1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:08,400 From the time that they pronounced me deaf was a good 45 minutes. 2 00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:13,440 They cut my clothes and then they paddled my heart, my heart had stopped. 3 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:18,120 And I could see people screaming and crying, but I didn't realize that was actually my 4 00:00:18,120 --> 00:00:21,320 physical body because I was somewhere else. 5 00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:27,400 The only thing that I could feel, if you could imagine, absolute love and peace, there wasn't 6 00:00:27,400 --> 00:00:29,400 anything else to be felt. 7 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:32,520 I was greeted by people I'd known in the past. 8 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:34,160 I'm back home again. 9 00:00:34,160 --> 00:00:38,560 Incredibly safe and felt at home. 10 00:00:38,560 --> 00:00:41,200 Welcome, welcome everybody to Round Trip Death. 11 00:00:41,200 --> 00:00:43,640 And to our special guest today, Brie Lafferty. 12 00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:44,600 How are you, Brie? 13 00:00:44,600 --> 00:00:45,920 I am fantastic. 14 00:00:45,920 --> 00:00:47,720 Thank you so much for asking. 15 00:00:47,720 --> 00:00:51,520 It is fun to have a listener of the show on. 16 00:00:51,520 --> 00:00:58,920 Yeah, I was actually directed to the show through one of my followers and became a huge fan. 17 00:00:58,920 --> 00:01:01,840 The stories were just so powerful. 18 00:01:01,840 --> 00:01:03,960 So I'm really excited to be here. 19 00:01:03,960 --> 00:01:08,800 Well does it feel weird to be on that side of it with a camera in your face now? 20 00:01:08,800 --> 00:01:11,600 A little bit, yeah. 21 00:01:11,600 --> 00:01:17,520 Okay, a few people that I've met in person that had only heard me on the show, they're 22 00:01:17,520 --> 00:01:22,360 like, it is so weird hearing your voice come out of a real person here. 23 00:01:22,360 --> 00:01:24,600 Hopefully that's not the case for you. 24 00:01:24,600 --> 00:01:30,600 You know, I think I had a pretty good idea between listening to you on the podcast, our 25 00:01:30,600 --> 00:01:34,040 brief phone call, and seeing you today. 26 00:01:34,040 --> 00:01:35,960 So I'm not too shocked. 27 00:01:35,960 --> 00:01:36,960 Good. 28 00:01:36,960 --> 00:01:38,720 I would hate to be too scary. 29 00:01:38,720 --> 00:01:41,120 Hey, tell us a little bit about you. 30 00:01:41,120 --> 00:01:42,120 Who's Brie? 31 00:01:42,120 --> 00:01:49,800 Yeah, so after my interesting experiences, I became a death and spiritual doula, which 32 00:01:49,800 --> 00:01:52,720 I've been pursuing for a couple of years. 33 00:01:52,720 --> 00:01:57,200 And I am also now an award-winning author twice over, two out of my three books, and 34 00:01:57,200 --> 00:01:59,400 my third book is up for an award. 35 00:01:59,400 --> 00:02:00,400 Congratulations. 36 00:02:00,400 --> 00:02:01,400 Thank you. 37 00:02:01,400 --> 00:02:02,600 And where do you live? 38 00:02:02,600 --> 00:02:04,960 I'm on the western slope of Colorado. 39 00:02:04,960 --> 00:02:07,760 I've heard this term death doula for a while. 40 00:02:07,760 --> 00:02:10,080 I know what a birth doula is. 41 00:02:10,080 --> 00:02:12,520 Tell me a little bit about what a death doula does. 42 00:02:12,520 --> 00:02:16,600 Sure, the simple way is I'm a midwife, the afterlife. 43 00:02:16,600 --> 00:02:18,880 That rhymes, very good. 44 00:02:18,880 --> 00:02:20,880 Thank you. 45 00:02:20,880 --> 00:02:23,560 Birth doulas help transition life into the world. 46 00:02:23,560 --> 00:02:28,720 I help with the transition out of it as a death doula, and I help people birth into 47 00:02:28,720 --> 00:02:31,680 their authentic spiritual selves as a spiritual doula. 48 00:02:31,680 --> 00:02:39,800 So it's really just a non-medical, holistic support person helping with these most difficult 49 00:02:39,800 --> 00:02:41,440 transitions of our lives. 50 00:02:41,440 --> 00:02:46,280 Hey, we're going to get into your NDE in a second, but I'm just curious about this. 51 00:02:46,280 --> 00:02:53,280 So if anybody else isn't, skip ahead a couple of minutes, but to cure my curiosity, tell 52 00:02:53,280 --> 00:02:59,640 me how do you get into it, and how do you know how to help people? 53 00:02:59,640 --> 00:03:02,200 And have you had any interesting stories happen? 54 00:03:02,200 --> 00:03:03,760 Yeah, absolutely. 55 00:03:03,760 --> 00:03:10,720 So my background is actually an instruction, and after my near-death experience, I was 56 00:03:10,720 --> 00:03:18,680 really drawn to death and dying, and not necessarily in the romanticized way, but kind of in a 57 00:03:18,680 --> 00:03:20,480 jealous way, honestly. 58 00:03:20,480 --> 00:03:27,160 I really wanted to go back and get as close as I could to where I just come from. 59 00:03:27,160 --> 00:03:32,840 And I knew that I could help people in that difficult transition by being authentically 60 00:03:32,840 --> 00:03:33,840 excited for them. 61 00:03:33,840 --> 00:03:35,520 You know, I didn't have to share my story. 62 00:03:35,520 --> 00:03:39,120 I didn't have to, you know, explain myself at all. 63 00:03:39,120 --> 00:03:43,400 I just got to hold authentic energy for people transitioning. 64 00:03:43,400 --> 00:03:47,920 And sometimes that's really what they need, especially, you know, tons of stuff is going 65 00:03:47,920 --> 00:03:48,920 on medically. 66 00:03:48,920 --> 00:03:53,480 Families, you know, can have all sorts of different types of emotions. 67 00:03:53,480 --> 00:03:54,480 There's a lot going on. 68 00:03:54,480 --> 00:04:01,800 So just to be a stable, authentic, excited, happy person, I felt like I could bring a 69 00:04:01,800 --> 00:04:02,800 lot of value. 70 00:04:02,800 --> 00:04:04,400 I'm also young. 71 00:04:04,400 --> 00:04:10,120 I'm in my 30s, so I bring a new fresh face to kind of the death and dying industry. 72 00:04:10,120 --> 00:04:16,920 You know, a lot of people in hospice or other death do as, at least up until the last few 73 00:04:16,920 --> 00:04:21,480 years have been, you know, retired RNs, retired nurses. 74 00:04:21,480 --> 00:04:26,200 And to have young people really enter this field is really exciting. 75 00:04:26,200 --> 00:04:32,240 Really opens up the community for accepting talking about death and dying. 76 00:04:32,240 --> 00:04:36,440 It's a really scary subject for a lot of our, our society. 77 00:04:36,440 --> 00:04:43,360 So bringing this authentic, excited energy without being, you know, this morbid, gothic 78 00:04:43,360 --> 00:04:46,640 or older person has been really, really exciting. 79 00:04:46,640 --> 00:04:54,080 I started as a hospice volunteer and I did that for two years and had incredible stories, 80 00:04:54,080 --> 00:04:55,760 you know, tons of them. 81 00:04:55,760 --> 00:05:00,800 Then when I last corporate America, I found a thing called a death dola found out I could 82 00:05:00,800 --> 00:05:07,000 do so much more than I could as a volunteer in hospice and help people anywhere from couples 83 00:05:07,000 --> 00:05:11,840 my age into people in their 80s and 90s who are actively dying. 84 00:05:11,840 --> 00:05:12,840 Everything in between. 85 00:05:12,840 --> 00:05:14,080 How do people find you? 86 00:05:14,080 --> 00:05:15,080 Yeah. 87 00:05:15,080 --> 00:05:20,360 So a lot of people reach out to me through, I'm on social media, I've got a website. 88 00:05:20,360 --> 00:05:25,440 And we'll stick that in the show notes, but I just, I just meant in general, is it like 89 00:05:25,440 --> 00:05:31,080 does hospice recommend you or because if people haven't heard of a death dola, how do they 90 00:05:31,080 --> 00:05:32,800 even know to look for one? 91 00:05:32,800 --> 00:05:33,800 Yeah. 92 00:05:33,800 --> 00:05:37,080 So I do a lot of just education with content. 93 00:05:37,080 --> 00:05:39,360 So that is being active in the community. 94 00:05:39,360 --> 00:05:46,320 I give presentations on all sorts of things revolving around end of life challenges, advanced 95 00:05:46,320 --> 00:05:52,600 directives, all the cool, low cost, green alternative ways that you can later, your body when you're 96 00:05:52,600 --> 00:05:53,600 done with it. 97 00:05:53,600 --> 00:05:58,720 Okay, we're not getting into that human composting thing here today. 98 00:05:58,720 --> 00:06:01,160 Maybe some other time. 99 00:06:01,160 --> 00:06:03,640 So yeah, I just give a lot of presentations. 100 00:06:03,640 --> 00:06:05,120 It's a lot of networking. 101 00:06:05,120 --> 00:06:11,600 I've got a lot of experience as my role as a business, business development person and 102 00:06:11,600 --> 00:06:14,560 marketing professional in construction. 