You're listening to Heritage Radio Network. Hi,
everyone. Welcome to Pot Luck Food Talks. I'm
here with José Peláez, and we're on our way to
Echeverry. So in the meanwhile, we're going to
talk about Basque cheesecake. How are you doing?
I'm doing great, Eric. Thank you for having me
on the way to Echeverry. So you started this
entrepreneurship. La Vasca, first of all, I have
to say, Jose and I used to be flatmates and we
lived with Adriano, who is a chef, and every
night he would come with this amazing cheesecake
from Enea, which was a restaurant that opened
short. And I remember, yeah, having these big
munchies every night and talking about the nature
of the Basque cheesecake. And just not so long
later, he started La Vasca. So what's the story
behind it? Yeah, so first of all, I'm going to
say something as well. My favorite dessert, or
the best dessert I've ever tried was in Echavarri,
actually. Now that we're going to talk about
desserts. Oh, nice. Which was a sheep milk idea.
Smoked one, yeah. With beetroot green, right?
That's amazing. And that's an example of how
very few ingredients and elements can be such
a fantastic elaboration that everybody falls
in love with. Yeah, as well as the Basque cheesecake,
I would say it's kind of a phenomenon that has
people who come to San Sebastian and it has been
like taken abroad to other countries and it's
been, well, it was the flavor of the year according
to the New York Times in 2021. People get crazy
about it. So in 2023, a friend of mine from childhood,
he came to San Sebastian and of course we went
out for food. And we finished our tour at La
Viña. He tried the Basque cheesecake and he was
so amazed by the taste. And he said, let's bring
this to Colombia. And I was like, okay, let's
talk more about it. And we started having like
meetings and suddenly we started selling. And
actually we started in March 2024. So we're doing
one year and we are, yeah, we're selling it in
Colombia and it's called La Basca. i don't remember
when was the first time i tried probably in some
of the dinner parties of the sociedad at the
chocos probably or probably when we went when
we went to the old town with the cheesecake to
make some to to take some uh photoshooting yeah
some some photos yeah that i brought a cheesecake
i think maybe there was a day i remember trying
it that day and saying this was my top one Oh,
nice. Thank you. And I was talking with that
to feel it also has something that is not the
classic feature of what is known as a Basque
cheesecake, which is a cookie. Exactly, yeah.
You see it and sometimes you don't, but for example,
La Viña doesn't have it. Yeah. And the most common
one is just crustless. Exactly, yeah. But we
were going to a different market, so we are not
100 % following the traditional recipe. but we
just used we just used the elements that are
more important for for us for me i would say
which is the texture the more or less the proportions
of the ingredients the nature of the ingredients
that are inside the batter and we use this this
cookie base which is actually quite famous in
different cheesecakes that are mostly in that
non -bus part but even they are they are called
abroad like spanish cheesecake now yeah so there
are some brands in madrid barcelona it's been
like a boom around this product this like creamy
runny product with this cookie base many people
love the cookie base and it is also very helpful
for the for the resulting texture is helpful
in terms of like heat transfer when you're baking
it it's also helpful to manipulate it to move
the the cake itself no Yeah, the one you have
is also like a pinch of salt, like a savory.
Yeah, because I think one of the most valued
things or features about this cheesecake is that
it's not as sweet as other desserts. It's not
as sweet as maybe the New Year cheesecake or
other cheesecakes. It has this savory, umami,
salty hint in the flavor profile. So yeah, we
want to have that in our cheesecake. We had a
previous episode on cheesecake with Patricia
Jurado. And yesterday, one of the listeners wrote,
I am listening slowly to the old episodes. And
the one on the Basque cheesecake, when you're
talking about one with Turkish feta. I am Greek
and you broke my heart. Just to make it clear,
there is no Turkish or any other than Greek feta.
So I apologize to that. Very, very cute. But
that was like a super nice cheesecake I was doing
in a Basque restaurant in Berlin. And we would
mix, gassy, yeah, like, well, this is a cheese
that comes like in a can, in a brine. Okay. And
it's ultra -savory, ultra -salty. Okay. We would
mix that with mascarpone, which is ultra -fatty
and not salty at all. Uh -huh. And that was our
cream cheese, so it was like... Oh, nice. Yeah,
and you had, like, this salty punch in the mixture,
and it was really, really nice. People would
go to that place only for the cheesecake. It
was a Basque pincho bar. Okay. Here, Lynn, there.
