WEBVTT 00:00:01.960 --> 00:00:05.540 You're listening to Their Auto Be A Law, the 00:00:05.540 --> 00:00:08.259 Center for Auto Safety podcast with Executive 00:00:08.259 --> 00:00:11.720 Director Michael Brooks, Chief Engineer Fred 00:00:11.720 --> 00:00:15.640 Perkins, and hosted by me, Anthony Cimino. For 00:00:15.640 --> 00:00:18.300 over 50 years, the Center for Auto Safety has 00:00:18.300 --> 00:00:25.460 worked to make cars safer. Hey listeners, today 00:00:25.460 --> 00:00:28.620 is Wednesday, September 2nd. We might be living 00:00:28.620 --> 00:00:31.539 in a hologram. No, wait, yes, quantum entanglement's 00:00:31.539 --> 00:00:34.159 real. Yeah, they just did some experiment. It 00:00:34.159 --> 00:00:35.880 has nothing to do with auto safety, but I thought 00:00:35.880 --> 00:00:39.039 it was fun. Einstein was wrong, I guess, maybe. 00:00:39.700 --> 00:00:43.640 Anyway, let's get into cars. So this was an interesting 00:00:43.640 --> 00:00:45.060 one. I'm going to start off with the exploding 00:00:45.060 --> 00:00:48.079 sunroof moonroof. Listeners, if anyone can write 00:00:48.079 --> 00:00:50.420 in and tell me the difference between a sunroof 00:00:50.420 --> 00:00:52.640 and a moonroof, Fred Perkins will come over to 00:00:52.640 --> 00:00:54.759 your house and mow your lawn. Yeah, I've been 00:00:54.759 --> 00:00:56.259 trying to figure that out for years. I don't 00:00:56.259 --> 00:00:57.799 think it exists, but there's an article. I mean, 00:00:57.880 --> 00:01:01.820 you can see the moon through a sunroof. Oh, God. 00:01:02.159 --> 00:01:05.620 Okay, show's over. Let's just go on. This is 00:01:05.620 --> 00:01:07.239 from an article in the Wall Street Journal titled, 00:01:07.359 --> 00:01:10.400 Car sunroofs keep spontaneously exploding and 00:01:10.400 --> 00:01:12.459 the problem's getting worse. Quoting from it, 00:01:12.939 --> 00:01:14.879 thousands of drivers have filed complaints with 00:01:14.879 --> 00:01:17.099 U .S. auto safety regulators describing jarring 00:01:17.099 --> 00:01:19.000 incidents in which their sunroof unexpectedly 00:01:19.000 --> 00:01:22.180 exploded or shattered. Often while they're driving. 00:01:22.379 --> 00:01:24.079 The number of complaints has soared recently 00:01:24.079 --> 00:01:26.719 is set to hit a record in 2026 with nearly 500 00:01:26.719 --> 00:01:30.159 reported so far this year. Further down, road 00:01:30.159 --> 00:01:32.219 debris that drivers don't notice is one culprit. 00:01:32.319 --> 00:01:34.620 Car designers and testers say hot temperature 00:01:34.620 --> 00:01:36.939 and rapid temperature shifts can cause rapid 00:01:36.939 --> 00:01:39.400 expansions of the glass. Sometimes design and 00:01:39.400 --> 00:01:42.620 manufacturing defects are also to blame. This 00:01:42.620 --> 00:01:44.879 is frightening. You're driving around. You're 00:01:44.879 --> 00:01:46.239 like, hey, I'm not going to look at the road. 00:01:46.340 --> 00:01:47.659 I'm going to look at the moon and then boom. 00:01:48.510 --> 00:01:51.489 you're covered in tempered glass shattered all 00:01:51.489 --> 00:01:57.530 over you uh and this is you know okay i can guess 00:01:57.530 --> 00:02:01.329 like i am a little stuck because i remember the 00:02:01.329 --> 00:02:02.829 first time i was in a car with a moonroof it 00:02:02.829 --> 00:02:06.829 was like the 1980s this is this isn't new but 00:02:06.829 --> 00:02:10.530 the explosion i think a lot of this i think a 00:02:10.530 --> 00:02:13.669 lot of this started when they started using the 00:02:13.669 --> 00:02:17.120 um tempered glass in the moon roofs and and you 00:02:17.120 --> 00:02:19.939 started seeing not just the little tiny panel 00:02:19.939 --> 00:02:24.099 sunroofs but these much larger full roof full 00:02:24.099 --> 00:02:26.860 sunroofs and that type of thing on vehicles um 00:02:26.860 --> 00:02:29.699 is when we really started seeing it but you know 00:02:29.699 --> 00:02:32.939 the the ultimately i think the main issue here 00:02:32.939 --> 00:02:36.060 still hasn't really been fleshed out which is 00:02:36.060 --> 00:02:39.539 the safety issue you know nitsa did a very long 00:02:39.539 --> 00:02:41.639 investigation into this as pointed out in the 00:02:41.639 --> 00:02:45.729 article and i think they They did essentially 00:02:45.729 --> 00:02:47.889 the peer review study where they sent out surveys 00:02:47.889 --> 00:02:50.330 to every manufacturer and said, hey, all of you 00:02:50.330 --> 00:02:52.889 tell us what's going on here. The manufacturers 00:02:52.889 --> 00:02:54.750 all reported back with all of their complaints. 00:02:54.870 --> 00:02:57.509 They're around, you know, 4 ,000 sunroofs that 00:02:57.509 --> 00:03:00.789 they collected there. And there was not a single 00:03:00.789 --> 00:03:04.530 one where it, you know, despite how startling 00:03:04.530 --> 00:03:06.750 these incidents are, where it caused a crash. 00:03:07.129 --> 00:03:10.990 There were some, I think, a few very minor injuries 00:03:10.990 --> 00:03:14.770 from glass. scratches, not any deep wounds or 00:03:14.770 --> 00:03:18.030 anything. So there is a, you know, somewhat minimal 00:03:18.030 --> 00:03:20.550 safety concern. I'm assuming, you know, you could 00:03:20.550 --> 00:03:23.110 get glass particles in your eye and have significant 00:03:23.110 --> 00:03:25.629 damage to your eyesight. There are safety concerns 00:03:25.629 --> 00:03:27.789 here. So I'm not poo -pooing the safety concerns 00:03:27.789 --> 00:03:32.949 here. But they are very rare and, you know, the 00:03:32.949 --> 00:03:35.610 safety side of this. But these moon roots are 00:03:35.610 --> 00:03:37.830 continuing to fail. You know, it's hard to tell 00:03:37.830 --> 00:03:40.090 from the complaint data whether this is a problem 00:03:40.090 --> 00:03:43.250 that's increasing or... Not it's also impossible 00:03:43.250 --> 00:03:48.409 to tell for you and the car and often for, you 00:03:48.409 --> 00:03:50.409 know, the dealer you take it to and for manufacturers 00:03:50.409 --> 00:03:55.509 to determine why the sunroof failed. You know, 00:03:55.509 --> 00:04:00.330 is it road debris? That's entirely possible if 00:04:00.330 --> 00:04:03.849 it's not a laminated sunroof, which I don't think 00:04:03.849 --> 00:04:06.490 many of the ones that are exploding are not laminated. 00:04:07.110 --> 00:04:10.509 They are the tempered glass. And, you know, those 00:04:10.509 --> 00:04:13.669 little tools that you use to break tempered glass 00:04:13.669 --> 00:04:16.509 are essentially the size of the corner of a rock 00:04:16.509 --> 00:04:19.709 that would come off the road. You know, I think 00:04:19.709 --> 00:04:22.319 there's a. you know, that manufacturers are arguing 00:04:22.319 --> 00:04:24.540 that this isn't primarily a road debris problem. 00:04:24.699 --> 00:04:27.100 And I think there's certainly something to that. 00:04:27.399 --> 00:04:30.579 I think there could also be issues with temperature 00:04:30.579 --> 00:04:34.519 and temperature shifts and, you know, bad manufacturing 00:04:34.519 --> 00:04:37.279 in some cases that produces glass that's going 00:04:37.279 --> 00:04:40.100 to fail like this. But this remains kind of a 00:04:40.100 --> 00:04:43.519 big mystery. You know, and in the article, I 00:04:43.519 --> 00:04:44.939 think someone said, you know, well, why don't 00:04:44.939 --> 00:04:46.699 we just make all these out of laminated glass? 00:04:46.879 --> 00:04:49.730 Well, That would solve the exploding sunroof 00:04:49.730 --> 00:04:53.449 problem. However, it also creates an egress issue 00:04:53.449 --> 00:04:57.529 because, you know, if your sunroof is laminated, 00:04:57.569 --> 00:05:00.269 now you're likely going to have laminated side 00:05:00.269 --> 00:05:03.350 windows in your car, a laminated front windshield 00:05:03.350 --> 00:05:05.910 and a laminated sunroof. If you have a crash, 00:05:06.110 --> 00:05:07.829 how the hell are you going to get out of the 00:05:07.829 --> 00:05:11.129 car if there's a fire through laminated windows 00:05:11.129 --> 00:05:14.430 if you don't have, you know. an electric saw 00:05:14.430 --> 00:05:17.329 or some other type of extrication equipment inside 00:05:17.329 --> 00:05:19.310 of your vehicle that's operable at the time. 00:05:19.410 --> 00:05:23.029 That's a tough question. We're reducing, slowly 00:05:23.029 --> 00:05:26.949 reducing all of the egress potential for windows 00:05:26.949 --> 00:05:30.449 in the vehicle. So that's a big concern of ours. 00:05:30.569 --> 00:05:33.470 Now that, you know, now that the ejection mitigation 00:05:33.470 --> 00:05:37.089 standard has pushed manufacturers to, I think, 00:05:37.089 --> 00:05:40.569 70 % of the market now. is laminated side windows 00:05:40.569 --> 00:05:43.250 that humans can't readily escape from, plus the 00:05:43.250 --> 00:05:47.269 windshield, plus the sunroof. That's a little 00:05:47.269 --> 00:05:49.629 scary to me from an egress perspective. Even 00:05:49.629 --> 00:05:52.750 though it solves this sunroof problem where we 00:05:52.750 --> 00:05:55.230 really haven't seen crashes and deaths, is it 00:05:55.230 --> 00:05:57.910 ultimately worth it reducing the potential for 00:05:57.910 --> 00:06:00.209 egress through the roof? I don't know. Is there 00:06:00.209 --> 00:06:02.170 any standard, any applicable standard, Michael? 00:06:03.500 --> 00:06:05.839 No, not for sunroofs that I know. I mean, they're 00:06:05.839 --> 00:06:07.720 going to be the typical glazing standards at 00:06:07.720 --> 00:06:09.939 NHTSA, but manufacturers, you know, have a lot 00:06:09.939 --> 00:06:12.879 of options there. They obviously can use laminated 00:06:12.879 --> 00:06:15.860 glass and sunroofs. They can use temporary glass 00:06:15.860 --> 00:06:18.959 and sunroofs. And just guessing, I'm going to 00:06:18.959 --> 00:06:22.379 guess that most manufacturers are going with 00:06:22.379 --> 00:06:24.939 what's the cheapest, right? Do either of you 00:06:24.939 --> 00:06:28.360 have sunroofs and or moonroofs? Yeah, I do not. 00:06:28.540 --> 00:06:32.810 Yeah, okay. I know this is very hard for me, 00:06:32.870 --> 00:06:36.189 but I'm not trying to be a jerk. I have a real 00:06:36.189 --> 00:06:41.850 question. Too late. Yeah, I know. Why? I've never 00:06:41.850 --> 00:06:43.850 had a car with one. I've been in cars with them, 00:06:43.850 --> 00:06:49.110 and I don't get it. Oh, I love it. I can see 00:06:49.110 --> 00:06:52.189 the clouds. You can see the sun. Yeah, and you're 00:06:52.189 --> 00:06:55.829 driving, so you're telling us here, live on the 00:06:55.829 --> 00:06:58.569 podcast. It's like a convertible without the 00:06:58.569 --> 00:07:05.850 rollover risks. Okay. All right. I like a sunroof. 