1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:08,400 From the time that they pronounced me deaf was a good 45 minutes. 2 00:00:08,400 --> 00:00:13,440 They cut my clothes and then they paddled my heart, my heart had stopped. 3 00:00:13,440 --> 00:00:18,120 And I could see people screaming and crying, but I didn't realize that was actually my 4 00:00:18,120 --> 00:00:21,320 physical body because I was somewhere else. 5 00:00:21,320 --> 00:00:27,400 The only thing that I could feel, if you could imagine, absolute love and peace, there wasn't 6 00:00:27,400 --> 00:00:29,400 anything else to be felt. 7 00:00:29,400 --> 00:00:32,520 I was greeted by people I'd known in the past. 8 00:00:32,520 --> 00:00:34,160 I'm back home again. 9 00:00:34,160 --> 00:00:36,520 Incredibly safe and felt at home. 10 00:00:39,080 --> 00:00:41,240 Welcome to Roundtrip Death, everybody. 11 00:00:41,240 --> 00:00:46,000 And welcome to our super very special guest, Louisa Peck. 12 00:00:46,000 --> 00:00:47,360 Morning, Louisa. 13 00:00:47,360 --> 00:00:48,480 Good morning. 14 00:00:48,480 --> 00:00:50,360 How's Seattle today? 15 00:00:50,360 --> 00:00:51,800 Dark and rainy. 16 00:00:51,800 --> 00:00:53,000 So it's good. 17 00:00:53,000 --> 00:00:54,280 Isn't that normal? 18 00:00:54,280 --> 00:00:55,720 That's normal. 19 00:00:55,720 --> 00:00:57,480 OK. 20 00:00:57,480 --> 00:01:00,440 We're going to jump right into your experience. 21 00:01:00,440 --> 00:01:05,160 And just to give people an idea of what there is to come, I'm going to read the title of 22 00:01:05,160 --> 00:01:10,320 your book because it's sort of a good summary of the whole thing. 23 00:01:10,320 --> 00:01:20,280 And the title is Die Hard Atheist from NDE Denier to Full On Woo Woo Against My Will. 24 00:01:20,280 --> 00:01:21,280 That's it. 25 00:01:21,280 --> 00:01:22,280 That's me. 26 00:01:22,280 --> 00:01:25,800 I'm a full on woo woo and I never thought I would be. 27 00:01:25,800 --> 00:01:28,960 To you, what does woo woo mean? 28 00:01:28,960 --> 00:01:34,760 So I think, so I'm also, I've had times in my life when I was lesbian and embraced the 29 00:01:34,760 --> 00:01:36,280 word dyke. 30 00:01:36,280 --> 00:01:42,760 And I'm an alcoholic with 29 years sober and I embraced the word drunk. 31 00:01:42,760 --> 00:01:50,040 And so for me, if people are trying to detract from you by throwing a name at you, if you 32 00:01:50,040 --> 00:01:52,880 own that name, you're like, yeah, I am a woo woo. 33 00:01:52,880 --> 00:01:54,760 Yeah, there are spirits everywhere. 34 00:01:54,760 --> 00:01:55,760 Thanks. 35 00:01:55,760 --> 00:01:57,960 And that's just how it is. 36 00:01:57,960 --> 00:02:00,520 And you take their power away. 37 00:02:00,520 --> 00:02:08,600 So woo woo is just my catch all term for one who knows that the spirit realm is real. 38 00:02:08,600 --> 00:02:14,680 And I think some of us look at the term as, okay, that person's kind of weird. 39 00:02:14,680 --> 00:02:16,760 I don't know if I should believe them or not. 40 00:02:16,760 --> 00:02:23,440 But yeah, admitting it upfront and not to the weird part, but I digress. 41 00:02:23,440 --> 00:02:27,200 Let's go back many years you were living in New York City. 42 00:02:27,200 --> 00:02:33,840 Give me a little idea of what your life was like and what led up to this night where you 43 00:02:33,840 --> 00:02:36,320 had a terrible tragedy. 44 00:02:36,320 --> 00:02:37,520 Okay. 45 00:02:37,520 --> 00:02:43,520 So I want to say first that I had been raised to be atheist and that was just how things 46 00:02:43,520 --> 00:02:44,800 went in my family. 47 00:02:44,800 --> 00:02:48,720 My dad really despised religion. 48 00:02:48,720 --> 00:02:51,600 He kind of inculcated all of us with that. 49 00:02:51,600 --> 00:02:58,000 So I went to Vassar and I did really well. 50 00:02:58,000 --> 00:02:59,000 What do I want to say? 51 00:02:59,000 --> 00:03:00,840 I'd been raised in an alcoholic home. 52 00:03:00,840 --> 00:03:07,520 So I needed constant affirmation and without tests and, you know, papers and so forth. 53 00:03:07,520 --> 00:03:13,160 I didn't know how to feel I was worth existing. 54 00:03:13,160 --> 00:03:23,240 So my God was coolness as kind of assembled from popular culture, whatever I thought at 55 00:03:23,240 --> 00:03:26,560 age 22 was cool. 56 00:03:26,560 --> 00:03:30,400 James Dean modernized to some extent. 57 00:03:30,400 --> 00:03:32,320 That was what I was shooting for. 58 00:03:32,320 --> 00:03:39,440 So I moved to New York specifically because the studio 54 was there and all the night 59 00:03:39,440 --> 00:03:43,160 clubs and what cooler place to be cool. 60 00:03:43,160 --> 00:03:54,280 So 1982, I'm 22 and my dad is a co-dealer and we do the cocaine that he has on our way 61 00:03:54,280 --> 00:04:02,160 to the Peppermint Lounge, which seemed to me the coolest of the night clubs in New York. 62 00:04:02,160 --> 00:04:07,880 And the bottom floor was New Wave, which was pretty new in 1982. 63 00:04:07,880 --> 00:04:13,200 So we were dancing and I was just starting to feel like I was finally starting to feel 64 00:04:13,200 --> 00:04:15,520 cool and good. 65 00:04:15,520 --> 00:04:23,880 And we ran out of coke and started coming down and stills like for me, you know, someone 66 00:04:23,880 --> 00:04:27,800 puts a finger on the turntable and slows the record down. 67 00:04:27,800 --> 00:04:31,560 It's just no fun anymore to just be me. 68 00:04:31,560 --> 00:04:34,480 And you know, alcohol is not going to be enough for that. 69 00:04:34,480 --> 00:04:41,360 So we had some cash and we started asking around the night club, is anybody selling cocaine? 70 00:04:41,360 --> 00:04:47,280 And this guy said, I am and, you know, it's just, they said in the dark back part of the 71 00:04:47,280 --> 00:04:53,600 night club, we bought a gram and we started snorting it and it did nothing. 72 00:04:53,600 --> 00:04:57,600 And my date being a dealer said, you know, we got taken. 73 00:04:57,600 --> 00:04:58,600 This is not cocaine. 74 00:04:58,600 --> 00:05:04,160 We're, you know, and I thought, well, it numbed our gums when we tested it. 75 00:05:04,160 --> 00:05:09,080 So maybe if I do the whole pile, it's just really crappy cocaine and I'll get a little 76 00:05:09,080 --> 00:05:10,200 bit higher. 77 00:05:10,200 --> 00:05:17,360 So I just snorted the entire pile of what I've learned since was lidocaine. 78 00:05:17,360 --> 00:05:24,000 So I got sober when I was 34 and made a lot of friends with former drug dealers. 79 00:05:24,000 --> 00:05:29,920 And those who heard my story said, oh, in the 80s, we used to cut cocaine with lidocaine 80 00:05:29,920 --> 00:05:31,920 because it was cheaper. 81 00:05:31,920 --> 00:05:35,200 And it sounds like you got sold to your lidocaine. 82 00:05:35,200 --> 00:05:42,480 So lidocaine poisoning shuts down your autonomic nervous system and your heart particularly 83 00:05:42,480 --> 00:05:45,800 begins to go slower and slower and you die. 84 00:05:45,800 --> 00:05:50,040 And people have died by just eating a tube of lidocaine ointment. 85 00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:54,480 But I snorted this whole pile, which had already lumped my gum. 86 00:05:54,480 --> 00:05:57,000 So it was potent. 87 00:05:57,000 --> 00:06:02,520 So my first sign, I told my dad I was going to the bathroom and on my way there, I began 88 00:06:02,520 --> 00:06:05,200 to notice I was getting kind of tunnel vision. 89 00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:10,720 I was getting a peripheral blindness where I don't know if you've ever almost fainted, 90 00:06:10,720 --> 00:06:14,300 but this kind of speckly stuff enters your field of vision. 91 00:06:14,300 --> 00:06:17,240 And I thought, oh, what a cool side effect of cocaine. 92 00:06:17,240 --> 00:06:19,840 I'm just going to hang on for the ride. 93 00:06:19,840 --> 00:06:25,680 When I got into the bathroom, it got worse and it began to seem dark as well. 94 00:06:25,680 --> 00:06:28,960 And when I was in the stall, I couldn't read any of the graffiti. 95 00:06:28,960 --> 00:06:33,360 And that's when I first realized that there was no air. 96 00:06:33,360 --> 00:06:39,760 So it felt to me like there was no oxygen in the nightclub because my heart was going 97 00:06:39,760 --> 00:06:47,760 so slowly that even if I consciously breathed deeply, no oxygen was reaching my brain. 98 00:06:47,760 --> 00:06:54,960 So I came out of there and I found my date and I was heaving my breath at that point. 99 00:06:54,960 --> 00:06:59,000 And I was angry rather than afraid. 100 00:06:59,000 --> 00:07:03,840 I was frustrated because how were all these other people not noticing that there was no 101 00:07:03,840 --> 00:07:04,960 air? 102 00:07:04,960 --> 00:07:06,640 And I said to him, there's no air down here. 103 00:07:06,640 --> 00:07:08,240 There's no air. 104 00:07:08,240 --> 00:07:14,200 And I had a sense of being like in this basement underground, in Greenwich Village, and just 105 00:07:14,200 --> 00:07:18,760 this claustrophobia and desire to escape there. 106 00:07:18,760 --> 00:07:26,520 So he took me to the bar and the bartender gave me a glass of water and I didn't want 107 00:07:26,520 --> 00:07:31,000 water, but just to please them, I took a sip. 108 00:07:31,000 --> 00:07:34,760 And that's the moment when my NDE began. 109 00:07:34,760 --> 00:07:42,040 So on this side, what happened was at that point, I had a ground wall seizure. 110 00:07:42,040 --> 00:07:49,920 I floundered all over the floor and then I had a cardiac arrest and the bartender began 111 00:07:49,920 --> 00:07:56,800 CPR with no luck for three minutes. 112 00:07:56,800 --> 00:07:58,720 I'm told that over three minutes. 113 00:07:58,720 --> 00:08:02,280 So here's what happened to me during those three minutes. 