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Hey there Berlin!

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Before we start the show, we have an important announcement.

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If you've ever wanted to join Phil and Eric on a live recording of Potluck Food Talks,

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this is your chance!

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On October 14th, we're going to be at the Pot Festival Berlin!

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What are we gonna talk about?

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Sandwiches!

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So what's the deal with sandwiches you ask?

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BLT, the Reuben, the Clubhouse, the Grilled Cheese, the Fried Chicken, not only will Phil

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and Eric take you on a mouthwatering journey around what makes the best fucking sandwiches

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in the world, you'll also get to try Phil's own creation after the show.

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The perfect marriage of crispy fried chicken and artisan bread harmonized with heavenly

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sauces.

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Don't worry, there will also be veggie alternatives.

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So if you're in Berlin or need an excuse to come to the city, join us!

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From Saturday October 14th starting at 11am at the Potfest Berlin.

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All the info will be in the description below or on potfestberlin.com.

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That's potfestberlin.com.

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Okay, now on with the show!

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Good morning Vietnam!

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That's the wrong intro.

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That's the wrong podcast.

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Yeah, well unless we're in Vietnam that would be really cool.

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Hello everyone, welcome to Potluck Food Talks.

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Today I'm here with my homie Phil Walter and we're going to talk about terroir.

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So what's the deal with terroir?

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What is the deal with terroir?

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What a mysterious and strange word.

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I mean, what do you think of when you think of terroir?

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Well it's a word commonly associated to the wine world, but I think in the last decade

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it has also been adapted in the gastronomy world and the chef world to explain that there

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is this common tag called time and place, which means what grows at what time and what

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place, meaning basically plants and animals, edible plants and animals.

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And this whole ecosystem, how it feeds itself and how it nourishes itself from the water,

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the plants that eat the animals, the animals that die and feed the soil and all this, how

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to say, life cycle that occurs there and generates...

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The circle of life.

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Exactly, that generates basically wonderful flavors.

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The more rich this ecosystem is, the richer it will taste whatever is produced there.

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That's my thought about it.

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Yeah, and just like you said, this term time and place really got coined and I think it's

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kind of become like a phrase that's overused by every little bistro says, oh yeah, there's

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a time and place.

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What were you thinking when you made this decision?

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Like, man, I really wanted to evoke a sense of time and place, but yeah, it's crazy how

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the locality and the thing that restaurants have been trying to evoke in people has really

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kind of evolved.

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Because it used to be kind of like, well, this is an Italian, this is a restaurant in

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Emilia Romana, for example, you know, and it makes dishes from Emilia Romana.

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So that's the terra, you know, that's the region.

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But nowadays the term means not just that, you know, but like a lot of other things as

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well.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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Also going back to the wine, because it's interesting, the wine world, because it's

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all about one product, right?

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The grape.

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And everybody talks about the soil, the climate, the minerals in the soil, the, if it's near

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the sea, the altitude and all of these different aspects just about the grape.

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But if you expand this to all the vegetables that are around and all the resources that

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you could have, that you could incorporate into a menu in a restaurant or even into a

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food identity of a country, for me, that's the wine.

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Because I mean, I come from an ex-colonial country, which is all of the Americas, and

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you will clearly see that in the Americas, there is not a sense of the war as strong

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as you will see in Europe.

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For instance, things that have become like new trends, like eating local products in

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season is something that has been done, for instance, here in the Basque country for the

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last 25,000 years.

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Precisely because of this, because of all of the aftermath that generates a process

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like a colonization that destroys the local identities and new identities emerge.

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I think that those are kind of challenges where the rock comes into play.

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And it's something that we have seen not only in the Americas with projects like what Virgilio

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is doing in Peru and other chefs like Borago also that are working only with things that

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grow around the restaurant, but also even in projects like, well, we'll get into that

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later, like Noma that had also incorporated into their menus and cities like Copenhagen,

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you would see products like olive oil and chocolate.

