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Thanks for tuning into the podcast everyone.

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This week's episode is brought to you by the famous Area 420.

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All summer long they will be holding events at the infamous train cars, starting off on

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May 26 with the summer of savings kickoff barbecue.

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There will be various vendors on the site, free food and beer, and best of all, the networking

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available.

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All of this is going to be happening on May 26, 3pm to 7pm in Moffett, Colorado at Area

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420.

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Then, on June 10th from 10am to 4pm in the San Luis Valley, Moffett, Colorado, there's

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going to be a seed and genetics fair.

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This will be a great time to get your last minute genetics to put outdoors for the season

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right before Father's Day.

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There are still spaces available for vendors and food trucks.

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For more information, there will be links in the description for vendor information.

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Make sure to select BrainStrap as your event contact and tell him you heard everything

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on Reefer the Reefer with Little Farmer.

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So welcome back, welcome back to the podcast everyone.

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Reefer the Reefer with your host Little Farmer.

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I'm here with Andre Grossman.

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He is one of the men behind the scenes from back in the day.

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Growing up, I would go to the grocery store, or actually where I grew up, we would not

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even find the magazine High Times where I grew up because it was something that they

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wouldn't even put on the shelves.

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I grew up in the Bible Belt.

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So, oh, we can have marijuana on the shelves and magazines.

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So even it would be going to places like New York or going to bigger cities or sometimes

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the airport, you would see High Times magazine and you would see some of the prettiest pictures

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and some centerfolds and people hanging them up.

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Andre is one of the men behind a lot of these pictures that a lot of people don't know about.

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It's kind of hard to find information about him on the internet.

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He's not too out there on the social media.

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So he's kind of a hard man to get and kind of a unheard hero of the photography business

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when it comes to cannabis.

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And I'm highly excited to have you on the show.

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We met down at Area 420 here in Colorado.

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You were down there taking some pictures and Matt Brainstrap hooked us up and introduced

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us and then I think I ran into you in Denver also at a couple of get togethers.

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And then we were down at Area 420 and Matt had you on his show and I helped you get all

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set up and heard you talking with Kyle Cushman and telling some of the stories.

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And I asked if you'd be on the show and you said yes and I'm highly excited to hear some

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of these stories and how you got to where you were and where you're at now.

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We talked a little bit and you told me how you got into cannabis and how you grew up

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in East Germany and you moved to West Germany before the wall was put up and then you graduated

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from high school and then I'll kind of let you go to the rest of it here.

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But how did you get into cannabis and when was the first time that you actually smoked

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it and were like, oh, this is for me.

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Okay.

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Hi everybody.

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Thanks for having me on your show.

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And yeah, let's start from the beginning.

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I'm born in 1955 in what used to be then East Germany, but I was only one year old when

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I already moved with the family to the West of Germany.

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So I grew up in the capitalist, well-to-do West.

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And there was like obviously some beer drinking during growing up, but there wasn't much smoking

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at this time.

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And I think I only saw my first tiny dice sized piece of hashish when I was 17 years

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old at school.

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Somebody had it.

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Look, what is this?

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In the locker room and he says like, okay, next weekend we try to smoke some of it and

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had the teenage nonstop giggle experience that sort of then made it like a priced thing

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to do that with some friends, have some hash when later I think it took us like a good

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two hour drive to go to Amsterdam at night to the dam rack was their big Plaza and center

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of town where you just were talking now about late seventies or early seventies even where

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you hit up some black guys in Amsterdam for hash.

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And you could, I guess, buy a gram for $20, but that's all we would get between five guys

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and crammed into a car and then drive back to Germany, go home and then get fucked up

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from probably like Moroccan hash or something.

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Is that where it came from?

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In Europe, like Amsterdam back then it was most likely then from Northern Africa somewhere.

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But I spent some time after school.

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I graduated from school when I was like 19, then go to Berlin for two years and there

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the cannabis use was like there was hash and then there was like very rarely some good

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grown bud, but that was really rare.

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And I became, I went to photography school in Germany and I was like 26 years old when

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I had an opportunity to work for an American photographer in the US and Pennsylvania was

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working for this art photographer who made it in sort of a social documentary style of

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photography a la Diane Arbus.

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So that was an interesting photographer.

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And they are like this guy always had like a good high quality often like Thai weed or

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something there.

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And he said here you can always help yourself, it's right here.

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And I got more hooked to smoking good pot there in my later 20s there.

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And when I was doing this, I was I was working as a print black and white photographs for

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like museum quality type.

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Was it a dark room?

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Dark room.

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Yeah, with the old school black and white.

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And clocked many hours and made good money and that was sort of fun.

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And living in Pennsylvania was two hours away from New York was an easy safe way to get

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to know New York.

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Was it Philadelphia you were in?

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I was more like we're Easton in Pennsylvania.

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It's like I think it's 120 miles straight west off the city.

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And then made friends in the city, started a little bit with the photojournalism for

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German magazines.

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That was pretty okay.

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Back then you'd get like $350 for a day rate if you landed a job with a magazine.

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And if you had two or three of these a month, then it was you were already kind of set or

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something.

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And I liked to photograph people.

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I like to use a flashlight.

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I liked photographing at night in clubs, in social environments and stuff.

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You mentioned to me that even in Berlin, you were in the night scene.

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You went to the clubs and that's where you got into the cannabis scene.

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And Berlin was the night scene.

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And they had not a rave scene, but they had a night life that was with music and drugs

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and dancing.

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And just it was definitely counterculture of Berlin at the time.

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Back then, if I understood right.

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Yeah, up to then I lived pretty much in more provincial towns.

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And then that was the first time in the big city.

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My friends, I lived together with a couple of people.

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And this was a bit of like the commune style was in back then.

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And we had like seven, eight people renting one apartment and have a big communal space.

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And there was always sort of drinking alcohol, smoking cigarettes, but also smoking hashish

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mostly.

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And that was real common.

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How did you guys consume your hashish?

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With tobacco?

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Chilum.

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Chilum.

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Or hookahs.

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Yeah, mostly like Chilum or some day roll tobacco joints and stuff.

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Like me personally, I prefer to have like sometimes poke a needle through a beer felt

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and then put a small lump on the needle tip and keep it lighted and then hold a glass

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over it and smoke it like that.

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That's the first way out of smoke hash.

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And so in Berlin it was pretty common.

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So being then in New York, age 26, 27, I was going out.

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I liked the photograph people, so I go in the nightclubs and somehow a little have very

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fair skin.

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So too much sun is not my thing, but like at night I liked the clubs, I liked music

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and started to make friends in the city that way to meet some musicians.

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They didn't mind having pictures and stuff.

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So that was kind of a nice thing.

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I was into taking the break dancing, do the athletic stuff like spinning on their heads

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or have these dance troupes and stuff.

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It was kind of nice.

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I got nice photography there.

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And one night I was taking pictures in a nightclub called the Fun House.

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That was a big famous club there in the 80s in Chelsea.

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And this guy comes up to me and says, hey, I'm writing a book on these hip hop kids here

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and show me your photos and maybe we can use some of the photos in my book.

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And that was the start of a pretty long cooperation.

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That guy was Steve Hager and he later became the editor in chief of High Times Magazine.

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So we did a lot of photography for the magazine through that contact.

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I met all the other guys and later one of the things that I always thought was kind

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of interesting about the working with the High Times guys is when the High Times, Steve

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Hager had this idea to go to Amsterdam where cannabis was viewed more relaxed and not so

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super illegal and stuff.

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People would have coffee shops where you could buy it, smoke it, and be pretty much not bothered.

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And we wanted to start a cannabis cup in Amsterdam and make a competition of who has the best

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cannabis, whether this is in a coffee shop or whether this is like imported hash or all

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of these things you could get and then meet the local growers, suppliers of the coffee

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shops, take pictures there and have competitions who's got the best and stuff and have a big

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party event about it with entertainment.

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Then I continued working with the High Times guys.

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I had like dozens and dozens of covers and centerfolds.

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Most of the time they were ideas that were born in the art department at the magazine

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and then they call me up and say like, can we come to your studio and set up this and

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this photo shoot and stuff.

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That was kind of a nice time, met a bunch of people this way.

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I did that until about I think 2015.

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By 2015 the magazine was like in more serious trouble and they didn't spend money on photographers

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anymore.

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I had other photography jobs.

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I was working in art business doing art reproductions with large format cameras and light systems

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and stuff and photograph sometimes 50 artworks in a day or so for use that was used in galleries

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or art publications.

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But that was a steady job.

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I was employed and had health insurance and social security and stuff.

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But that also lasted until more recently now I'm like basically retired, moved out of New

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York in 2020.

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Now I live for three years here in Colorado.

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It's a very nice Colorado, the state of cannabis legalization since 2012.

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I met some good old friends here again from the back days in Amsterdam of the Adam Dunn

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from the Adam Dunn Show.

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Introduced me to some of his friends here in the Colorado cannabis scene.

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I met many growers from the area 420 where I also met a little farmer here and he invited

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me to come to his place now for the first time.

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I'm in the central of Rocky Mountains.

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There's snow capped.

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It's beautiful.

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I've never seen it.

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I'm like pretty much in awe.

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It's gorgeous here in the old Western Front.

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The old gold mining town.

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We're actually in the highest incorporated town in North America.

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We're at 10,500 feet here.

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It is still cool and cold at night in the snow falls.

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It's a bunch of moose and bears.

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So hopefully we'll keep keeping our eye out.

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We used to have a dog that would sense the moose and let us know.

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So it was easier to know.

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But if we catch them out here, it'd be a good opportunity to get some nice scenic outdoor

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wildlife shots.

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Yeah, very good.

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Maybe we go for a moment hiking.

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Yeah, we can do that for sure.

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I'll put my winter jacket on.

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It's cold outside.

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We can drive up to the top of the pass.

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That's the highest point and see the view from up there.

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Yeah, that'd be nice.

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Yeah, it's a nice view.

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So you had lived in New York during the hip hop days, during the early hip hop days.

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Was it the early 80s breakdancing?

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More before hip hop.

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Yeah, and the graffiti and stuff.

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Graffiti, yeah.

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Like the break into, like the boogaloo days.

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Yeah, I've seen some of your pictures.

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It's like the kind of like the punk rock and hip hop singing kind of mixing up with the

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club scene there.

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Yeah, there's like the garage rock scene a little bit on the Lower East Side.

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That's all sort of mixing in and stuff.

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That was interesting.

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I mean, I would go out almost at least once a week or twice for some kind of event.

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And the guy from the High Times magazine had a garage band himself called the Soul Assassins.

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And they had, I don't know, three, four guys.

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And then sometimes they had a couple of girls dance up front, the band and stuff.

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And they made cannabis legalization as sort of like a theme of their songs and stuff.

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And their connection to High Times was kind of benefited from that.

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The art director would draw album covers for them.

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And so then me as a photographer, they always like to have the photographer around the thing

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that makes the flashes and later brings pictures and stuff.

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And it was a good time.

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And then sometimes I made a little bit money with the High Times.

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I mean, it was nice if you had a cover and a centerfold, you'd have $700.

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So that was not so bad.

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You just had to see that you hit the cover and the centerfolds with good photos.

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And we met some growers.

