WEBVTT 00:00:13.660 --> 00:00:16.420 Hello and welcome to Listen Up People, a podcast 00:00:16.420 --> 00:00:19.420 of the USC Suzanne Dworak-Peck School of Social 00:00:19.420 --> 00:00:22.120 Work. I'm Dr. Eric Rice, professor and associate 00:00:22.120 --> 00:00:24.820 dean for research. Today we're going to talk 00:00:24.820 --> 00:00:28.120 about social work and sports. Awareness of the 00:00:28.120 --> 00:00:30.179 connection between physical and emotional health 00:00:30.179 --> 00:00:33.450 has grown in recent years. Sports can serve as 00:00:33.450 --> 00:00:35.810 a protective factor for at -risk populations 00:00:35.810 --> 00:00:38.450 from elementary school to professionals. Yet 00:00:38.450 --> 00:00:40.929 despite these benefits, elite collegiate athletes 00:00:40.929 --> 00:00:43.549 display higher risk of anxiety, depression, and 00:00:43.549 --> 00:00:46.609 suicidal ideation than their peers. My guests 00:00:46.609 --> 00:00:49.310 are part of a faculty group that collaborated 00:00:49.310 --> 00:00:52.130 to create a new course at USC that aims to demonstrate 00:00:52.130 --> 00:00:54.770 how the integration of social work and sports 00:00:54.770 --> 00:00:57.969 can promote well -being, inclusivity, personal 00:00:57.969 --> 00:01:00.990 growth, and foster positive change within individuals' 00:01:01.390 --> 00:01:03.649 communities. and society. I'd like to welcome 00:01:03.649 --> 00:01:06.590 my two guests, Dr. Steve Hydon, teaching professor 00:01:06.590 --> 00:01:09.569 of practicum education and the director of social 00:01:09.569 --> 00:01:12.530 work in schools, and Dr. Aimee Odette, associate 00:01:12.530 --> 00:01:15.010 teaching professor. Both have extensive experience 00:01:15.010 --> 00:01:17.310 working with children in school settings as well 00:01:17.310 --> 00:01:19.409 as personal passions for the role that sports 00:01:19.409 --> 00:01:22.810 and exercise can play in mental health and wellness. 00:01:22.989 --> 00:01:25.430 It's great to have you both here. I would love 00:01:25.430 --> 00:01:29.280 to start off with a question to get more into 00:01:29.280 --> 00:01:31.519 something personal before I dive into your new 00:01:31.519 --> 00:01:34.459 program and your course, which is, okay, social 00:01:34.459 --> 00:01:36.959 work and sports is not necessarily two words 00:01:36.959 --> 00:01:39.620 that people put together too frequently. I guess, 00:01:39.819 --> 00:01:41.980 well, social work is two words itself. So three 00:01:41.980 --> 00:01:44.540 words people put together. So Aimee I'll turn 00:01:44.540 --> 00:01:46.340 to you first and then I'll turn to Steve. How 00:01:46.340 --> 00:01:48.439 did you get involved in bringing social work 00:01:48.439 --> 00:01:51.180 and sports together? Specifically for the course, 00:01:51.739 --> 00:01:55.099 Steve invited me to be a part of the development 00:01:55.099 --> 00:01:59.879 of it. But for me, I have been a student athlete 00:01:59.879 --> 00:02:03.709 for as long as I can remember. elementary school, 00:02:03.890 --> 00:02:06.609 middle school, high school up until college. 00:02:06.730 --> 00:02:09.189 So it was something that was very much a big 00:02:09.189 --> 00:02:12.569 part of my life. I also have three boys. They're 00:02:12.569 --> 00:02:15.250 not really boys anymore. They're young men who 00:02:15.250 --> 00:02:18.710 all spent time playing sports. And I have one 00:02:18.710 --> 00:02:23.009 who is a collegiate athlete right now. So I see 00:02:23.009 --> 00:02:27.759 the impact that sports. can have on an individual. 00:02:27.860 --> 00:02:31.139 And I think that we as social workers have an 00:02:31.139 --> 00:02:34.680 amazing opportunity to have an impact on athletics. 00:02:35.020 --> 00:02:38.219 Cool, cool. So Steve, how did you get into this 00:02:38.219 --> 00:02:40.300 space? Yeah, very similar. Thanks for the question, 00:02:40.300 --> 00:02:43.080 Eric, and good to see you both. And I too was 00:02:43.080 --> 00:02:45.800 a scholastic athlete. You could not keep me indoors. 00:02:45.819 --> 00:02:48.919 I was outside all the time, whether it was cross 00:02:48.919 --> 00:02:51.939 -country running or track or soccer or hoops. 00:02:52.099 --> 00:02:55.039 It was just sort of a love of mine. And then 00:02:55.039 --> 00:02:57.419 for the last few years, been kind of moving into 00:02:57.419 --> 00:03:01.900 this space around athletics and sports and mental 00:03:01.900 --> 00:03:05.189 health and resilience and social work. I'm privileged 00:03:05.189 --> 00:03:08.509 enough to be on a university committee, the USAC 00:03:08.509 --> 00:03:10.969 committee, which looks at sort of faculty and 00:03:10.969 --> 00:03:13.909 staff and relationships with collegiate athletes. 00:03:13.990 --> 00:03:16.509 And that's been eye opening for me. And then 00:03:16.509 --> 00:03:19.509 our former president of the university sort of 00:03:19.509 --> 00:03:21.330 launched these moonshots. And one of them was 00:03:21.330 --> 00:03:23.909 around sports and well -being and kind of that 00:03:23.909 --> 00:03:27.050 being an outward facing type of program. And 00:03:27.050 --> 00:03:30.099 so I... worked with some colleagues at our school 00:03:30.099 --> 00:03:32.379 and we just started to think about well what 00:03:32.379 --> 00:03:34.780 is sports and social work and this is not a new 00:03:34.780 --> 00:03:37.719 phenomenon it's actually a space that's been 00:03:37.719 --> 00:03:40.680 out there nationally for many many years and 00:03:40.680 --> 00:03:43.240 so we thought well I think we're primed and positioned 00:03:43.240 --> 00:03:46.719 here in the heart of Los Angeles which is a primary 00:03:46.719 --> 00:03:50.080 hub for sports to sort of move into the direction 00:03:50.080 --> 00:03:52.819 of looking at wellness of athletes and their 00:03:52.819 --> 00:03:55.439 resilience and their mental health. And being 00:03:55.439 --> 00:03:57.500 a school of social work, we felt like we had 00:03:57.500 --> 00:03:59.979 a lot of expertise to lend to this discipline. 