1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:07,000 Hi everyone, welcome to Pot Luck Food Talks. 2 00:00:07,000 --> 00:00:12,160 Today I'm here with the lead vocal singer of Homo Cannibal, a band that promotes cannibalism 3 00:00:12,160 --> 00:00:14,000 between people of the same sex. 4 00:00:14,000 --> 00:00:15,000 Hi Phil, how are you? 5 00:00:15,000 --> 00:00:16,000 Welcome. 6 00:00:16,000 --> 00:00:17,000 Hey, how's it going? 7 00:00:17,000 --> 00:00:19,000 Sorry, I got something stuck in my teeth. 8 00:00:19,000 --> 00:00:20,000 One second. 9 00:00:20,000 --> 00:00:21,000 What's up man, how have you been? 10 00:00:21,000 --> 00:00:22,000 It's been a while. 11 00:00:22,000 --> 00:00:23,000 Yeah, good. 12 00:00:23,000 --> 00:00:24,000 Good, good, good. 13 00:00:24,000 --> 00:00:25,000 Very busy. 14 00:00:25,000 --> 00:00:26,000 Very busy, and you? 15 00:00:26,000 --> 00:00:27,000 Good, good, good, good. 16 00:00:27,000 --> 00:00:28,000 What are we talking about today? 17 00:00:28,000 --> 00:00:30,000 Hey, we could talk about David Chang. 18 00:00:30,000 --> 00:00:31,000 Yes. 19 00:00:31,000 --> 00:00:32,000 What he did lately. 20 00:00:32,000 --> 00:00:33,000 What the fuck is going on there? 21 00:00:33,000 --> 00:00:35,200 What are you doing David? 22 00:00:35,200 --> 00:00:36,200 What's happening? 23 00:00:36,200 --> 00:00:38,800 Man, what was that man? 24 00:00:38,800 --> 00:00:40,400 David became Goliath suddenly. 25 00:00:40,400 --> 00:00:46,000 It's like a really stupid move, I have to say, like this whole thing with the... 26 00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:54,160 Well, to put in context, apparently Dave Chang trademarked the name for Chili Crunch. 27 00:00:54,160 --> 00:01:01,720 Just a few weeks ago he started chasing and suing people who also have the trademark Chili 28 00:01:01,720 --> 00:01:03,400 Crunch in use. 29 00:01:03,400 --> 00:01:06,600 Not the trademark, they were using the word Chili Crunch. 30 00:01:06,600 --> 00:01:11,520 But of course, only the small players, because Kraft Heinz was also using that name and there 31 00:01:11,520 --> 00:01:16,360 was no issue with Kraft Heinz as far as media knows. 32 00:01:16,360 --> 00:01:21,360 But it was with small companies doing the same thing. 33 00:01:21,360 --> 00:01:26,760 And the big problem is that a lot of people say like, hey, this is like the translation 34 00:01:26,760 --> 00:01:31,840 from a Chinese, from a recipe that has been in our family for generations. 35 00:01:31,840 --> 00:01:32,840 So what the fuck? 36 00:01:32,840 --> 00:01:34,480 Yeah, absolutely what the fuck. 37 00:01:34,480 --> 00:01:41,680 And it's like, man, please, David, climb down from your five kilometer high golden tower 38 00:01:41,680 --> 00:01:43,840 and like get down to the real world. 39 00:01:43,840 --> 00:01:45,520 It's like, what are you thinking? 40 00:01:45,520 --> 00:01:51,560 You know, pursuing businesses at Asian owned businesses that have been doing this long 41 00:01:51,560 --> 00:01:54,840 before his rich parents paid for his restaurant. 42 00:01:54,840 --> 00:02:00,400 And then this kind of like, what gives him the right to claim this? 43 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:05,240 You know, like, what kind of an illegal maniac do you have to be to say, this is mine? 44 00:02:05,240 --> 00:02:07,680 You know, like as if he invented it. 45 00:02:07,680 --> 00:02:10,800 He just took it and just decided that it's now is. 46 00:02:10,800 --> 00:02:16,080 Yeah, like I saw, well, first of all, I have to say, like strategically, I think it's like 47 00:02:16,080 --> 00:02:22,080 a really stupid decision because you already have the name Momofuku. 48 00:02:22,080 --> 00:02:25,720 It's already the most differential and original name you can have. 49 00:02:25,720 --> 00:02:30,360 You could make like a Momofuku ketchup, you know, and it would be differential. 50 00:02:30,360 --> 00:02:33,440 It would be a standout in the supermarket or whatever. 51 00:02:33,440 --> 00:02:35,920 You don't need to trademark the word ketchup. 52 00:02:35,920 --> 00:02:36,920 You know what I mean? 53 00:02:36,920 --> 00:02:37,920 Yeah, yeah, absolutely. 54 00:02:37,920 --> 00:02:38,920 Like he's got a trademark. 55 00:02:38,920 --> 00:02:40,160 He's got a brand. 56 00:02:40,160 --> 00:02:41,160 He's built a brand. 57 00:02:41,160 --> 00:02:44,440 And like, I mean, you have to give him that, you know, the brand he's built is very good. 58 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:45,440 It's very successful. 59 00:02:45,440 --> 00:02:47,880 You know, it's very expressive. 60 00:02:47,880 --> 00:02:50,320 You know, like it's a great, it's a really good brand. 61 00:02:50,320 --> 00:02:51,320 It's an appealing brand. 