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Hi everyone.

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Welcome to pot luck food talks.

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I'm here with Mike Less, Mr. Less.

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And we're going to talk about poached eggs.

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Phil, what are your ideas on poached eggs?

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Do you think it's something that is...

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Are they still relevant or they're outdated?

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What are your thoughts on poached eggs?

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I don't know a single chef who likes making poached eggs.

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Okay.

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I feel like poached eggs for some reason, like a poached egg is nice, you know.

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But have you ever met anybody who actually likes poaching eggs?

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No.

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And for me, this is one of those things that you get to see a lot like in culinary school.

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Maybe if you work at a breakfast service at the hotels.

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Or at brunch places.

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And that's it.

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Besides that, I think most people today do this like sous vide, low temperature cooked eggs.

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Which is something that I do at home once in a while.

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You know, like this 80, 75 to 80 Celsius, 40 minutes.

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And you crack the whole egg and you have like a liquid yolk.

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I think that's...

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An Onsen egg.

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Onsen egg.

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That's it.

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Yeah, no, that's what it's called.

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Okay.

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I didn't hear that expression.

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Yeah, you know why it's called that, right?

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Yeah, these are the baths, right?

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Like this hot bath in Japan.

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The natural hot springs in Japan.

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And that's what I used to just let eggs chill out in the bath and let them like poach away.

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Obviously, it's not like 80 something degrees because you'd be a fucking, you know,

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human boiled potato if you get in that.

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But yeah, Onsen eggs are really nice.

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But yeah, poached eggs.

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I feel like poached eggs are the bastards of the egg world.

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You know, like we can all get behind scrambled egg.

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Yeah, great.

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You know, I don't know how many fucking times I've heard Gordon Ramsay talk about scrambled eggs,

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which by the way, look like a fucking puree of eggs.

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I hate...

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Okay, look, this is a little rant about scrambled eggs.

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I am so over professional chefs pretending like stirring your fucking egg at like the lowest temperature

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on your pan like a fucking maniac is the best way to eat scrambled eggs.

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Once after you just have this like this barely set puree of eggs, you know,

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I'm really like in favor of eggs that are cooked so they're not super cooked through.

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But this like puree with no texture is just basically like a like a sludge.

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Nah, it has to be somewhere in between.

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Exactly. I agree.

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I like this omelette that are cooked on the outside and almost liquid inside.

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I think that's kind of like the sweet spot.

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Yeah, for sure.

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There's a big difference between raw egg and like medium rare egg, right?

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And I feel like often people, they like under do like they kind of mistake this like,

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for example, with a Spanish tortilla, you know, like everybody who knows anything about anything

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would agree that a tortilla shouldn't be cooked all the way through.

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And if you disagree, then get off this fucking podcast and get a life, you know, like often I feel like,

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especially when I've seen chefs make tortillas, they like severely undercooked them.

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And they say like, oh, this is how it's supposed to be.

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It's like, no, bitch, it's not.

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It's like there's a difference between the egg bean, like barely warm and raw to be just at the right point where it's still runny.

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I'm not I'm not with you on this one.

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No, I think that's your German side speaking out.

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How dare you?

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I think here in Spain, that's that's the way to go.

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You want your tortillas to be I mean, you don't want them to be liquid.

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Exactly. That's what I'm saying.

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No, no, no. But but like there are people that make tortillas that are liquid on the inside.

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And for me, I would say from the top five best I've ever tried, I would say three are like that.

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Yeah. But there's a difference between like raw liquid and creamy, a little bit further still liquid, but warm.

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And like something has happened.

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You know, yeah, OK, I agree with you on that.

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You don't want a soup around your tortilla, like which is, for example, OK, with Basque cheesecake.

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I think if you have like a liquid around like a Spanish style cheesecake, that's fine.

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That's OK. That's I won't be against that.

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That's actually something I like, to be honest, if it's really runny inside.

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I mean, creamy should be like the standard.

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But if it's liquid, I think it's a million times better than if it's really set.

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No, 100 percent. I totally agree with that.

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But I think that's a really good comparison because there I am totally with you.

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But actually, people do exactly the same.

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People say like, oh, a Basque cheesecake should be like really almost barely set, almost a little bit runny inside.

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But then they take that too far and they undercook it severely.

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They slice it. It's like soup. And they're like, no, it's supposed to be like that.

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It's like, no, it's not like that.

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That's what I'm saying that I like that.

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And I also tried, for example, a flan.

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How do you say a creme caramel? Is it in English or a custard like a Spanish creme caramel?

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The one from Albert Adria.

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He used to have this restaurant in 1846, I think was the name, when El Barrigou was at its peak.

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And someone got me the recipe from that flan.

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That's the best flan I've ever tried.

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And that's actually a flan that you see it and it's the whole thing.

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And then you break it with your spoon and you have like a creamy soup all over the place.

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And I think that's cool. You know, I do like that.

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It's like the Spanish, the Spanish chao long bao, the Spanish soup dumpling.

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Actually, what we were just talking about, like, so Spanish cheesecake or Basque cheesecake is something that is around 20 years old.

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Not more than that.

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Like what is today known as a standard Basque cheesecake or burnt cheesecake, the one you do with baking paper, the one from La Vina that became world famous.

