WEBVTT 00:00:03.869 --> 00:00:07.089 hi everyone welcome to potluck food talks i'm 00:00:07.089 --> 00:00:09.490 vladimir putin and i'm here with my friend kim 00:00:09.490 --> 00:00:14.970 jong -un and we're going to conquer some lands 00:00:14.970 --> 00:00:17.489 across the globe we're finally conquering the 00:00:17.489 --> 00:00:19.390 best country so what's the plan we're going to 00:00:19.390 --> 00:00:22.750 oreo now yeah first the plan is not to drive 00:00:22.750 --> 00:00:26.570 over any uh little puppies yeah the place we're 00:00:26.570 --> 00:00:30.030 going this is bodegon hoshimari i know the Well, 00:00:30.050 --> 00:00:35.009 you saw the videos. I did. It's iconic. Very 00:00:35.009 --> 00:00:37.710 classic fish grilling. How do you say besugo 00:00:37.710 --> 00:00:39.630 in English? I have no idea, actually. Besugo 00:00:39.630 --> 00:00:43.229 is like a super popular fish here. And like a 00:00:43.229 --> 00:00:45.210 really expensive fish also, no? Besugo is like, 00:00:45.310 --> 00:00:48.149 it's pricey, right? Yeah, I think if you go to 00:00:48.149 --> 00:00:51.159 this grill places, it's... It's a big piece of 00:00:51.159 --> 00:00:53.600 fish, the greatest you can get. It's super meaty 00:00:53.600 --> 00:00:55.439 and delicious. I have no idea what it's called, 00:00:55.520 --> 00:00:58.579 actually. But they were very pioneer in the besuga 00:00:58.579 --> 00:01:00.539 grilling in the region. And I don't know when 00:01:00.539 --> 00:01:04.920 they opened, but they're for sure over 50 years 00:01:04.920 --> 00:01:07.200 old, that place. Yeah, it's like super, super 00:01:07.200 --> 00:01:08.980 iconic. You said they were pioneering in like 00:01:08.980 --> 00:01:11.540 the fish grilling technique, no? That's what 00:01:11.540 --> 00:01:13.219 I was explaining yesterday, that there are two 00:01:13.219 --> 00:01:15.659 schools, the Orio school and the Getaria school. 00:01:16.239 --> 00:01:19.239 We're going to drive by Getaria, where El Cano 00:01:19.239 --> 00:01:21.609 is. Have you been to Elcano Chiqui? I've never 00:01:21.609 --> 00:01:24.530 been to either Elcano or Elcano Chiqui. I think 00:01:24.530 --> 00:01:26.730 you would love both of them. They're completely 00:01:26.730 --> 00:01:29.129 different experiences. I can imagine that. Elcano 00:01:29.129 --> 00:01:32.730 is like a fine dining setting. And Elcano Chiqui 00:01:32.730 --> 00:01:37.689 is more like a casual place, you know? But they 00:01:37.689 --> 00:01:41.030 have the same produce from Elcano. You have to 00:01:41.030 --> 00:01:42.829 book and you can only be there for two hours. 00:01:43.010 --> 00:01:45.310 And you're kicked out because they have the table 00:01:45.310 --> 00:01:47.790 for... So they do double seating. That's fair 00:01:47.790 --> 00:01:49.799 enough. and i mean it's a very casual place you 00:01:49.799 --> 00:01:51.480 know like you go there you have your whole menu 00:01:51.480 --> 00:01:53.359 i remember the last time i was there we were 00:01:53.359 --> 00:01:56.180 a little bit late and they were like they didn't 00:01:56.180 --> 00:01:59.200 allow us to because we're already in a car and 00:01:59.200 --> 00:02:02.620 it was like that's too much and then you're not 00:02:02.620 --> 00:02:04.900 going to finish it no it will take too long yeah 00:02:04.900 --> 00:02:09.539 and we have to leave we want our afternoon break 00:02:09.539 --> 00:02:15.180 so you're late that's really funny yeah but i 00:02:15.180 --> 00:02:19.539 mean obviously elcano you know, is now also world 00:02:19.539 --> 00:02:23.180 famous, you know, as like the reference. I remember 00:02:23.180 --> 00:02:25.120 when I first came to the Basque Country, it was 00:02:25.120 --> 00:02:27.139 like, kind of like everybody was talking about 00:02:27.139 --> 00:02:29.879 Echevary and people were sort of like, yeah, 00:02:29.879 --> 00:02:31.639 but have you heard of Elcano? And now it's like 00:02:31.639 --> 00:02:34.740 just as famous, you know. But I'm glad that the 00:02:34.740 --> 00:02:37.219 selection of places we're making, we're avoiding 00:02:37.219 --> 00:02:40.259 the golden route. that everybody does, which 00:02:40.259 --> 00:02:44.800 is Echevarri, Casa Julian, Elcano, like everybody 00:02:44.800 --> 00:02:47.020 knows that. And I think there's so much more 00:02:47.020 --> 00:02:50.300 to it, like to get to other places and other 00:02:50.300 --> 00:02:54.199 villages around San Sebastian that are lesser 00:02:54.199 --> 00:02:57.659 known for the larger public. And I think that's 00:02:57.659 --> 00:03:01.439 the whole point. Yeah. And yesterday