WEBVTT

00:00:10.049 --> 00:00:12.490
Welcome back to The Rate of Change with York

00:00:12.490 --> 00:00:15.470
Wealth Management. As advisors to some of the

00:00:15.470 --> 00:00:17.289
wealthiest families in the country, The Rate

00:00:17.289 --> 00:00:19.469
of Change is a podcast designed to help you in

00:00:19.469 --> 00:00:21.730
the pursuit of building long -term wealth through

00:00:21.730 --> 00:00:23.829
the insights of some of the brightest minds in

00:00:23.829 --> 00:00:26.469
asset management. I'm your host Murdoch Gaddi,

00:00:26.530 --> 00:00:28.230
and in today's broadcast, we're speaking with

00:00:28.230 --> 00:00:31.969
Bo Zhang, one of the three managing partners

00:00:31.969 --> 00:00:36.469
at Initium within the Hasen and Huang family

00:00:36.469 --> 00:00:41.119
office. Must say everyone, If you're an advisor

00:00:41.119 --> 00:00:43.759
and investor or you're currently in the space,

00:00:43.859 --> 00:00:46.219
I think you're really going to enjoy today's

00:00:46.219 --> 00:00:49.619
conversation. Um, and you may be thinking the

00:00:49.619 --> 00:00:52.719
name hasten and Huang within certain circles,

00:00:52.719 --> 00:00:56.719
uh, really rings a bell to begin with. You're

00:00:56.719 --> 00:00:59.439
right. The hasten group founded by Ian hasten.

00:00:59.630 --> 00:01:03.770
has established a 40 -year -old reputation for

00:01:03.770 --> 00:01:07.150
setting industry precedents. Most notably, Hasen

00:01:07.150 --> 00:01:10.109
was the first private developer to recognize

00:01:10.109 --> 00:01:13.230
the potential of Darling Harbour. Their development

00:01:13.230 --> 00:01:16.829
essentially has transformed the inner city and

00:01:16.829 --> 00:01:22.290
most notably, when it was complete, was opened

00:01:22.290 --> 00:01:26.450
by, yes, the Queen of England. Other high -profile

00:01:26.450 --> 00:01:28.890
projects include Sky Garden in Sydney's Pitt

00:01:28.890 --> 00:01:31.840
Street Mall, the Manly Wharf Retail Development,

00:01:32.359 --> 00:01:35.959
Hoggers Town Shopping Center, Cremons Metropole

00:01:35.959 --> 00:01:38.500
Shopping Center, Hildale Southpoint Shopping

00:01:38.500 --> 00:01:39.859
Center. Look, if I list them all, we're going

00:01:39.859 --> 00:01:42.439
to be here all day, but they're very, very high

00:01:42.439 --> 00:01:46.900
profile. On that note, you may not necessarily

00:01:46.900 --> 00:01:50.840
be familiar with the Huangs, but they have three

00:01:50.840 --> 00:01:53.239
decades of operation, both internationally and

00:01:53.239 --> 00:01:55.739
domestically, and they're just as well regarded.

00:01:56.250 --> 00:01:58.890
The Huang group founded by James Huang stands

00:01:58.890 --> 00:02:02.790
as a multi -faceted conglomerate, uniting various

00:02:02.790 --> 00:02:05.650
entities, spanning property, financial investments,

00:02:05.890 --> 00:02:08.129
and community -based developments. The Huang

00:02:08.129 --> 00:02:10.610
group has founded a strong legacy and reputation

00:02:10.610 --> 00:02:14.349
with the Chinese and the Australian Chinese communities

00:02:14.349 --> 00:02:19.949
marked by the creation of several renowned entire

00:02:19.949 --> 00:02:25.210
communities. So why did I want to go on? Well,

00:02:26.250 --> 00:02:29.810
Bo is very interesting in his own right. He's

00:02:29.810 --> 00:02:33.330
been in the banking sector for a long time and

00:02:33.330 --> 00:02:37.189
I just love speaking with Bo regarding, you know,

00:02:37.509 --> 00:02:39.629
how the thought process works about, you know,

00:02:39.629 --> 00:02:42.710
working with families. So alongside his partners

00:02:42.710 --> 00:02:46.530
Max Hasen and Victor Huang, the sons of the prominent

00:02:46.530 --> 00:02:49.270
patriarchs mentioned, they are quite literally

00:02:49.270 --> 00:02:53.870
embracing the essence of next -gen multi -generational

00:02:53.870 --> 00:02:57.280
wealth through a joint family office. Join us

00:02:57.280 --> 00:03:00.460
and hear from Bo's extensive experience in banking

00:03:00.460 --> 00:03:05.180
as we discuss how initiatives go on about forging

00:03:05.180 --> 00:03:10.400
this new generation of wealth, whilst honoring

00:03:10.400 --> 00:03:16.599
family legacy. Bit of fun. Bo unpacks the how.

00:03:16.740 --> 00:03:18.740
This is the most interesting part. right? So

00:03:18.740 --> 00:03:20.319
it's not just about the family office, but you

00:03:20.319 --> 00:03:22.520
know, how do they go about it? So initiative

00:03:22.520 --> 00:03:25.780
is essentially the company, you know, within

00:03:25.780 --> 00:03:31.599
the family office, and they primarily invest

00:03:31.599 --> 00:03:34.580
in retail property centers focusing predominantly

00:03:34.580 --> 00:03:36.800
on prime locations on the east of seaboard, such

00:03:36.800 --> 00:03:40.759
as Bondi. Mossman Manley St. Leonard's, whilst

00:03:40.759 --> 00:03:44.240
the H &H family office has expanded its interest

00:03:44.240 --> 00:03:47.520
across nearly all financial services, which create

00:03:47.520 --> 00:03:50.879
solutions for high noble families. These include

00:03:50.879 --> 00:03:53.819
the Commercial Property Fund, which targets a

00:03:53.819 --> 00:03:55.699
return of seven and a half to eight and a half

00:03:55.699 --> 00:03:57.979
percent per annum. Funded under management is

00:03:57.979 --> 00:04:02.439
53 million, 100 % weighted occupancy rate, 20

00:04:02.439 --> 00:04:04.979
% co -investment and a five year weighted average

00:04:04.979 --> 00:04:08.759
lease expiry. Secondly, they've got a private

00:04:08.759 --> 00:04:12.659
credit fund with a direct deal approach, which

00:04:12.659 --> 00:04:17.759
targets double digit returns per annum. Thirdly,

00:04:17.860 --> 00:04:21.300
the Mossman Development Project Fund was $15

00:04:21.300 --> 00:04:26.139
million raised, projects a 15 % return per annum

00:04:26.139 --> 00:04:29.060
with a 30 to 50 % co -investment with a two to

00:04:29.060 --> 00:04:33.459
four year hold. Initium also provides access

00:04:33.459 --> 00:04:38.259
to other upcoming direct development funds projects

00:04:38.259 --> 00:04:41.160
on an ad hoc basis. Essentially, you know, after

00:04:41.160 --> 00:04:42.839
they do all the checks and the deal lands, they

00:04:42.839 --> 00:04:46.220
send it out to their clients. And finally, they

00:04:46.220 --> 00:04:50.199
are expanding organically because their clients

00:04:50.199 --> 00:04:53.279
are just asking for it. And furthermore, they're

00:04:53.279 --> 00:04:55.939
growing through acquisition into the high net

00:04:55.939 --> 00:04:59.639
worth, high net worth wealth management and financial

00:04:59.639 --> 00:05:03.040
advisory space. Like I said, it's gonna it's

00:05:03.040 --> 00:05:05.149
a very, very interesting column. conversation

00:05:05.149 --> 00:05:08.189
and lots to unpack. So you know, please join

00:05:08.189 --> 00:05:11.889
us. It's going to be a great conversation. So

00:05:11.889 --> 00:05:13.970
before we get into this podcast, please remember,

00:05:14.269 --> 00:05:16.310
this podcast is intended for entertainment purposes

00:05:16.310 --> 00:05:19.410
only and should be only should not be taken as

00:05:19.410 --> 00:05:21.970
any form of advice. Be sure to listen to this

00:05:21.970 --> 00:05:23.930
glamour at the end of the broadcast and keep

00:05:23.930 --> 00:05:27.649
your feedback coming. You can reach me at mgassi

00:05:27.649 --> 00:05:32.750
at ywm .com .au As always, I hope you enjoy this

00:05:32.750 --> 00:05:35.649
conversation as much as I did, so sit back, relax,

00:05:35.949 --> 00:05:49.790
and enjoy. Bo Zhang, welcome to the rate of change

00:05:49.790 --> 00:05:52.050
with York Wealth Management. Thank you, Murdoch.

00:05:52.189 --> 00:05:54.089
Thanks for having me. Good to have you here,

00:05:54.230 --> 00:05:57.629
Bo. Beautiful day like today. So why don't we,

00:05:57.769 --> 00:06:00.069
as always, start things off and tell us a little

00:06:00.069 --> 00:06:02.910
bit about Bo and how you got into the wild world

00:06:02.910 --> 00:06:08.430
of financial markets. A little bit about myself.

00:06:08.850 --> 00:06:12.230
I've been banking and finance for about 15, 16

00:06:12.230 --> 00:06:15.769
years or so. I started actually working in stock

00:06:15.769 --> 00:06:19.889
breaking. Later, I started doing a lot of this

00:06:19.889 --> 00:06:23.370
single stock lens through margin lending. for

00:06:23.370 --> 00:06:25.569
a lot of the high net worth family office clients.

00:06:26.430 --> 00:06:31.129
At the time I was actually an internal BDM rather

00:06:31.129 --> 00:06:34.029
than an external BDM. So I had to manage a lot

00:06:34.029 --> 00:06:36.670
of relationships with a lot of the private bankers.

00:06:37.050 --> 00:06:40.430
We had a good relationship. Eventually basically

00:06:40.430 --> 00:06:43.230
we moved on to the point where they really wanted

00:06:43.230 --> 00:06:46.009
me to join, but then most of them got poached

00:06:46.009 --> 00:06:48.889
to Credit Suisse. And what happened there was

00:06:48.889 --> 00:06:52.779
they decided to bring me a crossover. with them,

00:06:52.959 --> 00:06:56.019
two credit strips. So that sort of just transpired

00:06:56.019 --> 00:06:59.019
my career from, you know, half the time, half

00:06:59.019 --> 00:07:02.379
of my career doing stock broking, margin ending

00:07:02.379 --> 00:07:05.240
too later, I started doing private banking. So

00:07:05.240 --> 00:07:08.860
when I started doing private banking for about,

00:07:09.540 --> 00:07:13.160
I think, I did it for about at least eight to

00:07:13.160 --> 00:07:17.639
nine years of it. Throughout that time, you know,

00:07:17.839 --> 00:07:20.379
slowly started building up my career through

00:07:20.379 --> 00:07:24.720
that. No path, yeah. Yeah, right. So and which

00:07:24.720 --> 00:07:28.000
bank were you at after Credit Suisse? I was at

00:07:28.000 --> 00:07:32.500
Westpac. Westpac. Yeah. So Westpac private. I

00:07:32.500 --> 00:07:36.740
think the specific part about myself, I was very

00:07:36.740 --> 00:07:40.439
different to a lot of other people. I myself,

00:07:40.439 --> 00:07:42.860
I didn't have the good grades. So I had to work

00:07:42.860 --> 00:07:47.459
my way up. I had to take at least 80 to 100 phone

00:07:47.459 --> 00:07:49.300
calls every day back in the days, I remembered

00:07:49.300 --> 00:07:53.000
very clearly. I started at the beginning where

00:07:53.000 --> 00:07:55.680
I was taking phone calls, just doing trade executions,

00:07:56.060 --> 00:07:59.139
answering custom service inquiries. Obviously

00:07:59.139 --> 00:08:01.240
later, you move your way up in the corporate

00:08:01.240 --> 00:08:07.300
ladder. But the most important, and the very

00:08:07.300 --> 00:08:09.399
big difference for me, I guess, specifically

00:08:09.399 --> 00:08:13.040
was the transition from ANZ to Credit Suisse.

