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Welcome to Students Incorporated, a podcast where we dive into relevant topics and issues

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related to the world of business, technology, education, and design.

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I'm your host, Mr. Jason.

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Episodes include student conversations, interviews with thought leaders, and inspirational stories

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with an international flavor.

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This podcast is created and produced with the help of students from the International

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Community School of Bangkok.

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In today's episode, we'll be interviewing a psychology and sociology teacher, Mrs. Julia.

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We'll be talking about psychology and some topics such as discrimination, bias, and prejudice.

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Then, in the second segment, we'll be sharing a couple top 10 lists you won't want to miss.

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Stay tuned.

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Okay, now onto our quote of the day and our headline news.

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The human mind is not a very logical or consistent place.

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Most people, given the choice to face a hideous or terrifying truth or, to conveniently avoid

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it, choose a convenience and piece of normality.

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That doesn't make them strong or weak people, or good or bad people.

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It just makes them people.

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This was said by Jim Butcher.

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As humans, we are all subjected to bias, we make mistakes, and that's okay.

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What matters is what we learn from our mistakes and strive to become a better person as a

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whole.

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And having that mindset already takes a lot of courage.

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So if you do, good job.

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Our first news headline comes from the company Mattel, creator of the iconic Barbie doll.

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It revealed its first Barbie doll representing a person with Down syndrome.

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Mattel worked with the National Down Syndrome Society to create the doll and ensure its

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accuracy.

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Along with portraying physical characteristics of a person with Down syndrome, the doll's

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clothes and accessories also carry special meaning.

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Now for news that is closer to home.

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A heat wave is sweeping across Asia and is breaking temperature records.

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In Bangkok, the heat index was forecasted to reach 50.2 degrees Celsius in the Bangna

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area.

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The temperature might even reach 52.3 degrees Celsius.

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To add to this environmental problem, pollution levels are rising, especially in Chiang Mai.

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Smoke from forest fires and burning crops are only increasing pollution.

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Our final news headline is about the chain bad and beyond.

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The business is closing an additional 87 stores as the retailer tries to consolidate its assets

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before possible bankruptcy filing.

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The store closures have been confirmed by the company.

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The company could file for bankruptcy soon this week.

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Thank you for the quote and the headline news.

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Now let's jump into the first part of our episode.

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Welcome to the podcast, Miss Julia.

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We're glad you can join us today.

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Lion will start us off with our first question.

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Can you please introduce yourself and tell us how many years you have been teaching at

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ICS?

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Sure.

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My name is Mrs. Julia and I've been teaching at ICS for one year and I teach AP Psychology

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and Sociology.

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Our next question is, since you teach both psychology and sociology, can you tell us

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what the differences between the two are?

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They're very much interrelated.

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Psychology is more of a social science that concentrates on the thoughts and behaviors

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of individual people and sociology studies more the thoughts and behaviors of a group

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of people.

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Like for example, if we were going to study homelessness, we might study maybe the mental

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disorders that led somebody to be homeless.

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And in sociology, we would study what societal forces have allowed someone become homeless

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in the first place.

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So they work hand in hand, but they're very different.

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Since this is technically a business podcast, we have a business oriented question for you.

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What are some of your thoughts on employers requiring their employees to take personality

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tests sometimes even before going through the entire hiring process?

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That's a great question, Lyon.

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And if you remember from AP Psych, we did talk about this and how we would feel if a

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lot of the hiring process were based on personality tests.

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I do think there's a place for it.

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I think it has to be the right test.

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I think a lot of you guys are maybe familiar with tests like Myers-Briggs, right?

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You guys know your letters and things like that.

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But actually, if you look up the studies on the company that actually made the Myers-Briggs,

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they themselves would say that test isn't so great for actual hiring, but it'd be great

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for like team building and being able to assess which team members would work well together.

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There are certain tests in that same company.

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There's one called the California Psychological Inventory that does help to diagnose people's

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strengths and weaknesses.

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And let's say a company has like an accounting side and a marketing side.