we had an 00:03:01.439 --> 00:03:05.520 interesting experience at MUCA that sparked like 00:03:05.520 --> 00:03:10.189 a debate about desserts and restaurants and some 00:03:10.189 --> 00:03:12.909 people think in many fine dining restaurants 00:03:12.909 --> 00:03:16.009 or high -end restaurants it's like a turn -off 00:03:16.009 --> 00:03:18.370 when the desserts come it's like oh this was 00:03:18.370 --> 00:03:21.110 an amazing menu like an amazing experience and 00:03:21.110 --> 00:03:23.430 suddenly ah here it comes desserts and you have 00:03:23.430 --> 00:03:27.969 like like lame desserts uh they they just don't 00:03:27.969 --> 00:03:30.610 add or stand up to the level of the rest of the 00:03:30.610 --> 00:03:33.169 experience in many cases what are your thoughts 00:03:33.169 --> 00:03:36.590 about that i don't necessarily agree with that 00:03:37.039 --> 00:03:40.819 yeah so um a lot of people say the the main thing 00:03:40.819 --> 00:03:43.020 that people are going to remember from a dinner 00:03:43.020 --> 00:03:44.939 is the dessert because it's the last thing that 00:03:44.939 --> 00:03:47.319 they have you want to end on a high note and 00:03:47.319 --> 00:03:50.840 there's a lot of importance put on desserts but 00:03:50.840 --> 00:03:53.039 you know the other half is kind of sort of like 00:03:53.039 --> 00:03:55.979 well how do you want people to leave like it 00:03:55.979 --> 00:03:58.159 should just be like a light refreshment there's 00:03:58.159 --> 00:04:00.000 also like the discrepancy between kind of like 00:04:00.000 --> 00:04:01.620 well do you want something rich and something 00:04:01.620 --> 00:04:03.500 filling or do you actually want the opposite 00:04:03.500 --> 00:04:05.439 of that do you want something to be light and 00:04:05.439 --> 00:04:09.099 refreshing or do you on purpose give people like 00:04:09.099 --> 00:04:12.180 both options this is you know the people have 00:04:12.180 --> 00:04:14.039 different opinions about this yeah for example 00:04:14.039 --> 00:04:17.699 my opinion is so i personally when after i like 00:04:17.699 --> 00:04:20.699 a long tasting menu i rather have something light 00:04:20.699 --> 00:04:24.339 especially light and not so overwhelmingly you 00:04:24.339 --> 00:04:27.399 know like with many components i already have 00:04:27.399 --> 00:04:29.920 that you know like what we had yesterday is like 00:04:29.920 --> 00:04:33.600 very like two three element desserts like or 00:04:34.300 --> 00:04:36.540 Even like just one main element, you know, like 00:04:36.540 --> 00:04:38.240 this is an ice cream. This is a panna cotta. 00:04:38.339 --> 00:04:41.759 This is a piece of fruit, you know, with an ice 00:04:41.759 --> 00:04:43.639 cream or something around. But a dessert that 00:04:43.639 --> 00:04:46.540 is already like a plated thing with many, many 00:04:46.540 --> 00:04:49.879 components, like a lot of information. I don't 00:04:49.879 --> 00:04:51.920 want that anymore at that point. I personally, 00:04:52.100 --> 00:04:54.720 in most cases. Yeah, I totally get that, you 00:04:54.720 --> 00:04:57.500 know, I totally get that. And it's really difficult 00:04:57.500 --> 00:04:59.860 also from like a restaurateur's perspective. 00:05:00.360 --> 00:05:04.639 It's a difficult territory to navigate. Well, 00:05:04.639 --> 00:05:06.399 yet at the same time, I have to think about the 00:05:06.399 --> 00:05:10.180 dessert I had at Mass in Tokyo. Yes. That was, 00:05:10.199 --> 00:05:12.300 at the same time, one of the best chocolate desserts. 00:05:12.620 --> 00:05:14.360 No, for sure, the best chocolate dessert I've 00:05:14.360 --> 00:05:18.579 ever had. What was it? It was exactly the opposite 00:05:18.579 --> 00:05:21.660 from what I'm just preaching. It was a dessert 00:05:21.660 --> 00:05:24.279 with a lot of information. You know, because 00:05:24.279 --> 00:05:27.240 it was like a deconstruction of not only chocolate, 00:05:27.500 --> 00:05:32.220 cocoa, and the fruit, but also of the... so to 00:05:32.220 --> 00:05:34.839 say related fruits from the same fruit family 00:05:34.839 --> 00:05:37.500 from the teobroma so you had copo azul which 00:05:37.500 --> 00:05:40.420 is not cocoa but like a different fruit a similar 00:05:40.420 --> 00:05:43.500 fruit from the same family and another one and 00:05:43.500 --> 00:05:46.420 cocoa and different you had it fermented as chocolate 00:05:46.420 --> 00:05:49.600 but also of the fresh fruit and juice form and 00:05:49.600 --> 00:05:53.139 it was like a like an insane lot of information 00:05:53.139 --> 00:05:55.360 there that you had like 30 