00:08:13.980 --> 00:08:17.220
I had a lot of these direct clients that was

00:08:17.220 --> 00:08:20.459
single stock. you know, single stock, I did a

00:08:20.459 --> 00:08:22.879
lot of single stock lens, sorry. And a lot of

00:08:22.879 --> 00:08:25.379
these clients are actually, you know, high net

00:08:25.379 --> 00:08:27.259
worth individuals, you know, listed companies,

00:08:27.480 --> 00:08:30.860
CEOs, major shareholders. And I thought I had

00:08:30.860 --> 00:08:32.440
a good relationship with them because obviously

00:08:32.440 --> 00:08:33.919
they were dealing with me on the margin and the

00:08:33.919 --> 00:08:36.259
end. So naturally when I thought I'm moving to

00:08:36.259 --> 00:08:38.899
Credit Suisse, it would have been an easy transition

00:08:38.899 --> 00:08:40.600
where I could just pick up the phone, give them

00:08:40.600 --> 00:08:42.179
a call and said, you know, I'm at Credit Suisse

00:08:42.179 --> 00:08:45.200
and you know, everything should be, should be,

00:08:45.200 --> 00:08:48.720
should be quite smooth. And in that first year,

00:08:48.840 --> 00:08:51.299
I think in the first six months of my time at

00:08:51.299 --> 00:08:53.399
Critisys, that was probably the toughest time

00:08:53.399 --> 00:08:55.940
in my career that I experienced. Nobody came

00:08:55.940 --> 00:08:59.779
across from ANZ. Nobody wanted to do deals with

00:08:59.779 --> 00:09:01.500
me. Nobody wanted to do business with me because

00:09:01.500 --> 00:09:04.799
I didn't hold that end relationship. So that

00:09:04.799 --> 00:09:07.440
sort of just made me understand that relationship

00:09:07.440 --> 00:09:10.080
is the key term and the most important part in

00:09:10.080 --> 00:09:15.759
business and in banking. Relationship gets loosely

00:09:15.759 --> 00:09:18.440
used in banking. You know, they say they're relationship

00:09:18.440 --> 00:09:21.779
director, relationship manager, but really, who

00:09:21.779 --> 00:09:24.399
really owns that relationship? Is it the bank

00:09:24.399 --> 00:09:27.340
or you personally? And most of the time, it's

00:09:27.340 --> 00:09:30.120
actually the banks, not the person managing the

00:09:30.120 --> 00:09:33.460
relationship. So at the time when I started Critters,

00:09:33.539 --> 00:09:38.039
I didn't have a book. I had to build a book up.

00:09:38.559 --> 00:09:42.259
That was very tough. The platform wasn't specifically

00:09:42.259 --> 00:09:46.120
catered to the type of client I wanted. We wanted.

00:09:46.899 --> 00:09:49.259
from the sort of the Asian segment that I was

00:09:49.259 --> 00:09:54.679
in. So I thought to myself, you know, do I continue

00:09:54.679 --> 00:09:56.840
to stay in a big international investment bank

00:09:56.840 --> 00:10:02.019
and try to hustle my way through managing the

00:10:02.019 --> 00:10:04.259
portfolios? Hopefully, you know, we'll get a

00:10:04.259 --> 00:10:06.659
few big high net worth clients and family offices,

00:10:06.840 --> 00:10:10.679
all China with families, whatnot. Or I go back

00:10:10.679 --> 00:10:14.500
to a major bank, which will be smooth sailing.

00:10:14.669 --> 00:10:17.149
I believe, because obviously the major banks

00:10:17.149 --> 00:10:19.789
offers the transactional banking, the lending,

00:10:20.289 --> 00:10:23.789
the wealth management. And at the time, Westpac

00:10:23.789 --> 00:10:26.330
Private was actually the best one on the market

00:10:26.330 --> 00:10:30.309
that allowed you to do all of that, which is

00:10:30.309 --> 00:10:32.070
quite similar to, of course, the likes of Credit

00:10:32.070 --> 00:10:39.370
Suisse. Whereas in terms of the investment, the

00:10:39.370 --> 00:10:42.269
whole investment availability was much less.

00:10:42.480 --> 00:10:45.279
in comparison to Credit Suisse, but it was okay.

00:10:45.440 --> 00:10:47.659
I mean, it was more around the specific ones

00:10:47.659 --> 00:10:50.379
that was available that met more than having

00:10:50.379 --> 00:10:52.679
a whole universe of investments where nobody

00:10:52.679 --> 00:10:55.399
knows who to go to or what to choose sometimes.

00:10:56.659 --> 00:11:00.200
So that transition actually changed, I must admit.

00:11:01.360 --> 00:11:04.220
Because I remember when I was at Credit Suisse,

00:11:05.139 --> 00:11:07.419
it was a time I got to the point where literally

00:11:07.419 --> 00:11:09.519
I sat in the corner of my room and I thought,

00:11:09.860 --> 00:11:13.120
how the hell Am I not getting deals done? You

00:11:13.120 --> 00:11:14.820
know, I've always done so well in banking, always

00:11:14.820 --> 00:11:16.919
done so well in sales. Why am I not getting it

00:11:16.919 --> 00:11:19.600
done? So, you know, a lot of different variables

00:11:19.600 --> 00:11:22.179
added together. I thought I didn't have the relationships.

00:11:22.220 --> 00:11:25.120
I need to build it. So I changed my strategy.

00:11:25.200 --> 00:11:27.139
When I went to Westpac, I told them that I didn't

00:11:27.139 --> 00:11:29.659
want any clients. So I said specifically, I wanted

00:11:29.659 --> 00:11:31.700
to go out there and build my own network, build

00:11:31.700 --> 00:11:36.659
my own clients. And through that, I built a lot

00:11:36.659 --> 00:11:39.590
of external parties, external networks. and built

00:11:39.590 --> 00:11:41.750
my own personal brand in that sort of high net

00:11:41.750 --> 00:11:44.690
worth space amongst referral partners amongst

00:11:44.690 --> 00:11:49.529
fellow clients which really propelled my career

00:11:49.529 --> 00:11:52.929
and I have to say you know I'm glad I made that

00:11:52.929 --> 00:11:55.870
move because if I didn't maybe perhaps today

00:11:55.870 --> 00:11:58.110
I was still trying I might be still struggling

00:11:58.110 --> 00:12:01.330
just because you know no matter how good you

00:12:01.330 --> 00:12:03.870
are in sales you know the product the platform

00:12:03.870 --> 00:12:06.690
everything else also needs to come together as

00:12:06.690 --> 00:12:10.769
one before It sort of makes sense. So, so I just

00:12:10.769 --> 00:12:14.009
started rambling off. It's half the fun of it.

00:12:14.090 --> 00:12:15.450
No, but it's interesting something you touched

00:12:15.450 --> 00:12:18.710
on. Like we've had a number of great guests and

00:12:18.710 --> 00:12:20.789
fund managers on that have all had a similar

00:12:20.789 --> 00:12:23.309
path. My dad worked for NAB, but he was one of

00:12:23.309 --> 00:12:25.710
the survivors that actually did finish his career

00:12:25.710 --> 00:12:28.509
at NAB. But this generation, you're seeing a

00:12:28.509 --> 00:12:30.269
lot of people, especially in the growth -based

00:12:30.269 --> 00:12:33.149
lending or property -based lending, who built

00:12:33.149 --> 00:12:36.110
up very good careers and relationships at the

00:12:36.110 --> 00:12:40.059
banks like Westpac, all taking that and taking

00:12:40.059 --> 00:12:43.059
those relationships and then going private. Would

00:12:43.059 --> 00:12:46.179
you say that that transition is not necessarily

00:12:46.179 --> 00:12:49.480
because you want to go private, it's maybe because

00:12:49.480 --> 00:12:53.559
the banks chose not to look after the clients

00:12:53.559 --> 00:12:55.840
in a way that you think is the right way to look

00:12:55.840 --> 00:12:59.480
after them? Maybe you had to find a different

00:12:59.480 --> 00:13:02.580
way of doing it? What do you think? It's a very

00:13:02.580 --> 00:13:06.519
good question, Dan Meadow. I had the mentality

00:13:06.519 --> 00:13:08.720
when I joined Westpac Private that I wanted to

00:13:08.720 --> 00:13:12.799
do private eventually. I had that set in the

00:13:12.799 --> 00:13:14.620
back of my mind. I'm going to go out there, start

00:13:14.620 --> 00:13:17.820
my own business, run my own show. Why? For the

00:13:17.820 --> 00:13:21.279
reason I know that I need to give it a shot to

00:13:21.279 --> 00:13:24.299
have that mentality that I need to go out there

00:13:24.299 --> 00:13:27.539
and start hustling. As much as hustling the bank,

00:13:28.279 --> 00:13:29.919
being in the private world, it's a totally different

00:13:29.919 --> 00:13:32.679
sort of setting, environment. So I just kept

00:13:32.679 --> 00:13:34.870
that in the back of my mind. I mean, the banks

00:13:34.870 --> 00:13:36.590
obviously do what they do to look after their

00:13:36.590 --> 00:13:38.669
clients, but obviously it's a very big organization.

00:13:39.809 --> 00:13:41.429
There's a lot of decision -making that's out

00:13:41.429 --> 00:13:45.210
of your control. And I like to control my own

00:13:45.210 --> 00:13:47.330
destiny, but it's going to be the right timing,

00:13:47.529 --> 00:13:52.070
right opportunity. So from that perspective,

00:13:52.190 --> 00:13:55.149
I think that's the more important aspect. Now,

00:13:55.169 --> 00:13:58.970
I guess in terms of a lot of people that's been

00:13:58.970 --> 00:14:02.600
banking, They think they have a great relationship

00:14:02.600 --> 00:14:05.600
with clients, but when they leave the bank, sometimes

00:14:05.600 --> 00:14:08.820
it's a big change. Why I say that is because

00:14:08.820 --> 00:14:13.399
sometimes a lot of clients, when you were a banker,

00:14:13.600 --> 00:14:17.720
still see you as the bank, but they don't see

00:14:17.720 --> 00:14:21.759
you as Bo. So when I was in banking, I made sure

00:14:21.759 --> 00:14:24.399
that I knew from the get -go that they need to

00:14:24.399 --> 00:14:27.840
know Bo and not the bank, although they know

00:14:27.840 --> 00:14:30.179
which bank. And surprisingly, I tell you what,

00:14:30.220 --> 00:14:32.039
some of my clients still don't know which bank

00:14:32.039 --> 00:14:35.580
I was in. Even after eight years, they still

00:14:35.580 --> 00:14:39.419
ask me, which bank were you in? Which bank am

00:14:39.419 --> 00:14:41.940
I when I was still in banking? But that to me

00:14:41.940 --> 00:14:44.240
proves that my personal brand worked with this

00:14:44.240 --> 00:14:46.399
client because they only cared about who Bo is.

00:14:46.940 --> 00:14:49.720
And if Bo said, okay, this is it, then this is

00:14:49.720 --> 00:14:52.179
it. Rather than saying, if Westpac said this,

00:14:52.539 --> 00:14:54.440
then we believe what Westpac says. Because what's

00:14:54.440 --> 00:14:56.879
going to happen is, as soon as I get out of that,

00:14:57.299 --> 00:14:59.740
sort of that banking environment become private,

00:15:01.000 --> 00:15:03.159
a lot of those clients that don't buy the personal

00:15:03.159 --> 00:15:04.919
brand, don't know the personal brand will still

00:15:04.919 --> 00:15:09.139
stick to Westpac. 110%, I guarantee that. I mean,

00:15:09.200 --> 00:15:12.399
people can prove me wrong, but so far, you know,

00:15:12.399 --> 00:15:15.000
I see that very clearly. And I think a lot of

00:15:15.000 --> 00:15:17.759
people see that clearly. Okay. I have to, I completely

00:15:17.759 --> 00:15:19.120
have to agree with you because like, you know,

00:15:19.159 --> 00:15:20.799
when I left showing partners and went and went

00:15:20.799 --> 00:15:24.580
to York, you know, um, I managed to take not

00:15:24.580 --> 00:15:26.840
many clients with me because, and what's hilarious,

00:15:26.860 --> 00:15:28.940
I brought them from a small shop to a large shop.

00:15:29.039 --> 00:15:30.399
But when they're large shop, one of my clients

00:15:30.399 --> 00:15:31.940
then said, I guess, oh, Murdock, I can't join

00:15:31.940 --> 00:15:33.620
you now because, you know, I'm at a very good

00:15:33.620 --> 00:15:34.960
prestigious firm. Like, how do you think you

00:15:34.960 --> 00:15:37.919
got that? I introduced them to you. Oh, but you

00:15:37.919 --> 00:15:39.539
know what I mean? That type of thing. But what's

00:15:39.539 --> 00:15:43.519
interesting, what you're touching on is, and

00:15:43.519 --> 00:15:45.000
this is what probably a lot of people are listening

00:15:45.000 --> 00:15:48.299
to now is it's a simple question. Who do I trust?

00:15:48.519 --> 00:15:51.740
Do I trust the advisor that's looking after me

00:15:51.740 --> 00:15:54.149
or do I trust the shop? And why I think that's

00:15:54.149 --> 00:15:57.669
so important is you go speak to any firm on the

00:15:57.669 --> 00:16:00.029
market and speak to a client of any of those

00:16:00.029 --> 00:16:02.210
firm. One will say that I had a good relationship.

