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Yeah, fuck it.

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Like, we're just gonna have to make up as we go along.

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It's usually, I suppose, like, what are you gonna do?

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Oh.

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["Wake Up"]

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Welcome to Game of Nodes,

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a weekly podcast on the cosmos

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from independent validator teams.

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Hello, welcome to Game of Nodes,

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a weekly podcast on the cosmos

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from independent validator teams.

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Where am I?

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In the real life, where am I, right now?

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So the context here is I've been in bed

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with a nasty flu or something for the last 48 hours.

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And I reheated my corpse and crawled out of bed

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because the show must go on in the words of Freddie Mercury.

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We were just talking about the infamous Dowdow episode

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where there were a number of bong hits being ripped off camera.

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And so like the equivalent for those of us

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who aren't that cool is a cup of warm red bush tea

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with honey, good for the throat.

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So I'm gonna be ripping some tea hits

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during the course of this podcast.

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Hey, you know what?

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There was another funny Dowdow thing happened this week,

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which was, I think it was Noah,

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just had like a mini thing, like not a serious thing,

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but it was like, it's like,

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why does everybody call it Dowdow with no space?

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It's definitely Dowdow, Dowdow, Dowdow with the space.

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And then I think Lerturt who launched the,

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you know, the bundling, it's kind of like,

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almost like OTC trading thing.

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I can't remember what it was called,

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it was Fusion on Juno,

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where you basically bundle a bunch of assets,

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set a price and somebody can buy the assets.

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It's kind of cool.

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Like Defund?

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What's that?

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Like Defund?

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Well, no, because it's not like an ETF.

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It's just buying and selling.

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It's not like, it's not tracking a basket of assets.

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Just the grab bag of shit.

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Yeah, if you just have like a whole bunch of shit coins,

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you just need to get rid of, you know, you can,

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You really need the OTCs.

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You can do that shit, right?

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So, yeah, so Noah's popping off.

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He's like, it's never been Dowdow without space.

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And Lerturt just like finds a bunch of tweets

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where Zeke is just posting about new Dowdow features

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and he's just posting Dowdow's one word.

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And it's these are like clearly massive discord

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in the Dowdow team lack of direction.

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That's the best tweet to run away.

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I thought it was like, is it two words?

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I was certain that it was one word.

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I thought it was one word too.

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I was certain it was one word.

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And then, I guess I was able to do two

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because that tweet wouldn't have blown up if it hadn't.

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It is one word because we said it's one word

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and our opinion is obviously more important

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than the implementers and maintainers of the project.

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So, on the subject of tweets,

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we're bringing back the drill tweet of the week.

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Are we?

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Do we have to though?

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Okay, the subject is Twitter.

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Wait, doesn't that mean the subject is company X, right?

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Didn't you just rename it?

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They did?

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Yeah, I think Twitter is now renamed to company X

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like the official company of it.

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Okay, well, it's unimportant for this book published in 2018.

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The tweet, sorry, the drill tweet about Twitter

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that my fingers landed on is,

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I have posted at length regarding my name balls

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at the cost of my family, my career and my dignity.

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The least you can do is rack up my faves.

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There we go.

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Hear first.

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Sensational, another sensational piece of wisdom.

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Try to remember why we dumped that idea.

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The master of the shit place.

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Why would we get rid of that?

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The thing is, right, obviously they're in name,

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that's the whole point,

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but then sometimes you'll be in a situation where,

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like let's say you've been doing a contract

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for a couple of years or maybe a year,

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because obviously IR35,

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you probably haven't been doing it for one, two years.

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And you're kind of in that,

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you know when you do a long contract

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and you're just like, what the fuck am I doing this again?

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The people are dumb, the money's okay,

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but I just, I need to go do something else.

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This is fucking insane.

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And then you'll think of a drill tweet,

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you'll be like, I have posted about my inane balls

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on this website at the cost of my family,

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my career and my dignity.

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The least you could do is rack up my faves.

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And you're like, that is exactly my situation.

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I've done this inane contract at the cost of my family,

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my dignity and my balls.

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The least you can do is rack up my bank balance.

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So anyway, that's the wisdom of drill.

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Okay.

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You don't see very convinced.

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This kind of feels a little bit

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like the master and commander thing.

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But it's another not Bong hit rip.

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What we're gonna do is,

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do you guys have albus oil in America?

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Is that a thing?

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No.

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I don't know what that is.

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Yeah, what is that?

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I have literally no fucking clue what's in it

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other than it's something,

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if you are looking unwell,

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my grandma would put on a hanky and shove in your face.

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And it is,

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it's like a

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almost painful.

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It's so intense,

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but it's really good for clearing the sinuses.

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Obviously ill baby,

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because I'm everybody's ill in the house.

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And I was just like, oh, fuck it.

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Let's just, let's just albus oil the kid.

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But I was like, I'll just check online first.

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It's so powerful.

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It will literally kill the child.

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So, you know, it's good thing you check these things.

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Oh, you can't use it with the kid.

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What?

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So like chloroform,

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like what are we even talking about?

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No, I was just like, it's like peppermint.

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You can look at this.

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It's like a pretty.

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I actually don't know what albus oil is.

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I assume.

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Juniper clove, you can look at this.

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It's everything that

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it's like men's sort of like, yeah.

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Yeah, wintergreen.

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Here that you have like Vicks,

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like Vicks vapor rub.

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Do you have that stuff?

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It's just kind of the same type of thing.

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Yeah, it's more intense.

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Much more intense.

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It's like, it's like,

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you know, if you have like raw peppermint

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and you're really, really strong.

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Imagine that, but literally applied

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straight up your nostril.

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Like, but like wait, like it's in,

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because it's a liquid.

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If you put it on your finger

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and then dabbed a bit inside your nostril,

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it would literally,

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I think it would literally give you a chemical burn.

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You burn it.

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Yeah.

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Yeah, it's that intense.

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It's a very, very.

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You talking about Vicks?

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No, we're talking about albus.

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Old, old, old, old.

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But apparently it can, it basically,

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it can, there's one of the active ingredients

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that slightly increases your heart rate

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and babies can't regulate

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their own heart rate very well.

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So if you just like,

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essentially just like put a hand key with it

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and just go out next to their face,

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their heart goes really quick

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and they just go,

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and they panic and they stop breathing.

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And then you have to basically go and resuscitate them.

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Good thing you fucking love it.

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Jesus Christ.

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To be fair, I wasn't gonna,

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I wasn't gonna put it on a pillow

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because I was like,

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I was like, this stuff makes my eyes water.

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I'm not just gonna put it on the baby's pillow

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and just be like, lie on that for a day.

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That seemed like a really bad idea.

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See you in the morning.

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I was gonna be like,

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I was basically gonna take what I've got

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and just like sort of go like,

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there you go.

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Kind of like what my ground did to me.

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There you go.

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Hey.

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And then see if that reduced the crying.

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I'm trying to remember if we,

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I think we use Vicks.

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I don't remember if that was,

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I think there's an age limit on that as well,

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but we use that here and there

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that would should be pretty effective,

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which is just trying to find something

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to clear the nostrils since,

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since they can't really suck in or blue things out

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or whatever else right at that age.

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So you just try to find something that blows through.

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Well, there's also like using whiskey, right?

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Yeah.

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Kind of like grandmother.

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Might be teeth as well.

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But that's the tea thing, isn't it?

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Yeah.

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It's putting little booze on there.

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Yeah.

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Again, my kids, my kid will be,

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they'll be fine then.

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We're gonna get a crowd.

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We got plenty of,

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we got plenty of home remedies lying around.

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Yeah.

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The Vicks man, the Vicks don't work anymore.

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They've changed the formula.

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It's bullshit.

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Oh really?

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00:08:11,080 --> 00:08:11,920
Yeah.

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00:08:11,920 --> 00:08:14,200
It's just my, my Mrs the other day,

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00:08:14,200 --> 00:08:18,800
she had a sniffle and we put the Vicks on

240
00:08:18,800 --> 00:08:21,000
and it's like, well, this shit doesn't work anymore.

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Still got the sniffle.

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00:08:21,920 --> 00:08:23,040
Or is it only working with kids?

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I don't know.

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00:08:23,960 --> 00:08:24,880
No, it should work.

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00:08:24,880 --> 00:08:25,720
Yeah.

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00:08:25,720 --> 00:08:27,360
It's an age range where Vicks first checks

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that you're under 16 and then it'll activate.

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Oh, you're a minor.

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You're a minor.

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Off we go.

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00:08:36,120 --> 00:08:36,960
Okay.

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00:08:36,960 --> 00:08:39,400
It's peppermint, eucalyptus,

253
00:08:39,400 --> 00:08:42,560
Cajiput, juniper berry oil,

254
00:08:42,560 --> 00:08:45,560
wintergreen oil and clove oil.

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00:08:45,560 --> 00:08:50,560
It's literally every powerful random ass.

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You've got a smell.

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You've jammed into one unholy mixture.

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Right.

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00:08:55,600 --> 00:08:56,960
I'm just like, just put this in your face.

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And I wonder it's so fucking.

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Oh, this smells pungent.

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00:08:59,320 --> 00:09:01,760
Let's fucking put this in there as well.

263
00:09:01,760 --> 00:09:03,200
The thing is that this shit works.

264
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It's amazing.

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00:09:05,000 --> 00:09:06,440
But it is one of those when you're like,

266
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if you work in an office with lots of people

267
00:09:07,960 --> 00:09:09,320
and you have it on a handkerchief in your pocket,

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you'll be like standing somewhere

269
00:09:12,000 --> 00:09:14,680
and then somebody a few steps away from you will be like.

270
00:09:14,680 --> 00:09:15,760
What the hell is that?

271
00:09:15,760 --> 00:09:17,280
He smells like.

272
00:09:17,280 --> 00:09:19,280
That's like danker rub.

273
00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:20,120
What's that?

274
00:09:20,120 --> 00:09:21,320
That's like danker rub.

275
00:09:21,320 --> 00:09:22,160
You get that?

276
00:09:22,160 --> 00:09:23,760
Like the hot.

277
00:09:23,760 --> 00:09:24,600
DP?

278
00:09:24,600 --> 00:09:25,560
Yeah, yeah, like that.

279
00:09:25,560 --> 00:09:26,400
It's that well.

280
00:09:26,400 --> 00:09:28,680
If you have like a sporting injury,

281
00:09:28,680 --> 00:09:29,520
you stick it on.

282
00:09:29,520 --> 00:09:31,280
Yeah, you put it on there and it's a lot of shit.

283
00:09:31,280 --> 00:09:34,040
And then fucking everyone in the buildings,

284
00:09:34,040 --> 00:09:37,640
like so you like spray on your wrist or something.

285
00:09:37,640 --> 00:09:39,040
Yeah, that's smell it.

286
00:09:39,040 --> 00:09:41,160
I kind of like the smell of that.

287
00:09:41,160 --> 00:09:43,760
Like I feel like it's one that is like perversely.

288
00:09:43,760 --> 00:09:45,600
It should be like bad smelling and medicinal,

289
00:09:45,600 --> 00:09:47,440
but it's kind of like root beer.

290
00:09:47,440 --> 00:09:49,120
Like it's one of those things kind of vaguely medicinal,

291
00:09:49,120 --> 00:09:50,920
but kind of tasty smelling.

292
00:09:50,920 --> 00:09:51,760
Oh yeah, man.

293
00:09:51,760 --> 00:09:52,600
Like root beer.

294
00:09:53,640 --> 00:09:55,320
Yeah, we didn't have root beer.

295
00:09:55,320 --> 00:09:56,480
You do have root beer.

296
00:09:56,480 --> 00:09:58,120
We got fucking real beer.

297
00:09:58,120 --> 00:09:59,440
You also have root beer.

298
00:09:59,440 --> 00:10:01,360
But that root beer is literally Australian, mate.

299
00:10:01,360 --> 00:10:02,840
Don't tell me you don't have root beer.

300
00:10:02,840 --> 00:10:04,040
Bundaberg.

301
00:10:04,040 --> 00:10:04,680
Yeah.

302
00:10:04,680 --> 00:10:07,720
Yeah, but there's no Bundaberg root beer, is there?

303
00:10:07,720 --> 00:10:10,520
Yeah, I literally had something Melbourne at a bar.

304
00:10:10,520 --> 00:10:12,000
Fuck.

305
00:10:12,000 --> 00:10:13,320
I've never seen it.

306
00:10:14,520 --> 00:10:16,200
But then again, I'm walking up to the bar

307
00:10:16,200 --> 00:10:18,040
and asking you fucking root beer.

308
00:10:18,040 --> 00:10:19,560
Null shops in different aisles.

309
00:10:19,560 --> 00:10:21,400
Yeah.

310
00:10:21,400 --> 00:10:23,760
One root beer, thank you, Kyneser.

311
00:10:23,760 --> 00:10:25,480
Well, you know, when all the beers start to piss,

312
00:10:25,480 --> 00:10:27,600
you've got to have something not alcoholic.

313
00:10:27,600 --> 00:10:29,240
Yeah, well, fuck.

314
00:10:29,240 --> 00:10:30,280
I'm after 10 o'clock.

315
00:10:30,280 --> 00:10:32,920
It's like, do I go for another coffee or a whiskey?

316
00:10:32,920 --> 00:10:36,680
Whole of Australia is coming after me that.

317
00:10:36,680 --> 00:10:37,760
So yeah, OK, right.

318
00:10:37,760 --> 00:10:42,800
Well, that's 11 minutes of solid bullshit.

319
00:10:42,800 --> 00:10:46,000
So this is like following on from your little pre-show there

320
00:10:46,000 --> 00:10:48,360
of what in the fuck are we going to do?

321
00:10:48,360 --> 00:10:52,720
We'll just roll with the punches.

322
00:10:52,720 --> 00:10:56,440
So I would like to mention and there's

323
00:10:56,440 --> 00:11:00,120
an NFT project that seems to be generating

324
00:11:00,120 --> 00:11:03,120
a little bit of Twitter traffic.

325
00:11:03,120 --> 00:11:05,440
And it's going to be minting very soon.

326
00:11:05,440 --> 00:11:07,920
And I quite like the artwork.

327
00:11:07,920 --> 00:11:11,120
I don't know if I'm willing to pay shitloads of money for it,

328
00:11:11,120 --> 00:11:12,280
but I like it.

329
00:11:12,280 --> 00:11:16,080
So what do you guys feel about artwork and liking it?

330
00:11:16,080 --> 00:11:19,920
Are you talking about money for artwork you like on the blockchain?

331
00:11:20,800 --> 00:11:24,920
Are you talking about the follow on the next set of?

332
00:11:24,920 --> 00:11:28,480
Yeah, after the collection from by the bad kids folk.

333
00:11:28,480 --> 00:11:29,960
Yeah. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

334
00:11:29,960 --> 00:11:31,640
I didn't see any of the artwork yet.

335
00:11:31,640 --> 00:11:33,400
So is that they do a couple?

336
00:11:33,400 --> 00:11:35,280
I don't got a page for it yet.

337
00:11:35,280 --> 00:11:38,120
Yeah, it's just after the filter.com.

338
00:11:38,120 --> 00:11:40,960
Oh, OK. It's got some some examples there.

339
00:11:40,960 --> 00:11:43,440
It's all like a grayscale black and white.

340
00:11:43,440 --> 00:11:46,160
It's about a post apocalyptic.

341
00:11:46,160 --> 00:11:47,880
You're going to be in a place of inquiry.

342
00:11:47,880 --> 00:11:50,880
You're just going to fucking a fucking posted it in the.

343
00:11:50,880 --> 00:11:53,040
Yeah, please.

344
00:11:53,040 --> 00:11:55,120
It's just in the chat in the normal chat.

345
00:11:55,120 --> 00:11:56,520
I didn't put it in the private chat.

346
00:11:56,520 --> 00:11:59,200
It's in the so the punters can also see it.

347
00:11:59,480 --> 00:12:02,240
There you go. After the way punters click away.

348
00:12:05,600 --> 00:12:06,280
Oh, it's this week.

349
00:12:06,280 --> 00:12:08,120
It's Thursday and the mint. Oh, shit.

350
00:12:08,120 --> 00:12:09,520
Yeah, fourteenth.

351
00:12:09,520 --> 00:12:12,080
So yeah, is what's the what's the mint price?

352
00:12:12,080 --> 00:12:14,960
Is it like eight million stargays per each one?

353
00:12:15,360 --> 00:12:18,720
Nineteen hundred stars, which is probably like what, 19 bucks?

354
00:12:18,720 --> 00:12:20,520
Uh, 20 bucks.

355
00:12:20,520 --> 00:12:21,800
A little bit more now, right?

356
00:12:21,800 --> 00:12:23,720
That's pretty recent. 0.017, I think.

357
00:12:24,960 --> 00:12:26,200
Thirty two dollars.

358
00:12:26,200 --> 00:12:29,960
Oh, yeah. I mean, it's so fucking it is a lot.

359
00:12:31,440 --> 00:12:35,160
Is there a little I'm just going to buy as many as liquid stars I have.

360
00:12:35,160 --> 00:12:38,640
And then I was like, oh, shit, I assume there's probably a limit per wallet, right?

361
00:12:39,360 --> 00:12:40,560
Maybe a wireless limit.

362
00:12:40,560 --> 00:12:42,720
The yeah, what was limited probably.

363
00:12:42,720 --> 00:12:46,640
Back in the back, it's launched with like three per wallet or something like that.

364
00:12:46,640 --> 00:12:50,960
I don't know how did that don kryptonian by like 40 of them?

365
00:12:51,680 --> 00:12:52,280
Four different.

366
00:12:52,280 --> 00:12:53,680
I guess. Yeah.

367
00:12:53,680 --> 00:12:56,360
Yeah, send them around.

368
00:12:56,360 --> 00:12:57,680
I bought some Genesis.

369
00:12:57,680 --> 00:12:59,320
Well, I don't know what they call glitch candies.

370
00:12:59,320 --> 00:13:03,280
I bought glitch candies from two wallets, which was obviously a very wise investment.

371
00:13:04,640 --> 00:13:06,560
How much did you pay for those at the time?

372
00:13:07,040 --> 00:13:09,400
You want to think about that or?

373
00:13:09,400 --> 00:13:11,640
Look, look, OK, so what are they?

374
00:13:11,640 --> 00:13:13,280
So they're really cool, man.

375
00:13:13,280 --> 00:13:15,160
So so here's the thing, right?

376
00:13:15,160 --> 00:13:25,360
We because of a combination of bad financial decisions and whatnot last year,

377
00:13:25,640 --> 00:13:30,840
in terms of how crypto gets taxed and minor NFT degeneracy.

378
00:13:30,840 --> 00:13:37,400
But that was really that was a rounding error on the general bad accountancy practices

379
00:13:37,920 --> 00:13:40,880
here in the bunker, I would say.

380
00:13:40,880 --> 00:13:48,320
We we literally made no money, like no sense, no dollars, no sense in income

381
00:13:49,200 --> 00:13:52,160
for the majority of this this year.

382
00:13:52,160 --> 00:13:54,880
So tax year is just ending for companies again in the UK now.

383
00:13:55,800 --> 00:14:01,680
The last one ended just when the bear got to start to get bad, which is like a great time.

384
00:14:03,160 --> 00:14:06,720
And yeah, like are you saying you've got a nil balance sheet

385
00:14:06,720 --> 00:14:08,720
for the last one inch of years that we tell me?

386
00:14:08,720 --> 00:14:12,880
No, so we basically we from the stuff that we have made this year,

387
00:14:12,880 --> 00:14:16,040
we made a lot less in terms of absolute number.

388
00:14:16,880 --> 00:14:21,440
But we have more in our bank account because we've been actually not stupid

389
00:14:21,440 --> 00:14:28,640
about compounding or just all sorts of dumb activities that ends up with you having crypto

390
00:14:28,640 --> 00:14:35,280
in your company balance sheet and not pound sterling because you can't pay your rent in fun

391
00:14:35,680 --> 00:14:36,840
to quote Jeff Rosenstock.

