WEBVTT

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Tough times.

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Tough times.

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For apples?

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For apples, for eaters of apples,

00:00:06.798 --> 00:00:07.839
for enjoyers of apples.

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The whole of the apple ecosystem.

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It's fucked.

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It's fucked.

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It's down only.

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I was trying so hard during that,

00:00:33.883 --> 00:00:35.482
I think it's 15 seconds, that intro.

00:00:35.762 --> 00:00:36.363
I was trying very,

00:00:36.404 --> 00:00:37.664
very hard to come up with

00:00:37.704 --> 00:00:41.845
an Apple-based Game of Nodes joke,

00:00:41.985 --> 00:00:45.606
but all I could think of was Royal Gala.

00:00:46.286 --> 00:00:47.307
That was all I could think of,

00:00:47.487 --> 00:00:51.128
and it doesn't help with any rhymes.

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There's no pun in Royal Gala.

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You know what's a good apple?

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Since apparently this is where we've gone.

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Have you ever had a russet?

00:01:04.504 --> 00:01:04.944
I think so.

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A russet apple?

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A russet apple.

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It's almost so sweet that it's unbearable.

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It's like really overwhelming.

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If you have some apple juice,

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you have to like properly,

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you have to literally

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dilute it with water.

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I think we have.

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I think we have those.

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I've never had that.

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I had a russet potato, but not an apple.

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Envy apples are the best.

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I will die on that hill.

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Envy apples?

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Envy.

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Not jealousy, but envy.

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Oh, like the Japanese post-rock band?

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Yeah, that sounds right.

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I don't know what that apple is.

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I only know...

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english apples here we have

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really rare they um they

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are a merging of a pear and

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an apple if I remember

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correctly from like you're

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not actually an apple then

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there's an apple that's a

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papal there's a quince

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isn't it it's mostly an

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apple it's like there's a

00:02:00.606 --> 00:02:01.906
little pear aspect to it

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hang on a second if you

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showed someone like yeah

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isn't the literal

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definition of a quince the

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cross of an apple and a

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pear uh yeah quince apples

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let's take a look I think you're right

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similar in appearance to a pear,

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but not... Oh, no.

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I think it might be a

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literally different thing.

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I guess it's not a cross.

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It's just a different thing.

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No, it's just a different thing.

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It just looks like a cross

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between an apple and a pear,

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but it's actually totally different.

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I don't know.

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I've never heard of an Envy apple before.

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What the heck?

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It's just like created in a

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lab or something.

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I'm not really sure,

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but you only can get them

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like one month out of the year.

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And then that's a glorious month,

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let me tell you.

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Wait, Envy's a brand.

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It's not a type.

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Ah, it's a brand.

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What kind of Apple?

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I think it's... I don't know.

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Every Apple picture is fucking perfect,

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though.

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Yeah.

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Here we go.

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There's two dudes.

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There's Apple dudes.

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can't remember which

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counties it is I want to

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say herefordshire and

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gloucestershire one of them

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is like apple country and

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one of them is pear country

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both of which you can make

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hard cider from an

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important side fact here so

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envy tm like bootstrap was

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born using natural plant breeding methods

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Clients having sex.

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Crossing between a Braeburn

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with Royal Gala apples.

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There you go.

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Royal Gala.

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There's half your... Right

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back to where we started.

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I must have caught the

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emanations in the

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atmosphere that Shortsy was

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also thinking of Royal Galas.

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The result is a pure bliss.

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Heightened enjoyment that is

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up only like no other.

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It's true.

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That's right.

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It was a Royal Gala and a... Braeburn.

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B-R-A-E-B-U-R-N.

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Braeburn apples I've had, yeah.

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I'm brave, brave friends.

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You just, you're standard at the coalface.

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I mean,

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I know they're like a New Zealand apple,

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but they're, they're very,

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that's not at the coalface apple.

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There's a lot of good apples.

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Um, you ever had a Cox apple?

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Love a bit of Cox?

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No.

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Cox on your lunch break?

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I don't think so.

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No?

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It's a great apple.

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Like, best apples of all time.

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Number one is the Cox.

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Just very small though.

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Really small, small little guys.

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Really small cocks.

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Really small cocks.

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Only winter though, you know,

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it's a cold day.

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It's kind of cold out.

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But yeah, they're very crisp, very tart.

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Anytime I hear someone in

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English say very small,

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I instantly go to very small rocks.

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What else floats in water?

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Apples.

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That's right.

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Very small rocks.

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So as soon as you say very small,

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I instantly go to...

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Oh, yeah.

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You didn't get that reference, did you?

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Did you get that reference?

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Yeah, of course.

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They don't actually show it

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to you in school.

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But it's kind of...

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I got my PhD in the Holy Grail.

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Yeah.

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I mean,

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I assume it's mainstream enough in

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the States that I guess if you quote it,

00:05:21.896 --> 00:05:23.579
people will pick up on it, right?

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Oh, yeah.

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Yeah, exactly.

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I mean, it's Monty Python.

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It's a big deal.

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Yeah.

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Well, my age, yeah.

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Yeah.

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These Zoomers and below,

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who knows what comedy

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they're listening to?

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No Monty Python on TikTok.

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Monty Python on TikTok.

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Anyway.

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Anyway.

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Anyway.

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Did you want to do the intro?

00:05:42.779 --> 00:05:43.221
The actual intro?

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Enough Apple chat.

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Welcome to Game of Nodes.

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There we go.

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Do we actually even add

00:05:51.184 --> 00:05:52.625
anything after that anymore?

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Yeah.

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The podcast.

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From, you know,

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independent validator teams.

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Welcome to the show.

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So, what's been happening this week, lads?

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uh test nets some launching

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launching this week oh yeah

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yeah a couple things oh

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yeah we talked about that

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yeah yeah a couple test

00:06:20.622 --> 00:06:21.184
nets which I don't know if

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we can talk about actually

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so maybe we'll just not

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talk about it um test nets

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are always fun like I like

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I like new things um

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Some of these are very... I

00:06:30.927 --> 00:06:31.327
like new things.

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I like new things.

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I just like new things.

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I suppose it's a bit of an affectation,

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but... You know, new.

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It's fun.

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That's it.

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I think it's hot as shit here.

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It's... I don't know.

00:06:51.701 --> 00:06:52.843
It's 94, 95 Fahrenheit.

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I don't know what that is Celsius.

00:06:55.584 --> 00:06:56.786
It's got to be... What is that?

00:06:56.805 --> 00:06:56.946
Like 32? 32?

00:06:59.377 --> 00:07:01.540
It is summer here.

00:07:01.661 --> 00:07:03.264
We are three days off the solstice,

00:07:03.343 --> 00:07:05.968
and it is 12 or 13 degrees, I believe.

00:07:06.028 --> 00:07:07.410
This is a winter jumper.

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34.

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It's 34 and a half here.

00:07:12.398 --> 00:07:16.060
34.

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It is 20 degrees colder where we are.

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Enjoy your summer.

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At least you have winter to

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look forward to.

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It has been a bad enough

00:07:24.163 --> 00:07:25.944
summer so far that it's

00:07:25.964 --> 00:07:27.365
been in the newspapers.

00:07:27.425 --> 00:07:27.846
Bear in mind,

00:07:27.865 --> 00:07:29.427
there's a shambolic general

00:07:29.466 --> 00:07:31.807
election going on right now.

00:07:32.468 --> 00:07:35.290
And even then, they're like, but wait,

00:07:35.589 --> 00:07:36.891
the weather has been bad.

00:07:37.110 --> 00:07:39.612
Even by our standards, it's news.

00:07:41.983 --> 00:07:44.163
So yeah, that's what's happening here.

00:07:44.785 --> 00:07:45.204
As usual,

00:07:45.305 --> 00:07:46.526
British people talking about the weather.

00:07:46.906 --> 00:07:48.247
The weather and how shitty it is.

00:07:49.226 --> 00:07:49.788
And how shitty.

00:07:50.307 --> 00:07:52.088
Yeah, it's freaking hot.

00:07:52.309 --> 00:07:53.290
We've been doing a lot of stuff outside,

00:07:53.310 --> 00:07:55.011
so it's just been miserably hot and

00:07:56.634 --> 00:07:56.713
Oh,

00:07:56.774 --> 00:07:58.675
how my heart bleeds for you with that

00:07:58.735 --> 00:07:59.415
warm weather.

