Hello, ladies and gentlemen, boys and girls,
and welcome back to Lore Crimes. Hello, everybody.
A little bit different. I have now moved into
a new place. Where is it? For the audio listeners,
there's a special guest. There's a dog. There's
a dog? Yes. Russell is chilling with me. A second
dog has struck lore crimes. And he has his Krusty
Krabs plushy toy. So if you hear any squeaking,
that's him chomping on that. How are we all?
How are we? I would say, speaking of chomping
on it, it's a big topic today, isn't it? Spin
on it, Dio? No. It's a big topic today because
we've got a cool, cool one. We're definitely...
Apparently, we looked at Warhammer 40k and we
went, you know what? I really wish to not sleep
at night. I want to scare every middle -aged
parent out there with my setting. We need to
make Warhammer more grimdark, more terrifying,
more nightmare fuel. This did come from my brain,
so there's not more tentacles. That's not going
to be one of the answers immediately. I'm just
putting that out there now. But yeah, guys, we've
got some... We should start the podcast by saying,
first of all, we are on offline stuff, Spotify,
all that good stuff. But also, we should ask,
is 40K still grimdark? Would you say it's a grimdark
universe? Would you like to go first, Cullen?
I'd say it is more than it isn't. It's definitely
lost some of the spice it used to have. You look
at the old artwork, right? Everything is dirty.
Intentionally. It's grimy. It's gross. Old Mechanicus
artwork? God, they need a bath. It's like, it's
gross and grimy and everything looks bad and
horrid. And nowadays it's like, I always think
of that one artwork of Gilliman with a halo over
his head, like Tara. And I think like Mars and
stuff like comes together to look like a halo
when he's got angel wings. And I'm like, you
kind of, you're pulling back on everyone being
an asshole. You kind of, you kind of given me
just what is pretty clearly the unironic hero
I'm supposed to root for. I'm like, you kind
of. you kind of lost me a little bit in terms
of everyone being evil. So it's almost a little
bit of grimdark. Because there is that aesthetic
from the 90s. When I think of things like Akira
and some of these grimy, dirty, lots of mechanical
gribblies, lots of wiring. You look at a vintage
Iron Warrior image and it's so complex of how
much stuff is going on. You kind of have to squint
and focus to see exactly what's going on. And
I liked that aesthetic of Warhammer. You had
things like... What's the Ikeda Sicarius? Is
it something Reach? Fall of... Black Reach. Oh,
Black Reach. Black Reach? Yeah, Black Reach.
It has that kind of 90s aesthetic, 80s aesthetic.
And I know Voldemort, for example, did a recent
video where he ranted about how Warhammer is
no longer a setting, it's a story. And I understand
that like... I see where he's coming from. See
where he's coming from with that one. I'll say,
I don't know. Today we're going to dive and delve
into each faction, and we're going to explain
ideas that we have into how we think we could.
Let's say Grimdark it up a bit. That's a hell
of a catchphrase. Grimdark my heart. Yes. And
for the subway surfer enjoyers, we do have some
Dawn of War for you guys as well. I even have
Kickstart my heart. You should definitely, in
the background, look up Kickstart my heart, but
you're dogfighting over Coruscant. Also, Andy,
again, another quick thing before we start. You
seem to have given me unlimited power. Oh, how
have I done this? I don't know, but I'm in. I'm
into the mainframe. Get off that. Get off that
right now. Uh -oh. You know what, guys? Let's
start big and strong. Let's start with what is
described as the grim... the horrible empire,
the grim, dark future. It is the Imperium of
Mankind. And to be fair, let's start with the
assessment. Do we think the Imperium of Mankind
is pretty grim, dark? Does it meet that threshold
still? Has it lost its charm a bit? Are we falling
from the wayside? What do you guys think? It's
kind of falling off a little bit. So it's still
pretty grim. There's still plenty, you know,
you get novels and it's like, yeah, there's still
a servitor there and they're still just not acknowledging
that's horrific. So, you know, it still gots
that grimdark spice a bit. There are moments
though, even in the Horus Heresy, like I can't
remember which book it is, but it's one of the
early ones. And it's like, this was when humanity
was trying to be like, let's emancipate everyone
and be peaceful. And then there's like an offhand
line was just like, and then the lobotomized
servitor gave the ammunition and go, oh yeah,
it's still not. It's not great. It's not great.
It's snuck in there. There's still plenty of
messed up stuff. I would just say now you kind
of have to look for it a little bit more. Do
you think that's possibly because a lot of the
earlier stories, they were establishing that,
and then in some way it's already been established,
so therefore a lot of novels or codex or stuff
that we read now, they don't feel the need to
basically... establish the basics again do you
think they're not doing enough to like hey hey
let's go back to our roots a bit here it could
be but i think the problem with that is that
they they're they're unestablishing too hard
in some ways like now you're around where you're
trying to make all like like you know you have
a guy who's like a genuine like you portray him
as a hero right he's the standout well when the
next 20 guys also are just kind of heroic Well,
if I may reference what I was, again, I watched
Voldemort's video today and he was all about
like all the stuff in the new Armageddon box
set. It's, you know, it's all about Dante, Maneus,
Kalgar, Gilliman, Primarchs, blah, blah. So these
days he's a bit despondent with how you can no
longer just have a bunch of captains who will
never really be a drop in the bucket because
they're expected to die. Therefore. it's lost
a bit of the charm of that like oh anyone could
kind of like the game of thrones thing where
anyone can die no one is a uh no one is inexhaustible
no one is inexpendable and so in a way warhammer
is now because it's got so many characters and
the characters have books and black library is
making more of those and therefore there's all
these main characters that takes away from the
idea that any of them could die at any moment
and therefore it's lost a bit of its charm in
that regard do you think this is uh best exonerate
or not exonerated the uh exemplified by once
again yarik somehow returned or something yes
this is the palpatine moment you know somehow
palpatine returned i i think yeah i was like
why they were even gonna tease like yarik's dead
but he's not it's like did we need that you could
have just not said that and we would have been
like oh it's garrick again cool that i mean that
one is so ex because that one's also doubles
it's just like right you just wasted my time
with all this now yeah yeah i'll say go start
with the imperial of man like i will put my hat
in the ring and say like if you ever read or
if someone listened to eisenhorn law There's
a thing you get when you're with like normal
inquisitor characters or like human characters,
which like it very well establishes like this
is a churning war machine. And most people live
in, you know, basically hive cities, which we
know to be obviously like a city. And then you
put another city on top of the city and then
the city is so big that sunlight doesn't reach
the bottom of the first city underneath. Other
city, people eat protein made of other people,
like protein gruel bars, you know. And I think
to that Darktide, you know, people have played
Darktide. That gets across quite well. I think
the established tone of Warhammer, but they've
almost eased off a bit in terms of the Imperium
of Man. I'd say the... disregard for human life
as in like they there's a bit too more of like
in some way like you get the impression like
they value people again which is like a very
uh like horrors heresy 30k mindset like you know
return of gilliman all that stuff so the first
thing i would do is you need to have more characters
and more stories of like normal humans who you're
willing to kill off a hundred percent willing
to kill like but also ones where people die just
because because the thing is like i i think one
of the reasons that game of thrones lost its
charm as like the biggest show on television
at the time and like i watched all of the series
as they came out from about season three so i
had like a few to catch up and i really loved
it when we were in dublin me and colin and i
think eli were chatting about like i think you
and you and eli hadn't watched it you're like
oh it's like no it's good fun but then after
like season four it lost the charm of anyone
could die sean dean died and then it was like
yeah but tyrian's not gonna die and cersei's
not gonna die until the last episode and but
and it's like and then they went again writing
then they added the bad writing it was just like
The problem is it betrayed its own ethos and
therefore it fell by the wayside. But using that
as like a ballpark, which characters could you
really kill off in Warhammer without causing
a kerfuffle for the Space Marines? Because I
feel like if you killed Dante, people would have
an uproar. They'd be like, no, his whole thing
is that he's long -suffering and he's like the
oldest Space Marine, so you can't kill him. It's
like, okay, can we kill Bjorn? No, because he's
the same, but he's a Dreadnought. Okay, can we
kill Maneus Kalgar now that... we take gilliam's
back oh no he's a classic you can't kill marneus
okay you could certainly kill him i said but
starting with just the imperium of mankind the
amount that inquisitor books do so well in like
painting the like the absolute horror that is
the most do you know do you know it really doesn't
get across anymore in um it's i think it's an
issue with the imperial man where like when gilliman
returns Is this still the most, in quotes, cruelest,
most bloodiest regime imaginable? Does that still
ring true? I think Gilliman's return has taken
a bit of that off because his whole thing is
he wants to change the status quo. But I don't
think we've seen enough of, no, Gilliman, that's
not possible anymore. You have to be like the
rest of the Imperium. curb stomp a child or whatever
they do in the imperium it's like at a certain
point it's like this is the grim the grim dark
future if we have too much i'm just going to
be a good boy and have no repercussions for just
being overpowered and therefore i can circumvent
the the the grim necessity of it i guess that's
where it's going to fall flat and i feel like
god blight you know he's he's like oh i've been
inhabited by the emperor and oh look at me and
i liked how in the 10th edition trailer with
temptation where they were like oh we're not
going to get victory against the tyrannous i'm
like that's a good yes yes i like that but then
since then it's like oh we're going back to armageddon
i guess we're going to save armageddon again
we're not going to let that planet die Please
let that planet die. I want Armageddon burned.
I want it destroyed. I want it cored. I want
it to be peeled like an orange. I want it to
be scattered. No more of that. Get rid of Armageddon.
We're done with Armageddon, please. Katie's gone.
It's the same thing when Armageddon happens.
