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Hey guys, welcome to Unleashed where we are the resistance.

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Man today, there's a guess we're going to be having on here that I've known for a number

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of years that I have the utmost respect for.

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His name is Don Higgins and I'll bring him in here in just a second and Don when I get

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done with this, I didn't want to do too big of a bio because you got a huge bio with everything

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you've done.

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But let me kind of give you a little bit of background about Don.

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I mean you're going to discover, I think you're going to love him.

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He's a no-nonsense guy who is in high demand.

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When I speak, doing game dinners, they've all said can you get ahold of Don Higgins if he

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hasn't already been there?

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Like would you, we want to get him back or whatever because he's just a wealth of knowledge.

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He's got an extensive agricultural background.

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He's an author, he's an outdoor writer.

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I'm sure if you hunt the Whitetail Woods, you've read his stuff.

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He's a Whitetail property consultant, a speaker, and a business owner and that's just a name

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of few things.

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But here's one of the things Don that I love about you.

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You don't buy into all the smoke and mirrors.

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From what I know about you from our conversations like at the ATA show, you're really humble,

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you're very down to earth, which I think surprises a lot of people when someone starts gaining

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the platform that you have.

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You and I both know it can begin to change people and a lot of people will go ahead and

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say, hey, I'm going to get all these sponsorships because I have the name now.

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Sponsorships means money.

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You don't go that route.

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You are the one that says they have to have integrity and that's at the very top of your

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list.

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One of my favorite things that stood out to me from your bio.

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It says that your integrity is important to you and it's not for sale.

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Don's a patriot.

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He's a passionate Christ follower and Don knows dear and he knows what he believes and

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stands firmly on that.

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So, buddy, good to have you here.

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Well, thanks for having me, Brent.

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I'll tell you, you did a pretty good job describing me.

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So I guess I'll have to slip you that $100 bill when this is over.

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And I'm guessing that $100 bill isn't going to come out of the shorts you're wearing right

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now.

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No shorts for this country, boy.

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My legs haven't seen the sun in many, many decades.

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Don's got a podcast with his co-host Terry Peer.

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It's called I'm Chasing Giants.

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And on this week's episode, as I was watching it this morning, Terry was teasing you about

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not wearing shorts.

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And that was just funny.

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Sorry, you guys.

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A little inside joke there.

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Well, Eric, you've got something for us here.

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Yeah.

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I got a couple of questions here from both of you guys.

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Uh, these are both pretending to archery.

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Um, Steve from Ohio wants to know what if you're left eye dominant, but you want to

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shoot archery?

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Do you shoot lefty?

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So the guy's right handed, but he's left eye dominant.

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You know what's weird?

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I'm right eye dominant and I bow hunt right handed, but I shoot a gun left handed.

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Isn't that interesting?

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When I was a kid, I think in my mom, I think I was left handed when I was a kid growing

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up.

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My mom wanted me to be right handed because back then it's like, Hey, we want you to be

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a righty and everything.

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Right.

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And so I just kind of adapt.

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I play pool left handed.

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Um, I mean, what's what are your thoughts on that, Don?

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Well, you know, guys, of all the questions that could be asked of me, that is probably

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one of the worst ones because I am not an expert at archery whatsoever.

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I'm self taught back decades ago when I was a kid, I had no one to show me the ropes.

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You know, I went to the local hardware store and got my first bow and it was all self taught

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and I picked up a lot of bad habits along the way.

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Still have them to this day.

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And I'm telling you, if you lined up every celebrity or whatever you want to call them,

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every person within the hunting industry and had an archery tournament or 3D tournament

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or whatever, I promise you, I would be in the bottom 25% and maybe the bottom 10%.

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I'm just not that good of a shot.

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And I think that's one of the reasons I became a decent hunter is because I was such a poor

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shot.

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I had to get them deer close.

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So I had to really sharpen my hunting skills to make it happen.

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So when it comes to archery gear, I'm probably the last person you guys ought to be listening

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to.

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Well, but you know, dear, that's, you know, what was it?

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Dr. Dave Samuel, you know, he's bow hunting, hall of fame guy.

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Dr. Dave, you know, that was one of the things about what was his, what was his, his column?

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Was it, man, I can't remember what it was about knowing deer, but that's exactly what

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I would actually interviewed both of you guys.

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I think it was about 12 years ago.

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Don, I had read your book, Hunting Trophy, White Tales in the Real World.

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Is that right?

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I think that was the first one.

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Yeah, that's it.

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And I mean, I immediately was drawn to that because it was kind of how you are.

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You're no nonsense.

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You and I have both seen so much smoke and mirrors in the industry and there's, there's

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too much of it to go into, but finding out what really works.

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You know, whether you were a, you know, great, you know, archer or not, you've been able

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to put it all together, which very few people have, not in the way that you have.

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So yeah, I don't know whether that, that question was, that's kind of all I can really

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think of.

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Yeah.

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I have no idea.

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So yeah, whatever you guys think, what else you got.

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Okay.

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So this is Ray from Edmonton, Canada.

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Hope it's, is that right?

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Oh yeah, I've driven through there.

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I know that there's actually, I don't know if it's just Ray, but there's, there's several

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episodes being played there.

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So this is good.

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He wants to know what are some general bow hunting strategies for white tales?

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We're going to get into that.

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We're going to, we're going to touch on that stuff.

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You know, one of the things that I would love to, but maybe Don, and if you've got some

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great ideas, man, you just throw them in here, but you know, a little bit later on, the whole

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game is not being seen, heard or smelled.

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I mean, that's the whole thing.

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And this is one of the areas where I know Don is an, is an expert with this.

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So we'll answer that as we go into the podcast.

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If that's okay, is that work where you done?

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That works great for me.

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Okay.

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Awesome.

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Well, man, we met, I can't remember what year it was at the ATA show, but when I interviewed

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you after reading that book, I had done a recording and I think I had, I had Charlie

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Alzheimer, I had you on there.

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I had Dr. Dave Samuel.

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Um, who also had Eddie Clay, you know, Eddie Claypool.

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I'm not real well, but I do know of him and I'm spoken to him a couple of times.

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Amazing hunter.

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Uh, he's, he's writing is it Peterson's bow hunting magazine?

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I think I see a lot of his stuff in, right, but we met at the ATA show and you know, we

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would go over and just kick back and have lunch and just talk about the real world.

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Not about hunting so much, but just about life, you know, our families, what's happening

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in the world.

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Um, it was just, it just gets to know you that way.

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I think it was so good rather than, you know, having this, you know, when you see some of

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the big names, um, you're not even really sure what to talk about.

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And it was a quiet respect that I had for you for years.

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And I had been with Whitetail University with Wade Nolan, you know, Wade passed about

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four years ago now, but I started with him with Whitetail University back in 2005.

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I think it was.

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And when you came, you know, really into the scene with that book, um, man, I was just

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drawn to, to a lot of what we're going to talk about here.

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So let's go ahead.

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We'll just start moving into some of this stuff.

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Um, you know, that first book that you had, I felt you didn't sell out to sponsors.

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Um, and all that, like I said, smoke and mirrors that were in the industry, but it was just

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really, it was, it was more than science scientific.

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It was your real world approach to being successful, what you have tried and tested that you know,

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from your experience, not from what someone else has told you.

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So give us a little bit of background about, you know, how you got into this place growing

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up and you're, you're, um, where you grew up.

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I think it was, it was in Illinois.

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I know that.

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Right.

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Yeah, I grew up in a small town in central Illinois, 250 people and my grandparents owned

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a small farm about three miles outside of town.

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And I seemed like I spent as much time on their small farm as I did at home and you

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know, it had a creek going through it.

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So I would trap and I'd hunt squirrels and small game and such.

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We didn't have deer in our area back then really.

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But, uh, you know, for me, it all comes down to my roots and my upbringing.

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You know, we were simple country people.

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I call myself a simple country boy to this day.

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And uh, you know, uh, our word was worth something.

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A handshake meant more than a written contract and you just, you didn't want to ever go back

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on your word.

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And, you know, I really got into writing based on the fact that I read everything that came

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out about deer hunting every magazine that hit the newsstands.

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I bought it.

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If it had anything, had a single deer article in it, I was buying it and reading it.

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And what happened was I was taking that information that I would read to the woods and try to

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apply it and it almost never worked.

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You know, the story sounded good in the magazines I'd read, but it just didn't work in the

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real world.

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And so at one point I just realized that, Hey, I think I know about as much as most

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of these guys writing these articles, maybe the time I've tried my hand at it.

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And that kind of got the ball rolling for me to start my writing career.

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And yeah, I was, I'd written for, I don't know, probably 10 years or so before I wrote

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the book that you referenced.

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And I had articles published in North American Whitetail, deer and deer hunting, Peterson's

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bow hunting, just about every hunting magazine I've been in at least once or twice.

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I've had hundreds of articles published over the years, but it really started with the

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fact that what I was reading and trying to apply just never seemed to work.

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Tell us a little bit about, you know, everyone knows you now for shooting big bucks.

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I remember reading about how one of your goals was to shoot 150 inch deer early on.

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And then it just, it really progressed to now I was watching the episode the other day

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and you were talking about letting, was it, was it male or smoky that you kept letting

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go by?

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I think it was male.

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It was.

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Yeah.

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And you were, you were driving back from somewhere and you had seen that deer.

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And I think if I remember, you can, you can tell the story, but it was something about

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if that deer didn't have a bunch of points broken off because you knew how big it was,

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this was the year if you could, if you could put it together.

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Yeah.

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So, you know, when I started, any deer was a trophy and it was my target and quickly

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it became bucks only.

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And then it became bucks with at least eight points and then it would have to be bucks that

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scored at least the 125 Pope and young minimum and then 140, then 150 and so forth.

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And you know, it wasn't like it was one year to the next.

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Each one of those steps took me a few years.

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I mean, I wanted to get to the point where I could do that consistently, whatever that

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goal was, and then I would raise the bar.

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But you know, I got to the point where I felt that I could kill any buck that I hunted as

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long as I could get access to the property I needed to for that particular buck.

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And you know, in 2020, I shot my biggest buck ever.

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He actually ends up being the number six all time typical with a bow and a buck I called

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Mel after Mel Johnson, who holds the world record.

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When that buck was a yearling, he had a 10 point rack, a real small 10 point rack.

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And I thought, man, if that buck lives, he has a chance to be something special.

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Well, the very next year when he was two years old, I got pictures of this clean six

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by six typical and I didn't recognize him.

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And the thing is, I pretty much, I know the buck that I'm hunting.

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I mean, I learned them.

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I watched him grow up through trail cameras as well as actual sightings.

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And when that six by six buck came along, I couldn't picture what buck is that, you

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know, I just eat from the previous year.

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I just couldn't picture which one he was.

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And then one day had dawned on me.

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That's that good five by five yearling from the year before and I ran to my computer and

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I started comparing pictures and the rack from both years.

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And sure enough, it's definitely the same buck.

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He just exploded from a little tiny 10 point rack of a yearling to 160 inch two year old.

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That was by far the best two year old I'd ever seen.

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That's crazy.

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It still is to this day.

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00:13:13,160 --> 00:13:17,840
Well I would have never believed he was a two year old had I not known it was the same

232
00:13:17,840 --> 00:13:20,320
buck from the year before.

233
00:13:20,320 --> 00:13:24,440
And people see the pictures of the buck as a yearling and they don't believe he's a yearling.

234
00:13:24,440 --> 00:13:26,600
But I know for a fact he is.

235
00:13:26,600 --> 00:13:30,720
If I would cover up his antlers and people just saw his body, they would, nobody would

236
00:13:30,720 --> 00:13:32,640
argue whatsoever.

237
00:13:32,640 --> 00:13:37,960
He had such a nice rack for a yearling, but you know, I'm moving on.

238
00:13:37,960 --> 00:13:38,960
He went from that.

239
00:13:38,960 --> 00:13:43,680
Well, the year he was the queen six by six two year old.

240
00:13:43,680 --> 00:13:48,000
That's when I named him Mel because, you know, Mel Johnson has the world record typical

241
00:13:48,000 --> 00:13:49,640
with a bow.

