WEBVTT 00:00:04.169 --> 00:00:06.750 Hi, everyone. Welcome to Pot Luck Food Talks. 00:00:06.750 --> 00:00:10.189 My name is Eric. I'm here with Phil, a .k .a. 00:00:10.189 --> 00:00:14.609 Michelle Lin. And yeah, today we wanted to share 00:00:14.609 --> 00:00:19.890 some ideas on restaurant organization. But before 00:00:19.890 --> 00:00:22.609 that, you're listening to Heritage Radio Network. 00:00:25.030 --> 00:00:27.890 So, Phil. How do you organize yourself in a kitchen? 00:00:28.010 --> 00:00:31.670 Do you use paper or do you use softwares or apps? 00:00:31.949 --> 00:00:35.310 And what's your approach on these tools? Like, 00:00:35.329 --> 00:00:37.509 for example, your to -do list, do you do it in 00:00:37.509 --> 00:00:40.700 the evening? for the next day after service or 00:00:40.700 --> 00:00:43.820 you do it when you arrive or half -half or how 00:00:43.820 --> 00:00:47.820 is your like normal day organization like in 00:00:47.820 --> 00:00:51.240 a routine where you you build up your prep and 00:00:51.240 --> 00:00:54.799 everything so i mean i use a mix of things i 00:00:54.799 --> 00:00:58.060 use apps for certain things i need i use paper 00:00:58.060 --> 00:01:02.060 for other things talking about prep lists i i 00:01:02.060 --> 00:01:05.480 think it's the best for years now that you do 00:01:05.480 --> 00:01:08.500 a prep list in the evening I think after a service, 00:01:08.560 --> 00:01:11.920 you are most in tune with what is where, how 00:01:11.920 --> 00:01:14.280 many portions you have sold of what, you know, 00:01:14.299 --> 00:01:16.459 what you're running low of, what you need to 00:01:16.459 --> 00:01:18.140 prioritize, all that sort of stuff. It's all 00:01:18.140 --> 00:01:21.219 fresh. It's all fresh in your head. In the morning 00:01:21.219 --> 00:01:23.379 when you come in, it's less fresh. I used to 00:01:23.379 --> 00:01:26.599 write prep lists by hand. Nowadays, I like having 00:01:26.599 --> 00:01:30.040 a printed out prep list. I like to do it in a 00:01:30.040 --> 00:01:34.140 way where I make a graph. or a table more like, 00:01:34.299 --> 00:01:38.219 where I put sections of dishes and in that section 00:01:38.219 --> 00:01:42.400 I will put every ingredient or like every component 00:01:42.400 --> 00:01:45.620 that I need for the dish. So like every dish, 00:01:45.780 --> 00:01:50.719 it's a list on its own. It's a checklist of the 00:01:50.719 --> 00:01:53.349 components you need to have for that dish. correct 00:01:53.349 --> 00:01:56.230 correct and it might not even it might be preparations 00:01:56.230 --> 00:01:59.109 it might be you know certain things turn the 00:01:59.109 --> 00:02:02.189 oven on or something like that or yeah it could 00:02:02.189 --> 00:02:05.890 be like um oh i know that for this dish i need 00:02:05.890 --> 00:02:09.009 a container with a little brush because at the 00:02:09.009 --> 00:02:11.229 very end i'm going to dust the powder over it 00:02:11.229 --> 00:02:13.629 so i need the brush to brush it as part of my 00:02:13.629 --> 00:02:17.430 setup right So at night I would fill in what 00:02:17.430 --> 00:02:19.270 I need where. Usually I have the name of the 00:02:19.270 --> 00:02:21.889 components, you know, I'll be sort of like, I 00:02:21.889 --> 00:02:24.490 need some roasted leeks, I need some lemon confit, 00:02:24.509 --> 00:02:26.409 I need this, I need that, I need blah. And I 00:02:26.409 --> 00:02:30.270 will leave a section where I can write how much 00:02:30.270 --> 00:02:33.469 of it I need, right? Like one recipe, two recipes, 00:02:33.810 --> 00:02:36.469 20 portions, whatever it is, right? So maybe 00:02:36.469 --> 00:02:38.889 I have a couple of portions left from the night 00:02:38.889 --> 00:02:41.990 before that I can rotate. But regardless of that, 00:02:42.400 --> 00:02:44.560 I'll fill that in at night. In the morning, the 00:02:44.560 --> 00:02:46.699 first thing that I do if I'm a chef de party, 00:02:46.780 --> 00:02:48.479 if I'm setting up a section, is I go through 00:02:48.479 --> 00:02:50.979 my section. I go through my section again. I 00:02:50.979 --> 00:02:52.819 open up everything. I get a lay of the land. 00:02:52.979 --> 00:02:55.039 This is especially important if you do a handover, 00:02:55.060 --> 00:02:56.979 right? We have this problem all the time. When 00:02:56.979 --> 00:02:58.939 you're in bigger kitchens where people are handing 00:02:58.939 --> 00:03:02.199 over sections, the person that was there in the 00:03:02.199 --> 00:03:05.199 night, ideally you're scheduled on so that you 00:03:05.199 --> 00:03:07.659 don't do a clopening. Clopening being you close 00:03:07.659 --> 00:03:11.219 and you open, right? We all love Kloppenings. 00:03:12.620 --> 00:03:15.819 Six hours sleep. You can look at the prep list, 00:03:15.939 --> 00:03:18.840 but don't take it for granted. You have to get 00:03:18.840 --> 00:03:21.960 a hold of your section. You have to grab the 00:03:21.960 --> 00:03:24.139 bull by the horns. You have to be in control. 00:03:24.379 --> 00:03:27.000 You have to know what's where. It's impossible 00:03:27.000 --> 00:03:29.960 that I come to you and I say, hey, where is the 00:03:29.960 --> 00:03:32.240 vinaigrette? And you have to start looking for 00:03:32.240 --> 00:03:33.680 it. You should know where it is. You should know 00:03:33.680 --> 00:03:35.240 that it's in the bottom drawer on the left -hand 00:03:35.240 --> 00:03:36.840 side, because you checked your section, you know 00:03:36.840 --> 00:03:39.400 where everything is. To me, it's already like 00:03:39.400 --> 00:03:41.780 an alarm bell. If I ask a chef de party or a 00:03:41.780 --> 00:03:43.740 demi -chef himself, like, hey, can I have a little 00:03:43.740 --> 00:03:45.520 bit of your vinaigrette? And he's like, where 00:03:45.520 --> 00:03:48.699 is it? And it's like 11 .30, and I'm like, that 00:03:48.699 --> 00:03:51.400 is not a good sign. Okay, let's say you built 00:03:51.400 --> 00:03:53.500 your station, you went through your checklist. 