00:04:00.479 --> 00:04:02.400 So yeah, that's how I got into it. And I'm so 00:04:02.400 --> 00:04:04.419 glad I made, I made that choice a few years ago. 00:04:04.639 --> 00:04:05.680 That's great. It's great to hear that you both 00:04:05.680 --> 00:04:08.479 have this personal connection, not only as social 00:04:08.479 --> 00:04:11.120 workers, but also as having had history of being 00:04:11.120 --> 00:04:13.439 athletes. And Steve, one of the things you mentioned 00:04:13.439 --> 00:04:17.339 there at the end was the mental health and wellbeing 00:04:17.339 --> 00:04:20.680 and, and student athletes. And I think there's 00:04:20.459 --> 00:04:22.600 There's been some high profile collegiate student 00:04:22.600 --> 00:04:24.740 athletes that have begun to speak openly about 00:04:24.740 --> 00:04:27.439 mental health struggles. And I guess the question 00:04:27.439 --> 00:04:31.660 here is how is it that social work in particular 00:04:31.660 --> 00:04:34.600 might be able to help athletes to not suffer 00:04:34.600 --> 00:04:38.879 in silence? Yeah, I'm so glad that we do have 00:04:38.879 --> 00:04:41.040 athletes that have come out publicly on what 00:04:41.040 --> 00:04:43.939 they've been experiencing. It kind of confirms 00:04:43.939 --> 00:04:46.949 the need. and validates what we're trying to 00:04:46.949 --> 00:04:50.689 build here at the School of Social Work. I think 00:04:50.689 --> 00:04:53.610 because of the expertise we have, we sort of 00:04:53.610 --> 00:04:58.170 have positioned ourselves to embrace those conditions 00:04:58.170 --> 00:05:00.910 that athletes face, whether it's mental health, 00:05:01.110 --> 00:05:04.149 whether it's substance abuse, performance anxiety, 00:05:04.870 --> 00:05:07.970 isolation, bullying, all these different sort 00:05:07.970 --> 00:05:11.540 of ways that athletes experience. these conditions 00:05:11.540 --> 00:05:15.019 and I think our role is to, as you suggested, 00:05:15.319 --> 00:05:18.160 sort of bring out their voice, highlight why 00:05:18.160 --> 00:05:21.620 there's a special attention specifically to athletes. 00:05:21.949 --> 00:05:24.949 that social workers can fulfill. A lot of the 00:05:24.949 --> 00:05:27.189 individuals as we started to talk about this 00:05:27.189 --> 00:05:29.230 initiative and whether it was with colleagues 00:05:29.230 --> 00:05:31.769 like Aimee and Professor Rafael Angulo, who was 00:05:31.769 --> 00:05:34.209 also instrumental in the development of the course, 00:05:34.290 --> 00:05:37.110 and many other colleagues. I also talked with 00:05:37.110 --> 00:05:39.790 external colleagues of mine across the country 00:05:39.790 --> 00:05:43.170 about they were once athletes or they had to, 00:05:43.389 --> 00:05:45.310 Dr. Odette's point, they have children who are 00:05:45.310 --> 00:05:47.170 athletes. I've talked to school districts who 00:05:47.170 --> 00:05:49.189 have said, yeah, I've seen that in our school 00:05:49.189 --> 00:05:52.160 campuses. And so thank you. for addressing this 00:05:52.160 --> 00:05:54.339 and bringing kind of some attention to this very 00:05:54.339 --> 00:05:57.899 needed area of practice. So yeah, I think that's 00:05:57.899 --> 00:06:00.839 one of the goals of ours is to, again, allow 00:06:00.839 --> 00:06:03.459 athletes to feel comfortable expressing who they 00:06:03.459 --> 00:06:05.699 are and what they're going through and how we 00:06:05.699 --> 00:06:08.980 can help them get through their day -to -day 00:06:08.980 --> 00:06:12.600 sort of progress. I think, and I don't want this 00:06:12.600 --> 00:06:15.660 to come out wrong or sound like I'm downplaying 00:06:15.660 --> 00:06:19.480 a high -profile athlete coming out and saying 00:06:19.480 --> 00:06:22.629 that I've struck with this, but there is a certain 00:06:22.629 --> 00:06:25.589 level of privilege to be able to do that. And 00:06:25.589 --> 00:06:29.329 I think that where we can absolutely have an 00:06:29.329 --> 00:06:34.660 impact are those. local groups, the young kids 00:06:34.660 --> 00:06:37.720 within our communities that they don't have the 00:06:37.720 --> 00:06:42.220 resources. The coaches don't know how to have 00:06:42.220 --> 00:06:46.100 that conversation with the kids. I spoke just 00:06:46.100 --> 00:06:49.639 a moment ago, how I have a son who is, he's playing 00:06:49.639 --> 00:06:53.759 collegiate baseball and he is at a very, a school 00:06:53.759 --> 00:06:56.199 that has a lot of resources. And he was excited. 00:06:56.379 --> 00:06:58.680 He said, mom, we've got a mental health professional 00:06:58.680 --> 00:07:01.389 coming to talk to us at the beginning. a fall 00:07:01.389 --> 00:07:03.730 ball, but the conversation was, hey, I'm here 00:07:03.730 --> 00:07:07.930 if you need anything. And that to me, I mean, 00:07:07.930 --> 00:07:09.790 it's great that they know that there's somebody 00:07:09.790 --> 00:07:12.509 there, but that doesn't help them have the conversation. 00:07:12.509 --> 00:07:15.689 And I think that's where this course and what 00:07:15.689 --> 00:07:19.449 we're doing can help people kind of get us integrated 00:07:19.449 --> 00:07:22.350 to help folks have the conversation. That's such 00:07:22.350 --> 00:07:25.149 an interesting point. I think mental health and 00:07:25.149 --> 00:07:27.170 struggling with mental health is still this taboo 00:07:27.170 --> 00:07:30.230 topic for lots and lots and lots of communities. 