114 00:08:02,280 --> 00:08:07,240 So the first thing I felt was maybe the shock of the ground wall kicking in, but it seemed 115 00:08:07,240 --> 00:08:09,640 to me that something struck me under the chin. 116 00:08:09,640 --> 00:08:16,000 And for just a fraction of a second, I thought I had slipped somehow and hit my chin on the 117 00:08:16,000 --> 00:08:23,320 bar, but then it transformed into something like I like to describe it as a Popeye punch. 118 00:08:23,320 --> 00:08:27,000 So if character gets punched by Popeye, they go flying up in the air. 119 00:08:27,000 --> 00:08:28,520 That's what I did. 120 00:08:28,520 --> 00:08:33,520 And so I shot up out of there and that was exactly what I was longing for because I had 121 00:08:33,520 --> 00:08:41,000 felt so sort of claustrophobic down there and I had a vague sense of leaving Manhattan 122 00:08:41,000 --> 00:08:42,000 below me. 123 00:08:42,000 --> 00:08:47,560 I had a vague sense of like, almost like the, I wouldn't say the curve of the earth, but 124 00:08:47,560 --> 00:08:53,320 you know, the land as it looks from an airplane receding away. 125 00:08:53,320 --> 00:08:59,400 And as that receded, I thought, oh, thank God I'm done with all that silliness because 126 00:08:59,400 --> 00:09:08,640 to me, my life is Louisa had been just a bunch of silliness and I was glad to be out of there. 127 00:09:08,640 --> 00:09:14,840 And so I had what's called an amnesiatic NDE where you don't remember your old life and 128 00:09:14,840 --> 00:09:17,600 you don't realize you're dead. 129 00:09:17,600 --> 00:09:23,640 So I flew up into the air and I was going up into this beautiful clear blue sky. 130 00:09:23,640 --> 00:09:29,600 And under me, I realized soon was the ocean, which was also beautiful, clear blue ocean. 131 00:09:29,600 --> 00:09:33,360 I got this idea that I was going to do a swan dive. 132 00:09:33,360 --> 00:09:39,000 So I was a ballet dancer in my regular life and I thought, I'm going to arc back and do 133 00:09:39,000 --> 00:09:43,480 a fancy dive swan dive, even though I could not do that in real life at all. 134 00:09:43,480 --> 00:09:45,680 I did it there and it worked perfectly. 135 00:09:45,680 --> 00:09:48,320 And I was really pleased with that. 136 00:09:48,320 --> 00:09:50,600 And then I was diving toward the ocean. 137 00:09:50,600 --> 00:09:57,320 I'd reversed my direction and I had a thought, isn't the water like concrete if you hit it 138 00:09:57,320 --> 00:10:00,000 from a great height? 139 00:10:00,000 --> 00:10:02,480 And there was no fear attached to the thought. 140 00:10:02,480 --> 00:10:05,640 There was only, okay, well, we'll find out. 141 00:10:05,640 --> 00:10:10,880 I hit the water in a perfect dive and I went way, way down deep into the water and I could 142 00:10:10,880 --> 00:10:15,160 see the bubbles around me, but the surface was way up there. 143 00:10:15,160 --> 00:10:18,080 And I thought, am I going to get there okay? 144 00:10:18,080 --> 00:10:22,520 And the next thing I know, I'm surfacing and I'm like, cool. 145 00:10:22,520 --> 00:10:25,360 And I see the shore and it's quite a ways off. 146 00:10:25,360 --> 00:10:27,640 And I think, okay, I'm hidden there. 147 00:10:27,640 --> 00:10:30,720 And I swam like maybe one stroke and then I was there. 148 00:10:30,720 --> 00:10:35,440 I was wading out of the water and again, I had no, like, how did that happen? 149 00:10:35,440 --> 00:10:36,760 I didn't have anything like that. 150 00:10:36,760 --> 00:10:38,680 I was just like, cool. 151 00:10:38,680 --> 00:10:46,720 And I looked to my left and I saw this mesa on kind of a sea stack coming out of the ocean. 152 00:10:46,720 --> 00:10:52,000 And on top of it, there was an old weather worn blue house. 153 00:10:52,000 --> 00:10:56,760 And I knew right away that house has to do with me and I want to get there. 154 00:10:56,760 --> 00:11:01,920 So next thing I know, I'm not at the house, but I'm at the bottom of the mesa, which turns 155 00:11:01,920 --> 00:11:12,440 out to be a bunch of big rocks and they're covered with this grotesque, brown, putrid, 156 00:11:12,440 --> 00:11:15,600 just revolting slime. 157 00:11:15,600 --> 00:11:16,840 And I thought, what is this? 158 00:11:16,840 --> 00:11:19,640 And I thought, is it like rotten seaweed? 159 00:11:19,640 --> 00:11:22,120 I just thought, well, okay, I'm strong. 160 00:11:22,120 --> 00:11:23,920 I'm going to climb past this. 161 00:11:23,920 --> 00:11:27,240 It's not going to stop me getting to the house. 162 00:11:27,240 --> 00:11:30,440 So I began climbing with this sense of great capability. 163 00:11:30,440 --> 00:11:32,280 I had none of my insecurity. 164 00:11:32,280 --> 00:11:38,240 I had just interest and can do were the only feelings I had. 165 00:11:38,240 --> 00:11:45,360 So I climbed to the house, but when I reached it, I had unfortunately lost my body. 166 00:11:45,360 --> 00:11:47,720 What does that mean? 167 00:11:47,720 --> 00:11:58,000 It means that I was a subjective camera view, maybe an inch from the door sill with nothing 168 00:11:58,000 --> 00:12:00,960 of me that I could see. 169 00:12:00,960 --> 00:12:04,840 And I thought, this is really inconvenient. 170 00:12:04,840 --> 00:12:05,840 What a bummer. 171 00:12:05,840 --> 00:12:07,400 And it's not going to stop me. 172 00:12:07,400 --> 00:12:09,280 It's what I thought. 173 00:12:09,280 --> 00:12:10,280 That's funny. 174 00:12:10,280 --> 00:12:11,280 It's just an inconvenience. 175 00:12:11,280 --> 00:12:15,560 It's not sheer terror, what's going on kind of thing. 176 00:12:15,560 --> 00:12:16,560 Oh, well. 177 00:12:16,560 --> 00:12:17,560 Right. 178 00:12:17,560 --> 00:12:19,200 It's like, what happened to my body? 179 00:12:19,200 --> 00:12:20,200 It's not here. 180 00:12:20,200 --> 00:12:21,200 Oh, well. 181 00:12:21,200 --> 00:12:22,200 Right. 182 00:12:22,200 --> 00:12:27,080 As I crossed the threshold, the first thing that struck me was how intensely worn the 183 00:12:27,080 --> 00:12:33,760 wood was there with so many footprints going through that doorway. 184 00:12:33,760 --> 00:12:40,960 And I understood immediately that all my ancestors had crossed that same threshold, that this 185 00:12:40,960 --> 00:12:44,920 was our house, and we all went through there. 186 00:12:44,920 --> 00:12:46,920 So I did not know my ancestors. 187 00:12:46,920 --> 00:12:48,640 I still really don't, to be honest. 188 00:12:48,640 --> 00:12:55,520 I'm not an ancestry-oriented person, but on the other side, it meant everything to me. 189 00:12:55,520 --> 00:13:00,760 It was like, we, this is our house, and this is where we passed through. 190 00:13:00,760 --> 00:13:03,320 And I had a great sense of honor. 191 00:13:03,320 --> 00:13:11,760 At the same time, I could sense my ancestors watching and kind of cheering for me and being 192 00:13:11,760 --> 00:13:18,200 very excited to be unified with me again and united, I mean. 193 00:13:18,200 --> 00:13:20,720 And I sense them. 194 00:13:20,720 --> 00:13:24,400 I couldn't see them, but I sensed the presence of many ancestors. 195 00:13:24,400 --> 00:13:28,040 I'm one stood out who was my father's father. 196 00:13:28,040 --> 00:13:31,080 He's the only one who died before I was born. 197 00:13:31,080 --> 00:13:33,480 He died at 60 some of a heart attack. 198 00:13:33,480 --> 00:13:39,000 I knew him only as a photograph in the back of my dad's closet on the shelf. 199 00:13:39,000 --> 00:13:40,240 That's the only way I knew him. 200 00:13:40,240 --> 00:13:47,200 He did not mean anything to me in my Louisa life, but on this side, he was so excited 201 00:13:47,200 --> 00:13:51,080 to meet me and I felt equally excited to meet him. 202 00:13:51,080 --> 00:13:53,920 However, having no body was a problem. 203 00:13:53,920 --> 00:14:00,720 There was supposed to be an armchair where I knew that all my ancestors loved to sit 204 00:14:00,720 --> 00:14:03,760 and look out at the ocean. 205 00:14:03,760 --> 00:14:05,760 And I felt like this is no fair. 206 00:14:05,760 --> 00:14:11,800 You know, the arm, the chair is not there and I'm too small, kind of like Alice in Wonderland. 207 00:14:11,800 --> 00:14:12,920 I can't see out the window. 208 00:14:12,920 --> 00:14:15,120 I want to see. 209 00:14:15,120 --> 00:14:23,840 And as soon as I thought I want to see something else took control and it pulled me across 210 00:14:23,840 --> 00:14:24,840 the floor. 211 00:14:24,840 --> 00:14:27,760 I didn't have a body, but I had the feeling of my sternum. 212 00:14:27,760 --> 00:14:32,000 I had the feeling of it pulling from my heart. 213 00:14:32,000 --> 00:14:37,240 And I started kind of just coasting over the floorboards and I was like, Whoa, what is happening? 214 00:14:37,240 --> 00:14:40,200 I was very thrilled. 215 00:14:40,200 --> 00:14:46,200 And then it went up over the windowsill and out. 216 00:14:46,200 --> 00:14:51,120 So next thing I knew, I was flying over the ocean and the sun was setting directly in 217 00:14:51,120 --> 00:14:59,360 front of me and beautiful sunset sky of all these colors and then this path of gold coming 218 00:14:59,360 --> 00:15:00,880 over the ocean. 219 00:15:00,880 --> 00:15:05,200 And that's what I was zooming straight down straight toward the sun. 220 00:15:05,200 --> 00:15:07,720 I'm just going to interrupt myself for a second to see. 221 00:15:07,720 --> 00:15:14,320 My father had taught me that the sun was the source of all life, that all energy comes 222 00:15:14,320 --> 00:15:17,040 from the sun, all life energy. 223 00:15:17,040 --> 00:15:22,520 Okay, let me interject one question here before we get on to the next step. 224 00:15:22,520 --> 00:15:27,720 Did you have or even in hindsight, did you have any feeling of where you were? 225 00:15:27,720 --> 00:15:31,520 Would you call this a heaven place or a place in between or? 226 00:15:31,520 --> 00:15:33,440 It's an in between. 227 00:15:33,440 --> 00:15:34,520 It's an in between. 