1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:08,400 From the time that they pronounced me deaf was a good 45 minutes. 2 00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:13,440 They cut my clothes and then they paddled my heart, my heart had stopped. 3 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:18,120 And I could see people screaming and crying, but I didn't realize that was actually my 4 00:00:18,120 --> 00:00:21,320 physical body because I was somewhere else. 5 00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:27,400 The only thing that I could feel, if you could imagine, absolute love and peace, there wasn't 6 00:00:27,400 --> 00:00:29,400 anything else to be felt. 7 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:32,520 I was greeted by people I'd known in the past. 8 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:34,160 I'm back home again. 9 00:00:34,160 --> 00:00:39,040 Incredibly safe and felt at home. 10 00:00:39,040 --> 00:00:43,640 Welcome, welcome to Round Trip Death everybody and I'd like to welcome our special guest 11 00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:48,600 today who is going to go by his nickname to stay a little bit anonymous. 12 00:00:48,600 --> 00:00:51,480 Shabby, good morning, how are you? 13 00:00:51,480 --> 00:00:53,800 I am fine, how about you guys? 14 00:00:53,800 --> 00:00:56,120 Ah, we're doing great here. 15 00:00:56,120 --> 00:00:58,840 Nobody that's listening has ever met you. 16 00:00:58,840 --> 00:01:04,200 I know you live down in Canab, Utah and I'd like our listeners to get to know you a little 17 00:01:04,200 --> 00:01:05,200 bit. 18 00:01:05,200 --> 00:01:07,360 What is Canab like? 19 00:01:07,360 --> 00:01:12,800 Because when I envision it, I envision the old John Wayne Western movies. 20 00:01:12,800 --> 00:01:14,280 That's part of it. 21 00:01:14,280 --> 00:01:17,720 That scenery is a lot what it looks like in that area, isn't it? 22 00:01:17,720 --> 00:01:19,160 Yeah, it is. 23 00:01:19,160 --> 00:01:25,240 There's two movies that's here in town that have been abandoned years ago. 24 00:01:25,240 --> 00:01:30,120 There's more of a tourist town than anything else, about 5,000 people live here. 25 00:01:30,120 --> 00:01:32,360 Almost everybody knows everybody. 26 00:01:32,360 --> 00:01:34,880 Very beautiful little community to live in. 27 00:01:34,880 --> 00:01:36,880 You're how far from Lake Powell? 28 00:01:36,880 --> 00:01:41,720 I am an hour from Lake Powell, an hour west of Lake Powell. 29 00:01:41,720 --> 00:01:45,960 Well anyway, it's good to see you this morning and I think people are going to be really 30 00:01:45,960 --> 00:01:48,320 interested in your story. 31 00:01:48,320 --> 00:01:53,640 I appreciate you trusting us enough to share with us. 32 00:01:53,640 --> 00:01:59,240 I know you have not shared it much, which is why we're keeping you anonymous. 33 00:01:59,240 --> 00:02:00,840 I love your nickname, Shabby. 34 00:02:00,840 --> 00:02:01,840 What does that mean? 35 00:02:01,840 --> 00:02:06,640 It means the great bear or grizzly bear in Cherokee. 36 00:02:06,640 --> 00:02:09,640 My grandfather was a Native American. 37 00:02:09,640 --> 00:02:14,040 I grew up with him and that influenced and he taught me the language and the culture 38 00:02:14,040 --> 00:02:18,160 and all the stuff that goes with that. 39 00:02:18,160 --> 00:02:22,600 You have been through some very difficult things in your life. 40 00:02:22,600 --> 00:02:27,000 We won't dwell on those too much, but you've had multiple near-death experiences and that's 41 00:02:27,000 --> 00:02:29,400 what we're going to be talking about. 42 00:02:29,400 --> 00:02:33,200 I'm not even sure where to start because your first one, I believe, was when you were four 43 00:02:33,200 --> 00:02:35,840 years old. 44 00:02:35,840 --> 00:02:40,000 Tell me about the one that stands out to you the most. 45 00:02:40,000 --> 00:02:46,960 If I said, Shabby, I know you've had a lot of experiences, but what one is the most memorable 46 00:02:46,960 --> 00:02:49,760 or you learn the most from? 47 00:02:49,760 --> 00:02:51,160 Let's start there. 48 00:02:51,160 --> 00:02:52,800 When did that happen? 49 00:02:52,800 --> 00:02:56,880 Two, but they're kind of equal in importance. 50 00:02:56,880 --> 00:03:05,800 The one where I was taught the most, I think, was when I was six years old. 51 00:03:05,800 --> 00:03:10,000 I was brutally raped by two women who were trying to get evil with my father, who was 52 00:03:10,000 --> 00:03:14,080 a very evil man by every definition of the word. 53 00:03:14,080 --> 00:03:20,400 I thought by her to me, they were her family and they proceeded to do some really nasty 54 00:03:20,400 --> 00:03:21,960 things to me. 55 00:03:21,960 --> 00:03:31,200 I was in the hospital for about two months and I had 220 plus stitches to put me back 56 00:03:31,200 --> 00:03:32,200 together. 57 00:03:32,200 --> 00:03:37,560 During the surgery to put me back together, I died twice, one time for a little over eight 58 00:03:37,560 --> 00:03:43,600 minutes and the second time was a little over six minutes. 59 00:03:43,600 --> 00:03:49,640 A lot of people have a lot of ideas that I'm not quite so sure they are having that they 60 00:03:49,640 --> 00:03:53,280 understand about what actually happens. 61 00:03:53,280 --> 00:03:56,160 For me, it was a very beautiful experience. 62 00:03:56,160 --> 00:04:00,280 It was a life-changing experience because it confirmed some of the things that my grandfather 63 00:04:00,280 --> 00:04:05,040 taught me when I was a little, I mean, when I was about four years old, he started teaching 64 00:04:05,040 --> 00:04:07,320 me. 65 00:04:07,320 --> 00:04:14,000 One thing I was taught as a child by my grandfather and my mother, my dad, we won't get there, 66 00:04:14,000 --> 00:04:19,560 because I have absolute faith in Jesus Christ that he would answer all of our questions 67 00:04:19,560 --> 00:04:25,880 and that he loved us unconditionally, that if we didn't doubt him, that he would come 68 00:04:25,880 --> 00:04:27,320 to us when we need him. 69 00:04:27,320 --> 00:04:34,200 That happened in the first NDE, the first major NDE that I had. 70 00:04:34,200 --> 00:04:37,920 If you don't mind, I want to get into the details of that. 71 00:04:37,920 --> 00:04:44,240 Tell me, lots of people say they went through a tunnel to some other place. 72 00:04:44,240 --> 00:04:47,960 Some people are in the hospital and see their body and what's going on. 73 00:04:47,960 --> 00:04:51,720 What first happened that you remember? 74 00:04:51,720 --> 00:04:56,040 The first thing that happened was I felt my heart quit beating and then I was looking 75 00:04:56,040 --> 00:05:03,680 at my body and then a messenger to this day, I don't know who it was, came to me and said, 76 00:05:03,680 --> 00:05:06,640 and asked me to follow him. 77 00:05:06,640 --> 00:05:11,040 He took me up the staircase, it was very well lit. 78 00:05:11,040 --> 00:05:15,360 There was an angel standing at the top of it, most of whom he needed to come forward. 79 00:05:15,360 --> 00:05:21,200 This messenger was holding my hand and walking with me and he told me not to be afraid and 80 00:05:21,200 --> 00:05:26,400 that it was all good, but this is going to be a short little visit. 81 00:05:26,400 --> 00:05:30,080 Their definition of visit was a lot different than ours. 82 00:05:30,080 --> 00:05:35,480 As I walked up the staircase, it was bright, it was blue and white and absolutely beautiful 83 00:05:35,480 --> 00:05:37,720 in every sense of the word. 84 00:05:37,720 --> 00:05:43,600 When I got to the top of the staircase, I was taken by this messenger at the top into 85 00:05:43,600 --> 00:05:46,480 a room and I was just told to wait. 86 00:05:46,480 --> 00:05:51,920 The room had a big white sofa sitting there, at least it looked like a sofa. 87 00:05:51,920 --> 00:05:56,800 It had two curled ends on either end of it and I was asked to sit. 88 00:05:56,800 --> 00:06:01,200 I was also greeted by a bunch of other people as they were passing by and each of them took 89 00:06:01,200 --> 00:06:08,720 time to welcome me and to ask me who I was as if they didn't know, but then they did 90 00:06:08,720 --> 00:06:13,880 and then they would call me by my Indian name, which was pretty interesting because I had 91 00:06:13,880 --> 00:06:16,040 never shared that name with anybody to that point. 