00:07:30.550 --> 00:07:34.410 And are you envisioning this course and sports 00:07:34.410 --> 00:07:38.370 as a way of helping break down some of those 00:07:38.370 --> 00:07:41.290 barriers? Is this part of the mission as well, 00:07:41.370 --> 00:07:43.610 other than just reaching out to athletes who 00:07:43.610 --> 00:07:46.250 may be suffering, but also the power of sports 00:07:46.250 --> 00:07:51.709 as a vehicle to engage communities? Well, so 00:07:51.709 --> 00:07:55.410 I can start here then Aimee I'm sure we'll share. 00:07:55.689 --> 00:07:57.990 And that is one of the things that Aimee said was 00:07:57.990 --> 00:08:01.189 how do coaches talk with their athletes? And 00:08:01.189 --> 00:08:03.870 I think part of that is teaching language and 00:08:03.870 --> 00:08:06.930 vocabulary. And that's experiencing some of these 00:08:06.930 --> 00:08:09.430 conditions is a very real thing. And we're not 00:08:09.430 --> 00:08:12.850 talking about sort of athletes who, yes, the 00:08:12.850 --> 00:08:15.230 elite and the privileged, but also athletes that 00:08:15.230 --> 00:08:18.449 are sort of hard to reach and hard to encourage 00:08:18.449 --> 00:08:21.860 to want to talk. Oftentimes, coaches are role 00:08:21.860 --> 00:08:24.100 models. Whether we want to believe that or not, 00:08:24.339 --> 00:08:27.360 they are. And so athletes look up to them. And 00:08:27.360 --> 00:08:31.899 they look to them to be led in particular directions 00:08:31.899 --> 00:08:36.100 or in particular pathways. And so one of the 00:08:36.100 --> 00:08:39.240 assignments in the course, and I'm so excited 00:08:39.240 --> 00:08:41.200 that we're going to be talking about this, is 00:08:41.200 --> 00:08:43.679 that students have to actually interview a coach. 00:08:43.980 --> 00:08:47.659 and interview the coach and what is their idea 00:08:47.659 --> 00:08:50.120 of mental health? How do you address mental health 00:08:50.120 --> 00:08:53.059 in your facilities, on your on your playgrounds, 00:08:53.059 --> 00:08:56.600 in your fields? And surprisingly, which is a 00:08:56.600 --> 00:08:58.860 really good thing, we've learned that there are 00:08:58.860 --> 00:09:01.960 coaches that have some awareness of these conditions. 00:09:02.340 --> 00:09:04.720 They believe in mental health. They believe in 00:09:04.720 --> 00:09:06.840 mindfulness engagement. They believe in open 00:09:06.840 --> 00:09:09.720 door policies. So they may not have the in -depth 00:09:09.720 --> 00:09:13.460 knowledge of how to address mental health conditions 00:09:13.460 --> 00:09:15.860 the way a social worker would do. They certainly 00:09:15.860 --> 00:09:18.399 have an awareness that I think has come along. 00:09:18.679 --> 00:09:21.200 Over the last few years, and so there's almost 00:09:21.200 --> 00:09:23.639 this sort of, yep, I understand that this is 00:09:23.639 --> 00:09:25.960 something that we want to embrace and I'm glad 00:09:25.960 --> 00:09:28.500 that I can work with a mental health or school 00:09:28.500 --> 00:09:31.460 social worker, somebody who I can refer my athlete 00:09:31.460 --> 00:09:35.639 to. But yes, certainly encourage that and it's 00:09:35.639 --> 00:09:38.139 not about. toughen up and just, you know, get 00:09:38.139 --> 00:09:40.279 through what you need to get through, not at 00:09:40.279 --> 00:09:42.559 all. The conversations that our students have 00:09:42.559 --> 00:09:44.840 had with the coaches that they've identified 00:09:44.840 --> 00:09:47.759 have been pretty positive. And that was really 00:09:47.759 --> 00:09:50.799 refreshing to see. That's great. Amy, do you 00:09:50.799 --> 00:09:53.409 want to add to that? I would like to add to that, 00:09:53.549 --> 00:09:56.090 please. You know, we need to meet people where 00:09:56.090 --> 00:09:59.350 they're at. That is not a new concept in social 00:09:59.350 --> 00:10:01.269 work, either. And that's something that we teach 00:10:01.269 --> 00:10:04.610 Social Work 101. Meet people where they are at. 00:10:04.929 --> 00:10:09.149 And so I think with social work and sports, it's 00:10:09.149 --> 00:10:11.480 meeting them on the playing field. meeting them 00:10:11.480 --> 00:10:14.500 in parks, meeting them at their dance class, 00:10:14.580 --> 00:10:17.740 meeting them in yoga, meeting them where they 00:10:17.740 --> 00:10:22.200 are naturally coming together as a community. 00:10:22.600 --> 00:10:26.360 I think that there is a misconception about who 00:10:26.360 --> 00:10:29.860 we are as a profession. I think today, if you 00:10:29.860 --> 00:10:31.779 still ask people, what does a social worker do? 00:10:32.440 --> 00:10:34.519 Aren't those the people that take kids out of 00:10:34.519 --> 00:10:37.899 people's homes and that kind of thing? So I think 00:10:37.899 --> 00:10:41.330 we have such an opportunity here to show our 00:10:41.330 --> 00:10:45.710 strengths as community organizers by being in 00:10:45.710 --> 00:10:49.950 our communities where folks are at. And so I 00:10:49.950 --> 00:10:55.250 think then that also takes some of that taboo 00:10:55.250 --> 00:10:59.110 away around or the stereotype or the shame around 00:10:59.110 --> 00:11:02.629 mental health, mental wellness, so. But I love 00:11:02.629 --> 00:11:05.059 what you're saying here too, which is that. It's 00:11:05.059 --> 00:11:08.059 also an opportunity for social workers to do 00:11:08.059 --> 00:11:10.139 a little bit of, for lack of a better way of 00:11:10.139 --> 00:11:15.000 putting it, PR around what it is that we as social 00:11:15.000 --> 00:11:19.820 workers in our profession do. And have you been 00:11:19.820 --> 00:11:23.960 experiencing... a positive reception in communities 00:11:23.960 --> 00:11:26.919 when you are approaching these sports teams and 00:11:26.919 --> 00:11:30.519 athletes as a social worker? So I know that our 00:11:30.519 --> 00:11:32.519 students have, and to Amy's point, which was 00:11:32.519 --> 00:11:34.919 a great one, and that is, again, part of that 00:11:34.919 --> 00:11:36.980 assignment is to not only interview