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And suddenly they said, okay, let's make a restaurant concept that do not include these

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ingredients because of a philosophy that will only work with local produce.

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And that reshapes the food identity of a city, a country, or let's say like a whole gastronomic

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movement, which is what happened in the Nordic countries.

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But I think I went too far in history to forward, let's go step by step.

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Yeah, no, but you're totally right.

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It's super, super interesting.

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It's a very complex thing because like you say, Terrah, it doesn't just talk about the

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type of product, but also, like you said, for example, if you take the example of a

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grape with altitude, altitude also will affect a region's ancient techniques, and like how

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they prepare food, the weather, the seasons, they all affect what's the traditional products

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are and the techniques that are used to elaborate those products.

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And so it's kind of like when we look at like Nordic food, for example, it's like, oh yeah,

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there's lots of like ferments and preserves and plants and stuff.

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It's like, yeah, that's not because they wanted to do that.

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It's because it was a necessity and the necessity then became like the rule, you know, and then

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got refined and refined and refined and out of like a difficulty, people started exploring

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the possibilities inside of what is possible in those parameters and refined it to find

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really, really great things that they then adapted as their own.

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So that's super, super interesting.

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I want to mention just something really quick because that's nothing to do with Terrah,

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but I think it's super interesting because you mentioned altitude and I lived two years

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in La Paz in Bolivia, which is one of the highest cities in the world.

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Then you have El Alto, which is even higher.

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I think it's 4,000 meters.

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I think El Alto is one of the highest cities in the world.

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Wow.

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So what happens there?

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The atmospheric pressure changes.

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So all the physics laws change, which means water boils at 80 degrees and bread needs

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50% more water and rice needs 40 minutes to cook and all these kinds of things.

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All the rules change because you're in like in a different physical environment.

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So imagine that this is what happens with cooking and there are like specific books

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about this, about altitude cooking, like cities like also in Switzerland, there are a lot of

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very high cities that also have to have these kinds of things in consideration.

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But yeah, I imagine the same happening in the soil with the food, with everything that

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grows, with all the animals, with everything.

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And that of course has an impact on the flavor profile that develops in a microclimate basically.

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Yeah, absolutely.

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It's super, super interesting.

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There is this saying from Jose Andres that really stuck to me.

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He said, if it grows together, it goes together.

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And I think that applies not only regionally, but also seasonal.

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You know, like if it grows in the same place in the same season, I mean, you can randomly

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put those things in a plate with a very simple seasoning and it should work.

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You know?

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I think that's a very, I'll have to think about that statement for a little bit.

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Yeah, I mean, yeah.

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It does seem to make sense.

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I mean, that of course that there will be like error ranges that, oh, oops, we added

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like this super aromatic thing that also grows here.

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It sounds good, definitely.

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But you know, Jose Andres is very good at saying things that sound good.

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Yeah, that's true.

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I take everything that he says with a pinch of salt now, since he's been going on about

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the peeled strawberry.

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Ah, yeah.

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Yeah, that's something worth watching.

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So everybody can pause now, this podcast, go to YouTube, watch Jose Andres talking about

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strawberries and come back to understand the joke.

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And compare, what did he do?

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Compare a peeled strawberry.

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Have you ever had a peeled strawberry?

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I love to peel the strawberries.

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There's nothing like when your lips content a skinless strawberry.

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You understand that the strawberry was created to be loved by you, by all.

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It's like a passionate kiss from your lover.

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Yeah.

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Okay.

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Going back to the row.

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Going back a little bit.

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But yeah, what I think is super interesting is that like jump from, you know, when restaurants

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were kind of like in a place, you know, with not that much sort of infrastructure, cooking

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the dishes that were, you know, their own, because usually the people that cook in the

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region are from the region.

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Or if not, they want to, you know, serve something that is familiar, you know, where there's

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a connection.