92 00:06:16,040 --> 00:06:19,160 I had very few people today even know it. 93 00:06:19,160 --> 00:06:22,400 I was asked to sit down and that somebody would come and visit with me. 94 00:06:22,400 --> 00:06:27,680 I was introduced to a lady who said that she would be my guide and she would answer my 95 00:06:27,680 --> 00:06:31,200 questions that various people were going to come and talk to me. 96 00:06:31,200 --> 00:06:36,680 She says, one you already know, but you've never met him, at least not in this life. 97 00:06:36,680 --> 00:06:39,320 I thought that was interesting. 98 00:06:39,320 --> 00:06:43,200 While sitting there waiting, which seemed like forever, even though it was just a few 99 00:06:43,200 --> 00:06:45,800 seconds, I was only six years old. 100 00:06:45,800 --> 00:06:50,040 I was told to look at a monitor that was at one end of the sofa and I was told that if 101 00:06:50,040 --> 00:06:55,640 I had any questions at all, I could ask the monitor and if I had faith, it would respond 102 00:06:55,640 --> 00:06:58,720 and show me whatever I asked for. 103 00:06:58,720 --> 00:07:02,000 And being young and innocent, I wanted to know if I was alive or dead, if I was going 104 00:07:02,000 --> 00:07:05,440 to live or if I was going to stay there. 105 00:07:05,440 --> 00:07:07,480 And it showed me my life. 106 00:07:07,480 --> 00:07:08,980 We're up to that point. 107 00:07:08,980 --> 00:07:15,800 I was shown the first surgery that I had and why I survived it and how I was born and 108 00:07:15,800 --> 00:07:17,200 who the doctors were. 109 00:07:17,200 --> 00:07:21,960 I was shown my mother with what she was wearing the day she brought me home because I was 110 00:07:21,960 --> 00:07:24,160 curious about us. 111 00:07:24,160 --> 00:07:28,240 I was just a little boy, really innocent. 112 00:07:28,240 --> 00:07:35,800 Then she asked me another question, which was still stages of smear to this day is, do 113 00:07:35,800 --> 00:07:39,640 you really love Jesus Christ and would you like to meet him? 114 00:07:39,640 --> 00:07:45,840 Having read the Bible with my grandfather many times, of course I said yes. 115 00:07:45,840 --> 00:07:48,280 Just wait a few minutes or wait a little while. 116 00:07:48,280 --> 00:07:51,480 So she said, wait just a little bit and he will be right here. 117 00:07:51,480 --> 00:07:55,200 He came and called me by a name from the Church. 118 00:07:55,200 --> 00:08:01,360 He called me by this new name, which I didn't know anything about until many, many years 119 00:08:01,360 --> 00:08:02,360 later. 120 00:08:02,360 --> 00:08:07,680 He said he had a message for me and that I could ask him anything I wanted and he would 121 00:08:07,680 --> 00:08:11,880 answer if he thought it was important for me to know. 122 00:08:11,880 --> 00:08:17,320 I asked him, have I done anything wrong and what would my life be? 123 00:08:17,320 --> 00:08:22,360 Once he mad at me, which is why I was dead and he said he wasn't mad at me and that 124 00:08:22,360 --> 00:08:27,880 he loved me and he smiled at me and just the most beautiful smile that anyone I've ever 125 00:08:27,880 --> 00:08:29,880 seen has ever given. 126 00:08:29,880 --> 00:08:35,680 He put the signs around me and I could feel him and he said the reason you're going through 127 00:08:35,680 --> 00:08:40,760 this trial is that for where great blessings are given, much is required. 128 00:08:40,760 --> 00:08:45,560 I asked him if I was going to be blessed and he said yes and he said that I would be tested 129 00:08:45,560 --> 00:08:47,480 heavy throughout my life. 130 00:08:47,480 --> 00:08:52,120 He said that there would be more to come at another time and that he wasn't finished 131 00:08:52,120 --> 00:08:56,880 talking to me and that he had more information to share with me at some future date. 132 00:08:56,880 --> 00:09:03,400 I was then at that point brought back to my body for just a few minutes while the doctor 133 00:09:03,400 --> 00:09:07,640 swore at me and I kept hearing one doctor saying I can't give up, I can't give up, 134 00:09:07,640 --> 00:09:09,840 I can't quit on him. 135 00:09:09,840 --> 00:09:15,040 At that point in time I was brought back again to the staircase and brought him to another 136 00:09:15,040 --> 00:09:19,840 bedroom and I was instructed about a few things that would happen in my life and the 137 00:09:19,840 --> 00:09:24,240 people that I would meet and that I was to prepare myself by studying the scriptures 138 00:09:24,240 --> 00:09:29,960 and staying faithful and then I said to the messenger, well I'm going to screw up life, 139 00:09:29,960 --> 00:09:35,120 I'm going to make a lot of mistakes and then I learned about the atonement, what that was 140 00:09:35,120 --> 00:09:40,080 all about and why Jesus died for us. 141 00:09:40,080 --> 00:09:43,320 A lot of people have a lot of different ideas about it. 142 00:09:43,320 --> 00:09:48,880 He said this messenger and she was my guardian angel, she's been with me my entire life. 143 00:09:48,880 --> 00:09:55,160 In fact I just saw her a couple days ago and that's a different discussion. 144 00:09:55,160 --> 00:10:01,920 But I was told that as I went through my life that certain people would try to influence 145 00:10:01,920 --> 00:10:06,520 me and change me and that I was to not let them and that I was always to stay close to 146 00:10:06,520 --> 00:10:08,520 the Lord by reading the scriptures. 147 00:10:08,520 --> 00:10:13,720 I was also told to learn everything I could about Jesus, not from people but by prayer 148 00:10:13,720 --> 00:10:14,720 and faith. 149 00:10:14,720 --> 00:10:19,880 Wow, let me just take a breath here before I ask you a hundred questions. 150 00:10:19,880 --> 00:10:25,440 That is really cool and amazing and must have helped you through your recovery after that 151 00:10:25,440 --> 00:10:29,080 because you remembered all this as soon as you woke up, right? 152 00:10:29,080 --> 00:10:34,440 That was a question I was asked if I wanted to remember this or not and I said yes. 153 00:10:34,440 --> 00:10:39,480 I was asked if I wanted to remember and I told him I wanted to remember because I didn't 154 00:10:39,480 --> 00:10:40,960 want to forget Jesus. 155 00:10:40,960 --> 00:10:41,960 Yeah. 156 00:10:41,960 --> 00:10:43,600 Did you see any other things? 157 00:10:43,600 --> 00:10:45,440 Were you just in this room the whole time? 158 00:10:45,440 --> 00:10:48,240 There were a lot of people in the room. 159 00:10:48,240 --> 00:10:53,680 I saw my great grandfather and he came and told me that he would be with me as well as 160 00:10:53,680 --> 00:10:55,080 other people. 161 00:10:55,080 --> 00:10:58,960 I asked about the prophets in the Bible if they were real. 162 00:10:58,960 --> 00:11:03,040 Several of them came forward and told me they were and said they were where are folks 163 00:11:03,040 --> 00:11:08,720 going on and that I had to finish in this life which is why I wasn't going to die but 164 00:11:08,720 --> 00:11:13,040 I had to be there to get some understanding that would prepare me for the time when that 165 00:11:13,040 --> 00:11:14,040 came. 166 00:11:14,040 --> 00:11:18,800 There have been a lot of those things that have been fulfilled and some even recently. 167 00:11:18,800 --> 00:11:21,920 Those are amazing questions for a six-year-old. 168 00:11:21,920 --> 00:11:29,840 Do you think maybe once you were in that place your brain was functioning more like an adult? 169 00:11:29,840 --> 00:11:32,080 Does that make sense? 170 00:11:32,080 --> 00:11:34,960 I don't know if that's true or not. 171 00:11:34,960 --> 00:11:38,520 My grandfather taught me and I was about five years old when he said this. 172 00:11:38,520 --> 00:11:41,600 He says if someone can build a house, you can build a house. 173 00:11:41,600 --> 00:11:44,000 If someone can build a car, you build a car. 174 00:11:44,000 --> 00:11:47,720 He says the only limits you have are the ones you allow others to place upon you. 175 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:51,000 And then he said we were reading about Einstein. 176 00:11:51,000 --> 00:11:54,280 He said Albert Einstein couldn't tie his shoes. 177 00:11:54,280 --> 00:11:58,160 He was using between 25 and 27% of his brain solvability. 178 00:11:58,160 --> 00:12:01,880 He says what if you tapped into 28 or 29 or 30? 179 00:12:01,880 --> 00:12:03,880 What could you do? 180 00:12:03,880 --> 00:12:04,880 And that stuck with me. 181 00:12:04,880 --> 00:12:09,120 And then he challenged me to read as many books as I could. 182 00:12:09,120 --> 00:12:12,800 He taught me to read by reading the Bible and he says if I could match the words in 183 00:12:12,800 --> 00:12:15,960 that book, nothing in life would be too difficult. 184 00:12:15,960 --> 00:12:20,400 And so I had that understanding that if I asked the right question, I would get the right 185 00:12:20,400 --> 00:12:21,400 answer. 