WEBVTT 00:00:00.000 --> 00:00:10.619 You're listening to Heritage Radio Network. Hi 00:00:10.619 --> 00:00:14.500 everyone, welcome to Pot Luck Food Talks. I'm 00:00:14.500 --> 00:00:18.160 screening direct from Malaga, southern Spain. 00:00:18.420 --> 00:00:21.780 This is a show where we talk about nonsensical 00:00:21.780 --> 00:00:26.000 food topics. Phil is just ordering some Chinese 00:00:26.000 --> 00:00:28.980 food. Well, I was. You interrupted me. I didn't 00:00:28.980 --> 00:00:31.000 want to be on my phone while we were starting 00:00:31.000 --> 00:00:34.920 this episode. Ah, okay. I didn't have a chance 00:00:34.920 --> 00:00:37.299 to brew myself another oolong. I didn't have 00:00:37.299 --> 00:00:39.979 time to order my beef tendon soup from Din Tai 00:00:39.979 --> 00:00:44.340 Fung. It just caught me with my pants down, basically. 00:00:45.060 --> 00:00:46.700 There's something I wanted to talk with you, 00:00:46.780 --> 00:00:51.359 man. I've been having this recurrent idea and 00:00:51.359 --> 00:00:55.659 I'm not sure if it's absolute genius or absolute... 00:00:56.840 --> 00:01:01.479 Does it have anything to do with British people's 00:01:01.479 --> 00:01:05.400 opinion on lemon curd and lemon pies or tarts? 00:01:06.180 --> 00:01:09.480 Well, it could be related, but it's not directly 00:01:09.480 --> 00:01:14.120 related to that. No, no, no. I was thinking these 00:01:14.120 --> 00:01:16.739 two ideas. I will just say them plainly and you 00:01:16.739 --> 00:01:19.459 let me know the first thing that comes to your 00:01:19.459 --> 00:01:22.640 mind. One would be this cheesecake that has a 00:01:22.640 --> 00:01:25.180 little bit of blue cheese to add some... some 00:01:25.180 --> 00:01:28.760 depth, some funkiness to it, but so little that 00:01:28.760 --> 00:01:32.019 it's subtle, but it just makes it better. And 00:01:32.019 --> 00:01:34.579 it's super counterintuitive to add blue cheese. 00:01:35.019 --> 00:01:37.200 I mean, at least if you've never seen it before. 00:01:37.459 --> 00:01:41.280 Two ideas. Number one would be anchovies, and 00:01:41.280 --> 00:01:45.480 number two would be foie gras. You know, I would 00:01:45.480 --> 00:01:48.200 have said that I don't like the idea if you had 00:01:48.200 --> 00:01:53.079 asked me this question yesterday. But thinking 00:01:53.079 --> 00:01:57.359 about it, As a substitute for blue cheese, I 00:01:57.359 --> 00:01:59.700 can kind of see it. I can kind of see it working. 00:02:01.120 --> 00:02:04.500 But foie gras, yeah, for sure. I can also see 00:02:04.500 --> 00:02:07.819 that. Foie gras, I see for sure. Like, anchovy, 00:02:07.879 --> 00:02:11.439 I think it's, you know, like the daring one. 00:02:11.580 --> 00:02:16.599 Like, it's a gutsy one, you know? That is very 00:02:16.599 --> 00:02:19.080 true. You need to have balls to serve that. I 00:02:19.080 --> 00:02:21.979 think that's what makes it interesting. Like, 00:02:21.979 --> 00:02:25.439 from a... Mugari thought process perspective. 00:02:25.800 --> 00:02:28.500 You know, at the end of the day, it's eggs, anchovies, 00:02:28.520 --> 00:02:31.099 and cream cheese, which absolutely works together. 00:02:31.240 --> 00:02:32.919 It has to work together, you know? Like, it's 00:02:32.919 --> 00:02:36.099 not something... The only thing that makes it... 00:02:36.099 --> 00:02:39.300 But yet, at the same time, even sugar, man, you 00:02:39.300 --> 00:02:44.819 know, like, there was this iconic, like, a tapa 00:02:44.819 --> 00:02:48.539 that Ferran Adria would do that was... condensed 00:02:48.539 --> 00:02:52.479 milk you know this milk yeah milk syrup basically 00:02:52.479 --> 00:02:56.039 with anchovies those two things you know and 00:02:56.039 --> 00:02:58.659 it works pretty well like that contrast of ancho 00:02:58.659 --> 00:03:02.400 or even the sour anchovies at chepecha that are 00:03:02.400 --> 00:03:05.240 with blueberry jam you know i think that the 00:03:05.240 --> 00:03:08.979 only problem here is the dessert concept you 00:03:08.979 --> 00:03:12.280 know like having a dessert with fish I've never 00:03:12.280 --> 00:03:15.319 had it, and I don't know if it's something that 00:03:15.319 --> 00:03:18.379 I would dig. But doing that and putting it in 00:03:18.379 --> 00:03:22.180 some kind of other context, maybe as a starter 00:03:22.180 --> 00:03:25.939 or as a component of some other things in a dish, 00:03:26.120 --> 00:03:30.120 or even as a savory dessert. Have you had savory 00:03:30.120 --> 00:03:32.840 desserts before? I'm pretty sure that I have. 00:03:33.020 --> 00:03:37.039 I mean, also things going on the verge of savory. 00:03:38.039 --> 00:03:43.080 A savory, I mean... Dessert as savory. That is 00:03:43.080 --> 00:03:46.659 a difficult question, huh? I went to this restaurant 00:03:46.659 --> 00:03:50.800 called John Dory in Amsterdam. And I remember 00:03:50.800 --> 00:03:54.460 having a savory dessert there. And it was, yeah, 00:03:54.520 --> 00:03:57.500 it was like crispy chicken skin with foie gras. 00:03:57.659 --> 00:03:59.819 And I don't know what else. These were all like, 00:03:59.819 --> 00:04:03.340 you know, like savory components. It had like 00:04:03.340 --> 00:04:06.819 a sweet spot. But at the end of the day, it was 00:04:06.819 --> 00:04:10.479 like having like a very sweet, savory dish. And 00:04:10.479 --> 00:04:13.280 I'm not super like a sweet tooth kind of person. 