62 00:02:51,320 --> 00:02:53,520 I can think about David Chang, whatever I want. 63 00:02:53,520 --> 00:02:58,560 I can agree with his microwave, you know, craziness or not, but his brand is really 64 00:02:58,560 --> 00:02:59,560 good. 65 00:02:59,560 --> 00:03:05,640 And it's kind of like, I think this must have been like, I think his PR team must have been 66 00:03:05,640 --> 00:03:10,120 tearing their fucking hair out at like this, you know, just be like, no, I'm not going 67 00:03:10,120 --> 00:03:11,120 to do this. 68 00:03:11,120 --> 00:03:12,280 Oh, David, please, we can't do this. 69 00:03:12,280 --> 00:03:13,440 This is a terrible idea. 70 00:03:13,440 --> 00:03:14,840 No, we will. 71 00:03:14,840 --> 00:03:15,840 You know? 72 00:03:15,840 --> 00:03:22,920 No, I saw like the whole statement they released, like in their podcast, David Chang and the 73 00:03:22,920 --> 00:03:27,040 CEO of the whole Momofuku company. 74 00:03:27,040 --> 00:03:32,480 And they were saying like, it's actually interesting because trademarks, it's not like as easy 75 00:03:32,480 --> 00:03:37,320 as we're talking right now, like to trademark something, you know, it's basically protecting 76 00:03:37,320 --> 00:03:38,320 a name. 77 00:03:38,320 --> 00:03:42,640 And once you get the trademark and you protect it, if you don't protect it, you lose it. 78 00:03:42,640 --> 00:03:45,000 So they were kind of, that's their argument. 79 00:03:45,000 --> 00:03:47,760 But of course it went out of their hands. 80 00:03:47,760 --> 00:03:51,160 They got really, really bad press. 81 00:03:51,160 --> 00:03:52,920 And now they have to take it all back. 82 00:03:52,920 --> 00:03:55,400 But they have the trademark. 83 00:03:55,400 --> 00:03:59,240 And so what David Chang was saying is, he was saying like, this is like the ring of 84 00:03:59,240 --> 00:04:02,520 the Lord of the Rings, but I can't throw it to Mount Doom. 85 00:04:02,520 --> 00:04:06,000 So I will give it to any NGO that takes it. 86 00:04:06,000 --> 00:04:10,400 So that's the only thing that I can do, which is the best thing that he can do actually. 87 00:04:10,400 --> 00:04:11,400 At this point. 88 00:04:11,400 --> 00:04:16,120 But the whole thing, at this point, exactly, the whole thing, the whole decision was so 89 00:04:16,120 --> 00:04:18,160 stupid from the very beginning. 90 00:04:18,160 --> 00:04:21,280 Now this is the price he has to pay. 91 00:04:21,280 --> 00:04:22,280 Yeah. 92 00:04:22,280 --> 00:04:26,040 He can't be like, hey, I'm just going to give it away because I don't really actually care. 93 00:04:26,040 --> 00:04:27,960 It doesn't really matter to me anyway. 94 00:04:27,960 --> 00:04:31,840 After the whole like industry came after him and was like, David, what the fuck are you 95 00:04:31,840 --> 00:04:32,840 doing? 96 00:04:32,840 --> 00:04:35,080 And then suddenly he's just like, I don't care. 97 00:04:35,080 --> 00:04:39,120 You know, it's like, well, you care enough to like sue businesses, you know. 98 00:04:39,120 --> 00:04:43,720 This is really a character that for me turned from a hero into a villain because, you know, 99 00:04:43,720 --> 00:04:49,520 like 10, 12 years ago, David Chang, we would watch like, wow, this guy made it up to a 100 00:04:49,520 --> 00:04:55,200 two star restaurant back then with Momofuku calls, starting with a, with a ramen joint 101 00:04:55,200 --> 00:04:57,520 and that was really admirable. 102 00:04:57,520 --> 00:05:02,240 And, and you know, the Momofuku cookbook is a book about entrepreneurship and how to open 103 00:05:02,240 --> 00:05:04,120 a restaurant out of scratch. 104 00:05:04,120 --> 00:05:07,440 And that's all like super inspiring. 105 00:05:07,440 --> 00:05:12,960 All of this just to become like a mogul, rolling down small companies. 106 00:05:12,960 --> 00:05:14,520 Yeah, totally. 107 00:05:14,520 --> 00:05:15,520 Totally. 108 00:05:15,520 --> 00:05:21,320 And like, I also, you know, wonder what's, I mean, you have to admit that David Chang 109 00:05:21,320 --> 00:05:27,560 with what he was doing at the time that he was doing it, hit into a sort of like culinary 110 00:05:27,560 --> 00:05:34,160 sort of direction that wasn't, you know, super explored by the masses, right? 111 00:05:34,160 --> 00:05:38,080 All these like condiments, like for say, for example, chili crunch, you know, the first 112 00:05:38,080 --> 00:05:41,640 time I ate Lao Gan Ma, you know, I would be a supporter of Lao Gan Ma. 113 00:05:41,640 --> 00:05:45,200 Everybody, everybody knows this. 114 00:05:45,200 --> 00:05:51,520 I was, I was amazed like every time I eat Lao Gan Ma, but you know, the first time it's 115 00:05:51,520 --> 00:05:55,280 kind of like, oh, the first time I had like Yuzu, you know, like I was like, wow, what 116 00:05:55,280 --> 00:05:56,280 is this? 117 00:05:56,280 --> 00:05:57,280 You know, what is this shit? 118 00:05:57,280 --> 00:05:58,720 It's like, wow, it's new, you know, like nicely made ponsos. 119 00:05:58,720 --> 00:06:02,880 Like, wow, that's insane because it's new and it's, you know, it's very good. 120 00:06:02,880 --> 00:06:03,880 Yeah. 121 00:06:03,880 --> 00:06:05,840 I remember my, my first sip of ramen. 122 00:06:05,840 --> 00:06:08,760 I was like, oh, wow, what was this all my life? 123 00:06:08,760 --> 00:06:09,760 Yeah, of course. 124 00:06:09,760 --> 00:06:10,760 Yeah. 125 00:06:10,760 --> 00:06:13,760 And he obviously marketed this like very, very well, you know, and that's why it was 126 00:06:13,760 --> 00:06:15,920 like very new and interesting and stuff. 