186 00:12:21,400 --> 00:12:27,520 And so I was thinking when I was sitting there, it's like if I'm allowed to ask anything, 187 00:12:27,520 --> 00:12:29,680 what I want to know. 188 00:12:29,680 --> 00:12:35,520 And I was innocent, but I wanted to know what my purpose in life was and who was I really. 189 00:12:35,520 --> 00:12:37,560 And I asked Jesus, who am I? 190 00:12:37,560 --> 00:12:40,760 And he says I was his son. 191 00:12:40,760 --> 00:12:42,760 But he loved me. 192 00:12:42,760 --> 00:12:45,320 And then explained the atonement to me. 193 00:12:45,320 --> 00:12:49,280 And very few people I think understand what the atonement is and how deep it is and how 194 00:12:49,280 --> 00:12:51,280 vast it is. 195 00:12:51,280 --> 00:12:56,320 It's a very simple principle, but it has a lot of different parts to it. 196 00:12:56,320 --> 00:13:00,320 As I listened, I remembered everything and he asked me to obey him. 197 00:13:00,320 --> 00:13:02,320 And I said, well, what if I screw up? 198 00:13:02,320 --> 00:13:03,320 I'm a little kid. 199 00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:06,480 I'd already made a lot of mistakes because I was just an adult. 200 00:13:06,480 --> 00:13:09,480 I was always outside and always involved in things. 201 00:13:09,480 --> 00:13:11,520 I said, what if I screw it up? 202 00:13:11,520 --> 00:13:14,760 And he said, come and ask me to forgive you. 203 00:13:14,760 --> 00:13:15,760 And I will. 204 00:13:15,760 --> 00:13:19,480 And he said, now it's time for me to come back. 205 00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:21,120 And that was after the second time. 206 00:13:21,120 --> 00:13:23,160 I said, it was time for me to come back. 207 00:13:23,160 --> 00:13:28,640 But that he had other messages to share with me, but I wasn't ready at that point to hear 208 00:13:28,640 --> 00:13:29,640 them. 209 00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:35,240 I needed more understanding of life and people before he could share those things with me. 210 00:13:35,240 --> 00:13:36,520 Wow, that's amazing. 211 00:13:36,520 --> 00:13:38,680 Thank you for sharing all of that. 212 00:13:38,680 --> 00:13:43,160 I imagine you remembered in your mind what he looked like. 213 00:13:43,160 --> 00:13:48,920 Have you seen paintings during your life that remind you of what he looked like or were 214 00:13:48,920 --> 00:13:49,920 even close? 215 00:13:49,920 --> 00:13:54,920 That is an intriguing question, an interesting question. 216 00:13:54,920 --> 00:13:56,680 I'm glad you asked that. 217 00:13:56,680 --> 00:14:01,160 I have never, I've only, I've got one painting that a friend of mine made for me. 218 00:14:01,160 --> 00:14:06,440 She was an artist and I was involved with a group that they were searching the scriptures 219 00:14:06,440 --> 00:14:09,640 and going really deep into doctrine. 220 00:14:09,640 --> 00:14:15,800 And one day she says, if you say you've seen Jesus, well, can I paint, can I paint a picture 221 00:14:15,800 --> 00:14:18,040 of him for you? 222 00:14:18,040 --> 00:14:23,560 And so once you describe it, and I will draw it out as you explained it to me. 223 00:14:23,560 --> 00:14:26,960 And she got really, really, really, really close. 224 00:14:26,960 --> 00:14:29,240 Jesus was not a super tall guy. 225 00:14:29,240 --> 00:14:34,160 He was about five, 10, and five, 11, somewhere in that neighborhood with the deepest blue 226 00:14:34,160 --> 00:14:37,000 eyes that you've ever seen. 227 00:14:37,000 --> 00:14:39,560 He's a very self-spoken guy, but he was a carpenter. 228 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:46,000 He had cow's hands and I could see the male princess' hands and his wrists. 229 00:14:46,000 --> 00:14:47,280 I didn't feel them. 230 00:14:47,280 --> 00:14:51,840 I didn't want to feel them because I thought that he was still hurting from that. 231 00:14:51,840 --> 00:14:53,800 He had the most amazing hair. 232 00:14:53,800 --> 00:14:55,280 It was soft and it was white. 233 00:14:55,280 --> 00:15:00,400 And I was really surprised that his hair was white because I know that people in the Middle 234 00:15:00,400 --> 00:15:03,160 East are typically dark-haired. 235 00:15:03,160 --> 00:15:06,520 And he said that he was a resurrected being and asked me if I knew what that was and I 236 00:15:06,520 --> 00:15:07,520 told him I didn't. 237 00:15:07,520 --> 00:15:11,640 And he said, basically, my body and my soul have been reunited. 238 00:15:11,640 --> 00:15:14,840 And he says, that will happen to me at some point in time. 239 00:15:14,840 --> 00:15:19,680 I said, but we'll talk more about that later when you're a little bit older. 240 00:15:19,680 --> 00:15:23,240 You can understand these things a little bit easier, a little bit better. 241 00:15:23,240 --> 00:15:26,360 And he asked me to remember those things. 242 00:15:26,360 --> 00:15:30,720 So was there a time when you were a little older that you had another conversation with 243 00:15:30,720 --> 00:15:31,720 him? 244 00:15:31,720 --> 00:15:32,720 Was it through another NDE? 245 00:15:32,720 --> 00:15:34,280 Yeah, it was. 246 00:15:34,280 --> 00:15:42,720 I've had approximately nine conversations with the Savior over the course of my life. 247 00:15:42,720 --> 00:15:45,080 The last one was about 15 years ago. 248 00:15:45,080 --> 00:15:49,520 Is that as a result of one of the accidents that you were in? 249 00:15:49,520 --> 00:15:53,080 Another accident that I had from another surgery that I'd had. 250 00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:59,200 I've had 29 surgeries so far and I'm looking at possibly another one, hearing the very 251 00:15:59,200 --> 00:16:00,200 near future. 252 00:16:00,200 --> 00:16:03,720 I'm not sure what they're going to do just yet because they're still trying to figure 253 00:16:03,720 --> 00:16:06,560 out what the problems are and where they're at. 254 00:16:06,560 --> 00:16:10,880 I've got interviews with a surgeon here in about a week and a half, two weeks, something 255 00:16:10,880 --> 00:16:12,400 like that. 256 00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:16,560 So tell me some of the other things that you learned from him later in life. 257 00:16:16,560 --> 00:16:20,920 I learned that evil people, that this country was going to be in a lot of trouble. 258 00:16:20,920 --> 00:16:26,640 I was shown every president that we would have up into the second coming. 259 00:16:26,640 --> 00:16:29,680 And so far, I've seen all but two. 260 00:16:29,680 --> 00:16:34,080 I was told about a war that would come and I was asked to look. 261 00:16:34,080 --> 00:16:40,520 I had to look away because it was just something you don't want to experience. 262 00:16:40,520 --> 00:16:44,760 I asked if it would happen in my lifetime and he said, that depends on people. 263 00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:48,440 He says, the first rule of heaven is agency. 264 00:16:48,440 --> 00:16:51,960 People can make a decision and do whatever they want. 265 00:16:51,960 --> 00:16:57,440 He says, my time is not measured like people's time on Earth is measured. 266 00:16:57,440 --> 00:17:02,040 He said, one second to me is a lot longer than what people realize. 267 00:17:02,040 --> 00:17:07,840 I said, just live your life to the best you can and look for these things and look for 268 00:17:07,840 --> 00:17:09,800 these people. 269 00:17:09,800 --> 00:17:14,400 When I saw the evil and I saw Satan, I was showing what he looks like. 270 00:17:14,400 --> 00:17:18,840 He does not look like the monster that people look so. 271 00:17:18,840 --> 00:17:21,800 He doesn't have warnings or hoops or anything like that. 272 00:17:21,800 --> 00:17:27,360 He's a very good looking man, but he's a very cunning man and a very smart man. 273 00:17:27,360 --> 00:17:31,680 And I was told never to challenge him nor to discount him. 274 00:17:31,680 --> 00:17:37,200 And he said that personally to me and he held me really close because I was scared. 275 00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:42,320 When I saw his face, I was scared because I could see the anger and rage in his eyes. 276 00:17:42,320 --> 00:17:48,320 And I was told to remember that, but to never push him and never challenge him. 277 00:17:48,320 --> 00:17:52,960 That's some of the things I was showing the war that's coming. 278 00:17:52,960 --> 00:17:58,760 And this war that will come, whether it will be in my lifetime, I don't know, but I was 279 00:17:58,760 --> 00:18:02,320 also warned that there were a lot of prophecies that had been filled before that war could 280 00:18:02,320 --> 00:18:03,320 happen. 