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If you're very flexible and you're very extroverted, maybe the marketing would be better for somebody

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versus somebody who's in accounting who would like things to be quite rigid.

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And so I do think there is a place for it.

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I don't think it should be the sole indicator for hiring.

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And I do think that people who decide to use it need to be properly trained.

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They can't just administer it and kind of use it as a one sole factor.

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Here's a follow-up question.

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Are there any personality tests that are more accurate than others?

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Actually, there's some research that suggests the big five trait inventory.

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You guys would know that one.

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Ocean, that's right.

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And your different scores on the OCEAN and blind, you can tell us what those mean since

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you're a AP Psych Pro now.

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And also the MMPI, which is another personality inventory that statistically have shown to

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be a little bit more accurate than tests like the Enneagram or the Myers-Briggs just because

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Myers-Briggs and Enneagram a little bit more of a personality test versus the MMPI and

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the big five trait.

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They're nuanced trait inventory.

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So there's different scales and different ratings.

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You can score high or low on different parts of the big trait theory, which helps people

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to be able to gather more information from the test.

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Let's shift gears and discuss some more layered topics that affect business and education.

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Discrimination, prejudice and bias are terms that are used frequently, especially within

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many of the world's political arenas.

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Could you help explain some of the differences between these terms?

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That's a great question.

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I think that's a very hot topic in our current world situation right now.

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Okay, so maybe we can just define some terms.

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Bias is really just a tendency to believe that some people or ideas are better than

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others and it usually leads in some sort of behavior like treating people unfairly or

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unequally.

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Prejudice is an emotional bias.

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Discrimination is a behavioral bias and stereotypes is like a cognitive bias.

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You wanted to break it down in those three simple ways.

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A follow-up would be what is the difference between bias and preference?

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And is this something everyone in the world carries around with them?

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We actually talked about this in sociology today.

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Preference is just an individual's personal leanings.

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Maybe a lion likes chocolate and you like strawberry ice cream, right?

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And the preferences don't necessarily lead to any sort of bias behavior, but sometimes

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they can.

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For instance, today in sociology, we took this implicit bias test on skin color and

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uncovering unconscious bias that really all of us have.

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And it was interesting to see how our preferences can lead to bias.

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So even though preferences don't necessarily indicate bias, a lot of times if they're

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regarding people or ideas, they can lead to bias.

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So it's a little bit different.

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Thank you, Mrs. Julia.

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Now, moving to a larger global perspective, what are some ways regions, nations, and even

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communities can stand together to help reduce discriminatory actions and prejudice attitudes?

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Or is it just a lost cause?

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Oh, I definitely hope it's not a lost cause, right?

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You guys are the future generation right here, right?

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You guys have the keys to shaping your future society.

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So I definitely don't think it's a lost cause.

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But I think it's a great question because I think coming off of the pandemic, we saw

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it with COVID, right?

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People here in Thailand were blaming the foreigners for bringing COVID here and people in America

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were blaming the Asians for bringing COVID there.

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And so this kind of systemic blaming is inherent in all of us, right?

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And I think what is really important for us to realize that it's not a cultural thing,

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but we are all biased, Westerners are biased, Asians are biased, right?

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People from Eastern cultures.

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And I think what was really important is when this started to happen here and even the states,

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there was this outcry on social media that, no, this is not something that we stand for.

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And we talk about this in sociology about how deviance actually helps us to define boundaries,

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right?

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And in some sense, when we deviate from the norm of being racist or being discriminatory,

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we're saying this is not something that we as a culture stand for.

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And so I think not everybody, I mean, if you don't use your social media for that platform,

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that's your own personal decision.

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But I do think that when people use their platforms in their own individual ways, it's

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their voice.

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And it's important that we use that voice to support these kinds of causes and empower

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one another to be able to properly communicate what our true ideals are, even if it's different

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than the mainstream culture.

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Putting this down to our communities, local schools, businesses, and even local governments,

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what are things you think we can do as a community to reduce discrimination and prejudice?

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That's another good question.

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And sometimes it can feel like a really big global issue, right?