242
00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:54,160
And I thought, man, if that buck just lives five or six years old, he might challenge

243
00:13:54,160 --> 00:13:56,760
Mel Johnson's world record.

244
00:13:56,760 --> 00:14:00,400
And so I called him, started calling him Mel as a two year old.

245
00:14:00,400 --> 00:14:06,560
Well the next year as a three year old, he blew up even more over 200 inches, but he

246
00:14:06,560 --> 00:14:08,160
was pretty non typical.

247
00:14:08,160 --> 00:14:10,800
I threw a lot of non typical points.

248
00:14:10,800 --> 00:14:17,320
And boy, I had a big decision to make and I just couldn't bring myself to shoot a three

249
00:14:17,320 --> 00:14:18,320
year old.

250
00:14:18,320 --> 00:14:22,320
No matter how big he was, I knew if I shot him, I would spend the rest of my life looking

251
00:14:22,320 --> 00:14:26,000
at him on the wall thinking what would he have been if I'd let him live?

252
00:14:26,000 --> 00:14:33,360
Don, how many people would even let, you know, something over a 150 walk and you're

253
00:14:33,360 --> 00:14:35,400
talking over a 200 inch deer.

254
00:14:35,400 --> 00:14:40,960
How did you ever come to the decision to not, I mean, I just, I can't even fathom that.

255
00:14:40,960 --> 00:14:48,240
Well, I've, you know, I kind of mastered every step along the way that I described as I continually

256
00:14:48,240 --> 00:14:50,360
raised the bar.

257
00:14:50,360 --> 00:14:54,280
Today I'm really looking for world class bucks and they're pretty hard to find.

258
00:14:54,280 --> 00:14:55,800
I don't have one to hunt every season.

259
00:14:55,800 --> 00:15:00,600
In fact, if I can find one about every three years, I'm doing really good.

260
00:15:00,600 --> 00:15:07,160
But you know, I remember the first time I let a 150 walk and I didn't know at that time

261
00:15:07,160 --> 00:15:10,160
there's a lot of guys that 150 walk today.

262
00:15:10,160 --> 00:15:14,400
But back when I did it, I did not know of a single other hunter who'd ever let a 150

263
00:15:14,400 --> 00:15:16,440
inch buck walk.

264
00:15:16,440 --> 00:15:23,640
And I just, I don't know, God has given me a kind of a different mindset that I don't

265
00:15:23,640 --> 00:15:25,120
need to impress anybody.

266
00:15:25,120 --> 00:15:30,960
And I found that I've learned more the years I don't shoot a deer than the years I do.

267
00:15:30,960 --> 00:15:38,800
Just those seasons I spend a lot more time in a tree observing if I'm not feeling a tag.

268
00:15:38,800 --> 00:15:43,120
And you know, my goal is always to end the season as a better hunter than when I started.

269
00:15:43,120 --> 00:15:48,280
I can start the following season, you know, better than I did this season before.

270
00:15:48,280 --> 00:15:55,560
And you know, I got to the point where the kill was literally not nearly as important

271
00:15:55,560 --> 00:15:57,560
to me as the chase.

272
00:15:57,560 --> 00:15:59,000
And it's the hunt.

273
00:15:59,000 --> 00:16:04,640
And I've shot enough of my target bucks that I know once I shoot that buck, it's over.

274
00:16:04,640 --> 00:16:07,960
Then I'm on a three year search for the next one.

275
00:16:07,960 --> 00:16:14,520
And that's really kind of the down point of that cycle, if you will.

276
00:16:14,520 --> 00:16:18,520
When you've found a world class buck and you're chasing him, that's the fun for me.

277
00:16:18,520 --> 00:16:22,920
Getting those trail camera pictures, you know, spotting him in velvet, coming out on a soybean

278
00:16:22,920 --> 00:16:24,600
field or whatever.

279
00:16:24,600 --> 00:16:29,320
I get such a thrill out of that that I don't really need to put an arrow in one anymore.

280
00:16:29,320 --> 00:16:34,240
Because, you know, I don't want this to sound arrogant because I don't mean it that way

281
00:16:34,240 --> 00:16:38,720
at all, but I've tagged way more than my per share of giants.

282
00:16:38,720 --> 00:16:45,040
And one more is not going to, it's not going to change my reputation among other hunters.

283
00:16:45,040 --> 00:16:48,680
It's not going to change how I feel about myself.

284
00:16:48,680 --> 00:16:50,000
It's just not going to change me.

285
00:16:50,000 --> 00:16:55,160
So the need to kill another giant is not there.

286
00:16:55,160 --> 00:16:58,280
Another desire is there, but the need is not there.

287
00:16:58,280 --> 00:17:02,360
You know, one of the things that I talk about on here is identity and where our worth and

288
00:17:02,360 --> 00:17:03,360
value comes from.

289
00:17:03,360 --> 00:17:08,040
And that makes total sense because when you're not getting your worth and value from all

290
00:17:08,040 --> 00:17:11,680
the people in the hunting industry because of, you know, how many big bucks you've shot,

291
00:17:11,680 --> 00:17:18,520
it doesn't, it doesn't press you to try to go and kill the next, you know, 180, 190 because

292
00:17:18,520 --> 00:17:20,120
you're not out there to impress anybody.

293
00:17:20,120 --> 00:17:22,120
It's, it's, it's your game.

294
00:17:22,120 --> 00:17:23,760
This is what you're doing is for you.

295
00:17:23,760 --> 00:17:24,760
It's your passion.

296
00:17:24,760 --> 00:17:28,200
And you can stay as patient as you want to because you're not trying to get anybody else's

297
00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:29,200
good opinion of you.

298
00:17:29,200 --> 00:17:34,080
I mean, that's, it just really goes along with a lot of what we talk about on here.

299
00:17:34,080 --> 00:17:39,400
No, one of the funny things, and if you guys, if you want to see, he's, he shot an amazing

300
00:17:39,400 --> 00:17:41,840
video on Mel.

301
00:17:41,840 --> 00:17:45,320
It's on the, it's on chasing giants, but what was, I don't remember if there was, was there

302
00:17:45,320 --> 00:17:46,320
an episode number?

303
00:17:46,320 --> 00:17:47,720
Was it just about Mel?

304
00:17:47,720 --> 00:17:53,840
It's on the chasing giants with Higgins Outdoors YouTube channel.

305
00:17:53,840 --> 00:18:01,800
You can just go through the hunts and I forget the title of it, but yeah, I've watched it

306
00:18:01,800 --> 00:18:02,800
a couple of times.

307
00:18:02,800 --> 00:18:03,920
I think it's just simply Mel.

308
00:18:03,920 --> 00:18:05,200
I think, I think it is.

309
00:18:05,200 --> 00:18:08,640
And one of the things that I think it'd be interesting for the viewers out there to know

310
00:18:08,640 --> 00:18:13,480
when, when, when Don finally took this buck, you had COVID.

311
00:18:13,480 --> 00:18:14,480
Yep.

312
00:18:14,480 --> 00:18:17,160
And so here's the, one of the funniest things.

313
00:18:17,160 --> 00:18:21,880
I don't mean to give this away, but when, when you shot Mel and you, and you knew he'd

314
00:18:21,880 --> 00:18:25,480
gone down, you know, you hit him through the vitals and you heard him crash.

315
00:18:25,480 --> 00:18:27,880
Did you run right over and see Mel?

316
00:18:27,880 --> 00:18:32,000
No, I actually went back to the house and called my grandsons.

317
00:18:32,000 --> 00:18:33,000
I won my grandson.

318
00:18:33,000 --> 00:18:34,000
They live in Indiana.

319
00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:35,960
So they live two hours away.

320
00:18:35,960 --> 00:18:40,880
I wanted them boys to be with me when I walked up on him because I knew that there was probably

321
00:18:40,880 --> 00:18:47,400
very little chance that they would ever get a chance to walk up on a 200 inch buck with

322
00:18:47,400 --> 00:18:49,240
their grandpa in their life.

323
00:18:49,240 --> 00:18:50,240
So you wouldn't take a nap.

324
00:18:50,240 --> 00:18:52,240
I did.

325
00:18:52,240 --> 00:18:59,200
And you know that video that we're referencing here, it's got almost 2 million views today.

326
00:18:59,200 --> 00:19:04,000
And I get so many, it was professionally done, not by myself, but by Steve Shields,

327
00:19:04,000 --> 00:19:06,000
a good friend of mine.

328
00:19:06,000 --> 00:19:09,400
And I'm telling you, he did a fantastic job.

329
00:19:09,400 --> 00:19:13,080
I didn't give him much to work with being a simple country boy.

330
00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:17,080
I'm not, you know, Mr. Photogenic or anything.

331
00:19:17,080 --> 00:19:20,960
Like that, Mr. Charisma, get on the camera.

332
00:19:20,960 --> 00:19:25,080
And he took what little I gave him to work with and he turned it into a masterpiece.

333
00:19:25,080 --> 00:19:26,080
It's excellent.

334
00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:28,640
It's guys, you got to go and look that up.

335
00:19:28,640 --> 00:19:30,040
It's an amazing video.

336
00:19:30,040 --> 00:19:32,280
It was really well done.

337
00:19:32,280 --> 00:19:34,080
And then so smokey.

338
00:19:34,080 --> 00:19:36,440
Now, what year did you take smokey?

339
00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:38,480
That would have been 2017.

340
00:19:38,480 --> 00:19:41,680
And he had was a 20 points.

341
00:19:41,680 --> 00:19:44,840
I know he only had 13.

342
00:19:44,840 --> 00:19:47,840
What was the one I'm thinking or was that?

343
00:19:47,840 --> 00:19:51,280
Well, I shot one in 2004 that had 20 points.

344
00:19:51,280 --> 00:19:53,280
That's what I'm remembering.

345
00:19:53,280 --> 00:19:54,280
Yeah.

346
00:19:54,280 --> 00:19:55,280
And that one scored.

347
00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:57,280
Was it was it 214?

348
00:19:57,280 --> 00:19:58,280
Yeah, it was 214.

349
00:19:58,280 --> 00:19:59,280
Yeah, man.

350
00:19:59,280 --> 00:20:02,840
So how many over 200 now have you taken?

351
00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:03,840
Three.

352
00:20:03,840 --> 00:20:10,080
And this is, this is not, you know, this is not high fence stuff that you're doing.

353
00:20:10,080 --> 00:20:11,080
No.

354
00:20:11,080 --> 00:20:13,080
And so, no, I'm not sure.

355
00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:16,120
And so, no, it's they're wild.

356
00:20:16,120 --> 00:20:18,200
Never since the word.

357
00:20:18,200 --> 00:20:22,640
So you know, when I was a kid, my dad would take me hunting and I talked about this.

358
00:20:22,640 --> 00:20:26,240
I think in a couple episodes ago, my dad knew nothing about hunting at all.

359
00:20:26,240 --> 00:20:29,600
You know, he wanted to be with me, which now I value that.

360
00:20:29,600 --> 00:20:32,400
I go back and go, you know, he didn't care anything about him, but he wanted to be with

361
00:20:32,400 --> 00:20:35,440
me, but I'll never forget the first time we went out.

362
00:20:35,440 --> 00:20:37,720
He went back in the house and came out and I could smell something.

363
00:20:37,720 --> 00:20:38,720
I said, dad, what is that?

364
00:20:38,720 --> 00:20:40,040
And he says, well, I put on old spice.

365
00:20:40,040 --> 00:20:41,920
He was a school teacher.

366
00:20:41,920 --> 00:20:46,080
We saw nothing that whole day because that's what he did.

367
00:20:46,080 --> 00:20:47,320
You know, he's went in and put on old spice.

368
00:20:47,320 --> 00:20:51,520
He didn't know anything about it, but his passion to be with me just helped fill my

369
00:20:51,520 --> 00:20:53,640
fire, you know, for white tails.

370
00:20:53,640 --> 00:20:55,480
So let's let's touch on something for a minute.