281 00:18:03,320 --> 00:18:08,200 And so far, the things that I was warned about haven't happened yet. 282 00:18:08,200 --> 00:18:13,600 So I think it's probably several years away, if not more, based on what I've seen. 283 00:18:13,600 --> 00:18:17,520 Have you told these experiences to very many people before? 284 00:18:17,520 --> 00:18:20,040 And if so, what was their reaction? 285 00:18:20,040 --> 00:18:22,840 I have one really close friend. 286 00:18:22,840 --> 00:18:23,840 His name is Adam. 287 00:18:23,840 --> 00:18:32,560 I shared a few things with and his reaction was shock, disbelief. 288 00:18:32,560 --> 00:18:36,320 He was scared, especially with some of the details that I shared with him. 289 00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:39,120 I didn't share with him everything. 290 00:18:39,120 --> 00:18:45,440 And when he read the book of Revelation, there was a chapter 17 made more sense to him after 291 00:18:45,440 --> 00:18:46,920 what I shared with him. 292 00:18:46,920 --> 00:18:51,960 I'm like, that's only one tiny piece of a much bigger picture. 293 00:18:51,960 --> 00:18:54,120 It's one corner of it. 294 00:18:54,120 --> 00:18:57,800 And I said, there's a lot more to that than you realize. 295 00:18:57,800 --> 00:19:02,120 And he's pressed me on occasion, but over the years, I've just said, there's just some 296 00:19:02,120 --> 00:19:05,320 things I'm just not comfortable or willing to share. 297 00:19:05,320 --> 00:19:06,680 Because I'm not a prophet. 298 00:19:06,680 --> 00:19:10,960 I am not a fortune teller or anything like that. 299 00:19:10,960 --> 00:19:12,200 I've never claimed that. 300 00:19:12,200 --> 00:19:14,080 I've never wanted to be called that. 301 00:19:14,080 --> 00:19:16,240 And I hate recognition for anything. 302 00:19:16,240 --> 00:19:22,760 I'm not very quiet, very introverted person in most cases. 303 00:19:22,760 --> 00:19:26,080 And today I'm coming a little bit out of my shell because there's some things I just 304 00:19:26,080 --> 00:19:29,720 felt that it was time to start sharing. 305 00:19:29,720 --> 00:19:34,880 And as I prayed before this interview, I asked my father what I could share and what I couldn't. 306 00:19:34,880 --> 00:19:37,840 And he said, I will put the thoughts in your mind before your mouth opens. 307 00:19:37,840 --> 00:19:39,720 That's what those things are. 308 00:19:39,720 --> 00:19:41,200 And that's already happened so far. 309 00:19:41,200 --> 00:19:44,960 Tell me some of the other things you feel like sharing today. 310 00:19:44,960 --> 00:19:47,200 We are being lied to. 311 00:19:47,200 --> 00:19:54,000 I was told that the father of lies would deceive a lot of people in the final moments and whatever 312 00:19:54,000 --> 00:19:57,760 that timeframe looks like is up to debate. 313 00:19:57,760 --> 00:20:01,880 And in the final moments, he said, say, we would deceive the hearts of many and many would 314 00:20:01,880 --> 00:20:02,880 believe the lies. 315 00:20:02,880 --> 00:20:06,160 He said, there would be people that have already talked about it. 316 00:20:06,160 --> 00:20:07,560 He mentioned Jay Rubin Clark. 317 00:20:07,560 --> 00:20:09,560 He said, my servant Jay Rubin. 318 00:20:09,560 --> 00:20:13,080 He didn't mention a class named Jay Rubin. 319 00:20:13,080 --> 00:20:14,800 Would warn us about the media. 320 00:20:14,800 --> 00:20:20,480 And I was told, and I was only, I think, 12 years old when I heard the name Jay Rubin. 321 00:20:20,480 --> 00:20:21,480 I didn't know who he was. 322 00:20:21,480 --> 00:20:22,800 I didn't know what he meant. 323 00:20:22,800 --> 00:20:24,000 I was shown a picture of him. 324 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:29,040 I said, when you see this man, listen to his words, because I sent him to warn the people 325 00:20:29,040 --> 00:20:30,920 and they won't listen. 326 00:20:30,920 --> 00:20:35,080 And that was one thing the Savior is warning me each time I met him and I've talked with 327 00:20:35,080 --> 00:20:36,080 him. 328 00:20:36,080 --> 00:20:37,600 I said, the people won't listen. 329 00:20:37,600 --> 00:20:42,360 They will draw near to me with their mouths, but the hearts are far from me. 330 00:20:42,360 --> 00:20:46,240 They will not listen because they want someone else to tell them, but they don't want me 331 00:20:46,240 --> 00:20:50,720 to tell them because they don't believe in me enough to listen to me. 332 00:20:50,720 --> 00:20:52,640 And he was crying when he said that. 333 00:20:52,640 --> 00:20:56,320 He said, if they would all listen, they wouldn't suffer. 334 00:20:56,320 --> 00:20:58,680 How do they listen? 335 00:20:58,680 --> 00:21:02,440 Just through reading scriptures, through prayer, how do they listen? 336 00:21:02,440 --> 00:21:04,840 Those that want to, right now? 337 00:21:04,840 --> 00:21:06,720 Through prayer and never doubting him. 338 00:21:06,720 --> 00:21:09,160 My grandfather was inspired when I said that to him as a kid. 339 00:21:09,160 --> 00:21:12,960 He says, if you never doubt the Lord, he will deliver you. 340 00:21:12,960 --> 00:21:17,120 And then I pressed my grandfather a little further on that. 341 00:21:17,120 --> 00:21:21,520 And I'm like, what do you mean by, you know, listening to the Lord and never doubting? 342 00:21:21,520 --> 00:21:28,280 He says, open your heart and ask him a direct question and he will answer it. 343 00:21:28,280 --> 00:21:35,120 But if you make assumptions or say what you want, not what he wants, he won't answer. 344 00:21:35,120 --> 00:21:41,080 So I always close my prayers, which I will, Lord, and that might be done because he's 345 00:21:41,080 --> 00:21:45,200 my father and he's the son of God. 346 00:21:45,200 --> 00:21:50,920 And if he gets his answers from heavenly father and instructions from heavenly father and 347 00:21:50,920 --> 00:21:54,200 I get them to him, I can't doubt. 348 00:21:54,200 --> 00:21:59,480 And one time I asked him, why don't you talk to people like you're talking to me? 349 00:21:59,480 --> 00:22:02,280 He said, because they won't talk to me. 350 00:22:02,280 --> 00:22:03,520 He says, they don't believe. 351 00:22:03,520 --> 00:22:07,680 He says, I will only answer questions to those who will listen to me. 352 00:22:07,680 --> 00:22:10,880 I will only come to people who will listen to me. 353 00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:14,480 I'm like, well, what if I make some mistakes and I quit listening to you? 354 00:22:14,480 --> 00:22:16,160 Because this was always a constant fear. 355 00:22:16,160 --> 00:22:18,560 And even to this minute, as a constant fear. 356 00:22:18,560 --> 00:22:21,240 And he said, get on your knees and repent. 357 00:22:21,240 --> 00:22:23,160 He says, remember the atonement. 358 00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:24,160 Never forget the atonement. 359 00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:29,560 It is so important for you to remember this throughout your whole life. 360 00:22:29,560 --> 00:22:30,560 Remember the atonement. 361 00:22:30,560 --> 00:22:33,720 And one time I really screwed up pretty bad. 362 00:22:33,720 --> 00:22:39,480 I was about 37, 38 years old and I was going through a hard time in my marriage. 363 00:22:39,480 --> 00:22:45,560 I've been divorced for 20 years now that I just gave up for the first time in my life 364 00:22:45,560 --> 00:22:47,960 with everything I just quit. 365 00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:49,600 And I did some really stupid stuff. 366 00:22:49,600 --> 00:22:53,000 And one time I was praying and I heard the words out loud. 367 00:22:53,000 --> 00:22:56,720 I didn't see him, but I heard the words out loud. 368 00:22:56,720 --> 00:22:57,720 You won't listen. 369 00:22:57,720 --> 00:22:58,720 You quit listening to him. 370 00:22:58,720 --> 00:23:00,720 I'm like, can I be forgiven? 371 00:23:00,720 --> 00:23:03,000 He says, when you're ready. 372 00:23:03,000 --> 00:23:05,960 It was a very audible voice, like your voice and my voice. 373 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:08,640 It was very audible. 374 00:23:08,640 --> 00:23:10,280 When I was ready, he would talk to me again. 375 00:23:10,280 --> 00:23:13,240 How long did it take you to get ready? 376 00:23:13,240 --> 00:23:16,280 About six or eight months. 377 00:23:16,280 --> 00:23:18,480 I had a lot of issues to work through. 378 00:23:18,480 --> 00:23:22,880 A bishop in my church said to me, because I was having a lot of problems. 379 00:23:22,880 --> 00:23:27,280 I asked him, you know, what am I doing wrong? 