Hi everyone, welcome to Potluck Food Talks. Today we're going to talk about condiments.
Condiments.
So what are condiments? Because a lot of people confuse stuff like spices, what are spices,
some people put like dry herbs into that category. My definition are like these pre-made sauces
that add most of the time flavor to things but I would say mayonnaise is also a condiment
that adds like not necessarily flavor but just like this sliminess and texture to whatever
you're eating.
Yeah I think I agree a condiment has to be something that's prepared. You know like I
wouldn't add spices in that you know a mayonnaise is an emulsion made, a chili oil is something
that you make right. All of these things you know for me that those are condiments.
Worcestershire sauce, these kind of things.
Yeah and also I think if you use I don't know let's say the brine use of your pickles or
something like that, that's also a condiment. You add that to a sauce or anything.
For me you know condiments are kind of like your toolbox. I love working like even like
whether it's at home or in a professional kitchen I like having a toolbox of like you
know just now you said pickle brine you know amazing you know it's kind of like if you
make a sauce or like a salad dressing and you want a little bit more like complexity
and acidity you know hey what do you have you can use vinegar or lemon juice or whatever
but you have something that you've made the pickle brine with like herbs in it and it's
you know like whatever spices and that and a briny you know maybe it's even like fermented
a little bit and you add that already you've got a lot more complexity. That for me you
know those are condiments. I really love working like that.
Yeah I once made a cucumber salad super simple. It was fresh cucumber like a really nice one
and I did the dressing with pickled cucumbers so you had like this brine thing that you
don't understand what you're eating because it tasted fresh and pickled at the same time
and that was quite nice. So but the most famous condiments at least in the western world I
would say Europe and America is this combination of how do you call it burger sauce?
I would call it burger sauce.
It's basically mayo ketchup and mustard but it's crazy because these ingredients have
completely different origins. Ketchup as far as I understand is from Malaysia but I've
also read it comes from China. It probably comes from China first and then Malaysia.
It used to be like with other fruits not only tomato. Ketchup is basically a blended chutney
so you do a chutney of whatever you make it like a smooth texture and that's a ketchup.
So you do that with tomatoes and you have a ketchup tomato which is for some reason
the one that got popularized.
Yeah I mean for me like I know like it makes sense that it comes from Asia. I know that
like the original ketchup there's like an original or more original version from the
UK right which was traditionally made with mushrooms.
Mushrooms and Worcestershire sauce and stuff like that and it was also like a cooked down
chutney with spices that then gets blended you know but it makes sense if they as the
British do they take the things from Asia and make it their own you know.
Yeah of course. Have you made your own ketchup?
Yeah I've made loads of different types you know like I used to make just like a normal
ketchup especially like a chili ketchup I really like. I've also made mushroom ketchup
also very recently and super super tasty. Also with the same kind of fruity tartness
you know the little bit of acidity but the sweetness with it you know and it works really
well cooking it down with onions and then spices you know like whole spice a little
bit of star anise maybe even a little bit of cinnamon Worcestershire sauce you know
caramelizing a little bit and then also with fruits you know like you said it works really
well really really well.
I remember always following like a recipe from Albert Roux he had this book called Sausage
and I would use his recipe for ketchup well he's a British chef which makes sense. I remember
no matter what ketchup he would do it would always have a tomato and an apple base at
some point.
Oh yeah.
And then also the different spices so that there is a lot of different spices and chutney
that's on one side ketchup that you would put on a burger you have mayonnaise the story
that I understand about mayonnaise is that first there was alioli and then mayonnaise
so like alioli is a much older sauce and at some point someone had to figure out how to
take the garlic out of it and the story that I know it might not be true because this recipe
is they don't have like a linear origin but there are like many things that happen that
put like a salsa in every table in the world. So there is this crazy thing about mayonnaise
in Spain that I haven't seen in any other countries that most families they make mayonnaise
at home here it's quite common to see people making a mayonnaise and preferring that instead
of the ones yard you see that a lot that on one side and on the other side a lot of people
here in Spain don't call it mayonnaise they call it maonesa and so this has its reason
maón is a port in Menorca in the Balearic Islands at some point the French took the
port I don't know exactly how the story went what they found first if they were already
doing a mayonnaise and maón or if they found like a garlic the alioli one and they took
it to France and figure out how to take the garlic out replacing because the original
original alioli is only garlic and oil and there would be a way to emulsify this into
a kind of like a mayonnaise but they probably replaced the garlic with eggs and called the
mayonnaise like mispronouncing the maonesa so the funny thing is that this term was imported
back to Spain from the French to put the mayonesa word in Spanish it's kind of like a linguistic
crazy trip for that word.