00:03:53.639 --> 00:03:56.180 Do you do all these checks on your own, or do 00:03:56.180 --> 00:03:59.110 you find a pier and you do it? like together 00:03:59.110 --> 00:04:01.810 or how does it work best for you it really depends 00:04:01.810 --> 00:04:03.830 i mean that's that's the job of a chef the party 00:04:03.830 --> 00:04:07.490 right so for people who don't know the old school 00:04:07.490 --> 00:04:11.090 kitchen structure still maintains you know prevalent 00:04:11.090 --> 00:04:14.629 internationally to this day where you move up 00:04:14.629 --> 00:04:16.589 from the bottom of the chain of commands you 00:04:16.589 --> 00:04:18.610 have the commies they're basically the lowest 00:04:18.610 --> 00:04:23.250 cooks to the demi chefs then the chef the parties 00:04:23.250 --> 00:04:26.490 chef the parties are basically the head chef 00:04:26.490 --> 00:04:29.170 of their little section so if you're the chef 00:04:29.170 --> 00:04:32.329 the party of the garde manger you are basically 00:04:32.329 --> 00:04:34.850 the head chef of the little like starter section 00:04:34.850 --> 00:04:37.350 and that is what you manage and you have a demi 00:04:37.350 --> 00:04:39.509 chef which is basically like your sous chef who 00:04:39.509 --> 00:04:42.470 will be a fairly like experienced cook with a 00:04:42.470 --> 00:04:44.189 couple of years of experience and you have a 00:04:44.189 --> 00:04:46.810 commie which will be a very young green i mean 00:04:46.810 --> 00:04:49.430 not young necessarily but like young inexperienced 00:04:49.430 --> 00:04:52.610 very green very fresh cook And you manage those. 00:04:52.709 --> 00:04:55.329 So you, as a chef de party, you delegate the 00:04:55.329 --> 00:04:58.149 tasks to the people on your section. And then 00:04:58.149 --> 00:05:01.269 as you move up in the kitchen, you become a junior 00:05:01.269 --> 00:05:03.230 sous chef, sous chef, and then eventually a head 00:05:03.230 --> 00:05:06.490 chef, right? And a sous chef then looks over 00:05:06.490 --> 00:05:09.110 the chef de parties and makes sure that they're 00:05:09.110 --> 00:05:10.870 working and the head chef looks over everything, 00:05:11.089 --> 00:05:16.550 right? So it's a gradual climb. For me, it's 00:05:16.550 --> 00:05:18.129 important that the chef at the party manages 00:05:18.129 --> 00:05:21.069 this. And if there is no chef at the party present, 00:05:21.209 --> 00:05:23.629 if there's a commie or a demi -chef, there needs 00:05:23.629 --> 00:05:26.449 to be the most important thing, one of the most 00:05:26.449 --> 00:05:28.430 important things, top two most important things 00:05:28.430 --> 00:05:31.550 in the kitchen, communication. Absolutely. Communication. 00:05:31.730 --> 00:05:34.350 It's kind of like, okay, you make yourself responsible, 00:05:34.490 --> 00:05:35.870 especially when you're a demi -chef, you should 00:05:35.870 --> 00:05:38.509 do this anyway. You say, okay, I come in. I check 00:05:38.509 --> 00:05:41.029 everything. I make myself a list of what I think 00:05:41.029 --> 00:05:43.870 I need to do. If I don't have a chef at the party, 00:05:44.009 --> 00:05:47.310 I will go to a sous -chef. And I will say, hey, 00:05:47.449 --> 00:05:49.589 this is my plan for today. What do you think? 00:05:50.069 --> 00:05:52.410 And it either gets approved or not. It's important 00:05:52.410 --> 00:05:55.750 because time management is so crucial, right? 00:05:55.850 --> 00:05:57.490 A lot of people don't really understand. Like, 00:05:57.490 --> 00:05:59.129 I think they understand the concept, but they 00:05:59.129 --> 00:06:01.689 don't understand the reality of it. Is that what 00:06:01.689 --> 00:06:04.889 makes cooking at a high level so stressful is 00:06:04.889 --> 00:06:08.490 that you have all these little timers that are 00:06:08.490 --> 00:06:11.110 going off at different times. You know, you have 00:06:11.110 --> 00:06:14.629 timers that, say you come in at nine o 'clock. 00:06:14.990 --> 00:06:17.910 Lunch service starts at 12. That's a timer. That's 00:06:17.910 --> 00:06:20.490 a three -hour timer that's ticking down. You 00:06:20.490 --> 00:06:23.949 have to make it until 12 o 'clock. You have to. 00:06:25.029 --> 00:06:27.129 Unnegotiable. So the things that you have to 00:06:27.129 --> 00:06:29.410 do to be set up need to happen in those three 00:06:29.410 --> 00:06:31.910 hours. Then you kind of start looking at the 00:06:31.910 --> 00:06:33.410 amount of prep that you have and you say, like, 00:06:33.449 --> 00:06:39.029 okay, I have to braise these ox cheeks. Already 00:06:39.029 --> 00:06:40.490 you understand because that takes longer than 00:06:40.490 --> 00:06:42.149 three hours. But say you have something that 00:06:42.149 --> 00:06:44.740 takes a long time. I need to reduce the stock. 00:06:44.899 --> 00:06:46.339 It's going to take me at least an hour and a 00:06:46.339 --> 00:06:48.399 half because I need to reduce it slowly. That 00:06:48.399 --> 00:06:50.779 should be your priority. If that's another timer, 00:06:50.879 --> 00:06:53.000 hour and a half. You need to fit that into those 00:06:53.000 --> 00:06:55.480 three hours. And then you prioritize all these 00:06:55.480 --> 00:06:58.240 jobs that take the longest. You try to get them 00:06:58.240 --> 00:07:01.680 working simultaneously as much as you can. And 00:07:01.680 --> 00:07:03.899 you leave all the little things to the end so 00:07:03.899 --> 00:07:06.439 that you can get the most amount of work done 00:07:06.439 --> 00:07:08.379 in that time. And then obviously those timers, 00:07:08.379 --> 00:07:10.740 they continue into service from ticket to ticket, 00:07:10.839 --> 00:07:13.350 from dish to dish. And they just multiply and 00:07:13.350 --> 00:07:15.629 multiply and multiply. And there's a lot of things 00:07:15.629 --> 00:07:18.329 to keep track of. And there's a lot of pressure, 00:07:18.529 --> 00:07:20.730 a lot of stress. And this is something a teacher 00:07:20.730 --> 00:07:23.769 told me when I was studying design. And I said 00:07:23.769 --> 00:07:26.209 that I was working in a kitchen in a restaurant. 00:07:26.370 --> 00:07:29.730 And he said, like, by definition, chefs are very 00:07:29.730 --> 00:07:32.430 good project managers. You know, I'm not sure 00:07:32.430 --> 00:07:34.430 if I'm a great project manager, but for sure, 00:07:34.529 --> 00:07:37.750 I've never crossed a deadline. You know, like, 00:07:37.790 --> 00:07:41.000 you make it on time. It doesn't matter. How? 00:07:41.100 --> 00:07:44.439 You know, like you just need to figure it out. 00:07:44.560 --> 00:07:46.540 You know, like there are like millions of ways. 00:07:46.879 --> 00:07:49.579 Phil, do you recommend podcasts to your friends? 