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Hello, welcome to another episode of Unpacking Neuroqueerness. This is your

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host George Muniz Gund. Today I have a very special episode, um, sorry, very

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special guest on the podcast for a very special episode. I forgot to mention, um,

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but this is the 150th episode of Unpacking Neuroqueerness and my guest

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today is Jim Jarrett, my acting teacher at the school I attended, the Meisner

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Technique Studio in San Francisco. Jim is the last teaching prodigy of Sanford

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Meisner and the founder of director of the school. Today I'm gonna ask Jim a

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little bit about his journey with being my teacher, watching me unmask and

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flourish into my true self, and we'll also talk a little bit about the training

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about his experiences working with other students, perhaps who had differences

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and a little bit about Jim himself. Welcome, without further ado, welcome Jim.

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Thank you George, it's a pleasure and privilege to be here. Thank you Jim, thank

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you for coming on, thank you for making the time. So the first thing I wanted to

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get into relates, about relates to my experience with going through the training

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and unmasking into my true self. Before the training I used to feel like in

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order to be accepted I needed to fit certain societal modes and expectations

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and I needed to learn to embody behaviors and mannerisms that weren't

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natural to me, that were more like copying other people, and so I was highly

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masked. I used to be very over analytical of myself, which led to struggles

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connecting with others, and I'm sure you remember like the first interview I did

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with you, how different I was, and I'll never forget the impact of certain

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teachings in the training, such as don't be good, be fearless, and not being

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polite had on my unmasking journey, because after learning that I was

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enough the way I am, and being encouraged to not be polite while working off

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another actor, and I started to feel a lot more freedom to a level that I

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hadn't experienced before, and I also remember you saying Jim that this training

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you said to the whole class in first session that this training would change

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your life and it would impact your relationships with every person, and I

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definitely felt that happen, so that leads me to my question. Jim tell us a

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little bit about the impact you've seen the training have on me, and if any of

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it reminds you of the impact those teachings had on you when you were going

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through it with Sanford Meisner, and maybe other students as well? Yeah okay

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well you know George, you already summarized it, you know you came to

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me as someone as you said masked, highly intellectual, felt the need to just fit

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in and really in many ways, you know not honor your no criticism, but just to try

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to conform and not get bullied and treated, can I swear by the way? Not being treated

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shitty by people, you just you felt that you know this need to conform, so not an

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authentic version of you right, but as you're talking I'm going oh my gosh

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George, not only was that true of you, but honestly that's true of virtually

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every single student that comes to me, and we'll get to that because right now

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your question is specifically about you, but it's an inevitable byproduct of this

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training, that's why I do say on the first day of class or early on this

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training will impact your life in such a profound way, it literally will change it

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for the better because the technique, the genius of what Sanford Meisner created

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was to help everyone step into this more authentic version of themselves to get

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out of their heads and work from their guts, and to really embrace that they are

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enough, so to quit giving that power away, so you are someone that flourished

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beautifully, I remember you vividly, I remember your interview because we had

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mutual friends and relationships and they asked if I would be willing to

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meet with you and in consideration for you to study with me, and I said of

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course absolutely, and I remember when I met you and I could tell that you were

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someone that was very introverted and on himself, very nervous, and again this is

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most everybody that comes to me for that first interview, and I just I remember

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thinking to myself and this happens often where I know this training will

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help this person, I am positive of that for all the reasons we've now talked

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about, but I just wasn't quite sure whether you were going to be able to go

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on the full journey and whether you even wanted to, I wasn't closing the door to

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it, I just remember that was my first impression, and then as the training went

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on again you were just a beautiful student and a beautiful example of what's

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possible if you can hang in there because you had bumpy days man, you had tough

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days and they're like all of us did, but you were resilient, you were humble, you

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were courageous, I'm not flattering you, this is the truth, you just you just you

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had there was no quit in you, so I remember very early on going oh my

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goodness this kid's gonna be just fine, he's he's he has all the qualities

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needed to grow into this, and I also want to add that your classmates were also