00:04:13.340 --> 00:04:15.319 So for me, that was super cool. You know, like 00:04:15.319 --> 00:04:18.019 having that at the end of the meal, just like, 00:04:18.060 --> 00:04:20.639 I think, by the way, I think foie gras is a great 00:04:20.639 --> 00:04:23.180 dessert. You know, like having, instead of having 00:04:23.180 --> 00:04:26.660 whatever, a chocolate cake, having a foie gras 00:04:26.660 --> 00:04:29.339 with blueberries or whatever, you know, like 00:04:29.339 --> 00:04:32.879 that perfectly works. I totally agree. I totally 00:04:32.879 --> 00:04:36.319 agree. Yeah. The problem is the fish, the anchovies, 00:04:36.379 --> 00:04:41.819 you know, like. But I want to try it, man. I 00:04:41.819 --> 00:04:47.560 just want to get the curiosity out and see what 00:04:47.560 --> 00:04:52.680 happens. Honestly, I think that it will and could 00:04:52.680 --> 00:04:55.540 work. I think both together could work really 00:04:55.540 --> 00:04:59.980 well as well. Blue cheese and anchovies. And 00:04:59.980 --> 00:05:03.620 foie gras. No, no, no. Anchovy and foie gras 00:05:03.620 --> 00:05:07.000 together. I can see blue cheese and anchovy. 00:05:07.449 --> 00:05:12.089 But anchovy and foie gras, yeah, wow. I don't 00:05:12.089 --> 00:05:14.670 see it like... I'm thinking about it now, right? 00:05:14.810 --> 00:05:17.050 And, you know, things that for me enter in a 00:05:17.050 --> 00:05:19.810 savory dessert category and kind of why I'm also 00:05:19.810 --> 00:05:22.050 now thinking that anchovy and foie gras would 00:05:22.050 --> 00:05:25.250 probably work. So I was just thinking sort of 00:05:25.250 --> 00:05:27.269 like, okay, you mentioned like having foie gras 00:05:27.269 --> 00:05:29.189 as dessert. I love that. And when I was living 00:05:29.189 --> 00:05:31.370 in San Sebastian, you know, I used to love kind 00:05:31.370 --> 00:05:35.509 of going for pinchos. And then when you're just 00:05:35.509 --> 00:05:38.980 full... like maybe you even go to the fucking 00:05:38.980 --> 00:05:41.060 vineyard and have a cheesecake you know if you 00:05:41.060 --> 00:05:44.259 really feel like just doing it or whatever but 00:05:44.259 --> 00:05:47.839 then you go to bar sport and you have a foie 00:05:47.839 --> 00:05:51.459 gras just to fucking give you that last that 00:05:51.459 --> 00:05:54.259 last punch in the stomach to really take you 00:05:54.259 --> 00:05:56.879 out of commission have you had the foie gras 00:05:56.879 --> 00:06:03.459 at atari no i used to never go to atari Dude, 00:06:03.540 --> 00:06:05.920 like that has become my favorite foie gras. They 00:06:05.920 --> 00:06:09.259 do it like with, you know, this overly savory 00:06:09.259 --> 00:06:12.819 corns that you get with beer, corn nuts, you 00:06:12.819 --> 00:06:18.199 know, this crunchy. Corn nuts, caramelized and 00:06:18.199 --> 00:06:21.860 powder. It's always a good idea to use corn with... 00:06:22.350 --> 00:06:25.089 foie gras or whatever the animal eats use it 00:06:25.089 --> 00:06:28.550 as whatever around the dish right you know this 00:06:28.550 --> 00:06:32.550 crunchy nuts this caramelized cornflakes kind 00:06:32.550 --> 00:06:35.610 of thing you know like not cornflakes cornflakes 00:06:35.610 --> 00:06:38.389 but this one that came with honey and you know 00:06:38.389 --> 00:06:40.889 like anyways like it reminded me of this kind 00:06:40.889 --> 00:06:43.730 of cereals breakfast cereals that on top of the 00:06:43.730 --> 00:06:47.370 foie gras and the interesting part is what comes 00:06:47.370 --> 00:06:51.029 next and basically like a very thick white chocolate 00:06:51.029 --> 00:06:54.980 ganache Interesting. It's so good. So fucking 00:06:54.980 --> 00:06:58.480 good, man. Like adding like a generous amount 00:06:58.480 --> 00:07:00.879 of the white chocolate ganache on top of the 00:07:00.879 --> 00:07:05.060 foie gras is just heaven. Yeah, I'm a big fan 00:07:05.060 --> 00:07:07.379 of that. You know, like for example, I also love 00:07:07.379 --> 00:07:11.000 at the end of a sushi meal, a tamago, tamagoyaki, 00:07:11.100 --> 00:07:13.319 the one that's like soaked a little bit with 00:07:13.319 --> 00:07:16.939 this like sweet, sweet liquid. Amazing. I love 00:07:16.939 --> 00:07:20.269 that. or like there's this thing also you know 00:07:20.269 --> 00:07:22.610 like the other day i had an inari sushi you know 00:07:22.610 --> 00:07:26.089 you know what it is there's this uh fried tofu 00:07:26.089 --> 00:07:29.610 that you soak in like a sweet dashi and it becomes 00:07:29.610 --> 00:07:33.430 like a pocket and inari sushi is basically um 00:07:33.430 --> 00:07:35.870 sushi rice that's like mixed with certain things 00:07:35.870 --> 00:07:39.529 wrapped in that pocket so it's like a little 00:07:39.529 --> 00:07:42.730 nigiri and it's like sweet and like the other 00:07:42.730 --> 00:07:45.689 day i had one I had a sushi tasting with one 00:07:45.689 --> 00:07:49.629 of the new sushi chefs and the sushi was pretty 00:07:49.629 --> 00:07:52.029 bad. It wasn't very good. But there was one thing 00:07:52.029 --> 00:07:55.170 that was really nice and I was very surprised 00:07:55.170 --> 00:07:57.269 by it, which was an Inari sushi and the rice 00:07:57.269 --> 00:08:00.970 was flavored with yuzu and truffle. And that 00:08:00.970 --> 00:08:03.649 combination was like really, I was like, oh wow, 00:08:03.769 --> 00:08:05.910 that's really, really cool. It's counterintuitive 00:08:05.910 --> 00:08:10.319 for me, like Citrix and truffle. Or, yeah, or 00:08:10.319 --> 00:08:13.699 even mushrooms and truffle and mushrooms and 00:08:13.699 --> 00:08:17.019 citrus is something that I hesitate to, you know. 00:08:17.980 --> 00:08:21.259 Yeah, yeah. But it really worked. And that has 00:08:21.259 --> 00:08:23.019 this thing where it's kind of it's savory, but 00:08:23.019 --> 00:08:25.939 at the same time, it's sweet. And it's a perfect 00:08:25.939 --> 00:08:27.779 ending. You know, we, for example, like if I 00:08:27.779 --> 00:08:30.300 would go to Rowan, the restaurant where I'm working 00:08:30.300 --> 00:08:34.519 right now, and I had a long meal and I just want 00:08:34.519 --> 00:08:37.850 to have that like last little fucking push. Maybe 00:08:37.850 --> 00:08:42.509 even after I've eaten desserts. We do a hand 00:08:42.509 --> 00:08:47.009 roll, sushi hand roll, a temaki with foie gras 00:08:47.009 --> 00:08:51.389 and unagi. Like roasted unagi with like a sweet 00:08:51.389 --> 00:08:55.830 sort of like chipotle honey soy sauce and roasted 00:08:55.830 --> 00:08:57.509 foie gras. That sounds so dirty to me. Stop it. 00:08:58.620 --> 00:09:01.940 It's insane. It's a Michael Hoepfel classic, 00:09:02.000 --> 00:09:06.379 and it's so, so good. Maybe one of my favorite 00:09:06.379 --> 00:09:09.960 dishes I had in Japan, and I ate a lot of things 00:09:09.960 --> 00:09:14.700 in Japan, was this unagi blue cheeseburger. You 00:09:14.700 --> 00:09:19.279 know, like, super, super nice. Well, talking 00:09:19.279 --> 00:09:22.919 about desserts, so I want to make a statement 00:09:22.919 --> 00:09:27.429 for all our British listeners. This might sound 00:09:27.429 --> 00:09:33.429 crazy out of this planet, but tarts and custards 00:09:33.429 --> 00:09:38.110 and creme caramel and crema catalana and flans 00:09:38.110 --> 00:09:41.870 and cheesecakes and pumpkin pies and all of this 00:09:41.870 --> 00:09:47.470 can be creamy and can be not settled like a gummy 00:09:47.470 --> 00:09:50.389 bear. And that's fine. And that's a thing in 00:09:50.389 --> 00:09:52.029 the rest of the world. You know, also in the 00:09:52.029 --> 00:09:54.029 rest of the world, people drive on the other 00:09:54.029 --> 00:09:56.860 side of the car. That's also like, you know, 00:09:56.879 --> 00:10:00.799 like there's a world outside of your island where 00:10:00.799 --> 00:10:03.600 other things happen. You know, I just wanted 00:10:03.600 --> 00:10:07.299 to share that thought. This goes for people from 00:10:07.299 --> 00:10:09.440 the UK, but also for Americans, you know, who 00:10:09.440 --> 00:10:11.639 seem to have a very, very strong opinion on things. 00:10:11.860 --> 00:10:18.220 You know what I dislike? And there was a guy 00:10:18.220 --> 00:10:20.440 in the comments commenting on a lemon pie. Wait, 00:10:20.440 --> 00:10:22.919 wait, wait. We should put in context. People 00:10:22.919 --> 00:10:24.480 don't know what we're talking about. We should 00:10:24.480 --> 00:10:28.779 put in context what happened. So Phil posted 00:10:28.779 --> 00:10:32.940 this video of a lemon curd. So it's basically 00:10:32.940 --> 00:10:36.460 like a very runny, creamy lemon curd. And then 00:10:36.460 --> 00:10:39.039 suddenly, well, but this also happened before 00:10:39.039 --> 00:10:42.789 when we posted a video with a cheesecake. which 00:10:42.789 --> 00:10:45.070 was like a super runny cheesecake which is the 00:10:45.070 --> 00:10:49.090 way I like them the most and suddenly we this 00:10:49.090 --> 00:10:57.629 smart asses appear like you know like with this 00:10:57.629 --> 00:11:00.750 condescending tone like preaching saying like 00:11:00.750 --> 00:11:04.269 well if you how did this motherfucker said it 00:11:04.269 --> 00:11:06.889 was like well next time if you do it correctly 00:11:08.100 --> 00:11:12.120 it would be settled and yeah that's the correct 00:11:12.120 --> 00:11:15.600 way to do it and it's like this correct for who 00:11:15.600 --> 00:11:18.559 who are you who do you pretend to be because 00:11:18.559 --> 00:11:20.940 you know like we talk about a lemon tart I can 00:11:20.940 --> 00:11:24.500 think about Massimo Bottura who is a you can 00:11:24.500 --> 00:11:28.000 like him or dislike him but he's a person in 00:11:28.000 --> 00:11:30.980 the food world or the cheesecake of Sueroa, which 00:11:30.980 --> 00:11:34.179 is also and I can sing also chocolate tarts or 00:11:34.179 --> 00:11:37.320 the flan of Albert Adria. These are big names. 