different components 00:05:55.360 --> 00:05:58.360 but it was like almost like a psychedelic trip 00:05:58.360 --> 00:06:01.670 to to the experience you know like yeah oh but 00:06:01.670 --> 00:06:03.470 that's cool because it's got a narrative and 00:06:03.470 --> 00:06:06.310 it's about a product that is tied to the identity 00:06:06.310 --> 00:06:08.730 of the restaurant you know it's kind of like 00:06:08.730 --> 00:06:10.410 with the apple yesterday that we had you know 00:06:10.410 --> 00:06:12.769 like apple very very significant for the basque 00:06:12.769 --> 00:06:15.870 region in desserts you play with these like often 00:06:15.870 --> 00:06:18.350 very very often with these very very classic 00:06:18.350 --> 00:06:20.730 fundamental ingredients like for example we were 00:06:20.730 --> 00:06:23.089 talking about vanilla right and it's kind of 00:06:23.089 --> 00:06:26.209 like it's very interesting to me to have a dessert 00:06:26.209 --> 00:06:28.990 that like showcases vanilla as not just like 00:06:28.990 --> 00:06:31.379 because vanilla is a luxury product but often 00:06:31.379 --> 00:06:33.279 it's sort of like this bastardized kind of like 00:06:33.279 --> 00:06:35.459 let's just put vanilla in it whatever vanilla 00:06:35.459 --> 00:06:37.639 ice cream suddenly is like you know like it's 00:06:37.639 --> 00:06:40.839 kind of like vanilla ice cream suddenly is this 00:06:40.839 --> 00:06:46.399 like super need your contact fuck you shut up 00:06:46.399 --> 00:06:49.220 vanilla ice cream suddenly this like super normal 00:06:49.220 --> 00:06:53.420 thing right what is like mega special and also 00:06:53.420 --> 00:06:55.379 vanilla beans have become really bastardized 00:06:55.379 --> 00:06:57.560 in my opinion you get vanilla beans and they're 00:06:57.560 --> 00:06:59.540 like really sad if you see a good vanilla bean 00:06:59.949 --> 00:07:04.430 Like a fucking juicy, full thing. It's very, 00:07:04.449 --> 00:07:06.870 very special. The flavor is very special. People 00:07:06.870 --> 00:07:09.230 kind of forget about this. Also, people get very 00:07:09.230 --> 00:07:12.709 greedy about it. Just like a micro pinch of vanilla 00:07:12.709 --> 00:07:14.629 to your ice cream, just to say that's vanilla. 00:07:14.949 --> 00:07:17.110 What we had yesterday, you could really feel 00:07:17.110 --> 00:07:20.930 like vanilla. Yeah, for sure. Like the deep notes 00:07:20.930 --> 00:07:22.949 of it, because it's such a complex aroma. It 00:07:22.949 --> 00:07:24.670 has to be one of the most complex aromas there 00:07:24.670 --> 00:07:27.889 is. hundred percent and and you can only experience 00:07:27.889 --> 00:07:30.829 it at its full if you add enough of it you know 00:07:30.829 --> 00:07:36.709 yeah absolutely i actually for a while my assistant 00:07:36.709 --> 00:07:38.970 head chef put a dessert on the menu which was 00:07:38.970 --> 00:07:40.889 basically just a vanilla ice cream with a caramel 00:07:40.889 --> 00:07:44.829 sauce but the ice cream is very well made with 00:07:44.829 --> 00:07:48.470 a shit ton of really high quality vanilla and 00:07:48.470 --> 00:07:52.009 the caramel was a very special caramel cooked 00:07:52.870 --> 00:07:56.850 Very dark with salted French butter, spices and 00:07:56.850 --> 00:07:59.990 pineapple juice amongst other things. So it was 00:07:59.990 --> 00:08:02.930 very, very good. And people were really surprised. 00:08:03.089 --> 00:08:05.149 And obviously then it's also expensive. We sold 00:08:05.149 --> 00:08:06.910 that dessert. It was like a big scoop of ice 00:08:06.910 --> 00:08:09.610 cream for like, I think it was like 18 euros 00:08:09.610 --> 00:08:11.050 that we sold it as. And people were like, oh, 00:08:11.050 --> 00:08:12.750 vanilla ice cream for 18 euros. And then you 00:08:12.750 --> 00:08:14.850 get it and you eat it and you can't get it, you 00:08:14.850 --> 00:08:18.490 know, because it's, you know, it's generous with 00:08:18.490 --> 00:08:21.000 something very high quality. i always have to 00:08:21.000 --> 00:08:22.720 think of thomas keller who says like it's like 00:08:22.720 --> 00:08:24.420 one of the most important things for a chef is 00:08:24.420 --> 00:08:27.779 to be generous and in examples like this like 00:08:27.779 --> 00:08:31.019 vanilla ice cream when you like if you know right 00:08:31.019 --> 00:08:33.399 you want a vanilla ice cream that's like full 00:08:33.399 --> 00:08:35.940 of vanilla and then you get like something that's 00:08:35.940 --> 00:08:39.000 like skimped out it's really disappointing it 00:08:39.000 --> 00:08:41.240 really takes like the