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And for me, like in the sort of like, you know, novel cuisine, it was really Michel Bras

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who kind of like really went in depth on the terroir.

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And of course, like he also started out cooking, you know, traditional dishes from the Auvergne

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and you know, still did until like the very end.

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But he then went like a step beyond where he just really looked at the ingredients,

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the seasons and just the landscape itself and really like dove into the nature and got

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super, super inspired by that.

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You can really see like Michel Bras is super interesting because on one side, his dishes

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look like a white canvas and also everything like in his restaurant, all the tables and

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everything.

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And then he actually, that crazy statement from Jose Andres that if it grows together,

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it goes together.

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I think that's kind of like what Michel Bras puts on a plate are things that grow together

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around his restaurant.

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Some of these are wild plants that have been foraged and put in the menu.

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And yeah, I think he was, like you said, the most radical in this sense of cooking terroir.

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But I think terroir existed since food exists because people used to eat what they had around

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basically, you know, like and the modern concept of restaurant chef comes from castles where

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they would make this fancy dinners for royalty and they would also cook with what they had

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in their surroundings.

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But I think like our civilization evolved into something so bizarre that you go to a

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forest with a beautiful river with the most delicious water in the world and you're drinking

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imported water from Italy, you know, which is in a plastic bottle, which is an absolute

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bullshit, you know?

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And that's the way a lot of people think because nobody thinks about it, you know, about this

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kind of thing, about where stuff comes from and these kind of things.

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So one of the protégés, I would say, or someone who was super influenced by Michel

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Bras is of course Andoni from Mugaritz, where we both work.

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And he also got radical into at least in one of his periods, I would say.

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I wouldn't say so bold that that's what he's doing still, but I would say in the mid 2000s,

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which is the season where I was there, we would go to the forest and forage, we would

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serve also water from the river at the restaurant.

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I mean, why would you bring water from a river from Italy if you have a river just in front

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of you, you know?

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Yeah.

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And all these kinds of things of working with the surroundings is super interesting.

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Flowers, herbs, mushrooms, pieces of wood.

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I mean, that there are so many things that can be transformed into delicious food.

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Yeah, totally.

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And then it goes beyond that, and then it's not just the ingredients, but it's also just

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the impression.

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In the case of Michel Bras, the beautiful Armenia with the little rivers and the white

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fields and stuff, and the lush green and that sort of stuff.

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Or if you take the Basque mountains with the rocks and also the rivers and the sheep, the

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pastures, the coast, all that sort of stuff.

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Because obviously in this sort of level of cooking, we're talking about a very artistic

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approach in cooking.

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And I feel like that was one of the big steps also in that sort of time where there was

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an artistic interpretation of the terroir, not just in the ingredients, but in the impressions

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and in an emotional and sort of feeling side.

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Yeah, I absolutely understand what you mean.

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Like, if you see dishes from restaurants like Borago, Noma, Mugaritz, or Michel Bras, you

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will notice that somehow the dishes visually communicate the surrounding.

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It's kind of like a landscape on the plate.

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Yeah, like not Nari Sawa, you know?

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Exactly.

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Like look at the dishes from Nari Sawa.

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It's like a forest, you know, but it's not in a sort of molecular way necessarily, or

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you know, like a gargayou.

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That is like a snippet of that day, you know?

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Yeah, like you have really like this forest feeling or this nature feeling.

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If we go to the opposite radical of this, the complete opposite would be, for instance,

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Timbawa.

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You know, he's like anti-terroir.

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Like, he will cook with ingredients that come from Asia and combine them with whatever is

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in the city.

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And it's a completely different approach for a restaurant proposal.

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I have nothing to say about Timbawa.

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I'm not going to talk about Timbawa.

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Yeah, but like even, you know, it's kind of like this like green and vegetable and plant

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and herb thing is one thing.

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But like, for example, when I, you know, like Muguriz, you know, with the walnuts, right?