127 00:06:15,920 --> 00:06:21,280 But like he really, for me anyway, this is just my personal perspective now, but he really 128 00:06:21,280 --> 00:06:26,840 like delved more and more because he was playing a lot with these like trash food ideas. 129 00:06:26,840 --> 00:06:33,560 Like, you know, cold fried chicken from the fridge and then, you know, paired with this 130 00:06:33,560 --> 00:06:38,660 like luxury opulence, not luxury, but opulence overindulgement. 131 00:06:38,660 --> 00:06:42,560 It always seemed to me and then putting a big fuck off spoon of caviar on top of it. 132 00:06:42,560 --> 00:06:47,400 I feel like in the last couple of years, he's just like really doubled down on that. 133 00:06:47,400 --> 00:06:51,720 I think the, um, the American audience really liked that. 134 00:06:51,720 --> 00:06:57,320 This like aspect because it's also relatable in a way for them, I guess, you know, and 135 00:06:57,320 --> 00:07:00,580 I think he just really also as a marketing thing doubled down and like all these cook 136 00:07:00,580 --> 00:07:06,960 shows that he's like, like all these like snippets that you see of him making, or was 137 00:07:06,960 --> 00:07:08,360 it that I sent you the other day? 138 00:07:08,360 --> 00:07:09,360 It was awful. 139 00:07:09,360 --> 00:07:14,400 It was like, he was like microwaving eggs and then like crunching up like crisps and 140 00:07:14,400 --> 00:07:18,440 just putting them on top and then putting caviar on top. 141 00:07:18,440 --> 00:07:19,440 And you're like, man, what are you doing? 142 00:07:19,440 --> 00:07:24,240 You know, it's just like, like one thing is kind of like stoner cooking, you know, and 143 00:07:24,240 --> 00:07:31,000 like, you know, like I can be like, I can be partial to like a garbage plate in parentheses, 144 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:32,960 you know, but I don't know. 145 00:07:32,960 --> 00:07:35,440 It's just, it doesn't have any, any technique. 146 00:07:35,440 --> 00:07:36,920 It doesn't have any soul. 147 00:07:36,920 --> 00:07:38,680 It doesn't have any finesse. 148 00:07:38,680 --> 00:07:41,280 It's just, it's just a bit obscene. 149 00:07:41,280 --> 00:07:44,360 And I feel like that's the only interesting thing about it these days. 150 00:07:44,360 --> 00:07:50,480 Yeah, I think this whole issue with the chili crunch is the second most disappointing thing 151 00:07:50,480 --> 00:07:52,640 I've had from Momofuku. 152 00:07:52,640 --> 00:07:57,720 You know, the first one was when I actually went to eat to one of the places. 153 00:07:57,720 --> 00:07:58,720 It was really disappointing. 154 00:07:58,720 --> 00:08:02,320 And my friends in New York were like, no, we don't go there. 155 00:08:02,320 --> 00:08:07,480 I'm afraid that's really bad, you know, and I went and it was like, what is this? 156 00:08:07,480 --> 00:08:11,520 You know, it was like a bao with a pork belly and hoisin sauce. 157 00:08:11,520 --> 00:08:12,520 That's it. 158 00:08:12,520 --> 00:08:13,520 You know, like, oh, genius. 159 00:08:13,520 --> 00:08:14,520 Yeah, crazy. 160 00:08:14,520 --> 00:08:18,040 You don't know, no bright, nowhere, no spark. 161 00:08:18,040 --> 00:08:19,520 It was like, what the fuck is this? 162 00:08:19,520 --> 00:08:20,520 Yeah. 163 00:08:20,520 --> 00:08:24,360 And it's like, if you, if you've never had a bao bun with a, what's it called? 164 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:29,320 Hong Shao red braised pork belly, you know, like, yeah, it's, it's, you've got to be like, 165 00:08:29,320 --> 00:08:30,320 wow, this is delicious. 166 00:08:30,320 --> 00:08:34,800 But if there's like nowadays, you know, people who are doing it actually well, doing nice 167 00:08:34,800 --> 00:08:38,480 baos, nice pork belly, you know, it's, you're kind of like, well. 168 00:08:38,480 --> 00:08:45,560 And ironically in that trip to New York, the, my best meal wasn't in another modern Korean 169 00:08:45,560 --> 00:08:48,440 attoboy that that shit was amazing. 170 00:08:48,440 --> 00:08:54,720 That was really like credible and creative and flavors that I never saw before used that 171 00:08:54,720 --> 00:08:55,720 way, you know? 172 00:08:55,720 --> 00:08:56,720 Yeah. 173 00:08:56,720 --> 00:09:00,160 So we can make a list of villains now that we started with David Chang and heroes. 174 00:09:00,160 --> 00:09:01,460 I have another one. 175 00:09:01,460 --> 00:09:08,440 So this guy has this channel and he's making paella with things like packed juices or chocolate 176 00:09:08,440 --> 00:09:12,400 drinks or Pepsi or this kind of things. 177 00:09:12,400 --> 00:09:13,400 And he's funny about it. 178 00:09:13,400 --> 00:09:20,040 He's like, Oh, I think I just invented a new Spanish dessert, like cooking Pepsi with Kit 179 00:09:20,040 --> 00:09:23,240 Kats and he's super happy when he eats it. 180 00:09:23,240 --> 00:09:25,240 He's like, this is so nice. 181 00:09:25,240 --> 00:09:27,560 I hate how happy he is about it. 182 00:09:27,560 --> 00:09:30,560 I'm out about the abomination that he's created. 