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They were growing really good looking plants where the plant wasn't just green, but also

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had things like purple pistols and stuff so that we get some exciting contrasting colors

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and use like a decent resolution cameras so that they look good when they're blown to

237
00:19:59,840 --> 00:20:04,680
a centerfold.

238
00:20:04,680 --> 00:20:06,840
It flew for a while.

239
00:20:06,840 --> 00:20:15,200
Have you noticed a difference in what the buds look like from when you first started

240
00:20:15,200 --> 00:20:20,320
taking pictures and the plants to now what have the plants done?

241
00:20:20,320 --> 00:20:23,600
Like you said, before it was all green, then there's a little color to it.

242
00:20:23,600 --> 00:20:27,380
Now I know there's all types of colors.

243
00:20:27,380 --> 00:20:30,680
Have you noticed any difference in the pictures?

244
00:20:30,680 --> 00:20:48,200
Yeah, one has to say that the evolution of the marijuana flowers, from the potency and

245
00:20:48,200 --> 00:20:54,840
the looks, it's just a staggering trip.

246
00:20:54,840 --> 00:21:04,200
In particular, the sophisticated indoor growing made the buds look just so amazing.

247
00:21:04,200 --> 00:21:11,880
The photography of cannabis became also really amazing.

248
00:21:11,880 --> 00:21:14,520
A lot of guys are into photography.

249
00:21:14,520 --> 00:21:18,040
A lot of guys are into cannabis.

250
00:21:18,040 --> 00:21:25,720
So there's definitely one can see this that also there's an evolution in the technique

251
00:21:25,720 --> 00:21:30,320
of the photography as well.

252
00:21:30,320 --> 00:21:37,400
It's always been a little difficult to do very close-up photography, macro photography,

253
00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:38,720
microscopic photography.

254
00:21:38,720 --> 00:21:48,120
It becomes a little more technical and it's a bit tedious and stuff, so not everybody

255
00:21:48,120 --> 00:21:49,120
is into this.

256
00:21:49,120 --> 00:21:58,560
But today, I know at least a handful of guys that became really good with the microscopic

257
00:21:58,560 --> 00:21:59,560
photography.

258
00:21:59,560 --> 00:22:04,160
That's, of course, a whole new visual world.

259
00:22:04,160 --> 00:22:12,160
When you see these, if you have a 50 or 100 times magnification of like a trichome gland

260
00:22:12,160 --> 00:22:22,600
with the gland heads on top and stuff, that's like out of this world type of photos come

261
00:22:22,600 --> 00:22:24,940
up real attractive.

262
00:22:24,940 --> 00:22:33,340
If I would put an image that's printed nice as a 16 by 20 nicely framed, I would put that

263
00:22:33,340 --> 00:22:38,080
on the wall at any time in my living room and it'd be looking really, really good and

264
00:22:38,080 --> 00:22:39,080
stuff.

265
00:22:39,080 --> 00:22:43,880
So I'm like, I can like, that's an exciting thing.

266
00:22:43,880 --> 00:22:51,520
I tried some of the close-up photography myself.

267
00:22:51,520 --> 00:22:54,560
It's really difficult to do it really good and stuff.

268
00:22:54,560 --> 00:22:58,000
So I applaud some of the guys that are doing it.

269
00:22:58,000 --> 00:23:05,680
Maybe at some point, I might actually get into shows of my cannabis photography where

270
00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:11,920
it's not just my own photographs, but maybe eventually be able to make an edit of the

271
00:23:11,920 --> 00:23:19,260
best cannabis photographers that I come across and do sort of really attractive shows when

272
00:23:19,260 --> 00:23:23,200
you source from different photographers.

273
00:23:23,200 --> 00:23:32,040
Then you can really hit another level of juicy looking photo shows or something.

274
00:23:32,040 --> 00:23:38,920
There are new social spaces in the cannabis industry with all the dispensary social spaces

275
00:23:38,920 --> 00:23:49,680
developing, coming up that look great with nice art on the walls and stuff.

276
00:23:49,680 --> 00:23:53,760
There's things to come and things to look forward to.

277
00:23:53,760 --> 00:24:01,680
That event space at the area 420 where they have these train cars that are already social

278
00:24:01,680 --> 00:24:11,080
spaces now, they're beautiful by the Sangre de Cristo mountains next to the Hoover hot

279
00:24:11,080 --> 00:24:16,160
springs, the Sand Dunes National Park.

280
00:24:16,160 --> 00:24:22,120
Of course, the area 420 will have their own dispensary there that you can stop right off

281
00:24:22,120 --> 00:24:33,160
the road there and buy cannabis, smoke cannabis products, watch it like ant, see photo shows,

282
00:24:33,160 --> 00:24:35,680
art shows in those train cars.

283
00:24:35,680 --> 00:24:36,680
That'd be really nice.

284
00:24:36,680 --> 00:24:38,680
A little exhibition, like a little gallery.

285
00:24:38,680 --> 00:24:39,680
That'd be nice.

286
00:24:39,680 --> 00:24:49,280
Openings for those things and who knows, new life will come there.

287
00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:54,960
Definitely on a bunch of weekends during the summer, the 420 events on Friday afternoons.

288
00:24:54,960 --> 00:25:00,720
The 420 event in the last couple of weeks ago was really nice.

289
00:25:00,720 --> 00:25:02,680
A lot of people showed up.

290
00:25:02,680 --> 00:25:03,880
Yeah, I was down there.

291
00:25:03,880 --> 00:25:07,120
I think they're having another one here on the 26th of this month.

292
00:25:07,120 --> 00:25:10,320
It's on a Friday, I believe.

293
00:25:10,320 --> 00:25:16,080
Yeah, it's a great place to congregate and have a good time with like-minded individuals

294
00:25:16,080 --> 00:25:22,880
who have a love for cannabis like we do, basically.

295
00:25:22,880 --> 00:25:26,740
You mentioned social media sites out there like Instagram.

296
00:25:26,740 --> 00:25:30,320
You are on Instagram at agros55, I believe.

297
00:25:30,320 --> 00:25:35,860
A-G-R-O-S-55 if anybody wanted to follow you and come on and check some of your pictures

298
00:25:35,860 --> 00:25:38,840
that you have available online.

299
00:25:38,840 --> 00:25:41,080
You like Instagram.

300
00:25:41,080 --> 00:25:46,440
How do you feel about the new cameras making it really easy for anybody like myself to

301
00:25:46,440 --> 00:25:47,440
take really good pictures?

302
00:25:47,440 --> 00:25:52,960
Because I have no experience with cameras, but my phone takes a really nice picture and

303
00:25:52,960 --> 00:25:56,880
everybody is a cannabis photographer now on Instagram.

304
00:25:56,880 --> 00:26:01,960
Yeah, it has two things, of course.

305
00:26:01,960 --> 00:26:09,160
To me, being a competitive guy or something is annoying to a degree.

306
00:26:09,160 --> 00:26:10,160
Okay, what?

307
00:26:10,160 --> 00:26:12,800
I'm not the only one who can take good pictures.

308
00:26:12,800 --> 00:26:14,040
So terrible.

309
00:26:14,040 --> 00:26:27,020
But the other side is that now we get spoiled by an ocean of really good photography because

310
00:26:27,020 --> 00:26:35,600
every time the photos are really good when people go, oh, look at this.

311
00:26:35,600 --> 00:26:36,600
Where's my camera?

312
00:26:36,600 --> 00:26:37,880
I need to take a picture.

313
00:26:37,880 --> 00:26:40,320
That's when a picture is a good picture.

314
00:26:40,320 --> 00:26:46,040
Then now in most cases when that happens, people have their camera with them.

315
00:26:46,040 --> 00:26:49,940
They work very well and stuff.

316
00:26:49,940 --> 00:26:52,680
For example, one thing I really like.

317
00:26:52,680 --> 00:26:59,640
I like storms on oceans and seeing the largest waves possible.

318
00:26:59,640 --> 00:27:06,560
Now when you go on YouTube, you can watch this all day long because every sailor who

319
00:27:06,560 --> 00:27:14,960
gets into a storm off of Northern Russia or something has his camera when his ship breaks

320
00:27:14,960 --> 00:27:17,000
in half or something.

321
00:27:17,000 --> 00:27:27,720
So we get to see all that cool stuff, especially in outdoor fields of marijuana when people

322
00:27:27,720 --> 00:27:34,120
go hang out in the sunrise or in the sunset when it's beautiful, maybe with some fog or

323
00:27:34,120 --> 00:27:42,480
some dew on the plants and take spectacular pictures with their iPhone or something.

324
00:27:42,480 --> 00:27:46,120
That's great.

325
00:27:46,120 --> 00:27:58,400
It just also proves the power of the image, whether it's a photo still image or the moving

326
00:27:58,400 --> 00:27:59,400
image.

327
00:27:59,400 --> 00:28:08,360
This is a very powerful thing and everybody loves it and stuff.

328
00:28:08,360 --> 00:28:19,280
It's just for myself, I wish there were some more paid jobs for myself in photography.

329
00:28:19,280 --> 00:28:27,000
Maybe the cannabis industry is going to regain a foothold in the next couple of years and

330
00:28:27,000 --> 00:28:36,600
find ways how to become more, I don't know, just make some profit for one, pay less taxes.

331
00:28:36,600 --> 00:28:43,960
That would be a good thing and people have a decent wage for decent work.

332
00:28:43,960 --> 00:28:51,040
The way that what's so nice about when you go down to the area 420 there, all these people

333
00:28:51,040 --> 00:28:59,400
are growers, they're very hardworking and real dedicated to the quality of cannabis

334
00:28:59,400 --> 00:29:07,240
first and foremost and that's what ultimately is going to make those guys survive because

335
00:29:07,240 --> 00:29:09,400
we need some good pot.

336
00:29:09,400 --> 00:29:16,040
So you've been around some of the best cannabis in the world, in Amsterdam, high time in New

337
00:29:16,040 --> 00:29:17,040
York.

338
00:29:17,040 --> 00:29:19,960
What are some of the best strains you've ever smoked?

339
00:29:19,960 --> 00:29:25,160
What do you like to smoke now if you had a choice?

340
00:29:25,160 --> 00:29:30,440
I know I heard the story about the strawberry cough and you and Kyle Cushman, he had it

341
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:33,880
and you cloned it for a long time and you helped distribute it throughout New York for

342
00:29:33,880 --> 00:29:39,080
a while in your younger days and it was a very common staple in your grow.

343
00:29:39,080 --> 00:29:42,200
Was that one of your favorites to consume personally?

344
00:29:42,200 --> 00:29:49,640
Yeah, the strawberry was definitely a nice smoke.

345
00:29:49,640 --> 00:29:58,120
If you grow it carefully organically yourself, give it a good cure, that's a good thing.

346
00:29:58,120 --> 00:30:11,200
But I would also enjoy like really a traditional well-cured hash in the right environment or

347
00:30:11,200 --> 00:30:14,520
something if you're comfy at home or maybe with some friends.

348
00:30:14,520 --> 00:30:18,200
The old school hash, not the newer hash.

349
00:30:18,200 --> 00:30:25,120
Like somebody brings something from Afghanistan or from Morocco or like a really good hash.

350
00:30:25,120 --> 00:30:32,000
But I think then you always get surprised by something new.

351
00:30:32,000 --> 00:30:38,800
You always have to try around, try a little bit.

352
00:30:38,800 --> 00:30:41,480
I like all of these things really.