371
00:20:55,480 --> 00:20:59,680
So I love talking about, you know, the three things in the game is don't be seen, heard

372
00:20:59,680 --> 00:21:00,680
or smelled.

373
00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:05,680
Obviously, don't put on old spice, but going back to the don't be seen part.

374
00:21:05,680 --> 00:21:09,560
I've heard you on a lot of your podcasts, you know, talk about, you know, entrance and

375
00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:14,200
exit, you know, all those different things touch on the, on the scene part of that, if

376
00:21:14,200 --> 00:21:15,200
you would.

377
00:21:15,200 --> 00:21:20,800
Well, you know, I think most deer hunters don't realize it, but most of the time they've

378
00:21:20,800 --> 00:21:24,200
run their hunt before they ever climb into their stand.

379
00:21:24,200 --> 00:21:28,760
They've alerted the deer in their hunting areas that they are there.

380
00:21:28,760 --> 00:21:32,800
And before they ever get into that tree and you know, the deer either sees them, smells

381
00:21:32,800 --> 00:21:34,240
them or hears them.

382
00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:40,200
So, you know, access or entrance to your stand location is very critical for success.

383
00:21:40,200 --> 00:21:45,160
And I don't think most deer hunters recognize just how critical it is because if that deer

384
00:21:45,160 --> 00:21:47,960
sees, smells or hears you before you get there, it's over.

385
00:21:47,960 --> 00:21:50,960
He's not going to be walking past your stand.

386
00:21:50,960 --> 00:21:53,080
And I know you do trail cams a lot.

387
00:21:53,080 --> 00:21:56,280
So like a lot of guys out there are doing them, but they're like, they're going back

388
00:21:56,280 --> 00:21:58,020
every month and they're accessing it.

389
00:21:58,020 --> 00:22:01,400
Now they have, you know, the, you can do them through your cell phone.

390
00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:03,920
But what are you, because I've heard you talk about this, but touch a little bit on

391
00:22:03,920 --> 00:22:06,160
pressuring your property.

392
00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:11,120
Well, I also use my, my cameras different than most hunters.

393
00:22:11,120 --> 00:22:14,840
I think most hunters are putting those cameras out there and they're running back and checking

394
00:22:14,840 --> 00:22:16,760
them on a fairly regular basis.

395
00:22:16,760 --> 00:22:21,920
And they're looking for that buck to do something that they can immediately take advantage of.

396
00:22:21,920 --> 00:22:25,840
And so they go, they pull their car, they come home, they throw it in the computer and

397
00:22:25,840 --> 00:22:29,240
oh man, my target buck has come by in daylight hours.

398
00:22:29,240 --> 00:22:30,600
It's time to start hunting.

399
00:22:30,600 --> 00:22:32,720
Well, no, you're already late to the game.

400
00:22:32,720 --> 00:22:37,080
And the time to start hunting was right there before he started moving in daylight.

401
00:22:37,080 --> 00:22:42,720
And so then they go back and, you know, they're probably taking a stand in with them and cutting,

402
00:22:42,720 --> 00:22:47,440
shooting lanes and, and they're bumping the deer off.

403
00:22:47,440 --> 00:22:52,360
Well, I use my trail cameras to gather annual data.

404
00:22:52,360 --> 00:22:59,720
So if I see a buck, I get a picture of a buck at a particular location at a, whatever date,

405
00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:05,000
I can pretty much figure that that buck is going to be in that area the same date the

406
00:23:05,000 --> 00:23:07,240
following year.

407
00:23:07,240 --> 00:23:11,520
And it's really uncanny how a mature buck has an annual pattern.

408
00:23:11,520 --> 00:23:16,400
And I'm putting that pattern together years before I hunt that deer.

409
00:23:16,400 --> 00:23:20,880
And in some cases, four or five years, there's one buck that I watched for six years and I

410
00:23:20,880 --> 00:23:24,600
went in and I killed him the first morning, a hundred point when he was six and a half

411
00:23:24,600 --> 00:23:25,760
years old.

412
00:23:25,760 --> 00:23:28,400
But it's that annual day.

413
00:23:28,400 --> 00:23:35,120
I'm not, when that buck is going to move past my stand, that stand has been in place for

414
00:23:35,120 --> 00:23:36,120
at least months.

415
00:23:36,120 --> 00:23:42,000
And in some cases, a couple of years, just waiting for that prime opportunity.

416
00:23:42,000 --> 00:23:46,520
And then when that comes along, you know, I'm getting in there and it's my first trip

417
00:23:46,520 --> 00:23:48,720
in, I didn't go have to go in and hang a stand.

418
00:23:48,720 --> 00:23:51,400
I didn't have to go in and hang trail cameras.

419
00:23:51,400 --> 00:23:53,520
I just know the buck's still alive.

420
00:23:53,520 --> 00:23:58,720
He's going to be doing this and that on these dates or close to it.

421
00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:01,360
And when the conditions are right, I go in and hunt.

422
00:24:01,360 --> 00:24:06,800
How like with your height on your deer stands, you know, you doing all the above, you know,

423
00:24:06,800 --> 00:24:10,440
ladder stands, lock-ons, climbers, or do you kind of stick with one and what height are

424
00:24:10,440 --> 00:24:13,200
you typically going at?

425
00:24:13,200 --> 00:24:18,600
I've got every kind of stand ever known to man, including enclosed elevated blinds.

426
00:24:18,600 --> 00:24:21,600
But the height varies by the tree.

427
00:24:21,600 --> 00:24:23,800
I think it's way more important to be hidden that tree.

428
00:24:23,800 --> 00:24:29,320
I mean, I've got stands that I can literally almost reach up and touch the platform.

429
00:24:29,320 --> 00:24:35,080
So there may be eight foot off the ground and real thick, brushy trees and also brushy

430
00:24:35,080 --> 00:24:40,280
terrain where you don't want to get too high or you just lose all your vision.

431
00:24:40,280 --> 00:24:45,080
And then I've got other stands are 30 feet, maybe 35 feet even high.

432
00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:48,880
So it just, it varies greatly by the tree more than anything.

433
00:24:48,880 --> 00:24:50,480
I don't know about 35 feet, buddy.

434
00:24:50,480 --> 00:24:52,760
I don't think I could do that.

435
00:24:52,760 --> 00:24:55,160
I mean, you know, I was, I don't have many like that.

436
00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:58,840
Oh, I got certified as a tree stand safety instructor back in 2007.

437
00:24:58,840 --> 00:25:02,760
I think it was, you know, we had to do investigations and different things with guys.

438
00:25:02,760 --> 00:25:09,040
And there was a guy in Louisiana who, uh, he was Cajun background and he had a tree

439
00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:12,000
stand 60 feet off the ground.

440
00:25:12,000 --> 00:25:14,320
And he obviously he fell and he passed away.

441
00:25:14,320 --> 00:25:16,320
No safety harness.

442
00:25:16,320 --> 00:25:17,320
I still do this day.

443
00:25:17,320 --> 00:25:22,360
And I even believe someone wasn't wearing a safety harness up there, but 60 feet.

444
00:25:22,360 --> 00:25:23,360
That's nuts.

445
00:25:23,360 --> 00:25:26,760
But I think, oh, go ahead.

446
00:25:26,760 --> 00:25:32,760
I was just going to say, I don't have very many that even are 30 feet today, but I have

447
00:25:32,760 --> 00:25:36,040
in the past had a lot of them over 30 feet older.

448
00:25:36,040 --> 00:25:41,360
I get the more, uh, more, I love the ground and stay close to it.

449
00:25:41,360 --> 00:25:44,400
So do you play the thermals into the height of your tree stand for morning and evening

450
00:25:44,400 --> 00:25:45,400
hunts?

451
00:25:45,400 --> 00:25:47,400
What are your thoughts on that consideration or more just being covered up and play the

452
00:25:47,400 --> 00:25:48,400
wind?

453
00:25:48,400 --> 00:25:53,440
Uh, it's more about playing the wind than anything that terrain that I'm hunting is

454
00:25:53,440 --> 00:25:54,640
fairly flat.

455
00:25:54,640 --> 00:25:56,040
I don't have big hills.

456
00:25:56,040 --> 00:25:59,640
So the thermals don't come into play near as much.

457
00:25:59,640 --> 00:26:05,840
Although I do understand that, you know, you get 20 feet up in a tree stand and it affects

458
00:26:05,840 --> 00:26:07,840
there's effect from the thermals as well.

459
00:26:07,840 --> 00:26:14,400
I mean, a lot of guys will say, you know, they swear a certain sent control product works

460
00:26:14,400 --> 00:26:18,360
because they had deer downwind of them and they didn't spell them.

461
00:26:18,360 --> 00:26:21,520
Well, you know, my explanation is pretty simple.

462
00:26:21,520 --> 00:26:25,520
The other days when, you know, you can see your neighbor's burning his leaves or something

463
00:26:25,520 --> 00:26:28,080
that smoke is going straight up in the air.

464
00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:32,920
And there's other days when that smoke is, is hanging down on the ground and your scent

465
00:26:32,920 --> 00:26:34,240
is doing the same thing.

466
00:26:34,240 --> 00:26:37,280
There's days when you can be in your tree and the deer can be straight downwind of

467
00:26:37,280 --> 00:26:39,760
being your sense going right over the top of them.

468
00:26:39,760 --> 00:26:43,320
One of the companies that, that, uh, you know, I've followed, actually, that's how we met.

469
00:26:43,320 --> 00:26:46,120
I was working for them at the ATA show was a company.

470
00:26:46,120 --> 00:26:49,800
It was called Attsco and this isn't, I'm not trying to do a plug here, but the research

471
00:26:49,800 --> 00:26:54,200
and again, I love them all and I think they make great products, but the research in, in

472
00:26:54,200 --> 00:26:58,560
dead skin cells, you know, when we're exfoliating, you know, like with a glove, you know, getting

473
00:26:58,560 --> 00:27:02,520
those dead skin cells off, you know, that.

474
00:27:02,520 --> 00:27:07,120
Respiring of that specific body odor that we have, you know, it's funny in white tails,

475
00:27:07,120 --> 00:27:11,880
the amount of receptors that they have compared to a human is, is what is it?

476
00:27:11,880 --> 00:27:16,960
They say that a white tail smells up to 10,000 times better, um, you know, than we do.

477
00:27:16,960 --> 00:27:20,920
And I always say it's like this when I, when I, you walk into grandma's house at Thanksgiving,

478
00:27:20,920 --> 00:27:21,920
right?

479
00:27:21,920 --> 00:27:26,240
And you can just smell this amazing meal, but a white tail walks in there.

480
00:27:26,240 --> 00:27:28,280
He doesn't smell an amazing meal.

481
00:27:28,280 --> 00:27:32,480
He can tell you every single thing it's cooking that sweet potato pie, you know, that's turkey,

482
00:27:32,480 --> 00:27:35,000
that's dressing that because he can identify everything.

483
00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:39,080
And so, you know, a lot of the smoke and mirrors that I, I discovered early on was a lot of

484
00:27:39,080 --> 00:27:43,520
these companies that promise you, you know, all these different things, you know, whether

485
00:27:43,520 --> 00:27:48,080
it was a cover cent or whatever it was, um, he smells it.

486
00:27:48,080 --> 00:27:50,160
He goes, that's raccoon urine, that's fox urine.

487
00:27:50,160 --> 00:27:55,120
Uh, you hung your stuff outside of a smoke, you know, wood stove and that's a human scent.

488
00:27:55,120 --> 00:27:57,040
He can identify every single one of those.

489
00:27:57,040 --> 00:28:01,360
So I don't buy a whole lot into, you know, the whole game with all the cover cent stuff,

490
00:28:01,360 --> 00:28:06,480
but I do love the, uh, the camel that you were wearing in that video.

491
00:28:06,480 --> 00:28:08,480
Who makes that?

492
00:28:08,480 --> 00:28:11,200
Oh, was that the Ocio Camo?

493
00:28:11,200 --> 00:28:12,200
Yeah.

494
00:28:12,200 --> 00:28:13,200
Yes.