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Yeah, with the elechos.

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No, and not the elechos, no, the one that's after that.

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And it was like filled with like, ah, what was in there?

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Was it like cheese, cream or something like that?

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But basically it looked like a walnut.

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And it was so evocative of like the siderias and stuff like that, you know, where you eat

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walnuts at the cider houses afterwards with ingredients that are, you know, very, very

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much, you know, representative of the region and of the feeling of wood and dairy and obviously

233
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nuts and all that sort of stuff.

234
00:15:18,880 --> 00:15:24,480
Yeah, so that dish with the elechos ferns in English, I mean, you look at that dish

235
00:15:24,480 --> 00:15:30,280
and you feel like you're seeing, I don't know, like a landscape with snow and plants and

236
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something like that.

237
00:15:31,280 --> 00:15:33,440
It really tells a story somehow, you know?

238
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Like just with the plating.

239
00:15:36,360 --> 00:15:37,680
Yeah, it really does.

240
00:15:37,680 --> 00:15:38,680
Absolutely.

241
00:15:38,680 --> 00:15:39,680
Same with narizawa.

242
00:15:39,680 --> 00:15:43,000
I see narizawa dishes and I feel like I'm in a Japanese forest.

243
00:15:43,000 --> 00:15:44,000
Absolutely.

244
00:15:44,000 --> 00:15:45,000
Oh yeah, for sure.

245
00:15:45,000 --> 00:15:49,360
And I mean, like, I mean, that is actually one of the perfect examples for Teruera, his

246
00:15:49,360 --> 00:15:50,360
soil soup.

247
00:15:50,360 --> 00:15:52,720
Have you, you've heard of the soil soup, right?

248
00:15:52,720 --> 00:15:55,320
No, no, I don't know that soup.

249
00:15:55,320 --> 00:15:56,320
Describe it.

250
00:15:56,320 --> 00:15:57,320
Tell us about it.

251
00:15:57,320 --> 00:16:01,720
So he, he, um, this might sound really bonkers.

252
00:16:01,720 --> 00:16:06,520
And I mean, it is because he's a bonkers guy in the best possible way, but he basically

253
00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:12,800
goes to this one part in the countryside where there's really high quality soil and picks

254
00:16:12,800 --> 00:16:13,800
it up.

255
00:16:13,800 --> 00:16:18,400
And this is really pure, dark sort of humus sort of soil.

256
00:16:18,400 --> 00:16:20,100
And he makes a soup with that soil.

257
00:16:20,100 --> 00:16:24,800
You know, when you dig into the ground and you have this smell of like deep, rich, healthy

258
00:16:24,800 --> 00:16:31,120
earth, and he wanted to put that sensation into a dish.

259
00:16:31,120 --> 00:16:33,840
Well, you, you, you remind me of a dish.

260
00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:37,880
I think this is one of the most creative dishes I've ever heard of.

261
00:16:37,880 --> 00:16:42,080
And also like a super clever wordplay in Spanish, surf and turf.

262
00:16:42,080 --> 00:16:47,640
It's called marimontana, which means sea and mountain.

263
00:16:47,640 --> 00:16:53,800
And John Roca, he made this dish where he desolated a soil like the one you described

264
00:16:53,800 --> 00:16:58,360
with, you know, like a soil, this dark soil that you take in the forest and you smell

265
00:16:58,360 --> 00:17:00,120
it and you, it smells like forest.

266
00:17:00,120 --> 00:17:01,120
Yeah.

267
00:17:01,120 --> 00:17:02,680
And he made a desolation out of it.

268
00:17:02,680 --> 00:17:07,160
So he had a, just a very pure water with that aroma.

269
00:17:07,160 --> 00:17:11,640
And he would add that to oysters and that's marimontana.

270
00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:12,640
You know, brilliant.

271
00:17:12,640 --> 00:17:13,640
That's really cool.