Yeah it's funny.
Then many places used today they used lactones replacing egg with milk and there is actually
a guy who invented that there is a chef that has a name I think his twitter account is
lactonesa or something like that and this was in the early 90s you know it's brilliant
he thought like okay let's emulsify milk with oil which is like you know like how come you
up with something like that and it's more stable hygienic wise let's say.
Yeah that's true.
And then we have mustard I've never done mustard I know that mustard was came also from Roman
times and they popularized it all over Europe and at some point in the 18th century it became
like a really fancy thing to have this beautiful mustard jars on the table and it was something
that mostly in Germanic countries and France and that you would see a lot.
Yeah.
Have you ever done mustard or something similar?
You know I tried to make it once out of mustard seeds and I have to remember how exactly I
made it but I had to sort of like ferment them a little bit and then you know blitzed
them also with like cider vinegar and stuff like that and what came out of it was something
that you could definitely call a mustard but it's not that easy to make it you know sort
of like why I didn't quite hit the spot it was alright it was tasty enough but yeah.
Far away from a proper old mustard with grains.
Exactly or like if you think of like you know here in Europe especially in Germany and in
Belgium and stuff like that we have these old mustard mills that make like old style
mustard you know now the area in Germany where I'm in Spreewald you know which is very forested
area they have traditional mustard there and it's super nice it's really really high quality
I don't know exactly how they make it but the variety between mustards in Europe is
crazy especially here in Germany.
I remember when I was in the UK I was doing like an event and I remember the woman who
was hosting the event she was a little bit older British woman and she kind of said to
me she was like because she knew I was German she was talking about mustard for some reason
she was like hmm our good English mustard not like proper spicy not like your German
mustard.
Oh man that's awful that yellow.
Yeah I call it.
That yellow devil sauce it's horrible.
And I was like if you walk into any supermarket in Germany right you find 10 different varieties
of mustards from very spicy to sweet to less spicy to mild.
Also with flavors with whatever Estragon or whatever yeah.
Yeah tarragon mustard you know super nice or like a blueberry mustard which is very traditional
also it's kind of purple it's kind of sweet goes really well with cheese to the super
super spicy kind of horseradish he wants.
Yeah we have a huge variety of mustard here that people don't really know about that much
you know the sweet mustard that you eat with the traditionally the weisswurst the white
sausages in Bavaria.
Oh yeah that's so good that's one of my favorites.
So tasty yeah.
Also like the most condiments I use is going to an Asian supermarket and you know there
are so many nice things like all these Korean barbecues or these kimchi based sauces or
this fermented soybeans you know like so many things for me it's like an amusement park
somehow.
Exactly it's exactly like an amusement park.
It's so cool when it's not your culture to discover these things also because you don't
really know how traditionally they're used right.
So like I've often had situations where I pick something up in an Asian supermarket
not knowing exactly what the normal use for it is and then I try it and I'm kind of like
well what would I do with this you know.
Yeah exactly.
But often I also had situations where I try something raw and I'm like oh this tastes
awful you know and I'm like I have no idea like what to do with it and then at some point
you see a traditional recipe and you're like that's how they use it and then they fry it
off or they do something with it or it's like and then it makes sense you know but it's
really really fun to kind of discover that.
You remember this chard wok I would do the Swiss chard wok I would do in Berlin.
Yeah you're a Szechuan chard.
Yeah that was so nice man and the key for that dish is the fermented soybeans that I
used and that's from a brand called Healthy Boy.
Oh yeah.
Healthy Boy the yellow one.
Yeah the logo is like a baby you know.
This was so easy I remember I got the recipe from Fuxia Dunlop which is a super cool writer
on Chinese food.
Oh yeah she's amazing.
