WEBVTT 00:00:12.000 --> 00:00:14.679 Hey, what's going on? I'm Clarissa. I'm Courtney. 00:00:14.880 --> 00:00:17.239 This is 30 Dirty and Dying, and we're back for 00:00:17.239 --> 00:00:20.079 another episode. We love to be here, and we hope 00:00:20.079 --> 00:00:23.600 that you love to listen. Yeah, we hope so. We're 00:00:23.600 --> 00:00:25.359 doing our season of favorite things, and one 00:00:25.359 --> 00:00:28.109 of our favorite things are real talks. We like 00:00:28.109 --> 00:00:30.469 to talk about real things. We do. Well, and I 00:00:30.469 --> 00:00:32.450 think we, you know, we play games, we have fun, 00:00:32.490 --> 00:00:35.689 we laugh, we cry, we just have breakdowns live 00:00:35.689 --> 00:00:39.070 on the air. But we want to cope with how things 00:00:39.070 --> 00:00:42.570 really are in this stage of our life and not 00:00:42.570 --> 00:00:44.429 this idea that we were sold of like, well, if 00:00:44.429 --> 00:00:46.149 you don't have your shit together and you don't 00:00:46.149 --> 00:00:49.130 have everything figured out, you're kind of failing. 00:00:49.289 --> 00:00:51.630 We're bucking against that, you know? So it's 00:00:51.630 --> 00:00:54.109 like real talks are a part of that. Like all 00:00:54.109 --> 00:00:56.689 the things that kind of get glossed over. We're 00:00:56.689 --> 00:00:58.250 not glossing over them. We're just talking about 00:00:58.250 --> 00:01:01.030 them. Good, bad, medium, just for what it is. 00:01:01.090 --> 00:01:05.390 Hard. Yeah. Expert mode. Easy. Yeah. So yeah, 00:01:05.450 --> 00:01:07.950 that's part of why we do the real talks and I 00:01:07.950 --> 00:01:09.849 really enjoy doing them. And this is one that 00:01:09.849 --> 00:01:12.129 I've kind of wanted to do for like a super long 00:01:12.129 --> 00:01:14.810 time. We're going to talk about toxic positivity. 00:01:15.549 --> 00:01:17.790 What does that mean to you, Courtney? It means 00:01:17.790 --> 00:01:21.780 that you're being overly positive. And, like, 00:01:21.799 --> 00:01:23.799 glossing over someone's feelings. Right, which 00:01:23.799 --> 00:01:25.819 is, like we just said, the exact thing we try 00:01:25.819 --> 00:01:27.340 to not do about these things. Yeah, we don't 00:01:27.340 --> 00:01:31.799 want to, like, you're invalidating someone because 00:01:31.799 --> 00:01:35.000 you assume they have to be positive. Yeah. Like, 00:01:35.180 --> 00:01:38.260 just get over it. Everything's going to be fine. 00:01:38.500 --> 00:01:42.239 Yeah. Don't worry about it. But, like, you can 00:01:42.239 --> 00:01:45.769 worry. that's valid. Yeah. It's okay to not be 00:01:45.769 --> 00:01:48.909 okay. I totally agree. I think it, the idea of 00:01:48.909 --> 00:01:50.810 toxic positivity is basically just like you're 00:01:50.810 --> 00:01:53.689 saying, being overly positive, but it, it either 00:01:53.689 --> 00:01:56.170 directly or indirectly perpetuates this idea 00:01:56.170 --> 00:02:00.569 of people are failing if they're not feeling 00:02:00.569 --> 00:02:02.530 a certain way, performing a certain way, life's 00:02:02.530 --> 00:02:06.510 not going a certain way. And I don't like that. 00:02:06.969 --> 00:02:09.289 and we don't we both don't like that so we're 00:02:09.289 --> 00:02:11.009 gonna we're gonna kind of break it down how it 00:02:11.009 --> 00:02:13.110 how it happens how it comes out break it down 00:02:13.110 --> 00:02:15.710 how it's affected us we're just gonna chit chat 00:02:15.710 --> 00:02:18.490 about it yeah real about it so i'm excited to 00:02:18.490 --> 00:02:21.469 do that today before we dive in is there is there 00:02:21.469 --> 00:02:22.990 any are there any updates we should give anybody 00:02:22.990 --> 00:02:25.909 do we have any do we have any jet we haven't 00:02:25.909 --> 00:02:29.150 like caught up in a minute uh warp tours coming 00:02:29.150 --> 00:02:33.189 up yeah you excited yeah super excited i don't 00:02:33.189 --> 00:02:36.069 so like One, I've never been to Warped Tour. 00:02:36.189 --> 00:02:37.969 I know. So, like, when Warped Tour was, like, 00:02:37.969 --> 00:02:40.770 a big deal, like, well, Coachella's going on 00:02:40.770 --> 00:02:44.789 right now. Oh. As we're recording. Yeah. By the 00:02:44.789 --> 00:02:46.150 time you hear this, it will not. It will not 00:02:46.150 --> 00:02:49.349 be. It's gone. It's gone. But, like, I've never 00:02:49.349 --> 00:02:51.689 been to that type of, like, I've been to concerts. 00:02:51.830 --> 00:02:53.889 Like a festival. I've never been to a festival. 00:02:54.169 --> 00:02:57.550 Okay. And I feel like at this time in my life, 00:02:57.629 --> 00:03:05.099 in my mid -30s. one would say um it's really 00:03:05.099 --> 00:03:06.819 not the time for that it's really not the time 00:03:06.819 --> 00:03:09.479 for that but i'm just gonna live for it right 00:03:09.479 --> 00:03:12.560 yeah i'm gonna i'm gonna try my best we got vip 00:03:12.560 --> 00:03:15.259 tickets we're gonna be an air -conditioned bathroom 00:03:15.259 --> 00:03:20.080 vip section i think that'll help yeah it is gonna 00:03:20.080 --> 00:03:23.580 be the middle of summer yeah i'm probably gonna 00:03:23.580 --> 00:03:28.180 die but at least i enjoyed watching 303 and young 00:03:28.180 --> 00:03:31.180 gravy yeah And I'm really fucking excited about 00:03:31.180 --> 00:03:34.039 that. I'm excited for you. No, listen, I think 00:03:34.039 --> 00:03:36.659 it's similar to what we were just saying. You 00:03:36.659 --> 00:03:38.479 got to do things that work for you. You're doing 00:03:38.479 --> 00:03:40.800 it the way that it works for you as a 30 -something. 00:03:41.039 --> 00:03:43.599 And if you're still having fun, who cares if 00:03:43.599 --> 00:03:45.000 it's how you would have done it before or how 00:03:45.000 --> 00:03:46.639 somebody else would have done it. As long as 00:03:46.639 --> 00:03:48.520 you enjoy yourself and you get something cool 00:03:48.520 --> 00:03:52.400 out of it, that's what matters. Yeah. I saw Trisha 00:03:52.400 --> 00:03:55.400 Paytas. I know you did. She was so good. Did 00:03:55.400 --> 00:03:58.460 that three -day concert thing happen yet, or 00:03:58.460 --> 00:04:00.099 is that coming later? So that's coming up, and 00:04:00.099 --> 00:04:01.599 it's not going to be three days anymore. We didn't 00:04:01.599 --> 00:04:04.219 get the tickets to the first one. So we're just 00:04:04.219 --> 00:04:06.939 going to see I Sign Kills twice. All right. In 00:04:06.939 --> 00:04:09.419 two days. And, well, technically three times, 00:04:09.479 --> 00:04:11.139 because they're at Warped Tour. Right, but I 00:04:11.139 --> 00:04:13.639 mean, that's... The three days in a row is not 00:04:13.639 --> 00:04:15.990 happening. It's just two days in a row now. Well, 00:04:16.009 --> 00:04:17.509 that makes sense. Because the tickets, apparently, 00:04:17.689 --> 00:04:19.550 they were surge pricing, so they're higher now. 00:04:19.769 --> 00:04:21.810 And he's like, I'm not going to do it. And I'm 00:04:21.810 --> 00:04:23.709 like, perfect. I've been thinking about that 00:04:23.709 --> 00:04:25.430 a lot. I've been hoping for you. I've been praying 00:04:25.430 --> 00:04:27.769 for you. Thank you. You're welcome. Thoughts 00:04:27.769 --> 00:04:29.069 and prayers. Thoughts and prayers. Thoughts and 00:04:29.069 --> 00:04:31.430 prayers. It worked. Yep. Well, but yeah, so we're 00:04:31.430 --> 00:04:33.290 going to do a real talk today. Talks of positivity. 00:04:33.550 --> 00:04:35.829 I think this was a great intro. And should we 00:04:35.829 --> 00:04:37.310 go back in time? Yeah, let's go back in time. 00:04:40.129 --> 00:04:48.920 Back in time. All right. So we chose 2011 today 00:04:48.920 --> 00:04:50.839 because apparently that was the first time the 00:04:50.839 --> 00:04:54.759 term toxic positivity appeared in print. Hang 00:04:54.759 --> 00:04:57.480 on, I'll get the deets. Because I have some facts. 00:04:57.959 --> 00:05:04.779 Okay, so apparently in J. Halberstam's 2011 book 00:05:04.779 --> 00:05:09.060 of queer theory, The Queer Art of Failure, the 00:05:09.060 --> 00:05:14.040 term toxic positivity appeared. The quote is 00:05:14.040 --> 00:05:17.600 whatever he was talking about. To poke holes 00:05:17.600 --> 00:05:20.899 in the toxic positivity of contemporary life. 00:05:21.259 --> 00:05:25.680 Hmm. So that's why we decided to do 2011. Those 00:05:25.680 --> 00:05:27.839 early 2010s, you know, I was in high school. 00:05:28.279 --> 00:05:32.779 I was in college. Teen. Teen times. I was 20. 00:05:32.939 --> 00:05:35.500 So 16, 17, 19, 20. But like smack dab in the 00:05:35.500 --> 00:05:37.540 middle of high school. Yeah. You know, doing 00:05:37.540 --> 00:05:39.819 that. I was living my college life. Yeah. I got 00:05:39.819 --> 00:05:43.779 my first car. I got my Volkswagen Beetle. I remember. 00:05:44.100 --> 00:05:47.160 Yep. His name was Vlad. And now my cat's name 00:05:47.160 --> 00:05:50.199 is Vlad. So, I don't know. I've always been weird. 