392
00:14:36,840 --> 00:14:38,640
Or indeed your tax bill.

393
00:14:38,640 --> 00:14:44,640
HMRC wants wants to taste and does not accept you know, or star HMRC.

394
00:14:45,160 --> 00:14:48,160
Her Majesty's Revenue and Customs, obviously Her Majesty.

395
00:14:48,160 --> 00:14:49,160
Her Majesty.

396
00:14:49,160 --> 00:14:50,760
Although her Majesty is dead.

397
00:14:50,760 --> 00:14:54,600
So yeah, get the button I've because she's toast.

398
00:14:54,600 --> 00:14:57,120
So wait, who died?

399
00:14:57,120 --> 00:14:58,120
Jesus.

400
00:14:58,120 --> 00:14:59,120
Her Majesty.

401
00:14:59,120 --> 00:15:00,120
Yeah, she's yeah.

402
00:15:00,120 --> 00:15:01,120
Yeah.

403
00:15:01,120 --> 00:15:02,120
Yeah.

404
00:15:02,120 --> 00:15:03,120
Like the Elizabeth one.

405
00:15:03,120 --> 00:15:04,120
Yeah.

406
00:15:04,120 --> 00:15:05,120
Long gone.

407
00:15:05,120 --> 00:15:06,120
Yeah.

408
00:15:06,120 --> 00:15:07,120
Yeah.

409
00:15:07,120 --> 00:15:08,120
What?

410
00:15:08,120 --> 00:15:09,120
You get the memo down there?

411
00:15:09,120 --> 00:15:10,120
Queen Elizabeth II.

412
00:15:10,120 --> 00:15:11,120
It was the whole thing.

413
00:15:11,120 --> 00:15:12,120
You fucking did.

414
00:15:12,120 --> 00:15:14,120
We talked about it on here.

415
00:15:14,120 --> 00:15:15,120
Yeah.

416
00:15:15,120 --> 00:15:16,120
Say lovey.

417
00:15:16,120 --> 00:15:20,560
We made it a one of one NFT for Game of Nodes to pay respects.

418
00:15:20,560 --> 00:15:22,120
It just had a great big F on it.

419
00:15:22,120 --> 00:15:24,120
Who's the boss now?

420
00:15:24,120 --> 00:15:30,120
As of three weeks time, it's Charles, isn't it?

421
00:15:30,120 --> 00:15:31,120
Chuck.

422
00:15:31,120 --> 00:15:32,120
Ugh.

423
00:15:32,120 --> 00:15:33,120
What a flop.

424
00:15:33,120 --> 00:15:34,120
Yeah.

425
00:15:34,120 --> 00:15:36,120
Fucking not as pop.

426
00:15:36,120 --> 00:15:42,680
Like you might be able to, you might be able to detect a hint of the fact that I am a very

427
00:15:42,680 --> 00:15:46,120
strong and ardent Republican.

428
00:15:46,120 --> 00:15:48,920
For the Americans listening, it means a very, very different thing in the UK.

429
00:15:48,920 --> 00:15:52,120
It means you want to just not before you go down.

430
00:15:52,120 --> 00:15:55,280
It means you want to abolish the monarchy.

431
00:15:55,280 --> 00:16:02,040
I made the mistake of saying that once to in a conversation over breakfast with an elderly

432
00:16:02,040 --> 00:16:06,480
Latino American lady on a train in America when I was backpacking once.

433
00:16:06,480 --> 00:16:09,720
She looked like I was going to physically hurt her.

434
00:16:09,720 --> 00:16:12,400
I had to go, oh, hang on a second.

435
00:16:12,400 --> 00:16:14,800
You're afraid of the fact that you think I'm an American Republican.

436
00:16:14,800 --> 00:16:16,320
I was like, oh, it's okay.

437
00:16:16,320 --> 00:16:17,680
I just want to get rid of the monarchy.

438
00:16:17,680 --> 00:16:19,120
She was like, you have a monarchy?

439
00:16:19,120 --> 00:16:23,800
I was like, oh, reminded the fact that not all Americans know about the weird shit that's

440
00:16:23,800 --> 00:16:24,920
going on the rest of the world.

441
00:16:24,920 --> 00:16:26,680
I was like, well, yes, we do.

442
00:16:26,680 --> 00:16:28,240
Yes, we should get rid of them.

443
00:16:28,240 --> 00:16:33,840
Anyway, I'm sorry for giving you a little fright, very nice old lady.

444
00:16:33,840 --> 00:16:36,200
I can't remember what it was.

445
00:16:36,200 --> 00:16:40,760
I asked her about something like a recipe and she told me some really good piece of

446
00:16:40,760 --> 00:16:43,200
advice about making, I think it was Picard Gallo or something like that.

447
00:16:43,200 --> 00:16:45,000
I was like, that's a really good idea.

448
00:16:45,000 --> 00:16:47,680
I didn't write it down and it's gone forever.

449
00:16:47,680 --> 00:16:50,320
Anyway, good train journey though.

450
00:16:50,320 --> 00:16:57,920
Do you know conversely to that, I was talking to a chap on this screen right here about

451
00:16:57,920 --> 00:17:06,000
American things and Steve Irwin was mentioned about how God damn Australian Steve Irwin

452
00:17:06,000 --> 00:17:11,640
is and I was like, I didn't even know about Steve Irwin until he got fucking stabbed in

453
00:17:11,640 --> 00:17:17,360
the chest with a fish and disgust and dismay ensued.

454
00:17:17,360 --> 00:17:20,040
Apparently Americans are really fucking like Steve Irwin.

455
00:17:20,040 --> 00:17:27,200
Yes, Steve Irwin dying was like a national tragedy and I was like, yes, don't fuck around

456
00:17:27,200 --> 00:17:28,200
with the stingrays.

457
00:17:28,200 --> 00:17:30,880
It's because he's basically like crocodile Dundee.

458
00:17:30,880 --> 00:17:33,240
That's why Americans like him.

459
00:17:33,240 --> 00:17:34,240
That's a nice.

460
00:17:34,240 --> 00:17:37,200
Hey, we have like two good models, right?

461
00:17:37,200 --> 00:17:43,280
We have Mr. Rogers and we have Steve Irwin and then Mr. Rogers died and then Steve Irwin.

462
00:17:43,280 --> 00:17:45,480
We have no good role models at this point.

463
00:17:45,480 --> 00:17:50,880
In the UK, we have a thing where all the people of that generation who were TV entertainers

464
00:17:50,880 --> 00:17:59,920
turn out to be pedophiles and it's like it's literally like a thing of like there's a joke

465
00:17:59,920 --> 00:18:06,160
that goes something like you see a beloved character mentioned in like a news ticker

466
00:18:06,160 --> 00:18:10,360
and as the name rolls along, you're like, please be dead, please be dead, please be dead, please

467
00:18:10,360 --> 00:18:12,240
there be a pedo, please be dead.

468
00:18:12,240 --> 00:18:16,600
It's like they're dead and you're like, could it could have gone either way?

469
00:18:16,600 --> 00:18:18,320
Could have gone either way.

470
00:18:18,320 --> 00:18:19,320
Awesome.

471
00:18:19,320 --> 00:18:23,240
That's not ruined because lots of them, lots of them.

472
00:18:23,240 --> 00:18:24,240
Yeah.

473
00:18:24,240 --> 00:18:26,440
Lots of them got operation you treat.

474
00:18:26,440 --> 00:18:30,160
So it turned out that they were not not good people.

475
00:18:30,160 --> 00:18:31,160
Yeah.

476
00:18:31,160 --> 00:18:36,680
There was like a, I don't know if I would call it like a slander campaign, but people thought

477
00:18:36,680 --> 00:18:42,320
that Mr. Rogers was a sniper in Vietnam for a long time.

478
00:18:42,320 --> 00:18:46,680
And so that was passed around a lot in order to like discredit him for being this positive

479
00:18:46,680 --> 00:18:48,560
actor, I guess.

480
00:18:48,560 --> 00:18:52,320
But wouldn't that be like quite plausible is in like if you killed a bunch of people

481
00:18:52,320 --> 00:18:55,520
and you were like, hmm, I actually don't think that that's the way I want to live the rest

482
00:18:55,520 --> 00:18:56,520
of my life.

483
00:18:56,520 --> 00:18:57,520
Right.

484
00:18:57,520 --> 00:18:58,520
So, you know, Bob Ross was.

485
00:18:58,520 --> 00:19:00,720
I was just about to bring him up.

486
00:19:00,720 --> 00:19:03,040
He was stationed, he was army, right?

487
00:19:03,040 --> 00:19:04,040
Or Marine.

488
00:19:04,040 --> 00:19:05,040
He was.

489
00:19:05,040 --> 00:19:06,040
Alaska.

490
00:19:06,040 --> 00:19:07,040
Air Force in Alaska.

491
00:19:07,040 --> 00:19:08,040
Air Force in Alaska.

492
00:19:08,040 --> 00:19:10,840
And he was, he was like a drill sergeant in the Air Force.

493
00:19:10,840 --> 00:19:11,840
Yeah.

494
00:19:11,840 --> 00:19:12,840
He was like the equivalent of that.

495
00:19:12,840 --> 00:19:16,360
He was like a warrant officer or he was a sergeant, like a non-commissioned officer who had to

496
00:19:16,360 --> 00:19:17,960
do a lot of shouting.

497
00:19:17,960 --> 00:19:18,960
Right.

498
00:19:18,960 --> 00:19:24,400
At young men who have joined the Air Force and a fucking station in Alaska and don't want

499
00:19:24,400 --> 00:19:27,680
to do anything other than sky off and get high.

500
00:19:27,680 --> 00:19:32,520
And then when he got demopped, he was like, I just want to fucking paint trees because

501
00:19:32,520 --> 00:19:35,280
I've done all the shouting I ever want to do in my life.

502
00:19:35,280 --> 00:19:36,280
That's right.

503
00:19:36,280 --> 00:19:37,280
Yeah, that's exactly right.

504
00:19:37,280 --> 00:19:39,600
Bob Ross is up there too with Mr. Rogers and Steve Irwin.

505
00:19:39,600 --> 00:19:42,080
There's a film coming out about him soon.

506
00:19:42,080 --> 00:19:46,480
They don't know how like autobiographically accurate it is, but.

507
00:19:46,480 --> 00:19:51,400
There's a couple of documentaries about him because there was that whole cluster fuck

508
00:19:51,400 --> 00:19:56,520
with his paintings and everything else after he died.

509
00:19:56,520 --> 00:20:00,120
And I think he had between his family or his wife or kids or something else.

510
00:20:00,120 --> 00:20:04,440
There was some arguing around the legacy and who has rights for that and all that kind

511
00:20:04,440 --> 00:20:05,440
of stuff.

512
00:20:05,440 --> 00:20:06,440
Like there's a bunch.

513
00:20:06,440 --> 00:20:07,440
Really?

514
00:20:07,440 --> 00:20:08,440
Yeah.

515
00:20:08,440 --> 00:20:10,440
I think after he passed, there wasn't clarity on some of that type of stuff.

516
00:20:10,440 --> 00:20:15,440
And I thought it was a wife versus some of his kids from maybe a previous wife or something

517
00:20:15,440 --> 00:20:16,440
similar.

518
00:20:16,440 --> 00:20:19,160
I remember it was, but yeah, there was some drama associated with.

519
00:20:19,160 --> 00:20:20,160
I know.

520
00:20:20,160 --> 00:20:21,160
Hey, so.

521
00:20:21,160 --> 00:20:22,160
Always something.

522
00:20:22,160 --> 00:20:23,160
Back to the cosmos.

523
00:20:23,160 --> 00:20:26,200
I've looked up this after the filter thing.

524
00:20:26,200 --> 00:20:29,520
It looks does look quite cool actually.

525
00:20:29,520 --> 00:20:32,520
And it says bad kids holders get priority.

526
00:20:32,520 --> 00:20:34,520
And we're all right.

527
00:20:34,520 --> 00:20:35,520
More bad kids holders.

528
00:20:35,520 --> 00:20:36,520
We are.

529
00:20:36,520 --> 00:20:38,680
I'm not a bad kids holder.

530
00:20:38,680 --> 00:20:39,680
You want one?

531
00:20:39,680 --> 00:20:42,000
You want to burn one right now?

532
00:20:42,000 --> 00:20:44,000
I don't want to burn one.

533
00:20:44,000 --> 00:20:45,000
I'll take one.

534
00:20:45,000 --> 00:20:46,640
Holy shit, man.

535
00:20:46,640 --> 00:20:50,640
I burnt maybe like 30 NFTs yesterday.

536
00:20:50,640 --> 00:20:51,640
I just looked at my wall.

537
00:20:51,640 --> 00:20:54,440
You didn't think that that was content for the show.

538
00:20:54,440 --> 00:21:00,600
I mean, there was fucking like all these Donald Trump NFTs and all those Joe NFTs that are

539
00:21:00,600 --> 00:21:01,600
fucking bored.

540
00:21:01,600 --> 00:21:03,600
I was like, burn, burn, burn.

541
00:21:03,600 --> 00:21:04,600
God.

542
00:21:04,600 --> 00:21:07,760
It's fucking kind of had lads as well.

543
00:21:07,760 --> 00:21:08,760
They need a good.

544
00:21:08,760 --> 00:21:11,200
Well, we burnt the kind of had one on the podcast.

545
00:21:11,200 --> 00:21:12,200
Yeah.

546
00:21:12,200 --> 00:21:13,200
But I still have lunch.

547
00:21:13,200 --> 00:21:16,040
I've got lunch as well.

548
00:21:16,040 --> 00:21:19,880
But the answer question was for to check to check what the right.

549
00:21:19,880 --> 00:21:20,880
I'm just going to go.

550
00:21:20,880 --> 00:21:21,880
I'm going to go.

551
00:21:21,880 --> 00:21:23,480
I'm going to go and look at Stargaze.

552
00:21:23,480 --> 00:21:28,920
Like you guys, you guys, sorry, this episode really is the group chat.

553
00:21:28,920 --> 00:21:31,560
I am actually going to go and look at stuff because I had no idea about it.

554
00:21:31,560 --> 00:21:33,760
So there's, I mean, we can talk to the only other.

555
00:21:33,760 --> 00:21:34,760
Okay.

556
00:21:34,760 --> 00:21:38,800
So the only other thing that I know has happened this week, which kind of funny is that Stargaze

557
00:21:38,800 --> 00:21:41,840
announced that they were going to do Dowdow or that.

558
00:21:41,840 --> 00:21:45,280
They were, they were the Dowdow was launching on Stargaze.

559
00:21:45,280 --> 00:21:49,600
And I was like, Oh, is that, is that like the outpost stuff?

560
00:21:49,600 --> 00:21:50,600
Right.

561
00:21:50,600 --> 00:21:52,920
Cause that's, cause that's, that's on the roadmap, right?

562
00:21:52,920 --> 00:21:57,800
For Dowdow is like launch the out the, cause the ICA functionality is coming soon and then

563
00:21:57,800 --> 00:22:01,280
outpost on them, on other cosmogen chains.

564
00:22:01,280 --> 00:22:06,160
And I think the two that are targeted first are Osmosis and Stargaze makes a lot of sense.

565
00:22:06,160 --> 00:22:07,160
Right.

566
00:22:07,160 --> 00:22:09,240
The original OG cosmogen chains.

567
00:22:09,240 --> 00:22:11,960
But I thought that it was all kind of bound up in mesh security.

568
00:22:11,960 --> 00:22:13,880
So it was like, Oh, that was kind of funny.

569
00:22:13,880 --> 00:22:19,840
And it turns out that like, I think the Stargaze were basically just for, for Dowdow and the

570
00:22:19,840 --> 00:22:20,840
Shio Lo again.

571
00:22:20,840 --> 00:22:23,600
And as far as I'm aware, Dowdow team don't have anything to do with it.

572
00:22:23,600 --> 00:22:26,760
So that was, that's my funny thing that I found out today.

573
00:22:26,760 --> 00:22:29,120
Anyway, I'm going to go, I'm going to look at this.

574
00:22:29,120 --> 00:22:31,120
I'll be back in a second.

575
00:22:31,120 --> 00:22:33,920
But with that, wait, go back before we leave the Dowdow thing.

576
00:22:33,920 --> 00:22:38,960
So but the, that the term that you use, but the idea is that, that you be able to IBC

577
00:22:38,960 --> 00:22:44,360
the use of Dowdow, be able to create a Dow structure and IBC the use across chains.

578
00:22:44,360 --> 00:22:45,360
Is that right?

579
00:22:45,360 --> 00:22:46,360
That's what that's what you're talking about.

580
00:22:46,360 --> 00:22:47,960
You said you need mesh security for that.

581
00:22:47,960 --> 00:22:48,960
Yeah.

582
00:22:48,960 --> 00:22:52,920
So, well, I don't think you need mesh, but I think the idea is that the mechanism will

583
00:22:52,920 --> 00:22:56,720
work better with them because, because then you're basically just cross-staking different

584
00:22:56,720 --> 00:22:59,400
assets and presumably that would be in a Dow treasury.

585
00:22:59,400 --> 00:23:00,400
I got you.

586
00:23:00,400 --> 00:23:05,680
So that Dow securing their own treasury, treasury, excuse me, presumably with a bundle of tokens

587
00:23:05,680 --> 00:23:11,600
rather than just their own asset, but I don't think it, I don't think it hard requires mesh

588
00:23:11,600 --> 00:23:16,320
security, but I, it will, I assume require the ICA stuff, which I don't believe has been

589
00:23:16,320 --> 00:23:17,960
launched yet.

590
00:23:17,960 --> 00:23:21,600
But somebody who follows, leaks Twitter a lot more closely could probably tell you,

591
00:23:21,600 --> 00:23:25,240
be like, bullshit, it's already been launched in which case, in the fair enough.

592
00:23:25,240 --> 00:23:30,280
But I think their general implementation model, I mean, we could literally fucking roll, we

593
00:23:30,280 --> 00:23:34,760
could literally go back and watch our episode, the Bong, the Bongrip episode, and I'm sure

594
00:23:34,760 --> 00:23:38,440
there would be some alpha in there about the exact time scale here.

595
00:23:38,440 --> 00:23:44,720
But from memory, it's similar to the Mars outpost strategy and it's still a little bit

596
00:23:44,720 --> 00:23:46,040
in the pipeline.

597
00:23:46,040 --> 00:23:50,520
But I gather it's, I gather it's soon.

598
00:23:50,520 --> 00:23:55,080
There's some kind of, there's some kind of additional library stuff that Zeke was doing

599
00:23:55,080 --> 00:23:58,720
that has a different name, which I gather is soon.

600
00:23:58,720 --> 00:24:01,320
And so, I mean, maybe knowing that scene, they ship a lot.

601
00:24:01,320 --> 00:24:04,240
Maybe it'll be this quarter or next, all of a sudden, in which case.

602
00:24:04,240 --> 00:24:09,200
And so, and then so the Stargaze team basically, they just forked it, like they're going to

603
00:24:09,200 --> 00:24:10,200
stand up.

604
00:24:10,200 --> 00:24:11,200
But I guess that would be.

605
00:24:11,200 --> 00:24:13,240
Yeah, that's my, that's my understanding.

606
00:24:13,240 --> 00:24:14,240
It's permissioned.

607
00:24:14,240 --> 00:24:15,240
It's permissioned.

608
00:24:15,240 --> 00:24:18,480
So they're not, they're not really standing up Dowdow, but they're, they're using the

609
00:24:18,480 --> 00:24:21,440
structure to create just the dowels that they need for Stargaze.

610
00:24:21,440 --> 00:24:26,800
I think I'm just going to, I assume just grab the wasms and deploy it all on, on Stargaze

611
00:24:26,800 --> 00:24:29,600
themselves and deploy the UI.