00:16:02.309 --> 00:16:04.289
One will say I had a bad relationship. And wouldn't

00:16:04.289 --> 00:16:06.750
you agree? It's not necessarily the firm to an

00:16:06.750 --> 00:16:09.549
extent. It's potentially the individual who they're

00:16:09.549 --> 00:16:12.470
dealing with at that particular place. So if

00:16:12.470 --> 00:16:14.029
anyone's listening out there considering, you

00:16:14.029 --> 00:16:16.230
know, who do I deal with? I would absolutely

00:16:16.230 --> 00:16:20.600
100%. Back the idea and this is for funds management

00:16:20.600 --> 00:16:22.600
advisory anything where you're essentially looking

00:16:22.600 --> 00:16:24.980
for a middleman to help facilitate a Transaction

00:16:24.980 --> 00:16:27.299
or you know do all the legwork put in a silver

00:16:27.299 --> 00:16:29.919
platter for you to make a decision Back the person

00:16:29.919 --> 00:16:32.220
don't back the house wouldn't you agree? I totally

00:16:32.220 --> 00:16:34.460
agree I've had a few of my clients that always

00:16:34.460 --> 00:16:36.799
said to me it's person we're investing in not

00:16:36.799 --> 00:16:40.659
the product not the firm Although I do represent

00:16:40.659 --> 00:16:43.059
the product. I am the product I am the firm but

00:16:43.059 --> 00:16:45.200
still at the end of the day They it's they still

00:16:45.200 --> 00:16:47.200
come back and said well we're investing in you

00:16:47.320 --> 00:16:49.200
Um, you know, there's a trust, there's a level,

00:16:49.279 --> 00:16:52.919
there's a relationship. So I totally agree 110%.

00:16:52.919 --> 00:16:54.820
I kind of agree. And why this becomes fun when

00:16:54.820 --> 00:16:57.019
you've done all this, you know, with a bank and

00:16:57.019 --> 00:16:58.840
build those relationships and they trust you.

00:16:59.220 --> 00:17:00.980
And let's get to the good bit. Why, why, why

00:17:00.980 --> 00:17:03.360
I brought you, why I brought you onto the podcast,

00:17:03.419 --> 00:17:06.299
Bo is essentially with these relationships, you've

00:17:06.299 --> 00:17:07.880
done something really, really quite interesting,

00:17:07.880 --> 00:17:11.700
right? Um, which is essentially you're working

00:17:11.700 --> 00:17:16.019
with a very prominent a family office from property

00:17:16.019 --> 00:17:18.200
background, right? But what's very interesting

00:17:18.200 --> 00:17:20.680
about this is not just a single family office,

00:17:21.039 --> 00:17:24.019
it's a joint family office, right? That, you

00:17:24.019 --> 00:17:26.500
know, and it's a definition of intergenerational

00:17:26.500 --> 00:17:29.920
wealth as well, which I find, you know, fascinating.

00:17:30.319 --> 00:17:33.119
So maybe let's begin this take a step back. For

00:17:33.119 --> 00:17:36.759
people that don't know what is a family office,

00:17:36.759 --> 00:17:39.619
right? And why have they gone a joint family

00:17:39.619 --> 00:17:41.980
office? And who is the family office? Yes, yes.

00:17:42.759 --> 00:17:46.279
I think I'll put it in layman's terms. To me,

00:17:46.480 --> 00:17:51.019
family office is an individual family that's

00:17:51.019 --> 00:17:52.680
built so much wealth that they can't manage it

00:17:52.680 --> 00:17:55.420
themselves personally. So let's put it in that.

00:17:55.720 --> 00:17:59.200
If you're worth 300 million plus, to me, that's

00:17:59.200 --> 00:18:03.980
a family office. Anything below, I think you

00:18:03.980 --> 00:18:06.839
can still manage your wealth quite well within

00:18:06.839 --> 00:18:09.569
the family. But when you start moving that fund,

00:18:09.569 --> 00:18:12.490
that 300 million plus, it gets more complicated.

00:18:12.650 --> 00:18:14.769
You need a lot more professionals around you,

00:18:14.789 --> 00:18:17.670
not more people around you. So really, that's

00:18:17.670 --> 00:18:19.809
how I see it. Your personal wealth has grown

00:18:19.809 --> 00:18:22.589
so large that you need a team of professionals,

00:18:23.369 --> 00:18:25.009
even your family members, to help you manage

00:18:25.009 --> 00:18:27.569
those individual wealth. If you're only worth,

00:18:27.569 --> 00:18:29.109
say, a couple million dollars, I'm sure you can

00:18:29.109 --> 00:18:31.569
manage it yourself. So that, to me, is what I

00:18:31.569 --> 00:18:34.970
call family wealth. Obviously, apart from that,

00:18:35.160 --> 00:18:40.920
You have those individual parts about family

00:18:40.920 --> 00:18:43.500
office governance, tax governance for the family

00:18:43.500 --> 00:18:46.900
office, legal, estate planning, wealth management,

00:18:47.059 --> 00:18:50.799
all of that stuff will be part of that, which

00:18:50.799 --> 00:18:54.039
forms the family office. But in reality, what

00:18:54.039 --> 00:18:56.900
is it? It's basically that. Just very, very wealthy

00:18:56.900 --> 00:18:59.640
people or family with a lot of money that can't

00:18:59.640 --> 00:19:01.119
manage it themselves and they need a bunch of

00:19:01.119 --> 00:19:02.799
people to help them run that particular office,

00:19:03.019 --> 00:19:06.650
which is the family. Hope that makes sense. Makes

00:19:06.650 --> 00:19:10.170
perfect sense. So the family which you're working

00:19:10.170 --> 00:19:13.470
with. Yes, yes. Why this family? Who are the

00:19:13.470 --> 00:19:16.789
family? You know, maybe let's start there. You

00:19:16.789 --> 00:19:18.750
know, nice and simple. Who are the families?

00:19:18.829 --> 00:19:22.190
Why these families in particular? Yeah, I mean,

00:19:23.190 --> 00:19:24.829
again, it comes back to that relationship piece,

00:19:25.190 --> 00:19:28.150
right? You know, you asked Murdoch. So these

00:19:28.150 --> 00:19:30.430
are actually existing clients on my, both the

00:19:30.430 --> 00:19:34.059
Hasen family and the Huang family. We've known

00:19:34.059 --> 00:19:38.259
each other for seven or eight years, at least.

00:19:40.299 --> 00:19:43.880
Throughout the time I've known the patriarchs

00:19:43.880 --> 00:19:46.880
and the matriarchs and later getting to know

00:19:46.880 --> 00:19:52.339
the kids, we've built a very good rapport relationship.

00:19:53.859 --> 00:19:56.779
And I think it's about the level of trust we've

00:19:56.779 --> 00:19:58.700
built with each other, understanding what each

00:19:58.700 --> 00:20:02.099
other needs, what they need in this market, what

00:20:02.099 --> 00:20:05.640
I want. what I need as well. And I think everything

00:20:05.640 --> 00:20:09.119
sort of connected together. And when you connect

00:20:09.119 --> 00:20:11.460
it together, that's when we've decided, hey,

00:20:12.299 --> 00:20:16.019
let's start up a firm together. But as you know,

00:20:16.420 --> 00:20:18.180
the Matriarchs and Patriarchs, they've made their

00:20:18.180 --> 00:20:20.420
money, they've made their wealth. There's really

00:20:20.420 --> 00:20:22.940
no need for them to go and try and make more

00:20:22.940 --> 00:20:25.539
money because they are already on the scene.

00:20:26.119 --> 00:20:28.920
For a bit of context, right? So who is Ian Hasing?

00:20:29.200 --> 00:20:32.140
And then, you know, who is the Huang family and

00:20:32.140 --> 00:20:34.900
how did they make their money? People would find

00:20:34.900 --> 00:20:36.720
that quite interesting. Are they entrepreneurs?

00:20:37.019 --> 00:20:40.480
Are they property? Like how? Correct. So, you

00:20:40.480 --> 00:20:44.319
know, I guess the Heisen family, obviously they

00:20:44.319 --> 00:20:46.519
were one of the very first property entrepreneurs

00:20:46.519 --> 00:20:50.460
in Australia. Harbourside shopping centre was

00:20:50.460 --> 00:20:52.539
built by them. You mean Darling Harbour, yeah?

00:20:52.940 --> 00:20:55.500
Darling Harbour. Just paint the picture. I think

00:20:55.500 --> 00:20:57.750
half of Darling Harbour was built by them. Back

00:20:57.750 --> 00:20:59.950
in the days, during the 80s, that was a $2 billion

00:20:59.950 --> 00:21:02.970
project. The Queen came down for the opening.

00:21:03.809 --> 00:21:06.750
So obviously, that was the very big project that

00:21:06.750 --> 00:21:09.150
they did, the most famous one. They then went

00:21:09.150 --> 00:21:11.910
and did quite a number of other famous properties.

00:21:11.950 --> 00:21:13.289
So they're very well -known in this property

00:21:13.289 --> 00:21:17.049
landscape, right? I met the Heisen family through

00:21:17.049 --> 00:21:20.150
the Huang family, right? In the Huang family,

00:21:20.210 --> 00:21:22.549
they've always been property and financial services

00:21:22.549 --> 00:21:27.309
in China. They know this market in China. but

00:21:27.309 --> 00:21:30.990
they don't know it so well in Australia. And

00:21:30.990 --> 00:21:33.470
the two families, they know each other very well

00:21:33.470 --> 00:21:35.970
because obviously Victor and Max, my two partners,

00:21:36.609 --> 00:21:40.569
they went to private school together. They boarded

00:21:40.569 --> 00:21:43.849
together, actually. So it just made a lot of

00:21:43.849 --> 00:21:45.589
sense where everything just sort of connected,

00:21:46.750 --> 00:21:48.769
where property mixed with finance, finance mixed

00:21:48.769 --> 00:21:52.269
with property, and everything just sort of just...

00:21:52.119 --> 00:21:54.559
interrelated and connected and that's how we

00:21:54.559 --> 00:21:56.539
all really got together got to know each other

00:21:56.539 --> 00:21:59.839
and thought okay we have that capability in property

00:21:59.839 --> 00:22:04.579
we understand finance and we also have that capability

00:22:04.579 --> 00:22:07.160
if we really need to obviously having me around

00:22:07.160 --> 00:22:10.279
managing wealth at the time why don't we put

00:22:10.279 --> 00:22:13.759
the two together and then create a fund which

00:22:13.759 --> 00:22:16.940
is obviously commercial property fund so before

00:22:16.940 --> 00:22:21.099
that obviously we were doing a lot of that They

00:22:21.099 --> 00:22:23.180
were doing a lot of that from a private office

00:22:23.180 --> 00:22:27.339
perspective. We've tested the market. We've seen

00:22:27.339 --> 00:22:30.039
results. We've seen our own track records. And

00:22:30.039 --> 00:22:32.839
we think, OK, now it's time to make a commercial.

00:22:33.960 --> 00:22:36.900
Because how I think of it is no matter how wealthy

00:22:36.900 --> 00:22:39.059
you are, there's always going to be a cap on

00:22:39.059 --> 00:22:41.339
how much money you're willing to spend. If you're

00:22:41.339 --> 00:22:42.819
worth a billion dollars, you're not going to

00:22:42.819 --> 00:22:45.000
go spend a billion dollars. You probably spend

00:22:45.000 --> 00:22:48.440
a portion of that. And what do you do after you

00:22:48.440 --> 00:22:50.619
spend that portion and you want to continue to

00:22:50.619 --> 00:22:55.660
build up the whole portfolio along with others,

00:22:55.900 --> 00:22:58.319
then you start raising capital. How would you

00:22:58.319 --> 00:23:00.279
raise it? You raise it through a commercial property.

00:23:00.859 --> 00:23:02.940
Or, of course, you can do it privately amongst

00:23:02.940 --> 00:23:05.200
different families. However, we really wanted

00:23:05.200 --> 00:23:08.319
to propel ourselves to become a recognizable

00:23:08.319 --> 00:23:11.799
brand. And, of course, for people to recognize

00:23:11.799 --> 00:23:14.700
the products that we offer as part of this Pathela

00:23:14.700 --> 00:23:17.269
brand. which is initiative, of course. Yeah.

00:23:17.329 --> 00:23:22.730
Okay. So the family office is Heisen and Huang

00:23:22.730 --> 00:23:28.569
family office, right? And then the firm is initiative.

00:23:31.029 --> 00:23:34.430
And just for just to paint the picture, it's

00:23:34.430 --> 00:23:37.369
began as on the property side. So you got lending

00:23:37.369 --> 00:23:39.630
on the credit side, and then you got direct private

00:23:39.630 --> 00:23:41.630
property, and then you got the commercial fund.