272
00:17:13,640 --> 00:17:14,640
Yeah.

273
00:17:14,640 --> 00:17:18,920
That's, that's crazy, you know, and that's kind of like just really thinking about evoking

274
00:17:18,920 --> 00:17:26,440
a really deep felt sensation of a place, you know, and that's really kind of like a very,

275
00:17:26,440 --> 00:17:33,240
very uniquely like unique to cooking expression of terora, you know?

276
00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:39,680
And that's why I get back to the, these ideas that I started talking about post colonization

277
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and blah, blah, blah.

278
00:17:40,680 --> 00:17:45,400
Because as I said, I come from Venezuela and in Venezuela, I think I've said this before,

279
00:17:45,400 --> 00:17:51,240
there are many traditional dishes that are based on imported products.

280
00:17:51,240 --> 00:17:55,880
Of course, this is a consequence of colonies, but why do we have like the one of our most

281
00:17:55,880 --> 00:18:05,400
traditional dishes need raisins, olives, capers, and some wine from South Spain.

282
00:18:05,400 --> 00:18:09,520
And you know, those are all things that are not produced in Venezuela and the ones that

283
00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:13,800
are sent there are not the highest quality, are the cheapest, you know, like we're buying

284
00:18:13,800 --> 00:18:18,040
the cheapest things from other countries to produce our own traditions.

285
00:18:18,040 --> 00:18:19,600
I think that's just wrong.

286
00:18:19,600 --> 00:18:25,800
I think that should just be reinvented, especially if we're talking about one of the countries

287
00:18:25,800 --> 00:18:27,920
with the richest biodiversity in the world.

288
00:18:27,920 --> 00:18:34,440
And there has to be so many ingredients that haven't been used to its full potential.

289
00:18:34,440 --> 00:18:40,240
And that's something that I found really interesting with the Nordic movement, just to say a short

290
00:18:40,240 --> 00:18:41,240
introduction.

291
00:18:41,240 --> 00:18:42,240
So we talk about Nouvelle Cuisine.

292
00:18:42,240 --> 00:18:44,520
This is something that happened in the sixties.

293
00:18:44,520 --> 00:18:48,640
Then in the seventies, there was a movement here in the Basque country called the New

294
00:18:48,640 --> 00:18:49,640
Basque Cuisine.

295
00:18:49,640 --> 00:18:54,060
They brought a manifesto and they also incorporated traditional recipes from grandmothers into

296
00:18:54,060 --> 00:18:55,060
high end restaurants.

297
00:18:55,060 --> 00:18:57,880
They kind of replicated the Nouvelle Cuisine.

298
00:18:57,880 --> 00:19:02,920
Then in the nineties, we had the Spanish Avant Garde led by Ferran Adria.

299
00:19:02,920 --> 00:19:09,920
What they did is they started making very creative and crazy combinations on technique

300
00:19:09,920 --> 00:19:18,360
and flavor combinations to just do all things that was possible and try everything, all

301
00:19:18,360 --> 00:19:23,560
possible combinations of techniques and flavors and everything to a point that it became really

302
00:19:23,560 --> 00:19:24,880
baroque.

303
00:19:24,880 --> 00:19:31,640
And then there was a saturation of over information, of over combinations, of over things in the

304
00:19:31,640 --> 00:19:32,640
plate.

305
00:19:32,640 --> 00:19:36,800
And then suddenly everything got plain again with the Nordic movement that said, okay,

306
00:19:36,800 --> 00:19:43,400
let's just focus on the Tehuar, on the surroundings, on time and place.

307
00:19:43,400 --> 00:19:49,360
And one thing that I found super interesting is once I tried a Whey ice cream, Whey, just

308
00:19:49,360 --> 00:19:53,560
something that is usually thrown away, it's usually garbage.

309
00:19:53,560 --> 00:19:54,800
Nobody would cook with that.