612
00:24:29,600 --> 00:24:32,880
Wouldn't you need, wouldn't you need, wouldn't it need to be, hmm.

613
00:24:32,880 --> 00:24:37,360
So the permission part of that with the permission, with the permission allow, could you basically

614
00:24:37,360 --> 00:24:41,560
run Dowdow as it is on Juno on Stargaze in a permission model?

615
00:24:41,560 --> 00:24:45,080
Or do you, or since those are, are those each one of those things a separate contract when

616
00:24:45,080 --> 00:24:46,080
they create a Dow?

617
00:24:46,080 --> 00:24:47,440
They are all separate contracts.

618
00:24:47,440 --> 00:24:59,520
So what the, the, I assume it's to allow NFT creators to create dowels around their NFTs,

619
00:24:59,520 --> 00:25:02,720
but yeah, that makes sense.

620
00:25:02,720 --> 00:25:07,120
I mean, I actually don't, I'm not really a hundred percent sure that it could work that

621
00:25:07,120 --> 00:25:11,720
well in a permission model, but, um, right.

622
00:25:11,720 --> 00:25:13,080
It's pretty, oh yeah.

623
00:25:13,080 --> 00:25:16,440
So Rama has just said in the chat presumably to use the NFT Dow portion.

624
00:25:16,440 --> 00:25:17,440
Yeah, exactly.

625
00:25:17,440 --> 00:25:21,720
I think that is the, so to create, right, to create permission groups based on NFT holders.

626
00:25:21,720 --> 00:25:22,720
Right.

627
00:25:22,720 --> 00:25:26,520
But then the difficulty there is that I think they'd have to modify, I think they basically

628
00:25:26,520 --> 00:25:38,000
have to modify their Wazim D from memory to allow you to launch contracts via just that

629
00:25:38,000 --> 00:25:42,440
contract, which requires some additional hooks.

630
00:25:42,440 --> 00:25:48,480
And at that point you're getting a little bit into T-Wazim territory rather than X-Wazim.

631
00:25:48,480 --> 00:25:52,160
I guess I understand the fork now because it's different.

632
00:25:52,160 --> 00:25:56,280
I guess I understand why that, why they wouldn't use it across Juno and all that kind of stuff

633
00:25:56,280 --> 00:25:57,280
right?

634
00:25:57,280 --> 00:26:01,560
I guess it's, it is a separate implementation that's pretty specific for that use, I guess.

635
00:26:01,560 --> 00:26:03,840
Well, what's all we're getting here?

636
00:26:03,840 --> 00:26:08,960
Well, it makes more sense to just use ICS-721 and just make the Dow in Juno because then

637
00:26:08,960 --> 00:26:11,960
you don't have to do any fucking about and it's all the codes is already written for

638
00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:13,600
you and just kind of works.

639
00:26:13,600 --> 00:26:17,280
But, um, but if they don't want to, but if they don't want to allow, well, if they don't

640
00:26:17,280 --> 00:26:21,920
want to allow NFT groups to be able to have a token based Dow or they want to have a membership

641
00:26:21,920 --> 00:26:24,440
based and they just want to be NFT only.

642
00:26:24,440 --> 00:26:29,200
I don't know how you, then you're basically adding to that structure to create rulesets

643
00:26:29,200 --> 00:26:31,960
that are restrictive versus what's available in Dow-Dow.

644
00:26:31,960 --> 00:26:32,960
Yeah.

645
00:26:32,960 --> 00:26:36,960
It kind of, I mean, it basically seems like quite a lot of a fat, like re-implanting the

646
00:26:36,960 --> 00:26:39,000
wheel to me, but you know, what do I know?

647
00:26:39,000 --> 00:26:41,000
I don't know what your plan is.

648
00:26:41,000 --> 00:26:45,200
I discussed earlier, I literally don't know how to do business or make money or journey.

649
00:26:45,200 --> 00:26:48,120
You know, whatever the fuck it, I don't even know how to be well.

650
00:26:48,120 --> 00:26:49,120
So, um,

651
00:26:49,120 --> 00:26:50,600
I don't know how to be well.

652
00:26:50,600 --> 00:26:53,000
That's, that's from my learning for the last 48 hours.

653
00:26:53,000 --> 00:26:57,560
Well, though, to be fair, again, um, today's episode gave me a notice that's sponsored by

654
00:26:57,560 --> 00:27:03,680
Albus oil, the natural remedy for, uh, no, it's not, but it, look, hey, look, if Albus

655
00:27:03,680 --> 00:27:06,360
oil, if you guys are listening, reach out to us.

656
00:27:06,360 --> 00:27:08,320
I will show the shit out of your product.

657
00:27:08,320 --> 00:27:09,320
It's fantastic.

658
00:27:09,320 --> 00:27:10,320
Don't use your babies.

659
00:27:10,320 --> 00:27:11,320
Just don't use it.

660
00:27:11,320 --> 00:27:12,320
Okay.

661
00:27:12,320 --> 00:27:17,320
That's the, just don't use that shit on babies.

662
00:27:17,320 --> 00:27:18,320
Um, cool.

663
00:27:18,320 --> 00:27:21,680
I thought we were supposed to, we had different, we had different sponsorship, right?

664
00:27:21,680 --> 00:27:23,200
What was the other sponsorship we had?

665
00:27:23,200 --> 00:27:24,200
Oh, heating oil.

666
00:27:24,200 --> 00:27:25,200
Yeah.

667
00:27:25,200 --> 00:27:26,200
What the fuck is that?

668
00:27:26,200 --> 00:27:27,200
Bring it on with that.

669
00:27:27,200 --> 00:27:28,200
I can't read that.

670
00:27:28,200 --> 00:27:29,200
I can't read it.

671
00:27:29,200 --> 00:27:30,200
I can't read it.

672
00:27:30,200 --> 00:27:38,320
And, uh, so what, what do you guys think about like actual just paid licensing for things

673
00:27:38,320 --> 00:27:39,320
like Dow Dow?

674
00:27:39,320 --> 00:27:40,560
Like, yeah, you can use it.

675
00:27:40,560 --> 00:27:43,280
You just got to pay us so we can continue to develop it.

676
00:27:43,280 --> 00:27:44,480
Like they have no other revenue.

677
00:27:44,480 --> 00:27:49,560
So like, is that an option or is that just like two taboo in the fucking, this decentralized

678
00:27:49,560 --> 00:27:50,560
world?

679
00:27:50,560 --> 00:27:51,640
That's what the token should be for, right?

680
00:27:51,640 --> 00:27:56,920
The token should be in order to, let's say create a Dow, then you need to buy, or maybe

681
00:27:56,920 --> 00:27:59,880
you need to burn a thousand Dow or something like that.

682
00:27:59,880 --> 00:28:00,880
Right?

683
00:28:00,880 --> 00:28:05,880
Like they need to develop some sort of tokenomics around the fact that you're using their product.

684
00:28:05,880 --> 00:28:06,880
Yeah.

685
00:28:06,880 --> 00:28:10,320
Or couldn't it be something like, wouldn't it, he's literally left.

686
00:28:10,320 --> 00:28:11,320
He's not even there.

687
00:28:11,320 --> 00:28:12,320
Yeah.

688
00:28:12,320 --> 00:28:13,320
He has a question that he bounced.

689
00:28:13,320 --> 00:28:15,320
He's like, all right, I did my part.

690
00:28:15,320 --> 00:28:16,320
I'm out of here guys.

691
00:28:16,320 --> 00:28:17,320
No, I couldn't.

692
00:28:17,320 --> 00:28:22,320
I'm out of here, it's just not fucking.

693
00:28:22,320 --> 00:28:27,320
That is, that is the level of respect we have to watch.

694
00:28:27,320 --> 00:28:31,840
But it's like, hey, you guys discuss this, but I don't really care about your business.

695
00:28:31,840 --> 00:28:34,560
And then he goes and grabs 2% milk.

696
00:28:34,560 --> 00:28:35,560
No.

697
00:28:35,560 --> 00:28:38,080
Do you drink 2% because you think you're fat?

698
00:28:38,080 --> 00:28:39,680
Because you could drink whole milk if you wanted.

699
00:28:39,680 --> 00:28:41,720
Wait, what's 2% milk?

700
00:28:41,720 --> 00:28:42,720
Full cream.

701
00:28:42,720 --> 00:28:43,720
Oh, wow.

702
00:28:43,720 --> 00:28:44,720
Okay.

703
00:28:44,720 --> 00:28:45,720
Wow.

704
00:28:45,720 --> 00:28:49,720
So, whole milk is, it's a red cap.

705
00:28:49,720 --> 00:28:52,400
2% is, is a full cream.

706
00:28:52,400 --> 00:28:56,360
In the UK, the weakest milk is red cap.

707
00:28:56,360 --> 00:28:57,360
It's really.

708
00:28:57,360 --> 00:28:58,360
Yeah.

709
00:28:58,360 --> 00:28:59,360
Yeah.

710
00:28:59,360 --> 00:29:01,640
The whole, the heaviest is gold cap.

711
00:29:01,640 --> 00:29:03,120
And then blue.

712
00:29:03,120 --> 00:29:04,120
I'm sorry.

713
00:29:04,120 --> 00:29:09,480
Did you just call me fat?

714
00:29:09,480 --> 00:29:11,760
It's a reference from Napoleon Dynamite.

715
00:29:11,760 --> 00:29:13,160
So yes, I did.

716
00:29:13,160 --> 00:29:15,400
God damn it.

717
00:29:15,400 --> 00:29:16,800
I mean, I really enjoyed your coffees.

718
00:29:16,800 --> 00:29:20,880
I wish you would come and be in my cupboard so I can just wake up in the morning and get

719
00:29:20,880 --> 00:29:30,160
a nice 50% whole milk, 50% oat milk, bloody baristed masterpiece as opposed to my like.

720
00:29:30,160 --> 00:29:31,160
What is that?

721
00:29:31,160 --> 00:29:32,160
Why is that?

722
00:29:32,160 --> 00:29:33,160
What did you do to that coffee?

723
00:29:33,160 --> 00:29:34,160
Fucking shit.

724
00:29:34,160 --> 00:29:36,400
It's like a half and a half.

725
00:29:36,400 --> 00:29:37,400
Why is it for me?

726
00:29:37,400 --> 00:29:41,560
It's like, it's just, it's instant coffee with milk in it.

727
00:29:41,560 --> 00:29:42,560
What do you want to do with it?

728
00:29:42,560 --> 00:29:47,440
So I've got like one of those, so you probably guys don't even know what I'm talking about.

729
00:29:47,440 --> 00:29:54,280
Over here we, so you guys, you put your drip shit into like a cup and then you put the

730
00:29:54,280 --> 00:30:00,360
creamer in there, this little fucking sachet of like high fructose corn syrup or whatever.

731
00:30:00,360 --> 00:30:05,960
There's like some sort of rocket fucking fuel that you put in there.

732
00:30:05,960 --> 00:30:12,440
Over here, the typical like, I can't be fucked to make anything nice coffee is you put your

733
00:30:12,440 --> 00:30:17,760
instant coffee is just like this powdered shit into a, into a cup and then like, it's

734
00:30:17,760 --> 00:30:18,960
like a, yeah, yeah.

735
00:30:18,960 --> 00:30:21,840
It's like this freeze dried stuff.

736
00:30:21,840 --> 00:30:27,720
And then you like two thirds fill your cup with hot water and then you just like top

737
00:30:27,720 --> 00:30:29,000
it up with milk.

738
00:30:29,000 --> 00:30:35,240
So it's like a third milk, two thirds water, swill.

739
00:30:35,240 --> 00:30:40,320
And so I've, I've got some actual good coffee making materials back here.

740
00:30:40,320 --> 00:30:44,560
That was just like it's a little bit hard to do on the poker.

741
00:30:44,560 --> 00:30:48,520
So I've got the grinder and like a thing called a mock-up hot that you put on the stove.

742
00:30:48,520 --> 00:30:51,560
A Schiltz Schiltz knows my vibe.

743
00:30:51,560 --> 00:30:54,680
And then, but I don't have like a milk steamer, right?

744
00:30:54,680 --> 00:30:56,640
So I've got like this milk froffer thing.

745
00:30:56,640 --> 00:30:58,320
It just spins around and heats it.

746
00:30:58,320 --> 00:31:03,120
And it like froths the milk a little bit and heats it up to put him there with your,

747
00:31:03,120 --> 00:31:05,880
with your espresso shot.

748
00:31:05,880 --> 00:31:15,080
So I did one day just out of curiosity, put just milk into my frother thing and then put

749
00:31:15,080 --> 00:31:19,000
the freeze dried coffee in that while it was spinning.

750
00:31:19,000 --> 00:31:20,000
It's actually pretty good.

751
00:31:20,000 --> 00:31:27,240
It's like a lot thicker, more rich sort of experience than this watered down fucking

752
00:31:27,240 --> 00:31:28,720
milk, swill shit.

753
00:31:28,720 --> 00:31:29,720
It did that.

754
00:31:29,720 --> 00:31:30,720
That sounds great.

755
00:31:30,720 --> 00:31:34,120
I'm trying to figure out why it's split 50-50.

756
00:31:34,120 --> 00:31:35,480
Like why is that foamed up?

757
00:31:35,480 --> 00:31:37,720
Is that because of the spinny piece?

758
00:31:37,720 --> 00:31:40,320
Oh, no, it's a gripper in the middle of the.

759
00:31:40,320 --> 00:31:41,320
Oh, okay.

760
00:31:41,320 --> 00:31:42,320
Oh, I missed it.

761
00:31:42,320 --> 00:31:43,320
All right.

762
00:31:43,320 --> 00:31:44,320
Okay.

763
00:31:44,320 --> 00:31:45,320
I'm my bad.

764
00:31:45,320 --> 00:31:47,640
On camera it looked like it was like a half and half or something.

765
00:31:47,640 --> 00:31:51,040
With like, you know, a black ring of fucking oil in the middle.

766
00:31:51,040 --> 00:31:53,800
No, I just, I didn't see the bottom.

767
00:31:53,800 --> 00:31:58,120
So it looked like it looked like it was just, okay, I get it now.

768
00:31:58,120 --> 00:31:59,120
Yeah.

769
00:31:59,120 --> 00:32:00,120
Okay.

770
00:32:00,120 --> 00:32:01,120
It sounds awful.

771
00:32:01,120 --> 00:32:02,120
Yeah.

772
00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:04,120
Interesting night last night.

773
00:32:04,120 --> 00:32:11,120
I had one AM wake up call for the say upgrade, the say Atlantic to upgrade.

774
00:32:11,120 --> 00:32:14,200
And then so I had three alarms set last night, right?

775
00:32:14,200 --> 00:32:17,320
I had one AM for the, for the say Atlantic upgrade.

776
00:32:17,320 --> 00:32:21,080
Then I had, I was hoping that went nice and quickly so I could get like a little bit more

777
00:32:21,080 --> 00:32:22,360
shut eye.

778
00:32:22,360 --> 00:32:27,200
And then I had two AM for the say, um, Validator call, right?

779
00:32:27,200 --> 00:32:32,520
And then I have like 530 AM for the, for the podcast cause I six 30 AM for the podcast

780
00:32:32,520 --> 00:32:38,200
cause it's now seven AM my time when we do the podcast, the group chat.

781
00:32:38,200 --> 00:32:43,240
And so anyway, the call wasn't at last night.

782
00:32:43,240 --> 00:32:45,240
Isn't the community called tomorrow?

783
00:32:45,240 --> 00:32:46,240
Yeah.

784
00:32:46,240 --> 00:32:47,240
Okay.

785
00:32:47,240 --> 00:32:50,720
So I'm like, I woke up, clicked the link and everything.

786
00:32:50,720 --> 00:32:51,880
I was just on the wrong day.

787
00:32:51,880 --> 00:32:56,400
I'm like waiting around for like 10 minutes for people to show up and I'm like, oh wait,

788
00:32:56,400 --> 00:32:57,400
check.

789
00:32:57,400 --> 00:32:58,400
They still not live.

790
00:32:58,400 --> 00:32:59,400
No, it's.

791
00:32:59,400 --> 00:33:00,400
It's not.

792
00:33:00,400 --> 00:33:01,400
Okay.

793
00:33:01,400 --> 00:33:02,400
Yeah.

794
00:33:02,400 --> 00:33:03,400
Holy shit.

795
00:33:03,400 --> 00:33:06,080
You guys, you're so stoked on it.

796
00:33:06,080 --> 00:33:08,600
I assumed it was live and you were making money on it.

797
00:33:08,600 --> 00:33:10,400
Like you're doing a lot of work for a testnet.

798
00:33:10,400 --> 00:33:11,400
I'm just saying.

799
00:33:11,400 --> 00:33:13,920
I mean, it's like a interesting testnet.

800
00:33:13,920 --> 00:33:18,400
It's like all the other tests nets are pretty benign because they're mostly vanilla, um,

801
00:33:18,400 --> 00:33:19,400
cosmos.

802
00:33:19,400 --> 00:33:20,800
I honestly don't know why they're testing them.

803
00:33:20,800 --> 00:33:23,560
They should just fucking launch it.

804
00:33:23,560 --> 00:33:24,560
Yeah.

805
00:33:24,560 --> 00:33:25,560
All right.

806
00:33:25,560 --> 00:33:29,800
I mean, they do have their custom modules that they need to test it.

807
00:33:29,800 --> 00:33:32,520
So anyway, uh, this is actually looking pretty good.

808
00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:37,720
If you guys looked at your, your misrate since you, um, since the upgrade, then what, why

809
00:33:37,720 --> 00:33:40,080
don't you just let, why, why were you getting up for that?

810
00:33:40,080 --> 00:33:43,880
Why didn't you just let Cosmoviris advisor do its thing and then trust it?

811
00:33:43,880 --> 00:33:44,880
Jesus.

812
00:33:44,880 --> 00:33:45,880
I mean, I haven't had a problem.

813
00:33:45,880 --> 00:33:48,000
You trust it until pager duty calls you.

814
00:33:48,000 --> 00:33:51,680
Hey, just trust it until pager duty decides to call you.

815
00:33:51,680 --> 00:33:53,880
Pager duty doesn't always wake me up though.

816
00:33:53,880 --> 00:33:58,320
So if there's a, if there's an event that I know I should be having one eye on, I just

817
00:33:58,320 --> 00:33:59,960
send an alarm to wake up.

818
00:33:59,960 --> 00:34:00,960
Wow.

819
00:34:00,960 --> 00:34:01,960
Do better.

820
00:34:01,960 --> 00:34:03,960
Do better, man.

821
00:34:03,960 --> 00:34:04,960
Seriously.

822
00:34:04,960 --> 00:34:09,560
Is there any page duty like extremely ladder something?

823
00:34:09,560 --> 00:34:10,560
Well, yeah.

824
00:34:10,560 --> 00:34:15,680
So you can set up so it can like call you, um, under certain escalation escalation conditions.

825
00:34:15,680 --> 00:34:16,680
Yeah.

826
00:34:16,680 --> 00:34:17,680
You can have dual sorts of nonsense.

827
00:34:17,680 --> 00:34:18,680
Yeah.

828
00:34:18,680 --> 00:34:23,080
Like I have for test nets, like my, my escalation policies way, way slower, right?

829
00:34:23,080 --> 00:34:24,680
Like, it's like call me tomorrow.

830
00:34:24,680 --> 00:34:25,680
Yeah.

831
00:34:25,680 --> 00:34:26,680
Yeah.

832
00:34:26,680 --> 00:34:28,800
So escalation for test nets is don't.

833
00:34:28,800 --> 00:34:29,800
Yeah.

834
00:34:29,800 --> 00:34:31,120
No, it's like 24 hours or something.