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incredibly supportive as well in terms of just you know and of each other not

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just specifically you, of just helping each other just you know because

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everybody's different, you know the people think about teaching actors George,

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you may recall me saying often was that you're you know you're the piano, you're

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the instrument, and my great teacher Sanford Meister would say to be a

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world-class actor you have to have a world-class instrument to play and you

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are that instrument, so again the healthier healthier we are the freer we

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are the more that we really do embody and make peace with all that we are and

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are not allows us to show up and not care what people think that's really at the

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core of the Meiser technique, it's just freedom, it really is it's and it's not

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by accident it's by design, so I knew if you could hang in there great things

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would happen for you and they did, they did, you you blossomed beautifully, I

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think that I remember so many of your family members on that final day of

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class came up to me and you know look they're trying to celebrate me or

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whatever and I'm like hey man it's it's George, it's the genius of my teacher

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and it's George, I'm you know I have my part and that part is that I'm a purist,

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I'm a conduit to my teacher's brilliance, I take seriously the privileged role of

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being asked by him to carry on his teaching legacy, okay so there's you know

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I have my part in it but George it was you and you just blossomed and they all

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to a person said we barely recognize him in terms of he's just a completely

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different person in terms of his confidence and his his his his belief

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in himself. I certainly recall that transformation as well and I think you

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know how it happened gradually and I remember the struggles that you you

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mentioned, it was hard like first session I remember the first I won't say what it

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was but the the first exercise that we did that we worked on I struggled a lot

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with having urgency with it and I remember, I even like there was a

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period where I wouldn't understand that I that I didn't have enough urgency and

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I would like a lot of other students tend to in the beginning of the training I

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would feel defensive because I just didn't understand like how deep it

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really goes and then I felt like you know I felt like with time I was able to

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understand that better and grow and and yeah I was just really powerful like in

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terms of unmasking I always think about that of how powerful it was to really

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let go and I think part of why I struggled in a little bit in the

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beginning was because I in the very beginning I still wasn't fully unmasked

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I think of course yeah I think it took maybe I don't know if you would agree but

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I want to say maybe until like the end of third session or like second year I

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agree completely George it was a slow progression initially a lot of one step

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forward two steps back again for almost every single student for what it's worth

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but boy man I absolutely remember when you turn to corner I can picture you one

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day in class for all you did the best I remember saying to you I go that's the

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best technique you've ever done and to do the technique well for all your

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listeners you you have to now be incredibly present you have to be out

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of your head and with that all nerves go away it's impossible to be nervous if

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your focus is off yourself and you used to suffer from a lot of tension and

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nerves prior prior to the exercise beginning once the exercise began

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moments missed and so you're you know this evolution but man all the sudden

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it's like you you're riding this horse and you caught stride and honestly you

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really never look back from that point forward you really began to do the kind

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of work that is would be considered solid work by anybody you know it just you

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did you turned a beautiful corner yeah thank you I I I certainly felt that

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that happened also and I think I remember that class that you mentioned

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where I had like that big breakthrough doing the the technique and just like

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really unleashing and being fully unmasked I remember how satisfying that

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was because I feel like not just in the training but in life till that point I

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wasn't I don't think I was ever as unmasked as I as I wasn't that exercise

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because I felt and I remember you mentioning also how it is a very like I

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mean it depends by culture and everything but like in society a lot of

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people not just neurodivergent people get conditioned to not to like not to

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be polite to not be a certain way so I felt I felt that impact for sure and I

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can I remember also how how my family noticed how yeah so the next thing I

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wanted to talk about is more related to developing strategies one thing I noticed

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about myself and about others is that we tell others that feel different or just

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maybe work in different ways than the most people that we tend to create our

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own strategies when it comes to getting things done and I remember there's one

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exercise that you teach in the it's the first thing you teach in the business

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class and you talk about top-downs yeah okay okay it's okay that's okay all

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right yeah so top-downs because it's they and it relates a lot to breaking

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things down into sub tasks correct yeah it's the old how do you eat an elephant