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So little, only 20 years.

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Yeah.

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Recently, yeah, like for me, this is really interesting because it's something that became world famous.

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I just saw Basque cheesecakes on my recent trip to Japan and it's something that people do at homes.

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And if you Google La Vina cheesecake, you will find it in Istanbul or in Chicago or, you know, like it's something crazy.

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And when I think about it, I think it's part of the, how to say, like of the Spanish archetype of things that slice should be running in the middle.

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Because that's something you see in the tortillas or that it should be rare in the middle.

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There's something you see in the steaks, the way they're cooked here in the Basque country.

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And then suddenly, okay, let's make a cheesecake.

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So it should be running in the middle.

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And for me, I don't know if it's related, but there is a clear correlation between these things, you know.

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That's interesting.

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We should pull the thread and see what it is that culturally makes Spanish people severely undercooked things.

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Especially egg products.

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Yeah, this is something, for example, you can't do that in Germany.

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You open a, because I work in at least three or four Spanish restaurants in Germany.

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And you can't undercook a tortilla in Germany.

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Like people go crazy like, oh, wow, someone else.

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You want to kill me.

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You're going to die.

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I'm going to die.

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Help.

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Yeah, no, it's true.

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It's, yeah, it's so strange, you know.

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Also what people feel like is like a given.

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They're like, no, you can't do this, you know.

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And it's kind of like, well, you definitely can.

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And other cultures definitely do also.

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And not just other cultures from like across the globe, but like in Europe.

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So broaden your horizon a little bit.

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What about xiaolongmushi and this kind of like savory custard?

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I just recently discovered that there is this steamed egg that is Chinese.

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And that's basically a xiaolongmushi.

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It's just like the cool version.

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They use water instead of dashi.

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But it makes completely sense.

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I mean, like I recently started making the comparison that China is to Asia,

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what Rome is to Europe, that there are so many things that influence

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the whole continent because it used to be like a larger empire or that they,

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I don't know, establish language, calligraphy, religion,

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many, many things that have spread all over the continent.

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And I guess this is one of those things, steamed eggs, Chinese style.

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Yeah. And you see it in a lot of different versions in Asia.

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Like I think it's super nice.

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I think steaming eggs is one of the nicest ways of cooking eggs.

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xiaolongmushi, well made, is a mega delicious thing.

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It's got such an interesting texture.

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And if you think of it, it's really great.

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I think, you know, talking about eggs, because if you haven't guessed yet,

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this episode is about eggs.

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But by the way, could you shortly explain what xiaolongmushi is?

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For people who don't know.

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A xiaolongmushi, in my understanding, is a mixture of egg and liquid

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in a certain proportion that is then steamed until it's barely set.

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It's almost like an egg tofu.

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That's how I would describe it.

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I completely agree.

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For me personally, a great xiaolongmushi is like silky tofu, right?

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Like, of course you can make it more firm and whatnot.

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But like, if you have the right proportion from liquid to egg

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and you just about steam it right and you let it rest a little bit and you eat it fresh,

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it's such a unique texture.

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It's so silky and slippery and delicate.

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It's actually one of my favorite things that I discovered when I was in Asia.

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There was a completely new experience.

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And like even such a simple xiaolongmushi like just a good egg

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and a good broth can be a clear chicken soup, can be a shrimp consomme,

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can be a dashi, can be anything, right?

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The basic recipe that I...

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Why?

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Do you ever cook xiaolongmushi at home or...

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At home not so much, but I actually have something that's similar,

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that is European that I'll get to in a second,

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which my mom used to make and it made me make the connection

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and I hadn't thought about it for a really long time.

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But yeah, my basic recipe for xiaolongmushi is one whole egg.

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Important is that you whisk it and you strain it, yeah, so it's super, super fine,

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to 100 milliliters of liquid.

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If you want it to really set nicely, you have to mixture just warm, yeah,

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because if you have it cold, you put it in a dish, you steam it,

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the outside cooks quicker than the inside.

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And then you just steam it for a maximum 10 minutes,

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depending on how much you make.

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It's usually like a portion.

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A cha wan is a tea cup.

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So usually you steam it in these gai wan tea cups.

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Of course, cha is tea, yeah.

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And yeah, and that's it.

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And you eat it hot.

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In Ryugin, I saw it the first time really in Ryugin,

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is a classic from Chef Seiji Yamamoto.

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He had a sweet corn xiaolongmushi, it's made with a sweet corn puree.

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And it was served with uni on top, big spoon of uni.

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Sea urchin.

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And yeah, sea urchin, chives, like quite a lot of chives,

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and deep fried shallots crumbled up.

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And the flavor mixture of the sweet corn with the egg,

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the uni and this like fried shallot flavor was amazing.

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It was so fucking delicious.

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I guess what makes it so attractive,

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and in most of the cases we're talking about

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like flan and xiaolongmushi and these costards and this thing,

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is this particular, also in Basque cheesecake, I would say,

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is this a jellyfying power that the egg has

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that makes this soft gumminess that you find like...

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Like silken tofu you mentioned.

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I'm pretty sure that thing that I tried in Chenkenichi's restaurant,

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I thought it was like a strong flavored tofu

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that at the end was, they call it foie gras pudding.

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I'm pretty sure that was like egg base

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because that was exactly the texture.