310
00:19:54,800 --> 00:19:59,760
And then they aromatized like a milk and make an ice cream with that.

311
00:19:59,760 --> 00:20:04,240
And it's delicious and a completely different flavor I've never tried before.

312
00:20:04,240 --> 00:20:06,920
And they use that, but for instance, vanilla is forbidden.

313
00:20:06,920 --> 00:20:12,800
And I think that's so clever because it's much cheaper and has so much identity and

314
00:20:12,800 --> 00:20:16,520
so much sense like socially, economically, like in so many senses.

315
00:20:16,520 --> 00:20:17,520
Sustainably.

316
00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:18,560
Yeah, totally.

317
00:20:18,560 --> 00:20:22,680
And creatively also, it's kind of like you set yourself limitations and it's kind of

318
00:20:22,680 --> 00:20:24,280
like, well, why wasn't Whey used?

319
00:20:24,280 --> 00:20:28,720
Whey is an amazing product and nowadays it's like really, really used in kitchens.

320
00:20:28,720 --> 00:20:32,360
But it's kind of like people weren't looking at it.

321
00:20:32,360 --> 00:20:35,560
People weren't not using Whey because it's bad.

322
00:20:35,560 --> 00:20:37,960
It was just sort of like, well, we're not doing anything with this.

323
00:20:37,960 --> 00:20:39,580
We're just going to throw it away.

324
00:20:39,580 --> 00:20:43,320
And it was just not the trend.

325
00:20:43,320 --> 00:20:44,320
It wasn't a trend.

326
00:20:44,320 --> 00:20:47,880
It wasn't what people are used to, what the routine was.

327
00:20:47,880 --> 00:20:52,600
And these sorts of limitations, they really push the creative boundaries to look at

328
00:20:52,600 --> 00:20:57,320
things a different way, to kind of take a few steps back and broaden your horizon and

329
00:20:57,320 --> 00:20:59,800
look at things with a fresh perspective.

330
00:20:59,800 --> 00:21:02,640
And that opened up, you know, infinite options.

331
00:21:02,640 --> 00:21:03,640
Absolutely.

332
00:21:03,640 --> 00:21:04,640
Yeah.

333
00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:07,800
I think again, this is something that has always existed.

334
00:21:07,800 --> 00:21:14,120
The person that first ate an artichoke had to be really hungry to do that, you know,

335
00:21:14,120 --> 00:21:15,120
to see something.

336
00:21:15,120 --> 00:21:16,280
Okay, let's cook this.

337
00:21:16,280 --> 00:21:17,760
Maybe it's delicious, you know?

338
00:21:17,760 --> 00:21:23,560
And that's what the new Nordic movement just brought to a completely different level.

339
00:21:23,560 --> 00:21:29,440
Looking around, then influential chefs around the world started imitating all the things.

340
00:21:29,440 --> 00:21:36,080
I remember Grant Akats from Chicago, he once wanted to do a stock with wood.

341
00:21:36,080 --> 00:21:42,280
So he called it wood stock, you know, but then taking just logs of wood and throwing

342
00:21:42,280 --> 00:21:47,280
them into water and cooking them to eat that, it's not common sense, you know?

343
00:21:47,280 --> 00:21:51,560
It's something that you have to come up with that and also pull it off and do it correctly.

344
00:21:51,560 --> 00:21:53,640
So it's something really worth doing, you know?

345
00:21:53,640 --> 00:21:54,640
Yeah, totally.

346
00:21:54,640 --> 00:21:55,640
Tell us about Fabikin.

347
00:21:55,640 --> 00:21:57,600
You work there, right?

348
00:21:57,600 --> 00:21:58,600
Or you visited?

349
00:21:58,600 --> 00:22:01,800
Yeah, I starved there for a few months.

350
00:22:01,800 --> 00:22:07,320
Yeah, that was also a restaurant with an incredible sense of terroir, you know, very, very, very

351
00:22:07,320 --> 00:22:13,040
local in both the ingredients and the techniques and also in the research of old techniques

352
00:22:13,040 --> 00:22:15,600
of that region.