353
00:30:41,480 --> 00:30:48,280
Sometimes I run out of really good pot and then you say like, hey, I didn't have some

354
00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:53,640
from last year's harvest in this container and check it out.

355
00:30:53,640 --> 00:30:54,640
It's not so bad.

356
00:30:54,640 --> 00:31:01,120
It'll get me over until I meet again one of the guys from 420 years, from area 420.

357
00:31:01,120 --> 00:31:02,560
Give me some good pot.

358
00:31:02,560 --> 00:31:06,960
Maybe Mad Kiss.

359
00:31:06,960 --> 00:31:11,520
But I don't know what comes to mind.

360
00:31:11,520 --> 00:31:12,920
There's always something new also.

361
00:31:12,920 --> 00:31:17,760
Do you find the difference between the newer herb on the scene and the older because everybody's

362
00:31:17,760 --> 00:31:22,200
like, oh yeah, the newer stuff's higher in THC, it's more intoxicating.

363
00:31:22,200 --> 00:31:30,600
Do you feel like the older herb was better or the newer herb or is it not much difference

364
00:31:30,600 --> 00:31:32,920
in your mind?

365
00:31:32,920 --> 00:31:40,280
I wouldn't take a stand easily there.

366
00:31:40,280 --> 00:31:49,640
I remember when in the 90s there was always somebody who had the best pot or something

367
00:31:49,640 --> 00:31:59,520
and I would say that during that time the high quality indoor pot would be the winner

368
00:31:59,520 --> 00:32:05,080
of the day out there.

369
00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:10,920
Sometimes outdoor would then again blow all the indoor stuff away.

370
00:32:10,920 --> 00:32:19,120
There would be cannabis cups in Amsterdam where you would smoke this locally grown stuff

371
00:32:19,120 --> 00:32:26,360
in Amsterdam for a week and then all of a sudden somebody shows up and says, oh, I'm

372
00:32:26,360 --> 00:32:33,280
coming fresh from the steps of Romania and here's some outdoor grown and then blows

373
00:32:33,280 --> 00:32:39,920
everybody away because it just has some kind of different outdoor effect or something and

374
00:32:39,920 --> 00:32:42,360
grown in the wind and the sun.

375
00:32:42,360 --> 00:32:44,720
It's very nice.

376
00:32:44,720 --> 00:32:51,960
Yeah, they say the sun gives it a different terpene profile, different cannabinoid structure

377
00:32:51,960 --> 00:32:54,400
and more sesquiterpenes or something like that.

378
00:32:54,400 --> 00:32:59,120
They're still debating what the difference is but the natural sunlight does produce different

379
00:32:59,120 --> 00:33:05,960
cannabinoids and terpenes which give you different effects which I've noticed like more body

380
00:33:05,960 --> 00:33:12,200
and more full head to toe really nice feelings.

381
00:33:12,200 --> 00:33:21,280
One never stops learning about new findings in growing or consumption.

382
00:33:21,280 --> 00:33:37,240
I was growing myself in New York City until about 2018 until I was so a bit overwhelmed

383
00:33:37,240 --> 00:33:41,160
with the frustrations of growing pot.

384
00:33:41,160 --> 00:33:49,440
There's too much paranoia and stuff and too much expenses with electricity and all the

385
00:33:49,440 --> 00:33:58,880
fancy grow equipment and then prices also came down over the decades.

386
00:33:58,880 --> 00:34:09,440
I remember a time maybe around 2005 where I actually myself got forked over $6,000 in

387
00:34:09,440 --> 00:34:16,280
cash for a pound of Primo strawberry pot.

388
00:34:16,280 --> 00:34:28,040
From there, now you're in Colorado in 2022-23 and you couldn't sell a high quality pot for

389
00:34:28,040 --> 00:34:30,960
$200 or something.

390
00:34:30,960 --> 00:34:40,440
Yes, it's been a big, big change in black market and it all depends on what state you're

391
00:34:40,440 --> 00:34:43,440
in now.

392
00:34:43,440 --> 00:34:50,800
From where I was at, we would ride up to New York, not me personally but I know some people

393
00:34:50,800 --> 00:34:54,200
from New York that would come down to West Virginia to go to school and they would ride

394
00:34:54,200 --> 00:35:00,200
up to New York and buy nickel bags and come back and sell them for $20 each.

395
00:35:00,200 --> 00:35:03,200
Or if they could get a pound, it was really cheap and they could come down and triple

396
00:35:03,200 --> 00:35:06,200
the money pretty easily.

397
00:35:06,200 --> 00:35:10,000
I can imagine the pricing got cheaper in Canada.

398
00:35:10,000 --> 00:35:13,400
I know a lot of New York would get their herb from Canada and when it went illegal there,

399
00:35:13,400 --> 00:35:19,560
it was across the border even quicker and faster and cheaper.

400
00:35:19,560 --> 00:35:26,480
Here it used to be $350 an ounce flat back in 2000.

401
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:32,440
You couldn't get a break and if you wanted to get a pound, it was like $3,800 almost.

402
00:35:32,440 --> 00:35:33,440
Something like $3,200.

403
00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:38,440
If you can get a pound for $3,200, it was cheap of Primo.

404
00:35:38,440 --> 00:35:45,840
I was in California and had a bunch of outdoor, really great outdoor season probably in 2003

405
00:35:45,840 --> 00:35:50,600
or so and all of that started flooding into here and brought the prices down to about

406
00:35:50,600 --> 00:35:52,960
$2.75 an ounce.

407
00:35:52,960 --> 00:36:03,240
And then I think when I came out here right before they legalized, it was about $1.75

408
00:36:03,240 --> 00:36:05,680
an ounce.

409
00:36:05,680 --> 00:36:09,080
And now there is no black market really.

410
00:36:09,080 --> 00:36:13,320
If you're buying something on black market just because you don't want to go to the dispensary

411
00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:17,360
or you're just wanting to support a friend or something like that, that's basically the

412
00:36:17,360 --> 00:36:18,960
black market here.

413
00:36:18,960 --> 00:36:23,720
The growers I learned from don't grow anymore because it was just supplemental income for

414
00:36:23,720 --> 00:36:26,320
them and some of them didn't even smoke.

415
00:36:26,320 --> 00:36:33,360
Now with the cost of electricity and the price, there's just no black market.

416
00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:37,400
But then that gives a chance for the dispensaries to jack up their prices.

417
00:36:37,400 --> 00:36:43,320
And whenever that happens, little bits of black market will bounce back up.

418
00:36:43,320 --> 00:36:48,640
So there is a fluctuation here and there I've noticed, but it all depends on the taxation.

419
00:36:48,640 --> 00:36:53,260
Like you were talking, it's really, really steep and a lot of these new states.

420
00:36:53,260 --> 00:36:57,680
So even in West Virginia, they got medical and there's a couple dispensaries.

421
00:36:57,680 --> 00:36:59,080
It's not that good quality.

422
00:36:59,080 --> 00:37:04,440
So people are still traveling out of state to go get their herb for a cheaper price with

423
00:37:04,440 --> 00:37:06,760
better quality.

424
00:37:06,760 --> 00:37:11,560
And it's got to be some kind of medium across the country here soon.

425
00:37:11,560 --> 00:37:18,480
Hopefully that'll balance it out and got to be a point where the growers can actually

426
00:37:18,480 --> 00:37:19,480
make money.

427
00:37:19,480 --> 00:37:26,640
And it's around $1,200 a pound would be something that growers could sell their herb for and

428
00:37:26,640 --> 00:37:33,080
still make a profit here in Colorado or any other state, depending on the taxes.

429
00:37:33,080 --> 00:37:39,120
It's interesting to hear these numbers for sure.

430
00:37:39,120 --> 00:37:52,160
When it becomes more expensive to produce it, then you can sell it for why then do it.

431
00:37:52,160 --> 00:37:57,000
A lot of people gave up.

432
00:37:57,000 --> 00:37:59,000
I don't know.

433
00:37:59,000 --> 00:38:09,000
Sounds like a bad thing, but maybe it's a good thing if it improves the quality somehow

434
00:38:09,000 --> 00:38:18,400
that the people who are into it are also really into the quality of it, which just makes sense.

435
00:38:18,400 --> 00:38:25,720
I think the outdoor, down in area 420, there's going to be more outdoor.

436
00:38:25,720 --> 00:38:30,160
So people complain, oh yeah, these people down there growing all this outdoor, tanking

437
00:38:30,160 --> 00:38:31,160
the market.

438
00:38:31,160 --> 00:38:32,160
And I've heard people say that.

439
00:38:32,160 --> 00:38:35,320
Like there's more outdoors, cheaper for them to do it.

440
00:38:35,320 --> 00:38:39,680
And sometimes we've smoked really good outdoor that blows indoor away.

441
00:38:39,680 --> 00:38:41,800
So sometimes it just doesn't look the prettiest.

442
00:38:41,800 --> 00:38:49,960
It might not have the visual bag appeal, but it's going to have higher contents of certain

443
00:38:49,960 --> 00:38:53,440
things that make you feel better and more therapeutic.

444
00:38:53,440 --> 00:38:57,040
So the outdoor is going to change the scene.

445
00:38:57,040 --> 00:39:02,760
If there's legalization of outdoor grows, it's going to be a whole different bargain

446
00:39:02,760 --> 00:39:10,560
because you can grow more, can be better quality if it's done right, and the prices will be

447
00:39:10,560 --> 00:39:11,560
different.

448
00:39:11,560 --> 00:39:15,600
It's going to make it even cheaper and there won't be any electricity.

449
00:39:15,600 --> 00:39:22,840
Yeah, this is like one of those real interesting things about the area 420 as well, that you

450
00:39:22,840 --> 00:39:36,920
can talk there or visit a grower who is doing the most ultra high tech way of aeroponic

451
00:39:36,920 --> 00:39:42,400
growing of marijuana indoors.

452
00:39:42,400 --> 00:39:54,920
And you can sit next to a guy who 500 yards on a different lot away grows an incredible

453
00:39:54,920 --> 00:40:02,320
outdoor field in the ground right there.

454
00:40:02,320 --> 00:40:10,280
Like I met one guy there who already pulled off like five years of big summer harvest

455
00:40:10,280 --> 00:40:17,520
with like, what do they have sometimes, 2000 plants or something on there.

456
00:40:17,520 --> 00:40:23,040
And they're all like big six foot bushes and stuff or five foot bushes.

457
00:40:23,040 --> 00:40:26,240
And it's like good stuff.

458
00:40:26,240 --> 00:40:39,360
I even saw there at the area 420 buds that top colors, they were grown outdoors.

459
00:40:39,360 --> 00:40:46,680
They look even better than indoors or it looked like indoors because it's just christally

460
00:40:46,680 --> 00:40:50,920
crazy and big thick buds and stuff.

461
00:40:50,920 --> 00:40:51,920
So it was crazy.

462
00:40:51,920 --> 00:40:57,840
You actually came to America when a lot of the American growers were going to Holland

463
00:40:57,840 --> 00:41:02,760
because of the drug war laws and you came to America and lived in New York City during

464
00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:07,280
some of the harshest drug wars laws.

465
00:41:07,280 --> 00:41:09,040
So I got to give you salute.

466
00:41:09,040 --> 00:41:11,320
Thank you for doing that and keeping cannabis alive.