103 00:06:14,560 --> 00:06:18,480 So I utilize some of those skills to help me get the word out about what a death dola 104 00:06:18,480 --> 00:06:19,480 is. 105 00:06:19,480 --> 00:06:21,040 And then of course, social media is awesome. 106 00:06:21,040 --> 00:06:26,320 I do post in lives and events and stuff there as well. 107 00:06:26,320 --> 00:06:27,320 Okay. 108 00:06:27,320 --> 00:06:30,160 I'm sorry, I will admit I haven't seen those, but I will look them up. 109 00:06:30,160 --> 00:06:32,240 No, I can't wait. 110 00:06:32,240 --> 00:06:38,920 I know nurse Hadley who you've probably heard we had on about a year ago and a hospice nurse 111 00:06:38,920 --> 00:06:42,120 and she was awesome, had great stories. 112 00:06:42,120 --> 00:06:47,160 So last my last question before we get into your story, do you have one that you want 113 00:06:47,160 --> 00:06:50,400 to share with us of someone that you've helped her worked with? 114 00:06:50,400 --> 00:07:00,680 Yeah, probably the, the one that really hit me was one of my first, not really my patient, 115 00:07:00,680 --> 00:07:02,360 but I was assigned to her. 116 00:07:02,360 --> 00:07:08,480 She was in the memory ward and I saw her every week, her inner husband, her husband was always 117 00:07:08,480 --> 00:07:12,520 there and her husband was losing her. 118 00:07:12,520 --> 00:07:16,720 So with dementia, you lose them twice and it's really hard. 119 00:07:16,720 --> 00:07:23,560 And the amount of love he had for her was something just indescribable. 120 00:07:23,560 --> 00:07:28,880 And Puskas was great, you know, being a volunteer, they taught me all about death and dying, 121 00:07:28,880 --> 00:07:34,640 the process, you know, kind of what to, you might see, you know, with people passing some 122 00:07:34,640 --> 00:07:39,360 of the things they see and report and just some of the magic that happens. 123 00:07:39,360 --> 00:07:44,720 And of course, the hard parts, what the body looks like, what they go through. 124 00:07:44,720 --> 00:07:49,840 What I was not prepared for was what the family members go through. 125 00:07:49,840 --> 00:07:54,880 And her husband was so destroyed, it was getting really, really close to the end. 126 00:07:54,880 --> 00:08:03,680 I think this happened a few weeks before she transitioned completely and he was just devastated. 127 00:08:03,680 --> 00:08:08,440 And that really tore me up and I had no idea how much that would turn me up. 128 00:08:08,440 --> 00:08:15,520 But the beautiful thing that happened at the same time was I was a pet therapy team. 129 00:08:15,520 --> 00:08:21,280 So I had my little, she was my service dog and I got her certified as a therapy dog. 130 00:08:21,280 --> 00:08:26,480 So we went in and the people would always light up. 131 00:08:26,480 --> 00:08:30,880 They might not be able to communicate, but they would light up when they saw my dog. 132 00:08:30,880 --> 00:08:34,320 I wouldn't say it was me, it was mostly my dog. 133 00:08:34,320 --> 00:08:41,040 And you're not supposed to let the patients hold, you know, the dog by themselves or the 134 00:08:41,040 --> 00:08:46,600 leash and there's a lot of rules around it just to protect the patients and the dog. 135 00:08:46,600 --> 00:08:49,400 But this gal held on the leash. 136 00:08:49,400 --> 00:08:53,400 She really wanted to hold the leash of this, my little dog. 137 00:08:53,400 --> 00:09:00,240 And she fell asleep, blaspheming it so tight and just the list on her face and she just 138 00:09:00,240 --> 00:09:05,480 passed out in the communal room holding the leash to my dog. 139 00:09:05,480 --> 00:09:12,360 And it was such an interesting moment where I realized grief is not a cycle. 140 00:09:12,360 --> 00:09:18,400 It is a web because you don't go through one emotion then another, then another, then another. 141 00:09:18,400 --> 00:09:23,400 You can have two, three, all of them, none of them, all at the same time. 142 00:09:23,400 --> 00:09:31,040 So that was really, a really eye opening for me was this very positive negative experience 143 00:09:31,040 --> 00:09:32,680 at the same time. 144 00:09:32,680 --> 00:09:38,120 So is your job more to help the person that is in those final stages of life or to help 145 00:09:38,120 --> 00:09:40,000 the family or is it kind of equal? 146 00:09:40,000 --> 00:09:46,200 Yeah, as a death to Julia, I found myself helping way more family members than actually 147 00:09:46,200 --> 00:09:48,080 the people transitioning. 148 00:09:48,080 --> 00:09:52,840 I thought I would be doing what I did as a hospice volunteer and sitting with the people 149 00:09:52,840 --> 00:09:58,920 who are actively dying, but it has gone so in a such direct, different direction than 150 00:09:58,920 --> 00:09:59,920 I thought. 151 00:09:59,920 --> 00:10:06,680 And I would say 98% of my work is helping the family. 152 00:10:06,680 --> 00:10:08,600 All right, enough about that. 153 00:10:08,600 --> 00:10:11,400 Let's talk about you. 154 00:10:11,400 --> 00:10:13,560 You had a very different kind of experience. 155 00:10:13,560 --> 00:10:20,000 Seems like I say that all the time because no two are alike, but tell me what was going 156 00:10:20,000 --> 00:10:21,840 on with your health growing up. 157 00:10:21,840 --> 00:10:23,960 I know you were a sick little girl. 158 00:10:23,960 --> 00:10:30,240 Yeah, so I started experiencing really weird symptoms at the age of 10. 159 00:10:30,240 --> 00:10:33,160 So we had just moved, made a big move. 160 00:10:33,160 --> 00:10:37,240 I started middle school probably way too early. 161 00:10:37,240 --> 00:10:43,880 Fifth grade was in middle school or junior high and I was young for my grade. 162 00:10:43,880 --> 00:10:49,680 So I was kind of thrown into this big, big girl world in a small girl body. 163 00:10:49,680 --> 00:10:55,240 So there was a lot going on and the first couple of years, we kind of didn't pay much 164 00:10:55,240 --> 00:10:59,920 attention to these symptoms because they were odd and there was a lot going on and it could 165 00:10:59,920 --> 00:11:01,280 be growing pains. 166 00:11:01,280 --> 00:11:07,080 So the first thing that started happening was my forearms and my calves and my arches 167 00:11:07,080 --> 00:11:12,040 of my feet and my palms would cramp really bad. 168 00:11:12,040 --> 00:11:15,320 And you know, my parents are just like, oh, it's probably growing pains. 169 00:11:15,320 --> 00:11:18,880 You know, your dad's tall, maybe you'll be tall. 170 00:11:18,880 --> 00:11:26,360 And within the probably a year, if not a few months after that, I started getting involuntary 171 00:11:26,360 --> 00:11:29,560 muscle movements of my left arm. 172 00:11:29,560 --> 00:11:32,720 And I would do, it would do this like flutter thing and I'd have no control of it, but 173 00:11:32,720 --> 00:11:33,720 I have long hair. 174 00:11:33,720 --> 00:11:37,360 So I just pretended I was playing with my hair and kind of hit it. 175 00:11:37,360 --> 00:11:42,680 The cramping got so bad that I, I wrapped my arms and legs and east bandages and hit 176 00:11:42,680 --> 00:11:44,840 them under my clothes at school. 177 00:11:44,840 --> 00:11:51,320 But nothing of this was too much of a concern until I got to be about 14. 178 00:11:51,320 --> 00:11:59,880 And at the time I was 14, my muscle, I had voluntary muscle movements were now in both 179 00:11:59,880 --> 00:12:02,200 my arms and my legs. 180 00:12:02,200 --> 00:12:07,560 And I also added in where I would just shiver for like 20 minutes. 181 00:12:07,560 --> 00:12:12,040 And my grandma swore I was freezing and they tried to cover me up and I'm not, I'm not 182 00:12:12,040 --> 00:12:17,680 cold, they did not as allergic reaction, but I would just tremor so bad. 183 00:12:17,680 --> 00:12:24,520 The muscle cramping also started to affect my back and I started developing nerve pain. 184 00:12:24,520 --> 00:12:29,480 So all of these symptoms combined were starting to become a concern. 185 00:12:29,480 --> 00:12:31,720 I grew up in a medical family. 186 00:12:31,720 --> 00:12:37,080 My grandpa was a doctor and he had no idea what was going on. 187 00:12:37,080 --> 00:12:42,640 And so we've finally started to see some different doctors and the first one was on the right 188 00:12:42,640 --> 00:12:48,960 track, you know, and we dismissed, we dismissed him because he wanted to put me on a benzo 189 00:12:48,960 --> 00:12:51,400 at 14 or 15 years old. 190 00:12:51,400 --> 00:12:55,360 And when he suggested that my mom said, well, we don't even have a diagnosis. 191 00:12:55,360 --> 00:13:01,360 Let's, let's hold off, you know, she luckily knew how dangerous benzos could be, you know, 192 00:13:01,360 --> 00:13:07,600 any other parent with no medical knowledge might have agreed to that and, you know, looking 193 00:13:07,600 --> 00:13:09,680 back that could have been detrimental. 194 00:13:09,680 --> 00:13:14,960 But he wanted to put me on a benzo, benzo-depot diazepine. 