and just make a million dollars or whatever. And you just like, the fucking scale is just so off.
You just get so fucking twisted.
Yeah, but that 20k is 20k here. And the other one is not here yet. And if it helps in the
future, like if it's a good thing for downstream, then yes. If it's not a good thing for downstream,
then no. I mean, yeah, probably. Like I say, I'm the fucking problem here. Like the chemistry fit is
that I am the problem. And that is just what I do in reference. I do references all the time for
people. But when I when people ask me for them, I give them names, I do not give them contact
numbers. And I say, Listen, I'm only going to ask this person to vouch for me twice a year. And
you need to you and I'm not sure if you're worth one of those two. So like, if that's so smart,
it's totally true, right? Because like, like if somebody's going to spend take time out of their
day and say, Hey, you know, like, Ryder does a good job and blah, blah, blah. Like that's a big
ask for somebody to take time out to do that, right? And like to be able to spend that time.
So I'm not calling in that. I'm not calling in that favor more than once or twice every year.
Like no matter what. And so prove to me that this opportunity is worth that call, because
otherwise I'm not going to waste their time. That's that's it in a nutshell, right? There's
some conversations where you're pitching somebody and there's some conversations where somebody
is pitching you, right? And yeah, it's difficult when the other party doesn't realize that they're
pitching you. Sometimes you have those conversations, right? And they're difficult,
because you're just like, Oh, well, that that that that's on you because because
maybe that's also an age thing because not not maybe that's maybe that's also
not you. Yeah, I've already said I have the problem. We just have a little possible doubt
that I have the problem in this situation. Welcome to Game of Nodes, a weekly podcast
from independent validator teams. Hello, and welcome to Game of Nodes, a weekly podcast from
independent validator teams still trucking in this, what are we, second year of persistent bear
market. We will keep broadcasting until price action continues. I was actually listening to a
a poddo earlier on essentially the continued degradation of living stands for the middle
class in Western economies, because obviously that's that's that's my kink. And there was an
interesting aside there, right, where they were talking to asset traders. And apparently, and
essentially, the thesis is very, very obvious, right, which is that when interest rates fall,
there are going to need to be because of it, because of increasing inequality, people are
looking for a place to put asset based wealth. And so there are going to be a variety of asset
classes that are going to benefit from that. So I mean, kind of like, I think Null was saying
this the other day, in fact, I feel like this is an, like, I, like, I'm not saying the Null
isn't clever, right? And doesn't, isn't correct quite bit of the time. But like, I was essentially,
I think what the story I'm trying to tell in a nutshell here is right. I was listening to
I was listening to a podcast with very, very clever people. And they said a thing that Null has
already said several times on this podcast. And I was like, huh, I haven't thought of that before,
even though I've been told it several times, and I was like, I was like, I should tell Null that I
have in the light of literally just listening to some experts reconsidered his thoughts on whether
or not there will be some kind of a bull run after interest rates change. Do you feel like you're
just talking to a ball of jello? I'm a slow learner. I mean, we've established this over time.
Now that we've talked, I've talked to someone or listened to someone that may or may not actually
know anything more than you. I actually can now be confirmed by someone I respect. Is it the
accent? I don't know what it's something, right? I'm just saying that like somebody who has a
British accent and a doctor. There's guys that's utterly more British, I'd better believe.
Yeah, they said some very specific targeted data points about about economies that I happen to
know something about, not Australia. And so I was like, Hey, okay, cool, this makes sense. I can
This gentleman didn't prefix his conversation with IMO.
He has that. Anyway, that's that. Yeah, well, you know.
So I mean, maybe we will be back, baby. Did anybody else see the insanity that happened
in the women's tour de France the other day? Isn't that over? Yeah, it's just finished.
It was the only sports I've heard of recently is break dancing in Australia.
What's your face? Oh, yeah, oh, Ray Gunn, man.
She's so fly. What's the story with that? So she was like a this is the first time that's
ever been in the Olympics, right? And also the last time, I think I believe that it is now being
canceled from the Olympics because it's dumb. Well, some somebody told me that somebody told me
that the host country gets to pick some sports or some some items that only that they can push
forward to be included. Is that what it is? Yeah, that's what I've been doing in last time. Yeah.
So break dancing like probably rather watch keg throwing like, yeah. Well, did you did you watch
the break dancing at the Olympics? Just just just really short. Just watch the replays. I watched
the women's final and I went into it being like, this could be fucking cringe. And okay, there
one thing was cringe, right? And I'm sorry, I'm fucking literally really old as well. So this
is like super lame. I'm like a man and I'm super old and like uncle. But one of the two ladies that
was facing off in the final was wearing like a little scarf thing. And I was like, that scarf
is kind of lame. This big cringe, whatever, I have literally no right to say that that was my only
that was the only thing. And but then they actually did the thing. And I was like, this is
actually really genuinely gymnastically quite fucking impressive. There was like this piece of
though they're doing they're like going to piece music. And there was like a really distinctive
like, you know, a lot of these things have like that kind of 808, like way it wasn't a 28. I mean,
it might have been an old school drum machine of some kind, maybe it's not important what
drum machine is. Don't get into that. Right. Come on. The point was that there was a syncopated,
you know, stab on the up as is very, very common in almost any breakbeat, hip hop, funk, soul,
blood of jazz, even tech metal, right? Very, very common to ride on the upbeat. And they were doing
like a thing where they were specifically moving their feet in a pattern that always kept one of
their feet on the down one of their feet on the up. And I was like, given that they're improvising,
that I mean, that's just that's attention to deal, man. Like I got to respect that shit. Like,
if you were a drummer, I mean, that would be a given actually, because you have to move your feet
in a particular because one is the hat, one of them is the kick, right? But ignore that I've
just said something really stupid there. It was just like very, very, very far than it needs to go.
It was just very, very, very gymnastic and very well coordinated. And I was like, fair enough
fucking respect. Like, it's just like watching a video of a really great drummer on YouTube.
And you're just like, damn, they're really killing this drum part. It's a different thing.
I don't know. I went into it having pretty high expectations to break dancing because I think
break dancing is really cool. And I actually took a break dancing class when I was in like fourth
grade. I'll have you know, in fourth grade. And yet you went to the limit this time ready to fight.
I know what happened. You're finally going to break good with that 20 years of practice.
What's right? That's I know. I'm ashamed. And yeah, I was I was let down. I've definitely seen
like random YouTube videos of some kid on the street. That's like six and a half pulling cooler
moves than what I saw at the Olympics. So are they doing like, are they doing like
other parades for Rachel gun at home or like what's going on down there?
There are no parades. No, I didn't. So she didn't get a point.
No, like she got 18 018 018 0 she got she got actually pulled she that's knocked out.
I believe she got like maybe some sponsorships and stuff though, like coming out of it. Yeah.
I think I think she's done pretty well out of it. That's just
yeah, it's total here. I don't know anything specifically.
She has like a PhD and she does. Yeah. Doesn't she?
Wow. And that breaks it. I think it's other girls. I mean, cultural studies and which is like,
okay, break dance. Like, you know, you hear I've heard just a bunch of stuff like
her husband ran the fucking, you know, competition or whatever that she had to win to
fucking get in the Olympics. Does a random shit like that. I don't know if any of it's true.
But that's just, you know, the words on the street that I hear, you know,
being an Aussie not watching the news ever because I fucking hate it.
So, you know, just random shorts on like YouTube or whatever that I might see
or someone talking near me. Oh, did you hear Reagan's fucking husband was running the competition
that she wanted to get into the Olympics? I'm like, you know, they give a fuck.
It's got some style and I'm over here. No one computer shit.
Yeah. Just got some style on there. So, yeah, you know, a bit of a bump in the prices, boys.
Just was doing something else over here and got distracted. And I noticed that there is
not insignificant rise in the prices overnight for me. Well, we cashed out some stuff the other day.
So that was jamming. Very due. Oh, you picked the bottom. Yeah. I do my part in a in a
market downturn. I sell my bags at the bottom for everybody else to be able to profit off.
It's very important somebody take the hit for the team. That's like, how much general policy on
that. Yeah. It's your it's your turn to, you know, take the hit before I hit last.