00:07:59.995 --> 00:08:00.596
It's not warm.

00:08:00.636 --> 00:08:02.216
It's like, it's shitty.

00:08:02.896 --> 00:08:03.817
My ears are like sweating

00:08:03.857 --> 00:08:04.937
inside the headphone cups

00:08:04.997 --> 00:08:05.978
and stuff like that.

00:08:06.497 --> 00:08:06.658
Yeah.

00:08:07.139 --> 00:08:07.718
Sounds great.

00:08:08.238 --> 00:08:08.778
It's amazing.

00:08:09.579 --> 00:08:10.220
Yeah.

00:08:11.139 --> 00:08:11.379
Cool.

00:08:11.560 --> 00:08:13.540
So it's hot on the east coast.

00:08:13.901 --> 00:08:14.422
Test nets.

00:08:15.161 --> 00:08:15.401
Hot.

00:08:15.802 --> 00:08:16.021
Hot.

00:08:16.141 --> 00:08:17.583
Test nets are hot.

00:08:17.862 --> 00:08:18.802
The weather's hot.

00:08:19.163 --> 00:08:21.084
What's the... Oh, fuck.

00:08:21.464 --> 00:08:22.644
Warm out yesterday.

00:08:23.185 --> 00:08:24.125
Warm out today.

00:08:25.206 --> 00:08:26.406
Warm out tomorrow.

00:08:26.427 --> 00:08:28.908
That's basically what it is.

00:08:28.927 --> 00:08:30.408
I can't remember.

00:08:30.449 --> 00:08:31.750
I think that's The Simpsons.

00:08:31.990 --> 00:08:33.410
Is he The Simpsons or Deliverance?

00:08:33.431 --> 00:08:34.991
I think it's The Simpsons.

00:08:35.912 --> 00:08:37.952
Got to be The Simpsons, hasn't it?

00:08:38.013 --> 00:08:39.014
It's a little bit like that

00:08:39.073 --> 00:08:40.033
other... What's the other

00:08:40.115 --> 00:08:41.215
really good Simpsons one

00:08:41.274 --> 00:08:42.395
with the Cayman Islands?

00:08:43.317 --> 00:08:43.798
Oh, crap.

00:08:44.379 --> 00:08:45.320
I definitely shouldn't have

00:08:45.360 --> 00:08:46.761
told them about that

00:08:46.822 --> 00:08:49.005
client's secret account.

00:08:49.626 --> 00:08:50.028
Oh, crap.

00:08:50.408 --> 00:08:51.429
I definitely shouldn't have

00:08:51.470 --> 00:08:53.172
said it was illegal.

00:08:53.192 --> 00:08:55.275
I don't even remember that.

00:08:55.996 --> 00:08:57.519
Just so hot outside.

00:08:59.912 --> 00:09:00.712
I think it's the crusty

00:09:00.773 --> 00:09:01.993
clown when he gets busted

00:09:02.013 --> 00:09:03.094
for tax evasion and

00:09:03.114 --> 00:09:04.394
basically they call up his

00:09:04.634 --> 00:09:06.615
crooked accountant in the Cayman Islands.

00:09:06.635 --> 00:09:08.677
He just goes, I'm terribly sorry.

00:09:08.777 --> 00:09:10.418
I'm not limited to divulge

00:09:10.898 --> 00:09:12.719
information on my client's

00:09:13.259 --> 00:09:16.019
very secret illegal account.

00:09:17.301 --> 00:09:18.361
And then hangs up the phone

00:09:18.381 --> 00:09:20.001
and then just has that

00:09:20.101 --> 00:09:21.123
triple take where he

00:09:21.163 --> 00:09:22.823
realizes he's revealed everything.

00:09:22.844 --> 00:09:25.004
And then he just sinks into

00:09:25.024 --> 00:09:27.105
his chair and wafts himself with a fan.

00:09:28.743 --> 00:09:32.105
it's uh oh shit primo cosmos

00:09:32.125 --> 00:09:36.466
memeage really um yeah so

00:09:36.486 --> 00:09:38.927
uh we just heard about uh

00:09:39.168 --> 00:09:40.149
that event as well at

00:09:40.328 --> 00:09:41.529
korean blockchain week

00:09:41.570 --> 00:09:42.649
which I didn't realize was

00:09:42.669 --> 00:09:44.451
I mean because I live under

00:09:44.490 --> 00:09:46.913
a rock is a thing fancy

00:09:46.932 --> 00:09:48.734
trip to korea when is that

00:09:48.754 --> 00:09:49.333
is that coming up

00:09:50.009 --> 00:09:52.591
no idea september something

00:09:52.610 --> 00:09:53.451
like that I do need to

00:09:53.471 --> 00:09:54.130
figure out what we're doing

00:09:54.150 --> 00:09:54.971
for the rest of this year

00:09:54.991 --> 00:09:56.352
there's a couple shows

00:09:56.832 --> 00:09:57.653
there's a couple shows I'd

00:09:57.673 --> 00:09:59.234
like to go to but but I

00:09:59.254 --> 00:10:00.534
just don't know if it makes

00:10:00.554 --> 00:10:02.456
sense or not oh yeah we'll

00:10:02.475 --> 00:10:04.878
see stateside uh

00:10:05.057 --> 00:10:06.619
permissionless is stateside

00:10:06.958 --> 00:10:07.399
that looks pretty

00:10:07.438 --> 00:10:08.659
interesting actually um

00:10:08.700 --> 00:10:12.182
where's that is it back in

00:10:12.282 --> 00:10:13.722
denver why do I think it's

00:10:13.763 --> 00:10:16.464
in denver why why break why

00:10:16.504 --> 00:10:17.865
break a formula that works

00:10:17.945 --> 00:10:19.005
I think it is back in denver

00:10:21.203 --> 00:10:21.884
Please be somewhere else.

00:10:22.024 --> 00:10:22.684
No, it's in Salt Lake.

00:10:23.264 --> 00:10:23.784
I like Salt Lake.

00:10:25.645 --> 00:10:26.206
It's in Salt Lake City.

00:10:26.246 --> 00:10:26.746
It's in Utah.

00:10:27.746 --> 00:10:28.748
That might be interesting.

00:10:29.107 --> 00:10:31.208
I think that's October.

00:10:32.669 --> 00:10:33.510
And then SmartCon,

00:10:33.591 --> 00:10:34.910
we've gone to the last few years.

00:10:35.751 --> 00:10:37.732
This year, two years ago,

00:10:37.753 --> 00:10:38.673
it was in New York.

00:10:38.692 --> 00:10:40.153
And then last year, it was in Barcelona,

00:10:40.193 --> 00:10:40.975
which you came down to.

00:10:40.995 --> 00:10:42.655
And then this year, it's in Hong Kong.

00:10:43.275 --> 00:10:43.895
And I think that might be

00:10:43.936 --> 00:10:44.657
just a little too far to...

00:10:45.366 --> 00:10:46.167
make the trip for that trip

00:10:46.647 --> 00:10:47.868
also you don't want to

00:10:47.927 --> 00:10:49.807
necessarily be in hong kong

00:10:49.869 --> 00:10:51.589
if there's a little bit of

00:10:51.969 --> 00:10:53.669
you know maybe them getting

00:10:53.730 --> 00:10:55.190
like finally invaded for

00:10:55.230 --> 00:10:56.990
good yeah what are the

00:10:57.010 --> 00:10:57.931
chances on the weekend I'm

00:10:57.951 --> 00:11:00.152
there it's pretty pretty low

00:11:00.611 --> 00:11:01.393
That's exactly what

00:11:01.452 --> 00:11:03.333
everybody says just before they end up.

00:11:03.354 --> 00:11:04.193
Just before the weekend.

00:11:04.715 --> 00:11:07.035
Yeah, just before they end up.

00:11:07.056 --> 00:11:08.976
When they're interviewed at the airport.

00:11:09.057 --> 00:11:09.518
Yeah,

00:11:09.717 --> 00:11:11.158
when they're interviewed at the airport.

00:11:11.239 --> 00:11:13.299
The film crew is like, sir, sir,

00:11:14.321 --> 00:11:15.981
what's happening?

00:11:16.241 --> 00:11:16.841
Jesus Christ,

00:11:16.922 --> 00:11:18.263
I'm just here for the weekend.

00:11:18.283 --> 00:11:19.344
Yeah, exactly.