195 00:13:14,960 --> 00:13:19,160 And when we went to schedule another appointment, they said he was leaving the office and his 196 00:13:19,160 --> 00:13:21,540 partner wasn't taking any of his patients. 197 00:13:21,540 --> 00:13:28,040 So he was willing to put a 14 or 15 year old on a benzo diazepine without a diagnosis 198 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:29,640 and not following me. 199 00:13:29,640 --> 00:13:34,760 So we just ignored everything he said because how can you trust anything that came out of 200 00:13:34,760 --> 00:13:35,760 his mouth? 201 00:13:35,760 --> 00:13:36,760 Yeah. 202 00:13:36,760 --> 00:13:37,760 Yeah, that's scary. 203 00:13:37,760 --> 00:13:38,760 Yeah. 204 00:13:38,760 --> 00:13:47,240 So we went on, you know, another four year search for a diagnosis and answer. 205 00:13:47,240 --> 00:13:50,440 And it was the symptoms kept progressing. 206 00:13:50,440 --> 00:13:52,640 I was an extreme insomniac. 207 00:13:52,640 --> 00:13:58,600 I mean, one hour a night, if I was lucky, sometimes zero hours for two or three days. 208 00:13:58,600 --> 00:14:03,120 So extreme anxiety, extreme depression set in, OCD. 209 00:14:03,120 --> 00:14:06,160 I have weird things going on with my body. 210 00:14:06,160 --> 00:14:10,600 I am a teenager in puberty as a girl. 211 00:14:10,600 --> 00:14:13,800 I'm in a new place. 212 00:14:13,800 --> 00:14:17,200 And so all of these things just kind of really converged. 213 00:14:17,200 --> 00:14:18,840 And I was a wreck. 214 00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:21,760 So we just tried different medications. 215 00:14:21,760 --> 00:14:26,440 We tried holistic practices, alternative medicine, Chinese herbs. 216 00:14:26,440 --> 00:14:30,240 I mean, basically whatever my mom could get her hands on, we tried. 217 00:14:30,240 --> 00:14:32,200 And nothing really helped. 218 00:14:32,200 --> 00:14:38,560 I finally got a diagnosis at 18 and we thought with a diagnosis would come answers and it 219 00:14:38,560 --> 00:14:39,560 didn't. 220 00:14:39,560 --> 00:14:44,280 It did that being a very rare neurological movement disorder. 221 00:14:44,280 --> 00:14:50,840 And last I looked it up was last August in 2023 and still only one in a million people 222 00:14:50,840 --> 00:14:51,840 have this condition. 223 00:14:51,840 --> 00:14:52,840 Wow. 224 00:14:52,840 --> 00:14:53,840 What's it called? 225 00:14:53,840 --> 00:14:54,840 Bioclonus dystonia. 226 00:14:54,840 --> 00:14:55,840 Okay. 227 00:14:55,840 --> 00:14:58,640 There will not be a quiz at the end. 228 00:14:58,640 --> 00:14:59,640 Good. 229 00:14:59,640 --> 00:15:01,800 Nor a spelling beyond how to spell it. 230 00:15:01,800 --> 00:15:04,080 Well, it took me here to learn how to pronounce it. 231 00:15:04,080 --> 00:15:05,080 So. 232 00:15:05,080 --> 00:15:10,720 Suffice it to say very rare neurological disease going on. 233 00:15:10,720 --> 00:15:12,960 And something that rare they usually don't have. 234 00:15:12,960 --> 00:15:15,200 Hey, here's the pill you take for it. 235 00:15:15,200 --> 00:15:16,200 Yeah. 236 00:15:16,200 --> 00:15:20,160 So, and by the time I was diagnosed, everything they would have tried me on even with the 237 00:15:20,160 --> 00:15:22,080 diagnosis we had already tried. 238 00:15:22,080 --> 00:15:28,240 You know, we tried stuff for the muscle cramps stuff for the non-epileptic myoclonic seizures, 239 00:15:28,240 --> 00:15:34,680 the twitches, the tremors, the pain, the anxiety, the depression, you know, we tried 240 00:15:34,680 --> 00:15:36,720 pharmaceuticals for all of it. 241 00:15:36,720 --> 00:15:40,720 My mom and I wrote a book called Wired to Be Disfunctional, our journey with myoclonus 242 00:15:40,720 --> 00:15:41,880 dystonia. 243 00:15:41,880 --> 00:15:46,200 In the last 10 pages, it goes through every single medication I tried. 244 00:15:46,200 --> 00:15:50,800 And that's 10 pages worth of different medications and their side effects. 245 00:15:50,800 --> 00:15:51,800 Wow. 246 00:15:51,800 --> 00:15:59,520 Well, we had also heard about a brain surgery that was possible, but it was shweringly experimental. 247 00:15:59,520 --> 00:16:06,080 The neurologist that ended up diagnosing me said, no one in this clinic, a pretty well-known 248 00:16:06,080 --> 00:16:10,640 clinic in Denver has seen anybody has any patients with this. 249 00:16:10,640 --> 00:16:16,360 So we are not going to put a 18-year-old through experimental brain surgery, you know, 250 00:16:16,360 --> 00:16:19,040 just do your best, basically. 251 00:16:19,040 --> 00:16:22,600 So did they tell you this was going to be something lethal or something that you would 252 00:16:22,600 --> 00:16:24,760 just bother you forever or what? 253 00:16:24,760 --> 00:16:25,760 Yeah. 254 00:16:25,760 --> 00:16:29,040 So there are lethal forms of myoclonus dystonia. 255 00:16:29,040 --> 00:16:30,040 It's called progressive. 256 00:16:30,040 --> 00:16:32,200 Oh my gosh, I don't know. 257 00:16:32,200 --> 00:16:34,320 But there are lethal forms of it. 258 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:38,480 They did not think mine was, but they also said mine wasn't progressive. 259 00:16:38,480 --> 00:16:44,480 And yet every year it progressed and progressed and progressed and progressed. 260 00:16:44,480 --> 00:16:51,400 So, you know, at this point I had been misdiagnosed a bunch of times by the time I was 18 and 261 00:16:51,400 --> 00:16:58,240 been put on so many medications that I reacted to and I just lost faith in the medical industry 262 00:16:58,240 --> 00:17:02,960 and I didn't care what they said, whether they said it was lethal or not. 263 00:17:02,960 --> 00:17:04,640 I was absolutely positive. 264 00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:07,440 I was going to die before I returned 28. 265 00:17:07,440 --> 00:17:09,360 I just knew it in my heart. 266 00:17:09,360 --> 00:17:14,840 I told my mom that since starting at 14 or 15 as well that I was going to die. 267 00:17:14,840 --> 00:17:18,640 I was going to die young and I was okay with it. 268 00:17:18,640 --> 00:17:22,720 So I also faced my own mortality from a young age, which also led me into being a death 269 00:17:22,720 --> 00:17:25,200 doula later on. 270 00:17:25,200 --> 00:17:28,240 So let's jump up to from 18. 271 00:17:28,240 --> 00:17:32,200 Is there much that happened between then and when you were 26? 272 00:17:32,200 --> 00:17:33,600 If not, let's jump to that. 273 00:17:33,600 --> 00:17:34,600 Yep. 274 00:17:34,600 --> 00:17:36,920 I was just about two because it kind of stagged me. 275 00:17:36,920 --> 00:17:41,560 For the next six years, just me trying to do my best. 276 00:17:41,560 --> 00:17:45,040 So kind of gave up on any treatment. 277 00:17:45,040 --> 00:17:46,040 But my mom did. 278 00:17:46,040 --> 00:17:47,720 My mom never did. 279 00:17:47,720 --> 00:17:57,360 And when I reached 26, I had actually moved to a whole other state because I figured I 280 00:17:57,360 --> 00:17:59,800 was going to die and I would die there. 281 00:17:59,800 --> 00:18:01,640 And it was just that knowing. 282 00:18:01,640 --> 00:18:08,840 But my mom, she, she found another treatment option that we tried and I ended up coming 283 00:18:08,840 --> 00:18:12,320 on top of my illness already, which my body's fatigued. 284 00:18:12,320 --> 00:18:13,320 It's hurting. 285 00:18:13,320 --> 00:18:14,320 My soul hurts. 286 00:18:14,320 --> 00:18:20,800 My mind hurts and prayed to God, screened to God as a teenager and no answers, no help. 287 00:18:20,800 --> 00:18:28,280 So I was very broken at this point and I ended up getting flu, really flu like symptoms. 288 00:18:28,280 --> 00:18:32,080 And they got so bad that I could not hold down water. 289 00:18:32,080 --> 00:18:34,000 I can't hold down food. 290 00:18:34,000 --> 00:18:35,400 I was really tired. 291 00:18:35,400 --> 00:18:36,680 I was really sick. 292 00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:39,440 But of course I had no trust in the medical community. 293 00:18:39,440 --> 00:18:43,920 So I wasn't going to go see a doctor about it and tell them it's, you know, a holistic 294 00:18:43,920 --> 00:18:44,920 alternative treatment. 295 00:18:44,920 --> 00:18:48,280 They're just going to, you know, throw more labels at me. 296 00:18:48,280 --> 00:18:51,400 So I figured I would deal with it. 297 00:18:51,400 --> 00:18:57,360 This went on for two or three weeks and leading up to it, I couldn't sleep. 298 00:18:57,360 --> 00:18:58,720 I was really, really sick. 299 00:18:58,720 --> 00:19:01,480 I just was exhausted. 300 00:19:01,480 --> 00:19:09,520 And on the night of April 27th, 2017 at two in the morning, I gave up. 301 00:19:09,520 --> 00:19:13,080 I called out to whatever God there was. 302 00:19:13,080 --> 00:19:19,120 I had no idea who it was, but I basically was thinking and calling out from my soul, 303 00:19:19,120 --> 00:19:24,440 my heart, my mind, my body, absolutely everything. 