495
00:28:13,200 --> 00:28:14,200
Yeah.

496
00:28:14,200 --> 00:28:15,200
Ocio.

497
00:28:15,200 --> 00:28:16,200
I love the guy.

498
00:28:16,200 --> 00:28:22,720
Joe Miles, a great hunter out of South Carolina, came up with that camel pattern.

499
00:28:22,720 --> 00:28:27,800
Oh, I, when you were standing in the one tree, I think it's when you shot Mel and I was looking

500
00:28:27,800 --> 00:28:31,600
at that Camo and I went, man, I really liked that Camo.

501
00:28:31,600 --> 00:28:32,600
I mean, I love the pattern.

502
00:28:32,600 --> 00:28:34,600
Now that would have been a different Camo.

503
00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:37,120
Which one was I trying to think what, or maybe it was smoke.

504
00:28:37,120 --> 00:28:39,360
I can't remember which one it was.

505
00:28:39,360 --> 00:28:45,720
Uh, it was probably, it was probably Mel, I'm guessing.

506
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:46,720
But I love it.

507
00:28:46,720 --> 00:28:49,440
And one of the things I'm always looking for in Camo, and I don't know how you feel about

508
00:28:49,440 --> 00:28:50,440
this.

509
00:28:50,440 --> 00:28:52,720
I don't know that I've heard the episode with you talking about it or not, but like with

510
00:28:52,720 --> 00:28:54,720
you be dies and brightners.

511
00:28:54,720 --> 00:28:56,240
What's your take on that?

512
00:28:56,240 --> 00:28:59,960
Well, I think there's definitely something to it.

513
00:28:59,960 --> 00:29:06,440
Um, it's, you know, there's, there's a lot of things that I think we, we understand that

514
00:29:06,440 --> 00:29:07,720
it has some effect.

515
00:29:07,720 --> 00:29:10,320
We just don't fully realize what effect.

516
00:29:10,320 --> 00:29:12,600
And it's kind of like the red moon.

517
00:29:12,600 --> 00:29:16,120
I get questions about the moon phases all the time and how that affects your movement.

518
00:29:16,120 --> 00:29:22,000
I do believe there's something to it, but I'm not knowledgeable enough to put my finger

519
00:29:22,000 --> 00:29:23,480
on exactly what it is.

520
00:29:23,480 --> 00:29:26,920
And I think it's the same way with these UV brightners.

521
00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:32,800
We don't know, I personally don't know specifically how a deer's eyes work.

522
00:29:32,800 --> 00:29:37,360
I know that they can pick up movement very, very easy.

523
00:29:37,360 --> 00:29:41,440
And yet there's times where you can stand still and they'll almost walk right by it

524
00:29:41,440 --> 00:29:43,160
a few feet.

525
00:29:43,160 --> 00:29:49,280
So, uh, you know, one of the long-winded way of saying, I don't know how your eyes work.

526
00:29:49,280 --> 00:29:51,600
We did, I did some experimenting just like you.

527
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:54,720
You said, I remember when you got some sync control stuff and someone had sent you some

528
00:29:54,720 --> 00:29:56,440
things and you said, I'm going to try them and these things.

529
00:29:56,440 --> 00:29:57,800
I'll let you know what I think.

530
00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:03,960
I did some testing with, with UV on blaze orange and I had a blaze orange vest.

531
00:30:03,960 --> 00:30:08,560
I went out during a gun season back in Pennsylvania when I was living back there years ago and

532
00:30:08,560 --> 00:30:12,440
man, I'm telling you, I was at the edge of the field and they saw me.

533
00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:15,240
And one of the things that, you know, I think it's the University of Georgia did the study

534
00:30:15,240 --> 00:30:21,600
on all this stuff, that behavioral research, um, that deer do absolutely see ultraviolet

535
00:30:21,600 --> 00:30:23,560
powered, um, what do they call them?

536
00:30:23,560 --> 00:30:27,640
Optical brightners way better than we do, but they only see in two colors, according

537
00:30:27,640 --> 00:30:29,280
to their research, and that was blue and yellow.

538
00:30:29,280 --> 00:30:32,280
And they did some kind of an experiment with food to get them to come.

539
00:30:32,280 --> 00:30:34,680
That's how they were discovering all this stuff.

540
00:30:34,680 --> 00:30:39,360
But I had these deer spot me or blow on stop and I had the wind in my favor.

541
00:30:39,360 --> 00:30:41,080
And then someone had done a drive.

542
00:30:41,080 --> 00:30:44,880
We were doing experiment and I was, I went into the woods and I put on a different blaze

543
00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:47,640
orange vest that was, um, UV dead.

544
00:30:47,640 --> 00:30:49,960
We treated it to get the UV out of it.

545
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:51,160
And those deer about ran me over.

546
00:30:51,160 --> 00:30:53,360
It had no clue I was standing there.

547
00:30:53,360 --> 00:30:56,480
So I know I've had it happen, like being up in a tree stand and you see that maternal

548
00:30:56,480 --> 00:30:59,520
doe walking through and all of a sudden you didn't move the winds right.

549
00:30:59,520 --> 00:31:02,640
And all of a sudden she just pops her head and looks right at you.

550
00:31:02,640 --> 00:31:04,160
And I mean, I understand it's their bedroom.

551
00:31:04,160 --> 00:31:07,760
They know everything that should or shouldn't be in a certain area, but I think there is,

552
00:31:07,760 --> 00:31:11,880
you know, something went something to that, but let's move on to the herd part.

553
00:31:11,880 --> 00:31:16,760
You know, we, we talked a little bit about, you know, approaching the stand and now you

554
00:31:16,760 --> 00:31:21,160
had, what was your sponsor that was the bike that you had getting in and out quietly to

555
00:31:21,160 --> 00:31:22,160
your stand?

556
00:31:22,160 --> 00:31:24,160
Not quite yet.

557
00:31:24,160 --> 00:31:28,240
Yes, talk a little bit about, you know, not being heard.

558
00:31:28,240 --> 00:31:37,400
Well, I mean, a mature buck is so in tune with his surroundings that, you know, he knows

559
00:31:37,400 --> 00:31:42,080
the difference between a squirrel running through the leaves and, you know, another deer coming

560
00:31:42,080 --> 00:31:46,080
through the leaves and a human coming through the leaves or whatever.

561
00:31:46,080 --> 00:31:51,680
It's, he just, it does you no good to address everything else and not address the sound

562
00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:53,200
that you make.

563
00:31:53,200 --> 00:31:59,560
So you can be totally sent free and you can be camoed up, but if you make too much sound

564
00:31:59,560 --> 00:32:02,960
getting to your stand or while you're in your stand, the hunt's over.

565
00:32:02,960 --> 00:32:08,160
A mature buck is just not going to come and investigate like a doe a lot of times will.

566
00:32:08,160 --> 00:32:10,320
You know, she sees you move.

567
00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:14,160
She's not, she's not leaving until she figures it out.

568
00:32:14,160 --> 00:32:16,760
She'll circle around downwind and then she gets your scent.

569
00:32:16,760 --> 00:32:21,360
She'll stomp and blow and tell everybody I mature bucks, see something that he don't

570
00:32:21,360 --> 00:32:24,600
like, he just turns and walks away.

571
00:32:24,600 --> 00:32:26,880
So they're just totally different.

572
00:32:26,880 --> 00:32:29,080
Mature bucks are totally different animal.

573
00:32:29,080 --> 00:32:33,560
I think that's another thing that probably holds a lot of deer hunters back is I think

574
00:32:33,560 --> 00:32:40,280
they're too successful at hunting other deer that it's really hard for them to change their

575
00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:43,680
tactics to hunt older mature bucks.

576
00:32:43,680 --> 00:32:48,080
Do you move your, do you move your trail cameras around a lot with, I mean, you used to have

577
00:32:48,080 --> 00:32:51,120
multiples now, but I was like trying to find it.

578
00:32:51,120 --> 00:32:52,120
I'm trying to remember.

579
00:32:52,120 --> 00:32:55,640
It's been a while since I read that first book of yours, but trying to understand their

580
00:32:55,640 --> 00:32:58,920
patterns through each season of the year.

581
00:32:58,920 --> 00:33:04,960
And you said something, and I do remember this, that a mature monster buck, he finds

582
00:33:04,960 --> 00:33:07,920
that place that he knows nobody else is going to pressure.

583
00:33:07,920 --> 00:33:11,200
And one of the goals is to try to find that.

584
00:33:11,200 --> 00:33:13,040
Oh yeah.

585
00:33:13,040 --> 00:33:20,640
I believe without any doubt that every mature buck alive today has a sanctuary, a place

586
00:33:20,640 --> 00:33:22,640
where he goes when the heat's on.

587
00:33:22,640 --> 00:33:25,280
If he didn't, he would have never made it to maturity.

588
00:33:25,280 --> 00:33:27,920
Someone with the odds would have caught up with him.

589
00:33:27,920 --> 00:33:31,400
His luck would have ran out and someone would have shot him.

590
00:33:31,400 --> 00:33:34,800
But and I don't think that these bucks are smarter than other bucks.

591
00:33:34,800 --> 00:33:36,040
I think a lot of it is luck.

592
00:33:36,040 --> 00:33:40,960
I think when they're young and they're dispersing, you know, those yearling bucks dispersing from

593
00:33:40,960 --> 00:33:46,240
their birth area to find the new home range, I think some of them just get lucky and they

594
00:33:46,240 --> 00:33:51,680
settle into a sanctuary area, maybe where there's no hunting allowed, you know, or there

595
00:33:51,680 --> 00:33:53,760
would be a small property or a big property.

596
00:33:53,760 --> 00:33:58,000
And they get to older age through luck more than anything.

597
00:33:58,000 --> 00:34:02,760
But once they do get to older age, they have figured out, you know, where they're safe

598
00:34:02,760 --> 00:34:03,760
and where they're not.

599
00:34:03,760 --> 00:34:05,160
They know where they encounter humans.

600
00:34:05,160 --> 00:34:07,880
They know where they encounter humans.

601
00:34:07,880 --> 00:34:10,600
And they just avoid those areas during daylight hours.

602
00:34:10,600 --> 00:34:13,840
I had one guy come up when he was talking to me about, you know, he rakes the leaves

603
00:34:13,840 --> 00:34:16,720
to all of his stands from about 75 yards out.

604
00:34:16,720 --> 00:34:18,760
I just don't do that.

605
00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:23,640
To me, it just feels like any disturbance that I'm doing in the forest like that.

606
00:34:23,640 --> 00:34:26,520
It's I mean, it's it's it's a it's a sign.

607
00:34:26,520 --> 00:34:30,120
It's you know, it's a hey, humans been here, but I don't know whether I mean, I've had

608
00:34:30,120 --> 00:34:35,160
guys say they mow, you know, one path through a field, which so they can get quietly and

609
00:34:35,160 --> 00:34:37,520
not be seen to their stand and those kind of things.

610
00:34:37,520 --> 00:34:42,560
But yeah, I think the approach to the to the stand is about as important as any.

611
00:34:42,560 --> 00:34:45,520
I'll take a turkey call with me on the southern Indiana.

612
00:34:45,520 --> 00:34:49,080
And I know that when I'm walking, I try not to walk in a way that is going to sound like

613
00:34:49,080 --> 00:34:50,280
a human walking.

614
00:34:50,280 --> 00:34:54,320
And I'll even scratch the ground with my foot a little bit with my mouth called.

615
00:34:54,320 --> 00:34:55,920
I'll be talking a little bit.

616
00:34:55,920 --> 00:35:00,120
And sometimes even if I get up in my stand, if I make a little bit of a sound, I'll take

617
00:35:00,120 --> 00:35:03,680
my hat off and I'll smack it on my leg and do like a fly down.

618
00:35:03,680 --> 00:35:05,960
You know, like, like there's a turkey down there.

619
00:35:05,960 --> 00:35:08,280
I've actually seen dough.

620
00:35:08,280 --> 00:35:12,560
I made a noise one time when there were three was a two maternals in a yearling.