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Fuck yeah.

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That sounds amazing honestly.

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Fogra xiaolongmushi sounds intense.

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With crab and shark fin soup.

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Yeah, fuck yeah. So nice.

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One of the nicest xiaolongmushis that I've like made and eaten,

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I've made with a really clear, intense chicken consomme.

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And just like that, like nicely seasoned chicken consomme,

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I said the egg, I make it super simple.

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I like mix it together.

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I whisk it.

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I strain it.

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I let it rest a little bit.

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I fill it into the bowl.

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I steam it.

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And then you take it out straight or hot.

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You top it with whatever you want.

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But even just like that, it's so nice.

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It's such a luxurious texture.

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Last year, no, two years ago,

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I was serving it with grilled mushrooms.

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With like a sort of mushroom garum glaze on top.

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It was very tasty.

236
00:13:40,160 --> 00:13:42,880
Yeah, you just brought me to the next point.

237
00:13:42,880 --> 00:13:50,160
What about egg-based sauce or even just like yolk-based sauce?

238
00:13:50,800 --> 00:13:54,960
Like the most basic one I would say is yolk

239
00:13:54,960 --> 00:13:59,040
with salt, like Gambara style eggs.

240
00:13:59,040 --> 00:14:00,880
For a lot of people, that's like mind-blowing.

241
00:14:00,880 --> 00:14:01,520
Like, yeah.

242
00:14:02,320 --> 00:14:03,200
No, seriously.

243
00:14:04,800 --> 00:14:08,400
Using just plain yolk with salt as a sauce.

244
00:14:08,400 --> 00:14:10,480
Yeah, because what is egg yolk?

245
00:14:10,480 --> 00:14:11,840
It's fat, you know?

246
00:14:12,640 --> 00:14:16,720
Yeah, like I couldn't answer that question like technically.

247
00:14:16,720 --> 00:14:17,760
Okay, quick break.

248
00:14:17,760 --> 00:14:19,040
But yeah, albumin.

249
00:14:19,040 --> 00:14:20,880
It's water, lipid and protein.

250
00:14:21,600 --> 00:14:22,880
So lipid is fat.

251
00:14:22,880 --> 00:14:23,280
Yeah.

252
00:14:23,280 --> 00:14:26,000
So it's basically an emulsion, no?

253
00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:28,400
It's an emulsion of water, fat and protein.

254
00:14:29,200 --> 00:14:32,400
And it's got lots of vitamins.

255
00:14:32,400 --> 00:14:36,000
It's got essential fatty acids and minerals,

256
00:14:36,000 --> 00:14:39,440
which if you know anything about food,

257
00:14:39,440 --> 00:14:41,440
you know, minerals and all those sorts of things,

258
00:14:41,440 --> 00:14:43,520
and like fatty acids,

259
00:14:43,520 --> 00:14:46,640
like nutrients and minerals make things taste good.

260
00:14:47,680 --> 00:14:49,280
And fat is always nice, you know?

261
00:14:49,280 --> 00:14:53,840
And so it's naturally creamy, but it's not super fatty.

262
00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:57,120
It's almost like a natural mayonnaise if you think about it.

263
00:14:58,800 --> 00:15:01,120
Yeah, like I remember as a kid,

264
00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:05,280
I would always dip my fries into the good yolks

265
00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:07,920
that would be in the, you know, like in a fried egg.

266
00:15:07,920 --> 00:15:08,560
Yeah.

267
00:15:08,560 --> 00:15:11,440
Which is also a topic in itself.

268
00:15:11,440 --> 00:15:12,000
It's delicious.

269
00:15:12,000 --> 00:15:12,720
Fried eggs.

270
00:15:12,720 --> 00:15:13,360
Fried eggs.

271
00:15:13,360 --> 00:15:16,560
You know, like, you know, like that's for me.

272
00:15:16,560 --> 00:15:21,280
I wouldn't dare to say that I can properly execute a fried egg

273
00:15:21,280 --> 00:15:22,320
like a pro.

274
00:15:22,320 --> 00:15:24,000
Like, I won't say that.

275
00:15:24,000 --> 00:15:24,640
No.

276
00:15:24,640 --> 00:15:27,600
I would, like, for example,

277
00:15:27,600 --> 00:15:30,080
because I've seen the way they're done here in Spain,

278
00:15:30,080 --> 00:15:33,680
like they're, so to say, they're immersed in oil.

279
00:15:33,680 --> 00:15:35,360
Yes, they're basically deep fried.

280
00:15:36,240 --> 00:15:40,240
And for me, that's the best way where you have like this whole thing

281
00:15:40,240 --> 00:15:41,600
and it's liquid in the middle,

282
00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:44,640
but also crispy on the outside.

283
00:15:44,640 --> 00:15:47,520
And it's not plain as when you do it in a pan.

284
00:15:48,080 --> 00:15:50,960
It's this oval shape kind of thing.

285
00:15:50,960 --> 00:15:52,240
I guess it's not that difficult,

286
00:15:52,240 --> 00:15:57,680
but I haven't done a hundred of those so that I don't master them, you know?

287
00:15:57,680 --> 00:15:59,280
Yeah, but that's the thing.