00:07:05.850 --> 00:07:07.550 You know, it's nice. I like a little sun on my 00:07:07.550 --> 00:07:10.029 face when I drive, right? You can also crack 00:07:10.029 --> 00:07:12.350 it, and when you fart, it'll go out the roof. 00:07:12.649 --> 00:07:15.610 Oh, okay. At night, you can see the stars and 00:07:15.610 --> 00:07:19.029 the moon. Again, I focused on the driving task 00:07:19.029 --> 00:07:21.410 at hand. I'm not looking up at the sky, you hippies. 00:07:22.709 --> 00:07:25.430 Well, the sky looks at you. That's what the sun 00:07:25.430 --> 00:07:29.279 does. It kind of comes in, you know? It's just 00:07:29.279 --> 00:07:32.060 nice, that's all. And yours has not exploded? 00:07:33.100 --> 00:07:35.879 It has not, no. But with tempered glass, there's 00:07:35.879 --> 00:07:38.459 lots and lots of ways it can get scratched, and 00:07:38.459 --> 00:07:42.220 it scratches all it takes for the entire panel 00:07:42.220 --> 00:07:46.279 to disintegrate into small particles. And I imagine 00:07:46.279 --> 00:07:48.199 it's got to be expensive to replace that piece. 00:07:49.279 --> 00:07:51.600 I'm sorry? I imagine it has to be expensive to 00:07:51.600 --> 00:07:55.040 replace your sunroof. If it gets done. Yeah, 00:07:55.079 --> 00:07:57.459 there's different implementations of them. Some 00:07:57.459 --> 00:07:59.480 of them are really simple. Some are particularly 00:07:59.480 --> 00:08:02.079 a panoramic one, right? That is essentially the 00:08:02.079 --> 00:08:04.220 roof of your vehicle or a large portion of it. 00:08:04.240 --> 00:08:05.920 They've got to be expensive. I think that's one 00:08:05.920 --> 00:08:07.639 of the where a lot of these complaints are coming 00:08:07.639 --> 00:08:10.279 from because consumers are going back to their 00:08:10.279 --> 00:08:12.759 dealer and they have this unexpected and shocking 00:08:12.759 --> 00:08:15.959 event take place, you know. And the dealer is 00:08:15.959 --> 00:08:18.939 saying, yeah, not our fault, road debris. And 00:08:18.939 --> 00:08:21.279 so they're filing complaints, obviously, because 00:08:21.279 --> 00:08:22.600 they feel like they're getting the short end 00:08:22.600 --> 00:08:24.500 of the stick and that the glass is defective. 00:08:24.620 --> 00:08:28.290 And the problem is I. I would guess that when 00:08:28.290 --> 00:08:31.529 you're taking this into your dealer, the dealer's 00:08:31.529 --> 00:08:33.409 looking at it going, you know, I have no idea 00:08:33.409 --> 00:08:36.769 whether this was design, road debris, what the 00:08:36.769 --> 00:08:39.370 problem is here. And they're, you know, unless 00:08:39.370 --> 00:08:41.269 they're really, really nice, you're probably 00:08:41.269 --> 00:08:44.049 not going to be getting that covered under warranty 00:08:44.049 --> 00:08:47.049 or otherwise. All right. Well, I'm not going 00:08:47.049 --> 00:08:49.970 to get one. Consumers are really pissed about 00:08:49.970 --> 00:08:51.850 this issue. We get a number of complaints on 00:08:51.850 --> 00:08:54.649 it, even in our relatively smaller complaint 00:08:54.649 --> 00:08:59.289 database compared to NHTSA. NHTSA gets, you know, 00:08:59.289 --> 00:09:01.830 I think 10 % of what the car manufacturers get, 00:09:01.909 --> 00:09:03.590 but there's certainly, this is happening, you 00:09:03.590 --> 00:09:07.269 know, thousands and thousands of times over the 00:09:07.269 --> 00:09:09.570 past few years. Okay. But it wasn't something 00:09:09.570 --> 00:09:11.350 that happened a lot. Something we never heard 00:09:11.350 --> 00:09:14.990 about before, you know, 2010 or so. Yeah. I wonder 00:09:14.990 --> 00:09:17.929 if like the formulation has changed in the glass 00:09:17.929 --> 00:09:21.080 they're using. Well, I think it probably changes 00:09:21.080 --> 00:09:23.259 every time they find a less expensive way to 00:09:23.259 --> 00:09:25.600 produce something that functions similarly, right? 00:09:25.840 --> 00:09:27.919 That's what it comes down to. Soon it will just 00:09:27.919 --> 00:09:30.399 be a piece of saran wrap. All right, let's move 00:09:30.399 --> 00:09:32.220 on. This is way too much time on moon roofs. 00:09:33.779 --> 00:09:36.940 IIHS has a new study that shows that police reports 00:09:36.940 --> 00:09:39.879 undercount cell phone use before crashes. Now, 00:09:39.899 --> 00:09:41.500 this one I love. This is the whole distracted 00:09:41.500 --> 00:09:45.389 driving. debate. And so I'm going to quote from 00:09:45.389 --> 00:09:48.389 it. A new study from IIHS that draws on telematics 00:09:48.389 --> 00:09:50.570 data confirms that far more drivers are using 00:09:50.570 --> 00:09:52.529 cell phones in the lead up to crashes than is 00:09:52.529 --> 00:09:55.549 reflected in police reports. IIHS researchers 00:09:55.549 --> 00:09:58.529 examined anonymized cell phone data from Cambridge 00:09:58.529 --> 00:10:00.750 Mobile Telematics for the study. They found that 00:10:00.750 --> 00:10:02.950 drivers enrolled in safe driving programs that 00:10:02.950 --> 00:10:06.029 rely on the CMT. Cambridge Mobile Telematics 00:10:06.029 --> 00:10:07.990 platform were using their cell phones in the 00:10:07.990 --> 00:10:11.590 30 seconds prior to impact in 7 % of single vehicle 00:10:11.590 --> 00:10:14.750 crashes and 8 % of two vehicle crashes. Police 00:10:14.750 --> 00:10:16.690 reports for the same crashes recorded cell phone 00:10:16.690 --> 00:10:20.669 use in less than 1%. I mean, we all know it. 00:10:20.690 --> 00:10:22.289 We're all on the road. You should read the next 00:10:22.289 --> 00:10:24.210 paragraph. I'll read the next. Okay. Those numbers 00:10:24.210 --> 00:10:25.909 include drivers whose screens were unlocked for 00:10:25.909 --> 00:10:29.049 any reason, including navigation. Yes. That was 00:10:29.049 --> 00:10:31.720 the part that threw me off because. I mean, my 00:10:31.720 --> 00:10:35.559 phone is plugged into my car, and it puts a map 00:10:35.559 --> 00:10:39.500 in the center screen, but I'm not using my phone. 00:10:39.679 --> 00:10:44.220 I'm listening to the voice say, in 350 feet, 00:10:44.279 --> 00:10:46.379 turn left, unless you don't want to. Then just 00:10:46.379 --> 00:10:48.399 keep going. Yeah, I've got a really old version 00:10:48.399 --> 00:10:52.879 of Android Auto that's buggy, and I always have 00:10:52.879 --> 00:10:55.919 to have my phone screen on with navigation. Oh, 00:10:56.000 --> 00:11:01.059 I can turn the screen off. Right. I don't know. 00:11:01.139 --> 00:11:05.539 I mean, we I mean, I think we know that, you 00:11:05.539 --> 00:11:07.960 know, there's 3000 to 4000 distracted driving 00:11:07.960 --> 00:11:11.500 related fatalities reported every year. And we 00:11:11.500 --> 00:11:14.659 know that number is probably three times higher. 00:11:14.799 --> 00:11:17.360 Best guess. Right. But police reports aren't 00:11:17.360 --> 00:11:22.019 picking it up. I don't know that this I don't 00:11:22.019 --> 00:11:24.159 know. There's a couple of things about the data 00:11:24.159 --> 00:11:26.700 set they used here that raise questions in my 00:11:26.700 --> 00:11:29.580 mind about how we can project from it. The first 00:11:29.580 --> 00:11:31.500 is these are people that actually are allowing 00:11:31.500 --> 00:11:33.960 their insurance companies to monitor their driving, 00:11:34.159 --> 00:11:37.940 right? So they're probably using their phones 00:11:37.940 --> 00:11:40.720 a lot less. Yeah, they should be better drivers, 00:11:40.879 --> 00:11:42.980 theoretically. Right, than your average crash. 00:11:43.120 --> 00:11:46.740 So that would suggest that these numbers are 00:11:46.740 --> 00:11:48.679 low that they're coming up with here. But then 00:11:48.679 --> 00:11:52.679 you see that the screens, that they're basing 00:11:52.679 --> 00:11:56.970 this on data where navigation counts. as, you 00:11:56.970 --> 00:11:59.250 know, having your, using your phone 30 seconds 00:11:59.250 --> 00:12:02.370 before a crash, which I don't know. I kind of 00:12:02.370 --> 00:12:04.590 question whether that's the way to go about this. 00:12:04.730 --> 00:12:08.529 I mean, I know it's hard to collect. I don't 00:12:08.529 --> 00:12:10.570 know how you're going to collect data without 00:12:10.570 --> 00:12:13.330 looking at what the human's looking at here to 00:12:13.330 --> 00:12:15.389 determine whether distractions involve, because 00:12:15.389 --> 00:12:19.049 I think most of us that use Waze or Google Maps 00:12:19.049 --> 00:12:21.289 or some other form of navigation, I primarily 00:12:21.289 --> 00:12:26.230 rely. on the audio cues. I'm not staring at the 00:12:26.230 --> 00:12:30.250 map, right? And I would argue that the use of 00:12:30.250 --> 00:12:33.309 navigation apps are actually preventing crashes 00:12:33.309 --> 00:12:36.909 in a lot of circumstances. I think they're probably 00:12:36.909 --> 00:12:38.750 preventing a lot of idiots from stopping in the 00:12:38.750 --> 00:12:40.250 middle of the interstate when they pass their 00:12:40.250 --> 00:12:44.509 exit, among other things. So there is something 00:12:44.509 --> 00:12:46.830 to navigation, I think, that can be argued to 00:12:46.830 --> 00:12:49.269 improve safety and that we probably should be 00:12:49.269 --> 00:12:51.809 using it. I mean, it's obviously more easy. It's 00:12:51.809 --> 00:12:54.129 obviously a lot safer than pulling out an Atlas 00:12:54.129 --> 00:12:55.789 and looking at it while you're driving. Right. 00:12:56.009 --> 00:12:59.850 So I don't know what to take from this study, 00:12:59.929 --> 00:13:02.769 given that it's kind of hard because you've got 00:13:02.769 --> 00:13:07.009 the the two things kind of hedging in different 00:13:07.009 --> 00:13:10.830 directions. But, you know, overall, I think it. 00:13:11.819 --> 00:13:15.340 aligns with our idea that the number of crashes 00:13:15.340 --> 00:13:17.799 that are reported related to distraction are 00:13:17.799 --> 00:13:23.600 much lower than what happens in reality. Fair 00:13:23.600 --> 00:13:26.899 enough. People stop looking at your phones. Yeah. 00:13:28.100 --> 00:13:30.360 And other things too, right? I mean, you look 00:13:30.360 --> 00:13:35.899 through, you know, a lot of the... data that 00:13:35.899 --> 00:13:37.840 has come out on, you know, when they've done 00:13:37.840 --> 00:13:40.399 research into what's distracting people. It is 00:13:40.399 --> 00:13:43.179 more than just the phone, right? We've even seen 00:13:43.179 --> 00:13:45.580 in some of the Tesla crashes where dropping objects, 00:13:45.759 --> 00:13:48.860 including phones, has resulted in crashes and 00:13:48.860 --> 00:13:51.340 distraction as well. And people just doing things 00:13:51.340 --> 00:13:55.320 that are not compatible with safely monitoring 00:13:55.320 --> 00:13:58.860 the driving environment. You mentioned the T 00:13:58.860 --> 00:14:01.200 word, so we're going to go into AVs now. Way 00:14:01.200 --> 00:14:03.460 to go. I was going to try and skip them first. 00:14:03.460 --> 00:14:06.639 What was the T word? Tesla. Yeah. Did I? You 00:14:06.639 --> 00:14:08.679 did. Oh, yeah. You did indeed. So I was going 00:14:08.679 --> 00:14:11.059 to hold off on this for a while. We'll start 00:14:11.059 --> 00:14:14.960 with Waymo, though, instead, which is tangentially 00:14:14.960 --> 00:14:19.240 related. So this was a few days ago, I believe. 