228 00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:42,360 And now looking back at it retrospectively, I passed through all the elements, air, water, 229 00:15:42,360 --> 00:15:48,720 wood, which is in Chinese, an element in Chinese folklore. 230 00:15:48,720 --> 00:15:51,320 And then I'm headed toward fire. 231 00:15:51,320 --> 00:15:52,320 That's interesting. 232 00:15:52,320 --> 00:15:53,520 Okay, keep going. 233 00:15:53,520 --> 00:15:59,240 So as I was zooming along and I was so happy, I just had a slight memory of my old life 234 00:15:59,240 --> 00:16:02,120 and I had a skeptical thought. 235 00:16:02,120 --> 00:16:05,320 And I thought, wait a second, people can't fly. 236 00:16:05,320 --> 00:16:07,440 What's going on here? 237 00:16:07,440 --> 00:16:09,400 I maybe I'm dreaming. 238 00:16:09,400 --> 00:16:13,920 And I just asked myself the way you pinch yourself sometimes, is this real? 239 00:16:13,920 --> 00:16:19,680 And as soon as I asked that, a voice answered me in telepathy. 240 00:16:19,680 --> 00:16:22,800 And it was a very strong voice. 241 00:16:22,800 --> 00:16:27,840 And it said more real than anything back there. 242 00:16:27,840 --> 00:16:29,960 And I had not known anyone was with me. 243 00:16:29,960 --> 00:16:31,680 I had not expected an answer. 244 00:16:31,680 --> 00:16:34,320 Certainly I was just wondering to myself. 245 00:16:34,320 --> 00:16:40,080 And yet at the same time, when the voice said that I had a feeling of respect, like this 246 00:16:40,080 --> 00:16:44,760 is, this is somebody and they're right. 247 00:16:44,760 --> 00:16:51,020 And so kind of acknowledged this is more real than anything back there in the silliness. 248 00:16:51,020 --> 00:16:54,840 And so the sun, meanwhile, is getting bigger and bigger as I approached it. 249 00:16:54,840 --> 00:17:02,640 And I began to actually see the corona on it and feel I didn't feel heat, but I thought, 250 00:17:02,640 --> 00:17:04,480 am I going to vaporize? 251 00:17:04,480 --> 00:17:07,320 If I get close to the sun, it should burn up. 252 00:17:07,320 --> 00:17:09,520 But again, I had no fear. 253 00:17:09,520 --> 00:17:15,560 And then before I thought I was getting that close, I passed through this kind of filament 254 00:17:15,560 --> 00:17:21,880 or veil and realized I was inside the sun. 255 00:17:21,880 --> 00:17:25,320 And in the sun was the light. 256 00:17:25,320 --> 00:17:28,560 So you want to talk about heaven? 257 00:17:28,560 --> 00:17:30,440 That was heaven. 258 00:17:30,440 --> 00:17:35,320 So I could not see anything or hear anything, but who needed to? 259 00:17:35,320 --> 00:17:36,320 I did not. 260 00:17:36,320 --> 00:17:39,440 I had everything I could possibly want. 261 00:17:39,440 --> 00:17:43,960 And people struggle so much to try to describe the love that's in the light. 262 00:17:43,960 --> 00:17:49,880 But I remember being somewhat surprised that it was all through me, that it was not something 263 00:17:49,880 --> 00:17:51,360 external to me. 264 00:17:51,360 --> 00:17:54,160 It was all through me. 265 00:17:54,160 --> 00:18:00,360 The best way I can think of to describe the light when I think of it now is think of every 266 00:18:00,360 --> 00:18:03,240 good thing you ever feel in life. 267 00:18:03,240 --> 00:18:04,880 Like, oh, I'm so glad that happened. 268 00:18:04,880 --> 00:18:07,240 Oh, I'm so happy to see that person. 269 00:18:07,240 --> 00:18:09,520 Oh, I can't believe I got me on that test. 270 00:18:09,520 --> 00:18:12,120 Oh, my gosh, I got the promotion. 271 00:18:12,120 --> 00:18:14,680 Oh, this natural spot is perfect. 272 00:18:14,680 --> 00:18:16,920 And we have it all to ourselves. 273 00:18:16,920 --> 00:18:23,800 All of those feelings and just put them all together and multiply it by a million. 274 00:18:23,800 --> 00:18:29,040 It's just such a powerful everything you could possibly long for. 275 00:18:29,040 --> 00:18:31,240 And I, for the first time in my life, felt complete. 276 00:18:31,240 --> 00:18:37,200 And I was very aware that I had been starving for this my whole life. 277 00:18:37,200 --> 00:18:42,720 Again, there's a slight memory of being Louisa because, you know, all the hoops I was jumping 278 00:18:42,720 --> 00:18:46,600 through, all of the trying to get validation. 279 00:18:46,600 --> 00:18:52,480 Finally, I just was completely fulfilled and felt loved. 280 00:18:52,480 --> 00:19:00,760 And so I became aware of a being holding me like an infant cradling me in its arms, which 281 00:19:00,760 --> 00:19:06,160 I am far from the only in the year to have this feeling I know now. 282 00:19:06,160 --> 00:19:11,720 But it was as if it was a parent figure that was holding me and just pouring love into 283 00:19:11,720 --> 00:19:12,720 me. 284 00:19:12,720 --> 00:19:13,720 You are so loved. 285 00:19:13,720 --> 00:19:14,720 You are so loved. 286 00:19:14,720 --> 00:19:16,560 I didn't have a sense of gender at that point. 287 00:19:16,560 --> 00:19:22,200 I had a sense that they were sitting on the floor and holding me and pouring love into 288 00:19:22,200 --> 00:19:23,200 me. 289 00:19:23,200 --> 00:19:29,680 And I loved the parent so much once I had recognized its existence and felt the love coming from 290 00:19:29,680 --> 00:19:30,680 it. 291 00:19:30,680 --> 00:19:34,560 And I just wanted this to go on forever. 292 00:19:34,560 --> 00:19:42,520 And then the parents said in telepathy in that same strong voice, you can't stay, you're 293 00:19:42,520 --> 00:19:44,280 not done yet. 294 00:19:44,280 --> 00:19:49,200 And then boom, the light gone, absolutely gone. 295 00:19:49,200 --> 00:19:52,120 And I'm in blackness and darkness. 296 00:19:52,120 --> 00:19:57,520 And to make matters worse for a fraction of a second, I seemed to be dropping. 297 00:19:57,520 --> 00:20:01,960 So I had, I threw a temper tantrum. 298 00:20:01,960 --> 00:20:03,880 I felt like no. 299 00:20:03,880 --> 00:20:09,760 And I felt had a sense of I'll show that parent that I'm more to deal with than they thought. 300 00:20:09,760 --> 00:20:12,560 And I'm getting back to the light no matter what. 301 00:20:12,560 --> 00:20:19,160 And then I got a little after echo message that just said, cased clothes sweetheart. 302 00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:22,720 And then I dropped into this total darkness. 303 00:20:22,720 --> 00:20:27,160 And I believe that was the point when I was dropping back into my body. 304 00:20:27,160 --> 00:20:32,760 And I also have a theory about our body being surrounded by a kind of aura of anger and 305 00:20:32,760 --> 00:20:38,400 fear that keeps us distinct for the purpose of free will. 306 00:20:38,400 --> 00:20:43,440 But in any case, I began to just see against the blackness, these little white chalk figures 307 00:20:43,440 --> 00:20:49,000 that were doing antics and cartwheels, and they had like, you know, a teeter totter and 308 00:20:49,000 --> 00:20:50,760 a swing set and a jungle gym. 309 00:20:50,760 --> 00:20:52,440 And they were like climbing on all these things. 310 00:20:52,440 --> 00:20:53,840 And they were laughing. 311 00:20:53,840 --> 00:20:59,240 And I thought, okay, well, I guess, you know, the parent gave me this to entertain me until 312 00:20:59,240 --> 00:21:00,680 I can go back to the light. 313 00:21:00,680 --> 00:21:03,480 But I'm definitely going back to the light. 314 00:21:03,480 --> 00:21:05,240 So I just started watching them. 315 00:21:05,240 --> 00:21:09,560 And they were saying these little rhymes like, you know, maybe you'd be swing slang or just 316 00:21:09,560 --> 00:21:14,320 whatever, and I was listening to their nonsense and just kind of feeling like, okay, this 317 00:21:14,320 --> 00:21:18,160 is Saturday morning cartoons, and I'm just going to hang out. 318 00:21:18,160 --> 00:21:25,440 And then one of them got closer and the face instead of being a chalk outline filled in 319 00:21:25,440 --> 00:21:30,080 more like a dinner plate, and he was getting in my face. 320 00:21:30,080 --> 00:21:31,360 So I couldn't see. 321 00:21:31,360 --> 00:21:35,280 And I was trying to like look around him and kind of feeling like, dude, you know, you're 322 00:21:35,280 --> 00:21:37,400 blocking my view. 323 00:21:37,400 --> 00:21:45,080 And then instead of his like hopscotch things to say, he was saying how many fingers, what 324 00:21:45,080 --> 00:21:47,120 is your name? 325 00:21:47,120 --> 00:21:50,800 Then I had this horrible realization. 326 00:21:50,800 --> 00:21:54,680 Then I was back in the meat puppet that I was trapped. 327 00:21:54,680 --> 00:22:01,680 And I was back at this old game that was so primitive and so dumb. 328 00:22:01,680 --> 00:22:07,360 And it just felt to me like if somebody told you, Eric, you're going to go back to kindergarten 329 00:22:07,360 --> 00:22:13,120 garden, and you're just going to be there for, you know, another few decades and you 330 00:22:13,120 --> 00:22:15,720 can just play with blocks and Lego. 331 00:22:15,720 --> 00:22:19,600 And I just like, no, I can't go back to this. 332 00:22:19,600 --> 00:22:24,680 And then I realized that he thought that I was separate from him, which even after only 333 00:22:24,680 --> 00:22:28,280 a little telepathy I knew was so not true. 334 00:22:28,280 --> 00:22:29,520 But I couldn't correct him. 335 00:22:29,520 --> 00:22:34,920 He wanted me to make noises with my mouth and the mouth felt to me way far away. 336 00:22:34,920 --> 00:22:37,880 I felt very much that I was in my brain. 337 00:22:37,880 --> 00:22:46,240 And so I had a feeling about my, my mouth as if it were an underground garage under 338 00:22:46,240 --> 00:22:47,800 where I was. 339 00:22:47,800 --> 00:22:51,360 And I had some kind of remote control where I could manipulate it. 340 00:22:51,360 --> 00:22:53,480 So that's what he wanted me to do. 341 00:22:53,480 --> 00:22:54,760 So I did it. 342 00:22:54,760 --> 00:23:02,440 And I said to, for the fingers and I said, Louisa, I came to on the night on the floor 343 00:23:02,440 --> 00:23:05,640 of the nightclub, this guy was the bartender. 