467
00:41:11,320 --> 00:41:16,560
And all the pictures you did, you inspired me when I first got into cannabis and seeing

468
00:41:16,560 --> 00:41:17,560
some of these pictures.

469
00:41:17,560 --> 00:41:20,840
I was, man, just some of them were mouthwatering.

470
00:41:20,840 --> 00:41:22,360
Can't lie.

471
00:41:22,360 --> 00:41:23,360
Thank you.

472
00:41:23,360 --> 00:41:33,240
Now that was a one off interesting thing for myself to have met the high times guys in

473
00:41:33,240 --> 00:41:41,880
order to more or less go back to Europe, go to Amsterdam and see what had realized, what

474
00:41:41,880 --> 00:41:43,640
had developed there.

475
00:41:43,640 --> 00:41:50,080
That was sort of, was a bit of a shock to me actually because I thought like, well,

476
00:41:50,080 --> 00:41:59,120
I have to admit though, I lived in New York in the eighties and in the nineties through

477
00:41:59,120 --> 00:42:08,280
2020, but I have never really gone to the West coast all that much.

478
00:42:08,280 --> 00:42:16,560
I was at some point in the golden triangle up there in Willets when my friend Carl Cushman

479
00:42:16,560 --> 00:42:23,480
was living and growing up there and that was interesting to see.

480
00:42:23,480 --> 00:42:26,920
There was like, let's see, when was that?

481
00:42:26,920 --> 00:42:31,400
I would say around 2008 or something.

482
00:42:31,400 --> 00:42:37,200
I would go visit Oregon, Northern California up there.

483
00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:42,120
That was nice to see, but it was only like a one week visit.

484
00:42:42,120 --> 00:42:46,760
So I never got to like really live there and experience that.

485
00:42:46,760 --> 00:42:54,880
That's a whole other, that's also, well, of course the original scenes were often, were

486
00:42:54,880 --> 00:42:58,880
there, that's where a lot of it started.

487
00:42:58,880 --> 00:43:03,480
It's a lot more laid back out in California, but in that area it could be dangerous too

488
00:43:03,480 --> 00:43:06,480
because all the growth there, especially in the illegal days.

489
00:43:06,480 --> 00:43:07,480
Yeah, yeah, yeah.

490
00:43:07,480 --> 00:43:08,480
No, they have the big stories.

491
00:43:08,480 --> 00:43:14,680
They end up missing and you stumble into somebody's land that you shouldn't have been on, booby

492
00:43:14,680 --> 00:43:16,320
traps or whatever out there.

493
00:43:16,320 --> 00:43:23,320
They had like that serious movie, that's a good movie, Murder Mountain, right?

494
00:43:23,320 --> 00:43:24,320
You know that one?

495
00:43:24,320 --> 00:43:26,720
I've heard of it, but I haven't watched it.

496
00:43:26,720 --> 00:43:30,120
Yeah, yeah, no, there's real stuff going on.

497
00:43:30,120 --> 00:43:39,360
I mean, I've heard of people here back in the 90s and 2000s getting robbed in black

498
00:43:39,360 --> 00:43:44,360
market and it was back in the day when nobody would invite you into their garden.

499
00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:47,440
If you got invited to somebody's garden, they really trusted you.

500
00:43:47,440 --> 00:43:48,440
Yeah, definitely.

501
00:43:48,440 --> 00:43:50,960
And it was just a no-no.

502
00:43:50,960 --> 00:43:54,040
And it was people getting robbed.

503
00:43:54,040 --> 00:43:59,520
And I know you have a story about being in New York that I've heard you tell that not

504
00:43:59,520 --> 00:44:05,840
only was it dangerous watching out for police and being put in jail, but people in a big

505
00:44:05,840 --> 00:44:09,040
city, there's a lot of dangerous people out there.

506
00:44:09,040 --> 00:44:11,520
Would you mind telling the story about what happened to you?

507
00:44:11,520 --> 00:44:13,600
No, not at all.

508
00:44:13,600 --> 00:44:23,520
And right away, I would like to mention that I had to admit to being maybe a bit naive

509
00:44:23,520 --> 00:44:29,080
in my late 20s coming from Europe to the city.

510
00:44:29,080 --> 00:44:37,280
I never had any really bad experiences in my life.

511
00:44:37,280 --> 00:44:44,280
Never got, never saw much guns throughout my growing up.

512
00:44:44,280 --> 00:44:51,840
My time in Germany, only the police had guns in little pouches made of fancy leather and

513
00:44:51,840 --> 00:44:52,840
stuff.

514
00:44:52,840 --> 00:45:04,120
But I knew with the marijuana that you had to be a little bit careful, because of course,

515
00:45:04,120 --> 00:45:12,040
there were fairly strict laws about even just one joint or something could send you in a

516
00:45:12,040 --> 00:45:14,520
bunch of trouble already or something.

517
00:45:14,520 --> 00:45:22,080
At least if you were young and your family found out that you got caught with marijuana

518
00:45:22,080 --> 00:45:28,560
or something, that was like trouble.

519
00:45:28,560 --> 00:45:36,960
In New York, we were always in the US, you always be careful about not having too much

520
00:45:36,960 --> 00:45:39,960
with you if you would carry.

521
00:45:39,960 --> 00:45:47,720
You wouldn't like, if you were carrying an ounce, you'd already kind of be pretty nervous.

522
00:45:47,720 --> 00:45:53,360
And if you were in the subway in New York and you have an ounce of weed in your pocket

523
00:45:53,360 --> 00:46:02,160
and it's not wrapped well and it stinks, it's definitely a cause for concern and stuff.

524
00:46:02,160 --> 00:46:10,800
And then I even never forget at some point where in New York, at some point I met some

525
00:46:10,800 --> 00:46:20,960
people that were more the dealers of pot, people that would bring in large amounts of

526
00:46:20,960 --> 00:46:25,760
Mexican weed in the old days or something.

527
00:46:25,760 --> 00:46:37,100
And meeting these people and it was then sometimes I would go to a grow and the grower would

528
00:46:37,100 --> 00:46:45,040
have a gun in the back of his pants and you'd be like, oh wow, here's people now where you

529
00:46:45,040 --> 00:46:48,360
see.

530
00:46:48,360 --> 00:46:53,560
This can sometimes be dangerous or something for real.

531
00:46:53,560 --> 00:46:59,880
If you kept sticking around and stuff, you heard being in touch with the high times people,

532
00:46:59,880 --> 00:47:03,860
there's always the stories what happened to other people.

533
00:47:03,860 --> 00:47:07,520
People were getting busted for growing and stuff.

534
00:47:07,520 --> 00:47:21,880
And I never had much problems or something until I did eventually move small amounts

535
00:47:21,880 --> 00:47:27,240
of pot for friends because I had access to it.

536
00:47:27,240 --> 00:47:33,080
And then you can sort of hook up friends or something and then you start to make an extra

537
00:47:33,080 --> 00:47:37,840
couple of bucks or something, but it's just friends.

538
00:47:37,840 --> 00:47:42,840
So it's nice because it's with friends.

539
00:47:42,840 --> 00:47:45,280
Yeah, because I never really sold to strangers.

540
00:47:45,280 --> 00:47:47,280
I never sold to make money.

541
00:47:47,280 --> 00:47:48,280
On a street corner or something.

542
00:47:48,280 --> 00:47:53,120
I was one, I would get an ounce and give three quarters to a friend and keep a quarter

543
00:47:53,120 --> 00:47:58,160
for myself at a discounted rate basically so I could smoke cheaper.

544
00:47:58,160 --> 00:48:00,160
That's what I did.

545
00:48:00,160 --> 00:48:12,160
And then one thing that I tried to stay away from in New York, but I did do it at some

546
00:48:12,160 --> 00:48:16,440
point to throw a really big party in my apartment.

547
00:48:16,440 --> 00:48:28,560
I had a nice loft at some point down by the Brooklyn Bridge on Broadway and had just published

548
00:48:28,560 --> 00:48:35,760
a photo of a really nice marijuana plant on the Sunday cover of the New York Times.

549
00:48:35,760 --> 00:48:39,680
I mean the Sunday magazine of the New York Times.

550
00:48:39,680 --> 00:48:47,520
And I threw a party in my apartment where I just told all the friends, hey, tell all

551
00:48:47,520 --> 00:48:48,520
your friends and stuff.

552
00:48:48,520 --> 00:48:52,680
And all of a sudden there were 120 people in my house.

553
00:48:52,680 --> 00:49:00,600
And I thought like, well, that's fine, but one of the uninvited guests that I didn't

554
00:49:00,600 --> 00:49:12,000
know put a gun to my head about two years later because he was a gangster.

555
00:49:12,000 --> 00:49:20,080
He came to my party uninvited, but you hang out at a bar in the East Village and hey,

556
00:49:20,080 --> 00:49:21,880
there's a party at this guy's house.

557
00:49:21,880 --> 00:49:24,280
Let's all go and stuff.

558
00:49:24,280 --> 00:49:37,000
And this guy became like a customer of buying half ounce or ounce bags of pot that I had

559
00:49:37,000 --> 00:49:40,000
access to.

560
00:49:40,000 --> 00:49:47,480
I made sure to always meet people in a neutral environment, in a cafe, in a bar somewhere

561
00:49:47,480 --> 00:49:51,960
on the street, never in my house to show where you live.

562
00:49:51,960 --> 00:50:00,760
But in this one situation, I kind of had started to trust a person and let him in my apartment.

563
00:50:00,760 --> 00:50:07,520
And there then it happened, the guy put a gun to my head and robbed me blind and stuff.

564
00:50:07,520 --> 00:50:14,000
And it was pretty scary event because what he did, he handcuffed me, made me lie down

565
00:50:14,000 --> 00:50:20,880
and poured a bunch of lighter fuel over me and stood there with the lighter and threatened

566
00:50:20,880 --> 00:50:29,400
to set everything on fire if I don't give up all the goods I have, give me all your

567
00:50:29,400 --> 00:50:31,840
drugs and money and stuff.

568
00:50:31,840 --> 00:50:43,880
So I had probably a pound of good pot in the house and five grand in a box somewhere that

569
00:50:43,880 --> 00:50:47,360
I gave up to save my ass and stuff.

570
00:50:47,360 --> 00:50:50,240
He took the shit and left and stuff.

571
00:50:50,240 --> 00:50:59,680
And then I was handcuffed on my back and was there in my house, handcuffed, just gotten

572
00:50:59,680 --> 00:51:01,680
robbed blind.

573
00:51:01,680 --> 00:51:10,840
And it was about 5.30 in the afternoon and my friend Kyle Cushman was the pot editor

574
00:51:10,840 --> 00:51:13,480
at High Times Magazine at the time.

575
00:51:13,480 --> 00:51:18,400
And I called him up and dialed with my chin on one of those old phones.

576
00:51:18,400 --> 00:51:22,880
And he actually came and rescued me, uncuffed me and stuff.

577
00:51:22,880 --> 00:51:23,880
That's crazy.

578
00:51:23,880 --> 00:51:30,320
I know a couple other people that had gotten robbed in the past and one of them actually

579
00:51:30,320 --> 00:51:31,720
got shot.

580
00:51:31,720 --> 00:51:33,720
He was mistaken.

581
00:51:33,720 --> 00:51:35,520
He wasn't even selling.