304 00:19:24,440 --> 00:19:26,280 I can't do this anymore. 305 00:19:26,280 --> 00:19:27,680 It's in your hands. 306 00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:29,600 If you're out there, it's up to you. 307 00:19:29,600 --> 00:19:31,280 I am done. 308 00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:37,400 And growing up, I was told, you know, surrender to God, but no one tells you what that means. 309 00:19:37,400 --> 00:19:39,560 And that night I found out I surrendered. 310 00:19:39,560 --> 00:19:41,560 I gave up. 311 00:19:41,560 --> 00:19:42,560 My body gave up. 312 00:19:42,560 --> 00:19:43,560 My soul gave up. 313 00:19:43,560 --> 00:19:44,720 Everything gave up. 314 00:19:44,720 --> 00:19:48,560 And in that moment, everything was ripped. 315 00:19:48,560 --> 00:19:51,060 There were, there was silence. 316 00:19:51,060 --> 00:19:52,240 There was peace. 317 00:19:52,240 --> 00:19:54,240 There was no pain. 318 00:19:54,240 --> 00:19:55,280 It was calm. 319 00:19:55,280 --> 00:19:56,920 It was serenity. 320 00:19:56,920 --> 00:20:02,040 The only time in my life, I remember it being that supreme. 321 00:20:02,040 --> 00:20:06,240 And right after that, I heard this big booming voice. 322 00:20:06,240 --> 00:20:07,640 Are you ready? 323 00:20:07,640 --> 00:20:08,760 Something just happened. 324 00:20:08,760 --> 00:20:11,160 I didn't hesitate to say yes. 325 00:20:11,160 --> 00:20:16,800 And in that, I felt three really hard pounds on my chest and I felt my heart stop. 326 00:20:16,800 --> 00:20:19,680 And I was detached from my body. 327 00:20:19,680 --> 00:20:24,000 And that is the beginning of what is a profound experience. 328 00:20:24,000 --> 00:20:25,640 Wow. 329 00:20:25,640 --> 00:20:30,960 I just want to make sure we're clear in case somebody wasn't listening closely enough. 330 00:20:30,960 --> 00:20:33,680 This is not suicide, right? 331 00:20:33,680 --> 00:20:34,960 But it is. 332 00:20:34,960 --> 00:20:35,960 I give up. 333 00:20:35,960 --> 00:20:37,640 I can't do it any longer. 334 00:20:37,640 --> 00:20:38,640 And I get it. 335 00:20:38,640 --> 00:20:40,720 I mean, this has been the majority of your life. 336 00:20:40,720 --> 00:20:41,720 Yeah. 337 00:20:41,720 --> 00:20:43,280 And so you say you surrendered. 338 00:20:43,280 --> 00:20:44,280 Okay. 339 00:20:44,280 --> 00:20:47,480 I guess we'll have to figure out exactly what that means. 340 00:20:47,480 --> 00:20:48,480 Yeah. 341 00:20:48,480 --> 00:20:53,600 It's still hard to put words to it other than, I think, I think I could compare it to somebody 342 00:20:53,600 --> 00:20:59,960 swimming in the ocean and, you know, being stuck and not seeing land anywhere near them. 343 00:20:59,960 --> 00:21:00,960 They're exhausted. 344 00:21:00,960 --> 00:21:03,640 They've been treading water in high waves. 345 00:21:03,640 --> 00:21:04,640 It's cold. 346 00:21:04,640 --> 00:21:05,640 They're tired. 347 00:21:05,640 --> 00:21:11,200 They've been stranded for days, not weeks, however long someone can survive. 348 00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:15,960 And when they give up knowing that giving up means they die, that's the closest I can 349 00:21:15,960 --> 00:21:19,120 explain to that, is you just stop. 350 00:21:19,120 --> 00:21:21,600 I think that's a good explanation. 351 00:21:21,600 --> 00:21:23,080 Giving up is not suicide. 352 00:21:23,080 --> 00:21:27,000 That's a different thing, but giving up. 353 00:21:27,000 --> 00:21:28,240 All right. 354 00:21:28,240 --> 00:21:29,800 So go back a step. 355 00:21:29,800 --> 00:21:32,920 What were you feeling and what were you hearing? 356 00:21:32,920 --> 00:21:34,240 You said you heard something. 357 00:21:34,240 --> 00:21:35,240 Yeah. 358 00:21:35,240 --> 00:21:43,720 So at the moment I gave up, the moment I stopped treading the water I call life, I felt peace, 359 00:21:43,720 --> 00:21:52,840 extreme peace and serenity and stillness and no pain, no fear, no, just nothing negative. 360 00:21:52,840 --> 00:21:54,480 And it was amazing. 361 00:21:54,480 --> 00:21:58,760 It was almost as if heaven had entered the room. 362 00:21:58,760 --> 00:22:05,080 And with that, the voice, a big, booming voice, and I, you know, it wasn't external. 363 00:22:05,080 --> 00:22:06,080 It wasn't internal. 364 00:22:06,080 --> 00:22:08,400 It was just ever present. 365 00:22:08,400 --> 00:22:10,880 And I would say it sounded masculine. 366 00:22:10,880 --> 00:22:12,920 Asked, are you ready? 367 00:22:12,920 --> 00:22:16,880 Just those words, and I didn't hesitate to think about what that meant or what I was 368 00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:17,880 ready for. 369 00:22:17,880 --> 00:22:23,160 I just knew something had happened and I was absolutely ready for whatever was next. 370 00:22:23,160 --> 00:22:24,160 Okay. 371 00:22:24,160 --> 00:22:25,160 Keep going. 372 00:22:25,160 --> 00:22:26,160 All right. 373 00:22:26,160 --> 00:22:31,800 So as soon as I think yes, I feel those pounds of my heart and I'm detached from my body 374 00:22:31,800 --> 00:22:37,880 and I am just energy in this black void. 375 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:42,360 I call it a void even though it was not void of anything. 376 00:22:42,360 --> 00:22:44,000 It was everything. 377 00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:45,000 It was pure energy. 378 00:22:45,000 --> 00:22:51,440 But it was, you know, it was dark, I didn't see any light, but it was, it felt as if you 379 00:22:51,440 --> 00:23:00,120 could walk into those old static TV stations and it was just warm and love and energy. 380 00:23:00,120 --> 00:23:05,280 And in that, in that darkness, I understood the Creator to be there. 381 00:23:05,280 --> 00:23:12,080 I understood God, the, the being that saved me from whatever was just going on, which 382 00:23:12,080 --> 00:23:14,440 I was completely unaware of at this point. 383 00:23:14,440 --> 00:23:18,080 I didn't, I wasn't aware of a person named Brie. 384 00:23:18,080 --> 00:23:20,680 I wasn't aware of a place called earth. 385 00:23:20,680 --> 00:23:22,760 I wasn't aware of a body. 386 00:23:22,760 --> 00:23:25,200 And in this place, I had no body. 387 00:23:25,200 --> 00:23:31,600 And even though I was completely unaware of the human concept and where I'd just come 388 00:23:31,600 --> 00:23:37,560 from, some part of my conscious knew that I was dead. 389 00:23:37,560 --> 00:23:40,880 And so I had that thought, am I dead? 390 00:23:40,880 --> 00:23:46,880 And three months up here out of this darkness, just floating by, laughing at me. 391 00:23:46,880 --> 00:23:52,120 And I, you know, not mean, just like, oh, I feel only knew. 392 00:23:52,120 --> 00:23:53,880 And I just thought that was super curious. 393 00:23:53,880 --> 00:23:58,500 I didn't put any judgment into it and they've disappeared back into the darkness. 394 00:23:58,500 --> 00:24:03,080 It would take me another six years to realize they were laughing because there is no such 395 00:24:03,080 --> 00:24:04,960 thing as death. 396 00:24:04,960 --> 00:24:06,880 So it was a funny question. 397 00:24:06,880 --> 00:24:11,240 It was a funny thought because there is no such thing as death or dead. 398 00:24:11,240 --> 00:24:18,840 And after they fade into back into the darkness, I end up in this tunnel and I am going like 399 00:24:18,840 --> 00:24:24,680 supersonic hyper speed, warp speed, whatever, so fast. 400 00:24:24,680 --> 00:24:28,720 And it's the outside is filled with ones and zeros. 401 00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:31,000 And I'm still just a soul body at this point. 402 00:24:31,000 --> 00:24:36,520 And I know I'm being downloaded with so much important and amazing information. 403 00:24:36,520 --> 00:24:38,400 Not aware of what that information is. 404 00:24:38,400 --> 00:24:42,960 Just I knew I would, it would come to me when I needed it. 405 00:24:42,960 --> 00:24:44,240 And it was very cool. 406 00:24:44,240 --> 00:24:52,000 It was kind of horizontal and just most theory old blue with ones and zeros tons of binary 407 00:24:52,000 --> 00:24:54,800 code, which I could read binary code. 408 00:24:54,800 --> 00:24:58,720 Maybe I could go back and figure out what, what everything was saying. 409 00:24:58,720 --> 00:25:04,280 And after that, I end up in a white, white room. 410 00:25:04,280 --> 00:25:09,040 It's not really a room because there's no walls or floors or doors or walls, any of 411 00:25:09,040 --> 00:25:12,120 that, but if, you know, it's a space. 412 00:25:12,120 --> 00:25:17,040 And behind me is a cantel, it's a send in master teacher. 