Brandon Mortini, commercial pilot and flight instructor and I'm Carson Vasquez.
I'm a private pilot and you're listening to the aviation mentors podcast sponsored by
Stratis Financial.
Buckle up because the aviation mentors are taking off.
Welcome back everybody.
The great episode of the aviation mentors podcast.
Thanks for joining us today.
I know last week we had a couple awesome episodes and we had a test pilot on the podcast which
was absolutely phenomenal.
Carson actually lined that up even though I'm friends with him for longer.
It was kind of weird.
But it worked out really nice and we had a great time talking with Kevin.
So hopefully you guys really enjoyed it.
It was fantastic just to talk airplanes and especially talk ICON A5.
I just found out my ICON is going to need the new rocket put into it I think next month
actually so ICON just told me I'm going to get a real nice repair bill for that.
So it's down even longer for maintenance?
Yeah it's going to be down another month for maintenance I think.
But I'm trying to get him convinced to let me repair it in Long Beach so I don't have
to fly it literally across the US to Florida to get the rocket replacement done.
So that would be the only downside.
Well we can both keep losing weight so we can fly that thing together.
Yeah exactly, exactly.
So since last week I'm down another pound and a half so I'm going to go for it.
So today though we have an amazing guest for you.
His name is Justin Sullivan.
Justin is the CEO of Ajax Jets.
He's got a long history of aviation entrepreneurship.
He started as a charter broker.
Now he owns a fully integrated 135 operation.
He also has a 145 repair station which is a maintenance facility that's regulated by
the FAA.
It's very difficult to get and hold on to by the way.
I've worked on that process for a long time so I know quite a bit about it.
And he even has a charter business now.
He has a very unique business model that delivers incredible value to the owners in his company
system.
He's told me about some of the jets that they work with and how it's beneficial for their
owners and for the clients.
So I'm excited to kind of hear a lot about that as well as how he thinks differently
on his fleet of classic business jets.
Welcome to our podcast Justin.
Thanks so much for being with us.
Brandon Carson, great to be here guys.
Thanks for having me.
Yeah, it's a pleasure meeting you Justin.
I know Brandon set this one up and I haven't gotten to meet you until this morning.
But can you tell us about how you got started with aviation?
That's the first thing we always ask people on our podcast.
Yeah, I graduated college and went straight into tech sales.
So I worked for IBM for a couple of years and then another big computer company.
And there's a big tech downturn in the early 2000s and a bunch of my colleagues left our
company in Boston to go work for a company called Sentient Jet, which is the 800 pound
gorilla, the inventor of the jet card.
And they made a career shift.
I had never heard of this industry.
I'd obviously seen private planes at the airport, but just got very excited about the industry.
I knew that I could add a lot of value and build a great business doing this.
I'd done a lot of entrepreneurial things up to that point.
And I talked myself into actually interviewed with Sentient as a sales rep, but talk myself
into a position as VP of sales with a dot com startup.
So a company that was that erased a lot of venture capital and was going to take the
on demand charter space by storm.
So I worked there for a few years, built up a very sizable book of business, high net
worth clients, athletes, entertainers, a lot of companies.
And just really enjoyed what I was doing.
As I mentioned, I've been very entrepreneurial in the past.
And there was an inflection point about three years into my tenure where that company that
I was working with sold itself to Sentient Jet.
So I was a bit at a decision point and decided to start my own business.
So I've been a charter broker, which is really like a glorified travel agent whereby we have
high net worth clients and people who desire to fly on private aviation and they need to
take a trip.
They need to fly from Bedford, Massachusetts to Van Nuys, California.
And the job of a charter broker is to represent that client's interests in the marketplace
of aircraft.
So part 135 airplanes that are duly authorized and have economic authority from the FAA to
operate.
Those are air carriers that charter brokers really serve as the intermediary with and
did that independently for a number of years.
About five years ago, maybe a little longer than that, I launched a parallel career path.
I've been very enamored with the airplane ownership management side of the business.
And really as a charter broker, I feel that it gives, in hindsight, it has certainly proven
this out.
It gives me and my company a great leg up and a competitive advantage in having our
own proprietary fleet of planes that we can dispatch for our clients in addition to the
brokered suite of thousands of aircraft all over the world.
So I launched this parallel career path working with a company that really pioneered the business
model that I'm in, which is taking older planes, putting nice new interiors into them and getting
top rate charters.
Did that for several years.