835
00:34:31,120 --> 00:34:34,280
Like it sends me an email and I have it in like the app and all that stuff, but I don't,

836
00:34:34,280 --> 00:34:37,200
I don't get like a phone call for a day.

837
00:34:37,200 --> 00:34:41,480
So here's a, here's an interesting comment from a badger bite.

838
00:34:41,480 --> 00:34:43,880
Why don't you trust Cosmovisor?

839
00:34:43,880 --> 00:34:49,720
Well, Mr. Badger bites, uh, back in the early days of Cosmovisor, you couldn't trust that

840
00:34:49,720 --> 00:34:50,720
shit.

841
00:34:50,720 --> 00:34:55,320
So it worked sometimes and then it didn't a lot of the time.

842
00:34:55,320 --> 00:34:57,480
And so we're all scarred.

843
00:34:57,480 --> 00:35:04,120
So I've been using Cosmovisor since 0.4.

844
00:35:04,120 --> 00:35:07,080
I thought it was one point.

845
00:35:07,080 --> 00:35:14,760
Oh, you've also had only on like four networks for some networks, they all like do the naming

846
00:35:14,760 --> 00:35:17,980
wrong and that'll cause Cosmovisor to fail even still.

847
00:35:17,980 --> 00:35:23,320
So like we still have to normalize all of our, all of our upgrade names because that

848
00:35:23,320 --> 00:35:26,480
is, that is because of poor fucking discipline.

849
00:35:26,480 --> 00:35:29,480
So he is capital.

850
00:35:29,480 --> 00:35:32,800
You're a fucking idiot.

851
00:35:32,800 --> 00:35:37,200
You should always, always normalize stuff to lower case.

852
00:35:37,200 --> 00:35:40,080
That is literally like, I can't eat.

853
00:35:40,080 --> 00:35:44,920
I had, I had a CTO once who was so fucking on it about that.

854
00:35:44,920 --> 00:35:50,520
He literally would not type capital letters in text messages ever because he was like,

855
00:35:50,520 --> 00:35:52,840
I don't want to see capital letters.

856
00:35:52,840 --> 00:35:57,040
You just, you never see a capital I from him ever in a text message in slack.

857
00:35:57,040 --> 00:35:58,040
That's great.

858
00:35:58,040 --> 00:35:59,040
That's hilarious.

859
00:35:59,040 --> 00:36:02,400
He was one of the most visionary technical people I've ever met or worked with in my

860
00:36:02,400 --> 00:36:03,400
life.

861
00:36:03,400 --> 00:36:08,760
So you're just like, he's eccentric, but he is like, right so much of the time that

862
00:36:08,760 --> 00:36:14,160
I'm going to allow this cause I suspect he might also be right on this as well, despite

863
00:36:14,160 --> 00:36:16,160
being a bit of a authoritarian.

864
00:36:16,160 --> 00:36:25,040
I believe in the latest Cosmo or Cosmos upgrade had a capital, right?

865
00:36:25,040 --> 00:36:28,800
And so they tell you to capitalize it, but Cosmo visor will underscore it.

866
00:36:28,800 --> 00:36:30,400
It'll normalize it down.

867
00:36:30,400 --> 00:36:34,560
So, so that, that, that badger is, is when it starts to fail.

868
00:36:34,560 --> 00:36:36,760
I do think that the misrate is lower.

869
00:36:36,760 --> 00:36:38,440
My stats say, I don't know if this is right.

870
00:36:38,440 --> 00:36:40,400
I'm just looking at, I can't really tell from thing.

871
00:36:40,400 --> 00:36:46,640
My stats say I was missing five blocks a minute over the seven day average on Atlantic two,

872
00:36:46,640 --> 00:36:50,120
but the database was pretty fricking large for part of that structure.

873
00:36:50,120 --> 00:36:52,960
But in the last hour, I've missed 2.37 blocks a minute.

874
00:36:52,960 --> 00:36:54,520
So it's about half or a little bit less.

875
00:36:54,520 --> 00:36:55,520
Yeah.

876
00:36:55,520 --> 00:36:57,640
So it does look like it's less, it does look like it's down.

877
00:36:57,640 --> 00:36:59,760
I'm not missing any blocks.

878
00:36:59,760 --> 00:37:02,260
Bullshit.

879
00:37:02,260 --> 00:37:04,200
My alleged is clean baby.

880
00:37:04,200 --> 00:37:09,240
It's, it's, I mean, literally it's, we're missing 15, 40 validators.

881
00:37:09,240 --> 00:37:12,680
Oh yeah, you gotta be missing something or it's not reporting correct.

882
00:37:12,680 --> 00:37:14,240
We're missing 15 out of 40 validators.

883
00:37:14,240 --> 00:37:15,240
What?

884
00:37:15,240 --> 00:37:16,240
Yeah, it bounces around.

885
00:37:16,240 --> 00:37:17,240
Uh, yeah.

886
00:37:17,240 --> 00:37:18,240
Mine, mine, mine too.

887
00:37:18,240 --> 00:37:19,240
Mine, mine too.

888
00:37:19,240 --> 00:37:20,240
Mine, mine too.

889
00:37:20,240 --> 00:37:22,600
It says there's 40 active miss right now.

890
00:37:22,600 --> 00:37:28,040
I'm missing, we're jumping between 10 and 14 missing consistently.

891
00:37:28,040 --> 00:37:29,680
What's this like per minute?

892
00:37:29,680 --> 00:37:30,680
Yeah.

893
00:37:30,680 --> 00:37:31,680
Yeah.

894
00:37:31,680 --> 00:37:34,840
If I get back, how long is the history on 10 to Judy?

895
00:37:34,840 --> 00:37:36,240
90,000, I think.

896
00:37:36,240 --> 00:37:37,240
Let me check.

897
00:37:37,240 --> 00:37:38,560
No, no, that's a little thing at the top.

898
00:37:38,560 --> 00:37:40,240
Maybe not a little tracking thing at the top.

899
00:37:40,240 --> 00:37:41,240
10,000, isn't that 10,000 blocks?

900
00:37:41,240 --> 00:37:42,240
Oh, that thing on top?

901
00:37:42,240 --> 00:37:45,720
I think it's based on your, your monitor itself.

902
00:37:45,720 --> 00:37:47,200
I think block pane is even in the thing.

903
00:37:47,200 --> 00:37:48,200
So block pane.

904
00:37:48,200 --> 00:37:49,200
I'll tell you.

905
00:37:49,200 --> 00:37:50,200
Do you mean on the little UI?

906
00:37:50,200 --> 00:37:51,200
Yeah.

907
00:37:51,200 --> 00:37:52,200
Yeah.

908
00:37:52,200 --> 00:37:54,720
I thought the UI was just like the last 100 blocks with 200 blocks or something, isn't

909
00:37:54,720 --> 00:37:55,720
it?

910
00:37:55,720 --> 00:37:59,120
So I've got full misses across that, uh, history on the UI there.

911
00:37:59,120 --> 00:38:00,120
Yeah.

912
00:38:00,120 --> 00:38:01,120
Okay.

913
00:38:01,120 --> 00:38:07,280
I mean, at, at, well, the block time right now is still half a second before the upgrade.

914
00:38:07,280 --> 00:38:09,640
Uh, what the fuck?

915
00:38:09,640 --> 00:38:11,200
Oh, it's block processing.

916
00:38:11,200 --> 00:38:12,720
Maybe I'm really focused.

917
00:38:12,720 --> 00:38:15,000
Oh, okay.

918
00:38:15,000 --> 00:38:17,280
So question to Ramar in the chat.

919
00:38:17,280 --> 00:38:19,280
Sorry, everybody.

920
00:38:19,280 --> 00:38:24,000
Um, I CS 999, which is kind of cool and interesting.

921
00:38:24,000 --> 00:38:28,640
And obviously we've had Larry on the show before talk about various things, but not this.

922
00:38:28,640 --> 00:38:36,960
Um, Ramar, you said, uh, 999 won't get mass adoption with a licensing model.

923
00:38:36,960 --> 00:38:41,880
It's still, to my knowledge, a draft spec, isn't it?

924
00:38:41,880 --> 00:38:44,960
Just a draft spec in a, in a hack MD document.

925
00:38:44,960 --> 00:38:47,600
It doesn't have a licensing model.

926
00:38:47,600 --> 00:38:49,160
Are you thinking of CWS DK?

927
00:38:49,160 --> 00:38:54,080
Cause that has, uh, uh, closed, a closed license possibly.

928
00:38:54,080 --> 00:39:00,080
Anyway, we'll wait for Ramar to back in.

929
00:39:00,080 --> 00:39:04,280
UK shows.

930
00:39:04,280 --> 00:39:07,880
So also the other thing that happened this week that I'm aware of is that you, sir,

931
00:39:07,880 --> 00:39:10,280
per, uh, gave a Ted talk.

932
00:39:10,280 --> 00:39:11,880
I did give a Ted talk.

933
00:39:11,880 --> 00:39:12,880
Yeah.

934
00:39:12,880 --> 00:39:13,880
It was fun.

935
00:39:13,880 --> 00:39:14,880
Pretty exciting.

936
00:39:14,880 --> 00:39:15,880
It's like available.

937
00:39:15,880 --> 00:39:16,880
Can I post the slides?

938
00:39:16,880 --> 00:39:17,880
I want to see the video.

939
00:39:17,880 --> 00:39:19,880
That's what I want to see.

940
00:39:19,880 --> 00:39:22,480
Oh, I think it was exciting.

941
00:39:22,480 --> 00:39:26,920
You'll have to post the slides because that, that, that link is on my phone and I don't

942
00:39:26,920 --> 00:39:27,920
know how to get it off.

943
00:39:27,920 --> 00:39:32,800
As I'm reliably informed, it was basically like the end of dead poet society where all

944
00:39:32,800 --> 00:39:38,400
the students got up and I stood on their desks and they all, do they salute or do they put

945
00:39:38,400 --> 00:39:39,800
their hand on their heart at the end of that film?

946
00:39:39,800 --> 00:39:40,800
I can't remember.

947
00:39:40,800 --> 00:39:42,600
I think they put their hand on the heart, right?

948
00:39:42,600 --> 00:39:46,200
They're all like captain, my captain to usurper.

949
00:39:46,200 --> 00:39:50,480
And he did that and shed a little tear, rubbed his eye and got a little bit emotional.

950
00:39:50,480 --> 00:39:56,080
And he was just like, he was like, I thought if I came here and I just, I touched one young

951
00:39:56,080 --> 00:40:02,120
adult, it sounds a lot worse when you put it that way.

952
00:40:02,120 --> 00:40:08,960
You know what I mean by just touch one heart, you know, with crypto.

953
00:40:08,960 --> 00:40:18,000
So I, yeah, so it was a Joshua Tan who is part of Validator Commons.

954
00:40:18,000 --> 00:40:22,360
Josh, Joshua is a great background in the house, but part of the Validator Commons group.

955
00:40:22,360 --> 00:40:28,960
He's, he, I think he is the, I don't know about his background, but runs a group called

956
00:40:28,960 --> 00:40:34,720
Metagov, I met them down at consensus cause we were at, at consensus last summer, we went

957
00:40:34,720 --> 00:40:38,840
to a cosmos governance conversation and it was pretty deep actually.

958
00:40:38,840 --> 00:40:42,680
And I met a bunch of people there and I met Joshua, then he's, he's here in town with

959
00:40:42,680 --> 00:40:43,680
me.

960
00:40:43,680 --> 00:40:47,120
And so we've, we've got out a couple, or one time and just be able to hang out a little

961
00:40:47,120 --> 00:40:48,840
bit and just get to know each other.

962
00:40:48,840 --> 00:40:55,480
And then he teaches a classic Carnegie Mellon and at CMU related to governance and a bunch

963
00:40:55,480 --> 00:40:59,480
of types of things within web three and they has a class right now.

964
00:40:59,480 --> 00:41:05,440
I think it's called, I don't know, governing many worlds, I think is what it's called.

965
00:41:05,440 --> 00:41:07,920
And it's a, it's like 12 weeks or something like that.

966
00:41:07,920 --> 00:41:13,000
And so one of this week, he asked if I would come in and talk a little bit around prop 16

967
00:41:13,000 --> 00:41:14,320
and so, and the Juneau world.

968
00:41:14,320 --> 00:41:15,960
And so there was a, there was three speakers.

969
00:41:15,960 --> 00:41:20,640
One was really, they were talking a little bit around bit, the Bitcoin soft fork that

970
00:41:20,640 --> 00:41:21,640
happened.

971
00:41:21,640 --> 00:41:24,600
They were talking, there's another group that came in to talk about, I think it was constellation

972
00:41:24,600 --> 00:41:28,360
at Dow to talk a little bit around the at Dow and then they want to talk a little bit

973
00:41:28,360 --> 00:41:29,360
around prop 16.

974
00:41:29,360 --> 00:41:33,400
So I did a little, I had to like, I was like, sure, yeah, at first I thought it was like

975
00:41:33,400 --> 00:41:38,000
a, just like more of a round table conversation.

976
00:41:38,000 --> 00:41:41,000
Then I realized that really I needed to do some education because nobody really knows

977
00:41:41,000 --> 00:41:42,240
too much about the cosmos.

978
00:41:42,240 --> 00:41:45,040
And so I just put together a little bit of a slides.

979
00:41:45,040 --> 00:41:50,200
I try to remember to go back and, and talk about the, the course of events and some of

980
00:41:50,200 --> 00:41:54,000
the things that, that we were thinking about from a validator perspective.

981
00:41:54,000 --> 00:41:57,560
I went back to school, listened to some of our prop 16 components within game of nodes,

982
00:41:57,560 --> 00:42:03,640
which is back like an episodes six, seven, eight, 10 somewhere in there and, and built

983
00:42:03,640 --> 00:42:08,160
a small deck just to like try to get the group understanding of what we were thinking about

984
00:42:08,160 --> 00:42:13,560
and kind of like more from a validator perspective of like, of this whole fucking disaster.

985
00:42:13,560 --> 00:42:14,560
And so it was good.

986
00:42:14,560 --> 00:42:19,800
Like it was just a 20 minutes kind of kept it tight around some of the information.

987
00:42:19,800 --> 00:42:23,800
I'm trying to leave them with some questions, you know, to kind of think about what's happening

988
00:42:23,800 --> 00:42:29,000
in the future and, you know, what do we learn out of this type of situation?

989
00:42:29,000 --> 00:42:30,000
So it was good.

990
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:31,880
They asked some good questions.

991
00:42:31,880 --> 00:42:37,200
Group asked some good questions and, and, and it was funny because like within, within

992
00:42:37,200 --> 00:42:42,600
the first few minutes of those questions, like the idea of like, does POS work?

993
00:42:42,600 --> 00:42:46,040
Like, is that going to survive?

994
00:42:46,040 --> 00:42:47,040
Came up pretty quick.

995
00:42:47,040 --> 00:42:48,560
Like the first like eight minutes of those questions.

996
00:42:48,560 --> 00:42:51,280
It's like, yeah, we've talked about that a little bit.

997
00:42:51,280 --> 00:42:52,280
So it was good.

998
00:42:52,280 --> 00:42:53,280
It was fun.

999
00:42:53,280 --> 00:42:55,720
We talked about that a little bit on game of notes.

1000
00:42:55,720 --> 00:43:01,560
Every Wednesday at 2100, UTC was what you say I said.

1001
00:43:01,560 --> 00:43:02,560
I did.

1002
00:43:02,560 --> 00:43:03,560
I did.

1003
00:43:03,560 --> 00:43:11,360
I left it, you know, I said, I said, you know, if you want, if you, you know, compared

1004
00:43:11,360 --> 00:43:15,240
to some of the other governance conversations, this prop 16 is like, it's a good use case.

1005
00:43:15,240 --> 00:43:19,360
Like it's a good conversation to have in the early days of, of trying to figure out what

1006
00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:26,320
the hell governance is in web three and the whole idea of having a small number of project

1007
00:43:26,320 --> 00:43:32,760
owners or core group that are decision makers and, and those types of things versus, you

1008
00:43:32,760 --> 00:43:36,960
know, the, the massive amount of delegators.

1009
00:43:36,960 --> 00:43:40,920
So in Twitter and Twitter fights and all that kind of stuff and kind of this idea on the

1010
00:43:40,920 --> 00:43:44,640
small group of people making decisions in a large group of community, who's trying to

1011
00:43:44,640 --> 00:43:48,960
understand what the hell's actually going on and, and just the inner fighting between

1012
00:43:48,960 --> 00:43:49,960
that and everything else.

1013
00:43:49,960 --> 00:43:53,640
I think it was a pretty interesting type of structure.

1014
00:43:53,640 --> 00:43:55,280
How cathartic was it for you?

1015
00:43:55,280 --> 00:43:57,880
I deliberately not, was it terrible?

1016
00:43:57,880 --> 00:44:02,160
I've tried not to think back on props and too much just because a little bit of PTSD

1017
00:44:02,160 --> 00:44:07,160
from that, but I imagine like having to go through and listen to videos and talking with

1018
00:44:07,160 --> 00:44:09,920
people and having to make a talk about it.

1019
00:44:09,920 --> 00:44:12,080
What I figured be cathartic as hell.

1020
00:44:12,080 --> 00:44:13,320
Yeah, it was, it wasn't too bad.

1021
00:44:13,320 --> 00:44:15,800
I guess it was, it was, it was good.

1022
00:44:15,800 --> 00:44:20,640
I actually, I spent some time with Freya on, on just to like make sure that my recollection

1023
00:44:20,640 --> 00:44:21,880
was correct, right?

1024
00:44:21,880 --> 00:44:24,440
Like these are things that happened in this order.

1025
00:44:24,440 --> 00:44:27,240
And I tried to stay away from some of the other things I knew that were happening behind

1026
00:44:27,240 --> 00:44:33,480
the scenes or that, you know, we found out later related to that and, and some of the

1027
00:44:33,480 --> 00:44:34,560
timelines of that.

1028
00:44:34,560 --> 00:44:40,240
So I, I tried to be very accurate in terms of just what the, what the, what the community

1029
00:44:40,240 --> 00:44:45,160
was thinking, what validators were thinking, you know, like I very specific around how

1030
00:44:45,160 --> 00:44:52,080
like I was pretty, pretty down on overall SDK governance processes, especially governors

1031
00:44:52,080 --> 00:44:56,920
or validators voting, non voting shares, which, you know, I've always been kind of a negative

1032
00:44:56,920 --> 00:45:01,520
around and how that fit into this as well, where really a validator had no right decision

1033
00:45:01,520 --> 00:45:02,520
in that structure.

1034
00:45:02,520 --> 00:45:05,760
Cause if they voted for immutability, you're kind of like, what the hell are we doing?

1035
00:45:05,760 --> 00:45:08,720
If you voted against it, you had to get a community up your ass.

1036
00:45:08,720 --> 00:45:10,920
So I talked about that a little bit.

1037
00:45:10,920 --> 00:45:15,680
We talked about the idea of like, of our validators responsible for the blocks that

1038
00:45:15,680 --> 00:45:16,680
they signed.

1039
00:45:16,680 --> 00:45:21,560
Um, and Joshua brought some, a couple case studies up where they have been responsible

1040
00:45:21,560 --> 00:45:25,760
for those blocks, um, which I, I was unaware of.

1041
00:45:25,760 --> 00:45:28,920
Um, and so that was actually, can we go back on that a little bit more?

1042
00:45:28,920 --> 00:45:30,080
I don't have the details.

1043
00:45:30,080 --> 00:45:34,400
Uh, he mentioned it, it would be in there, it would be in the recording, but there, there

1044
00:45:34,400 --> 00:45:36,800
was, I forget where that was.

1045
00:45:36,800 --> 00:45:43,920
Um, but there was in terms of both the jurisdiction of where the validator sat and those types

1046
00:45:43,920 --> 00:45:47,520
of things, but he can, you know, it might be something to have him, have him, have

1047
00:45:47,520 --> 00:45:50,120
those, somebody from Medigabond to talk about that a little bit.