00:07:49.660 --> 00:07:52.720 All the time. The best way of showing friends 00:07:52.720 --> 00:07:54.860 that you care is recommending a great podcast 00:07:54.860 --> 00:07:58.000 to listen to. I agree. If you're listening right 00:07:58.000 --> 00:08:00.399 now, you should show your love by recommending 00:08:00.399 --> 00:08:03.939 our show to all your best friends. It will make 00:08:03.939 --> 00:08:07.060 them happy. It will make us happy. PopLock Food 00:08:07.060 --> 00:08:09.759 Talks. Tell your friends. It will make the world 00:08:09.759 --> 00:08:15.779 a better place. You do use some apps or software. 00:08:16.279 --> 00:08:19.259 Like which ones are for what or in which context 00:08:19.259 --> 00:08:22.680 do you use digital tools? There's a lot of technology 00:08:22.680 --> 00:08:25.579 that I've seen that is very helpful in kitchens. 00:08:25.720 --> 00:08:28.660 And you specifically, you work in a lot of those 00:08:28.660 --> 00:08:30.899 sort of things as well. While they are really 00:08:30.899 --> 00:08:33.039 great and I see a lot of value in them, I don't 00:08:33.039 --> 00:08:36.519 use that many. Not because I don't want to, just 00:08:36.519 --> 00:08:39.120 because it's not really given right now in the 00:08:39.120 --> 00:08:41.299 environment that I'm in. But I wouldn't be opposed 00:08:41.299 --> 00:08:44.960 to. But I use apps for all HR -related things. 00:08:45.960 --> 00:08:48.860 But apart from that, honestly, like costing, 00:08:49.039 --> 00:08:53.740 scheduling, vacation planning, I use Excel. You 00:08:53.740 --> 00:08:56.799 know, like it's pretty old school. Like I have 00:08:56.799 --> 00:08:58.840 a system that works for me that like calculates 00:08:58.840 --> 00:09:01.980 this stuff. I used to, you know, you have to 00:09:01.980 --> 00:09:04.799 use scheduling apps these days. It has to be 00:09:04.799 --> 00:09:06.480 like, especially, you know, you have to keep 00:09:06.480 --> 00:09:09.120 track of something, you know, the hours need 00:09:09.120 --> 00:09:11.340 to be calculated, et cetera. It's important. 00:09:11.440 --> 00:09:14.179 Yeah, and also by law, it's also like a good 00:09:14.179 --> 00:09:19.009 way to, Accountability. For accountability reasons, 00:09:19.129 --> 00:09:21.809 you need to have some evidence that you can show. 00:09:23.029 --> 00:09:25.690 Absolutely, yeah. The thing is that what I found, 00:09:25.809 --> 00:09:29.049 me personally, is that a lot of these apps are 00:09:29.049 --> 00:09:32.169 a little bit poorly designed. If I need to manage 00:09:32.169 --> 00:09:35.549 six, seven different sections, and on each section, 00:09:35.649 --> 00:09:38.509 in one day, I have three to four people working, 00:09:38.710 --> 00:09:42.059 it's very hard for me to keep an overview. Are 00:09:42.059 --> 00:09:44.519 there enough people scheduled on every day for 00:09:44.519 --> 00:09:46.519 lunch? Are there enough people scheduled on every 00:09:46.519 --> 00:09:49.799 day for dinner? It gets often, you would be surprised. 00:09:49.899 --> 00:09:51.500 You know, you'd think somebody would make an 00:09:51.500 --> 00:09:53.580 effort to make it like super easy to view this. 00:09:53.720 --> 00:09:55.659 But you have to imagine in my kitchen team, there's 00:09:55.659 --> 00:09:57.820 almost 40 chefs at some point. You know, it's 00:09:57.820 --> 00:10:00.059 like between 30 and 40 chefs, a lot of fucking 00:10:00.059 --> 00:10:02.960 people. But I need to be able to take a step 00:10:02.960 --> 00:10:05.139 back and look at the week and just kind of browse 00:10:05.139 --> 00:10:07.480 through. I have enough people for breakfast. 00:10:07.639 --> 00:10:08.980 I have enough people for lunch. I have enough 00:10:08.980 --> 00:10:10.940 people for dinner. I have enough people for prep. 00:10:11.599 --> 00:10:14.440 So for that, it's very, very useful. And you 00:10:14.440 --> 00:10:17.039 said you use Excel for your costs. What do you 00:10:17.039 --> 00:10:20.340 have, like a table somebody gave you at some 00:10:20.340 --> 00:10:23.919 point and that's the one you use or cost calculation, 00:10:24.200 --> 00:10:26.759 pricing and all of this? Yeah, correct. I have 00:10:26.759 --> 00:10:30.100 a table that Katie gave me at one point, which 00:10:30.100 --> 00:10:33.320 is very useful, like 10 years ago or something 00:10:33.320 --> 00:10:37.440 like that. But it's good because it does very 00:10:37.440 --> 00:10:39.830 simple things, right? You make... So for people 00:10:39.830 --> 00:10:41.990 who don't understand how costing works in a restaurant, 00:10:42.169 --> 00:10:47.789 say you have a dish, there's a steak, there's 00:10:47.789 --> 00:10:50.210 some french fries seasoned with rosemary salt, 00:10:50.370 --> 00:10:54.330 there's a salad dressed with a vinaigrette, right? 00:10:54.389 --> 00:10:57.309 And there's maybe a sauce. So the steak is easily 00:10:57.309 --> 00:10:59.669 calculated, right? You get a piece of meat in, 00:10:59.769 --> 00:11:02.909 it costs a certain amount, you lose a certain 00:11:02.909 --> 00:11:04.429 amount of that meat because you have to trim 00:11:04.429 --> 00:11:07.009 it off and you have to portion it. And then what 00:11:07.009 --> 00:11:11.110 you're left with... You divide and that portion 00:11:11.110 --> 00:11:14.769 is the cost of the meat, right? Very easy. With 00:11:14.769 --> 00:11:17.269 French fries, for example, it starts getting 00:11:17.269 --> 00:11:19.950 a little bit more tricky because you need to 00:11:19.950 --> 00:11:22.450 calculate the tomatoes, but what you use to season 00:11:22.450 --> 00:11:24.990 it, you use a rosemary salt. Okay, so now you 00:11:24.990 --> 00:11:26.509 have to make a separate recipe for the rosemary 00:11:26.509 --> 00:11:28.529 salt because you need to know how much the rosemary 00:11:28.529 --> 00:11:30.549 salt costs. The rosemary salt maybe consists 00:11:30.549 --> 00:11:34.830 of sea salt, rosemary, and like, let's say something 00:11:34.830 --> 00:11:37.850 else, garlic powder, MSG, four things, right? 