344 00:23:05,640 --> 00:23:11,840 He had been ceaselessly doing good Samaritan CPR on me and I had come around and I was 345 00:23:11,840 --> 00:23:16,640 in a pool of water that I thought they had thrown on me, but it was just sweat. 346 00:23:16,640 --> 00:23:18,680 And I came back into my body. 347 00:23:18,680 --> 00:23:22,080 I sweated that much water. 348 00:23:22,080 --> 00:23:23,080 Wow. 349 00:23:23,080 --> 00:23:25,400 Let me clarify a couple of things. 350 00:23:25,400 --> 00:23:29,320 You kept talking, you were talking about this guy. 351 00:23:29,320 --> 00:23:30,840 Who is the guy? 352 00:23:30,840 --> 00:23:31,840 The bartender. 353 00:23:31,840 --> 00:23:32,840 Okay. 354 00:23:32,840 --> 00:23:34,200 That's what I thought. 355 00:23:34,200 --> 00:23:40,800 So, so there's some kind of interaction going on with the bartender, sort of when you're 356 00:23:40,800 --> 00:23:43,520 out of your body and coming back in or back in. 357 00:23:43,520 --> 00:23:45,360 Am I getting that right? 358 00:23:45,360 --> 00:23:46,360 Yes. 359 00:23:46,360 --> 00:23:47,360 Okay. 360 00:23:47,360 --> 00:23:51,360 At a time where you're sort of in both worlds just briefly. 361 00:23:51,360 --> 00:23:57,640 And I feel that all the people that were going on the play things on the swing sets 362 00:23:57,640 --> 00:24:03,880 and jungle gyms, when I opened my eyes, I was surrounded by a ring of Gawkers like as 363 00:24:03,880 --> 00:24:06,320 the whole nightclub was gawking. 364 00:24:06,320 --> 00:24:09,400 And I feel I had been picking up their energy. 365 00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:13,640 I myself felt as though I were five years old. 366 00:24:13,640 --> 00:24:19,680 That was my mentality as would be, I would compare it to being a child of that age. 367 00:24:19,680 --> 00:24:25,800 And I had sort of seen all of them in the same zone as children. 368 00:24:25,800 --> 00:24:27,640 But I mean, I think that's my theory. 369 00:24:27,640 --> 00:24:28,640 I don't know. 370 00:24:28,640 --> 00:24:34,360 All I know is that she came out, he came from among those stick figures. 371 00:24:34,360 --> 00:24:39,720 And when I opened my eyes, there were dozens and dozens and dozens of people around me. 372 00:24:39,720 --> 00:24:40,720 Sure. 373 00:24:40,720 --> 00:24:41,720 Okay. 374 00:24:41,720 --> 00:24:44,080 Let me ask you a couple of questions about what was going on. 375 00:24:44,080 --> 00:24:48,000 And then there's more to come after this that we're going to talk about as well. 376 00:24:48,000 --> 00:24:55,760 In the sun, this parent figure, were you seeing anything or anybody or was this just all feeling? 377 00:24:55,760 --> 00:25:00,880 Was all feeling and knowing because I could only see the light. 378 00:25:00,880 --> 00:25:01,880 Okay. 379 00:25:01,880 --> 00:25:06,680 Please try to explain the love a little bit more. 380 00:25:06,680 --> 00:25:13,760 So is that once a sensation of warmth and comfort, a little bit like if you lie on the 381 00:25:13,760 --> 00:25:20,160 beach and you feel the sun on your skin warming you up, big stuff, that's going all through 382 00:25:20,160 --> 00:25:25,240 your thoughts, all through your being. 383 00:25:25,240 --> 00:25:29,240 It is just a love. 384 00:25:29,240 --> 00:25:35,440 I don't know how else to describe it. 385 00:25:35,440 --> 00:25:38,920 How do you describe that intensity? 386 00:25:38,920 --> 00:25:43,080 Being alive in our bodies is such a struggle. 387 00:25:43,080 --> 00:25:47,920 And I actually think it's an unnatural state that we are, you know, people have all these 388 00:25:47,920 --> 00:25:54,640 theories about us being here on a mission or whatever, but whatever project the universe 389 00:25:54,640 --> 00:26:01,200 source God is working on has involved making us carnate. 390 00:26:01,200 --> 00:26:05,480 And it's not comfortable. 391 00:26:05,480 --> 00:26:09,280 It's when you're relieved of that. 392 00:26:09,280 --> 00:26:12,880 I mean, I had been out of the body when I was in the in-between zone, but I think this 393 00:26:12,880 --> 00:26:20,920 is the point at which I reunited with the source that is God, that angel that I now 394 00:26:20,920 --> 00:26:27,280 call Ignacio is the one who pulled me across the floor and guided me into my source. 395 00:26:27,280 --> 00:26:32,960 So if I had believed in Jesus, maybe that's what I would have seen, but for me, I believed 396 00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:34,080 in the sun. 397 00:26:34,080 --> 00:26:36,240 And so that's where I went. 398 00:26:36,240 --> 00:26:40,440 All right, let's talk about Ignacio. 399 00:26:40,440 --> 00:26:41,680 Jump right into it. 400 00:26:41,680 --> 00:26:42,680 Okay. 401 00:26:42,680 --> 00:26:45,720 I mean, you've got a name for him in everything now. 402 00:26:45,720 --> 00:26:49,440 So I didn't get the name until the pandemic. 403 00:26:49,440 --> 00:26:55,840 My first weird after effects were not him specifically. 404 00:26:55,840 --> 00:26:57,520 I was in a dark place. 405 00:26:57,520 --> 00:26:58,520 I had depression. 406 00:26:58,520 --> 00:26:59,880 I rejected my NDE. 407 00:26:59,880 --> 00:27:01,000 I wanted to keep drinking. 408 00:27:01,000 --> 00:27:07,320 I wanted to go on as I had, but I shoving away this NDE was difficult. 409 00:27:07,320 --> 00:27:15,840 And I was so lost that I went into a time of panic attacks and a time of depression. 410 00:27:15,840 --> 00:27:25,120 And so my first weird after effect was seeing a ghost who I saw so clearly as a 19th century 411 00:27:25,120 --> 00:27:29,120 fisherman in a Macintosh and everything in the middle of a storm. 412 00:27:29,120 --> 00:27:34,000 I was walking on the beach in a storm, but then it turned out he left no tracks. 413 00:27:34,000 --> 00:27:35,000 So that was the first one. 414 00:27:35,000 --> 00:27:36,120 It just made me angry. 415 00:27:36,120 --> 00:27:38,920 I was just like, this cannot be, this cannot be. 416 00:27:38,920 --> 00:27:45,120 The next one was foreknowing that my nephew was going to die before he was born. 417 00:27:45,120 --> 00:27:47,680 For during birth, I didn't really know much about my nephew. 418 00:27:47,680 --> 00:27:54,520 I just knew that my brother was going to plunge into this horrible, dark sadness because 419 00:27:54,520 --> 00:27:56,640 his baby was going to die. 420 00:27:56,640 --> 00:27:59,680 And knowing that was awful and when it came true, it was awful. 421 00:27:59,680 --> 00:28:03,560 Again, I'm still drinking and I'm heading towards my bottom, right? 422 00:28:03,560 --> 00:28:08,240 I'm drinking more and more and it's getting less and less okay because I'm in my 30s now. 423 00:28:08,240 --> 00:28:11,320 I drove home super drunk. 424 00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:12,760 I was not living in Seattle then. 425 00:28:12,760 --> 00:28:14,120 I was living in a long cabin. 426 00:28:14,120 --> 00:28:20,360 My partner had left me because I'd been untrue and I was just reading the Kowski and drinking 427 00:28:20,360 --> 00:28:26,600 and just scrolling in my journal obsessively about this boy at the espresso shop where 428 00:28:26,600 --> 00:28:27,920 I worked. 429 00:28:27,920 --> 00:28:35,600 And I got home after crossing this railroad overpass where I had seen millions of reflectors 430 00:28:35,600 --> 00:28:37,480 and not millions, but maybe like six. 431 00:28:37,480 --> 00:28:41,480 I just guessed and like headed for the middle and drove through it 80 miles an hour in the 432 00:28:41,480 --> 00:28:44,480 dark just completely bombed. 433 00:28:44,480 --> 00:28:49,640 When I got home, I got out of my car and I was holding onto the door because I couldn't 434 00:28:49,640 --> 00:28:50,640 stand without it. 435 00:28:50,640 --> 00:28:59,920 It was a starry night and my thought was, hey, and I drive so badass when I'm shit-faced. 436 00:28:59,920 --> 00:29:05,520 And then Ignacio shot something through me. 437 00:29:05,520 --> 00:29:09,640 It seemed like it came from the stars and I was so not expecting this. 438 00:29:09,640 --> 00:29:14,000 It was a bolt of knowing that hit me like a bolt of lightning. 439 00:29:14,000 --> 00:29:15,600 And he had two things. 440 00:29:15,600 --> 00:29:19,760 He was yelling and he, but it's telepathic. 441 00:29:19,760 --> 00:29:25,000 And the first one was, this is the last time I can help you. 442 00:29:25,000 --> 00:29:29,800 And then the next one was, you do know right from wrong. 443 00:29:29,800 --> 00:29:33,400 And well, I remember that so clearly. 444 00:29:33,400 --> 00:29:37,680 I knew in my heart, he's the one who took me across the bridge. 445 00:29:37,680 --> 00:29:42,520 And then in the morning when I woke up, I had done all kinds of things in a blackout. 446 00:29:42,520 --> 00:29:45,200 I'd left a huge mess in a blackout. 447 00:29:45,200 --> 00:29:50,080 I had no idea what happened after that bolt because that's when he pulled the plug on 448 00:29:50,080 --> 00:29:55,760 the spiritual sort of life support that he was giving me, right, to get me home safe. 449 00:29:55,760 --> 00:29:57,800 And after that, it was just my brain. 450 00:29:57,800 --> 00:30:02,280 I have found that spiritual memories do not fade like my NDE. 451 00:30:02,280 --> 00:30:06,920 Like anything spiritual that I have lived through, I can know it. 452 00:30:06,920 --> 00:30:09,360 So it ruined my drinking. 453 00:30:09,360 --> 00:30:13,600 Let's just say that I kept trying and it kept coming back to me. 454 00:30:13,600 --> 00:30:16,040 You know, you do know right from wrong. 455 00:30:16,040 --> 00:30:21,200 So when I finally hit bottom, I ended up calling Alcoholics Anonymous. 