582
00:51:35,520 --> 00:51:40,800
Like somebody down the hall was selling weed and they got the apartments mixed up and came

583
00:51:40,800 --> 00:51:41,800
into his house.

584
00:51:41,800 --> 00:51:42,800
Lovely.

585
00:51:42,800 --> 00:51:45,160
He had stuff to do with cannabis.

586
00:51:45,160 --> 00:51:53,480
So he found out a couple weeks later that it was meant for the people down the hall.

587
00:51:53,480 --> 00:51:57,560
But yeah, that type of shit makes you want to get out of the game.

588
00:51:57,560 --> 00:52:04,520
And the paranoia of that happening or getting busted is not an easy thing to take.

589
00:52:04,520 --> 00:52:06,720
It's not for the weed cart.

590
00:52:06,720 --> 00:52:08,760
Yeah, yeah.

591
00:52:08,760 --> 00:52:16,080
Definitely.

592
00:52:16,080 --> 00:52:23,000
It was probably six years ago I moved back out here just because I was growing illegally

593
00:52:23,000 --> 00:52:26,760
and it was so paranoid.

594
00:52:26,760 --> 00:52:30,560
I didn't grow it the last year I was there and just got tired of smoking weed.

595
00:52:30,560 --> 00:52:33,160
That wasn't what I grew.

596
00:52:33,160 --> 00:52:38,360
And I got sick too because it was contaminated weed.

597
00:52:38,360 --> 00:52:40,640
I don't know where it came from.

598
00:52:40,640 --> 00:52:41,640
Colorado.

599
00:52:41,640 --> 00:52:43,680
It was all this gorilla glue from Colorado.

600
00:52:43,680 --> 00:52:44,680
It's good.

601
00:52:44,680 --> 00:52:45,680
It looked good.

602
00:52:45,680 --> 00:52:46,680
It smelled okay.

603
00:52:46,680 --> 00:52:50,040
But when I smoked it, it burned my lungs.

604
00:52:50,040 --> 00:52:51,040
That's nasty.

605
00:52:51,040 --> 00:52:52,040
Yeah.

606
00:52:52,040 --> 00:52:56,080
So after smoking three bottles, I ended up coughing a lot and ended up getting bronchitis

607
00:52:56,080 --> 00:52:59,000
and threw the rest of it in the trash.

608
00:52:59,000 --> 00:53:00,080
Yeah.

609
00:53:00,080 --> 00:53:10,480
That's kind of like in a way one of the good things that you have to have if you're serious

610
00:53:10,480 --> 00:53:15,520
about your smoke, you have to have access to good smoke.

611
00:53:15,520 --> 00:53:20,360
Either you grow it yourself, which is probably the best idea because then you really know

612
00:53:20,360 --> 00:53:27,200
what's up with it and it'll probably be the best you get anyways or something.

613
00:53:27,200 --> 00:53:33,120
A lot of people have green thumb and just have to try it.

614
00:53:33,120 --> 00:53:42,160
I started it at some point and I was also never grew even a houseplant in my life.

615
00:53:42,160 --> 00:53:46,120
Even my mother didn't have many houseplants.

616
00:53:46,120 --> 00:53:50,400
There was maybe a cactus in the living room or something.

617
00:53:50,400 --> 00:53:59,600
And I was fairly even paranoid of trying it, of being pretty sure it would be a failure

618
00:53:59,600 --> 00:54:01,320
or something.

619
00:54:01,320 --> 00:54:09,240
But then I did have this contact to the high times guys and stuff.

620
00:54:09,240 --> 00:54:15,440
And I had met some funny growers in California too.

621
00:54:15,440 --> 00:54:23,880
Back then they were the big guys in LA, they have a pretty big indoor grow place with five

622
00:54:23,880 --> 00:54:30,120
to six grow rooms with like four or six thousand watts each room and stuff.

623
00:54:30,120 --> 00:54:38,680
And I never forgot this one guy, he was saying, what do you need a bedroom for in your apartment?

624
00:54:38,680 --> 00:54:44,200
You make that the grow room and then you sleep on the couch or something.

625
00:54:44,200 --> 00:54:50,600
And I came to the point at some point in New York because the rents were always really

626
00:54:50,600 --> 00:54:51,600
expensive.

627
00:54:51,600 --> 00:54:56,800
And if you lived in Manhattan, everything was always a thousand or two thousand or three

628
00:54:56,800 --> 00:54:58,920
thousand dollars and stuff.

629
00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:02,560
There was nothing like two hundred or some dollars.

630
00:55:02,560 --> 00:55:05,160
It was always like up there.

631
00:55:05,160 --> 00:55:12,280
And I was always in the above two thousand dollar range for where I rented and lived.

632
00:55:12,280 --> 00:55:22,720
But I made that choice and never regretted it that you grow indoors for yourself and

633
00:55:22,720 --> 00:55:23,720
your friends.

634
00:55:23,720 --> 00:55:25,560
And it worked really well for me.

635
00:55:25,560 --> 00:55:29,960
I mean, I paid those rents for a long period of time.

636
00:55:29,960 --> 00:55:34,880
Well, I think that's a way it should go now is in caregiverships.

637
00:55:34,880 --> 00:55:42,120
Like as in caregivers, you can have one person for a group of five people and they're designated

638
00:55:42,120 --> 00:55:46,520
to grow for these people and grow as much as they want and distribute and those people

639
00:55:46,520 --> 00:55:47,520
help pay for it.

640
00:55:47,520 --> 00:55:53,680
Maybe help for the place they live, the electric and food, you know, nothing where he's going

641
00:55:53,680 --> 00:55:59,120
to live lavishly, just where he makes a living, pays rent, pay the bills and still support

642
00:55:59,120 --> 00:56:01,040
everybody else with their cannabis.

643
00:56:01,040 --> 00:56:03,400
Yeah, that seems a good idea.

644
00:56:03,400 --> 00:56:09,760
That would be good for the community, you know, because that's a fairly small circle

645
00:56:09,760 --> 00:56:13,920
and they can all know each other and stuff, you know, and say like you grew.

646
00:56:13,920 --> 00:56:16,560
Yeah, that's also one of those things.

647
00:56:16,560 --> 00:56:23,040
I mean, to grow the pot really good, you do.

648
00:56:23,040 --> 00:56:24,640
You have to know your shit.

649
00:56:24,640 --> 00:56:28,120
You know, it's kind of like the more you know, the better.

650
00:56:28,120 --> 00:56:29,120
You never learn.

651
00:56:29,120 --> 00:56:31,400
You never stop learning and stuff.

652
00:56:31,400 --> 00:56:42,920
And because there's natural good ways of growing it without toxic pesticides or anything, you

653
00:56:42,920 --> 00:56:51,240
can be careful that if you do the growing right, you don't have to have pests or critters

654
00:56:51,240 --> 00:57:01,320
or fungus on it and stuff, you know, and that should all be understood by everybody.

655
00:57:01,320 --> 00:57:09,120
You don't want you want clean, high quality pot, not some stuff that's like sprayed with

656
00:57:09,120 --> 00:57:13,480
what you don't know or critters you don't know or anything.

657
00:57:13,480 --> 00:57:19,120
This is you ingest this, you know, it's already bad enough.

658
00:57:19,120 --> 00:57:24,680
So I don't I don't think consuming on accident a couple of little bugs are going to be bad.

659
00:57:24,680 --> 00:57:30,120
You know, the high you'd be highly, highly surprised how many bugs are in our canned

660
00:57:30,120 --> 00:57:32,360
foods and some of our foods.

661
00:57:32,360 --> 00:57:34,800
We don't really realize we're eating them all the time.

662
00:57:34,800 --> 00:57:42,240
Especially in the US, there's a certain amount of organic material that's not the food that's

663
00:57:42,240 --> 00:57:43,240
allowed in there.

664
00:57:43,240 --> 00:57:48,120
They're like the larvas, aphids, little tiny bugs that you can hardly see.

665
00:57:48,120 --> 00:57:52,440
There's some of that on our food and you don't really notice it, especially if you grow in

666
00:57:52,440 --> 00:57:58,160
the garden, you know, you see the little bugs all over the place and some of the outdoors.

667
00:57:58,160 --> 00:58:02,800
I found little bugs on some of the outdoor, you know, they just get caught up in the bug

668
00:58:02,800 --> 00:58:06,080
and the stickiness and they get trapped there.

669
00:58:06,080 --> 00:58:10,560
Some of them will break down actually because of the sun, the UVs, but then some of the

670
00:58:10,560 --> 00:58:18,400
hard shell ones might get like a shell of a locust or a grasshopper or something in

671
00:58:18,400 --> 00:58:19,400
there.

672
00:58:19,400 --> 00:58:22,320
But you can take those and a lot of people with outdoors will dip them and clean them

673
00:58:22,320 --> 00:58:26,440
and spray them down with cleaners.

674
00:58:26,440 --> 00:58:33,320
There's certain types of cleaners, like hydrogen peroxide or good rain mimics hydrogen peroxide.

675
00:58:33,320 --> 00:58:37,640
That's why they say taking a little hydrogen peroxide and put it in water is like rainwater.

676
00:58:37,640 --> 00:58:40,880
It'll help clean it and disinfect it and it's good for it.

677
00:58:40,880 --> 00:58:48,640
It might be a good thing to do for outdoor crops too, especially down here where we're

678
00:58:48,640 --> 00:58:53,880
talking about the San Juan Valley where you've got these strong dust storms.

679
00:58:53,880 --> 00:58:57,160
There's always a bunch of stuff in the air.

680
00:58:57,160 --> 00:59:06,440
If there's a good, safe way to dip them in some cleaning solution and stuff, I've

681
00:59:06,440 --> 00:59:11,880
haven't seen it myself, but I've heard when they do it, the water gets dirty looking pretty

682
00:59:11,880 --> 00:59:12,880
quick.

683
00:59:12,880 --> 00:59:17,960
Yeah, I've seen some people take big plants and a 55 gallon bucket of water and they dip

684
00:59:17,960 --> 00:59:23,880
it in there, maybe with the hydrogen peroxide without just to clean off the residues and

685
00:59:23,880 --> 00:59:25,640
whatever blood on it.

686
00:59:25,640 --> 00:59:35,080
Some of that can fail a test of microbes or contamination, heavy metals.

687
00:59:35,080 --> 00:59:38,600
I've heard that happening.

688
00:59:38,600 --> 00:59:46,440
But yeah, some of the heavy metal testing and some of the other stuff is over regulated

689
00:59:46,440 --> 00:59:48,040
in some states.

690
00:59:48,040 --> 00:59:55,480
I believe some of the natural occurring chemicals, like I believe one of them they look for is

691
00:59:55,480 --> 01:00:01,120
going to be a natural forming of strychnine or something like that, which is also in the

692
01:00:01,120 --> 01:00:02,640
seeds of apples.

693
01:00:02,640 --> 01:00:07,640
So, some people say that eating the seeds of apple is actually good for you and it's

694
01:00:07,640 --> 01:00:12,720
anti-cancerous, but then you could read that it has a strychnine, a form of strychnine

695
01:00:12,720 --> 01:00:16,360
that's naturally occurring in the seed itself.

696
01:00:16,360 --> 01:00:23,800
But that same one can fail a heavy metals test in cannabis plant.

697
01:00:23,800 --> 01:00:26,960
So is that actually going to be bad for you?

698
01:00:26,960 --> 01:00:29,200
Because some people say yes, some people say no.