the momentum out of your 00:08:41.240 --> 00:08:44.440 experience also something i have to see and for 00:08:44.440 --> 00:08:47.940 me that's um that's very moogari like all of 00:08:47.940 --> 00:08:50.419 the desserts were like a single component that's 00:08:50.419 --> 00:08:53.059 also something that that you see like i work 00:08:53.059 --> 00:08:55.080 in many restaurants and the pastries you know 00:08:55.080 --> 00:08:57.460 and i always wanted to do desserts like in that 00:08:57.460 --> 00:09:00.379 direction and many times the chef would say no 00:09:00.379 --> 00:09:02.539 you have to do like a mille -feuille and like 00:09:02.539 --> 00:09:06.559 this very complex things with complicated platings 00:09:06.559 --> 00:09:08.759 and complicated assembly when you can do like 00:09:08.759 --> 00:09:11.879 this you know something that is just one element 00:09:11.879 --> 00:09:15.600 that that is very easy to execute same with the 00:09:15.600 --> 00:09:20.049 petit fours you know like this over -technical 00:09:20.049 --> 00:09:23.370 execution of something that in many cases is 00:09:23.370 --> 00:09:25.990 not even eaten, you know? Yeah, yeah, yeah. And 00:09:25.990 --> 00:09:27.769 not put any attention to that much, you know? 00:09:27.789 --> 00:09:29.669 That wouldn't make me so angry because it was 00:09:29.669 --> 00:09:35.409 what took the most effort in production and people 00:09:35.409 --> 00:09:38.490 would leave untouched, you know? Yeah, yeah, 00:09:38.529 --> 00:09:40.970 yeah. It's a real shame. But like, I really love 00:09:40.970 --> 00:09:43.309 the creativity in desserts. And actually, I have 00:09:43.309 --> 00:09:45.289 been thinking about this recently because I hired 00:09:45.289 --> 00:09:48.399 a new pastry chef. and she comes from a patisserie 00:09:48.399 --> 00:09:52.019 background so in germany where i'm currently 00:09:52.019 --> 00:09:55.559 working um you have this thing called uh conditor 00:09:55.559 --> 00:09:59.740 yeah conditoren which is like what pastries and 00:09:59.740 --> 00:10:03.879 primarily cakes layered complex cakes very cool 00:10:03.879 --> 00:10:05.740 professions very cool that we have an apprenticeship 00:10:05.740 --> 00:10:09.200 for that profession because it's very very unique 00:10:09.200 --> 00:10:14.580 she now started in my restaurant and When she's 00:10:14.580 --> 00:10:16.960 tasked with making desserts that fit into the 00:10:16.960 --> 00:10:19.600 menu, it's very difficult for her, because it's 00:10:19.600 --> 00:10:22.379 a completely different approach, especially with 00:10:22.379 --> 00:10:25.080 the way that we're cooking, which is very similar 00:10:25.080 --> 00:10:26.799 to what we ate at Mucha yesterday. It's very 00:10:26.799 --> 00:10:29.840 minimalistic. It's interesting combinations of 00:10:29.840 --> 00:10:33.340 a few elements that have to make sense. And she 00:10:33.340 --> 00:10:35.059 doesn't get that at all. She's like, ah, let's 00:10:35.059 --> 00:10:38.179 make a... I can make... It always starts with 00:10:38.179 --> 00:10:40.279 a cake. I can make a biscuit, and then I can 00:10:40.279 --> 00:10:42.879 do a mousse. and then i make a gelatin of this 00:10:42.879 --> 00:10:44.659 and then i can do this chocolate decoration i'm 00:10:44.659 --> 00:10:47.220 like no no no that's we don't want that it's 00:10:47.220 --> 00:10:51.220 not a cake shop right we want uh three four items 00:10:51.220 --> 00:10:54.100 that are interesting and nice to eat and aesthetic 00:10:54.100 --> 00:10:57.539 like you know simple yeah and also where there 00:10:57.539 --> 00:11:00.320 is like a bold flavor statement because that's 00:11:00.320 --> 00:11:02.279 that that's it's like a completely different 00:11:02.279 --> 00:11:04.399 experience the experience you have in a cake 00:11:04.399 --> 00:11:07.600 shop you know where you get a cake like a petit 00:11:08.350 --> 00:11:10.629 gateau in paris for example that's completely 00:11:10.629 --> 00:11:12.470 different where you open a cake and you have 00:11:12.470 --> 00:11:14.990 like this whole universe of different textures 00:11:14.990 --> 00:11:18.129 and flavors inside the cake yes and and just 00:11:18.129 --> 00:11:20.830 a spoonful you have like seven different things 00:11:20.830 --> 00:11:24.549 seven different elaborations and yeah that's 00:11:24.549 --> 00:11:26.809 the thing on its own and it's also an experience 00:11:26.809 --> 00:11:29.730 on its own you go there for that and you're having 00:11:29.730 --> 00:11:32.610 that probably with a coffee or a tea yeah and 00:11:32.610 --> 00:11:34.730 that's it