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From the time that they pronounced me deaf was a good 45 minutes.

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They cut my clothes and then they paddled my heart, my heart had stopped.

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And I could see people screaming and crying, but I didn't realize that was actually my

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physical body because I was somewhere else.

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The only thing that I could feel, if you could imagine, absolute love and peace, there wasn't

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anything else to be felt.

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I was greeted by people I'd known in the past.

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I'm back home again.

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Incredibly safe and felt at home.

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Welcome to Roundtrip Death, everybody, and we have the special honor all the way from

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Belgium.

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We're talking to Patrick today.

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Good morning and good evening to you.

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How are you?

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Pretty good.

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Good evening and good morning to you.

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Did you tell me you live in a castle?

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Yes.

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So, it was a castle at one point or like a palace.

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Castles here are not fortresses like what you see in Germany.

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They're like big estates.

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There's two still in a town that I have that are active castles, big nobility estates.

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The interesting story was he's actually a pretty famous doctor, very famous for ornithology.

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And he also did the family lines in the Congo, basically mapped out like the royal family

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lines and everything else, took part in World War I and in World War II, he was still a

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doctor.

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He was part of the underground resistance smuggling Allied pilots that got shot down

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or Allied air crew back across the channel.

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And he was caught by the Nazis and eventually he was executed in Berlin.

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But yeah, so he did a lot of good stuff for the Allied war effort.

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Wow.

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That is awesome.

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Well, today we're talking about near-death experiences.

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And yours happened not that long ago.

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No, about a year and a half ago now at this point.

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And awfully traumatic because this is related to food poisoning.

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In fact, speaking of trauma, I know your wife does not like to relive this.

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Before we get into the whole story, do you mind sharing why it's so difficult to talk

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about?

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I had just retired from the Army.

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I had worked for a civilian job now.

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But I just retired from the Army.

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So that's almost 23 years.

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So it's 22 and a half years total service.

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And she's watching me basically fade away on the celebration we're supposed to have for

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the retirement.

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So I mean, she's watching me go.

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I was gone twice that night, medically dead, not completely dead.

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But I guess was it cardio death?

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If your heart stops, that's dead enough for me.

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It sucks when you can feel it too.

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It's really terrible when you can feel it.

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OK.

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Let's go back about a year and a half ago.

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You came across some bad oysters and didn't know it.

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What was going on?

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You were out to eat and what happened?

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Yeah, nothing unusual.

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It was a pretty decent night.

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And we get back to the beach house that we were staying at.

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You know, everybody goes to bed.

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And this was in Florida, correct?

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South Carolina.

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South Carolina, OK.

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Yeah, Myrtle Beach area.

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And go to sleep, no problem.

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Probably about two to three hours later, I wake up with just this.

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It's really hard to describe.

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It's one of those pains where you just like, you know, you're kind of in a bad position.

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Like, this is not good.

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And I noticed that I couldn't move.

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I couldn't, you know, all my limbs were going tingly.

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And I just barely managed to flop over, nudge my wife enough and just blurred out, you know,

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poison 911.

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And my wife, of course, she's waking up like, oh my God.

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And at that point, that was the first time I went was I, I, as she described it, you

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know, did the curled up kicking cockroach type of thing.

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I had no control over this.

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I didn't know what was going on.

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I was lucid the entire time.

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I know I didn't have any control over anything on my body.

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At that point, I couldn't feel anything.

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Everything felt like it was on fire.

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And she said, I like tensed up and all of a sudden I just dropped.

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And she said, the mice went glassy.

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People's completely gone, everything.

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And I remember during that time, it roughly coincided with, you know, everything's hurting

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and all of a sudden it just felt like I dropped the way.

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It was a weird dropping feeling.

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And then there was this place that my grandpa, you know, he lived in Charleston when I was

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a kid and they were still developing it back in the 80s.

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And there was a pond across the street.

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And I remember I'm there.

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I'm looking out of like, whenever I drop, I'm looking out across that pond.

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I don't know whether it has no significance to me.

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I just remember I was there.

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And it was almost like a, like a trip through like, you know, going, going back through

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your life.

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Like they say, a life flashes before your eyes.

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Those are some things that just, they had no real significance.

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But I remember I was there looking across.

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I remember we were fishing.

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And then after that it was, it was, everything was in gray tones.

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It was very familiar.

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So it's really hard to describe, but it's kind of like a club of some type.

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I know it sounds weird, but you've got those rope barriers.

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You mean like the velvet kind?

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Yep.

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That was weird.

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Like family members that have been dead for a while were behind it and they're yelling

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at me and I'm all of a sudden back to being a kid.

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Like I'm only a little kid and I'm running towards those rope barriers and somebody,

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I guess like, like he equated it to a bouncer is like closing the rope barrier off and pushing

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me back.

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And you hear, I'm yelling, no, no, go back, go back.

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Go like that.

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I'm trying to go forward, but then they keep yelling, go back, go back.

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Somebody I don't know who it was.

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A voice I'd never heard before was like, go back.

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It's not your time.

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Yeah.

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It was just a weird, it was a voice out of nowhere.

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Go back.

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It's not your time.

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All right.

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Slow down.

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I want to totally pick this apart a little bit.

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So you, you mentioned something about the, I think you used the term dropping.

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You felt like you were dropping.

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Explain that.

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Yeah.

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So it was like my vision was falling away.

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Everything was falling away.

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Like the world was falling.

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And not like, it's not like going down outward per se, hell or anything like that.

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It wasn't as that it was just like, like all of a sudden, you notice the room is unnaturally

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or the roof is unnaturally high.

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Everything's unnaturally far away.

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Everything just drops.

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Did you feel any kind of sensation of maybe you were leaving your body or more like a

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dream or what else?

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So I do remember, like I said, my depth perception got to where it was like, you know, the room

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was much larger, much higher, the roof was much higher as I'm looking at it.

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And it was a drop like a falling feeling.

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Okay.

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That's very unusual.

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That's interesting.

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And everything was not hurting.

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That's a, that's a thing is that I couldn't feel the hurt anymore.