699
01:00:29,200 --> 01:00:36,800
Like the other arsenic is known to be not good for you, proven it can give you cancer.

700
01:00:36,800 --> 01:00:46,600
I mean, I guess there are definitely things that need to be fine tuned over the legal

701
01:00:46,600 --> 01:00:58,360
period that they find a way of how have a more fair taxation and have like more sense

702
01:00:58,360 --> 01:01:08,340
making control mechanism with all this test that this also is for the benefit of the consumer

703
01:01:08,340 --> 01:01:16,360
and not to enrich some kind of testing business or something.

704
01:01:16,360 --> 01:01:18,560
These things will probably fine tuned.

705
01:01:18,560 --> 01:01:21,840
I think it's good.

706
01:01:21,840 --> 01:01:25,960
We never cared in the old days, really.

707
01:01:25,960 --> 01:01:33,680
We would say, well, we would prefer the pot to be grown in an organic way or something,

708
01:01:33,680 --> 01:01:44,960
that you like meaning avoid as many bad things as possible, which one of them would be to

709
01:01:44,960 --> 01:01:51,000
use just salt fertilizer because it's the easiest way to do it and stuff.

710
01:01:51,000 --> 01:02:01,080
If you adopt and learn an organic way to grow, that's then definitely a better tasting pot

711
01:02:01,080 --> 01:02:04,920
than to just grow with like mineral salts.

712
01:02:04,920 --> 01:02:12,640
The pesticides and herbicides are the worst, especially pesticides, indoor and outdoor.

713
01:02:12,640 --> 01:02:17,640
Outdoor people spray herbicides on them too to keep other herbs down too.

714
01:02:17,640 --> 01:02:18,640
That's terrible.

715
01:02:18,640 --> 01:02:24,040
Those are really what will mess up your lung because a lot of the testing from what I heard

716
01:02:24,040 --> 01:02:32,040
of consuming those and being approved by the governing factors, FDA probably in this case

717
01:02:32,040 --> 01:02:38,280
in America, they tested the consumption on food and people eating it, not inhaling it

718
01:02:38,280 --> 01:02:42,920
on something like in a tobacco form or in a cannabis form.

719
01:02:42,920 --> 01:02:49,880
Those pesticides will go straight to your lungs and are more bioavailable to your body

720
01:02:49,880 --> 01:02:54,200
and make you sicker quicker.

721
01:02:54,200 --> 01:02:59,280
Back to Germany, I think they're about to legalize and be the first one in Europe to

722
01:02:59,280 --> 01:03:01,200
go fully legal, right?

723
01:03:01,200 --> 01:03:03,560
Have you been keeping up on that?

724
01:03:03,560 --> 01:03:12,320
I'm not so entirely sure about Europe, but Spain is another place where there's a big

725
01:03:12,320 --> 01:03:23,400
marijuana scene because they have some kind of lax law situation that some kind of thing

726
01:03:23,400 --> 01:03:32,040
where if you don't know and you don't tell, then it's not a problem or something.

727
01:03:32,040 --> 01:03:35,000
I lived in Spain for 12 years.

728
01:03:35,000 --> 01:03:39,280
When I lived, where I lived, it was on the north coast in the center, it was called Santander

729
01:03:39,280 --> 01:03:44,800
in Cantabria, and it was a little more conservative.

730
01:03:44,800 --> 01:03:47,040
So it wasn't like that.

731
01:03:47,040 --> 01:03:51,960
I worked in a restaurant for a little bit, had an owner who was a national police.

732
01:03:51,960 --> 01:03:56,040
He was part owner and he was there for the interview and I said, oh yeah, what about

733
01:03:56,040 --> 01:03:58,800
marijuana and this and this is illegal?

734
01:03:58,800 --> 01:04:03,840
And he said, well, if you grow it home for yourself, we're not going to bother you.

735
01:04:03,840 --> 01:04:07,240
But if you're out distributing it, then it becomes an offense.

736
01:04:07,240 --> 01:04:13,760
But if you go to the next province over where Bilbao and the Guggenheim is and that border

737
01:04:13,760 --> 01:04:16,120
is France, that's a whole other story.

738
01:04:16,120 --> 01:04:19,240
You can get hash right next to the police department.

739
01:04:19,240 --> 01:04:22,360
The police department, they don't really care.

740
01:04:22,360 --> 01:04:26,280
Barcelona on the east coast, that's a whole other story.

741
01:04:26,280 --> 01:04:30,160
That's where Spanibus was, I believe.

742
01:04:30,160 --> 01:04:34,520
They celebrate Spanibus and have an expo there every year.

743
01:04:34,520 --> 01:04:41,440
I've been there like two nights and didn't have any herb walk down the beach.

744
01:04:41,440 --> 01:04:47,040
It was constantly people giving out flyers for the late night scene.

745
01:04:47,040 --> 01:04:51,760
There's a light show DJ here and this and handing them out.

746
01:04:51,760 --> 01:04:54,440
And as they were handing them out, marijuana, ecstasy.

747
01:04:54,440 --> 01:04:58,160
I was like, oh, there you go.

748
01:04:58,160 --> 01:04:59,160
Funny.

749
01:04:59,160 --> 01:05:00,960
I was like, how much?

750
01:05:00,960 --> 01:05:01,960
Ponto?

751
01:05:01,960 --> 01:05:03,960
Oh yeah, come with me.

752
01:05:03,960 --> 01:05:10,920
I walked down the pathway and he'd reach into the bushes and just pull out a bag.

753
01:05:10,920 --> 01:05:11,920
Here you go.

754
01:05:11,920 --> 01:05:12,920
20 euros.

755
01:05:12,920 --> 01:05:13,920
I'm like, okay.

756
01:05:13,920 --> 01:05:16,920
Back to the hotel.

757
01:05:16,920 --> 01:05:25,640
I know not too much about the German cannabis legalization efforts.

758
01:05:25,640 --> 01:05:35,920
I do know that the efforts have been going on forever and nothing would ever really change

759
01:05:35,920 --> 01:05:37,640
in Germany.

760
01:05:37,640 --> 01:05:44,240
And it was still illegal more recently and stuff.

761
01:05:44,240 --> 01:05:53,680
But I think there's some more movement happening now because they have a more newer government

762
01:05:53,680 --> 01:06:07,920
in Germany now and they promised their voters certain changes in the drug policies.

763
01:06:07,920 --> 01:06:14,080
And they were actually really pressured to get something going.

764
01:06:14,080 --> 01:06:15,360
And I think they did.

765
01:06:15,360 --> 01:06:24,800
They made some new laws regarding the cannabis.

766
01:06:24,800 --> 01:06:25,800
It was really bad.

767
01:06:25,800 --> 01:06:31,360
I mean, it was there with heroin at number one schedule or whatever.

768
01:06:31,360 --> 01:06:33,360
Like here in America.

769
01:06:33,360 --> 01:06:34,360
Yeah.

770
01:06:34,360 --> 01:06:39,080
So you could get in really bad trouble.

771
01:06:39,080 --> 01:06:45,200
Like during the time period when I grew up, like in the 70s or something, man, even for

772
01:06:45,200 --> 01:06:50,120
a small amount, people got in so much trouble and stuff.

773
01:06:50,120 --> 01:06:54,640
And so it was only around in the big cities also.

774
01:06:54,640 --> 01:06:55,640
Yeah.

775
01:06:55,640 --> 01:06:59,880
I have been talking to a couple of people in Spain.

776
01:06:59,880 --> 01:07:03,120
When I got there, where I lived, nobody grew.

777
01:07:03,120 --> 01:07:05,040
There was a couple seed shops.

778
01:07:05,040 --> 01:07:09,680
It was legal to sell seeds, but I couldn't find any green herb.

779
01:07:09,680 --> 01:07:10,680
It was all hash.

780
01:07:10,680 --> 01:07:11,680
Morocco or…

781
01:07:11,680 --> 01:07:15,120
It's only a couple hundred miles away.

782
01:07:15,120 --> 01:07:16,120
Yeah.

783
01:07:16,120 --> 01:07:19,520
So they would have a lot of hash smoking with tobacco, like you said.

784
01:07:19,520 --> 01:07:21,080
They would roll it up with tobacco.

785
01:07:21,080 --> 01:07:22,440
And I didn't like it that way.

786
01:07:22,440 --> 01:07:26,040
So I smoked hash out of a little pipe, a little hash pipe.

787
01:07:26,040 --> 01:07:27,880
It treated me well.

788
01:07:27,880 --> 01:07:35,720
But I met a Canadian who had a Northern Lights mother plant that was probably six foot tall.

789
01:07:35,720 --> 01:07:38,640
And we were cutting 50 clones off at the time, taking them to Belvao.

790
01:07:38,640 --> 01:07:41,000
And they would sell them out of the store and clones.

791
01:07:41,000 --> 01:07:42,800
Like it was nothing.

792
01:07:42,800 --> 01:07:46,520
So we got a little plant.

793
01:07:46,520 --> 01:07:47,520
I got another apartment.

794
01:07:47,520 --> 01:07:48,520
I had another room.

795
01:07:48,520 --> 01:07:51,360
And we put up 12 plants there.

796
01:07:51,360 --> 01:07:54,480
And it was the first time I set up and grew.

797
01:07:54,480 --> 01:07:56,680
And it was pretty cool.

798
01:07:56,680 --> 01:08:00,040
It was liberating to be able to grow your own weed.

799
01:08:00,040 --> 01:08:02,080
And I ended up teaching a couple other people.

800
01:08:02,080 --> 01:08:06,200
So now when I go back, there's at least six or seven growers in that town.

801
01:08:06,200 --> 01:08:09,120
And it's pretty easy to find a herb.

802
01:08:09,120 --> 01:08:10,280
And it's a whole different scene.

803
01:08:10,280 --> 01:08:15,320
And they're saying they're just waiting for Germany to legalize.

804
01:08:15,320 --> 01:08:20,280
And then the rest of Europe will probably follow suit just because a lot of them look

805
01:08:20,280 --> 01:08:28,440
up to Germany as being the economic leader in the European Union and very efficient and

806
01:08:28,440 --> 01:08:31,320
don't do too many idiotic things.

807
01:08:31,320 --> 01:08:35,760
So they follow along with them.

808
01:08:35,760 --> 01:08:42,600
Even though the good weather for growing is more south of the Alps.

809
01:08:42,600 --> 01:08:47,720
If you go like Spain is probably a good place to grow.

810
01:08:47,720 --> 01:08:51,040
They used to grow a lot of tobacco in the south.

811
01:08:51,040 --> 01:08:53,480
It's just a water thing there in the south.

812
01:08:53,480 --> 01:08:55,320
Now more than ever.

813
01:08:55,320 --> 01:08:58,400
And the north where I lived, it rained a lot.

814
01:08:58,400 --> 01:08:59,400
Too much then.

815
01:08:59,400 --> 01:09:02,160
That's a beautiful area though.

816
01:09:02,160 --> 01:09:04,520
I like that northern Spain there.

817
01:09:04,520 --> 01:09:07,960
Both northern Italy in the mountains there.

818
01:09:07,960 --> 01:09:08,960
In Switzerland.

819
01:09:08,960 --> 01:09:13,640
There's going to be some good places to grow some out there.

820
01:09:13,640 --> 01:09:20,880
I guess the climate has always changed since then too.