a coach, 00:11:37.299 --> 00:11:40.539 but to actually go to a park recreational facility, 00:11:40.860 --> 00:11:43.480 a rec center, and observe. What do you see? How 00:11:43.480 --> 00:11:45.440 do you see people interacting? How do you see 00:11:45.440 --> 00:11:50.240 the community embracing sports? We do something 00:11:50.240 --> 00:11:53.299 that we call a windshield survey, where they 00:11:53.299 --> 00:11:55.759 literally go out in their cars, if they have 00:11:55.759 --> 00:11:58.580 one, okay, any motor transportation, and they 00:11:58.580 --> 00:12:00.620 compare and contrast two different neighborhoods 00:12:00.620 --> 00:12:02.679 with two different recreational and park settings, 00:12:02.919 --> 00:12:04.940 and then they interview individuals that are 00:12:04.940 --> 00:12:07.659 in those neighborhoods. And again, overwhelmingly, 00:12:08.220 --> 00:12:10.799 the response has been positive, people have embraced. 00:12:11.039 --> 00:12:14.120 individuals, they've shown support, they've said 00:12:14.120 --> 00:12:17.039 come back and let us know how this class has 00:12:17.039 --> 00:12:19.919 been moving for you. So that's really been wonderful. 00:12:20.120 --> 00:12:22.159 The other thing that's super exciting is that 00:12:22.159 --> 00:12:24.659 there's a National Alliance for Social Work and 00:12:24.659 --> 00:12:27.059 Sports, which has been around I want to say for 00:12:27.059 --> 00:12:29.539 about 10 to 15 years. I know it's a bit of a 00:12:29.539 --> 00:12:33.440 large window, but they're solely dedicated. to 00:12:33.440 --> 00:12:36.700 this profession of sport and social work? And 00:12:36.700 --> 00:12:39.759 how are professional teams? So NBA teams are 00:12:39.759 --> 00:12:41.480 required to have mental health staff. I've got 00:12:41.480 --> 00:12:43.299 a lot of individuals who have reached out to 00:12:43.299 --> 00:12:46.960 say, I'm a social worker for an NFL team. And 00:12:46.960 --> 00:12:50.049 so hockey teams, if you look at. some of these 00:12:50.049 --> 00:12:52.990 sports where there is violence there's unfortunately 00:12:52.990 --> 00:12:56.129 domestic violence there's substance use there's 00:12:56.129 --> 00:12:59.950 a need for this profession to be in these spaces 00:12:59.950 --> 00:13:02.409 and to bring attention to it not in a shaming 00:13:02.409 --> 00:13:05.210 way but more in a helpful approach and that's 00:13:05.210 --> 00:13:08.009 what's really exciting about getting into this 00:13:08.009 --> 00:13:10.289 profession that this is not something again like 00:13:10.289 --> 00:13:12.870 I mentioned earlier it's not new it's something 00:13:12.870 --> 00:13:14.830 that's going to be around for a while and we're 00:13:14.830 --> 00:13:17.470 glad to be a part of it again especially since 00:13:17.789 --> 00:13:20.210 We're at the heart of many huge events that are 00:13:20.210 --> 00:13:22.350 coming up with the World Cup and the Olympics 00:13:22.350 --> 00:13:25.389 and the Super Bowl and all these wonderful activities. 00:13:25.570 --> 00:13:28.370 Why not be involved? How can you not get excited 00:13:28.370 --> 00:13:32.409 about it? USC has a small reputation of being 00:13:32.409 --> 00:13:37.149 a decent place to be a student athlete. So I 00:13:37.149 --> 00:13:41.490 think it's only appropriate that you all are 00:13:41.490 --> 00:13:43.710 starting a program where you're really bringing 00:13:43.710 --> 00:13:47.419 social work into an appropriate visibility. as 00:13:47.419 --> 00:13:50.100 a helping profession around mental health and 00:13:50.100 --> 00:13:53.259 behavioral health issues. Like Steve and Aimee, 00:13:53.279 --> 00:13:56.600 you both have mentioned the good work that social 00:13:56.600 --> 00:13:58.700 workers can do in these communities. I want to 00:13:58.700 --> 00:14:01.399 turn a minute for our listeners to be able to 00:14:01.399 --> 00:14:03.320 hear a little bit more about this course that 00:14:03.320 --> 00:14:07.299 you've started. You've alluded to these... cool 00:14:07.299 --> 00:14:10.159 assignments where you're sending students out 00:14:10.159 --> 00:14:13.519 into the community to really see where are people 00:14:13.519 --> 00:14:17.059 at, as Aimee pointed out. But can you talk a little 00:14:17.059 --> 00:14:19.960 bit about the process of creating this course? 00:14:20.139 --> 00:14:22.000 And really, I think the thing that's most exciting 00:14:22.000 --> 00:14:24.240 to me is what is the student reception been? 00:14:24.360 --> 00:14:26.600 I mean, perfect. Yeah, sure. I mean, so what 00:14:26.600 --> 00:14:31.139 happened was a few years ago, myself, Aimee, and 00:14:31.139 --> 00:14:34.460 I mentioned Rafael Angulo a little bit earlier. 00:14:35.320 --> 00:14:38.240 we said, you know, let's think about what a course 00:14:38.240 --> 00:14:40.500 in an elective would look like. And what's one 00:14:40.500 --> 00:14:42.620 of the first goals was to look at what's already 00:14:42.620 --> 00:14:44.620 being offered in other schools. So we're not 00:14:44.620 --> 00:14:47.139 replicating that or maybe we're filling in some 00:14:47.139 --> 00:14:48.980 gaps. And so that was the first kind of mini 00:14:48.980 --> 00:14:51.840 lit review. And then we came together and we 00:14:51.840 --> 00:14:54.289 literally just sat down and said, okay. It's 00:14:54.289 --> 00:14:58.090 a 15 unit course. Amy, you take a few weeks. 00:14:58.190 --> 00:15:00.090 I'll take a few weeks. Rafael, you take a few 00:15:00.090 --> 00:15:02.870 weeks. But what's important to us? And we didn't 00:15:02.870 --> 00:15:05.450 want the course to focus on one particular athlete. 00:15:05.570 --> 00:15:08.570 We wanted to focus on the lifespan of an athlete. 