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And it can feel like something that's a little bit too big for all of us.

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But you know, like even you two sitting here about to go to college, both of you next year,

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and whatever spheres of influence you guys are in, whether it be business or engine,

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financial engineering, you guys will make choices that will represent the future of

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society.

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And you guys have a choice whether to continue with the precedent set before you or to deviate,

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right?

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Like if you, let's talk about discrimination and bias.

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I know a lot of senior girls, I don't know if you were part of that, Linda, the skin

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tone matters, were you part of that?

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That raising awareness in Asian cultures about all skin tones are beautiful, right?

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If you're in marketing, what will you choose to represent beauty?

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Is it going to be the fair skinned, light complexion person?

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Or is it going to be somebody who, a wide representation of different skin tones, different

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body types, different ages, different ethnicities.

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And when you make those choices, you're raising awareness and you're allowing even like we

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talk about psychology, mere exposure effects, seeing diverse people represented in pop culture

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as being beautiful allows society to change your thinking.

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And so I think that's really important for you guys to think about as you guys go in

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because it can feel like you're going against the current, you know, like when you're the

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new freshmen in school or even the new apprentice at your job.

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But being able to hold on to the ideals, I think that's really important.

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And even like if you guys start to be part of your companies and they do things like

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professional development, like doing things like are we unconsciously biased, right?

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And just being aware of how we all have those seeds and how can we grow in that and continuing

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in those conversations and reading books and being open to our friends that are different

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than us.

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Like those kinds of conversations are really important for us to continue to have.

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So we have this life-long process of learning.

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I think that's what's going to really help our local communities.

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Thank you so much for sharing some of your thoughts about this very important and impactful

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topic.

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Now for our final question, we'd like to ask what advice would you give the average student

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who is graduating and heading off to university or to start a career if they encounter some

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of these negative actions or attitudes in the people around them?

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I think it's interesting for, you know, you guys both sitting here, you guys are both

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Asian and you've grown up maybe in Asian culture.

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I am Asian-American, so I grew up Asian in a very Caucasian culture.

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And so I grew up as a minority.

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And I don't know if you guys have ever grown up where you were the obvious minority, but

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maybe when you guys go to college, you guys will possibly be like that.

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And you'll encounter people who are not from this ICS community, who are not in this international

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kind of environment.

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And you might encounter some ideals that were very different and maybe shocking.

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And I think one thing to really remember is ignorance doesn't always come from a place

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of malice.

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Sometimes ignorance just comes from ignorance and being unaware.

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And so when you are maybe encountering a moment of maybe a racial slur or somebody being ignorant

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or somebody being unkind, try to engage and not react.

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I think you could be the first person that could not, I don't want to say educate, but

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be a point of contact and point of reference and a point of relationship.

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And I think that I'm not trying to belittle the hurt that can come from being prejudiced

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and having prejudiced attitudes and actions shown to you, but be the bigger person and

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engage in, try to allow that to be a learning opportunity for the other person too.

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I think you guys being in an international setting, you have a gift that a lot of people

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don't have.

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So yeah, as you guys go out into the wider world, understand that that will happen and

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then it's hurtful.

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We're not trying to belittle that, but use it as an opportunity.

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Thank you, Miss Julia, for that great advice and insight.

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And with that, we'll be right back after a short PSA.

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We are back with part two, where we are going to share a few top 10 lists that are a little

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more lighthearted in nature.

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The first top 10 list is titled the top 10 things a patient should not say to a therapist.

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And the second top 10 list is titled the top 10 things a therapist should not say to a

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patient.

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Let's get in.

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Number one, the first thing you shouldn't say to a psychologist or a therapist is, can

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you just tell me what's wrong with me already?

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Your therapist does not want to jump to any quick conclusions about what issues you may

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be struggling with.

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This is a process that takes time and requires communication, trust, and some vulnerability.

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Moving on to number two, I don't believe in therapy or psychology.

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You could give the therapist a chance before stating that you don't believe in it.

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We have doctors for our physical health.

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It's important we have doctors for our mental health and emotional health as well.