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The only thing I felt was the cold in my chest.

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That was before the paramedics got there.

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My heart stopped the first time.

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Okay.

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So I felt, I felt that, but it was, it was, it faded away.

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And it was a drop.

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Like I said, like the, the, that your depth perception were, you know, everything seems

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further and further away, a dropping feeling.

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She said at that point I was twitching.

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Like my body was just twitching.

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And you said you saw relatives.

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Yeah.

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Tell me about that.

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Do you know about how many and who they were?

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Definitely saw my grandmother, my grandfather, one of my uncles that passed a couple of

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years ago, a few others, I wasn't sure who they were, but they felt familiar and it wasn't,

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you couldn't really see them.

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They said, everything's in gray tones.

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You just kind of feel who they are.

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They're very familiar, but they're behind this like velvet rope barrier type of thing

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telling me, you know, no, go back, go back.

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Like, don't go this way.

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Go back.

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And as I'm running up towards, towards the ropes, almost like a bouncer, you know, somebody

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just closes off the, you know, the little rope barrier and it's, you know, basically

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like, you know, I put in their hand up, like, don't go, don't go.

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And it's all very confusing.

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Keep in mind that I'm a zero once guy.

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I'm a RF engineer.

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So I, you know, I like zeros and ones.

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I like things that like either make sense or it doesn't, you know, and I couldn't explain

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any of it, but, you know, you can feel the relatives, but you can't really see anything.

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Everything's in gray tone for some reason, or at least it was for me after I fell away.

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Everything went to gray tones.

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And I was like, kind of like being outside in a full moon where it's cloudy, but there's

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still a moon light going through.

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Then you can kind of see shapes of people.

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Really hard to describe.

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Like I said, it's just kind of like different tones of gray, but it wasn't solid.

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They were, it's really hard to describe it.

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How are you feeling at this point?

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In other words, especially from the other, the beings that you are seeing there, are

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you feeling drawn towards them?

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Are you feeling fear?

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Or what do you think?

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I feel like I'm a kid.

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You know, whenever you, you know, get a little, like maybe one or two year old that's just

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learning how to walk.

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And all of a sudden they run off in their pants and they go underneath, you know, say

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like the line at the grocery store or something like that running off.

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And as people try and tell you to, you know, go back, I felt like a, like little again.

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And I'm running.

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I remember I was running towards it.

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And all of a sudden, like there were people there that I didn't know.

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I didn't know who they were, but they were trying to keep me from going through to all

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of a sudden I just remember that voice just cut through everything and said, not your

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time.

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Go back.

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And then after that it was follow me, focus on breathing.

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Then it was like, inhale, exhale, inhale, it was whatever, whoever the voice was, coaching

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me on how to breathe.

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And it wasn't my wife.

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Paramedics had not shown up yet and they had just woken up my sister, her husband, and

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then my older daughter who's an adult.

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They just woken them up to try to basically try anything.

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I didn't recognize any of their voices.

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This was a voice that was coaching me on how to breathe.

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And that was something that you should, it was very calming.

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And I couldn't place if it was a man or a woman or something, but there was somebody

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coaching me on how to breathe.

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And I remember I came out of it final and I remember like taking that first breath and

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everything hurting, like my lungs hurt, you know, my limbs hurt, everything hurt, but

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I was back.

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Probably about a, I don't know, I didn't have a sense of time.

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I could hear everything.

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So the first thing that goes when you go is your sight, but your ears are still going.

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So you do hear people out there.

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And whenever the ears go, that's when I thought I was done.

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But I could hear everything.

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I could hear my sister freaking out.

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You know, I could hear my wife freaking out.

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I was back.

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My vision started coming back.

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And I remember that that first time it was like, Oh man, what happened?

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Like, where did I go?

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Like what time is it?

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You know, like you just felt disoriented.

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Okay.

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So you're back, but that's not the end of the experience we're going to be talking about.

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Oh no, I'd hurt.

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Oh, everything was still hurting.

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My limbs are still twitching.

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Okay.

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What happened next?

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Paramedics took how long to get there?

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I don't know.

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Okay.

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I don't know.

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I don't know how long.

249
00:11:51,480 --> 00:11:54,280
I know when this whole thing was over, it was sunrise.

250
00:11:54,280 --> 00:11:57,520
We probably went to bed about like 10 or 11 or so.

251
00:11:57,520 --> 00:11:59,640
So it was an all night thing.

252
00:11:59,640 --> 00:12:00,640
Paramedics come in there.

253
00:12:00,640 --> 00:12:07,480
I was a loose enough, but I was, I was focusing on breathing so much because I was not breathing

254
00:12:07,480 --> 00:12:08,480
normally.

255
00:12:08,480 --> 00:12:12,080
I had to kind of make a compromise where the only thing I really had control over was

256
00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:15,560
my stomach for some reason.

257
00:12:15,560 --> 00:12:19,600
So I was pumping in my stomach and trying to breathe and they're asking me questions and

258
00:12:19,600 --> 00:12:25,080
I'm like, I want to answer, but help me with like some type of breathing apparatus or help

259
00:12:25,080 --> 00:12:26,080
me breathe.

260
00:12:26,080 --> 00:12:28,760
I'm trying to communicate that to them.

261
00:12:28,760 --> 00:12:33,800
And then one guy, he was a, he was a, I forgot what he did in the military before he became

262
00:12:33,800 --> 00:12:39,480
a paramedic, but he started talking to me about, you know, just like, Hey, you know,

263
00:12:39,480 --> 00:12:40,480
what service were you in?

264
00:12:40,480 --> 00:12:41,480
You know, Hey, I was army.

265
00:12:41,480 --> 00:12:45,560
I'm trying to talk to the guy, but I'm like, I'm like, focus breathing.

266
00:12:45,560 --> 00:12:50,120
Like, I'm trying to like tell them, help me breathe, like help me breathe.

267
00:12:50,120 --> 00:12:51,720
Like I said, I had no control of my limbs.

268
00:12:51,720 --> 00:12:54,120
The only thing I had control over was my stomach.