00:14:19.639 --> 00:14:21.740 Waymo driverless vehicle collides with a car 00:14:21.740 --> 00:14:24.740 in California. Now, you can see this video. We 00:14:24.740 --> 00:14:28.860 have a link. it's uh you know no i don't think 00:14:28.860 --> 00:14:31.120 waymo's at fault here i don't i think it was 00:14:31.120 --> 00:14:34.220 i mean my big takeaway from this is that the 00:14:34.220 --> 00:14:36.539 waymo car looks more ridiculous than a zooks 00:14:36.539 --> 00:14:39.000 car that i honestly thought this was clearly 00:14:39.000 --> 00:14:41.360 a human driver who was pulling out into a road 00:14:41.360 --> 00:14:44.000 when they couldn't see what was 100 human driver 00:14:44.000 --> 00:14:47.820 i think is that not at fault is uh the responsible 00:14:47.820 --> 00:14:50.860 party how does that work that good but what was 00:14:50.860 --> 00:14:52.899 interesting to me is watching this video is that 00:14:52.899 --> 00:14:57.019 the weird looking waymo cartoonish, just kept 00:14:57.019 --> 00:15:01.000 driving on like a human driver. It just smashed 00:15:01.000 --> 00:15:03.379 into this car and just kept going down the road. 00:15:03.600 --> 00:15:05.399 Do we know how far it went before it stopped? 00:15:05.980 --> 00:15:08.899 Fred, you had some data. Waymo went about, I 00:15:08.899 --> 00:15:13.340 think, 100 yards or something like that. Well, 00:15:13.480 --> 00:15:15.080 that's according to the waymo. And what they 00:15:15.080 --> 00:15:17.620 said is that it automatically determined that 00:15:17.620 --> 00:15:20.649 it would be hazardous to stop there. Yeah, it 00:15:20.649 --> 00:15:23.090 was on one lane, right? And so it went down the 00:15:23.090 --> 00:15:27.269 road to a place where it could safely pull over. 00:15:27.870 --> 00:15:30.149 I wasn't there. I don't know what the hell was 00:15:30.149 --> 00:15:32.309 going on. I'm not charging them for hit and run 00:15:32.309 --> 00:15:34.690 in that environment, even if we could. Yeah. 00:15:35.149 --> 00:15:38.429 Anyway, it just went around the internet and 00:15:38.429 --> 00:15:42.210 we'd be remiss to ignore it. But yeah, it's just 00:15:42.210 --> 00:15:44.470 funny looking at these. It is a funny looking 00:15:44.470 --> 00:15:46.470 car. It really is. But it looks better than a 00:15:46.470 --> 00:15:51.179 Zoox. It does. uh and uh okay now i'll do the 00:15:51.179 --> 00:15:54.980 tesla god all right so remember back in the day 00:15:54.980 --> 00:15:58.960 elon said back in 2016 2017 i don't know saying 00:15:58.960 --> 00:16:01.340 your car will be able to drive itself you'll 00:16:01.340 --> 00:16:03.240 go to sleep at night it will drive around the 00:16:03.240 --> 00:16:04.980 hardware is all ready we're just going to keep 00:16:04.980 --> 00:16:07.500 updating your software this is great no this 00:16:07.500 --> 00:16:12.159 is my real hair no no no it is uh so that's just 00:16:12.159 --> 00:16:15.539 not true And we know this because years later 00:16:15.539 --> 00:16:17.240 he's kind of admitted it and said, oh, yeah, 00:16:17.379 --> 00:16:19.539 we I lied to you repeatedly. Thanks for your 00:16:19.539 --> 00:16:24.159 money. Look at my rocket. And so what they do 00:16:24.159 --> 00:16:25.899 now is they put out a new version of their full 00:16:25.899 --> 00:16:29.299 self -driving version 14, the light edition. 00:16:29.399 --> 00:16:32.019 The light edition means we got to try and jam 00:16:32.019 --> 00:16:35.539 this difficult software onto old hardware that 00:16:35.539 --> 00:16:38.500 was not able to handle this. And part of that, 00:16:38.519 --> 00:16:40.100 I'm going to quote from an electric article. 00:16:41.539 --> 00:16:44.620 FSD version 14 Lite is a compressed version of 00:16:44.620 --> 00:16:47.559 hardware for version 14 model, squeezed onto 00:16:47.559 --> 00:16:51.340 hardware 3's memory -constrained computer, which 00:16:51.340 --> 00:16:53.139 has 8 gigs of RAM and roughly one -eighth of 00:16:53.139 --> 00:16:55.740 the bandwidth of the newer hardware. And so that's 00:16:55.740 --> 00:16:59.519 why people have videos of this driving down the 00:16:59.519 --> 00:17:02.440 street. There is clearly a log. And by a log, 00:17:02.440 --> 00:17:04.569 I mean it looks like... a significant portion 00:17:04.569 --> 00:17:07.670 of a tree that's a yeah that's a tree like covering 00:17:07.670 --> 00:17:10.869 the road and they just the tesla just keeps driving 00:17:10.869 --> 00:17:15.369 over boom and just keeps going no uh awake human 00:17:15.369 --> 00:17:19.049 driver it did so impact the the amazing part 00:17:19.049 --> 00:17:21.490 was so it hits this and it gets thrown over the 00:17:21.490 --> 00:17:23.230 other lane but then it corrects itself and puts 00:17:23.230 --> 00:17:25.029 it back in the right lane so that i was like 00:17:25.029 --> 00:17:28.470 hey kudos that's that's pretty good but uh i'm 00:17:28.470 --> 00:17:31.069 sure your undercarriage is uh pretty messed up 00:17:31.069 --> 00:17:32.769 right now and there's nothing important under 00:17:32.769 --> 00:17:34.710 the bottom of a tesla right it's not like where 00:17:34.710 --> 00:17:39.470 they keep the batteries just so yeah um yeah 00:17:39.470 --> 00:17:42.769 and then it's just these uh tesla fanboys being 00:17:42.769 --> 00:17:44.609 like you got to keep pay attention these are 00:17:44.609 --> 00:17:46.990 the same people who mind you post videos of them 00:17:46.990 --> 00:17:51.930 asleep at the wheel so um yeah you can't this 00:17:51.930 --> 00:17:56.049 is just another example of just dumb This is 00:17:56.049 --> 00:17:58.150 another example of why this is not going to work. 00:17:59.230 --> 00:18:01.730 Camera only will not work. We're going to keep 00:18:01.730 --> 00:18:05.670 seeing crashes and deaths related not only to 00:18:05.670 --> 00:18:08.809 the complacency here, but by the human, but by 00:18:08.809 --> 00:18:11.650 the system simply not being able to detect threats 00:18:11.650 --> 00:18:15.309 in time to warn the human. Right. Well, that's 00:18:15.309 --> 00:18:19.809 clearly inadequate. I mean, if it runs over a 00:18:19.809 --> 00:18:25.190 six inch or eight inch thick log. without even 00:18:25.190 --> 00:18:28.269 noticing it, but at the same time, will jam on 00:18:28.269 --> 00:18:34.210 the brakes for false inputs from its, what am 00:18:34.210 --> 00:18:37.950 I stumbling around here? Phantom braking. Phantom 00:18:37.950 --> 00:18:40.390 braking, yeah. For which it's being investigated 00:18:40.390 --> 00:18:44.410 by NHTSA. Clearly, on both ends of the detection 00:18:44.410 --> 00:18:47.529 problem, there's stuff going on that ought not 00:18:47.529 --> 00:18:50.900 be going on. In Tesla's defense when they – their 00:18:50.900 --> 00:18:52.680 response to this video is, oh, we kept going 00:18:52.680 --> 00:18:54.559 because we thought it was a railroad crossing. 00:18:55.640 --> 00:18:58.960 Have you ever mistaken a tree for a railroad 00:18:58.960 --> 00:19:01.500 crossing? Yeah, but it's also Tesla not stopping 00:19:01.500 --> 00:19:03.779 at railroad crossings. Come on. Who's from out 00:19:03.779 --> 00:19:09.000 of town? Okay. Okay. Here's another one. This 00:19:09.000 --> 00:19:11.680 is a weird day. This is – we're linking this 00:19:11.680 --> 00:19:14.420 one from Yahoo. Why robo -taxi heartbreaking 00:19:14.420 --> 00:19:17.970 injuries vanish from federal safety data. Here's 00:19:17.970 --> 00:19:19.769 a regular story quirk worth understanding before 00:19:19.769 --> 00:19:21.509 you read another word about autonomous vehicle 00:19:21.509 --> 00:19:24.569 statistics. If a robot taxi slams on the brakes 00:19:24.569 --> 00:19:26.490 hard enough to hurt the person sitting in it 00:19:26.490 --> 00:19:29.049 and nothing touches anything, the federal government 00:19:29.049 --> 00:19:30.890 that regulates the vehicle never hears about 00:19:30.890 --> 00:19:34.049 it. Yep. Yeah. So this means. That's right. I 00:19:34.049 --> 00:19:35.750 went back and checked, you know, looking at this 00:19:35.750 --> 00:19:38.269 year. I was like, are you sure? Yeah. For something, 00:19:38.329 --> 00:19:39.750 for some reason, the back of my mind, I was thinking 00:19:39.750 --> 00:19:41.869 if there was an injury or, you know, obviously 00:19:41.869 --> 00:19:44.950 a death reported that there would be a requirement 00:19:44.950 --> 00:19:48.650 to, to, to. inform nits of that under the standing 00:19:48.650 --> 00:19:51.430 general order but it all hinges on there being 00:19:51.430 --> 00:19:54.269 a crash yeah so this is you're a passenger in 00:19:54.269 --> 00:19:56.890 say a waymo and it has to have a heartbreaking 00:19:56.890 --> 00:19:59.809 event you go flying forward your head smashes 00:19:59.809 --> 00:20:02.690 against the seat in front of you you're cut bleeding 00:20:02.690 --> 00:20:05.349 slightly brain damaged thinking about becoming 00:20:05.349 --> 00:20:09.089 a professional football player and there's no 00:20:09.089 --> 00:20:11.970 recording of this there's no data that's capturing 00:20:11.970 --> 00:20:14.309 this and say hey this had a really heartbreaking 00:20:14.309 --> 00:20:18.130 event that injured a human And I don't know what 00:20:18.130 --> 00:20:21.390 the chances of this really are. I mean, in normal 00:20:21.390 --> 00:20:24.710 passenger vehicles where there's an option to 00:20:24.710 --> 00:20:29.549 buckle your seatbelt, those short stops can injure 00:20:29.549 --> 00:20:31.990 you and you can hit things in the car. I don't 00:20:31.990 --> 00:20:35.589 know if that is as much of a risk. And one of 00:20:35.589 --> 00:20:37.309 the good things about autonomous vehicles, at 00:20:37.309 --> 00:20:39.150 least the ones that I'm aware of, all of them 00:20:39.150 --> 00:20:41.230 require everyone in the car to be buckled in 00:20:41.230 --> 00:20:47.480 before they leave. I think these type of events 00:20:47.480 --> 00:20:50.339 obviously should be reported, you know, but not 00:20:50.339 --> 00:20:52.319 just because of the injury, right? I think we 00:20:52.319 --> 00:20:54.779 should be reporting all these short stops and 00:20:54.779 --> 00:20:58.440 anytime the vehicles are doing something poorly 00:20:58.440 --> 00:21:01.359 that could result in a safety issue in the future, 00:21:01.480 --> 00:21:04.640 even if that current event that happened wasn't 00:21:04.640 --> 00:21:08.680 that bad. And that's one of the reasons why we 00:21:08.680 --> 00:21:11.079 don't really like how the SGO collects data, 00:21:11.240 --> 00:21:13.420 because they're just collecting information on 00:21:13.420 --> 00:21:16.829 incidents after they've happened. after injuries 00:21:16.829 --> 00:21:18.470 and deaths have happened, they're not collecting 00:21:18.470 --> 00:21:21.549 information on incidents that could result in 