456 00:30:21,200 --> 00:30:26,080 I was going to either drink a gallon of vodka or call Alcoholics Anonymous. 457 00:30:26,080 --> 00:30:28,720 And I decided, well, if I drink the gallon of vodka, I can't call. 458 00:30:28,720 --> 00:30:30,400 So I'll do that one first. 459 00:30:30,400 --> 00:30:35,360 And I got sober on January 29, 1995. 460 00:30:35,360 --> 00:30:37,920 My birthday is coming up 29 years. 461 00:30:37,920 --> 00:30:39,880 So that was the first time he spoke to me. 462 00:30:39,880 --> 00:30:41,880 Congratulations, by the way. 463 00:30:41,880 --> 00:30:42,880 Thank you. 464 00:30:42,880 --> 00:30:43,880 Thank you. 465 00:30:43,880 --> 00:30:44,880 You deserve it. 466 00:30:44,880 --> 00:30:45,880 It is. 467 00:30:45,880 --> 00:30:48,560 So then he's spoken to me many times after. 468 00:30:48,560 --> 00:30:49,880 Is this part of the woo-woo? 469 00:30:49,880 --> 00:30:50,880 Yeah, this is. 470 00:30:50,880 --> 00:30:59,080 But I was still kind of like, maybe I'm crazy, you know, but I'm not really having that. 471 00:30:59,080 --> 00:31:04,560 Next I, when I got sober, I sold the long house and I went to Europe and I just had so 472 00:31:04,560 --> 00:31:07,960 many serendipitous events happen. 473 00:31:07,960 --> 00:31:13,680 Like he, I was getting ready to go and I had puted with my best friend in college and I 474 00:31:13,680 --> 00:31:17,280 didn't know where she was, but it started telling me, you need to call her. 475 00:31:17,280 --> 00:31:18,880 You need to call her. 476 00:31:18,880 --> 00:31:24,880 And I didn't know this was as nausea then, but it ended up that she was in Greece also 477 00:31:24,880 --> 00:31:28,200 for four hours when my flight was laid over. 478 00:31:28,200 --> 00:31:34,160 So I got to see her and I got to make amends with her and like, oh, what I had done wrong 479 00:31:34,160 --> 00:31:41,200 and turned out her mother was dying of alcoholism and I was able to talk to her about that. 480 00:31:41,200 --> 00:31:42,720 Again and again, he saved me. 481 00:31:42,720 --> 00:31:46,440 I wrote, there was a time I was just about to drink on the island of Paros because the 482 00:31:46,440 --> 00:31:51,680 thing hydrofile was delayed and I was waiting at a bar and I was sitting there at this point 483 00:31:51,680 --> 00:31:52,680 in my life. 484 00:31:52,680 --> 00:31:59,080 I was quite a sort of stereotypical dyke and he said, talk to the people behind you. 485 00:31:59,080 --> 00:32:01,280 And I was like, I'm not talking to the people behind me. 486 00:32:01,280 --> 00:32:02,560 I've all I've had is a sprite. 487 00:32:02,560 --> 00:32:06,520 And I don't know these people and no one and I could hear that they were very queer. 488 00:32:06,520 --> 00:32:08,360 It was two guys. 489 00:32:08,360 --> 00:32:12,200 And so he was just not let not talk to the people behind you, talk to the people behind 490 00:32:12,200 --> 00:32:13,200 you. 491 00:32:13,200 --> 00:32:14,400 So I turned my chair around. 492 00:32:14,400 --> 00:32:18,640 Well, first I, yeah, I turned my chair and I said, are you guys friends of Dorothy? 493 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:22,000 No idea where that came from, but it's kind of code for Wizard of Oz. 494 00:32:22,000 --> 00:32:23,000 Are you queer? 495 00:32:23,000 --> 00:32:24,000 Right. 496 00:32:24,000 --> 00:32:27,280 And they kind of went like Dorothy and Toto. 497 00:32:27,280 --> 00:32:28,440 And I was like, yeah. 498 00:32:28,440 --> 00:32:31,280 And so I joined them. 499 00:32:31,280 --> 00:32:40,280 And the one on my right was sober eight years, pretty much ran AA on the island. 500 00:32:40,280 --> 00:32:44,240 He heard from me that I'd called the hotline and they hadn't picked up and he was like, 501 00:32:44,240 --> 00:32:47,120 Jessica, she's going to get some shit for me. 502 00:32:47,120 --> 00:32:52,440 And then he took me all over to this beautiful tour of the island. 503 00:32:52,440 --> 00:32:59,000 And at the very end, you know, he, he, I had a hundred days sober or something like that. 504 00:32:59,000 --> 00:33:02,560 And I said, yeah, man, it's so lucky that I, I turned around and talked to you. 505 00:33:02,560 --> 00:33:05,880 And he said, luck, how often do you do that? 506 00:33:05,880 --> 00:33:06,880 Right. 507 00:33:06,880 --> 00:33:10,800 And there's seven of us on the island that hold down AA. 508 00:33:10,800 --> 00:33:15,920 And I have, he had 11 years, I guess it was actually. 509 00:33:15,920 --> 00:33:20,080 And so I began to know, okay, I have this voice and I don't really know what it is. 510 00:33:20,080 --> 00:33:25,880 But then the voice told me when my sister was dying that she was blocked from crossing 511 00:33:25,880 --> 00:33:30,680 because she was full of fear and that I needed to describe the light to her. 512 00:33:30,680 --> 00:33:32,960 And I was fighting it, fighting it, fighting it. 513 00:33:32,960 --> 00:33:35,600 Finally, I described the light to her. 514 00:33:35,600 --> 00:33:43,320 And 20 minutes later, she died, but I could feel her hovering and pouring the love. 515 00:33:43,320 --> 00:33:48,400 And it felt like I got a little freebie of the light that she poured into me. 516 00:33:48,400 --> 00:33:52,480 And then I began, okay, like this voice, I don't know what it is. 517 00:33:52,480 --> 00:33:53,840 And maybe I'm crazy. 518 00:33:53,840 --> 00:33:58,600 Maybe I'm like some kind of psychopath, but it seems to know more than I do. 519 00:33:58,600 --> 00:34:01,400 So many people have had this experience. 520 00:34:01,400 --> 00:34:07,360 I was at an intersection at night and the light turned green and he said, don't go. 521 00:34:07,360 --> 00:34:08,360 And I was like, that's dumb. 522 00:34:08,360 --> 00:34:09,360 I'm going to go. 523 00:34:09,360 --> 00:34:10,920 And he was like, don't go. 524 00:34:10,920 --> 00:34:11,920 He can yell. 525 00:34:11,920 --> 00:34:15,360 I don't, I know how to describe yelling in telepathy, but he can do it. 526 00:34:15,360 --> 00:34:17,400 So I looked in the rear view and there was no one behind me. 527 00:34:17,400 --> 00:34:18,960 So I'm like, huh. 528 00:34:18,960 --> 00:34:20,640 And then I'm like, how long don't go? 529 00:34:20,640 --> 00:34:25,880 And then this car goes zoom through the intersection going a hundred miles an hour. 530 00:34:25,880 --> 00:34:29,000 He saved me that way a few times. 531 00:34:29,000 --> 00:34:32,400 Some of the more dramatic ones, I don't have time for all of them. 532 00:34:32,400 --> 00:34:34,760 They're all in my book. 533 00:34:34,760 --> 00:34:41,440 But one had to do with, I wrote my addiction memoir and my family hated it because no one 534 00:34:41,440 --> 00:34:45,600 was reconciled to the fact that our father was alcoholic. 535 00:34:45,600 --> 00:34:49,520 I also wrote about my weird things, which they thought that's what I call my paranormal 536 00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:50,680 events. 537 00:34:50,680 --> 00:34:55,640 They thought I was just making stuff up and trying to capitalize on my nephew's death. 538 00:34:55,640 --> 00:35:01,640 And it's anytime you write a family history, family is going to be mad, but mine were soul 539 00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:04,800 mad and just came down on me so hard. 540 00:35:04,800 --> 00:35:10,640 And right after that was in the thick of that, I learned I had breast cancer. 541 00:35:10,640 --> 00:35:19,160 So really the breast cancer was bad, but the family stuff felt worse to just lose your 542 00:35:19,160 --> 00:35:21,640 first chakra of support. 543 00:35:21,640 --> 00:35:25,840 So I was going to a lot of Al-Anon meetings to try to detach from them. 544 00:35:25,840 --> 00:35:30,320 And I came out of one one day and it was raining really hard, this being back in Seattle. 545 00:35:30,320 --> 00:35:34,560 And I was on top of a very tall hill, this being Seattle Queen En Hill. 546 00:35:34,560 --> 00:35:39,520 And I remember taking a corner and touching my brakes and they're feeling just a little 547 00:35:39,520 --> 00:35:40,520 soft. 548 00:35:40,520 --> 00:35:44,760 So I thought, well, I'll probably have to get the brake pads replaced again. 549 00:35:44,760 --> 00:35:48,320 Sometimes, you know, here comes Ignacio. 550 00:35:48,320 --> 00:35:52,760 And he's like, get off the road, pull over, you have no brakes. 551 00:35:52,760 --> 00:35:55,680 And I'm like, don't be silly, man. 552 00:35:55,680 --> 00:35:58,400 I know it's raining and I have a hair appointment. 553 00:35:58,400 --> 00:36:00,040 No, no. 554 00:36:00,040 --> 00:36:02,960 And he's yelling again, you have nothing. 555 00:36:02,960 --> 00:36:08,400 And I'm coming up on this big hill that at the bottom, there's a busy intersection. 556 00:36:08,400 --> 00:36:12,000 And I have one more turn to make before I get to that hill. 557 00:36:12,000 --> 00:36:16,400 And I see a sign in a weird place that says arterial turns. 558 00:36:16,400 --> 00:36:19,520 And I'm like, is this where it turns? 559 00:36:19,520 --> 00:36:21,800 And it's like, yes, yes, turn, turn. 560 00:36:21,800 --> 00:36:24,120 So I turned and I had no brakes. 561 00:36:24,120 --> 00:36:28,520 I could hardly hold the turn in because I was it was there was nothing. 562 00:36:28,520 --> 00:36:30,200 My foot went to the floor. 563 00:36:30,200 --> 00:36:32,880 And then I realized, no, this isn't the right turn. 564 00:36:32,880 --> 00:36:35,440 This is just a tiny little side street. 565 00:36:35,440 --> 00:36:38,720 And then I rolled slowly to a stop. 566 00:36:38,720 --> 00:36:42,360 And I said, I'm sorry. 567 00:36:42,360 --> 00:36:43,360 Thank you. 568 00:36:43,360 --> 00:36:45,960 And I was like, okay, I'll never doubt you again. 569 00:36:45,960 --> 00:36:48,560 If you tell me something, it's true. 570 00:36:48,560 --> 00:36:56,680 So just to carry over from this, I had a party that fell very close to my 18th AA birthday. 