00:11:38.379 --> 00:11:41.019 you need to make a recipe how much of those ingredients 00:11:41.019 --> 00:11:45.659 go into a recipe of rosemary salt. And then that 00:11:45.659 --> 00:11:48.019 recipe you need to divide by how many portions 00:11:48.019 --> 00:11:50.360 it gives you. So let's say if I make 100 grams 00:11:50.360 --> 00:11:53.799 of rosemary salt, I need to know how many servings 00:11:53.799 --> 00:11:56.539 of fries I can season with this. Same for the 00:11:56.539 --> 00:11:58.500 salad. What goes into the salad? You need to 00:11:58.500 --> 00:12:00.340 break down all the ingredients. You need to break 00:12:00.340 --> 00:12:02.860 down the wastage. Then you need to make a separate 00:12:02.860 --> 00:12:04.740 recipe for the dressing. What goes into your 00:12:04.740 --> 00:12:07.220 dressing? How many portions? What percentage 00:12:07.220 --> 00:12:09.379 of that dressing goes into the salad? And so 00:12:09.379 --> 00:12:12.519 not to go on and on about this, but like a simple 00:12:12.519 --> 00:12:15.600 recipe for a restaurant is a lot of fucking work. 00:12:15.840 --> 00:12:18.960 If you want to actually control the cost, you 00:12:18.960 --> 00:12:20.960 want to actually know what's going on, at some 00:12:20.960 --> 00:12:23.000 point you can like eyeball it. I don't recommend 00:12:23.000 --> 00:12:24.879 it to anybody. If you actually want to know. 00:12:25.200 --> 00:12:27.500 what it is that you're spending on food and what 00:12:27.500 --> 00:12:29.940 it is that you need to charge. This is exactly 00:12:29.940 --> 00:12:32.220 what you have to do. And this table does that 00:12:32.220 --> 00:12:34.620 exactly for me. I can put in a recipe. I can 00:12:34.620 --> 00:12:36.460 in a little window say, okay, this gives me this 00:12:36.460 --> 00:12:38.759 amount of portions. It calculates straight away 00:12:38.759 --> 00:12:42.080 what one portion of this would cost. So I can 00:12:42.080 --> 00:12:44.679 take that and straight away input it into another 00:12:44.679 --> 00:12:47.940 like full dish thing. But also it gives me a 00:12:47.940 --> 00:12:51.399 certain percentage of usables, of miscellaneous 00:12:51.399 --> 00:12:55.750 things. So things like, salt for seasoning pepper 00:12:55.750 --> 00:12:58.909 for seasoning oil for like neutral oil for cooking 00:12:58.909 --> 00:13:01.950 if you would add all those things into your recipe 00:13:01.950 --> 00:13:06.830 making your work would be doubled so a lot of 00:13:06.830 --> 00:13:09.629 times it's much easier to take a certain percentage 00:13:09.629 --> 00:13:12.649 and add that onto your cost like two three percent 00:13:12.649 --> 00:13:15.210 and in this you include exactly this they're 00:13:15.210 --> 00:13:17.169 like little little knob of butter that you throw 00:13:17.169 --> 00:13:19.409 in at the end to glaze your vegetables the you 00:13:19.409 --> 00:13:21.490 know the squeeze of vinegar that you use to deglaze 00:13:21.490 --> 00:13:24.870 the pan That's like incorporated in there. And 00:13:24.870 --> 00:13:26.990 so this table does everything like that for me. 00:13:27.429 --> 00:13:30.690 Yeah, like what I would do as well is adding 00:13:30.690 --> 00:13:33.870 a 10 % of margin error. You know, just assuming 00:13:33.870 --> 00:13:38.230 one of each 10, somebody will eat it, it will 00:13:38.230 --> 00:13:41.529 be returned, it will be whatever. And at the 00:13:41.529 --> 00:13:44.330 end of the day, you have that calculated, that 00:13:44.330 --> 00:13:47.110 is something that can happen. You can also learn 00:13:47.110 --> 00:13:51.529 on the go, like, which is your real... error 00:13:51.529 --> 00:13:54.769 margin. But at the end of the day, it's better 00:13:54.769 --> 00:13:56.850 to be safe than not. You know, like it's better 00:13:56.850 --> 00:13:59.429 to be a little bit more expensive and have your 00:13:59.429 --> 00:14:02.870 cost saved than just, you know, like trying to 00:14:02.870 --> 00:14:05.909 play to have the most competitive price. And 00:14:05.909 --> 00:14:11.090 at the same time, you know, like being losing 00:14:11.090 --> 00:14:13.549 money because you're not calculating some things 00:14:13.549 --> 00:14:15.830 that are also part of the business, you know. 00:14:16.759 --> 00:14:19.120 Absolutely. Yeah, totally. I totally agree with 00:14:19.120 --> 00:14:24.620 the margin of error. And it's really very beneficial 00:14:24.620 --> 00:14:27.799 to do this because you fact check yourself basically, 00:14:27.960 --> 00:14:31.200 right? Us as chefs and as professionals, we often 00:14:31.200 --> 00:14:33.240 get caught up in sort of like thinking that we 00:14:33.240 --> 00:14:35.480 know exactly what's going on. But it's very important 00:14:35.480 --> 00:14:37.320 to fact check yourself because it's very easy 00:14:37.320 --> 00:14:39.519 to be wrong. You might be starting to make a 00:14:39.519 --> 00:14:40.980 dish and you're kind of like, oh, I love this. 00:14:41.019 --> 00:14:43.500 This is great. And then you start putting it 00:14:43.500 --> 00:14:46.190 together. And you start adding up all the cost 00:14:46.190 --> 00:14:49.610 and you're like, hold on a second. For this salad, 00:14:49.789 --> 00:14:52.889 I suddenly need to charge almost 30 euros or 00:14:52.889 --> 00:14:55.129 $30 or whatever. And you're like, I can't do 00:14:55.129 --> 00:14:57.409 that. Nobody's going to buy that. Unless you 00:14:57.409 --> 00:14:59.009 market it in a good way, unless there's like 00:14:59.009 --> 00:15:01.629 a premium ingredient that you want to put on 00:15:01.629 --> 00:15:04.509 and then you can like sort of justify it. But 00:15:04.509 --> 00:15:06.110 you're kind of like, oh shit, you know, like 00:15:06.110 --> 00:15:08.549 what can I do to make this happen? Because you 00:15:08.549 --> 00:15:10.590 can make a fucking amazing dish. If the salad 00:15:10.590 --> 00:15:13.169 costs 40 quid, nobody's going to buy it. And 00:15:13.169 --> 00:15:14.870 then it doesn't matter how good it was. Unless 00:15:14.870 --> 00:15:16.730 you have a restaurant, the only restaurant in 00:15:16.730 --> 00:15:19.210 an airport, people will buy it. That's very true. 00:15:19.350 --> 00:15:21.429 And that is the, you know, exploitation