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one bite at a time the top-downs concept I started to advancing for myself about

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40 years ago for zero because I was a procrastinator I had great intentions

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the old phrase the road to hell is paved with good intentions we want to get

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stuff done but talk is cheap and we tend to over the course of our upbringing we

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tend to start losing what I call personal integrity we don't we don't wait let's

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say we're gonna go to the store that day or we're gonna register our car we're

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gonna call this person and we don't do it yeah anyway it's very subtle but it's

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also very insidious and it's like a slow leak into our our bank of personal

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integrity so most everybody's really struggles with with procrastination and

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that's just easy stuff basic stuff but then we shame ourselves we feel guilt we

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drink the poison and now worry we're it's even harder it's like we're digging a

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hole and and then the reason why I started to really go after this is man

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if your word isn't gold and you have big dreams and George as you know in this

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industry you know to be an actor I've been doing this for 37 years to make a

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living at this is almost impossible it is yeah and to do it year after year

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pretty much is and that I've been part of that group I a great part of that is

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due to my addressing the procrastinator inside of me and so this top-down

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concept was something that exactly George you just people get overwhelmed by

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the enormity of trying to get their film to Sundance let's say they're like oh

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my god they can't even open the computer and start typing and so by taking it

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down to these actionable steps picture a ladder with not big steps but like

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teeniest steps just in a ladder that really would only need 30 steps a

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fireman's ladder to three floors this lat these ladders have like 150 steps it's

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just dip dip dip dip dip dip and it just breaks it down and makes things that

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are that seem overwhelming no longer overwhelming yeah definitely I feel like

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that was one of the exercises that was really helpful for me because I hadn't I

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think before that I hadn't really thought that way of like breaking things

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into subtasks and how it really helps get things done instead of just saying oh

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I want to get this done and yeah I've talked to other students a little bit

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now on the the link in between masking acting and the Meisner technique a little

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more one of the main aspects of masking for me was studying all kinds of people

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and trying to replicate all their unique mannerisms and behaviors and I think

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that's one positive one positive was that it eventually drew me to acting

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because it drew me to want to try on all these different characters and I felt

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like I was already doing that in a way but of course like I learned how to do

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it a lot more authentically like from the gut which was very different because

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I used to be very much so in my head and so a lot of other actors have expressed

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similar feelings I was wondering if you felt if that you felt that you had to

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mask like certain things or if you like in terms of socially and everything yeah

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well so no that's for me that's not what drew me to acting but I do understand

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your point and I after teaching literally thousands of people over the

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years that's certainly the case for a lot of people and understandable and you're

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you are right there's some real positives to that right as you were

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talking I was thinking I have a friend of mine that shot a film in the south and

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he really struggled with his accent he had a heat as he said he goes I had one

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down but it just felt cliche it just didn't feel like I'd earn it and he

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walked into a hardware store he needed to buy something he was like I don't know

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somewhere in the south Georgia deep in the south he walked in a hardware store

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and there was this good old boy behind the counter and as soon as he spoke he

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goes oh my god holy hell that's that's the accent that's the guy that's the

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cadence that's so so you talk about you know mirroring and masking and this is

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what we as actors definitely do we we are ambassadors on behalf of the human

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experience our job is to study and and file away whether it's mannerisms

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behavior character elements characteristics of people absolutely true

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but as you know George as well the other component of the miser technique is

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all about authenticity right about about that you are enough and and stepping

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into that too so it's a it's a bit of a contradiction on the one hand we're

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trying to pay attention to what we're not and and and what's out there and

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and and when I say steal from it I just simply mean for our art and yet be real

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about it for me what brought me to acting was just really straightforward I

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saw a film that it was called the direct deer hunter and I just I had that film

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punched me in the soul it was in the 80s I didn't even I was trying to figure out

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what I did want to do with my life what my purpose was not just a job but what

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I've been put on this earth to do acting and filmmaking was not a even on the

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radar I never acted in my life I was a jock and when I experienced this movie

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and I say experienced it because that's what happened and when it was over I