00:21:21.549 --> 00:21:24.569 injuries or deaths one day if the problem isn't 00:21:24.569 --> 00:21:27.529 corrected. California does a little better job 00:21:27.529 --> 00:21:30.789 in that area. They collect information on disengagement 00:21:30.789 --> 00:21:34.809 incidents. But I'd really like to think if we 00:21:34.809 --> 00:21:38.029 got better federal reporting around all of the 00:21:38.029 --> 00:21:40.250 types of incidents that are safety -related, 00:21:40.410 --> 00:21:43.430 not just crashes, we'd have a much richer database 00:21:43.430 --> 00:21:45.950 with which to address the safety problems we 00:21:45.950 --> 00:21:48.710 see arising in autonomy. What we need is for 00:21:48.710 --> 00:21:51.990 NHTSA to define the near -miss criterion, and 00:21:51.990 --> 00:21:54.349 the near -misses should be reported as well. 00:21:55.490 --> 00:21:59.349 From a control system point of view, if you're 00:21:59.349 --> 00:22:01.789 only... developing your control system to avoid 00:22:01.789 --> 00:22:04.809 the death and serious injury, but you've got 00:22:04.809 --> 00:22:07.269 very little data to work from. But if you were 00:22:07.269 --> 00:22:10.190 looking at near misses, which will happen, you 00:22:10.190 --> 00:22:12.349 know, certainly much more frequently than death 00:22:12.349 --> 00:22:14.950 or injuries, that gives you a lot more to work 00:22:14.950 --> 00:22:17.369 from. And it would also give the public a much 00:22:17.369 --> 00:22:20.470 better idea of how close they are to catastrophe 00:22:20.470 --> 00:22:23.329 when they're... And how they're performing, you 00:22:23.329 --> 00:22:26.940 know, which is great to know. If you're choosing 00:22:26.940 --> 00:22:29.279 between different AV providers, which one is 00:22:29.279 --> 00:22:31.000 performing better from a safety perspective? 00:22:31.440 --> 00:22:34.299 Right. So, you know, we really need a near miss 00:22:34.299 --> 00:22:37.119 criterion as a minimum so that can be reported 00:22:37.119 --> 00:22:40.039 as well. Which is something that I hear they're 00:22:40.039 --> 00:22:42.259 using and working on at the University of Michigan. 00:22:42.259 --> 00:22:44.180 Yeah, I was going to say, you'd love this research 00:22:44.180 --> 00:22:46.859 team at the University of Michigan that is training 00:22:46.859 --> 00:22:51.859 their AVs with near miss driving data. So we 00:22:51.859 --> 00:22:55.079 have a link to this. We have a link to this, 00:22:55.099 --> 00:22:57.220 essentially, press release on it. I can't find 00:22:57.220 --> 00:22:59.680 the actual report they did on this because they, 00:22:59.779 --> 00:23:02.640 right off the bat, it has some conclusions saying 00:23:02.640 --> 00:23:07.200 self -driving cars are safer than humans. Where, 00:23:08.000 --> 00:23:14.119 what conditions? We've been through this level 00:23:14.119 --> 00:23:17.019 of bullshit before. Maybe someday, possibly, 00:23:17.240 --> 00:23:19.420 we'd all love this to happen, but I still don't 00:23:19.420 --> 00:23:21.579 see it, and we don't see it. I saw it before 00:23:21.579 --> 00:23:25.079 I joined this podcast, but now. We also don't 00:23:25.079 --> 00:23:27.400 know who funded this study at Michigan. Oh, we 00:23:27.400 --> 00:23:29.539 do. It says that's what I was looking for. It 00:23:29.539 --> 00:23:32.099 was funded by the Center for Connected and Automated 00:23:32.099 --> 00:23:34.019 Transportation at the University of Michigan 00:23:34.019 --> 00:23:38.440 and the National Science Foundation. But I don't 00:23:38.440 --> 00:23:40.440 know who funds the Center for Connected and Automated 00:23:40.440 --> 00:23:43.000 Transportation. That's the real question. Or 00:23:43.000 --> 00:23:45.660 who funds this National Science Foundation? I 00:23:45.660 --> 00:23:52.339 mean, come on. I don't care who's funding it. 00:23:52.960 --> 00:23:55.279 saying we need to look at near miss driving data 00:23:55.279 --> 00:23:57.559 because that's essentially what we're saying 00:23:57.559 --> 00:23:59.940 in the SGO. We need more of that information 00:23:59.940 --> 00:24:02.920 to be coming into play to fix these issues before 00:24:02.920 --> 00:24:04.759 they happen. Yeah, well, what they seem to be 00:24:04.759 --> 00:24:06.740 doing is these researchers, they're testing all 00:24:06.740 --> 00:24:09.619 these simulations and saying, hey, we'll train 00:24:09.619 --> 00:24:11.759 it on crash data. We'll train it on simulations 00:24:11.759 --> 00:24:17.039 of near misses. But I apologize, listeners, we 00:24:17.039 --> 00:24:20.250 don't have a link to the actual report. to understand 00:24:20.250 --> 00:24:22.769 what they're doing because i see them training 00:24:22.769 --> 00:24:25.369 on simulations and fred perkins voice pops into 00:24:25.369 --> 00:24:28.849 my head because he says a simulation is doomed 00:24:28.849 --> 00:24:33.930 to succeed right correct hey i win the show that's 00:24:33.930 --> 00:24:36.950 great i've been paying attention so interesting 00:24:36.950 --> 00:24:39.009 i mean i think they should be trained on all 00:24:39.009 --> 00:24:41.930 driving scenarios as we've said repeatedly yes 00:24:41.930 --> 00:24:44.670 we can't get every single we can get them okay 00:24:44.670 --> 00:24:47.470 we can get enough heuristics blah blah blah blah 00:24:47.470 --> 00:24:50.319 blah blah but Interesting. Just what you guys 00:24:50.319 --> 00:24:54.980 were talking about. Fascinating. And is it? No, 00:24:55.039 --> 00:24:56.619 I feel like a gaslight time. Do you guys have 00:24:56.619 --> 00:25:00.599 gaslights this week? Yeah. You do? You know, 00:25:00.599 --> 00:25:02.160 I'll start off because mine is going to be short 00:25:02.160 --> 00:25:05.140 and sweet. I've got a preemptive. I think this 00:25:05.140 --> 00:25:07.819 is our first preemptive gaslight call. But by 00:25:07.819 --> 00:25:10.799 the time this podcast comes out tomorrow, I think 00:25:10.799 --> 00:25:13.799 tomorrow is the date of the Tesla CyberCab event. 00:25:14.099 --> 00:25:21.079 Oh, God. That's my gaslight already. I know it's 00:25:21.079 --> 00:25:23.940 going to happen. And you're all forewarned that 00:25:23.940 --> 00:25:26.819 there's going to be a lot of things said there 00:25:26.819 --> 00:25:32.079 that are misleading, lying. I'm talking about 00:25:32.079 --> 00:25:36.539 things that don't exist and are impossible. Things 00:25:36.539 --> 00:25:38.819 that don't exist. Things that things that, you 00:25:38.819 --> 00:25:41.299 know, approve regulatory approvals that haven't 00:25:41.299 --> 00:25:43.119 happened and won't and haven't even been applied 00:25:43.119 --> 00:25:45.980 for. So there's going to be a lot of nonsense 00:25:45.980 --> 00:25:47.599 going on. So I'm just going to go ahead and call 00:25:47.599 --> 00:25:51.220 that one now. Wow. That was really good. And 00:25:51.220 --> 00:25:53.799 you're on the limb there, Michael. That's that's 00:25:53.799 --> 00:25:56.599 good. He's got a future, right? That's about 00:25:56.599 --> 00:25:59.559 as slam dunk as you can get. Yeah, okay. Fred, 00:25:59.640 --> 00:26:03.299 what do you got? I've got Kodiak, our friends 00:26:03.299 --> 00:26:06.440 at Kodiak, who are developing self -driving trucks. 00:26:07.200 --> 00:26:09.619 18 -wheelers. They've got an announcement where 00:26:09.619 --> 00:26:17.119 they say that AMD, which is a company that is 00:26:17.119 --> 00:26:21.400 not NVIDIA, is going to power Kodiak's AI next 00:26:21.400 --> 00:26:24.819 -generation autonomous trucks. So that's interesting. 00:26:26.000 --> 00:26:30.160 What's most interesting to me is that behind 00:26:30.160 --> 00:26:33.759 the scenes, it means that they're going to have 00:26:33.759 --> 00:26:36.700 to reject all of the data, all the statistics 00:26:36.700 --> 00:26:38.859 on safety data that they've already accumulated. 00:26:40.200 --> 00:26:44.200 Will they? Right. They certainly will not in 00:26:44.200 --> 00:26:47.740 the public domain. But it also gave me an opportunity 00:26:47.740 --> 00:26:52.079 to say, well, how's this really going to work? 00:26:53.519 --> 00:26:58.119 It turns out that the Federal Motor Vehicle Carrier 00:26:58.119 --> 00:27:01.240 Safety Administration has developed a lot of 00:27:01.240 --> 00:27:05.279 safety information on heavy trucks. The reason 00:27:05.279 --> 00:27:07.480 this is important in this venue, and we normally 00:27:07.480 --> 00:27:09.519 talk about light trucks and pedestrian safety 00:27:09.519 --> 00:27:15.960 and things like that, is that 82 % of the fatalities 00:27:15.960 --> 00:27:19.720 associated with heavy trucks were not occupants 00:27:19.720 --> 00:27:23.339 of the large truck. So 82%. It's almost everybody 00:27:23.339 --> 00:27:29.720 who's outside. So in the year 2022, there were 00:27:29.720 --> 00:27:34.720 4 ,848 fatalities who were not occupants versus 00:27:34.720 --> 00:27:39.440 1 ,064 who were occupants. And they go on to 00:27:39.440 --> 00:27:45.359 say that the critical pre -crash event for 63 00:27:45.359 --> 00:27:49.380 % of the largest trucks. was another vehicle, 00:27:49.539 --> 00:27:53.079 person, or animal or control, but 24 % of the 00:27:53.079 --> 00:27:56.460 large trucks in fatal crashes had critical pre 00:27:56.460 --> 00:27:59.160 -crash events of their own movement or loss of 00:27:59.160 --> 00:28:03.839 control. So what this means is that if you had 00:28:03.839 --> 00:28:08.779 a perfect self -driving system, you could eliminate 00:28:08.779 --> 00:28:13.380 24 % of those crashes. That's a big number. That 00:28:13.380 --> 00:28:17.430 would be a good thing to do. But if you compare 00:28:17.430 --> 00:28:23.849 that to the fact that 8 % of the fatal truck 00:28:23.849 --> 00:28:27.670 crashes were caused by speeding, and you note 00:28:27.670 --> 00:28:32.630 that intelligent speed assist has been proven, 00:28:32.769 --> 00:28:35.509 it's very effective, and it could eliminate those 00:28:35.509 --> 00:28:41.009 potentially. Again, these are the potential savings, 00:28:41.250 --> 00:28:43.750 life savings, of both of those competing technologies. 