571 00:36:56,680 --> 00:37:03,040 And a whole bunch of my friends from AA had I had done good things for many of them. 572 00:37:03,040 --> 00:37:04,280 And they came to this. 573 00:37:04,280 --> 00:37:05,280 I made it. 574 00:37:05,280 --> 00:37:09,440 I get to keep my boo party slash 18 years sober. 575 00:37:09,440 --> 00:37:14,080 And my house was full of people and they started singing happy birthdays. 576 00:37:14,080 --> 00:37:19,880 Someone had brought a cake and oh my gosh, it's hard to tell. 577 00:37:19,880 --> 00:37:28,120 So as I saw the cake and all the smiling faces, I thought your siblings are right. 578 00:37:28,120 --> 00:37:30,240 You're a freaking narcissist. 579 00:37:30,240 --> 00:37:35,040 And that's why you set up situations like this where you're the center of attention. 580 00:37:35,040 --> 00:37:37,240 You suck. 581 00:37:37,240 --> 00:37:41,280 And then Ignacio came and he was kind of laughing. 582 00:37:41,280 --> 00:37:46,400 And he said, this is the best part of life. 583 00:37:46,400 --> 00:37:48,240 Just let them love you. 584 00:37:48,240 --> 00:37:51,560 And it was kind of best part and whole point of life. 585 00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:54,560 He was saying, just let them love you. 586 00:37:54,560 --> 00:37:56,920 So I had promised him that I was going to obey him. 587 00:37:56,920 --> 00:38:03,080 So I was like, you know, to go from I hate myself to let them love you and look in their 588 00:38:03,080 --> 00:38:07,000 eyes and receive their love as I'm worthy person. 589 00:38:07,000 --> 00:38:11,400 So while I was going through this struggle, people were also taking pictures because it 590 00:38:11,400 --> 00:38:13,800 was a birthday moment. 591 00:38:13,800 --> 00:38:20,440 And the next day in one of my camera's pictures, I saw this big orb right by my left, which 592 00:38:20,440 --> 00:38:26,120 is always where I seem to hear him at the moment that I was going through this struggle. 593 00:38:26,120 --> 00:38:30,240 But then I was looking at Facebook and there was another picture from my friend's camera 594 00:38:30,240 --> 00:38:31,640 a moment later. 595 00:38:31,640 --> 00:38:36,200 And there's the orb again, but it's moved a few inches away. 596 00:38:36,200 --> 00:38:38,040 And I saw her picture. 597 00:38:38,040 --> 00:38:41,320 I was just like, oh my God, that's him. 598 00:38:41,320 --> 00:38:42,320 That's him. 599 00:38:42,320 --> 00:38:44,320 A question about him. 600 00:38:44,320 --> 00:38:51,520 So some people feel like they get direction in their life from the Holy Ghost or from, 601 00:38:51,520 --> 00:38:53,920 oh, what's the term I'm looking for? 602 00:38:53,920 --> 00:38:55,920 Oh, or from guardian angels. 603 00:38:55,920 --> 00:38:59,480 And a lot of things that he did for you are like guardian angels. 604 00:38:59,480 --> 00:39:04,480 Do you have a, do you want to put him under some kind of classification like that? 605 00:39:04,480 --> 00:39:07,480 Definitely, he's guardian angel. 606 00:39:07,480 --> 00:39:15,000 And he's sort of like, you know, the sun has shafts of light, you know, that are raised 607 00:39:15,000 --> 00:39:19,480 and he is like a sunbeam of God. 608 00:39:19,480 --> 00:39:24,960 He is part of God, but he is Ignacio. 609 00:39:24,960 --> 00:39:30,400 And the reason I call him Ignacio is during the pandemic, I had just too much time to 610 00:39:30,400 --> 00:39:33,480 talk to him. 611 00:39:33,480 --> 00:39:38,160 And I had started talking back and forth and I was like, I don't like calling you angel. 612 00:39:38,160 --> 00:39:40,880 Like angel is just, I don't like that name. 613 00:39:40,880 --> 00:39:43,840 Like don't you, how can you tell me a name? 614 00:39:43,840 --> 00:39:45,080 Not personal enough. 615 00:39:45,080 --> 00:39:46,080 Yeah. 616 00:39:46,080 --> 00:39:48,400 And he was just like, no, no, no, no, no. 617 00:39:48,400 --> 00:39:49,880 And I just kept nagging. 618 00:39:49,880 --> 00:39:51,960 I said, just tell me something. 619 00:39:51,960 --> 00:39:55,000 Then he comes back and again, it's just kind of impatience. 620 00:39:55,000 --> 00:40:00,240 And he's just like, little one, I have had so many lifetimes and so many names and none 621 00:40:00,240 --> 00:40:03,440 of them are in alphabets, you know. 622 00:40:03,440 --> 00:40:09,320 And then I was like, oh, I hadn't thought of that. 623 00:40:09,320 --> 00:40:11,760 And so I still wouldn't give up though. 624 00:40:11,760 --> 00:40:14,320 So I was like, just give me something, something, something. 625 00:40:14,320 --> 00:40:18,000 So then he starts playing charades and I'm sitting down and I'm meditating and I keep 626 00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:22,800 seeing an IG, IG and I'm like, I don't know any IG names. 627 00:40:22,800 --> 00:40:25,400 All I can think of is Iggy Pop. 628 00:40:25,400 --> 00:40:29,440 And he's like, what is Iggy's name? 629 00:40:29,440 --> 00:40:30,440 You know? 630 00:40:30,440 --> 00:40:32,680 And I'm like, is it Ignacio? 631 00:40:32,680 --> 00:40:36,120 And then he right away puts an E under the I. 632 00:40:36,120 --> 00:40:38,800 And so I'm like, egg, no, no. 633 00:40:38,800 --> 00:40:39,800 And it's like charades. 634 00:40:39,800 --> 00:40:41,440 And he's like, yes, yes, that's it. 635 00:40:41,440 --> 00:40:42,440 I can feel that. 636 00:40:42,440 --> 00:40:46,880 So then I googled it and it's an Etruscan name. 637 00:40:46,880 --> 00:40:55,520 When it's Italian with the I, but it's Etruscan with the E. It means born of fire. 638 00:40:55,520 --> 00:40:59,000 And that's where he held me was in the sun. 639 00:40:59,000 --> 00:41:01,120 And so I'm like, that's what I'm calling you, dude. 640 00:41:01,120 --> 00:41:02,760 He is okay. 641 00:41:02,760 --> 00:41:05,560 If you have to tell me something, I'll take that. 642 00:41:05,560 --> 00:41:10,040 You know, this, this just gets me thinking of all these interviews I've done, people 643 00:41:10,040 --> 00:41:18,160 who have met beings in the spirit world, their introductions don't happen. 644 00:41:18,160 --> 00:41:19,160 Okay. 645 00:41:19,160 --> 00:41:23,800 Somebody doesn't come up and say, I'm so and so, you know, and you're so and so from 646 00:41:23,800 --> 00:41:25,760 earth or something like that. 647 00:41:25,760 --> 00:41:26,760 It doesn't happen. 648 00:41:26,760 --> 00:41:31,600 So that's kind of an interesting take on it, how far you took that down the road. 649 00:41:31,600 --> 00:41:36,160 So I asked him also, like, you know, were you my dad? 650 00:41:36,160 --> 00:41:38,160 Were you my husband? 651 00:41:38,160 --> 00:41:41,160 Were you my, you know, how are we, why do you love me so much? 652 00:41:41,160 --> 00:41:42,720 Why are we connected? 653 00:41:42,720 --> 00:41:44,760 And a lot of times I ask things like that. 654 00:41:44,760 --> 00:41:49,240 And he says, little one, be human. 655 00:41:49,240 --> 00:41:51,760 Not going to answer everything you want. 656 00:41:51,760 --> 00:41:56,360 When we spoke before, you said something about how this NDE removed. 657 00:41:56,360 --> 00:42:01,880 I think you said it like a filter that was blocking spiritual energies or something like 658 00:42:01,880 --> 00:42:03,280 that. 659 00:42:03,280 --> 00:42:04,280 Explain that. 660 00:42:04,280 --> 00:42:07,600 I can read minds when I don't want to. 661 00:42:07,600 --> 00:42:12,040 And you, this never happened before prior to heaven's law. 662 00:42:12,040 --> 00:42:13,760 Heaven's law. 663 00:42:13,760 --> 00:42:19,160 And so, you know, some are, or I know when something's about to happen. 664 00:42:19,160 --> 00:42:24,680 So I wrote down someone's name on a clickboard before they said it. 665 00:42:24,680 --> 00:42:26,840 And boy, were they pissed. 666 00:42:26,840 --> 00:42:29,760 They just were like, how did you know that? 667 00:42:29,760 --> 00:42:31,800 Have you been spying on me? 668 00:42:31,800 --> 00:42:32,800 And I'm like, sorry, sorry. 669 00:42:32,800 --> 00:42:34,160 You know, like crossing it out and stuff. 670 00:42:34,160 --> 00:42:36,840 I couldn't explain to her. 671 00:42:36,840 --> 00:42:41,280 And then I often know I'm going to see people just before I see them. 672 00:42:41,280 --> 00:42:45,600 And I one time got very excited to see this guy that I hadn't seen in years. 673 00:42:45,600 --> 00:42:49,400 And I thought he was coming down the right hand side of the street. 674 00:42:49,400 --> 00:42:53,640 And then the last second I saw, I'm driving, that it wasn't him. 675 00:42:53,640 --> 00:42:59,720 And so my inner skeptic said, ah, see, this is all of your weird things are equally explainable 676 00:42:59,720 --> 00:43:00,880 in mundane terms. 677 00:43:00,880 --> 00:43:03,760 You would have gone on and said, oh, I knew I was going to see Tim. 678 00:43:03,760 --> 00:43:04,840 And then I saw him. 679 00:43:04,840 --> 00:43:09,760 And I'm like, and then here comes the real Tim down the left hand side of the street. 680 00:43:09,760 --> 00:43:11,120 And there's just no denying it. 681 00:43:11,120 --> 00:43:12,400 I see him so clearly. 682 00:43:12,400 --> 00:43:13,400 I honk later. 683 00:43:13,400 --> 00:43:17,160 I connected him over Facebook and yeah, he heard the honk. 684 00:43:17,160 --> 00:43:18,160 He was coming down. 685 00:43:18,160 --> 00:43:20,720 And I hadn't seen him in years and years. 686 00:43:20,720 --> 00:43:22,680 Another one was more embarrassing. 687 00:43:22,680 --> 00:43:27,560 I pulled into Home Depot parking lot and all of a sudden thought of this couple that I 688 00:43:27,560 --> 00:43:31,240 was friends with and thought, man, I bet they still have a really good sex life. 689 00:43:31,240 --> 00:43:36,480 I bet sometimes they send the little girls to grandma's and they just go for it. 690 00:43:36,480 --> 00:43:41,720 And then I saw her naked on a bed with her hair coming down. 691 00:43:41,720 --> 00:43:46,600 She was kind of propped up on one elbow and it was like a four poster and she looked gorgeous. 