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just I couldn't move George I sat there in the movie theater and I literally was

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I was emotional I was I was angry this film is about the Vietnam War and the

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not just the fallout for the people that actually go over and fight but for the

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people that they come back to and and how destroyed everyone gets by it the

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fallout after the fact and it just broke my heart and it really bothered me and

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I had never been bothered by a film before like this I had never been and

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I'll even use the word haunted because it's accurate and so that film was the

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catalyst for me to to begin this this journey and again that was in nineteen

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that actually started in 84 I began officially my career in 87 spent a few

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years just getting my stuff together George trying to deal with all my

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procrastination and bad habits and things and save money and get out of debt

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and and really clean up my act so I spent several years just set in the table

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before I even felt ready to go after something so difficult a lot like a

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somebody in a you know back in the Christopher Columbus days you know you

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don't just hop in the boat going hey I'm gonna go for a sail out to the middle

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of nowhere here I need a good boat and I need a I need to have you know supplies

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etc so that was my approach but again sorry I'm getting a little wordy with

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this to your question to answer it I became an actor not to unmask but to

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truly just say stuff that I wanted to say to tell stories that mattered to me

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in hopes that if I told it well it could kind of have it could have the kind of

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impact like the deer hunter had on me that I could I and I and thank God I

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found my teacher because Sanford Meisner believed that to be an actor was

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important that it was a noble profession that if you told stories as actors in an

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elite way and by for Sandy that meant truthful believable that your works

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believable that you can turn a cold piece of paper into a believable human

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being literally that you could change people's lives forever through your

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storytelling through your work I'd experience that and I wanted that so

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that that's what my motivation was yeah yeah I definitely relate also to wanting

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to tell stories and I think especially after I went through the training and I

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I was unmasking and you probably remember it was in the business class that I

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really shifted that when we started like I'm talking about how to market

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ourselves and everything and like the stories we want to tell like our

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identity as actors and all that and I that's when I became an advocate it was

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I was unbelievable you it's like a light bulb went on for you and you've never

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you've never looked back and everyone who knows you and cares about you so damn

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proud of you and I saw the day it happened we're like holy hell this is

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why I think I was doing all this yeah yeah yeah it was really powerful like it

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right after the business class I remember actually I remember talking about it

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the last day of the business class that I was going to start an Instagram page

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yep and so I went on and did that and I started in the beginning it was mostly

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sharing things that I was reading from other advocates and I really resonated

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with and then eventually I started writing my own stuff and it was a whole

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process because I started writing only on Instagram in the beginning and then I

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realized that I just had so much to say and you can only fit like so much in

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there and like not everyone has social media so I wanted to I wanted to have a

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larger reach and then I asked I started thinking about making a blog and I was

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just a little bit worried because I wasn't sure how I would promote my blog

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and then I remember I was talking to my dad at one day like I was like yeah I've

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been thinking about starting this blog but I don't know like if people are

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gonna see it because one thing I liked about social media was that it's like

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easy to promote stuff on there but but then my dad made me realize like he was

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like well you could do the blog but you could and then you could share the

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blog you could share your posts on the link to your post on social media and

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then I was like oh okay yeah I could do that and then I did I decided to do that

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and I started the blog and then I want to say a couple months after that I

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started getting into podcasts and I started this I was it was the same

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similar kind of thing I was listening to like podcasts by other advocates and

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really liked them and I was like and then I started realizing you know I could

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do something like this and then I started it I remember just recording like the

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first episode and it still says like in the first episode I say welcome to the

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first episode of unpacking neurodiversity and I ended up changing the

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name to neuroqueerness but I just left to the first episode like that because I

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felt like it's it's kind of it's a reminder of like oh this was actually

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gonna be called something else and then I sat I remember I sat on that episode

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for 12 days before I published it because I did get a little bit stuck like I

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felt myself getting stuck back in the like you know being afraid to be good

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or not so much even just that but like I guess starting to over worry again about

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the perception and what how it was gonna be received and whatnot but then I