00:11:37.460 --> 00:11:41.539 OK, and they use like very runny versions of 00:11:41.539 --> 00:11:45.679 this dessert. And then suddenly. Mr. Poppy Guy 00:11:45.679 --> 00:11:51.419 comes and starts lecturing on a comment section 00:11:51.419 --> 00:11:55.240 on a social media channel and is like, dude, 00:11:55.340 --> 00:11:58.039 you're just a fucking idiot. Go find something 00:11:58.039 --> 00:12:00.679 to do with your life. That's my opinion. Sorry. 00:12:00.820 --> 00:12:03.480 Okay, go ahead. Yeah, absolutely. Absolutely 00:12:03.480 --> 00:12:10.600 agree. We were sort of roasting him a little 00:12:10.600 --> 00:12:14.129 bit. As we do when people comment stupid shit. 00:12:14.730 --> 00:12:16.649 And he was like, oh, I don't know why you're 00:12:16.649 --> 00:12:21.049 getting so offended. And he deleted his comment. 00:12:21.710 --> 00:12:24.529 He said, I don't know why you're getting so offended. 00:12:24.730 --> 00:12:32.029 You and I know I'm right. It's exactly because 00:12:32.029 --> 00:12:38.220 of that posture. That's basically it. Yeah, but 00:12:38.220 --> 00:12:40.080 what I was gonna say is that it's sort of like, 00:12:40.100 --> 00:12:42.259 man, nobody's getting offended. Like, you know, 00:12:42.259 --> 00:12:44.720 like, we don't care about your opinion. It doesn't 00:12:44.720 --> 00:12:48.500 matter. Like, but like, what I find always very 00:12:48.500 --> 00:12:54.419 fascinating is this entitled and unqualified, 00:12:54.659 --> 00:12:58.960 ignorant opinion, you know, when somebody tells 00:12:58.960 --> 00:13:02.960 me, hey, in my country, They make a fucking, 00:13:03.179 --> 00:13:04.480 I don't know, like I can't think of it. They 00:13:04.480 --> 00:13:06.019 make a chocolate mousse. It's kind of like an 00:13:06.019 --> 00:13:08.500 aerated mousse, but it's liquid. I won't be like, 00:13:08.679 --> 00:13:11.919 that's wrong. You can't do that. A mousse has 00:13:11.919 --> 00:13:15.179 to be like a foamy with egg white. And that's 00:13:15.179 --> 00:13:19.600 the way it was done in 1854. And that's how my 00:13:19.600 --> 00:13:21.679 grandmother used to do it. And that's a proper 00:13:21.679 --> 00:13:24.519 mousse. And what you did is not correct. Shut 00:13:24.519 --> 00:13:29.500 the fuck up. Go somewhere else. Don't leave your 00:13:29.500 --> 00:13:32.720 stupid crap on our comment section. Especially 00:13:32.720 --> 00:13:35.860 with cooking, honestly. Almost with anything 00:13:35.860 --> 00:13:38.220 else. It's kind of like, man, you don't know 00:13:38.220 --> 00:13:43.679 anything. Me also. It's kind of like, I regularly 00:13:43.679 --> 00:13:46.860 come across things where I'm sort of like, I've 00:13:46.860 --> 00:13:48.899 never seen that before in my life. I don't really 00:13:48.899 --> 00:13:51.440 know how to make it either. It's fucking fascinating. 00:13:51.720 --> 00:13:54.750 That's the cool thing about cooking. like some 00:13:54.750 --> 00:13:57.070 and like rules are also there like they're meant 00:13:57.070 --> 00:14:00.149 to be broken it doesn't matter it's always the 00:14:00.149 --> 00:14:03.870 people who because like i remember i was sort 00:14:03.870 --> 00:14:06.309 of like oh you must be like a an amazing professional 00:14:06.309 --> 00:14:08.830 chef you know to share your wisdom here and he 00:14:08.830 --> 00:14:12.129 was like no my days as a professional chef are 00:14:12.129 --> 00:14:13.929 long gone and i was like then shut the fuck up 00:14:13.929 --> 00:14:17.059 man like you know you're like who are you man 00:14:17.059 --> 00:14:19.240 just like just zip it keep it to yourself nobody 00:14:19.240 --> 00:14:23.860 cares about you being at your home on your sofa 00:14:23.860 --> 00:14:26.360 pretending like you know what the you're talking 00:14:26.360 --> 00:14:29.440 about because you don't so the the case in this 00:14:29.440 --> 00:14:34.120 it's a lemon curd where the the eggs are boiled 00:14:34.120 --> 00:14:38.700 and that that's For anyone with an academic background 00:14:38.700 --> 00:14:41.960 in culinary craft, that's counterintuitive. That's 00:14:41.960 --> 00:14:43.320 against the rules. You don't do that. You're 00:14:43.320 --> 00:14:47.700 not supposed to do that. I guess it works because 00:14:47.700 --> 00:14:51.220 it has so much fat and so much liquid that the 00:14:51.220 --> 00:14:53.740 egg somehow doesn't over -coagulate. Because 00:14:53.740 --> 00:14:56.600 there were some smart people asking, it doesn't 00:14:56.600 --> 00:15:00.039 have an omelette taste. And that's the interesting 00:15:00.039 --> 00:15:02.720 thing about this recipe for people who don't 00:15:02.720 --> 00:15:05.620 get it. In any case... I take it back. I think 00:15:05.620 --> 00:15:09.740 all those idiots that want to comment on our 00:15:09.740 --> 00:15:11.940 section are welcome. That just helps the algorithm 00:15:11.940 --> 00:15:15.519 to get more traction to our channel. So please 00:15:15.519 --> 00:15:19.320 continue doing so. Sorry. Yeah, yeah, yeah. That's 00:15:19.320 --> 00:15:21.100 also the thing. Lots of people are commenting 00:15:21.100 --> 00:15:22.639 sort of like, oh, but doesn't it taste like an 00:15:22.639 --> 00:15:24.159 omelet? And I'm like, that's exactly the interesting 00:15:24.159 --> 00:15:25.960 thing about it. And then there was lots of people 00:15:25.960 --> 00:15:27.539 sort of like, oh, so you're talking about a lemon 00:15:27.539 --> 00:15:30.100 curd? And I'm like... Do you actually think, 00:15:30.120 --> 00:15:32.080 do you know how many ways there are that you 00:15:32.080 --> 00:15:34.820 can make a lemon curd? But just dumping everything 00:15:34.820 --> 00:15:37.679 into a pot and boiling the shit out of raw egg 00:15:37.679 --> 00:15:40.740 is definitely not a normal way to do it. Yeah, 00:15:40.740 --> 00:15:42.340 exactly. And it's not something you will find 00:15:42.340 --> 00:15:46.840 on a cookbook, like at least not on any cookbook. 