288
00:15:59,280 --> 00:16:04,240
I remember when I was part of an opening of a restaurant in Mexico,

289
00:16:05,040 --> 00:16:08,000
that's really something that I noticed intensely because,

290
00:16:08,720 --> 00:16:11,280
you know, we opened two restaurants almost at the same time.

291
00:16:11,280 --> 00:16:13,760
First, we opened one, it was breakfast and lunch.

292
00:16:13,760 --> 00:16:16,160
And then we opened the one on the floor above,

293
00:16:16,160 --> 00:16:19,840
which was just dinner, just tasting menu, just carte blanche.

294
00:16:19,840 --> 00:16:21,920
And so I hired, like, we hired all these chefs

295
00:16:22,480 --> 00:16:24,640
for the, like, tasting menu restaurant, right?

296
00:16:25,520 --> 00:16:28,400
And the idea was like, okay, we're going to open the first restaurant first.

297
00:16:28,400 --> 00:16:31,120
We're going to get, like, this is what they were saying,

298
00:16:31,120 --> 00:16:32,800
kind of like, we're going to get, like, more, like,

299
00:16:32,800 --> 00:16:34,560
breakfast and lunch chefs in.

300
00:16:34,560 --> 00:16:38,240
And then all the, like, the top guys are going to go upstairs, right?

301
00:16:39,360 --> 00:16:41,760
So it was really funny seeing them at the opening,

302
00:16:41,760 --> 00:16:44,800
cooking breakfast, and you had these guys that were, like,

303
00:16:44,800 --> 00:16:46,480
applying as sous chefs and stuff.

304
00:16:46,480 --> 00:16:48,720
They couldn't fry a fucking egg, you know?

305
00:16:48,720 --> 00:16:52,000
You could maybe do one, yeah, but then the orders come in.

306
00:16:52,000 --> 00:16:55,280
And then, you know, and I was sending out, like, I was standing at the parcel,

307
00:16:55,280 --> 00:16:59,680
I was sending back eggs and I was like, man, like, there's a, there's a raw spot here.

308
00:16:59,680 --> 00:17:02,720
It's like too burnt on the bottom, blah, blah, blah.

309
00:17:02,720 --> 00:17:06,080
And it's kind of, and I was like, are you looking at yourself right now?

310
00:17:06,080 --> 00:17:09,680
Like you, you're frying eggs, you know?

311
00:17:09,680 --> 00:17:13,840
And, you know, to be fair, frying an egg correctly is not super simple,

312
00:17:13,840 --> 00:17:15,280
because you have, there's a lot of variables.

313
00:17:15,280 --> 00:17:15,920
Not at all.

314
00:17:15,920 --> 00:17:16,960
There's a lot of variables.

315
00:17:16,960 --> 00:17:17,600
No, no, no.

316
00:17:17,600 --> 00:17:24,400
I remember reading an autobiography of Daniel Boullou, and he would say that

317
00:17:24,400 --> 00:17:29,200
he would make chefs cook a fried egg on their trial day.

318
00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:32,880
And I remember maybe reading the same from Marco Pierre White, you know?

319
00:17:32,880 --> 00:17:37,040
Like, it's really like something that, because also it says a lot, you know?

320
00:17:37,040 --> 00:17:42,480
Like it's something simple, but it presents a lot of who you are as a chef.

321
00:17:42,480 --> 00:17:43,280
What are your skills?

322
00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:43,840
100%.

323
00:17:43,840 --> 00:17:44,640
What's the way you work?

324
00:17:44,640 --> 00:17:47,280
How's the way you organize your station and everything?

325
00:17:47,280 --> 00:17:49,760
You can measure all those kinds of things.

326
00:17:49,760 --> 00:17:55,520
Plus if you can properly execute a fried egg, which I said, something I wouldn't say I can't,

327
00:17:55,520 --> 00:18:00,880
I would have to practice if I had like an opening like that or a trial day.

328
00:18:00,880 --> 00:18:02,880
Yeah, I mean, let's talk it through, right?

329
00:18:02,880 --> 00:18:05,040
It's like you're, you're applying somewhere.

330
00:18:05,040 --> 00:18:08,080
This guy, or like, you know, you tell somebody, hey, make me a fried egg.

331
00:18:08,080 --> 00:18:09,200
I want to assess your skills.

332
00:18:09,200 --> 00:18:12,640
So first of all, like you said, how do you set up your section?

333
00:18:12,640 --> 00:18:18,000
Do you have the egg just fucking lying next to the stove?

334
00:18:18,000 --> 00:18:19,680
Do you have something to crack it on?

335
00:18:19,680 --> 00:18:22,000
Do you have something to throw the shells into?

336
00:18:22,000 --> 00:18:23,600
Like, what do you have?

337
00:18:23,600 --> 00:18:25,040
Do you take something with you?

338
00:18:25,040 --> 00:18:27,280
Then which pan do you use?

339
00:18:27,280 --> 00:18:29,040
The heat control.

340
00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:33,440
Because I would say I would start a fried egg on a high heat and then lower the heat, right?

341
00:18:33,440 --> 00:18:35,200
Because what is it for me?

342
00:18:35,200 --> 00:18:36,640
Like, what is a good fried egg?

343
00:18:36,640 --> 00:18:40,000
I want there to be a little bit of color on the bottom.