00:11:19.984 --> 00:11:21.845
Tourists fleeing the scene.

00:11:22.485 --> 00:11:23.086
When they're interviewed at

00:11:23.105 --> 00:11:25.207
the airport behind a sea of...

00:11:26.035 --> 00:11:27.157
No planes on the tarmac.

00:11:27.297 --> 00:11:27.856
Yeah, exactly.

00:11:27.878 --> 00:11:28.557
Yeah, exactly.

00:11:29.097 --> 00:11:30.158
And the one I really want to

00:11:30.198 --> 00:11:30.919
go to is Token,

00:11:31.259 --> 00:11:32.421
which is in Singapore in

00:11:32.541 --> 00:11:33.201
the middle of September.

00:11:33.221 --> 00:11:34.442
It's just really bad timing.

00:11:34.543 --> 00:11:35.222
Oh, Token 2049?

00:11:35.322 --> 00:11:35.442
Yeah.

00:11:35.482 --> 00:11:35.582
Yeah.

00:11:38.586 --> 00:11:39.368
I should have gone to...

00:11:39.408 --> 00:11:40.548
They did one in London last year,

00:11:40.609 --> 00:11:41.950
and I should have gone to it.

00:11:42.129 --> 00:11:43.691
But I ummed and aahed about

00:11:44.530 --> 00:11:47.293
the... The ticket was quite

00:11:47.373 --> 00:11:48.453
reasonable to start off with,

00:11:48.494 --> 00:11:49.794
but it's very expensive if

00:11:49.815 --> 00:11:50.455
you got it late.

00:11:51.174 --> 00:11:52.495
And I was just like,

00:11:52.515 --> 00:11:54.717
I don't know if I can hack

00:11:54.758 --> 00:11:55.798
it or if I'm going to get

00:11:55.817 --> 00:11:56.599
the value out of it.

00:11:56.678 --> 00:11:58.320
So I'll just decide later.

00:11:58.399 --> 00:11:59.841
And it literally doubled in price.

00:11:59.880 --> 00:12:00.640
I was like, fuck.

00:12:00.701 --> 00:12:02.361
Well, I'm not paying that now.

00:12:02.383 --> 00:12:04.283
Because it's back to John.

00:12:04.764 --> 00:12:05.004
Back to...

00:12:07.327 --> 00:12:08.947
uh back to artifacts point

00:12:09.048 --> 00:12:10.489
and whatnot about like if

00:12:10.509 --> 00:12:11.269
you're going to go to these

00:12:11.308 --> 00:12:12.668
conferences you have to a

00:12:13.229 --> 00:12:16.309
go kind of all in and b you

00:12:16.350 --> 00:12:17.330
need to get like you can't

00:12:17.370 --> 00:12:19.051
just get the basic tier if

00:12:19.071 --> 00:12:19.811
you're trying to actually

00:12:19.850 --> 00:12:20.471
talk to like the

00:12:20.530 --> 00:12:21.691
foundations or whatever you

00:12:21.890 --> 00:12:23.971
you may as well go for one

00:12:23.991 --> 00:12:24.991
of the more expensive ones

00:12:25.011 --> 00:12:26.692
where you get some extra

00:12:26.772 --> 00:12:28.873
access yeah whether well I mean

00:12:31.054 --> 00:12:32.375
Whether or not that's true, I don't know.

00:12:32.535 --> 00:12:33.816
But by the time it's $1,000

00:12:33.816 --> 00:12:35.897
of marketing expense, you're like,

00:12:37.277 --> 00:12:38.238
it's already painful.

00:12:38.937 --> 00:12:40.519
Yeah, and here it's especially.

00:12:41.099 --> 00:12:42.599
The early bird is still up for $500,

00:12:42.599 --> 00:12:43.940
and then it goes to $1,300,

00:12:43.940 --> 00:12:44.960
to your point.

00:12:45.860 --> 00:12:46.600
That's a regular one.

00:12:46.640 --> 00:12:49.081
And the special access is $5,000.

00:12:50.081 --> 00:12:49.081
$5,000?

00:12:50.461 --> 00:12:50.562
It's $5,000.

00:12:51.342 --> 00:12:53.923
So it's a 10x between those two.

00:12:53.943 --> 00:12:55.583
I mean,

00:12:55.604 --> 00:12:56.664
you get breakfast and lunch and

00:12:56.684 --> 00:12:57.485
shit like that, but still.

00:12:58.753 --> 00:13:00.673
You get connection with

00:13:00.693 --> 00:13:02.414
speakers and VIP guests and

00:13:02.434 --> 00:13:03.215
there's a separate

00:13:03.254 --> 00:13:04.475
concierge and you get

00:13:04.515 --> 00:13:06.076
access to the speaker lounge.

00:13:06.296 --> 00:13:07.397
If you can make the right

00:13:08.236 --> 00:13:09.498
connections and if it's

00:13:09.577 --> 00:13:10.697
worth it from that perspective,

00:13:10.738 --> 00:13:12.278
then it might be.

00:13:12.639 --> 00:13:13.519
It just depends on how you use it,

00:13:13.538 --> 00:13:13.678
I think.

00:13:13.739 --> 00:13:14.379
I think you might have to be

00:13:14.419 --> 00:13:15.779
better at networking than I

00:13:15.860 --> 00:13:17.480
am to make that fully worthwhile.

00:13:18.587 --> 00:13:19.428
Um, yeah.

00:13:19.769 --> 00:13:21.490
And plus, I mean, you do, I mean,

00:13:21.510 --> 00:13:22.432
how are those it's,

00:13:22.532 --> 00:13:24.253
it's in one show is not really enough.

00:13:24.273 --> 00:13:25.193
So you have to, you have to do that.

00:13:25.234 --> 00:13:25.934
Like, you know,

00:13:26.054 --> 00:13:26.895
you do that a dozen times

00:13:26.916 --> 00:13:28.317
and you come out with something, um,

00:13:28.537 --> 00:13:29.758
that's significant, but it takes,

00:13:29.937 --> 00:13:31.058
it might, it might, you might,

00:13:31.179 --> 00:13:33.260
you might shoot some blanks as they say.

00:13:34.142 --> 00:13:34.903
So I would like to get,

00:13:34.923 --> 00:13:35.683
I would like to get out there.

00:13:35.764 --> 00:13:36.124
Also,

00:13:36.705 --> 00:13:38.365
I think the other issue with that is

00:13:38.625 --> 00:13:41.688
I believe that weekend is also F1, um,

00:13:42.970 --> 00:13:43.809
on that same weekend.

00:13:44.269 --> 00:13:44.549
So,

00:13:44.710 --> 00:13:47.230
which means every fricking hotel and

00:13:47.311 --> 00:13:48.431
flight is going to be ridiculous.

00:13:48.490 --> 00:13:49.591
So I haven't really looked yet.

00:13:49.610 --> 00:13:50.071
Cause I know,

00:13:50.350 --> 00:13:50.932
I know that they're in

00:13:50.951 --> 00:13:51.731
Singapore that weekend,

00:13:51.751 --> 00:13:52.792
which also I would love to

00:13:52.812 --> 00:13:53.251
go to that race.

00:13:53.292 --> 00:13:53.892
That's a separate thing.

00:13:54.451 --> 00:13:54.892
So, yeah.

00:13:54.912 --> 00:13:56.253
Um, I mean,

00:13:56.273 --> 00:13:57.092
that must be why they've done

00:13:57.173 --> 00:13:58.753
it is so that people can expense the,

00:13:58.993 --> 00:14:00.293
the trip for the shenanigans,

00:14:01.234 --> 00:14:02.274
but it was a good plan.

00:14:04.094 --> 00:14:05.354
Oh, it sounds like a plan.

00:14:05.693 --> 00:14:05.913
Yeah.

00:14:05.974 --> 00:14:07.054
So I should have done the,

00:14:07.075 --> 00:14:08.095
should have done the last one probably,

00:14:08.134 --> 00:14:08.294
but,

00:14:10.105 --> 00:14:11.267
you know, when you go to, I mean, you know,

00:14:11.307 --> 00:14:12.128
you know, from East Denver,

00:14:12.148 --> 00:14:13.490
I've not even been to East Denver,

00:14:13.509 --> 00:14:13.950
but like,

00:14:14.571 --> 00:14:16.113
I just have this like nightmare

00:14:16.173 --> 00:14:17.654
of it just being a massive

00:14:17.735 --> 00:14:19.657
room where every conversation I have,

00:14:19.756 --> 00:14:21.019
I'm trapped with like that

00:14:21.058 --> 00:14:22.461
enthusiastic East guy.