00:28:44.750 --> 00:28:47.529 Then putting those results together, it turns 00:28:47.529 --> 00:28:50.009 out that the potential lives that could be saved 00:28:50.009 --> 00:28:55.549 associated with heavy trucks from AI -based self 00:28:55.549 --> 00:29:03.710 -driving is 468 versus 473 if you retain the 00:29:03.710 --> 00:29:07.089 human driver and you put the intelligent speed 00:29:07.089 --> 00:29:11.569 assist into all of these trucks. So the question 00:29:11.569 --> 00:29:14.019 that arises is, nice that they're... you know, 00:29:14.039 --> 00:29:16.400 want to put AMD processors in to do the self 00:29:16.400 --> 00:29:21.460 -driving, but why bother? Clearly, if they use 00:29:21.460 --> 00:29:24.859 the ISA with a much less challenging computing 00:29:24.859 --> 00:29:28.119 environment and a human driver, they're going 00:29:28.119 --> 00:29:31.220 to get superior results or at least no worse 00:29:31.220 --> 00:29:33.619 results than if they go through the whole development 00:29:33.619 --> 00:29:37.200 process associated with this new processor and 00:29:37.200 --> 00:29:40.000 the uncertainty of self -driving, which is still 00:29:40.000 --> 00:29:42.789 not in any venue proven. to have any particular 00:29:42.789 --> 00:29:47.809 benefits. So I'm giving the Gaslight nomination 00:29:47.809 --> 00:29:50.369 to Kodiak since they're starting over with accumulation 00:29:50.369 --> 00:29:53.490 of safety statistics without notifying the public 00:29:53.490 --> 00:29:56.829 that that's an important part of their switching 00:29:56.829 --> 00:30:00.670 over to a different processor. And in any case, 00:30:00.670 --> 00:30:02.769 there's likely no safety benefit from driverless 00:30:02.769 --> 00:30:06.509 operation compared to proven intelligent speed 00:30:06.509 --> 00:30:10.670 assist with a human driver in the seat. This 00:30:10.670 --> 00:30:13.390 points out that clearly the whole drive toward 00:30:13.390 --> 00:30:16.910 self -driving for the trucks has nothing to do 00:30:16.910 --> 00:30:19.609 with safety. It has everything to do with reducing 00:30:19.609 --> 00:30:22.990 the operating costs of the trucks and putting 00:30:22.990 --> 00:30:26.710 truck drivers out of work. So the announcement 00:30:26.710 --> 00:30:29.250 of a new control system is just a distraction 00:30:29.250 --> 00:30:33.670 from the questionable safety benefits of computer 00:30:33.670 --> 00:30:37.869 -assisted driving. So that's my gaslight. You 00:30:37.869 --> 00:30:41.549 said, why are them switching from NVIDIA processors 00:30:41.549 --> 00:30:44.509 to AMD processors? Why would they have to throw 00:30:44.509 --> 00:30:48.069 out their safety data? I'm lost on that. Because 00:30:48.069 --> 00:30:52.549 that is... The hardware stack. Oh, right, the 00:30:52.549 --> 00:30:53.869 hardware stack. It's the data processing stack. 00:30:53.869 --> 00:30:56.509 Okay, got it, yeah. So you got a whole new computer 00:30:56.509 --> 00:30:58.490 in there and I'm sure you've bought a new computer 00:30:58.490 --> 00:31:00.450 and the old software didn't work properly. Right. 00:31:00.490 --> 00:31:02.930 Okay. I was just, I was focused on the wrong 00:31:02.930 --> 00:31:04.789 thing. Yes. Or bought a new computer and the 00:31:04.789 --> 00:31:07.250 new one didn't work properly. Well, that works 00:31:07.250 --> 00:31:10.890 too. Yeah. Okay. So that's just a refresh for 00:31:10.890 --> 00:31:13.690 listeners who are as halfway as I am. This is 00:31:13.690 --> 00:31:15.269 what we've talked about this. Every time they 00:31:15.269 --> 00:31:17.230 upgrade software or hardware, you're starting 00:31:17.230 --> 00:31:20.130 from zero again and not a single AV manufacturer 00:31:20.130 --> 00:31:23.859 will admit that. No, we, you know, like now it's. 00:31:24.180 --> 00:31:26.480 And it's not even that you're starting from zero. 00:31:26.640 --> 00:31:29.019 It's that. You can't claim your previous wins, 00:31:29.140 --> 00:31:32.900 really. Yeah, you need to, you know, separate 00:31:32.900 --> 00:31:36.720 the old data from the new data and not try to 00:31:36.720 --> 00:31:39.880 goad the public into believing that you've got 00:31:39.880 --> 00:31:43.279 this great safety record when the new data doesn't 00:31:43.279 --> 00:31:45.539 back that up yet. Yeah, you don't know what bugs 00:31:45.539 --> 00:31:47.640 you've introduced in this new stack. Got it. 00:31:47.680 --> 00:31:49.940 So what we talked about a couple of weeks ago, 00:31:49.980 --> 00:31:54.950 was it? is that if you look at fatality data 00:31:54.950 --> 00:31:58.369 and you strip out the bad drivers, and you're 00:31:58.369 --> 00:32:03.210 only looking at competent nominal drivers, nominal 00:32:03.210 --> 00:32:06.069 human drivers, it turns out that there's a fatal 00:32:06.069 --> 00:32:10.089 event about once every roughly 500 million miles. 00:32:10.430 --> 00:32:13.250 So in order to prove that your self -driving 00:32:13.250 --> 00:32:17.680 system is superior to human drivers, Because, 00:32:17.680 --> 00:32:20.940 right, the computers don't drink, they don't 00:32:20.940 --> 00:32:24.460 drive, they don't have ambitions, they don't 00:32:24.460 --> 00:32:26.960 have any of those things. So in order to prove 00:32:26.960 --> 00:32:29.319 that that was safer, you need to have the same 00:32:29.319 --> 00:32:32.660 software load and the same computer processor 00:32:32.660 --> 00:32:36.039 load in the car and accumulate several billion 00:32:36.039 --> 00:32:40.079 miles to prove that you're as good as the demonstrated 00:32:40.079 --> 00:32:44.460 safety of a careful, competent driver. So that 00:32:44.460 --> 00:32:46.759 same thing is true with the trucks, no doubt. 00:32:46.859 --> 00:32:49.559 The truck drivers tend to be better than humans 00:32:49.559 --> 00:32:53.480 on a per mile basis, but the consequences of 00:32:53.480 --> 00:32:57.359 their mistakes are pretty severe. Hey, listeners, 00:32:57.420 --> 00:33:00.519 if you feel ambitious on like these non -human 00:33:00.519 --> 00:33:03.420 drivers, go to autosafety .org and click on donate. 00:33:04.039 --> 00:33:05.819 That's right. Do it once, do it twice, do it 00:33:05.819 --> 00:33:10.319 thrice. Yeah. Okay. I'm going to do my gas light. 00:33:10.380 --> 00:33:17.380 My gas light is BMW. Oh, that's right. BMW. OK, 00:33:17.579 --> 00:33:21.359 so we've talked repeatedly on the show about 00:33:21.359 --> 00:33:24.799 how there is this we're removing buttons, physical 00:33:24.799 --> 00:33:27.039 buttons and physical switches from cars. And 00:33:27.039 --> 00:33:28.480 it's all on a touch screen. It's all going to 00:33:28.480 --> 00:33:31.559 be buried 18 levels deep in a touch screen and 00:33:31.559 --> 00:33:33.299 bad software design, especially when you're moving 00:33:33.299 --> 00:33:36.039 65 miles per hour. Down a highway, and you're 00:33:36.039 --> 00:33:38.119 like, instead of just reaching over and tapping 00:33:38.119 --> 00:33:40.160 or turning a dial for your air conditioning or 00:33:40.160 --> 00:33:43.319 tapping the hazard button, now you're going to 00:33:43.319 --> 00:33:46.500 shift your entire focus to a screen. Again, keep 00:33:46.500 --> 00:33:48.079 in mind, you're still moving 65 miles per hour 00:33:48.079 --> 00:33:49.480 down the highway, and you're going to be like, 00:33:49.519 --> 00:33:52.400 where's this, this, this, scroll to it. Or, if 00:33:52.400 --> 00:33:55.839 you're lucky, I do this, I hit my voice control 00:33:55.839 --> 00:33:58.299 and I say something, and the computer does the 00:33:58.299 --> 00:34:01.900 wrong thing repeatedly. I don't know why I cannot 00:34:01.900 --> 00:34:04.019 even pronounce my wife's name correctly to have 00:34:04.019 --> 00:34:07.539 a texter. I have to do some very ethnic variation, 00:34:07.880 --> 00:34:11.599 which is amusing to me. But this is stupid. I 00:34:11.599 --> 00:34:13.440 ask it to play a song and it plays something 00:34:13.440 --> 00:34:16.219 else completely different. But sometimes it works 00:34:16.219 --> 00:34:19.880 and it's helpful. So BMW is saying, yeah, we 00:34:19.880 --> 00:34:22.639 don't need buttons because the kids these days. 00:34:23.599 --> 00:34:26.820 They they they don't want buttons. They want 00:34:26.820 --> 00:34:30.549 it all. They want it all on a touch screen. Vikram 00:34:30.549 --> 00:34:33.670 Pawar, the CEO of BMW Group Australia, said that 00:34:33.670 --> 00:34:36.750 young buyers prefer the newer controls. Quoting, 00:34:36.809 --> 00:34:38.409 we can see that the voice and touch are becoming 00:34:38.409 --> 00:34:41.110 more and more common. Maybe it's a generational 00:34:41.110 --> 00:34:43.110 thing as well. You would see that a lot of younger 00:34:43.110 --> 00:34:45.849 generation, maybe 45 or below, they're trapped 00:34:45.849 --> 00:34:47.710 into these technologies at a faster pace using 00:34:47.710 --> 00:34:49.730 voice, using touch. According to the executive, 00:34:49.889 --> 00:34:51.630 younger customers are less patient with their 00:34:51.630 --> 00:34:53.889 technology. They want things done quickly and 00:34:53.889 --> 00:34:55.869 they're multitasking. And keep that in mind. 00:34:55.889 --> 00:34:58.289 That's how customers are evolving. They're multitasking. 00:34:58.469 --> 00:35:01.150 This is my gaslight. The humans are multitasking. 00:35:01.269 --> 00:35:03.750 This is horseshit. That's bad. This is not true. 00:35:03.750 --> 00:35:07.469 Let's let them distract themselves. Any new technology 00:35:07.469 --> 00:35:09.210 comes out, they say, oh, they're multitasking 00:35:09.210 --> 00:35:11.369 now. And the only reason that word ever came 00:35:11.369 --> 00:35:14.190 to the lexicon, because... By 1995, Microsoft 00:35:14.190 --> 00:35:16.210 figured out how to make their software not break 00:35:16.210 --> 00:35:19.070 by running two operations at the same time. Not 00:35:19.070 --> 00:35:21.329 a human running two operations at the same time. 00:35:21.389 --> 00:35:25.170 A computer that is not breathing and responsible 00:35:25.170 --> 00:35:29.030 for life. Isn't it cognitively proven that humans 00:35:29.030 --> 00:35:32.010 can't multitask? It is cognitively proven that 00:35:32.010 --> 00:35:38.250 men cannot multitask. Women apparently have some 00:35:38.250 --> 00:35:40.610 ability to do this at a much greater rate than 00:35:40.610 --> 00:35:43.489 men. They've done these studies. And I don't 00:35:43.489 --> 00:35:46.070 want somebody multitasking while they're moving 00:35:46.070 --> 00:35:48.869 a... four -ton vehicle at 65 miles per hour, 00:35:48.909 --> 00:35:52.070 especially a BMW. Or a one -ton vehicle. Right. 00:35:52.110 --> 00:35:54.710 We know they're moving at least 20 miles over 00:35:54.710 --> 00:35:56.730 the speed limit in that vehicle, and they're 00:35:56.730 --> 00:35:59.889 not paying attention. I don't want them multitasking. 