00:05:50.740 --> 00:05:56.740 I remember you drew that picture at work of the 00:05:56.740 --> 00:06:01.540 bug. You had your car and said... Because I wanted 00:06:01.540 --> 00:06:03.939 to ride in it. My dream car was a bug. Yeah. 00:06:03.980 --> 00:06:06.980 And you let me ride in it. What does the picture 00:06:06.980 --> 00:06:09.220 have to do with that? You drew a picture saying 00:06:09.220 --> 00:06:12.120 that your chariot awaits or something. Did I? 00:06:12.220 --> 00:06:14.240 Yeah. I have no memory of this, but I'll take 00:06:14.240 --> 00:06:17.240 your word for it. On, like, a piece of box. Okay, 00:06:17.319 --> 00:06:19.259 I do have a picture. I think it was from 2012, 00:06:19.480 --> 00:06:22.439 though, where I drew a unicorn. I drew on the 00:06:22.439 --> 00:06:24.860 boxes, like, the pieces of, like, the flaps from 00:06:24.860 --> 00:06:27.060 the cardboard boxes a lot. Oh, yeah. Because 00:06:27.060 --> 00:06:28.800 I was bored as fuck. We broke them down. We got 00:06:28.800 --> 00:06:30.519 to play with them, too. Yeah, I drew pictures 00:06:30.519 --> 00:06:33.279 a lot. Working hard for the money, you know. 00:06:34.060 --> 00:06:36.379 But, yeah, so I got my first car, and I did a 00:06:36.379 --> 00:06:39.810 full, like, little photo shoot. In a church parking 00:06:39.810 --> 00:06:42.689 lot where I learned to drive. Love that. Yeah. 00:06:42.910 --> 00:06:45.750 It was dumb. I also have a picture. I made a 00:06:45.750 --> 00:06:48.550 gingerbread house and I broke it, so I put a 00:06:48.550 --> 00:06:51.589 vine up the back. And I felt the need to document 00:06:51.589 --> 00:06:57.389 this. Now I want to go back to my Insta. I didn't 00:06:57.389 --> 00:07:00.829 have an Instagram yet. I got an Instagram in 00:07:00.829 --> 00:07:02.670 2012, so I don't have anything like that. I wish 00:07:02.670 --> 00:07:06.029 I could go back by year on Instagram. Yeah, you 00:07:06.029 --> 00:07:11.319 just gotta scroll. And then I deactivated my 00:07:11.319 --> 00:07:13.620 Twitter a long time ago, so I don't have that 00:07:13.620 --> 00:07:16.579 anymore. But I can tell you, I was also in a 00:07:16.579 --> 00:07:20.339 creative writing class. And I sat in the back 00:07:20.339 --> 00:07:22.779 with two of my friends. And one picture that 00:07:22.779 --> 00:07:28.199 we have is one day we all wore owl jewelry. Because 00:07:28.199 --> 00:07:30.600 do you remember how big of a fucking deal owl 00:07:30.600 --> 00:07:34.100 jewelry was? I had owl jewelry. So did I. But 00:07:34.100 --> 00:07:37.689 we all... had on at least one piece of owl jewelry. 00:07:37.930 --> 00:07:41.509 So we lined up our owl jewelry and took pictures 00:07:41.509 --> 00:07:44.829 of it and did like a little photo shoot of owls 00:07:44.829 --> 00:07:48.949 because I don't know. Mine, I think was a gold 00:07:48.949 --> 00:07:52.990 ring that was an owl. And then at least one of 00:07:52.990 --> 00:07:54.910 the girls had one of those like pendants at the 00:07:54.910 --> 00:07:58.230 owl, but it was like curtains. The body was like, 00:07:58.329 --> 00:08:00.730 you know what I'm talking about? Yeah. I remember 00:08:00.730 --> 00:08:04.389 that. Yep. Good times. Good times. I also had 00:08:04.389 --> 00:08:06.829 a, around the same time, because I think in one 00:08:06.829 --> 00:08:08.470 of the pictures I can see myself wearing it, 00:08:08.529 --> 00:08:12.509 one of those watch rings that I wore a lot. I 00:08:12.509 --> 00:08:15.129 had a lot of owl jewelry. You know, I was fully 00:08:15.129 --> 00:08:17.930 in it. A lot of my stuff was from Route 21 at 00:08:17.930 --> 00:08:19.509 that point in my lifetime. Oh, yeah. That was 00:08:19.509 --> 00:08:22.689 sort of my sweet spot. I wore a lot of clothes 00:08:22.689 --> 00:08:26.649 from Route 21. I really ate up the owl jewelry. 00:08:26.829 --> 00:08:29.480 I feel like a woman. Obviously we knew each other 00:08:29.480 --> 00:08:31.560 because I started it at the movie theater. I 00:08:31.560 --> 00:08:34.480 did post on October 13th, 2011. All I need is 00:08:34.480 --> 00:08:36.519 you and I. And you were definitely talking about 00:08:36.519 --> 00:08:41.120 me. Let's be so fucking for real. So fucking 00:08:41.120 --> 00:08:43.059 for real. You were talking about me. Duh. Just 00:08:43.059 --> 00:08:44.639 give us a snapshot of what your life was like 00:08:44.639 --> 00:08:47.179 in 2011 that you can remember. I mean, what were 00:08:47.179 --> 00:08:55.220 you doing? Other than Bob. Um, 2011... It would 00:08:55.220 --> 00:08:57.740 have been freshman going into sophomore year 00:08:57.740 --> 00:09:03.059 of college. Right. I met, cheat on you, cheat 00:09:03.059 --> 00:09:04.759 on me with a girl named Courtney. We called him 00:09:04.759 --> 00:09:10.100 Robert. I don't remember much. I'm going to be 00:09:10.100 --> 00:09:12.080 honest. I don't know what was happening in 2011 00:09:12.080 --> 00:09:15.779 with my life. Bob was still in the picture. Yeah, 00:09:15.799 --> 00:09:18.230 always. That's all I can say. So just a, just 00:09:18.230 --> 00:09:21.389 a Rolodex of dudes. Love it. The youth. Yeah. 00:09:21.529 --> 00:09:24.009 I didn't have anything like that going on. I 00:09:24.009 --> 00:09:27.730 was a big fat virgin, um, in high school. I'm 00:09:27.730 --> 00:09:29.230 sure I had a lot of crushes though. I remember 00:09:29.230 --> 00:09:33.570 having a lot of high school crushes. Um, there 00:09:33.570 --> 00:09:37.629 was this one boy. I actually think we probably 00:09:37.629 --> 00:09:38.730 should have, I probably should have mentioned 00:09:38.730 --> 00:09:41.470 him in the episode we did more about 2009. Cause 00:09:41.470 --> 00:09:44.309 I remember him being more of a thing when I was 00:09:44.309 --> 00:09:48.289 a freshman. Okay. Um, so he probably was gone 00:09:48.289 --> 00:09:50.990 by this point, but just thinking of crushes got 00:09:50.990 --> 00:09:53.649 me thinking about this guy. So he lived in the 00:09:53.649 --> 00:09:57.190 same neighborhood as me. Um, I'm not, I don't, 00:09:57.190 --> 00:10:01.710 I'll call him Theo. Okay. Um, we had French class 00:10:01.710 --> 00:10:04.409 together and he always called me by my French 00:10:04.409 --> 00:10:09.240 name, which was Ocien. Um, we picked. our names 00:10:09.240 --> 00:10:11.440 they weren't like based on our actual names we 00:10:11.440 --> 00:10:13.039 just had to pick yeah my spanish name was reina 00:10:13.039 --> 00:10:15.419 yeah because my middle name is ray yeah that 00:10:15.419 --> 00:10:17.320 sounds we just got to pick one and i liked ocean 00:10:17.320 --> 00:10:20.460 and nobody else picked it so um but he called 00:10:20.460 --> 00:10:23.299 me by that name and every day we lived in the 00:10:23.299 --> 00:10:25.379 same neighborhood like i said and we would get 00:10:25.379 --> 00:10:28.879 off the bus and he we didn't like talk very much 00:10:28.879 --> 00:10:31.159 or anything but every day we got off the bus 00:10:31.159 --> 00:10:33.580 he would like call my name and tell me i was 00:10:33.580 --> 00:10:36.230 beautiful And then that was it. He was, like, 00:10:36.230 --> 00:10:38.389 not a weirdo either. Like, we were, he was cool. 00:10:38.429 --> 00:10:40.750 We talked. We were friends. But every day he 00:10:40.750 --> 00:10:44.289 did that. And I, but I was, like, you know, 14, 00:10:44.450 --> 00:10:46.450 15. I didn't know how to deal with it. Yeah. 00:10:46.889 --> 00:10:50.289 And then he moved away before, I don't know. 00:10:50.509 --> 00:10:53.169 I ended up having a crush on him after a while. 00:10:53.269 --> 00:10:54.929 Like, at first I didn't because I was just, like, 00:10:55.009 --> 00:10:57.590 I don't know what to do with this. And then he 00:10:57.590 --> 00:11:00.250 moved away. Oh. I went to the beach for the first 00:11:00.250 --> 00:11:03.809 time in 2011. That's cool. Yeah. My cool story, 00:11:03.909 --> 00:11:08.200 bro. Yep. That was 2011. Good times. Yeah, I 00:11:08.200 --> 00:11:10.500 decided to go back picture -wise. Yeah. This 00:11:10.500 --> 00:11:12.039 was one of my favorite pictures. People were 00:11:12.039 --> 00:11:14.419 like, oh my god, you're so skinny. Yeah, because 00:11:14.419 --> 00:11:16.279 you were doing the foreword. Oh, doing the foreword. 00:11:16.340 --> 00:11:20.659 I have a coach phone case. Wow. Wow. You're really 00:11:20.659 --> 00:11:25.080 something, ain't ya? Something. In the dorm. 00:11:25.539 --> 00:11:29.000 Ooh. That was actually, that's a really good 00:11:29.000 --> 00:11:31.279 picture of me. It is a nice picture. My hair 00:11:31.279 --> 00:11:33.600 looks really nice. It does. I went to the zoo. 00:11:35.700 --> 00:11:39.320 Nice. There's the owl picture. That's funny. 00:11:39.460 --> 00:11:41.960 Yeah. With two people that I'm no longer friends 00:11:41.960 --> 00:11:48.919 with. Fuck them. Fuck them. Fuck them. I drew 00:11:48.919 --> 00:11:54.120 a cartoon. I drew myself as a panda and one of 00:11:54.120 --> 00:11:56.259 my friends as a squirrel. Panda, panda, panda. 