00:14:22.480 --> 00:14:23.923
I just,

00:14:24.884 --> 00:14:26.826
I don't know how polite I could be

00:14:26.885 --> 00:14:27.586
for that long.

00:14:27.827 --> 00:14:28.048
Like,

00:14:28.938 --> 00:14:31.240
I know like I'm British,

00:14:31.320 --> 00:14:32.600
so I can just say sorry

00:14:32.879 --> 00:14:35.120
over and over to tell

00:14:35.159 --> 00:14:36.480
people to fuck off while

00:14:37.721 --> 00:14:38.961
ostensibly maintaining a

00:14:39.000 --> 00:14:40.461
veneer of politeness to their face.

00:14:41.381 --> 00:14:44.682
But it's demoralizing after

00:14:44.702 --> 00:14:45.822
a while when you're just like,

00:14:46.082 --> 00:14:47.943
you just like, I'm, I'm just like,

00:14:48.063 --> 00:14:50.104
I'm sideshow Bob walking into a rake,

00:14:50.384 --> 00:14:52.784
you know, over and over, except everyone,

00:14:52.825 --> 00:14:54.945
these rakes is a boring crypto guy.

00:14:54.965 --> 00:14:57.966
It's just, it's just,

00:15:06.099 --> 00:15:09.860
Just got to replace that with restaking.

00:15:10.140 --> 00:15:13.243
Yeah, no, no, no.

00:15:13.403 --> 00:15:14.703
It's liquid staking.

00:15:14.783 --> 00:15:15.724
It's liquid staking.

00:15:16.183 --> 00:15:17.985
People are like, oh, fuck it.

00:15:18.024 --> 00:15:18.384
You know what?

00:15:18.404 --> 00:15:18.566
Actually,

00:15:18.605 --> 00:15:20.385
recently I've gone to a couple of

00:15:20.426 --> 00:15:23.148
things and it's been like zero knowledge.

00:15:24.008 --> 00:15:25.288
Yeah, I've heard of it.

00:15:25.969 --> 00:15:27.129
There was at least one where

00:15:27.149 --> 00:15:28.971
there was a group of people going to,

00:15:29.691 --> 00:15:30.110
they were like, oh,

00:15:30.130 --> 00:15:30.751
we're going to implement

00:15:30.812 --> 00:15:33.432
this zero knowledge thing on Ethereum.

00:15:33.452 --> 00:15:34.693
It was like, oh, cool.

00:15:35.407 --> 00:15:36.187
And I was like, well,

00:15:36.207 --> 00:15:37.989
who are you guys working with?

00:15:38.068 --> 00:15:41.370
Like vaguely, um, had, you know, no, no,

00:15:41.390 --> 00:15:42.510
some of the people through other people.

00:15:42.571 --> 00:15:42.932
And I was like,

00:15:43.471 --> 00:15:44.773
they don't have any cryptographers.

00:15:45.393 --> 00:15:46.514
They don't have any

00:15:46.774 --> 00:15:47.774
engineers that understand.

00:15:47.793 --> 00:15:48.894
They're talking about zero knowledge.

00:15:48.955 --> 00:15:49.274
Right.

00:15:49.775 --> 00:15:50.035
Okay.

00:15:50.056 --> 00:15:50.196
We're,

00:15:50.216 --> 00:15:51.517
we're beginning to verge onto like

00:15:52.596 --> 00:15:53.977
paying real cryptographers,

00:15:54.018 --> 00:15:54.979
real money to do stuff.

00:15:55.058 --> 00:15:55.318
Okay.

00:15:55.859 --> 00:15:56.740
And they're like, yeah, yeah,

00:15:56.759 --> 00:15:57.419
we've got a white paper.

00:15:57.440 --> 00:15:58.500
We've got a white paper and stuff.

00:15:58.520 --> 00:15:59.000
And blah, blah, blah.

00:15:59.020 --> 00:16:01.763
You're like, uh, okay, cool.

00:16:02.557 --> 00:16:04.118
And then, yeah, like, you know, whatever.

00:16:04.138 --> 00:16:04.938
Didn't think any more of it.

00:16:04.958 --> 00:16:05.739
Taught some other people.

00:16:06.379 --> 00:16:07.379
Plenty of other fine people.

00:16:09.121 --> 00:16:09.461
No worries.

00:16:10.543 --> 00:16:11.222
Finally got around to

00:16:11.302 --> 00:16:13.104
reading the white paper after I got back.

00:16:14.465 --> 00:16:16.187
Got back chez moi, as the French say,

00:16:16.206 --> 00:16:17.047
a little while later.

00:16:17.067 --> 00:16:19.589
And it literally had a

00:16:19.609 --> 00:16:20.529
section where I shit you not,

00:16:20.549 --> 00:16:21.490
where it just had a page

00:16:21.610 --> 00:16:22.931
and it had literally kind

00:16:22.951 --> 00:16:23.971
of like a Wikipedia level

00:16:24.011 --> 00:16:25.413
description of ring signatures,

00:16:25.773 --> 00:16:27.695
zero knowledge proofs, and blinds.

00:16:27.815 --> 00:16:29.495
And then it just moved on to

00:16:29.515 --> 00:16:30.397
the next page and started

00:16:30.417 --> 00:16:31.437
talking about tokenomics.

00:16:31.837 --> 00:16:32.238
And you're like,

00:16:34.817 --> 00:16:36.778
whoa lads you cannot just

00:16:37.139 --> 00:16:40.082
tbc step three zero

00:16:40.102 --> 00:16:40.763
knowledge in your

00:16:40.822 --> 00:16:42.304
implementation yeah it's

00:16:42.345 --> 00:16:44.447
just like profit exactly

00:16:44.466 --> 00:16:47.009
you're like you're like oh

00:16:47.210 --> 00:16:48.672
gosh step one launch

00:16:48.711 --> 00:16:49.592
blockchain step two

00:16:49.732 --> 00:16:50.573
implement zero knowledge

00:16:50.594 --> 00:16:53.196
step three question mark step four

00:16:53.995 --> 00:16:55.797
I was like, I was like, yeah,

00:16:55.876 --> 00:16:57.197
it's one of those things that like, I,

00:16:58.238 --> 00:16:59.899
there are actual

00:16:59.938 --> 00:17:01.119
cryptographers in a

00:17:01.158 --> 00:17:02.639
computer science department.

00:17:02.779 --> 00:17:03.580
And you talk to them about

00:17:03.620 --> 00:17:05.520
this stuff and they're like, Hmm,

00:17:06.121 --> 00:17:07.061
that would require some

00:17:07.142 --> 00:17:08.682
thought and some serious work.

00:17:08.701 --> 00:17:08.962
You know,

00:17:08.982 --> 00:17:09.903
when you ask them about these

00:17:09.923 --> 00:17:11.083
kinds of questions, you're like, Hey,

00:17:11.124 --> 00:17:12.104
how hard is that?

00:17:12.124 --> 00:17:13.785
They're like, how's your math?

00:17:13.845 --> 00:17:14.244
And you're like,

00:17:14.964 --> 00:17:16.385
I stopped doing math when I was 16.

00:17:16.385 --> 00:17:19.207
And they're like, yes,

00:17:19.586 --> 00:17:20.247
you probably want to leave

00:17:20.287 --> 00:17:21.327
this to the adults then.

00:17:21.347 --> 00:17:21.387
No.

00:17:22.508 --> 00:17:22.788
Yeah.

00:17:22.929 --> 00:17:23.588
And you're like, Oh,

00:17:25.057 --> 00:17:25.676
It is true though.

00:17:26.076 --> 00:17:27.137
I should leave it to the adults.

00:17:27.597 --> 00:17:28.738
And then you get these Yahoo,

00:17:28.917 --> 00:17:31.538
just like TBC, zero knowledge, Bruce,

00:17:32.038 --> 00:17:34.180
a novel implementation, the word,

00:17:34.220 --> 00:17:36.080
the novel implementation,

00:17:36.121 --> 00:17:37.661
the three worst words in

00:17:37.681 --> 00:17:38.840
the English language when

00:17:38.881 --> 00:17:40.442
combined with cryptography, right?