And ultimately, it was time for me to do my own thing.
Raised a couple million bucks from some clients of mine who wanted to make a strategic investment
in this industry and acquire a part 135 air carrier about two years ago.
And that actually brings up a great point.
Everyone asked me how somebody can get into aviation or how you can build a business in
aviation because there's a lot of entrepreneurs in the world or people that want to be entrepreneurs.
And I'll tell you this, the big thing between an entrepreneur and just an average person
is an entrepreneur gets it done.
They are a doer.
They have an idea and they execute on that idea, which it sounds like you did.
And everyone always asked me at least, and I'm sure people have asked you, well, how
do you get started in the industry?
I don't know how to get started.
I don't know any of these.
Honestly, you need an anchor client.
And it sounds like that's what you had.
You had a couple anchor clients.
I know somebody who owns a couple FBOs.
I asked how they got started.
They said, I got an anchor client because unless you have millions of dollars up front,
you have to get an initial client who believes in you as a person and believes that you will
execute on those ideas in entrepreneurship, which is amazing.
Sounds like you've done that, which is pretty fantastic.
And I kind of did the same thing.
Everyone's kind of heard some of my story in the background where I've gone after I
had to get a loan from three different people on one airplane so I can buy an airplane.
And that was I was my own anchor client, actually.
But it kind of worked out.
I know that earlier you mentioned a jet card.
For some of our listeners, they might not know what a jet card is.
Can you explain what a jet card is and what it does for H&Ws or high net worth individuals?
Certainly.
Most of our business is charter.
So it's clients who desire to fly, in that example, from Bedford, Massachusetts to Van
Isle, California.
They get a quote.
The quote is $35,000 one way.
They book that transaction and do that trip.
They have no further commitments.
And the company doesn't have any other commitments beyond that trip.
A jet card is a pre-funded debit card that's either in a cash denomination.
So it's $100,000 jet card or a quarter million dollar jet card.
And that entitles the owner to access aviation on a predetermined occupied hourly rate schedule.
So for one of our planes, an occupied hourly rate would be about $12,000 per flight hour.
And it's a very bite size, maybe not bite size, but it's a product that people can purchase
that they can set it and forget it.
They buy that jet card.
They buy that membership.
And now they have one single point of contact.
And they don't have the challenge or inconvenience of moving money back and forth every time they
want to fly.
The concept was pioneered by Ascension Jet membership back in the early 2000s.
And the industry has really gone through a lot of changes.
At one point, it was the thing to do.
You may remember the Marquis Jet Card, which was a 25 hour access point into NetJets.
The challenge with jet cards from an operator standpoint is that it creates an entitlement.
So somebody, if you have too many people who have entitlements to be able to call out a
jet and they all want to do it on a peak day or on a day of limited availability, it creates
a lot of operational pressure onto whoever sold that jet card.
So we've done it in the past.
And frankly, it caused us a lot more problems than it created opportunities.
And we've gotten away from that.
And the only people who have a contractual entitlement to call out a plane with us are
the owners of the plane.
So every plane that we manage is owned by a different high net worth family or corporation.
That's neat.
I know you said that you brokered jets.
So have you ever purchased a jet yourself?
And if you have, what was that like buying your first jet?
I know I've always wanted to own a jet.
It's on my bucket list and it's actually on my 10 year goal list.
I will own a jet.
I will tell you that.
That will be for sure.
But what was that like buying your first jet?
I mean, it had to have been kind of an exhilarating experience, especially being in aviation.
Well, it was pretty cool.
I was working, as I mentioned, in that parallel career path where I didn't have my own 135.
So I was managing planes and leasing them to other part 135s.
And I saw the cash flows that the Falcon 50s generate.
And back in the day, there's a lot of operational efficiencies and things that you can do with
Falcon 50s that you can't do, frankly, with any other business jet.
And back in 2015, 16, that was a million dollar asset.
So pretty shocking to be able to get into a nine seat super midsize jet that has coast
to coast range for about a million dollars.
I had a lot of confidence in it just from seeing the cash flows of the jets that I was
managing.
And that gave me the confidence to go and do it.
Quick disclaimer, I'm actually I do great, but I wouldn't call myself a high net worth
individual.
So I had to do some creative financing and some different things to make that jet purchase
happen.
So quick aside, I happen to know the owner of this plane.
And he was living in Boston, a couple of towns over from me.
We've become friends and the jet was more than he wanted to.