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The third thing you should not say to a therapist is, you're just trying to make me feel crazy.

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Now, I don't think that is what the mental health professional is trying to do.

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They're here to help, not to categorize or label you.

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Number four is, I'm not like your other patients.

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Let's not assume anything yet.

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We like to think that we're unique and special, but there are probably others who struggle

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with some of the same things.

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And number five is, are you analyzing me right now?

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They're not analyzing or judging you.

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They're there to help you to listen and to make helpful suggestions.

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And number six is, I don't need therapy.

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I can handle it on my own.

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Well, it's not bad to ask for help or advice when dealing with your mental and emotional

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health.

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Sometimes just talking to someone about it will help to alleviate the stress and anxiety.

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Number seven is, you're not helping me at all.

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Sometimes you just need to learn to be patient and trust the process.

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Healing can take time.

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Number eight, I really know what you're going to say.

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Not every therapist thinks or practices their profession the same way.

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Be open to hearing new advice and suggestions.

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Number nine is, I don't want to talk about my feelings.

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Maybe being a little vulnerable in this area will help you get past some of the issues

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you may be experiencing.

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Be brave and share what's on your mind.

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Number 10, the last one, I don't have any problems.

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I'm just here because someone else told me to come.

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It's possible that someone else you're referring to loves and cares about you and wants to

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see you heal and improve.

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And there you have it, the top 10 things a patient should not say to a therapist.

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Okay, moving on to our second list.

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This list is called the top 10 things a therapist should not say to a patient.

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First on this list of things a therapist should not say to their patient is, I don't have

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time to listen to this right now.

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Technically, this is the job of a professional therapist is to listen and listen a lot.

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If listening is not your thing, then you are in the wrong profession.

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The second thing a therapist should not say to a patient is, you're not trying hard enough.

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Ouch.

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Healing can take time and sometimes the ability to understand how hard a person is trying

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is not very clear from the outside.

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Celebrate the small things and be patient.

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And number three is, I don't think you really have any problems.

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A person's emotional and mental state can be a mystery.

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So validation can help and like the previous statement, patients and listening are sometimes

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the best therapy.

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The fourth one is, just get over it and move on.

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This is probably the most shallow advice that can be thrown out there to someone.

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Sometimes it takes a while to get over something.

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Let the process happen and help them along the way.

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And number five is, I have another client who had it much worse than you.

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Invalidation is the opposite of what you're supposed to do in this situation.

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Next on the list is number six.

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It is, your problems aren't that serious compared to others I've seen.

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Again, invalidating another person's concern only makes it worse.

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What may seem small to you may seem quite large to them.

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And number seven is, I can't help you if you don't want to help yourself.

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This may be true, but this statement does not communicate a lot of empathy and compassion.

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Number eight is, you're just making excuses.

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Again, this may be true as well, however, it would be good to find out the why behind

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your excuses instead of just throwing out this statement.

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And number nine is, you're just being irrational.

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This could come across as an insult or communicate you just don't care, which will break trust

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and your credibility.

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Be careful with statements like this.

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And finally, number 10 is, I'm the expert, you need to listen to me.

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True you may be considered an expert as this is your profession, but therapists are also

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humans so stay humble and teachable as well.

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Sometimes therapists can be wrong as well.

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And with that final list item, we have run out of time.

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We all hope you enjoyed our top 10 list and we'd like to give a special thanks to our

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guest Mrs. Julia for providing us with some great insight into the world of psychology

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and sociology and for giving us all great advice about how to avoid and deal with prejudice,

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bias and discrimination.

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Our next episode will feature several special guests who will be sharing with us their experiences

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that span back many years here at our school.

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You may learn a few things you have never heard before, so stay tuned as we look back

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and celebrate our school's 30th year anniversary.

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This podcast would not be possible without the hard work and support of our international

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student production team.

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All music and sound effects are courtesy of Pixabay.com, a vibrant community of creatives

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sharing copyright free images, videos and music.

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And we are signing off until next time.

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We are Students Incorporated because your voice matters.