that 00:15:21.429 --> 00:15:24.049 people do at airports. Like water bottles for 00:15:24.049 --> 00:15:26.909 like eight euros, you know? Yeah. 300 milliliters 00:15:26.909 --> 00:15:29.919 of water bottles. Phil, did you know we've already 00:15:29.919 --> 00:15:33.860 made nine episodes of The Line? Oh, really? People 00:15:33.860 --> 00:15:36.419 sure love our crazy abuse stories working in 00:15:36.419 --> 00:15:39.899 restaurants. Yes, they do. But now we're interested 00:15:39.899 --> 00:15:43.539 in our listeners' stories. Oh, yay. I would love 00:15:43.539 --> 00:15:45.840 to listen to more crazy stories about people 00:15:45.840 --> 00:15:48.299 getting abused in restaurants. So, if anything 00:15:48.299 --> 00:15:50.639 crazy ever happened to you working in professional 00:15:50.639 --> 00:15:53.820 kitchens, if you want people to make fun of your 00:15:53.820 --> 00:15:56.860 disgraces the same way we make fun of our disgraces, 00:15:57.039 --> 00:16:00.639 Send us your stories from The Line and we'll 00:16:00.639 --> 00:16:03.480 feature them on the show. DM us on Instagram. 00:16:03.639 --> 00:16:06.620 Send it as a text or voice note. We'll share 00:16:06.620 --> 00:16:09.120 our favorite ones in the next The Line episode. 00:16:09.399 --> 00:16:12.799 So keep it short and sweet. Because trauma brings 00:16:12.799 --> 00:16:18.139 people together. You were talking about recent 00:16:18.139 --> 00:16:20.360 technology. So a few things about pricing. I 00:16:20.360 --> 00:16:23.700 think as you're just saying. The price has to 00:16:23.700 --> 00:16:26.759 be common sense. It doesn't matter what you calculate 00:16:26.759 --> 00:16:30.139 and what was in your mind. If suddenly it's completely 00:16:30.139 --> 00:16:33.720 out of the average in the market, you're doing 00:16:33.720 --> 00:16:36.419 something wrong, even if it's too cheap or if 00:16:36.419 --> 00:16:38.679 it's too expensive. You should check on that. 00:16:38.820 --> 00:16:40.820 If it's too cheap, you're probably charging too 00:16:40.820 --> 00:16:43.639 cheap, and you could add a little bit more price 00:16:43.639 --> 00:16:47.659 to that. So this was one of the tech tools that 00:16:47.659 --> 00:16:50.659 I liked the most in the last years. It's a Spanish 00:16:50.659 --> 00:16:53.879 startup that is called Dynamite. And what they 00:16:53.879 --> 00:16:57.279 did, this guy, he took technology that already 00:16:57.279 --> 00:17:03.460 existed for airport flights pricing, like flight 00:17:03.460 --> 00:17:07.680 pricing or hotel pricing. This is like an old 00:17:07.680 --> 00:17:10.559 story that the same flight will be more expensive. 00:17:11.660 --> 00:17:14.319 On high season and cheaper on low season. So 00:17:14.319 --> 00:17:17.279 the prices are, you know, like the fluctuate 00:17:17.279 --> 00:17:21.000 regarding the offer and demand, right? Same thing 00:17:21.000 --> 00:17:24.720 in hotels. Well, this guy applied this to restaurants. 00:17:25.099 --> 00:17:30.319 So he would like, you know, connect this software 00:17:30.319 --> 00:17:35.140 to the booking system and to other systems. And 00:17:35.140 --> 00:17:37.759 so basically the way it works is if the restaurant 00:17:37.759 --> 00:17:40.200 is completely full, some prices get a little 00:17:40.200 --> 00:17:43.349 bit down. And if it's go or the other way around, 00:17:43.390 --> 00:17:45.609 exactly. Now, if it's completely empty, everything 00:17:45.609 --> 00:17:47.930 gets cheaper. If it's completely full, everything 00:17:47.930 --> 00:17:49.990 gets a little bit more expensive. And this would 00:17:49.990 --> 00:17:52.430 make like, you know, like an increase at the 00:17:52.430 --> 00:17:54.769 end of the month, just playing with that, you 00:17:54.769 --> 00:17:57.589 know, like, and also that the systems that like 00:17:57.589 --> 00:18:01.210 natural things, for example, you're at the pass 00:18:01.210 --> 00:18:04.269 in a restaurant and you, you know, you, you communicate 00:18:04.269 --> 00:18:07.569 with your head waiter and you say, I want to 00:18:07.569 --> 00:18:10.700 get rid of. this ox cheeks, you know, like I 00:18:10.700 --> 00:18:13.519 have two more portions, sell them. Like this 00:18:13.519 --> 00:18:15.680 kind of dynamics, the chef could do it like directly 00:18:15.680 --> 00:18:18.180 through the app and it would appear like first 00:18:18.180 --> 00:18:23.200 thing on the screen when you open it. But yet 00:18:23.200 --> 00:18:26.200 again, like, so this is not like for every concept. 00:18:26.319 --> 00:18:28.779 I think having a digital menu on a fine dining 00:18:28.779 --> 00:18:31.880 is lame, for example. But on a burger place, 00:18:32.000 --> 00:18:34.180 it's perfectly fine. You know, like it depends 00:18:34.180 --> 00:18:38.160 on. On what the concept it is. And yeah, I think 00:18:38.160 --> 00:18:40.960 that's also like a handicap of many digital tools, 00:18:41.140 --> 00:18:45.140 especially towards the guest. You know, you want 00:18:45.140 --> 00:18:47.779 to feel the paper and some other things and you 00:18:47.779 --> 00:18:50.339 don't want to be playing around with an app or 00:18:50.339 --> 00:18:52.759 a tablet without interacting with other people. 00:18:52.799 --> 00:18:56.900 Nobody ever would choose a cocktail vending for 00:18:56.900 --> 00:19:00.579 a mixologist, you know, like a barman or bartender 00:19:00.579 --> 00:19:03.589 catering you. Completely different experience, 00:19:03.730 --> 00:19:05.490 completely different story, you know? Yeah, that's 00:19:05.490 --> 00:19:07.509 super, super interesting. And it makes total 00:19:07.509 --> 00:19:10.470 sense. And yeah, you know, without the sort of 00:19:10.470 --> 00:19:12.150 app, the importance of front of house comes in, 00:19:12.210 --> 00:19:13.970 you know, having a good front of house team is 00:19:13.970 --> 00:19:17.450 a fucking, it's a golden goose. If you work with 00:19:17.450 --> 00:19:20.730 professionals that you can have a symbiosis with. 00:19:21.409 --> 00:19:24.230 as a chef it's it's fucking amazing you know 00:19:24.230 --> 00:19:26.930 they get excited about specials that you do they 00:19:26.930 --> 00:19:29.509 understand how to write the perfect check you 00:19:29.509 --> 00:19:31.230 