Right. I experienced shilty land last night getting woken up no less than eight fucking times last
night by the pager duty. I love, you know, one, one thing that seems to fuck me in the
been in this time zone is that people just love to fucking mess around with shit during the day
over in the States, which is my fucking nighttime. Nothing ever happens when I'm awake. It's always
when I'm asleep. They're like, Oh, fuck, Null's going to sleep. Let's fuck with this test net now.
Make it stop. Dude, he getting a walk. He getting woken up because of test net.
Ah, man, it's like, I gotta, I gotta make a new tag and then not get alerted from the tag. But
ah, dude, I barely even get alerts on test net shit. Please stop nerdnecking straighten
that back and next sit. Why are you so far away from the microphone when I do that?
Why have you got any notifications on a test net? Because yeah, responsible,
you know, you gotta have some notification. The node is fully stopped. That's it.
Not three years. That's what was happening. It's just stall warnings.
Yeah, but still, what it has to be a chain hold.
Do you want the X? What happened? Yeah, just kept fucking stopping last night.
Yep. Yep. Yep. Yep. Okay. Yeah, I'll get past. What were they doing?
Yeah. Look, man, I, I for for chains that we care about, I will care about their test
node as well. So yeah, but you probably get alerts, the same alerts on all test net nodes, right?
Yeah, I am going to put a tag. I'm going to put a tag. There's like, no, it's because
we're professionals like, but you have the important ones and the unimportant ones. No. Well, tag,
give a shit. sympathy level decreasing rapidly. Hashtag, give a shit. I have got a fucking list
of shit to do. And that should be on the top of it. He shows an empty piece of paper. I have a
four less. This is the back of the note pad. I can't show you the front of the note pad. The front of it says
battery fucking it, you know, salad, dildo batteries, fucking salad spork,
fashion salad spork out of yardstick. No, it's in those are classic mnemonic words on they like
alarm, salad, battery, whatever party. The joke was you turn around the fucking pad and your
mnemonics on it. There we are. Sorry. Fuck it. I'm tired. I trouble. Oh, the mnemonic right.
There we go. Right. Okay. Happy days. Jesus. Anyway, what is nerdnecking? Is it? Is this nerdnecking?
I don't know. It's a new term. I didn't know that. Apparently you're nerdnecking. It's happening.
I, there's there's no, I need, there's no real way to have my mic boom thing on this table,
the way it's set up. So I've got it on like a stand and how do you have the edge? Do you have an edge
of a table? Tables got four edges. Yeah. Yeah. So you can put a, you can put a boom. Yeah. But then
it's constantly in my way. I've got a wall right next to it. So it can't let me show you this.
Going to blow your mind. Right. One second. Fuck that seemed to have taken a lot of effort to move.
It did. Those who are listening, the Frage is very slowly fucking moved his camera off the scene.
Boom mic. Well, so the only reason I had to move it slowly is because as established,
I'm in the loft, right? And if you move it quickly, all that happens is you take another
chip out of the paintwork. They're all above my desk here from all of like stuff. You just,
you know, when you put your laptop on the stand and you get, you get back from the office and you
just stuff the laptop on the stand, but you're not very careful. You just whack the wall.
There's literally, there's literally a dent in the wall here, which is my not being very
fucking careful with my laptop stand. And there's like the corner of the MacBook is literally almost
like, and it's kind of like discolored from the, the plaster, I guess it's like, it's fucked anyway.
And so I just trying to be a bit, I was trying to be a bit careful rather than just go like smack
in one go and just take another fucking chunk out of the ceiling. Like it's already missing chunks.
I assume there's dramatic effect. Like you already have to do some repair. Why not do a lot of repair?
Yeah, probably true. I didn't need to, I didn't need to fix a little hole there as well,
which I caused by just, you know, when you go like that and you're not paying attention,
I just like punched the fucking ceiling, hurt my hand and somehow I actually dislodged a bit of the
thingy. You're really feeling within touching space? Yeah, he's in the attic. He's in the
fucking attic. Wow. I mean, I know that. I just didn't realize that it was like,
knowing how tall you are, I didn't realize you would have to enter that, enter it like
hunting, like crawling forward. Oh yeah, just realized you don't, you've not,
you've not seen my house. So this doesn't make, in fact, none of you have. So this doesn't make
any sense. But yeah, the laptop here is literally, so that I'm now touching the wall and touching the
top of the laptop. It's the mirror of what we see behind you. Yeah. So it's like the wall comes
down here just behind the laptop. And the desk comes like way out. So like, the perspective is
super weird because of the wide angle camera, but there's, there's like, I don't know, two foot
between the camera and me. So it's like, it's a way bigger space than it looks like, but the
laptop is proper jammed right up in the corner. So is it a cathedral, cathedral ceiling where it
just goes like arcs, like an A frame all the way up, or does it level out at some point to a flat
top? It's just, it's just a peak roof. It's a classic European. It is literally the rafters
aligned to make a ceiling. Yeah. Hopefully it's got some, yeah. Well, I mean, exactly the beam,
the beam is behind the plaster just here, I guess. The rafters. The rafters. No, the rafters,
well, I thought the rafters are the cross beams, not the support beams. Those bits are the rafters.
Are they? I always thought they were the, the crossy ones. The joists, the ceiling joists.
Well, the joists are under the floor, aren't they? Well, they're floor joists when there's floor on
there. Yeah, okay. Yeah. Yeah. All right. We're agree. We're agree. Yeah. Yeah. It's cool.
The building podcast. So funky says you can also turn up the game on your mic and funky,
you don't want that. If I turn up the game, game on my mic, you're just going to hear echoes. So
when they'll came, it's not that kind of like you have to be like around it. Anyway, sorry,
you're fucking wrong. It's a proximity microphone, right? It's a broadcast mic, right?
Yeah, broadcast. And, you know, I've got the studios. So if, you know, if you turn up the
game too much, you're going to hear an echo from those, I guess. Yeah. I mean, you could get,
I guess the other way of doing it would be to like get a pop shield and a cadenza and then you
could, you could then bring down the background noise. Well, okay, we're over complicating
things at this point. Sorry. What you should do is buy a boom. I own one. It's on the table back
there. Well, then unpack it and set it up, my good man. Do you want me to do that right now?
Yeah. Yeah. We're sitting here. What else? We got a little stuck about.
I mean, get on that. Well, there's a bunch of news and obviously, you know, well, none of you
seen the tour de France. So, you know, it's, it's, it was really close. It was down to four
seconds. Like grand tours don't come down to four seconds. That's crazy stuff. Nobody cares.
You said that. It's very important. It was, it was lost by the favourite because their team
betrayed them. What do you mean? Well, they, they, they had a minor crash and their team didn't go
back for them to bring them back to the peloton. They lost a minute and that's the difference
between winning and losing. So, you mean like the support truck? Like the other riders.
Why would, what would the other riders do? What does that mean? Yeah. Well,
you're, if you're, if your leader goes down, the other riders on your team,
stop whatever the fuck they're doing. If they're like in contention to win a stage or something,
they stop what they're doing. They go back to do what? Get the leader and fucking get riden.
Like they swap bikes or something. What do you mean? Well, you, you, you, you basically do a,
do a multi person uptime trial to get them back to the peloton because the peloton is moving at
60 kilometers an hour and an individual rider can do 40, 50. Oh, you mean like, like to, to be,
like where they do the thing where they in the row and then they have the,
it's me in the back goes to the front and like you just draft to get like to increase speed.
Yeah. Which is, it's like, it's like what 30 to 40% less effort to draft. So the, the peloton,
which is, you know, the group of like 50 riders, 60 riders, whatever, they're doing like 60 kilometers
an hour. And if you crash and then you're trying to catch that back up, it's not physically possible,
right? So you're just going to lose a lot of time. That's what happened. They didn't go back for their
leader, even though they were the favorite for the prohibitive favorite for the race.
Is there, is there a, but, but the winner is individual, right? Not a team?
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Individual. Are there team, are there team points as well? Like,
is it like F1 where you like, like, oh yeah, yeah, there's like a, there's team standings
for the overall season. And then each grand tour also has a quickest overall team, but it's not
prestigious. Okay. So that's like F1, right? Okay. So then, so then, but, but you will say,
if you say like, oh, so and so wins, you would always say, oh, so and so from X team wins because
it's not sure it's not really possible to win as a solo effort because of the physics of the sport,
which is somebody, Peloton's drafting. So somebody crashed the rest of the team said,
fuck it, let's keep going because they weren't feeling can be able to catch up.