692 00:43:46,600 --> 00:43:49,320 And I thought, what's wrong with me? 693 00:43:49,320 --> 00:43:51,080 You know, I never think of her that way. 694 00:43:51,080 --> 00:43:53,440 I never even seen her with her hair down. 695 00:43:53,440 --> 00:43:55,680 I go into Home Depot. 696 00:43:55,680 --> 00:43:57,240 First I get turned around. 697 00:43:57,240 --> 00:44:00,760 I thought it was in Lowe's and went the wrong way and that killed some time. 698 00:44:00,760 --> 00:44:04,520 And then I came back and I was going down the main way in front of all the cash registers 699 00:44:04,520 --> 00:44:09,280 and coming the other way is that woman's husband Joel. 700 00:44:09,280 --> 00:44:12,040 And so he's like, how's he going? 701 00:44:12,040 --> 00:44:15,520 And I'm like, good, how's he going with you? 702 00:44:15,520 --> 00:44:20,760 And he goes, oh man, we just sent the girls to grandma's for a weekend and we got a bed 703 00:44:20,760 --> 00:44:25,880 and breakfast and he gets this big old grin and he goes, it was much needed. 704 00:44:25,880 --> 00:44:30,000 And I wanted to say, yeah, who knew your wife was so hot? 705 00:44:30,000 --> 00:44:34,400 And that was the one that happened in 2011. 706 00:44:34,400 --> 00:44:41,400 And I finally Googled IONs because I was like, this is too weird. 707 00:44:41,400 --> 00:44:46,760 And then in IONs, I learned that this is an after effect of an NDE. 708 00:44:46,760 --> 00:44:53,920 Now some people have this after effect directly after like they come back and they not only 709 00:44:53,920 --> 00:44:57,720 remember everything that happened to them, but these, I'm going to call them spiritual 710 00:44:57,720 --> 00:45:00,240 gifts they're given immediately. 711 00:45:00,240 --> 00:45:02,480 Years took quite a while. 712 00:45:02,480 --> 00:45:03,480 Yes. 713 00:45:03,480 --> 00:45:04,480 Didn't it? 714 00:45:04,480 --> 00:45:05,480 Yes. 715 00:45:05,480 --> 00:45:06,840 And some people, by the way, don't feel bad. 716 00:45:06,840 --> 00:45:08,760 Some people don't have any of this. 717 00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:09,760 We're glad. 718 00:45:09,760 --> 00:45:14,760 So, you know, I don't want those people to feel like, oh darn, I got, you know, I died 719 00:45:14,760 --> 00:45:18,080 and all I came back with was this T-shirt kind of thing. 720 00:45:18,080 --> 00:45:23,880 I think so again, I believe there is this kind of sphere encapsulating us to make us 721 00:45:23,880 --> 00:45:25,160 distinct from God. 722 00:45:25,160 --> 00:45:31,520 I like to call it a God phobic membrane in the same way that each cell in your body 723 00:45:31,520 --> 00:45:35,600 needs a hydrophobic membrane in order to function. 724 00:45:35,600 --> 00:45:41,200 If we were constantly hearing all of the signals around us, we would get eaten by a line like 725 00:45:41,200 --> 00:45:42,200 that. 726 00:45:42,200 --> 00:45:44,840 You know, we have to be focused on the physical world. 727 00:45:44,840 --> 00:45:47,360 So we've got this kind of shield. 728 00:45:47,360 --> 00:45:53,760 For some of us, it gets damaged when we leave it and come back. 729 00:45:53,760 --> 00:45:57,280 Bruce Greason, who does a lot of research, he thinks it's something in the brain that 730 00:45:57,280 --> 00:45:58,280 shifts. 731 00:45:58,280 --> 00:46:04,760 I think it's something in our aura that gets literally like torn when we leave it and things 732 00:46:04,760 --> 00:46:05,760 can leak in. 733 00:46:05,760 --> 00:46:09,600 My, more often than not, my stuff seems to come from the left. 734 00:46:09,600 --> 00:46:13,360 I know it sounds so weird, but I didn't go to Ions. 735 00:46:13,360 --> 00:46:16,320 I went to Ions 30 years after my NDE. 736 00:46:16,320 --> 00:46:23,600 What there was with me was both a loyalty to my father for atheism and alcoholism. 737 00:46:23,600 --> 00:46:25,040 I just did not. 738 00:46:25,040 --> 00:46:30,720 I knew I had this moment of truth the next morning after my NDE where either this was 739 00:46:30,720 --> 00:46:38,560 real and I changed my whole identity or I come up with an explanation of hypoxia to explain 740 00:46:38,560 --> 00:46:39,560 it away. 741 00:46:39,560 --> 00:46:45,040 Though I knew it couldn't account for the, you know, the voice that I had heard or the 742 00:46:45,040 --> 00:46:50,080 sense that it was more real or especially that, you know, you're not done yet. 743 00:46:50,080 --> 00:46:56,680 But if I, if I acknowledged it was real, I couldn't keep drinking and the pull of my 744 00:46:56,680 --> 00:47:00,240 alcoholic life was strong. 745 00:47:00,240 --> 00:47:01,240 I was only 22. 746 00:47:01,240 --> 00:47:04,000 Also, it was not near my bottom yet. 747 00:47:04,000 --> 00:47:09,440 You know, I was still quote having fun, although it really was over then the panic attacks 748 00:47:09,440 --> 00:47:10,440 began. 749 00:47:10,440 --> 00:47:16,480 But when I made that choice to turn my back on the spirit world, as I said, my first 750 00:47:16,480 --> 00:47:19,680 two paranormal events were dark. 751 00:47:19,680 --> 00:47:27,320 That fisherman was as upset as I was and the sadness around my brother to be tuned into 752 00:47:27,320 --> 00:47:28,320 that. 753 00:47:28,320 --> 00:47:33,840 The turning point was when I stopped drinking and he did other things to get me into AA. 754 00:47:33,840 --> 00:47:40,240 Like he got me into a relationship with someone in AA that I, I know I was steered by him. 755 00:47:40,240 --> 00:47:46,400 It's another story, but in AA, I kind of had the scaffolding to learn what he wanted me 756 00:47:46,400 --> 00:47:54,400 to learn also, which was that life is about giving love and receiving love and being useful 757 00:47:54,400 --> 00:48:00,680 and of service to other people and loving them as you do it, you know, not doing it 758 00:48:00,680 --> 00:48:03,560 out of an eye and that's, you know, for real. 759 00:48:03,560 --> 00:48:10,960 It's about giving from a place of plenty and leaving one, one, 90 ERI interviewed said 760 00:48:10,960 --> 00:48:15,480 she was told it's about the wake you leave behind you. 761 00:48:15,480 --> 00:48:21,880 Does each person feel better after interacting with you or do they feel saddened? 762 00:48:21,880 --> 00:48:23,120 I love that. 763 00:48:23,120 --> 00:48:27,560 And people that talk to me about their life reviews, that's something that comes up is 764 00:48:27,560 --> 00:48:33,480 they get put in the position of the one that they affected and they feel that how they 765 00:48:33,480 --> 00:48:35,800 affected that person. 766 00:48:35,800 --> 00:48:39,600 Speaking of, I have kind of a cool story, but get into that. 767 00:48:39,600 --> 00:48:42,360 You and I talked about how you met Kathy McDaniel. 768 00:48:42,360 --> 00:48:45,040 She's been on this show. 769 00:48:45,040 --> 00:48:46,440 Drop that one real quick. 770 00:48:46,440 --> 00:48:47,440 All right. 771 00:48:47,440 --> 00:48:48,440 All right. 772 00:48:48,440 --> 00:48:51,840 Well, you have to read Kathy, Kathy's book in Kathy's book. 773 00:48:51,840 --> 00:48:57,000 She talks about how she kept hearing this voice that she wanted to prove was not real 774 00:48:57,000 --> 00:49:03,080 and the voice told her she had to go to this Ion's meeting quite a drive for her because 775 00:49:03,080 --> 00:49:08,960 she was going to meet a special friend there and she was just so huffy and she drove there 776 00:49:08,960 --> 00:49:09,960 despite it. 777 00:49:09,960 --> 00:49:15,240 And then just to prove it wrong, she got there super early and she sat on the end seat by 778 00:49:15,240 --> 00:49:20,640 an aisle in an empty auditorium and she was like, okay, so show me. 779 00:49:20,640 --> 00:49:22,280 So I walked in and I don't know. 780 00:49:22,280 --> 00:49:25,240 I never get places early, but I got there early also. 781 00:49:25,240 --> 00:49:30,000 And I dropped off my cornbread at the table for the potluck. 782 00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:34,800 And then I looked at this empty thing and I thought, okay, I want to hear this guy. 783 00:49:34,800 --> 00:49:38,440 It's going to be evidence of the afterlife. 784 00:49:38,440 --> 00:49:40,080 Jeff Long, I want to hear him. 785 00:49:40,080 --> 00:49:42,120 So I'm going to the front row, man. 786 00:49:42,120 --> 00:49:48,120 So I start down and then I see the back of Kathy's head and Ignacio says, sit next to 787 00:49:48,120 --> 00:49:49,120 her. 788 00:49:49,120 --> 00:49:50,400 She needs a friend. 789 00:49:50,400 --> 00:49:54,240 And so I said to him like, next to her? 790 00:49:54,240 --> 00:49:55,240 He says, empty. 791 00:49:55,240 --> 00:49:57,560 She's going to think I'm a freaking weirdo. 792 00:49:57,560 --> 00:49:59,000 And he answers. 793 00:49:59,000 --> 00:50:03,520 He says, there will be some anger, but love can cut right through it. 794 00:50:03,520 --> 00:50:04,680 He didn't say anger. 795 00:50:04,680 --> 00:50:07,720 He said, there will be some, I don't know what he is. 796 00:50:07,720 --> 00:50:10,480 She'll react, but love can cut right through it. 797 00:50:10,480 --> 00:50:13,760 So I'm like, okay, I don't disobey you anymore. 798 00:50:13,760 --> 00:50:20,520 So I had to go past all the seats to get to her. 799 00:50:20,520 --> 00:50:25,600 And I got closer and closer and closer and I sat down right next to her. 800 00:50:25,600 --> 00:50:30,040 And if she writes in her book, she says it's a good thing I was sitting down because I 801 00:50:30,040 --> 00:50:31,040 was. 802 00:50:31,040 --> 00:50:36,480 And so she didn't say anything to me and I just said, hi, I'm Louisa. 