00:23:42.309 --> 00:23:44.880
But now it's You've kind of expanded quite a

00:23:44.880 --> 00:23:48.299
bit. It's practically becoming a full financial

00:23:48.299 --> 00:23:52.480
advisory one -stop -shop offering. The dream,

00:23:52.480 --> 00:23:55.240
the dream where, and I love this dream as well,

00:23:55.279 --> 00:23:56.960
where essentially you just have to go to one

00:23:56.960 --> 00:23:59.019
place and all your needs are taken care of. But

00:23:59.019 --> 00:24:00.619
let's just take a step back for a second, right?

00:24:00.799 --> 00:24:03.039
So I always like to discuss the mechanics of

00:24:03.039 --> 00:24:05.319
the funds. Let's just begin with a commercial

00:24:05.319 --> 00:24:07.579
property fund, because you've also brought across

00:24:07.579 --> 00:24:09.460
the chief investment officer that helps with

00:24:09.460 --> 00:24:12.079
the SMAs, who I know quite well is... very, very

00:24:12.079 --> 00:24:14.660
intelligent in this particular space, but what,

00:24:14.859 --> 00:24:19.200
what is the initial commercial property fund?

00:24:19.660 --> 00:24:21.480
What are the mechanics behind it and how's the

00:24:21.480 --> 00:24:23.680
structure? What returns, you know, more importantly,

00:24:23.680 --> 00:24:29.460
um, uh, where are you focusing? Is this Queensland?

00:24:29.480 --> 00:24:31.259
Is it Sydney? You know, why, like, you know,

00:24:31.259 --> 00:24:33.200
maybe give everyone a bit of an idea of what's

00:24:33.200 --> 00:24:35.099
happening with the fund. Yeah. Yeah. I mean,

00:24:35.220 --> 00:24:37.460
so for the commercial property fund, we specifically

00:24:37.460 --> 00:24:40.339
invest in retail commercial medium to large format

00:24:40.339 --> 00:24:43.420
stores. high street retail, I'll call it, right

00:24:43.420 --> 00:24:46.759
across the eastern seaboard of Australia. We

00:24:46.759 --> 00:24:48.779
see this market as a market that's quite niche.

00:24:49.680 --> 00:24:53.940
We have done enough research to see that there

00:24:53.940 --> 00:24:56.240
hasn't been many fire managers out there that

00:24:56.240 --> 00:25:00.519
focuses on this market or in this area. We see

00:25:00.519 --> 00:25:03.480
the likes of Dex's, Charter Hall, Centuria, Corvall,

00:25:03.519 --> 00:25:06.819
they do a lot of the office, hospitals, industrial

00:25:06.819 --> 00:25:09.759
shopping centers. But really, you don't see really

00:25:09.759 --> 00:25:13.900
any fund managers that has investments into retail

00:25:13.900 --> 00:25:18.019
commercial shopfronts. So we wanted to be that

00:25:18.019 --> 00:25:23.940
particular niche. We want to be known to be as

00:25:23.940 --> 00:25:26.579
part of that particular niche. So hence the reason

00:25:26.579 --> 00:25:31.119
why we decided to, of course, start up the fund

00:25:31.119 --> 00:25:36.180
in that regard. So our focus is in the eastern

00:25:36.180 --> 00:25:38.839
seaboard of Australia. The main areas that we

00:25:38.839 --> 00:25:42.980
look at is North Shore, Northern Beaches, and

00:25:42.980 --> 00:25:46.640
Eastern Suburbs. Because we believe in these

00:25:46.640 --> 00:25:49.200
particular areas, they obviously are very affluent

00:25:49.200 --> 00:25:52.779
areas. Retail commercial space in these particular

00:25:52.779 --> 00:25:56.400
areas are performing much better than some of

00:25:56.400 --> 00:25:59.960
the other areas. In particular, I had clients

00:25:59.960 --> 00:26:03.519
that had questions around the retail commercial

00:26:03.519 --> 00:26:08.750
market. We, us ourselves in Australia, we enjoy

00:26:08.750 --> 00:26:12.490
the recreational activities. We enjoy going out.

00:26:12.769 --> 00:26:15.950
So, it's very different to some of the areas,

00:26:16.569 --> 00:26:18.970
some other countries overseas where people are

00:26:18.970 --> 00:26:22.369
very used to just using their mobile, ordering

00:26:22.369 --> 00:26:27.329
food, buying groceries, buying, you know, anything

00:26:27.329 --> 00:26:31.329
and everything. So, that's why we chose the likes

00:26:31.329 --> 00:26:34.910
of Bondi Manly, you know, St. Leland's for example.

00:26:35.069 --> 00:26:39.970
where there's a lot of foot traffic in most of

00:26:39.970 --> 00:26:42.430
these commercial retail stores that we host at

00:26:42.430 --> 00:26:47.130
the moment. So the over return on our fund at

00:26:47.130 --> 00:26:51.789
the moment is around 7 .5 % to 8 .5%. And so

00:26:51.789 --> 00:26:55.710
far, all the tenants have been quite consistent

00:26:55.710 --> 00:27:00.809
in terms of running their own business, in terms

00:27:00.809 --> 00:27:03.710
of managing it, in terms of, of course, maintaining

00:27:03.710 --> 00:27:07.349
it. I think that's the most important part. So

00:27:07.349 --> 00:27:10.609
in that regard, we're hoping that we can continue

00:27:10.609 --> 00:27:13.930
to see more opportunities on the market. Obviously,

00:27:13.990 --> 00:27:18.789
rates has been quite high at the moment. So it's

00:27:18.789 --> 00:27:22.109
a lot harder to locate good opportunities, but

00:27:22.109 --> 00:27:25.250
I'm sure there's obviously a lot more that will

00:27:25.250 --> 00:27:29.710
come about. And of course, Max, my partner, his

00:27:29.710 --> 00:27:33.029
main focus is always him and his team is always

00:27:33.029 --> 00:27:37.099
looking for you know, sites or shops or wherever

00:27:37.099 --> 00:27:40.079
that we think is suitable for the fund. So yeah.

00:27:40.259 --> 00:27:41.900
Definitely going to get Max on to discuss, you

00:27:41.900 --> 00:27:43.740
know, how he looks at particular opportunities,

00:27:43.900 --> 00:27:45.460
but just with, let's just break down some of

00:27:45.460 --> 00:27:47.099
the mechanics because a lot of people will be

00:27:47.099 --> 00:27:49.059
interested in this. So it's targeting seven and

00:27:49.059 --> 00:27:51.819
a half to eight and a half percent. Is that purely

00:27:51.819 --> 00:27:54.339
growth? Is there an income component? Like how

00:27:54.339 --> 00:27:57.000
does that work? Yeah. So four to four and a half

00:27:57.000 --> 00:27:59.660
percent, that's the rental yield that gets paid

00:27:59.660 --> 00:28:01.839
monthly. The three and a half to four percent.

00:28:01.950 --> 00:28:04.490
That's based on valuation. So that'll get valued

00:28:04.490 --> 00:28:07.190
once a year. Obviously, right now, we are in

00:28:07.190 --> 00:28:10.990
an environment that's very tough in terms of

00:28:10.990 --> 00:28:14.589
high interest rates. Obviously, the demand for

00:28:14.589 --> 00:28:17.549
any commercial or any residential has sort of

00:28:17.549 --> 00:28:21.029
slowed down. But as soon as we start seeing the

00:28:21.029 --> 00:28:23.029
interest rate drop, we're going to see a lot

00:28:23.029 --> 00:28:24.910
of demand. Well, the Fed's talking about it now,

00:28:25.049 --> 00:28:26.589
right? And essentially, Australia follows the

00:28:26.589 --> 00:28:27.990
Fed. So that's going to be quite an interesting.

00:28:28.529 --> 00:28:32.509
How many rate cuts, I believe? they're looking

00:28:32.509 --> 00:28:36.269
at, I think Coggins was discussing. I think three

00:28:36.269 --> 00:28:42.269
at least we're hoping in the coming year. We

00:28:42.269 --> 00:28:46.250
don't believe that that will start at the end

00:28:46.250 --> 00:28:48.210
of the year this year, but hopefully beginning

00:28:48.210 --> 00:28:50.990
of the second quarter of next year we'll start

00:28:50.990 --> 00:28:54.269
seeing that sort of come down a little bit. Soon

00:28:54.269 --> 00:28:58.029
as we see that, we're going to see all these

00:28:58.029 --> 00:29:06.279
prices slowly So that's what people should consider

00:29:06.279 --> 00:29:09.819
in terms of, of course, investing these type

00:29:09.819 --> 00:29:14.599
of products or I should say asset class. Most

00:29:14.599 --> 00:29:16.299
of these type of investments, you generally give

00:29:16.299 --> 00:29:18.900
it at least five years, realistically. It is

00:29:18.900 --> 00:29:23.480
very defensive. It's obviously not like your

00:29:23.480 --> 00:29:26.180
stocks where you can see the prices of these

00:29:26.180 --> 00:29:31.170
particular assets go up and down. Generally speaking,

00:29:31.210 --> 00:29:34.769
you need to give at least five years plus. And

00:29:34.769 --> 00:29:37.730
once you sort of see that, then you'll say, OK,

00:29:37.970 --> 00:29:40.829
it's like you're holding individual assets yourself.

00:29:41.890 --> 00:29:46.210
But have a think about if you only have a very

00:29:46.210 --> 00:29:49.589
limited amount of capital, although, of course,

00:29:50.230 --> 00:29:52.150
you are high net worth, but still there are a

00:29:52.150 --> 00:29:54.230
limited amount of liquid capital, liquid cash,

00:29:54.690 --> 00:29:57.410
then you may not go one and put all your money

00:29:57.410 --> 00:30:00.690
in one asset. For example, one of the assets

00:30:00.690 --> 00:30:03.410
are worth $16 million. Are you going to put $16

00:30:03.410 --> 00:30:05.769
million into it? Maybe not. You want to be part

00:30:05.769 --> 00:30:07.750
owners of it. So you may only want to put $500

00:30:07.750 --> 00:30:11.390
,000, $1 million. Maybe that's something that

00:30:11.390 --> 00:30:12.789
you may be more interested in. You still get

00:30:12.789 --> 00:30:14.869
your return. You're still owner of the particular

00:30:14.869 --> 00:30:17.369
asset. But you just don't have to take the full

00:30:17.369 --> 00:30:19.750
risk and the full responsibility of managing

00:30:19.750 --> 00:30:23.880
it. So that's the difference, I believe. So what

00:30:23.880 --> 00:30:26.099
are the fees in the fund and what's the I believe

00:30:26.099 --> 00:30:27.740
there's a wholesale and then there's a retail

00:30:27.740 --> 00:30:31.640
feeder funds Yes, the lock -ins so locking period

00:30:31.640 --> 00:30:37.579
for the wholesale fund It is on two years generally

00:30:37.579 --> 00:30:42.859
speaking Two years is already a very tight timeframe

00:30:42.859 --> 00:30:46.920
for the say management fees 0 .5 % Obviously,

00:30:46.920 --> 00:30:49.619
we've got a retail feeder. That's enough month

00:30:49.619 --> 00:30:54.500
to month basis and of course If anybody's interested

00:30:54.500 --> 00:30:56.740
to find out more, we're happy to provide more

00:30:56.740 --> 00:30:59.339
information on that, of course. Yeah. Nice. So

00:30:59.339 --> 00:31:01.640
that's okay. So that's the, there's a lot of,

00:31:01.640 --> 00:31:03.200
a lot of great fund managers I'm seeing that

00:31:03.200 --> 00:31:05.299
have, it's not just one particular thing they're

00:31:05.299 --> 00:31:09.180
doing. So this is the commercial property with

00:31:09.180 --> 00:31:12.819
the credit side. Right. So then I believe you're

00:31:12.819 --> 00:31:15.779
exploring doing another fund as well. And then

00:31:15.779 --> 00:31:19.779
also you have the credit lending. So how does

00:31:19.779 --> 00:31:21.460
your private credit and then you got private

00:31:21.500 --> 00:31:24.279
property direct deals. So how does that work?

00:31:24.279 --> 00:31:26.539
We've got three different products. So one obviously

00:31:26.539 --> 00:31:28.240
is the commercial property fund we spoke about

00:31:28.240 --> 00:31:30.980
just then, the set, hold, forget type of investments

00:31:30.980 --> 00:31:34.440
where you're just holding that, getting your

00:31:34.440 --> 00:31:36.259
rental yield and looking forward to that capital

00:31:36.259 --> 00:31:39.819
upside. Blue chip property, Mossman, Manly, nice

00:31:39.819 --> 00:31:43.099
and chilled. Nice and easy. Second part of our

00:31:43.099 --> 00:31:46.279
product obviously is the direct project development

00:31:46.279 --> 00:31:51.819
funds. We've got a site of Mossman. The fun part.