269
00:12:54,120 --> 00:12:57,440
Then I'm trying to basically force the breath.

270
00:12:57,440 --> 00:13:01,640
Finally I remember them picking up the sheets and loading me onto the ambulance.

271
00:13:01,640 --> 00:13:02,640
I got in there.

272
00:13:02,640 --> 00:13:07,760
I just remember like I came to finally like a hundred percent and then all of a sudden

273
00:13:07,760 --> 00:13:12,000
like everything turned red and I went again.

274
00:13:12,000 --> 00:13:16,680
There were people there again or she, I would say, she, so they felt very familiar.

275
00:13:16,680 --> 00:13:19,480
Tell me, no, no, go back, go back.

276
00:13:19,480 --> 00:13:21,680
My eyes went or my eyes went this time.

277
00:13:21,680 --> 00:13:26,800
I'm hooked up to a EKG so I can hear the, my heart stop.

278
00:13:26,800 --> 00:13:30,880
And I said, I just remember thinking to myself, you know, keeping it clean on here.

279
00:13:30,880 --> 00:13:32,440
Oh heck no.

280
00:13:32,440 --> 00:13:33,440
That's it.

281
00:13:33,440 --> 00:13:34,440
Like, come on.

282
00:13:34,440 --> 00:13:38,400
Again, it was the whole not your time go back.

283
00:13:38,400 --> 00:13:40,720
And I just remember like they stopped the ambulance.

284
00:13:40,720 --> 00:13:43,680
The drivers got out to try to work on me.

285
00:13:43,680 --> 00:13:46,560
And I'm basically going into spasms at this point.

286
00:13:46,560 --> 00:13:48,640
I could feel my heart stop.

287
00:13:48,640 --> 00:13:49,640
Your limbs go cold.

288
00:13:49,640 --> 00:13:54,960
It's like a sleep paralysis, but it starts in the chest and it works its way across and

289
00:13:54,960 --> 00:13:58,000
all your limbs are basically fighting for air.

290
00:13:58,000 --> 00:14:00,680
I never want to experience pain like that again.

291
00:14:00,680 --> 00:14:08,120
Like I left again and I just remember getting angry, basically turning around so to speak

292
00:14:08,120 --> 00:14:09,120
and running back.

293
00:14:09,120 --> 00:14:11,080
I just got real angry.

294
00:14:11,080 --> 00:14:16,000
Like this is not how it's supposed to end or something like that.

295
00:14:16,000 --> 00:14:18,840
I just remember getting extreme anger.

296
00:14:18,840 --> 00:14:21,840
I came to, I sat up, poor paramedic.

297
00:14:21,840 --> 00:14:26,080
I was probably kid of about maybe early 20s or so.

298
00:14:26,080 --> 00:14:28,720
I grabbed him by the collar.

299
00:14:28,720 --> 00:14:30,840
I sat up, I'm like, no.

300
00:14:30,840 --> 00:14:32,680
And he's like, do we need to tie him down?

301
00:14:32,680 --> 00:14:34,440
I'm like, no, no, just go.

302
00:14:34,440 --> 00:14:38,320
Just finally I was able to actually have control over myself, but I was just anger.

303
00:14:38,320 --> 00:14:41,480
So you're talking for the first time now, sounds like.

304
00:14:41,480 --> 00:14:47,400
Well, I had been able to like, blurt out words before because I didn't have the breath that

305
00:14:47,400 --> 00:14:49,920
tried to make a conversation.

306
00:14:49,920 --> 00:14:57,040
So it was simple words that would blur out to the paramedics like IV, breathing, focus,

307
00:14:57,040 --> 00:15:00,120
breathe, like I'm trying to tell them like, Hey, this is what I need.

308
00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:01,640
I need something to flush out.

309
00:15:01,640 --> 00:15:05,280
I think they finally figured it out because they did inject.

310
00:15:05,280 --> 00:15:07,520
I want to say I'm probably going to have this wrong.

311
00:15:07,520 --> 00:15:08,720
I think it was like the task or something.

312
00:15:08,720 --> 00:15:13,960
I tried to flush it out and the IV line, but they injected it and it started feeling better

313
00:15:13,960 --> 00:15:15,680
after that.

314
00:15:15,680 --> 00:15:20,120
And then finally with the anger, I was actually able to talk normally.

315
00:15:20,120 --> 00:15:24,320
I remember being angry and coming back, like sitting up, grabbing the poor kid.

316
00:15:24,320 --> 00:15:28,000
He looked like his eyes were wide because they were just prepping the shock paddles

317
00:15:28,000 --> 00:15:29,000
and bringing me back.

318
00:15:29,000 --> 00:15:30,560
And I sat up and I cried.

319
00:15:30,560 --> 00:15:33,080
I was like, no, it's like, do we need a time down?

320
00:15:33,080 --> 00:15:34,080
Like I'm fine.

321
00:15:34,080 --> 00:15:35,080
I'm fine.

322
00:15:35,080 --> 00:15:36,080
All right.

323
00:15:36,080 --> 00:15:37,720
A minute ago, you said everything went red.

324
00:15:37,720 --> 00:15:39,160
What do you mean by that?

325
00:15:39,160 --> 00:15:40,160
My vision went red.

326
00:15:40,160 --> 00:15:43,800
My vision, it just went red and then all of a sudden faded like gone.

327
00:15:43,800 --> 00:15:44,800
Okay.

328
00:15:44,800 --> 00:15:46,280
This time it was quick.

329
00:15:46,280 --> 00:15:50,760
The first time it was the dropping away feeling where everything was slowly slowing down and

330
00:15:50,760 --> 00:15:52,480
all of a sudden gone.

331
00:15:52,480 --> 00:15:53,680
This time it was quick.

332
00:15:53,680 --> 00:15:58,600
It was, I don't know if you've ever seen a spectrum analyzer before where you see sound

333
00:15:58,600 --> 00:16:02,800
waves and everything else they moved through, but they kind of have a curve shape to them

334
00:16:02,800 --> 00:16:04,480
whenever the people talk.