380 00:23:27,280 --> 00:23:30,600 And he said, one phrase is to forgive yourself. 381 00:23:30,600 --> 00:23:35,760 And I thought of all the things he could say to me. 382 00:23:35,760 --> 00:23:36,760 Forgive myself. 383 00:23:36,760 --> 00:23:37,760 How do you forgive yourself? 384 00:23:37,760 --> 00:23:39,760 How do you do that? 385 00:23:39,760 --> 00:23:44,200 And I was praying and asking the Savior and he said, I will speak to you when you forgive 386 00:23:44,200 --> 00:23:47,000 yourself. 387 00:23:47,000 --> 00:23:49,320 So how do you do that? 388 00:23:49,320 --> 00:23:50,520 Because what I did was pretty bad. 389 00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:53,920 I made a suicide attempt after my divorce. 390 00:23:53,920 --> 00:23:57,200 I was in a very dark place at that time. 391 00:23:57,200 --> 00:24:04,080 I forgot how to pray for a while and I thought there's no way God could love me again. 392 00:24:04,080 --> 00:24:08,080 The Heavenly Father, Jesus Christ, could never love me again after that. 393 00:24:08,080 --> 00:24:10,400 Because of what I did. 394 00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:17,960 And what was so amazing is that when you find a path to forgive yourself, the heavens open 395 00:24:17,960 --> 00:24:18,960 back up again. 396 00:24:18,960 --> 00:24:22,240 They're not closed for anybody. 397 00:24:22,240 --> 00:24:24,880 Nobody, they're not closed. 398 00:24:24,880 --> 00:24:29,880 You just got to know that he will and believe that he will talk to you. 399 00:24:29,880 --> 00:24:36,880 And one time when I was about 17 years old, I rolled a car and it was pretty bad in it. 400 00:24:36,880 --> 00:24:42,480 And the other thing I said, he said to me, because I was only gone for just a flash, 401 00:24:42,480 --> 00:24:47,920 it seemed like, he just told me to never, ever doubt. 402 00:24:47,920 --> 00:24:48,920 Never doubt. 403 00:24:48,920 --> 00:24:55,560 Speaking of doubt, most people listening to this podcast listen because they either believe 404 00:24:55,560 --> 00:24:59,000 or want to believe in an afterlife. 405 00:24:59,000 --> 00:25:02,880 We have people of all different faiths listening. 406 00:25:02,880 --> 00:25:04,200 Some believe in Jesus. 407 00:25:04,200 --> 00:25:05,880 Some do not. 408 00:25:05,880 --> 00:25:09,560 Some are going to just flat out have a hard time believing you. 409 00:25:09,560 --> 00:25:10,560 Okay? 410 00:25:10,560 --> 00:25:11,560 And that's okay. 411 00:25:11,560 --> 00:25:12,560 I don't care. 412 00:25:12,560 --> 00:25:14,680 And what do you have to say to them? 413 00:25:14,680 --> 00:25:19,720 What I have to say to them is that you have to come to turn us yourself. 414 00:25:19,720 --> 00:25:22,400 What you feel is what you feel. 415 00:25:22,400 --> 00:25:25,600 I know what I know and I've never turned my back on it. 416 00:25:25,600 --> 00:25:27,800 I never walked away from it. 417 00:25:27,800 --> 00:25:30,280 Your agency is in your hands. 418 00:25:30,280 --> 00:25:34,880 And there's something in the Scriptures that talks about, I think it's in Matthew, it talks 419 00:25:34,880 --> 00:25:37,200 about the books of life. 420 00:25:37,200 --> 00:25:42,120 And what I have to say to those people who doubt is, when your book of life is opened, 421 00:25:42,120 --> 00:25:44,560 your entries based on what you do here are in there. 422 00:25:44,560 --> 00:25:48,120 And one day the Savior will read them to you. 423 00:25:48,120 --> 00:25:53,800 And I can go into very detail, very deep details as to what that day will look like. 424 00:25:53,800 --> 00:25:58,640 Be careful what you say and be careful who you offend and who you hurt, because angels 425 00:25:58,640 --> 00:26:01,400 in heaven are writing everything down. 426 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:05,360 Your journal isn't here on earth, it's in heaven. 427 00:26:05,360 --> 00:26:07,320 Be very careful what you do. 428 00:26:07,320 --> 00:26:09,960 I hope they're writing positive things too. 429 00:26:09,960 --> 00:26:11,920 We do good things now and then. 430 00:26:11,920 --> 00:26:13,520 I hope so too. 431 00:26:13,520 --> 00:26:21,120 One thing I learned is that the Savior's love is infinite and He's ready to help us and 432 00:26:21,120 --> 00:26:22,120 teach us. 433 00:26:22,120 --> 00:26:23,640 He wants to talk to us. 434 00:26:23,640 --> 00:26:26,840 He's made that very clear to me many, many times. 435 00:26:26,840 --> 00:26:28,080 He wants to talk to us. 436 00:26:28,080 --> 00:26:30,400 I've got a little emotional here. 437 00:26:30,400 --> 00:26:33,880 He really, really, really wants to talk to us. 438 00:26:33,880 --> 00:26:39,320 He wants us to come back to Him and He wants us to live with Him forever. 439 00:26:39,320 --> 00:26:43,160 And we all take different paths and whatever paths you're on, don't give up. 440 00:26:43,160 --> 00:26:44,600 I mean, I've done that. 441 00:26:44,600 --> 00:26:46,480 You don't want to go there. 442 00:26:46,480 --> 00:26:50,120 And I made a mistake when I was about 15 years old challenging Satan. 443 00:26:50,120 --> 00:26:55,280 Actually, I was 21 when I was 21, but challenging Satan. 444 00:26:55,280 --> 00:26:57,000 You don't want to do that. 445 00:26:57,000 --> 00:26:58,920 You don't want to do that. 446 00:26:58,920 --> 00:27:02,000 You will pay a price like you can't imagine. 447 00:27:02,000 --> 00:27:05,680 And if you think He cares or He'll be nice to you, you're wrong. 448 00:27:05,680 --> 00:27:07,840 You're very wrong. 449 00:27:07,840 --> 00:27:10,640 That book of life is there for a reason. 450 00:27:10,640 --> 00:27:16,600 And it's your experiences and it's individually written just for you and no one else. 451 00:27:16,600 --> 00:27:19,960 And when you stand in front of the Savior, there won't be anybody there present other 452 00:27:19,960 --> 00:27:21,520 than those that you've offended. 453 00:27:21,520 --> 00:27:24,280 And their testimony will be entered. 454 00:27:24,280 --> 00:27:27,560 It's already in the book, but it will be entered. 455 00:27:27,560 --> 00:27:33,760 And there's a way that that's done and people wake up because time is running out. 456 00:27:33,760 --> 00:27:36,000 Wake up, please wake up. 457 00:27:36,000 --> 00:27:40,800 I like to believe that also the positive things are going to be there too. 458 00:27:40,800 --> 00:27:47,280 The people that we have served, the good that we have done and those kinds of things. 459 00:27:47,280 --> 00:27:52,720 And as I've talked to other people about their life reviews, one of the things that I hear 460 00:27:52,720 --> 00:28:00,200 and you tell me how this jives with your experiences is that they're shown the things that they 461 00:28:00,200 --> 00:28:06,600 did, the choices that they made and exactly how those affected other people for good and 462 00:28:06,600 --> 00:28:07,600 for bad. 463 00:28:07,600 --> 00:28:09,320 Have you experienced that too? 464 00:28:09,320 --> 00:28:10,320 Yes, I have. 465 00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:17,080 And one of my experiences I was taken into a room, there was a screen in the front of 466 00:28:17,080 --> 00:28:18,080 the room. 467 00:28:18,080 --> 00:28:19,080 It was huge. 468 00:28:19,080 --> 00:28:20,080 It was bigger. 469 00:28:20,080 --> 00:28:22,280 It was like a movie screen in front of me. 470 00:28:22,280 --> 00:28:26,720 I was asked if I would believe what I was going to be shown. 471 00:28:26,720 --> 00:28:30,200 And I said, you know, I have no reason to doubt. 472 00:28:30,200 --> 00:28:36,000 And I was shown the good things that people do and services important, so important. 473 00:28:36,000 --> 00:28:40,680 And I was reminded of the future of course, as what the Savior says, when you're done 474 00:28:40,680 --> 00:28:43,600 it under these beliefs in my presence, you're done it under me. 475 00:28:43,600 --> 00:28:45,720 There's a lot of joy in that. 476 00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:48,200 There is a lot of joy in that. 477 00:28:48,200 --> 00:28:54,240 There is so many great things that the Savior will use. 478 00:28:54,240 --> 00:28:59,360 This is when you repent and you do these things, these bad things are forgotten. 479 00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:05,040 It says they're cast into see a forgetfulness and remember no more. 480 00:29:05,040 --> 00:29:09,600 And I believe that based on what I've seen in that room, that I was taken into another 481 00:29:09,600 --> 00:29:10,600 room. 482 00:29:10,600 --> 00:29:12,640 I was asked, you know, what talent would you want? 483 00:29:12,640 --> 00:29:15,520 If I could give you any talent, what would you want? 484 00:29:15,520 --> 00:29:20,720 And I asked to know where it would be when the slate was over. 485 00:29:20,720 --> 00:29:22,480 What was the answer? 