00:31:52.259 --> 00:31:54.460
Yeah, so we've got a site in Mossman. We're looking

00:31:54.460 --> 00:31:56.900
to buy another site in Mossman. Hopefully we

00:31:56.900 --> 00:32:00.859
can exchange that today. But essentially, it's

00:32:00.859 --> 00:32:04.019
just buying it, knocking it down, rebuilding

00:32:04.019 --> 00:32:06.920
it. For example, the one on Military Road, four

00:32:06.920 --> 00:32:10.380
levels, luxury high -end apartments with two

00:32:10.380 --> 00:32:13.220
commercial shops on the bottom, right in the

00:32:13.220 --> 00:32:16.140
heart of Mossman. So that's project development.

00:32:16.259 --> 00:32:18.099
That's a little bit different with a product

00:32:18.099 --> 00:32:21.099
like that. We offer 15 % returns and that's on

00:32:21.099 --> 00:32:25.279
equity and then in 50 50 on the catch -up. So

00:32:25.279 --> 00:32:27.420
We will continue to have let's catch up. Sorry.

00:32:27.460 --> 00:32:33.160
So Essentially very simple We take 15 Investor

00:32:33.160 --> 00:32:36.539
takes 15 if anything over there's a 50 50 split

00:32:36.539 --> 00:32:39.180
between us. Yeah, right investor investor. Yep

00:32:39.180 --> 00:32:42.140
So, okay, so you've done a project and this is

00:32:42.140 --> 00:32:44.420
a talk about a new project So just you look at

00:32:44.420 --> 00:32:47.700
the numbers on the last project you did What

00:32:47.700 --> 00:32:49.920
are the numbers from that just to paint the picture?

00:32:50.940 --> 00:32:52.220
So if we put the numbers, we're talking about

00:32:52.220 --> 00:32:54.019
dollar figures, or we're talking about just in

00:32:54.019 --> 00:32:56.559
terms of percentage return? Percentages and dollar

00:32:56.559 --> 00:32:58.539
figures. I'm just trying to get an idea. It's

00:32:58.539 --> 00:33:01.819
not going to be a direct deal. Very easy. So

00:33:01.819 --> 00:33:03.740
just think of it as this. If a client invests

00:33:03.740 --> 00:33:06.660
$100 ,000, hypothetically speaking, the return

00:33:06.660 --> 00:33:08.819
on that is 50 % per annum. It's a four -year

00:33:08.819 --> 00:33:13.240
project. 15. So four -year project, what does

00:33:13.240 --> 00:33:15.640
that mean? So after four years, 60 % return.

00:33:16.779 --> 00:33:24.799
It's just direct versus us. So from our perspective

00:33:24.799 --> 00:33:29.240
then, they'll receive 15, we'll receive 15. So

00:33:29.240 --> 00:33:31.619
you're technically looking at a 30 % return per

00:33:31.619 --> 00:33:34.259
annum over four years. So that's about 120%.

00:33:34.259 --> 00:33:37.180
But we get a 50 -50 split. So they get 60 % of

00:33:37.180 --> 00:33:40.519
it. We get 60 % of it. We are, of course, ourselves

00:33:40.519 --> 00:33:42.339
the fire manager and, of course, the development

00:33:42.339 --> 00:33:44.980
manager. As you know, Initium has the Initium

00:33:44.980 --> 00:33:47.160
management, which is the development manager.

00:33:48.480 --> 00:33:50.519
The Initium capital being our manager, of course.

00:33:51.200 --> 00:33:56.460
So there's that direct interrelation with our

00:33:56.460 --> 00:33:59.180
project development. So all of our project developments

00:33:59.180 --> 00:34:02.900
are set up in that way. We know the developments

00:34:02.900 --> 00:34:05.000
ourselves very well. We have a full team. We

00:34:05.000 --> 00:34:07.519
have our head of project development. We have

00:34:07.519 --> 00:34:09.480
a leasing manager. We've got two acquisition

00:34:09.480 --> 00:34:11.760
managers. So everything's all hosted in -house.

00:34:11.920 --> 00:34:15.760
in particular. So yes, that's the exciting part,

00:34:15.960 --> 00:34:18.099
but obviously it comes with a lot of risk because,

00:34:18.099 --> 00:34:20.880
you know, a four -year project, what does that

00:34:20.880 --> 00:34:22.840
mean? It means that you've got to take on development

00:34:22.840 --> 00:34:26.440
risk. There's opportunity risk, there's a lot

00:34:26.440 --> 00:34:29.059
of timing risk, there's a lot of different components

00:34:29.059 --> 00:34:32.579
that comes into it. So it's suitable for a lot

00:34:32.579 --> 00:34:34.099
of people that's looking for that high growth,

00:34:34.199 --> 00:34:39.659
high return, and willing to take some risk. and

00:34:39.659 --> 00:34:41.420
suitable for people that knows property to a

00:34:41.420 --> 00:34:44.019
certain degree or wants to co -participate. So

00:34:44.019 --> 00:34:46.300
we get a lot of clients that has co -participated

00:34:46.300 --> 00:34:48.820
in this particular fund for the reason that they

00:34:48.820 --> 00:34:50.639
want it again to property, they want it again

00:34:50.639 --> 00:34:52.599
to development, but they just don't have that

00:34:52.599 --> 00:34:58.019
capacity or the capital or even the relationships

00:34:58.019 --> 00:35:02.579
in all aspects throughout the development stages.

00:35:03.860 --> 00:35:05.719
So hence the reason why they've decided to just

00:35:05.719 --> 00:35:08.519
go with us. So that deal, how much was raised

00:35:08.519 --> 00:35:12.780
for that deal? For the three assets, $15 million

00:35:12.780 --> 00:35:16.000
in total. And the new asset in Mossman right

00:35:16.000 --> 00:35:20.559
now? That one's about $13 million. $13 million.

00:35:22.579 --> 00:35:27.420
We do like this part of the market because...

00:35:27.420 --> 00:35:29.340
What is the part of the market? Because we had

00:35:29.340 --> 00:35:31.280
a recent guest on as well that was discussing

00:35:31.280 --> 00:35:34.159
doing say Light Industrial or doing Amazon style

00:35:34.159 --> 00:35:38.590
warehouses or... land subdivision and then obviously

00:35:38.590 --> 00:35:42.929
CBD right now is incredibly difficult. That's

00:35:42.929 --> 00:35:45.869
very, very difficult, but what is this sub asset

00:35:45.869 --> 00:35:48.730
class? Like by definition, so you take these

00:35:48.730 --> 00:35:50.869
townhouses or businesses which are buying, what

00:35:50.869 --> 00:35:53.090
is the actual product which you're building on

00:35:53.090 --> 00:35:56.070
it? Like what is it? Yeah. So let's just take

00:35:56.070 --> 00:35:59.050
it as an example. The one on military road, that's

00:35:59.050 --> 00:36:01.449
three commercial shops. Three commercial shops.

00:36:01.789 --> 00:36:04.510
Is there a living, like apartments, houses? No,

00:36:04.809 --> 00:36:08.469
nothing at all. Just pure commercial shops. Three

00:36:08.469 --> 00:36:11.989
in a row that we've purchased, that we're going

00:36:11.989 --> 00:36:14.469
to knock down and rebuild where we can build

00:36:14.469 --> 00:36:17.170
four levels of residential. Apologies. That's

00:36:17.170 --> 00:36:19.250
what I meant. Like you're buying the, yes. And

00:36:19.250 --> 00:36:21.110
what are you putting on top of them? Yeah. What's

00:36:21.110 --> 00:36:22.329
the development? So we're going to knock it down.

00:36:22.510 --> 00:36:24.409
We're going to build two commercial shops on

00:36:24.409 --> 00:36:27.559
the bottom and four levels on top. Oh, residential.

00:36:27.679 --> 00:36:30.019
Residential, yes. The high -end quality residential.

00:36:30.019 --> 00:36:32.219
High -end quality ones, yes. High -quality residential.

00:36:33.360 --> 00:36:36.940
The other one over in, the other one in Mossman

00:36:36.940 --> 00:36:39.679
that we're looking to, hopefully we can exchange

00:36:39.679 --> 00:36:43.679
today, that one is a block of commercial apartments.

00:36:44.920 --> 00:36:47.820
So we're gonna get a new DA, most definitely

00:36:47.820 --> 00:36:50.360
we'll knock down rebuild it to repurpose it,

00:36:50.380 --> 00:36:55.400
obviously to a much higher quality build. You

00:36:55.400 --> 00:36:59.880
always see us doing a lot of these type of development

00:36:59.880 --> 00:37:02.699
projects, because there's a lot of these type

00:37:02.699 --> 00:37:05.900
of deals out on the market, off market, of course,

00:37:06.079 --> 00:37:07.480
not on market. Well, the one in Mossman makes

00:37:07.480 --> 00:37:09.400
sense. You're essentially taking three shops,

00:37:10.000 --> 00:37:12.639
putting back three shops, but then you're going

00:37:12.639 --> 00:37:14.940
up on the residential. Yes, correct. It just

00:37:14.940 --> 00:37:19.360
makes sense. Yeah. And everybody wants to get

00:37:19.360 --> 00:37:21.320
into that area. Everyone wants to get in, but

00:37:21.320 --> 00:37:24.219
there's just no deals. It's hard to find. Then

00:37:24.219 --> 00:37:26.800
you get priced out. The other thing which I find

00:37:26.800 --> 00:37:30.119
great about the two prong relationship is you

00:37:30.119 --> 00:37:32.539
have the Hason family, which is renowned, everyone

00:37:32.539 --> 00:37:35.059
knows the name. Then you have the Wang family.

00:37:35.860 --> 00:37:39.480
It's a nice balance. Come on, let's be honest.

00:37:39.900 --> 00:37:42.559
This upper rate national is very clicky. Even

00:37:42.559 --> 00:37:45.059
if you got the money and you want to do the deal

00:37:45.059 --> 00:37:46.360
with them, they might not know who you are and

00:37:46.360 --> 00:37:50.489
just sell to you. Isn't that a problem? organizing,

00:37:50.730 --> 00:37:52.190
if even people want to do this thing. Yeah, I

00:37:52.190 --> 00:37:57.309
mean, that is the part. So that's why Maxis is

00:37:57.309 --> 00:38:00.670
relationships in that sort of area, in that particular

00:38:00.670 --> 00:38:04.170
space. And that's a space that, you know, if

00:38:04.170 --> 00:38:08.070
you ask me to get into it, it's definitely not

00:38:08.070 --> 00:38:11.510
my particular area because the relationships

00:38:11.510 --> 00:38:13.809
from that end is totally different to the relationship

00:38:13.809 --> 00:38:18.570
we have, of course, the capital front. So that

00:38:18.570 --> 00:38:23.219
being said, Um, it's what gets things done. You

00:38:23.219 --> 00:38:25.559
know, um, I think I believe a lot of things are

00:38:25.559 --> 00:38:27.639
done based on relationship, based on who you

00:38:27.639 --> 00:38:30.159
know. Um, and like you said, it's, it's a clique.

00:38:31.199 --> 00:38:34.239
Um, and anywhere you go, it's always going to

00:38:34.239 --> 00:38:38.340
be like that. So can't change that, um, as much

00:38:38.340 --> 00:38:39.920
as you want to change that, but that's the harsh

00:38:39.920 --> 00:38:41.840
reality, you know. You go to Noosa, it's the

00:38:41.840 --> 00:38:47.260
Melbourne mafia. Yeah, it is what it is. Right.

00:38:47.679 --> 00:38:50.719
But that's business, right? And again, this is

00:38:50.719 --> 00:38:52.099
the benefit and this is why I wanted to, you

00:38:52.099 --> 00:38:54.000
know, discuss, like you discuss how family offices

00:38:54.000 --> 00:38:56.579
and some people asked us before, like, you know,

00:38:56.579 --> 00:38:58.420
is it a good idea to have a joint family office?

00:38:58.460 --> 00:39:00.519
You say the minimum is 300 ones, you've got 150

00:39:00.519 --> 00:39:03.159
each. You can't just put two families together

00:39:03.159 --> 00:39:05.280
that, you know, don't click, but you know, clearly

00:39:05.280 --> 00:39:09.280
the synergies make sense, which I find quite

00:39:09.280 --> 00:39:12.219
interesting. The synergy makes sense is because

00:39:12.219 --> 00:39:15.460
of interest alignment. Interest alignment is

00:39:15.460 --> 00:39:21.050
very important. in business to me, because if

00:39:21.050 --> 00:39:24.349
our interests are the same, our focuses are the

00:39:24.349 --> 00:39:28.849
same, our goals are the same, then there won't

00:39:28.849 --> 00:39:31.969
be any doubts amongst each other. I will not

00:39:31.969 --> 00:39:35.250
second guess what Victor or Max do. They will

00:39:35.250 --> 00:39:37.269
not second guess what I do, because that's of

00:39:37.269 --> 00:39:41.030
course how you manage that, right? And manage

00:39:41.030 --> 00:39:44.190
that, meaning the business and interest alignment

00:39:44.190 --> 00:39:47.150
is everything. It's key to everything. Um, and

00:39:47.150 --> 00:39:49.889
I see that very clearly, you know, and I'm sure

00:39:49.889 --> 00:39:53.050
a lot of people will agree, um, why businesses

00:39:53.050 --> 00:39:57.250
do well, do better or some just don't. The ones

00:39:57.250 --> 00:39:59.809
that I don't, I see the one that's that, that

00:39:59.809 --> 00:40:01.789
don't end up succeeding or just don't end up

00:40:01.789 --> 00:40:05.670
surviving. I see is just a lot of different ideas.