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reminded myself like you used to say there's a guy that's that's in the back

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of the bus that comes to the front of the bus and he's like you're you've had a

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name for it the like basically like the negative voice in your head you know we

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teach off this all the time right that we have excuse me every one of us has

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inside of us this critic it's just a matter of how loud he is and who do you

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want driving your bus right do you want the healthiest version of you and you

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want that guy and even if that guy's not driving your bus he's on the bus and

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and so you know you just want to be you don't want to be ruled by and live your

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life small because you're you're you know either afraid of making mistakes or

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the judgment of others or falling short you know to just again to be live a life

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of truly not caring what people think and again I don't mean in some

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narcissistic bratty way I'm not saying treat people crappy or anything like

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that when I say to not care what people think I always say you know that's what

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charisma is George somebody that has tremendous charisma you know what it is

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it's freedom they they feel without arrogance that they're enough that

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they're they value themselves they they like themselves they have something to

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say and and they and somebody with Christmas feels the same way about you

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by the way you'll feel welcomed you'll feel warmed by them whereas ego is

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is something else entirely so yeah the bus driver who do you want driving your

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bus do you want this voice this critic this hyper critic this cynic this this

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person that wants to keep driving you into the ditch and have you you know

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fall short of what you deserve in your life or do you want you know the

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healthiest version of you and of course you know I I would hope just about

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everybody would be able to easily say that version but that's just because

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it's easy to say doesn't mean it's it's easy to do and that also is not just the

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work of this training of course that's the work in our all of our all of our

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lives yeah definitely I feel like that's definitely one teaching from the

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training that translates to life in general and that's when that's what

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led me to finally publish that episode 12 days later I looked at it on my

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computer and it was still there and I was like you know what I I'm not gonna

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try to be good I'm just gonna do it and I published it and I even went with a

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different name and then it just I remember it just evolved because I had so

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many things to say and I would do an episode about like one subtopic at one

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point I was pumping out episodes like almost daily because I it was just like

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these short little episodes of just me on my own and then I started having guests

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and I had I remember my first guest was my sister Luana who was he at graduation

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sure and it was I remember like that was a really powerful episode because we we

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just like talked about things that we had never talked about before and then

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you know I was able to have more family members and friends on and even a few

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Meisner technique students and and it's it's hard to believe that now I have a

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hundred and this is the 150th episode gosh like also remaining humble like

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because I don't like to brag either but it's like the fact that I have almost

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14,000 downloads now like I didn't certainly did not predict that or

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expect that so yeah definitely I feel like a lot of it is due to the training

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and what we learned in the business class as well so I have a few more

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questions and the next question I had the next two questions are more related

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about reflecting on yourself through others like students that you've taught

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and so has working with all kinds of different students over so many years

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made you see some of their differences strengths and struggles in yourself and

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if so what are some examples of that yeah of course right you know you see you

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know you see yourself in certain students they remind you of how you went

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through how you were when you went through the training both positive

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qualities and the qualities that got in the way of learning and being open so

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there's no doubt and one of the you know privileges of teaching acting and

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actors and especially this way of working is and we said I said mentioned

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it earlier is that you are the piano you know how many times did we say George

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don't compare your instrument to anybody else in this room because you all

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have your own unique experiences and that means that it's there's never been a

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piano like yours ever and and you act from who and what you are it doesn't

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mean you need to have a horrible life to be an actor it just means you draw on

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so much of your life experiences you do and then once you really understand what

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acting is about in terms of being able to develop your imagination and now you

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can take from the realities of your life and use your imagination to expand and

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grow that to experience all kinds of things that you've actually never never

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literally experienced but to do that you're gonna come up against your stuff

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and so to answer your question you know oh yes I not only see me and my

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students and how and certainly that makes me a better teacher more

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compassionate but honestly George just to the point of the teaching is each one

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of you is different and so my job is really is to try to look at each student

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separate from anyone else and try my best to help them as they start to

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untangle and get free of all their wounds and blocks again this ain't therapy

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but as this is Sanford Meiser talking he'd say this ain't therapy but it's