He had done everything he needed to do with jet, except he wanted to be able to take it
couple times a year to between Boston and West Palm Beach, maybe 30 hours a year.
So in arranging this purchase, he gave me a bit better deal than he otherwise might
have because I gave him a cut rate deal on for the next three years on his flights between
Boston and West Palm Beach.
So he was able to get what he wanted.
And I was able to get myself into a plane by frankly, mortgaging my house.
Wow.
And that is crazy.
But it's not that crazy.
I mean, for you to be an entrepreneur, you got to be crazy.
I'll tell you that for sure.
All of us entrepreneurs are absolutely bonkers and nuts because we do things like that.
And we bet it all on ourselves.
And if you bet on yourself, you will win, I guarantee it, because you put it all out
there and it sounds like you're winning.
And it sounds like that deal, which was very creative.
It worked out for you so far.
I know that every time that somebody wants to structure a big deal like this, I went
to a conference a couple of weeks ago in Key Largo, I believe it was.
And when I went there, I met with a lot of bankers who are in the private jet market.
I also met appraisers in the private jet market.
Almost everybody was in the private jet market that was there.
And it was really a fantastic show to go to or a conference to go to because I learned
how creative these deals get.
I mean, I was really kind of surprised with I was here in terms of only like a 40% loan
to value.
That's all they were giving them 40%.
And they had a three year note with a balloon payment at the end.
I was like, what is how does this even make any sense?
But I guess for some people, it does.
It sounds like a hard money law.
It did sound like a hard money loan, but it was from like a major bank.
I just was in the room and I heard it in like the background.
But it sounds like a hard money loan because I mean, I've seen hard money loans all the
time.
And actually, I wouldn't even take that deal.
So there had to have been some reason behind it.
I just don't know what it was.
But maybe I'll figure it out one of these days.
But but yeah, yeah, I'll share with you that financing these jets is tough.
Most airplane finance companies don't want to touch something that's 15 years, it's older
than 15 years old.
And our oldest jet is from 1981, Ronald Reagan's first term.
And our youngest jet is 96.
It's a Falcon 900 and 1993 Falcon 50.
You get into these planes, they have brand new interiors, they have updated avionics,
it looks and feels like a brand new piece of equipment.
But that doesn't matter for airplane finance companies.
And you know, there's a lot a lot to unpack that the market for used executive business
jets is still pretty hot.
I thought it would after the the tax incentive of the cares act tax incentive where you get
100% bonus depreciation that expired at the end of the year.
I thought that would really pop this this balloon.
But it hasn't.
And the market for Falcon 50s, there's Falcons in general, they're just very well built machines
that have almost an infinite airframe life.
There are Falcons flying around from the 70s.
And our planes from the 80s and 90s will still be flying 25 years from now.
We do the continuous airworthiness programs of these planes.
I was going to ask you what do you think the business jet market will be like in the next
year?
I know I'm hearing and when I say the business jet market, I don't just mean the sales part
of it.
I mean, the usability of it, how of the high network net worth individuals utilizing the
private jet market and business jet market in the future, because everyone says this
recession is looming, supposedly 80% chance of happening the end of this year, Federal
Reserve keeps raising rates, all these things are still happening.
So I'm kind of curious on where do you think it'll be in the next year?
And I asked mostly for the reason because a lot of our listeners are pilots are soon
to be pilots.
They want to know what's going to happen in our marketplace.
Because if people aren't using planes, then they're not going to be flying.
And obviously, they want to be flying.
So where do you see that the business jet market is going to be in the next year?
Well, if you look at the big OEMs like Bombardier, Gulfstream and Textron, they've planned their
supply chains out for the next five years.
And they're forecasting over 10% growth year over year in their new plane builds.
They've got a backlog of orders that stretch out more than 18 months.
And companies like NetJets and FlexJet, I've heard they may be opening up some slots for
fractional owners at the end of this year.
But pretty tight, pretty tight availability at that top end of the market, people who
are buying $65 million Falcon 8Xs and $30 million Challenger 350s directly from the
OEM.
We focus on a different slice of the market.
We're working with classic business jets that have been mostly depreciated by the previous
owners.
So a Falcon 50 that we operate, it's a $2 to $3 million asset right now compared to
a $30 million asset for a comparable brand new super mid-sized jet.
So what I want to know is where are all these, most of these owners who are buying these
latest generation planes, they are not first time airplane owners.