I would say an improvement to make something
a bit more grimdark is actually be brave enough
as well to let... con like with like um imperial
like you know uh army books or other stuff that
was like a campaign books that come out like
you would say like once again we revisit armageddon
like armageddon is like we've been sort of getting
to the point here like it's been cheapened and
i almost like it's also like a billion people
you know three billion died in armageddon i kind
of go there's no tactical value it's just out
of spite and we we don't even have the steel
legion it's cadians and um like kriegers i'm
like just let it die then let it die we don't
need any more armageddon i mean the cadians are
still here so yeah they just have so many void
born they're like we can stick it out it's fine
but here's the crazy thing right hal i'm i'm
positioning this to you and i'm waiting for colin's
reaction on this Is it about time how we let
the first of the founding chapters die? Let's
just say the Iron Hands die. What about we let
the Iron Hands die and then the Sons of Medusa
could take up the mantle? I would agree, but
change one specific group in that. Let them Imperial
Fists die so the Black Templars reign supreme.
Because that is grimdark. Because the Black Templars
are like the worst. but like in the heresy they
they make a point to say like you turned us in
like into the black templars yeah karn gets a
vision of the black templars is like damn that's
messed up that ain't right yeah so the only reason
i say that is because i'm like iron hands if
they died it would be like it would be like all
right finally won that but also like their suffering
is finally over then the more a schism could
have a bit of birth you have a new color scheme
with like a not neon green but it's different
than caliban or salamanders green they're not
going to blend in with the raven guard you add
stakes of oh a first founding chapter died that's
never happened before because you can't do it
to the blood angels you can't do it to the ultramarines
you can't do it to the white scars i will not
let you so like iron hands can go on the chopping
block and then yeah maybe but i'll save my opinion
more for like when we get to the Space Marine
segment on that, because I have iron hand opinions.
I wish to really vent there. But I think for
the Imperium of Man, the other part I'd add in
here is there's another sub -faction we could
talk about very quickly, which is, I would say
like Adeptus Mechanicus kind of do Grimdark quite
well so far. again, like they should embrace
a bit more of like, I hope they do more dark
mechanic and stuff in the 11th. Like we get,
I think there's a particular thing of grim dark
that doesn't happen as much is what's called
like the body horror of it. And the, like, you
know, when people are learning about a space
Marine, they're supposed to get across that.
Like when someone's turned into a space Marine,
they're not like a custodian where like, they're
still like a human, but like larger and perfectly
sculpted. A Space Marine needs to be, like, ugly.
And... Apart from Blood Angels. Well, they could
be, like, horrifically beautiful, you know what
I mean? But the Edessa's Mechanicus stuff could,
like, if you see on their Codex, like, covers,
they actually have some things like that. But
they need to do more, like, why don't the Mechanicus
have more things that are, like, penitent engines?
like generally like you you think for the faction
that cares so little for humans they would do
something even more effed up well one thing i
found was strange with the there's been a recent
dawn of war 4 trailer about the mechanicus commanders
you get and one's a scutari one one's like a
magos but they're both just kind of like humanoid
and i thought surely one of them could be a beetle
And one of them's even like, oh, she can get
like a plasma incinerator, all this. It's like,
well, surely she can have six legs. That's very
Mechanicus -y. Get some bio -horror, like, yeah,
like body horror going. Let's make the Mechanicus
not just metal -y. Make her into the General
Grievous rolling holy disc. Do something. Turn
her into this beautiful wheel. Not even him turn
her into the wheel. Yeah, roly -poly across the
battlefield. Terrain bonus. Good. Rather than,
I just have legs. And it's like, sometimes we
get another banger like that. Like the Mechanicus,
like the tech priest that's all bloated and fat
and he's kind of gross looking. That model's
cool. Can we get more of him? Even the lady who's
now in the brand new... just just end of 10th
edition stuff with armageddon i think it is she's
like the uh order reductor like scion i'm like
for a person who's all like my thing is about
being a weapon of war she could look a lot more
like messed up with like guns everywhere it's
like come on go crazy this is the mechanic this
is warhammer go crazy that's the whole thing
we got walking cathedrals come on give us something
crazy i think that's also a good part as well
like the the kind of weird part about the grim
dart future is also it's a uh what's the word
like it's not it's not the vatican but it's like
a religious holy state as well like the the mechanic
is unknown obviously for worshiping the machine
god why is there not like a big ass altar like
why are these guys not going into battle chanting
their their binaric hymns with some horrific
display of like you know man and machine combined
into some like this should be a again i think
maybe embracing on the mechanical side more of
that their lack of humanity or like humanity
twisted into some weird like mix together rather
than just guy in red robe priest and he has a
bionic eye like you can go harder than that There's
even a bit I've been I read through the Lysander
stuff and there was a bit there in a Starfort
and it talks about how the data like hive where
the machine spirit lives has all these like Mechanicus
people plugged into it who are like shriveled
prunes and they're all just they're kind of like
and then when this like virus attacks they all
shrivel up and die as like a protective measure
and they start to like wither instantly and turn
to dust. I'm like we could have like a like a
Mechanicus 5G tower. with a bunch of tech priests
plugged in, and they could all be praying to
their antenna, and you could have a weird thing,
where it's like, this is weird and horrific.
Man on stilts with gun is fun. Don't get me wrong.
I do love that. I do love that guy. I love that
mini, but also, could we have some more of that,
but also crazier? Could we have some roly -poly
guys, like General Grievous? Please, go on. It's
the thing of like when people are into Warhammer
for quite a long time. Well, I've been playing
Warhammer for a while. All those people don't
end up playing Space Marines. And there's a reason
for that, which is at some point the Space Marine
feels like too safe. Do you know what I mean?
Like it's such a safe choice and it doesn't embrace
the wackiness and the horrifying nature of like,
I remember when I was learning about Warhammer
years ago, I think it was like a Luton video
where like he mentions how they refill. a uh
ship and there's a guy who has to go out in the
vacuum of space with like a special suit on and
he has to like like he's dying by the second
just to plug in this like he there's not enough
of like someone needs to die in a horrific way
for no reason at all That's only what Grimdark
comes out to be. You need to have a book where
it talks about a void ship when it runs out of
fuel to power its engines. It just chucks labor
serfs into it to keep the fire going just because
they have so many of them. They're like, ah,
it's fine. Chuck Kevin in there. Go on. Why not?
Just needlessly cruel, needlessly barbaric and
silly. Because that's the thing. It was like,
ah, well, what's the sanctity of life? Never
heard of it. Because I think these days it's
more like, you can be like Astra Militarum, man
with gun, times 100 ,000. That works. But man
with gun, when it's Mechanicus, it's just really
unimaginative. It's like, man with a crazy gun?
It's like, ah. Can't he just have like, maybe
he could put his hands into the ground and it
connects with like... the Wi -Fi cables, and
then he can, like, be a network, and he becomes,
like, an outpost that signals, like, a broadcast,
and a big speak comes out of his mouth. Like,
can I do something crazy? Can I do, like, body
horror and weird stuff? It's like, no, man, with
a gribbly gun. Okay. Do you know what it is?
The issue, just on the appearing of man stuff,
the disconnect is not, like, because when you
go through Warhammer lore, it's still, like,
grimdark. It's not really changed too much. But
the... you know, people were, you know, there's
obviously some instances where that's wrong,
but the visual language has changed from Grindr.
And I know that's coming from a company who once
had like goblin green bases and then like, they're
very brightly colored, you know, they're almost
like plastic toys. Well, they are plastic toys,
but like there was an era where that was not
the case too. The issue is like the visual language,
like, you know, we look at like codecs. the front
car of that that's not the model you get like
the the codex arts are often grimdark but then
the actual model is like quite clean so i think
that's where the disconnect is like you need
to uh basically let law have more of an influence
on the design characters or tabletop stuff like
particularly for the imperium of man because
if they expand out the inquisition stuff that
better have some like crazy stuff in it like
they have demon hosts classic early you know
eisenhorn law established is the fact that people
have demon hosts that they i think they removed
it you couldn't once the um imperial agents became
an army you couldn't have demon hosts which obviously
is like crazy stuff you know that's one of the
craziest things in there was like a person's
body then possessed by a demon they're damning
their soul forever so yeah yeah basically You
know what I mean? Match the lore, we'll say for
now. Before we get any further, though, should
we get to the first? Yes, let's do that. Would
you like to read this one, Hal? Well, of course.
I mean, Hal, this one's to all of you. Thank
you, brother. Every stream, thank you. DonkeyManUSA
for five bucks, man. Thank you. You're a loyal
companion, brother. Stream late due to Hal ironing
his warrior till he demonculabas. I didn't need
it. read that, but we did. All will wear a green
hat in three weeks for two. I hope you all got
your hats ready. I know I've got mine. You've
seen mine. I already own a green hat. So good.
So good. Russell, hold on a second. He's slipping.
You can't see him. Hey, bud. You okay? That's
the dog. He's just kind of there. He's just kind
of chilling. There he is. He's nearby. There's
the loaf of bread on the floor. He's loafing
around. Wait a minute. Yes! My unlimited power
is coming in handy. There you go. There you go.
Do you want this one, Colin? Sure. TomNomNom27.
Member for 16 months. Thank you. 40k is already
maximum grimdark because no boing gob. He was
too bright for this. Damn. I misread that name
as giant robot feet. I think I need to get outside.
He's obviously the OCD giant robot fan for 20
bucks. Thank you, man. How do you guys feel about
Russ coming back with the wolf goddess Aisha
who keeps Big E alive longer on who keeps Big
E alive longer on life support, hangs out with
the wolves to forget Nurgle, and hates Eldar
for not banning together to rescue her. Can we
leave the Eldar plotlines to the Eldar, please?
Because that's so much to ask. That was a sentence
you put there. Also, they did try and ban together
to rescue her once. They invaded Nurgle's garden.