00:17:42.251 --> 00:17:45.375
uh oh but anyway anyway

00:17:46.135 --> 00:17:47.637
following up on our well I

00:17:47.657 --> 00:17:48.638
was listening well two

00:17:48.659 --> 00:17:49.859
things one I was listening

00:17:49.900 --> 00:17:51.141
to our show a couple weeks

00:17:51.181 --> 00:17:52.102
ago with the three of us we

00:17:52.122 --> 00:17:52.903
were talking about coming

00:17:52.942 --> 00:17:54.964
back from from uh consensus

00:17:55.025 --> 00:17:55.846
and like one of the teams

00:17:55.885 --> 00:17:57.106
being restaking and I think

00:17:57.346 --> 00:17:58.127
some of the because we were

00:17:58.147 --> 00:17:58.768
talking about that I think

00:17:58.909 --> 00:18:00.829
when we came back and that

00:18:00.990 --> 00:18:01.730
that story reminds me

00:18:01.750 --> 00:18:02.311
because I think we had a

00:18:02.332 --> 00:18:02.952
bunch of those questions

00:18:02.972 --> 00:18:03.712
and people are so like

00:18:03.893 --> 00:18:04.913
ridiculously excited about

00:18:04.954 --> 00:18:06.276
restaking and abs's and

00:18:06.885 --> 00:18:07.185
I'm like, yeah,

00:18:07.205 --> 00:18:08.146
we've had Liquid staking a

00:18:08.186 --> 00:18:08.886
bunch of their protocols,

00:18:08.907 --> 00:18:09.728
and it hasn't really done

00:18:09.768 --> 00:18:10.449
as much as we thought.

00:18:10.469 --> 00:18:11.348
They're like, oh, okay.

00:18:12.170 --> 00:18:12.250
Like,

00:18:12.269 --> 00:18:13.371
I'm sure it'll be great here in Ethereum,

00:18:13.391 --> 00:18:13.550
though.

00:18:13.570 --> 00:18:13.891
It'll be awesome.

00:18:13.911 --> 00:18:14.852
What are you talking about?

00:18:14.872 --> 00:18:15.873
There's, like, way more people.

00:18:15.893 --> 00:18:16.573
It should be fine.

00:18:17.653 --> 00:18:18.335
It's not going to bring in

00:18:18.355 --> 00:18:20.016
the next million users, however.

00:18:20.395 --> 00:18:21.196
Just FYI.

00:18:22.577 --> 00:18:23.238
That is not enough.

00:18:25.799 --> 00:18:26.160
Yeah.

00:18:28.261 --> 00:18:28.622
I mean... Yeah.

00:18:32.444 --> 00:18:32.744
Yeah.

00:18:34.340 --> 00:18:34.740
I don't know.

00:18:34.901 --> 00:18:36.682
Do we need another million users?

00:18:36.942 --> 00:18:38.403
I don't know.

00:18:38.423 --> 00:18:39.844
Financially, from a business perspective,

00:18:40.044 --> 00:18:41.825
we need another million users.

00:18:41.964 --> 00:18:44.346
I'm pretty fucking soon, I would say.

00:18:44.365 --> 00:18:47.488
I'll tell you that the bills

00:18:47.548 --> 00:18:48.769
seem to be staying the same.

00:18:50.170 --> 00:18:50.670
They're getting those

00:18:50.730 --> 00:18:53.290
inflationary yearly increases,

00:18:53.310 --> 00:18:55.451
and you're like, cool, cool, cool.

00:18:55.511 --> 00:18:58.673
Still not making a red cent in Cosmos.

00:19:00.095 --> 00:19:00.434
Yeah.

00:19:01.256 --> 00:19:01.915
Yeah, bills are going up.

00:19:03.380 --> 00:19:04.240
hardware's getting tight too

00:19:04.259 --> 00:19:06.240
we're we're starting to see

00:19:06.520 --> 00:19:07.480
some constraints on like

00:19:08.020 --> 00:19:08.582
there's too many people

00:19:08.622 --> 00:19:09.701
renting servers right now

00:19:10.622 --> 00:19:12.123
yeah there's just people

00:19:12.182 --> 00:19:13.343
really want to lose money

00:19:13.383 --> 00:19:14.762
running running validators

00:19:15.083 --> 00:19:15.943
but waiting for some stuff

00:19:15.963 --> 00:19:17.784
in tokyo for now uh eight

00:19:17.804 --> 00:19:19.904
weeks really yeah

00:19:21.343 --> 00:19:22.963
I'm losing my patience with

00:19:22.983 --> 00:19:24.365
so that's not wildly

00:19:24.404 --> 00:19:25.526
surprising actually as soon

00:19:25.625 --> 00:19:27.288
as I mean we we try like in

00:19:27.307 --> 00:19:28.148
the spring right when we

00:19:28.169 --> 00:19:29.630
were trying to get the um

00:19:30.191 --> 00:19:31.191
the high performance stuff

00:19:31.230 --> 00:19:32.332
for that stress network

00:19:32.873 --> 00:19:34.294
going four weeks for a

00:19:34.394 --> 00:19:36.375
major vendor because they

00:19:36.395 --> 00:19:37.978
were just like oh yeah

00:19:38.178 --> 00:19:39.398
we're ready to rack these

00:19:39.638 --> 00:19:42.521
when we receive them and

00:19:42.561 --> 00:19:43.682
you're like okay well

00:19:43.903 --> 00:19:45.924
thanks that's great I figured

00:19:47.239 --> 00:19:48.400
did figure that but you did

00:19:48.440 --> 00:19:53.585
also say um but yeah I mean

00:19:54.226 --> 00:19:57.710
makes sense yeah well you

00:19:57.750 --> 00:19:58.390
know it's back to you it's

00:19:58.410 --> 00:19:59.111
back to everybody who's

00:19:59.131 --> 00:19:59.912
getting super excited about

00:19:59.932 --> 00:20:01.073
zero knowledge proofs right

00:20:01.713 --> 00:20:03.154
that that that hardware

00:20:03.194 --> 00:20:04.696
ain't ain't ain't a joke

00:20:04.717 --> 00:20:06.298
you think that's for maybe

00:20:06.959 --> 00:20:09.121
yeah maybe could be what

00:20:09.161 --> 00:20:09.882
else is it going to

00:20:11.248 --> 00:20:12.509
I don't, that's a good question.

00:20:12.528 --> 00:20:13.869
I don't know if it's, I mean,

00:20:14.510 --> 00:20:15.632
they rent to a shitload of people,

00:20:15.672 --> 00:20:16.311
so I don't know if it's

00:20:16.491 --> 00:20:20.015
just cloud movement and, and that,

00:20:20.055 --> 00:20:21.256
although I think the, the,

00:20:21.496 --> 00:20:22.737
the services that we use,

00:20:23.337 --> 00:20:24.838
I don't see enterprises

00:20:24.959 --> 00:20:26.000
using in any sort of way.

00:20:26.200 --> 00:20:28.261
Maybe if they like lease space and like,

00:20:29.061 --> 00:20:29.301
You know,

00:20:29.461 --> 00:20:30.883
they want to like I could

00:20:30.903 --> 00:20:32.844
definitely see somebody saying, hey,

00:20:32.864 --> 00:20:34.223
we want to buy racks and, you know,

00:20:34.223 --> 00:20:36.625
17 year data centers because we you know,

00:20:36.664 --> 00:20:37.645
we want this distribution.

00:20:37.786 --> 00:20:38.526
That makes sense to me.

00:20:38.566 --> 00:20:41.747
But but I just don't see I don't know.

00:20:41.826 --> 00:20:42.887
Buying one of bare metal

00:20:42.907 --> 00:20:44.087
machines to me seems like

00:20:44.127 --> 00:20:45.328
it's either enthusiasts.

00:20:45.588 --> 00:20:47.509
It's maybe small business

00:20:47.529 --> 00:20:48.470
doing something with that,

00:20:48.509 --> 00:20:49.330
which seems weird to me.