621
00:35:12,560 --> 00:35:16,320
And when I was up in there and I did that, I watched them at first, they were like perking

622
00:35:16,320 --> 00:35:19,080
up and then I did that little fly down thing pretty soon.

623
00:35:19,080 --> 00:35:20,080
They stood up tails.

624
00:35:20,080 --> 00:35:23,240
You know, they were just wagging their tails feeding.

625
00:35:23,240 --> 00:35:24,600
They were good.

626
00:35:24,600 --> 00:35:28,320
But yeah, but they pay attention big time.

627
00:35:28,320 --> 00:35:29,880
They're in tune to their surroundings.

628
00:35:29,880 --> 00:35:31,160
No doubt about it.

629
00:35:31,160 --> 00:35:33,440
What about let's go to let's go to the last one.

630
00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:35,320
We talked about not being seen, not being heard.

631
00:35:35,320 --> 00:35:40,080
What about not being smelled because you are probably so well known for saying you got to

632
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:42,080
play the wind.

633
00:35:42,080 --> 00:35:49,680
Yeah, you know, I have tried every single gimmick that that there is or product.

634
00:35:49,680 --> 00:35:55,640
I may be a shunt on gimmick because I do believe most of them work to some degree.

635
00:35:55,640 --> 00:36:00,960
Thirty years ago when I went to the woods, I did it all.

636
00:36:00,960 --> 00:36:02,920
I mean, I took a shower before I went.

637
00:36:02,920 --> 00:36:08,000
I even took the chlorophyll tablets for a month before season open.

638
00:36:08,000 --> 00:36:12,000
All my gear was kept in a tote plastic tote.

639
00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:15,880
I changed my clothes outside my vehicle when I got to my hunting area.

640
00:36:15,880 --> 00:36:17,800
I sprayed down.

641
00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:18,800
I did everything.

642
00:36:18,800 --> 00:36:21,600
I even tried to bottle the pee in.

643
00:36:21,600 --> 00:36:26,520
Well, you know, one day I looked at that pee bottle in my stand and I thought this thing

644
00:36:26,520 --> 00:36:28,000
has got the stain.

645
00:36:28,000 --> 00:36:29,240
There's just no way it can't.

646
00:36:29,240 --> 00:36:34,520
I've been peeing in this bottle every day of hunting season and we're two months in.

647
00:36:34,520 --> 00:36:36,440
And I started by throwing that thing away.

648
00:36:36,440 --> 00:36:39,560
I thought I'm going to just try peeing out of my stand seeing what happens.

649
00:36:39,560 --> 00:36:45,240
And you know, this is almost a God thing.

650
00:36:45,240 --> 00:36:47,680
The next time I went hunting, I peed out of my stand.

651
00:36:47,680 --> 00:36:52,960
I'm telling you, Brandon, it wasn't five minutes later and eight point buck comes by, sticks

652
00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:56,160
his nose right where I peed and started eating the grass.

653
00:36:56,160 --> 00:37:01,880
Well, I've been peeing out of my stand ever since and I slowly gave up every other, you

654
00:37:01,880 --> 00:37:05,200
know, sand elimination product that I ever used.

655
00:37:05,200 --> 00:37:08,200
It's all about the wind.

656
00:37:08,200 --> 00:37:15,320
And here's the other thing is, you know, everybody thinks that the wind has to be right for you

657
00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:17,640
to be successful.

658
00:37:17,640 --> 00:37:22,000
And in reality, the wind needs to be right for that mature buck and you need to figure

659
00:37:22,000 --> 00:37:30,240
out how you can give him the wind he needs to be comfortable up on his feet moving and

660
00:37:30,240 --> 00:37:32,160
yet still not be able to smell you.

661
00:37:32,160 --> 00:37:36,720
Where are you going to have your stand along that route that he's comfortable moving?

662
00:37:36,720 --> 00:37:40,320
Because if he's not comfortable with the wind, you can have the wind 100 percent your favorite.

663
00:37:40,320 --> 00:37:44,320
Yeah, he's not going to smell you, but he's also not walking by because he's not comfortable

664
00:37:44,320 --> 00:37:46,080
with that wind.

665
00:37:46,080 --> 00:37:52,640
And once I started figuring that out, then my success just skyrocketed.

666
00:37:52,640 --> 00:37:53,640
What do you do in the mornings?

667
00:37:53,640 --> 00:37:55,560
I know early October, I've heard you talk about it.

668
00:37:55,560 --> 00:37:58,720
You're not a big morning hunter in early October, neither am I.

669
00:37:58,720 --> 00:38:03,720
It's just a lot of time spent, a lot of making noise and smells in the woods.

670
00:38:03,720 --> 00:38:06,920
I try to stay away from that.

671
00:38:06,920 --> 00:38:11,360
But sorry, I'm here a little bit of noise going on outside the studio here.

672
00:38:11,360 --> 00:38:12,360
So sorry about that.

673
00:38:12,360 --> 00:38:13,600
I got distracted for a second.

674
00:38:13,600 --> 00:38:16,840
Back to what we were talking about.

675
00:38:16,840 --> 00:38:21,360
So when you're going in in the mornings, do you find yourself, do you go in?

676
00:38:21,360 --> 00:38:25,160
How long before daylight are you one of these hunters that wait until they get back to their

677
00:38:25,160 --> 00:38:29,040
beds and go get in and then wait to get in when they come out feeding?

678
00:38:29,040 --> 00:38:35,040
No, I like to get in early, but I don't want to get in too early.

679
00:38:35,040 --> 00:38:37,120
I don't want to sit there in the dark for an hour.

680
00:38:37,120 --> 00:38:44,640
So I try to get in there about say on average 20 minutes before shooting light.

681
00:38:44,640 --> 00:38:48,960
Yeah, that's, I know guys are going an hour before and I'm like, I don't want to be sitting

682
00:38:48,960 --> 00:38:51,240
up there freezing and everything else for the next hour.

683
00:38:51,240 --> 00:38:56,360
But funny, when I was a kid growing up, you know, we would always, my dad, we would go

684
00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:57,360
out.

685
00:38:57,360 --> 00:39:00,600
I told you he wasn't much of a hunter and there was a, there was a family with us and

686
00:39:00,600 --> 00:39:03,080
we were out hunting together, another father and son.

687
00:39:03,080 --> 00:39:08,280
And he went in, I don't know, it was like some crazy early hour and he was in there

688
00:39:08,280 --> 00:39:12,320
so long he had to go to the bathroom and he told his dad, he goes, dad, I got to do a

689
00:39:12,320 --> 00:39:13,320
number two.

690
00:39:13,320 --> 00:39:14,480
His dad said, well, listen, go over there.

691
00:39:14,480 --> 00:39:17,320
He said, dig a hole and he's with your heel.

692
00:39:17,320 --> 00:39:21,480
And he had, remember those big, look like a big carrot, the big, like the big jumpsuit

693
00:39:21,480 --> 00:39:24,080
looking, you know, blaze, orange stuff.

694
00:39:24,080 --> 00:39:27,840
And he went over and his dad said, now make sure you covered up really well.

695
00:39:27,840 --> 00:39:29,640
You know, you don't want all that smell going on.

696
00:39:29,640 --> 00:39:34,880
So he goes over and he comes back to his dad and they're standing there and his dad goes,

697
00:39:34,880 --> 00:39:37,480
are you sure you didn't like stepping it or something?

698
00:39:37,480 --> 00:39:40,640
He said, no, he says, I, I stayed away from everything.

699
00:39:40,640 --> 00:39:44,320
He says, I was actually leaning up against a tree and he says, I think everything was

700
00:39:44,320 --> 00:39:45,320
good.

701
00:39:45,320 --> 00:39:48,000
And he says, man, you stink.

702
00:39:48,000 --> 00:39:54,000
He, he pulled the hood up over his head and you can figure it out.

703
00:39:54,000 --> 00:39:55,000
Yeah.

704
00:39:55,000 --> 00:39:58,880
To this day, he still has a nickname to this day.

705
00:39:58,880 --> 00:39:59,880
Oh my gosh.

706
00:39:59,880 --> 00:40:00,880
Yeah.

707
00:40:00,880 --> 00:40:05,240
I bet he's not the only one that's happened to over the years.

708
00:40:05,240 --> 00:40:06,240
Yeah.

709
00:40:06,240 --> 00:40:07,240
Yeah.

710
00:40:07,240 --> 00:40:08,520
I'm, yeah, we'll just keep it there.

711
00:40:08,520 --> 00:40:10,880
You know, you were going back to the, to like P bottles and stuff.

712
00:40:10,880 --> 00:40:15,720
I think most guys do take that with them, but we discovered we did some, some testing

713
00:40:15,720 --> 00:40:20,400
with scrapes and we were putting different things in scrapes and to see how it affect

714
00:40:20,400 --> 00:40:21,400
them.

715
00:40:21,400 --> 00:40:22,400
It had no effect.

716
00:40:22,400 --> 00:40:23,400
Right.

717
00:40:23,400 --> 00:40:24,400
None at all.

718
00:40:24,400 --> 00:40:25,400
We put WD 40.

719
00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:28,400
We were doing all kinds of different things to see what the difference was.

720
00:40:28,400 --> 00:40:29,400
They didn't care.

721
00:40:29,400 --> 00:40:31,520
And so it's probably been maybe five or six years now.

722
00:40:31,520 --> 00:40:32,520
I'm the same way now.

723
00:40:32,520 --> 00:40:33,520
It's like, you know what?

724
00:40:33,520 --> 00:40:34,840
I mean, I don't usually have to go.

725
00:40:34,840 --> 00:40:38,200
I can be up there five, six hours and be fine, but I agree.

726
00:40:38,200 --> 00:40:39,200
I totally agree.

727
00:40:39,200 --> 00:40:40,200
What a waste.

728
00:40:40,200 --> 00:40:41,200
And you're right.

729
00:40:41,200 --> 00:40:43,200
That bottle probably smells worse than anything else by now.

730
00:40:43,200 --> 00:40:44,200
Yep.

731
00:40:44,200 --> 00:40:45,200
Um, broadheads.

732
00:40:45,200 --> 00:40:46,200
Touch on that real quick.

733
00:40:46,200 --> 00:40:48,160
Um, fixture mechanical.

734
00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:49,520
What's your, what's your opinion?

735
00:40:49,520 --> 00:40:52,800
Uh, it's gotta be fixed.

736
00:40:52,800 --> 00:40:53,960
Yeah.

737
00:40:53,960 --> 00:40:56,280
I knew you were going to say that already.

738
00:40:56,280 --> 00:40:57,880
I just had to put it out there.

739
00:40:57,880 --> 00:40:58,880
Yeah.

740
00:40:58,880 --> 00:41:01,760
I didn't want to run with it too hard.

741
00:41:01,760 --> 00:41:07,520
I might run off a few listeners, but I just see the mechanical as a chance that doesn't

742
00:41:07,520 --> 00:41:09,000
need to be taken.

743
00:41:09,000 --> 00:41:13,120
Well, I think there's, I mean, the benefit when I think about like an expandable is,

744
00:41:13,120 --> 00:41:16,880
you know, if you make a God forbid you make a bad shot, it's happened to everybody.

745
00:41:16,880 --> 00:41:18,160
And so you hit him back.

746
00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:20,880
You have a little bigger of a cutting diameter.

747
00:41:20,880 --> 00:41:23,240
You're still going to have to wait that deer out six, eight hours.

748
00:41:23,240 --> 00:41:26,880
You know, if you get a liver hitter back in the gut or whatever until that deer expires.

749
00:41:26,880 --> 00:41:32,560
But when it comes to like bone, um, you know, I think it doesn't, if you hit a deer in the

750
00:41:32,560 --> 00:41:36,560
vitals, it doesn't matter if you have a two inch cut broad headed, whether you got it

751
00:41:36,560 --> 00:41:41,280
and you know, an inch cut, you know, if you hit them the way you should hit them, they're

752
00:41:41,280 --> 00:41:42,280
going to expire.

753
00:41:42,280 --> 00:41:46,160
Um, long heart shot, you know, they're going to both can be down within a hundred yards.