821
01:09:20,880 --> 01:09:29,080
So I guess they're getting some more warmer weather summers in northern Europe as well

822
01:09:29,080 --> 01:09:38,280
where they have a good two, three month period where they have above 80 or something and

823
01:09:38,280 --> 01:09:39,280
be good for growing.

824
01:09:39,280 --> 01:09:43,080
That's the beautiful thing about cannabis though.

825
01:09:43,080 --> 01:09:46,400
You can have different varieties that grow better in certain areas.

826
01:09:46,400 --> 01:09:51,840
There's a little cooler and a little more sunlight or longer days.

827
01:09:51,840 --> 01:09:54,920
They have varieties that will go good.

828
01:09:54,920 --> 01:09:59,920
That's when it comes to the regional cannabis.

829
01:09:59,920 --> 01:10:05,880
I think in California they're starting to get something region terroir.

830
01:10:05,880 --> 01:10:08,240
I can't remember the saying.

831
01:10:08,240 --> 01:10:12,800
But it's going to be kind of like the grapes grown in southern France.

832
01:10:12,800 --> 01:10:14,000
And they get them certified.

833
01:10:14,000 --> 01:10:18,760
These are grapes from this area locally.

834
01:10:18,760 --> 01:10:25,800
That will be their regional touristic attraction when people travel there.

835
01:10:25,800 --> 01:10:28,440
They could get this regional herb.

836
01:10:28,440 --> 01:10:34,040
And I think maybe the south of France and some of the northern Spain would be really

837
01:10:34,040 --> 01:10:35,800
good places to grow too.

838
01:10:35,800 --> 01:10:40,600
Oh yeah, the south of France for sure definitely.

839
01:10:40,600 --> 01:10:43,120
Like in the Pyrenees.

840
01:10:43,120 --> 01:10:44,120
That's like…

841
01:10:44,120 --> 01:10:46,280
In Germany too.

842
01:10:46,280 --> 01:10:50,320
That's where the Dutch come from or the Amish.

843
01:10:50,320 --> 01:10:56,400
My mother's family came from east of the Rhine before there was east and west Germany.

844
01:10:56,400 --> 01:10:59,520
It was just a Germanic land.

845
01:10:59,520 --> 01:11:05,000
It wasn't actually Germany and Holland and different countries there.

846
01:11:05,000 --> 01:11:10,640
But when her ancestors moved to America.

847
01:11:10,640 --> 01:11:11,640
I think in Europe…

848
01:11:11,640 --> 01:11:16,160
And now they were all farmers and it was just farmland.

849
01:11:16,160 --> 01:11:23,800
In Europe it's still really popular with the hash because they have these old traditional

850
01:11:23,800 --> 01:11:34,840
production places in North Africa where they are still making big production every year.

851
01:11:34,840 --> 01:11:47,960
For outdoor growers in North in Europe, in Spain, I think especially in Spain during

852
01:11:47,960 --> 01:11:57,480
the summer, all the pollen of the Moroccan cannabis plants goes up in the air and lands

853
01:11:57,480 --> 01:12:00,680
in Spain and pollinates everything.

854
01:12:00,680 --> 01:12:04,120
That would be crazy.

855
01:12:04,120 --> 01:12:11,440
This is like something that happens to the dismay of these guys that are growing.

856
01:12:11,440 --> 01:12:16,040
That's an issue in the area of 422 or any place you grow outdoor.

857
01:12:16,040 --> 01:12:18,200
If you have males you've got to cut your males down.

858
01:12:18,200 --> 01:12:22,320
But in these areas where you're talking about, they just throw them out there and let themselves

859
01:12:22,320 --> 01:12:26,040
pollinate each other and probably make the hash with the male.

860
01:12:26,040 --> 01:12:31,360
I don't know in how far in the long run that would be a thing that should be improved

861
01:12:31,360 --> 01:12:39,840
I guess, that they also start to be considered about people in other areas are growing and

862
01:12:39,840 --> 01:12:40,840
don't want that.

863
01:12:40,840 --> 01:12:43,840
I think it was an issue in Oklahoma too.

864
01:12:43,840 --> 01:12:50,360
When they started growing there was a lot of grows and it attracted a lot of bugs.

865
01:12:50,360 --> 01:12:54,200
There was a big influx of aphids.

866
01:12:54,200 --> 01:13:02,240
It created new infestation problems of different types of bugs migrating and having a large

867
01:13:02,240 --> 01:13:03,240
food source.

868
01:13:03,240 --> 01:13:08,160
Yeah, I don't know.

869
01:13:08,160 --> 01:13:16,440
What else would I like to say about growing the pot?

870
01:13:16,440 --> 01:13:22,600
I could do it pretty good, but I think it's a lot of work.

871
01:13:22,600 --> 01:13:26,600
It turned out to be a lot of work.

872
01:13:26,600 --> 01:13:36,760
If you don't put in the work you get these things like problems with pests or any kind

873
01:13:36,760 --> 01:13:42,720
of these problems only always come up if you don't pay attention enough.

874
01:13:42,720 --> 01:13:44,200
The new term is dialed in.

875
01:13:44,200 --> 01:13:52,040
If you've got it dialed in, meaning what you're doing, what to prevent, what to feed

876
01:13:52,040 --> 01:13:58,560
it, the timing, what lights, how to cure it, how to dry it, how to do everything, you've

877
01:13:58,560 --> 01:14:00,120
got to dial it in.

878
01:14:00,120 --> 01:14:03,120
It's really hard to do, especially the larger you go.

879
01:14:03,120 --> 01:14:08,240
Some people would blame me of being against large corporate grows, but I'm not.

880
01:14:08,240 --> 01:14:11,800
I feel that the quality goes down, but if they got it dialed in and know what they're

881
01:14:11,800 --> 01:14:18,840
doing there can be some successful large grows, which that's hard to do.

882
01:14:18,840 --> 01:14:25,560
If you got the right amount of people, the right setup, and like you said, you pay your

883
01:14:25,560 --> 01:14:27,320
workers and they can make a living.

884
01:14:27,320 --> 01:14:28,320
That's hard.

885
01:14:28,320 --> 01:14:30,200
Earlier you mentioned making a living off of it.

886
01:14:30,200 --> 01:14:35,720
A lot of these larger places don't want to pay people that know what they're doing.

887
01:14:35,720 --> 01:14:42,880
They just pay them to follow orders and they run out of green thumbs and just find people

888
01:14:42,880 --> 01:14:48,920
that want to have a green thumb but don't have it and it ends up not turning out as

889
01:14:48,920 --> 01:14:49,920
a good thing.

890
01:14:49,920 --> 01:14:58,440
That's the main thing is it's hard to find a quality grower and pay him well, which gets

891
01:14:58,440 --> 01:15:02,640
back to the fact people want to grow their own because they're not getting respected

892
01:15:02,640 --> 01:15:05,360
or paid enough to grow it for somebody else.

893
01:15:05,360 --> 01:15:10,080
I find it to be a very common problem in the industry right now.

894
01:15:10,080 --> 01:15:20,640
I know this is during the growth process, the more every single plant can be monitored

895
01:15:20,640 --> 01:15:28,440
and supervised or something, you kind of ideally want to look once every day or once every

896
01:15:28,440 --> 01:15:36,160
other day below every single plant to see what's going on if there is nothing weird

897
01:15:36,160 --> 01:15:38,320
going on and stuff.

898
01:15:38,320 --> 01:15:46,080
If you have a thousand plants in a space or something, somebody needs to be at least once

899
01:15:46,080 --> 01:15:52,240
a week bowing down on every plant to kind of look and clean it a little bit.

900
01:15:52,240 --> 01:15:55,280
It's hard for one person to grow 50 plants.

901
01:15:55,280 --> 01:15:58,080
High quality and taking care of everything all the time.

902
01:15:58,080 --> 01:16:01,520
It becomes too much for one person.

903
01:16:01,520 --> 01:16:04,080
I don't know, VF.

904
01:16:04,080 --> 01:16:10,160
That's kind of like what I did when I was growing, I was kind of around maybe use four

905
01:16:10,160 --> 01:16:14,120
lights and have about 50 plants.

906
01:16:14,120 --> 01:16:20,360
Then you have some area where you can keep some other plants so you can have a healthy

907
01:16:20,360 --> 01:16:27,080
cloning practice that can give you some extra income, can help some friends with giving

908
01:16:27,080 --> 01:16:31,560
some of them some clones.

909
01:16:31,560 --> 01:16:46,360
That's all good, but then ultimately I like to have the good growers grow the pot.

910
01:16:46,360 --> 01:16:53,320
Then if you decide to be a grower, you kind of should be doing it 100% and stuff.

911
01:16:53,320 --> 01:16:55,560
Then you'll get somewhere.

912
01:16:55,560 --> 01:16:58,080
It could be tedious and it's like having children or a pet.

913
01:16:58,080 --> 01:17:00,280
It's hard to travel and you can't leave them for too long.

914
01:17:00,280 --> 01:17:01,280
Yeah.

915
01:17:01,280 --> 01:17:06,040
I got mine set up where I only have to see them every three or four days now.

916
01:17:06,040 --> 01:17:09,560
I can't give them all the inspection I'd like all the time.

917
01:17:09,560 --> 01:17:12,120
I have to prevent a lot.

918
01:17:12,120 --> 01:17:13,120
Things happen.

919
01:17:13,120 --> 01:17:19,200
It's not an easy task and I salute everybody out there doing it that can do it well and

920
01:17:19,200 --> 01:17:20,200
keep doing it.

921
01:17:20,200 --> 01:17:26,200
It looks nice in your one space though where the plants have these big containers.

922
01:17:26,200 --> 01:17:27,200
What's that?

923
01:17:27,200 --> 01:17:28,200
30 gallons or something.

924
01:17:28,200 --> 01:17:29,200
50 gallon pot.

925
01:17:29,200 --> 01:17:34,600
Then they have a nice space to spread out in there.

926
01:17:34,600 --> 01:17:37,400
That seems like a good thing to do.

927
01:17:37,400 --> 01:17:38,760
It's easier too for me.

928
01:17:38,760 --> 01:17:42,760
It's called no-till gardening.

929
01:17:42,760 --> 01:17:45,000
It's cheaper.

930
01:17:45,000 --> 01:17:54,520
I'm recycling the dirt only by some new amendments to top dress them and to feed them using some

931
01:17:54,520 --> 01:18:03,440
fertilizers from build a soil and ferment a plant extracts this time around.

932
01:18:03,440 --> 01:18:07,760
It's easier because I don't have to water them every two days.

933
01:18:07,760 --> 01:18:14,000
I can water them more and I come back in four days and it's pushing it every three days.

934
01:18:14,000 --> 01:18:21,080
But if I got five to seven gallon pots, especially cloth pots here at this humidity, every two

935
01:18:21,080 --> 01:18:22,880
days you have to water them.

936
01:18:22,880 --> 01:18:28,480
It's like a real very low humidity area around here.

937
01:18:28,480 --> 01:18:32,920
It really makes such a big difference.

938
01:18:32,920 --> 01:18:40,680
You water something and after two days or something it's like dry or something.

939
01:18:40,680 --> 01:18:47,120
I don't like to automatically irrigate because if you're not here and something happens,

940
01:18:47,120 --> 01:18:54,320
a little tiny hose pops off and they say your whole floor is flooded and then you come in

941
01:18:54,320 --> 01:18:57,000
and you're standing in water.