335
00:16:04,480 --> 00:16:09,360
And it was like, it was like looking at spectrum analyzer and the red lines going across and

336
00:16:09,360 --> 00:16:12,520
then all of a sudden everything just kind of went dark red.

337
00:16:12,520 --> 00:16:14,240
And then all of a sudden I couldn't see anymore.

338
00:16:14,240 --> 00:16:15,680
The vision went black again.

339
00:16:15,680 --> 00:16:17,880
That's when I left.

340
00:16:17,880 --> 00:16:19,080
And then I remember hearing everything.

341
00:16:19,080 --> 00:16:21,320
I remember hearing the heart monitor go out.

342
00:16:21,320 --> 00:16:26,760
Again, it was the same situation where I'm, like I said, a bunch of shapes and they're

343
00:16:26,760 --> 00:16:27,960
like, no, not your time.

344
00:16:27,960 --> 00:16:29,360
Go back, go back.

345
00:16:29,360 --> 00:16:34,040
Finally, I remember like I turned around and I was like, all right, well, this is not

346
00:16:34,040 --> 00:16:35,040
how it is.

347
00:16:35,040 --> 00:16:36,760
I need to go.

348
00:16:36,760 --> 00:16:37,760
And I remember getting angry.

349
00:16:37,760 --> 00:16:41,320
And then after that, I felt like a told chef sat up, grabbed that poor pair of med.

350
00:16:41,320 --> 00:16:43,680
I remember to look in his eyes, I got my vision back.

351
00:16:43,680 --> 00:16:47,920
The first thing I'm looking at is, this is early 20s paramedic.

352
00:16:47,920 --> 00:16:48,920
Or kid.

353
00:16:48,920 --> 00:16:49,920
Yeah.

354
00:16:49,920 --> 00:16:50,920
I mean, to me, he's a kid.

355
00:16:50,920 --> 00:16:52,200
I know I'm in my 40s.

356
00:16:52,200 --> 00:16:53,200
Yeah.

357
00:16:53,200 --> 00:16:56,080
And did you say that they had shocked you or they were about to?

358
00:16:56,080 --> 00:16:58,000
No, they were, they were prepping the paddles.

359
00:16:58,000 --> 00:16:59,000
Okay.

360
00:16:59,000 --> 00:17:00,000
So they were getting them out.

361
00:17:00,000 --> 00:17:01,000
They were getting them ready.

362
00:17:01,000 --> 00:17:04,640
And I just remember, I don't know if I was angry at the paddles or like I didn't want

363
00:17:04,640 --> 00:17:05,640
them to shock me.

364
00:17:05,640 --> 00:17:07,640
I just remember I was going, no.

365
00:17:07,640 --> 00:17:09,840
And they're like, is he like, do we need to tie him down?

366
00:17:09,840 --> 00:17:10,840
Like I'm fine.

367
00:17:10,840 --> 00:17:13,140
Get to the hospital.

368
00:17:13,140 --> 00:17:18,240
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369
00:17:18,240 --> 00:17:23,720
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370
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371
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373
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374
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375
00:17:39,960 --> 00:17:44,560
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376
00:17:44,560 --> 00:17:45,960
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377
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378
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379
00:17:54,080 --> 00:17:56,480
Now, back to the interview.

380
00:17:56,480 --> 00:18:01,220
Now, have you had any medical training because you almost sound like you were giving them

381
00:18:01,220 --> 00:18:04,480
instruction and telling them specifically what you needed?

382
00:18:04,480 --> 00:18:06,920
I mean, I'm not a medic.

383
00:18:06,920 --> 00:18:11,760
You do get, you know, it's the basics, combat life-saver training you talk to, a few medics

384
00:18:11,760 --> 00:18:19,760
over, you know, military career, you know, our docs, our combat medics, some of the best

385
00:18:19,760 --> 00:18:23,280
people that, you know, the best infantryman, best friend basically.

386
00:18:23,280 --> 00:18:27,520
Because that's a guy or woman that's going to bring you back to life, going to save your

387
00:18:27,520 --> 00:18:28,520
life.

388
00:18:28,520 --> 00:18:30,800
So, you kind of learn a few tips and tricks.

389
00:18:30,800 --> 00:18:34,200
Plus, I have a few years of combat as well.

390
00:18:34,200 --> 00:18:36,320
But what did you know about poisoning?

391
00:18:36,320 --> 00:18:39,760
The only thing I knew was that I needed to flesh it out.

392
00:18:39,760 --> 00:18:45,440
And I remember, like I said, I keep thinking potassium for some reason.

393
00:18:45,440 --> 00:18:50,720
But I was like, there's some substance that helps flush it out, like the IV line.

394
00:18:50,720 --> 00:18:55,600
I just remember, I don't know where I remember that from, but I'm like, I need something,

395
00:18:55,600 --> 00:18:57,360
something to flush this out.

396
00:18:57,360 --> 00:18:59,680
I can't, I could be totally wrong.

397
00:18:59,680 --> 00:19:04,240
If there's any doctors listening to this, yeah, I'm not a doctor.

398
00:19:04,240 --> 00:19:05,400
I don't know anything about it.

399
00:19:05,400 --> 00:19:08,400
I just remember hearing about potassium at one point.

400
00:19:08,400 --> 00:19:13,840
Well, they can email Eric at roundtripdesk.com and give me the real medical side of this

401
00:19:13,840 --> 00:19:15,800
whole thing.

402
00:19:15,800 --> 00:19:19,760
How many oysters did you eat and what was wrong with them?

403
00:19:19,760 --> 00:19:23,840
So it was the summer of 22.

404
00:19:23,840 --> 00:19:30,120
And I guess they had a really bad red tide problem in that part of South Carolina.

405
00:19:30,120 --> 00:19:31,280
I remember hearing about it.

406
00:19:31,280 --> 00:19:34,000
Didn't really think much of it when I first got there.

407
00:19:34,000 --> 00:19:38,640
I don't know if it was that or maybe something else, something else I ingested.

408
00:19:38,640 --> 00:19:43,000
That's just a likely culprit because it's been responsible for deaths before.