Well, no, that's just it. Nobody fucking knows. And the team, it's such a big fuck up, like it's
an unprecedented level fuck up that the team has said nothing. They said nothing about it on the
day. And they've said nothing about it. Why is it a fuck up though? How many people around the team?
Like six or seven. So if one, so if you lose 13% who gives a shit, like then the other six go win,
right? What does it matter? No, because they can't win. It's like, that's not how it works.
Oh, do they all have to cross the line for a team? No, it's for points.
And one person wins, right? Your GC winner wins because they are the strongest overall rider.
They have to be good at all because they're highest and I got you. I got you. I got you.
Yeah. So if you're the favorite for the entire race, you're already in the yellow jersey and you
crash, your team goes, the person in the yellow jersey is crashed. You stop riding, you bring them
back to the peloton. And then, then you continue shenanigans, do whatever you want. Yeah. Instead,
they just kept fucking riding. So that actually happens where they stop and let them join back
in for like, for the race. That's a whole thing and catch back up, right? Because the point is
that the team is supporting this whoever's in the lead. Exactly. To be okay. I got you. It's
always one team riding together for the person who has the best chance on the team, right? And if
you're in the yellow jersey, right, you are literally the race leader. If the race leader
goes down and you're just chilling in the peloton, riding probably less than your threshold power,
just motoring along 60 kilometers an hour and somebody says over the radio, hey, our leaders
crashed. You don't just go like, yeah, I guess I'll just, I'll just keep chilling here till the end
of the race. Not even, not even attack, not even do anything. I'm just going to chill until I cross
the finish line. You would be like, I'm just going to pull over to the side of the road and
wait for them to catch up and then I'll give them some help catching back on the very least.
Like it's, it's absolutely unheard of. Absolutely madness. So, so the team that
betrayed their leader got in second, was it the person that crashed that got in second or was it
one of the, one of the team members? Second. So it was the person that crashed came,
they came second by four seconds despite losing like a minute 50 or two minutes or something
on that stage. So they absolutely hauled balls then is what you're saying. They absolutely
demolished. So that day they were fucked. They crossed the line like behind everybody. It was
a total shambles. You know, they, it was a, it was a complete shambles, but they just
demolished the entire field in the mountains, but it just wasn't enough. So, you know,
okay, so the overall they got second. Okay. Now it's starting to make more sense because it's,
it's the aggregate. You want them to speed back up because you still want to get them in first.
Got it. Now it's all coming in.
The overall time for the entire mileage of the race, right? So every, every second counts basically.
Okay. Yeah. So that, that's pretty egregious. That's insane.
Yeah. They literally just went like, Hey, we've got millions of euros in sponsorship or what?
Ever. Should we maybe go and get the person in the most prestigious Jersey and bring them back
to the group? They're just like, nah, we're happy here. We're just going to chill.
That's story. They didn't even win the stage either. That was the crazy thing. They like,
it was like, Oh, they're going to try for the stage. Is there some like grand plan has not been
communicated or their radio's down? And it just like kind of was like, whatever, man. It was just,
it was just bizarre. Like it was one of the most bizarre things. It was like, it's like the equivalent
of F1. Somebody being like, I think I hear a rattle. I'm going to pull the car over and just
get out and check the tires or something. Like it, it's that level of like, you're like,
that's not how tactics work in this sport. They haven't worked in that's, what?
What? Yeah. So anyway, that was that, that's, that's some news this week. That's the only thing
I can think of that's really happened this week other than continuing ICS shenanigans, right?
That story almost got me over the hump of giving a shit about cycling.
Yeah. It's like halfway. It was like a halfway the night. Then I rolled back. Yeah.
You should have, you should have gone to the, you should have gone to the women's
when you're in Paris. The Americans won it. It was a big upset. It was really funny.
It doesn't, but that's like, I mean, that, that literally is like watching marathons. Like you're
staying in one spot and then people walk, they roll past you and like, who gives a shit?
Yeah. But the race winning attack happened on Montmartre, which they did three times. So you
could stood on it and seeing them go past and you would have seen, you would have seen the attack.
Amazing. So, I mean, but yeah, it's like, it's like whatever, man. I appreciate it. It's a,
it's a fucking lame sport. Well, to be honest, I didn't know there was that much strategy associated
to like the team structure because that's actually a little bit more interesting where
similar to F1 where it's a team, but it's also individuals. And so you have competition within
a team, but also competition between teams and also competition individually.
That does create some interesting situations that have blown up in ridiculous situations.
Yeah. I mean, there's a reason that they, the people who, so Netflix, you know, commissioned
the Tour de France documentary that has been aired over the, about the last two series of the men's
because they were like people who like F1 because of the extended tactics that play out over a season
will probably enjoy a three week bike race where internal and external politics, nutrition,
distance, team dynamics, personalities, all plays out in a really chaotic way. Like,
and it's been a smash hit. So, you know, there's, they were obviously right about that. And there's
a lot of similarities between F1 and cycling obviously, because it's all marginal gains, right?
Like tiny, tiny increments. It's like 30 seconds on the mountain. That's the Tour de France one
or lost, right? On 30 seconds over, yeah, 3000 kilometers and whatever the total time would be
hundreds of hours, probably. The strategy for the Tour de France specifically used to be absolutely
outrageous too. Like it used to be that cyclists would IV carbs at night. Like they literally
have an IV of basically a sugar drip so they could load up for the next cycle. And there was,
I think it was in the 50s, they used to take this type of steroid that it would thicken your blood.
And so there were literally cyclists that would die if they didn't get up in like the middle of
the night to warm up to get their blood moving again, because their blood becomes so viscous.
So that's actually a more recent thing. So that was Marco, the famous Italian climber Marco
Pantani, who was around in the late 90s. His resting heart rate was something like 30. It was so,
so low. And, you know, we now know that was probably for many, many years of EPO, right?
Because that was like peak EPO times. And so he went to a doctor because he was like having these
weird palpitations and they were like, that is your heart stopping. He literally had to set,
stopwatch, wake up in the middle of the night and then just do like just turning the pedals over on
a bike to bring his heart rate up so that he could then sleep and be safe for a few more hours.
He died young, obviously, Pantani. So that sounds like me, that sounds like me and Brickeridge.
The Italians say that he died. I gotta get up and run around a fucking circle for a little bit,
try to get some oxygen. Right. Yeah. But yeah, the Italians say he died. He died of a broken heart.
Marco Pantani. Probably not. The squad from the sport. It was probably the cocaine though.
Yeah. It was probably the cocaine. But he did. Well cocaine bounced out the heart rate, right?
Yeah. Yeah. We had a heart attack. He had a heart attack on Valentine's Day, I think in the end.
After being barred from the sport during the big, you know, huge doping explosion and the
when it all came out at the end of the 90s, the first time. Yeah. They used to, before like doping
was a thing, they used to just do amphetamine all the time. And then there's a famous case where a
British rider in the 60s just died at the top of mountain. He was just like so off his balls. He
just stepped off his bike by the side of the road and just fucking died. See, that's one thing. It
doesn't carry out an F1. That'd be awesome if you had like hugely heavily cocaine drivers running around
on the F1 track. Yeah. There's some like wild stories if you go back in like when it was
pre kind of like, there's like this really weird period where cycling was not professional
in the kind of modern sense. But like it was possible to make a living as a cyclist from pure
like, like, like, like the public would be like, ah, what's amazing, what amazing sporting prowess
we would like. And then people would be like, yeah, we help us sell your butter or something
like that. Lots of people did live off it. But it was just, yeah. I love cycling. Please move on
because this is tedious. Okay. 100%. Fair enough. Are we about the the Evamos ICS stuff? Oh, can
we? It's amazing. We still have 40 minutes until Neutron halts. So super exciting about that.
I'm like, who agreed to this fucking Evamos ICS shit? Me. Are you kidding me? I love that
Cheryl did Know With Vito on it. That just makes me so happy that he was like, nope.