I'll have to try it. Nowadays you're seeing that
people and brands playing around with the cheesecake
itself. The important thing I would say is to
keep that creamy texture, that high content of
fat. And yeah, keeping the sweetness right in
the spot. Something we've talked a lot about
in the show is the value Basques in general give
to dairy. That is one of the very few... It's
the only that I know, maybe Italian also, but
what you see, milk ice cream, you know, very
plain or what you just mentioned, sheep milk
ice cream. Yeah, because I would say that that's
a Basque culinary identity feature in general.
It's just like few elements or even like the
raw materials themselves. as less intervention
as possible. You know what I mean? Yeah, absolutely.
Like, never more than four or five components.
Mamiya, which is just curded milk. That's another
of my... That's also in my top three favorite
desserts in the world. Okay. Do you have, like,
a memorable one? We have, like, an incredible
one. Asador Bedua. I have in mind the one that
my girlfriend's grandmother... prepares and also
my girlfriend prepares sometimes at home. And
of course there's the nostalgia because of it
is like our homemade dessert. Do you have like
a special milk for it? I don't have in mind like
a brand or something. Of course it's sheep milk,
but I don't have in mind a specific brand, no.
Okay, okay. I like to eat it with honey. Oh,
yeah. Yeah. Yeah, that's a very... Yeah, it feels
good. The one we had felt like a mousse and it
was just curd sheep milk. Super nice. That's
amazing. I love it. How was the reception with
the Colombian consumer? Yeah, it's been a...
I wouldn't say like it's been a challenge because
fortunately it is a product that everybody tries
and they just love it. But at the beginning when
they see photos or they see the texture which
is quite runny and creamy... people might think
that it is like undercooked so you kind of have
to explain to them like this is a traditional
culinary technique like from the from the Basque
country that's the way it is it is properly cooked
so people kind of understand it and they tried
and they and they want to repeat a lot we have
a lot of loyal customers it also helped that
we started with another brand kind of at the
same time so we've been both like creating awareness
of this product in the country. I would say that
we are, both of us are a reference in this product
category in Colombia. And yeah, that helps, you
know, like the fact that it's not only one, but
other. So that's nice. And a funny story is that
sometimes some people would see the pictures
of the runny cake, which is like a round shape.
And they would ask in the comments, like, what
is that? Is that an arepa? Because they thought
it was an arepa with melted cheese coming out
of it. And we were like... Ah, that's funny.
Because they got the cheese in the middle of
the two crusts. Yeah, because there was like
a photo from the top. So you see like the round
shape cut in half and the runny cream coming
out of it. Which is like the... gets you like
craving that. Yeah, for me that's the best part,
the creamy metal, the runny metal. Yeah, and
all of the posts that have these kind of videos
or that show this cream are the ones that always
get viral and that people want just to like to...
tried you know and and put a spoon inside of
it yeah it's also i i guess like it's a natural
thing for latin americans because fresh cheese
is so common all over latin america like white
fresh cheese and we also did a variation well
this is something that some maybe the most uh
traditional people would would not be like uh
would not agree on which is doing like variations
of the of the of the cheesecake so we did we
had done like a dulce de leche, like dulce de
leche cheesecake. That's like a flavor from every
Colombian person, like from childhood, mixing
fresh cheese with arequipe or with manjar blanco,
which is our dulce de leche. So we put them together
and created this flavor that is also typical.
You can find it in other brands in Spain. And
it's amazing. I remember also trying one you
did for our friend Hitoshi with matcha. Yeah,
that was a special because we were having this
dinner for, we were cooking in the society for
Japanese. So I used the matcha to make a Basque
cheesecake, like a matcha Basque cheesecake for
them. And yeah, it was interesting. Are there
any, like, strange flavors you've seen? I've
seen with lemon has become relatively popular,
coffee, pistachio in some cheesecake stores.
Like, rare, I wouldn't say rare, but... Well,
I've seen that there's this Japanese Instagrammer.
Yeah? She cooks, like, really nice Basque cheesecakes,
and I've done it with some... One day she did...
She cooked one with sweet potato. Oh, good. And
it was like a... I think two, one like an orange
Basque cheesecake and a purple Basque cheesecake
made both with two varieties of sweet potatoes.