and you're having that in the middle 00:11:34.730 --> 00:11:37.710 of the afternoon or or as a breakfast or whatever 00:11:38.169 --> 00:11:41.669 but it's not like in the context of dinner or 00:11:41.669 --> 00:11:45.289 you know like a dining experience it can be if 00:11:45.289 --> 00:11:47.669 that's what you want to go for but so many other 00:11:47.669 --> 00:11:49.889 times you know you you want something you want 00:11:49.889 --> 00:11:52.090 to keep that momentum going of sort of like when 00:11:52.090 --> 00:11:54.090 you've already had you know like four or five 00:11:54.090 --> 00:11:57.289 six dishes that have been kind of you know try 00:11:57.289 --> 00:11:59.169 to achieve something where you're sort of like 00:11:59.169 --> 00:12:02.190 a little bit a little element of surprise you 00:12:02.190 --> 00:12:04.809 know a little bit of ah okay cool i see i haven't 00:12:04.809 --> 00:12:07.559 had this before um then a cake's not going to 00:12:07.559 --> 00:12:09.779 do that you know but that's in a tasting menu 00:12:09.779 --> 00:12:12.179 environment obviously like we were talking yesterday 00:12:12.179 --> 00:12:15.120 about well you know somebody maybe wants something 00:12:15.120 --> 00:12:18.399 like indulgent and the example of like a lava 00:12:18.399 --> 00:12:20.600 cake came up which i think is super valid because 00:12:20.600 --> 00:12:23.519 i like nowadays i work in an environment where 00:12:23.519 --> 00:12:25.600 i don't do tasting menus i do a la carte right 00:12:25.600 --> 00:12:28.059 and i want to make sure that everybody can get 00:12:28.059 --> 00:12:31.299 like what they feel like if i had a dessert menu 00:12:31.299 --> 00:12:34.159 that only has like that has like a sorbet an 00:12:34.159 --> 00:12:37.399 ice cream and a panna cotta i'd be like well 00:12:37.399 --> 00:12:39.500 what about somebody who really wants something 00:12:39.500 --> 00:12:43.860 super comfy you know i think it's also important 00:12:43.860 --> 00:12:48.299 to cater to that so we can't forget that as a 00:12:48.299 --> 00:12:51.240 chef you're not just stroking your own ego with 00:12:51.240 --> 00:12:53.159 the cool combinations that you're making at the 00:12:53.159 --> 00:12:55.279 end of the day you want to sell something to 00:12:55.279 --> 00:12:57.320 people that they really want that they really 00:12:57.320 --> 00:13:00.720 like while not selling yourself out in the process 00:13:01.340 --> 00:13:03.840 Can you think of good examples of restaurants 00:13:03.840 --> 00:13:08.220 where you say, this is what a good restaurant 00:13:08.220 --> 00:13:11.139 dessert is for me? I mean, yesterday was pretty 00:13:11.139 --> 00:13:13.220 great. Yesterday is a very good example. But 00:13:13.220 --> 00:13:16.100 some others, I can think of in Paris, I went 00:13:16.100 --> 00:13:18.860 to Eels. Yeah. And I remember having there like 00:13:18.860 --> 00:13:22.759 desserts where you could get like impressive 00:13:22.759 --> 00:13:25.059 technique, like, you know, like getting surprised 00:13:25.059 --> 00:13:27.960 by, wow, I'm here getting different textures 00:13:27.960 --> 00:13:32.120 and different stuff, like in very little. components, 00:13:32.120 --> 00:13:35.960 but it worked pretty well. For example, Fernando 00:13:35.960 --> 00:13:39.360 himself, he used to be a pastry chef at Amelia 00:13:39.360 --> 00:13:42.919 and Fismuller, exactly. Well, he actually developed 00:13:42.919 --> 00:13:46.779 the Basque cheesecake at Fismuller that has become 00:13:46.779 --> 00:13:49.100 also like an icon. We were just talking about 00:13:49.100 --> 00:13:52.500 Basque cheesecake and the one he did, which is 00:13:52.500 --> 00:13:55.299 already part of one of the iconic desserts at 00:13:55.299 --> 00:13:58.159 Fismuller in Madrid. And that is a Basque cheesecake 00:13:58.159 --> 00:14:01.230 that... Actually, you get the blue cheese. Last 00:14:01.230 --> 00:14:04.409 time I was at Amelia, and I remember having, 00:14:04.610 --> 00:14:07.669 I think the name is Vigilante, which is like 00:14:07.669 --> 00:14:10.190 an Argentinian dessert. Again, very simple, just 00:14:10.190 --> 00:14:14.169 goat cheese with sweet potato. Like an interpretation 00:14:14.169 --> 00:14:16.830 of an Argentinian dessert. That felt like a little 00:14:16.830 --> 00:14:19.909 bit like membrillo with goat cheese. Super nice 00:14:19.909 --> 00:14:22.909 as well. Nice. Sounds really good. Goat cheese 00:14:22.909 --> 00:14:24.450 with membrillo, that's such a good combination. 