00:40:06.389 --> 00:40:09.409
There's no direct alignment in interest. One

00:40:09.409 --> 00:40:11.809
partner may say this, the other may want that

00:40:11.809 --> 00:40:15.599
never, never, never, never gets a guy. So. That's

00:40:15.599 --> 00:40:18.360
the most important part, I believe. Or if both

00:40:18.360 --> 00:40:20.679
people are offensive and no one's defensive.

00:40:20.840 --> 00:40:22.400
You know what I mean? Ying Yang works nicely.

00:40:22.500 --> 00:40:24.820
Yes, correct. Ying Yang works very, very, very

00:40:24.820 --> 00:40:28.260
nicely. So there's that side, which is very interesting.

00:40:28.360 --> 00:40:30.420
Then you've got the credit side, because you

00:40:30.420 --> 00:40:32.039
can't walk down the street these days without,

00:40:32.039 --> 00:40:34.239
you know... And look, the banks, as you mentioned

00:40:34.239 --> 00:40:36.480
before, have created this problem where essentially

00:40:36.480 --> 00:40:38.880
they just refuse to lend in particular areas,

00:40:39.019 --> 00:40:42.070
right? So there were so many great... um, firms,

00:40:42.070 --> 00:40:44.650
uh, offering direct or, you know, via a fund,

00:40:44.730 --> 00:40:47.289
um, on the credit lens side. But like, say, as

00:40:47.289 --> 00:40:50.329
an example, you're, you're a wealthy family.

00:40:50.449 --> 00:40:51.929
You want to do something with it, with a house.

00:40:52.090 --> 00:40:57.989
They can come to an issue to do a direct private

00:40:57.989 --> 00:41:01.710
credit. How does that work? Yeah. So on the private

00:41:01.710 --> 00:41:05.210
credit fund, why we started and decided to do

00:41:05.210 --> 00:41:07.630
private credit is because apologies. Is it a

00:41:07.630 --> 00:41:10.199
fund or is it direct? It's a fund. It's a fund,

00:41:10.320 --> 00:41:13.460
okay. But it's single asset. So it's not a pooled

00:41:13.460 --> 00:41:15.480
fund. It's single asset. So single asset deals.

00:41:15.900 --> 00:41:18.840
Right. Yeah. So meaning that if somebody wants

00:41:18.840 --> 00:41:22.900
to borrow on a piece of land, we'll directly

00:41:22.900 --> 00:41:25.059
lend to that borrower. Of course, it's a single

00:41:25.059 --> 00:41:27.219
asset deal, but we'll still package it and put

00:41:27.219 --> 00:41:31.519
it together as a fund. And is this a fund an

00:41:31.519 --> 00:41:34.619
investor can allocate capital? How much is in

00:41:34.619 --> 00:41:38.940
that fund currently? The one that we've recently

00:41:38.940 --> 00:41:45.539
done is about 26 million. And I should have asked

00:41:45.539 --> 00:41:48.659
before, how much is in the commercial fund? The

00:41:48.659 --> 00:41:50.800
commercial property fund, we've got about 53

00:41:50.800 --> 00:41:55.679
million. So 53 there, 20. And then for the Mossman

00:41:55.679 --> 00:41:58.079
development projects, it's obviously 50 million

00:41:58.079 --> 00:42:03.079
there, right? So quite a lot of allocations in

00:42:03.079 --> 00:42:07.179
different products. Right now for the private

00:42:07.179 --> 00:42:10.239
credit fund, we are only focusing on single asset

00:42:10.239 --> 00:42:13.059
deals. Eventually we'll have a pooled basis.

00:42:14.619 --> 00:42:17.000
Why we started doing the private credit fund

00:42:17.000 --> 00:42:20.219
mainly is because we see where the market is

00:42:20.219 --> 00:42:22.320
at. You're going to move with the market as well.

00:42:22.480 --> 00:42:24.980
Everybody wants again private credit because

00:42:24.980 --> 00:42:28.500
the investors want double digit returns. That's

00:42:28.500 --> 00:42:31.340
all they want to see. So we thought, okay, that

00:42:31.340 --> 00:42:34.000
could be an area that we could get into. We know

00:42:34.000 --> 00:42:37.170
about credit. I came from banking. Under lending

00:42:37.170 --> 00:42:41.230
Max has been property. So Essentially, Max will

00:42:41.230 --> 00:42:44.389
just look at the deal is that do his own feasibility

00:42:44.389 --> 00:42:47.889
and he'll feel okay It's a worthwhile deal for

00:42:47.889 --> 00:42:50.070
us to take on if we were to lend if he says yes

00:42:50.070 --> 00:42:52.250
Then I'll look at from the financial markets

00:42:52.250 --> 00:42:55.210
perspective and add parameters around it risk

00:42:55.210 --> 00:42:57.170
parameters around to ensure that they can pay

00:42:57.170 --> 00:43:00.050
about on time So, you know a two -pronged approach

00:43:00.050 --> 00:43:03.429
essentially on the private credit fund This question

00:43:03.429 --> 00:43:05.989
is just for me. I've always been No, I'm not

00:43:05.989 --> 00:43:10.190
a banker. My old man was, right? But, you know,

00:43:10.210 --> 00:43:12.030
he always told me, just look at senior secured,

00:43:12.289 --> 00:43:13.889
like, you know, ensure that whatever you do,

00:43:13.989 --> 00:43:16.489
if everything goes to pot, you can reach in and

00:43:16.489 --> 00:43:20.449
take assets, like just basic, simple. But you've

00:43:20.449 --> 00:43:25.530
also just done recently a second mortgage, right?

00:43:26.110 --> 00:43:29.409
So can you explain to me why you felt comfortable

00:43:29.409 --> 00:43:31.909
doing a second mortgage where As an example,

00:43:32.030 --> 00:43:34.150
my old man is like, never touch that stuff. You

00:43:34.150 --> 00:43:36.090
can't get your money back. But like, why, why

00:43:36.090 --> 00:43:38.469
would you do that? Why do you feel comfortable

00:43:38.469 --> 00:43:40.469
with that? Why I feel comfortable was because

00:43:40.469 --> 00:43:43.570
it was in Point Piper. Point Piper is the location

00:43:43.570 --> 00:43:46.050
of the insert. Yeah. I say it's in Point Piper.

00:43:47.449 --> 00:43:53.190
Point Piper goes well, I think. So that's thought

00:43:53.190 --> 00:43:56.610
one. Second of all, it was short dated. Thirdly,

00:43:56.630 --> 00:43:59.150
I know the borrower very well. I was the borrower's

00:43:59.150 --> 00:44:05.480
banker. And investors, through one way or another,

00:44:05.500 --> 00:44:08.119
knows about the borrower too. And we know what

00:44:08.119 --> 00:44:13.559
it's used for. We know his asset position. Even

00:44:13.559 --> 00:44:17.219
if we take on a position, including the first

00:44:17.219 --> 00:44:20.719
mortgage with the second mortgage, the LVR parameters

00:44:20.719 --> 00:44:26.719
are still within a very safe sort of area. On

00:44:26.719 --> 00:44:30.679
top of that, we took a discount on the asset

00:44:30.880 --> 00:44:33.260
So we took 10 million dollars off the asset,

00:44:34.360 --> 00:44:37.280
rather than us assessing based on the valuation.

00:44:38.860 --> 00:44:42.260
What does that mean, sorry? There's a lot of

00:44:42.260 --> 00:44:46.159
complexity with this deal, but long story short,

00:44:47.840 --> 00:44:52.480
the property itself is two levels. Two levels

00:44:52.480 --> 00:44:55.079
combined together is worth X amount of dollars.

00:44:55.320 --> 00:44:58.539
But if you were to value them individually, they're

00:44:58.539 --> 00:45:02.519
worth much less. All right. Yes. Because to be

00:45:02.519 --> 00:45:04.760
sold together, they're worth much more. But selling

00:45:04.760 --> 00:45:07.099
individually is worth much less. So I took the

00:45:07.099 --> 00:45:10.280
approach of the much less approach. So let's

00:45:10.280 --> 00:45:14.320
just say if it's worth $100 million, right? Together.

00:45:14.480 --> 00:45:19.059
Is it worth $100 million? Together? Yeah. But

00:45:19.059 --> 00:45:21.619
individually, they're not worth $50 million each.

00:45:22.039 --> 00:45:25.659
Much less than that. So I took the conservative

00:45:25.659 --> 00:45:29.889
approach and then built risk parameters around

00:45:29.889 --> 00:45:33.949
that. So we felt comfortable about that. So that's

00:45:33.949 --> 00:45:37.929
the reason why. Yes, we know that Point Piper

00:45:37.929 --> 00:45:40.150
doesn't sell overnight. Obviously, it's worth

00:45:40.150 --> 00:45:43.550
that value. It takes time. People need to go

00:45:43.550 --> 00:45:45.309
out, check it out. It's not like buying vegetables

00:45:45.309 --> 00:45:48.650
out of a grocery store, right? But at least you

00:45:48.650 --> 00:45:52.789
know the value is going to be there. It's the

00:45:52.789 --> 00:45:56.000
most prime location you can be. Well, they also

00:45:56.000 --> 00:45:57.619
the other interesting thing like, you know, from

00:45:57.619 --> 00:45:59.780
my line of thing, as I like to say, I know 70

00:45:59.780 --> 00:46:01.840
% about everything. So I know nothing. But what

00:46:01.840 --> 00:46:04.719
I like to always look at is just macro trends

00:46:04.719 --> 00:46:06.480
kind of came from a currency background. You

00:46:06.480 --> 00:46:08.480
see, watch them how the money moves and why policies.

00:46:08.960 --> 00:46:11.099
But if you look at places like Russia, China,

00:46:11.400 --> 00:46:13.599
or other countries, they can just reach into

00:46:13.599 --> 00:46:16.199
any point in time and seize your assets. So isn't

00:46:16.199 --> 00:46:18.139
there a culture as well? Because I don't deal

00:46:18.139 --> 00:46:19.579
with this community, you deal very much with

00:46:19.579 --> 00:46:22.860
the high end. Isn't it potentially as well that

00:46:22.860 --> 00:46:25.119
they see the West and property is essentially

00:46:25.239 --> 00:46:27.579
you know, better than a bank in say China, right?

00:46:27.880 --> 00:46:29.559
So hypothetically, if someone's got a billion

00:46:29.559 --> 00:46:31.659
dollars, because they made a crap ton of money

00:46:31.659 --> 00:46:33.559
building properties throughout South Beijing

00:46:33.559 --> 00:46:37.280
that, you know, parking $100 million in a point

00:46:37.280 --> 00:46:42.329
Piper. Asset which is essentially property back

00:46:42.329 --> 00:46:44.670
There's laws to stop seizures and all that type

00:46:44.670 --> 00:46:46.849
of stuff is potentially safer than having it

00:46:46.849 --> 00:46:49.389
in other jurisdictions It's national jurisdictions.

00:46:49.389 --> 00:46:52.050
Yeah, I mean, is that a thought process? Yeah,

00:46:52.050 --> 00:46:55.449
I mean, I guess I I'm not speaking on their behalf

00:46:55.449 --> 00:46:58.250
I'll be clear about that. But what I see from

00:46:58.250 --> 00:47:01.670
a very third -person perspective is yes, we see

00:47:01.670 --> 00:47:05.570
the Like so Australia is a very safe country.

00:47:05.630 --> 00:47:09.159
It's like a safe haven in comparison to our other

00:47:09.159 --> 00:47:14.460
jurisdictions. Um, and I think it's basically

00:47:14.460 --> 00:47:17.039
that's the only reason why. Yeah, right. It is

00:47:17.039 --> 00:47:19.019
the only reason why. This is a joke running around.

00:47:19.099 --> 00:47:20.800
You go on a harbor cruise for new years or whatever,

00:47:20.800 --> 00:47:22.980
and you look around and you'd like to see, you

00:47:22.980 --> 00:47:25.119
see like in a building, you know, beautiful building,

00:47:25.280 --> 00:47:27.139
like you got prime fireworks and you see only

00:47:27.139 --> 00:47:29.440
like three levels out of like 20 with lights

00:47:29.440 --> 00:47:32.809
on. Yeah, exactly. It's like that. It's like

00:47:32.809 --> 00:47:34.650
it's like that. And these things are changed.