942
01:18:57,000 --> 01:18:58,000
It reminds me of …

943
01:18:58,000 --> 01:18:59,480
People die that way too.

944
01:18:59,480 --> 01:19:00,480
I've heard of people dying.

945
01:19:00,480 --> 01:19:05,800
Like the floor floods and they touch an electrical cord on that water and that actually electrocutes

946
01:19:05,800 --> 01:19:06,800
them.

947
01:19:06,800 --> 01:19:12,580
It really strikes a chord with the watering systems.

948
01:19:12,580 --> 01:19:16,920
Having lived and grown in apartments for 20 years.

949
01:19:16,920 --> 01:19:26,680
I can't tell you how many times my downstairs neighbors came running up the stairs and pound

950
01:19:26,680 --> 01:19:27,680
on my door.

951
01:19:27,680 --> 01:19:30,080
There's a lot of water coming down.

952
01:19:30,080 --> 01:19:33,960
A lot of water.

953
01:19:33,960 --> 01:19:40,800
One time I live above a pizzeria and I had this like 100 gallon reservoir that needed

954
01:19:40,800 --> 01:19:48,800
to be sometimes refilled out of the other 100 gallon reservoir with the reverse osmosis

955
01:19:48,800 --> 01:19:54,640
water and I would have like a huge pump and a thing and it still would take 10 minutes

956
01:19:54,640 --> 01:19:56,880
to pump 100 gallons.

957
01:19:56,880 --> 01:20:01,760
I would always manage to walk away from that.

958
01:20:01,760 --> 01:20:07,040
When that pump flipped the hose, flipped out of the thing or whatever the fuck happened,

959
01:20:07,040 --> 01:20:10,520
it made like a major flood above this pizzeria.

960
01:20:10,520 --> 01:20:16,120
It was amazing and it was like the pizzeria that was the closest to the first precinct

961
01:20:16,120 --> 01:20:21,760
which is the main police headquarters in Manhattan and New York.

962
01:20:21,760 --> 01:20:27,520
These guys are like the pizza guy said to me, you know how many cops come to like have

963
01:20:27,520 --> 01:20:29,680
pizza here every day?

964
01:20:29,680 --> 01:20:39,000
We're like doing a nice 50 plant garden upstairs and this is the irrigation water that's raining

965
01:20:39,000 --> 01:20:41,840
down on you.

966
01:20:41,840 --> 01:20:44,280
But nothing like this ever happened to me.

967
01:20:44,280 --> 01:20:47,440
I never got busted like that.

968
01:20:47,440 --> 01:20:54,760
We had like close calls though where you somehow find out through the super that there is some

969
01:20:54,760 --> 01:21:02,280
kind of inspection or repair thing or something where they need to have access to your space.

970
01:21:02,280 --> 01:21:11,240
And that's like then of course all of a sudden you try to cram 50 plants into a square yard

971
01:21:11,240 --> 01:21:16,520
or something and make that nobody notice it.

972
01:21:16,520 --> 01:21:22,920
I had that six foot mother plant in the middle of downtown, something there in Spain where

973
01:21:22,920 --> 01:21:23,920
I lived.

974
01:21:23,920 --> 01:21:26,280
Carried in a van.

975
01:21:26,280 --> 01:21:30,600
I had to take a trash bag and put it over the top and carry it down the street.

976
01:21:30,600 --> 01:21:35,800
And then the same thing happened, oh inspection.

977
01:21:35,800 --> 01:21:39,080
And I hurried out, had to take it down, no trash bag, run it down through this huge ass

978
01:21:39,080 --> 01:21:40,720
fuck the cannabis plant.

979
01:21:40,720 --> 01:21:45,400
Like Sunday morning, four o'clock in the morning or something, there's nobody out trying to

980
01:21:45,400 --> 01:21:48,400
get into the van and take it somewhere else.

981
01:21:48,400 --> 01:21:52,160
It was frantic.

982
01:21:52,160 --> 01:21:59,200
And I think every grower has been in that situation, especially if they rented, they

983
01:21:59,200 --> 01:22:05,520
had to take everything down within 24 hours, find another place to put it or store it someplace

984
01:22:05,520 --> 01:22:09,560
for a little bit and then bring it back and put it all back up.

985
01:22:09,560 --> 01:22:15,320
I've done that before, it's not fun.

986
01:22:15,320 --> 01:22:21,040
But hey, Andre, it was a great pleasure having you come on the show and tell everybody some

987
01:22:21,040 --> 01:22:23,080
of these great stories.

988
01:22:23,080 --> 01:22:29,180
I highly salute you for all the pictures and keeping up the legacy when it was during the

989
01:22:29,180 --> 01:22:34,280
Prohibition days in New York City and risking your neck.

990
01:22:34,280 --> 01:22:35,280
Thank you.

991
01:22:35,280 --> 01:22:37,240
Thank you too for having me.

992
01:22:37,240 --> 01:22:44,040
And then yeah, we're having a good situation here on the 26th.

993
01:22:44,040 --> 01:22:55,360
We're going to be hanging out at the area 420 in Moffat and continue the exchange of

994
01:22:55,360 --> 01:22:56,960
cannabis knowledge.

995
01:22:56,960 --> 01:23:06,920
I just actually had a new How to Start Growing Cannabis book with a photo of mine on the

996
01:23:06,920 --> 01:23:08,760
cover in the mail a couple of days ago.

997
01:23:08,760 --> 01:23:10,800
So that's always kind of fun.

998
01:23:10,800 --> 01:23:14,800
Which one was it?

999
01:23:14,800 --> 01:23:18,760
It's on my latest Instagram post.

1000
01:23:18,760 --> 01:23:33,600
AGROS 55, by this Canadian publisher.

1001
01:23:33,600 --> 01:23:37,000
Green Candy Publishers out of Canada.

1002
01:23:37,000 --> 01:23:47,640
They have a Grow 101 book and they have a nice one of those Kyle Cushman purple plants

1003
01:23:47,640 --> 01:23:53,680
and that one is a very popular image.

1004
01:23:53,680 --> 01:24:01,600
So if you find an unusual looking pot plant, you can really do something with the photo

1005
01:24:01,600 --> 01:24:06,000
like that, but it needs to be unusual.

1006
01:24:06,000 --> 01:24:08,200
The one picture you're talking about with the purple before.

1007
01:24:08,200 --> 01:24:12,240
Then it went like the High Times cover of the year.

1008
01:24:12,240 --> 01:24:13,240
Yeah, right.

1009
01:24:13,240 --> 01:24:19,320
And they had like a photography special and then it was on the cover of that and it was

1010
01:24:19,320 --> 01:24:27,920
on the cover of the Sunday magazine in 1995.

1011
01:24:27,920 --> 01:24:38,720
This is a photo where if every photo, one could actually drive like a mid-size family

1012
01:24:38,720 --> 01:24:50,200
car or something, but it's just rare that you land like something big and profitable.

1013
01:24:50,200 --> 01:24:53,880
But you keep trying and then you diversify.

1014
01:24:53,880 --> 01:24:57,280
You do like little things here and there.

1015
01:24:57,280 --> 01:24:59,880
You do some of this and some of that.

1016
01:24:59,880 --> 01:25:08,240
Maybe we work together and find ways to do it.

1017
01:25:08,240 --> 01:25:12,600
This is that sounds interesting with your mushroom drop.

1018
01:25:12,600 --> 01:25:24,280
That's the new photography future too with the mushrooms and one of my favorites is the

1019
01:25:24,280 --> 01:25:26,560
time lapse and they're so quick.

1020
01:25:26,560 --> 01:25:31,480
They'll grow in three, four days and you can take the time lapse instead of taking the

1021
01:25:31,480 --> 01:25:33,720
time lapse of a canvas plant like months.

1022
01:25:33,720 --> 01:25:36,280
It takes dedication.

1023
01:25:36,280 --> 01:25:39,200
That's a good idea actually to do that.

1024
01:25:39,200 --> 01:25:41,920
Yeah, and then watch them pop up and eat them in person.

1025
01:25:41,920 --> 01:25:42,920
They come back down.

1026
01:25:42,920 --> 01:25:43,920
It's really cool to watch.

1027
01:25:43,920 --> 01:25:46,920
I like that a lot.

1028
01:25:46,920 --> 01:25:50,000
Okay, let's eat some mushrooms.

1029
01:25:50,000 --> 01:25:55,720
They are legal here now, so that is actually something that's coming up in the near future

1030
01:25:55,720 --> 01:25:59,200
that photography is going to be possible.

1031
01:25:59,200 --> 01:26:05,600
There's so many different strains coming out now and they're everywhere.

1032
01:26:05,600 --> 01:26:06,600
You can get them pretty much.

1033
01:26:06,600 --> 01:26:10,840
They're not for sale anywhere, but if you go to the right place, people are gifting

1034
01:26:10,840 --> 01:26:14,520
them all the time.

1035
01:26:14,520 --> 01:26:16,200
I got some gifted to me the other day.

1036
01:26:16,200 --> 01:26:18,840
If you'd like one, you're more than welcome to have some.

1037
01:26:18,840 --> 01:26:19,840
Thank you.

1038
01:26:19,840 --> 01:26:20,840
Good show.

1039
01:26:20,840 --> 01:26:23,520
Hey, thank you for tuning in everyone.

1040
01:26:23,520 --> 01:26:26,960
Tune in again next week and we'll have another special guest.

1041
01:26:26,960 --> 01:26:27,960
Thank you.

1042
01:26:27,960 --> 01:26:28,960
Peace and love.

1043
01:26:28,960 --> 01:26:34,680
Once again, this episode was brought to you by Area 420 in Moffett, Colorado in the train

1044
01:26:34,680 --> 01:26:35,680
cars.

1045
01:26:35,680 --> 01:26:41,280
They will be holding events all summer long starting on May 26th with a barbecue kicking

1046
01:26:41,280 --> 01:26:46,640
off the season, followed up on June 10th with a seed and genetics fair.

1047
01:26:46,640 --> 01:26:48,820
There are still spaces available for vendors.

1048
01:26:48,820 --> 01:26:54,160
If you're interested, make sure to contact Mountain Valley Events and BrainStrap.

1049
01:26:54,160 --> 01:26:56,680
All links will be found in the description.

1050
01:26:56,680 --> 01:27:00,480
Let them know you heard it on Reefer the Reefer with Little Farmer.

1051
01:27:00,480 --> 01:27:01,480
Thanks for tuning in.

1052
01:27:01,480 --> 01:27:08,480
Don't diss herbal doctors from rumors you heard.

1053
01:27:08,480 --> 01:27:15,480
The man's not a drug dealer, call him Dr. Err.

1054
01:27:15,480 --> 01:27:22,480
Don't diss the herbal doctors from all those rumors that y'all heard.

1055
01:27:22,480 --> 01:27:27,480
Our man's not a drug dealer, we call him Dr. Err.

1056
01:27:27,480 --> 01:27:32,480
For the healing meditation and good vibration.

1057
01:27:32,480 --> 01:27:35,480
For food, view, fiber and a little bit of fun.

1058
01:27:35,480 --> 01:27:39,480
See the joint ain't necessarily the point, but I want more.

1059
01:27:39,480 --> 01:28:01,480
Reduct.