Yeah and it was basically you start with a wok with your basics like you know garlic
ginger and chili then you have like a pre-blanched chard you throw it in the wok then you throw
coriander and Stauden celery stalks.
Yeah like really finely chopped then a few tablespoons of the soybean paste and that's
it that's it.
Yeah man such a nice dish.
Super super nice.
And it takes just like if you have everything ready five minutes.
Hey yeah I think honestly I think Asian cooking is all about I'm not all about but it's like
a huge part of it is condiments much more so than in European cooking.
If we start from the point that soy sauce is a condiment of course.
Exactly exactly soy sauce is a condiment you know miso is a condiment you know Mirian and
sake and Shaoxing wine they're all condiments.
Exactly.
There's something prepared that you then use to enhance you know all the you know the chili
oils the fermented paste, gochujang all that sort of stuff you know kimchi sauce you know
kimchi marinade or kimchi itself.
Yeah exactly.
Then again kimchi is a dish but you know we don't want to take that away.
Yeah but you can blend it and use it as a condiment which is what I do and I love to
use the kimchi uses to throw also throwing it into something you wouldn't add normally
like a puttanesca with some kimchi use man that's fucking brilliant.
Oh the Italians are crying right now it's just like somewhere in Tuscany an Italian
grandma just had a heart attack.
A Sicilian sailor just died.
Exactly.
Do you know what my favorite Asian condiment is though?
How do you call it?
Tasty paste.
No it's called Lao Gan Ma man.
Ah yeah.
It's so good I think we talked about it before.
Yeah.
Oh my god it's so good.
They have the chicken flavored chili oil but they also have this one with crispy tofu and
like I think fermented kohlrabi inside and that gives you like a little bit of crunchiness.
Man it's so tasty.
That sounds really nice.
Yeah.
Hey you know talking about Asian cuisines and condiments I think one of the most interesting
one I mean for me anyway is Thai cuisine.
Ah yeah of course.
They're so big on condiments.
I was so surprised and such unusual condiments also you know.
It has this chili jam.
Have you ever tried Thai chili jam?
It's like well it is what it is.
You kind of cook it down.
I saw this recipe from David Thompson and it's like sweet spicy salty chili jam that
you cut with a little bit of coconut milk, palm sugar and you like cook it down until
it's like this thick paste and then you use that.
You make that.
They then use that for example for like stir fries.
Clams, noodles, holy basil and a spoonful of chili jam, tossed, done, dish.
I love that sort of cooking.
What comes to my mind is that this is from David Chang.
He would do like this Chinese ham with coffee mayonnaise.
Oh yeah.
I haven't tried that but it sounds like really interesting.
Yeah that's super nice.
One other like condiment from Thai cooking which I thought was super crazy is this kind
of cooked down jam but it's made with ground pork.
So you basically you caramelize ground pork with like sugar and then you cut it with fish
sauce etc. and chili and blah and you cook it down until it's this really intense paste
and you eat that.
Traditionally it's eaten that.
It's called what's it called?
Nam prik on.
I think it's called nam prik on.
You have it in a little bowl and then next to it you have like fresh vegetables and herbs
and stuff like that and salad leaves and you take this like these fresh condiments and
you dip that into this pork jam and eat it.
Oh man.
And for me that's super cool you know.
That sounds so nice.
For us it's counterintuitive to like take a meat and cook it into like a condiment to
then be eaten with vegetables.
It's like the other way around you know.
For instance here in Bar Antonio they are you know mojama which is this tuna ham so
to say like a tuna charcuterie they do like it's kind of like a mojama powder on top of
the ensaladilla rusa which I think is just brilliant.
Oh they do that?
Yeah.
Their ensaladilla is amazing.
I never even realized it had mojama on it.
Yeah.
I also had to try it a few times and then I was like yeah this is like dried tuna what
is on top like this powder they sprinkle on top.
Yeah nice.
And then the other one I had also a different bar here called Aitana right now it's artichoke
season and I recently had this charcoal grilled artichokes and they added a mayo made of cow
fat of chuleta fat.
Man so nice.
Oh yeah that's really really good.
Also that playing with different fats to make your mayonnaise is really really nice.
Absolutely.
That's it for this week's episode of Potluck Food Talks.