00:15:46.919 --> 00:15:49.480 In many cases, you will see like a water bath 00:15:49.480 --> 00:15:52.700 and do it slowly. Exactly. You know, like all 00:15:52.700 --> 00:15:56.340 these things. There are also like this other 00:15:56.340 --> 00:15:59.970 one that said, oh, this prick. This prick just 00:15:59.970 --> 00:16:06.250 discovered... That was funny. This prick just 00:16:06.250 --> 00:16:08.990 discovered 11, Kurt, and he's a genius. And it's 00:16:08.990 --> 00:16:14.590 like, God. Anyways. But it was funny. This guy 00:16:14.590 --> 00:16:17.129 actually responded to... Because I heckled him. 00:16:17.190 --> 00:16:21.110 I gave him a response. And he actually reacted 00:16:21.110 --> 00:16:25.519 with a smiley face. So that's all good. Anglo 00:16:25.519 --> 00:16:29.000 people have a problem with creamy tarts, you 00:16:29.000 --> 00:16:33.279 know, like creamy pies and tarts and cheesecakes 00:16:33.279 --> 00:16:36.460 and chocolate cakes. You know, like the coulant, 00:16:36.600 --> 00:16:39.220 for example. You know, like the coulant is supposed 00:16:39.220 --> 00:16:43.519 to be like an uncooked chocolate cake. But yet 00:16:43.519 --> 00:16:45.379 at the same time, because I think this is also 00:16:45.379 --> 00:16:49.139 interesting, what is cooked? You know, like to 00:16:49.139 --> 00:16:52.460 say something is cooked, when is something cooked? 00:16:52.860 --> 00:16:55.139 You know, there has to be an indicator, a physical, 00:16:55.419 --> 00:17:00.820 chemical KPI that determines that something is 00:17:00.820 --> 00:17:04.259 cooked. Like a core temperature or something, 00:17:04.460 --> 00:17:07.359 you know? Like, if you dominate that and you 00:17:07.359 --> 00:17:09.339 know, like, yeah, I know at this temperature 00:17:09.339 --> 00:17:13.740 my egg is not coagulated, but also not rare. 00:17:14.119 --> 00:17:18.180 So then... Technically, it's cooked according 00:17:18.180 --> 00:17:21.720 to those parameters. But of course, the only 00:17:21.720 --> 00:17:26.099 parameter that it has is a caveman that has to 00:17:26.099 --> 00:17:29.460 stick a knife inside a cake and find it dry. 00:17:29.720 --> 00:17:33.720 If that's the only parameter you have, then everything 00:17:33.720 --> 00:17:38.599 will be undercooked for you. Yeah, yeah. I mean, 00:17:38.619 --> 00:17:43.420 it all boils down, I think, to... um a stance 00:17:43.420 --> 00:17:46.220 to take a sort of like of realizing it's like 00:17:46.220 --> 00:17:49.519 hey maybe the how i know that things are done 00:17:49.519 --> 00:17:52.319 is not the only way that things are done and 00:17:52.319 --> 00:17:55.380 maybe that's okay and maybe the way that i like 00:17:55.380 --> 00:17:58.440 to do things doesn't have to be superior to how 00:17:58.440 --> 00:18:00.799 other people like to do things because it's not 00:18:00.799 --> 00:18:04.279 you know but people have corrected versus incorrect 00:18:04.279 --> 00:18:07.380 you know like that that dichotomy of correct 00:18:07.380 --> 00:18:10.609 correct according to who Correct according to 00:18:10.609 --> 00:18:17.650 which parameters. Yeah, absolutely. As you were 00:18:17.650 --> 00:18:19.890 saying, it's so interesting that, for example, 00:18:19.930 --> 00:18:23.970 I love the steak the way it's cooked in the Basque 00:18:23.970 --> 00:18:28.170 country, which is basically rare as hell. But 00:18:28.170 --> 00:18:31.609 I do understand that, for example... I know that 00:18:31.609 --> 00:18:35.410 Argentina is a great grilling country, so is 00:18:35.410 --> 00:18:38.509 Japan, and so is the United States, you know, 00:18:38.589 --> 00:18:41.910 among many others. And I know that's not the 00:18:41.910 --> 00:18:44.170 way it's cooked there. And I would never dare 00:18:44.170 --> 00:18:47.049 to go to Argentina and say, it's overcooked. 00:18:47.529 --> 00:18:49.809 It should be rare, like the way we do it in the 00:18:49.809 --> 00:18:52.250 bus country. You know, like, it's wrong. It's 00:18:52.250 --> 00:18:56.609 not correct. Dude, just travel, you know, like, 00:18:56.690 --> 00:18:59.049 but not only physically, like, also intellectually. 00:18:59.829 --> 00:19:01.549 Take a journey through the world and see how 00:19:01.549 --> 00:19:05.609 things are done and that the world is way larger 00:19:05.609 --> 00:19:09.109 than your couch where you're posting comments 00:19:09.109 --> 00:19:13.470 on social media. So we were talking about savory 00:19:13.470 --> 00:19:18.190 desserts or desserts with savory components. 