803 00:50:36,480 --> 00:50:42,280 And then at the break, she said, this, you're going to think I'm crazy, but a voice told 804 00:50:42,280 --> 00:50:45,360 me you would be here. 805 00:50:45,360 --> 00:50:47,520 And I said, Mike Lewis told me too. 806 00:50:47,520 --> 00:50:50,120 And she was again, dumb counted. 807 00:50:50,120 --> 00:50:55,920 So she, because she had come from gone to hell, she was very ashamed of her NDE, but 808 00:50:55,920 --> 00:51:00,000 she agreed to listen when I told mine the following month. 809 00:51:00,000 --> 00:51:04,600 She sat front and center and was my look at this person because you're nervous person. 810 00:51:04,600 --> 00:51:11,120 And I had a lot of dark stuff from my childhood that I decided to share. 811 00:51:11,120 --> 00:51:15,680 And she heard that and she was like, man, if she can share that, I can share mine. 812 00:51:15,680 --> 00:51:18,960 And we are good friends now. 813 00:51:18,960 --> 00:51:21,760 I've been very supportive of her writing her book. 814 00:51:21,760 --> 00:51:27,000 By the way, Kathy's experience for those that haven't heard her episode yet. 815 00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:30,040 And maybe we'll stick that in the show notes. 816 00:51:30,040 --> 00:51:31,800 It was about going to hell. 817 00:51:31,800 --> 00:51:35,880 And then how she got out of there and super interesting. 818 00:51:35,880 --> 00:51:41,880 And I think without the support of a friend, there were no dark NDE ears in Ions at that 819 00:51:41,880 --> 00:51:43,120 time that she knew of. 820 00:51:43,120 --> 00:51:44,880 She had to find them, right? 821 00:51:44,880 --> 00:51:50,680 Because people were secretive and the voice guiding her to me and my voice guiding her 822 00:51:50,680 --> 00:51:51,680 to her. 823 00:51:51,680 --> 00:51:57,200 We became a kind of duo that gave us both the strength to share. 824 00:51:57,200 --> 00:51:58,200 Okay. 825 00:51:58,200 --> 00:52:00,600 Couple quick questions and we need to wrap up. 826 00:52:00,600 --> 00:52:03,160 How often do you get direction from Ignacio? 827 00:52:03,160 --> 00:52:10,600 Man, he goes sometimes for months or I mean, the weird things that were so weird that I 828 00:52:10,600 --> 00:52:15,160 could not deny they were his would come a couple years apart, right? 829 00:52:15,160 --> 00:52:20,400 And a lot of times I'm not sure whether it's my thought or his thought. 830 00:52:20,400 --> 00:52:26,400 So I'd say the ones where he takes what I'm saying and says, no, you're doing the opposite, 831 00:52:26,400 --> 00:52:30,840 you know, those come maybe once a year or every two years. 832 00:52:30,840 --> 00:52:34,000 There are much more of them in my book. 833 00:52:34,000 --> 00:52:37,880 I think anytime I want to pray and meditate, I can. 834 00:52:37,880 --> 00:52:43,720 I'm moving to Oregon because when I came out of anesthesia from getting my hip replaced, 835 00:52:43,720 --> 00:52:50,880 she put this image on the wall in front of me and he pointed out that almost all my interactions, 836 00:52:50,880 --> 00:52:55,080 I was at the center of a hub and coming out for me were all my interactions with people. 837 00:52:55,080 --> 00:52:57,560 He said, these are all virtual. 838 00:52:57,560 --> 00:53:00,640 You did not have people in your home. 839 00:53:00,640 --> 00:53:04,880 You're just, and he showed me, me and my home from above as this pencil scribble that was 840 00:53:04,880 --> 00:53:08,760 just following where I went and becoming this dark black scribble. 841 00:53:08,760 --> 00:53:10,840 And he said, and it's not good. 842 00:53:10,840 --> 00:53:12,840 You need to go. 843 00:53:12,840 --> 00:53:13,840 And so I'm moving. 844 00:53:13,840 --> 00:53:14,840 Cool. 845 00:53:14,840 --> 00:53:18,920 It sounded like when you were told that you needed to come back, when you were in the 846 00:53:18,920 --> 00:53:22,080 sun, that you were not given a choice at all. 847 00:53:22,080 --> 00:53:24,480 You were just told, here's what it is. 848 00:53:24,480 --> 00:53:25,480 Is that correct? 849 00:53:25,480 --> 00:53:26,480 Yeah. 850 00:53:26,480 --> 00:53:31,440 And we're overriding a whole poison dose of lidocaine to make it happen, but you're 851 00:53:31,440 --> 00:53:32,440 going back. 852 00:53:32,440 --> 00:53:35,240 Yeah, and I've never heard of lidocaine poisoning before. 853 00:53:35,240 --> 00:53:37,440 I can't imagine what it's like. 854 00:53:37,440 --> 00:53:41,000 I don't know much about how the symptoms work or anything. 855 00:53:41,000 --> 00:53:45,560 What do you make of the fact that some people get a choice of whether to stay or come back 856 00:53:45,560 --> 00:53:48,680 and some people are just told you have to go back? 857 00:53:48,680 --> 00:53:50,440 You thought about that? 858 00:53:50,440 --> 00:54:01,200 You know, I write a blog that I fund on recovery from alcoholism and it has half a million 859 00:54:01,200 --> 00:54:02,840 views. 860 00:54:02,840 --> 00:54:07,200 And I believe it has helped people. 861 00:54:07,200 --> 00:54:11,480 And I've sponsored a lot of women and helped them get sober. 862 00:54:11,480 --> 00:54:14,880 And I know that I have helped them. 863 00:54:14,880 --> 00:54:19,000 I lived my life trying to spread kindness. 864 00:54:19,000 --> 00:54:25,360 And I had a son, have a son, who is a gift. 865 00:54:25,360 --> 00:54:31,040 I had a 2% chance of having him in vitro, not in vitro. 866 00:54:31,040 --> 00:54:32,480 What do you call that? 867 00:54:32,480 --> 00:54:35,840 Artificial insemination at the age of 40. 868 00:54:35,840 --> 00:54:38,720 It's not supposed to work. 869 00:54:38,720 --> 00:54:42,200 But I have him and he's a wonderful person too. 870 00:54:42,200 --> 00:54:51,960 And I feel that at 22, I was so screwed up by my childhood that I had not given anything 871 00:54:51,960 --> 00:54:56,760 from the gifts that I was given except greed-wise. 872 00:54:56,760 --> 00:54:58,920 I had done well. 873 00:54:58,920 --> 00:55:02,320 But it was just so much squandered potential. 874 00:55:02,320 --> 00:55:07,680 And Ignacio was just like, you're going to use these gifts. 875 00:55:07,680 --> 00:55:09,160 You know? 876 00:55:09,160 --> 00:55:14,320 He was like, this is just too much to scrap it at 22. 877 00:55:14,320 --> 00:55:19,160 So are you thinking that at that age and where you were and what your upbringing was, you 878 00:55:19,160 --> 00:55:21,920 would have made the wrong choice and you would have stayed? 879 00:55:21,920 --> 00:55:24,840 Oh, I was determined to stay. 880 00:55:24,840 --> 00:55:26,920 And I hate to call that the wrong choice. 881 00:55:26,920 --> 00:55:29,320 You would have made a different choice. 882 00:55:29,320 --> 00:55:32,840 But you were sent back here because you had a lot of good to do. 883 00:55:32,840 --> 00:55:38,280 And he knew he was going 100% against my will, but that's the case closed, honey. 884 00:55:38,280 --> 00:55:40,920 Like I have made a ruling and you are going back. 885 00:55:40,920 --> 00:55:46,280 I have one other thing in my notes from our pre-interview in quotes, kindness matters. 886 00:55:46,280 --> 00:55:48,680 Where did that come from? 887 00:55:48,680 --> 00:55:58,240 It's just if the whole idea of life is to leave this wake of goodness behind you, every 888 00:55:58,240 --> 00:56:01,440 interaction matters. 889 00:56:01,440 --> 00:56:08,760 Every interaction is a choice to either make some more God by making a connection with 890 00:56:08,760 --> 00:56:15,800 somebody even just for a second, just even a smile, just any exchange of yes, we are 891 00:56:15,800 --> 00:56:21,480 connected in some way by our humanity, by being alive on the planet at this instant 892 00:56:21,480 --> 00:56:22,480 of the planet. 893 00:56:22,480 --> 00:56:26,640 You know, I've had a lot of people die recently. 894 00:56:26,640 --> 00:56:32,320 If you look behind me, you can see ashes from my mother and next to it, a little thing of 895 00:56:32,320 --> 00:56:39,920 ashes from my ex-boyfriend who died in July from drinking, drank himself to death. 896 00:56:39,920 --> 00:56:44,680 And I need to take his ashes to the top of a mountain to drop them off. 897 00:56:44,680 --> 00:56:49,880 Anyway, it's a hard mountain to climb, three fingers. 898 00:56:49,880 --> 00:56:53,440 What you remember of someone is the moments of kindness. 899 00:56:53,440 --> 00:56:58,240 I'm throwing away everything from my mom, all these papers, all this stuff saved and 900 00:56:58,240 --> 00:57:05,560 I'm keeping whatever, but no one remembers anything but your kindness. 901 00:57:05,560 --> 00:57:07,600 What did Maya Angelou say? 902 00:57:07,600 --> 00:57:11,320 People won't remember what you did, but they'll remember how you made them feel. 903 00:57:11,320 --> 00:57:14,160 That's the gift you have to give. 904 00:57:14,160 --> 00:57:17,600 Louisa Peck, thank you so much for being with us. 905 00:57:17,600 --> 00:57:19,360 And tell us again about your book. 906 00:57:19,360 --> 00:57:20,360 Sure. 907 00:57:20,360 --> 00:57:21,360 Thank you. 908 00:57:21,360 --> 00:57:28,640 My book is called Die Hard Atheist from NDE Denier to Full on Woo Woo Against My Will 909 00:57:28,640 --> 00:57:33,080 and it's on Amazon in both paperback and e-book. 910 00:57:33,080 --> 00:57:37,760 And you won't find another book with Woo Woo in the title. 911 00:57:37,760 --> 00:57:41,040 Thanks again. 912 00:57:41,040 --> 00:57:43,840 Thanks again for listening and sharing this podcast. 913 00:57:43,840 --> 00:57:49,920 Don't forget to hit the follow or subscribe button and sign up for our newsletter at roundtriptest.com. 914 00:57:49,920 --> 00:57:54,200 If you want to share your near-death experience or if you have questions or comments about 915 00:57:54,200 --> 00:57:58,720 the show, send an email to ericatroundtriptest.com. 916 00:57:58,720 --> 00:58:24,720 Until then, I wish you everything good that you're looking for in this life and the next.