know how many restaurants have you worked in 00:19:31.230 --> 00:19:33.210 where they talk about the perfect check you know 00:19:33.210 --> 00:19:36.150 and everybody's striving obviously for the business 00:19:36.150 --> 00:19:38.029 to have the perfect check it's like a nice full 00:19:38.029 --> 00:19:40.210 check it's a good bill but also for the experience 00:19:40.210 --> 00:19:43.430 of the customer you know um it's really good 00:19:43.430 --> 00:19:45.650 and like with you know with this like costing 00:19:45.650 --> 00:19:48.529 what you're saying sort of like when dishes are 00:19:48.529 --> 00:19:50.680 too cheap you can charge a little bit more. And 00:19:50.680 --> 00:19:53.160 that's an interesting point because the way that 00:19:53.160 --> 00:19:55.920 I've learned it is that if you have a menu, right, 00:19:56.059 --> 00:19:58.700 there's different categories of dishes on the 00:19:58.700 --> 00:20:01.519 menu. There's a lot of people that are way more 00:20:01.519 --> 00:20:05.599 into this than me, but it is like very... Even 00:20:05.599 --> 00:20:07.660 if you're not trying to do it, it is kind of 00:20:07.660 --> 00:20:09.599 what's happening. But if you're smart about it, 00:20:09.619 --> 00:20:11.240 you can set your menu up. It's really, really 00:20:11.240 --> 00:20:13.279 good for business. So there's some dishes that 00:20:13.279 --> 00:20:15.579 have like a wow effect, but they don't give you 00:20:15.579 --> 00:20:17.339 like a lot of revenue. They don't make a lot 00:20:17.339 --> 00:20:19.220 of money, right? But there's other sort of like 00:20:19.220 --> 00:20:22.579 carrier items that are very popular, but really 00:20:22.579 --> 00:20:25.539 low cost that kind of like bump it up. And so 00:20:25.539 --> 00:20:27.980 these items that are cheaper, but that you can 00:20:27.980 --> 00:20:30.099 sell at a higher price, they enable you to put 00:20:30.099 --> 00:20:32.460 things on the menu that maybe aren't really cost 00:20:32.460 --> 00:20:34.839 effective, but they're interesting. they're exciting 00:20:34.839 --> 00:20:38.539 right so for example say hey i want to make a 00:20:38.539 --> 00:20:40.859 whole grill turbot in my restaurant and you get 00:20:40.859 --> 00:20:43.400 you try to source a nice turbot you try to get 00:20:43.400 --> 00:20:45.920 the right size and you're like fuck man if i 00:20:45.920 --> 00:20:47.960 sell this turbot like i have to sell it for like 00:20:47.960 --> 00:20:50.819 150 euros per portion otherwise i'm not going 00:20:50.819 --> 00:20:52.880 to make any money on it you're sort of like okay 00:20:52.880 --> 00:20:55.579 well what would people be okay to buy what can 00:20:55.579 --> 00:21:00.519 i charge without making minus right and then 00:21:00.519 --> 00:21:03.799 maybe you get sort of like okay i can i can sell 00:21:03.799 --> 00:21:07.099 it for 110 you know still expensive but like 00:21:07.099 --> 00:21:09.380 four or five people can share it and it's fine 00:21:09.380 --> 00:21:12.319 and then maybe you entice the people to order 00:21:12.319 --> 00:21:14.880 like a lot of sides with it and these sides they're 00:21:14.880 --> 00:21:16.859 super cheap you have like a sweet potato dish 00:21:16.859 --> 00:21:20.740 you have like you know a cool like grilled broccolini 00:21:20.740 --> 00:21:23.200 dish or something like asparagus here there and 00:21:23.200 --> 00:21:25.259 you can like upsell you know you have like truffle 00:21:25.259 --> 00:21:29.460 fries that people could push with it And it, 00:21:29.539 --> 00:21:31.559 like, balances it out. And people are going to 00:21:31.559 --> 00:21:33.400 come. They're going to be like, oh, man, where 00:21:33.400 --> 00:21:35.380 the fuck can you get a whole grilled turbot like 00:21:35.380 --> 00:21:37.319 this unless you live in a Basque country? Not 00:21:37.319 --> 00:21:39.700 that many places. And even there, not that many 00:21:39.700 --> 00:21:42.299 places, right? But they're like, man, that was 00:21:42.299 --> 00:21:45.119 fucking amazing. And because you kind of sold 00:21:45.119 --> 00:21:46.900 this, like, big package, you had a wow factor, 00:21:46.980 --> 00:21:48.740 but you equaled it out with all the other dishes, 00:21:48.940 --> 00:21:50.779 they're going to leave feeling like they had 00:21:50.779 --> 00:21:53.019 a very special experience, which they did, and 00:21:53.019 --> 00:21:54.299 they're going to come back. And they're going 00:21:54.299 --> 00:21:55.920 to bring, they're going to, you know, advertise 00:21:55.920 --> 00:21:57.420 your place to other people, and that's how your 00:21:57.420 --> 00:22:01.410 business grows. So I found it. This is from a 00:22:01.410 --> 00:22:05.490 website. So it's a menu engineering idea, concept. 00:22:05.630 --> 00:22:09.710 There's this matrix where you have, you balance 00:22:09.710 --> 00:22:13.849 dishes that are more popular or high in popularity 00:22:13.849 --> 00:22:17.329 or in profitability. So there are four animals. 00:22:17.549 --> 00:22:21.829 You have dogs are low profit and low popularity. 00:22:22.230 --> 00:22:25.750 Then you have puzzles. They're high profit, low 00:22:25.750 --> 00:22:30.180 popularity. Plow horses, low profit, high popularity, 00:22:30.359 --> 00:22:34.359 and stars, high profit, high popularity. I think 00:22:34.359 --> 00:22:39.119 you should balance. You can always have some 00:22:39.119 --> 00:22:42.240 of each. For example, if you have a dish where 00:22:42.240 --> 00:22:45.279 the profit is very low, but it's super popular 00:22:45.279 --> 00:22:48.119 and people go for that reason, you should keep 00:22:48.119 --> 00:22:50.660 the price that way. You should make it more expensive 00:22:50.660 --> 00:22:54.640 because, as you say, it can work as the reason 00:22:54.640 --> 00:22:57.490 people go there. And it's like a marketing thing 00:22:57.490 --> 00:23:00.430 incorporated into your offer. I can always think 00:23:00.430 --> 00:23:02.470 about Crema Catalana. You know what? I remember 00:23:02.470 --> 00:23:05.490 Crema Catalana is so ridiculously cheap to produce. 