It didn't work because they invaded Nurgle's
garden. Yeah, and now a quarter of it was on
fire because of the emperor being like, ligma
balls, and there is that. The fact that you called
her the wolf goddess is crazy. He's already shipping
them, that's why. Evil. This is for you, Colin.
Hgrim2773, thank you for the fiver. Man, Colin,
your pancreas may not work, but my colon blew
up on me Wednesday. Still in hospital. Hope y
'all are well. I hope you're okay, dude. I hope
you're doing well. Jesus Christ, man. I hope
you're doing alright, brother. It blew up on
me, Jesus. There's no one for you, Colin, here.
Ooh. In between, I'm trying to find the name
of something. It'll come up later in the episode.
I'm trying to find this name so badly. But until
then, look back, let retro. Thank you for the
fiver. To Colin, have you read Void's Garden?
If so, what are your thoughts? As my first Eldar
book, I liked it, but I heard Craftworld fans
didn't like it. I have not read it yet. I've
heard good things about it. I am afraid that
it does kind of end there for my input. Andy,
have you read it? No. I have not read it, and
I've heard that might be the last we get of Elves
for a long time. Let's just put it that way.
Was it bad? I don't think that's a factor. I
just think if people don't buy it, it doesn't
matter if it's good or bad. As far as what I've
heard, it's like... Could have been the best
Eldar book we've ever had. Doesn't matter, no
one bought it. As far as I've heard, anyway.
Sorry Colin, I don't know. It's fine, it's fine.
I've accepted that fantasy and AOS are where
I get my elf fix. Oh, Mr Townsend. Good to see
you again, buddy. We're two Australians. Greetings
from Australia, friends. How you doing, buddy?
Are there more snake tales? I hope there are.
Donkey Man USA again for five bucks. Thank you,
man. GW brought back Yari because otherwise they'd
lose their Yowie enthusiast demographic. Well,
no. The throne corpse begins to grow a meaty
wet moss. We don't got to put the flood on the
golden throne. No. The girthy flood. What? Nothing.
All wear a green hat in three weeks. If GW has
to kill a faction for Grimm, it'd be a Xenos
one. Yeah, they would. Send the Botan into Hell's
Anus. They are Xenos, apparently. They're currently
a Xenos faction, apparently. They're in the Xenos
faction on GW's store. Got this one, Hal? Mr.
Townsend again. 20 Austrian. Thank you, man.
What if either a loyalist Primarch just gives
up and self -deletes themselves in front of their
sons, or Vicky wakes up and goes on to kill his
own Imperium and screw it big time to start again,
but this time no sons. That's a crazy first part.
I gotta be honest. I feel like all the Primarchs
would be too arrogant to think that they couldn't
fix something. They'd be like, no, I can sort
it. That's their thing. I can fix it. i guess
it would make me you know i would have like you
know i what is it schadenfreude like just you
know laugh at you know other people's unhappiness
of like rogal dorn comes back and just sucks
starts a bolter oh good one's like ah is this
the state of the imperium i have this i have
this visual now like the Black Templars and the
Imperial Fists are like, oh my god, he's returned,
he's returned. And then there's just Rogald dangling
around the room. What do you like about Rogald
Dorn? He knew how to make a noose. It's like
that family guy bit where he's like, goodnight,
Chris. And then he's like, goodnight, Meg. And
Meg's hanging from the ceiling. this is dawn
like slapping around the room we've got a rather
girthy donation here for wow 1984 for 49 .99
thank you very much for grim derp change how
the orcs reproduce will not elaborate for necrons
treat the flare virus like the hollowing in dark
souls for eldi i'm not sure humans make the dark
king slowly influence humanity as the golden
throne breaks down uh well we already know that
you're smex is gross because grotsnick is like
it's grim yeah so many fluids I don't know like
that I don't know if the Orcs need to bang but
that is a I do like the idea of like the Orcs
being a bit more like the Orcs just like to fight
but they could there's like um you know what's
the uh Crimson Fist novel uh Rinsworld Rinsworld
remember in that bit Andy where like the that
family and they're watching oh yeah and then
like three but the the orcs are like playing
with like the weak human like they pick him up
and it's like hover him over the fire and stuff
like yeah there could be more instances of like
the orcs being a bit more cruel you know i mean
rather than just you know i mean but they don't
usually torture people but as i feel like orc
should only be comic relief when it's a pov from
an orc if it's anyone else it should be the most
horrific like they have no mercy they don't care
about pain again they they put this guy's feet
on the fire and they giggle while he's setting
a fire from the feet up it's like they're horrible
they eat people alive they do all sorts like
orcs terrifying only from an orc's perspective
should they be like funny because from there
it's like that that pyro cinematic from tf2 where
it's the same with the bubble machine like and
then like everyone else is on fire screaming
in a shantytown like that's that's how it should
be necrons like the hollowing from dark souls
a really good idea though thank you a lot of
money by the way thank you so much and the dark
king so the influence humanity of the golden
that is a good idea as well i love it And Grey
Boss. Grey Boss. What if the Eldari die saving
us from Purdy? Thanks. He hates that. Colin couldn't
hate that anymore. There's nothing. The last
one from Zenon says Grimdark come back in the
form of consequences. That is an eerie tale.
So, guys, moving on to the next group. Well,
basically, we're still in the Imperium because
we're finally going to talk about Space Marines.
Space Marines themselves. Space Marines. I do
like thinking back to the iconic Dark Crusade
voice actor guy. The guy is like, you know, the
Horus Heresy. It is Kronos. The Horus Heresy
was a long time ago, and I believe that the orcs
are all gits, and I hate them. The space marines
are lovely. You should kiss them on the mouth.
Kronos. God, that guy does, like, that's, like,
that's one of my favorite things in, like, video
games. It's like, the Horus Heresy was 3 ,000
years, and the word bearers were a bunch of weeaboos.
We should kill them. Hmm. The town made all of
the people sterile. Actually, surprisingly, not
far off there. You should do a whole video, Hal,
one of your multi -hour ones, just doing an impression
of him. You know what I used to do, Andy? I used
to have a three -hour video of me just shouting
Scotland for three hours. Scotland forever. I
love that. Space Marines, though, because I...
got the impression when i was younger i have
a even from the um the poster of what is um the
battle for mccragg well i've said it before i
have the battle of mccragg's set i've got the
um which tyrannic war is that one again is that
the third the first tyrannic war and i have this
artwork of kalgar and like that infamous last
stand or not last time but like it's designed
to be looking like that it's and space means
the amount that they get across like the visual
language like it's a grim dark universe is so
cool because i think particularly the equipment
that they all have what's happened with like
the primaris marines is like the kind i guess
they're trying to somewhat fix it now which is
like 40k when it's first born they all have like
All their things are relics. Do you know that
iconic artwork of all of the Ultramen lined up
as a chapter? And they have that chaplain walking
down the line. And its tone is so gritty and
it looks horrific. And I think they need to...
You don't really see as many space marine recruitment
stories as much anymore. Which I always liked.
anytime I'm in like I'm learning about a space
marine character like I like the Dante novels
I like some of the other ones which you get to
see them before they're space marines because
then you get across how like horrible it is like
when Dante is growing up on Baal and like there's
these thousands of children who are basically
competing to just get to the front door of like
the trials and they go across like a whole desert
and then they almost die and then there's a bit
where like they all go to the um the top of this
cliff and they like create like these fake wings
so they yeah because that's the only way to get
to like the angels landing area and they had
to glide on these fake wings for like hours and
like dante who's not dante yeah is describing
it how when they yeah louise dante like when
they're flying he's like my your arms start to
go numb. And after a while, these predatory birds
start picking off the kids in the water. It gets
across of bloody hell, the amount they have to
go through just to be a space marine. Even again,
just because I've read all of it recently with
Lysander, when it's like, how did he get his
start? Well, we don't know much about his training,
but he was on a pilgrim ship. and his entire
family and all of his friends were murdered by
a murderer on this ship on the way to Holy Terror.
And then he survived that somehow. And then he
was just gawking at the Pillar of Bone, where
it's like the big monument to the Imperial Fists.
And then a chaplain was just there, and he was
just like, that's an Imperial Fist right there.
I'm going to recruit him. Where have you come
from? I just survived the most horrible expedition.
Come here, you. Get in the chapter. Poor fella.
Do you think, because Colin, you're not necessarily
a Space Marine enjoyer, what kick do you not
get out of Space Marines? Do you think they've
lost their grim darkness and that kind of erodes
any interest? I'm going to be honest. We're going
to put aside games like Bolt Gun and Space Marine
2 because those are for fun video game purposes,
right? I'm not... I like those games, but I'm
not... No one is playing Space Marine 2 for the
Epictetus lore. I'm sorry. We are doing that
to watch a tyranid get its head ripped off in
50 creative ways over the course of an hour or
so. But I... honestly i like space marines not
as like background characters but not point of
view because like there's they're like they're
reprogrammed weapons of people and when we go
to their point of view and they're just people
but taller and bigger it's like i'm losing this
like monast this idea of these monastic like
monk like you know battle brothers who are still
nonetheless beyond and also removed from humanity
would you prefer them to be like a force of nature
where they turn up yeah like not like not so
unknowable as like you know like in in theory
the eldar should be but like again like you are
you are so separated from humanity that has been
robbed of you because again they you know they
are child soldiers because i gotta be honest
I went through the race. I recently went through
the first of the iron snakes books and I really
liked how it's ADB. So, you know, it's going
to be good. Yeah. And he did a really good job
of establishing their home world, their rituals,
their mindset. And then I started a dash, like
the one of two partners where it's so cocky.