00:19:19.069 --> 00:19:21.369 There's another thing that I think it's quite 00:19:21.369 --> 00:19:26.029 interesting and it's the role of bread in a menu. 00:19:26.329 --> 00:19:32.000 You know, like in very... classic settings let's 00:19:32.000 --> 00:19:34.960 say in a classic three mission and star restaurant 00:19:34.960 --> 00:19:38.160 from 50 years ago they would be like like the 00:19:38.160 --> 00:19:42.759 bread basket right and there would be like 170 00:19:42.759 --> 00:19:46.279 different kinds of bread and you would have like 00:19:46.279 --> 00:19:49.440 different pieces and this and that or then you 00:19:49.440 --> 00:19:51.619 you also have like like the bread on the side 00:19:51.619 --> 00:19:54.059 but i think something that i think it's pretty 00:19:54.059 --> 00:19:57.220 cool and i've seen in some nice restaurants is 00:19:57.220 --> 00:20:01.380 when they do like a bread course. You know, like 00:20:01.380 --> 00:20:03.680 suddenly there's nothing on the table. There 00:20:03.680 --> 00:20:06.019 is just bread and butter. And you have your time 00:20:06.019 --> 00:20:10.259 just to enjoy like a beautiful bread and butter 00:20:10.259 --> 00:20:12.519 or other things. Maybe there is whatever, you 00:20:12.519 --> 00:20:16.619 know, like olive oil or I don't know what else. 00:20:16.680 --> 00:20:18.420 Things that you can play around with your bread. 00:20:18.519 --> 00:20:20.660 But you're actually only enjoying your bread 00:20:20.660 --> 00:20:24.839 and giving it its space and not using it just 00:20:24.839 --> 00:20:28.450 like as a... filling component to clean the sauce 00:20:28.450 --> 00:20:30.890 of the plate you know like i think that's also 00:20:30.890 --> 00:20:33.309 pretty cool i mean the enjoyment of good bread 00:20:33.309 --> 00:20:37.309 you know it's like it's a thing in itself and 00:20:37.309 --> 00:20:39.950 bread when it's good it's i mean bread is such 00:20:39.950 --> 00:20:42.789 a magical fucking creation right through the 00:20:42.789 --> 00:20:44.910 course of like fermentation all the things that 00:20:44.910 --> 00:20:46.750 happen in the fermentation the flavor that gets 00:20:46.750 --> 00:20:49.250 developed the way the sugars change and then 00:20:49.250 --> 00:20:51.990 caramelize you know the way it's cooked Like 00:20:51.990 --> 00:20:54.250 if I think of like a sourdough loaf, you know, 00:20:54.329 --> 00:20:56.470 that's first like basically steamed, you know, 00:20:56.509 --> 00:20:58.509 with a lot of moisture and then, you know, dry 00:20:58.509 --> 00:21:01.789 baked until it's golden. It's an amazing product. 00:21:02.549 --> 00:21:07.910 And if it's done correctly, it's like there are 00:21:07.910 --> 00:21:10.210 few things in life that are more delicious to 00:21:10.210 --> 00:21:14.349 me than a well -made piece of bread and a good 00:21:14.349 --> 00:21:19.450 butter or good olive oil. It's one of life's 00:21:19.450 --> 00:21:23.710 greatest enjoyments. Olive oil or butter? I don't 00:21:23.710 --> 00:21:27.150 know. Butter wins every time for me. I know you're 00:21:27.150 --> 00:21:29.410 the kind of butter people. I'm the olive oil 00:21:29.410 --> 00:21:34.390 kind of people. I think it's genetic. I can appreciate 00:21:34.390 --> 00:21:38.910 both. It's only you olive oil people who hate 00:21:38.910 --> 00:21:41.109 on the butter people. Us butter people, we're 00:21:41.109 --> 00:21:44.509 like, yeah, man, I prefer butter. I prefer butter, 00:21:44.589 --> 00:21:47.009 but olive oil is also nice. It's only the olive 00:21:47.009 --> 00:21:50.150 oil people that are like... only olive oil butter 00:21:50.150 --> 00:21:53.509 is no butter is for barbarians i'm i'm from the 00:21:53.509 --> 00:21:57.250 you know like i'm from the south no but a good 00:21:57.250 --> 00:22:01.349 bread with olive oil uh or a panko tomate or 00:22:01.349 --> 00:22:05.390 with an iberico ham that's just i don't think 00:22:05.390 --> 00:22:09.869 there's anything better in life do you remember 00:22:09.869 --> 00:22:12.509 in my goal when we used to in the morning bake 00:22:12.509 --> 00:22:15.809 the leftover flutes and often you would grate 00:22:15.809 --> 00:22:19.019 some tomato and like mix some il cassone olive 00:22:19.019 --> 00:22:20.980 oil into it and we used to have the flutes in 00:22:20.980 --> 00:22:24.460 the morning like uh with like basically like 00:22:24.460 --> 00:22:27.920 a little frenchy pan con tomate i don't remember 00:22:27.920 --> 00:22:30.920 that i did that what a cool guy yeah yeah so 00:22:30.920 --> 00:22:33.420 we yeah exactly so we used to always like often 00:22:33.420 --> 00:22:36.440 we used to have like two trays of flutes which 00:22:36.440 --> 00:22:38.119 are like little baguettes left over from the 00:22:38.119 --> 00:22:40.519 day that were unbaked and we would bake them 00:22:40.519 --> 00:22:42.180 in the morning for breakfast it was one of my 00:22:42.180 --> 00:22:44.319 favorite parts of the day and often we would 00:22:44.319 --> 00:22:47.019 just have them with like salted butter But sometimes 00:22:47.019 --> 00:22:49.220 you would like take a tomato, grate it, add some 00:22:49.220 --> 00:22:50.799 like olive oil. We had this really nice olive 00:22:50.799 --> 00:22:53.099 oil and we just like spoon it onto the bread 00:22:53.099 --> 00:22:55.200 and eat it. It was fucking