00:15:08.970 --> 00:15:11.610 So scholastic, collegiate, professional, older 00:15:11.610 --> 00:15:14.649 adults. We had a lot of fun building out this 00:15:14.649 --> 00:15:18.029 course, looking at women's rights, looking at 00:15:18.029 --> 00:15:20.879 mental health interventions. looking at substance 00:15:20.879 --> 00:15:24.240 use, looking at the mentality of an athlete, 00:15:24.620 --> 00:15:26.720 what happens when you're injured or sports is 00:15:26.720 --> 00:15:29.059 no longer part of your DNA, then what happens 00:15:29.059 --> 00:15:31.100 and how do you deal with some of that isolation 00:15:31.100 --> 00:15:33.340 and maybe even depression that might sit in. 00:15:33.720 --> 00:15:37.120 When you look at the protective factors of sports 00:15:37.120 --> 00:15:40.269 and why it could be a good thing. that you're 00:15:40.269 --> 00:15:44.309 involved in sport activities. So we kind of, 00:15:44.309 --> 00:15:46.610 we had a lot of fun also with like the titles. 00:15:46.909 --> 00:15:49.529 So like Friday Night Lights is a title. The Mamba 00:15:49.529 --> 00:15:52.710 Mentality is a title. There's No Crying in Baseball. 00:15:52.769 --> 00:15:55.029 That's one of the titles of the units. We're 00:15:55.029 --> 00:15:57.909 all familiar with that Tom Hanks movie. And so 00:15:57.909 --> 00:16:00.450 we just got a lot of fun with that. And I think 00:16:00.450 --> 00:16:03.299 that captured a lot of the interest. From students, 00:16:03.580 --> 00:16:05.580 I literally said to students their very first 00:16:05.580 --> 00:16:07.700 class, which was the first time we taught this 00:16:07.700 --> 00:16:09.820 class was last spring and the very first class 00:16:09.820 --> 00:16:11.559 again. So it would have been in January. And 00:16:11.559 --> 00:16:13.379 I said, why did you sign up for this course? 00:16:13.539 --> 00:16:15.100 You know, just be honest with me. And we actually 00:16:15.100 --> 00:16:17.460 had over enrollment, which was really exciting. 00:16:17.600 --> 00:16:19.899 And a good percentage of the students said, you 00:16:19.899 --> 00:16:22.340 know, I was a student athlete and I experienced 00:16:22.340 --> 00:16:25.139 some of these conditions and I didn't know that 00:16:25.139 --> 00:16:26.840 there was somebody out there I could talk to. 00:16:27.019 --> 00:16:28.820 Oftentimes it was a high school guidance counselor 00:16:28.820 --> 00:16:31.019 and they were great, but they didn't always. 00:16:31.479 --> 00:16:34.000 provide what they would need it. And so students 00:16:34.000 --> 00:16:36.299 signed up to say I just never thought about this 00:16:36.299 --> 00:16:38.840 marriage between sport and social work so that 00:16:38.840 --> 00:16:41.000 just got me excited. A couple other students 00:16:41.000 --> 00:16:42.899 said it just sounded cool and there was nothing 00:16:42.899 --> 00:16:45.019 else left to take. I'm like all right that's 00:16:45.019 --> 00:16:48.789 cool. By the time our class was over we had guest 00:16:48.789 --> 00:16:51.509 speakers. We had students engaged in debates. 00:16:51.809 --> 00:16:54.909 We had students engaged in hot topics. We had 00:16:54.909 --> 00:16:58.409 students create podcasts like this. We had students 00:16:58.409 --> 00:17:01.289 create motivational speeches. So they literally 00:17:01.289 --> 00:17:04.309 would set the stage and say, OK, I'm a coach 00:17:04.309 --> 00:17:06.410 in the middle of an auditorium and I'm getting 00:17:06.410 --> 00:17:09.450 all my guys ready or girls ready to kind of warm 00:17:09.450 --> 00:17:11.849 up and get ready to go out and play. So that 00:17:11.849 --> 00:17:13.630 was a lot of fun. The students gave each other 00:17:13.630 --> 00:17:16.440 feedback. So we really kind of did this. flip 00:17:16.440 --> 00:17:19.619 design style of teaching where the students did 00:17:19.619 --> 00:17:22.640 all the activities and they shared and they enjoyed 00:17:22.640 --> 00:17:25.519 and then they were able to kind of see while 00:17:25.519 --> 00:17:27.799 they brought the breadth and depth of social 00:17:27.799 --> 00:17:30.359 work and sports and in my last class and I'll 00:17:30.359 --> 00:17:32.099 stop talking so I know Amy has some thoughts 00:17:32.099 --> 00:17:34.480 the very last class I said listen you're going 00:17:34.480 --> 00:17:36.160 to get an evaluation and you're going to fill 00:17:36.160 --> 00:17:38.160 that out and that's wonderful I want to see that 00:17:38.160 --> 00:17:40.829 but I'd like to get some I'd like to solicit 00:17:40.829 --> 00:17:43.069 some of your feedback now so I can begin to jot 00:17:43.069 --> 00:17:45.309 down some ideas that we can think about moving 00:17:45.309 --> 00:17:48.190 forward. So overall sort of how was this experience 00:17:48.190 --> 00:17:50.970 for you? And overwhelmingly students love the 00:17:50.970 --> 00:17:53.690 course, they love the idea, you changed my whole 00:17:53.690 --> 00:17:57.410 paradigm and like shift in how I look at athletes 00:17:57.410 --> 00:18:00.089 and sports and why social work is so important. 00:18:00.380 --> 00:18:02.319 I started off the class not really knowing what 00:18:02.319 --> 00:18:04.880 to get, but I was, you know, okay, I was intrigued. 00:18:05.220 --> 00:18:08.500 And they left the class feeling much more empowered 00:18:08.500 --> 00:18:12.259 with how they look at this field. There are jobs 00:18:12.259 --> 00:18:14.539 out there that I forwarded to students, whether 00:18:14.539 --> 00:18:17.059 they're in athletic departments or sport facilities. 00:18:17.480 --> 00:18:19.240 And then we got some really good feedback about, 00:18:19.460 --> 00:18:21.799 hey, it would be great to actually have one class 00:18:21.799 --> 00:18:24.740 hybrid and go to a community center on like a 00:18:24.740 --> 00:18:27.079 Saturday. And let's actually see people who are 00:18:27.079 --> 00:18:28.900 doing this work. And I thought that was great. 