183 00:09:30,560 --> 00:09:32,760 Like it's fucking awful. 184 00:09:32,760 --> 00:09:38,280 Like on one side I want to be happy for him and I want people to be able to be free to 185 00:09:38,280 --> 00:09:39,440 do whatever they want. 186 00:09:39,440 --> 00:09:45,040 But at the same time watching him make these like horrible Kit Kat Oreo paellas, I just 187 00:09:45,040 --> 00:09:46,760 really hate him. 188 00:09:46,760 --> 00:09:51,000 This guy, you really made a whole channel for pissing off Spanish people. 189 00:09:51,000 --> 00:09:52,000 Yeah. 190 00:09:52,000 --> 00:09:53,000 And he really made it. 191 00:09:53,000 --> 00:09:54,000 He made it to the newspapers. 192 00:09:54,000 --> 00:09:55,800 I actually saw this in El País. 193 00:09:55,800 --> 00:09:56,800 There was like... 194 00:09:56,800 --> 00:09:59,320 I'm not surprised. 195 00:09:59,320 --> 00:10:00,320 All the Valencians. 196 00:10:00,320 --> 00:10:03,320 They come to kill you? 197 00:10:03,320 --> 00:10:08,600 Yeah, like all the Paiyanace community came together. 198 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:10,680 But there were even like death threats. 199 00:10:10,680 --> 00:10:14,640 You know, I couldn't find the comments, but you better hide because I'm going to find 200 00:10:14,640 --> 00:10:15,640 you and kill you. 201 00:10:15,640 --> 00:10:17,160 So you better pray. 202 00:10:17,160 --> 00:10:18,160 I'm not surprised. 203 00:10:18,160 --> 00:10:19,760 I'm not even surprised. 204 00:10:19,760 --> 00:10:20,760 People are crazy. 205 00:10:20,760 --> 00:10:21,760 You know? 206 00:10:21,760 --> 00:10:26,560 But the conversation, like you said, is the best, you know? 207 00:10:26,560 --> 00:10:29,120 I'm crying blood watching this. 208 00:10:29,120 --> 00:10:34,200 I mean, imagine that there happens like a first, you know, murder attempt in the name 209 00:10:34,200 --> 00:10:37,480 of Paiyanacism that would be fucked up, you know? 210 00:10:37,480 --> 00:10:42,800 Dude, I like if this guy, like he was doing something on the street in Spain like that, 211 00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:44,680 you know, I feel like people would get violent. 212 00:10:44,680 --> 00:10:45,680 Ah, yeah, yeah. 213 00:10:45,680 --> 00:10:47,560 That would get violent, of sure. 214 00:10:47,560 --> 00:10:52,040 If he wants to be funny and do this, like in Valencia, he would get... 215 00:10:52,040 --> 00:10:53,040 People would get upset. 216 00:10:53,040 --> 00:10:54,040 Yeah. 217 00:10:54,040 --> 00:10:55,040 At least punch in the face a couple of times. 218 00:10:55,040 --> 00:10:56,040 Yeah. 219 00:10:56,040 --> 00:10:57,040 Yeah. 220 00:10:57,040 --> 00:10:59,280 That's a strange to say because it's just... 221 00:10:59,280 --> 00:11:00,280 Bryce. 222 00:11:00,280 --> 00:11:04,640 Yeah, but I think, you know, just recently a friend of mine from Bilbao, because you 223 00:11:04,640 --> 00:11:09,240 know, Bilbao just recently won the whatever, some football match, I think the national, 224 00:11:09,240 --> 00:11:10,240 I don't know. 225 00:11:10,240 --> 00:11:11,240 Oh yeah. 226 00:11:11,240 --> 00:11:12,240 So people... 227 00:11:12,240 --> 00:11:13,240 This happens every 40 years. 228 00:11:13,240 --> 00:11:14,240 So people go crazy. 229 00:11:14,240 --> 00:11:17,640 And she was telling me, no, this is not a football team, a soccer team. 230 00:11:17,640 --> 00:11:18,640 It's an emotion. 231 00:11:18,640 --> 00:11:19,640 Oh yeah. 232 00:11:19,640 --> 00:11:22,800 And I guess, I guess it's the same with Paiyanacism for Valencians, you know? 233 00:11:22,800 --> 00:11:24,840 Like you're messing with their grandmother, man. 234 00:11:24,840 --> 00:11:26,600 You know, that's not acceptable. 235 00:11:26,600 --> 00:11:27,600 I mean, it is true. 236 00:11:27,600 --> 00:11:31,800 I mean, like, I mean, food and cooking is cultural identity, you know? 237 00:11:31,800 --> 00:11:34,120 I mean, that's undeniable. 238 00:11:34,120 --> 00:11:39,000 So I do understand when people feel offended in a way, you know? 239 00:11:39,000 --> 00:11:42,240 It's also like, I mean, is it, is it appropriation in a way? 240 00:11:42,240 --> 00:11:43,800 You know, it's kind of like... 241 00:11:43,800 --> 00:11:47,200 No, this is cultural destruction, not appropriation. 242 00:11:47,200 --> 00:11:48,760 Yeah, cultural destruction. 243 00:11:48,760 --> 00:11:49,760 Jesus. 244 00:11:49,760 --> 00:11:50,760 Who's the Paiyanazi? 245 00:11:50,760 --> 00:11:54,160 You're sounding a lot like a Paiyanazi right now. 246 00:11:54,160 --> 00:11:55,160 Yeah, yeah. 247 00:11:55,160 --> 00:11:56,160 True, true. 248 00:11:56,160 --> 00:11:58,640 It's a front to humanity. 249 00:11:58,640 --> 00:12:02,680 You see, we're both closeted Paiyanazis after all. 250 00:12:02,680 --> 00:12:03,680 Yeah, I would like... 251 00:12:03,680 --> 00:12:08,400 There's a little Paiyanazi inside of every proper gastronomy lover, I guess. 252 00:12:08,400 --> 00:12:09,400 Yeah, absolutely. 