00:23:05.690 --> 00:23:08.369 It's basically, you're selling milk, you know, 00:23:08.390 --> 00:23:12.930 like milk with sugar and some flour. And it probably 00:23:12.930 --> 00:23:17.009 costs like 20 euro cents the portion, and you 00:23:17.009 --> 00:23:19.250 will sell it by 250, you know, and it's like 00:23:19.250 --> 00:23:22.819 a decent or more, you know, like. What about 00:23:22.819 --> 00:23:27.059 the buying? How do you handle buying? Well, I 00:23:27.059 --> 00:23:30.799 mean, that kind of depends where you are, I think. 00:23:30.960 --> 00:23:35.599 I mean, whenever I was in a kitchen, depending 00:23:35.599 --> 00:23:37.480 on where I was in the world, I have to adapt 00:23:37.480 --> 00:23:40.400 to the local market, right? There are some places 00:23:40.400 --> 00:23:42.720 where certain things are much cheaper and certain 00:23:42.720 --> 00:23:45.220 things are much more expensive. You need to know 00:23:45.220 --> 00:23:49.069 the market, right, of where you are. So it's 00:23:49.069 --> 00:23:51.650 very, very viable to be sort of like, okay, if 00:23:51.650 --> 00:23:54.089 I buy these potatoes at this price and I want 00:23:54.089 --> 00:23:56.210 to make, let's just go with the example of French 00:23:56.210 --> 00:23:58.150 fries. I want to make French fries. I have to 00:23:58.150 --> 00:24:00.349 charge this much. Well, how much do French fries 00:24:00.349 --> 00:24:02.789 over there cost? And over there and over there 00:24:02.789 --> 00:24:06.829 and over there. And why, you know, how much volume 00:24:06.829 --> 00:24:09.289 do they do to justify that price or like whatever? 00:24:09.450 --> 00:24:11.289 And where can I position myself? Do I position 00:24:11.289 --> 00:24:13.509 myself in value? Do I position myself in quality? 00:24:13.930 --> 00:24:18.980 Right. So I've always been a very, very, or privileged 00:24:18.980 --> 00:24:23.220 team of we've got to choose quality and we'll 00:24:23.220 --> 00:24:26.160 charge a little bit more rather than do cheaper 00:24:26.160 --> 00:24:31.160 and do more, you know. You cannot skimp on ingredients. 00:24:31.920 --> 00:24:37.220 I think buying the ingredients is probably the 00:24:37.220 --> 00:24:39.019 most important thing in what makes your dish 00:24:39.019 --> 00:24:41.579 good or not, in my opinion. You know, there's 00:24:41.579 --> 00:24:44.140 many examples that I could name. You know, you 00:24:44.140 --> 00:24:46.160 can like twist around and this and that and blah, 00:24:46.240 --> 00:24:48.910 but I think 90 % of the time, And as we're talking 00:24:48.910 --> 00:24:51.589 about some really niche cooking places that can, 00:24:51.710 --> 00:24:54.289 for example, the Mugaritz, you know, like I heard 00:24:54.289 --> 00:24:56.009 when I was in Mugaritz, people were saying stuff 00:24:56.009 --> 00:24:58.829 like the ingredients of the quality of the ingredients 00:24:58.829 --> 00:25:01.210 doesn't really matter that much for what we do. 00:25:01.289 --> 00:25:03.430 It makes sense for what they do, because they're 00:25:03.430 --> 00:25:07.609 not offering flavor, for example. Not necessarily, 00:25:07.930 --> 00:25:11.769 yeah. I'm pretty sure they have some dope product 00:25:11.769 --> 00:25:15.009 at some point across the menu that you have something 00:25:15.009 --> 00:25:17.380 that is... absolutely unique in the world and 00:25:17.380 --> 00:25:20.099 top quality and top price as well. But yeah, 00:25:20.140 --> 00:25:23.539 I understand that they use like, you know, normal 00:25:23.539 --> 00:25:26.819 vegetables for whatever, you know, like. If you've 00:25:26.819 --> 00:25:30.880 experienced, you know, cooking where the ingredient 00:25:30.880 --> 00:25:34.380 is at the number one place and, you know, food 00:25:34.380 --> 00:25:36.900 produced by somebody who understands that and 00:25:36.900 --> 00:25:41.259 gets the essence of things out, it's... It's 00:25:41.259 --> 00:25:43.799 amazing. It's like transcendent, you know, and 00:25:43.799 --> 00:25:45.480 there's not a lot of places where you can experience 00:25:45.480 --> 00:25:49.440 this. But for me personally, as a chef, that 00:25:49.440 --> 00:25:51.519 is what, you know, people should strive for. 00:25:51.559 --> 00:25:53.259 I think the ingredient should be a number one. 00:25:53.440 --> 00:25:55.240 And, you know, there's so much like talking about 00:25:55.240 --> 00:25:57.079 costing and all that sort of stuff. There's this 00:25:57.079 --> 00:25:59.980 like ego aspect, right? As a chef, you make something 00:25:59.980 --> 00:26:03.460 that you like and then you make it and you check 00:26:03.460 --> 00:26:05.440 it, right? How do you check it? You cost it. 00:26:05.500 --> 00:26:08.339 Does it work in a business sense? You know, you'd 00:26:08.339 --> 00:26:10.099 be surprised not a lot of chefs are able to do 00:26:10.099 --> 00:26:12.410 that. Fair enough. Nobody really shows you as 00:26:12.410 --> 00:26:14.589 a chef. You kind of have to figure it out. You 00:26:14.589 --> 00:26:17.190 have to have a great mentor. Well, today I think 00:26:17.190 --> 00:26:20.529 you can use ChatGPT for it. It won't give you 00:26:20.529 --> 00:26:23.809 precise things, but if you give them the inputs 00:26:23.809 --> 00:26:26.990 of the price you paid for the ingredients, it 00:26:26.990 --> 00:26:30.049 can get very close, close enough to be a valid. 00:26:31.349 --> 00:26:33.990 It's not eyeballing. It's a little bit better 00:26:33.990 --> 00:26:36.900 than that. So it's something, but you should 00:26:36.900 --> 00:26:40.279 always be skeptic for whatever an AI tool does. 00:26:41.220 --> 00:26:43.380 Absolutely, yeah. But so like you say, you make 00:26:43.380 --> 00:26:44.900 a dish, you cost it out, you're kind of like, 00:26:44.980 --> 00:26:46.640 fuck, I have to charge way too much. I can't 00:26:46.640 --> 00:26:48.599 really justify this. It's kind of like, well, 00:26:48.640 --> 00:26:50.980 what do you have to do? Can you scale it somehow? 00:26:51.160 --> 00:26:53.200 Can you change it? Can you do a little bit of 00:26:53.200 --> 00:26:55.779 this? Can you compromise somewhere so that it 00:26:55.779 --> 00:26:57.559 does work? And then the second thing is kind 00:26:57.559 --> 00:26:59.940 of like fact -checking it against the customer. 