00:14:24.450 --> 00:14:27.860 And sweet potato. for example in my opinion germany 00:14:27.860 --> 00:14:32.259 is not a good example like the places i've been 00:14:32.259 --> 00:14:34.440 there i also have to say i was there like a long 00:14:34.440 --> 00:14:38.000 time ago there are of course exceptional exceptions 00:14:38.000 --> 00:14:40.860 that are exceptionally good desserts and restaurants 00:14:41.529 --> 00:14:43.889 but like the typical thing is exactly all what 00:14:43.889 --> 00:14:46.509 we're talking about like add a cake to it add 00:14:46.509 --> 00:14:48.470 vanilla because you need to add vanilla but not 00:14:48.470 --> 00:14:51.450 too much because it's too expensive and could 00:14:51.450 --> 00:14:54.009 you get this over and over again yeah different 00:14:54.009 --> 00:14:56.970 restaurants yeah yeah for sure um yeah i mean 00:14:56.970 --> 00:14:59.210 germany is a weird place anyway because they 00:14:59.210 --> 00:15:01.269 were very good at like this like high level michelin 00:15:01.269 --> 00:15:04.169 vibe because of like all the like seriousness 00:15:04.169 --> 00:15:07.850 and the bar but it's only now developing that 00:15:07.850 --> 00:15:11.039 they're kind of having a bit more of like an 00:15:11.039 --> 00:15:14.440 open style of cooking. Obviously, you know, also 00:15:14.440 --> 00:15:19.080 due to, you know, all the sort of like immigrant 00:15:19.080 --> 00:15:21.080 exchange, you know, people coming to like places 00:15:21.080 --> 00:15:24.159 like Berlin and opening a little bit more sort 00:15:24.159 --> 00:15:26.080 of like casual places because that's where the 00:15:26.080 --> 00:15:28.279 trend is also. Nobody wants to, I mean, not nobody, 00:15:28.360 --> 00:15:32.159 but so like few people want to go to these like 00:15:32.159 --> 00:15:34.980 two or three Michelin star places. They want 00:15:34.980 --> 00:15:36.980 restaurants that they can go to every week or 00:15:36.980 --> 00:15:38.700 every two weeks or at least once a month if they 00:15:38.700 --> 00:15:41.220 want to. So you have all these chefs. We've talked 00:15:41.220 --> 00:15:42.740 about this many times before. You have all these 00:15:42.740 --> 00:15:44.500 chefs that come from the high level background 00:15:44.500 --> 00:15:46.659 and they want to do something accessible where 00:15:46.659 --> 00:15:48.279 their friends can also come maybe, you know. 00:15:48.559 --> 00:15:51.440 But with the same level of technique and quality. 00:15:52.440 --> 00:15:55.019 And there I feel like you get the coolest desserts, 00:15:55.120 --> 00:15:56.799 you know. Kind of like what we did yesterday 00:15:56.799 --> 00:16:00.019 where it's like minimalistic, cool ideas. Things 00:16:00.019 --> 00:16:02.480 where, you know, earlier we were talking about 00:16:02.480 --> 00:16:04.799 what's intuition in cooking, you know. Where 00:16:04.799 --> 00:16:07.480 you have intuitive combinations of things that 00:16:07.480 --> 00:16:09.679 are just very interesting and very delicious. 00:16:09.820 --> 00:16:12.559 That maybe you would have to have experienced 00:16:12.559 --> 00:16:16.179 to have the idea. And to then put that together 00:16:16.179 --> 00:16:19.279 into simple desserts that are kind of like three, 00:16:19.419 --> 00:16:22.639 four, five spoonfuls at the end of your... For 00:16:22.639 --> 00:16:26.899 me, also what determines a good dessert or even 00:16:26.899 --> 00:16:30.840 a dish. Or what makes something memorable. For 00:16:30.840 --> 00:16:33.720 me, something memorable, if it's worth telling 00:16:33.720 --> 00:16:36.159 a story afterwards, you know, like, oh, I had 00:16:36.159 --> 00:16:38.899 this in this place that had this and that. For 00:16:38.899 --> 00:16:40.240 example, some of the things we had yesterday, 00:16:40.399 --> 00:16:43.559 ah, there was this sour honey sauce, you know, 00:16:43.600 --> 00:16:47.299 like, or we had this intense vanilla or this 00:16:47.299 --> 00:16:50.200 white chocolate with tonka beans, you know, like 00:16:50.200 --> 00:16:52.940 where you can actually tell what you had, you 00:16:52.940 --> 00:16:56.159 know, like sometimes you have, you know, it's 00:16:56.159 --> 00:16:59.039 just. whatever it's just okay it was just a sweet 00:16:59.039 --> 00:17:01.679 bite after the meal yeah but at the same time 00:17:01.679 --> 00:17:05.859 i think that um too much emphasis is put on like 00:17:05.859 --> 00:17:08.299 smart combinations like that is definitely like 00:17:08.299 --> 00:17:10.420 a really cool thing when it's done right but 00:17:10.420 --> 00:17:16.319 i also think that we like we mustn't forget that 00:17:16.319 --> 00:17:18.980 cooking is a craft not just an art