253 00:12:09,400 --> 00:12:15,640 And some of us hide him away and some of us nurture him, you know, and feed him. 254 00:12:15,640 --> 00:12:16,760 I mean, I think there are limits. 255 00:12:16,760 --> 00:12:19,680 I think there are things that you can do with paella that are still okay. 256 00:12:19,680 --> 00:12:26,040 I have this book on paellas and there was like a paella with German sausages and mustard 257 00:12:26,040 --> 00:12:27,040 and this kind of thing. 258 00:12:27,040 --> 00:12:31,120 And I think if you can do something like that and pull it off and it's delicious and it 259 00:12:31,120 --> 00:12:34,560 responses certain parameters, fine, why not? 260 00:12:34,560 --> 00:12:40,360 But there of course are limits where you say, okay, this is like an absolute no-go. 261 00:12:40,360 --> 00:12:46,560 Is there a sweet paella that would be acceptable in your eyes? 262 00:12:46,560 --> 00:12:53,620 But for me, the question is, I think yes, it would, but I haven't seen it yet. 263 00:12:53,620 --> 00:12:55,960 But I think like theoretically it's possible. 264 00:12:55,960 --> 00:12:57,400 That's my personal opinion. 265 00:12:57,400 --> 00:13:02,160 First of all, I don't understand why would you make like a sweet rice in that pan? 266 00:13:02,160 --> 00:13:07,080 You know, I think perhaps there are other better methods, but I don't know. 267 00:13:07,080 --> 00:13:08,480 I haven't thought about it too much. 268 00:13:08,480 --> 00:13:14,520 Well, if you imagine like a rice pudding, but like baked until it's like super caramelized 269 00:13:14,520 --> 00:13:18,000 and gooey and kind of like really cooked down, you know. 270 00:13:18,000 --> 00:13:19,000 That would be cool. 271 00:13:19,000 --> 00:13:21,920 Like kind of like a toffee rice. 272 00:13:21,920 --> 00:13:24,560 That would be like the socarrate is like a toffee. 273 00:13:24,560 --> 00:13:26,960 That would be actually be cool. 274 00:13:26,960 --> 00:13:29,440 All the Spanish people listening are like scratching their eyes out. 275 00:13:29,440 --> 00:13:33,600 I thought they were on our side. 276 00:13:33,600 --> 00:13:37,640 You were meant to be the chosen ones, not join the dark side. 277 00:13:37,640 --> 00:13:39,000 So what about heroes? 278 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:44,320 I think a hero worth mentioning lately is Jose Andres. 279 00:13:44,320 --> 00:13:45,320 Absolutely. 280 00:13:45,320 --> 00:13:48,360 With this whole situation in Gaza. 281 00:13:48,360 --> 00:13:52,760 Well basically what happened is Jose Andres has this organization called World Central 282 00:13:52,760 --> 00:13:59,120 Kitchen and they sent like humanitarian aid to Palestine. 283 00:13:59,120 --> 00:14:04,600 And there was like a convoy of three or four cars and humanitarian aid workers. 284 00:14:04,600 --> 00:14:10,840 They have to report that there is like a special app where they report to the IDF where they're 285 00:14:10,840 --> 00:14:13,640 moving what their cars are. 286 00:14:13,640 --> 00:14:19,200 They were properly with signs that it was humanitarian help. 287 00:14:19,200 --> 00:14:24,160 And a drone came and they destroyed the three cars, one after the other. 288 00:14:24,160 --> 00:14:29,280 They chased him until everybody was dead by the Israeli army. 289 00:14:29,280 --> 00:14:30,880 So this was no accident. 290 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:32,520 This was no oops. 291 00:14:32,520 --> 00:14:33,520 It was a wrong shot. 292 00:14:33,520 --> 00:14:35,200 No, no, no, no. 293 00:14:35,200 --> 00:14:37,480 They chased him until they killed everyone. 294 00:14:37,480 --> 00:14:43,560 And what Jose Andres says is they basically and I can really see here like a war strategy, 295 00:14:43,560 --> 00:14:51,720 you know, a way of starving Palestinians to death by killing humanitarian aid, which is 296 00:14:51,720 --> 00:14:53,080 absolutely fucked up. 297 00:14:53,080 --> 00:14:54,080 Yeah, yeah. 298 00:14:54,080 --> 00:14:59,640 I mean, that's such a no go, you know, like it's say about war and conflict, like whatever 299 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:00,640 you want to know. 300 00:15:00,640 --> 00:15:05,600 This is, you know, I mean, what's happening in Gaza is, you know, so clearly a fucking 301 00:15:05,600 --> 00:15:08,600 genocide and just absolutely horrible. 302 00:15:08,600 --> 00:15:12,880 But like it's another level to then also attack people. 303 00:15:12,880 --> 00:15:17,520 You know, it's kind of like, like killing civilians and women and children and bombing 304 00:15:17,520 --> 00:15:20,800 hospitals and killing humanitarian workers. 305 00:15:20,800 --> 00:15:25,960 You know, it's like, that's just beyond, you know, like you say, you know, the work that 306 00:15:25,960 --> 00:15:30,400 like this Jose Andres, you know, this is a, he's really transcended. 307 00:15:30,400 --> 00:15:31,400 Like, you know, he was a chef. 308 00:15:31,400 --> 00:15:35,600 He was like a chef, the party at El Bruy, he moved to America, he opened restaurants 309 00:15:35,600 --> 00:15:41,840 and he's just, he's really the embodiment of the belief that because I am one who believes 310 00:15:41,840 --> 00:15:48,080 that that food is political and culturally and politically very important. 