00:20:50.451 --> 00:20:52.491
um crypto obviously ai

00:20:52.571 --> 00:20:53.593
obviously like those types

00:20:53.633 --> 00:20:55.433
of things obviously crypto

00:20:55.493 --> 00:20:56.335
obviously like there's a

00:20:56.355 --> 00:20:57.035
lot of people writing those

00:20:57.734 --> 00:20:58.675
those I mean there's a lot

00:20:58.695 --> 00:20:59.836
of consultancy work where

00:20:59.876 --> 00:21:01.498
people will depending on

00:21:01.518 --> 00:21:03.138
the sla run it bare metal

00:21:03.398 --> 00:21:04.740
or run it yeah yeah a

00:21:04.880 --> 00:21:05.980
couple of bare metal boxes

00:21:06.019 --> 00:21:07.800
behind or resell services

00:21:07.861 --> 00:21:09.201
too like we like we were

00:21:09.221 --> 00:21:09.923
talking to somebody at

00:21:09.942 --> 00:21:11.624
consensus that runs a a

00:21:11.644 --> 00:21:13.144
pretty large like vps

00:21:14.580 --> 00:21:16.063
service for crypto like

00:21:16.083 --> 00:21:17.683
where they run like rpcs on

00:21:17.703 --> 00:21:18.944
vps for like a whole bunch

00:21:18.964 --> 00:21:21.267
of l1 l2s and behind the

00:21:21.287 --> 00:21:21.907
scenes they're just renting

00:21:21.928 --> 00:21:22.867
the same service renting

00:21:22.887 --> 00:21:23.628
service for the same shit

00:21:23.648 --> 00:21:24.769
that we are you know what I

00:21:24.789 --> 00:21:25.830
mean so and they just take

00:21:25.871 --> 00:21:26.971
those and and basically

00:21:26.991 --> 00:21:27.772
package them up and then

00:21:28.393 --> 00:21:29.534
take one bare metal server

00:21:29.554 --> 00:21:30.414
at 300 a month and turn it

00:21:30.434 --> 00:21:30.835
into 25 vps is at 30 a

00:21:30.855 --> 00:21:32.257
month you know what I mean so woohoo

00:21:38.929 --> 00:21:40.049
Are they making money?

00:21:40.069 --> 00:21:41.310
If they're making money,

00:21:41.351 --> 00:21:43.011
we should be moving into their market.

00:21:43.172 --> 00:21:43.792
I don't know.

00:21:44.032 --> 00:21:44.272
Maybe.

00:21:44.553 --> 00:21:45.054
Maybe they are.

00:21:46.394 --> 00:21:48.496
We're not doing enough to sell the shovel.

00:21:48.556 --> 00:21:49.856
That's what I'm saying.

00:21:49.916 --> 00:21:50.817
I'm in the same business.

00:21:50.877 --> 00:21:52.419
I'm just selling the end product,

00:21:52.439 --> 00:21:56.501
which is the RPC data on a global scale,

00:21:56.521 --> 00:21:57.843
but it's almost the same thing.

00:21:58.603 --> 00:21:58.883
What's that?

00:21:59.844 --> 00:22:00.944
I mean, that's also what Akash does,

00:22:00.964 --> 00:22:01.065
right?

00:22:01.085 --> 00:22:02.986
That's what they're trying to do.

00:22:05.248 --> 00:22:05.847
Yeah, I guess so.

00:22:05.988 --> 00:22:06.648
I mean, they're

00:22:07.724 --> 00:22:08.665
They are cutting.

00:22:10.247 --> 00:22:10.426
Yeah,

00:22:10.507 --> 00:22:11.247
I thought there they were just

00:22:11.646 --> 00:22:14.388
reselling VPSs at a higher rate.

00:22:15.068 --> 00:22:16.630
Just get an Amazon 8 VPS and

00:22:16.650 --> 00:22:19.152
then just put it on Akash

00:22:19.172 --> 00:22:20.292
and sell it at a higher number.

00:22:20.952 --> 00:22:21.712
No, no, no.

00:22:22.074 --> 00:22:23.054
Now, granted, this was years ago.

00:22:23.153 --> 00:22:23.755
Last I saw,

00:22:23.775 --> 00:22:26.957
it was most Akash servers were

00:22:27.017 --> 00:22:27.777
actually at Hetzner.

00:22:28.376 --> 00:22:28.917
And then they were just

00:22:28.938 --> 00:22:29.938
basically shocking.

00:22:30.199 --> 00:22:30.538
Amazing.

00:22:30.679 --> 00:22:30.878
Yeah.

00:22:33.681 --> 00:22:34.141
Unbelievable.

00:22:35.119 --> 00:22:36.040
which technically might be

00:22:36.080 --> 00:22:38.501
allowed now under Hudson's revised TOS.

00:22:38.521 --> 00:22:39.343
So I think we're all good.

00:22:39.903 --> 00:22:40.923
Do they have a revised TOS?

00:22:41.864 --> 00:22:42.084
Well,

00:22:42.124 --> 00:22:43.424
they said that they were kind of okay

00:22:43.444 --> 00:22:44.445
with proof of state, didn't they?

00:22:47.647 --> 00:22:49.108
Yeah, it's not as cut and dry now.

00:22:51.029 --> 00:22:51.869
Isn't Solana proof of state?

00:22:52.631 --> 00:22:54.132
Is that when they jacked all

00:22:54.152 --> 00:22:54.731
those people out of there?

00:22:56.104 --> 00:22:57.824
they did the verbiage has

00:22:57.884 --> 00:22:59.365
changed a little bit but

00:23:00.085 --> 00:23:01.865
because solana is so heavy

00:23:01.945 --> 00:23:03.246
they were like and they can

00:23:03.266 --> 00:23:04.906
go um but I don't remember

00:23:04.926 --> 00:23:05.926
the exact verbiage what was

00:23:05.967 --> 00:23:07.106
and what it does it does

00:23:07.166 --> 00:23:08.807
rip through some nbmes

00:23:08.827 --> 00:23:10.167
that's for sure I mean if

00:23:10.208 --> 00:23:11.188
cosmos had more

00:23:11.228 --> 00:23:12.229
transactions on it maybe

00:23:12.249 --> 00:23:12.989
they'd have a problem with

00:23:13.009 --> 00:23:14.249
you running cosmos boxes

00:23:14.308 --> 00:23:17.390
but I think as it is

00:23:17.430 --> 00:23:18.430
they're just like these

00:23:18.470 --> 00:23:19.391
suckers just paying for

00:23:19.431 --> 00:23:20.651
loads of rounds yeah you

00:23:20.671 --> 00:23:21.810
guys want to let them do it

00:23:22.652 --> 00:23:24.092
we're gonna allow it you can

00:23:24.602 --> 00:23:26.022
All these zero transaction blocks,

00:23:26.042 --> 00:23:26.782
you can buy all the

00:23:26.803 --> 00:23:27.323
machines that you want.

00:23:27.343 --> 00:23:28.303
Although, to be fair,

00:23:28.343 --> 00:23:31.125
we did send a hard drive

00:23:31.184 --> 00:23:33.565
and NVMe to the Dark Dimension last week.

00:23:33.585 --> 00:23:35.766
What do you mean?

00:23:36.467 --> 00:23:37.787
Well, so as finally promised,

00:23:37.906 --> 00:23:39.768
we wound down our Mars validator,

00:23:39.788 --> 00:23:40.827
but not before.

00:23:41.788 --> 00:23:42.429
Not before.

00:23:42.568 --> 00:23:44.430
So the context here was like,

00:23:44.750 --> 00:23:45.930
we said we were going to

00:23:45.950 --> 00:23:46.690
wind down in March.

00:23:49.371 --> 00:23:50.292
But extended the grace

00:23:50.353 --> 00:23:51.755
period because people

00:23:51.835 --> 00:23:53.196
really fucking did not seem

00:23:53.217 --> 00:23:53.998
to get the message.

00:23:54.859 --> 00:23:57.022
We posted about it, wrote a blog post.

00:23:57.042 --> 00:23:57.884
Because nobody's looking at it.

00:23:57.903 --> 00:23:58.684
They're not looking at it.

00:23:58.704 --> 00:23:59.487
They're not watching your shit.

00:23:59.507 --> 00:24:00.188
Unfortunately.

00:24:00.208 --> 00:24:00.848
They don't give a fuck.

00:24:01.538 --> 00:24:03.840
We are no longer going to

00:24:03.941 --> 00:24:06.402
pay €250 a month to run Mars.

00:24:06.481 --> 00:24:08.163
And more operationally, like,

00:24:08.723 --> 00:24:09.723
what's the fucking point?

00:24:09.944 --> 00:24:11.144
They're killing the chain.