413 00:25:17,040 --> 00:25:18,040 And which one? 414 00:25:18,040 --> 00:25:19,160 I have no idea. 415 00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:24,960 I think it really depends on what your religious and cultural upbringing maybe is who you might 416 00:25:24,960 --> 00:25:25,960 experience. 417 00:25:25,960 --> 00:25:32,400 But for me, I would recognize someone like Jesus, just because I was raised in a Christian 418 00:25:32,400 --> 00:25:33,400 household. 419 00:25:33,400 --> 00:25:38,760 And in front of me is a pile of giant black numbers. 420 00:25:38,760 --> 00:25:43,080 And they're all just kind of piled up and they're one through nine. 421 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:49,080 And I grab them and I throw them up with childlike enthusiasm and go, no, what are you love 422 00:25:49,080 --> 00:25:51,000 creating these? 423 00:25:51,000 --> 00:25:53,960 Because I realized the universe was created with math. 424 00:25:53,960 --> 00:25:57,760 And for some reason I thought that was really exciting at that moment. 425 00:25:57,760 --> 00:26:03,280 Yeah, that's kind of different because some people wouldn't be excited at that. 426 00:26:03,280 --> 00:26:05,400 They'd go, oh, mass. 427 00:26:05,400 --> 00:26:06,600 I never liked mass. 428 00:26:06,600 --> 00:26:07,600 Yeah. 429 00:26:07,600 --> 00:26:12,560 I mean, I enjoyed that, but I never, you know, was super gun hoe. 430 00:26:12,560 --> 00:26:14,320 It wasn't my career. 431 00:26:14,320 --> 00:26:17,000 It was nothing like, you know, I wasn't a math nerd. 432 00:26:17,000 --> 00:26:22,480 I didn't join, gosh, there's tons of math clubs, you know, so for math and binary code 433 00:26:22,480 --> 00:26:28,920 and numbers to show up a few times through my experience is still kind of funny to me, 434 00:26:28,920 --> 00:26:35,200 especially because in the process of this disorder, along with some other brain injuries 435 00:26:35,200 --> 00:26:38,960 I've had along the way, I developed a satia for numbers. 436 00:26:38,960 --> 00:26:42,880 So I find that really ironic and hilarious. 437 00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:43,880 That really is. 438 00:26:43,880 --> 00:26:44,880 Yeah. 439 00:26:44,880 --> 00:26:49,200 That's, I don't know how to explain that, but that's okay. 440 00:26:49,200 --> 00:26:56,800 So after this excitement with the numbers, I end up in another place and this place is 441 00:26:56,800 --> 00:27:03,240 full of other beings and it's the right white area was the first time I had a human body 442 00:27:03,240 --> 00:27:07,000 and the only time in my experience I had a human like body. 443 00:27:07,000 --> 00:27:13,960 So going into the next part of my experience, there are other beings and these beings looked 444 00:27:13,960 --> 00:27:17,480 more like dolls than anything. 445 00:27:17,480 --> 00:27:21,360 And I call them beings because I have no, I still didn't know what a human was. 446 00:27:21,360 --> 00:27:24,960 So if they ever had a human experience, I don't know. 447 00:27:24,960 --> 00:27:27,600 They didn't look human, but they didn't look alien. 448 00:27:27,600 --> 00:27:33,120 We all just kind of had these fluid bodies and they look like dolls. 449 00:27:33,120 --> 00:27:36,200 I looked like a doll for a little while as well. 450 00:27:36,200 --> 00:27:39,320 Then I also was a robot for a little while. 451 00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:46,800 I was a snowman for a little while, but the big part of this experience was my thoughts 452 00:27:46,800 --> 00:27:49,400 turned into reality instantly. 453 00:27:49,400 --> 00:27:56,440 So I saw these guys sliding down snow covered trees and I thought it looked like so much 454 00:27:56,440 --> 00:27:59,560 fun, but I didn't think I liked snow. 455 00:27:59,560 --> 00:28:03,840 And before my eyes instantly, as soon as I thought that it turned to these lush green 456 00:28:03,840 --> 00:28:07,880 covered trees and I was sliding down them with these other beings. 457 00:28:07,880 --> 00:28:14,840 And I thought, wow, if I don't like snow, but they do, what if they are experiencing 458 00:28:14,840 --> 00:28:19,400 sliding down the snow trees and I'm sliding down the green trees and we're having these 459 00:28:19,400 --> 00:28:23,080 experiences that are separate, but we're experiencing them together. 460 00:28:23,080 --> 00:28:29,320 And I thought that was just really cool, but not that crazy where I say that here on earth. 461 00:28:29,320 --> 00:28:33,800 And it's like, that's kind of a mind blow. 462 00:28:33,800 --> 00:28:38,400 But there it was just another like, oh, cool, that they might be experiencing different 463 00:28:38,400 --> 00:28:42,000 realities that were experiencing together. 464 00:28:42,000 --> 00:28:46,120 Another part was when I was a snowman, these beings were working on a machine with a huge 465 00:28:46,120 --> 00:28:47,720 flame at the end of it. 466 00:28:47,720 --> 00:28:51,600 And I just had the thought happens if I get too close. 467 00:28:51,600 --> 00:28:57,720 Sure enough, I was instantly underneath the flame, melted and a puddle of eyeballs. 468 00:28:57,720 --> 00:29:01,840 Then I had the thought, where can you put me back together instantly? 469 00:29:01,840 --> 00:29:03,880 I was put back together. 470 00:29:03,880 --> 00:29:08,840 So my thoughts were instant reality. 471 00:29:08,840 --> 00:29:14,960 And I am now so thankful that we have the opportunity to change our thought direction 472 00:29:14,960 --> 00:29:18,480 here on earth, because I thought still create reality. 473 00:29:18,480 --> 00:29:21,400 But thank goodness we have the chance to change it. 474 00:29:21,400 --> 00:29:25,640 Because if you go, oh, I see a tractor across the street, I wonder what would happen if I 475 00:29:25,640 --> 00:29:27,000 got run over. 476 00:29:27,000 --> 00:29:32,560 You would be there and run over and it would be a lot of pain where in my experience there's 477 00:29:32,560 --> 00:29:34,720 no pain, there's no fear. 478 00:29:34,720 --> 00:29:38,440 But here you could be like, I wonder, I see that tractor, I wonder what would happen if 479 00:29:38,440 --> 00:29:39,440 I get run over. 480 00:29:39,440 --> 00:29:43,080 Oh, why don't I just not go stand in front of the tractor? 481 00:29:43,080 --> 00:29:44,600 You have that chance to. 482 00:29:44,600 --> 00:29:47,600 Yeah, you have the time to fix those thoughts. 483 00:29:47,600 --> 00:29:50,600 You absolutely have time to fix that. 484 00:29:50,600 --> 00:29:58,480 So another big part of this experience is I would say it's really hard to describe. 485 00:29:58,480 --> 00:30:03,000 We communicated as one, but no words were ever said. 486 00:30:03,000 --> 00:30:07,240 And people ask me if it was telepathy, but telepathy, you have a thought. 487 00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:11,400 Everyone receives that thought or hears it, thinks about it and returns it and you hear 488 00:30:11,400 --> 00:30:13,760 it all silently. 489 00:30:13,760 --> 00:30:18,840 And it was so much faster and even less communication than that. 490 00:30:18,840 --> 00:30:21,520 It was just we moved as one. 491 00:30:21,520 --> 00:30:25,960 At one point we danced like there was 20 of us and we danced as if we had choreographed 492 00:30:25,960 --> 00:30:28,280 for millennia without ever saying a word. 493 00:30:28,280 --> 00:30:31,040 We just all moved in one and unison. 494 00:30:31,040 --> 00:30:35,720 And those beings who put me back together, I didn't try to send my thought to anyone 495 00:30:35,720 --> 00:30:37,960 to ask for help. 496 00:30:37,960 --> 00:30:39,840 It just, they knew. 497 00:30:39,840 --> 00:30:45,200 So that was really an interesting phenomenon in that area. 498 00:30:45,200 --> 00:30:50,360 And towards the end of that place I was at, there was a barbed wire fence and there was 499 00:30:50,360 --> 00:30:56,040 an opening and some of the beings were going through the opening to on a land bridge behind 500 00:30:56,040 --> 00:30:57,040 it. 501 00:30:57,040 --> 00:31:02,880 And here we could see behind barbed wire very clearly, but it was very fuzzy and blurry behind 502 00:31:02,880 --> 00:31:04,680 the fence in this experience. 503 00:31:04,680 --> 00:31:07,880 And I was never asked if I wanted to go with them. 504 00:31:07,880 --> 00:31:10,040 I didn't really have a choice. 505 00:31:10,040 --> 00:31:12,120 I just knew that I couldn't go with them. 506 00:31:12,120 --> 00:31:16,440 I didn't know what lied beyond, but I just knew I couldn't go with them. 507 00:31:16,440 --> 00:31:23,080 And so I ended up in the last kind of place in my experience and it's a dark room. 508 00:31:23,080 --> 00:31:24,840 And this one actually feels like a room. 509 00:31:24,840 --> 00:31:31,440 Like it feels small and there are seven like very powerful beings behind me. 510 00:31:31,440 --> 00:31:38,240 I don't see them, but I know they're powerful, like not as great as the creator that I met 511 00:31:38,240 --> 00:31:42,800 in the void and more powerful than the ascended master teacher. 