311 00:15:48,080 --> 00:15:53,800 Well, I also need to say that I would say Jose Andres, 10 years ago, something like 312 00:15:53,800 --> 00:15:56,160 that, he was one of the top chefs in the world. 313 00:15:56,160 --> 00:15:58,680 I think Minivar was one of the best restaurants in the world. 314 00:15:58,680 --> 00:16:03,360 It was really like doing like avant-garde dope shit in that restaurant. 315 00:16:03,360 --> 00:16:09,040 It's not like some TV celebrity chef that, you know, got really famous and he's living 316 00:16:09,040 --> 00:16:10,040 out of fame. 317 00:16:10,040 --> 00:16:14,280 He was first like an incredible chef before becoming super famous. 318 00:16:14,280 --> 00:16:20,880 But the crazy thing about this, and I think never in history, like a chef has played such 319 00:16:20,880 --> 00:16:28,360 a role in a geopolitical situation that he got a call from Biden, you know, and just 320 00:16:28,360 --> 00:16:34,240 a day later, United States sent an ultimatum to Israel to protect civilians. 321 00:16:34,240 --> 00:16:37,640 And this is the first time something like that happens since 1990. 322 00:16:37,640 --> 00:16:43,600 But at the same time, I think it's a little bit of bullshit because just a week later, 323 00:16:43,600 --> 00:16:51,400 they sent like 100 million dollars or 2000 million dollars in military aid to Israel. 324 00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:56,600 But yeah, that happened, which is absolutely crazy, I think. 325 00:16:56,600 --> 00:16:58,280 Yeah, it is absolutely crazy. 326 00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:01,640 It sometimes reminds me, like when I see that, it's kind of like when you're almost like 327 00:17:01,640 --> 00:17:10,560 reading a history book and reading of like a Roman emperor who has his chef make, give 328 00:17:10,560 --> 00:17:14,400 him advice on political matters and you would read that sort of stuff and be kind of like, 329 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:15,400 what, how does that happen? 330 00:17:15,400 --> 00:17:17,280 You know, it happens like that. 331 00:17:17,280 --> 00:17:23,280 And it's kind of like, I mean, a lot of things kind of like worked and came together with 332 00:17:23,280 --> 00:17:29,280 Jose Andres, like you said, amazing chef with a very cool vision, a very strong culinary 333 00:17:29,280 --> 00:17:31,920 identity of Spain, you know, very representative. 334 00:17:31,920 --> 00:17:36,840 He's very representative of Spain in all the way that he does and that he talks about food 335 00:17:36,840 --> 00:17:40,440 and what he like, you know, and then he's a very likable character. 336 00:17:40,440 --> 00:17:44,160 I mean, for most people anyway, he's very, very good at expressing himself. 337 00:17:44,160 --> 00:17:47,200 The guy is like a walking showman, you know. 338 00:17:47,200 --> 00:17:53,960 And so it's just natural for me that if you think about it, that somebody involved with 339 00:17:53,960 --> 00:18:00,360 food and everything that's connected to it with that ability, that's somebody that reaches 340 00:18:00,360 --> 00:18:01,800 people in a different way. 341 00:18:01,800 --> 00:18:04,840 That's like beyond, you know, a restaurant environment. 342 00:18:04,840 --> 00:18:05,840 Yeah. 343 00:18:05,840 --> 00:18:08,120 You mentioned that food is political. 344 00:18:08,120 --> 00:18:09,120 What's the name? 345 00:18:09,120 --> 00:18:10,840 I think I always pronounce it wrong. 346 00:18:10,840 --> 00:18:13,880 I say Foxia Dunlop, this British. 347 00:18:13,880 --> 00:18:14,880 Yeah. 348 00:18:14,880 --> 00:18:15,880 Fuchsia Dunlop. 349 00:18:15,880 --> 00:18:16,880 Fuchsia Dunlop. 350 00:18:16,880 --> 00:18:17,880 Yeah. 351 00:18:17,880 --> 00:18:18,880 Fuchsia Dunlop. 352 00:18:18,880 --> 00:18:19,880 Yes. 353 00:18:19,880 --> 00:18:20,880 Yeah. 354 00:18:20,880 --> 00:18:23,280 She recently wrote an article for the New York Times where she talks, it's super interesting. 355 00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:24,280 You should check it out. 356 00:18:24,280 --> 00:18:29,480 It's about how American dignitaries behave in China towards food. 357 00:18:29,480 --> 00:18:35,120 And that's really like a thing, you know, like if they know if they have chopstick skills, 358 00:18:35,120 --> 00:18:37,720 it's observed as a sign of cultural competence. 359 00:18:37,720 --> 00:18:38,720 Yes. 360 00:18:38,720 --> 00:18:42,440 And the places they visit, they become trendy. 361 00:18:42,440 --> 00:18:49,960 And you know, like a key moment was when Treasury Secretary Janet Yellen ate mushrooms at a restaurant 362 00:18:49,960 --> 00:18:56,960 in Beijing that were revealed to be mightily toxic and potentially hallucinogenic, like, 363 00:18:56,960 --> 00:18:57,960 you know, psychedelic. 364 00:18:57,960 --> 00:18:58,960 Yeah. 365 00:18:58,960 --> 00:19:01,680 If they're not cooked properly. 366 00:19:01,680 --> 00:19:04,960 And people went crazy about it and it became like a trend in China. 