409
00:19:43,000 --> 00:19:44,000
And that's what we think.

410
00:19:44,000 --> 00:19:50,920
I still get screened from the local medical treatment facility over here at the local

411
00:19:50,920 --> 00:19:54,120
base, you know, our little base that's out here.

412
00:19:54,120 --> 00:19:57,680
And they're just making sure that, like, my liver and kidney functions are still good.

413
00:19:57,680 --> 00:20:04,640
I had elevated, it was ATZ levels and a few other things from the aftermath.

414
00:20:04,640 --> 00:20:09,400
That's my, basically, it went through my organs pretty bad.

415
00:20:09,400 --> 00:20:11,760
And then they were trying to monitor that.

416
00:20:11,760 --> 00:20:12,760
Yeah.

417
00:20:12,760 --> 00:20:17,520
Going back to the second experience that happened in the ambulance, and it sounded very similar

418
00:20:17,520 --> 00:20:19,600
to the first one.

419
00:20:19,600 --> 00:20:21,960
Was it almost identical?

420
00:20:21,960 --> 00:20:25,360
Did you feel like the same people were there?

421
00:20:25,360 --> 00:20:27,520
Was the voice the same?

422
00:20:27,520 --> 00:20:34,400
So it's like, I know it's going to sound weird, but it's like the same door was there.

423
00:20:34,400 --> 00:20:38,440
Like, you know, you have reality that you and I can see, that we can touch, that we

424
00:20:38,440 --> 00:20:40,320
can feel.

425
00:20:40,320 --> 00:20:41,640
And this time it went faster.

426
00:20:41,640 --> 00:20:44,400
It's like I dropped into it a lot faster.

427
00:20:44,400 --> 00:20:48,840
So instead of fading away like I did on the bed the first time, this time it was, I felt

428
00:20:48,840 --> 00:20:50,920
fine, everything was hurting.

429
00:20:50,920 --> 00:20:54,200
My nerves were definitely being injured.

430
00:20:54,200 --> 00:21:00,360
And pain I've never felt before, you know, this absolutely horrific pain.

431
00:21:00,360 --> 00:21:06,040
I was like, basically being slapped down, so to speak, into another reality I almost

432
00:21:06,040 --> 00:21:09,840
felt like, like basically being slapped away from life.

433
00:21:09,840 --> 00:21:13,120
And it was that sudden, it was pretty quick.

434
00:21:13,120 --> 00:21:16,360
Apparently I was, that was convulsing.

435
00:21:16,360 --> 00:21:20,520
So I'm pretty sure that's a limbs fighting for oxygen again.

436
00:21:20,520 --> 00:21:23,640
But this time, you know, I could actually hear the heart monitor and I heard the flatline.

437
00:21:23,640 --> 00:21:28,080
I could feel the cold in my chest and all of a sudden I was like being slapped down.

438
00:21:28,080 --> 00:21:34,600
Again, the familiar, I wouldn't say you couldn't really see them, but they were familiar shapes

439
00:21:34,600 --> 00:21:40,840
or shadows of relatives telling me, like I said, no, go back, go back.

440
00:21:40,840 --> 00:21:44,240
Then that's when I turned around and, you know, they always told, you know, they're

441
00:21:44,240 --> 00:21:45,960
telling me, no, not your time, go back.

442
00:21:45,960 --> 00:21:51,720
And I remember I turned, I felt like I turned around and I basically forced myself back.

443
00:21:51,720 --> 00:21:52,720
I was angry.

444
00:21:52,720 --> 00:21:54,560
That's when I sat up.

445
00:21:54,560 --> 00:22:01,400
And the poor kid, the poor paramedic, I find it so fascinating that every NDE is different.

446
00:22:01,400 --> 00:22:07,440
I've talked to a number of people who in a situation sort of similar to yours, they

447
00:22:07,440 --> 00:22:14,280
ended up being outside their body and looking down at what was happening with the doctors

448
00:22:14,280 --> 00:22:16,880
and the paddles and those kinds of things.

449
00:22:16,880 --> 00:22:19,400
But you were, it doesn't sound like that happened to you.

450
00:22:19,400 --> 00:22:23,960
Like you were more in your body because you were feeling different things with your body

451
00:22:23,960 --> 00:22:26,160
at the same time, right?

452
00:22:26,160 --> 00:22:27,280
Sort of.

453
00:22:27,280 --> 00:22:33,480
I was in my body, but like the only time I knew that things were bad is whenever I wasn't

454
00:22:33,480 --> 00:22:36,000
hurting, but there was no pain.

455
00:22:36,000 --> 00:22:40,600
And that's when I, that's when I kind of thought to myself, oh God, I'm screwed, you know,

456
00:22:40,600 --> 00:22:42,760
whenever, and when everything was not hurting.

457
00:22:42,760 --> 00:22:46,000
And then I'd come back and the first time and everything hurt again.

458
00:22:46,000 --> 00:22:51,240
I'm kind of like, you know, there's a saying if you're, if you're in an airborne unit in

459
00:22:51,240 --> 00:22:56,200
the army, it's that, you know, if you hit, if you hit and everything hurts, that's good.

460
00:22:56,200 --> 00:22:57,960
It means you're alive.

461
00:22:57,960 --> 00:22:58,960
Like pain is good.

462
00:22:58,960 --> 00:23:00,560
It means you're still alive.

463
00:23:00,560 --> 00:23:01,560
Yeah.

464
00:23:01,560 --> 00:23:06,040
The second time it was much faster and it felt almost like being slapped down.

465
00:23:06,040 --> 00:23:08,720
Like it wasn't the falling away feeling.

466
00:23:08,720 --> 00:23:10,720
It was like a sudden slap.

467
00:23:10,720 --> 00:23:14,000
And I was gone for a long, I don't know how long.

468
00:23:14,000 --> 00:23:17,760
Were they able to explain to you how your heart restarted?

469
00:23:17,760 --> 00:23:18,760
No.

470
00:23:18,760 --> 00:23:20,720
And I don't recall when it actually started again.