It's like, it finishes the first one goes, this
will be continued in the second book. I'm like,
it shouldn't, this was rubbish. Like I got through
that book. I'm like, i all the love i had of
the iron snakes i lost in this book because they
were so forgettable and i don't even remember
what i i don't remember what happens in that
book because they just kind of they were just
carbon copy space marines that just did space
marine things i'm like oh they lost all their
character or their charm they're just They're
just there, and they're like, I am a space marine,
and I could be any chapter, and blah, blah, blah.
Oh, Saint Sabat, hello. I am a space marine.
I'm like, oh, you're dull now. Go away. Go where
we were. Yeah, that's fair. I don't... It's...
The problem with giving them character and motivation
and personality like that is that I feel like
they stop becoming... It's very hard to make
them super, like, titanic beyond human beings.
Not impossible. You can make that, like, kind
of super soldier thing, like, where they still
feel human but detached. But I don't know. The
reason I... Do you know they often... That's
why I like a lot more the earlier Horus Heresy
novels. And they kind of don't get this as much.
Despite being, like, chapters, they don't have
as many, like, human... perspectives into like
viewing this like you said like the space marine
from the outside whereas so when you read like
the horus like heresy books in the early one
particularly which are it's like half human half
space marine perspectives and then you're when
you're the humans and then you get to like like
the example would be like in horus rising when
the remembrances get to um they get to go down
to like a planet to like, you know, Oh, you get
to witness the space Marines, you know, finish
clearing up a planet. And then they get to walk
through and then they see the space Marines fight.
It's like, that's one of the first few times
I've ever seen them fight. And they go like,
Oh my God, that was horrific. What? Like, I can't
believe we call these guys heroes. They're just
like, it's like a bulldog with a chainsaw, you
know, like it's a horrific beast of a thing.
And I think that's maybe what's missing. Like
you. if you're too much in like space marine
stories where it's like i like to like just pov
i am titus i'm only titus you don't get to be
scared of the space marine because like you are
the space marine so i think the idea of like
even more like i when i listened to the uh iron
hands book uh which i read it it's not an audio
book um the iron hands books are actually i mean
andy are quite big fans of those ones because
they have parts in it which like make the iron
hands seem like such bastards yeah they have
no compassion they're just like calculus is you're
screwed off i go oh okay but they're dismissively
cruel because not because they'd like to torture
people but because they there's no value in normal
human life there's nothing in them that do you
remember that exchange cardan stronos when he's
he's like a sergeant he's on medusa and there's
like a kid being he's fighting in like a he's
fighting like an animal in like a like a betting
game and he's all like oh i don't really enjoy
this but here's his mistakes and here's why i
can't help him and he was just very matter of
fact he wasn't malicious he was just like no
here's why this is bad and this is why he's going
to die this is why it's not your fault but he
wasn't like i'm going to mourn this child who
died in this like essentially like pit fight
he's just like no here's how he died this is
why he died i'm not going to mourn him but i'm
also not happy about this oh Iron hands, everyone.
They're just calculating about it. That still
is one of my favourite scenes in a Space Marine
novel, which is what they called again the Guardians
of the Iron Council. The Morlocks. Not the Morlocks.
The Hellfathers, sorry. Hellfathers. When Cardan
Stronos sees a Hellfather. That's wrong. yeah
because he's like he's with another human character
he speaks like a mechanicus adept i think in
the scene he's not a but he's just like speaking
to them and they both see a hell father which
for people listening a hell father is like this
guy in like a terminator suit who they never
leave the armor because they're not sure how
much is bionic and how much is human inside And
they've undergone this process where they literally
turn themselves like into kind of a like an upgraded
servitor. But there's no human emotion within
it. And they are genuinely like when even when
the other iron hands are around them, they're
like, that thing is terrifying. It has no humanity
at all. And they're just like, look at you. And
all of them are terrified of them because they're
like, that thing is just a weapon. It is a weapon.
And it's, you know, horrifying and it's upgraded
and it's got cool stuff. And this is kind of
where I'm like, I'd prefer it if the Iron Hands
just became all Hellfivers. Like, what if all
the chapters just became this like byword of
like, oh, as far as the Imperium's concerned,
the chapter's dead. But it's now just like an
undead, not Legion of the Damned, but an undead
chapter that's being fueled by technology. It's
doing its own thing. It's not working with the
Imperium. It just turns up now and again. And
it's like an ill omen. It's like a reminder like,
ah, that's a chapter that lost their Primarch,
like the Blood Angels. They have no direction.
And their bitterness, their need to improve,
got the better of them. And therefore, the end
result was they became a chapter of automatons.
They don't play by rules. They don't have a...
codex astartes approach anymore they just repair
and rebuild themselves they fight and they don't
even realize what they fight anymore for they
just must fight must fight must fight and if
anyone gets in their way they get in their way
and they get in the crossfire but like i feel
like that's where the iron hands should be don't
have characters just have like a weird faction
that's completely logic driven that do that with
the iron hands why not Why not? That'd be cool.
We don't see enough of Space Marines quelling
rebellion. I would love it if it was just like,
oh, there's a secret chaos cult. It turns out
there was no chaos cult. They were just people
who were trying to have a better life. That's
illegal. That's just illegal. There's not enough
time where sometimes the Space Marines are too
much like the heroes. they are protagonists they
shouldn't be the heroes you know what i mean
like yeah i do to some extent get why that is
right because i for the most part people don't
want to read a book where their protagonist right
is just you know hello infant child step you
know it's usually it's usually not what people
are into but that kind of thing is what i was
i kind of what i was trying to say earlier where
it's like when you humanize them like this and
they lose that like transhuman dread which i
think is another thing like people look at space
marines and if they don't feel awe they feel
fear over like what do you what do you what do
you move like how do you do that and another
interesting thing that baltimore said is like
because they're the post boys of the setting
therefore they're used as the yardstick of like
the average faction whereas what they should
be is an elite faction like guardsmen should
be like the standard orcs comparable tower comparable
but because space marines are the like the poster
boys therefore they they are treated as like
the normal like space marines are the average
where really no that they should be above that
but because everything is based around space
marines you then have to add like i guess an
element of like well the tau even though they're
comparable to humans uh we have to like rejig
some of the power scaling and i think that's
also like a thing of if space marines are so
prevalent in the setting they're going to be
seen as the bog standard unit even though they're
canonically not they're law -wise not and so
therefore everything else has to unnecessarily
be upscaled and therefore it kind of it kind
of messes with the the cohesion all the factions
have with each other which again was his point
of like if they were disposable where a captain
is just some guy that's going to die you know
he's going to die and it doesn't matter what
his name is or his story is because he's going
to die anyway that kind of feeds into that but
now that every captain every sergeant every lieutenant
has a book or a video game tie -in or whatever
it adds that element of oh we can't kill these
characters off because we all remember what happened
to Chiron being killed off in a community post
and everyone was like, oh no, Chiron, I loved
him. I'll be honest, I was not that sad. How?
I was not that sad. I wish they killed Gadriel
instead. No, no, Chiron. Wait a minute. Chiron
died. Yes, yes. Yeah, no, pardon me. Wait, no,
wait. In the game. They should have killed one
of them in the game, at least. Yeah, but that
would have made the co -op awkward. Kill them
at the end. Yeah, that's true. In the final cutscene
or something, that could work. Yeah, I think
sometimes with, like, it's that thing of when
you're, like... again we probably mentioned a
bit earlier but like with space ring stories
once like one of the better ones of all time
that people will always come back to is uh hell's
reach and i believe like only like from hell
there's only one other guy like the tech marines
the ones that survive like they're not brave
enough to you know i mean like it's it's a war
zone but the um the part i was going to get to
is that the The thing about, like, you can have
Space Marine characters that are, like, you do
learn their perspective and they're interesting,
but the overarching villain should always be
the war machine that is the Imperium of Man.
And in some way, like, the Space Marine character,
like, in the Dark Imperium trilogy, there's one
point in the third book where they're literally
trying to, like, do a secret mission and have
to cross this, like, Nurgle -infected landscape.
And they find these civilians in a church. And
the civilians start making noise because they're
happy the space marines are here. And they're
telling them to be quiet. But then they start
making too much noise because they're like, we're
not here to save you. So in the space marines,
they're going to make too much noise and attract
the Nurgle demons. So the space marines end up
killing the civilians. That part in the book
is like... yikes that's the perfect encapsulation
of like they're not that you know i mean like
they weren't the heroes necessarily in that moment
but they were the heroes in the overarching part
of that campaign because later on they go to
like fight is it cougar maybe it's cougar i think
is one of the greater demons of nurgle so like
yeah and goblin so yeah that's good the yeah
is is a good uh like envy that's not that's not
too old about law necessarily but I guess it's
10 years almost now, but like it, it shows an
example of like, you know, they, the, you know
what I mean? Like, I don't, if someone's too
much of a clean cut, good hero, you don't get
the aspect of like the universe is as horrible
as it seems. I think that's where it gets eroded
and people are like, Oh, you know? Yeah. It's
too shiny. Yeah. You know, like, like I said,
like make the, make it make sense, you know,
make it all match up a bit. I said, before we
get any further, was there any more of the Dunners
before? There are a few. There's another rather
large one from Jay Townsend. Jesus! For $50.
That's for Colin. Do you want to read this one?
Yeah. Well, Colin, it's getting closer to winter,
so the snake stories may slow, but I got years
of Aussie lore to dump onto you, including the
day that... Me and my mates were swimming in
a river and the next day they pulled a six meter
croc from that exact spot. Holy shit. For reference,
my American friends, that's about 20 feet long.
Scary. You could have lost your mate in one bite.
