Hello, I'm Brandon Martini, a commercial pilot and flight instructor.
I'm Carson Vasquez.
I'm a private pilot.
And you're listening to the aviation mentors podcast sponsored by Stratis Financial.
So buckle up because the aviation mentors are taking off.
Welcome back everybody to another great and fantastic episode of the aviation mentors
podcast.
Thanks for joining us today.
As we count down with only three days left to Oshkosh Air Venture for the kickoff.
We can't wait.
As you guys know, by the time you're listening to this at least, we're recording this a few
days early because we're getting in travel mode with the entire Stratis Financial team.
I think we've got 10 of us going to the show.
That's why we mentioned that we bought nine or 10 bikes on the last episode.
And it is going like crazy for planning wise.
And I'm sure if you're planning on going, you're already starting to look into things.
And if, especially if you're coming from across the world, some of you might actually already
be in route before even hearing this episode today, which is pretty fantastic.
Our entire team will be at Oshkosh getting ready to see each one of you there.
And Carson and I have been talking a lot about how you can fly into Oshkosh, what's to experience.
And he needs more hours and experience to feel comfortable with him flying there.
I think he could do it.
Don't you guys?
Maybe, maybe not.
I don't know.
You know, that's, that's a semi nice thing for you to say until you drop the drums on
me, but I do appreciate it.
You know, I just, I think we just need a little bit more before we, before you go fly to Oshkosh
together, especially need to get super current again.
Yes.
There's a difference between current and super current.
Thanks so much for telling us, Carson.
Well, that's like saying IMC versus the soup.
Okay.
Everyone knows what I'm talking about.
Yeah.
Super current.
I love that.
That's a new FAA term that they're, they're now adopting.
Yeah.
The 2024 far aim came out.
You didn't catch that part in the revision.
Super current.
Super current and competent at the same time.
Wow.
You're competent.
So that's interesting.
Which brings us to a pretty great way to build time actually, since Carson needs to build
some more time for him to feel comfortable.
And that is joining a flying club.
We've never actually talked about flying clubs.
We've always talked about, we've talked about flight schools and university programs and
things like that.
So they are not for building hours usually, or not only for building hours.
There's a ton of great benefits to being a member of a flying club.
And we're going to get into several of them today actually.
Yeah.
Well, Brandon, you know, neither of us have actually been in a flying club, but we've been
around them plenty and we have plenty of friends who actually been in them.
So Brandon was suggesting I joined with them and gave me so many great reasons for it.
So I want to make sure you guys heard all of them.
First off, Brandon, why don't you start by explaining what a flying club is?
Thanks for that, Carson.
Now, a flying club, by the way, wait until we start going to video and you're going to
get to see our funny facial interactions.
It's pretty hilarious.
And we're going to do some video recording in AirVenture.
So it'll be pretty awesome for you guys to see some of us.
And you're going to see how ugly Carson is now, how amazingly great looking I am, of course.
I mean, it's just true.
You know, Brandon, you can think whatever you'd like to think about that.
Matty feels differently and so does my mom.
So that's what really counts here.
I guess that's it.
The two women in your life that matter the most.
That's good for you.
So back to back to business, right?
So a flying club is similar to a flight school, except for it's not structured like a flight
school.
It's structured more like a group of friends that want to rent aircraft to each other and
they want to share in the expenses of them.
So that's really what a flying club is.
So you can have a very small flying club with one or two airplanes.
And generally flying clubs are really made up of several aircraft.
You normally I don't know, three to 10 airplanes are probably the average size flying club,
probably generally kind of like the average size flight school, right?
The average size flying club will already have all these assets and we'll have several
members and we'll have a cap on members.
And what they do is they take a normally a large fee upfront.
So you'll pay five or 10 or 20,000.
I've even seen $50,000, sometimes even more if you're one of the only members of a brand
new club that needs a new airplane.
And what they'll do is they will put the plane in the flying club's name and over time they
will sell shares of that.
And that's how they will kind of cash themselves out when they start a flying club, right?
But in general, after a flying club is established, let's just say you've got two airplanes and
they're worth $100,000 total and you have 100 people in that club.