367 00:19:04,960 --> 00:19:10,560 Everybody was like, oh, you know, now we have to try this psychedelic mushrooms, you know, 368 00:19:10,560 --> 00:19:11,560 like in restaurants. 369 00:19:11,560 --> 00:19:12,560 Yeah. 370 00:19:12,560 --> 00:19:13,560 It's like it's like food was like blowfish. 371 00:19:13,560 --> 00:19:15,720 Oh, we have to eat this thing that might kill me. 372 00:19:15,720 --> 00:19:19,720 That has to be like a like a big deal, you know, like being like an American diplomat 373 00:19:19,720 --> 00:19:20,720 and going to China. 374 00:19:20,720 --> 00:19:26,480 Like, and first of all, everything you do and everything, how you behave and your cultural, 375 00:19:26,480 --> 00:19:32,440 sorry, your corporal body language, but also what you eat and how you eat it, you know, 376 00:19:32,440 --> 00:19:33,920 that's also super interesting. 377 00:19:33,920 --> 00:19:34,920 Yeah, for sure. 378 00:19:34,920 --> 00:19:35,920 For sure. 379 00:19:35,920 --> 00:19:40,160 I mean, that's kind of like, especially in cultures where food is has a different kind 380 00:19:40,160 --> 00:19:44,640 of like not meaning but like feel to it in a way, like food cultures are like so slightly 381 00:19:44,640 --> 00:19:46,320 different in every country. 382 00:19:46,320 --> 00:19:50,480 You know, I'm not saying that in some countries food is more important than in others, although 383 00:19:50,480 --> 00:19:56,160 that is kind of the case, you know, but it's like food and the communal aspect of food 384 00:19:56,160 --> 00:20:01,720 and how it ties people in the community together is like, is very different, you know, and 385 00:20:01,720 --> 00:20:04,440 that's really interesting that it's like, I can really imagine that being like that, 386 00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:06,440 you know, in China. 387 00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:07,880 All right. 388 00:20:07,880 --> 00:20:10,920 Well, we have any other heroes? 389 00:20:10,920 --> 00:20:14,880 I can think of more villains than heroes, you know, and that. 390 00:20:14,880 --> 00:20:18,080 I would include Pedrito Sanchez as a chef. 391 00:20:18,080 --> 00:20:19,080 As a hero? 392 00:20:19,080 --> 00:20:20,080 Yeah, that's a hero. 393 00:20:20,080 --> 00:20:21,080 Let me show you. 394 00:20:21,080 --> 00:20:22,840 I have something from him here. 395 00:20:22,840 --> 00:20:25,120 Let me show you my screen. 396 00:20:25,120 --> 00:20:27,200 So there's this chef from Hai'en. 397 00:20:27,200 --> 00:20:34,240 Hai'en is a less visited region in Andalusia, which is a very touristic region. 398 00:20:34,240 --> 00:20:38,460 But for some reason, Hai'en has set behind probably because they don't have coast. 399 00:20:38,460 --> 00:20:41,400 So this guy opened this restaurant in 2018. 400 00:20:41,400 --> 00:20:42,680 It's the smallest Michelin. 401 00:20:42,680 --> 00:20:48,920 For me, this is one of the most exciting cuisines in Spain right now because it's so radical, 402 00:20:48,920 --> 00:20:51,600 minimalistic and so clever. 403 00:20:51,600 --> 00:20:58,120 So this guy opened this restaurant in 2018 and it's the smallest restaurant with a, are 404 00:20:58,120 --> 00:20:59,360 you seeing my screen now? 405 00:20:59,360 --> 00:21:00,360 Yeah. 406 00:21:00,360 --> 00:21:03,480 It's the smallest restaurant with a Michelin star. 407 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:06,720 And he never puts more than two elements in a dish. 408 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:10,480 This is his whole staff is like just five people. 409 00:21:10,480 --> 00:21:13,000 It's him plus two chefs. 410 00:21:13,000 --> 00:21:19,600 He has just like a home kitchen, a microwave, a Korean cooker, a sous vide machine, and 411 00:21:19,600 --> 00:21:20,960 that's it. 412 00:21:20,960 --> 00:21:26,080 And all of the dishes are just, you know, two elements and they're usually pretty clever. 413 00:21:26,080 --> 00:21:35,160 For instance, one of his key, his most classics is a cream of, or like a foam of eel skin 414 00:21:35,160 --> 00:21:36,920 with an oxidized pear. 415 00:21:36,920 --> 00:21:37,920 And that's it. 416 00:21:37,920 --> 00:21:39,120 Sounds delicious. 417 00:21:39,120 --> 00:21:40,520 Just two elements. 418 00:21:40,520 --> 00:21:41,520 Yeah. 419 00:21:41,520 --> 00:21:44,000 Or like a nice piece of steak with vanilla. 420 00:21:44,000 --> 00:21:45,000 That's it. 421 00:21:45,000 --> 00:21:46,000 Salt. 422 00:21:46,000 --> 00:21:47,000 That's it. 423 00:21:47,000 --> 00:21:48,000 Interesting. 424 00:21:48,000 --> 00:21:52,240 And then he has like this really conceptual things like with just two elements where he 425 00:21:52,240 --> 00:21:54,480 really breaks boundaries. 426 00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:57,160 And I had actually the opportunity to talk with him. 427 00:21:57,160 --> 00:22:03,040 He did a dinner that's also worth mentioning and the last Michelin gala, there were four 428 00:22:03,040 --> 00:22:06,840 new Michelin stars in high end where he's from. 429 00:22:06,840 --> 00:22:10,560 And all of them are kind of like related to him or inspired by him. 430 00:22:10,560 --> 00:22:16,120 So he's actually creating like a gastronomic movement in that province from his little 431 00:22:16,120 --> 00:22:17,120 kitchen. 