weekend, we did the Guardian
Run 2023. It was a great time. You get to see
a lot of pictures of people pain and suffering,
but also having a great time practicing their
marksmanship. Really is a great place to be,
and check it out. All right, cool. So, Ken, you
got anything else for our guest here today? I
very much appreciate you stopping by. As I said,
I own six of these things myself, so I am a fan,
and I do believe that exactly what we want to
do here at Frugal Firearms, we produce a quality
product at a reasonable price. It's an excellent
platform, which is to start constructing whatever
you want. So a lot of ways to go. Good stuff.
All right. Hey, thanks for your time, Kyle. Hey,
thank you, Craig. It was an honor. I'd like to
very much thank Kyle for coming on and representing
Anderson Manufacturing. I think they're a great
platform to build if you're going to create your
own AR. And I'm looking forward to some of their
new offerings that they're going to be doing,
bolt action and some semi -automatic pistols
here toward the end of the year. So if I end
up going to shot in 2024, we're definitely going
to be sitting there and spending quite a bit
of time at their booth talking to Kyle again.
So I'd really like to thank him. Indeed. You
know, that's the kind of content that we want
to have on this show that really, you know, speaks
to, you know, right to the core of the value
proposition because, you know, the criticism
of the poverty pony, I mean, it's kind of a funny,
clever phrase, but in a way it is undeserved
because if you're building a quality product,
you know, poverty or not, I mean, poverty is
just the wrong term. if it's a value product
it's a value product no matter where the price
point is so absolutely it's built with quality
materials and uh i've looked at them to fit and
finish fantastic yeah right for our listeners
if you're going to go out and and buy their products
or buy anyone's products i mean do your research
make sure that you you know pick the right stuff
for you be safe remember everything that we say
here is not legal advice it's not even buying
advice it's revealing the best values out there
but ultimately you're only going to be happy
with those purchases if you do the research and
you convince yourself that you did the right
thing so ken any feedback from from listeners
yet that we want to talk about Not particularly,
although I think that we are probably going to
have to do another little segment on reloading.
It seemed to be pretty popular, and I've got
more I'd like to say about it, particularly if
we move up the scale to mid -range and high -end
reloading. Right. And thank you very much to
our new listeners. We've got a couple more countries
represented. So it's now getting a worldwide
presence. I think I mentioned before Poland.
Thank you for our Eastern European listeners.
New listeners down in Sydney. G'day. Some new
listeners popping up in Germany, Belgium, the
Netherlands. London has come on board. since
we last recorded. So thanks for getting the word
out and thanks for spreading it. You can always
contact us at frugalfirearmspodcast at gmail
.com. Again, frugalfirearmspodcast at gmail .com.
And what do we want them to do on their social
media platforms, Ken? We would like them to share
and come over and listen to us because I think
we've got some exciting things to say and I think
that they would enjoy it. Yep. Like and subscribe.
That's how you get the word out. So thanks again,
everyone, and good night. Got the recording,
Greg. Okay, I'll stop the recording.