486 00:29:22,480 --> 00:29:26,920 And the answer was very, very clear that that depended on what I did. 487 00:29:26,920 --> 00:29:29,520 And then I was counseled to continue to do service. 488 00:29:29,520 --> 00:29:33,800 He said, the first law of heaven is agency. 489 00:29:33,800 --> 00:29:35,800 This is never forget that. 490 00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:40,000 So earlier I asked you about your most significant NDEs. 491 00:29:40,000 --> 00:29:44,480 You said there were two and you talked about the ones when you were six years old. 492 00:29:44,480 --> 00:29:49,120 Was that both of them or was there another one? 493 00:29:49,120 --> 00:29:50,480 Let's talk about the other one. 494 00:29:50,480 --> 00:29:51,480 When was that? 495 00:29:51,480 --> 00:29:55,080 A family named Bill Bradford had passed away. 496 00:29:55,080 --> 00:29:57,000 I was very sick. 497 00:29:57,000 --> 00:29:59,480 He was on a staff bed. 498 00:29:59,480 --> 00:30:05,040 When I went to visit him in the hospital and there's a few people that know the story very 499 00:30:05,040 --> 00:30:06,760 well, they were present. 500 00:30:06,760 --> 00:30:10,320 There's about 15 people that were there when this happened. 501 00:30:10,320 --> 00:30:15,000 Bill Bradford couldn't talk to him, his lyrics were removed. 502 00:30:15,000 --> 00:30:18,240 And he asked me if I would die for him. 503 00:30:18,240 --> 00:30:23,080 And I thought he was kidding because how do you die for somebody? 504 00:30:23,080 --> 00:30:26,880 And then he wrote on a piece of paper, he says, I need a heart and lungs. 505 00:30:26,880 --> 00:30:30,400 Would you give me yours? 506 00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:34,600 That shocked a little heck out of me. 507 00:30:34,600 --> 00:30:35,960 And I didn't know how to answer that. 508 00:30:35,960 --> 00:30:41,400 And I thought he was joking around and he's being superficial because he was dying. 509 00:30:41,400 --> 00:30:44,280 And I thought, yeah, I'll die for you. 510 00:30:44,280 --> 00:30:47,840 And just casually thought, I'll die for you. 511 00:30:47,840 --> 00:30:49,320 And then he said, I'm serious. 512 00:30:49,320 --> 00:30:53,920 He wrote that on a piece of paper, I'm serious. 513 00:30:53,920 --> 00:30:56,080 So a few days went by after that. 514 00:30:56,080 --> 00:30:59,760 I was talking with my other friend who was in the room. 515 00:30:59,760 --> 00:31:03,360 And I said, is he serious? 516 00:31:03,360 --> 00:31:09,000 So I talked to a member of my church, one of my bishops and a person above him. 517 00:31:09,000 --> 00:31:13,480 And I asked him, so is there anything against me doing this? 518 00:31:13,480 --> 00:31:15,040 And I told him about Bill. 519 00:31:15,040 --> 00:31:20,320 And so there's no doctrine in church as far as I were aware of against it. 520 00:31:20,320 --> 00:31:22,240 So then the burden was put back on me. 521 00:31:22,240 --> 00:31:24,640 So I talked to my mother, got her opinion. 522 00:31:24,640 --> 00:31:26,840 My mother and I were very, very close. 523 00:31:26,840 --> 00:31:31,520 I just said, well, why has the Savior said about that? 524 00:31:31,520 --> 00:31:33,440 And I had to go deep into the scriptures. 525 00:31:33,440 --> 00:31:35,400 And he said, no, we're going to love half a man. 526 00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:37,680 Then he died for his brother. 527 00:31:37,680 --> 00:31:41,640 And then I asked my mom, who was my brother, he said, Bill. 528 00:31:41,640 --> 00:31:44,440 That was her simple answer, Bill. 529 00:31:44,440 --> 00:31:48,880 So out of curiosity, I went and had to test down to see if I was a match flooring. 530 00:31:48,880 --> 00:31:55,400 And other than a direct family member, I was a perfect match for him. 531 00:31:55,400 --> 00:32:05,080 And it really hit home because now the rubber is hitting the road really hard. 532 00:32:05,080 --> 00:32:09,560 So I talked to the hospital staff to find out what that was all about. 533 00:32:09,560 --> 00:32:13,520 And the hospital administrator answers, you have to send a waiver that your family will 534 00:32:13,520 --> 00:32:18,640 not hold the hospital liable because you will die in a surgery. 535 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:25,320 That was an awful lot for a 27-year-old guy to go through after the ill. 536 00:32:25,320 --> 00:32:29,440 So I signed all the papers, talked to the lawyers, got everything done. 537 00:32:29,440 --> 00:32:33,240 So I was sitting in the hospital and Bill was right next to me in the room. 538 00:32:33,240 --> 00:32:37,320 And they hooked me up and they put the drugs into me. 539 00:32:37,320 --> 00:32:40,480 And while I was waiting, my heart quit beating. 540 00:32:40,480 --> 00:32:41,480 And I thought, this is it. 541 00:32:41,480 --> 00:32:43,640 I'm going home. 542 00:32:43,640 --> 00:32:52,480 And the love that was shown for me when I got to the top of the staircase and the tears 543 00:32:52,480 --> 00:32:54,640 were flowing like water. 544 00:32:54,640 --> 00:33:01,840 The Savior says, you have proven your love for me and now I'm going to do this for you. 545 00:33:01,840 --> 00:33:07,320 And what he did for me is something I've never showed any human being and I don't think I 546 00:33:07,320 --> 00:33:08,320 can. 547 00:33:08,320 --> 00:33:15,160 I was shown that whatever I did after that point, as long as I remain faithful, that 548 00:33:15,160 --> 00:33:16,720 there was a place for me. 549 00:33:16,720 --> 00:33:23,400 And I was shown what that place was to describe the beauty of it and the magnitude of it and 550 00:33:23,400 --> 00:33:27,000 the people that were going to be with me there is beyond all words. 551 00:33:27,000 --> 00:33:34,000 And I was told that it was time to go back because I was willing to die for my friend, 552 00:33:34,000 --> 00:33:37,120 that the atonement was in full effect for me. 553 00:33:37,120 --> 00:33:41,440 And then I needed to return and share those messages. 554 00:33:41,440 --> 00:33:46,400 And I was put back in my body and I was suffering over my body for about, I was seen like four 555 00:33:46,400 --> 00:33:48,200 or five minutes. 556 00:33:48,200 --> 00:33:52,960 And then my angel said to me, it's time for you to leave, but we're not finished yet. 557 00:33:52,960 --> 00:33:57,880 But remember these things and keep them sacred. 558 00:33:57,880 --> 00:33:59,400 And I have. 559 00:33:59,400 --> 00:34:03,960 What happened was that Bill Bradford's brother had died the same minute that the injection 560 00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:05,760 was given to me. 561 00:34:05,760 --> 00:34:11,120 His brother, twin brother had passed away and his twin brother wanted his organs given to 562 00:34:11,120 --> 00:34:12,120 him. 563 00:34:12,120 --> 00:34:17,360 Now, Bill Bradford was the guy who trained a lot of CIA agents, FBI agents and police 564 00:34:17,360 --> 00:34:18,760 officers. 565 00:34:18,760 --> 00:34:24,920 This guy had done more service for this country than any person I've ever met in my life. 566 00:34:24,920 --> 00:34:29,760 This guy in my mind was more important than I was in this world because of the lives he 567 00:34:29,760 --> 00:34:32,320 had saved and the people he had helped. 568 00:34:32,320 --> 00:34:35,960 This guy's level of service was second to none. 569 00:34:35,960 --> 00:34:40,280 And that's why when I considered all those things, I went to do this. 570 00:34:40,280 --> 00:34:43,880 I agreed to that, to how to happen. 571 00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:52,360 And the saver said, my sacrifice was no gears and heads and that I would be rewarded for 572 00:34:52,360 --> 00:34:53,360 time. 573 00:34:53,360 --> 00:34:58,160 That was the most powerful and he got that and I was 27 years old. 574 00:34:58,160 --> 00:35:01,800 Sorry, I'm a little speechless after that. 575 00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:04,680 I can't really control my emotions on that one. 576 00:35:04,680 --> 00:35:05,680 Yeah. 577 00:35:05,680 --> 00:35:09,280 But because Bill, Bill was a special guy. 578 00:35:09,280 --> 00:35:13,560 But when I was told the atomic was in full effect for me. 579 00:35:13,560 --> 00:35:14,840 I didn't know what that meant. 