00:27:00.299 --> 00:27:02.799 Because you might really like something, but 00:27:02.799 --> 00:27:04.910 does your audience like it? And that, at the 00:27:04.910 --> 00:27:06.289 end of the day, is the most important thing, 00:27:06.390 --> 00:27:07.829 right? And I feel like a lot of people, they 00:27:07.829 --> 00:27:10.289 don't do this. Chefs are often so ego -driven. 00:27:10.410 --> 00:27:12.390 They make this thing and they're like, oh, it's 00:27:12.390 --> 00:27:15.069 so interesting. It's so this, it's so that. This 00:27:15.069 --> 00:27:17.670 technique, this like fucking little thing is 00:27:17.670 --> 00:27:20.410 so cool. And then like nobody orders it, nobody 00:27:20.410 --> 00:27:24.190 likes it. And it's really, it's a very good exercise 00:27:24.190 --> 00:27:28.029 as a chef to make things. The way that I do it, 00:27:28.049 --> 00:27:30.369 I serve things as a special, right? I put it 00:27:30.369 --> 00:27:32.470 on as a special. I tell front of house about 00:27:32.470 --> 00:27:35.390 it. I do a tasting with them. I tell them the 00:27:35.390 --> 00:27:37.650 details about it. They taste it. Hopefully they 00:27:37.650 --> 00:27:40.950 like it. They get excited about it. People are 00:27:40.950 --> 00:27:42.230 simple, you know, you give them something to 00:27:42.230 --> 00:27:44.769 taste, they get excited about it, you know, like 00:27:44.769 --> 00:27:47.089 more likely to sell more of it, right? So if 00:27:47.089 --> 00:27:48.390 you want to sell something, give them a taste 00:27:48.390 --> 00:27:50.730 and they're like, yum, yum, yum, so tasty. Exactly. 00:27:50.930 --> 00:27:53.210 And that taste isn't the 10 % you calculated, 00:27:53.369 --> 00:27:56.819 so it's already part of it. And then run it as 00:27:56.819 --> 00:27:59.640 a special and then tell front of house, so, hey, 00:27:59.700 --> 00:28:01.900 please, I need feedback on the dishes. So when 00:28:01.900 --> 00:28:03.839 somebody orders the special, do get some feedback 00:28:03.839 --> 00:28:06.460 on it. And if the feedback's not good, let it 00:28:06.460 --> 00:28:10.799 go or work on it, you know, because that's the 00:28:10.799 --> 00:28:12.660 whole point, right? The whole point is like to 00:28:12.660 --> 00:28:14.559 give it to people, not for you to sit there and 00:28:14.559 --> 00:28:18.019 eat it yourself. I'm so surprised on how many 00:28:18.019 --> 00:28:20.599 people struggle with this. Kind of like, I really 00:28:20.599 --> 00:28:23.359 want to, I'm hanging on to it so much. It's like, 00:28:23.380 --> 00:28:25.220 no, people don't like it. People don't want it. 00:28:25.299 --> 00:28:27.859 Let it go, man. Or find a different approach. 00:28:28.059 --> 00:28:32.140 Find a different combination, a different plating. 00:28:32.180 --> 00:28:34.400 Maybe instead of having it as a big main course, 00:28:34.500 --> 00:28:37.240 make it a little snack. You know, like, oh, you 00:28:37.240 --> 00:28:39.119 wanted to serve sweetbreads as a main course 00:28:39.119 --> 00:28:40.799 and nobody's ordering it? Well, I don't know, 00:28:40.920 --> 00:28:44.940 you know. Obviously, a big part of our function 00:28:44.940 --> 00:28:47.779 as professionals is to educate people gently, 00:28:48.000 --> 00:28:51.680 right? Not everybody's going to order awful if 00:28:51.680 --> 00:28:54.299 they've not grown up with it, right? We can gently 00:28:54.299 --> 00:28:56.279 bring it to their attention and be sort of like, 00:28:56.400 --> 00:28:58.400 hey, maybe try this, you know? Give it a try. 00:28:58.579 --> 00:29:00.420 Hey, you know what? I'll bring you a small portion. 00:29:00.460 --> 00:29:02.000 You can try it. Maybe next time you want to order 00:29:02.000 --> 00:29:03.839 it, right? And that's how you educate people 00:29:03.839 --> 00:29:07.160 in a kind way, not in an entitled way. But, you 00:29:07.160 --> 00:29:08.940 know, maybe they didn't want to eat a main course 00:29:08.940 --> 00:29:11.900 of sweetbreads. Make it a snack. Make it a small 00:29:11.900 --> 00:29:14.259 bite. Grill it. Put it on a toast. I don't know. 00:29:14.339 --> 00:29:17.660 Put it into a framework where it's more digestible 00:29:17.660 --> 00:29:19.859 to people. I think I've told this story before 00:29:19.859 --> 00:29:23.079 of my friend, Raul Roman, who is a chef in Paris. 00:29:23.240 --> 00:29:26.279 He was working in his own restaurant that made 00:29:26.279 --> 00:29:28.880 it to the Michelin Guide at some point, and he 00:29:28.880 --> 00:29:31.460 served anticuchos, you know? Yes. And somebody 00:29:31.460 --> 00:29:33.819 called him and said, like, wow, this is so nice. 00:29:33.960 --> 00:29:35.720 It's really tasty. I've never had this before. 00:29:35.839 --> 00:29:38.539 And he said, because I made it with the heart. 00:29:42.460 --> 00:29:45.559 That's really funny. But he didn't say what it 00:29:45.559 --> 00:29:47.319 was, you know? Like, this is something I've seen. 00:29:47.859 --> 00:29:51.440 Millions of times in culinary schools projects 00:29:51.440 --> 00:29:54.759 where they serve cow's heart because they think 00:29:54.759 --> 00:29:56.900 it's so crazy and creative and modern and different, 00:29:57.039 --> 00:30:00.559 and they find out that nobody likes it. Nobody 00:30:00.559 --> 00:30:03.519 will order it. It's like a very niche thing, 00:30:03.740 --> 00:30:06.259 and you can't put that on a menu just like that. 00:30:06.440 --> 00:30:08.940 You really have to know what you're doing. in 00:30:08.940 --> 00:30:10.839 order for something like that to be sold. You 00:30:10.839 --> 00:30:14.200 have to be like St. John, you know, like a no 00:30:14.200 --> 00:30:16.980 -fault restaurant or having a no -fault event 00:30:16.980 --> 00:30:20.359 or something like that where people go for that, 00:30:20.440 --> 00:30:22.160 you know, people who like that kind of stuff. 00:30:22.799 --> 00:30:26.660 Yeah, the way that you market things and that 00:30:26.660 --> 00:30:29.599 you brand things is so extremely important. You 00:30:29.599 --> 00:30:33.140 know, the same thing, like, can be rejected, 00:30:33.180 --> 00:30:37.069 but you give it a different coat of paint. And 00:30:37.069 --> 00:30:39.430 if you know how to do that really well and you 00:30:39.430 --> 00:30:43.329 know how to navigate your concept and your style, 00:30:43.529 --> 00:30:45.269 it's a very, very good skill to have.