512 00:31:42,800 --> 00:31:49,560 So somewhere in between, then in front of me is the scroll and it's unrolled and things 513 00:31:49,560 --> 00:31:51,680 are starting to be written on it. 514 00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:54,760 Beautiful, sparkly golden script. 515 00:31:54,760 --> 00:32:00,480 And for some reason that's when my soul decided, oh, you're going to remember you're a human 516 00:32:00,480 --> 00:32:04,960 and your human ego is going to come back and it did and said, huh, you're showing this 517 00:32:04,960 --> 00:32:10,320 to a human and the letters disappeared, the scroll rolled up and that was the moment I 518 00:32:10,320 --> 00:32:12,160 snapped back into my body. 519 00:32:12,160 --> 00:32:13,160 Okay. 520 00:32:13,160 --> 00:32:15,520 Well, that's a lot to unpack, isn't it? 521 00:32:15,520 --> 00:32:18,760 I can tell some important things that you learned and we'll get into that here in a 522 00:32:18,760 --> 00:32:19,960 little while. 523 00:32:19,960 --> 00:32:23,000 My first question is, let's talk about the word void. 524 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:24,000 Yeah. 525 00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:29,480 It comes up all the time and I've never been that comfortable with it and you said something 526 00:32:29,480 --> 00:32:37,360 about it today that made sense that it wasn't devoid of everything. 527 00:32:37,360 --> 00:32:38,360 Explain that again. 528 00:32:38,360 --> 00:32:40,120 What was it like there? 529 00:32:40,120 --> 00:32:41,120 Yeah. 530 00:32:41,120 --> 00:32:45,240 So, so it absolutely was not devoid of anything. 531 00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:47,800 It was absolutely everything. 532 00:32:47,800 --> 00:32:50,560 It was everything in energy. 533 00:32:50,560 --> 00:32:58,720 So if you take the highest form of energy and you are just in that presence, the center 534 00:32:58,720 --> 00:33:05,480 of creation, all the energy possible in all the universes, all the dimensions and put it 535 00:33:05,480 --> 00:33:07,760 in a space and you're in that space. 536 00:33:07,760 --> 00:33:13,720 It is pure energy and it's like as if you walked into an old TV that had that static 537 00:33:13,720 --> 00:33:16,520 on the channel that was just really fuzzy. 538 00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:18,000 That's how it felt. 539 00:33:18,000 --> 00:33:19,000 That's interesting. 540 00:33:19,000 --> 00:33:24,160 You know, most people that talk about it, they don't, they don't talk about the energy 541 00:33:24,160 --> 00:33:28,120 of it, but they also don't talk about it being completely empty. 542 00:33:28,120 --> 00:33:34,120 The fact that it might be black, I don't know, why do we, just because it's dark, for some 543 00:33:34,120 --> 00:33:40,560 reason we call it a void or something more, you know, it has this mysterious kind of aura 544 00:33:40,560 --> 00:33:43,880 to it and I don't think it needs to. 545 00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:48,760 If it has all this energy like you're talking about, it's not scary. 546 00:33:48,760 --> 00:33:55,360 It's not devoid of everything except maybe light at that particular time, which also 547 00:33:55,360 --> 00:34:02,680 means when you go to the next thing like you did in a lot of other people do, well, imagine 548 00:34:02,680 --> 00:34:10,400 this at nighttime, when you turn on a really bright light, it seems a lot brighter than 549 00:34:10,400 --> 00:34:14,520 it would have if you turned it on during the day, right? 550 00:34:14,520 --> 00:34:18,480 Maybe that's what this void is for in some circumstances. 551 00:34:18,480 --> 00:34:21,760 So we really get it when the light comes. 552 00:34:21,760 --> 00:34:23,920 It is a big impact. 553 00:34:23,920 --> 00:34:26,400 Yeah, I think that's a great idea. 554 00:34:26,400 --> 00:34:31,360 I also heard, I wish I could remember his name, he presented at the IONS conference 555 00:34:31,360 --> 00:34:38,080 last year about some different aspects of seeing the light in the near-death experiences 556 00:34:38,080 --> 00:34:45,440 and he, I don't know if it was his idea or he found it somewhere, but when light is so 557 00:34:45,440 --> 00:34:48,200 bright, it can collapse on itself. 558 00:34:48,200 --> 00:34:53,120 And so I often wonder, you know, looking back in my experience, if there was just so much 559 00:34:53,120 --> 00:34:56,680 light and it was so bright, it collapsed in on itself. 560 00:34:56,680 --> 00:34:59,200 Okay, that's blown my mind too. 561 00:34:59,200 --> 00:35:01,800 I'll think about that later. 562 00:35:01,800 --> 00:35:02,800 Awesome. 563 00:35:02,800 --> 00:35:09,160 Okay, when we spoke before, you'd mentioned a bunch of different dimensions. 564 00:35:09,160 --> 00:35:13,800 Is that something that you explained going from one place to another to another, or is 565 00:35:13,800 --> 00:35:16,240 that something else that you left out today? 566 00:35:16,240 --> 00:35:21,080 Yeah, so I didn't, that is the different places I went to. 567 00:35:21,080 --> 00:35:22,080 Okay. 568 00:35:22,080 --> 00:35:27,880 So, you them as different dimensions, just it makes the most sense in my mind, instead 569 00:35:27,880 --> 00:35:33,440 of being one place that are so drastically different, I believe they were five different 570 00:35:33,440 --> 00:35:35,160 dimensions. 571 00:35:35,160 --> 00:35:41,480 And did this seem like it was, it took place over a long period of time to you? 572 00:35:41,480 --> 00:35:42,480 How long would you say? 573 00:35:42,480 --> 00:35:50,120 So, in the experience itself, I didn't feel any sense of time at all in any of the dimensions. 574 00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:56,560 It just really wasn't a concept, to get from here to there, there was no time, there wasn't 575 00:35:56,560 --> 00:35:58,200 that concept. 576 00:35:58,200 --> 00:36:04,800 However, when I was back into my body, I was terrified to open my eyes. 577 00:36:04,800 --> 00:36:06,880 I was absolutely certain. 578 00:36:06,880 --> 00:36:14,160 Once again, I didn't know what happened, but somehow my conscious knew that I had died. 579 00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:18,760 And so, when I was back in my body and back in the physical, I was positive that if I 580 00:36:18,760 --> 00:36:24,760 opened my eyes, I'd be buried in a casket, coffin, whatever, six feet underground. 581 00:36:24,760 --> 00:36:30,120 And that my parents had ignored my wishes to be cremated because they were so distraught 582 00:36:30,120 --> 00:36:33,360 that I had died young and they don't want to cremate me. 583 00:36:33,360 --> 00:36:37,280 And it was this full crazy thing going on in my head, but I was terrified to open my 584 00:36:37,280 --> 00:36:42,480 eyes because I thought it'd been at least a month, if not two. 585 00:36:42,480 --> 00:36:44,280 And how long was it, do you know? 586 00:36:44,280 --> 00:36:49,840 When I finally got brave and opened my eyes, it had only been eight minutes. 587 00:36:49,840 --> 00:36:54,280 So then, thinking that there was no way it was only eight minutes, I was trying to figure 588 00:36:54,280 --> 00:37:00,960 out if I had the day wrong, what day it was, was it the same rough time, like was it eight 589 00:37:00,960 --> 00:37:04,960 minutes and 24 hours, eight minutes and 48 hours? 590 00:37:04,960 --> 00:37:10,080 I was trying really hard to place because I had been gone from my body for so long, 591 00:37:10,080 --> 00:37:11,080 it felt. 592 00:37:11,080 --> 00:37:12,440 I get it. 593 00:37:12,440 --> 00:37:15,320 Like that eight minutes was maybe a day and eight minutes or? 594 00:37:15,320 --> 00:37:16,320 Yeah. 595 00:37:16,320 --> 00:37:17,320 Yeah. 596 00:37:17,320 --> 00:37:20,800 When I opened, I didn't believe the clock, basically, and it believed what I was seeing. 597 00:37:20,800 --> 00:37:26,720 You mentioned that you had felt extreme peace and serenity, I think were your words. 598 00:37:26,720 --> 00:37:27,720 Yes. 599 00:37:27,720 --> 00:37:28,960 Explain that more. 600 00:37:28,960 --> 00:37:37,440 So I think that comes from, you know, the 16 years leading up to that, my body was tormented. 601 00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:42,960 You know, I constantly had different pains through muscle cramping, nerve pain, twitching, 602 00:37:42,960 --> 00:37:49,440 hitting myself, hitting others involuntarily, then the mental anguish of it, you know, and 603 00:37:49,440 --> 00:37:55,400 the emotional toll it took, the anxiety, the OCD, my mind was never silent. 604 00:37:55,400 --> 00:38:02,000 It was always chatter and this and that and what ifs and ruminations. 