00:11:56.299 --> 00:11:58.059 And I felt the need to share this. I got bras 00:11:58.059 --> 00:12:02.299 and Elena. Ooh, look at this cardigan I had on 00:12:02.299 --> 00:12:04.519 with studs on the shoulders. Look how badass 00:12:04.519 --> 00:12:07.220 I thought I was. Look at that. Well, look at 00:12:07.220 --> 00:12:10.980 me in my zebra print. Ooh, I'm sure I can find 00:12:10.980 --> 00:12:14.240 it. And my Hollister shirt. Ooh, I've got one 00:12:14.240 --> 00:12:18.419 with, you know those shirts that also had an 00:12:18.419 --> 00:12:21.700 attached cardigan and a belt? You know what I'm 00:12:21.700 --> 00:12:25.340 talking about? Check it. Had one. Wore it all 00:12:25.340 --> 00:12:28.570 the time. I went to my first football game and 00:12:28.570 --> 00:12:32.269 last. I also loved this picture of me, too, back 00:12:32.269 --> 00:12:34.870 in the day. That's a nice picture. Yeah. You're 00:12:34.870 --> 00:12:37.730 so blonde. I know. I always think of you as a 00:12:37.730 --> 00:12:39.789 blonde. Even though your hair is, like, brown 00:12:39.789 --> 00:12:42.309 now. Yeah. If I'm thinking about you, which I'm 00:12:42.309 --> 00:12:44.750 always thinking about you, duh, I'm thinking 00:12:44.750 --> 00:12:47.450 of a blonde. Blonde me. Yeah. So, like, this 00:12:47.450 --> 00:12:50.149 was peak blonde me. Yes. Ever since. That's, 00:12:50.149 --> 00:12:51.929 like, what your hair color was when I met you. 00:12:51.970 --> 00:12:55.570 Mm -hmm. Like, 2011. Yeah. So. And then I dyed 00:12:55.570 --> 00:12:58.659 it. I went on a vacation. I got to take my friend. 00:12:59.000 --> 00:13:03.019 The side swoop. This wasn't my reality, but I 00:13:03.019 --> 00:13:06.779 also remember the 2011, 2012, 2013 tanning had 00:13:06.779 --> 00:13:10.639 really taken everybody into a chokehold. I did 00:13:10.639 --> 00:13:13.279 not tan. I did not tan. I've been in a tanning 00:13:13.279 --> 00:13:16.120 bed one time. I did not enjoy it. I got out. 00:13:16.360 --> 00:13:20.840 I was like, I'm destined to be whitefish, and 00:13:20.840 --> 00:13:24.129 I'm okay with it. Um, but when I was a senior, 00:13:24.210 --> 00:13:26.629 I think I got a few, I know, not think, but I 00:13:26.629 --> 00:13:30.629 got a few spray tans. Um, I got a couple spray 00:13:30.629 --> 00:13:33.169 tans. Yeah. I got like a spray tan before prom. 00:13:33.250 --> 00:13:37.110 I got like a, like a couple of times. Um, but 00:13:37.110 --> 00:13:41.610 I did, I know a lot of people were big fans of 00:13:41.610 --> 00:13:43.110 the tanning and they would do the thing with 00:13:43.110 --> 00:13:46.450 the little, uh, little sticker to show how dark 00:13:46.450 --> 00:13:49.350 they'd gotten. Uh huh. Yeah. Did you do that? 00:13:49.690 --> 00:13:52.990 No. With your spray tan? No. Oh, okay. The people 00:13:52.990 --> 00:13:55.110 I know who did it only did it when they were 00:13:55.110 --> 00:13:57.070 frying themselves. Gotcha. Yeah, that was really 00:13:57.070 --> 00:13:58.990 bad. But it reminded me. It was quite a time. 00:13:59.029 --> 00:14:01.049 I hope everybody's doing okay. Get your skin 00:14:01.049 --> 00:14:04.889 cancer checks. Guys, if you were a teenager in 00:14:04.889 --> 00:14:07.090 the 2010s, you're going to have to go get a skin 00:14:07.090 --> 00:14:10.850 cancer check soon. It's a good idea, especially 00:14:10.850 --> 00:14:12.610 if you were tanning. I'm not hating on you for 00:14:12.610 --> 00:14:16.559 it, but we all made mistakes. Yeah. I'm gonna 00:14:16.559 --> 00:14:18.980 go into some facts. Okay, go into some facts. 00:14:19.039 --> 00:14:20.620 Let's go out facts. Do you remember Borders? 00:14:20.759 --> 00:14:22.759 Bookstore? Fuck yeah, I do. Filed bankruptcy. 00:14:23.200 --> 00:14:27.320 Aww. I went to Walden Books mostly, which also 00:14:27.320 --> 00:14:30.899 doesn't exist anymore. Nope. Chromebooks went 00:14:30.899 --> 00:14:32.539 on sale for the first time. I remember those. 00:14:32.919 --> 00:14:35.840 Snapchat was founded. You know, I've never had 00:14:35.840 --> 00:14:39.059 a Snapchat. I still use it. I don't use it. So, 00:14:39.179 --> 00:14:42.860 speaking of Snapchat, Americans spent, on average, 00:14:43.120 --> 00:14:48.340 2 .7 hours per day online. That seems fair. It's 00:14:48.340 --> 00:14:51.360 almost seven hours today. Well, yeah. Fashion 00:14:51.360 --> 00:14:54.299 trends. Here we go. Here comes the cold water. 00:14:55.139 --> 00:15:00.639 Hair feathers. Kesha! Fedoras. I wore fedoras. 00:15:01.080 --> 00:15:06.759 Bubble skirts. Boho headbands. Shut up. Statement 00:15:06.759 --> 00:15:10.500 tights. Shut up. Maxi skirts. Stop, I had so 00:15:10.500 --> 00:15:14.440 many. Platform pumps. I didn't have those. Tribal 00:15:14.440 --> 00:15:18.840 prints. Ooh, yeah. Oversized cocktail rings. 00:15:19.480 --> 00:15:22.799 The owl ring was an oversized cocktail ring. 00:15:23.120 --> 00:15:27.919 Tunic dresses. Neon everything. Everything. And 00:15:27.919 --> 00:15:32.740 skull print scarves. Yes! Oh, what a - It was 00:15:32.740 --> 00:15:36.360 honestly - I saw a meme the other day, and I'm 00:15:36.360 --> 00:15:40.120 gonna quote it. The air tasted different. From 00:15:40.120 --> 00:15:45.220 like 2010 to 2014. It did. The air tasted different. 00:15:45.860 --> 00:15:48.360 Sort of like the perfume at Route 21. That's 00:15:48.360 --> 00:15:50.419 how it tasted. And I loved every second of it. 00:15:51.120 --> 00:15:53.139 Hollister Abercrombie was like, I was trying 00:15:53.139 --> 00:15:55.500 real cool. Yeah, but I remember the Route 21, 00:15:55.600 --> 00:15:56.879 like the tribal prints, like you were saying. 00:15:57.019 --> 00:15:59.500 I had so many pairs of those shorts that were 00:15:59.500 --> 00:16:01.659 like as thin as a fucking piece of tissue and 00:16:01.659 --> 00:16:04.480 ripped after you washed them one time. And they 00:16:04.480 --> 00:16:07.039 were all like weird tribal prints and not real 00:16:07.039 --> 00:16:11.059 tribal prints. Just like bullshit. Neon. Neon 00:16:11.059 --> 00:16:14.759 everything. Loved it. Loved it. The world population 00:16:14.759 --> 00:16:17.779 reached 7 billion. Too many. Look what we did. 00:16:17.980 --> 00:16:22.980 That's 7 billion too many people. Yep. Anyways, 00:16:23.220 --> 00:16:27.779 the popular baby names. Okay. Jacob, Mason, William, 00:16:28.059 --> 00:16:32.679 Jaden, Sophia. Jaden. Jaden. Sophia, Isabella, 00:16:32.740 --> 00:16:35.779 Emma, and Olivia. Okay. Olivia. Yeah, Olivia 00:16:35.779 --> 00:16:39.169 got real popular there for a while. Of the world's 00:16:39.169 --> 00:16:42.649 4 billion mobile phones, 1 billion were smartphones. 00:16:43.429 --> 00:16:47.309 Wow. Nearly 1 billion didn't even have texting 00:16:47.309 --> 00:16:49.549 capabilities. I'm trying to think. 2011, I think 00:16:49.549 --> 00:16:54.190 I had like an HTC. I had the HTC. I think it 00:16:54.190 --> 00:16:56.570 was called the HTC Touch. It was a touchscreen. 00:16:56.950 --> 00:16:58.490 It was a touchscreen, yeah. It was one of the 00:16:58.490 --> 00:17:02.309 first touchscreens. I had the HTC Evo. I didn't 00:17:02.309 --> 00:17:04.680 have that one. Mine was like, it was basically 00:17:04.680 --> 00:17:06.660 like a square. It was almost like BlackBerry 00:17:06.660 --> 00:17:09.759 sized, but it was a touchscreen and I hated it 00:17:09.759 --> 00:17:11.859 was a touchscreen. I absolutely hated it. I did 00:17:11.859 --> 00:17:14.599 not think it was going to catch on. I was wrong. 00:17:14.640 --> 00:17:16.920 Now it's all we have. Yeah. And I hate it. I 00:17:16.920 --> 00:17:19.240 missed the, cause I had the keyboards. I had 00:17:19.240 --> 00:17:21.680 like the rumor and the, like I had, I loved those. 00:17:21.720 --> 00:17:25.380 I never, so I had, before I got the Evo, I had 00:17:25.380 --> 00:17:28.539 the BlackBerry Pearl. Ooh, fancy. If I could 00:17:28.539 --> 00:17:30.819 go back to a BlackBerry, I would. I had an LG 00:17:30.819 --> 00:17:33.700 rumor. And I loved that phone. If I could have 00:17:33.700 --> 00:17:35.619 that phone again, I would. And then before that, 00:17:35.720 --> 00:17:40.140 I had kind of like the early phase of, it had 00:17:40.140 --> 00:17:44.759 a keyboard, but it flipped up horizontal. It 00:17:44.759 --> 00:17:47.839 was the shape of an eight. And it kind of, instead 00:17:47.839 --> 00:17:51.140 of, it didn't slide, it flipped into a keyboard. 00:17:51.420 --> 00:17:54.559 The brand was, I might be mispronouncing this, 00:17:54.619 --> 00:17:58.309 so I'm sorry. Kyocera. Okay. And, um, I don't 00:17:58.309 --> 00:18:01.329 know what the like model was, but yeah, that 00:18:01.329 --> 00:18:02.769 was, and that's when I fell in love with the 00:18:02.769 --> 00:18:06.049 keyboard thing. And I, I, I would have a rumor 00:18:06.049 --> 00:18:08.930 today. Bring it back. I'll do it. Fuck it. I'll 00:18:08.930 --> 00:18:11.170 do it. Bring back the rumor. Blackberry, come 00:18:11.170 --> 00:18:14.089 back. Yeah. We miss you. We miss you. Like if 00:18:14.089 --> 00:18:16.670 you can have, it's touchscreen slash keyboard. 00:18:16.950 --> 00:18:20.150 Yeah. If we can have both, I will be happy. I 00:18:20.150 --> 00:18:22.549 want the Blackberry Pearl so bad. Yeah. I want 00:18:22.549 --> 00:18:26.000 it back. Where are you? And I'm so sorry. Netflix 00:18:26.000 --> 00:18:28.660 introduced online video streaming service. Yeah, 00:18:28.680 --> 00:18:30.039 because before that you got it in the mail. You 00:18:30.039 --> 00:18:33.140 got DVDs in the mail with Netflix. It's like 00:18:33.140 --> 00:18:35.140 Blockbuster, but not. It comes to your house. 