00:24:11.846 --> 00:24:12.645
Like, literally,

00:24:12.685 --> 00:24:13.846
what are we fucking doing here?

00:24:13.866 --> 00:24:14.867
Well,

00:24:15.208 --> 00:24:16.868
that was when they're converting it

00:24:16.949 --> 00:24:18.410
into a contract, right?

00:24:18.430 --> 00:24:18.750
A neutron.

00:24:18.910 --> 00:24:20.070
Is that what you're talking about?

00:24:20.530 --> 00:24:20.652
Yeah.

00:24:20.672 --> 00:24:20.951
Yeah, exactly.

00:24:20.971 --> 00:24:22.692
So, like, who gives a shit?

00:24:22.772 --> 00:24:22.932
Right.

00:24:23.232 --> 00:24:24.834
There's an end point.

00:24:24.913 --> 00:24:25.074
Yeah.

00:24:25.515 --> 00:24:26.035
Yeah, sure.

00:24:26.075 --> 00:24:26.335
Exactly.

00:24:26.375 --> 00:24:27.996
And you're just like, you're like,

00:24:28.175 --> 00:24:28.616
this entire...

00:24:31.178 --> 00:24:31.979
Involvement in this project

00:24:31.999 --> 00:24:32.778
has been a massive waste of

00:24:32.798 --> 00:24:34.500
time from a value perspective.

00:24:34.619 --> 00:24:34.839
Great.

00:24:35.059 --> 00:24:35.319
Cheers.

00:24:36.980 --> 00:24:37.561
Smashed it, lads.

00:24:37.902 --> 00:24:38.362
So anyway,

00:24:38.382 --> 00:24:41.144
we were given an extended grace period.

00:24:41.163 --> 00:24:42.084
And then it was like, right,

00:24:42.184 --> 00:24:43.404
we're obviously not going

00:24:43.424 --> 00:24:45.385
to renew the six-month

00:24:45.445 --> 00:24:46.666
lease we have on this box.

00:24:46.946 --> 00:24:49.249
So that was going to come to

00:24:49.288 --> 00:24:51.170
an end at the end of this month.

00:24:51.250 --> 00:24:52.790
So we knew we had to wind

00:24:52.851 --> 00:24:53.671
down by the end of the month.

00:24:53.711 --> 00:24:56.133
So just started to look at that.

00:24:56.752 --> 00:24:56.932
Yeah.

00:24:57.594 --> 00:24:58.295
And of course,

00:24:58.315 --> 00:24:59.997
then we had a hard drive fail.

00:25:02.499 --> 00:25:04.500
So it failed at the absolute

00:25:05.162 --> 00:25:06.022
best time ever.

00:25:06.083 --> 00:25:08.585
So twice a day,

00:25:08.825 --> 00:25:10.326
all of the boxes phone home

00:25:10.826 --> 00:25:12.548
with like a notification on

00:25:12.588 --> 00:25:13.349
their current device.

00:25:14.891 --> 00:25:16.772
utilization hard disk space

00:25:16.833 --> 00:25:17.773
stuff like that just to say

00:25:18.114 --> 00:25:20.076
hey still alive like

00:25:20.195 --> 00:25:20.955
outside of the entire

00:25:20.996 --> 00:25:21.936
monitoring stack they just

00:25:21.997 --> 00:25:23.499
push a essentially like if

00:25:23.719 --> 00:25:24.318
you like a discord

00:25:24.338 --> 00:25:25.279
notification like a push

00:25:25.779 --> 00:25:26.840
notification somewhere

00:25:26.861 --> 00:25:28.182
where we can see it and

00:25:28.222 --> 00:25:30.344
just says hey I am box x

00:25:30.384 --> 00:25:31.806
here's my identifier here's

00:25:31.846 --> 00:25:33.467
my top line stats and

00:25:34.813 --> 00:25:35.814
there's anything to worry

00:25:35.874 --> 00:25:39.257
about you know and um this

00:25:39.336 --> 00:25:40.498
actually this has saved our

00:25:40.518 --> 00:25:41.219
bacon on a number of

00:25:41.259 --> 00:25:42.058
occasions when we've seen

00:25:42.118 --> 00:25:43.440
massive hard drive bloat

00:25:43.621 --> 00:25:45.102
outside of what our grafana

00:25:45.122 --> 00:25:46.083
stack and our alerting

00:25:46.123 --> 00:25:48.285
stack would catch this has

00:25:48.345 --> 00:25:49.345
caught it before because

00:25:49.625 --> 00:25:50.506
you literally just see

00:25:51.166 --> 00:25:52.327
twice a day two

00:25:52.367 --> 00:25:53.669
notifications from each box

00:25:53.749 --> 00:25:54.710
with an identifier in a

00:25:54.750 --> 00:25:57.011
kind of table format um

00:25:57.412 --> 00:25:58.212
when they all kind of come

00:25:58.272 --> 00:26:00.315
through at a specific time

00:26:01.703 --> 00:26:03.244
And so you literally see twice a day, oh,

00:26:04.005 --> 00:26:04.445
hang on a minute,

00:26:04.465 --> 00:26:06.165
that's gone up by 4% in a day, right?

00:26:06.227 --> 00:26:07.346
Okay, we need to go look into that,

00:26:07.527 --> 00:26:09.909
or RAM usage really high, or network,

00:26:09.969 --> 00:26:12.009
or whatever it might be, right?

00:26:12.509 --> 00:26:14.451
But anyway, the hard drive failed,

00:26:14.651 --> 00:26:15.372
as it turned out,

00:26:15.791 --> 00:26:16.991
four minutes after the

00:26:17.472 --> 00:26:19.134
daily check in the morning,

00:26:19.854 --> 00:26:20.554
and then obviously got

00:26:20.594 --> 00:26:21.974
caught by the one in the afternoon.

00:26:22.576 --> 00:26:25.176
The monitoring didn't do fucking anything.

00:26:25.836 --> 00:26:26.857
None of the alerts triggered.

00:26:27.357 --> 00:26:28.398
It was weird.