amazing start to the 00:22:55.200 --> 00:22:59.920 day always. Yeah, that il cassone, that olive 00:22:59.920 --> 00:23:02.400 oil, I've never found it again. It was like an 00:23:02.400 --> 00:23:04.680 incredible Italian olive oil. It was very nice. 00:23:04.799 --> 00:23:07.339 It was very nice. Yeah. That's also an interesting 00:23:07.339 --> 00:23:14.119 question. Olive oil, Italian or Spanish? or greek 00:23:14.119 --> 00:23:19.619 or or french or i don't know i don't care i really 00:23:19.619 --> 00:23:22.079 don't care like this i've had so many olive oils 00:23:22.079 --> 00:23:25.039 from italy that were both really amazing and 00:23:25.039 --> 00:23:27.740 also super i have so many olive oils from stain 00:23:27.740 --> 00:23:30.299 that were absolute crap and also incredibly delicious 00:23:30.299 --> 00:23:33.140 same for greece i've had olive oil that is basically 00:23:33.140 --> 00:23:35.720 like petroleum but all of all that's really delicious 00:23:35.720 --> 00:23:39.420 but really i think i think in spain the average 00:23:39.420 --> 00:23:42.339 is at least good that but to be honest i think 00:23:43.000 --> 00:23:47.319 That's a discussion. You could say... I could 00:23:47.319 --> 00:23:51.200 accept if someone tells me, no, it's Italy. In 00:23:51.200 --> 00:23:54.180 the case of olive oil, Italy reigns supreme. 00:23:54.579 --> 00:23:58.640 But what I think there is no discussion, and 00:23:58.640 --> 00:24:02.440 there isn't, is about jamón, about the jam. There 00:24:02.440 --> 00:24:06.279 is no discussion. There is zero discussion who 00:24:06.279 --> 00:24:09.119 has the best jamón. There is nothing that comes 00:24:09.119 --> 00:24:13.220 close to a jamón ibérico. Right? It's just, you 00:24:13.220 --> 00:24:15.940 know, it's a magic animal, like Homer Simpson 00:24:15.940 --> 00:24:20.099 would say. Yeah. I remember there was an Anthony 00:24:20.099 --> 00:24:22.619 Bourdain episode where he was in, I think, Madrid. 00:24:23.720 --> 00:24:25.960 And he was going around with this guy. I don't 00:24:25.960 --> 00:24:27.900 even know who it is. Maybe you, if you see him, 00:24:27.920 --> 00:24:30.519 you know who it is. It was like this Spanish 00:24:30.519 --> 00:24:33.099 guy. He had like a big gray beard. He was like 00:24:33.099 --> 00:24:36.069 a little bit like opulent. And I don't know whether 00:24:36.069 --> 00:24:38.549 he was like a foodie or like an art person or 00:24:38.549 --> 00:24:40.930 something, but like they went to eat, go eat 00:24:40.930 --> 00:24:44.569 jamon in a, like a super traditional place. And 00:24:44.569 --> 00:24:46.789 they had this like big plate with the typical 00:24:46.789 --> 00:24:48.829 sort of like, you know, round sort of plated 00:24:48.829 --> 00:24:51.650 jamon. And the guy was like, and you take the 00:24:51.650 --> 00:24:54.589 jamon and first you like touch it and you, you 00:24:54.589 --> 00:24:56.710 rub it in between your fingers and you, you feel 00:24:56.710 --> 00:24:59.089 the oiliness in it. And they were like putting 00:24:59.089 --> 00:25:01.880 these slices of jamon in their mouth. like they 00:25:01.880 --> 00:25:04.200 were like little jewels like and you could see 00:25:04.200 --> 00:25:06.579 them like letting it melt on their tongue and 00:25:06.579 --> 00:25:08.559 they were just like eating one slice after the 00:25:08.559 --> 00:25:12.740 next just going like oh i remember watching that 00:25:12.740 --> 00:25:15.500 at some point and i was like oh my god like i 00:25:15.500 --> 00:25:17.720 i know what that's like it's not like i'm watching 00:25:17.720 --> 00:25:19.460 like a foreign thing like i grew up in spain 00:25:19.460 --> 00:25:22.839 you know like come on is amazing no no when you 00:25:22.839 --> 00:25:25.779 have a good a good time on it will really make 00:25:25.779 --> 00:25:31.680 you you know like close your eyes yeah it's godly 00:25:31.680 --> 00:25:36.640 yeah but hey this brings me to a thing in recent 00:25:36.640 --> 00:25:40.920 years i've had so many jamon jamon cheesecake 00:25:40.920 --> 00:25:43.980 amazing i can see that yeah i can see that no 00:25:43.980 --> 00:25:47.400 like yeah you know like whatever jamon is cooked 00:25:47.400 --> 00:25:53.569 i think it it loses like i don't know like Yeah, 00:25:53.670 --> 00:25:57.289 but you do that with the trims. You do that with 00:25:57.289 --> 00:26:00.029 the ham that you can't eat because it's all the 00:26:00.029 --> 00:26:03.470 trims and you cook it. And yeah, it's delicious, 00:26:03.630 --> 00:26:06.809 but I think it's just better if you have it rare. 00:26:09.789 --> 00:26:12.769 I don't know. For me, it's hard to argue with 00:26:12.769 --> 00:26:17.730 a good croqueta de jamón. A jamón croqueta, for 00:26:17.730 --> 00:26:19.210 me, is one of the most delicious things in the 00:26:19.210 --> 00:26:24.250 world. Honestly. But anyway, what I was going 00:26:24.250 --> 00:26:26.789 to say is in recent years, in the times that 00:26:26.789 --> 00:26:29.809 I've, because I go to Spain very regularly, there's 00:26:29.809 --> 00:26:33.730 been so many times that I ate bad jamón. And 00:26:33.730 --> 00:26:37.289 especially like when you go to like a bar and 00:26:37.289 --> 00:26:39.150 like you have the hams hanging, you know, and 00:26:39.150 --> 00:26:40.329 they're like very Spanish. They have different 00:26:40.329 --> 00:26:42.410 types of jamón and often they're very snobby 00:26:42.410 --> 00:26:44.289 about it. Some Spanish people are really snobby 00:26:44.289 --> 00:26:48.329 about the ham. And they cut it and they give 00:26:48.329 --> 00:26:51.839 it to you and they're like, yeah. And you eat 00:26:51.839 --> 00:26:56.559 it and you're like, it's basically rancid. It's 00:26:56.559 --> 00:27:01.359 oxidized to a point where you're sort of like, 00:27:01.559 --> 00:27:04.039 no, that's not it, bro. And it's mega expensive. 