What happened? Who know if he did it? Chill validation. He was like, this is an attack
on the chain because you're changing the state, Know With Vito. I saw the Commonwealth post from
Chill being like this. Yeah. Being like this is an attack on consensus and as a validator.
I didn't realize they'd fully gone through that. That's awesome. So has the Cosmos Hub approved it?
I don't think the votes up yet. Let me check because like the Ethereum
like governance proposals are as if it's going to happen. Well, not necessarily. They're
re-genocicing and changing the set size. But when you read all the Commonwealths, it's all in
preparation for ICS. True. I don't know why I'm wasting my time fucking reading them. That's what it says.
Yeah, but I don't think the prop is up there. I haven't seen it. I don't think I've seen it.
And so is it going ICS or what's the new one? What do you call it? The
where validators can opt into it? Partial side security. That's still ICS. That's ICS2 is what
it's called, but it is partial set security. Yeah. It's not full ICS. So what happens if,
so what happens if of all the validators say no? So the way I'm seeing it roll out right now is the
teams that want to go to partial set security, they are kind of reaching out to validators and
paying a stipend to be part of their partial set. Which in my opinion is actually like a really great
way to go about it. If they don't think they'll actually get like enough commissions for it,
then just pay the validators a stipend. Great. Everyone's happy. That's um, so, so the team can
that set reduction is absolute savagery. It is fucking. What is it like 190 is living? They
end up like 20. Isn't it fucking 16? I think it is. It's 16. Yeah. It's probably only 16 that
we're making any money at this point there. Right. No, I don't think anybody's. Yeah.
Yeah. Except for Block Demon because they're still running the archive and they getting like
20,000 a month for that. Those fucking are.
20 grand a month. I need to introduce the King nodes fucking. I feel like we're all
running archives because you can't state sick this fucking piece of shit. Shane.
Yeah. Well, the, well, the, the state is one terabyte. So yeah. What the hell big deal?
That's nothing. Yeah. So right now, 117 in the set right now, going to what 16? There's no way
these. Yeah. So I was, I was talking to a network yesterday about archives and we were talking about
incrementals, like keeping incremental backups so that you can go back in time. For example.
Um, what does that mean? And well, like, you know, Restora a backup from, I don't know,
six months ago and get something out of it. If you need, like, you know, just to be able to access
or, or and incrementally, like, um, uh, so say if, if, um, a partner who is using the data,
sinks with your backup from, I don't know, has a, has a backup that they synced off you from,
like, six months ago and they want to update it, right? Um, without having to like download the
full thing, they can just update from the incremental. That's how it works.
It is. What was the FS you can, you can do stuff like that. Um, but, but, but anyway,
that's not the point of this. Um, so tendermint touches so many fucking files that like, if you
did that, you would be burning like, you know, on a, on a normal chain, like a terror, like,
like 10 gig a day or something, 100 gig a day or something ridiculous like that. It just touches
so many files. Plus on say it's one terabyte a day of files that change. Yeah. Cause files get
created and then aggregated and destroyed, right? Yeah. Yeah. So, so it's kind of like a, yeah.
Yeah. Cause you get, so much stuff changes that it just, it's not like just creating new files.
It's like changing everything in the, in the filing structure. Yeah. Speaking of that. And anyway,
it's annoying. What I've seen that say also, like recently, I'm not sure if something changed with
this last upgrade, but, but we've seen like, um, the actual use space on the drives go fucking ape
shit. But if you restart, say D to clears all that shit out. So it's like holding onto some sort of,
um, for some reason, the file system is calling those destroyed files as being held
for something or maybe the binary is holding onto those for some reason. So, yeah, like we've seen
like a couple of things where we've seen like three or four terabytes of growth, but you restart
saying it goes back down to, you know, 600 gigs or something. Um, yeah. Some weirdness. So you
should watch that. And well, it might be, I don't know, that might be a say DB thing or something.
I'm going to impact you. Well, I mean, I restarted every day anyway, but the, um,
um, you restart the binary every day on the archive. Yeah. Cause we do a daily,
all for take a snap. So it's just part of the, um, pipeline is that it stops the node.
Yeah. Does a snapshot starts to back up, replicates a snapshot does a table.
Um, how the fuck. But yeah, anyway, the point is it touches fucking each of us.
How the fuck is only number five in the most that how did that happen?
Yeah. Uh, from your big drops on the internet. Is that boost drop TM TM?
No, I don't think so. I don't think that boost drop yielded much.
Uh, I voted, uh, no with veto on every one of these props for evmos. I think so. No, that's not
true. The question remains, why the fuck you still even validating? Well, I mean, there's really no
reason at all. There's really no reason. There's no reason at all to be able to be a part of this.
I have no, I have no idea. Hey, Jake, into the chat.
Apathy. I think it's what it is. It's apathy. It's still running. So why fuck with it?
As soon as we go through an upgrade and or something else happens and that it'll be it, but
funky, you're going to be waiting a fucking long time for that T-shirt. But
we don't have one with Mars for us was like, I think I spent a year saying we need to just
like turn that shit off. And I was saying you need to turn that shit off. And then it was finally
an upgrade. It was just no, it was a it was an out of governance upgrade. And I was like, fucking
yeet. Oh, no, that was it. No, we had a hard drive fail. That was it. We had the we had the
server fail. And then we had to migrate everything to avoid the slashing window
so that we could then unbond without it being like,
so that we could unbond gracefully rather than be downtime slashed. Yeah, you should probably turn
that shit off. How many of you guys are doing the the Kujira validating cert shields?
No, I'm still there just because apathy. I will probably write it into the dirt until
that fucking price feeder starts to not work properly. And then I may eat it.
Because at this point, I just don't know if I could spend two hours fixing the price feeder
once it fucks up unless it's an easy fix because I reckon if I added up like the hours spent on
that damn price feeder since Kujira started, it would owe me a lot of hours for zero return.
And 20 hours maybe, for sure. At least, at least. And you're slashing right?
And each one of them in the middle of the night.
I've been slashing. Transmuter and... So that's official, right? It's going to Thor?
Yeah, that's official. And what's interesting or fun about it is the Thor team, I guess,
is going to sponsor like three validators to join the Thor set. And so they're having some sort of
like competition right now around it. Who's committed enough to be one of our validators?
And it's like, if they sponsor you into the set, you make like, I think it's like $1,200 a year.
So they're like, who is going to fight it out? Who's going to fight it all? Yeah, exactly.
It's amazing. What are the hardware requirements for Thor? Is it not too egregious or is it like?
It's higher than normal Cosmos chains and Thor also has weird stuff. I don't remember too much
around its setup, but I remember correctly, it's kind of like polygon in that it has a
tendermint core, but there's also a different execution layer.
Oh, really? My understanding was it was tendermint for consensus and then...
Oh, really? Is that true? Yeah. Something else? Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Sweet. $626 million. Value lacked. Wow.
Wow. Well, we've inadvertently obviously also stumbled onto our actual news sheet provided
by a news researcher with that last item. Yeah. That was actually a smooth transition by me.
It's very gross.
So could it be a good scenario?
It's very gross. I'm posing the question from our news researcher would be that
the way it has been bailed out is apparently $3 million USDC to buy 12 million six-month bonded
arcouge tokens. The question being posed after that information is, is that pretty cheap for
the products on Kajira? Before or after this massive exploit issue?
Well, but if they can make some hay with that, I mean, yeah, I guess the problem is that,
like, especially with open-sourced Cosmos and stuff, the fact that you've got projects that
or products that exist, yeah, it would cost you more than $3 million to have those sponsored,
incubated and developed. But if they come without their community or the community's toast at this
point, then it's not worth anything, is it really? It's just open-source software running for nobody's
benefit, which is the question. Anybody know how many fees have been generated by Kajira over the
last, since Genesis? Is that known? I think a question. Ram is got to know that one.
$3 million seems like a buy. I mean, good project and good team. And it seems like it's a totally
like wish we were involved in it early on. But I don't know what it's actually,
I mean, that doesn't mean anything, but it hasn't generated anything.
But also, I don't think there's any assumption that the team are coming with that other than
the team have said it. But like, if you move off your own app chain onto somebody else's chain,
unless you have like a formal agreement, people don't, if people have already been paid, they
don't continue to work for free, if that makes sense. Like, I know that you can pay somebody
upfront and expect them to do work later, but that's true.