00:36:00.650 --> 00:36:04.429 This is lazy. It's kind of a tone -deaf interview, 00:36:04.550 --> 00:36:07.960 too. I mean, Australia's NCAP just started. giving 00:36:07.960 --> 00:36:10.280 points credit to cars this year that have buttons 00:36:10.280 --> 00:36:12.820 instead of screen so i guess he's happy losing 00:36:12.820 --> 00:36:15.960 those those points i i know and it's also i i 00:36:15.960 --> 00:36:18.099 mean i would love voice control to become much 00:36:18.099 --> 00:36:20.039 better because that would make certain things 00:36:20.039 --> 00:36:22.900 much easier but even with the most perfect voice 00:36:22.900 --> 00:36:27.260 control it's just i mean maybe i'm just old but 00:36:27.260 --> 00:36:31.760 muscle memory Is there anything preventing both 00:36:31.760 --> 00:36:33.820 voice control and buttons from being in the same 00:36:33.820 --> 00:36:36.519 car? Not at all. Mine has it, and I return to 00:36:36.519 --> 00:36:38.760 the manual control. Well, I got a question for 00:36:38.760 --> 00:36:41.780 you. Yes. You have an effective voice control 00:36:41.780 --> 00:36:45.820 in your car. What's to stop the person in the 00:36:45.820 --> 00:36:49.219 passenger seat from saying, stop the car now, 00:36:49.300 --> 00:36:52.599 I want to get out? Excellent point. I do this 00:36:52.599 --> 00:36:54.320 regularly when I'm in somebody else's car and 00:36:54.320 --> 00:36:56.539 they're dictating a text message. So they finish 00:36:56.539 --> 00:36:58.280 off, hey, honey, I'm going to the store getting 00:36:58.280 --> 00:37:02.079 some milk. And I always tag in and jump on top 00:37:02.079 --> 00:37:04.800 and yell, love your butt. Yeah, you are that 00:37:04.800 --> 00:37:07.099 guy. Yeah, 100%. So a bunch of people got, hey, 00:37:07.139 --> 00:37:09.460 I'm picking up milk. Love your butt. And it's 00:37:09.460 --> 00:37:13.340 hilarious to me. But I imagine there's ways they 00:37:13.340 --> 00:37:14.980 can do directional microphones. They can tell 00:37:14.980 --> 00:37:17.809 it's just coming from the driver's seat. You 00:37:17.809 --> 00:37:20.730 have to verify your voice with the vehicle, I 00:37:20.730 --> 00:37:22.690 think is the better way to do it. Even then, 00:37:22.710 --> 00:37:24.190 it's just like you're going to sit there for 00:37:24.190 --> 00:37:27.750 an hour. At least make it difficult. Yeah. Also, 00:37:27.909 --> 00:37:30.730 don't let assholes in your car that will do that 00:37:30.730 --> 00:37:34.070 kind of thing. Come on! Everyone has a fun time. 00:37:34.969 --> 00:37:38.909 So that's my gaslight for the week. This is a 00:37:38.909 --> 00:37:42.789 tough one. I'm giving it to Michael because he's 00:37:42.789 --> 00:37:44.710 going for the future. Yeah, it's low -hanging 00:37:44.710 --> 00:37:48.039 fruit. But he's very low. This event has not 00:37:48.039 --> 00:37:52.059 happened. And hey, we're living. We already we're 00:37:52.059 --> 00:37:54.300 already very confident that there's it's going 00:37:54.300 --> 00:37:56.440 to be full of bullshit. But this will be amazing 00:37:56.440 --> 00:37:57.980 because next week we'll come back on the show 00:37:57.980 --> 00:38:00.659 and be like Elon came out and he's like, this 00:38:00.659 --> 00:38:05.860 was a folly. This was dumb. I have noticed that 00:38:05.860 --> 00:38:08.760 what finally Waymo is pushing back, at least 00:38:08.760 --> 00:38:12.719 on the idea of single sensor autonomy, even though 00:38:12.719 --> 00:38:16.019 they're not specifically naming Tesla. They're 00:38:16.019 --> 00:38:19.000 clearly targeting this event with some of their 00:38:19.000 --> 00:38:21.460 recent PR. Okay. Well, let's continue. Let's 00:38:21.460 --> 00:38:25.139 go on to some. Let me just say that since the 00:38:25.139 --> 00:38:28.159 Tesla and Elon Musk came up, I want to congratulate 00:38:28.159 --> 00:38:31.380 them for launching that new observatory into 00:38:31.380 --> 00:38:34.639 L2. That's a hell of an achievement. It's a wonderful 00:38:34.639 --> 00:38:41.099 new satellite that NASA has produced. It's unlike 00:38:41.099 --> 00:38:43.760 us to compliment Elon Musk and his enterprises, 00:38:43.920 --> 00:38:46.139 but that was a magnificent achievement. Are you 00:38:46.139 --> 00:38:51.440 talking about the new telescope? Yeah, 300 megapixel 00:38:51.440 --> 00:38:54.380 telescope. Yeah, that's going to be fun. But 00:38:54.380 --> 00:38:56.219 let's be honest, like Elon's involvement in that 00:38:56.219 --> 00:38:58.579 was like my involvement in designing the iPhone. 00:38:58.920 --> 00:39:03.619 Yeah, I was in the building, but like I was the 00:39:03.619 --> 00:39:06.480 iPod. I wasn't there. Go ahead. That's fine. 00:39:06.599 --> 00:39:10.239 Sorry. Okay, let's go to. A story we've talked 00:39:10.239 --> 00:39:12.099 about repeatedly. This is counterfeit Chinese 00:39:12.099 --> 00:39:15.019 airbags. We've talked about how these things 00:39:15.019 --> 00:39:17.420 are a nightmare. Consumers don't know about it. 00:39:17.440 --> 00:39:20.199 They go on to eBay and they buy. I need a replacement 00:39:20.199 --> 00:39:22.880 airbag. They buy it. They think it's OK. Put 00:39:22.880 --> 00:39:27.340 it in the car. Explodes. Death mayhem. Horrible, 00:39:27.360 --> 00:39:29.280 horrible things. We've been pushing back as a 00:39:29.280 --> 00:39:31.460 bunch of other groups saying, hey, eBay, stop 00:39:31.460 --> 00:39:34.940 selling these personal landmines, essentially. 00:39:36.599 --> 00:39:41.340 And now eBay has said, hey, we're going to stop 00:39:41.340 --> 00:39:44.460 sending this. So starting September 24th, eBay 00:39:44.460 --> 00:39:47.019 will ban the listing or sale of airbags, airbag 00:39:47.019 --> 00:39:49.239 inflators, and steering wheel airbag covers. 00:39:49.539 --> 00:39:51.480 The company said the decision was made following 00:39:51.480 --> 00:39:53.800 a comprehensive review of the risks these products 00:39:53.800 --> 00:39:57.760 may pose to eBay users. Oh, that should have 00:39:57.760 --> 00:40:00.420 been my gas light. Yeah, I know, I know. I mean, 00:40:00.440 --> 00:40:03.630 that's such crap. Let's all give them a little 00:40:03.630 --> 00:40:06.750 golf clap for finally doing the right thing after, 00:40:06.849 --> 00:40:08.829 you know, we've known about this problem for 00:40:08.829 --> 00:40:10.630 years. We've known that these airbags have been 00:40:10.630 --> 00:40:13.309 sold on eBay for years. And now they're saying, 00:40:13.449 --> 00:40:16.489 oh, they had to, I mean, that sentence was just 00:40:16.489 --> 00:40:18.809 nonsense. They've known about this. They've been 00:40:18.809 --> 00:40:20.710 well aware of this problem for years. Right. 00:40:20.849 --> 00:40:22.610 Now I'm going to move on to a new segment called 00:40:22.610 --> 00:40:25.150 the worst person in the world. And this is the 00:40:25.150 --> 00:40:28.070 first inaugural worst person in the world award. 00:40:28.349 --> 00:40:30.949 And this is going to go to anyone guess? Anyone 00:40:30.949 --> 00:40:36.070 guess? Huh? Sean Duffy. There you go. Sean Duffy. 00:40:36.130 --> 00:40:39.409 There you go. He says, we quote, we are about 00:40:39.409 --> 00:40:41.889 to announce a common sense fuel economy standard 00:40:41.889 --> 00:40:44.610 because we want Detroit to build cars that Americans 00:40:44.610 --> 00:40:47.989 want to buy, not cars that Democrats want Washington 00:40:47.989 --> 00:40:51.070 to build. What the hell is he talking about? 00:40:51.190 --> 00:40:54.469 Well, what he's talking about is the fleet ride 00:40:54.469 --> 00:40:58.250 average. The cafe standard was supposed to be 00:40:58.250 --> 00:41:04.039 50 .4 miles per gallon by 2031. Which seems completely 00:41:04.039 --> 00:41:07.139 reasonable and we know it's totally doable. And 00:41:07.139 --> 00:41:09.219 instead he's like, yeah, let's drop that down 00:41:09.219 --> 00:41:13.380 to 34 .5 miles per gallon. Because he found a 00:41:13.380 --> 00:41:15.280 secret stash of oil somewhere. And he's like, 00:41:15.300 --> 00:41:17.780 this global warming thing's a myth. Yeah, that's 00:41:17.780 --> 00:41:21.579 the ticket. Well, it's right. The American entitlement 00:41:21.579 --> 00:41:23.659 is right there in this statement. We are about 00:41:23.659 --> 00:41:25.699 to announce a common sense fuel economy standard 00:41:25.699 --> 00:41:28.099 because we want Detroit to build cars that Americans 00:41:28.099 --> 00:41:30.699 want to buy. Right. Americans want to buy Japanese 00:41:30.699 --> 00:41:33.860 cars and Chinese cars. Americans want to buy. 00:41:33.860 --> 00:41:36.699 Yeah. Americans want to buy Chinese cars. That's. 00:41:36.699 --> 00:41:38.539 But Americans also want to buy cars that are 00:41:38.539 --> 00:41:41.719 terribly polluting, have terrible safety features, 00:41:41.860 --> 00:41:47.079 have significantly bad. automations on them that 00:41:47.079 --> 00:41:49.239 are that are probably I mean, what Americans 00:41:49.239 --> 00:41:52.719 want to buy is, you know, not going to correspond 00:41:52.719 --> 00:41:55.559 with what is the safest and the most efficient 00:41:55.559 --> 00:41:59.639 vehicles. So that's not where that's not what 00:41:59.639 --> 00:42:01.519 the director of the Department of Transportation 00:42:01.519 --> 00:42:04.380 should be saying. I mean, it's obviously clear 00:42:04.380 --> 00:42:09.710 that he is very politically. And he acts based 00:42:09.710 --> 00:42:11.969 on political things. We've seen, you know, we've 00:42:11.969 --> 00:42:14.130 covered Duffy and a lot of the things he's said 00:42:14.130 --> 00:42:18.710 for a while now. But, you know, this is not the 00:42:18.710 --> 00:42:20.429 thing that someone who is responsible for the 00:42:20.429 --> 00:42:22.869 safety of vehicles in America should be saying, 00:42:22.989 --> 00:42:26.090 in my opinion. We need to be selling Americans 00:42:26.090 --> 00:42:30.250 cars that are safe and have good fuel economy. 00:42:31.610 --> 00:42:34.090 that Americans want to buy, right? Yeah. It's 00:42:34.090 --> 00:42:35.909 not that hard to get around that. We don't want 00:42:35.909 --> 00:42:38.409 to destroy the fuel economy that we've built 00:42:38.409 --> 00:42:41.829 over the past, what is it, 50 years since CAFE 00:42:41.829 --> 00:42:44.090 came into play, which is essentially what the 00:42:44.090 --> 00:42:46.030 Trump administration has been dedicated to doing 00:42:46.030 --> 00:42:47.869 since they - We got to do something with all 00:42:47.869 --> 00:42:51.070 the oil we've just stolen from Venezuela. I mean, 00:42:51.090 --> 00:42:53.030 this is all, this is just drill, baby drill. 