754
00:41:46,160 --> 00:41:49,640
And that's the one nice thing I do like about fixed is you don't have a problem.

755
00:41:49,640 --> 00:41:53,080
Like if you catch one of those blades on an expandable on a little branch, it can, you

756
00:41:53,080 --> 00:41:57,040
know, open it prematurely and redirect the path of that arrow.

757
00:41:57,040 --> 00:42:02,720
Um, but yeah, I, I mean, I honestly use both depending upon where I'm hunting, but yeah,

758
00:42:02,720 --> 00:42:06,600
there's no doubt that fixed broad heads are probably a little stronger.

759
00:42:06,600 --> 00:42:10,480
Oh, let's see here.

760
00:42:10,480 --> 00:42:12,840
Let's get into something that I wanted to talk to you about.

761
00:42:12,840 --> 00:42:14,160
We'll, we'll finish.

762
00:42:14,160 --> 00:42:18,600
We'll bring God into this in just a minute, but you said at the beginning of this podcast,

763
00:42:18,600 --> 00:42:23,960
you know, you grew up in a small town, you're just like a country boy and, um, you know,

764
00:42:23,960 --> 00:42:29,680
whatever I see you posting, you know, on social media posts, you don't really hold back, but

765
00:42:29,680 --> 00:42:33,440
you're also not trying to rub someone's nose in something, but you're very passionate about

766
00:42:33,440 --> 00:42:34,440
this country.

767
00:42:34,440 --> 00:42:36,480
You're very passionate about God.

768
00:42:36,480 --> 00:42:40,120
You're very passionate about like you just said earlier about your kids waiting a couple

769
00:42:40,120 --> 00:42:42,800
hours for them to get there so you could take them in to see the deer.

770
00:42:42,800 --> 00:42:48,160
So I know family means an incredible amount to you, but we both grew up in the 1960s.

771
00:42:48,160 --> 00:42:56,120
And the world's, the world has changed an incredible amount.

772
00:42:56,120 --> 00:43:03,040
And you know, I'm just kind of wondering, I guess one of my questions would be, you know,

773
00:43:03,040 --> 00:43:07,000
is God in what's happening in this country right now?

774
00:43:07,000 --> 00:43:09,280
Now, where is he in all that?

775
00:43:09,280 --> 00:43:11,680
You know, what's our part?

776
00:43:11,680 --> 00:43:19,520
Well, it's interesting that we're having this conversation today because one of the things

777
00:43:19,520 --> 00:43:25,640
that, that I decided I was going to do this summer was I'm going to read the New Testament

778
00:43:25,640 --> 00:43:32,720
again because, uh, I believe that we're probably in the end times and I want to understand

779
00:43:32,720 --> 00:43:35,760
the book of revelation better, but I didn't want to go right to a revelation.

780
00:43:35,760 --> 00:43:40,480
I wanted to start at the beginning of the New Testament and read it all.

781
00:43:40,480 --> 00:43:44,080
And then when I got to revelation, I'm going to really slow down and take a chapter at

782
00:43:44,080 --> 00:43:50,920
a time and maybe even get a, you know, some kind of study material to go along with it.

783
00:43:50,920 --> 00:44:00,080
But I recently read Romans 13 and Romans 13 talks about, and it was so profound that my

784
00:44:00,080 --> 00:44:07,560
wife and I had a long discussion about it afterwards that it says very clearly that

785
00:44:07,560 --> 00:44:12,080
every government that's in power, God put them there.

786
00:44:12,080 --> 00:44:16,800
And you know, it talks about, you know, give to Caesar what is Caesar's talk to pay your

787
00:44:16,800 --> 00:44:17,800
taxes.

788
00:44:17,800 --> 00:44:25,160
And well, we had a real discussion about that one because obviously as Christians, we don't

789
00:44:25,160 --> 00:44:29,800
agree with everything our government's doing with our money, with our tax dollars.

790
00:44:29,800 --> 00:44:34,520
And you know, when they're doing things like supporting abortions through Planned Parenthood

791
00:44:34,520 --> 00:44:43,320
and things like that, it's really tough for me as a Christian to want to pay my taxes

792
00:44:43,320 --> 00:44:49,600
and to not want to look for ways to pay less.

793
00:44:49,600 --> 00:44:55,000
And that was a real eye opener for me at Romans chapter 13.

794
00:44:55,000 --> 00:45:01,440
So if anybody's listening and they're having the same issues that I've had, I love my country,

795
00:45:01,440 --> 00:45:07,320
but I despise my government and I don't think you've got to look too hard to see that this

796
00:45:07,320 --> 00:45:12,680
world today and this country in particular, there's a battle of good and evil happening.

797
00:45:12,680 --> 00:45:16,440
There's a spiritual battle happening right before our eyes.

798
00:45:16,440 --> 00:45:22,960
And the only way that you cannot see it is to not have any knowledge whatsoever of scripture,

799
00:45:22,960 --> 00:45:24,440
the Bible.

800
00:45:24,440 --> 00:45:30,680
So I mean, I could, I could fill about four podcasts with this one topic.

801
00:45:30,680 --> 00:45:31,680
I know you could.

802
00:45:31,680 --> 00:45:36,400
And you know what, and I'm the one that brought this, you didn't, excuse me, you didn't bring

803
00:45:36,400 --> 00:45:37,400
this up.

804
00:45:37,400 --> 00:45:38,400
I did.

805
00:45:38,400 --> 00:45:41,880
And it's because God's been convicting me to be honest with you, Don, because here's

806
00:45:41,880 --> 00:45:46,800
what I've always been, and I'll continue to be this to a degree is, you know, my role

807
00:45:46,800 --> 00:45:52,200
isn't to try to convince someone, for instance, how to vote.

808
00:45:52,200 --> 00:45:57,720
My job is to promote God, promote scripture, live my life in accordance.

809
00:45:57,720 --> 00:46:01,800
So when people see that, they can see the difference between right and wrong, and I

810
00:46:01,800 --> 00:46:03,000
can build a trust with them.

811
00:46:03,000 --> 00:46:06,400
So now I have a platform to speak into their life.

812
00:46:06,400 --> 00:46:08,800
And so I, I want them to know God.

813
00:46:08,800 --> 00:46:12,720
And I really believe that if they know God, the Holy Spirit will lead them of what they

814
00:46:12,720 --> 00:46:13,720
need to do.

815
00:46:13,720 --> 00:46:14,720
Well, here's what's happened.

816
00:46:14,720 --> 00:46:17,000
You know, this podcast is called Unleashed.

817
00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:20,240
And the reason I made it Unleashed is because I want to see men free.

818
00:46:20,240 --> 00:46:24,200
I want men to understand that their identity is in Christ alone, not from the biggest deer

819
00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:27,080
they've shot, not from what kind of car they drive, how much money they have with their

820
00:46:27,080 --> 00:46:29,600
wife looks like, how big their muscles are.

821
00:46:29,600 --> 00:46:33,280
I want it to be nothing except that I want them to know that your identity, your one

822
00:46:33,280 --> 00:46:37,920
true identity comes because the God of the universe, if you're a believer, is inside

823
00:46:37,920 --> 00:46:38,920
of you.

824
00:46:38,920 --> 00:46:42,520
And because of that, you have everything you will ever need in him.

825
00:46:42,520 --> 00:46:46,960
So whatever he's called you to do, you can do it fearlessly because he's got this, no

826
00:46:46,960 --> 00:46:47,960
matter what.

827
00:46:47,960 --> 00:46:53,000
Well, then when I was looking for, you know, like the subtitle, which is, We Are the Resistance.

828
00:46:53,000 --> 00:46:58,080
You know, I was working with a guy, Nate Sotter, who played with the New England Patriots.

829
00:46:58,080 --> 00:46:59,880
He was on, I think, three of their Super Bowl teams.

830
00:46:59,880 --> 00:47:01,680
He just retired this past year.

831
00:47:01,680 --> 00:47:06,280
But anyhow, he was a friend and we were having a conversation texting back and forth.

832
00:47:06,280 --> 00:47:10,120
And there was something about the We Are the Resistance came up and I said, can I steal

833
00:47:10,120 --> 00:47:11,120
that?

834
00:47:11,120 --> 00:47:12,120
And he says, I'm not using it.

835
00:47:12,120 --> 00:47:14,080
Do what you want with it.

836
00:47:14,080 --> 00:47:16,640
Well, I sat on it for a while.

837
00:47:16,640 --> 00:47:20,960
And as I began to keep reading those words, We Are the Resistance, God started saying

838
00:47:20,960 --> 00:47:23,680
to me, what does that mean to you?

839
00:47:23,680 --> 00:47:27,480
If you're going to use that phrase, it has to mean something rather than a catchy little,

840
00:47:27,480 --> 00:47:29,480
you know, phrase.

841
00:47:29,480 --> 00:47:34,280
And he said, and if it does mean something to you, what are you willing to do with that?

842
00:47:34,280 --> 00:47:36,880
And I said, okay, God, you know, it's like search me and know me.

843
00:47:36,880 --> 00:47:39,160
I want to know what's going on here.

844
00:47:39,160 --> 00:47:44,720
And you know, growing up in the 1960s, you know, I could take my pocket knife to school.

845
00:47:44,720 --> 00:47:48,920
I had in high school, I had my gun rack in the back of my truck and I could have my rifle

846
00:47:48,920 --> 00:47:52,080
hanged, my doors weren't locked, our house doors weren't locked.

847
00:47:52,080 --> 00:47:54,600
And we've seen this country change.

848
00:47:54,600 --> 00:47:58,720
You know, the whole thing, and I've said this and I think you're right there with me.

849
00:47:58,720 --> 00:48:00,040
Guns don't kill people.

850
00:48:00,040 --> 00:48:02,000
People kill people.

851
00:48:02,000 --> 00:48:09,200
And when you take God out of the school system, you've just slaughtered morality.

852
00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:14,520
And then you take the fathers out of homes and all kinds of things that we've been seeing

853
00:48:14,520 --> 00:48:15,520
happening.

854
00:48:15,520 --> 00:48:19,800
And I did an episode here just recently where I was talking about, they had killed these

855
00:48:19,800 --> 00:48:22,880
elephants over in Africa, the older bulls.

856
00:48:22,880 --> 00:48:27,000
And what ended up happening was the younger bulls, when they came into what's called must

857
00:48:27,000 --> 00:48:31,520
when they were testosterone is kicking up, they were going around and they were killing

858
00:48:31,520 --> 00:48:34,200
rhinos because they weren't being mentored.

859
00:48:34,200 --> 00:48:36,640
And that's a lot of what we're seeing a lot of the young people right now, whether

860
00:48:36,640 --> 00:48:40,880
school shootings or the violence or all these things going on is because you take God away

861
00:48:40,880 --> 00:48:42,640
from this stuff.

862
00:48:42,640 --> 00:48:44,400
And you're left up to your own devices.

863
00:48:44,400 --> 00:48:49,760
You're left without a compass being God pointing true north.

864
00:48:49,760 --> 00:48:52,240
And Don, I really believe this.

865
00:48:52,240 --> 00:48:56,000
We are seeing right now in this country, and you and I both when we go and we speak from

866
00:48:56,000 --> 00:48:58,880
men's events, there's a fire that's lighting.

867
00:48:58,880 --> 00:49:03,760
When I went down to Asbury, when the revival was happening earlier this year, and I stood

868
00:49:03,760 --> 00:49:08,880
in line for seven hours to get in there to be a part of that.

869
00:49:08,880 --> 00:49:13,400
But mostly what happened for me was outside of the building with all these people and

870
00:49:13,400 --> 00:49:16,600
the conversations I was having, they were praying for one another.

871
00:49:16,600 --> 00:49:17,980
There were healings happening.

872
00:49:17,980 --> 00:49:19,720
They were singing praise and worship.

873
00:49:19,720 --> 00:49:23,240
There was no racial divides.

874
00:49:23,240 --> 00:49:27,000
It was all about we're here because the God of the universe made us and we're all going

875
00:49:27,000 --> 00:49:29,400
to be together someday as it is.