00:18:35.259 --> 00:18:36.519 Comes to your house. Redbox, do you remember 00:18:36.519 --> 00:18:41.299 that? Yeah. Oh, man. Good times. Samsung launched 00:18:41.299 --> 00:18:44.900 the Galaxy Note. I had a Galaxy. I had a couple 00:18:44.900 --> 00:18:48.220 Galaxy phones, I think, early. I did not. I had 00:18:48.220 --> 00:18:52.299 a couple. I didn't care for them. No shade, just 00:18:52.299 --> 00:18:55.720 it wasn't for me. Mike had the Galaxy Note when 00:18:55.720 --> 00:18:58.779 I, not the first one probably, but he had a Galaxy 00:18:58.779 --> 00:19:00.819 Note. All right. I have the most visited web 00:19:00.819 --> 00:19:03.339 destinations and there's a ton of them. All right. 00:19:03.359 --> 00:19:05.460 We'll pick like, pick like five and we'll go 00:19:05.460 --> 00:19:08.559 out with this. Okay. Um, those are obvious. Google, 00:19:08.660 --> 00:19:10.259 Facebook, Yahoo, YouTube. Find some good ones. 00:19:10.299 --> 00:19:17.019 Come on. Blogspot. Ooh, okay. Blogs. MapQuest. 00:19:17.019 --> 00:19:20.799 Yes. Was still big. Uh, I like this one. Photo 00:19:20.799 --> 00:19:24.380 bucket? Dude, I was on photo bucket 24 -7 -3 00:19:24.380 --> 00:19:26.720 -6 -5. I use it a lot for my fan fiction. I don't 00:19:26.720 --> 00:19:28.839 want to talk about it. You're listening to 30, 00:19:29.000 --> 00:19:31.859 Dirty, and Dying. If you're in your late 20s 00:19:31.859 --> 00:19:34.220 and your early 30s and don't quite feel like 00:19:34.220 --> 00:19:36.299 an adult, but you certainly don't feel like a 00:19:36.299 --> 00:19:38.980 kid anymore, you may have found the right podcast. 00:19:39.640 --> 00:19:42.000 Every week we wade through our own existential 00:19:42.000 --> 00:19:44.759 crisis and figure out what life is supposed to 00:19:44.759 --> 00:19:47.720 look like on this side of 30. and relive some 00:19:47.720 --> 00:19:49.960 of our favorite memories from years gone by. 00:19:50.119 --> 00:19:51.759 We'd love to have you along for the ride, so 00:19:51.759 --> 00:19:54.059 make sure you follow and find us on social media 00:19:54.059 --> 00:19:57.299 at 30dirtyanddying to keep up with what we're 00:19:57.299 --> 00:19:59.740 doing next. Toxic positivity! We're talking about 00:19:59.740 --> 00:20:02.099 toxic positivity. So we said a little bit at 00:20:02.099 --> 00:20:04.299 the beginning kind of what it means to us, but 00:20:04.299 --> 00:20:08.559 like, so if I had to ask you, like, if you felt 00:20:08.559 --> 00:20:12.559 like somebody was being toxically positive, what 00:20:12.559 --> 00:20:14.900 would that kind of look like? Um, I feel like... 00:20:15.200 --> 00:20:18.200 Just the world in general is just very, very 00:20:18.200 --> 00:20:20.619 toxic. Yes. Yeah. Like if you have a problem, 00:20:20.759 --> 00:20:23.099 it'll be fine. People have it worse than you. 00:20:23.240 --> 00:20:26.359 Yeah. That like, it's just a lot of gaslighting. 00:20:26.519 --> 00:20:29.559 It kind of is. It's kind of sold as this idea 00:20:29.559 --> 00:20:31.799 of like being optimistic. And there's a difference. 00:20:31.900 --> 00:20:34.940 Yeah. Without being toxic. Yeah. But it's just 00:20:34.940 --> 00:20:38.420 like if everything, everything is not all right. 00:20:38.500 --> 00:20:42.059 No. And that's fine. There's optimism and then 00:20:42.059 --> 00:20:45.119 there's also realistic. Yeah. But when you're 00:20:45.119 --> 00:20:48.539 not being realistic, then it can become toxic 00:20:48.539 --> 00:20:51.140 positivity. Well, and I feel like optimism is 00:20:51.140 --> 00:20:55.680 like, I'm acknowledging what reality is. I hope 00:20:55.680 --> 00:20:59.000 this happens. Yeah. Hope is one thing. Toxic 00:20:59.000 --> 00:21:03.799 positivity to me is I'm ignoring reality, good, 00:21:03.940 --> 00:21:08.019 bad, whatever. And I'm just like saying that 00:21:08.019 --> 00:21:10.220 if you're not ignoring it and you're not thinking 00:21:10.220 --> 00:21:12.859 about it this way instead, you're wrong. Right. 00:21:13.279 --> 00:21:15.039 And I don't love that. Like, there's a difference 00:21:15.039 --> 00:21:18.640 in hoping for something and trying to cancel 00:21:18.640 --> 00:21:22.359 reality out, for lack of a better term. And that's 00:21:22.359 --> 00:21:23.900 where I feel like it's different. And look, I'll 00:21:23.900 --> 00:21:26.599 be the first one to say right now, I'm a pessimist. 00:21:26.680 --> 00:21:30.660 I am a big fucking pessimist. I'm so awful. You 00:21:30.660 --> 00:21:32.839 do not want this dark cloud in your stratosphere 00:21:32.839 --> 00:21:35.299 if you're an optimist or even, like, just kind 00:21:35.299 --> 00:21:38.859 of medium. But I've been trying to get better 00:21:38.859 --> 00:21:40.940 at it over the years, but I do think it's hard 00:21:40.940 --> 00:21:45.130 when the It almost feels like the norm has become 00:21:45.130 --> 00:21:48.609 a level of toxic positivity of, like, you have 00:21:48.609 --> 00:21:52.349 to focus on the good all the time. That's hard 00:21:52.349 --> 00:21:54.150 for some people, and I also don't think it's 00:21:54.150 --> 00:21:58.650 fair. No. And it's not healthy. No. It's, like, 00:21:58.650 --> 00:22:02.150 fine to be open about the fact that something's 00:22:02.150 --> 00:22:04.849 not going well or that you don't feel like it's 00:22:04.849 --> 00:22:07.410 going well. Yeah. I think it's, you said at the 00:22:07.410 --> 00:22:09.390 beginning, it's really invalidating. Mm -hmm. 00:22:09.839 --> 00:22:12.400 So I get what you're saying there. I think it's 00:22:12.400 --> 00:22:14.019 the same kind of thing. The invalidating thing 00:22:14.019 --> 00:22:16.859 is big. Yeah, I do have like a definition. Yeah, 00:22:16.900 --> 00:22:20.980 go for it. Okay. So toxic positivity refers to 00:22:20.980 --> 00:22:23.980 the excessive and unhealthy focus on maintaining 00:22:23.980 --> 00:22:27.220 a positive attitude, even in the face of difficult 00:22:27.220 --> 00:22:32.089 situations and the denial or minimum. Minimalization. 00:22:32.089 --> 00:22:35.890 Thank you. Of negative emotions. It's the idea 00:22:35.890 --> 00:22:38.690 that negative emotions are inherently bad and 00:22:38.690 --> 00:22:40.910 should be avoided even when they are natural 00:22:40.910 --> 00:22:42.670 and appropriate response to circumstances. Yeah. 00:22:42.769 --> 00:22:45.250 I can speak to that a little bit because I remember 00:22:45.250 --> 00:22:47.670 in one of my rounds of therapy I did a few years 00:22:47.670 --> 00:22:52.069 ago about I have trichotillomania and it's like 00:22:52.069 --> 00:22:54.289 a compulsive disorder. Things my therapist and 00:22:54.289 --> 00:22:57.769 I like really had to focus on was got to stop 00:22:57.769 --> 00:23:00.430 assigning a negative meaning to this behavior. 00:23:00.529 --> 00:23:03.500 Yeah. I'm not saying you just accept it and it's 00:23:03.500 --> 00:23:06.680 fine and we don't work on it, but because you're 00:23:06.680 --> 00:23:10.119 thinking of it as inherently very bad to do this, 00:23:10.279 --> 00:23:15.319 it's creating this cycle of shame and then you 00:23:15.319 --> 00:23:19.019 do it more and you feel worse about it and your 00:23:19.019 --> 00:23:24.079 own self -esteem is being negatively affected 00:23:24.079 --> 00:23:25.619 because you feel like you can't stop doing this 00:23:25.619 --> 00:23:27.779 terrible thing. We have to take the negativity 00:23:27.779 --> 00:23:30.640 away from this action. And just make it more 00:23:30.640 --> 00:23:32.400 about like what you want to do and what you don't. 00:23:32.839 --> 00:23:35.200 It's neutral. It's got to become neutral. And 00:23:35.200 --> 00:23:37.200 I feel like there's something similar in the 00:23:37.200 --> 00:23:40.700 world of like toxic positivity. Because if feeling 00:23:40.700 --> 00:23:43.480 something negative is inherently a bad thing 00:23:43.480 --> 00:23:47.539 to do. Then you're just going to. It's natural 00:23:47.539 --> 00:23:50.339 to have a negative feeling. To be sad. To be 00:23:50.339 --> 00:23:52.819 angry. To be disappointed. Yeah. And if you tell 00:23:52.819 --> 00:23:55.160 yourself that that's a bad thing for you to feel. 00:23:55.319 --> 00:23:58.160 You become a bad person. You start feeling like 00:23:58.160 --> 00:24:01.440 ashamed. That you can't be as positive. And you 00:24:01.440 --> 00:24:04.180 can't look on the sunny side of bullshit or whatever. 