432 00:22:17,120 --> 00:22:20,720 It's the smallest Michelin restaurant, Michelin star restaurant in Europe. 433 00:22:20,720 --> 00:22:22,440 There are only like 12 seats. 434 00:22:22,440 --> 00:22:24,480 All the menus are like a hundred euros. 435 00:22:24,480 --> 00:22:29,680 And you will see pictures in his social media of Perran Adria, the chef from Alchemist and 436 00:22:29,680 --> 00:22:33,320 all these superstars chefs going there to eat. 437 00:22:33,320 --> 00:22:37,240 You know, like he's really respected in the food world, in the restaurant world. 438 00:22:37,240 --> 00:22:38,240 It looks really nice. 439 00:22:38,240 --> 00:22:39,240 Sounds really interesting. 440 00:22:39,240 --> 00:22:47,840 He has this dessert where he does like lettuces, like salads and syrup with cream ice cream 441 00:22:47,840 --> 00:22:48,840 with rice vinegar. 442 00:22:48,840 --> 00:22:52,560 You remember when we had this idea of making like a sushi rice ice cream? 443 00:22:52,560 --> 00:22:53,560 Yes. 444 00:22:53,560 --> 00:22:54,560 Kind of like it. 445 00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:55,560 Yes. 446 00:22:55,560 --> 00:22:56,560 So I had it. 447 00:22:56,560 --> 00:22:58,140 I had this dessert and it was really incredible. 448 00:22:58,140 --> 00:23:02,960 But more interesting for me, it was not like me and my snobby children are your friends 449 00:23:02,960 --> 00:23:04,240 talking about this dessert. 450 00:23:04,240 --> 00:23:05,820 For me, it was more interesting. 451 00:23:05,820 --> 00:23:11,160 We had like in the table with us because it was like a round table, there was a couple 452 00:23:11,160 --> 00:23:15,760 that these were like really non-pretentious normal people, you know, from here, from San 453 00:23:15,760 --> 00:23:18,200 Sebastian and they get this dessert. 454 00:23:18,200 --> 00:23:19,680 You know, this was really interesting to watch. 455 00:23:19,680 --> 00:23:27,600 They get like a dessert of salad with syrup and an ice cream of sushi rice vinegar. 456 00:23:27,600 --> 00:23:29,660 And they were really amazed. 457 00:23:29,660 --> 00:23:32,560 And when they tried, they were like, wow, this is really nice. 458 00:23:32,560 --> 00:23:34,060 This is really nice to have this. 459 00:23:34,060 --> 00:23:37,760 And I asked Pedrito Sanchez, like, how did you come up with this dessert? 460 00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:42,920 And he said, like, well, after you have like a long menu, like you had so many dishes, 461 00:23:42,920 --> 00:23:44,160 why do you have to have pastries? 462 00:23:44,160 --> 00:23:48,280 Why do you have to have biscuits and cakes and all of these kinds of things? 463 00:23:48,280 --> 00:23:51,600 These things are better meant to have like tea in the afternoon. 464 00:23:51,600 --> 00:23:54,840 But like after a long menu, perhaps you want something really light. 465 00:23:54,840 --> 00:23:57,160 So my idea was to do like an anti-dessert. 466 00:23:57,160 --> 00:24:00,600 So I wanted to make like a salad to finish the menu. 467 00:24:00,600 --> 00:24:03,760 And I was like, oh, wow, that's, you know, like conceptually, that's also like really 468 00:24:03,760 --> 00:24:05,280 smart to put it that way. 469 00:24:05,280 --> 00:24:06,280 That's really cool. 470 00:24:06,280 --> 00:24:07,280 I love that. 471 00:24:07,280 --> 00:24:12,560 It's also super cool because it's like it's intelligent, but it's not intelligent for 472 00:24:12,560 --> 00:24:14,220 the sake of being intelligent. 473 00:24:14,220 --> 00:24:15,400 You know what I mean? 474 00:24:15,400 --> 00:24:19,880 It's not like trying to be like, oh yeah, you know, like I have a crazy idea and I just 475 00:24:19,880 --> 00:24:22,920 push it through, you know, it actually makes sense. 476 00:24:22,920 --> 00:24:27,840 I think making something like this, it's a thin line between being a genius or an absolute 477 00:24:27,840 --> 00:24:28,840 idiot. 478 00:24:28,840 --> 00:24:29,840 Absolutely. 479 00:24:29,840 --> 00:24:30,840 Yeah. 480 00:24:30,840 --> 00:24:31,840 Like no, no in between. 481 00:24:31,840 --> 00:24:35,840 If you put a salad for dessert, either it really works for everyone or it doesn't, you 482 00:24:35,840 --> 00:24:37,960 know, and this really worked. 483 00:24:37,960 --> 00:24:38,960 I think that's the key. 484 00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:39,960 Yeah, absolutely. 485 00:24:39,960 --> 00:24:47,880 That's it for this week's episode of Potluck Food Talks. 486 00:24:47,880 --> 00:24:51,760 If you like what we're doing, make sure to subscribe to the podcast so you never miss 487 00:24:51,760 --> 00:24:52,760 an episode. 488 00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:57,000 You can also find us on Instagram and TikTok as Potluck Food Talks. 489 00:24:57,000 --> 00:25:01,400 The show airs every Monday.