00:27:04.299 --> 00:27:08.960 It's not cut nicely. But at the same time, you're 00:27:08.960 --> 00:27:10.900 kind of telling me this is how it should be because 00:27:10.900 --> 00:27:16.630 why? Yeah at the end of the day you know that 00:27:16.630 --> 00:27:19.549 there's a lot of uneducated tourists for example 00:27:19.549 --> 00:27:21.750 and they eat that and go crazy about it and it 00:27:21.750 --> 00:27:24.309 just works and it's like well whatever you know 00:27:24.309 --> 00:27:28.049 we sell it like this but I think actually that 00:27:28.049 --> 00:27:31.609 in any like crappy supermarket in Spain you can 00:27:31.609 --> 00:27:36.269 if you go to the cold cuts section and if you 00:27:36.269 --> 00:27:40.410 look for an iberico that will be at least very 00:27:40.410 --> 00:27:43.440 good Not good, but very good. If it's a very 00:27:43.440 --> 00:27:46.779 good, it's a very good. It's a magic animal, 00:27:46.880 --> 00:27:51.700 man. It will taste very nice. It will not taste 00:27:51.700 --> 00:27:55.900 bad. Obviously, there's hams where it's cut super 00:27:55.900 --> 00:27:58.460 nicely, bland, tempered, or whatever, and you 00:27:58.460 --> 00:28:00.579 eat it, and it's incredible, right? But it will 00:28:00.579 --> 00:28:03.470 be very nice. For sure. I used to do that. I 00:28:03.470 --> 00:28:05.650 used to love that in Spain. Supermarkets in Spain 00:28:05.650 --> 00:28:08.869 are good. You go, like in San Sebastian, I used 00:28:08.869 --> 00:28:10.930 to go and I used to get like pate de jabali, 00:28:11.029 --> 00:28:16.730 like wild boar pate and stuff like that, like 00:28:16.730 --> 00:28:19.049 little foie gras pates, just in a fucking supermarket 00:28:19.049 --> 00:28:23.049 and not expensive either. Cold cuts, salchichón 00:28:23.049 --> 00:28:26.400 ibérico. I love salchichón ibérico. Oh, dude, 00:28:26.480 --> 00:28:30.819 the one we had at Echeverry, which is a collaboration 00:28:30.819 --> 00:28:34.880 with Joselito, that was over the top, man. Yeah, 00:28:34.940 --> 00:28:37.400 I wasn't there. I wasn't there, man, so I wouldn't 00:28:37.400 --> 00:28:40.039 know. You went without me. If you had to come 00:28:40.039 --> 00:28:45.500 up with a savory dessert or even a sweet dessert 00:28:45.500 --> 00:28:51.640 with any part of the Iberico Peak, it could be 00:28:51.640 --> 00:28:56.349 a jamón or whatever, what would you do? Easy. 00:28:56.349 --> 00:29:04.630 I would make a flan with the ham fat inside of 00:29:04.630 --> 00:29:10.029 the caramel. Ah, you nasty motherfucker. I like 00:29:10.029 --> 00:29:13.430 that. Once I had something similar. It was a 00:29:13.430 --> 00:29:18.910 Portuguese dessert by a very, very famous chef, 00:29:19.009 --> 00:29:21.069 Nuno Mendes, in London. He's a Portuguese chef 00:29:21.069 --> 00:29:25.369 in London. What was it? He had this like, it's 00:29:25.369 --> 00:29:27.490 almost like a flan, but with like more egg yolk. 00:29:27.630 --> 00:29:29.970 It's a Portuguese dessert and it was made with 00:29:29.970 --> 00:29:33.589 pork fat. And it was very, very nice. And just 00:29:33.589 --> 00:29:37.390 like caramel with like pork fat and this like 00:29:37.390 --> 00:29:40.829 light flan texture. Jesus Christ, man. I'm a 00:29:40.829 --> 00:29:45.809 fucking genius. A jamon fat flan? Are you kidding 00:29:45.809 --> 00:29:51.950 me? How good would that be? You know, like it's 00:29:51.950 --> 00:29:54.890 probably someone in the Middle Ages already did 00:29:54.890 --> 00:29:57.170 it. You know, if you see like this. Yeah, for 00:29:57.170 --> 00:30:01.029 sure. Super old Middle Ages recipes. There's 00:30:01.029 --> 00:30:03.609 a lot of pastries with pork fat, you know, like 00:30:03.609 --> 00:30:07.289 cookies and all this kind of thing. You know, 00:30:07.309 --> 00:30:09.609 like those have to be good times, you know, when 00:30:09.609 --> 00:30:12.849 caviar was like the cheapest thing you would 00:30:12.849 --> 00:30:15.990 find on any corner all over Europe, you know, 00:30:16.009 --> 00:30:21.420 like, and cook. Cookies with pork fat. Good times. 00:30:26.079 --> 00:30:28.500 That's it for this week's episode of Potluck 00:30:28.500 --> 00:30:30.960 Food Talks. If you like what we're doing, make 00:30:30.960 --> 00:30:33.220 sure to subscribe to the podcast so you never 00:30:33.220 --> 00:30:35.880 miss an episode. You can also find us on Instagram 00:30:35.880 --> 00:30:39.359 and TikTok as Potluck Food Talks. The show airs 00:30:39.359 --> 00:30:39.839 every Monday.