So maybe you have 100 people paying $1,000 to join the club and then you have a more
monthly maintenance fee for every member in that club.
And that every member might have to spend $100 a month on maintenance fee.
And that keeps the insurance on the airplane.
It keeps the airplane hangered.
It pays all the cost.
And then generally you'll have what's called a dry rate on the airplane.
Now whenever you go to flight school, they typically have wet rates.
The difference between a wet rate and a dry rate is one includes fuel and one does not
include fuel.
So a wet rate means let's say you pay $200 an hour for an airplane.
If it's a wet rate, you don't pay any additional fuel cost unless there's a fuel surcharge
or something which has been kind of prevalent in our industry over the past two years because
of the Ukraine War.
Or you can be in a flying club or something that typically has what's called a dry rate.
And a dry rate means you can save money if you like to save fuel.
So if you like to lean your mixture and you like to save fuel and treat the airplane the
way it should be very well, you will end up saving money, right?
So the dry rate might be on that same $200 per hour airplane.
It might only be $100 per hour.
But then you pay for the fuel separately.
So maybe the rate is really, your total rate is $160 an hour.
So generally there's a break even point.
You need to fly an hour or two or five hours a month or whatever it may be in your club
to break even per year just like it is to buy an airplane.
Generally you need to fly about 100 hours per year on a rental airplane before it makes
sense to purchase one and different things like that if you're only looking at the cost
and not the time savings.
So that's really kind of the main way that a flying club operates and what it is and
what their purpose is.
The purpose also, they take $100 or whatever their fee is.
Some places have really high fees from a whole lot of different people.
And guess what?
Most people don't get on the schedule and fly the airplane.
They just pay their fee every month.
But inside the agreements that everyone has to sign, they all have to stay current or
super current or whatever you said it was, Carson.
So that's also a possibility.
They have to stay current.
So they may have to go up with an instructor.
There's typically check instructors that are mandated by either the insurance or the board
of directors.
Those are definitely all different points that you could see in a flying club.
Well, going back a step and speaking about fees, there's a ton of advantages to it.
But based on the price first, how can that be a beneficial part of being a flying club?
Well, generally, if you're at a flying club, you're not have to pay for flight school profit.
Flight school is a business.
They need to make money.
That way they can pay themselves and pay their staff and pay for their lifestyles.
Now, generally, flight schools aren't a very profitable business compared to other businesses.
Some flight schools are and they make a lot of money.
The world's largest flight school, I guarantee they make a lot of money.
They've got like 56 campuses or something.
So the big difference is you're not paying their profit.
So let's just say their profit margin is normally 20%.
So $200 per hour airplane, that's $40 per hour that's going to go into the flight school's
pocket.
There also might be some overhead costs that isn't really profit.
That's maybe another 20 or $40.
So let's just say you might be able to get the airplane for 20 to 50% cheaper than you
would if you went to a flight school.
But there's an upfront cost usually.
It's typically whatever that is to become a member of that flying club, whether it's
a thousand, two thousand, 10, 20, 30,000.
I know there's flying clubs that have Honda jets.
And I think those are memberships are like 250,000 and you have to pay for your own type
rating and you have to have this insurance checkout.
And you have to be with an instructor for like 50 hours or something.
So there's flying clubs that are for more wealthy people as well as people who are just
trying to save money or they want a different community.
So some people like a community of older pilots.
That's typically in a flying club, not brand new younger ones.
They like newer, nicer airplanes, ones that are well-kept because everybody in a flying
club is typically an owner of that airplane.
So you're going to keep good care of that airplane.
You're not going to treat it like a rental airplane or a rental car.
Everyone treats a rental car like junk.
And everyone also keeps her treats rental airplanes like junk.
It's really unfortunate, but that's kind of the way that people treat things.
Not all people, but a lot of people do.
So I would say that those are kind of the benefits, especially on cost.
You can save quite a bit of money because you're not paying for that flight school's
profit or some of their overhead.
Flying club might not even have an office.
Really?