00:24:04.640 --> 00:24:09.019 And it creates this cycle of negative self -esteem 00:24:09.019 --> 00:24:13.180 and never reaching your goals or whatever because 00:24:13.180 --> 00:24:15.539 your perspective is all fucked up. And I think 00:24:15.539 --> 00:24:17.940 it's a similar thing. I don't know. That definition 00:24:17.940 --> 00:24:20.019 sounds like it to me. Yeah. And then when you 00:24:20.019 --> 00:24:22.500 get into that cycle, then you're going to start 00:24:22.500 --> 00:24:25.720 taking it out on other people. Yeah. And making 00:24:25.720 --> 00:24:28.660 them feel bad. Yes. And then it's just like what 00:24:28.660 --> 00:24:31.740 society has become. Honestly, it's what society 00:24:31.740 --> 00:24:33.799 has become. Yeah. And it's, I almost think it 00:24:33.799 --> 00:24:37.059 lends itself to that idea of like trauma Olympics 00:24:37.059 --> 00:24:41.039 or whatever. Like, well. how dare you feel bad 00:24:41.039 --> 00:24:42.799 about what you've gone through if I've gone through 00:24:42.799 --> 00:24:44.400 worse or if I know someone else has gone through 00:24:44.400 --> 00:24:47.019 worse and you're not being positive about it. 00:24:47.079 --> 00:24:49.460 And it's like, dude, none of this matters. Everybody's 00:24:49.460 --> 00:24:52.960 experience is their own. I mean, if you're full 00:24:52.960 --> 00:24:56.099 -blown 24 -7, 365 Eeyore, I can understand people 00:24:56.099 --> 00:24:58.539 being like, dude, you gotta stop. But it's really 00:24:58.539 --> 00:25:02.240 not that for most people. Even with people who 00:25:02.240 --> 00:25:05.900 do a lot of dark humor or whatever, nuance is 00:25:05.900 --> 00:25:08.019 important. And if you're not letting people have 00:25:08.019 --> 00:25:11.940 any nuance in how they react honestly to negative 00:25:11.940 --> 00:25:14.039 things, whatever that means for them, the standard 00:25:14.039 --> 00:25:16.319 is different for everybody. Yeah. I feel like 00:25:16.319 --> 00:25:18.579 that gets into the realm of toxic positivity 00:25:18.579 --> 00:25:20.779 and I don't like it. Yeah. Like for instance, 00:25:21.079 --> 00:25:23.039 say like I've had a lot of death in my life. 00:25:23.099 --> 00:25:25.519 Yeah. And I have a lot of people in my life who 00:25:25.519 --> 00:25:27.819 have never like had any death in their life. 00:25:28.059 --> 00:25:30.920 It's as if like someone died in their family 00:25:30.920 --> 00:25:32.880 and they're upset. I'm like, well, I've had way 00:25:32.880 --> 00:25:35.779 more people die. Suck it up. Yeah. That's the 00:25:35.779 --> 00:25:37.400 wrong thing. You should just be glad that this 00:25:37.400 --> 00:25:39.299 person's not dead. Yeah. Or that you didn't lose 00:25:39.299 --> 00:25:41.559 this guy. Yeah. I don't even have a mom. So why 00:25:41.559 --> 00:25:43.279 are you, like, pissed off that you don't have 00:25:43.279 --> 00:25:44.759 a great aunt? Yeah. You know what I mean? You 00:25:44.759 --> 00:25:46.619 should really be grateful for who you have. Yeah. 00:25:46.640 --> 00:25:49.140 And that's, I hate that so much. Me too. Like, 00:25:49.240 --> 00:25:53.500 just. Just let it, let me feel. Yeah. Just let 00:25:53.500 --> 00:25:57.420 me feel. Let me feel. And this is, I do think, 00:25:57.420 --> 00:26:00.599 though, it's really easy, like, for me, as I've 00:26:00.599 --> 00:26:04.079 said, I'm a pessimist, right? To be. really anti 00:26:04.079 --> 00:26:06.019 -toxic positivity like if you're trying to be 00:26:06.019 --> 00:26:08.480 too positive at me fuck you and everything you 00:26:08.480 --> 00:26:10.900 stand for get out i mean sometimes i do overly 00:26:10.900 --> 00:26:14.000 positive to piss people off you do but that's 00:26:14.000 --> 00:26:17.220 for certain things yeah it's not because i'm 00:26:17.220 --> 00:26:19.799 being toxic positive no you're not really genuinely 00:26:19.799 --> 00:26:22.500 pushing about it no i just mean in general for 00:26:22.500 --> 00:26:25.000 me because i am pessimistic i know that my line 00:26:25.000 --> 00:26:28.019 for this is probably like not fair Some of it's 00:26:28.019 --> 00:26:29.880 probably, but one thing I've noticed that I'm 00:26:29.880 --> 00:26:31.700 doing recently, because it made me think of this 00:26:31.700 --> 00:26:35.779 when you said, let me feel, is I do think, you 00:26:35.779 --> 00:26:39.200 know, any kind of perspective can get toxic if 00:26:39.200 --> 00:26:40.839 there's too much of it, right? Yeah. So toxic 00:26:40.839 --> 00:26:43.720 positivity, obviously. Toxic negativity. But 00:26:43.720 --> 00:26:46.660 also, and this is something I'm realizing, like, 00:26:46.680 --> 00:26:50.180 literally just very recently that I think I struggle 00:26:50.180 --> 00:26:56.789 with is toxic apathy. Like. I don't do well with 00:26:56.789 --> 00:27:00.710 feelings. Mood apathetic. Yes. I don't do well 00:27:00.710 --> 00:27:03.710 with feelings I never have. But the last few 00:27:03.710 --> 00:27:05.710 years of my life, I've, you know, I've sought 00:27:05.710 --> 00:27:07.170 a lot of mental health treatment. I've worked 00:27:07.170 --> 00:27:10.490 on it and I have sort of expanded my feelings. 00:27:10.690 --> 00:27:15.730 Yeah. And my like emotional capacity. But it's 00:27:15.730 --> 00:27:18.410 still not easy for me. And I think sometimes 00:27:18.410 --> 00:27:22.130 like when somebody asks or if it's like, Hey, 00:27:22.150 --> 00:27:23.910 how's it going? Or is everything okay? Or whatever. 00:27:25.019 --> 00:27:27.960 i'm fine i'm always fine i'm always gonna be 00:27:27.960 --> 00:27:31.839 fine whatever even when something is obviously 00:27:31.839 --> 00:27:36.500 wrong right right and instead of like outwardly 00:27:36.500 --> 00:27:38.440 i'm saying like to other people as i interact 00:27:38.440 --> 00:27:40.799 with people instead of just being super negative 00:27:40.799 --> 00:27:44.400 about it or if i am it's it's it's dark humor 00:27:44.400 --> 00:27:48.319 it's casual it's whatever but i've noticed that 00:27:48.319 --> 00:27:52.359 like my i have to be apathetic about it because 00:27:52.359 --> 00:27:56.109 i don't want to get caught in this like feeling 00:27:56.109 --> 00:27:57.750 cycle and I don't want to feel vulnerable in 00:27:57.750 --> 00:27:59.549 front of other people. So it can definitely be 00:27:59.549 --> 00:28:01.930 like a defense mechanism. And for me, I've noticed 00:28:01.930 --> 00:28:04.390 myself doing that with the apathy. You know, 00:28:04.450 --> 00:28:06.009 I've had, I'm not going to get into specifics, 00:28:06.150 --> 00:28:09.130 but I've had a lot of like lifestyle type changes 00:28:09.130 --> 00:28:13.109 in my, in my life pretty recently. And if anyone 00:28:13.109 --> 00:28:15.250 asks, if any, my whole thing is like, I've got 00:28:15.250 --> 00:28:17.009 to, I'm okay. It's fine. It's fine. It's fine. 00:28:17.150 --> 00:28:20.390 And in general, in a lot of ways it is like on 00:28:20.390 --> 00:28:23.049 paper, it's fine, but it's like, I'm not letting 00:28:23.049 --> 00:28:28.490 myself feel anything beyond just being fine and 00:28:28.490 --> 00:28:30.410 okay and prepared and blah blah blah blah blah 00:28:30.410 --> 00:28:34.269 outwardly to other people and it's like uh it's 00:28:34.269 --> 00:28:37.710 like i don't care i am apathetic about it and 00:28:37.710 --> 00:28:40.670 if it's a defense mechanism that i'm doing because 00:28:40.670 --> 00:28:43.029 at some point it catches up to you if you're 00:28:43.029 --> 00:28:44.849 toxically positive if you're toxically negative 00:28:44.849 --> 00:28:48.759 toxically apathetic it's going to catch up to 00:28:48.759 --> 00:28:51.960 you at some point. In the wise words of Bo Burnham, 00:28:52.039 --> 00:28:55.200 apathy is a tragedy and boredom is a crime. I 00:28:55.200 --> 00:28:58.279 don't really know what to do with that. I just 00:28:58.279 --> 00:29:00.319 wanted to stick some Bo Burnham in there. I mean, 00:29:00.359 --> 00:29:02.779 always a good time for that, I suppose. And especially 00:29:02.779 --> 00:29:06.019 with just the world we live in. Yeah. Well, and 00:29:06.019 --> 00:29:08.559 it's easy to want to say, oh, I want to focus 00:29:08.559 --> 00:29:10.299 on the positive or I just want everything to 00:29:10.299 --> 00:29:11.859 be fine and I'm not going to get too into the 00:29:11.859 --> 00:29:14.099 weeds and doom scroll and blah, blah, blah. But 00:29:14.099 --> 00:29:15.779 at some point you do have to feel the feeling. 00:29:16.190 --> 00:29:17.529 You have to feel the feeling. You have to face 00:29:17.529 --> 00:29:20.910 the facts. Yeah. You've got to let yourself. 00:29:20.910 --> 00:29:23.769 You've got to live. Yeah. Because if you keep 00:29:23.769 --> 00:29:26.910 holding back, if you keep, like, you've stopped 00:29:26.910 --> 00:29:29.730 living. Yeah. And you can't stop living. I mean, 00:29:29.750 --> 00:29:32.930 you can't stop living. Look. But don't purposefully 00:29:32.930 --> 00:29:34.509 stop living. Don't do that. Don't purposefully 00:29:34.509 --> 00:29:36.509 stop living. One day we're going to die. No, 00:29:36.549 --> 00:29:38.650 but I can say. But you know what I mean. Yeah. 00:29:38.710 --> 00:29:40.190 Like, when I was talking a minute ago about, 00:29:40.230 --> 00:29:44.359 like, my. past emotional capacity. It was almost 00:29:44.359 --> 00:29:46.660 nothing. Yeah. I'm not saying I never had any 00:29:46.660 --> 00:29:49.140 feelings. I wasn't a psycho, but what I am saying 00:29:49.140 --> 00:29:52.839 is I, I kind of just shut myself off a lot so 00:29:52.839 --> 00:29:56.220 that I wouldn't feel anything. And look, I think 00:29:56.220 --> 00:29:58.339 that I'm wired a little different than some people. 