344
00:18:40,000 --> 00:18:41,600
I don't want it to stick.

345
00:18:41,600 --> 00:18:45,200
I want the white to be cooked all the way through to the top.

346
00:18:46,080 --> 00:18:48,640
And I want the egg yolk to be nice and runny for me.

347
00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:49,140
Yeah.

348
00:18:50,320 --> 00:18:53,440
Henry, what about crispy borders?

349
00:18:53,440 --> 00:18:54,480
That's also something I like.

350
00:18:54,480 --> 00:18:55,360
I like it.

351
00:18:55,360 --> 00:18:59,520
Yeah, I think people sometimes overdo it because if you have a fried egg and it's too crispy

352
00:18:59,520 --> 00:19:00,880
on the bottom, it gets a little bit tough.

353
00:19:00,880 --> 00:19:04,240
So I think it should be like a nice sort of like deep golden brown.

354
00:19:04,880 --> 00:19:12,800
But if also you take it too long and you cook the egg white for too long, it gets really gummy.

355
00:19:12,800 --> 00:19:14,880
It should set all the way, but that's it.

356
00:19:14,880 --> 00:19:18,320
There's a difference between cooked egg white and cooked egg white.

357
00:19:18,320 --> 00:19:22,320
If you just set it and it's cooked through, it's really bouncy and blah.

358
00:19:22,320 --> 00:19:23,920
And then you cook it more, more, more, more, more.

359
00:19:23,920 --> 00:19:24,720
It doesn't stay the same.

360
00:19:24,720 --> 00:19:26,800
It gets firmer and firmer and firmer.

361
00:19:26,800 --> 00:19:28,400
And like it gets kind of rubbery.

362
00:19:28,400 --> 00:19:32,800
So there, and then it's kind of like, how do you regulate the heat?

363
00:19:34,160 --> 00:19:35,680
How are you paying attention?

364
00:19:35,680 --> 00:19:37,360
Do you maybe start with oil?

365
00:19:37,360 --> 00:19:38,560
What oil do you start with?

366
00:19:38,560 --> 00:19:41,440
Do you at some point maybe add a knob of butter?

367
00:19:41,440 --> 00:19:45,600
Do you maybe baste the egg white a little bit?

368
00:19:45,600 --> 00:19:49,600
Do you maybe even put a lid on at the end to kind of steam it a little bit?

369
00:19:49,600 --> 00:19:50,640
Add a splash of water.

370
00:19:50,640 --> 00:19:52,080
It's what the Japanese do a lot.

371
00:19:52,720 --> 00:19:53,760
They fry it.

372
00:19:53,760 --> 00:19:54,800
On top it's still raw.

373
00:19:55,440 --> 00:19:56,480
Touch of water.

374
00:19:56,480 --> 00:19:59,760
Lid, 10 seconds, out, done.

375
00:20:00,800 --> 00:20:01,680
And that's the thing.

376
00:20:01,680 --> 00:20:07,520
Like from all the variables you mentioned, you could do like perfect fried eggs.

377
00:20:07,520 --> 00:20:11,200
Just with one of those variables, you know, like with lid or without,

378
00:20:11,200 --> 00:20:16,960
or with oil, without butter, you know, like all of those are like paths that you can take

379
00:20:17,600 --> 00:20:20,160
and do like a perfect fried egg, you know?

380
00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:20,720
Yeah.

381
00:20:20,720 --> 00:20:23,040
They're like the different approaches.

382
00:20:23,040 --> 00:20:23,280
100%.

383
00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:24,240
Yeah.

384
00:20:24,240 --> 00:20:26,000
Same with everything else.

385
00:20:26,000 --> 00:20:28,720
Same with omelette, same with scrambled eggs, like we said before.

386
00:20:30,320 --> 00:20:31,360
You know, I mean, like are you...

387
00:20:31,360 --> 00:20:35,200
What about this, going back to the yolk sauces?

388
00:20:36,000 --> 00:20:36,640
Yes.

389
00:20:36,640 --> 00:20:43,760
This style of sauce is like the one we had at Noma, which was like umami rich egg yolk

390
00:20:43,760 --> 00:20:46,800
that you ended up drinking it like a yogurt.

391
00:20:46,800 --> 00:20:48,400
That's like a very Japanese thing, right?

392
00:20:48,400 --> 00:20:52,480
Like these are like cured egg yolks with soy sauce, something like that?

393
00:20:52,480 --> 00:20:54,080
Yeah, I mean, so...

394
00:20:54,080 --> 00:20:54,880
So it's cured?

395
00:20:54,880 --> 00:20:55,840
Yeah, so it's cured.

396
00:20:55,840 --> 00:21:01,520
You basically make a mixture of certain things, you know, can be sake, mirin, soy sauce, etc.

397
00:21:01,520 --> 00:21:02,020
Kombu.

398
00:21:03,360 --> 00:21:08,320
And then you submerge the egg, it gets cured from the salts and the acid and the cure.

399
00:21:08,960 --> 00:21:13,040
You cure it for a certain amount of time, then you take it out and it gets very waxy,

400
00:21:13,040 --> 00:21:14,160
almost like it's cooked.

401
00:21:14,160 --> 00:21:15,600
That's mega delicious.