They're working on their third, fourth, fifth investment and as their lifestyle continues
to move up the food chain, they want more expensive toys.
So I think that that's going to leave a very big hole in the market for more classic business
jets and companies like ours that specialize in not only operating, but really maintaining,
providing the continuous airframe maintenance on these classic airframes.
That's going to be a real center of growth as the industry continues to evolve.
That said, you asked about the charter and the usage side.
What's happened in our business is in the last, after COVID in the 18 months since the
initial shock, our market has continuously moved up, more demand, greater pricing power.
But that's due to people who don't want to fly commercially anymore.
There's going to be some macroeconomic trends about how high net worth individuals and families
have done very well in the last 18 months.
But it's really, in my view, do more to the consolidation in the industry.
So you've got three companies, Directional, Wheels Up, and Vista Global, who acquired
seven of the largest 15 private air carriers in the last 18 months.
So companies like Travel Management, Delta Private Jets, Mountain Aviation, Jet Edge.
Every one of those fleets was over 70 planes when they got acquired by those big companies.
And those companies are generally closed loops.
So they service their own membership.
And all of that supply was taken out of the charter market, creating a supply crunch.
So you may have heard, this isn't exactly breaking news, that there's a company called
Wheels Up that's having some financial difficulty.
What's funny is, while you were talking, Carson and I have our screen over to the side and
I actually was typing in for Carson to ask a question right now about what you're about
to talk about.
So that is hilarious.
Yeah, Justin, you're segueing from one thing to another.
It's awesome.
We were just about to ask.
Exactly.
So it's a little bit of a contrarian point of view, guys, but Wheels Up has, I don't
know how big their fleet is, but say it's 500 planes and they're losing a million five
a day.
They're about to get delisted off of the New York Stock Exchange and their CEO just quit.
I'm not making any judgments, but what's going to happen to the charter market if those 500
airplanes come back into the charter market?
I don't know.
Stranger things have happened.
I can't make heads or tails of buying an $8 million King Air 350i and trying to make money
off of it, even at $5,000 an hour.
It just doesn't compute to me.
All that debt service, all the operational expenses of carrying a plane.
So I think it's a tough business model to be owning new planes and trying to make money
by chartering them.
We've got a lot of leverage points with classic jets and the engines alone, the engines on
Falcon 50s, you save half a million dollars a year on those engines compared to a comparable
Citation 10 or Citation Sovereign.
So you'd have to, and it costs 20% as much to acquire one of these Falcon 50s and Citation
10 or Citation Sovereign.
So if you're in business to make money, I think a Falcon 50 better move than what Wheels
Up did.
Go ahead.
So it seems like Wheels Up just has a riskier investment, but it also seems like the reward
is pretty good considering the size of the company.
Are you seeing a huge difference in the risk versus reward that you guys have versus what
Wheels Up has?
Obviously, it seems like things are going a little bit downhill for them, but they have
more expensive ones.
Yeah, fundamentally.
So it just kind of makes sense that fundamentally we're different in every respect.
Every one of the planes that we operate now is owned by a high net worth individual or
a company.
So we don't have any financial risk of operating them.
We run a pretty lean organization.
We don't create entitlements.
So with Wheels Up, they have 15,000 members who can call out a plane on a day's notice
no matter where they are in the country and have a plane show up.
How is that working out for them?
We don't do that.
We're flew in nine planes.
We stack our schedule very tightly based on the positioning of our airplanes.
So we don't have to eat a four hour deadhead across the country if we happen to be out
of position to take care of one of our most important clients.
If one of our clients needs to fly and our planes are out of position, we broker them
something else.
Nobody has an entitlement.
And we don't have to pay, even if we did have to pay the debt service on a $2 or $3 million
Falcon 50 that's cash flow and 50 grand a month, that would be okay.
But we don't have to.
And not for nothing, but a $2 to $3 million investment is to everybody, the three of us,
that's a lot of money.
To the guy who's looking, who's a lifestyle private jet traveler, he probably has a net
worth of 50 million or more.
And for that guy to look at making an investment that's 4X what our investment in Falcon 50
is, that's a big chunk of his net worth.
Whereas $2 to $3 million, it's much more bite sized.
Yeah, much more bite sized.
We can run the numbers on what we would be doing.
We do smaller airplanes.
Carson hasn't bought his first airplane yet, but he will.
We all do different size deals for where we're at in life.