00:29:58.400 --> 00:30:00.759 I don't think I would ever have the most, like, 00:30:00.819 --> 00:30:03.660 even if nothing ridiculous happened to me, I 00:30:03.660 --> 00:30:05.660 think I probably would have been a little less 00:30:05.660 --> 00:30:10.339 on the emotional scale than some people, but 00:30:11.789 --> 00:30:15.009 I have, I've had to rewire myself throughout 00:30:15.009 --> 00:30:18.829 my adult life to try and have any kind of life, 00:30:18.930 --> 00:30:21.609 like you're saying. To emote is to be human. 00:30:22.190 --> 00:30:24.150 And that doesn't always have to be something 00:30:24.150 --> 00:30:28.529 positive. You can't just focus on the positive. 00:30:28.789 --> 00:30:30.930 Right. Well, I mean, going back to what you said, 00:30:31.029 --> 00:30:32.150 like, when people ask you, like, how are you 00:30:32.150 --> 00:30:33.730 doing? And you say fine, even though you're not 00:30:33.730 --> 00:30:36.730 fine. But that's just what society has, like, 00:30:36.730 --> 00:30:39.730 pushed on us. Like, because if you're, like... 00:30:40.009 --> 00:30:41.849 At a meeting at work. And someone's like, hey, 00:30:41.890 --> 00:30:44.069 how are you doing? They don't expect you and 00:30:44.069 --> 00:30:47.650 they don't want you. No. To trauma dump on them 00:30:47.650 --> 00:30:50.210 of like the problems that you're actually having. 00:30:50.390 --> 00:30:52.849 Yeah. They just want you to say good and move 00:30:52.849 --> 00:30:54.789 on so they can continue with their day. Yeah. 00:30:55.049 --> 00:30:58.170 Because that's what society wants us to do. Like 00:30:58.170 --> 00:30:59.750 they don't want to have these conversations, 00:30:59.869 --> 00:31:05.450 which. And it's like, not every setting is for 00:31:05.450 --> 00:31:08.970 it. I get it. No, no. I'm not going to talk about 00:31:08.970 --> 00:31:11.589 my dead mom at a work conference. No, like if 00:31:11.589 --> 00:31:13.589 the cashier says, hey, are you doing it? I'm 00:31:13.589 --> 00:31:16.730 not going to. Not good, Cheryl. Like, I'm not 00:31:16.730 --> 00:31:20.789 going to do that. But I found myself not even 00:31:20.789 --> 00:31:24.029 doing it with like friends and family and people 00:31:24.029 --> 00:31:27.750 who know and care. Totally fine if I said, man, 00:31:27.789 --> 00:31:30.740 I'm not okay. Or. yeah, things are okay here, 00:31:30.839 --> 00:31:33.319 but I'm actually feeling this kind of way about 00:31:33.319 --> 00:31:36.119 it as I'm navigating this. That feeling of needing 00:31:36.119 --> 00:31:37.920 to be fine, I don't think I'm alone in that. 00:31:38.000 --> 00:31:41.019 I think it permeates. And some of it is a fear, 00:31:41.220 --> 00:31:43.839 at least for me, of the person who's toxically 00:31:43.839 --> 00:31:46.579 positive. I don't want to face toxic positivity 00:31:46.579 --> 00:31:50.700 and be... vulnerable finally and say oh my god 00:31:50.700 --> 00:31:52.720 i am not doing good and suck it up it's gonna 00:31:52.720 --> 00:31:54.900 be fine yeah or like well you know you should 00:31:54.900 --> 00:31:56.400 really focus on the good things in your life 00:31:56.400 --> 00:31:59.599 and well you know it could be worse or like have 00:31:59.599 --> 00:32:03.140 you tried meditating have you tried like dieting 00:32:03.140 --> 00:32:07.940 and losing weight but like i i don't want that 00:32:07.940 --> 00:32:10.460 i do not want to have that interaction and sometimes 00:32:10.460 --> 00:32:14.910 i think that like the toxic positivity being 00:32:14.910 --> 00:32:16.970 kind of like the standard, like you were saying 00:32:16.970 --> 00:32:21.630 earlier, makes people who are like myself, who 00:32:21.630 --> 00:32:26.029 are, who are inclined to pull themselves up away 00:32:26.029 --> 00:32:31.029 from people, go further into that hole and be 00:32:31.029 --> 00:32:33.769 like, you know what? No. I can't fuck with this. 00:32:33.950 --> 00:32:36.849 Yeah. I actually have like an example, semi like, 00:32:36.910 --> 00:32:39.069 not an example, but like just like a little blurb. 00:32:39.069 --> 00:32:41.710 Okay. So like if you're expressing like disappointment 00:32:41.710 --> 00:32:45.230 or sadness and someone says happiness is a choice. 00:32:45.390 --> 00:32:47.970 Okay. And that suggests that these like feelings 00:32:47.970 --> 00:32:49.910 of like negative emotion is their own fault. 00:32:50.089 --> 00:32:53.849 Yeah. But it's literally just being human. Yes. 00:32:53.849 --> 00:32:58.170 People are sad. People get sad. People get depressed. 00:32:58.289 --> 00:33:02.849 People like have anxiety. People feel. upset 00:33:02.849 --> 00:33:06.029 and sometimes happiness is not a it's not a choice 00:33:06.029 --> 00:33:10.529 no like if i if i could choose to just be happy 00:33:10.529 --> 00:33:14.890 i wouldn't need medication but also that would 00:33:14.890 --> 00:33:17.150 be you would be you would need medication that 00:33:17.150 --> 00:33:19.130 would be delusional that would not be a full 00:33:19.130 --> 00:33:22.809 -fledged human experience wired different like 00:33:22.809 --> 00:33:26.130 people are different yeah people's lives are 00:33:26.130 --> 00:33:27.950 different people go through different things 00:33:27.950 --> 00:33:31.099 and it's not a choice I genuinely believe too 00:33:31.099 --> 00:33:35.759 that anybody who is like always happy, something 00:33:35.759 --> 00:33:37.599 is fucking wrong with you. Something is wrong 00:33:37.599 --> 00:33:39.859 with you. And I don't know if it's really that 00:33:39.859 --> 00:33:41.440 you're choosing to do this or that something 00:33:41.440 --> 00:33:45.460 is broken in your brain, but like how do you 00:33:45.460 --> 00:33:48.000 expect to really connect with anyone on a human 00:33:48.000 --> 00:33:52.119 level? It's human to feel positive and negative 00:33:52.119 --> 00:33:55.799 feelings. How do you expect to empathize or sympathize 00:33:55.799 --> 00:33:59.509 with? anyone going through anything if your knee 00:33:59.509 --> 00:34:04.349 jerk is to say is not even to say to just like 00:34:04.349 --> 00:34:07.049 bathe everything and it has to be positive because 00:34:07.049 --> 00:34:09.369 doing that you're pushing out anything negative 00:34:09.369 --> 00:34:11.570 and i hate to be the one that breaks this to 00:34:11.570 --> 00:34:14.329 you i really do the world is kind of a negative 00:34:14.329 --> 00:34:17.210 place yeah there's a bunch of terrible shit that 00:34:17.210 --> 00:34:19.210 happens every day there's a bunch of positive 00:34:19.210 --> 00:34:21.070 shit that happens every day too i'm not taking 00:34:21.070 --> 00:34:23.389 away from that but you can't take away from the 00:34:23.389 --> 00:34:26.730 negative by just like bleeding positive everywhere. 00:34:26.969 --> 00:34:30.030 You can't, you can't do either one. And that's 00:34:30.030 --> 00:34:32.449 what it becomes. Yeah. And like, you can like, 00:34:32.510 --> 00:34:36.730 for me, like I've, you know, depression is a 00:34:36.730 --> 00:34:40.269 more recent thing for me. Yeah. But like, I, 00:34:40.510 --> 00:34:43.750 it's more of like, it's an effort. Like I do 00:34:43.750 --> 00:34:47.670 have to put forth effort to put myself in situations 00:34:47.670 --> 00:34:51.760 that do help my mood. Yeah. Me too. So like, 00:34:51.820 --> 00:34:53.739 it's not like, yeah, I'm, I guess technically 00:34:53.739 --> 00:34:56.300 I am choosing to be happy, but at the same time, 00:34:56.320 --> 00:34:59.719 like I'm just, I just know what can like help. 00:34:59.860 --> 00:35:02.019 I'm choosing to experience something positive 00:35:02.019 --> 00:35:05.019 and hope that I can receive it and that I can 00:35:05.019 --> 00:35:07.320 actually affect my feelings. But I also know, 00:35:07.380 --> 00:35:09.019 and this is where it gets a little dicey as somebody 00:35:09.019 --> 00:35:12.809 with depression or depressive episodes. Sometimes. 00:35:13.030 --> 00:35:14.449 It just doesn't work. It's not going to do anything. 00:35:14.670 --> 00:35:18.349 And that's fine. Yeah. I hope it does for you, 00:35:18.449 --> 00:35:20.489 whoever you are out there. But for other people, 00:35:20.510 --> 00:35:22.110 it's not always going to do that. People have 00:35:22.110 --> 00:35:24.710 different experiences. But one thing I found 00:35:24.710 --> 00:35:28.590 was a breakdown, and this is just off of Alicia 00:35:28.590 --> 00:35:33.409 Peterson's blog. Okay. I don't know who this 00:35:33.409 --> 00:35:35.670 person is. It was published via Medium, so it's 00:35:35.670 --> 00:35:38.090 probably like an article or something. But I 00:35:38.090 --> 00:35:40.449 liked the infographic of it. And it's putting 00:35:40.449 --> 00:35:43.900 together... Toxic positivity versus genuine optimism 00:35:43.900 --> 00:35:46.940 and how that looks different in like common statements. 