Dude, we're all general validators. What the fuck are you talking about?
What are you talking about? It's totally untrue.
That is devastating, Rich. You said I have a list of chains.
I have a list of chains that meet that criteria. Are you kidding me? Are you fucking kidding me?
What do we have been paying me to work? Are you kidding me?
So, so here's something fun for that. I actually had
something like $100,000 and unrealized losses for Juno. And I just realized them last
week. Congrats. Nice.
Thank you. I finally. You sold.
I finally sold. Yeah, finally sold my Juno.
It's like taking a huge shit. I think if we were doing the capital,
what do they call it? The capital gains method for assets. When we sold our Juno,
probably would have been in the million in realized losses, I think.
Flex.
Well, when it was $40, we held a lot of them all the way down to nothing.
I guess hypothetically, our company holdings would have been worth 1.1 million pounds,
which is like $1.3 million, $1.4 million, something like that. Easy come, easy go.
Well, then you eat them off for four grand.
But the thing is like, obviously, they never were realized that they were never,
we never had to pay tax on them at that value because otherwise we'd be bankrupt, right?
Because you can't pay tax on 1.1 million pounds worth of tokens that don't exist when you don't
have any money because they are currently not there. So the way we did tax is that luckily
they went right up and came right back down like pretty quick. So when it hit 30th of June,
we didn't have this massive bag to pay tax on. It had already depreciated a fair bit.
We got stunned by that big times.
CB – Yeah, we had to pay the tax. Okay, this is real tragic. I'm going to say it because
it's like old school, cosmos law, and this is really, really tragic. But we basically wiped out
the entire profit of anything we ever made on Stargaze by the loss we took on the Juno assets
becoming realized at the point where we crossed a tax year threshold. And we had to pay tax on it.
JL – Including the Juno name service?
CB – No, Juno values profits.
JL – Yeah, but not the name service. Okay.
JL – Well, we did pay that. That is part of... So the name service money partly went to pay this
tax bill, partly went on the fact we had to pay VAT on everything, partly went on how development
there and stuff. But yeah, we wiped out the bigger, I guess, the thing that we, I 100%
know happened is that every cent we ever made on Stargaze, which wasn't like tons, but it was
like not nothing either. We fully wiped out paying our tax bill on Juno when it then obviously
completely died within maybe two months of us having to pay the tax bill on the hypothetical money.
So yeah. Fun times.
CB – That's horrible. That's sad. That's...
JL – It's a lesson, isn't it? Like a usurper's business partner said to me about getting my
phone stolen. You've learned a cheap lesson in the grand scheme of things.
CB – That's right. That's exactly what he said.
JL – Which it didn't feel like a... You know what? The thing this has in common with
getting my phone nicked in Barcelona is that it didn't feel like a cheap lesson at the time,
but in hindsight, if you walk away from it, it's a cheap lesson. It's just that you look at it and
you go, oh, my fucking god, that is just insanity. Like Nile says, the idea that there was even,
even if it was vesting, the idea that there was $1.1 million hypothetically sat somewhere
where at some point you'd have access to and between the time it existed. And we've all
worked for startups, right? So the idea that you have vesting things, then the company goes
barely up or whatever.
CB – That's right. That's exactly right.
JL – This is not an uncommon idea. We've been there in other scenarios and stuff,
but it's the scale of the number. If you have vested shares from a startup or something and
it goes tits up, you're like, oh, damn, that would have been a nice holiday, right? If they'd
ever cashed out and sold the company, I already got like a couple thousand dollars and gone on
a holiday or something. Like when the hypothetical number is over a million dollars, you're like,
this is silly. It's not real. And as it turns out, it's not real and it won't ever be real
because it turns out it just evaporates.
CB – The term for that is unrealized gains.
JL – Well, yes, exactly. As I explained very patiently to the tax man when they came
not, no, that's what accountants do.
CB – Well, I do think it might be something that people who have worked for public companies
who have gotten options or that might be worked for private companies who might have
auctions or equity or something else that might have experience with. But I think most,
not to generalize, but I think most people who get involved in this ecosystem might not understand
that term. And that term meaning like just because you have it doesn't mean it's worth anything.
And validators, I think, get sometimes caught in that shit as well, right? Or anybody who's
like huge token holders or even project teams. Project teams are like the mass, like they're
the fucking capital of unrealized gains, right? Like they hold the tokens, they create that
a thin air and then they put things like this on the website that says like TVL is worth $600
million. Is it though? Is it? That's an unrealized gain that you could never realize that gain.
So, yeah, I think that we've all been bitten by that, right?
JL – An unrealizable amount of, your token is only worth the liquidity that's in the pools, right?
CB – I learned that from you. And Ben Davis says the moral story is realize your gains. I mean,
that's that's the one way of, Jake says it's not because it's because it's...
JL – What does he say it's not too though?
CB – Probably to realize your gains. Realizing your gains means that you're basically exiting
or you're aggressively taking profits as Rama says, which is right, or to be able to exit out.
And like, I think depending on depending on what you're, if you're in this to be able to just
fuck around and have fun, then I think it's okay to not realize gains and just see what the fuck
happens, right? Because you're fucking around having fun. If you have real costs associated to it,
and you are fucking around finding out, then you're fucking around finding out.
And in this case, I would say that you have to aggressively take profits is a weird way of saying
it might be a way of just saying, just take what you can get. Because like right now,
we're not aggressively taking profits at this level of token price on some of these types of
things. But at some point, you just have to say, like what Chelsea just did, which is like,
you have to eventually say, well, fuck it, we're just going to sell what we can get, right?
JL – So I would push back a little bit around. I think his aggressively taking
profit and fuck the haters is the right take right now, right? The made up for validators for a
long time was kind of influenced by Jake up and a couple other heavy hitters where they're talking
about how their income was coming more from their commissions than from delegators, right?
And so a lot of people were following that path, just because it was made really popular. Like if
you're a true validator, you're going to just restake all your commissions, and then all your
income from that. We talked about it on this multiple times, right? And I think the meta is
changing quite a bit here. Like one, I think that there's less due diligence being done
on what validators are being done. Like, no, he knows, God, he always gets shit on
Twitter for it for taking profits anytime that happens. Really, it's always really funny to me.
JL – A business stage cash flow, man. I'm not going to apologize for that.
JL – Yeah, but why people follow you specifically? I don't know. But if you look at
the dimension set right now, the number one validator is called Diamond Hands.
But if you look at his transactions, he's pulling commissions like every two days selling them.
JL – That's commitment.
JL – It's so good. So the meta is just different now than it was. And I think that
Romney's take of aggressive between Provisan and the haters, that should be the new meta.
JL – That's amazing.
JL – But to us, you've got to appreciate only a critter. So you pull your Diamond
Hands and you are the most paper hands in the eco. That's really…
JL – It's so good. Yeah.
JL – It's water hands, man. It's amazing.
It's like somebody asked me years ago, is this all just performance art? And you go,
JL – Yeah.
JL – Yeah. Do I even need to think about it? Yes, it is. That's all we're doing here.
JL – It's been interesting in the last three months. Prices haven't really gone anywhere,
but revenue seems to have stopped somehow and costs seem to be ever increasing.
I also think I'm making dumb decisions on infros.
JL – I know. I keep buying more and more shit. That's a really other issue as well.
JL – I just committed to a new rack for three years and I'm like,
JL – Yeah. JL – Shit is not cheap in Australia. Oh, jeez.
JL – I think I crossed the 100 server mark this month. I have 100
terminal servers rented right now. JL – That is up there.
JL – That's…
JL – Well, I don't have anywhere near the amount of validators you have and I have probably 40.
JL – Yeah. I mean, neither do we and we've got 15.
JL – How many?
JL – 15. I'm not counting any sort of VPSs or anything.
Including VPSs, it's way higher. Just straight bare metal full on machines.
JL – What is a VPS? Like a DO or something?
JL – Yeah, like Digital Ocean, the CloudThings, Amazon, AWS. Yeah.
So you can include those. I've got probably over 200. Just straight bare metal over 100.
JL – Jesus. What is it?
JL – I have a question. Do you aggregate logs from those 100 bare metal servers?