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incredibly therapeutic it has to be again it goes back to the beautiful art

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form called being an actor we are the instrument so the healthier you are the

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freer you are the more self-aware you are the better actor you'll be it doesn't

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mean you know here's another beautiful teaching of Sanford Meiser's the sea

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dairy character you will ever play is already inside you I like all of my

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students every student inside of them has the this this guy this guy on their

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bus their bench guy or gal but this this dynamics this this component this

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character element where they're incredibly noble and honest and sneaky and

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deceitful and and and a really really good person and a really really selfish

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person person and everything in between and I can go on and on list you know all

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the the positive and negatives of being in this human experience we all have it

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and and one of the beautiful things about being an actor is to stop denying

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it he doesn't mean you want to live it out I don't want to be a shit bag to

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people I don't want to be selfish I don't want to be that guy but I can be

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that guy he's in there so it is when you work with students you see that stuff

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come out earlier you mentioned that you were you know early on a bit defensive

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you know you get you get by the way you weren't bad at all George you weren't

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you weren't but you know I get that I get people who are defensive who make it

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difficult to teach and at some point if they just can't address where that comes

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from because usually what it means is when they were young and they got

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critiqued by teachers parents whatever there's a lot of shame around it so when

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you go to teach them especially because you're teaching the quote unquote them

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meaning they're the instrument they can take it personally and they can get

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prickly and it's a real dynamic and and so at some point you get some students

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where you just literally say I can't I can't work with you you're I'm not I'm

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the wrong teacher for you you know you're just not like we can't do this so it's

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not working but for most yeah I'm able to see what what's going on and do my

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best to help them heal and again without enabling without getting you know

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again I'm it's a fine line George because you don't want to you don't want to

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overstep and there's certain things that for some people go way deeper than what

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this training is about and I have to be very sensitive to that but I also have

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to be if I'm working with with actors you have to be incredibly self-aware of

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the human condition yeah yeah definitely I I remember seeing that like noticing

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that in class also like all how everyone like has their own stuff for sure like

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and I noticed like I do remember like having some classmates that did really

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struggle to take certain teachings and I think as like as always with with any

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group there were like a couple conflicts and I remember I even had a partner

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that was was not committed was not very committed to the scene and I remember

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because I remembered how you talked about how it takes to the dance or like

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how you know if you're not giving your your best self or like really working

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hard on it it it can affect the other person too yeah and so I definitely

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noticed that with one certain partner that I worked with but and then we got

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rid of him yeah yeah right yeah which is great you know again I mean look you

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you teach a hundred students you have a hundred students you believe me there's

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gonna be a couple words just not a good fit and that's just the way it goes yeah

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I don't take it personally whatsoever yeah I think you might have already

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touched a little bit on this but my the last question I wanted to ask is because

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I feel like a lot of people who feel different like me they end up drawing

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to they they end up being drawn to the world of creative arts and performance

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and become dreamers they I noticed that they they never a lot of them or most of

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them like you say also never end up they end up never following their dreams

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because of shyness or fear of not being good enough and I feel like it's still I

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mean of course like I've unlearned that but by now but it's I definitely notice

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like when I talk like it's probably the number one thing I hear from people when

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I talk to them is like they're like oh yeah I really wanted to do acting too but

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I wasn't good enough or I I have stage fright or I'm too shy I could never do

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it what is the main piece of advice that you you have for those folks self love

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you know just keep working on yourself I'm enough I've got something to say and

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people if you know George as you know I do my all these shows I do a lot of live

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theater and I tour and a big house for me is you know a thousand twelve hundred

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people usually 800 to a thousand is a usual house and my shows wildly

401
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successful my shows and but there's gonna be some people that aren't just

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not gonna like it and there's nothing to do about it and I and I when I say I

403
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don't care I care very much that I've shown up that I've done my job I'm a

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pro I care very much about doing everything I can to deliver the goods but

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I can't care well I can but I don't choose to care what what what people think in