00:35:47.280 --> 00:35:51.320 Okay. So like, one, being negative won't help 00:35:51.320 --> 00:35:55.159 you. Instead of that, you might say, it's important 00:35:55.159 --> 00:35:57.280 to let it out. Is there anything I can do to 00:35:57.280 --> 00:36:02.599 make this easier for you? Good vibes only. I 00:36:02.599 --> 00:36:05.280 love you through all your emotional states. I 00:36:05.280 --> 00:36:07.920 would absolutely bust into a million pieces if 00:36:07.920 --> 00:36:10.280 somebody said that to me. You'll get over it. 00:36:10.360 --> 00:36:13.800 Ugh. Fuck you. You are so resilient and your 00:36:13.800 --> 00:36:16.079 strength will get you through it. I think that's 00:36:16.079 --> 00:36:18.000 better. Yeah. You know, it's not just because 00:36:18.000 --> 00:36:20.719 the getting over it thing sucks. But getting 00:36:20.719 --> 00:36:23.539 through it, to me, it just sounds different because 00:36:23.539 --> 00:36:25.699 it's like getting over it is like forget about 00:36:25.699 --> 00:36:27.019 it. It doesn't even matter. Getting through it 00:36:27.019 --> 00:36:29.639 is acknowledging the experience as a whole. Right. 00:36:29.699 --> 00:36:31.239 But that's just me. I don't know. And that's 00:36:31.239 --> 00:36:34.579 just like how things are. Yeah. Like you don't 00:36:34.579 --> 00:36:37.039 really get over things, especially like something 00:36:37.039 --> 00:36:40.480 as serious as like death. Or, like, it just, 00:36:40.559 --> 00:36:43.679 it gets easier. Yeah. But it doesn't just go 00:36:43.679 --> 00:36:46.199 away. Literally the only way out is through. 00:36:46.340 --> 00:36:49.139 The only way out is through. And that acknowledges 00:36:49.139 --> 00:36:50.780 it a little better. Because getting over it again 00:36:50.780 --> 00:36:53.099 is very out of sight, out of mind. Which is, 00:36:53.179 --> 00:36:56.440 I think, like the crux of toxic positivity. Yeah. 00:36:56.739 --> 00:36:59.059 Because it's not dealing with any negative emotions. 00:36:59.440 --> 00:37:01.940 No. It's... Ignoring the problem, pushing it 00:37:01.940 --> 00:37:04.139 back, and then you just snap. La la la la la. 00:37:04.280 --> 00:37:06.219 That's basically what it is to anything negative. 00:37:06.500 --> 00:37:12.449 And... Smile. Crying won't help. I always cry. 00:37:12.530 --> 00:37:15.949 What do you mean? It's okay to cry. We all do. 00:37:16.050 --> 00:37:20.369 Can I get you a tissue or a hug? Dude, who is 00:37:20.369 --> 00:37:23.710 this person? Alicia, please come stay here. Just 00:37:23.710 --> 00:37:26.849 stay positive. That's the biggest one. Things 00:37:26.849 --> 00:37:28.710 are tough right now. Do you want to talk about 00:37:28.710 --> 00:37:30.550 it or do you want to do something lighthearted? 00:37:31.070 --> 00:37:32.349 I think that one kind of goes to what you were 00:37:32.349 --> 00:37:34.349 saying. Like, you can try to do things that are 00:37:34.349 --> 00:37:38.889 positive and have positive experiences, but you 00:37:38.889 --> 00:37:41.849 can't force the feeling to come from the experience. 00:37:42.170 --> 00:37:45.090 No. It's, you know, it's like you can still try 00:37:45.090 --> 00:37:47.409 to do positive things. Right. Like, when I'm 00:37:47.409 --> 00:37:50.730 feeling, like, low, I'll just re -watch a show 00:37:50.730 --> 00:37:52.929 that I enjoy. That I know it just brings me joy. 00:37:53.010 --> 00:37:54.769 Like, if I want a good laugh, I want to watch 00:37:54.769 --> 00:37:57.670 Psych or Parks and Rec. Yeah. That's just... 00:37:57.849 --> 00:37:59.710 Those are just like my like feel good shows. 00:37:59.889 --> 00:38:01.750 Yeah, I do the same thing. Even when, no matter 00:38:01.750 --> 00:38:03.170 what, I'm going to laugh and I'm going to have 00:38:03.170 --> 00:38:05.090 a good time and then I can just keep going. I 00:38:05.090 --> 00:38:08.469 do the same thing or like sometimes I'll like 00:38:08.469 --> 00:38:10.550 watch a movie that I know will really like make 00:38:10.550 --> 00:38:13.050 me think and make me like distract my mind a 00:38:13.050 --> 00:38:15.289 little bit and get into other things. But I also 00:38:15.289 --> 00:38:17.150 know that sometimes I will sit there and it will 00:38:17.150 --> 00:38:20.309 not work. And I can't, I try not to beat myself 00:38:20.309 --> 00:38:23.010 up when it doesn't work. Yeah. Because this is 00:38:23.010 --> 00:38:27.409 just me experiencing being human. Hey. Thanks 00:38:27.409 --> 00:38:29.610 for listening to 30 Dirty and Dying, the show 00:38:29.610 --> 00:38:32.289 for millennials by millennials. We get real about 00:38:32.289 --> 00:38:34.949 chronic illness, burnout, nostalgia, and why 00:38:34.949 --> 00:38:37.710 we aren't exactly thriving. If that sounds like 00:38:37.710 --> 00:38:39.849 you, join us every Thursday for new episodes. 00:38:39.949 --> 00:38:42.550 Now, back to the show. I think toxic positivity 00:38:42.550 --> 00:38:45.829 really affects how people sort of view their 00:38:45.829 --> 00:38:48.289 own lives and move forward in their lives and 00:38:48.289 --> 00:38:53.610 sort of take stock of if they're doing enough, 00:38:53.670 --> 00:38:55.530 if they've got their shit together, if whatever. 00:38:56.219 --> 00:38:58.340 And I really think it does come down to like 00:38:58.340 --> 00:39:00.079 a toxic positivity thing. I don't know. That's 00:39:00.079 --> 00:39:01.840 how I always view that. It's like you should 00:39:01.840 --> 00:39:03.820 have your shit together. Yeah, it's toxic positivity, 00:39:03.980 --> 00:39:07.380 but it's also like based on a long time ago, 00:39:07.519 --> 00:39:13.260 people, like there was the home life that was 00:39:13.260 --> 00:39:16.980 expected. Yes. And outside of toxic positivity, 00:39:17.280 --> 00:39:20.079 but like in your early 20s, you get married, 00:39:20.219 --> 00:39:23.420 have a kid, you have this family. That's just 00:39:23.420 --> 00:39:25.719 is how it's supposed to be. Yeah. And it has 00:39:25.719 --> 00:39:29.800 like continued through time and the expectations 00:39:29.800 --> 00:39:32.900 are there. So when people are in their late 20s, 00:39:32.900 --> 00:39:35.340 early 30s, they still haven't found someone to 00:39:35.340 --> 00:39:38.639 love. They're just like, I'm so far behind. But 00:39:38.639 --> 00:39:42.360 every person has their own timeline. Not one 00:39:42.360 --> 00:39:47.320 person is the same. old -fashioned idea of what 00:39:47.320 --> 00:39:51.179 should happen is old yeah it's because they died 00:39:51.179 --> 00:39:55.280 at age 50 okay like going to war okay but like 00:39:55.280 --> 00:39:57.760 you know what i mean like the times were different 00:39:57.760 --> 00:39:59.639 the expectations were different it's different 00:39:59.639 --> 00:40:02.460 i also think though it came down to a level of 00:40:02.460 --> 00:40:04.880 perception because here's the thing there are 00:40:04.880 --> 00:40:06.920 people who still have that exact same timeline 00:40:06.920 --> 00:40:09.820 maybe you got married maybe but what i'm saying 00:40:09.820 --> 00:40:12.880 is The timeline may be the exact same, but maybe 00:40:12.880 --> 00:40:15.420 you do, you've maybe checked all the boxes and 00:40:15.420 --> 00:40:18.440 you feel like, man, I still don't feel like I've 00:40:18.440 --> 00:40:20.219 got this all figured out. I still feel like I'm 00:40:20.219 --> 00:40:21.880 just making this up as I go along. I still feel 00:40:21.880 --> 00:40:24.559 like I'm in a really chaotic place in my life. 00:40:24.960 --> 00:40:27.780 And I think that's because the perception was 00:40:27.780 --> 00:40:30.519 like toxically positive of like, if you do these 00:40:30.519 --> 00:40:32.639 things, it'll be great. You win. And it's like, 00:40:32.639 --> 00:40:34.599 you can do all those things, but you will probably 00:40:34.599 --> 00:40:38.500 still feel like this. Yeah. Because I think this 00:40:38.500 --> 00:40:40.610 is how we all feel. really that like we're just 00:40:40.610 --> 00:40:42.030 making this up some days are great some days 00:40:42.030 --> 00:40:45.010 aren't great uh it's rarely exactly what you 00:40:45.010 --> 00:40:48.070 pictured even if you check all the boxes the 00:40:48.070 --> 00:40:50.630 way you feel about it is probably not how you 00:40:50.630 --> 00:40:52.190 thought you feel about it i'm not saying you 00:40:52.190 --> 00:40:54.250 regret your whole life i'm just saying it's gonna 00:40:54.250 --> 00:40:57.050 be different but nobody talked about that no 00:40:57.050 --> 00:40:59.550 you could not be like man i don't know how i 00:40:59.550 --> 00:41:01.610 don't know I don't know if I should do this. 00:41:01.690 --> 00:41:03.449 Like, growing up, it's just like, oh, our parents 00:41:03.449 --> 00:41:05.690 had it together. Yeah. They sure fucking didn't. 00:41:05.690 --> 00:41:07.929 No, but they made it seem like they did because 00:41:07.929 --> 00:41:09.090 they were checking the boxes and they weren't 00:41:09.090 --> 00:41:11.949 talking about anything else. No. And now I have 00:41:11.949 --> 00:41:14.570 to go to therapy because nobody else fucking 00:41:14.570 --> 00:41:18.809 would. You're welcome, everyone. Toxic positivity 00:41:18.809 --> 00:41:20.949 can be like all those sayings and things that 00:41:20.949 --> 00:41:23.809 we kind of listed a little bit ago, but I also 00:41:23.809 --> 00:41:27.820 think it can just come down to... like the perception 00:41:27.820 --> 00:41:30.019 that you think you're supposed to have about 00:41:30.019 --> 00:41:32.440 different phases of your life. It's not saying 00:41:32.440 --> 00:41:34.920 you got to hate it or regret it or not like it, 00:41:34.940 --> 00:41:37.199 but you can also see the full picture. You can 00:41:37.199 --> 00:41:39.820 be living your absolute dream life and still 00:41:39.820 --> 00:41:42.159 be having a really bad day. You'll still be having 00:41:42.159 --> 00:41:44.179 really bad times or something can be happening 00:41:44.179 --> 00:41:48.179 within the midst of your narrative right now 00:41:48.179 --> 00:41:50.599 that's really negative and bad and you don't 00:41:50.599 --> 00:41:52.239 like it. It doesn't mean that your whole life 00:41:52.239 --> 00:41:55.190 is trash. No, it just means that we have bad 00:41:55.190 --> 00:41:56.849 times. Yeah, but you don't have to ignore it. 00:41:56.909 --> 00:41:59.110 You can still be like, things are going well, 00:41:59.210 --> 00:42:02.869 but this isn't. And that's okay. Yeah, the full 00:42:02.869 --> 00:42:05.730 circle is important. There, I found this quote. 