353
00:22:15,600 --> 00:22:22,800
So Fabikin was located in the very north of Sweden on the border of Norway in an area

354
00:22:22,800 --> 00:22:26,680
called Jämtland and it was close to like a ski resort in the middle of the forest.

355
00:22:26,680 --> 00:22:33,280
And the chef, Magnus Nilsson, amazing chef, he started it there on an old like hunting

356
00:22:33,280 --> 00:22:34,280
estate.

357
00:22:34,280 --> 00:22:37,640
There was nothing really there and he just started cooking, you know, like going out,

358
00:22:37,640 --> 00:22:38,800
shooting, game.

359
00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:43,360
It was really, really beautiful because he just focused on getting, it was very simple

360
00:22:43,360 --> 00:22:46,640
really, but like incredibly complicated in its like simplicity.

361
00:22:46,640 --> 00:22:50,520
He just focused on getting super, super good ingredients throughout the season and then

362
00:22:50,520 --> 00:22:56,520
preparing them, putting them together in a creative way with incredibly, incredibly sharp

363
00:22:56,520 --> 00:22:57,520
technique.

364
00:22:57,520 --> 00:23:03,200
And so, you know, drawing on the meat elements, drawing on the seafood elements, you know,

365
00:23:03,200 --> 00:23:07,320
that it's sort of like river fish, the seafood he would get from Norway, you know, and then

366
00:23:07,320 --> 00:23:09,800
just like really, really just focusing on the basics.

367
00:23:09,800 --> 00:23:12,400
Like I've got a really good king crab.

368
00:23:12,400 --> 00:23:16,000
Just cook that king crab perfectly, get the best king crab you can, cook it perfectly

369
00:23:16,000 --> 00:23:20,000
and then just add one or two things to complement that.

370
00:23:20,000 --> 00:23:25,000
He did that with a lot of things, you know, get a really good retired dairy cow, you know,

371
00:23:25,000 --> 00:23:28,640
cook that piece of meat absolutely perfectly, one or two things to complement it and that's

372
00:23:28,640 --> 00:23:29,640
it.

373
00:23:29,640 --> 00:23:33,200
And it was like one of the purest and also one of the best restaurants I've ever been

374
00:23:33,200 --> 00:23:34,200
in.

375
00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:37,920
Yeah, I feel it was one of the best restaurants in the world when it was active.

376
00:23:37,920 --> 00:23:38,920
For sure.

377
00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:39,920
Yeah.

378
00:23:39,920 --> 00:23:40,920
How long did it go?

379
00:23:40,920 --> 00:23:42,120
Like four years already, I think so, right?

380
00:23:42,120 --> 00:23:43,600
Well, I think you're right.

381
00:23:43,600 --> 00:23:45,320
Seems like a long time, but I think you're right.

382
00:23:45,320 --> 00:23:46,320
Yeah.

383
00:23:46,320 --> 00:23:47,320
Yeah, it's a shame.

384
00:23:47,320 --> 00:23:48,320
Yeah.

385
00:23:48,320 --> 00:23:49,320
It's a real shame.

386
00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:52,240
Another good example is Cox in the Faroe Islands.

387
00:23:52,240 --> 00:23:57,520
That's again, that's a restaurant that literally has only its surroundings because it's in

388
00:23:57,520 --> 00:23:59,180
the middle of nowhere.

389
00:23:59,180 --> 00:24:03,880
Other examples could be Boragoen, Chile, Gusto where I worked in Bolivia.

390
00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:04,880
Yeah.

391
00:24:04,880 --> 00:24:08,120
There was also Pedro Schiaffino in Peru.

392
00:24:08,120 --> 00:24:09,800
He had like this restaurant called Amas.