1048
00:45:50,120 --> 00:45:54,640
Um, that'd be really interesting because I know that, uh, and on Bitcoin, I think there's

1049
00:45:54,640 --> 00:46:00,840
a link to child pornography or maybe there's child pornography on the chain itself.

1050
00:46:00,840 --> 00:46:06,520
So like, can you imagine being the person that are the validators that were that, uh,

1051
00:46:06,520 --> 00:46:09,640
post that block and then you'd be liable for it.

1052
00:46:09,640 --> 00:46:10,640
That.

1053
00:46:10,640 --> 00:46:11,640
Yeah.

1054
00:46:11,640 --> 00:46:12,640
Yeah.

1055
00:46:12,640 --> 00:46:14,520
We've talked about that look with, uh, IPFS notes too.

1056
00:46:14,520 --> 00:46:20,360
So IPFS notes, um, you know, we run some IPFS notes for Stargaze and, and you have some

1057
00:46:20,360 --> 00:46:24,200
controls over that, but you, I mean, you can control it where like, I'm only going to serve

1058
00:46:24,200 --> 00:46:29,240
items that are pinned and we pin everything, um, that comes through on the app and things

1059
00:46:29,240 --> 00:46:30,240
like that.

1060
00:46:30,240 --> 00:46:32,240
But there can be collections that aren't pinned.

1061
00:46:32,240 --> 00:46:37,560
And so you kind of want to allow, uh, you, you want to be able to allow some, uh, movement

1062
00:46:37,560 --> 00:46:41,720
of, uh, images that might not be pinned from a collection perspective that are still required

1063
00:46:41,720 --> 00:46:46,000
for the site, but that also means that you might be in, you might be in possession of

1064
00:46:46,000 --> 00:46:48,680
something that you do not want to be in possession of and you can't control that.

1065
00:46:48,680 --> 00:46:49,680
Right.

1066
00:46:49,680 --> 00:46:53,840
And so there's obviously there's blacklists for some, um, collections and things like

1067
00:46:53,840 --> 00:46:58,800
that, which is, which is pretty, um, it's easy to implement, but you, it's kind of like

1068
00:46:58,800 --> 00:47:00,560
mail spam, like how effective is it?

1069
00:47:00,560 --> 00:47:01,560
Right.

1070
00:47:01,560 --> 00:47:04,840
And so yeah, we've talked about that a little bit too, like what the hell are we doing?

1071
00:47:04,840 --> 00:47:07,320
Um, so anyway, it was a good, it was a good talk.

1072
00:47:07,320 --> 00:47:08,440
It was like 20 minutes.

1073
00:47:08,440 --> 00:47:11,080
Um, it was, it felt good to get, you know, go through some of that.

1074
00:47:11,080 --> 00:47:17,480
And I thought, uh, that the, like the, the overall, I just wanted to tell a story, right?

1075
00:47:17,480 --> 00:47:19,120
Is really what I was trying to do.

1076
00:47:19,120 --> 00:47:20,920
And I think that was at least effective.

1077
00:47:20,920 --> 00:47:24,120
And I thought that, um, everybody kind of understood the process of it.

1078
00:47:24,120 --> 00:47:30,280
Um, and I think as, you know, as the governance controls increase and as, um, you know, what's

1079
00:47:30,280 --> 00:47:34,360
being done within Dow, Dow and other types of things that kind of break down governance

1080
00:47:34,360 --> 00:47:39,360
into maybe little subgroups and other ways to be able to have more controls over that.

1081
00:47:39,360 --> 00:47:44,440
I think, um, you know, the idea of having, I think what we, some of the class ended up

1082
00:47:44,440 --> 00:47:49,320
was, was the idea of having something to be, can be mutable, meaning that chain can be

1083
00:47:49,320 --> 00:47:54,680
changed, uh, requires a level of governance that is extremely sophisticated.

1084
00:47:54,680 --> 00:47:58,800
And either you are running a code is law type of chain where it doesn't matter.

1085
00:47:58,800 --> 00:47:59,800
Right.

1086
00:47:59,800 --> 00:48:03,320
And even if it's wrong, even if there's fraud, it is what it is.

1087
00:48:03,320 --> 00:48:07,720
Or if it can be changed because of, because of this is the way it should be, and this

1088
00:48:07,720 --> 00:48:11,480
is right, um, not saying that this prop was, I'm just saying, if it, if it, something,

1089
00:48:11,480 --> 00:48:15,840
it needs to be changed, there has to be an incredibly amount of mature governance to

1090
00:48:15,840 --> 00:48:16,840
be able to do that.

1091
00:48:16,840 --> 00:48:20,720
Cause if it's just something that we went through with prop 16, it's, it's automatically

1092
00:48:20,720 --> 00:48:22,200
going to turn into a shit show.

1093
00:48:22,200 --> 00:48:27,160
So, um, and then that, that, that, you know, I think that might be just where, where we

1094
00:48:27,160 --> 00:48:33,000
are in the maturity of some of these tools and, and the, um, and, uh, the thought around

1095
00:48:33,000 --> 00:48:34,360
how this is going to work in the future.

1096
00:48:34,360 --> 00:48:36,400
So anyway, it was fun.

1097
00:48:36,400 --> 00:48:42,120
Did you talk at all about how around the conversation around how we as validators are in a sense,

1098
00:48:42,120 --> 00:48:45,240
um, kind of like continuously elected representatives.

1099
00:48:45,240 --> 00:48:53,120
Um, and the conversation around that compared to, um, teams delegating like their, their

1100
00:48:53,120 --> 00:48:56,040
first hundred validators and the active set or whatever.

1101
00:48:56,040 --> 00:48:59,080
Uh, I, I didn't talk about it from that perspective.

1102
00:48:59,080 --> 00:49:02,800
I, cause there, there is that like, I think we've talked about it too, like where it,

1103
00:49:02,800 --> 00:49:07,400
like there's some relationship here between Cosmos validators and like, like elected officials.

1104
00:49:07,400 --> 00:49:08,400
Right.

1105
00:49:08,400 --> 00:49:11,520
Cause, and even we had, remember, and we had, I forget what episode it was, but we also

1106
00:49:11,520 --> 00:49:15,800
had somebody came out who didn't even recognize that, that they could vote.

1107
00:49:15,800 --> 00:49:16,800
Right.

1108
00:49:16,800 --> 00:49:18,760
Remember that they didn't know that they could vote their own shares and like they thought

1109
00:49:18,760 --> 00:49:20,360
it was only with the validator.

1110
00:49:20,360 --> 00:49:23,880
Like that is a bad byproduct of, of this governance structure.

1111
00:49:23,880 --> 00:49:24,880
Right.

1112
00:49:24,880 --> 00:49:29,200
And that's something that, that, that individual should know, um, how their vote counts and

1113
00:49:29,200 --> 00:49:30,720
all those other types of things.

1114
00:49:30,720 --> 00:49:33,440
Um, so I didn't, I didn't bring it up from that perspective.

1115
00:49:33,440 --> 00:49:34,440
I didn't talk about that.

1116
00:49:34,440 --> 00:49:40,360
But I did talk, I did talk a little bit around that it, it creates that like validators market.

1117
00:49:40,360 --> 00:49:41,360
We all know that, right?

1118
00:49:41,360 --> 00:49:44,680
They're marketing for delegations and governance is a marketing tool.

1119
00:49:44,680 --> 00:49:45,680
Ultimately.

1120
00:49:45,680 --> 00:49:47,640
Like it's a marketing tool.

1121
00:49:47,640 --> 00:49:48,640
That's what it is.

1122
00:49:48,640 --> 00:49:51,960
So either you have validators who vote yes all the time or they tweet every single thing

1123
00:49:51,960 --> 00:49:57,680
out that they do, or they, you know, you have that fucking governance, larping on Twitter

1124
00:49:57,680 --> 00:50:02,400
around, um, you know, I'm doing this for you type of bullshit.

1125
00:50:02,400 --> 00:50:04,200
And all that is fucking garbage.

1126
00:50:04,200 --> 00:50:06,400
Like that's, that's, it's just a marketing tool.

1127
00:50:06,400 --> 00:50:12,040
And so when, when governance turns into a marketing tool, um, which it, it kind of core

1128
00:50:12,040 --> 00:50:15,880
is within the validator group, um, it, it becomes useless.

1129
00:50:15,880 --> 00:50:16,880
Right.

1130
00:50:16,880 --> 00:50:21,000
So, or at least it's because it becomes, um, it becomes less effective.

1131
00:50:21,000 --> 00:50:21,920
Right.

1132
00:50:21,920 --> 00:50:27,360
And I remember a little while ago, um, I woke up on the wrong side of bed and I, I won't

1133
00:50:27,360 --> 00:50:33,520
name, but a moderately big validator, they have staff, um, was posting his, all the stuff

1134
00:50:33,520 --> 00:50:36,440
we voted on this week and here's how we voted.

1135
00:50:36,440 --> 00:50:38,440
Um, and I just said, why?

1136
00:50:38,440 --> 00:50:40,440
Who gives a shit?

1137
00:50:40,440 --> 00:50:43,320
Why did you, why did you vote this way and this way?

1138
00:50:43,320 --> 00:50:44,320
Um, right.

1139
00:50:44,320 --> 00:50:49,200
Is that they're like param changes and they were like, well, we think this is great because

1140
00:50:49,200 --> 00:50:50,200
of the improved performance.

1141
00:50:50,200 --> 00:50:53,640
No, but why, why do you think it will do that?

1142
00:50:53,640 --> 00:50:54,640
What do you think?

1143
00:50:54,640 --> 00:50:55,640
What do you think is it?

1144
00:50:55,640 --> 00:50:57,680
Cause actually it's a positive and a negative to this.

1145
00:50:57,680 --> 00:51:01,000
So what, what, what convinced, what swayed you?

1146
00:51:01,000 --> 00:51:04,840
And they got very evasive and very funny.

1147
00:51:04,840 --> 00:51:06,200
And obviously I was being a dickhead.

1148
00:51:06,200 --> 00:51:09,880
I definitely got out there alongside, but I was just so fucking tight.

1149
00:51:09,880 --> 00:51:13,280
Like you just swing in and post like, here's the fucking eight crops we voted on this week

1150
00:51:13,280 --> 00:51:16,880
on Evmas and Osmo and Juno and shit.

1151
00:51:16,880 --> 00:51:18,480
And I'm just like, I literally don't give a fuck.

1152
00:51:18,480 --> 00:51:19,800
Like you haven't thought about these.

1153
00:51:19,800 --> 00:51:21,160
You don't give a fuck.

1154
00:51:21,160 --> 00:51:27,000
Um, like I'm more and more convinced that validators should actually just not be able

1155
00:51:27,000 --> 00:51:29,680
to vote and vote their own shares.

1156
00:51:29,680 --> 00:51:30,680
Literally.

1157
00:51:30,680 --> 00:51:31,680
Yeah.

1158
00:51:31,680 --> 00:51:32,680
Exactly.

1159
00:51:32,680 --> 00:51:33,680
You should be able to vote your own shares of validators.

1160
00:51:33,680 --> 00:51:34,680
That's it.

1161
00:51:34,680 --> 00:51:38,160
Like what you say, what you've compounded, but the, the, the problem comes because you

1162
00:51:38,160 --> 00:51:41,680
need to be quarrel to pass a software upgrade in cosmos.

1163
00:51:41,680 --> 00:51:46,680
So there has to be a backstop that means validators can force something through, but it's like,

1164
00:51:46,680 --> 00:51:48,960
again, I can have that in other networks.

1165
00:51:48,960 --> 00:51:52,360
You don't have that aptos in other places where it's just like, you know, the validators

1166
00:51:52,360 --> 00:51:58,240
all decide to run the software and it's either compatible or it's fucking not, but you do

1167
00:51:58,240 --> 00:51:59,640
not double sign.

1168
00:51:59,640 --> 00:52:00,640
So it's not an issue.

1169
00:52:00,640 --> 00:52:05,360
It's not like an existential issue for the validator to run the wrong binary.

1170
00:52:05,360 --> 00:52:10,320
If you run the wrong fucking binary, you look like a bit, you get a bit of egg in your face.

1171
00:52:10,320 --> 00:52:11,320
That's about it.

1172
00:52:11,320 --> 00:52:15,760
We saw, we saw Google do that this week and they were like, they're like, we're on this

1173
00:52:15,760 --> 00:52:16,760
version.

1174
00:52:16,760 --> 00:52:17,760
What could be going wrong?

1175
00:52:17,760 --> 00:52:19,880
It's all there is behind.

1176
00:52:19,880 --> 00:52:20,880
That's why it's failed.

1177
00:52:20,880 --> 00:52:25,480
And they're like, okay, well, I guess we need to upgrade.

1178
00:52:25,480 --> 00:52:30,040
I do love the, I do love the, uh, the, the new Kepler validator interface for voting,

1179
00:52:30,040 --> 00:52:31,040
the governance.

1180
00:52:31,040 --> 00:52:32,040
Have you guys used that?

1181
00:52:32,040 --> 00:52:33,040
Validator.cupler.app.

1182
00:52:33,040 --> 00:52:34,040
And, uh, I love it.

1183
00:52:34,040 --> 00:52:35,040
Like, I think it's great.

1184
00:52:35,040 --> 00:52:39,240
I think it's, it, it, our, our voting compliance has gone way up just because it's a nice UI

1185
00:52:39,240 --> 00:52:41,480
interface to OTHZ voting.

1186
00:52:41,480 --> 00:52:44,360
Cause I hate, I fucking hate voting via CLI with my ledger.

1187
00:52:44,360 --> 00:52:48,600
It's like, it's like the last thing I want to do and it's such painy ass and, you know,

1188
00:52:48,600 --> 00:52:49,960
you fucking lazy asshole.

1189
00:52:49,960 --> 00:52:50,960
I am, man.

1190
00:52:50,960 --> 00:52:51,960
It's fucking garbage.

1191
00:52:51,960 --> 00:52:55,760
And, and it's a, it's just not a great interface and it fails a lot and it's just painy ass.

1192
00:52:55,760 --> 00:52:59,080
And so you got to like schedule time to do it, but that, that, that interface is really

1193
00:52:59,080 --> 00:53:01,800
great set up OTHZ and like it's all in UI.

1194
00:53:01,800 --> 00:53:04,960
But what they did is they allow validators to put notes in there.

1195
00:53:04,960 --> 00:53:05,960
Right.

1196
00:53:05,960 --> 00:53:06,960
And so you can actually go to this website.

1197
00:53:06,960 --> 00:53:07,960
I don't even know where they show up.

1198
00:53:07,960 --> 00:53:08,960
They might, it might go to the mess.

1199
00:53:08,960 --> 00:53:10,520
It might go in the note, in the message.

1200
00:53:10,520 --> 00:53:11,680
I don't even know if they do or not.

1201
00:53:11,680 --> 00:53:12,680
Do you know?

1202
00:53:12,680 --> 00:53:13,680
No, no, no.

1203
00:53:13,680 --> 00:53:14,680
Okay.

1204
00:53:14,680 --> 00:53:17,280
Explicitly doesn't go in the memo, which I think is really fascinating.

1205
00:53:17,280 --> 00:53:20,440
It should go in the memo, but, but I love looking at these because what you have is

1206
00:53:20,440 --> 00:53:24,840
validators who literally take the two or three top lines of what the prop is and they put

1207
00:53:24,840 --> 00:53:25,840
it in the note.

1208
00:53:25,840 --> 00:53:29,440
Like we're totally for insert, insert details here.

1209
00:53:29,440 --> 00:53:30,640
Like they just shove it in there.

1210
00:53:30,640 --> 00:53:33,800
Like they're like, and steak Ceto is like the, I don't know who does it.

1211
00:53:33,800 --> 00:53:38,040
It's obviously not him, but whoever does theirs is hilarious because they always like take

1212
00:53:38,040 --> 00:53:43,600
whatever's in the prop and they put like flowers and like rainbows on it and fucking unicorns

1213
00:53:43,600 --> 00:53:44,600
and shit.

1214
00:53:44,600 --> 00:53:45,600
And they shove it in that note.

1215
00:53:45,600 --> 00:53:46,600
I just want to go, fuck you.

1216
00:53:46,600 --> 00:53:49,040
Like, like stupid fucking marketing bullshit.

1217
00:53:49,040 --> 00:53:51,560
Fucking garbage shit.

1218
00:53:51,560 --> 00:53:54,080
Steak Ceto is like, oh, it's so funny.

1219
00:53:54,080 --> 00:53:59,640
I'm not going to hack on him or anything, but you know, they appear to be towing the

1220
00:53:59,640 --> 00:54:00,640
party line.

1221
00:54:00,640 --> 00:54:04,400
It's, but it is like professionals that towing the party line.

1222
00:54:04,400 --> 00:54:08,480
But it's, it's such a like, it's like a, like if you pasted this, if you took this text

1223
00:54:08,480 --> 00:54:12,560
and shoved it into chat, GPT and just like, make this thing look like a rainbow, like

1224
00:54:12,560 --> 00:54:15,160
a unicorn, shit it out and give it in 20 words.

1225
00:54:15,160 --> 00:54:18,320
You just take that and you push it into this thing and put it on that website.

1226
00:54:18,320 --> 00:54:23,040
It is like such a, like, just like, this is fucking awesome.

1227
00:54:23,040 --> 00:54:24,200
And they always, they always laugh.

1228
00:54:24,200 --> 00:54:25,200
Oni's the same way.

1229
00:54:25,200 --> 00:54:28,880
Like they always, they always have like really funny descriptions that are in there that

1230
00:54:28,880 --> 00:54:32,320
are always like ridiculously over positive for what it is.

1231
00:54:32,320 --> 00:54:33,640
Like we, this upgrade's amazing.

1232
00:54:33,640 --> 00:54:34,640
Like just do it.

1233
00:54:34,640 --> 00:54:35,640
Let's do the upgrade.

1234
00:54:35,640 --> 00:54:36,640
I just said, just say yes.

1235
00:54:36,640 --> 00:54:37,640
So just say yes.

1236
00:54:37,640 --> 00:54:40,140
I can speak the opposite of it.

1237
00:54:40,140 --> 00:54:43,720
And then you'll write.

1238
00:54:43,720 --> 00:54:48,520
Erdeman is really funny because Erdeman is one of the members of lavender five.

1239
00:54:48,520 --> 00:54:52,480
And sometimes I get messages from people being like, Hey, why did you vote?

1240
00:54:52,480 --> 00:54:55,760
I mean, I see why you voted no, because you put it in Memo-In, but Erdeman will put in

1241
00:54:55,760 --> 00:55:00,520
like a big old essay on why he voted no and like really hard line.

1242
00:55:00,520 --> 00:55:02,480
And then someone will message me about like, what the hell?

1243
00:55:02,480 --> 00:55:03,480
Why'd you vote no on this?

1244
00:55:03,480 --> 00:55:07,320
And I'll be like, I didn't know, but I've read the reasoning.

1245
00:55:07,320 --> 00:55:08,320
It sounds like great reasoning.

1246
00:55:08,320 --> 00:55:09,320
So that's why.

1247
00:55:09,320 --> 00:55:10,320
Yeah, exactly.

1248
00:55:10,320 --> 00:55:11,320
It's in the fucking note.

1249
00:55:11,320 --> 00:55:12,320
Wait some more time.

1250
00:55:12,320 --> 00:55:13,320
Fucking asshole.

1251
00:55:13,320 --> 00:55:14,320
Yeah.

1252
00:55:14,320 --> 00:55:17,160
So I know I'm starting to slip like little asshole messages in my, just knowing that

1253
00:55:17,160 --> 00:55:18,160
they're not going anywhere.

1254
00:55:18,160 --> 00:55:19,160
They're not the notes.

1255
00:55:19,160 --> 00:55:22,680
I, I little, I slip little things like, fuck this prop.