471
00:23:20,720 --> 00:23:24,640
I remember when I sat up, it was, it was going, but it was elevated.

472
00:23:24,640 --> 00:23:25,640
Yeah.

473
00:23:25,640 --> 00:23:26,640
Okay.

474
00:23:26,640 --> 00:23:28,560
So physically, what happened to you next?

475
00:23:28,560 --> 00:23:32,520
Did they get you to the hospital and then everything was hunky-dory or what kind of process

476
00:23:32,520 --> 00:23:33,920
did you go through?

477
00:23:33,920 --> 00:23:41,120
They got me to the hospital and I remember somewhere in between, I remember they gave

478
00:23:41,120 --> 00:23:46,080
me something where finally everything stopped hurting and I was in and out of, you know,

479
00:23:46,080 --> 00:23:48,000
it's, I had not any sleep.

480
00:23:48,000 --> 00:23:53,960
They just, you know, flew on a plane from Colorado to South Carolina that day prior.

481
00:23:53,960 --> 00:23:55,760
You know, I didn't have any sleep.

482
00:23:55,760 --> 00:23:57,000
I was tired.

483
00:23:57,000 --> 00:23:59,240
I remember that I kept fading in and out.

484
00:23:59,240 --> 00:24:04,240
But at one point I was, I thought I was awake and then I kind of faded out and came back.

485
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:05,240
My wife's there.

486
00:24:05,240 --> 00:24:06,240
All right.

487
00:24:06,240 --> 00:24:09,400
So tell me what happened when you got to the hospital and how long did it take you to

488
00:24:09,400 --> 00:24:10,400
recover?

489
00:24:10,400 --> 00:24:13,120
It was pretty quick.

490
00:24:13,120 --> 00:24:18,760
I would say that next morning, probably about, I remember it was like nine or 10, they released

491
00:24:18,760 --> 00:24:19,760
me.

492
00:24:19,760 --> 00:24:25,080
Well, that seems awfully fast to release you after your heart has stopped just a few hours

493
00:24:25,080 --> 00:24:26,080
before.

494
00:24:26,080 --> 00:24:28,720
Hey, try care.

495
00:24:28,720 --> 00:24:32,120
You know, I was like, yeah, okay, they don't want to pay so much.

496
00:24:32,120 --> 00:24:35,040
I was just trying to get them out of here as fast as possible.

497
00:24:35,040 --> 00:24:40,400
And basically told me to follow up with where I was living in Colorado with the base clinic

498
00:24:40,400 --> 00:24:42,080
that was there.

499
00:24:42,080 --> 00:24:47,840
And that's when they started doing the liver levels, I guess, for like liver function and

500
00:24:47,840 --> 00:24:48,840
everything else.

501
00:24:48,840 --> 00:24:52,600
I get it done like once, well, I had it done once a quarter.

502
00:24:52,600 --> 00:24:55,160
Now it's once a year is fine.

503
00:24:55,160 --> 00:24:57,720
Everything's back to pretty much normal.

504
00:24:57,720 --> 00:25:00,040
Was there some damage then up front?

505
00:25:00,040 --> 00:25:01,040
Yeah.

506
00:25:01,040 --> 00:25:04,080
There was some abnormal levels and I don't remember what all they were.

507
00:25:04,080 --> 00:25:06,960
I remember one of them was like ATZ or something like that.

508
00:25:06,960 --> 00:25:09,200
ATZ levels were high.

509
00:25:09,200 --> 00:25:11,800
So there was some liver and kidney damage.

510
00:25:11,800 --> 00:25:13,480
That was for months, but it kept dropping.

511
00:25:13,480 --> 00:25:19,840
It was progressively going back down in my early 40s and I still exercise.

512
00:25:19,840 --> 00:25:23,640
So recovery is not as slow as it was.

513
00:25:23,640 --> 00:25:28,480
It's not as fast as I would have been my 20s, but it's not as slow as some people of my

514
00:25:28,480 --> 00:25:29,480
age.

515
00:25:29,480 --> 00:25:32,120
Well, I'm glad you've recovered.

516
00:25:32,120 --> 00:25:33,600
How did this affect you?

517
00:25:33,600 --> 00:25:36,960
Mentally, emotionally?

518
00:25:36,960 --> 00:25:37,960
Definitely.

519
00:25:37,960 --> 00:25:38,960
Yeah.

520
00:25:38,960 --> 00:25:46,240
We can't go through something like this and not have, you know, leave a trace on you.

521
00:25:46,240 --> 00:25:49,760
This is one of the, I was expecting, you know, military career, you know, something happens

522
00:25:49,760 --> 00:25:50,760
in the military.

523
00:25:50,760 --> 00:25:57,200
I wasn't expecting to technically be dead after I retired, but you know, there I was.

524
00:25:57,200 --> 00:25:58,400
Definitely better.

525
00:25:58,400 --> 00:25:59,400
That's one.

526
00:25:59,400 --> 00:26:05,040
Again, the exercising, trying to keep that up a bit, trying to, you know, walk where

527
00:26:05,040 --> 00:26:09,040
I could, you know, instead of drive and that type of stuff, take a bike.

528
00:26:09,040 --> 00:26:11,520
More appreciative of everything though.

529
00:26:11,520 --> 00:26:15,160
There is some weird stuff that happens.

530
00:26:15,160 --> 00:26:19,720
It's like that feeling of like, you know, when you had your relatives nearby, sometimes

531
00:26:19,720 --> 00:26:22,240
I'll know when somebody else is there.

532
00:26:22,240 --> 00:26:25,160
It's, or it feels like somebody else is there sometimes.

533
00:26:25,160 --> 00:26:32,040
Like, it's just, it's kind of hard to describe, but it's like, I'm in a room, nobody's in

534
00:26:32,040 --> 00:26:34,560
there, but I'm like, but somebody feels like they're there.

535
00:26:34,560 --> 00:26:40,200
It just feels more, I don't know, it's a weird feeling, but it feels familiar from what I

536
00:26:40,200 --> 00:26:41,200
went through.

537
00:26:41,200 --> 00:26:42,880
It had to happen here when we moved in.