00:42:05.889 --> 00:42:11.889 It says, it's about tox pox. Tox pox. Toxic positivity. 00:42:12.809 --> 00:42:16.710 Toxoplasmosis. Toxic shock syndrome. That's what 00:42:16.710 --> 00:42:19.570 this episode is about. Take your tamps out right 00:42:19.570 --> 00:42:23.590 now. Take your tamp out. It's shaming causes 00:42:23.590 --> 00:42:26.489 guilt, avoids authentic human emotion, prevents 00:42:26.489 --> 00:42:29.730 growth. It creates a false narrative of reality, 00:42:30.010 --> 00:42:31.750 often causing you to question what you think 00:42:31.750 --> 00:42:33.889 and feel. That's exactly, I think that covers 00:42:33.889 --> 00:42:35.289 it. That's pretty much everything we've talked 00:42:35.289 --> 00:42:38.099 about throughout the conversation. kind of in 00:42:38.099 --> 00:42:40.760 a bulleted list. Yeah. I think that covers it. 00:42:40.780 --> 00:42:42.159 It really does have a lot of effects. People 00:42:42.159 --> 00:42:45.099 think it's just pessimists wanting to stay pessimists 00:42:45.099 --> 00:42:47.340 or wanting to reject positive things. And it's 00:42:47.340 --> 00:42:49.340 like, no, it's more than just sayings that aren't 00:42:49.340 --> 00:42:51.159 great. It's more than just you hurt my feelings. 00:42:51.480 --> 00:42:54.760 It's mental health and it affects relationships. 00:42:54.920 --> 00:42:57.239 It affects how we interact. And I think until 00:42:57.239 --> 00:42:59.500 we get real about that, it's going to keep happening. 00:42:59.579 --> 00:43:03.280 I do genuinely feel like it's rooted in the idea 00:43:03.280 --> 00:43:07.300 that mental health doesn't exist. Yeah. Because, 00:43:07.300 --> 00:43:11.260 you know, therapy was not a thing for the longest 00:43:11.260 --> 00:43:14.579 time. So that's where, like, it came from. But, 00:43:14.579 --> 00:43:16.440 like, now that we're actually talking about mental 00:43:16.440 --> 00:43:18.860 health, we're actually getting help. We're realizing 00:43:18.860 --> 00:43:23.440 that it matters. Yeah. We can start pushing away 00:43:23.440 --> 00:43:27.699 this. Yeah. And that mental health and these 00:43:27.699 --> 00:43:31.300 feelings and thoughts that come up are not always 00:43:31.300 --> 00:43:34.119 within someone's control. And we have to be able 00:43:34.119 --> 00:43:36.780 to embrace that. And be okay with that. And deal 00:43:36.780 --> 00:43:40.099 with it in another way. Like, I think something. 00:43:40.239 --> 00:43:42.579 Like, you see this a lot. And I know a few people 00:43:42.579 --> 00:43:45.820 who, like, they don't go to therapy. They don't 00:43:45.820 --> 00:43:47.539 whatever. But they're really big on, like, the 00:43:47.539 --> 00:43:50.260 self -help train. Which, like, look. If that 00:43:50.260 --> 00:43:51.920 works for you, go for it. Whatever you want to 00:43:51.920 --> 00:43:53.800 do. But I will say that there's a lot of that 00:43:53.800 --> 00:43:56.760 that's rooted in this, like, you have to. You 00:43:56.760 --> 00:43:59.519 choose. The choice. The choices. And you have 00:43:59.519 --> 00:44:02.340 to, you know, grab your fucking life by the horns. 00:44:02.440 --> 00:44:05.039 And I'm not saying that's all bad. But what I 00:44:05.039 --> 00:44:09.019 am saying is you can't self -help book your way 00:44:09.019 --> 00:44:12.099 through a mental health issue. No. You just can't. 00:44:12.099 --> 00:44:13.900 I'm sorry. I'm not saying it can't help you at 00:44:13.900 --> 00:44:16.760 times. There can't be positive things that come 00:44:16.760 --> 00:44:18.880 out of it. Genuinely positive things. Yeah. Not 00:44:18.880 --> 00:44:20.219 toxic positive things. But it's not going to 00:44:20.219 --> 00:44:22.360 do the work for you. No. Because again, you're 00:44:22.360 --> 00:44:25.320 not going to really, until you get really honest 00:44:25.320 --> 00:44:27.780 about it and what's causing it and what's not, 00:44:27.900 --> 00:44:30.340 and that you might not have any control over 00:44:30.340 --> 00:44:33.059 this. And if you do, it probably doesn't have 00:44:33.059 --> 00:44:35.159 anything to do with what you think it does. You 00:44:35.159 --> 00:44:37.960 know, like, self -help is not the same as therapy, 00:44:38.039 --> 00:44:41.139 is not the same as mental health care. I'm not 00:44:41.139 --> 00:44:43.820 saying it can't have a good effect on people, 00:44:43.940 --> 00:44:47.099 but it's not the same thing. We've got to stop 00:44:47.099 --> 00:44:50.780 equating the two. We've got to stop doing that. 00:44:50.860 --> 00:44:54.960 I see that happen so much of, like, self -help 00:44:54.960 --> 00:44:58.239 and self -care and blah, blah, blah being... 00:44:59.730 --> 00:45:02.010 with mental illness, mental health care. It's 00:45:02.010 --> 00:45:03.869 not the same thing. I'm not saying there is an 00:45:03.869 --> 00:45:07.630 overlap, but it's not, they're not equal things. 00:45:07.750 --> 00:45:10.050 They're different, and they mean different things 00:45:10.050 --> 00:45:12.050 to different people, and you've got to be able 00:45:12.050 --> 00:45:13.530 to acknowledge that. Would it be nice to get 00:45:13.530 --> 00:45:15.789 a massage? Yeah, self -care. Is that going to 00:45:15.789 --> 00:45:18.710 cure my depression? No. It's sure not, but will 00:45:18.710 --> 00:45:21.550 I feel good for like an hour? Yeah. They are 00:45:21.550 --> 00:45:24.949 not going to cure this. You know what I mean? 00:45:24.969 --> 00:45:26.849 There are different things that are happening. 00:45:26.969 --> 00:45:28.969 And I will say, as someone who has sought therapy 00:45:28.969 --> 00:45:31.449 several times in my life from different therapists 00:45:31.449 --> 00:45:36.250 for different issues, not one therapist has ever 00:45:36.250 --> 00:45:39.130 said to me, you should be more positive. No. 00:45:39.190 --> 00:45:41.969 Have you tried thinking positively? Have you 00:45:41.969 --> 00:45:46.989 tried positively manifesting this? No one has 00:45:46.989 --> 00:45:49.940 ever fucking said that to me. No, and maybe they 00:45:49.940 --> 00:45:52.239 say it to other people if they have, you know, 00:45:52.239 --> 00:45:55.440 have fun in the comments. But like, that's, that 00:45:55.440 --> 00:45:58.199 only goes so far. Yeah. Is really the point. 00:45:58.260 --> 00:46:02.059 And if you can just acknowledge that as you interact 00:46:02.059 --> 00:46:04.719 with people who are of different experiences, 00:46:05.039 --> 00:46:07.239 that would be fucking great. That's all I have 00:46:07.239 --> 00:46:10.860 to say about that. I agree. Well, thanks for 00:46:10.860 --> 00:46:13.159 listening. Yeah. I enjoy talking about this kind 00:46:13.159 --> 00:46:15.000 of stuff. Me too. Tell us what other Real Talks 00:46:15.000 --> 00:46:17.940 you want us to cover. We're always... Willing 00:46:17.940 --> 00:46:20.420 to look into new things and deep dive into our 00:46:20.420 --> 00:46:22.119 feelings about subjects and do some research, 00:46:22.280 --> 00:46:24.119 whatever. Courtney loves research. I love research. 00:46:24.460 --> 00:46:26.900 Hell yeah. So let us know what you guys want 00:46:26.900 --> 00:46:29.340 to hear next. We are getting toward the end of 00:46:29.340 --> 00:46:35.199 season seven. Whoa! Which is crazy. So make sure 00:46:35.199 --> 00:46:38.659 you're all caught up and tell us what you want 00:46:38.659 --> 00:46:41.760 next because I assume we're going to keep going. 00:46:42.219 --> 00:46:44.940 I'd like to. Yeah. Yeah, probably. Probably. 00:46:45.079 --> 00:46:47.550 So let us know what you want to hear next. And 00:46:47.550 --> 00:46:50.050 remember, it's okay to not be okay. It is okay 00:46:50.050 --> 00:46:52.389 to not be okay. And I just want to feel. Yep. 00:46:52.550 --> 00:46:54.929 If you want to feel, if you want to laugh through 00:46:54.929 --> 00:46:57.010 the pain, you want someone to commiserate with, 00:46:57.250 --> 00:46:59.809 check out the rest of the episodes. We got a 00:46:59.809 --> 00:47:01.829 lot of them. Yep. Have a great day, guys. Or 00:47:01.829 --> 00:47:03.349 don't. Whatever the fuck you need to do, it's 00:47:03.349 --> 00:47:17.119 fine. Yeah, bye. Bye. Babette ate oatmeal.