1256
00:55:22,680 --> 00:55:26,520
Like things like that on certain things, just cause it's fun to be able to put notes

1257
00:55:26,520 --> 00:55:27,520
in there.

1258
00:55:27,520 --> 00:55:28,520
Fuck these guys.

1259
00:55:28,520 --> 00:55:29,520
If I'm killing Randy.

1260
00:55:29,520 --> 00:55:30,520
Fuck them.

1261
00:55:30,520 --> 00:55:36,200
So artifact, I think on steak, C toes operators also friends validator, just so I'm referring

1262
00:55:36,200 --> 00:55:37,200
to the chat.

1263
00:55:37,200 --> 00:55:38,200
Wait, what?

1264
00:55:38,200 --> 00:55:39,200
Really?

1265
00:55:39,200 --> 00:55:40,200
They're different people on they?

1266
00:55:40,200 --> 00:55:41,200
Oh, I don't know.

1267
00:55:41,200 --> 00:55:43,840
No, I don't think that's true.

1268
00:55:43,840 --> 00:55:47,520
I've seen, I've seen steak, Ceto folks posting in discord and they're different from the

1269
00:55:47,520 --> 00:55:48,520
friends validator people.

1270
00:55:48,520 --> 00:55:49,520
I think.

1271
00:55:49,520 --> 00:55:50,520
Are they?

1272
00:55:50,520 --> 00:55:51,520
Oh yeah.

1273
00:55:51,520 --> 00:55:52,520
They're definitely different people.

1274
00:55:52,520 --> 00:55:54,520
So I think they do run their own notes that aren't steak, Ceto though.

1275
00:55:54,520 --> 00:55:57,720
I can't remember what their team is called.

1276
00:55:57,720 --> 00:55:59,200
The state Ceto people.

1277
00:55:59,200 --> 00:56:00,200
Yeah.

1278
00:56:00,200 --> 00:56:01,680
I met them a very long time ago.

1279
00:56:01,680 --> 00:56:05,560
I met them in, oh, Shorts is going up.

1280
00:56:05,560 --> 00:56:07,200
It's loving an elevator.

1281
00:56:07,200 --> 00:56:12,200
I was trying to go down before when I was looking at all the mechanical shit down there.

1282
00:56:12,200 --> 00:56:14,040
I'm like, I can't figure that out.

1283
00:56:14,040 --> 00:56:15,040
Fuck it.

1284
00:56:15,040 --> 00:56:20,800
But yeah, I met, I met, I met the state Ceto guys in 2021 and somewhere.

1285
00:56:20,800 --> 00:56:21,800
I don't know.

1286
00:56:21,800 --> 00:56:22,800
I don't know.

1287
00:56:22,800 --> 00:56:24,720
Like we're running our own validator.

1288
00:56:24,720 --> 00:56:26,720
Like how, how hard is it to get delegations?

1289
00:56:26,720 --> 00:56:28,920
And I was like, surprisingly hard.

1290
00:56:28,920 --> 00:56:30,320
There's a lot of marketing involved.

1291
00:56:30,320 --> 00:56:32,320
You should get involved with the Ceto.

1292
00:56:32,320 --> 00:56:33,320
Yeah.

1293
00:56:33,320 --> 00:56:34,320
I don't have it.

1294
00:56:34,320 --> 00:56:35,320
I mean, they're, I don't have an issue with the operations.

1295
00:56:35,320 --> 00:56:38,760
I just, the yapping is like fucking relentless.

1296
00:56:38,760 --> 00:56:40,600
Jesus Christ almighty.

1297
00:56:40,600 --> 00:56:43,160
Like give it a goddamn rest people.

1298
00:56:43,160 --> 00:56:44,160
The Ceto York?

1299
00:56:44,160 --> 00:56:45,160
Yeah.

1300
00:56:45,160 --> 00:56:47,160
No, just not even, I mean, in general.

1301
00:56:47,160 --> 00:56:49,160
State Ceto is rather than York's, no?

1302
00:56:49,160 --> 00:56:51,160
Or I guess the current thing.

1303
00:56:51,160 --> 00:56:56,160
What's the difference in shilling and yapping on certain postcard?

1304
00:56:56,160 --> 00:56:59,400
I would throw out that it is who the audience is.

1305
00:56:59,400 --> 00:57:00,400
Yeah.

1306
00:57:00,400 --> 00:57:01,400
That's the favorite.

1307
00:57:01,400 --> 00:57:06,400
I mean, you know, upwards and you shill downwards is like down.

1308
00:57:06,400 --> 00:57:13,400
Shilling is like pushing down the yop upwards and you sh it's exactly what it is.

1309
00:57:13,400 --> 00:57:14,400
I'm just, that's good.

1310
00:57:14,400 --> 00:57:17,400
That's a good game of notes quote.

1311
00:57:17,400 --> 00:57:19,400
We put that on a t-shirt.

1312
00:57:19,400 --> 00:57:24,400
That's completely reframed how I see my corporate career.

1313
00:57:24,400 --> 00:57:26,400
Yop and just the arrows or something.

1314
00:57:26,400 --> 00:57:32,400
I certainly realized that I was only successful because I'm incredibly good at yapping.

1315
00:57:32,400 --> 00:57:34,400
Yop up and you shill down.

1316
00:57:34,400 --> 00:57:38,400
100% because you know, like, you know, every time you start a job in a big company, right?

1317
00:57:38,400 --> 00:57:43,400
The first thing you do is you work out, you find that person and you make friends with

1318
00:57:43,400 --> 00:57:45,400
them and you buy them a bit, right?

1319
00:57:45,400 --> 00:57:46,400
And they think you're a great guy.

1320
00:57:46,400 --> 00:57:50,400
After that, you're invincible and nobody can do fucking shit to you because if anybody

1321
00:57:50,400 --> 00:57:55,400
ever had the problem with you, the kind of disciplinary and like the person who was

1322
00:57:55,400 --> 00:57:59,400
the person who is the actual power behind the throne.

1323
00:57:59,400 --> 00:58:05,400
If somebody goes to them like Godfather style with a problem, they're like, but Godfather,

1324
00:58:05,400 --> 00:58:15,400
Frey has stolen my lunch money and he stole my lunch money and then he forced push to

1325
00:58:15,400 --> 00:58:18,400
main and he did all these things and it was terrible.

1326
00:58:18,400 --> 00:58:22,400
He's like, well, Frey bought me a beer once.

1327
00:58:22,400 --> 00:58:29,400
So therefore, that's not very good Marlon Brando pressure, but that is my Marlon Brando

1328
00:58:29,400 --> 00:58:30,400
pressure.

1329
00:58:30,400 --> 00:58:31,400
But that's basically what you do, right?

1330
00:58:31,400 --> 00:58:35,400
A big company is you you up to that person and then you're untouchable.

1331
00:58:35,400 --> 00:58:36,400
That's right.

1332
00:58:36,400 --> 00:58:43,400
So yeah, artifact is here today in the in the in the chat and isn't been in a while, but

1333
00:58:43,400 --> 00:58:46,400
he called me before and I'm like, yeah, I'm gone.

1334
00:58:46,400 --> 00:58:47,400
He's like, oh, that's on now.

1335
00:58:47,400 --> 00:58:48,400
I'll jump in.

1336
00:58:48,400 --> 00:58:49,400
Anyway, have him join.

1337
00:58:49,400 --> 00:58:51,400
What is he doing?

1338
00:58:51,400 --> 00:58:54,400
Hey, he's very fucking active in this chat.

1339
00:58:54,400 --> 00:58:55,400
I like it.

1340
00:58:55,400 --> 00:58:57,400
I know I love it.

1341
00:58:57,400 --> 00:58:58,400
Join us.

1342
00:58:58,400 --> 00:59:04,400
We tried to get artifacts on the show before, but he's it's like a 10,000 viewers face reveal

1343
00:59:04,400 --> 00:59:05,400
type situation.

1344
00:59:05,400 --> 00:59:09,400
I think it is face reveal at 15,000 people live.

1345
00:59:09,400 --> 00:59:12,400
So anyway, back to what I was saying.

1346
00:59:12,400 --> 00:59:18,400
I wanted to I wanted to shout out to artifact for having the fucking best merch in the cosmos

1347
00:59:18,400 --> 00:59:20,400
and what's your way.

1348
00:59:20,400 --> 00:59:21,400
That happens.

1349
00:59:21,400 --> 00:59:25,400
I'm wearing right now the artifact, the artifact merch.

1350
00:59:25,400 --> 00:59:26,400
Uh-huh.

1351
00:59:26,400 --> 00:59:27,400
You can show it off.

1352
00:59:27,400 --> 00:59:28,400
Yes.

1353
00:59:28,400 --> 00:59:29,400
Yes.

1354
00:59:29,400 --> 00:59:33,400
For folks on the podcast, you're we're seeing look.

1355
00:59:33,400 --> 00:59:39,400
You're seeing an awkward man try to take a squat backwards to show us a shirt.

1356
00:59:39,400 --> 00:59:42,400
It looks better than he makes it look.

1357
00:59:42,400 --> 00:59:44,400
It's better.

1358
00:59:44,400 --> 00:59:45,400
IRL.

1359
00:59:45,400 --> 00:59:50,400
Absolutely devastating.

1360
00:59:50,400 --> 00:59:59,400
So I had a pretty lengthy meeting the other day with the Commonwealth guys, you know,

1361
00:59:59,400 --> 01:00:01,400
like the Commonwealth.

1362
01:00:01,400 --> 01:00:02,400
I am good.

1363
01:00:02,400 --> 01:00:03,400
Yeah.

1364
01:00:03,400 --> 01:00:04,400
Yeah.

1365
01:00:04,400 --> 01:00:08,400
Before we continue, can I just say that I just thought of this and I think it's quite

1366
01:00:08,400 --> 01:00:09,400
funny.

1367
01:00:09,400 --> 01:00:12,400
Someone's gonna say it, but I think the road to hell is paved with good yorping.

1368
01:00:12,400 --> 01:00:13,400
They captured.

1369
01:00:13,400 --> 01:00:14,400
Did he?

1370
01:00:14,400 --> 01:00:16,400
Does anyone want to timestamp that one?

1371
01:00:16,400 --> 01:00:21,400
I'm not going to, but if you want to like, I've been time, I've been time stamping snippets

1372
01:00:21,400 --> 01:00:23,400
for, uh, for the shorts.

1373
01:00:23,400 --> 01:00:29,400
And so far they're all the Frey Frey on capitalization and Yorpe up and shield down.

1374
01:00:29,400 --> 01:00:31,400
That's good one though.

1375
01:00:31,400 --> 01:00:38,400
Um, so anyway, so they're, they're like doing, you know, some market sounding talking about,

1376
01:00:38,400 --> 01:00:42,400
you know, the features they're working on in there.

1377
01:00:42,400 --> 01:00:44,400
Um, what do they call it?

1378
01:00:44,400 --> 01:00:48,400
The roadmap for the next like a year or so.

1379
01:00:48,400 --> 01:00:53,400
Um, so they've just sent a link while we were on this chat.

1380
01:00:53,400 --> 01:00:55,400
Can I ask a question?

1381
01:00:55,400 --> 01:00:57,400
How do they make, how do they make money?

1382
01:00:57,400 --> 01:01:00,400
Oh, well, I had that same question.

1383
01:01:00,400 --> 01:01:04,400
So the, um, cause I'm like, how I don't fucking understand that kind of.

1384
01:01:04,400 --> 01:01:05,400
Yeah.

1385
01:01:05,400 --> 01:01:07,400
I made some, I made some notes while I was in the car.

1386
01:01:07,400 --> 01:01:13,400
So this, this conversation degenerated to me asking them questions and drinking whiskey.

1387
01:01:13,400 --> 01:01:16,400
It was like, it was midnight or something over in there.

1388
01:01:16,400 --> 01:01:22,400
They're both in New York, um, Mark and, um, got them forgetting the other, uh, Reese.

1389
01:01:22,400 --> 01:01:27,400
So Mark and Reese are in New York and they're like their, their, um, you know, community people.

1390
01:01:27,400 --> 01:01:32,400
Anyway, so talking to them and then I ended up drinking a heap of whiskey while we talked to them for like

1391
01:01:32,400 --> 01:01:34,400
probably two hours.

1392
01:01:34,400 --> 01:01:40,400
Uh, and, um, anyway, they raised to date, I think about $23 million.

1393
01:01:40,400 --> 01:01:41,400
What?

1394
01:01:41,400 --> 01:01:48,400
And yeah, they, they raised through like, you know, however they do that with start ups over in the States.

1395
01:01:48,400 --> 01:01:49,400
Well, they call it rounds.

1396
01:01:49,400 --> 01:01:51,400
I think they've done like two rounds.

1397
01:01:51,400 --> 01:01:54,400
They did like a $3 million round and a $20 million round or something like that.

1398
01:01:54,400 --> 01:01:56,400
They have a team of 20 people.

1399
01:01:56,400 --> 01:01:59,400
Hey, how are they going to return income?

1400
01:01:59,400 --> 01:02:02,400
Well, I asked that same question and.

1401
01:02:02,400 --> 01:02:08,400
Well, I don't, I don't know if I, um, I don't know if they gave me permission to talk about it.

1402
01:02:08,400 --> 01:02:17,400
So, so 23 million to, to what's the output of the $23 million for this, for this website that is a,

1403
01:02:17,400 --> 01:02:19,400
this fucking website.

1404
01:02:19,400 --> 01:02:23,400
No, I mean, is that the, is that the, is that the, I don't know the extent of the, I don't know.

1405
01:02:23,400 --> 01:02:24,400
That's the product.

1406
01:02:24,400 --> 01:02:25,400
Is that the product?

1407
01:02:25,400 --> 01:02:29,400
Is that the only product or is there, is there other things that come together in that?

1408
01:02:29,400 --> 01:02:30,400
No.

1409
01:02:30,400 --> 01:02:36,400
I mean, I don't know if they're their own product, but I mean, of course they're following like the, um, you know, the freemium model.

1410
01:02:36,400 --> 01:02:41,400
It's just like Reddit with like Web three theater on top.

1411
01:02:41,400 --> 01:02:52,400
Yeah, but obviously, you know, all these start ups, you know, start with a free product and then move into like some paid offerings or subscription things in the background.

1412
01:02:52,400 --> 01:02:59,400
Like, you know, they said that they're not going to be making any paid services to users.

1413
01:02:59,400 --> 01:03:00,400
Yeah.

1414
01:03:00,400 --> 01:03:03,400
I'm not making that fucking gospel, but that's what they told me.

1415
01:03:03,400 --> 01:03:07,400
It's more like, you know, they'll monetize on the back.

1416
01:03:07,400 --> 01:03:08,400
The capital model, isn't it?

1417
01:03:08,400 --> 01:03:12,400
It's going to be the past 300 fucking thousand dollars or you don't get exactly that.

1418
01:03:12,400 --> 01:03:13,400
Well, I mean, not for it.

1419
01:03:13,400 --> 01:03:20,400
There'll be additional features or something that you can, you know, pay more money, pay money for in the background on the back end with the block chain.

1420
01:03:20,400 --> 01:03:22,400
So the foundations or whatever.

1421
01:03:22,400 --> 01:03:25,400
So if you so want them, I guess.

1422
01:03:25,400 --> 01:03:29,400
It is a very short, I will say that. That's what I said.

1423
01:03:29,400 --> 01:03:35,400
So anyway, there is, I just, I posted in the chat there, the link to their roadmap.

1424
01:03:35,400 --> 01:03:42,400
And I told them, I said, the one fucking thing you need is a mobile first interface and a fucking app.

1425
01:03:42,400 --> 01:03:43,400
And it's not on the roadmap.

1426
01:03:43,400 --> 01:03:45,400
And then I just yelled at them in the chat.

1427
01:03:45,400 --> 01:03:48,400
I said, where's the goddamn mobile first in the roadmap?

1428
01:03:48,400 --> 01:03:50,400
And they said it's coming, I promise.

1429
01:03:50,400 --> 01:03:51,400
I wouldn't look at Reddit Reddit.

1430
01:03:51,400 --> 01:03:53,400
Their first round was one million.

1431
01:03:53,400 --> 01:03:59,400
That was from 2005 to 2012 for seven years of development.

1432
01:03:59,400 --> 01:04:05,400
And then they raised 50 million two years after that when they actually in 2014, when they really started hitting the stride, they've raised a billion dollars.

1433
01:04:05,400 --> 01:04:08,400
But I'm trying to understand 23 million on that.

1434
01:04:08,400 --> 01:04:11,400
They raised a billion dollars and made no money.

1435
01:04:11,400 --> 01:04:17,400
I'm trying to understand 20, the 23 million is a significant number for that, for that use case.

1436
01:04:17,400 --> 01:04:19,400
Like that seems excessively high.

1437
01:04:19,400 --> 01:04:28,400
I agree, especially whenever discourse, which in my opinion is a better medium for discussion.

1438
01:04:28,400 --> 01:04:34,400
If they just added in a Kepler integration or web through integration, then they would basically be there.

1439
01:04:34,400 --> 01:04:41,400
But I guess if they're going for web three first, which come out this, it's, I mean, it's a different value add, but nothing is sitting on coming with.

1440
01:04:41,400 --> 01:04:44,400
I think it's far superior to having nothing or having like discord.

1441
01:04:44,400 --> 01:04:46,400
I think it's a huge value add for networks.

1442
01:04:46,400 --> 01:04:50,400
Discourse was founded in 2012 to date. They've raised 20 million.

1443
01:04:50,400 --> 01:04:52,400
Wow, really?

1444
01:04:52,400 --> 01:04:54,400
What's that discord?

1445
01:04:54,400 --> 01:04:56,400
Discourse.

1446
01:04:56,400 --> 01:04:59,400
That's what that's what cosmos uses for their forums.

1447
01:04:59,400 --> 01:05:05,400
That's what secret uses a couple of other networks, even 20 million for discourse sounds ridiculous, but that's that's different.

1448
01:05:05,400 --> 01:05:08,400
Yeah, I don't really see how discourse makes much money either.

1449
01:05:08,400 --> 01:05:12,400
But I mean, that's the problem with web two, isn't that's what we're here to solve with web three.

1450
01:05:12,400 --> 01:05:15,400
And we're doing a fucking great job because none of the products we're raising.

1451
01:05:15,400 --> 01:05:18,400
None of the products can monetize themselves and survive.

1452
01:05:18,400 --> 01:05:25,400
So the SAI Foundation just raised, well, they just announced that they raised 30 million dollars as well.

1453
01:05:25,400 --> 01:05:28,400
For an $800 million total at this point.

1454
01:05:28,400 --> 01:05:30,400
Is it 800 million total?

1455
01:05:30,400 --> 01:05:34,400
No, I thought they were trying to get to that level. I don't think that's where they were.

1456
01:05:34,400 --> 01:05:39,400
I thought that that was that concluded the $800 million. That's what my read was.

1457
01:05:39,400 --> 01:05:44,400
If they have $800 million, then they have absolutely no business being on tandem.

1458
01:05:44,400 --> 01:05:48,400
So you start writing your own at that point. Time to fork out to us.

1459
01:05:48,400 --> 01:06:01,400
Sorry, if you have $800 million, you get over you call up Dr. Martin Clapman and you get you try and win him over.

1460
01:06:01,400 --> 01:06:04,400
You back up a dump truck of money into his house.

1461
01:06:04,400 --> 01:06:06,400
Well, he's the guy.

1462
01:06:06,400 --> 01:06:09,400
He's on the original Apache Afga people LinkedIn.

1463
01:06:09,400 --> 01:06:11,400
So I think he already has the dump truck of money.

1464
01:06:11,400 --> 01:06:16,400
He can afford to be an academic just just going like distributed systems.

1465
01:06:16,400 --> 01:06:18,400
Very clever guy.