00:18:29.220 --> 00:18:30.880 And then one of the areas, there was a couple 00:18:30.880 --> 00:18:32.980 other areas and another one was on this whole 00:18:32.980 --> 00:18:35.180 changing landscape of name, image and likeness. 00:18:35.180 --> 00:18:39.059 And how are we looking at students who are using 00:18:39.059 --> 00:18:43.019 that for whatever you believe in to their advantage. 00:18:43.160 --> 00:18:45.579 And so that was an area that. I'm going to work 00:18:45.579 --> 00:18:47.799 on so that we can weave that into the conversation. 00:18:47.980 --> 00:18:50.619 Keeping up with the very, very cutting edge of 00:18:50.619 --> 00:18:53.359 what's happening in student sports. Amy, do you 00:18:53.359 --> 00:18:55.039 have anything you want to add about the design 00:18:55.039 --> 00:18:58.480 of the class? Just quickly, when we first got 00:18:58.480 --> 00:19:02.420 together to do this, you have your ideas on things 00:19:02.420 --> 00:19:04.960 that you think you want to have in the course 00:19:04.960 --> 00:19:06.420 or things that you know that you want to have 00:19:06.420 --> 00:19:09.339 in the course. I think what was amazing as we 00:19:09.339 --> 00:19:13.279 continue to talk was how many things we could 00:19:13.279 --> 00:19:16.640 have incorporated into the course that we even 00:19:16.640 --> 00:19:19.380 said, gosh, we could have a whole other course 00:19:19.380 --> 00:19:24.160 filled. And just how the dynamic between sports 00:19:24.160 --> 00:19:29.680 and athletics can be such a wonderful, powerful 00:19:29.680 --> 00:19:33.019 dynamic force in an athlete's or an individual's 00:19:33.019 --> 00:19:35.880 life, but how there is the flip side too. And 00:19:35.880 --> 00:19:40.160 how it can absolutely be a part of maybe even 00:19:40.160 --> 00:19:44.019 leading down a path that a student didn't want 00:19:44.019 --> 00:19:47.079 to in terms of impacting their mental health 00:19:47.079 --> 00:19:50.220 in a negative way. So I think that we tried to 00:19:50.220 --> 00:19:53.480 touch on as many things as we could and we didn't 00:19:53.480 --> 00:19:55.279 sugarcoat it. Yeah, I know that's that's that's 00:19:55.279 --> 00:19:56.900 really powerful. Go ahead, Steve. And I was going 00:19:56.900 --> 00:19:59.799 to know I agree 100 % what Amy's saying. The 00:19:59.799 --> 00:20:02.269 other thing is this. Word has gotten out. I literally 00:20:02.269 --> 00:20:04.630 just got an email this morning from someone at 00:20:04.630 --> 00:20:06.829 another institution who wants to meet with me 00:20:06.829 --> 00:20:09.309 to talk about, hey, I heard you've got this really 00:20:09.309 --> 00:20:11.789 cool sports course. We're thinking about something 00:20:11.789 --> 00:20:14.109 similar. Would you mind meeting with me to talk 00:20:14.109 --> 00:20:15.730 about it? And I'm like, yeah, of course. Like, 00:20:15.730 --> 00:20:17.210 let's talk about it. I've shared the syllabus 00:20:17.210 --> 00:20:20.190 with other colleagues. So we're starting to get 00:20:20.190 --> 00:20:22.710 out there that people are aware that we're launching 00:20:22.710 --> 00:20:26.130 this initiative. And I mentioned earlier a little 00:20:26.130 --> 00:20:27.990 bit about the Alliance for Social Work and Sports. 00:20:28.029 --> 00:20:31.319 That is one of our next things. annual symposium. 00:20:31.619 --> 00:20:33.640 We've spent three years working with their board 00:20:33.640 --> 00:20:36.099 and next year they're bringing the alliance here 00:20:36.099 --> 00:20:39.579 to Los Angeles and USC for their annual symposium. 00:20:40.059 --> 00:20:42.720 So super excited to highlight and profile all 00:20:42.720 --> 00:20:45.400 the wonderful work that we're building in this 00:20:45.400 --> 00:20:48.640 area. Is this something that is only available 00:20:48.640 --> 00:20:50.740 to social work students? I know the focus is 00:20:50.740 --> 00:20:53.059 on social work and sports or is this something 00:20:53.059 --> 00:20:56.759 that is more broadly open to students at USC? 00:20:57.259 --> 00:20:59.960 I really don't know. Broadly open to to any student 00:20:59.960 --> 00:21:01.700 who is interested in taking the course. You can 00:21:01.700 --> 00:21:03.579 be a graduate student and then there are some 00:21:03.579 --> 00:21:05.819 undergraduate students that are eligible to take 00:21:05.819 --> 00:21:09.450 graduate courses. We only lost it for the first 00:21:09.450 --> 00:21:11.809 time in the spring, so we had 19 of our current 00:21:11.809 --> 00:21:15.049 MSW students. But yes, it's open to anybody who's 00:21:15.049 --> 00:21:18.150 interested in taking the course and that included. 00:21:18.170 --> 00:21:20.150 Did you see people from other departments or 00:21:20.150 --> 00:21:22.130 other schools that were trying to get in? I know 00:21:22.130 --> 00:21:24.890 you said you had an overflow. I did see people 00:21:24.890 --> 00:21:28.029 from outside schools yet, but I have seen a few 00:21:28.029 --> 00:21:31.180 people who reached out who aren't at USC. I see 00:21:31.180 --> 00:21:32.839 can you tell me a little bit more about this 00:21:32.839 --> 00:21:34.799 course and kind of what you're doing over there? 