402
00:21:15,600 --> 00:21:18,400
And so these then obviously if you mix them and strain them,

403
00:21:18,400 --> 00:21:20,160
you only have the yoghurt like a dipping sauce.

404
00:21:20,160 --> 00:21:26,400
And I've seen it mainly in Japanese food, but I'm sure like a lot of things,

405
00:21:26,400 --> 00:21:31,280
it comes from, you know, the fantastic vast world of Chinese cooking.

406
00:21:31,280 --> 00:21:33,680
And is it, is it just cured, right?

407
00:21:33,680 --> 00:21:34,480
It's never...

408
00:21:34,480 --> 00:21:35,120
Never cooked?

409
00:21:35,120 --> 00:21:35,840
No, never heated.

410
00:21:35,840 --> 00:21:36,340
Okay.

411
00:21:37,840 --> 00:21:40,160
Yeah, I mean, I'm sure there's other recipes also,

412
00:21:40,960 --> 00:21:44,320
but like the ones that I've made and all the ones that I've seen, it's cured.

413
00:21:44,320 --> 00:21:47,760
You make the mixture, usually you boil it one time, you let it cool down,

414
00:21:47,760 --> 00:21:54,000
you submerge your eggs for like 30 minutes to, you know, an hour, depending, you know,

415
00:21:54,000 --> 00:21:57,200
depending on how strong your, your brine is.

416
00:21:57,200 --> 00:21:59,120
But I mean, that, that is amazing.

417
00:21:59,120 --> 00:22:06,160
You know, just that soy cured egg yolk on nice rice is one of the most delicious things ever.

418
00:22:07,200 --> 00:22:07,760
Absolutely.

419
00:22:07,760 --> 00:22:14,160
You just remind me of, I had a first in New York and recently also in Kyoto,

420
00:22:14,800 --> 00:22:16,480
like a traditional Japanese breakfast.

421
00:22:16,480 --> 00:22:23,440
And so we had this incredible steamed rice, which I don't cease to be amazed with the rice culture

422
00:22:23,440 --> 00:22:28,960
in Japan, but they, they come with the pot and they open it and they presented that as if it was

423
00:22:28,960 --> 00:22:35,760
like a suckling pig with a, an apple in its mouth, you know, but it's rice and everybody's like, wow.

424
00:22:36,320 --> 00:22:38,320
And then you get this rice.

425
00:22:38,320 --> 00:22:43,280
Also something that impressed me is, you know, the sticky bottom that you find at the pot.

426
00:22:43,280 --> 00:22:47,600
So which is like a, like, like a socarat, like a cookie.

427
00:22:48,080 --> 00:22:53,440
And when I tried it and I really want to understand why, why is that it completely

428
00:22:53,440 --> 00:22:59,280
reminded me of arepa, you know, like of, of roasted corn, white corn.

429
00:23:00,000 --> 00:23:04,400
So there is probably like some aromatic thing that they share in common.

430
00:23:04,400 --> 00:23:09,520
So it may probably some kind of starch, you know, but I found that to be extremely interesting.

431
00:23:09,520 --> 00:23:15,360
So, but going back to, to the breakfast, it was like, well, you could make different combinations.

432
00:23:15,360 --> 00:23:21,120
There was, there was a soup, there was some fried fish, different things, but then you had like this

433
00:23:21,120 --> 00:23:28,000
bowl of rice with poached egg, but poached like this soft cooked eggs where you have the liquid

434
00:23:28,000 --> 00:23:30,880
yolk and gelatin on top.

435
00:23:30,880 --> 00:23:33,760
And I mean, incredible.

436
00:23:33,760 --> 00:23:35,440
That sounds so amazing.

437
00:23:35,440 --> 00:23:37,200
That kind of makes me think of this thing.

438
00:23:37,200 --> 00:23:40,080
That I've not tried a lot, but I really want to look more into it.

439
00:23:40,080 --> 00:23:42,800
You know, these Korean steamed eggs?

440
00:23:43,920 --> 00:23:49,120
No, you get them as like, I think a starter in like lots of like Korean steak houses and stuff.

441
00:23:49,120 --> 00:23:54,480
And they usually come in this like little sort of like pot and it's almost like an egg souffle.

442
00:23:55,200 --> 00:23:58,080
I'm pretty sure that it's also made with like broth and stuff.

443
00:23:58,080 --> 00:24:04,000
I have to look more into it, but they look so, they look like an egg souffle flan, super wobbly

444
00:24:04,000 --> 00:24:08,400
steamed egg. You know, it kind of reminds me of this trend that people were doing where they were

445
00:24:08,400 --> 00:24:14,160
eating instant ramen and then they add egg to the liquid and then like cook it in a microwave and it

446
00:24:14,160 --> 00:24:15,200
becomes this egg souffle.

447
00:24:16,080 --> 00:24:16,880
Have you seen that?

448
00:24:18,160 --> 00:24:20,320
No, but with ramen broth?

449
00:24:20,320 --> 00:24:23,680
Yeah, so basically you take like a cup noodle sort of thing.

450
00:24:23,680 --> 00:24:26,960
You know, I wouldn't recommend cup noodle itself, but like a brand that's actually good.

451
00:24:27,520 --> 00:24:32,160
And you make the ramen as you would with the broth and you eat the egg.