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00:37:04,560 --> 00:37:10,880
terms of them let's say not liking me or my art now again if I respect this

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person and I've done something offensive or shitty then of course I'm not but

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I'm not talking about that George again I'm just talking about as an artist you

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know your question is you know what advice would you give people who who who

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feel a bit locked up who aren't going after the things because of shyness

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because of these things and just for what it's worth George it's that's most

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everybody most everybody is not living their dreams most everybody is

413
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settling most everybody is living a much smaller version of of of who they

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really know they are but they're wounded they've got to they've got this

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00:37:45,200 --> 00:37:48,600
imprinting and programming and conditioning that they're not enough that

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they're not good enough that most people who are shy really early on life

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didn't wasn't safe they're like a little turtle so they're just they're gonna

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barely peek their head out so they don't get smacked or teased or laughed at or

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ridiculed so they're they bonded to the wounds of their past right they're

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they're they've been defined by these these moments and events and in so

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doing they are now going to crawl inside a box a very small box put the lid on

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and stay small and I say that with compassion you know that's again George

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it's most everybody in life is has very limiting beliefs about themselves so for

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me the key to to live an authentic life to live a life of no regret to go after

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your dreams man you've got to believe in yourself you've got to believe that

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you've got something to say and again without ego but truly just the sincere

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desire to express and help like what you're doing with this podcast I'm sure

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some people subscribe and then kick quit and you know whatever blah blah blah and

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some people will listen to every episode and you know I'm going and and and all

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you can do George is continue to do your best to try to be a voice and provide a

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voice of others for others and if it resonates for you this week wonderful if

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it doesn't well you know I'll just keep marching forward and there it is it's

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it's just it's it's it's doing it because you want to express and you feel like

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you really do have something to say you found your calling and you're not doing

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it to collect the good opinion of others so many actors doing this are very

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00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:38,360
insecure they want attention there's a stereotype that actors are starved for

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00:39:38,360 --> 00:39:43,480
attention because ready most actors are starved for attention they were in a

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play in high school everyone clapped one night and took pictures and brought

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00:39:46,760 --> 00:39:49,080
them flowers it was the greatest night of their life and they've been chasing

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00:39:49,080 --> 00:39:55,800
that drug ever since and and okay but now back to my teacher Sandy would say

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get your ego out of your art most people are in this industry have a lot of ego

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and they're doing it because they want praise they want attention they want

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things again I'll quote my teacher one last time he said most people doing this

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just want some good reviews to send back to everyone back home in South Dakota to

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say see I told you I was special how true that is and so for me anyway my

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opinion that's not sustainable and it's certainly a crappy way to go through

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your dream in your life to try to prove everybody wrong and and to try to be

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validated you know that's you're trying to fill a fill a void in a wound that's

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a lot of art comes from pain I get that but I would rather heal my stuff and

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continue to say tell other stories that are healthier honestly yeah yeah that

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makes sense I have noticed how a lot of people are just drawn to the response

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like of others and how it's gonna be received by others but not enough on

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how they feel about it and yeah so that's definitely another really

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important teaching well those are all the questions I had for I have for you

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today but I wanted to thank you again for coming on because you were a really

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big part of my journey into of unmasking and becoming an advocate and

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00:41:32,000 --> 00:41:38,960
starting this podcast so I think it's very fitting that you are the guest for

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the 150th episode and yeah just thanks again you're welcome George I'm

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incredibly proud of you I watched you literally blossom through the training

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and certainly a good part portion of that was the genius of what Sanford

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00:41:57,880 --> 00:42:02,760
Meisner created there's no doubt but George you know you it was you you did

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the work and you hung in there and it's just been an absolute pleasure to watch

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you grow into your voice and your life's purpose and I know that this there'll be

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other things besides this but hell if this was the only thing you chose to do

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with it what a beautiful thing you're doing because I'm positive you're

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helping others find their voice too so again thank you for having me on and

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whatever I can do for you I'll always do thank you you got it pal thank you

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everyone for listening I hope you all enjoyed this episode and I'll see you

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all next time