I haven't tried it, but I would like to. Has
anyone ever tried to do a vegan cheesecake? I
have no record of something like that. It wouldn't
be a cheesecake. It would be a vegan cake. But
if you achieve the same texture... but you use
whatever i don't know coconut cashews maybe i
haven't tried it and i haven't seen it seen it
in the like in social media i worked in a vegan
in a raw vegan restaurant and we had like a cashew
cheese steak okay which was kind of like a cashew
puree with a crust and then settled okay that
was it was really nice with hydrated mango and
i don't know but yeah like this vegan cuisine
something we've done and we actually it's a it's
a very good Selling product is we did a like
zero sugar Okay version. Ah, yeah. Yeah, which
is like a like a huge trend Yeah, and people
love it and I would say this is it's amazingly
achieved many people in a blind tasting wouldn't
Tell the difference we use a little as a sweetener.
Ah super nice. So it's actually sweet. It's not
like yeah It's sweet. It's sweet. Ah, that's
pretty cool. Yeah, very very cool. Huh? Of course,
we've been playing around with different We're
about to launch a new flavor next month, like
in April 7th. And yeah, we'll see how it goes.
There's also another like debate or dilemma,
which is toppings or not toppings. For me, it's
no topping. For example, I see a lot of people
in La Viña that they, and also people that say
that's actually the best thing to do is to add
the sherry wine on top, like a thick, sweet sherry
wine as a topping. and it sounds like this raising
kind of notes and people go like oh that's what
makes the cheese game for me that's what it ruins
it you know like oh i haven't tried that i i
would say that um i love to eat it like plain
yeah without toppings but then people people
are hackers And when they get it at their home,
they hack it with stuff. They put stuff on top.
And we've seen that. And we've seen photos of
people posting our Basca with, I don't know,
with like strawberry or raspberry coulis or jam
or whatever. Or chocolate. It's not something
that ruins it, as I said. But for me, it changes
the experience, the pure experience of a Basque
cheesecake, in my opinion. Which is like a very
minimalist kind of thing. However, since we are
Basque -inspired cheesecake, maybe sometime we
will play around with toppings or sidings, maybe.
Not to call them toppings. And then I've seen,
like, what are the big names in the cheesecake
world? Because there are some, like, patissieres
in Barcelona and Madrid. In the cheesecake world
right now, Alex Cordobés is the most famous and
viral one. Actually, I had a meeting with David,
which is the one behind the main operations and
everything. He graduated from BCC. When our project
was just a project on paper, we had a meeting,
kind of a coaching meeting. There's also John
Cake in Barcelona, which is quite famous. He
plays around not with, like, flavors, like chocolate,
dulce de leche, pistachio, but with cheeses.
Okay. He uses different types of cheeses. Cheddar,
this kind of stuff. Cheddar, gouda, emmental,
parmigiano. Yeah, he plays around with different
cheeses. For me, the best cheese is always like
a... Just a tablespoon of that for the whole
cake. Yes. Just to add like the saltiness. We
have kind of a secret sauce related to that you're
mentioning. Like your secret cheese. Yeah, of
course. Something I wanted to ask you, like what
most people do wrong when they do Basque cheesecake
at home is, one is they burn it because it's
also known as burnt cheesecake. So it's burnt
until it's black. If the other one. is it's overcooked
so it's stiff you know like it's because you're
I don't know you put like a stick stick it out
when it's dry it's very it's kind of logic that
doesn't apply to the bass cheesecake so what's
your advice on how to do it properly or man it's
at home bass cheesecake like the a good result
of bass cheesecake relies mostly on the cooking
on the baking technique okay on the times and
temperatures you can use different times or temperatures
But what you want is that the egg protein is
not fully coagulated. So that's why my indicator
is temperature inside. So 60, 61 degrees, something
like that. And also leaving it to rest a bit
after the baking. Do you rest it in the fridge
or outside? Since we are a commercial brand,
I have to say that we rest it in the fridge,
but at home, you should rest it outside. Okay.