00:42:53.130 --> 00:42:55.349 This is the Department of Transportation pushing 00:42:55.349 --> 00:42:59.530 an energy agenda. Strange. But anyway, worst 00:42:59.530 --> 00:43:02.260 person in the world, John Duffy. I'm sure he'll 00:43:02.260 --> 00:43:04.059 make it again. I think there are many people 00:43:04.059 --> 00:43:05.780 ahead of him. Well, I mean, this is just once 00:43:05.780 --> 00:43:08.179 a week. I just made this segment up right now. 00:43:08.300 --> 00:43:11.559 Oh, well, then that works. We'll fill it up. 00:43:11.619 --> 00:43:14.400 Absolutely. Let's jump over to Singapore. Go 00:43:14.400 --> 00:43:16.219 to the. What? Oh, go to, you want me to go somewhere 00:43:16.219 --> 00:43:17.860 else? You want to go to the rear view camera, 00:43:17.880 --> 00:43:18.980 don't you? I just want to make sure you cover, 00:43:19.079 --> 00:43:21.780 no. Oh, good. Okay. What do you got? My favorite, 00:43:21.800 --> 00:43:23.599 one of my favorite ideas I've heard this year 00:43:23.599 --> 00:43:27.480 was the, is the red light system. Oh, yes. I 00:43:27.480 --> 00:43:29.659 love this one. This was fascinating. I love it. 00:43:29.719 --> 00:43:31.559 Okay. Let's jump to that. And then I got to, 00:43:31.579 --> 00:43:34.659 then I'll jump to Singapore. Okay. So I love 00:43:34.659 --> 00:43:36.920 this idea. This is from the AP. It's titled, 00:43:37.000 --> 00:43:38.880 some U .S. cities have begun rewarding careful 00:43:38.880 --> 00:43:42.960 drivers with fewer red lights. I'm quoting, this 00:43:42.960 --> 00:43:45.860 is, In Albuquerque, there's a lot of high -speed 00:43:45.860 --> 00:43:49.340 car crashes along residential streets. And so 00:43:49.340 --> 00:43:52.340 instead of just punishing the speeders, which 00:43:52.340 --> 00:43:55.260 hasn't made any difference, instead, quoting, 00:43:55.380 --> 00:43:57.440 the solution which the city credits for a dramatic 00:43:57.440 --> 00:44:00.179 drop in crashes and injury along one busy stretch 00:44:00.179 --> 00:44:02.880 of road is a relatively novel version of a long 00:44:02.880 --> 00:44:05.699 -standing traffic safety concept constantly known 00:44:05.699 --> 00:44:08.880 as rest in red, in which traffic signals default 00:44:08.880 --> 00:44:12.230 to red until a vehicle approaches. But Albuquerque 00:44:12.230 --> 00:44:14.710 and Portland, Oregon took it a step further by 00:44:14.710 --> 00:44:17.769 adding speed sensors that grant a much earlier 00:44:17.769 --> 00:44:20.309 green light to drivers traveling at or below 00:44:20.309 --> 00:44:25.610 the posted speed limit. How cool is that? It's 00:44:25.610 --> 00:44:28.289 so cool. I want it on every street light in America. 00:44:28.469 --> 00:44:32.230 I love that idea. Yeah, I think if we got that 00:44:32.230 --> 00:44:34.489 out, we would see. If we put that on every street 00:44:34.489 --> 00:44:36.510 light in America tomorrow, I think we would see 00:44:36.510 --> 00:44:41.070 noticeable. reductions in intersection crashes 00:44:41.070 --> 00:44:44.829 next year. I mean, it's no doubt here. Plus, 00:44:45.110 --> 00:44:48.769 not only that, you're rewarding good driving 00:44:48.769 --> 00:44:52.309 behavior here. People who aren't speeding are 00:44:52.309 --> 00:44:54.849 going to be getting to where they want to get 00:44:54.849 --> 00:44:57.250 to quicker than the speeders who will be stopped 00:44:57.250 --> 00:44:59.449 at all these lights before they turn green. See, 00:44:59.469 --> 00:45:01.329 I want to take it a step further and have it, 00:45:01.349 --> 00:45:03.230 you have the green and when you go through, you 00:45:03.230 --> 00:45:05.469 can open your sunroof and it'll drop donuts in. 00:45:06.199 --> 00:45:08.579 That would be, I mean, come on. Why don't you 00:45:08.579 --> 00:45:10.019 just drop them straight through the sunroof? 00:45:10.059 --> 00:45:11.440 Yeah, that's what I'm saying. Yeah, straight 00:45:11.440 --> 00:45:12.820 through the sunroof. You do that. I mean, straight 00:45:12.820 --> 00:45:15.519 through the sunroof. Oh, okay. Those are heavy 00:45:15.519 --> 00:45:18.400 donuts. Further in the article, they quote the, 00:45:18.500 --> 00:45:21.900 in Aragona, Oregon. Wow, Aragona. Huh. Oregon 00:45:21.900 --> 00:45:24.460 State University professor, who's the professor 00:45:24.460 --> 00:45:26.500 of transportation engineering, David Hurwitz, 00:45:26.579 --> 00:45:28.760 quoting, this choice that we're making to try 00:45:28.760 --> 00:45:30.440 and increase speed compliance seems like it's 00:45:30.440 --> 00:45:32.420 working really well. Seems like it has potential. 00:45:33.070 --> 00:45:34.989 He stressed that further research is needed to 00:45:34.989 --> 00:45:37.070 ensure these gains are not offset by more drivers 00:45:37.070 --> 00:45:38.530 running red lights or negative consequences. 00:45:38.730 --> 00:45:41.710 But right now, the early data shows that, hey, 00:45:41.730 --> 00:45:45.130 this is saving lives. This is helping with the 00:45:45.130 --> 00:45:47.869 problem of speeding. This is one of the best 00:45:47.869 --> 00:45:50.650 examples of outside -the -vehicle active intelligent 00:45:50.650 --> 00:45:53.110 speed assistance I've seen and something that 00:45:53.110 --> 00:45:55.969 municipalities can put into place, and we don't 00:45:55.969 --> 00:45:58.130 have to wait 20 years for the automakers to actually 00:45:58.130 --> 00:46:01.750 care. Yeah, very cool. I'm a fan. All right, 00:46:01.769 --> 00:46:04.590 now Singapore. So I didn't know this, but well, 00:46:04.670 --> 00:46:09.230 I know Singapore is this tiny little pseudo fascist 00:46:09.230 --> 00:46:13.019 island. It's about 35 by 17 in terms of miles, 00:46:13.139 --> 00:46:15.800 so it's very small. So buying a car there is 00:46:15.800 --> 00:46:18.059 ridiculously expensive. With this Wall Street 00:46:18.059 --> 00:46:20.320 Journal article quoting, a one -year -old BMW 00:46:20.320 --> 00:46:24.880 X5 SUV was on sale for the equivalent of $352 00:46:24.880 --> 00:46:29.360 ,000. The price for a new Yaris Cross, a small 00:46:29.360 --> 00:46:34.239 city SUV from Toyota, was $152 ,000. Even a seven 00:46:34.239 --> 00:46:37.300 -year -old BMW 4 Series Grand Coupe with 56 ,000 00:46:37.300 --> 00:46:40.320 miles on it cost nearly $70 ,000. For the past 00:46:40.320 --> 00:46:43.440 36 years, a firm cap on car ownership has kept 00:46:43.440 --> 00:46:45.559 Singapore largely free of the gridlock that marks 00:46:45.559 --> 00:46:49.139 life in every other South Asian metropolis. So 00:46:49.139 --> 00:46:51.679 Singapore has, okay, there's the car, but then 00:46:51.679 --> 00:46:54.280 you have to pay for the license to use it. It's 00:46:54.280 --> 00:46:56.860 like a medallion system, really, right? Yeah, 00:46:56.960 --> 00:46:59.159 and they limit the amount of these, and it's 00:46:59.159 --> 00:47:07.469 the Certificates of Entitlements. And the dealers 00:47:07.469 --> 00:47:09.489 have to say, hey, this is part of the cost. And 00:47:09.489 --> 00:47:12.730 that is super, super expensive, which is great. 00:47:12.789 --> 00:47:15.010 So Singapore has an amazing mass transit system. 00:47:15.429 --> 00:47:17.690 And so people are like, why do I need to drive? 00:47:17.809 --> 00:47:20.190 I've traveled throughout Southeast Asia. And 00:47:20.190 --> 00:47:22.070 sometimes on these roads, you're like, what is 00:47:22.070 --> 00:47:25.230 happening here? Because it's the traffic. It's 00:47:25.230 --> 00:47:26.789 almost like California where it starts going 00:47:26.789 --> 00:47:30.059 backwards at times. I mean, it's a great way 00:47:30.059 --> 00:47:32.460 to manage, you know, you have limited space, 00:47:32.800 --> 00:47:35.119 right? And you can only fit so many vehicles 00:47:35.119 --> 00:47:37.260 on the roads in the country. And I love that 00:47:37.260 --> 00:47:39.599 this, I mean, obviously this limits not just 00:47:39.599 --> 00:47:41.820 congestion, it limits road death, road usage, 00:47:42.059 --> 00:47:44.639 air pollution, a whole bunch of benefits. And 00:47:44.639 --> 00:47:46.860 it reminds me of an old Chris Rock joke where 00:47:46.860 --> 00:47:49.300 he's like, this is how we stop gun violence is 00:47:49.300 --> 00:47:51.739 you make guns free, but you charge a million 00:47:51.739 --> 00:47:55.250 dollars per bullet. So anytime someone shot a 00:47:55.250 --> 00:47:56.769 bullet, you'd find them digging it out of the 00:47:56.769 --> 00:47:58.489 person that they killed. I'm like, I got to get 00:47:58.489 --> 00:48:03.030 that back. So that's, I mean, cars, maybe it's 00:48:03.030 --> 00:48:05.690 not popular on this show, but cars driven by 00:48:05.690 --> 00:48:08.769 some people are like bullets. And then while 00:48:08.769 --> 00:48:11.730 this works on a, you know, a very small island, 00:48:11.809 --> 00:48:15.690 you know, there's. there's no chance the United 00:48:15.690 --> 00:48:17.949 States will ever adopt this. Well, as somebody 00:48:17.949 --> 00:48:20.309 who lives on a very small island, if they put 00:48:20.309 --> 00:48:22.070 this massive charge in there. I wonder if they 00:48:22.070 --> 00:48:24.349 could do that in New York, right? Or places where 00:48:24.349 --> 00:48:27.469 there are too many cars. I mean, congestion pricing 00:48:27.469 --> 00:48:30.550 has done a massive increase to New York. It's 00:48:30.550 --> 00:48:33.230 been really a huge positive. Even the governors 00:48:33.230 --> 00:48:34.949 of New Jersey are no longer complaining about 00:48:34.949 --> 00:48:37.449 it. So that's going to be really good. And if 00:48:37.449 --> 00:48:39.130 they did something like that and use that money 00:48:39.130 --> 00:48:42.829 to clean up the... An ancient subway system with 00:48:42.829 --> 00:48:46.949 routers and switches from 1904. That would be 00:48:46.949 --> 00:48:50.230 great. You don't like the Wi -Fi down there? 00:48:50.329 --> 00:48:52.210 There's no Wi -Fi down there. What are you talking 00:48:52.210 --> 00:48:54.150 about? I don't like the fact that the train just 00:48:54.150 --> 00:48:58.289 stops because we found a crack. Like, what? It's 00:48:58.289 --> 00:49:00.090 the preventative maintenance, people. But that's 00:49:00.090 --> 00:49:01.989 not what this show is about. Not about my complaints. 00:49:02.309 --> 00:49:04.289 It could be worse. You could be D .C. and buy 00:49:04.289 --> 00:49:07.590 trains that are too heavy for the tracks. Speaking 00:49:07.590 --> 00:49:10.090 of too heavy for the tracks, let's go into recalls. 00:49:10.510 --> 00:49:15.670 Let's do it. First up, Chrysler, 844 ,027 vehicles, 00:49:15.769 --> 00:49:20.349 the 26 -27 Dodge Charger, 26 Ram ProMaster EV. 00:49:21.309 --> 00:49:24.750 All right. And the Jeep Grand Cherokee, Jeep 00:49:24.750 --> 00:49:28.750 Gladiator, Jeep Wrangler, Jeep Compass, Ram 2500. 00:49:28.849 --> 00:49:33.309 Oh, my word. Keeps going. Pages and pages. Cherokees. 00:49:33.349 --> 00:49:36.670 If you own a Chrysler Pacifica plug -in hybrid, 00:49:36.889 --> 00:49:41.039 Chrysler Voyager, oh, boy. This is virtually 00:49:41.039 --> 00:49:44.699 every Chrysler car built last year. This is how 00:49:44.699 --> 00:49:47.420 you're going to start me off. Okay. The suspect 00:49:47.420 --> 00:49:51.619 radio software may prevent the rear view image 00:49:51.619 --> 00:49:54.559 from displaying in a backing event. Oh, look, 00:49:54.559 --> 00:49:57.360 infotainment and safety colliding all again. 00:49:57.639 --> 00:50:00.599 I love how it's described as the suspect radio 00:50:00.599 --> 00:50:07.230 software. One, who's using the radio? uh yeah 00:50:07.230 --> 00:50:09.869 so the the radio software is messing up the rear 00:50:09.869 --> 00:50:15.449 view camera oh i mean i know phil copeland can 00:50:15.449 --> 00:50:17.909 explain to me how hard this is i just don't care 00:50:17.909 --> 00:50:21.989 i don't care i just fix the shit these are these 00:50:21.989 --> 00:50:25.750 are 2026 vehicles they're new last year's vehicles 00:50:25.750 --> 00:50:29.730 already having these problems um they i don't 00:50:29.730 --> 00:50:31.670 see any evidence that this problem is slowing 00:50:31.670 --> 00:50:34.429 down i think that Rearview camera recalls made 00:50:34.429 --> 00:50:36.710 up, what was it, like 15 %? Somewhere around 00:50:36.710 --> 00:50:41.710 there. An outsized portion of overall recalls 00:50:41.710 --> 00:50:44.210 last year and are affecting millions of vehicles 00:50:44.210 --> 00:50:49.130 across virtually every manufacturer. And at this 00:50:49.130 --> 00:50:51.250 point, it doesn't look like solutions have been 00:50:51.250 --> 00:50:54.190 implemented at Chrysler and anywhere else for 00:50:54.190 --> 00:50:56.389 that matter. But we'll continue monitoring them. 00:50:56.969 --> 00:50:59.409 Owners should get a quick fix. Looks like... 00:50:59.940 --> 00:51:01.860 They've already started fixing these vehicles. 