876
00:49:29,400 --> 00:49:34,280
But this voice that we are the resistance begin to stir me because what we saw growing

877
00:49:34,280 --> 00:49:39,200
up freely being able to go to church, freely being able to speak in our speech and talk

878
00:49:39,200 --> 00:49:44,600
about things that we really believed in, we're now seeing persecution coming.

879
00:49:44,600 --> 00:49:45,880
We talked about COVID earlier.

880
00:49:45,880 --> 00:49:47,920
You had COVID, I had COVID.

881
00:49:47,920 --> 00:49:50,560
But the whole vaccination thing, it divided families.

882
00:49:50,560 --> 00:49:52,880
It divided our nation.

883
00:49:52,880 --> 00:49:55,640
Whether you're going to be vaccinated, whether you're going to be unvaccinated.

884
00:49:55,640 --> 00:50:00,440
And then we've seen so many other things happening with commercials we're seeing on television

885
00:50:00,440 --> 00:50:05,440
that are really going against the core of most people in this country.

886
00:50:05,440 --> 00:50:11,640
But it seems like the less we speak up, the more ground evil gains.

887
00:50:11,640 --> 00:50:12,840
And so God convicted me.

888
00:50:12,840 --> 00:50:16,840
He said, Brent, are you willing to listen to me?

889
00:50:16,840 --> 00:50:18,080
Are you willing to follow me?

890
00:50:18,080 --> 00:50:20,400
Are you willing to be a voice?

891
00:50:20,400 --> 00:50:21,400
And here's the thing.

892
00:50:21,400 --> 00:50:23,520
It doesn't matter who you are, where you've been or what you've done.

893
00:50:23,520 --> 00:50:25,960
God loves you desperately.

894
00:50:25,960 --> 00:50:28,840
That's why he gave his son for you.

895
00:50:28,840 --> 00:50:32,200
He took the bullet for you because he loves you so much.

896
00:50:32,200 --> 00:50:36,280
But we're also called to stand against the evil one.

897
00:50:36,280 --> 00:50:41,560
And Don, I haven't brought anything up like this in any of my podcasts at this point.

898
00:50:41,560 --> 00:50:46,240
But when God brought you into my mind to have you on the podcast, I know how passionate

899
00:50:46,240 --> 00:50:47,400
you are about this.

900
00:50:47,400 --> 00:50:52,200
And anyway, if you, I mean, gosh, what's that song that was a Jason Aldean's got out right

901
00:50:52,200 --> 00:50:54,560
now that try that in a small town?

902
00:50:54,560 --> 00:50:55,560
Yeah.

903
00:50:55,560 --> 00:50:58,120
It's all based on, listen, we are family.

904
00:50:58,120 --> 00:50:59,120
We love one another.

905
00:50:59,120 --> 00:51:05,120
We're willing to die for what we believe in, but it just seems like that voice is getting

906
00:51:05,120 --> 00:51:08,640
silenced and people are just walking around blind.

907
00:51:08,640 --> 00:51:12,600
Yeah, boy, I'll tell you, you've thrown out so much here.

908
00:51:12,600 --> 00:51:15,640
My mind's been racing for the last couple of minutes.

909
00:51:15,640 --> 00:51:20,760
I can take this conversation 50 different directions, but I guess to start with, you

910
00:51:20,760 --> 00:51:26,280
know, you talked about that phrase, Unleashed.

911
00:51:26,280 --> 00:51:32,920
When I started the chasing giants podcast, and I only recently, and I can the last 30

912
00:51:32,920 --> 00:51:39,320
days have shared this with Terry, my co-host, you know, chasing giants was, it had a double

913
00:51:39,320 --> 00:51:40,440
meaning for me.

914
00:51:40,440 --> 00:51:43,360
It was chasing giant white tails.

915
00:51:43,360 --> 00:51:51,880
But also I think most of us at some point in our life have been chasing a demon or demons

916
00:51:51,880 --> 00:51:53,920
been chasing us.

917
00:51:53,920 --> 00:52:00,640
You know, we're, we've all had that vice, whatever it may be, alcohol, drugs, women,

918
00:52:00,640 --> 00:52:02,400
you name it.

919
00:52:02,400 --> 00:52:08,480
At some point, most of us have faced something and it's that giant that was chasing us.

920
00:52:08,480 --> 00:52:17,640
And it's time to, you know, turn the tables and start chasing it.

921
00:52:17,640 --> 00:52:24,680
I mean, I think the problem with this country is not our schools, I think, or it didn't

922
00:52:24,680 --> 00:52:25,680
start there anyway.

923
00:52:25,680 --> 00:52:31,320
I think it started in our homes, you know, back when you and I were kids on a Sunday,

924
00:52:31,320 --> 00:52:35,240
90% plus of businesses were closed.

925
00:52:35,240 --> 00:52:39,080
Families went to church together on Sunday morning and Sunday afternoon.

926
00:52:39,080 --> 00:52:42,240
You'd visit grandparents or whatever.

927
00:52:42,240 --> 00:52:44,320
And today that doesn't happen at all.

928
00:52:44,320 --> 00:52:49,520
I mean, very, very small percentage of people and the failure started in the home.

929
00:52:49,520 --> 00:52:50,720
It didn't start with the government.

930
00:52:50,720 --> 00:52:52,560
It didn't start at school.

931
00:52:52,560 --> 00:52:53,800
It started in our home.

932
00:52:53,800 --> 00:52:58,240
And one of the things that I've tried to use the chasing giants podcast for is to encourage

933
00:52:58,240 --> 00:53:04,640
young men to, you know, stand up and take care of their obligations.

934
00:53:04,640 --> 00:53:10,880
The Bible is very clear that the man is the head of the family and he's got certain obligations.

935
00:53:10,880 --> 00:53:16,960
And I've also got a video out on YouTube where I did a seminar at a church in Effingham,

936
00:53:16,960 --> 00:53:17,960
Illinois.

937
00:53:17,960 --> 00:53:19,880
It's only about 20, 25 minutes long.

938
00:53:19,880 --> 00:53:21,160
Somebody wants to watch it.

939
00:53:21,160 --> 00:53:26,440
But my message was, you know, watch your purpose.

940
00:53:26,440 --> 00:53:30,120
God put us here and we each have a purpose.

941
00:53:30,120 --> 00:53:34,880
And maybe your purpose is just to raise your kids to be good people.

942
00:53:34,880 --> 00:53:40,040
I mean, my parents, I promise you had no idea what I was going to do with my life.

943
00:53:40,040 --> 00:53:44,800
They had no idea that one day I would stand in front of crowds of more than a thousand

944
00:53:44,800 --> 00:53:51,800
people at times and, you know, share the gospel with them or they had no idea that one day

945
00:53:51,800 --> 00:53:56,840
I would have a podcast with, you know, I don't know, probably 20,000 or so people a week

946
00:53:56,840 --> 00:53:58,480
listened to.

947
00:53:58,480 --> 00:53:59,680
They had no idea.

948
00:53:59,680 --> 00:54:05,200
But the only reason that I can do that today is because of the foundation my parents set,

949
00:54:05,200 --> 00:54:07,960
you know, 60 years ago.

950
00:54:07,960 --> 00:54:16,160
And a person's purpose could just be to raise that child to have the values that they need

951
00:54:16,160 --> 00:54:20,400
to make a difference in this world down the road decades from now.

952
00:54:20,400 --> 00:54:22,640
And I think it's a really powerful message.

953
00:54:22,640 --> 00:54:27,600
I share it on my social media most years right before hunting season because I encourage

954
00:54:27,600 --> 00:54:31,240
deer hunters to listen to that message.

955
00:54:31,240 --> 00:54:34,360
And as they're sitting there, staying that fall, you know, we've all got plenty of time

956
00:54:34,360 --> 00:54:37,680
to sit there and think about different things.

957
00:54:37,680 --> 00:54:40,160
They need to think about what their purpose is in life.

958
00:54:40,160 --> 00:54:41,560
Why did God put them here?

959
00:54:41,560 --> 00:54:46,200
You know, I could continue taking this in a slightly different direction.

960
00:54:46,200 --> 00:54:52,360
I've had people tell me that they believe and I thought this myself long before it happened,

961
00:54:52,360 --> 00:54:56,960
long before anybody else said it, that some of my deer hunting success has been almost

962
00:54:56,960 --> 00:54:57,960
unbelievable.

963
00:54:57,960 --> 00:55:06,120
About a good example, in 2017 I shot my second 200 inch buck smoking and then on the very

964
00:55:06,120 --> 00:55:11,120
next hunt, the very next time I went to the woods, I shot a hundred ninety three inch

965
00:55:11,120 --> 00:55:12,960
buck with my number two buck.

966
00:55:12,960 --> 00:55:14,120
I remember that.

967
00:55:14,120 --> 00:55:16,240
So 400 inches of antler.

968
00:55:16,240 --> 00:55:17,920
I shot them back to back hunt.

969
00:55:17,920 --> 00:55:19,560
It was even covered by Fox News.

970
00:55:19,560 --> 00:55:20,560
I saw that.

971
00:55:20,560 --> 00:55:22,520
That's how I remember it.

972
00:55:22,520 --> 00:55:23,520
Yeah.

973
00:55:23,520 --> 00:55:31,160
So, you know, I've had people suggest to me that the only way to explain my success is

974
00:55:31,160 --> 00:55:32,960
that God is using.

975
00:55:32,960 --> 00:55:38,960
He's almost my guide, my outfitter, if you will, and he likes what I'm doing with my platform

976
00:55:38,960 --> 00:55:43,880
and he wants people to have their eyes on me so that I can share the message.

977
00:55:43,880 --> 00:55:44,880
I was afraid.

978
00:55:44,880 --> 00:55:48,760
I had that thought myself and I was afraid to say it and then I've had people say it

979
00:55:48,760 --> 00:55:53,400
to me that they watched from afar and they've noticed it themselves.

980
00:55:53,400 --> 00:55:54,480
There's just no way.

981
00:55:54,480 --> 00:55:58,360
Some of the things, I mean, we talked about me passing up a buck that scored over 200

982
00:55:58,360 --> 00:55:59,360
inches.

983
00:55:59,360 --> 00:56:04,520
There's no way I could have ever dreamed that was going to happen.

984
00:56:04,520 --> 00:56:08,520
Another message that I've always got for young people is to dream big because it doesn't

985
00:56:08,520 --> 00:56:16,200
matter how big you dream, that dream, as wild as you can imagine, God's reality is even

986
00:56:16,200 --> 00:56:19,120
bigger and I'm living proof of that.

987
00:56:19,120 --> 00:56:25,560
There is no way on this earth that I could have possibly dreamed that I would accomplish

988
00:56:25,560 --> 00:56:27,760
some of the things that I have.

989
00:56:27,760 --> 00:56:32,200
And that's all the glory goes to him because it's not me.

990
00:56:32,200 --> 00:56:40,600
I was kind of the vehicle, if you will, or the messenger that he's allowed and, you

991
00:56:40,600 --> 00:56:43,800
know, man, I can just keep going.

992
00:56:43,800 --> 00:56:44,800
Do this for me.

993
00:56:44,800 --> 00:56:53,120
The other thing is in the Bible, I was just saying, in the Bible, God used, he doesn't

994
00:56:53,120 --> 00:56:59,400
use the mightiest, the wealthiest, the kings, the queens.

995
00:56:59,400 --> 00:57:03,720
He uses the least likely.

996
00:57:03,720 --> 00:57:04,720
And that's me.

997
00:57:04,720 --> 00:57:09,720
I mean, I'm telling you, Brian, if you would go back to the kids that were in my high school

998
00:57:09,720 --> 00:57:15,360
class, I went to a small school about, where's that 40 in my graduating class?

999
00:57:15,360 --> 00:57:19,800
I'm telling you, I was the kid that was voted the most likely to end up in jail.

1000
00:57:19,800 --> 00:57:22,600
I mean, I was in trouble all the time.