Yes. Yeah, like how long? Two hours, three hours,
something like that? Not as much, maybe 40 minutes
or something like that, yeah. Yeah, and for me,
that's the best moment to eat it while it's still
warm. It's still warm. Yeah, it wasn't a little
cold. But the thing is that if you eat it right
after you take it out of the oven, you will put
the spoon inside or even one hour later and it
will be liquid because there's still things happening
in the within like the protein and the whole
gel that is formed inside the cheesecake that's
why the also the the resting time in the fridge
is super important so and and something interesting
about this product is that it evolves the texture
evolves without the days because the Kind of
the whey from the dairy products, it's released
slowly. So it gets like the creaminess like concentrates
somehow. But yeah, it's a whole thing to do it
actually. We do it in three days. We make the
butter, we rest the butter in the fridge, we
bake the butter the next day, we rest it in the
fridge, and the day after is ready to eat. I
don't know if you saw some chefs at BCC, Neko
and John Iker, they add a penicillium to a cheesecake.
Ah, yes, I saw the video. So it's like this.
velvety white layer outside like a like a brie
cheese like a common yeah like and then you would
cut it in and yeah it will be yellow inside i
when i saw it i i was like man i want to try
that that would be cool and doing like the same
packaging as a yeah a camera bread cheese yeah
oh man think about it it's a cheese a cheesecake
cheese yeah or yeah a cheesecake cheese or a
cheese cheesecake Nice, nice, nice. We'll have
to try it one day. And you mentioned sweet potatoes,
but any other vegetables or things? Man, I would
like to, I would love to do one with pumpkin.
Okay. Yeah. You know, there is a, like a flavor
combination that I love that is, I first saw
it from El Bulli, but then I also saw like, yeah,
like some basic cakes that was pumpkin, coconut,
and cardamom. Those three things. Ah. Oh, nice.
I love cardamom. I love it. Actually, the matcha,
I did a matcha version in Colombia in an event
that we did. And it was matcha cardamom. Okay,
nice. And it was delicious. Delicious, yeah.
What about coconut? I've never seen a coconut
cheesecake either. Me neither. Because coconut
and yogurts are pretty good, I think. Yeah, yeah,
yeah. That would be interesting, yeah. Something
that mixes cheese and coconut. Well, the yogurts
are actually vegan yogurts. No, but I've tried
coconut yogurts, like dairy yogurts. But I mean,
in any traditional gastronomy, do you see coconut
and cheese combination? Right now, I don't have
it in. That's the only thing that comes to mind,
like coconut and dairy yogurt. Okay. Besides
that, not much. We'll have to try them. Also,
the chocolate one, you kind of see it around.
My friend brands like chocolate cheesecake with
cocoa added or melted chocolate in the process
as well. Oh yeah, that's relatively common. But
that's not what I look for in a cheesecake. For
that I would have more like a deep chocolate
thing. Okay, okay. A good combination is white
chocolate. White chocolate and cheesecake. In
the batter, it's nice. White chocolate and yogurt
also works pretty good. Okay, okay. That's this
sour balance as well. So last things I want to
talk about is drinks. Drinks. Do you have like
a favorite pairing or something you would say
would pair very well? Coffee, of course. Coffee
and cheesecake is like... And a good coffee?
Of course, yeah. If it is a latte, it tastes...
Delicious. And any white wine with sugar residue
in the wine, like a Sauternes or a cherry wine,
wow, it tastes amazing because the sugar residue
in the drink kind of equilibrates with the sweetness
of the cheesecake and reduces the impact of the
maybe sour, hints that might be present in the
in the wine so the combination is is delicious
like any any white wine or any wine that has
sugar residue i love um you know they apply the
same technique that is used for ice wine for
apples to make like a sweet cider okay okay no
i think it's from sapien Okay, yes, yes, yes,
yes, yes. Yeah, I've tried it. I didn't have
the name in mind. It is from Spain. It definitely
is. There's another cider house, Astarve, and
they do, like, this apple liqueur that literally
feels like liquid apple strudel. I think that
would pair, like, perfect with a cheesecake.
We would have to try it because it is kind of
a sweet beverage, no? And also something less
orthodox, but I think it works pretty well, and
I like it very much, is pacharan. Oh, okay. Yeah,
I love pacharan. I haven't tried it, like, eating
it with cheesecake, but I love it. Just plain,
with ice. After a society... After a dinner,
a proper lunch with friends in a... You have
the pacharan after dessert? Yes. Okay. Yeah,
after a coffee with a cheesecake, and then pacharan
also very good. Yeah, yeah. That's it for this
week's episode of Potluck Food Talks. If you
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