JL – I do. And I actually have a server with 400 terabytes to process those logs.
JL – 400 terabytes?
JL – Reduce down 300 terabytes in RAID 10. So it's actually half of that.
JL – Of spinners?
JL – Of spinners, yeah.
JL – 100 terabytes of spinners.
JL – Yeah.
JL – That seems like a bad idea.
JL – Spinners.
JL – It's fast enough.
JL – It's fast enough. Yeah, absolutely.
JL – From aggregating logs from 100 servers?
JL – Yeah, for sure.
JL – Holy shit. But that might be 100 bare metal servers, but that might be like
600 separate fucking diamonds that it's logging from, right?
JL – Yeah. So are you shipping system D logs then? But are you using log tail or something?
JL – Promtail, yeah. End of the things, but promtail primarily.
Yeah. And then we prege logs every three days, or it's rolling three days at logs.
JL – Okay. And so how much of your 100 terabytes do you use on that three-day cycle?
JL – You know what? I couldn't tell you offhand.
JL – Wait. So you only keep three days of logs across all that shit?
JL – Yeah.
JL – Why bother?
JL – It's dependent on its criticality, if you will. A lot of things like logging out.
JL – Name me one critical thing that you need logs for.
JL – I like to keep track of the logs of SSH attempts that I typically keep for a month.
JL – But I thought you closed all those parts.
JL – I did. So typically it doesn't really have anything or doesn't really have anything.
JL – Yeah, it shouldn't be anything in there, right?
JL – Yeah. But I don't know. It feels important to me from a security perspective to at least
know what's going on.
JL – So do you keep logs for like nodes?
JL – Yeah. Do you keep customer nodes?
JL – No.
JL – Yeah. I mean, I keep probably on the server, I keep maybe a day.
JL – I keep two gigs of logs.
JL – Yeah. Whatever that is.
JL – Well, we do ours in RAM and it's just full of…
JL – Me too. Two gigs of rolling RAM, that's really what it is.
JL – Yeah. Because if something goes wrong, if you're hunting through a log,
you're not calling back a week. You're going back like 10 minutes or an hour.
JL – The only one I'm actually considering actually doing a lot more logging of is web requests
because what we've have seen is we're serving so much fucking RPC traffic.
JL – Like for your hoproxies?
JL – Yeah. Is that…
JL – Yep.
JL – So I traditionally don't keep hoproxy, HA proxy type logs. And the reason of that is because…
JL – They are numerous.
JL – Not only that. Not only that, this is an open ecosystem. And I kind of have a little bit
of a privacy slash… Not necessarily privacy, but like a moral stance against trying to figure
out what the fuck is going on. However, we've had…
JL – I think keeping stats is important.
JL – We keep a fucking stat. Oh yeah, I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about specifically
like logs. But we do have… We've had a request like we're just recently actually with a team
that we've seen that they had a blockchain problem where a specific contract was causing
literally large delays in node processing both on the RPC as well as within the VALSET.
And they knew it was a problem. And so they were actually trying to
identify what calls were coming in. So now I started logging both the request as well as the
body of the request as well as the response. So it's a huge fucking piece of data like seeing
exactly what's coming in, exactly what's coming out. And then because they were doing troubleshooting
of that. So I started keeping a shitload of fucking logs associated to a shitload of requests
on the EVM side of trying to identify what the hell's going on. And that actually…
And then I was like, well, should I keep these all the time? Should I fucking hold on to this
shit? And I was like, I don't know if I can deal with this shit, right? Because those logs are huge.
I mean, you're talking like HAProxy, like web request logs with both the body and the response
is massive. Like you have a huge amount of data that's coming out of that.
And like even with that, I almost talked about it. I did do it and I was querying it. I didn't
provide access to it. I queried to be able to provide the data that was requested, but I did not
say, hey, I'm going to ship you 14 gigs of logs for you to go see who the fuck is requesting what
on where. Because at some point, there is, again, maybe it's that attitude, but like,
it's a fucking permissionless system. Like if somebody's using our RPCs for nefarious shit,
but like I kind of, it's not necessarily my responsibility to block that IP. You know what
I mean? Like, sorry, I was going to say that caddy is the big thing of the logs that I keep,
because caddy basically emits most things through their logs. So like any sort of events
that goes through the logs. So a lot of our logs are, go ahead.
But you see the body or you see the request? I see the request. I don't see the, go ahead.
I was actually tracking the body. Like, I was purposely looking for like an EVM request.
It's not like an RPC request where you like a traditional Cosmos where you just get the URL,
like, hey, somebody's tracking delegators, blah, blah, blah. And EVM is just posting to the
NVM thing. So you actually have to look at the body of that request to say, what are they,
what contract are they calling? Like, what, like, what's the body of that? And like,
that would be encoded and if they can decode it in real time, like all that shit, right?
Which to me, like, I don't know, I just want to get involved in that business. You know what I
mean? Did you say you were logging that or they wanted you to log that? Both. I wasn't logging
it before. They requested because they're looking for specific people who were calling,
they're looking for specific IPs that were calling specific contract with specific,
that were calling specific, and that contract wasn't bad. There's nothing wrong with the contract,
actually. It was just that that contract was creating a situation that would actually,
was it was an issue with the daemon itself. And so that was actually stalling some things that
were happening internally. And so to be able to pull that data out, required me to pull the body
data out because I had to actually look at see what exactly what was in the body of each JSON
RPC request to be able to see which ones were calling those specific contracts. And then to be
able to understand, could we rate limit that issue? Because that issue was actually creating a
situation where it was stalling the nodes out, the VALSET specifically. So did you have to,
were you doing that with half proxy or did you have to use some sort of middleware?
No, I can do that with half proxy. You can, you can, you can, you can, you can log it out. It's
like a fucking gig a minute. It's like crazy amounts of text, right? The only thing I've added to my
logs is API's is the only thing that I added to my logs other than the standard. What do you mean
API's API keys? Oh yeah, that's good. Yeah. Yeah. So just print the API key for the on that line for
the request. Yeah, that's smart. Yeah. Yeah, it's only so I can get statistics on who's abusing the
fucking free API keys. Yeah, yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That's basically why I started as well, like seeing
the API keys and like what, what we're whitelisting and seeing what actually usage looks like. Yep.
Yeah, that I can do. I can do that through Cloudflare. I mean, I can pull that through the logs
through like at the, at the CF level, but can you do that at Cloudflare? I think you'd have to have
a worker for that because you can't inspect the headers. We can't get stats on the headers
for the API key at the worker. Yep. Are you going to work it for that? I did. I figured that out.
I'd love to see that. I'm sure you would. Fucking asshole. We've been collaborating on some
We've been, we've been bros lately. Yeah. The these fucking this EVM, we've been Zabx arising,
arising the EVM monitoring, which has been interesting. And so that we came up with this
fork detection thing, which would basically like take the latest block on our, our nodes,
and then extract the block hash and then test a public node for the same block height and test
its block hash to detect a divergence of fork. Right. And, um, well, we keep getting these false
positives. No idea why. I didn't make some changes to that. Like it's interesting where I thought
maybe it was related to how we were pulling data or if the maybe the number would change.
It's definitely querying the right block height. I even removed some steps in between
how we were grading that data. So I need to ask somebody, but is it possible? Is it possible?
This is an EVM side, but is it possible that I could query multiple nodes at the same height
and receive a different hash? It doesn't seem like it should be possible, but it doesn't make
any sense. Could it be, could it be an, could it be an MEV thing? Because the block is committed,
right? So the hash should always be the same. Otherwise that's an equivocation.
Yeah. Which is weird because it's happening every, oh, it's a, wait, wait, wait, wait,
wait, wait, wait, wait, there's, there's a situation I think. Okay. I'm not, I'm not familiar enough
with exactly the order of operations in Ethereum to know if this is possible.
Okay. But I guess there is a hypothetical situation in which a mempool, which is obviously
is ordered in a certain way. If you could query a mempool before block commitment,
and that block was not the leader, I guess there's potential, there's like, there's obviously a
window of time between the finalization of the order of a block and the commitment of a block,
whereby if you said to a mempool, maybe at this height, which is the prospective current height,
what have you got versus this other one, they would report different things, but you'd have to
ask the mempool, not the node, because the nodes, no matter which consensus you're using,
a leader has to have said, this is the block we're committing and people have to agree to it.