God. That is horrifying. Well, this isn't a fair
question. at WatchItInTheDerp for 499. Thank
you, that's a good name. To all, which series
would you say is funnier? Emperor, TTS, or Red
vs. Blue? I'm going to say RB Blue. Look, I know
I feel like I'm the odd man out when I say this
here. I do like TTS. I do think it's funny, but
I mean... Red vs. Blue. Yeah, yeah. I appreciate
TTS, but I... I grew up watching Red vs. Blue
on Xbox 360 dashboard when they were on the front
page and you'd watch them every week. It was
good fun. I might say a card here because I had
been watching Rooster Teeth for quite a while
and then I hadn't watched Red vs. Blue, so I
went back to watch it as the company's quite
a bit older now. And I missed the bow on the
heat. Kill this guy. Kill this guy. And I watched
that. I watched like the first few seasons. I
stuck through it. So I was like, okay, it gets
good. It gets good. It gets good. And at times
I did enjoy it, but it was also, I definitely
missed the bow on it at the time. But I do like
a lot of Rooster Teeth stuff. Emperor TTS does
have some pretty. gold moments though it's a
pretty god like uh i'm trying to think of um
what's the one with uh oh my god what's his name
sly marbo like oh just karate chopper this guy
is it is it yeah but the the weird part is like
they've both not been around for quite a while
that if we talk to new people they might not
know what we're even talking about you know i
mean like they're officially getting quite on
just i'm just saying when was the last time we
saw a game studio adopt a meme where it's like
griff ball it's an official playlist inhaler
like yeah that's how influential rvb was we love
it i want most of townsend uh fire australian
um That was terrible. I cannot remember who it
was, but Adeptus Ridiculous interviewed a 48
author and he described using space marines as
monsters rather than human beings. I think they
did it with... Who's the guy with the Mohawk?
Mike Brooks. I didn't want... They did an interview
with Mike Brooks. It might have been him. Or
Nate. Mr. Nate. Not Nate Crowley. The other guy,
Nate something. Yeah, but... I think that's a
good point. Like, yeah, it depends. Like the,
maybe the other I'm thinking about, you know,
it was really good perspective of like the Imperium
itself is in that twice dead King novel. When
the, because it's the Necron novel and it shows
like the Imperial armadas and they're just like,
Oh my God, there's an endless tide of this thing.
So that was a pretty good grim, dark example
there. Andy's blowing kisses to all of the dog,
I think. He's in the cupboard. What are you doing
in there, eh? Good boy. He is such a big tail
for a corgi. Oh yeah, they dock them in the US
and such, so he's got a full old tail. I don't
know why people dock them. I mean, I like nub
corgi, but man. I love big fluffy tail. Do you
want this one, Andy? LF not for $699 Canadian
dollars. Hey, y 'all. Just wanted to toss a few
bucks to you. Handsome fellas are your work.
Keeps me company on a long commute and while
working. Thank you very much. Glad to be of service.
Yeah. Shout to the sleep gang at the moment.
We try to be soothing. Less, less shouty. Sure.
Overly sarcastic productions did a good trope
talk on Grimnark and how it's evolved and the
difficulties to write it. I watched it. And thank
you, Syke. Sykes12146 for the five euro pound.
Fuck. I still do that. You know what the funny
thing is? I have like 80 pounds in my wallet
because when I went to Manchester for Warhammer
Fest, I just got, I went to a currency exchange
thing before I went just in case and I still
have them. Alright, Colin. You want a lore drop
though? Say you have a pound. Do you have a one
pound note? A Guernsey one pound note. I do not
have a Guernsey one pound note. Manchester was
not overflowing with them. That is pretty cool
though. It's legal tender. It's a real money.
My brother used to collect like currency, like
examples of currency from around the world. He
managed to get a Zimbabwe dollar, I think. A
trillion dollars. Yeah, whatever, a million,
million, or whatever it was. That's pretty cool.
Russell's going back in the sound booth. He doesn't
know what it is. He's like, what's in here? He's
having fun. Mr. Wah again. Thank you. Make the
Space Marine into the Lace Marines. Instead of
firing bolters, they fire up. They swing swords.
They swing beer. They love PCP. Wow. Jesus, they're
having a good time. Also, JTownsend, for five
more Aussie lore, went out for dinner for one
night while we were eating. Heard moving above
us, looked up to see a big possum staring down
at me. Big possum good. Unless it's the one from
Adric who bullies Colin. That's not a good possum.
That is a very different possum. That's a real
rat of a man, but we love him. Nice. So... We're
going to get two more dog counters now. We have
pictures of dogs in the background framed. Moving
back onto the next section, we could start going
into Chaos. Now, this might be a bit more difficult
because Chaos kind of already does Grimdark quite
well, I'd say, mostly. like do you think about
you know there's um iconic artworks where they
have like the four different versions of like
the chaos marines and then they're like a bit
old school so they had like the zine sorcerer
the noise marine the corn berserker and uh the
nurgle guy like they is it no good but i remember
like the um the noise marine guy and that god
that's horrifying that picture if you know what
i'm talking about that one is yeah yeah it's
I know for the tabletop, the things are all painted
in heavy metal style because they're to sell
a product. They're just showing you the basics
of it. But going through Chaos itself, Chaos
is quite good. And I really enjoy the fact that
Chaos itself can be quite... It's just haunting.
Even being a Chaos worshipper, I think... I know
that basically... the litmus test for this thing
is basically the Damoculaba. I don't know how
you guys feel, but like, should anything ever
get worse than that? Because I do remember like
years ago, I heard the Luton video about talking
about what it was. I think I was a bit younger,
but I was like, I was listening to it. And I
remember thinking that genuinely sounds horrible.
That made me feel weird listening to that the
first time. I'm probably a bit desensitized to
it now, but I don't know what you guys... Did
you have any initial thoughts or reactions to
that? Contemplating that. Wow, hollowness, apparently.
Absolutely hollow. The thing is about that, I
find it like... I find that bit of lore a bit
like what a 13 year old thinks is like edgy there's
much worse things you could do because like in
the grand scheme of things it's a horrible thing
that happens to a few people but like if you
can properly describe like a global plague that
kills billions and it's getting to the point
where like There are sores and pustules and people
are dying and relatives and blah, blah, blah.
That's way more horrific than, like, a few people
being turned into, like, skinless space ring
clothes. Up your hoo -ha, hee -hee. Yeah, yeah,
it's a hee -hee -hee, gribbly. Even things like
the idea of playing with feasting on a person's
immortal soul and... doing all that like even
the guy who's like uh in the the god blight books
how who gets folded in on himself again and again
and can't die and is reset and again that one
is so like well described it's horrific when
you go i can't remember who wrote that was it
great it wasn't graham was it whoever wrote that
i'm like dude what's wrong with you guy hayley
guy what what what happened to you what why did
you do this he's the guy we didn't need to know
how to like you know that thing that say you
can only fold a piece of paper so many times
he did that to a person's like dude what's wrong
with you see a psychiatrist i think it's like
the guy gets over bloated and then he starts
to shrivel up to the point where like his skin
and bones start cracking yeah and then like but
the point like he starts like he starts folding
in on himself because he's so like his moisture
just got absolutely yeeted out of his entire
system so like it's a pretty horrific way to
go i think the most part like sunesh stuff i
know obviously to be fair like i don't want to
go down that road necessarily so next does it
quite well obviously noble stuff does corn i
mean i don't know how to called like a god of
murder i don't really go murder like god of war
slash you know killing us like it's not really
as scary i think like some people have described
like when you in some story they make world leaders
pretty terrifying but again like i don't know
if i maybe it's like i've read so much warhammer
that i'm just like i feel like if you're a clever
writer you could do a whole thing with like a
scene plot where it's like imagine the worst
like real real life account you've ever had of
someone who said alzheimer's and then you play
that into a story where a person just keeps like
forgetting and misremembering and then there's
repercussions with other people and there's a
whole scene where like that could be way more
horrifying than like i skinned you like yeah
it would hurt a lot and that'd be that's pretty
horrific but when you got like the night lords
do it the world leaders do it lots of people
do it and what is like it's like oh it's a bit
one note where it's like if you could have like
a whole plot of like but like like something
like old boy the korean version not the american
one like if you had like a scene plot that was
like old boy and it was on like 11 out of 10.
i feel like that'd be way more horrific than
oh you just skinned night lord skin people that's
who's that yeah yeah okay another skin cape add
some layers to it i think with chaos the one
the only things that generally i thought was
quite a terrifying idea on the chaos perspective
it's like you know in um in the heresy when malikador
was speaking to his little like tortured poor
servant who just like keeps getting made and
then just to be his like therapist and then i
think he says to this person that when people
die they just get devoured by the war like every
single person like i guess in the 40k maybe does
the emperor do they go to the emperor's side
who knows but it was a thing like he describes
like basically the horrifying truth of the universe
is that when every single person dies their soul
goes into the warp and i think that means that
they're basically prey so you know i think the
idea like that comes up a bit more prevalent
that can be quite an interesting take because
the like what makes like grim dark universes
so like the idea of what you make like as a grim
dark universe is like basically the whole i mean
i mean i'm maybe wrong here but the whole point
is like being dead is being better than being
alive in it is that like the kind of i that's
the whole thing what was it that person mentioned
osp what they mentioned is like it's like grimdark
is like when you put a hero into a grimdark setting
something needs to break if because either it's
going to stay grimdark and what breaks is that
hero or they can still be heroic and it's no
longer grimdark because you've got a superhero
running around saving the day and other and kind
of like building on that it's like for grimdark
it like at least my ideal image is like a happy
ending is not on the horizon like in there and
anything you do is if not meaningless then like
delaying the unhappy end that's going to happen
like there is no recourse there is no saving
the day and that needs to you know apply to everyone
like you know even chaos isn't going to ever
get its big victory because the imperium's gonna
hold it to a standstill but flip side The Imperium's
churning through lives and, you know, different
practices, both necessary and unnecessary. And,
like, it needs to be shit. The trouble with,
like, such a large setting for Chaos specifically
is, like, they need to have wins reliably. Otherwise,
they seem impotent. And right now... We need
Armageddon to fall. We need, like, something
tangible. Like, Cadia was a good start, but unless
Chaos can get, like, some tangible wins, unless,
like, Tyranids had that whole thing of, like,
the fourth trinity where they were like, hey,
vote which planet. Is it going to be the Ultramarines
who win or the Tyranids win? And it was the Tyranids
that won because people were fed up of Ultramarines
winning and Space Marines winning. We need to
have more tangible, like, A. we're getting close
to the throne world and maybe it's like a push
back and a push forward and push back but like
right now it's like oh armageddon okay katie's
gone i thought that was a big deal it doesn't
seem like it because katie's gone and tara's
okay uh like the stakes aren't moving and cicatrix
maledictum was good because it cut the galaxy
in two but also it's like well half the galaxy
is on the throne world side the other half isn't
so like the nihilist side who who gives a it's
like oh nihilist it's like the wild west yeah
you almost heard almost heard nothing as in like
yeah yeah perspective wise from that region yeah
oh what again oh he's i thought he was doing
vigilance no he's done that oh okay ultra marine
victory i guess cool i think would A lot of the
Chaos stuff, they do it quite well, and a lot
of the Grimdark stories, or even the Emperor's
Children models, I think the most recent releases,
they are pretty on point, I'd say. A lot of that
other stuff looks good. As always, you can paint
your models the way you want to, but I think
particularly, it's why I particularly have a
love for word -bearer stuff. The word -bearers
are the ones which I love, because they generally
are terrifying. Because they just basically at
the end of the day go, listen, I'm going to torture
you because it works. And they just go, if I
do this to you, a little bit of demon power will
work for me. So I'm just going to do it to you.