605 00:38:02,000 --> 00:38:08,840 I mean, the list really goes on and on and on and I don't remember the time where it 606 00:38:08,840 --> 00:38:10,720 was quiet and pain free. 607 00:38:10,720 --> 00:38:15,440 Even before I was 10, I was always so tired. 608 00:38:15,440 --> 00:38:17,440 I can keep up with my friends. 609 00:38:17,440 --> 00:38:22,120 I didn't do well in sports, even though I look like I would do awesome in sports. 610 00:38:22,120 --> 00:38:26,920 And I just, I didn't understand how my friends could play all day and jump on the trampoline 611 00:38:26,920 --> 00:38:31,440 and ride their bikes and rollerblane and keep going and run up and down the hill and slide 612 00:38:31,440 --> 00:38:34,280 and it was so exhausting. 613 00:38:34,280 --> 00:38:41,680 So I never knew what pain free or quiet mind was like. 614 00:38:41,680 --> 00:38:47,160 And I tried mindfulness meditation, but mindfulness, you really, you know, it's full mind, it's 615 00:38:47,160 --> 00:38:49,000 full senses. 616 00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:55,360 And when I felt that peace and serenity, it was absolutely something extremely foreign 617 00:38:55,360 --> 00:38:56,360 to me. 618 00:38:56,360 --> 00:38:58,280 My body felt peace. 619 00:38:58,280 --> 00:39:04,720 It felt calm, painless and my mind was silent for the first time in my whole life. 620 00:39:04,720 --> 00:39:06,720 That must have been wonderful. 621 00:39:06,720 --> 00:39:11,480 When you came back, did everything come back at once or were you still feeling much of 622 00:39:11,480 --> 00:39:12,480 that peace? 623 00:39:12,480 --> 00:39:16,680 Before I opened my eyes, I was, I was still in a lot of that peace. 624 00:39:16,680 --> 00:39:21,880 I was still in a lot of that serenity, but then it started coming back very, very quickly. 625 00:39:21,880 --> 00:39:23,360 And I started freaking out. 626 00:39:23,360 --> 00:39:28,160 I started trying to slow my breath, meditating, begging to go back. 627 00:39:28,160 --> 00:39:32,160 I did not want to be in my body again. 628 00:39:32,160 --> 00:39:38,640 So at first, the first instance, like second I got back, it was still peace and serenity, 629 00:39:38,640 --> 00:39:41,880 but very, very quickly the human took over. 630 00:39:41,880 --> 00:39:43,760 It must have been frustrating. 631 00:39:43,760 --> 00:39:44,760 Oh, yeah. 632 00:39:44,760 --> 00:39:50,880 I mean, I was, I was trying to everything I possibly could to go back. 633 00:39:50,880 --> 00:39:53,320 It's been what seven years now since that happened. 634 00:39:53,320 --> 00:39:54,320 Yeah. 635 00:39:54,320 --> 00:39:56,040 My seventh year anniversary just passed. 636 00:39:56,040 --> 00:39:58,120 Well, you seem totally healthy now. 637 00:39:58,120 --> 00:39:59,400 What has happened? 638 00:39:59,400 --> 00:40:04,720 The after effects of this were also very, very crazy. 639 00:40:04,720 --> 00:40:08,360 I was in kind of a whole new state of survival. 640 00:40:08,360 --> 00:40:10,880 I was so overwhelmed. 641 00:40:10,880 --> 00:40:14,280 I had come back with medical intuition blown wide open. 642 00:40:14,280 --> 00:40:16,240 I could feel people's pain. 643 00:40:16,240 --> 00:40:18,240 I could hear people's thoughts. 644 00:40:18,240 --> 00:40:21,800 I mean, if I drove past a car accident, I could tell you exactly where they were injured 645 00:40:21,800 --> 00:40:25,920 because I felt it and I could hear what people were thinking. 646 00:40:25,920 --> 00:40:28,360 And it was so overwhelming. 647 00:40:28,360 --> 00:40:32,080 I also felt like I'd been stuffed into a sausage casing. 648 00:40:32,080 --> 00:40:38,000 Like I just felt so constricted and uncomfortable and walls freaked me out. 649 00:40:38,000 --> 00:40:43,400 I didn't, I didn't understand the solidity of things and the density and the hatred of 650 00:40:43,400 --> 00:40:44,400 the world. 651 00:40:44,400 --> 00:40:52,240 I mean, I had gone from, you know, fear and anger and hate to blitz and love and curiosity 652 00:40:52,240 --> 00:40:56,360 and joy back to fear and anger and hate. 653 00:40:56,360 --> 00:41:02,400 And so I was in a whole new state of survival and that in the next year, I actually, I was 654 00:41:02,400 --> 00:41:04,080 so such a wreck. 655 00:41:04,080 --> 00:41:06,560 I did actually try to take my life. 656 00:41:06,560 --> 00:41:12,120 So you know, my near death experience had nothing to do with suicide, but I'm, you know, 657 00:41:12,120 --> 00:41:17,160 being transparent and I tried to go back to that place when it didn't work that night, 658 00:41:17,160 --> 00:41:18,560 just breathing and wishing. 659 00:41:18,560 --> 00:41:23,960 I took drastic measures and ended up in a four day coma because of it. 660 00:41:23,960 --> 00:41:28,000 I was not expected to live and I did not get a taste. 661 00:41:28,000 --> 00:41:34,400 I did not have another NDE and I was so mad when I woke up from that coma. 662 00:41:34,400 --> 00:41:36,880 I was absolutely livid. 663 00:41:36,880 --> 00:41:39,640 But I realized, okay, well, this has to be for a reason. 664 00:41:39,640 --> 00:41:42,320 I must, I guess I've got to be here. 665 00:41:42,320 --> 00:41:43,880 I don't know why. 666 00:41:43,880 --> 00:41:45,600 And so I did physical therapy. 667 00:41:45,600 --> 00:41:48,040 I had some pretty severe brain damage. 668 00:41:48,040 --> 00:41:49,400 So I worked really hard. 669 00:41:49,400 --> 00:41:55,800 And once I was good and I was functional functioning again as a human being, I jumped into hospice 670 00:41:55,800 --> 00:42:03,160 and that really started to help me heal from the experience and kind of everything leading 671 00:42:03,160 --> 00:42:06,160 up to the experience and the aftermath of that. 672 00:42:06,160 --> 00:42:09,280 So hospice was really healing for me. 673 00:42:09,280 --> 00:42:15,760 And then this time I didn't realize I didn't have any symptoms of myoconus dystonia. 674 00:42:15,760 --> 00:42:21,880 Exactly because I was just in such a state of survival, I wasn't aware. 675 00:42:21,880 --> 00:42:29,920 And by the time I had realized that I didn't have symptoms, I finally was starting to talk 676 00:42:29,920 --> 00:42:32,120 about it and get excited. 677 00:42:32,120 --> 00:42:36,400 But at this point, I had gone back to my career in construction. 678 00:42:36,400 --> 00:42:42,280 I was working 40 to 60 hours a week, was volunteering, just going hard. 679 00:42:42,280 --> 00:42:44,520 My old thoughts were coming. 680 00:42:44,520 --> 00:42:48,240 I have reintegrated into life like I thought I was supposed to do. 681 00:42:48,240 --> 00:42:50,760 I had no idea what else I was supposed to do with it. 682 00:42:50,760 --> 00:42:54,080 So the illness came back. 683 00:42:54,080 --> 00:42:57,160 So I was like, okay, I went into remission for whatever reason. 684 00:42:57,160 --> 00:42:58,760 Let's deal with it. 685 00:42:58,760 --> 00:43:06,600 And so the illness came back with a vengeance and I ended up having to leave corporate America. 686 00:43:06,600 --> 00:43:11,720 I did get that brain surgery finally because I had lost all of my dependence. 687 00:43:11,720 --> 00:43:17,800 I was no longer able to walk very well, type, text, button up my clothes, put on eyeliner, 688 00:43:17,800 --> 00:43:18,800 put on earrings. 689 00:43:18,800 --> 00:43:25,160 I mean, my tremors were so bad, I couldn't hold a glass, I couldn't text or type anything, 690 00:43:25,160 --> 00:43:26,840 I couldn't work. 691 00:43:26,840 --> 00:43:29,520 So I was fast tracked to brain surgery. 692 00:43:29,520 --> 00:43:30,760 And it was pretty successful. 693 00:43:30,760 --> 00:43:36,720 However, I had the warning that what they had learned in those years from me being 18 to 694 00:43:36,720 --> 00:43:44,360 30 is that myoclonal stestonia is a cunning illness and it loves to learn around the brain 695 00:43:44,360 --> 00:43:45,720 surgery. 696 00:43:45,720 --> 00:43:50,480 And so I had relief or pretty good relief for about a year. 697 00:43:50,480 --> 00:43:54,640 And it started rewiring around it and coming back. 698 00:43:54,640 --> 00:43:59,760 And kind of hopeless, not hopeless yet. 699 00:43:59,760 --> 00:44:01,960 There are still some programming we could do. 700 00:44:01,960 --> 00:44:04,400 I had a deep brain stimulator in. 701 00:44:04,400 --> 00:44:09,400 But I finally had a good healthcare team that took me seriously, knew what they're doing, 702 00:44:09,400 --> 00:44:12,520 had seen and worked with this condition. 703 00:44:12,520 --> 00:44:18,720 And I figured, okay, you know, I finally have somebody I can trust with my body. 704 00:44:18,720 --> 00:44:22,600 It's time to work on my subconscious. 705 00:44:22,600 --> 00:44:26,880 You know, I had a lot of subconscious programs written out of survival that I didn't need 706 00:44:26,880 --> 00:44:28,840 or want anymore. 