Right. Yeah. But this is all, these are all committed blocks. I think every time that we do
this, right? Because we're looking at, we're looking at the past. And it only happens like once
every, literally every, what, I'm getting a bunch, I run more chains than you do, but I'm getting it
like once, I'm like, like Astar we're running. And it happened on polygon, it happened a couple
of other ones where, where like, it happened enough for me to turn the fucking the alert off.
Did it happen on bear for you? Oh, it didn't happen on bear for me. All right. So something's
fucked. That's weird, because I just actually, I just changed that job to do actually make sure that
the whatever, whatever block number is coming out of the node, it's at I'm verifying that it's
actually querying that in a public RPC, that it has a, that it's querying the same block height,
but I'm, but I have received like once every one day for a chain, I have received something
different. So what I thought about, I thought about kicking this down the fucking path, which was
just be, Hey, it's got to be wrong four times in a row. That's, that's, that's my solution to it.
All right. If it's wrong once, totally cool. It's fine. But if it's wrong three times, then
there's an issue. Maybe that's the right, maybe because I, it might, it must be querying the
wrong block height somehow, but I don't even know how that would be possible.
No, it can't be. It can't be, it can't be or, or, or maybe, maybe, I don't even know what the
fuck it would possibly be. It's fucked up. I mean, they're all G E's nodes, right? Maybe it's a bug
with G E's. Maybe not because I've had it in polygon, which is not geth. That's bore. I've had it on
Astar, which is, I don't know what the fuck that is. I've had it on, I've had it on a shitload of
chains. But like, I mean, I can go back and look at the problems, but it has to be at least six or
seven different chains, but it's only one block. And then, and that hash doesn't match. And it's
not like it, it's not like it's off by a set or something else. Like it's totally different.
Like it's fucked. So anyway, anyway, so Nell and I have been working together. We've been bros
working towards our, this dashboard is looking good though. Like, I'm really happy with the
moderating. So we did it for both Solana because we do some stuff with Solana together with Schultz
and all VBN chains. It's looking pretty fucking tits. I gotta admit.
Looks nice. I think there's a few lessons learned there that we're going to move up to the
Cosmos monitoring as well. Yeah, I think so. Not this hash thing, but...
No, no, no, no. Actually, so I said this to you in the chat the other day, but I'm going to
get out my fucking low level discovery hat. And I'm going to make that sinking thing happen
where when it's in sync mode, it's going to sync all the various heights for like, you know, what's
you know, safe and like all the stages of the sync in like G ETH and have like a low level
discovered dashboard for that as well, just so it comes up when you're doing the sync and then
disappears a day later. So that'll be a fun little experiment. I sort of half built it before and
then deleted it because it was frustrating and it was late. Okay, cool. I fucking I always
forget how that low level discovery works. I have to like reread the docs every fucking time I do it.
It's so annoying. It's not intuitive at all. But it's pretty cool when you get it working.
Neutron is going to halt in a minute and 49 seconds. So that's super exciting for all of us.
It's a halt height upgrade, which means that it will totally fail. It's going to blow straight
through that upgrade high, isn't it? It is 100% going to I guarantee it moves places. I would say
place bets now, but I think we all think it's going to blow through the upgrade height, don't
we? The target block ends in 950. I guarantee there's a 951, 952, 953. There's no way.
So one thing that other networks have done, which I like is that if they have to have this fucking
hold height, they distribute a new binary in advance with a hold height built into it. Well,
it's basically the governance thing. So then you can stage the, it's governance without,
it's like it puts an upgrade plan without governance and then you can just use Cosmovisor.
So I don't know why they're not using that type of lesson learned and just fucking doing it that
way. Not Cosmovisor though, right? It just, I think the binary just automatically halts at that height.
I think it injects like an upgrade plan the same as if they had governance.
Oh, okay. Yeah, it's related to the SDK. It's not related to Cosmovisor.
Yeah. I thought it just halts it like it just forces the halt and that's it. It just shuts
it down. Yeah. It's a function of XGov rather than Cosmovisor. The upgrade, the emission
is the same as a scheduled software upgrade essentially. Yeah. So we'd put the log and
Cosmovisor would pick it up. I mean, that would be great if that actually worked.
My point is that if you were not running Cosmovisor, it would also hold.
Oh, I think we just hit the hold height. Let me see if my nodes all stopped.
Why are they appearing? They should be fucking dead. I mean, the other thing you can do is just
stop the system D and run it in like screen or T marks with a fucking hold height.
Wait, what the fuck is this shit? Fail to apply block error halt height per configuration height
117,950. That's where we are. Are you on Neutron Shieldsie?
Yeah, he's on Neutron. Yeah. Yeah. You're experiencing the same pain in real time.
All right. Well, my nodes are, they halted at the height somehow. So did, did we get 51?
Holy shit. We didn't get 51. God damn it. Unbelievable. It actually worked.
He did get the height. It actually halted on height. All right. Let me run the upgrade.
Unbelievable. That's amazing. You saw it here first, folks. Something stopped at the height.
And a whole height actually worked. Is it v421? Is that what it is?
Chelsea, did you, did you stop at the height? He's got, he's got to ask James.
He delegates a shit. Come on, man. He's a CEO. You know, you got, I got, I got checked with my
people. Is the discord looking just like a fucking shit show of yapping upgraded, upgraded, upgraded,
upgraded. It's amazing. Yeah. It will be soon though. Does everyone think that like, you know,
the fucking foundation is there with their pen and paper writing down the fucking monikers of the
people who you're that they've upgraded. Oh, fuck it. Oh shit. Yeah. Right. No, it's upgraded. Oh,
that's a fucking gold star for Rhino. We're going to get out the gold starboard to keep it
track. I'm 100% sure that some teams do. Should they? No. Do they? Yes.
And the teams that do almost certainly the ones that shouldn't fucking bother, I imagine.
Something like that. Yeah. That's kind of my name. A couple of networks.
My impression at least like when we were running more networks was the people who are the most
jobs worthy, shall we say, were usually the networks that had too much time on their hands,
because maybe the network wasn't doing as well as they thought it would.
But they still had budget.
They still got a bit of runway left to burn, baby. And so let's do it by sitting on discord,
because that's work. So Rhino or Sirp, I've just started load balancing the beacon nodes on ETH.
And for some reason, I thought that it would have issues, but it seems to work just fine.
You can do that. Seems like you can. You can't really change the
like the provider though. So like you can't mix Prism and Lighthouse because they have different
URLs. So that's super dumb, but you can load balance them. URIs?
You can't. It's a one-on-one period. It's the same. It's not. No. They're not the same.
Oh, sorry. But there's like some of them are the same and some of them are different though, right?
They have small differences. Small differences. Which makes them kind of incompatible.
You can load balance the consensus engine. Is that what you're saying? Same. That way. Yeah.
I swear to God, like they all say. As long as you have the, as long as your
entities that are running all have the same identity, only one of them will get hit by the
request, right? And then go and do it. I don't know why you would. I can't really think of a
reason why you would load balance it because all you're doing is putting additional load on the box.
And maybe fail over a single thread. Fail over might be a better, a better,
not necessarily load balance, but maybe fail over might be a better. Yeah. But if you're on the same,
yeah. So you could put two on separate boxes, load balance and have like an automatic failover,
I suppose, for the consensus part. But I mean, what's the point? That's also, well, hang on.
I mean, let's take a step back. Is that doable for tendermint? No. No, it's not. Because tendermint
has the slashing built in. So it's back to, it's back to, well, the way slashing is implemented
in tendermint means it's not possible in tendermint is my understanding. What's the point of doing that?
What's that? What's the point of having, of having a failover on the CL engine? Probably none.
Because you're still going to use one execution. So it gives a shit. Yeah. I don't think I'm going
to undo it because it's scaring me. But anyway, SSV continued to function
just fine, bouncing between two different consensus clients. I mean, I do remember seeing that on like
all of the consensus engine structures around not mixing multiple consensus engines and not
having multiple consensus, like that CL EL should be a one-to-one pair always.
Yeah, the CL EL is one-to-one. But sorry, maybe I explained that wrong. Actually, you like
exposing the beacon, two different beacons to like the one SSV, for example.