452
00:24:32,160 --> 00:24:37,040
As you would with the broth and you eat the noodles with the soup, but you leave some of the soup.

453
00:24:38,080 --> 00:24:42,800
And then into the soup, you add some whisked eggs, you mix that and then you put it in the

454
00:24:42,800 --> 00:24:48,240
microwave and cook it. And then it like the egg absorbs and becomes this like juicy egg souffle.

455
00:24:48,240 --> 00:24:49,920
And then you eat the souffle afterwards.

456
00:24:50,560 --> 00:24:54,480
I haven't tried it yet because I don't have a microwave anywhere near me, nowhere.

457
00:24:55,360 --> 00:24:56,880
But I really, really want to try it.

458
00:24:57,600 --> 00:24:59,520
Something that I also found super interesting.

459
00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:06,720
I don't know if we have talked about this, this microwave sponge cakes from also from Albert

460
00:25:06,720 --> 00:25:07,120
Adria.

461
00:25:07,120 --> 00:25:07,920
Yeah, I mean, they're classic.

462
00:25:07,920 --> 00:25:08,480
Have you seen that?

463
00:25:08,480 --> 00:25:13,520
Yeah. Yeah. Super classic in the little cups that you snip and you spray.

464
00:25:13,520 --> 00:25:16,560
Yeah. And it's something like really difficult.

465
00:25:17,600 --> 00:25:21,760
Like, like so I don't think there's a lighter sponge cake than that.

466
00:25:21,760 --> 00:25:22,560
Absolutely.

467
00:25:22,560 --> 00:25:26,560
And it's like complicated for a service because you have to do it at a minute.

468
00:25:26,560 --> 00:25:27,680
There is no way around.

469
00:25:27,680 --> 00:25:28,640
Yeah. You can't keep them.

470
00:25:28,640 --> 00:25:34,080
And if it stays. Yeah, exactly. So there is going to be a lot of waste if you have one of those

471
00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:39,280
because the guy stood up, you have to do another one, you know, like, okay.

472
00:25:40,560 --> 00:25:40,880
Yeah.

473
00:25:45,760 --> 00:25:49,040
Well, you talked about souffles. What's the deal with souffles?

474
00:25:49,040 --> 00:25:52,960
Is it also something that is outdated? Is it still relevant?

475
00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:58,880
A souffle is really, really amazing and it's kind of hard to pull off, especially in a restaurant.

476
00:25:59,360 --> 00:26:03,680
But I am a big fan of souffles. I've been testing a lot of souffles last year.

477
00:26:04,640 --> 00:26:14,560
And I came across an amazing recipe from Adam Byatt, Adam Byatt, Michelin star chef in London.

478
00:26:15,440 --> 00:26:20,240
Who, by the way, if you're like interested in any sort of food, he's like doing a lot more social media

479
00:26:20,240 --> 00:26:28,320
now and he does amazing cooking videos. Just this really sort of like really good English cooking

480
00:26:28,320 --> 00:26:35,200
with French technique and super creative, super clean, really amazing. And he's got a recipe for

481
00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:41,360
souffle where, because normally you make like a, like a creme pâte base with flour and eggs and et cetera.

482
00:26:42,400 --> 00:26:47,520
But he uses rice pudding as a base. So you take,

483
00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:54,000
you take like arroz-co-leche, you know, you bake it in the oven like you would.

484
00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:59,200
And then you take the rice with the liquid and you blitz it until it's a fine puree.

485
00:26:59,920 --> 00:27:04,000
So super smart because there you also, you have a lot of starch in there, right?

486
00:27:04,800 --> 00:27:07,040
Which is what you want for a souffle.

487
00:27:07,040 --> 00:27:12,480
Exactly. And then you let that cool down and then you take this like gelified base,

488
00:27:12,480 --> 00:27:19,200
a rice starch base, which has a lot of like sweetness. I often cook it with like cinnamon,

489
00:27:19,200 --> 00:27:24,640
lemon zest, vanilla and star anise and stuff. And so the base already has a lot of flavor.

490
00:27:24,640 --> 00:27:29,360
And then you just use that normally. You add your whisked egg whites and your flavor base,

491
00:27:29,360 --> 00:27:33,920
whatever you want. And you fold that in, add it into the mold. There's lots of like fine tuning

492
00:27:33,920 --> 00:27:39,920
with souffles. The mold has to be the right one. It has to get coated, brushing up, right,

493
00:27:39,920 --> 00:27:44,960
to the very corner, has to get coated evenly. When you add the filling, you have to tap it down.

494
00:27:44,960 --> 00:27:49,040
You have to level the top. You have to run your finger around the edge. So, and then,

495
00:27:49,040 --> 00:27:52,240
but then if you do it right, you get this perfect tower with a flat top.

496
00:27:52,880 --> 00:27:57,520
And I think a well-made souffle, this is the sort of thing that the world needs more of,

497
00:27:57,520 --> 00:28:02,960
like the cooking world. It's kind of like proper, proper technique. Things that are like,

498
00:28:02,960 --> 00:28:07,760
they're not easy to do, you know, but if you make them right, then, you know, it's super, super

499
00:28:07,760 --> 00:28:12,320
amazing. And nowadays there's lots of like copy out shit, you know, it's like,

500
00:28:14,560 --> 00:28:18,800
I put a certain ingredient on or I put a certain technique on, you know, for a long time it was,

501
00:28:19,440 --> 00:28:24,880
I put lots of fermented things in my food or, you know, I use a lot of Sosa ingredients, etc.