I know you probably like thinking I'm hateful,
I'm cruel. No, I'm just going to do it because
I'm going to get something out of it. like that's
even more terrifying it's like the um i mean
like not to get like too historical but they
show like um they talk about like world war ii
or other kind of history things the people who
often did like the most horrific stuff were just
like they they when they interviewed them they
didn't find them to be like really like vindictive
There's that film where it's like there were
the guys who lived next to Auschwitz and therefore
they were just like doing the laundry and doing
and they were like, they hear the scream, but
they didn't acknowledge it. I can't remember
what the film's called, but it's just like, oh,
they desensitize themselves and they're just
like, oh, it's just normal now. It's like, no,
it's not normal. Yeah. Well, there is a terrifying
because they just. You know, they like, they
just do it. And they're like, I'm not doing this
because it makes me happy. I'm not like an emperor's
children or anything like that. I'm just doing
it because it needs to be done. So pretty horrible.
I wish they took more of a center stage. Black
Legion, shove it up your anus. I don't care.
Let Lorgar return and be a horrible bastard,
maybe. And then Korrax can kill him. Who knows?
That'll be pretty enjoyable. Said before we get
any further rally up with the Xenos stuff Hey,
we could yeah, if you do few more the damage
From Zenon chaos grimdark let word bearers be
quite Paris see He's on that he's on it Also
No, miss Chomsky became a member for six months.
I know he did Colin. Does he mean was he mean
by that? Gonna need more to go off of than that,
dude. Okay. Oh, that one by Wah. Thank you, man,
so much. Last message, got no job brackets. They
need more warp stuff outside of Chaos. There's
an infinite amount of stuff in the warp. There
should be more stuff, like the Watcher in the
Rain or other creatures. That is a good idea.
Bring back the Crotolids. Do not know what this
man is talking about. Warp Crocodiles. I think
we also had one of them in the Red Corsairs pack
that came out. I think there is. Yeah. No, no,
but no, no, wait, no, because no, they're just
crocodiles, but they use the warp to traverse.
Because there's like a crocodile. Sorry. They
do crazy stuff. Okay, guys, so rounding it out,
we're going to begin with the Xenos section.
Colin. Do you want to save Eldar for last, or
do you want to go tackle them first? I mean,
the Eldar have done a pretty good job at keeping
the Grimdark up, because they just keep getting
the piss beaten out of them. So yeah, it sure
does feel like they are the last survivors hopelessly
holding off the end when I read an Eldar blurb.
Life kind of does suck to be an Eldar. Like,
it really, really sucks. Someone made a point
earlier If you're listening to the remastered
version, you wouldn't have heard it, but in the
donation, someone made a point about the Dark
King thing. It'd be really cool if someone had
an example of like, you know how Slaanesh sucks
on Eldar souls as soon as they immediately exit
the mortal universe. I think that'd be a cool
thing if humans had some entity that sucks their
soul immediately, but then they didn't. It took
a while for them to notice that. Yeah, Eldar...
Sorry, sticking with Void. Eldar... I mean, life
of an Eldar, Colin, pretty bad. Not great. You
know, actually, you know, funny thing is, like,
in day -to -day life, craft worlds are pretty
damn nice to live in. It's just then the subject
of a book happens, and then they all start exploding
very violently. And then when they die, they
go to super hell. Do you think they've killed
off too many... craft was at this point, because
it's hard to make, in some way, more grimdark
for the elves. I mean, I know this is a Warhammer
fantasy line, but there was an author who I believe
almost word for word said there are as many elves
as the plot demands. So, no, I don't think they've
blown up too many craft worlds. I think they
will never do that, but they will always threaten
to do it. Yeah. I think with Elder stuff, it
is obviously pretty horrific. their lives. It
could be an idea of maybe there's more infighting
between craft worlds, but that almost seems...
I think more in the Grimdark future, the idea
that happens a few times in Eldar stories is
they attempt to work with humans because they're
forced to work with the Monkai to do a thing,
and then they end up getting betrayed. I think
they already do that quite well, so I don't know
if that one... I think there's something on Vigilus
and then Calgar was like, yeah, you can kill
those people because, you know. That was some
properly grimdark stuff. How do we pay this blood
debt? Okay, Imperial nobles, come inside this
building. There's candy inside. And then they
lock the door on the magical space elf murder
dungeon. Oof. Which you don't deserve. Speaking
of... was already grim dark is the drew kari
themselves though because i i don't know yeah
do you don't have any more points i want to add
to the elder so they're they're grim i feel honestly
they're grim dark enough like like you know a
good old yanari plot line of we're going to save
the elder race the last thing you need for that
is slanesh is dangling it between crotch I feel
like the thing the Eldar need is they need to
make more alliances because they're the only
faction who's like on the precipice of death.
So like they've done stuff with like. dawn of
war for example but i feel like they need to
make uncomfortable alliances like we'll make
an alliance with the tao even though we think
that they are like too naive we need to make
alliances with the necrons because we hate them
because there are mortal enemies but we need
to get one over on the imperium oh we need to
make an alliance with the orcs kind of like they
did with dawn of war but like we're going to
try and manipulate them and maybe then the manipulation
fails because orcs are so stupid it kind of counteracts
like i think we need the elder to be more like
the kind of like oh we need any help we can get
we can't because the problem i have with elder
is when i've read all their stuff it's like aren't
you guys supposed to be coming to extinction
you seem to be getting on okay like they're like
the craft world stuff they're in these like craft
worlds and they seem to be like i'm still doing
poetry i'm doing all these different paths that
aren't combat related and it seems to be paradisal
and i'm like aren't you like threading the needle
of your own doom like surely yeah you need a
bit more like of a I'm not going on a gap here,
Dad. I've got to stop the extinction of my entire
race kind of thing. Actually, now that I'm thinking
about it too, I would say one thing that could
keep the Grimdark going and give them credit
is have their plots and schemes actually work,
like just work, but then we get a reason why
it doesn't matter that they pulled off the 10
out of 10 perfect round in the fighting game
match and it just doesn't fucking matter. instead
of the normal thing which is you know again like
any ad like yep you could have uh it would have
just unironically worked but the guy said he
doesn't care if you kill a whole chaos god he
just doesn't want you to win right now i i don't
i don't care if you win i need the eldar to lose
fucking kylo ren whatever hawks looking ass let
let the elder get a win and then explain why
it doesn't work like or not work why it doesn't
matter not keep kicking them in the sack And
then going, yeah, but they're like, you know,
cool still buy these minis. It's like, no, I
don't want to now. And the idea of like, there's
a, I think because the elder, like there's something
you'd like, they don't necessarily have hope,
but they have like a thing of, I think in some
way, like the more unity between them is almost
like the greatest signal of like the end is near.
The fact that they don't have the option to put
aside their differences, or they have the option,
sorry, to put aside their differences, or whatever
the phrasing is, but as in they're like, we're
all going our own way. It's like, no, no, no.
You've got to band together or it's death. You
know what I mean? Full send it, you know, crap.
Someone's going to destroy all this stuff. I
quite like the Harlequin stuff I've read because
they are bipartisan. They're like, They ally
more with Drukhari because Drukhari don't care.
But they work like Motley's stuff in the Drukhari
books. He's like, I'll side with Eldar, Crathwelders,
and Exodites, and Drukhari, because Drukhari
are easy. But he's like, I'll side with whoever
I need. And he doesn't pick any side because
he's like, we need to unite as an entire species.
We can't have these different factions. And I
really like that because... They're the ones
who are like, we're the smallest of all the Eldar
factions. And yet we're very bespoke, but we
can't do it all our own. We have to like actually
make alliances and trick this guy and pilfer
from that guy and try to reestablish this power
base so that that power space can, can bolster
themselves in the future. I really like that.
And then it's like, ah, and then Craftwell books,
they heard her. I'm going to be a poet. I'm going
to make pottery. Oh. so mr mike of the grail
made a great point i was thinking of which is
uh even when we get those moments of like oh
like something goes well but then ends up being
bad or like it's just snatched away at the last
second yeah captain artemis my beloved even when
we get that we kind of like i kind of low -key
hate it i guess what i mean it's like let them
have an unqualified win and it just isn't enough
like they I was going to say, Colin, you can't
give Artemis too much flack, because just remember,
without Captain Artemis doing that, we wouldn't
have had the Inari, so we wouldn't have had those
fantastic Inari books. Of course, yes, I should
thank him for that. I should thank him for the
trilogy so ass it didn't get to be a trilogy.