538
00:26:42,880 --> 00:26:47,520
I went to go check out my son's room after the family that was here moved out.

539
00:26:47,520 --> 00:26:52,440
And not, I mean, nothing happened, but it was, felt like somebody was in the room with me.

540
00:26:52,440 --> 00:26:53,440
They weren't bad.

541
00:26:53,440 --> 00:26:57,720
It was just like, felt like if somebody else was in there too, thought that was odd.

542
00:26:57,720 --> 00:27:02,720
You know, occasionally you'll feel like, you know, you just walked by somebody and you're

543
00:27:02,720 --> 00:27:05,400
like, there's nobody there.

544
00:27:05,400 --> 00:27:07,640
Weird stuff like that.

545
00:27:07,640 --> 00:27:11,640
Another thing is, is that, like I said, it's more appreciative of everything, but that

546
00:27:11,640 --> 00:27:15,880
whole feeling of like, you know, there was familiar people there.

547
00:27:15,880 --> 00:27:20,440
You get that now whenever you walk around, you know, random places and sometimes you'll

548
00:27:20,440 --> 00:27:23,720
pass, feels like you walk past somebody, but there's nobody there.

549
00:27:23,720 --> 00:27:26,200
That's just, it's weird.

550
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:31,400
I don't know if that was directly related to that or was it, you know, maybe something

551
00:27:31,400 --> 00:27:32,400
I don't know.

552
00:27:32,400 --> 00:27:36,120
Do you have more fear of death or less fear of death now?

553
00:27:36,120 --> 00:27:39,760
Uh, I don't want to die like that.

554
00:27:39,760 --> 00:27:44,920
Like I was telling you before we started the interview, if I found out in terminal condition,

555
00:27:44,920 --> 00:27:46,400
would I want to go by hypothermia?

556
00:27:46,400 --> 00:27:47,600
Yeah, probably.

557
00:27:47,600 --> 00:27:51,720
You know, I wanted to stay in Colorado and I'll probably make every effort I can to

558
00:27:51,720 --> 00:27:55,400
go back, but definitely don't want to die a poison.

559
00:27:55,400 --> 00:27:58,800
As far as death goes, that's not a fear of death.

560
00:27:58,800 --> 00:28:02,720
It's more like hate to say, but it's like, you know, it's end of the day at work and

561
00:28:02,720 --> 00:28:07,080
you're trying to get everything done and you're like, no, I can't leave yet because I have

562
00:28:07,080 --> 00:28:09,120
to get stuff done.

563
00:28:09,120 --> 00:28:14,240
So it's more like, I feel like I've got to do more with my life before I go.

564
00:28:14,240 --> 00:28:18,040
You know, basically I haven't finished my job for the day, so to speak, so I can't go

565
00:28:18,040 --> 00:28:19,040
home type of feeling.

566
00:28:19,040 --> 00:28:24,040
It's a good way to put it, especially when they told you so specifically to go back.

567
00:28:24,040 --> 00:28:26,440
Yeah, I was told not my time, go back.

568
00:28:26,440 --> 00:28:29,040
I do remember one thing that was weird.

569
00:28:29,040 --> 00:28:31,880
They did say, now I know I have my older daughter there.

570
00:28:31,880 --> 00:28:37,600
She's, she's in her, in her twenties, but she's older, but I've got younger kids too.

571
00:28:37,600 --> 00:28:38,960
I've got a teenage son.

572
00:28:38,960 --> 00:28:46,320
I remember specifically being told that he would be lost if, if I, if I, if I went when

573
00:28:46,320 --> 00:28:50,920
I was running towards a roped, I was told by some, one of the relatives, I can't remember

574
00:28:50,920 --> 00:28:55,640
who was telling me, no, you know, my son, I'm not going to mention his name will be lost

575
00:28:55,640 --> 00:28:56,640
if you keep going.

576
00:28:56,640 --> 00:29:02,200
And I remember like, okay, you know, obviously he needs a dad, you know, in his teenage years.

577
00:29:02,200 --> 00:29:06,920
Yeah, I remember that, but it's just like, like I said, like unfinished business.

578
00:29:06,920 --> 00:29:12,680
It happened so fast that it's, it was a flurry of, you know, people yelling and all like

579
00:29:12,680 --> 00:29:16,680
basically like being a kid, you know, you're a two year old and you're running, you know,

580
00:29:16,680 --> 00:29:20,840
the grocery store, you're running out towards a door, the grocery store or something while

581
00:29:20,840 --> 00:29:22,840
your parents are waiting a line type of feeling.

582
00:29:22,840 --> 00:29:23,840
Yeah.

583
00:29:23,840 --> 00:29:26,400
It was a bunch of people, you know, telling me to go back.

584
00:29:26,400 --> 00:29:28,840
Has it affected your belief in an afterlife?

585
00:29:28,840 --> 00:29:30,440
Yes, completely.

586
00:29:30,440 --> 00:29:31,440
Tell me about that.

587
00:29:31,440 --> 00:29:35,800
Like I said, I'm one of those people that unless I actually see it or I can, you know,

588
00:29:35,800 --> 00:29:38,000
account for it, I don't believe it.

589
00:29:38,000 --> 00:29:43,120
Not so much, you know, oh, I read this on these articles like, Hey, show me the data.

590
00:29:43,120 --> 00:29:46,240
Show me, you know, Hey, you know, what was your, what was your control for this?

591
00:29:46,240 --> 00:29:48,800
What was your show me hard numbers?

592
00:29:48,800 --> 00:29:51,600
I was a hard numbers type of person.

593
00:29:51,600 --> 00:29:55,280
Definitely feels like there's more to it than we think.

594
00:29:55,280 --> 00:29:59,400
There's more, more around this than we're aware of.

595
00:29:59,400 --> 00:30:04,160
And like I said, that whole feeling of like I just walks by somebody or somebody's here

596
00:30:04,160 --> 00:30:06,040
with me type of thing.

597
00:30:06,040 --> 00:30:10,040
It's just to become, I wouldn't say more sensitive to it, but you notice it more.