And by the way, I looked up to see how many aircraft Wheels Up has while you guys were
talking.
And they claim to have over 1500 private aircraft.
And that's owned and managed airplanes.
So that's a lot of airplanes.
And if 1500 airplanes went on the market, it's going to crush the marketplace.
I doubt that would actually happen.
They would have to get acquired, I would assume.
But that's pretty insane.
And speaking of 1500 airplanes, there's obviously a lot of job opportunities for pilots flying
private jets.
So how do you hire pilots in your part 135 operation?
Is there a difference between 135 and 91 operators?
Is there anything you're looking for?
So 135, our employees are all full time employees.
So our pilots are all full time employees.
So we don't work with contractors.
Everybody who's flying for us has been to simulator school in the last year.
And they've been to simulator school.
One of the FARs is that they have to go to the simulator school under our training program.
So we'll have a program at CAE and another program at flight safety.
And when we bring a pilot on, even if they've been, so even if we're poaching them from
another air carrier and they went to school two weeks ago for a Falcon 50, we hire them.
They have to have to go to school again for us.
The platform that we use for pilot hiring is called climb2350.com.
That's the only place that we look for pilots.
It's free for us as an employer.
So it doesn't cost anything and we get a very steady stream of qualified applicants.
That seems like it's the place to be.
Some things have loosened up a bit in the training market.
So previously an initial Falcon 50 simulator, which is a three to four week pretty expensive
ordeal.
Those were scheduling nine months out.
So it was very difficult for us to bring in pilots who don't already have a type rating.
And most of the pilots that we've hired in the past 18 months or two years, I guess,
have come to us with a Falcon 50 type rating.
So they only have to go to an initial, or excuse me, they only have to go to a recurrent,
which is a Falcon 50, about 12 grand and five days.
That compares to, I operate a couple Challenger 350s part 91.
And the simulator training for those is scheduling out many more months in advance than Falcon
50s.
And the simulator training costs about 2X.
So it's another, just one more data point of why classic jets are easier to operate,
easier to, a quicker time to value.
And if you get somebody who kind of worth individual buys a Challenger 350, spends $30 million
on it, in order for him to get pilots without sending them to simulator training, he's going
to have to go poach them from net jets or flex jet or, or XO jet.
And he's paying those captains a quarter million dollars a year because they're really top
dollar guys.
Whereas Falcon pilots do not make that much.
They're well compensated, but they don't make anywhere near what the current rated captains
of the newer next generation planes make.
So a lot of this is also word of mouth.
Our planes are all over, our pilots are in FBOs, pilots have cool uniforms.
We ran a, we had a sunglass promotion with these like ultra, wish I had them here, but
ultra clear lenses that we give to all of our clients who book charters with us.
He's like $1,500 sunglasses.
And we give them to all our pilots because we want them all to look awesome.
Right.
So our pilots all have these, these very cool designer frames with, with crystal clear bullet
proof lenses.
And they just look like, you know, top gun fighter pilots.
So we've got to look and we've got an aura about us and it's a team that people want
to be a part of.
What are you looking for from a pilot that you want to hire?
You know, in terms of hours, what are you looking for?
And then what does the average kind of pay that these pilots can expect or benefits in
a job like this?
So a, we operate a floating fleet.
So unlike most air carriers that are based in a particular home base.
So say we're, we're, say we were in Orlando based flight department and you're only hiring
pilots that are within driving distance of Orlando.
That's not how we do it.
Our pilots live all over the country.
They can live in 50 states as long as they have access to commercial transportation.
And on day one of their rotation, they'll airline to their plane.
So their plane might be sitting in Denver and on crew rotation day, we're going to
airline two pilots there.
We're going to airline the other two pilots back to their, their homes.
And they're going to start a 14 day rotation where they stay with the plane for 14 days.
A senior captain in our program is earning $150,000 base plus benefits, including company
paid health insurance.
And SICs are really all over the map.
Somebody who's a highly qualified rated SIC that maybe has 4,000 hours of total time.
They could jump into a captain seat at any point.
That guy's probably making 120 grand plus benefits.
And somebody who is going to say we hire a Learjet pilot, put them through initial and
he's a thousand, like a thousand hours is our insurance minimum for an SIC.
That guy's probably making 85 grand a year plus benefits.
So that sounds like a really good kind of segue for pilots who they've gotten their
time flying as a CFI and they've flown maybe 700 hours of CFI and they want to get their
first job instead of waiting to go to the airlines at 1500 or more at some point.