1466
01:06:18,400 --> 01:06:26,400
Fun fact, I went during the peak of Prop 16 in the early hours of one morning while having a nervous bit of a nervous breakdown.

1467
01:06:26,400 --> 01:06:32,400
I emailed Dr. Martin Clapman asking him for career advice in the light of Prop 16.

1468
01:06:32,400 --> 01:06:38,400
He wrote me back a very nice email basically saying he didn't think there was much that any of this web three stuff was much cop.

1469
01:06:38,400 --> 01:06:44,400
And it wouldn't be for quite a long time because there wasn't any utility there compared to normal distributed systems.

1470
01:06:44,400 --> 01:06:46,400
Boys will be boys.

1471
01:06:46,400 --> 01:06:48,400
Yolo.

1472
01:06:48,400 --> 01:06:50,400
No, he's not elsewhere.

1473
01:06:50,400 --> 01:06:51,400
Gents.

1474
01:06:51,400 --> 01:06:54,400
Oh, well, I would clapman suggest, but I think I believe he's American.

1475
01:06:54,400 --> 01:06:57,400
So I don't think boys will be boys is in the lexicon.

1476
01:06:57,400 --> 01:06:59,400
Oh, oh, yes, it is.

1477
01:06:59,400 --> 01:07:00,400
Oh, yes, it is.

1478
01:07:00,400 --> 01:07:02,400
We're trying hard.

1479
01:07:02,400 --> 01:07:09,400
But if you have $800 million, anyway, you go to the CRDT's guy and you go, let's fucking go.

1480
01:07:09,400 --> 01:07:11,400
30 transactions is 30 K transactions a second.

1481
01:07:11,400 --> 01:07:13,400
Dr. Clapman, how do we do it?

1482
01:07:13,400 --> 01:07:19,400
Go reach into your network of brainiacs and find me the other researchers that can make this happen.

1483
01:07:19,400 --> 01:07:24,400
And then you you you you you cue the sound of beeping dump trucks.

1484
01:07:24,400 --> 01:07:37,400
Well, so I was reading about a distributed system, I don't know, last week or so about how you can scale a database such that databases on on like that are fairly far away.

1485
01:07:37,400 --> 01:07:52,400
You can like get rid of the the low optimization time or high optimization time, optimism time by allowing them to eat into each other's memory to read into each other's memory directly rather than having to deal with like any sort of interference.

1486
01:07:52,400 --> 01:07:59,400
And there was this, there's a lot of math involved and why that works basically zero knowledge proofs, but it was super super cool.

1487
01:07:59,400 --> 01:08:01,400
See if I can pull up that link for that.

1488
01:08:01,400 --> 01:08:14,400
But I imagine like that's that would be the end game for blockchain is finding some way to effectively do direct memory accessing for other systems or other nodes effectively to have instant finalization.

1489
01:08:14,400 --> 01:08:19,400
So that the back to the same thing real quick, they they raise 30 at a valuation of 800.

1490
01:08:19,400 --> 01:08:25,400
So they they valuation, which is easy in testnet.

1491
01:08:25,400 --> 01:08:27,400
But that's kind of where this is going.

1492
01:08:27,400 --> 01:08:32,400
But I think they if I remember they they raised 30 or 50 beforehand.

1493
01:08:32,400 --> 01:08:37,400
So they probably they probably raised, I would think they raised somewhere between 7500 million.

1494
01:08:37,400 --> 01:08:39,400
But they were a cosmos chain.

1495
01:08:39,400 --> 01:08:42,400
It's a sign it's a lot lot for a cosmos chain.

1496
01:08:42,400 --> 01:08:51,400
And at eight, literally at $800 million valuation when when I mean pre launch is pretty crazy.

1497
01:08:51,400 --> 01:08:53,400
Right. That's a that's pretty high.

1498
01:08:53,400 --> 01:08:57,400
I mean, not like $23 million for Commonwealth crazy.

1499
01:08:57,400 --> 01:08:59,400
It's maybe the same same ratio.

1500
01:08:59,400 --> 01:09:01,400
But yeah, so they raise at 800 million.

1501
01:09:01,400 --> 01:09:11,400
So so 30 out of 800 means they basically they let's see they paid $30 million for 3.7% of equity.

1502
01:09:11,400 --> 01:09:14,400
Which is that is eye-watering.

1503
01:09:14,400 --> 01:09:17,400
And that's not just the orbits or you're talking right.

1504
01:09:17,400 --> 01:09:21,400
Yeah. 3.7% 3.7% Wow.

1505
01:09:21,400 --> 01:09:25,400
Well, so 30 out of 800 3.7% of what if you raise it.

1506
01:09:25,400 --> 01:09:27,400
So they raise at $800 million value.

1507
01:09:27,400 --> 01:09:32,400
So $800 million value post money would be that you're if you're raising through 30 million.

1508
01:09:32,400 --> 01:09:35,400
That means you oath you own 30 million out of 800.

1509
01:09:35,400 --> 01:09:40,400
And so eight at that at 100 at in percentage is 3.75%.

1510
01:09:40,400 --> 01:09:42,400
So basically they're on the cap table.

1511
01:09:42,400 --> 01:09:46,400
They are paying $30 million to own 3.75% of outstanding shares.

1512
01:09:46,400 --> 01:09:49,400
And so you might have, you know, you might have founder shares.

1513
01:09:49,400 --> 01:09:53,400
You might have stuff that's going towards obviously to air drop into this and that and everything else.

1514
01:09:53,400 --> 01:09:57,400
But that means that they are acquiring you want to use tokens instead of shares.

1515
01:09:57,400 --> 01:09:58,400
You can do that.

1516
01:09:58,400 --> 01:10:04,400
So that means they have 3.75% of total tokens on the chain for 30 for 30 million.

1517
01:10:04,400 --> 01:10:06,400
Yeah. Okay. Wow.

1518
01:10:06,400 --> 01:10:09,400
Yeah. Wow is right.

1519
01:10:09,400 --> 01:10:14,400
Okay. So that's why you guys give so much or a shit about say it's because they're going to have to deliver something

1520
01:10:14,400 --> 01:10:21,400
because they have a lot of people with big money and presumably quite big sticks stood over their shoulder.

1521
01:10:21,400 --> 01:10:25,400
Yeah. Going where's our fucking software.

1522
01:10:25,400 --> 01:10:26,400
Right.

1523
01:10:26,400 --> 01:10:28,400
They have a pretty decent size team as well.

1524
01:10:28,400 --> 01:10:29,400
They do.

1525
01:10:29,400 --> 01:10:33,400
I mean, they are funnily enough that the marketing team is way bigger than the engineering team.

1526
01:10:33,400 --> 01:10:34,400
Imagine my surprise.

1527
01:10:34,400 --> 01:10:35,400
That's normal.

1528
01:10:35,400 --> 01:10:36,400
That's normal.

1529
01:10:36,400 --> 01:10:41,400
So it's normally grip say I would say it's normal and Web 2 as well.

1530
01:10:41,400 --> 01:10:42,400
That's my experience.

1531
01:10:42,400 --> 01:10:43,400
I've been at.

1532
01:10:43,400 --> 01:10:44,400
Oh yeah.

1533
01:10:44,400 --> 01:10:45,400
No.

1534
01:10:45,400 --> 01:10:47,400
The sales team is the biggest.

1535
01:10:47,400 --> 01:10:51,400
The marketing team is one overworked person who manages the Twitter account.

1536
01:10:51,400 --> 01:10:52,400
You're right.

1537
01:10:52,400 --> 01:10:53,400
I was kind of rolling them together.

1538
01:10:53,400 --> 01:10:54,400
Yeah.

1539
01:10:54,400 --> 01:10:57,400
So that actually they raised 5 million in August of 2022.

1540
01:10:57,400 --> 01:10:58,400
I don't even know if they raised something else.

1541
01:10:58,400 --> 01:10:59,400
Maybe I'm wrong on that.

1542
01:10:59,400 --> 01:11:01,400
Maybe this was the round that I was thinking of.

1543
01:11:01,400 --> 01:11:05,400
But this this round is a jump crypto distributed global multi coins in here.

1544
01:11:05,400 --> 01:11:06,400
I don't know if that's a yes.

1545
01:11:06,400 --> 01:11:11,400
I don't know if that's a flow traders hypersphere and Bixen ventures.

1546
01:11:11,400 --> 01:11:13,400
So yeah, it's pretty cool.

1547
01:11:13,400 --> 01:11:18,400
The mistake you are making with the marketing team versus the sales team there.

1548
01:11:18,400 --> 01:11:25,400
Short C is that the sales team York sell and the marketing team shield sell.

1549
01:11:25,400 --> 01:11:29,400
And that's a difference between Web 2 and Web 3.

1550
01:11:29,400 --> 01:11:30,400
That's right.

1551
01:11:30,400 --> 01:11:35,400
You call up the decision maker when there's a shirt and tie and you tell them how great

1552
01:11:35,400 --> 01:11:37,400
it's going to make them look great.

1553
01:11:37,400 --> 01:11:38,400
It's going to be amazing.

1554
01:11:38,400 --> 01:11:42,400
They're going to get a great bonus and would they like to play around a golf at some point.

1555
01:11:42,400 --> 01:11:49,400
And in Web 3 you post a load of rockets and moons and DJs make you rich.

1556
01:11:49,400 --> 01:11:52,400
And then everybody loses in the end.

1557
01:11:52,400 --> 01:11:55,400
I mean, 800 million in this bear is pretty fucking incredible.

1558
01:11:55,400 --> 01:11:56,400
That's all.

1559
01:11:56,400 --> 01:11:57,400
Yeah.

1560
01:11:57,400 --> 01:11:58,400
Yeah.

1561
01:11:58,400 --> 01:11:59,400
Like I mean, yeah, as well.

1562
01:11:59,400 --> 01:12:04,400
I mean, you could say, I mean, I mean, if you take the multiplication of how far this

1563
01:12:04,400 --> 01:12:11,400
market is down, at least in this ecosystem, say it's down what 40x 99.5%.

1564
01:12:11,400 --> 01:12:15,400
I mean, Juno's down 40x.

1565
01:12:15,400 --> 01:12:19,400
Osmosis is down what maybe 20.

1566
01:12:19,400 --> 01:12:21,400
I've never heard of it expressed like that before.

1567
01:12:21,400 --> 01:12:23,400
Whoever you want to say 40x.

1568
01:12:23,400 --> 01:12:25,400
Well, I'm meaning 40 times the current valuation.

1569
01:12:25,400 --> 01:12:29,400
So, I mean, you're talking at 800 million now.

1570
01:12:29,400 --> 01:12:30,400
That's crazy.

1571
01:12:30,400 --> 01:12:35,400
And I guess, I mean, if you're just to do with the end of tax year though, because presumably

1572
01:12:35,400 --> 01:12:39,400
a lot of these funds they have because when did the raise happen?

1573
01:12:39,400 --> 01:12:45,400
Because like if those funds, I don't know, if you want, but if they have funds, they

1574
01:12:45,400 --> 01:12:50,400
allocate for a given year and they need, they need or want to use them in that year.

1575
01:12:50,400 --> 01:12:51,400
Could that be it?

1576
01:12:51,400 --> 01:12:53,400
They're just like, there aren't that many other credible projects.

1577
01:12:53,400 --> 01:12:55,400
I mean, it's only, I mean, only raised 30 million.

1578
01:12:55,400 --> 01:12:59,400
It's not like it's incredible number, but the valuation is what's amazing, right?

1579
01:12:59,400 --> 01:13:04,400
Like what they, but maybe that's, maybe that's a normal, maybe that's a normal valuation

1580
01:13:04,400 --> 01:13:09,400
or a ratio evaluation for something in web three, because you're, you have a lot of

1581
01:13:09,400 --> 01:13:12,400
community stakeholders and you have drops and you have all this other type of shit that

1582
01:13:12,400 --> 01:13:14,400
you have valuation going out the door, right?

1583
01:13:14,400 --> 01:13:16,400
Do you remember Star Fox on the N64?

1584
01:13:16,400 --> 01:13:18,400
No, is it N64 or is it the Super Nintendo?

1585
01:13:18,400 --> 01:13:19,400
I think it was the Super Nintendo.

1586
01:13:19,400 --> 01:13:20,400
N64.

1587
01:13:20,400 --> 01:13:23,400
Well, it's the middle between you talking about the two of you.

1588
01:13:23,400 --> 01:13:24,400
Star Fox?

1589
01:13:24,400 --> 01:13:25,400
Yeah.

1590
01:13:25,400 --> 01:13:31,400
So do you remember how you would fight a boss and then halfway through it enter a new phase

1591
01:13:31,400 --> 01:13:34,400
and it would turn out the boss was like much bigger and tougher.

1592
01:13:34,400 --> 01:13:36,400
And what was his name?

1593
01:13:36,400 --> 01:13:37,400
Fox McLeod.

1594
01:13:37,400 --> 01:13:40,400
We just have, there'd be like a quip and you'd be like, oh fuck.

1595
01:13:40,400 --> 01:13:42,400
And you know, at this age, you're like 10 years old or whatever.

1596
01:13:42,400 --> 01:13:44,400
So you're like, oh my God, it's the mid 90s.

1597
01:13:44,400 --> 01:13:45,400
You know, things are different then.

1598
01:13:45,400 --> 01:13:47,400
And you're like, oh my God, this boss is so big and scary.

1599
01:13:47,400 --> 01:13:52,400
I feel like that is, that is everything the longer you spend in crypto, the more like this

1600
01:13:52,400 --> 01:13:57,400
valuation is that is where you learn a thing and you're like, huh, and then it's just like

1601
01:13:57,400 --> 01:13:59,400
this huge looming boss.

1602
01:13:59,400 --> 01:14:04,400
And you're like, oh, what I thought was true about thing is actually even more insane that

1603
01:14:04,400 --> 01:14:06,400
I had previously.

1604
01:14:06,400 --> 01:14:10,400
I feel that's like a weekly occurrence working in this space and I really haven't got used

1605
01:14:10,400 --> 01:14:14,400
to it, but it's very at least the Super Nintendo prepared me for the feeling.

1606
01:14:14,400 --> 01:14:15,400
Yeah.

1607
01:14:15,400 --> 01:14:19,400
Not only that, but I mean, even the, I mean, even these, the ventures that are putting money

1608
01:14:19,400 --> 01:14:22,400
in, well, I don't know if that's street money or if that's, if there are other things that

1609
01:14:22,400 --> 01:14:26,400
have been sold off in the past or whatever else, but even in this, even in this bear.

1610
01:14:26,400 --> 01:14:27,400
What is street money?

1611
01:14:27,400 --> 01:14:28,400
What does that mean?

1612
01:14:28,400 --> 01:14:36,900
Meaning like if, if, if a VC or if a, a firm like this might go out and do a round and

1613
01:14:36,900 --> 01:14:40,400
they're looking for individual investors to say, Hey, we're going to put a $200 million

1614
01:14:40,400 --> 01:14:41,400
round together.

1615
01:14:41,400 --> 01:14:46,400
They raise $200 million externally and then they're promising back a set of returns on

1616
01:14:46,400 --> 01:14:47,400
that.

1617
01:14:47,400 --> 01:14:50,800
And then that round they would take and do investments across a bunch of web three type

1618
01:14:50,800 --> 01:14:51,800
of structures, right?

1619
01:14:51,800 --> 01:14:53,400
Or it could be a mix of whatever they want to do, right?

1620
01:14:53,400 --> 01:14:54,400
Whatever that, whatever the focus is.

1621
01:14:54,400 --> 01:14:56,400
Like investments and to get.

1622
01:14:56,400 --> 01:14:57,400
Yeah.

1623
01:14:57,400 --> 01:14:58,400
Yeah.

1624
01:14:58,400 --> 01:14:59,400
I mean, that's what that's what VCs do, right?

1625
01:14:59,400 --> 01:15:02,400
They, they raise money from, from wealthy individuals and they put those into a fund.

1626
01:15:02,400 --> 01:15:04,400
They, they put a prospectus on that fund.

1627
01:15:04,400 --> 01:15:05,400
They put a timeline in that fund.

1628
01:15:05,400 --> 01:15:09,400
They invest in certain things and they hope that some of that stuff, you know, they hope

1629
01:15:09,400 --> 01:15:11,400
they don't wake up one day in concrete boots.

1630
01:15:11,400 --> 01:15:12,400
Yeah.

1631
01:15:12,400 --> 01:15:19,000
Well, this is just reminding me to, to always be careful about where you put your pension

1632
01:15:19,000 --> 01:15:20,400
if you manage it yourself.

1633
01:15:20,400 --> 01:15:22,400
Never in web three.

1634
01:15:22,400 --> 01:15:23,400
No shit.

1635
01:15:23,400 --> 01:15:27,400
But the idea, but, but here like they would, you, I mean, these guys, I mean, something

1636
01:15:27,400 --> 01:15:29,400
like multi coin, they're looking for, what are they looking for?

1637
01:15:29,400 --> 01:15:33,400
They're looking for one out of 20 investments to a hundred X, right?

1638
01:15:33,400 --> 01:15:37,160
Like multi, you know, multi kinds looking for a helium where they, you know, they put

1639
01:15:37,160 --> 01:15:41,160
in $2 million and they get 250 back, right?

1640
01:15:41,160 --> 01:15:44,160
And then the rest of that stuff, who gives a shit, whatever happens and they take, then

1641
01:15:44,160 --> 01:15:47,160
that goes out to the investors and they get a shitload themselves and they put that into

1642
01:15:47,160 --> 01:15:51,160
a, they roll some of that off into another fund and yeah, you know, you keep going, you

1643
01:15:51,160 --> 01:15:52,160
keep going.

1644
01:15:52,160 --> 01:15:53,160
So that, that's funny.

1645
01:15:53,160 --> 01:15:57,160
You know, the quote debate, the Matthew McCartney, he seemed for the beginning of the Wolf of

1646
01:15:57,160 --> 01:15:58,160
Wall Street there without even,

1647
01:15:58,160 --> 01:16:01,160
What do you let them do?

1648
01:16:01,160 --> 01:16:05,160
Do you let them take their money and scooch off?

1649
01:16:05,160 --> 01:16:06,160
No.

1650
01:16:06,160 --> 01:16:07,160
That's a great idea.

1651
01:16:07,160 --> 01:16:08,160
And of the stock.

1652
01:16:08,160 --> 01:16:09,160
That's right.

1653
01:16:09,160 --> 01:16:10,160
Yeah.

1654
01:16:10,160 --> 01:16:13,160
And they roll from fund A to fund B and you, you know, you keep putting down there, but

1655
01:16:13,160 --> 01:16:15,760
there's so much like, I mean, I don't know, whatever.

1656
01:16:15,760 --> 01:16:18,600
It's interesting that, but it's interesting that they, it's only 30, like I said, it's

1657
01:16:18,600 --> 01:16:19,600
only 30 million.

1658
01:16:19,600 --> 01:16:22,160
There's six, there's six groups in here or something like that.

1659
01:16:22,160 --> 01:16:24,160
So, but it is interesting that.

1660
01:16:24,160 --> 01:16:27,160
So it's probably like five, it will be different amounts for each one, but even at five million

1661
01:16:27,160 --> 01:16:29,160
group, those guys are fucking minted.

1662
01:16:29,160 --> 01:16:31,160
They can afford to throw five million at a punt.

1663
01:16:31,160 --> 01:16:32,160
Right.

1664
01:16:32,160 --> 01:16:33,160
Right.

1665
01:16:33,160 --> 01:16:35,560
But even at that valuation, at the valuation, like you're, I mean, you're paying a lot for

1666
01:16:35,560 --> 01:16:36,560
a small percentage, right?

1667
01:16:36,560 --> 01:16:38,720
So you're hoping that means 800 million.