Oh, so I'm sorry. So two different CL EL pairs to one SSV, meaning like SSV is, oh, yeah, that
doesn't make a difference. Yeah, yeah. Okay. Because it doesn't really do anything with the,
with the, it's just looking for an endpoint to be able to get chain state, right? So that's totally
cool. Yeah. Not sharing like a JWT or anything. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Okay. All right. All right.
That makes sense. That's a fucking weird diversion. But yeah. Okay.
All right. What's going on? New tricks anyway. Move a block. We, oh, no, we didn't get any,
wait, we didn't get any live logs here or we moved past it. I was right. 950, 951 through 955.
A minute ago, I'm guessing 955 is not on the new, is not on the new engine. I think whole
height failed. Let's see. My notes are all in the new one. We'll see what the fuck. Happy days.
For the record, there's now a Discord channel called Validator Chat full of text saying upgraded.
It just now happens. It's funny. All right. Let's see what happens.
Thanks to Juno's communication there. 4k a month, I think for two comms members.
Juno now has a tutorial slash demo on how to use andro, andromedromedra's
platform to min some NFTs for Juno. Illegal rave event being hosted by Highlander.
See event hosted by Highlander? I thought he disappeared. I thought he was gone.
I'm still around. My neutron nodes are seeing 56, 57. Did we make it past this upgrade already?
Get the fuck out of here. That's impossible. There's no way. Maybe the upgrade actually
successfully happened and you're seeing new blocks not because you blew past it, but because
the professionalism of neutron validators cannot be underestimated. I think that comment is 100%
true because I'm seeing new blocks on the new binary with no app hashes. That was a halt height
upgrade that went better than an actual Cosmovisor upgrade. That's fucking unbelievable. James saying
congrats validators. That is insanity. How the hell did that happen? That is literally unbelievable.
That's the first time that has never happened that we've ever, I've never seen a halt height
upgrade that actually went through. That hasn't taken two hours plus. That hasn't taken two hours.
No less. Eight hours plus. You're getting two hours. Maybe the neutron cohort are just getting
really used to it now. There's been enough training by this point. The halt height was
10 minutes ago. Wait, no, that's not true. Yeah, the halt height was 10 minutes ago.
Looks like we had two more blocks, which it did move past and now, yeah, 10 minutes or less.
Actually, it looks like it started moving six minutes ago. That's insanity. I do see some,
like we do see some nodes that are having app hashes, not us, but like some, some vowels
we're talking about, but that's because they pretty missed the whole thing. That's crazy.
Wow. So I'll tell you one thing I have done before with a halt height upgrade was not use system D
and go into screen and start the binary with the halt height in it, but with the,
yeah, I'll just quit. Yeah, but with, and then at the end of that, put the ampersand ampersand
and then the start for the system D, right? And then upgrade the new binary into the current
directory of Cosmovisor so that when the halt height hits and it exits the current, you know,
instance, it'll then start up the system D with the new binary without you having to be there.
Well, that's a smart, that's a good idea. That's fucking maverick.
Crazy, dude. Blazing trails.
We still get a change of binary, right? So how would you do that? Yeah, that's mad.
No, you put it into the Cosmovisor current directory because that's what it's going to start
to put the other one into like a in go bin or something.
You just have the other one in go bin. Yeah. Yeah. Dude, you're like, yeah, but you can also
start the binary with the halt height and put ampersand ampersand and then, you know,
neutron D start after it, right? And after it starts up, then you upgrade the binary in go bin.
And then it'll start stopping restart again, and then you're upgraded.
That's, that's, it's pretty fucking badass, dude. It's a good idea. That's one of the same thing.
It comes up with all sorts of bullshit when you don't want to get up at 3am.
That's the other thing. It's just really the, the adapts and provides overcome meme.
This is one of those things that like some, some PhD 10 years from now, they'll explain to,
to the fray and it'll be like, oh fuck, yeah, no mention this back in 2024. He's a fucking genius.
Any of his shits can be relevant in 10 years time. It's already, it's already scarcely.
It's amazing. It wasn't that a thing a few years ago.
I tell you what, I have in the last couple of years, I have increasingly
been forced to be more of a bash monkey. So do enjoy a bit of bash these days.
Jake says, what do people think about the state of Cosmos and these days? Well, well,
I mean, it's the source of a lot of fun. I mean, there has been some issues.
I think if you are a white hat hacker, there, it can be quite lucrative, the current state
of Cosmos in like bug bashing, right? What's the bug bashing? What's the dollars associated
there right now? Who's got my depends on the network, but if there's, you know,
networks that if you discover a critical vulnerability in their stack and Cosmos is
part of the stack, then you can make bank on like the bug bounty. Maybe I should be doing that.
You should. There was a dude for say the other day took home a cool fucking couple of million
for a bug in the wrong game. Yeah. In whatever game I'm currently in. I
don't know what game I'm playing anymore. A couple of million, whatever game.
Can't remember the exact amount, but I'm confused. It was upwards of a million.
Dude, there's, there's literally like one billion. Wow, offer you if you want to be able to do this,
if you could make it happen. Like I got one billion. Wow, wow for you right here, buddy.
I think has the, um, has the, wow, wow teams successfully whittled down the fucking treasury
to nothing yet or burn it all. It must be nearly zero. You just thought going to ICS at a chain
near you. Oh, that'd be great. They're talking about it already came up, right? What if wow,
wow, just, I thought it's a Z deck. It'd be amazing. They're, they're trying to remarket that a
little bit like, Hey, were the original meme, meme coin and all that. Yeah. They are the original
cosmos meme. They should probably just become their own hub and do ICS off of wow. Yeah. Yeah.
That's what I'm thinking. Amazing. Reload. She has an ICS chain from wow. I think so.
I resurrects for us. Yes. I, I think, uh, I think Jappy's plan is a much better meme chain.
The you moron thing. That's great. You moron. Yeah. You have a moron. You have a moron. You
have a token where the tick is moron and then that is dominated as you morons and then you're
surprised when it rug pulls you fucking perfect. That's, I mean, that's, that's OG. The gonj
has not been so active in the last like six months as what it was with that discussion about the
fucking moron chain. Yeah. Well, it's because the actual reason is because a lot of the gonj chat
are back to their day jobs. The group chat. Look, you know, like we, we, we, we've in the pre-show
we were like, I was talking about that is, is currently what's happened in my life. So it's
just like, yeah, you know, there's love. There's a lot of, what are we doing in the cosmos energy?
And it's not particularly surprising that like it's because it's also not every, it's also just
like in general, the validated business that we've talked about before at length,
in various different angles is becoming kind of what you would expect now, right? Which is a
margins game. It's like a big volume margins game. And the mom pop garage band validators,
which is what to varying extents we all were when we started companies working in the space,
are no longer viable in the same way, right? And we've got different routes. Some of us have
expanded and become very big. And some of us have backed away from it. You know, and I think
that's just true in the, in the group chat in general, when you look at folks have taken
different decisions on the direction they want to go as far as they seem to guess, right? A lot
people keep it as a hobby, right? As well, or an expensive hobby, potentially. I think if you're
like, if you're a hobbyist and running and you're interested in like maybe one or two networks,
I think that's probably like fine, but you're not a hobbyist running fucking 40 networks. Like
you're pretty committed at that point. Sure, sure, sure. But like there's the only person I can
think of who is like a hobbyist in spirit, but running that many networks is probably like
Jaby. He doesn't run that many networks, though, right?
He runs around about 12, I think, right? I don't even know. I thought it was like 10.
Yeah, or five or six or something like that. But agreed. Like, but, but hobbyist is a weird,
a weird thing because I think people enter this like, I guess a 24 seven job, right? Like it's,
it's work, even though like, you know, Null runs all the shit at Contabo and stuff like that. Like
in VPS is like, there's the, even though his archive, I don't have shit at Contabo.
Even though his archive nodes are running on Raspberry Pi's and like a stack of, of, uh,
spinner drive under his desk and take NVMEs these days. Even
it's still, it's still a lot of work. That's for sure. I'm just waiting to be rugged here.
Like, are you just not pressing the button? The fray or, oh, are you over time? I still
can't believe this fucking network.