580 00:35:14,840 --> 00:35:16,640 I didn't know how to handle that. 581 00:35:16,640 --> 00:35:20,760 And I tried and the saver was sweeping with me when he was holding me. 582 00:35:20,760 --> 00:35:26,240 And his last thing he said before I left is that I love you and my love will never die 583 00:35:26,240 --> 00:35:27,740 for you. 584 00:35:27,740 --> 00:35:30,120 I will be with you forever. 585 00:35:30,120 --> 00:35:31,680 And I believe him. 586 00:35:31,680 --> 00:35:32,880 I have no doubt. 587 00:35:32,880 --> 00:35:39,040 So for those who doubt that the saver is real, you don't know how deep his love is for you 588 00:35:39,040 --> 00:35:41,520 and how great his joy is when we do the right thing. 589 00:35:41,520 --> 00:35:49,400 When we help people, when we get out here and share his messages and read his scriptures. 590 00:35:49,400 --> 00:35:55,240 He really takes great pride and love for us and joy in us when we listen to the scriptures, 591 00:35:55,240 --> 00:35:56,240 when we do those things. 592 00:35:56,240 --> 00:36:01,360 You know, when it's saying hi to a stranger or picking up the mail for somebody or picking 593 00:36:01,360 --> 00:36:03,840 somebody at plate of cookies. 594 00:36:03,840 --> 00:36:09,360 Those blessings and that joy that the saver has for you are very important to him and 595 00:36:09,360 --> 00:36:13,320 he never forgets those are for your benefit. 596 00:36:13,320 --> 00:36:17,800 And I encourage people to keep doing those things and to find opportunities. 597 00:36:17,800 --> 00:36:23,080 Eric, every day of my life, I find somebody to help or at least I try to every day of 598 00:36:23,080 --> 00:36:24,080 my life. 599 00:36:24,080 --> 00:36:26,440 I'm retired now for health reasons. 600 00:36:26,440 --> 00:36:34,320 And because like I said, every day of my life, now that I'm retired, I try to help 601 00:36:34,320 --> 00:36:41,600 someone somehow and I never get upset with people, but people do irritate me and I know 602 00:36:41,600 --> 00:36:45,320 different than anyone else listening or reading. 603 00:36:45,320 --> 00:36:50,280 There are people out here that just really burn my shorts, but I have to remember that 604 00:36:50,280 --> 00:36:51,800 they're on their own path. 605 00:36:51,800 --> 00:36:55,440 And I remind myself of that, that they're on their own path. 606 00:36:55,440 --> 00:36:58,160 They have to do whatever they feel is right for them. 607 00:36:58,160 --> 00:37:01,320 And it being mean to me or anyone else is what makes them happy. 608 00:37:01,320 --> 00:37:03,840 Who am I to tell them no? 609 00:37:03,840 --> 00:37:06,080 I just know that doesn't work for me and it won't. 610 00:37:06,080 --> 00:37:08,080 It never has and never will. 611 00:37:08,080 --> 00:37:14,880 I strive every day to try to do the right thing and I repent every night sometimes for hours 612 00:37:14,880 --> 00:37:19,560 because some days I just have really bad days and welcome to being human. 613 00:37:19,560 --> 00:37:21,200 Yeah, exactly. 614 00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:22,200 We all do. 615 00:37:22,200 --> 00:37:23,200 None of us are perfect. 616 00:37:23,200 --> 00:37:27,760 I want to ask about something you brought up earlier, which is your guardian angel. 617 00:37:27,760 --> 00:37:31,320 This is something I believe in, but I know very little about. 618 00:37:31,320 --> 00:37:36,640 Give me an idea of what, what you know about your guardian angel and is it one? 619 00:37:36,640 --> 00:37:37,640 Is it multiple? 620 00:37:37,640 --> 00:37:41,720 There are many, but one in particular, it's a lady. 621 00:37:41,720 --> 00:37:44,920 She has really dark hair. 622 00:37:44,920 --> 00:37:50,200 She's not very tall and she is not as far as I've not never been born. 623 00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:51,800 She's waiting for the resurrection. 624 00:37:51,800 --> 00:37:54,320 It's a different topic. 625 00:37:54,320 --> 00:37:56,760 Some people believe it and some people don't. 626 00:37:56,760 --> 00:38:03,240 She is very, very close to me and when I first met her, she said that she had been assigned 627 00:38:03,240 --> 00:38:09,400 to me to help me and to guide me, but mostly she's been assigned to learn me about things 628 00:38:09,400 --> 00:38:11,800 when there's danger present. 629 00:38:11,800 --> 00:38:16,880 She has the most beautiful smile of that woman I've ever seen in my life. 630 00:38:16,880 --> 00:38:21,760 Voice is very soft, but her messages are very direct. 631 00:38:21,760 --> 00:38:24,440 I have never been able to physically touch her. 632 00:38:24,440 --> 00:38:29,600 When I've even asked her if she would give me a hug because some of the things that she's 633 00:38:29,600 --> 00:38:36,480 messages she's given me have been very, very emotional in nature and she says, I can't 634 00:38:36,480 --> 00:38:37,480 do that. 635 00:38:37,480 --> 00:38:39,640 It's not time, but just remember what I'm sharing. 636 00:38:39,640 --> 00:38:43,720 You know, she'll tell me to look and she shows me something that's going to happen. 637 00:38:43,720 --> 00:38:47,760 Since this is going to affect you and you need to be prepared for that. 638 00:38:47,760 --> 00:38:54,760 And she always says that when she leaves, remember these things and never forget. 639 00:38:54,760 --> 00:39:01,240 And then she goes away and the messages are usually 20, 30 seconds in length, but usually 640 00:39:01,240 --> 00:39:06,160 she shows me a picture of what it is that I need to be prepared for. 641 00:39:06,160 --> 00:39:11,000 She'll always say look and I look and then I see what it is. 642 00:39:11,000 --> 00:39:15,280 She warned me about my car accident that I had, that I would be injured, but I would 643 00:39:15,280 --> 00:39:18,600 walk away and she says, you will wake up laughing. 644 00:39:18,600 --> 00:39:23,040 I was 18 years old the day I got in the car. 645 00:39:23,040 --> 00:39:29,840 I recognized the car and I thought, holy heck, is there any way out of this that I wanted 646 00:39:29,840 --> 00:39:30,840 to race that day? 647 00:39:30,840 --> 00:39:33,160 I wanted to race that day so that I couldn't stand it. 648 00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:35,600 And it's just like an energy. 649 00:39:35,600 --> 00:39:36,600 I get a positive energy. 650 00:39:36,600 --> 00:39:38,600 I love old cars, by the way. 651 00:39:38,600 --> 00:39:40,760 I love antique cars. 652 00:39:40,760 --> 00:39:44,160 And it was a 69 inch of all that I was driving that day. 653 00:39:44,160 --> 00:39:49,880 And I got on the track and the feature of the race before somebody blown the engine 654 00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:52,680 and they jumped a whole bunch of oil on the track. 655 00:39:52,680 --> 00:39:57,720 As I got in the car, I saw the oil puddle, but there was a car beside me and there was 656 00:39:57,720 --> 00:40:01,920 no way I was going to avoid that with the track. 657 00:40:01,920 --> 00:40:05,320 And I remember what she said and so I just let go of this steering wheel and held on 658 00:40:05,320 --> 00:40:06,320 tight. 659 00:40:06,320 --> 00:40:13,280 As the car was rolling, she was sitting in, I told you, she was in the car, I told you. 660 00:40:13,280 --> 00:40:15,120 And I thanked her. 661 00:40:15,120 --> 00:40:19,520 And it was just a second or two or three, just a few seconds. 662 00:40:19,520 --> 00:40:25,320 And when the safety supra got to me, I was upside down, hanging in my seatbelt and laughing 663 00:40:25,320 --> 00:40:26,320 hysterically. 664 00:40:26,320 --> 00:40:28,120 And I had blood coming out of my eye. 665 00:40:28,120 --> 00:40:32,400 I have a cut under my right eye from that. 666 00:40:32,400 --> 00:40:34,200 And I was just laughing hysterically. 667 00:40:34,200 --> 00:40:40,800 And the safety supra thought, your teacher had her something. 668 00:40:40,800 --> 00:40:43,400 And I got out of the car and I was just laughing. 669 00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:44,560 And I'm like, what are you laughing about? 670 00:40:44,560 --> 00:40:46,080 You just destroyed this car. 671 00:40:46,080 --> 00:40:48,160 And I'm like, I'm walking away. 672 00:40:48,160 --> 00:40:50,000 I just got in. 673 00:40:50,000 --> 00:40:51,640 I got in the back of my nose to check me out. 674 00:40:51,640 --> 00:40:55,760 And other than a few bruises, my minor cut under my eye was okay. 675 00:40:55,760 --> 00:40:58,200 And I'm in universal words. 