1668
01:16:38,720 --> 01:16:43,060
That means like if you're, if you're one of these VCs, you want at least 10x, that means,

1669
01:16:43,060 --> 01:16:48,080
that means they're hoping that say, turns into an eight billion dollar valuation.

1670
01:16:48,080 --> 01:16:50,080
That seems doubtful, but.

1671
01:16:50,080 --> 01:16:51,080
Is my math right?

1672
01:16:51,080 --> 01:16:52,080
800 million times 10.

1673
01:16:52,080 --> 01:16:53,080
What do we know?

1674
01:16:53,080 --> 01:16:54,080
Like we keep it.

1675
01:16:54,080 --> 01:16:55,080
Is it that doubtful though?

1676
01:16:55,080 --> 01:16:56,080
No.

1677
01:16:56,080 --> 01:16:57,080
I mean, 80 million.

1678
01:16:57,080 --> 01:16:58,080
Wait, no.

1679
01:16:58,080 --> 01:16:59,080
Wait, 800 million times 10, right?

1680
01:16:59,080 --> 01:17:00,080
Is that what it is?

1681
01:17:00,080 --> 01:17:01,080
Is that 8?

1682
01:17:01,080 --> 01:17:02,080
Is that 8 million?

1683
01:17:02,080 --> 01:17:03,080
Yeah.

1684
01:17:03,080 --> 01:17:04,080
It is, right?

1685
01:17:04,080 --> 01:17:05,080
80 million times 10 is 800 million.

1686
01:17:05,080 --> 01:17:06,080
Yeah.

1687
01:17:06,080 --> 01:17:07,080
In actual billions.

1688
01:17:07,080 --> 01:17:11,800
So, but, but again, like to Noel's always point, just because it's, just because that's

1689
01:17:11,800 --> 01:17:15,000
what the value is doesn't mean that you can actually get that liquidity, right?

1690
01:17:15,000 --> 01:17:16,000
So.

1691
01:17:16,000 --> 01:17:17,000
Yeah.

1692
01:17:17,000 --> 01:17:18,000
Oh, fuck no.

1693
01:17:18,000 --> 01:17:19,000
Yeah.

1694
01:17:19,000 --> 01:17:22,440
So another thing also I want to bring it back to is like, you know, from your TED talk,

1695
01:17:22,440 --> 01:17:26,120
an interesting thing you touched on was like the need to give background because a lot

1696
01:17:26,120 --> 01:17:28,200
of people don't even know what the cosmos is.

1697
01:17:28,200 --> 01:17:33,880
A few weeks ago, whenever it was, I went to that academic or scientific blockchain conference

1698
01:17:33,880 --> 01:17:40,640
where the fuck it was and just sort of stood at the back like a fucking nerd, you know,

1699
01:17:40,640 --> 01:17:43,120
being like, what's this about then?

1700
01:17:43,120 --> 01:17:48,680
Completely completely out of my element as an actual degenerate being let into the ivory

1701
01:17:48,680 --> 01:17:52,240
tower somehow.

1702
01:17:52,240 --> 01:17:58,680
That was my overriding takeaway from that whole experience was that people didn't even

1703
01:17:58,680 --> 01:18:02,880
know that they could go and look up a use case and call it like.

1704
01:18:02,880 --> 01:18:05,920
So obviously there were a bunch of people that just like had no fucking clue basically,

1705
01:18:05,920 --> 01:18:11,320
but then the people who had done interesting work or interesting papers hadn't even thought

1706
01:18:11,320 --> 01:18:16,680
to look in cosmos for data or data points, not because the data points weren't there

1707
01:18:16,680 --> 01:18:21,440
or they didn't have the means to build custom stuff to find the data or a lot of the technical

1708
01:18:21,440 --> 01:18:22,440
people.

1709
01:18:22,440 --> 01:18:26,080
It was just because they literally did not know cosmos existed.

1710
01:18:26,080 --> 01:18:27,960
They maybe knew atom if you're lucky.

1711
01:18:27,960 --> 01:18:30,360
They had no fucking clue what IBC was.

1712
01:18:30,360 --> 01:18:31,360
Right.

1713
01:18:31,360 --> 01:18:32,360
Absolutely none.

1714
01:18:32,360 --> 01:18:36,360
I've heard of it and the people that I talked to you who literally worked in the space as

1715
01:18:36,360 --> 01:18:40,720
consultants and they just every time they'd released a finished consulting on launching

1716
01:18:40,720 --> 01:18:45,280
a project in web three, they tried to get an academic paper out of it because as a consultancy

1717
01:18:45,280 --> 01:18:47,880
it bolstered their credentials.

1718
01:18:47,880 --> 01:18:52,960
Even those guys, they were just like, yeah, I'm vaguely aware there might be some other

1719
01:18:52,960 --> 01:18:55,360
chains that are a bit like cosmos now.

1720
01:18:55,360 --> 01:18:56,360
It's kind of like polka dot, right?

1721
01:18:56,360 --> 01:18:57,360
Parachains.

1722
01:18:57,360 --> 01:18:58,360
Yeah.

1723
01:18:58,360 --> 01:18:59,360
It's kind of same thing.

1724
01:18:59,360 --> 01:19:04,040
Yeah, I mean, it's a protocol that's permissionless.

1725
01:19:04,040 --> 01:19:07,800
So anybody can launch a chain and then they just talk to the other chains and they're

1726
01:19:07,800 --> 01:19:09,560
like, oh, that's pretty novel.

1727
01:19:09,560 --> 01:19:10,560
Right.

1728
01:19:10,560 --> 01:19:14,160
You're like, yes, been alive for a little while now.

1729
01:19:14,160 --> 01:19:15,160
Yeah.

1730
01:19:15,160 --> 01:19:16,160
No bridges.

1731
01:19:16,160 --> 01:19:17,160
It's amazing.

1732
01:19:17,160 --> 01:19:18,160
Check it out.

1733
01:19:18,160 --> 01:19:21,600
But that's interesting because it's exactly the same as what you were talking about.

1734
01:19:21,600 --> 01:19:25,360
Just like that my overriding take away from that entire thing was literally nobody fucking

1735
01:19:25,360 --> 01:19:26,560
knows who cosmos is.

1736
01:19:26,560 --> 01:19:32,760
Well, even what we were talking about before, like the idea of having dow-dow with mesh security

1737
01:19:32,760 --> 01:19:38,160
across chains to be able to, like, even my head spins on that shit.

1738
01:19:38,160 --> 01:19:44,760
Like, how's that getting everybody's psyche around how that's going to possibly work around,

1739
01:19:44,760 --> 01:19:45,760
you know, polygonics?

1740
01:19:45,760 --> 01:19:50,400
It means you can get rugged from two.

1741
01:19:50,400 --> 01:19:51,840
You don't see before, right?

1742
01:19:51,840 --> 01:19:56,040
We were at this singular app chain where you could only get rugged by the price action

1743
01:19:56,040 --> 01:19:57,040
on one chain.

1744
01:19:57,040 --> 01:20:02,880
So now we're going to have like multi-party rugging where you're going to get rugged from

1745
01:20:02,880 --> 01:20:08,640
several different directions at once, possibly via multi-sig, which is obviously a big improvement

1746
01:20:08,640 --> 01:20:11,360
on the rugging scenario we had before.

1747
01:20:11,360 --> 01:20:13,560
That's what decentralized.

1748
01:20:13,560 --> 01:20:16,240
It sounds like a rug down is needed.

1749
01:20:16,240 --> 01:20:17,240
Rugged out.

1750
01:20:17,240 --> 01:20:20,240
Do you just make a rug down that rug?

1751
01:20:20,240 --> 01:20:21,240
That's right.

1752
01:20:21,240 --> 01:20:24,680
And it was like, I can't believe they rug.

1753
01:20:24,680 --> 01:20:28,120
We talked about that for, we talked about that for Game of Notes chain, right?

1754
01:20:28,120 --> 01:20:30,240
Like, we are going to rug you.

1755
01:20:30,240 --> 01:20:33,640
The question is, can you make money before that rugging happens?

1756
01:20:33,640 --> 01:20:34,640
And so...

1757
01:20:34,640 --> 01:20:36,440
I mean, can you time the rug?

1758
01:20:36,440 --> 01:20:38,000
No, you know it's coming.

1759
01:20:38,000 --> 01:20:40,840
Like, we're being very clear that we're going to rug everybody.

1760
01:20:40,840 --> 01:20:44,120
But in the meantime, we're going to have a massive APR so people can...

1761
01:20:44,120 --> 01:20:45,920
Wait, that's literally a podsy.

1762
01:20:45,920 --> 01:20:48,040
That's literally a podsy.

1763
01:20:48,040 --> 01:20:49,040
What's your explanation, sir?

1764
01:20:49,040 --> 01:20:50,040
Of course.

1765
01:20:50,040 --> 01:20:51,040
Of course it is.

1766
01:20:51,040 --> 01:20:52,040
Of course it is.

1767
01:20:52,040 --> 01:20:54,000
It's a mixture of technologies.

1768
01:20:54,000 --> 01:20:55,000
It's a rug, the podsy.

1769
01:20:55,000 --> 01:21:00,480
It's a podsy and a last man in the scam.

1770
01:21:00,480 --> 01:21:03,000
Is it a podsy if you tell people it's a podsy?

1771
01:21:03,000 --> 01:21:08,800
My favorite rug was definitely the Squid Games one where after like a week, people putting

1772
01:21:08,800 --> 01:21:13,880
money in, the founders rugged everyone because it's Squid Game and everyone was like, yeah,

1773
01:21:13,880 --> 01:21:14,880
okay, that's fair.

1774
01:21:14,880 --> 01:21:15,880
They're like, that's what happens.

1775
01:21:15,880 --> 01:21:16,880
Yeah.

1776
01:21:16,880 --> 01:21:17,880
Oh, you were serious.

1777
01:21:17,880 --> 01:21:22,880
Yes, you all did get rugged.

1778
01:21:22,880 --> 01:21:25,640
But do you remember when we...

1779
01:21:25,640 --> 01:21:30,960
This is going back to pre-Pocass even existing.

1780
01:21:30,960 --> 01:21:35,760
Without the rug component, said that we should launch a meme chain called Dozenwasm.

1781
01:21:35,760 --> 01:21:36,760
Oh, yeah.

1782
01:21:36,760 --> 01:21:37,760
Yeah.

1783
01:21:37,760 --> 01:21:38,760
I still want to be on Dozenwasm.

1784
01:21:38,760 --> 01:21:39,760
Dozenwasm, Dozenwasm.

1785
01:21:39,760 --> 01:21:42,640
I don't know how you pronounce that.

1786
01:21:42,640 --> 01:21:43,640
Maybe Dozenwasm.

1787
01:21:43,640 --> 01:21:45,680
And this is this pre-Kerberus.

1788
01:21:45,680 --> 01:21:46,680
This would have been...

1789
01:21:46,680 --> 01:21:47,680
This would have been...

1790
01:21:47,680 --> 01:21:48,680
It's pre-Kerberus.

1791
01:21:48,680 --> 01:21:49,680
Given when it would have been launched.

1792
01:21:49,680 --> 01:21:54,960
It would have been launched in January 2022.

1793
01:21:54,960 --> 01:22:01,760
So every time we even remotely look like we know what we're talking about, every time

1794
01:22:01,760 --> 01:22:04,960
we think, hey, I think I might be on top of things today.

1795
01:22:04,960 --> 01:22:11,640
Remember that on the group chat, we talked about a joke meme chain using Cosmosm called

1796
01:22:11,640 --> 01:22:17,600
Dozenwasm in January 2022 and launching it as a set of validators.

1797
01:22:17,600 --> 01:22:20,480
If we had done that, that would have been the most profitable thing any of us would

1798
01:22:20,480 --> 01:22:22,480
have ever done in our entire lifetime.

1799
01:22:22,480 --> 01:22:23,480
Oh, easily.

1800
01:22:23,480 --> 01:22:28,840
And we would have front run the massive boom in January to February by a few weeks.

1801
01:22:28,840 --> 01:22:34,680
We would have been there for the app chain explosion with a meme chain.

1802
01:22:34,680 --> 01:22:36,400
When did Chihuahua launch?

1803
01:22:36,400 --> 01:22:38,400
A little bit before that.

1804
01:22:38,400 --> 01:22:39,400
But it didn't...

1805
01:22:39,400 --> 01:22:40,400
Oh, that's right.

1806
01:22:40,400 --> 01:22:41,400
Yeah, it didn't.

1807
01:22:41,400 --> 01:22:42,400
Dang.

1808
01:22:42,400 --> 01:22:43,400
So, yeah.

1809
01:22:43,400 --> 01:22:45,400
So this is the thing.

1810
01:22:45,400 --> 01:22:48,800
I sometimes think about that whenever I think I might know something about anything.

1811
01:22:48,800 --> 01:22:53,040
I'm just like, yeah, the joke idea that we had and we didn't do because obviously it

1812
01:22:53,040 --> 01:22:58,360
was a joke would have been the most successful business venture any of us would ever do in

1813
01:22:58,360 --> 01:23:01,760
our lifetimes if we had gone through with the joke.

1814
01:23:01,760 --> 01:23:02,760
Welcome to Web3.

1815
01:23:02,760 --> 01:23:04,760
That's where we are.

1816
01:23:04,760 --> 01:23:06,760
Devastating, isn't it?

1817
01:23:06,760 --> 01:23:09,120
But what are you going to do?

1818
01:23:09,120 --> 01:23:14,760
I wonder if the market cap of Chihuahua is now more than Juno.

1819
01:23:14,760 --> 01:23:16,200
I checked and it is not.

1820
01:23:16,200 --> 01:23:17,200
I checked that last week.

1821
01:23:17,200 --> 01:23:18,200
Well, it might be now.

1822
01:23:18,200 --> 01:23:21,240
I haven't checked them last week because I was curious about that as well.

1823
01:23:21,240 --> 01:23:23,840
It hasn't gone down that much this week, has it?

1824
01:23:23,840 --> 01:23:25,840
Well, either Juno or Chihuahua.

1825
01:23:25,840 --> 01:23:31,360
Well, I mean, Juno is only down 98% from its peak, so it's still got a bit to go.

1826
01:23:31,360 --> 01:23:35,160
No, only 98% that's pretty good.

1827
01:23:35,160 --> 01:23:41,320
Now worth less than the likes of Comdex and Asset Man to like.

1828
01:23:41,320 --> 01:23:43,320
Asset Man to like.

1829
01:23:43,320 --> 01:23:45,040
Yeah, is it?

1830
01:23:45,040 --> 01:23:47,600
So Chihuahua was almost a penny a piece, wasn't it?

1831
01:23:47,600 --> 01:23:48,600
It was pretty close, wasn't it?

1832
01:23:48,600 --> 01:23:49,600
Like point?

1833
01:23:49,600 --> 01:23:51,400
Yeah, no, it hit a penny.

1834
01:23:51,400 --> 01:23:55,040
Probably worth less than Sentinel.

1835
01:23:55,040 --> 01:23:58,600
Have they done anything recently?

1836
01:23:58,600 --> 01:24:00,960
Is Sentinel still going?

1837
01:24:00,960 --> 01:24:03,120
Sentinel has, I don't think so.

1838
01:24:03,120 --> 01:24:06,000
The Sentinel team basically became say.

1839
01:24:06,000 --> 01:24:07,000
What?

1840
01:24:07,000 --> 01:24:08,000
No, no, I think.

1841
01:24:08,000 --> 01:24:09,000
Wait, what?

1842
01:24:09,000 --> 01:24:12,680
No, I thought it was just Dan that was part of that.

1843
01:24:12,680 --> 01:24:13,680
Is that so?

1844
01:24:13,680 --> 01:24:19,360
I know that, yeah, I'm not going to, if that's what you think, I'm going to run with that.

1845
01:24:19,360 --> 01:24:20,360
That's better than anything I have.

1846
01:24:20,360 --> 01:24:21,360
Well, I'm not sure.

1847
01:24:21,360 --> 01:24:22,360
Is it still running?

1848
01:24:22,360 --> 01:24:23,360
Sentinel?

1849
01:24:23,360 --> 01:24:24,360
Yeah.

1850
01:24:24,360 --> 01:24:25,360
Yeah.

1851
01:24:25,360 --> 01:24:28,360
And I thought, I thought, I thought actually D.D.O. was just a, was like a contractor on Sentinel.

1852
01:24:28,360 --> 01:24:30,240
I don't think he was actually founder.

1853
01:24:30,240 --> 01:24:32,720
I thought there was a different, that team is still around or something.

1854
01:24:32,720 --> 01:24:34,800
I think it is still running though, isn't it?

1855
01:24:34,800 --> 01:24:40,800
It's not in the archived section of MintScan, which is a newly minted section for the likes

1856
01:24:40,800 --> 01:24:41,800
of.

1857
01:24:41,800 --> 01:24:45,680
The new sad panda section of the selector section.

1858
01:24:45,680 --> 01:24:46,680
Amazing.

1859
01:24:46,680 --> 01:24:51,760
Yeah, for that.

1860
01:24:51,760 --> 01:24:55,120
So the token price is.00053.

1861
01:24:55,120 --> 01:24:59,640
Yeah, that's three zeros, five three for DVPN.

1862
01:24:59,640 --> 01:25:04,920
So they've gotten the treatment with the extra zeros on their dashboard.

1863
01:25:04,920 --> 01:25:09,320
And but the market cap is still like 6.8 million dollars.

1864
01:25:09,320 --> 01:25:10,840
So where do they, where do they show the market cap?

1865
01:25:10,840 --> 01:25:11,840
Where are you looking at?

1866
01:25:11,840 --> 01:25:15,160
It's just on the, on the default page, mintscan.io.

1867
01:25:15,160 --> 01:25:18,360
Oh, MintScan is not showing it for Chihuahua.

1868
01:25:18,360 --> 01:25:20,840
I was actually curious that you mentioned it.

1869
01:25:20,840 --> 01:25:24,280
Yeah, but there's like a hundred, a hundred billion tokens.

1870
01:25:24,280 --> 01:25:25,280
There's a hundred.

1871
01:25:25,280 --> 01:25:26,280
Isn't that right?

1872
01:25:26,280 --> 01:25:27,280
A thousand million.

1873
01:25:27,280 --> 01:25:29,480
Yeah, I think there's a hundred billion.

1874
01:25:29,480 --> 01:25:31,760
So just times all the zeros by a hundred billion.

1875
01:25:31,760 --> 01:25:32,760
Yeah.

1876
01:25:32,760 --> 01:25:34,280
Even, even, Clingo doesn't show a market cap.

1877
01:25:34,280 --> 01:25:35,920
I mean, they're burning a lot, right?

1878
01:25:35,920 --> 01:25:36,920
Is that why?

1879
01:25:36,920 --> 01:25:38,160
Because they're talking about the.

1880
01:25:38,160 --> 01:25:41,720
They probably don't have like a mechanism to show the actual supply.

1881
01:25:41,720 --> 01:25:43,200
Yeah, they must not.

1882
01:25:43,200 --> 01:25:44,200
Which is a fuckload.

1883
01:25:44,200 --> 01:25:45,200
Right.

1884
01:25:45,200 --> 01:25:46,720
There's too many zeros in the fucking.

1885
01:25:46,720 --> 01:25:48,800
They might just look it up from Janus's, maybe.

1886
01:25:48,800 --> 01:25:52,520
No, it keeps going up because it's, you know, minting new tokens every.

1887
01:25:52,520 --> 01:25:55,280
Oh, you mean current circulating supply.

1888
01:25:55,280 --> 01:25:56,280
Yeah.

1889
01:25:56,280 --> 01:26:01,560
So yeah, I guess maybe they don't want to show it because, you know, you don't want

1890
01:26:01,560 --> 01:26:05,000
people to know what it's the market cap might be potentially.

1891
01:26:05,000 --> 01:26:06,000
I don't know.

1892
01:26:06,000 --> 01:26:09,320
It's hollering at that 99.08 percent