502
00:28:24,880 --> 00:28:31,280
That's all fine. Like fermentation is a tool. Sosa products are a tool. Great. But like, don't rest

503
00:28:31,280 --> 00:28:36,160
yourself on these techniques. So I love these sorts of things where you have a real, like,

504
00:28:36,160 --> 00:28:42,160
because it's a craft after all, you know, so the artistic aspect these days of cooking gets like

505
00:28:42,160 --> 00:28:48,240
really emphasized, like art here, art there, amazing. Massimo Bottura wanking his 12th sauce

506
00:28:48,240 --> 00:28:53,200
on a plate. Everybody's losing their fucking mind, but like actually making something with your hand,

507
00:28:53,840 --> 00:28:58,400
you know, it's really underrated. What's the name of this super

508
00:28:58,400 --> 00:29:09,680
top one German chef from Schwarzwaldstube? What's the name of this guy? Oh, Harald Wohlfahrt.

509
00:29:09,680 --> 00:29:13,920
Yeah. Harald Wohlfahrt. Please cut that.

510
00:29:17,680 --> 00:29:27,520
That is him, no? Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Harald Wohlfahrt. Yeah. He said once something that really

511
00:29:27,520 --> 00:29:34,400
stuck to me, like in a hundred years, you won't find, you probably won't find this liquid nitrogen

512
00:29:34,400 --> 00:29:40,720
ice cream that has some Blumenthal is making, but for sure you will find a classic vanilla ice.

513
00:29:40,720 --> 00:29:46,560
And I completely agree on that one, you know, like also going back to ice, like I would say like a

514
00:29:46,560 --> 00:29:52,800
classic vanilla ice, the key ingredient there or one of the key ingredients is the egg. Yeah.

515
00:29:52,800 --> 00:30:00,240
Yeah. Made with vanilla ice, made with a good creme anglaise is just a fantastic thing.

516
00:30:00,240 --> 00:30:05,040
And so many people these days, you know, they're using all these stabilizers and blah.

517
00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:10,880
And it's like, that's all fine. That's all cool. And like, they're useful, but can you make an

518
00:30:10,880 --> 00:30:15,360
ice cream just like without that shit? Can you make something without all that fucking fancy

519
00:30:15,360 --> 00:30:21,440
equipment and that, and that's why like eggs are synonymous with a chef's skill in a way,

520
00:30:21,440 --> 00:30:27,520
you know? It's like, if you have eggs, you have potatoes, you have onions, show me what you can do.

521
00:30:29,200 --> 00:30:36,720
Yeah. That's for example, like a super nice test, you know, like let's do a chef battle

522
00:30:36,720 --> 00:30:43,520
with that. Like we get like a bar, two chefs, cameras, and we give them potatoes, onions,

523
00:30:43,520 --> 00:30:50,240
and eggs. And I like cuisine. For sure. Yeah. And you know, like what I hinted at before,

524
00:30:50,240 --> 00:30:55,200
like talking about all these Asian egg dishes, but there's actually a really nice European,

525
00:30:56,160 --> 00:31:04,960
like steamed egg dish, which is, have you ever made them, eaten them? Yeah. No,

526
00:31:04,960 --> 00:31:10,160
but it's also like a costal, right? So cocotte is this little pot, right? Like this. Well,

527
00:31:10,160 --> 00:31:15,680
you find these super beautiful pots that were, that are specially made for this dish,

528
00:31:15,680 --> 00:31:19,920
and you don't see that anywhere anymore. My mom used to make it every now and again,

529
00:31:19,920 --> 00:31:24,400
they're super nice because they're usually these little ceramic pots with like little metal lids,

530
00:31:24,400 --> 00:31:29,680
and they're like, they're very gorgeous. And so basically, it's just, you crack your eggs into

531
00:31:29,680 --> 00:31:35,600
this buttered pot, and you add your aromats. Usually you add maybe a couple of small pieces

532
00:31:35,600 --> 00:31:42,800
of butter, some ham, some chives, and you close the lid, and you put it in a pot with just a little

533
00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:47,920
bit of simmering water, and you steam it in these pots. And what you have is this like very

534
00:31:47,920 --> 00:31:55,280
creamy, flavored, aromatic, steamed egg inside of this little cup that you eat it out of. So the

535
00:31:55,280 --> 00:32:01,520
outside is like a little bit like dried, like sort of almost like crispy, and the inside the yorks

536
00:32:01,520 --> 00:32:06,480
are like really nice and waxy, and the chives flavor the egg and the ham flavors the egg. It's

537
00:32:06,480 --> 00:32:09,600
super beautiful. That's actually something that you don't ever see anymore.

538
00:32:09,600 --> 00:32:15,280
That's it for this week's episode of Potluck Food Talks. If you like what we're doing, make sure to

539
00:32:15,280 --> 00:32:20,000
subscribe to the podcast so you never miss an episode. You can also find us on Instagram and

540
00:32:20,000 --> 00:32:42,160
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