1001
00:57:22,600 --> 00:57:29,640
But there is absolutely no way to think that I would somehow have a platform that I'd be

1002
00:57:29,640 --> 00:57:30,640
using for God.

1003
00:57:30,640 --> 00:57:32,960
That was just totally unfathomable.

1004
00:57:32,960 --> 00:57:39,120
Nobody in my class would have ever, ever believed that if you'd have told them that when I graduated.

1005
00:57:39,120 --> 00:57:42,680
And God can do amazing things with the most unlikely people.

1006
00:57:42,680 --> 00:57:44,240
And I'm just living proof of it.

1007
00:57:44,240 --> 00:57:47,600
Do me a favor, we're going to be wrapping up here in a second, but I wanted to give you

1008
00:57:47,600 --> 00:57:49,740
an opportunity to talk about your business.

1009
00:57:49,740 --> 00:57:55,080
Because when I saw you at the ATA after things that really picked up after shooting some of

1010
00:57:55,080 --> 00:57:58,280
these big bucks and your seed company was taken off, I saw you and I walked over and

1011
00:57:58,280 --> 00:58:00,760
you said, buddy, it's going nuts.

1012
00:58:00,760 --> 00:58:04,280
I mean, things have just exploded almost overnight.

1013
00:58:04,280 --> 00:58:09,400
And just talk a little bit about your company with real-world wildlife products and just

1014
00:58:09,400 --> 00:58:12,840
kind of let the listener know maybe who you are.

1015
00:58:12,840 --> 00:58:14,480
We know what you represent.

1016
00:58:14,480 --> 00:58:17,920
And yeah, just tell them a little bit about that.

1017
00:58:17,920 --> 00:58:24,400
Well, you know, my, with my passion for white tails and land management, habitat management,

1018
00:58:24,400 --> 00:58:29,880
15 years ago, I started a company called real-world wildlife products.

1019
00:58:29,880 --> 00:58:35,000
And it's almost a story in itself.

1020
00:58:35,000 --> 00:58:42,080
I had a partner, a really great guy, Christian guy, but 10 years in, he decided that we needed

1021
00:58:42,080 --> 00:58:43,680
to part ways.

1022
00:58:43,680 --> 00:58:49,880
And we had never had issues, but the company got big enough that where we could quit our

1023
00:58:49,880 --> 00:58:53,720
jobs and do this full time.

1024
00:58:53,720 --> 00:58:57,760
And I think the stress of it was too much for him to handle.

1025
00:58:57,760 --> 00:59:02,200
And he decided for whatever reason that one of us had to go.

1026
00:59:02,200 --> 00:59:04,840
I thought it was going to be me going.

1027
00:59:04,840 --> 00:59:10,720
I thought that I've got so much going on, no way I can run this company by myself.

1028
00:59:10,720 --> 00:59:12,800
And we struggled for about six months.

1029
00:59:12,800 --> 00:59:15,960
I mean, it was terrible, terrible situation.

1030
00:59:15,960 --> 00:59:22,120
And finally the tables turned to where I became the buyer and bought him out.

1031
00:59:22,120 --> 00:59:29,360
And I'm telling you the night, and I'd been six months or so, I hadn't slept a night.

1032
00:59:29,360 --> 00:59:34,280
But during that time, you know, my wife and I prayed for my partner and his family and

1033
00:59:34,280 --> 00:59:38,600
his kids on a regular basis, almost every night when we went to bed.

1034
00:59:38,600 --> 00:59:39,960
And the prayer was sincere.

1035
00:59:39,960 --> 00:59:42,520
You know, we, we really cared about these people.

1036
00:59:42,520 --> 00:59:45,440
They'd become great friends of ours.

1037
00:59:45,440 --> 00:59:50,960
And we just couldn't understand why any situation couldn't be worked through.

1038
00:59:50,960 --> 00:59:54,080
Well, I ended up buying him out.

1039
00:59:54,080 --> 01:00:02,120
And the day that we signed that contract for me to purchase him out, I didn't purchase

1040
01:00:02,120 --> 01:00:03,120
it all.

1041
01:00:03,120 --> 01:00:05,760
There was another person that came in and purchased some too, but I became the majority

1042
01:00:05,760 --> 01:00:07,480
owner where it had been 50-50.

1043
01:00:07,480 --> 01:00:10,400
But that night I slept like a baby for the first time.

1044
01:00:10,400 --> 01:00:17,520
And it was almost like God confirming that the reason it had been so tough for six months

1045
01:00:17,520 --> 01:00:19,360
was God wanted me to have that company.

1046
01:00:19,360 --> 01:00:22,040
He had plans.

1047
01:00:22,040 --> 01:00:27,360
And I recognized that and I decided that, you know, we'd talked about it before.

1048
01:00:27,360 --> 01:00:30,560
We'd done good things before.

1049
01:00:30,560 --> 01:00:34,760
But we really, really became at that point a Christian-based company.

1050
01:00:34,760 --> 01:00:39,880
The young man that had bought in to the company with me was Wes Delks.

1051
01:00:39,880 --> 01:00:43,480
And I don't know, you should have Wes Delks on because I'm telling you, this young man

1052
01:00:43,480 --> 01:00:45,920
came in at Christian, young man.

1053
01:00:45,920 --> 01:00:49,160
He held my feet to the fire as a Christian.

1054
01:00:49,160 --> 01:00:54,880
It's like, and it was almost reverse roles because he's young enough to be my son.

1055
01:00:54,880 --> 01:01:02,960
But yet there was times that he was, he had the more mature stance on certain issues.

1056
01:01:02,960 --> 01:01:12,240
And we just, from that point on, you know, we wanted to be a company that not only talked

1057
01:01:12,240 --> 01:01:14,440
a good talk, but we wanted to follow it up.

1058
01:01:14,440 --> 01:01:22,560
I mean, the fact that we do things like support your ministry, we pay tithes on everything

1059
01:01:22,560 --> 01:01:24,060
we make.

1060
01:01:24,060 --> 01:01:29,640
And every person that we deal with, whether it be a customer or a vendor, gets treated

1061
01:01:29,640 --> 01:01:33,960
with the utmost respect just the way we would want to be treated.

1062
01:01:33,960 --> 01:01:40,760
We strive for long-term relationships with everybody, a customer or a vendor.

1063
01:01:40,760 --> 01:01:45,760
We just, we want to use our company the same way I use my platform to glorify God and all

1064
01:01:45,760 --> 01:01:47,560
that we do.

1065
01:01:47,560 --> 01:01:53,720
And when we turned that corner, and we weren't a bad company before, we were doing things

1066
01:01:53,720 --> 01:01:56,120
right, but we took it to the next level.

1067
01:01:56,120 --> 01:01:59,560
And when we did, God took it to the next level.

1068
01:01:59,560 --> 01:02:05,120
And to this day, I'm always mindful of where my blessings come from.

1069
01:02:05,120 --> 01:02:08,600
I know it's not me making these things happen.

1070
01:02:08,600 --> 01:02:12,640
You know, when we started working together, just a little over a year ago now, when I

1071
01:02:12,640 --> 01:02:18,240
got a hold of Terry Peer, your co-host with Chasing Giants, you know, I was, you know,

1072
01:02:18,240 --> 01:02:21,880
being at, I'm a speaker and do a lot of game dinners, and I was, you know, looking for sponsorships

1073
01:02:21,880 --> 01:02:24,000
and different things and people I believed in.

1074
01:02:24,000 --> 01:02:27,760
Terry said to me, he goes, Brandon goes, I don't care if you put these brochures out

1075
01:02:27,760 --> 01:02:30,000
the table or even talk about us.

1076
01:02:30,000 --> 01:02:32,760
He said, we believe in you and we want to support you.

1077
01:02:32,760 --> 01:02:36,480
We know what God has done by us supporting other people and we're all about helping other

1078
01:02:36,480 --> 01:02:38,000
people's ministry.

1079
01:02:38,000 --> 01:02:41,280
That spoke everything I needed to hear.

1080
01:02:41,280 --> 01:02:46,080
At the very beginning, when you said your integrity is not for sale, you know, that's

1081
01:02:46,080 --> 01:02:50,120
the people that I know about, you know, in your company, they're like that.

1082
01:02:50,120 --> 01:02:54,320
And guys, if you're listening to, you know, what we're talking about with this seed company

1083
01:02:54,320 --> 01:02:58,640
and everything right now, Don, what's the website on that?

1084
01:02:58,640 --> 01:03:03,520
It's realworldwildlifeproducts.com.

1085
01:03:03,520 --> 01:03:07,920
And you've heard in this conversation, the kind of a person in a company that you're

1086
01:03:07,920 --> 01:03:13,720
dealing with, American based company, love God, love country.

1087
01:03:13,720 --> 01:03:20,080
And I just want to, I just want to invite you guys to put your trust and your pocket

1088
01:03:20,080 --> 01:03:24,200
book, I guess, behind that and support these guys too, because they're making a huge difference

1089
01:03:24,200 --> 01:03:25,200
out there.

1090
01:03:25,200 --> 01:03:30,480
And Don, if you can send us some links, we can include the links to the mail, to the

1091
01:03:30,480 --> 01:03:31,980
company.

1092
01:03:31,980 --> 01:03:33,160
We can put those all in the description.

1093
01:03:33,160 --> 01:03:35,560
Guys can just click and go.

1094
01:03:35,560 --> 01:03:36,560
Yes.

1095
01:03:36,560 --> 01:03:38,280
Well, definitely do that.

1096
01:03:38,280 --> 01:03:43,760
So wrapping things up today, God made everything there is.

1097
01:03:43,760 --> 01:03:45,160
He made the white tailed deer.

1098
01:03:45,160 --> 01:03:47,200
He made the great white shark.

1099
01:03:47,200 --> 01:03:50,240
I always tell you, the black mom with a line, the mountains, all these things.

1100
01:03:50,240 --> 01:03:54,720
And he made us above all those things because he loves us.

1101
01:03:54,720 --> 01:03:57,480
And we're living in a time right now.

1102
01:03:57,480 --> 01:04:02,800
Guys, this episode may be bigger than any other episode for the first time we've really

1103
01:04:02,800 --> 01:04:04,440
opened up.

1104
01:04:04,440 --> 01:04:07,200
We are the resistance.

1105
01:04:07,200 --> 01:04:12,280
And I want to invite you in this episode, if you don't know God, to know that he loves

1106
01:04:12,280 --> 01:04:15,480
you no matter, like I said, who you are, where you've been or what you've done.

1107
01:04:15,480 --> 01:04:17,880
He absolutely loves you.

1108
01:04:17,880 --> 01:04:21,360
And he has a purpose like Don was talking about for your life.

1109
01:04:21,360 --> 01:04:24,440
But he's saying, give me your life and I'll direct it in ways like what Don just talked

1110
01:04:24,440 --> 01:04:26,880
about that would blow you away.

1111
01:04:26,880 --> 01:04:30,160
You know, there's a quote that says, you know, hard times make hard men.

1112
01:04:30,160 --> 01:04:36,840
Hard men make easy times, easy times make soft men and soft men make hard times.

1113
01:04:36,840 --> 01:04:41,560
You are needed right now because we have been going through a time where this country and

1114
01:04:41,560 --> 01:04:45,400
so many things we've seen have become soft and we're seeing the enemy do whatever

1115
01:04:45,400 --> 01:04:47,920
he wants to do right now.

1116
01:04:47,920 --> 01:04:52,560
And like with no resistance, it's time for that to stop.

1117
01:04:52,560 --> 01:04:55,240
Guys, we are the resistance.

1118
01:04:55,240 --> 01:05:01,760
Your strength is needed and you have what it takes if you have the God of the universe

1119
01:05:01,760 --> 01:05:02,760
in you.

1120
01:05:02,760 --> 01:05:05,400
Don, thanks so much for being with us today.

1121
01:05:05,400 --> 01:05:07,480
Well, thanks for having me, Brent.

1122
01:05:07,480 --> 01:05:08,480
It's been a pleasure.

1123
01:05:08,480 --> 01:05:09,480
Absolutely.

1124
01:05:09,480 --> 01:05:15,480
See you next time, guys.