598
00:30:10,040 --> 00:30:12,320
It's like, Oh, there's that familiar feeling again.

599
00:30:12,320 --> 00:30:13,960
You know, it's like somebody's there.

600
00:30:13,960 --> 00:30:19,160
I don't want to say everybody's like, Oh, go and I'm like, Well, you know, that might

601
00:30:19,160 --> 00:30:20,840
be a possibility at this point.

602
00:30:20,840 --> 00:30:25,440
I mean, you can kind of hear like when somebody walks by type of thing that that absence of

603
00:30:25,440 --> 00:30:30,440
sound for a split second, and you just, you notice it more.

604
00:30:30,440 --> 00:30:32,040
It's weird on how that works.

605
00:30:32,040 --> 00:30:34,720
But I don't, I don't fear things.

606
00:30:34,720 --> 00:30:39,200
I don't, you know, people go into dark, scary places and they're scared.

607
00:30:39,200 --> 00:30:41,440
And I'm like, No, I don't have a fear of that anymore.

608
00:30:41,440 --> 00:30:46,520
I mean, people, people are, of course, you know, can be, you know, monsters themselves.

609
00:30:46,520 --> 00:30:49,960
So I fear people more than I do anything scary.

610
00:30:49,960 --> 00:30:53,160
So, you know, like a walk through a graveyard in middle of the night when it's dead quiet

611
00:30:53,160 --> 00:30:56,000
and no, okay, well, people here at least at peace.

612
00:30:56,000 --> 00:30:57,840
How many people have you shared this with?

613
00:30:57,840 --> 00:31:02,240
Oh, the whole reason I wanted to get it out was to get it out.

614
00:31:02,240 --> 00:31:03,720
My wife doesn't like talking about it.

615
00:31:03,720 --> 00:31:10,000
Yeah, just my, my, I have two sisters and middle sister and a younger sister, both younger

616
00:31:10,000 --> 00:31:14,800
than me and talk to my middle sister about it.

617
00:31:14,800 --> 00:31:18,640
And then of course my wife, but she's, she doesn't like to be reminded of the incident

618
00:31:18,640 --> 00:31:20,400
with, you know, good, good reason.

619
00:31:20,400 --> 00:31:24,760
You know, she was there watching me die, you know, in a bed.

620
00:31:24,760 --> 00:31:29,840
But other than that, that's it, I did, I did talk a little bit about it to my son when

621
00:31:29,840 --> 00:31:35,400
he was having, having deep depression and was talking about death.

622
00:31:35,400 --> 00:31:40,920
And I finally let him know that, hey, you know, for me, it was painful, you know, do

623
00:31:40,920 --> 00:31:42,440
I want to go like that?

624
00:31:42,440 --> 00:31:46,480
No, I don't want to, you know, life is good, you know, I want to keep living as long as

625
00:31:46,480 --> 00:31:50,440
possible, but I didn't, I didn't go into detail about it.

626
00:31:50,440 --> 00:31:54,640
I kind of helped him like, okay, well, yeah, there's more to life than just what I'm dealing

627
00:31:54,640 --> 00:31:56,200
with as a teenager.

628
00:31:56,200 --> 00:32:00,240
I appreciate you trusting us enough to share with us here today.

629
00:32:00,240 --> 00:32:02,240
And I hope it's been good for you.

630
00:32:02,240 --> 00:32:05,240
I hope it's a little therapeutic in a way.

631
00:32:05,240 --> 00:32:08,400
And is there anything else that you want to share with our listeners about this whole

632
00:32:08,400 --> 00:32:09,400
thing?

633
00:32:09,400 --> 00:32:14,480
Yeah, so it's weird because I was told, you know, not your time yet, basically like you've

634
00:32:14,480 --> 00:32:16,800
got stuff to do.

635
00:32:16,800 --> 00:32:21,600
Exactly one year to the day I came here to Belgium to work with my current job exactly

636
00:32:21,600 --> 00:32:26,400
one year to the day, and now I'm here, you know, life's been good since we got here at

637
00:32:26,400 --> 00:32:27,400
schools better.

638
00:32:27,400 --> 00:32:30,000
And the job I have is absolutely great.

639
00:32:30,000 --> 00:32:33,080
It's 100%, you know, hey, it's individual effort.

640
00:32:33,080 --> 00:32:34,080
It's a good job.

641
00:32:34,080 --> 00:32:39,080
Like I said, it was kind of weird that exactly to one day that since he isn't in half and

642
00:32:39,080 --> 00:32:40,080
I'm here.

643
00:32:40,080 --> 00:32:45,320
So if there was something else for you to do, and you've already done it, is that a little

644
00:32:45,320 --> 00:32:46,320
bit scary?

645
00:32:46,320 --> 00:32:47,320
Not really.

646
00:32:47,320 --> 00:32:51,360
I think, I think I'll know whenever, I think I'll know whenever I'm done.

647
00:32:51,360 --> 00:32:54,120
I still feel like there's more to go.

648
00:32:54,120 --> 00:32:55,120
I'm sure there is.

649
00:32:55,120 --> 00:32:57,000
I'm sure you have a lot more to do.

650
00:32:57,000 --> 00:32:59,760
Sounds like you have a great family and a great life over there.

651
00:32:59,760 --> 00:33:03,280
So anyway, Pat, thanks so much for being on the show with us.

652
00:33:03,280 --> 00:33:04,280
Really appreciate it.

653
00:33:04,280 --> 00:33:05,280
Thank you.

654
00:33:05,280 --> 00:33:08,760
Thank you for having me.

655
00:33:08,760 --> 00:33:10,400
Thank you so much for listening.

656
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:16,520
Don't forget to hit the follow or subscribe button and sign up for our newsletter at roundtripdeath.com.

657
00:33:16,520 --> 00:33:20,800
If you want to share your near death experience, or if you have questions or comments about

658
00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:25,120
the show, send an email to ericatroundtripdeath.com.

659
00:33:25,120 --> 00:33:53,200
Until then, I wish you everything good that you're looking for in this life and the next.