00:21:35.019 --> 00:21:37.400 Is there an opportunity for me to do that? So 00:21:37.400 --> 00:21:40.559 we've had the interest just have not enrolled 00:21:40.559 --> 00:21:43.900 yet. Some of those outside of our school students, 00:21:44.099 --> 00:21:46.640 but it's kind of hope is to absolutely do that 00:21:46.640 --> 00:21:48.759 though. Yeah, it's coming. It's coming. Yep. 00:21:48.980 --> 00:21:51.059 That's great. That's great. Something that you 00:21:51.059 --> 00:21:53.920 said. Amy i want to touch back on for just a 00:21:53.920 --> 00:21:56.819 second which was that you had said a lot of this 00:21:56.819 --> 00:22:00.160 course is focused on not sugar coating the the 00:22:00.160 --> 00:22:03.980 some of the issues around how student athletes 00:22:03.980 --> 00:22:07.599 may be encountering mental health issues or substance 00:22:07.599 --> 00:22:11.759 use issues but i also know that there is a pretty 00:22:12.000 --> 00:22:16.180 robust dialogue, especially in work on school 00:22:16.180 --> 00:22:19.480 age kids and adolescents that really talks about 00:22:19.480 --> 00:22:23.319 the benefits of sports. And is this part of the 00:22:23.319 --> 00:22:26.539 course as well? And if so, how do you talk about 00:22:26.539 --> 00:22:29.980 social work's role in that? Absolutely. I think 00:22:29.980 --> 00:22:35.400 that sports can be a tremendous positive influence. 00:22:35.920 --> 00:22:38.319 But go back to something that I said at the very 00:22:38.319 --> 00:22:41.299 beginning is that we have to educate people. 00:22:41.599 --> 00:22:44.940 I think that just given my experience personally, 00:22:45.079 --> 00:22:48.980 given my my kids experiences, I don't think coaches 00:22:48.980 --> 00:22:53.299 or they underestimate the impact that they have 00:22:53.299 --> 00:22:57.660 on their athletes on their team. And and maybe 00:22:57.660 --> 00:23:00.119 it's something in the way that it's well, this 00:23:00.119 --> 00:23:01.799 is the way that it's always done, or they have 00:23:01.799 --> 00:23:04.640 been doing their job for, you know, so many decades. 00:23:05.210 --> 00:23:09.910 there is an opportunity to educate on many levels 00:23:09.910 --> 00:23:14.470 because coaches. They are sometimes with our 00:23:14.470 --> 00:23:17.890 kids more hours than parents are, depending on 00:23:17.890 --> 00:23:22.069 what level of sport, you know, the athlete is 00:23:22.069 --> 00:23:26.750 at. I think also, too, that parents need education 00:23:26.750 --> 00:23:31.089 on their impact with their student, with their 00:23:31.089 --> 00:23:35.690 athlete, the things that we say. It's a huge 00:23:35.690 --> 00:23:38.690 piece of it. So, yes, we definitely talk about 00:23:38.690 --> 00:23:43.359 it as a protective factor, but I think there's 00:23:43.359 --> 00:23:46.059 a tremendous amount of education that needs to 00:23:46.059 --> 00:23:50.039 happen at various levels, depending on what league. 00:23:50.839 --> 00:23:52.980 Is it a school league? Is it a travel league? 00:23:53.460 --> 00:23:56.680 Is it a collegiate league? There needs to be 00:23:56.680 --> 00:24:00.500 that dialogue so that we're on the same page 00:24:00.500 --> 00:24:03.640 in terms of this isn't shameful to talk about 00:24:03.640 --> 00:24:07.440 your feelings. especially in certain sports. 00:24:07.680 --> 00:24:10.279 Well, I'm curious to ask a follow up to that 00:24:10.279 --> 00:24:12.720 question, but I'm going to pitch it over to Steve 00:24:12.720 --> 00:24:15.099 for a second, which is that I would imagine some 00:24:15.099 --> 00:24:17.039 of these students who come into this, especially 00:24:17.039 --> 00:24:19.390 since you said a lot of them. have backgrounds 00:24:19.390 --> 00:24:22.769 as athletes themselves. Is there perspective 00:24:22.769 --> 00:24:26.170 on taking this class and engaging in this more 00:24:26.170 --> 00:24:29.930 from a college and high school and other athletic 00:24:29.930 --> 00:24:32.789 experiences where these great things and I want 00:24:32.789 --> 00:24:35.529 to return to this or was it or has it been more 00:24:35.529 --> 00:24:38.690 of an experience of this is a complex and nuanced 00:24:38.690 --> 00:24:42.230 space and I want to explore that more. I'm just 00:24:42.230 --> 00:24:44.109 curious kind of where the headspace of your students 00:24:44.109 --> 00:24:47.109 is with respect to these this dynamics. I would 00:24:47.109 --> 00:24:49.450 say it's probably leans a little bit towards 00:24:49.450 --> 00:24:52.789 the latter, like this complex relationship between 00:24:52.789 --> 00:24:56.089 sports and athletes, between marginalized groups, 00:24:56.349 --> 00:24:59.829 vulnerable groups, how are we building up courage, 00:25:00.230 --> 00:25:04.049 bravery, teamwork, leadership, compassion, all 00:25:04.049 --> 00:25:06.789 these wonderful elements that we talk about in 00:25:06.789 --> 00:25:09.279 social work all the time. And how are we then 00:25:09.279 --> 00:25:11.680 bringing that to the surface through the vehicle 00:25:11.680 --> 00:25:14.240 of athletics? Yes, do they want to find perhaps 00:25:14.240 --> 00:25:16.500 jobs in those some of those other spaces that 00:25:16.500 --> 00:25:19.039 you mentioned? But I think it has been more about 00:25:19.039 --> 00:25:22.779 this complex dynamic between how can where do 00:25:22.779 --> 00:25:24.960 I fit in the role? Where's the role of social 00:25:24.960 --> 00:25:28.059 work? And why is there a need for social work 00:25:28.059 --> 00:25:30.740 specifically to be working with student athletes? 00:25:30.980 --> 00:25:34.230 I think. That's primarily where our students 00:25:34.230 --> 00:25:38.230 so far have been landing in thinking through 00:25:38.230 --> 00:25:41.430 these concepts, these ideologies, the literature, 00:25:41.650 --> 00:25:45.089 the research. And again, these assignments, it's 00:25:45.089 --> 00:25:47.289 interesting to think about assignments as exciting, 00:25:47.690 --> 00:25:51.220 but they kind of are. You're outdoors and you're 00:25:51.220 --> 00:25:53.279 doing things outside and you're kind of navigating 00:25:53.279 --> 00:25:56.700 all those complex, you know, areas that you then 00:25:56.700 --> 00:25:59.359 bring back to the classroom conversation. So 00:25:59.359 --> 00:26:01.960 there isn't like a final, there isn't a 20 page 00:26:01.960 --> 00:26:04.680 paper. These are all more experiential types 00:26:04.680 --> 00:26:08.200 of activities. that I think students have resonated 00:26:08.200 --> 00:26:11.380 with thus far. That's great. It sounds way better 00:26:11.380 --> 00:26:14.579 than sitting in front of a Zoom screen or maybe 00:26:14.579 --> 00:26:17.500 even sitting in a basement classroom that I've 00:26:17.500 --> 00:26:20.079 certainly taught some MSW courses in without 00:26:20.079 --> 00:26:21.980 windows. Not that those classes haven't been 00:26:21.980 --> 00:26:24.180 fabulous. No, no, no, of course. Of course they 00:26:24.180 --> 00:26:27.559 were. The windowless part is kind of rough sometimes. 