393
00:24:09,800 --> 00:24:13,480
Well, the restaurant was in the city, but everything from that restaurant would work

394
00:24:13,480 --> 00:24:14,480
with Amazonian produce.

395
00:24:14,480 --> 00:24:15,480
Yeah.

396
00:24:15,480 --> 00:24:16,480
Yeah.

397
00:24:16,480 --> 00:24:20,160
But I think like the concept of having the restaurant not in the place already breaks

398
00:24:20,160 --> 00:24:21,600
the terroir concept.

399
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:22,680
Totally.

400
00:24:22,680 --> 00:24:29,920
You can't do like how to say, imagine like a terroir from some forest in New York.

401
00:24:29,920 --> 00:24:30,920
You know what I mean?

402
00:24:30,920 --> 00:24:31,920
Like it doesn't work like that.

403
00:24:31,920 --> 00:24:32,920
Yeah.

404
00:24:32,920 --> 00:24:33,920
It has to be in the place.

405
00:24:33,920 --> 00:24:34,920
Yeah, totally.

406
00:24:34,920 --> 00:24:35,920
Totally.

407
00:24:35,920 --> 00:24:36,920
And I think it's a trend that's like really cool, you know?

408
00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:40,880
I mean like trend is kind of like calling it a trend doesn't really do it justice because

409
00:24:40,880 --> 00:24:45,480
it's kind of going back to basics, you know, and to it makes sense sustainably, you know,

410
00:24:45,480 --> 00:24:46,480
it makes sense.

411
00:24:46,480 --> 00:24:47,720
Logistically, it makes sense.

412
00:24:47,720 --> 00:24:50,920
But like even like smaller restaurants, you know, my restaurant does the same thing, you

413
00:24:50,920 --> 00:24:55,160
know, we're based in Berlin and we only use products from the region.

414
00:24:55,160 --> 00:25:00,360
We only, we don't go outside of Brandenburg and which is the area outside of Berlin.

415
00:25:00,360 --> 00:25:05,120
And you know, that means no olive oil, no lemons, you know, fish, like we can't get

416
00:25:05,120 --> 00:25:09,000
fish from the North Sea or from Brittany or whatever, something that's like normal for

417
00:25:09,000 --> 00:25:10,000
other restaurants.

418
00:25:10,000 --> 00:25:11,440
What does that do?

419
00:25:11,440 --> 00:25:14,400
Like we said before, you know, it's kind of like, well, first of all, you put a lot of

420
00:25:14,400 --> 00:25:17,560
time and effort into finding the best products from the region.

421
00:25:17,560 --> 00:25:18,560
And like, what do you find?

422
00:25:18,560 --> 00:25:26,400
You find like a small guy who runs like a lake community that does incredibly high quality

423
00:25:26,400 --> 00:25:31,440
soft water fish, you know, like trout and stuff, a sturgeon, amazing best sturgeon

424
00:25:31,440 --> 00:25:33,080
I've ever had, you know?

425
00:25:33,080 --> 00:25:37,480
And you know, you find people that make cold pressed rapeseed oil, you know, rapeseed oil

426
00:25:37,480 --> 00:25:41,080
that's usually like a cooking oil, but like cold pressed, super high quality, intensely

427
00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:42,520
yellow, super fragrant.

428
00:25:42,520 --> 00:25:44,360
And you find all these interesting things.

429
00:25:44,360 --> 00:25:48,280
Of course you can use olive oil, but it's actually really, really interesting to find

430
00:25:48,280 --> 00:25:49,280
these sorts of things.

431
00:25:49,280 --> 00:25:53,480
And then kind of like, and it has a lot of, you know, it's very real in a way and then

432
00:25:53,480 --> 00:25:58,080
it's very authentic in its own, because like it doesn't really matter like how you put

433
00:25:58,080 --> 00:25:59,080
these things together.

434
00:25:59,080 --> 00:26:20,360
They're always going to be authentically from that place, you know?