00:47:34.769 --> 00:47:36.889
They're like five, 15, 20 million dollar apartments.

00:47:36.909 --> 00:47:38.989
That's bad. You know, and that's why it's a bubble,

00:47:39.050 --> 00:47:43.369
you know, and the bubbles burst. So the smarter

00:47:43.369 --> 00:47:46.690
ones put on them for making those right decisions

00:47:46.690 --> 00:47:49.730
10, 20 years ago. I'm not saying the ones that

00:47:49.730 --> 00:47:51.889
didn't make those decisions now are not smart,

00:47:51.949 --> 00:47:54.090
but it's just that maybe at the time wasn't right

00:47:54.090 --> 00:48:00.840
for them potentially. So that being said, I believe

00:48:00.840 --> 00:48:03.599
the likes of Australia, especially for a lot

00:48:03.599 --> 00:48:06.780
of the new migrants, whether you're from China

00:48:06.780 --> 00:48:11.199
or wherever else in the world, it's a great area

00:48:11.199 --> 00:48:14.280
to, of course, park your capital. You're definitely

00:48:14.280 --> 00:48:17.400
not going to be able to see those crazy returns

00:48:17.400 --> 00:48:19.059
like what you see overseas, but at least you

00:48:19.059 --> 00:48:22.260
know your money's safe. We're very well regulated.

00:48:25.260 --> 00:48:28.579
Everything's all very transparent. in comparison

00:48:28.579 --> 00:48:32.219
to what it's like overseas. So I'm sure anybody,

00:48:32.400 --> 00:48:34.119
any high net with families that do come to our

00:48:34.119 --> 00:48:36.500
show, they'll feel safe themselves too. Even

00:48:36.500 --> 00:48:37.880
if they just leave the money in the bank, I'm

00:48:37.880 --> 00:48:40.519
sure they'll feel much safer too. So most of

00:48:40.519 --> 00:48:43.400
the, if you see a lot of banks, especially in

00:48:43.400 --> 00:48:48.239
China, I see a lot of them just going bust. The

00:48:48.239 --> 00:48:51.579
smaller ones, the ones that's not so well recognized.

00:48:52.519 --> 00:48:54.400
You see people lining up, knocking on their doors,

00:48:54.739 --> 00:48:58.599
trying to... grab whatever they can, all of that.

00:48:59.679 --> 00:49:01.480
It's essentially like America before the Federal

00:49:01.480 --> 00:49:05.360
Reserve came in. Yeah. There's not much they

00:49:05.360 --> 00:49:08.559
could do. It's just how the market has sort of

00:49:08.559 --> 00:49:12.099
transpired through that over time. But it is

00:49:12.099 --> 00:49:15.059
what it is. That's how different markets are.

00:49:15.880 --> 00:49:17.420
I'm not here to make comments on whether it's

00:49:17.420 --> 00:49:21.420
good or bad, but I'm sure the ones that made

00:49:21.420 --> 00:49:23.340
that decision, they made the right choices or

00:49:23.340 --> 00:49:25.000
they made the right choice and they just have

00:49:25.000 --> 00:49:27.800
to on with it basically. Yeah, it's just smart

00:49:27.800 --> 00:49:30.960
money with capitalism. Yeah, I'm speaking of

00:49:30.960 --> 00:49:34.159
capitalism and looking at other areas. You've

00:49:34.159 --> 00:49:38.280
also gone into another space, the sorry, actually,

00:49:38.300 --> 00:49:40.179
is this just such a maxicide. So you've also

00:49:40.179 --> 00:49:43.199
got real estate and mortgage broking as well.

00:49:43.840 --> 00:49:46.420
So you're kind of covering all areas of the property.

00:49:46.500 --> 00:49:48.519
Yeah. What was the thinking behind that? Yeah.

00:49:49.460 --> 00:49:52.739
So like I said, I've been private banking for

00:49:52.739 --> 00:49:55.610
so long. I've been banking for so long. we know

00:49:55.610 --> 00:49:58.230
this market so well and we thought why don't

00:49:58.230 --> 00:50:01.090
we just offer that service on the broken perspective,

00:50:01.150 --> 00:50:04.690
the mortgage breaking perspective. Now from Max's

00:50:04.690 --> 00:50:07.670
perspective, he knows property so well, his team

00:50:07.670 --> 00:50:09.989
knows property so well, why don't they focus

00:50:09.989 --> 00:50:13.309
and not focus but put more of their services

00:50:13.309 --> 00:50:16.449
out there? Because we get a lot of inquiries

00:50:16.449 --> 00:50:18.989
from our clients directly that ask us for these

00:50:18.989 --> 00:50:21.869
type of help. I've had clients that ask me, hey

00:50:21.869 --> 00:50:24.250
Bo, can you help us manage this particular asset?

00:50:24.349 --> 00:50:27.250
And we have done that, help us bring in tenants.

00:50:27.369 --> 00:50:30.070
And we have done that. We get clients ask us,

00:50:30.190 --> 00:50:32.110
hey, Bo, can you help us with some lending needs?

00:50:33.289 --> 00:50:35.849
There's a lot of different lending stuff, anything

00:50:35.849 --> 00:50:38.670
and everything. And we thought, OK, why don't

00:50:38.670 --> 00:50:42.610
we offer that service? Because obviously, we

00:50:42.610 --> 00:50:45.289
ourselves, yes, we are Nishim. Yes, we are a

00:50:45.289 --> 00:50:47.489
financial manager. Yes, we offer other services

00:50:47.489 --> 00:50:51.170
in financial services. But we are backed by family

00:50:51.170 --> 00:50:54.989
office. We know this particular space so well,

00:50:54.989 --> 00:50:57.150
so we know what family offices need. We know

00:50:57.150 --> 00:50:58.909
what ultra -high net worth, high net worths need.

00:50:59.630 --> 00:51:01.969
They don't just look at one part of the aspect

00:51:01.969 --> 00:51:04.510
of financial services being wealth management.

00:51:04.590 --> 00:51:06.530
They're going to look at property. How do you

00:51:06.530 --> 00:51:07.590
manage your property? They're going to look at

00:51:07.590 --> 00:51:09.750
lending, borrowing money. They're going to look

00:51:09.750 --> 00:51:13.010
at the future in terms of succession planning,

00:51:13.590 --> 00:51:15.949
estate planning, a whole suite of works. So I

00:51:15.949 --> 00:51:19.929
thought, why don't we offer that as a full package

00:51:19.929 --> 00:51:23.940
service and at least When a client walks through

00:51:23.940 --> 00:51:26.300
the door, we know that we have that relationship

00:51:26.300 --> 00:51:29.420
through one of our services or through one of

00:51:29.420 --> 00:51:31.519
our products. And that's how we maintain that

00:51:31.519 --> 00:51:35.380
relationship. You know, we are, of course, a

00:51:35.380 --> 00:51:37.519
lot different to, you know, your traditional

00:51:37.519 --> 00:51:40.400
file managers where the focus is purely directly

00:51:40.400 --> 00:51:42.900
on the product, which we are, of course, but

00:51:42.900 --> 00:51:45.599
we do also believe that the services that we

00:51:45.599 --> 00:51:49.199
have, the added services that we have, is what's

00:51:49.199 --> 00:51:51.420
going to also help us maintain the relationship,

00:51:51.460 --> 00:51:55.300
because we ourselves have a lot of the high net

00:51:55.300 --> 00:51:57.719
worth relationship, family office relationships,

00:51:59.460 --> 00:52:02.579
and through that, in that particular, in that

00:52:02.579 --> 00:52:04.340
sort of area, it's always about relationship.

00:52:05.880 --> 00:52:09.800
So a very, very different way of thinking from

00:52:09.800 --> 00:52:12.860
our final end. That's why a lot of things takes

00:52:12.860 --> 00:52:16.320
time, I believe, and things take time with us.

00:52:16.839 --> 00:52:19.019
But at least you got to stay consistent. If you're

00:52:19.019 --> 00:52:20.639
consistent, I'm sure, you know, we eventually

00:52:20.639 --> 00:52:22.340
get to where we want to be. I couldn't agree

00:52:22.340 --> 00:52:24.079
more. I think we're essentially where everything's

00:52:24.079 --> 00:52:26.159
going is a one -stop shop. You have one summer.

00:52:26.440 --> 00:52:28.539
Look at the end of the day, everyone is just

00:52:28.539 --> 00:52:32.119
a family, right? What does a family need? There's

00:52:32.119 --> 00:52:34.340
so many different things that like in the life

00:52:34.340 --> 00:52:37.079
cycle of any family, like any family, my family,

00:52:37.219 --> 00:52:40.230
your family. But if you can help at the end of

00:52:40.230 --> 00:52:41.929
the day, it's not pitching someone a product.

00:52:42.730 --> 00:52:45.190
It's like, how can I help you today? And they

00:52:45.190 --> 00:52:47.010
go, what's your biggest problem right now? Leave

00:52:47.010 --> 00:52:49.349
everything alone. Right? What's your biggest

00:52:49.349 --> 00:52:51.429
issue? And if you can help them with that problem

00:52:51.429 --> 00:52:53.510
there, then they go, okay, I was very happy with

00:52:53.510 --> 00:52:54.909
that relationship you delivered. What else you

00:52:54.909 --> 00:52:57.230
got? Right? You know, what else can you do? And

00:52:57.230 --> 00:53:00.309
then, okay, from a business perspective, if you

00:53:00.309 --> 00:53:03.480
offer three services, the retention rate. staying

00:53:03.480 --> 00:53:05.019
with our family increases, which is essentially

00:53:05.019 --> 00:53:08.019
the banking model. And then you've also expanded,

00:53:08.019 --> 00:53:10.360
I believe, into financial advisory as well, Hunter,

00:53:10.360 --> 00:53:12.860
with financial advisory. Yeah. I mean, we believe

00:53:12.860 --> 00:53:15.380
private wealth management is important. We wanted

00:53:15.380 --> 00:53:17.340
to be in private wealth management for the reason

00:53:17.340 --> 00:53:23.099
that... Yeah. As much as I wish everybody wanted

00:53:23.099 --> 00:53:24.900
to invest in our fund, it's not the reality.

00:53:25.679 --> 00:53:28.119
The reality is everybody has their own thoughts,

00:53:28.599 --> 00:53:30.969
thought process, their own thinking. So... We

00:53:30.969 --> 00:53:32.710
thought, okay, why don't we provide that service?

00:53:32.789 --> 00:53:34.829
Because we obviously know that service very well,

00:53:34.829 --> 00:53:38.010
you know, and be able to capture that market

00:53:38.010 --> 00:53:39.809
too. Because if our clients that walk through

00:53:39.809 --> 00:53:41.610
the door says, oh, you know, we're not interested

00:53:41.610 --> 00:53:43.949
in your fund or your product, okay, well, we

00:53:43.949 --> 00:53:45.489
can offer the private wealth management piece.

00:53:45.610 --> 00:53:48.110
You know, we can do the asset allocation for

00:53:48.110 --> 00:53:52.570
you. You can invest into a portfolio that either

00:53:52.570 --> 00:53:56.630
you like or we can show you, whatever it may

00:53:56.630 --> 00:54:01.000
be. We wanted to be also part of that. Being

00:54:01.000 --> 00:54:03.320
part of that also means that there's a lot more

00:54:03.320 --> 00:54:05.460
opportunities to be able to get in front of different

00:54:05.460 --> 00:54:08.440
clients as well. There's a lot more opportunities

00:54:08.440 --> 00:54:12.320
for us to explore more areas as well. And I think,

00:54:12.320 --> 00:54:15.139
you know, for one individual family or person

00:54:15.139 --> 00:54:17.340
that's high net worth, they're going to need

00:54:17.340 --> 00:54:19.980
all of this. They will definitely need property,

00:54:20.940 --> 00:54:23.639
property services, finance, financial services,

00:54:23.940 --> 00:54:26.840
investment, investment services, lending, lending

00:54:26.840 --> 00:54:29.460
services, you know, even from the family office

00:54:29.460 --> 00:54:31.610
piece. even family office advisory, you know,

00:54:31.650 --> 00:54:34.449
it's everything that we can think of a person

00:54:34.449 --> 00:54:37.429
needs, want to be able to cover it. That being

00:54:37.429 --> 00:54:39.449
said, want to make sure we can cover everything

00:54:39.449 --> 00:54:41.969
well. You know, that's the most important part.

00:54:42.070 --> 00:54:43.530
It's not saying, okay, we believe this is going

00:54:43.530 --> 00:54:45.809
to help us. We're going to do a bit of that.