form you know 00:17:18.980 --> 00:17:22.319 and i think that very well executed things in 00:17:22.319 --> 00:17:24.750 flavor and in technique are very very memorable 00:17:24.750 --> 00:17:27.470 like even just like an ice cream a well -made 00:17:27.470 --> 00:17:30.410 ice cream that's nice and fatty but light that 00:17:30.410 --> 00:17:32.910 isn't crystallized and that is perfectly seasoned 00:17:32.910 --> 00:17:35.150 that's going to be memorable a really nicely 00:17:35.150 --> 00:17:37.910 made souffle doesn't have to be like invented 00:17:37.910 --> 00:17:39.630 doesn't have to be creative it just has to be 00:17:39.630 --> 00:17:41.750 well executed and when you hit that sweet spot 00:17:41.750 --> 00:17:44.250 then that's going to be memorable you know and 00:17:44.250 --> 00:17:45.690 of course there can be a combination between 00:17:45.690 --> 00:17:48.809 the two worlds between the artistic and the craft 00:17:48.809 --> 00:17:51.829 and that is what makes cooking so special i think 00:17:52.119 --> 00:17:56.720 is the combination of the two but a lot of times 00:17:56.720 --> 00:17:58.619 people put too much emphasis i think on like 00:17:58.619 --> 00:18:00.960 oh let's try to make a cool combination and then 00:18:00.960 --> 00:18:03.079 they forget about the other part and then it's 00:18:03.079 --> 00:18:05.619 and then it reads cool on the on the menu on 00:18:05.619 --> 00:18:07.619 paper but then you eat it and you're kind of 00:18:07.619 --> 00:18:12.759 like you know it sounded nice but yeah that happens 00:18:12.759 --> 00:18:16.480 actually quite a lot yeah yeah that's another 00:18:16.480 --> 00:18:20.519 thing that in many places to desserts like if 00:18:20.519 --> 00:18:23.559 there were no seasonality to it yeah totally 00:18:23.559 --> 00:18:25.920 and you know like okay because you have creams 00:18:25.920 --> 00:18:28.200 and you have vanilla you have a chocolate and 00:18:28.200 --> 00:18:31.079 you have these things that are at temporary uh 00:18:31.079 --> 00:18:34.759 or not seasonal that's true uh but then which 00:18:34.759 --> 00:18:36.660 is not true you know i mean like chocolate yeah 00:18:36.660 --> 00:18:38.400 but like vanilla and stuff it does have like 00:18:38.400 --> 00:18:40.940 a like a season you know if you really really 00:18:40.940 --> 00:18:43.500 get down to the nitty -gritty of it there is 00:18:43.500 --> 00:18:45.259 a season for vanilla yeah it's like when it's 00:18:45.259 --> 00:18:47.680 better and when it's less good for sure it doesn't 00:18:47.680 --> 00:18:50.329 make a huge difference but Okay, I didn't know 00:18:50.329 --> 00:18:52.650 about that. Because for me it's a spice and in 00:18:52.650 --> 00:18:55.829 that regard you can buy it in a month and use 00:18:55.829 --> 00:18:59.130 it 10 months later. It's not going to be the 00:18:59.130 --> 00:19:03.769 same though. Most people will probably not notice 00:19:03.769 --> 00:19:08.309 it. Even that I think you should approach with... 00:19:08.309 --> 00:19:11.670 How do you treat vanilla? Do you freeze it? I 00:19:11.670 --> 00:19:15.049 keep it cold and I try to buy it relatively... 00:19:15.049 --> 00:19:16.849 I mean not fresh obviously because it's not fresh, 00:19:16.970 --> 00:19:20.519 it's fermented. I try to use it up as quickly 00:19:20.519 --> 00:19:22.460 as possible. I don't buy like a stock of vanilla 00:19:22.460 --> 00:19:24.319 and just have it hanging out, you know. Okay. 00:19:24.420 --> 00:19:26.859 Because my vanilla dealer is a guy from Iran 00:19:26.859 --> 00:19:31.160 and he selects really high quality, super expensive, 00:19:31.420 --> 00:19:34.819 you know. It's like 500 euros a kilo. Yeah. But 00:19:34.819 --> 00:19:38.559 it'll be juicy, aromatic vanilla pots, you know. 00:19:38.819 --> 00:19:40.819 And like how many times do you go to a supermarket 00:19:40.819 --> 00:19:42.680 and buy a vanilla pot? It's this little shriveled 00:19:42.680 --> 00:19:45.460 up thing that you can barely get any seeds out. 00:19:45.640 --> 00:19:48.529 Wow. It's a supermarket vanilla. Exactly. But 00:19:48.529 --> 00:19:50.490 you don't know how long it's been there also. 00:19:50.609 --> 00:19:53.089 It could have been three years. Of course. That's 00:19:53.089 --> 00:19:54.730 what I'm saying. No, of course. Yeah, there are 00:19:54.730 --> 00:19:57.009 vanillas and vanillas. And yeah, I agree with 00:19:57.009 --> 00:20:00.390 everything you said. But yeah, not only fruits, 00:20:00.509 --> 00:20:03.549 but also vegetables, you know. You can use vegetables 00:20:03.549 --> 00:20:08.730 in insanely interesting