00:51:02.039 --> 00:51:06.599 Oh, that's good. Next up, Kia, 21 ,290 vehicles, 00:51:06.639 --> 00:51:12.380 the 25 to 26 Kia EV9. Increased risk to a child 00:51:12.380 --> 00:51:14.800 in a CRS in the event of a crash due to deployment 00:51:14.800 --> 00:51:17.920 of the front passenger airbag. Oh, there was 00:51:17.920 --> 00:51:19.739 somebody we had similar with this. A couple weeks 00:51:19.739 --> 00:51:22.559 ago. I think it may have been Hyundai. It was 00:51:22.559 --> 00:51:25.460 Hyundai, yeah. It was improper routing of the 00:51:25.460 --> 00:51:28.239 ODS matte bladder tube. So basically, this is 00:51:28.239 --> 00:51:30.320 the... pressure sensor that figures out how much 00:51:30.320 --> 00:51:32.500 something weighs in that front seat to turn on 00:51:32.500 --> 00:51:34.880 or off the airbag. And I guess they got a kink 00:51:34.880 --> 00:51:37.639 in it or something. Yeah, this is not a good 00:51:37.639 --> 00:51:41.900 one. What's the remedy? October 20th is the date 00:51:41.900 --> 00:51:44.239 you'll be getting a fix for that. They're going 00:51:44.239 --> 00:51:47.840 to properly route your ODS mat bladder tube. 00:51:48.059 --> 00:51:50.519 My mat bladder tube, I haven't found it. I don't 00:51:50.519 --> 00:51:52.980 know what's going on. Well, go see your proctologist 00:51:52.980 --> 00:51:56.820 and they'll help you out. Next up, Britax Child 00:51:56.820 --> 00:52:05.650 Safety. Inc. 114 ,660 things. The Bratax BeSafe 00:52:05.650 --> 00:52:08.190 Gen 2 FlexFit Plus. Yeah, don't go through that. 00:52:08.349 --> 00:52:10.670 This is worse than Mercedes. Oh, man. These are 00:52:10.670 --> 00:52:13.670 rear -facing infant seats, and there's pages 00:52:13.670 --> 00:52:15.730 and pages of different model numbers. And so 00:52:15.730 --> 00:52:18.690 this is an interesting one because this is not 00:52:18.690 --> 00:52:23.239 a crash or vehicle safety -related issue. I think, 00:52:23.280 --> 00:52:25.239 I don't know, I may be kind of talking out my 00:52:25.239 --> 00:52:27.980 ass here, but I think this Consumer Product Safety 00:52:27.980 --> 00:52:31.119 Commission has some jurisdiction in this area. 00:52:31.159 --> 00:52:34.159 I don't see that mentioned in the 573, but this 00:52:34.159 --> 00:52:37.599 is the handle. So this is people are carrying 00:52:37.599 --> 00:52:39.340 their baby around in the car seat, holding the 00:52:39.340 --> 00:52:41.900 handle and the handle breaks off because one 00:52:41.900 --> 00:52:46.239 of the screws is bad. So interesting recall from 00:52:46.239 --> 00:52:49.800 that perspective. Yeah, it's weird. It says after 00:52:49.800 --> 00:52:52.739 receiving consumer complaints, they've, uh, protects 00:52:52.739 --> 00:52:55.300 investigative field and warranty reports. And 00:52:55.300 --> 00:52:57.599 it says, based on this analysis and attrition 00:52:57.599 --> 00:52:59.820 model, assessing car seats and further information 00:52:59.820 --> 00:53:02.599 about complaints about the, uh, and the car seat, 00:53:02.679 --> 00:53:05.239 they developed this recall population. I don't 00:53:05.239 --> 00:53:07.260 really know what that means based on analysis 00:53:07.260 --> 00:53:11.159 and attrition model. Um, but you're telling me 00:53:11.159 --> 00:53:14.559 that handles breaking off. Yeah. My hand was 00:53:14.559 --> 00:53:16.539 breaking off because the screw is failing. Oh 00:53:16.539 --> 00:53:19.599 man. Oh, this is, this is the world. This is 00:53:19.599 --> 00:53:22.539 the longest recall I've ever seen. This is crazy. 00:53:22.559 --> 00:53:26.400 They're developing a repair kit. And I guess 00:53:26.400 --> 00:53:28.980 the, and they no longer make these products. 00:53:29.619 --> 00:53:32.739 It says affected products are no longer in production. 00:53:33.420 --> 00:53:37.139 Okay. Well, that's something. So if you have, 00:53:37.179 --> 00:53:39.400 we don't do many car seats through that one in 00:53:39.400 --> 00:53:41.400 there. Yeah. That's a pretty big recall. Yeah. 00:53:41.440 --> 00:53:45.110 Duct tape people just duct tape your baby. Next 00:53:45.110 --> 00:53:49.469 up, Lucid. It's been a while, Lucid. Yeah, it's 00:53:49.469 --> 00:53:52.769 27 ,185 vehicles, which I'm going to guess is 00:53:52.769 --> 00:53:56.010 every vehicle they've ever produced. That's close. 00:53:56.230 --> 00:54:01.289 22 to 2026, Lucid Air. Insufficient low voltage 00:54:01.289 --> 00:54:04.170 overcurrent protection can lead to circuit overheating, 00:54:04.190 --> 00:54:06.329 which can result in smoke or fire, increasing 00:54:06.329 --> 00:54:09.269 the risk of injury. Affected exterior lighting 00:54:09.269 --> 00:54:11.570 may also malfunction, which increase the risk 00:54:11.570 --> 00:54:14.820 of crash. By affected exterior lighting, do they 00:54:14.820 --> 00:54:17.019 mean your headlights? Or do they mean like some 00:54:17.019 --> 00:54:21.559 sort of ground effect lights? They do not specify. 00:54:22.519 --> 00:54:25.039 Some of those things look like spaceships. They've 00:54:25.039 --> 00:54:28.960 probably got lights everywhere. Yeah. But this 00:54:28.960 --> 00:54:31.960 is a park outside. Park outside. If you own a 00:54:31.960 --> 00:54:35.800 Lucid, do not park it in your... giant garage 00:54:35.800 --> 00:54:38.019 and your giant house. Right, because I'm thinking 00:54:38.019 --> 00:54:40.760 you spent over $100 ,000 on this vehicle. Yeah, 00:54:40.880 --> 00:54:44.639 they are not cheap. And not good. We talked about 00:54:44.639 --> 00:54:46.099 them a lot. Remember, they were the vehicles 00:54:46.099 --> 00:54:49.340 that were going into turtle mode. Right. And 00:54:49.340 --> 00:54:52.820 a lot of battery problems. When I first saw this, 00:54:52.860 --> 00:54:54.519 I assumed it would be a battery problem, but 00:54:54.519 --> 00:54:57.320 it doesn't appear to be directly a battery problem, 00:54:57.400 --> 00:55:00.380 even though it's electric. Next up, the final 00:55:00.380 --> 00:55:03.219 recall of the week, the heavyweight champion. 00:55:03.929 --> 00:55:08.489 The greatest company in the world. Ford. 184 00:55:08.489 --> 00:55:14.409 ,663 vehicles. 24 to 26 Mustang. A loss of motive 00:55:14.409 --> 00:55:16.190 power while driving increases the risk of crash. 00:55:16.489 --> 00:55:18.909 Yes, that is true. This is something to do with 00:55:18.909 --> 00:55:20.809 their windshield wiping and washing systems and 00:55:20.809 --> 00:55:24.289 lamps. An operable headlamp may reduce the driver's 00:55:24.289 --> 00:55:25.929 visibility and make the vehicle less visible 00:55:25.929 --> 00:55:27.730 to other drivers. Oh, so your headlamps don't 00:55:27.730 --> 00:55:31.989 work. And an inoperable windshield washing system 00:55:31.989 --> 00:55:34.309 increases the risk of crash. So, okay, so your 00:55:34.309 --> 00:55:36.369 headlights go out and you can't clean your windshield. 00:55:36.489 --> 00:55:39.150 You can also lose motive power installed on the 00:55:39.150 --> 00:55:40.730 road. So that should probably be the headliner 00:55:40.730 --> 00:55:46.489 there. But, you know, what do you have to say 00:55:46.489 --> 00:55:48.130 here? I don't know. They're not going to have 00:55:48.130 --> 00:55:52.969 a remedy until March of 2027, folks. So if you 00:55:52.969 --> 00:55:55.230 own one of these Mustangs, that's any of them 00:55:55.230 --> 00:55:59.409 produced from 2024 to 20... It looks like what 00:55:59.409 --> 00:56:00.969 they're going to be waiting for quite some time. 00:56:01.090 --> 00:56:03.409 Yeah. This is a park outside Jim Farley's house 00:56:03.409 --> 00:56:06.250 notice. So yeah. And it's, you know, these park 00:56:06.250 --> 00:56:08.289 outside, you know, if you own a Mustang and you 00:56:08.289 --> 00:56:10.250 live in an apartment complex that doesn't allow 00:56:10.250 --> 00:56:12.889 you to park vehicles in your garage, if it's 00:56:12.889 --> 00:56:15.269 parked outside, you're, you're screwed. This 00:56:15.269 --> 00:56:17.130 is not a park outside. I was just saying people 00:56:17.130 --> 00:56:18.690 should take it to Jim Farley's house and park 00:56:18.690 --> 00:56:21.630 it on his lawn. Okay. Yeah. I think just park 00:56:21.630 --> 00:56:24.550 it on his lawn. There's no fire here. Sorry, 00:56:24.610 --> 00:56:26.849 I'm totally blue. I was confusing the last one 00:56:26.849 --> 00:56:29.949 with Lucid, but I think it was heat shrink that 00:56:29.949 --> 00:56:36.710 got me on this one. What is heat shrink? It's 00:56:36.710 --> 00:56:39.989 plastic that shrinks when you heat it. That's 00:56:39.989 --> 00:56:42.730 what I thought, but it says heat shrink. They 00:56:42.730 --> 00:56:46.409 use it on wires, for example, to make a wire 00:56:46.409 --> 00:56:54.000 bundle. So heat shrink is hot and it shrinks. 00:56:54.260 --> 00:56:57.500 George Costanza stuff here. Here we go. Well, 00:56:57.539 --> 00:57:00.039 it's a weird one. Apparently some component that's 00:57:00.039 --> 00:57:03.519 in the heat shrink material is incompatible with 00:57:03.519 --> 00:57:08.420 the junction block that has a lot of things screwed 00:57:08.420 --> 00:57:11.059 into it and causes it to fatigue or wear out. 00:57:11.159 --> 00:57:15.250 That's a weird one. Yeah. Well. I mean, how many 00:57:15.250 --> 00:57:17.750 recalls we up to for Ford now? Number of vehicles? 00:57:17.849 --> 00:57:20.170 Millions this year. And we're only, we've just 00:57:20.170 --> 00:57:23.690 started September. Yeah. I mean, they're clearly 00:57:23.690 --> 00:57:26.469 going to win the recall contest. Oh, man. This 00:57:26.469 --> 00:57:29.190 year. I'm interested to see how those numbers 00:57:29.190 --> 00:57:31.489 decline when they're out of this monitoring period 00:57:31.489 --> 00:57:35.170 with NHTSA. We have nothing to recall. No, they'll 00:57:35.170 --> 00:57:38.809 say quality is job one. Right. Exactly. Quality 00:57:38.809 --> 00:57:42.230 is job one. But you should have seen the other 00:57:42.230 --> 00:57:46.030 items that were on that list. Anyway, hey, thanks, 00:57:46.110 --> 00:57:49.489 listeners. Always a pleasure. We'll be back next 00:57:49.489 --> 00:57:54.130 week. And until then, bye -bye. Bye -bye. Hey, 00:57:55.010 --> 00:57:58.610 Michael said goodbye this time. Sweet. For more 00:57:58.610 --> 00:58:02.210 information, visit www .autosafety .org.