Yeah. Punch in the face. Obviously, I think the
Eldor... in some way they do grimdark quite well
like whenever i learned about anything elder
i just feel like depressed man and that's obviously
what we're going for in this episode so they
do that quite well the next one though is let's
do orcs i just do necrons very quickly yeah guys
are good necrons no notes wakey wakey flesh and
bakey perfect fine love them There is a lot of
grimdark horror with them already that I think
is well done. Every now and again, you're told
that, by the way, this guy really wants to breathe.
He needs to breathe. Why can't I breathe? And
I'm like, all right. Yeah, that's horrifying.
Yeah, and only the officer cast matter because
all the others are drones. Yeah, no, no, they're
fine. I think I've read at some point, maybe
it was a short story or a blurb in some book,
but even that, you also get sometimes like a
Necron warrior awakens. They have their personality,
but they can't... They have no mouth. Yeah, they
have super locked -in syndrome, basically. It's
like, wow, I didn't want to sleep comfortably
tonight anyways. Thanks. And then there's the
destroyers where there's that one who's like,
I'm a prince of this dynasty. He woke up before
the entirety of his dynasty was driven mad. Then
he was roaming around the halls, killed his friends,
and then he became the destroyer lord. And it's
like, yeah, that's fun. and it was all a plot
by another one from his dynasty who woke him
up early intentionally like yeah they're fine
necrons are fine they're grim enough yep i have
no notes i guess uh if they wanted one thing
like the guy in the in the in the dono said uh
if you know make the make the flare virus a kind
of like hollowing -esque yeah like dark souls
and you die you lose a bit more each time you
get yeah which i think i think does happen I
wish it happened with that Hellbrecht versus
Imhotek battle, because I could have used that.
Imhotek, he was getting crunked again and again,
and he's like, respawn, get the GameShark out
of your cartridge. Get out of here. Nah, but
see, that's different. He just had, like, you
know, Vegeta -level arrogance. It didn't matter
if he got his ass beat. He's coming back for
round two. Oh, my dad works at Nintendo, said
Emotech. Yeah, fuck you. Get out of here. Emotech
spent the entire fight just doing the fucking,
the Dragon Ball thumb point foes, which means
a character is without fault about to get the
floor wiped with them. And then it just didn't
matter because he just came back. Hello, Athena.
Oh, Doug. I like the idea with Necrons. They
have a thing, you know, like Trezin and Orokin,
they had a whole, you know, the future of the
Necron race, will you return to flesh or will
we become spirit beings? I like the idea of being
like, they're both just dead ends. There will
never be another Necron, new Necrons. There's
only a finite amount of Necrons and they are
only going down. Which I think is more of a tragedy
sort of thing. Yeah. think yeah combined with
that you know if you die too many times you eventually
become a foot soldier that'd be pretty cool because
it's like pretty sad it's like oh maybe dying
is not worth it you know maybe let's try not
to die too much uh the next one yeah we did you
know not too many notes for necrons but orcs
now this is difficult because orcs funny my beloved
red go faster uh princess the squig you know
i i'd love orcs being kind of a comic relief
in some sense but i think andy had a point earlier
about like was it you said the orcs should be
terrifying from every perspective other than
their own but they should be a bit more i think
we also had someone here said someone in their
donation was it uh who said like they should
um reproduce normally which is a hell of a take
What do you mean by normally? Only normal for
us. I just come from Mushroom. That's normal.
There's more of us than you. I don't know. Do
you remember the first Dragon Age, Andy? Oh,
yes, I do. I love that first game. Do you remember
the bit that makes it feel weirdly uncomfy? Is
the... Broodmother? Yes. I knew what you were
going to say as soon as you mentioned Dragon
Age. I was like, yeah, the Broodmother. It's
like a hint, isn't it? It's a hint to something,
but, like, it's not... Fun fact, there is a broodmother
in the Lysander books who eats its young. So,
yeah. Grim. That's one of the few things where,
like, I like the idea, like, if they wanted to
make orcs really horrific, they could do something
like that. Basically, it's how the Skaven reproduce.
I mean, technically, they eat squigs, and squigs
are technically orcs because they're just a different
subspecies. So, like, orcs already devour their
own... They eat Gretchen. Orcs is orcs is orcs.
They're all mushrooms. They eat each other. Do
you want to explain what I'm talking about the
broodmother in Dragon Age quickly, Andy? No,
I'd rather you do it because you brought it up.
You know what? There's no way. It's like a dwarven
lady, right? Who goes down to the deep roads
and then is like captured by the darkspawn. You
thought the Demonculaba was bad? What if it was
worse? Yeah. It's in the title, Broodmother.
Yippee! I love Dragon Age Origins. Why did they
have to make it worse with every iteration of
Dragon Age? The first one was amazing. Are you
telling me Dragon Vet? What was it called? Something
Veil? Oh. Something Veil, yeah. Wolf Veil? No,
not Wolf Veil. Veil Guard. Are you telling me
Veilguard was not the best thing you've ever
seen? I'm just saying every game they put out
was worse than the last, in my opinion. Dragon
Age 2 was worse than 1. Inquisition was worse
than 2. Veilguard was like... It was like a stairwell
that kept going down and down and down. They
nailed it, and then they worsened it. That's
the only game franchise where I legitimately
thought someone should go for prison for how
much they murdered that. That was an assassination.
In Age 1, you could play as multiple species
who had their own origin stories, and then 2
is like, who's going to play as this emo guy
called Hawk? Oh. And then they're like, we're
going to bring back all the species, but they're
all just kind of the same. There's no backstory,
it just doesn't matter. It got worse. We should
do a Dragon Age episode just purely ripping on
it. I'll do a fancy fireside on Origins and then
we'll never talk about Dragon Age again because
it was spoiled potential. Yes, but that would
be my thought on how to make the Orcs horrified
because generally that is horrifying to me. Good
way of doing it. Tyranids? I mean... It's already
Genesteak, isn't it? It's already... i feel like
they're kind of pretty good i guess the way to
make them grimdark is let them win on screen
more but aside from that i mean all devouring
swarm of intergalactic space locusts they it's
it's pretty like just inherently grimdark and
messed up and you know terrifying right i feel
like I feel like they could take a page out of
dead spaces book where they could be like, maybe
have like a collective, like, I know that the,
like Tigurius has kind of spoken to the hive
mind. I want more of like, what is the like objectively
highest hive mind? I want more of that. just
so we can impress upon all the other characters
that interacts within the setting how out of
their league it is and how terrifying it is because
at the moment it's just like it's just a bunch
of gribblies it's just a bajillion gribblies
and we don't really know any characters because
they all die because gene sealers get eaten by
all the gribblies so it's like oh i want to have
some kind of consciousness that scares the other
characters that's all i want Fabius Bile in the
Blood Angels omnibus captures a Neurothrope and
it asks one of the Blood Angels to kill it because
it's in so much pain. So there's more going on
than just primal instinct. It communes with Raffen
and his team like, please kill me. I want that.
I want more of that. But the only way we're going
to get that is if we have the highest hive mind
reaching out now and again. So that's kind of
the issue. I think the only way to make Tyranids
possibly more grimdark is if it's that whole
thing of, like, it's confirmed that this isn't
the main, like, force of it or whatever. Like,
in some way, like, it's a theory, isn't it? Like,
there's more of it. Like, we've only seen, like,
a fraction of it so far. Just straight up just
be like, yeah. Or even the archivist who's a
zoet who works for the Tyranids, but he's a different
species. characters that are intermediaries agents
people who are indoctrinated by the uh tyranids
as a mediator i want to see more because that's
the only way you can have them be fleshed out
pardon the pun but like the only way to flesh
out the tyranids is have a common ground between
them and the other characters to facilitate that
kind of like that remember like the uh alien
alien game came out i think it was alien versus
predator and there was a character who had like
a little alien in his chest and he had like a
weird like mask and everything he's like ah i
am i communicate with the aliens you need someone
like that and they wasted him because he died
in the same cutscene i think but i was like you
need some bridge of that gap to make them more
compelling there's like the darkspawn thing in
dragon age again there's like the weird uh not
emissaries although that's something else aren't
they like they're weird sentient darkspawn, like
proper sentient ones. Oh, the ones who invaded
heaven. Yeah, like the... I can't remember what
they're called. Like Corypheus. Oh, no, I mean
like... There's like an enemy type, I think,
or something. I don't know. Oh, yeah, yeah. I've
not played. I don't know. They were good. They
were good. First game. First game. Peak. I'll
say that... had a cool idea which like now we
kind of we've hit most of the main factions if
you want any more but please do comment on the
video because we'd love to hear any of your suggestions
for stuff because there's plenty of opportunity
here i don't know no sorry i thought you were
no no you go it's fine you go i say did i like
hard zone out for it or did we just kind of collectively
just and unspokenly agree we can just leave the
dark altar alone oh we mentioned we said they
were grim dark enough I thought that was it,
but I would say, okay, okay. They're fine. Yeah,
they're fine. My last two points were Grimdark,
nuke the Leagues of Otan immediately. That's
not Grimdark. You just want them exploded. I
literally thought, when are we going to talk
about the Wotan? And he said, before that, and
I thought, oh, here we go. I have no notes. Immediately
nuke every... votan child so they're not there's
no votan children they're all grown um nuke every
votan from existence uh eat your heart out off
the bones um and my last one is i wish there
was another faction other than tau because tau
is like i forgot almost forgot tau there every
second guys we have any notes for tau i don't
know if there's anything to do with tau i i think
tau's progression has to be pit their naivety
against the reality of the setting and have them
continually lose their morals as they realize
every species that followed the Eldar gets worse
and worse and worse because that's the only way
they can survive. Humanity sucks. had a meteoric
rise and then a calamitous fall because they
didn't have a choice to an extent of like, oh,
we're kind of screwed anyway. There's already
a big rip in reality called the Eye of Terror.