676 00:40:58,200 --> 00:41:03,320 And that's when I began to fully trust in anything that she would say to me. 677 00:41:03,320 --> 00:41:06,840 But she's been with me since I was six years old. 678 00:41:06,840 --> 00:41:11,760 And like I said earlier in this interview, I saw her about two weeks ago, two, three 679 00:41:11,760 --> 00:41:12,760 weeks ago. 680 00:41:12,760 --> 00:41:17,800 And she warned me about some things that were going to happen and how it would affect me. 681 00:41:17,800 --> 00:41:26,600 And since that time, about a handful of those 15 or 20 things have happened, we were walking 682 00:41:26,600 --> 00:41:31,040 into a very dangerous period of our nation's history. 683 00:41:31,040 --> 00:41:33,040 And she warned me about that too. 684 00:41:33,040 --> 00:41:37,040 She warned me about my surgery, so it will test me. 685 00:41:37,040 --> 00:41:39,040 I'm like, how many won't test me? 686 00:41:39,040 --> 00:41:43,120 I've had 202 broken bones, 29 surgeries. 687 00:41:43,120 --> 00:41:46,400 How much more do I need to go through? 688 00:41:46,400 --> 00:41:47,400 Unbelievable. 689 00:41:47,400 --> 00:41:49,760 You've been through plenty, believe me. 690 00:41:49,760 --> 00:41:54,240 A lot of people that have had near-death experiences come back with some kind of spiritual 691 00:41:54,240 --> 00:42:03,040 gift where it seems like the veil is much more thin for them than for the rest of us. 692 00:42:03,040 --> 00:42:06,920 For example, most of us haven't seen our guardian angel. 693 00:42:06,920 --> 00:42:09,320 It's really cool that you have. 694 00:42:09,320 --> 00:42:10,880 I don't know. 695 00:42:10,880 --> 00:42:13,000 Any advice for the rest of us? 696 00:42:13,000 --> 00:42:15,600 How do we get in touch? 697 00:42:15,600 --> 00:42:18,120 That's different for every person. 698 00:42:18,120 --> 00:42:20,680 I don't really know the right answer to that. 699 00:42:20,680 --> 00:42:27,880 I know for me that personally, I look forward to those visits and sometimes I ask for them 700 00:42:27,880 --> 00:42:33,080 because there are things that are happening in my life from time to time that I just don't 701 00:42:33,080 --> 00:42:34,080 understand. 702 00:42:34,080 --> 00:42:37,880 Then I was talking to a friend of mine. 703 00:42:37,880 --> 00:42:40,160 I think you might know of him. 704 00:42:40,160 --> 00:42:43,880 Ezra Teffbentzen was a good friend of mine, a very close friend of mine. 705 00:42:43,880 --> 00:42:45,800 I asked him one time about that. 706 00:42:45,800 --> 00:42:48,920 Why do these things happen to me and no one else? 707 00:42:48,920 --> 00:42:51,640 He said, you ask the right questions. 708 00:42:51,640 --> 00:42:53,920 That was a simple answer. 709 00:42:53,920 --> 00:42:55,920 You ask the right questions. 710 00:42:55,920 --> 00:43:03,080 For people, I think when you pray to a number one, is have absolute faith. 711 00:43:03,080 --> 00:43:05,600 Number two, ask the right questions. 712 00:43:05,600 --> 00:43:09,440 Number three, act when you receive those promptings. 713 00:43:09,440 --> 00:43:10,440 Don't put it off. 714 00:43:10,440 --> 00:43:13,720 Don't wait till tomorrow or a week from now. 715 00:43:13,720 --> 00:43:18,800 When you receive those promptings, whatever they are, act on them immediately. 716 00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:23,680 If you do that enough times, they will become part of your life. 717 00:43:23,680 --> 00:43:25,480 At least it has for me. 718 00:43:25,480 --> 00:43:28,240 A lot of wisdom flowing here today. 719 00:43:28,240 --> 00:43:29,920 We're about out of time. 720 00:43:29,920 --> 00:43:34,640 I just want to thank you for all of this and for being willing to share. 721 00:43:34,640 --> 00:43:39,120 I know it is taking you way, way out of your comfort zone. 722 00:43:39,120 --> 00:43:43,440 Are there any last thoughts that you'd like to leave with the listeners? 723 00:43:43,440 --> 00:43:45,240 There's a lot of things I would like to say. 724 00:43:45,240 --> 00:43:48,040 Let's try to narrow it down. 725 00:43:48,040 --> 00:43:53,880 I think the most important thing is to be willing to listen. 726 00:43:53,880 --> 00:43:59,760 Humble yourself to the point where you can listen and start reading your scriptures and 727 00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:02,840 open your mind to other possibilities. 728 00:44:02,840 --> 00:44:06,120 What we're being told by the world is wrong. 729 00:44:06,120 --> 00:44:10,320 I'd say about 98% of everything you're hearing out there is wrong. 730 00:44:10,320 --> 00:44:16,080 Ignore the chatter and listen and never doubt and believe with everything that's in you. 731 00:44:16,080 --> 00:44:21,680 Have a hold of it with all the energy you have in your heart and never doubt. 732 00:44:21,680 --> 00:44:23,680 Those miracles will happen. 733 00:44:23,680 --> 00:44:27,240 The Lord has promised us that he will do those things worse. 734 00:44:27,240 --> 00:44:28,720 And I don't doubt him. 735 00:44:28,720 --> 00:44:30,320 Not for a second. 736 00:44:30,320 --> 00:44:32,160 You've had a really rough life. 737 00:44:32,160 --> 00:44:34,600 How much fear do you have of death? 738 00:44:34,600 --> 00:44:35,600 Zero. 739 00:44:35,600 --> 00:44:37,440 I look forward to it. 740 00:44:37,440 --> 00:44:38,880 I want to go home. 741 00:44:38,880 --> 00:44:42,520 All my family, I'm the last surviving member of my family. 742 00:44:42,520 --> 00:44:46,320 All my aunts and uncles and most of my cousins have all passed away. 743 00:44:46,320 --> 00:44:47,760 My mother and my father are both gone. 744 00:44:47,760 --> 00:44:50,840 My father, I'm glad he's gone, but my mother hurt me. 745 00:44:50,840 --> 00:44:52,360 It took a lot out of him. 746 00:44:52,360 --> 00:44:54,920 I was relieved that her suffering was over. 747 00:44:54,920 --> 00:44:56,920 She died from Alzheimer's. 748 00:44:56,920 --> 00:44:58,960 I was relieved her suffering was over. 749 00:44:58,960 --> 00:45:01,160 But there's still many times I need her at council. 750 00:45:01,160 --> 00:45:02,760 My grandfather's waiting for me. 751 00:45:02,760 --> 00:45:06,760 And I know he's one of my guardian angels because one of the things he said just before 752 00:45:06,760 --> 00:45:09,360 he died, he says, when I die, I won't leave you. 753 00:45:09,360 --> 00:45:13,400 And if anybody hurts you, they'll have to deal with me. 754 00:45:13,400 --> 00:45:20,680 And my grandfather was a tall man and he was a guy that he met business. 755 00:45:20,680 --> 00:45:25,040 I look forward to going home and being with those people again. 756 00:45:25,040 --> 00:45:27,080 I don't fear any human being. 757 00:45:27,080 --> 00:45:31,560 I've met some really, really bad people, dangerous people. 758 00:45:31,560 --> 00:45:36,920 They don't scare me because one day just like me, they'll have to stand in front of the 759 00:45:36,920 --> 00:45:37,920 savior. 760 00:45:37,920 --> 00:45:40,720 And I don't fear any pain I have to go through and die. 761 00:45:40,720 --> 00:45:45,880 We'll be short-lived because the love of Jesus Christ will make up for that when I'm home. 762 00:45:45,880 --> 00:45:47,440 And it will be a very special day. 763 00:45:47,440 --> 00:45:49,880 And I look forward to that. 764 00:45:49,880 --> 00:45:52,800 So as far as death, I don't fear. 765 00:45:52,800 --> 00:45:53,800 It's a beautiful place. 766 00:45:53,800 --> 00:45:56,080 It's such a beautiful place. 767 00:45:56,080 --> 00:45:57,440 You would do anything. 768 00:45:57,440 --> 00:46:00,920 If you knew what it looked like, you would do anything in a world to get there. 769 00:46:00,920 --> 00:46:02,800 You would make any sacrifice. 770 00:46:02,800 --> 00:46:06,000 Absolutely, any sacrifice to get there. 771 00:46:06,000 --> 00:46:08,000 Shabby, thanks again. 772 00:46:08,000 --> 00:46:10,480 I have a feeling we'll be talking again soon. 773 00:46:10,480 --> 00:46:13,480 I hope so because I've enjoyed this. 774 00:46:13,480 --> 00:46:17,120 This has been difficult and my emotions have been all over the planet. 775 00:46:17,120 --> 00:46:20,440 I'm glad that you reached out to me. 776 00:46:20,440 --> 00:46:23,240 I hope there's a much time where we can share some more information. 777 00:46:23,240 --> 00:46:27,120 I've just scanned over the surface of so many things. 778 00:46:27,120 --> 00:46:28,120 Well done. 779 00:46:28,120 --> 00:46:31,160 We'll take a deeper dive. 780 00:46:31,160 --> 00:46:33,960 Thanks again for listening and sharing this podcast. 781 00:46:33,960 --> 00:46:40,040 Don't forget to hit the follow or subscribe button and sign up for our newsletter at roundtriptest.com. 782 00:46:40,040 --> 00:46:44,320 If you want to share your near-death experience or if you have questions or comments about 783 00:46:44,320 --> 00:46:48,640 the show, send an email to eric at roundtriptest.com. 784 00:46:48,640 --> 00:47:12,240 Until then, I wish you everything good that you're looking for in this life and the next.