They can actually go to a company like yours and start making money and making a lot better
money.
You save a thousand hours, you get a thousand hour insurance minimum.
Yeah, yeah.
A thousand hours.
So we take 250, 300 for them to get their CFI.
And then after that 700 hours.
Oh, I see.
Yeah.
So they get to you.
They're making a lot more money.
I mean, 85 grand is a lot better than a lot of flight instructors make across the US.
So that'd be fantastic.
How many hours a month do you think these pilots are getting when they go and work for
a company like yours?
Well, a plane flies about a hundred hours a month and they're flying on it about 50%
of the time.
So probably 50 hours a month.
50 hours a month?
Very busy operation.
But you know, Falcon 50 is a superman.
So it flies coast to coast.
So in two days it could fly 10 hours.
Oh, wow.
Yeah.
That's a lot of flying.
Do you see a lot of turnover because of the amount of hours you're giving?
Sounds pretty good to me.
Do you see a lot of turnover in this industry right now?
I mean, I see it kind of all over the place.
I mean, as flight instructors, I see flight instructors come and go every six months.
So are you seeing that or are people kind of staying?
Mixed bag.
I mean, certainly we've lost quite a few pilots to the airlines over the years.
And we provide a, people like flying Falcons.
You know, we operate 50s and 900s.
It's the same type rating for a 50 and a 900.
The reason why I ask that question is I see it as an opportunity for new pilots that are
coming up, the ones who just got their flight instructor rating or just got their commercial
pilot rating.
The reason why I ask the question is so people who are listening to us, they know they can
go to a company like yours and there's going to be openings and there's going to be openings
in the near future for pilots.
So make sure that you're applying at these other types of companies.
You can start flying a ton of hours very early on in your career rather than having to wait
till you get to 1500 and fly an airline and you got to fly in a little 172 inside the
pattern.
Go fly something cool.
I mean, I'd want to go fly a Falcon 50.
That sounds awesome.
So Justin, whenever you just need somebody to go fill a seat for an SIC, one that you
can just sign off, just let me know if they're coming out of John Wayne or heck, I'll go
over to...
Three to two and three landings and you're all set, right?
Yeah, exactly.
That's all I need, right?
I already know how it all works.
No, not really.
Yeah, that's pretty neat.
So yeah, thanks so much for joining us today.
This was quite awesome.
I really appreciate you being here.
Yeah, thanks for being on with us today.
And you know, everyone, Justin is a great example of where aviation can take you.
I know we talked quite a bit about being a pilot and going to the airlines, but aviation
is a thriving place that businesses can just grow.
Whether you're going to be an entrepreneur like Justin or whether you want to be a pilot
and you want to go fly any one of these cool, cool airplanes, going from a Cessna 172 to
a Falcon 50 is a pretty awesome jump to go make.
Yeah, it absolutely is.
And Justin, for all of our listeners who would like to either possibly invest with you by
getting a jet of their own or if they're interested in becoming a pilot and working for you and
your company, where can they reach you at?
What's the name of your company's website and best email to get a hold of you guys as
well?
My email address is justin at Ajax.com.
Our website is AjaxJets.com.
And if your audience is interested, I have a YouTube channel that's called Your Friend
with Jets, where I have dozens of videos, other podcasts like this, interviews and ideas
with new planes that we're trying to bring to market, new ideas and my perspective on
things, which is obviously a bit contrarian.
That's awesome.
Well, again, thank you so much for joining us.
I really enjoyed talking with you.
I know we went a little longer than we said we would.
Our podcasts, typically we've been having awesome guests, so they're going a little
bit longer.
So everybody who's our normal listeners, I hope you guys are enjoying it as much as
we are.
But if you want to reach out to Carson or I, you can reach us at Twitter or Instagram.
For me, it's at MrMartiniGuy.
For Carson, it's at Carson underscore AV17.
And as always, we prefer via email, I'm Brandon at AviationMentors.com and Carson at AviationMentors.com.
And there's one more thing that we're looking at the climb to 350.
This is absolutely something to go and check out if you're looking for a job in aviation.
And we're just looking at this website and there's so many listings that you can go
and go after.
So it's a great stepping stone, especially underway the airlines or even another program.
But as always, as a wrap up for the day, remember, we're here to guide your aviation journey.
So fly safe and enjoy the ride.