ways for desserts. I 00:20:08.730 --> 00:20:13.329 just mentioned this sweet potato with goat cheese 00:20:13.329 --> 00:20:16.789 and quince. you know like for a dessert like 00:20:16.789 --> 00:20:19.190 it's like an interpretation of an argentinian 00:20:19.190 --> 00:20:22.210 dessert but elevated to a fine dining context 00:20:22.210 --> 00:20:24.630 that's just an example i've also seen desserts 00:20:24.630 --> 00:20:28.390 with aubergines with eggplants you know like 00:20:28.390 --> 00:20:30.910 there are like a lot of of things that you can 00:20:30.910 --> 00:20:33.930 turn sweet that are counterintuitive and just 00:20:33.930 --> 00:20:36.589 take advantage of the of the seasonality herbs 00:20:36.589 --> 00:20:41.869 also absolutely like a basil mousse with something 00:20:41.869 --> 00:20:48.029 as classic Strawberries is incredible. Also for 00:20:48.029 --> 00:20:51.289 herbs. I mean, also for ice creams with different 00:20:51.289 --> 00:20:54.170 herbs. There's a whole universe that you can 00:20:54.170 --> 00:20:56.890 unlock just by paying attention to this kind 00:20:56.890 --> 00:20:59.190 of thing. Absolutely. I think also when we talk 00:20:59.190 --> 00:21:02.049 about seasonality, it's also like the sentiment 00:21:02.049 --> 00:21:05.630 of it. Because, for example, you can make... 00:21:05.630 --> 00:21:07.990 I think it only makes sense to take advantage 00:21:07.990 --> 00:21:09.910 of the season, right? So, like, if strawberries 00:21:09.910 --> 00:21:12.740 are in season, like, I want to... absolutely 00:21:12.740 --> 00:21:14.839 showcase the strawberry or like rhubarb you know 00:21:14.839 --> 00:21:16.640 as soon as the first rhubarb comes i want to 00:21:16.640 --> 00:21:18.859 showcase that when it's over then i want to move 00:21:18.859 --> 00:21:21.000 on to the next thing but it's also like you can 00:21:21.000 --> 00:21:23.859 of course make you can make a dessert with like 00:21:23.859 --> 00:21:27.200 a milk -based dessert with like stuff in summer 00:21:27.200 --> 00:21:30.299 but you can also like leave it for winter when 00:21:30.299 --> 00:21:33.980 there's like a scarcity of produce like making 00:21:33.980 --> 00:21:37.539 a dessert based off for example just like milk 00:21:37.539 --> 00:21:40.819 and honey and like cereals like grains and stuff 00:21:40.819 --> 00:21:43.460 like that It's got a certain vibe and it's got 00:21:43.460 --> 00:21:46.059 a certain comfort. And there's a feeling that 00:21:46.059 --> 00:21:48.799 it gives you that's very nostalgic in a way, 00:21:48.880 --> 00:21:52.880 which can fit really, really well in winter, 00:21:52.980 --> 00:21:54.500 you know, when it's cold outside and you want 00:21:54.500 --> 00:21:56.299 something that's warm and comforting, where you 00:21:56.299 --> 00:22:00.339 don't necessarily want to rely on fresh produce. 00:22:01.240 --> 00:22:04.859 And also moving with these sorts of emotional 00:22:04.859 --> 00:22:09.200 approaches, what kind of sensation does it give 00:22:09.200 --> 00:22:11.519 you after you've eaten it? i think that's something 00:22:11.519 --> 00:22:14.359 that people kind of neglect like for example 00:22:14.359 --> 00:22:16.019 this like dessert yesterday of the like stewed 00:22:16.019 --> 00:22:18.960 apple with the milk ice cream that's like even 00:22:18.960 --> 00:22:21.000 though i don't have particular childhood memories 00:22:21.000 --> 00:22:24.299 of eating apple with like milk it's exactly that 00:22:24.299 --> 00:22:26.900 you eat it and it's kind of like something that 00:22:26.900 --> 00:22:28.619 you would maybe eat if you're sick as a child 00:22:28.619 --> 00:22:31.880 you know stewed sweet and sour apple milky fatty 00:22:31.880 --> 00:22:36.640 ice cream um and for me personally that like 00:22:36.640 --> 00:22:39.000 ties into the seasonality just as much as anything 00:22:39.000 --> 00:22:41.339 else just like if it's like if you're drinking 00:22:41.339 --> 00:22:43.960 a cold soup in the midst of summer when it's 00:22:43.960 --> 00:22:46.680 boiling hot or you're drinking a warm broth when 00:22:46.680 --> 00:22:50.579 it's raining outside in autumn you know it's 00:22:50.579 --> 00:22:57.380 super super impactful that's it for this week's 00:22:57.380 --> 00:23:00.099 episode of putt lock food talks if you like what 00:23:00.099 --> 00:23:02.400 we're doing make sure to subscribe to the podcast 00:23:02.400 --> 00:23:05.390 so you never miss an episode You can also find 00:23:05.390 --> 00:23:08.170 us on Instagram and TikTok as potluckfoodtalks. 00:23:08.289 --> 00:23:09.910 The show airs every Monday.