00:54:45.889 --> 00:54:47.309
We're going to believe that's going to help us.

00:54:47.309 --> 00:54:49.489
We're going to do a bit of that. No, we want

00:54:49.489 --> 00:54:51.710
to make sure we are good at what we do in every

00:54:51.710 --> 00:54:53.530
single part of it. That's what we're trying to

00:54:53.530 --> 00:54:57.449
aim to. Yeah. The only one you didn't say was

00:54:57.449 --> 00:55:02.639
accounting. Yes, we haven't found any accounts

00:55:02.639 --> 00:55:06.420
that we think that can do this part well, but

00:55:06.420 --> 00:55:08.059
maybe something down the track that we could

00:55:08.059 --> 00:55:10.360
explore potentially. But yes, you're absolutely

00:55:10.360 --> 00:55:11.860
right. Accounting is probably another one that

00:55:11.860 --> 00:55:15.820
we could look at too. No, I like the idea I've

00:55:15.820 --> 00:55:18.179
always had of essentially, it's just a family

00:55:18.179 --> 00:55:20.179
at the end of the day. One thing that never sat

00:55:20.179 --> 00:55:22.260
well with me is when I was at a particular firm,

00:55:22.659 --> 00:55:25.030
I won't say which one. I remember a client came

00:55:25.030 --> 00:55:26.969
in, oh, look, I want to buy a property. I got

00:55:26.969 --> 00:55:29.530
like $4 million. I want to buy a property. And

00:55:29.530 --> 00:55:30.650
one of the advisors turned around and he goes,

00:55:30.690 --> 00:55:32.469
oh, I've got a great retail investment trust.

00:55:32.510 --> 00:55:36.909
And I'm like, why did you say that? Is that because

00:55:37.230 --> 00:55:39.949
you don't get remunerated by referring someone

00:55:39.949 --> 00:55:41.750
to go buy a property, which may have been in

00:55:41.750 --> 00:55:44.610
their better interest? Or is the retail investment

00:55:44.610 --> 00:55:46.489
trust purely because since it's transactional,

00:55:46.489 --> 00:55:48.429
it's not a fund and you can't get rid of it in

00:55:48.429 --> 00:55:50.489
a fund, you can clip the ticket by sticking in

00:55:50.489 --> 00:55:52.190
that asset. Like, you know, what's in their best

00:55:52.190 --> 00:55:54.110
interest. So I think at the end of the day, what

00:55:54.110 --> 00:55:56.429
resonates really well with myself is what is

00:55:56.429 --> 00:55:58.469
in people's best interest and then essentially

00:55:58.469 --> 00:56:03.170
having the capacity to essentially help that

00:56:03.170 --> 00:56:05.849
family find what they're looking for. Absolutely.

00:56:06.110 --> 00:56:10.250
I think doing what's right by the client. But,

00:56:10.289 --> 00:56:12.130
you know, especially in this particular market

00:56:12.130 --> 00:56:14.429
in the high net worth space, trust is everything.

00:56:15.050 --> 00:56:19.389
But trust takes a long time to build. Five years,

00:56:19.409 --> 00:56:22.250
10 years, 15 years, however long it is, it takes

00:56:22.250 --> 00:56:25.409
a very, very long time. It can be broken, you

00:56:25.409 --> 00:56:30.250
know, overnight. So, you know, that's why I never

00:56:30.250 --> 00:56:33.150
think about we definitely have to do something

00:56:33.150 --> 00:56:35.809
with a client as soon as they walk through the

00:56:35.809 --> 00:56:38.010
door. As much as we want to make sure that we

00:56:38.010 --> 00:56:41.469
can do something with them, it's not something

00:56:41.469 --> 00:56:45.289
we can force because it just takes time and they

00:56:45.289 --> 00:56:47.869
get to know us. They at least know what we do.

00:56:48.110 --> 00:56:51.010
Over time, they'll do their own personal assessment

00:56:51.010 --> 00:56:53.190
and judgment on us. And hopefully, eventually,

00:56:53.869 --> 00:56:55.309
somewhere down the trail, we can do some business

00:56:55.309 --> 00:57:00.030
together. If not, it's okay. And so what you've

00:57:00.030 --> 00:57:02.829
just mentioned, that example, it's probably because

00:57:02.969 --> 00:57:04.989
There's probably other reasons behind it. Right.

00:57:05.329 --> 00:57:08.590
So yeah. Um, you know, so hopefully, hopefully,

00:57:08.590 --> 00:57:11.829
you know, we, we can grow to a certain scale,

00:57:11.949 --> 00:57:13.829
a certain space where everything can be hosted

00:57:13.829 --> 00:57:16.230
internally through all of our own businesses.

00:57:16.570 --> 00:57:19.150
It'll become an internal referral network. We

00:57:19.150 --> 00:57:21.690
can have our own internal ecosystem and we can

00:57:21.690 --> 00:57:24.289
build an initial ecosystem. It's a great thing.

00:57:24.849 --> 00:57:29.489
How many in the team now? Uh, 15. 15. Yeah. Yeah.

00:57:29.510 --> 00:57:32.780
Right. Yeah. Yeah, so I mean, we'll continue

00:57:32.780 --> 00:57:36.639
to expand. So hopefully, in the coming new year,

00:57:37.980 --> 00:57:40.239
the market picks up, meaning that we'll see the

00:57:40.239 --> 00:57:42.880
rate starts coming down. That'll also help us

00:57:42.880 --> 00:57:45.739
because obviously, it's not the best market right

00:57:45.739 --> 00:57:47.380
now at the moment for a lot of fire managers.

00:57:48.360 --> 00:57:52.360
Even the property fire managers, everybody is

00:57:52.360 --> 00:57:54.980
getting hit quite bad, whether it's on the asset

00:57:54.980 --> 00:57:58.440
values or whether on redemption notices. You

00:57:58.440 --> 00:58:00.300
see a lot of that. you know, it's all over there

00:58:00.300 --> 00:58:03.039
if I want not. So hopefully, you know, we start

00:58:03.039 --> 00:58:05.599
seeing the rates come down, you know, and the

00:58:05.599 --> 00:58:07.860
commercial property market improves, you know,

00:58:07.940 --> 00:58:09.579
even though for the office buildings, hope everybody

00:58:09.579 --> 00:58:11.440
will change from a hybrid working environment

00:58:11.440 --> 00:58:13.679
to a full time working environment office. I

00:58:13.679 --> 00:58:16.159
think that'll be a good thing. That'll help everything

00:58:16.159 --> 00:58:19.980
out, you know, because we ourselves, we're part

00:58:19.980 --> 00:58:23.019
of this market, but we're obviously in a particular

00:58:23.019 --> 00:58:26.599
niche of the market from our commercial property

00:58:26.599 --> 00:58:29.829
fund perspective. However, it's still consider

00:58:29.829 --> 00:58:33.530
as commercial property market. So I want everything

00:58:33.530 --> 00:58:35.409
in this particular market to do well. So, you

00:58:35.409 --> 00:58:37.530
know, we can, we can, we can be part of that

00:58:37.530 --> 00:58:39.489
too, you know, not in particular, just because

00:58:39.489 --> 00:58:42.210
the office, office market is not doing well.

00:58:42.329 --> 00:58:44.070
So you should, you should not invest in offices.

00:58:44.269 --> 00:58:46.630
I mean, people still want to get into offices.

00:58:46.710 --> 00:58:49.110
Of course they do. Yeah. I still see people buying

00:58:49.110 --> 00:58:50.989
into offices now. What's the expression? Blood

00:58:50.989 --> 00:58:53.469
on the street by property. No one wants to buy

00:58:53.469 --> 00:58:54.889
when everything's going to pop, but that's actually

00:58:54.889 --> 00:58:57.480
the best time. And I mean, if you're buying at

00:58:57.480 --> 00:58:59.239
a time where everything's so high, then what's

00:58:59.239 --> 00:59:04.480
the point? For me, how I think of it, if you're

00:59:04.480 --> 00:59:06.599
cash stubble, you have the ability to borrow

00:59:06.599 --> 00:59:09.539
through the banks, this is probably the right

00:59:09.539 --> 00:59:12.719
time. You probably could pick up some prime location

00:59:12.719 --> 00:59:17.599
assets at a good price. Because most of these

00:59:17.599 --> 00:59:19.840
asset prices, a lot of them has actually devalued

00:59:19.840 --> 00:59:23.329
quite a bit. Yeah, it's fascinating. Last question

00:59:23.329 --> 00:59:25.190
I'd like to finish with is more than the last,

00:59:25.510 --> 00:59:26.969
is what keeps you up at night and what gets you

00:59:26.969 --> 00:59:29.929
out of bed in the morning? What keeps me up at

00:59:29.929 --> 00:59:34.269
night? Work. I wake up middle of the night, probably

00:59:34.269 --> 00:59:37.030
nearly every day, two, three o 'clock in the

00:59:37.030 --> 00:59:39.110
morning. I'll sit up and just start thinking

00:59:39.110 --> 00:59:41.690
about work, think about things I need to do.

00:59:42.730 --> 00:59:44.050
Because every day there's a lot of things that

00:59:44.050 --> 00:59:45.949
rush through my head. Sometimes when you're in

00:59:45.949 --> 00:59:48.389
the office, everybody knocks on your door, you

00:59:48.389 --> 00:59:51.239
slowly forget about things to do. Um, and I set

00:59:51.239 --> 00:59:53.320
a to -do list in my head. I sometimes write it

00:59:53.320 --> 00:59:55.000
up because it's just too many to -do lists, right?

00:59:55.159 --> 00:59:58.260
But at night there's a lot of things that I feel

00:59:58.260 --> 01:00:00.380
I just have to wake up and think about it and

01:00:00.380 --> 01:00:03.079
start jotting it down and then execute it the

01:00:03.079 --> 01:00:07.559
next day. So that keeps me up at night. Um, and

01:00:07.559 --> 01:00:09.059
what was the other question? What gets you out

01:00:09.059 --> 01:00:12.219
of bed in the morning? Work again. Got a hustle.

01:00:12.800 --> 01:00:15.079
You know, that, that that's important. You think

01:00:15.079 --> 01:00:17.300
about the things you're going to do during the

01:00:17.300 --> 01:00:19.650
nighttime before you go to sleep. When you're

01:00:19.650 --> 01:00:22.090
sleeping and as soon as you wake up, the first

01:00:22.090 --> 01:00:24.289
thing you do is hustle and execute the things

01:00:24.289 --> 01:00:26.909
you've thought about the night before or overnight.

01:00:27.469 --> 01:00:31.489
And I think that's how it is. That's life. This

01:00:31.489 --> 01:00:34.050
is my life. This is my baby. I want to make sure

01:00:34.050 --> 01:00:37.449
we can continue to do well and deliver. We are

01:00:37.449 --> 01:00:39.389
in a tough environment, but we'll get through

01:00:39.389 --> 01:00:43.630
it. We'll find ways, different avenues, but focus

01:00:43.630 --> 01:00:47.889
and continue to hopefully reach our goals. Hit

01:00:47.889 --> 01:00:50.679
milestones. If anyone wants to learn more about

01:00:50.679 --> 01:00:53.219
Initium or the family office, where do they go?

01:00:54.400 --> 01:00:57.260
They can go on, so Initium .com .au. They can

01:00:57.260 --> 01:01:00.179
find more about us in terms of the backgrounds

01:01:00.179 --> 01:01:03.900
of ourselves individually and families. If it's

01:01:03.900 --> 01:01:06.460
about the products in particular and services,

01:01:06.619 --> 01:01:09.579
InitiumCapital .com .au, then you'll be able

01:01:09.579 --> 01:01:12.380
to locate more information on us. And hopefully

01:01:12.380 --> 01:01:17.800
I look forward to hearing from some of our listeners.

01:01:18.259 --> 01:01:21.340
Yeah. Well, Bo, thanks for having you on. This

01:01:21.340 --> 01:01:23.480
has been great. I really, really enjoyed that

01:01:23.480 --> 01:01:26.400
and see you around. Fantastic. Thanks a lot,

01:01:26.519 --> 01:01:28.300
Murdoch. Appreciate it. Take it easy, Bo. Thanks,

01:01:28.380 --> 01:01:48.969
mate. Any reference to financial product does

01:01:48.969 --> 01:01:51.489
not constitute advice or recommendation and before

01:01:51.489 --> 01:01:53.809
any action you should seek proper advice from

01:01:53.809 --> 01:01:56.170
your financial professional. Australian listeners

01:01:56.170 --> 01:02:00.530
should head to www .moneysmart .gov .au to find

01:02:00.530 --> 01:02:02.690
more information on obtaining financial advice.

01:02:03.230 --> 01:02:05.369
To get in touch with York head to our website

01:02:05.369 --> 01:02:08.969
www .yorkwealth .com .au