We've already got the Necrons, the Eldar, the
Dark Eldar. We've got the Orcs already. We've
got Chaos. We've got everything to deal with.
Every species that follows gets a worse deal.
And so the Tau have to be like, right, we have
to abandon maybe compassion, then maybe mercy.
then maybe we have to abandon, you know, like,
Tau rights. And then it's a continual, like,
begrudging acceptance of, oh, if we want to not
be slaughtered, we can't be no good no more.
Yeah. Even if they don't do that, their grimdark
can be, like, the contrast. It's like, look,
we have, like, you know. even if you made them
like totally unironic good guys right here's
the star trek federation they're great it's lovely
come be peaceful and then you zoom out just an
inch and it's like oh you're like a percentage
of a percentage of the galaxy you're so have
a story like where it's like we are not going
to abandon our morals let's see how well that
works out for you like That could be a story
arc. That could be a faction arc of like, we'll
never abandon our ideals and say, well, guess
what? You're doomed to perish. And that could
be their thing. But it's like, it underlines
the setting. And then it could be like, oh, unlike
the Eldar who scrapped with their fingernails
to try and survive, the Eldar willingly embraced
annihilation rather than become monsters. That
could be their thing. They could be humble right
to a fault. But there has to be a cost, I think.
So that would be interesting. I was going to
end it on, I had an idea for another faction,
like a dark version of the Tau, which is, you
know, there's loads of minor, like, Xenos factions,
and wow, they're kind of interesting. Like, God,
I blanked it there massively then. I was thinking
about... The Trust, the Felonids, the Longshank,
well, they're abhumans. oretti there's something
with the fraud sorry the hard was what i think
right yeah other ones like i'd like the idea
if there's a faction that is it's not chaos but
like they come to an understanding of like life
in the universe of warhammer is fundamentally
not worth it so the idea of this faction is to
simply gather a force large enough to basically
end all of existence To stop the cycle. And not
like chaos. Like sacrifice of the war. I just
mean end chaos too. Like you know the cabal said.
If you kill all humans. It will supposedly save
all the other species. Just do that. Just have
like a faction. Just like you know what guys.
Let's just all end it. That would be pretty cool.
That's pretty grimdark. And pretty horrific.
I guess other than that though. I think that's
most of the factions done. I think that's how
we grim docked it up as best we can, obviously
without 100 hours prep time. I'm not going to
throw babies into a meat grinder or anything
like that. We're not getting that stupid. But
we did have some minis of the week. I think we
had some from the previous. episodes also previous
um things but we've also got some for this episode
because you guys been although again if you want
to join our discord uh that's where you can watch
the live streams unedited and that's what the
donation stuff is uh check out our discourse
and then we have our little channels where there's
uh people submit their tabletop stuff yeah we've
each chosen a selection what we got first andy
So the first one is the one that you chose. This
is from Saint Wagons. Can you tell us about this
one? Look at how, like, that slaps you in the
face, doesn't it? It's got a lovely font. Yeah,
that is, like, particularly the, I don't know,
was it the nudgles or whatever it's called, like
on his hands, which go, like, feed into his massive
gun. That is pretty cool. This thing fucks. that
is a that is a silhouette this model if also
well painted white always is just like incredibly
impressive to me because i'm so with painting
white i never also it reminds me of like a molten
like you've got The molten orange, you've got
the white ash, and you've got the charcoal black.
It has all the elements of a cohesive color palette.
It's like a fiery molten ether in it thing. It
looks good. It makes me want to paint some of
my new models white, because that's really good.
I really enjoy that, man. I know, it's STEM.
Colin's enjoying this. Chef's kiss. He's enjoying
it. This person's a good painter. Thank you very
much, brother. Thank you. Colin, this one is
from Fat Man Kitchen. What's up with this one?
You mentioned... This is what, by the way, when
I said I was trying to find the name of something,
we have here our nice... This is a battle mech.
I know this is a battle mech. I think... it's
a chameleon i think it's a chameleon but i don't
know for certain either way i love it it's got
like that retro paint scheme and i think it's
done quite well especially i like the little
like you know how bright it is but at the same
time like you know you've got the little like
the like the white on the cockpit window as if
it's like you know it's like the light reflecting
off of it i like the I just, I like it. It's,
it's very like simplistic, but very well done.
I like when I like, I like minis like that, like
in that older style, like that heavy metal style,
I think they would call it, or even outside of
like, you know, Warhammer, just that eighties,
nineties, like very bright, flashy style. This
is well done. Please tell me someone tell me
what this fucking mech is almost positive. It's
a chameleon. but i i don't know and that took
me like in the background like 45 minutes of
just scrolling through the battle tech wiki looking
at pictures of max to try and figure out what
it kind of has that it looks like an old rogue
era trade uh rogue era titan but also like the
way it looks it's like you know they're like
They made those suits for ladies in the 70s,
80s that had the big shoulders to make them more
masculine. It's got that thing with the trousers
and the gun. I'm like, that's pretty fun. It's
like the big puffy shoulders. Nice reflection.
And this is my dick from Miss Tyler. I also saw
that one. This one is also just like... Yes.
This is the opposite end of the spectrum where
there's so much goddamn detail. Jesus, that sword.
It's a Zeus. Thank you. Sorry. It's a Zeus. Yeah.
One thing I love about this one is the little
lantern in his left hand. It looks glowy. And
so that's now on the foot. And so you can see
the blue light on it. That's so well done. It
looks like it's glowy. That's so good. Damn.
And we all love the sword cleaner. Everyone loves
the sword cleaner. It's our favorite. mini side
character in all of Warhammer. It's the sword
cleaner. What's his job? He cleans the sword.
Poor Orc. And the Orc looks like gribbly as well.
He looks completely messed up. That sword cleaner
is definitely putting in the work right now.
And I like how pristine Helbrecht and the sword
cleaner are. And then how crusty the Orc is.
He looks like it looks like the sword cleaner
has put the work in to keep Helbrecht nice and
shiny. And then the Orc just shows the talent
of the painter to be like, oh, But this is what
the result is. Before the cleaning, it just looks,
oh, I love it. It's really good. Well done, Mr.
Ivar. That's good stuff. I think we also had
a question of the week from the previous weeks.
I don't remember what the previous question was.
I don't think I was there for that episode, unfortunately.
It is unfortunate, but not to worry. We have
greatest of best good questions of the week.
It was simply hashtag thank wall. What setting
are you tossing them into? There's quite a few
good answers for this. I'm going to start off
with a short one by Alex AAU. I'd plop thank
wall the total war. You hear me? So true. So
true. Where is he? Where's our boy? uh we have
bennis dd uh just tossed a little bastard into
the elder scrolls uh he'll blunder his way into
recreating scaven from skeevers pluck every pick
clean every dwemer ruin then cause black reach
to cave in swallowing several old capitals there's
a city called scaven in the elder scrolls fun
fact his capital and the waiting is right there
i think it's in hammer fell I need to check the
maps. Oh, my God. I only know that because I
bought from a Renaissance fair. They had a map
of Tamriel, and I was looking at it. I was like,
what are you doing there? Why is there a town
called Skaven? Is Elder Scrolls 6 ever going
to come out, Colin? No, no, no, no. But Skyrim
will ten more times. They had a trailer for it
seven years ago, didn't they? yeah sorry trailer
tease a 10 10 second teaser something i was announcing
they were thinking about working on it i gotta
be honest i saw the trailer yesterday for stranger
than heaven the prequel to yakuza set in like
the 19 1913 to 65 there's a time span and snoop
dog is in it i'm like i don't give a fuck about
gta 5 gta 6 or uh elder scrolls i don't care
give me that give me snoop dog and a yak as a
game i don't care anymore Let's go. We got a
few more. Velpress. I would put the funny rat
into Lord of the Rings. Imagine Sauron's reaction
when he finds the ring has been stolen from Gollum
or the Fellowship by a rat who would trade it
for magic crack. That's pretty good. Bruh. And
then the last one from Exported Cheese. Wow,
that's a good name. I would send him to Blizzard's
office for killing my turtle. There's a backstory
there. There's lore to that one. I'm sorry to
hear that happened. We don't have time to unpack
all that. This trauma should stay in its box
for now. I think a lot of people have sent packages
to blizzards, to be honest. Oh yeah, when they
sent all the... Not as a blizzard, to Bethesda,
when they had a bunch of bottle caps when 76
came out. weigh this yeah just don't send blizzard
any breast milk nope don't do that anyway that
was uh that was that was making warhammer so
we need a question of the week this week um we
could just how would you make 40k yeah how's
that grim how would you make 40k grim but give
the wrong answer like don't give an actual proper
answer like like just give me an answer which
makes absolutely no sense so we have so eli has
to read it out next time but like what did you
guys even talk about so yes how would you make
40k more grim completely wrong completely wrong
yeah like just just start just yapping about
like unicron or something or something just total
nonsense like how you just opening up like a
a dog petting shop or something like just completely
confuse him yeah so he's not ready for it uh
that being said though i thank you guys everyone
for listening for watching of course you want
to check us out offline and spotify and other
parts and obviously dude on the discord because
then you can be involved and get you know access
to offline although our streams unedited you
know with the donations and all that funny crap
we say you make us say all the time and we'll
catch you guys all in the next one peace bye
everybody i knew your face was waiting unlimited
power