00:26:27.740 --> 00:26:30.819 So being outdoors in spaces and where people 00:26:30.819 --> 00:26:33.420 are participating in sports sounds like a great 00:26:33.420 --> 00:26:36.700 experience for a student. Before we wrap up, 00:26:36.859 --> 00:26:39.720 I really want to give you each a chance to... 00:26:39.710 --> 00:26:42.970 talk about if there's anything in this work that 00:26:42.970 --> 00:26:44.869 has been meaningful to you that you really want 00:26:44.869 --> 00:26:46.930 to share with our listeners. I think that this 00:26:46.930 --> 00:26:49.009 has been such a great and lively conversation. 00:26:49.490 --> 00:26:51.670 We have a time for just a little bit of a wrap 00:26:51.670 --> 00:26:53.710 up. So maybe I'll turn to Aimee first and then 00:26:53.710 --> 00:26:56.269 Steve close it out. Is there anything that you 00:26:56.269 --> 00:26:59.049 would like our listeners to know about social 00:26:59.049 --> 00:27:01.029 work and sports in general that you haven't had 00:27:01.029 --> 00:27:03.690 a chance to talk about? You know, I think that 00:27:03.690 --> 00:27:07.000 initially some people might believe this is kind 00:27:07.000 --> 00:27:10.460 of an odd pairing or an oddball couple, but it 00:27:10.460 --> 00:27:13.240 really isn't. I was thinking about the course 00:27:13.240 --> 00:27:15.759 and I was thinking about, you know, some of the 00:27:15.759 --> 00:27:20.769 interventions that that we promote. within schools, 00:27:20.849 --> 00:27:23.269 one of them being social and emotional learning. 00:27:23.710 --> 00:27:25.430 As I was thinking about that, I was thinking 00:27:25.430 --> 00:27:29.089 about what an athlete experiences when they're 00:27:29.089 --> 00:27:32.170 a part of a team. And it absolutely lines up. 00:27:32.390 --> 00:27:36.230 If you think about what, you know, the five components 00:27:36.230 --> 00:27:39.490 of social, emotional learning, self -awareness, 00:27:39.589 --> 00:27:42.769 you know, learning, learning who you are in your 00:27:42.769 --> 00:27:45.509 environment, in your community, with your teammates, 00:27:46.009 --> 00:27:48.730 being able to self -manage, right? So you don't 00:27:48.730 --> 00:27:50.930 get the red card and get chucked out of the game 00:27:50.930 --> 00:27:55.930 or whatever it is, social awareness and relationship 00:27:55.930 --> 00:27:59.250 skills and responsible decision making. So the 00:27:59.250 --> 00:28:02.970 marriage really is a beautiful marriage that 00:28:02.970 --> 00:28:06.180 works really well. And I've said this to Steve 00:28:06.180 --> 00:28:08.319 a million times, this is just the beginning. 00:28:08.740 --> 00:28:10.259 Well, Steve, you want to take us home? Got some 00:28:10.259 --> 00:28:12.880 thoughts for us? Well, I'll just say this, that 00:28:12.880 --> 00:28:15.380 not a two or three week window goes by where 00:28:15.380 --> 00:28:18.359 I don't get something via email from a colleague 00:28:18.359 --> 00:28:21.180 who says, here's an article, here's a story, 00:28:21.559 --> 00:28:24.880 here's a publication. here's a podcast. And that's 00:28:24.880 --> 00:28:27.319 to Aimee's point, there's so much out there that 00:28:27.319 --> 00:28:29.819 we easily could begin to already start thinking 00:28:29.819 --> 00:28:32.980 about another course, a certificate in this area 00:28:32.980 --> 00:28:35.839 that I think is our future direction. And then 00:28:35.839 --> 00:28:38.039 eventually, how can we start to tap into maybe 00:28:38.039 --> 00:28:41.160 some research and look at some funding for research 00:28:41.160 --> 00:28:44.059 in some of this particular area? And then one 00:28:44.059 --> 00:28:47.039 last thing is to have somewhat of a presence 00:28:47.039 --> 00:28:50.160 at the LA Olympics, which is in three years. 00:28:50.200 --> 00:28:53.019 And I think for us to have some type of platform 00:28:53.019 --> 00:28:56.839 or space or stage to sort of highlight and showcase 00:28:56.839 --> 00:28:59.819 this very much needed area, that's a personal 00:28:59.819 --> 00:29:02.519 goal of mine that I'm hoping to bring to fruition 00:29:02.519 --> 00:29:06.190 in a couple of years. Very cool, very cool. Thank 00:29:06.190 --> 00:29:10.210 you, Steve, and thank you, Aimee, for such a great 00:29:10.210 --> 00:29:13.910 conversation about such an interesting and potentially 00:29:13.910 --> 00:29:18.549 truly impactful line of work. And so to our listeners, 00:29:18.650 --> 00:29:21.670 if you want to learn more about social work in 00:29:21.670 --> 00:29:23.769 sports and the new course at USC, you can visit 00:29:23.769 --> 00:29:27.289 our school's website at dwarkpeck .usc .edu. 00:29:27.869 --> 00:29:30.009 And if you have any questions for the guests... 00:29:30.039 --> 00:29:33.000 or myself, and the transformative research and 00:29:33.000 --> 00:29:35.240 programs that happen here at the USC Suzanne 00:29:35.240 --> 00:29:38.000 Dworak-Peck School of Social Work, you can email 00:29:38.000 --> 00:29:42.599 us at ListenUpPeople @usc.edu. And one more 00:29:42.599 --> 00:29:44.700 time, I just want to thank the two of you for 00:29:44.700 --> 00:29:47.160 giving me your time and giving the passion and 00:29:47.160 --> 00:29:49.079 energy to our students and our communities through 00:29:49.079 --> 00:29:51.500 this work. Thank you so much. Thanks, Dr. Rice.