They will have overhead like insurance and things like that, but they probably don't
have an office space.
They don't have staff that mans that office.
They have different expenses and they're a lot lower.
Yeah.
Well, it makes up for it because as far as the aircraft that you're flying, they're typically
going to be in better condition.
Like Rand said, you're going to be a part owner of that plane and you're pretty much
buying into it as well.
So you definitely want to have a part to play in keeping that plane nice and pretty.
Yeah, definitely.
And there's also some benefits to it.
I know flight schools I've been to.
Typically they have staff that clean the airplanes, right?
They keep your windows clean.
They make sure the bellies get cleaned regularly.
Well, a flying club, you're volunteers.
So that's also another thing you're going to be doing.
You're going to need to volunteer to go clean those airplanes.
You can't just be the slacker and never go.
You have to actually do something, right?
You have to be a member of this club.
It's like joining a country club or joining a shooting club or joining any type of club.
It's a club you have to join and you need to be a competent member of that.
So those are some things you also have to do.
So obviously I've been a member of several different types of clubs for a long time,
but I'm a member of a soaring club, which I think I mentioned a couple episodes past
on when we talked about soaring.
And I don't participate that much, but I pay my dues.
So I'm actually probably a really good member.
I haven't gone there in like six months or a year and I pay my dues every month and never
complain and never ask for anything.
I'm the perfect club member, right?
They take my money.
I'd help pay for all the airplanes and the maintenance, but the downside of it, I don't
really go there too, because I don't have the time right now.
I don't go there to help clean the airplanes and be an active member in that community.
But if you do want to join a flying club, I highly suggest you're an active member in
that community.
That way you can keep those points in better conditions.
And it is a great community as well.
You're pretty tight knit.
You guys are flying together, you're flying the same planes.
You can time build together and there's a lot of just networking opportunities.
Like Brandon said, that's the way that you go and talk to people is just walk around
the airport making friends.
And that's essentially what you do.
And it's a great way as well to go and get into a flying club if you can't find one near
you.
Because you can only find that kind of club and that kind of community in aviation.
So with all that interconnectedness, I think it's a really good route for me to take.
And like I was saying, most airports do have a flying club.
You're going to probably be around at least one or two airports locally to you, which
I didn't know about until I started flying, by the way, that there were so many airports
and someone's going to be a flying club.
Someone's going to know someone.
So just go talk, go reach out on Facebook or Instagram and someone's going to help you
out.
That's what aviation is all about, is just helping everyone.
And with that being said, I can't wait to help everyone and get to see everyone at Oshkosh.
And next year, hopefully I'm going to be able to fly into it.
So that's my huge goal.
And by the way, I'm going to mention one more thing on flight instructors.
So like I said a few minutes ago, typically with flight instructors, you have to use the
club's flight instructors.
But sometimes they have flight instructors that the club has checked out who are not
members who allow you to flight train in those airplanes.
But also keep in mind, if you are not a pilot, there also might be a possibility that you
cannot even join that club until you're a pilot and have had a checkout flight, which
is typically about the same as another checkride or a checkride or a BFR until you become a
competent pilot to fly those airplanes.
They really want to take really good care of them.
And they're typically not your just cheesy 172 or Cherokee.
They're typically a 182 or a Cherokee six or a 210 or a serious or or even that Honda
jet that I talked about earlier.
So they could be kind of anything.
So I'm looking forward to seeing everybody in three days.
Actually, by the time you are listening to this, I will be in an airplane on my way to
Milwaukee to get my rental car.
Carson will already be at Oshkosh and you will get to go over and see him if you'd like.
He'll be setting up.
The show starts next Monday.
So just in a few days from now.
So if you want to come see us at the booth, make sure you come see us at the booth number
1053 1054 hangar B aircraft spruce hangar.
And if you want to reach out to us so you can reach us at Brandon and aviation mentors
dot com or as always Carson at aviation mentors dot com.
We're looking forward to seeing you.
Thanks so much.
And as a wrap up for the day, remember, we're here to guide you in your aviation journey.
So stay super current, fly safe and enjoy the ride.
See you there.