707 00:44:28,840 --> 00:44:30,680 And I did that. 708 00:44:30,680 --> 00:44:38,400 And in that, I ended up in a meditation, a transcendental meditation where I got back 709 00:44:38,400 --> 00:44:41,360 into that void, that darkness that. 710 00:44:41,360 --> 00:44:42,840 The good void. 711 00:44:42,840 --> 00:44:44,360 Yeah, the good. 712 00:44:44,360 --> 00:44:47,280 I had a client call it a friendly darkness. 713 00:44:47,280 --> 00:44:48,960 And I love it so much. 714 00:44:48,960 --> 00:44:52,400 You know, it's the realm of endless possibilities. 715 00:44:52,400 --> 00:44:56,720 And as I'm in this place, I see my heart and my brain appear out of the darkness, much 716 00:44:56,720 --> 00:45:03,200 like the monks did, and a piece of code from my tunnel come circulate within my heart and 717 00:45:03,200 --> 00:45:04,200 my brain. 718 00:45:04,200 --> 00:45:07,720 I knew it was rewiring my brain. 719 00:45:07,720 --> 00:45:12,240 And the next day I turned off my deep brain stimulator and I have had no symptoms since. 720 00:45:12,240 --> 00:45:13,240 Wow. 721 00:45:13,240 --> 00:45:22,080 I have gone from a miraculous healing to a devastating relapse back to another miraculous 722 00:45:22,080 --> 00:45:27,280 healing, but there's been so many amazing, incredible lessons along the way. 723 00:45:27,280 --> 00:45:33,120 And looking back as hindsight is crystal clear, I can see exactly why everything happened, 724 00:45:33,120 --> 00:45:35,320 how it happened, when it happened. 725 00:45:35,320 --> 00:45:36,320 Amazing. 726 00:45:36,320 --> 00:45:37,320 All right. 727 00:45:37,320 --> 00:45:38,320 What else do you want to talk about? 728 00:45:38,320 --> 00:45:40,880 I feel like that was a, that was a good look. 729 00:45:40,880 --> 00:45:42,720 Oh, for you. 730 00:45:42,720 --> 00:45:44,480 You did awesome. 731 00:45:44,480 --> 00:45:48,320 When you had this experience, who did you tell about it? 732 00:45:48,320 --> 00:45:56,440 My mom immediately, she's always been way more into the metaphysical and the spiritual 733 00:45:56,440 --> 00:45:59,920 while my dad was a fundamentalist Christian. 734 00:45:59,920 --> 00:46:05,520 And I saw a ghost and Auras as a kid and telling her she, she had pooped me. 735 00:46:05,520 --> 00:46:07,720 She didn't not believe me. 736 00:46:07,720 --> 00:46:12,760 And she, she kind of helped me with what those things might be and, you know, that they're 737 00:46:12,760 --> 00:46:14,720 good and they're gifts. 738 00:46:14,720 --> 00:46:19,040 So I'd always told her about any of my metaphysical or paranormal experiences. 739 00:46:19,040 --> 00:46:25,680 So of course I told her about this and I had no idea what a near death experience was, 740 00:46:25,680 --> 00:46:31,840 or any of the things related out of bodies, spiritually transformative experience, Kundalini 741 00:46:31,840 --> 00:46:35,960 awakenings, you know, now, now I know there's a list of things. 742 00:46:35,960 --> 00:46:40,800 I had no idea what any of this was and I'm telling her about it and she's, she's actually 743 00:46:40,800 --> 00:46:45,440 heard of near death experiences, my great grandmother had three, but didn't talk about 744 00:46:45,440 --> 00:46:49,560 him other than watch your words and we're not meant to know everything. 745 00:46:49,560 --> 00:46:51,800 Those were the only insights I ever knew. 746 00:46:51,800 --> 00:46:58,280 Not what she experienced, nothing, just what her life ended up being like around those, 747 00:46:58,280 --> 00:46:59,720 not the actual experiences. 748 00:46:59,720 --> 00:47:03,560 So I knew very little, but I told my mom, I trusted her. 749 00:47:03,560 --> 00:47:08,800 She's been my advocate, my best friend, my whole life, my wing woman, I would not have 750 00:47:08,800 --> 00:47:14,640 made it as far as I did without her for sure, medically and spiritually. 751 00:47:14,640 --> 00:47:16,360 That's a huge blessing. 752 00:47:16,360 --> 00:47:19,640 So I told her, and she had an idea of that. 753 00:47:19,640 --> 00:47:22,120 I had the near death experience and I thought she was crazy. 754 00:47:22,120 --> 00:47:26,360 It's like, whatever, you get, you have crazy ideas about things. 755 00:47:26,360 --> 00:47:28,160 You know, that's not what it was. 756 00:47:28,160 --> 00:47:33,280 But through the next year, she persuaded me to go to IAINs and just, you know, feel it 757 00:47:33,280 --> 00:47:34,280 out. 758 00:47:34,280 --> 00:47:37,680 I heard all these amazing stories of near death experiences. 759 00:47:37,680 --> 00:47:43,200 Dr. Maria O'Neill, who drowned in a kayaking accident. 760 00:47:43,200 --> 00:47:49,200 And I really wanted to see Evan Alexander, you know, the atheistic brain surgeon. 761 00:47:49,200 --> 00:47:54,720 And I heard all these fantastic stories of going to heaven and seeing past loved ones 762 00:47:54,720 --> 00:47:58,320 and the marble gates of healing and life reviews. 763 00:47:58,320 --> 00:47:59,440 And I had none of that. 764 00:47:59,440 --> 00:48:01,120 So I was like, cool. 765 00:48:01,120 --> 00:48:03,400 That was a beautiful conference. 766 00:48:03,400 --> 00:48:04,640 That's not what happened. 767 00:48:04,640 --> 00:48:07,680 I did not get to hear Evan Alexander's story though. 768 00:48:07,680 --> 00:48:09,200 I didn't do the whole conference. 769 00:48:09,200 --> 00:48:11,840 I did a couple of days because I didn't know what to expect. 770 00:48:11,840 --> 00:48:20,840 And I heard him on YouTube in 2020 and realized his experience had similarities to mine. 771 00:48:20,840 --> 00:48:24,280 His was the closest to mine that I had ever heard. 772 00:48:24,280 --> 00:48:29,640 And it hit me like a force that I have never experienced. 773 00:48:29,640 --> 00:48:37,760 Maybe like a huge G force shoved into my stomach and I realized, oh, that was real. 774 00:48:37,760 --> 00:48:39,480 And that's what happened. 775 00:48:39,480 --> 00:48:43,360 But it still took me some time to come to terms with that and talk about it. 776 00:48:43,360 --> 00:48:49,640 Until I left corporate America after brain surgery was having the kind of crisis like, 777 00:48:49,640 --> 00:48:50,640 why did I do that? 778 00:48:50,640 --> 00:48:53,920 I worked my full life through all of this to make it to the top. 779 00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:57,480 And I just said no to my dream job and why? 780 00:48:57,480 --> 00:49:04,200 So I ended up in a meditative state and asking a bunch of questions. 781 00:49:04,200 --> 00:49:10,520 And I was shown a river with books thrown as stepping stones, meaning I had to write 782 00:49:10,520 --> 00:49:12,120 some books. 783 00:49:12,120 --> 00:49:14,680 And I didn't want to, but I said, fine, I'll listen. 784 00:49:14,680 --> 00:49:20,600 And I wrote my first book about my experience and I've come out ever since. 785 00:49:20,600 --> 00:49:22,160 All right. 786 00:49:22,160 --> 00:49:24,720 Well, this has been fun. 787 00:49:24,720 --> 00:49:25,720 Love your story. 788 00:49:25,720 --> 00:49:26,720 Love your attitude. 789 00:49:26,720 --> 00:49:29,400 It's been fantastic. 790 00:49:29,400 --> 00:49:35,400 Let's leave one last great message for everybody out there today. 791 00:49:35,400 --> 00:49:38,960 What's the most important thing that you learned from this that you can share? 792 00:49:38,960 --> 00:49:42,320 Our thoughts absolutely create our reality. 793 00:49:42,320 --> 00:49:45,640 If you have negative ones, you have a chance to change it. 794 00:49:45,640 --> 00:49:50,600 And if you have positive ones, have those positive emotions draw it into reality. 795 00:49:50,600 --> 00:49:55,520 And that is absolutely the most powerful point I think I've learned in my experience. 796 00:49:55,520 --> 00:49:57,240 And how afraid of death are you? 797 00:49:57,240 --> 00:49:58,240 Not at all. 798 00:49:58,240 --> 00:50:00,480 Scale of one to zero, you're zero. 799 00:50:00,480 --> 00:50:03,560 If there is a negative answer in this, it's negative. 800 00:50:03,560 --> 00:50:04,560 There it is. 801 00:50:04,560 --> 00:50:05,560 That's the answer. 802 00:50:05,560 --> 00:50:06,560 All right. 803 00:50:06,560 --> 00:50:08,440 I even help people who are facing death. 804 00:50:08,440 --> 00:50:10,520 So there's your answer. 805 00:50:10,520 --> 00:50:11,520 Thanks so much. 806 00:50:11,520 --> 00:50:12,520 Bray appreciate you. 807 00:50:12,520 --> 00:50:15,800 Thank you, Eric. 808 00:50:15,800 --> 00:50:18,600 Thanks again for listening and sharing this podcast. 809 00:50:18,600 --> 00:50:24,680 Don't forget to hit the follow or subscribe button and sign up for our newsletter at roundtriptest.com. 810 00:50:24,680 --> 00:50:28,960 If you want to share your near death experience or if you have questions or comments about 811 00:50:28,960 --> 00:50:33,480 the show, send an email to Eric at roundtriptest.com. 812 00:50:33,480 --> 00:51:00,480 Until then, I wish you everything good that you're looking for in this life and the next.