00:26:29.247 --> 00:26:30.847
was totally bizarre but it

00:26:31.087 --> 00:26:32.950
it it turned out some

00:26:32.970 --> 00:26:34.371
because the the drives had

00:26:34.490 --> 00:26:37.232
failed so completely that

00:26:37.393 --> 00:26:39.755
the logs weren't they

00:26:39.795 --> 00:26:41.155
weren't being written uh

00:26:42.876 --> 00:26:43.777
they weren't being written

00:26:43.836 --> 00:26:46.078
to I get I'd assume that

00:26:46.098 --> 00:26:46.900
they would be like

00:26:46.960 --> 00:26:47.960
ephemeral like to ram and

00:26:47.980 --> 00:26:48.601
then just shipped

00:26:49.020 --> 00:26:50.201
immediately but apparently

00:26:50.241 --> 00:26:51.423
they are spilled to disk or

00:26:51.462 --> 00:26:52.483
at least the way we had it

00:26:52.523 --> 00:26:54.244
configured they're being spilled to disk

00:26:54.785 --> 00:26:57.185
nothing was reaching um the

00:26:57.266 --> 00:26:59.106
grafana server for some

00:26:59.186 --> 00:27:00.586
reason that didn't trip an

00:27:00.666 --> 00:27:01.747
alert which is something

00:27:01.767 --> 00:27:02.948
we've been trying to work

00:27:03.048 --> 00:27:04.567
out why because they really

00:27:04.587 --> 00:27:05.729
should have done and

00:27:05.989 --> 00:27:06.969
there's nothing in the

00:27:07.009 --> 00:27:09.769
alert that anyway that's

00:27:09.829 --> 00:27:11.911
another story but crucially

00:27:11.931 --> 00:27:13.070
there's also a dead man's

00:27:13.111 --> 00:27:14.751
switch on the box that for

00:27:14.852 --> 00:27:15.652
depending on the chain

00:27:15.872 --> 00:27:16.972
there's there's a liveness

00:27:17.012 --> 00:27:18.532
check yeah every minute

00:27:18.653 --> 00:27:19.712
that runs and if something

00:27:19.753 --> 00:27:21.814
goes wrong it hard pushes

00:27:22.094 --> 00:27:23.994
one notification to the round robin

00:27:24.886 --> 00:27:26.548
um we have tool company

00:27:26.587 --> 00:27:27.689
phones and it also pushes

00:27:27.729 --> 00:27:28.528
like a pager duty

00:27:29.089 --> 00:27:31.171
notification so it goes to

00:27:31.290 --> 00:27:32.151
one it goes to the other

00:27:32.432 --> 00:27:33.172
one of those things will

00:27:33.192 --> 00:27:34.053
bust through even if

00:27:34.093 --> 00:27:34.752
people's phones are on

00:27:34.813 --> 00:27:36.233
silent everything will kick

00:27:36.334 --> 00:27:39.635
off that didn't work either

00:27:40.435 --> 00:27:43.178
and it turned out that was

00:27:43.617 --> 00:27:45.378
for some really esoteric

00:27:45.419 --> 00:27:47.701
reason which is when the or

00:27:47.740 --> 00:27:49.161
at least it seems esoteric

00:27:49.181 --> 00:27:50.102
but it seems like the root

00:27:50.122 --> 00:27:51.442
cause was that the

00:27:53.234 --> 00:27:55.017
disk that was mounted that

00:27:55.096 --> 00:27:57.357
had the cron tab on it was

00:27:57.417 --> 00:27:59.539
the one that failed and for

00:27:59.640 --> 00:28:00.861
some reason when it was

00:28:00.881 --> 00:28:01.981
trying to access the file

00:28:02.082 --> 00:28:03.702
even just to execute it it

00:28:03.722 --> 00:28:04.564
was getting a not

00:28:04.584 --> 00:28:05.865
accessible error even

00:28:05.964 --> 00:28:07.405
though you could grep and

00:28:07.445 --> 00:28:09.307
look inside the content of

00:28:09.708 --> 00:28:11.288
the file system yeah when

00:28:11.348 --> 00:28:12.450
shit fails it gets all weird

00:28:12.930 --> 00:28:13.891
Yes, stuff gets really bad.

00:28:13.911 --> 00:28:15.231
There's no logic associated with that.

00:28:15.291 --> 00:28:16.491
It was so weird because you

00:28:16.551 --> 00:28:17.952
could SSH into the box, fine.

00:28:18.133 --> 00:28:19.013
You could poke around.

00:28:19.394 --> 00:28:19.994
You could look at the

00:28:20.035 --> 00:28:20.994
contents of the crontab.

00:28:21.115 --> 00:28:22.016
You could even execute

00:28:22.476 --> 00:28:23.817
crontab E and have a look.

00:28:24.257 --> 00:28:24.436
Yeah.

00:28:24.798 --> 00:28:27.459
But if you then try to fire

00:28:27.739 --> 00:28:29.800
the logic implied by the crontab,

00:28:30.221 --> 00:28:31.021
it would be like, whoa.

00:28:31.602 --> 00:28:32.722
But is the dead man switch

00:28:32.843 --> 00:28:34.544
on that box or is it on a

00:28:34.584 --> 00:28:35.564
third box that...

00:28:36.884 --> 00:28:38.125
the dead man switch is on is

00:28:38.185 --> 00:28:40.247
on every box and then if

00:28:40.287 --> 00:28:41.387
where we where we have

00:28:41.448 --> 00:28:42.648
remote signers there's a

00:28:42.769 --> 00:28:44.869
there's a final sense check

00:28:44.910 --> 00:28:45.931
but the final sense check

00:28:46.010 --> 00:28:47.432
is time delay it's like 15

00:28:47.432 --> 00:28:48.992
minutes because there are

00:28:49.032 --> 00:28:50.794
situations where a network

00:28:51.153 --> 00:28:51.993
yeah sure yeah you might

00:28:52.034 --> 00:28:52.674
have a slow network or

00:28:52.694 --> 00:28:53.234
something you don't want to

00:28:53.255 --> 00:28:55.215
be like oh no fuck this

00:28:55.276 --> 00:28:57.857
block hasn't advanced yeah

00:28:57.917 --> 00:28:58.738
you'd be like are you

00:28:58.778 --> 00:28:59.878
kidding me like this is

00:29:00.519 --> 00:29:01.359
especially when jacob's

00:29:01.380 --> 00:29:02.461
doing his shenanigans right

00:29:02.480 --> 00:29:02.881
you just get a

00:29:07.171 --> 00:29:08.813
um but so anyway like we

00:29:08.932 --> 00:29:09.713
basically all of our

00:29:09.753 --> 00:29:10.433
monitoring stack

00:29:10.493 --> 00:29:11.474
comprehensively failed

00:29:11.655 --> 00:29:14.038
except for the two daily

00:29:14.137 --> 00:29:15.578
updates which I still swear

00:29:15.679 --> 00:29:17.661
by uh the second one caught

00:29:17.721 --> 00:29:18.883
it and just went it

00:29:19.002 --> 00:29:19.864
basically just because it

00:29:19.903 --> 00:29:21.505
said here are my stats

00:29:22.125 --> 00:29:23.086
don't know don't know don't

00:29:23.106 --> 00:29:24.067
know don't know don't know

00:29:24.248 --> 00:29:26.150
and you're like well that's not good

00:29:29.748 --> 00:29:32.769
So, yeah, that was all fun and games.

00:29:35.010 --> 00:29:36.692
Had to recover that onto a

00:29:36.731 --> 00:29:39.472
new box for all of five

00:29:39.512 --> 00:29:41.314
days before we were

00:29:41.413 --> 00:29:42.714
decommissioning that server anyway.

00:29:44.214 --> 00:29:46.836
in order to just, just issue a,

00:29:46.955 --> 00:29:47.856
and this happened also,

00:29:47.876 --> 00:29:48.777
this happened to like eight

00:29:48.817 --> 00:29:49.557
or nine in the evening.

00:29:50.137 --> 00:29:51.077
So it's after the point

00:29:51.117 --> 00:29:51.978
where we could go and

00:29:53.318 --> 00:29:55.779
access a company ledger in

00:29:55.799 --> 00:29:57.881
the bank vault or the company ledgers.

00:29:58.500 --> 00:30:01.903
There's one for all these, but, um, yeah,

00:30:01.923 --> 00:30:03.042
it was just at that point you're like, oh,

00:30:03.303 --> 00:30:03.583
fuck it.

00:30:03.603 --> 00:30:04.443
Let's just unbond it.

00:30:04.743 --> 00:30:06.184
And then you're like the

00:30:06.224 --> 00:30:07.164
ledgers in the bank vault

00:30:07.365 --> 00:30:08.445
it's eight o'clock at night.

00:30:09.226 --> 00:30:11.287
Can't just, can't just spitefully unbond.

00:30:13.680 --> 00:30:15.140
So it was just a total shambles.

00:30:15.460 --> 00:30:15.661
Like,

00:30:15.881 --> 00:30:17.260
like these guys would just had

00:30:17.320 --> 00:30:19.842
messages from me being annoyed all night.

00:30:19.882 --> 00:30:21.281
I can't believe I've got to fix this.

00:30:21.321 --> 00:30:22.602
I'm so annoyed about this.

00:30:23.022 --> 00:30:23.502
Not being able,

00:30:23.603 --> 00:30:24.982
not being able to spitefully unbond.

00:30:25.022 --> 00:30:25.563
It's like such a,

00:30:25.942 --> 00:30:27.443
such a fucking like last

00:30:27.483 --> 00:30:28.104
minute fail check.

00:30:28.144 --> 00:30:28.884
Like fuck all this.

00:30:29.084 --> 00:30:29.923
I can't even get another.

00:30:29.943 --> 00:30:30.104
Fuck.

00:30:30.124 --> 00:30:30.243
Fuck.

00:30:30.285 --> 00:30:30.565
Yeah.

00:30:44.260 --> 00:30:46.343
absolute absolute shambles

00:30:46.583 --> 00:30:48.644
absolute shambles um hey

00:30:48.723 --> 00:30:49.565
game of notes came together

00:30:49.605 --> 00:30:51.286
though we had nodes up for

00:30:51.306 --> 00:30:52.767
you like point your your

00:30:52.846 --> 00:30:54.867
shit yeah this there was if

00:30:54.928 --> 00:30:56.308
anything there was too much

00:30:56.368 --> 00:30:58.510
sympathy because well I

00:30:58.550 --> 00:30:59.631
mean honestly you you were

00:30:59.651 --> 00:31:00.432
complaining for like four

00:31:00.471 --> 00:31:01.492
hours and like I'm going to

00:31:01.512 --> 00:31:02.773
bed and I'm like give me

00:31:02.854 --> 00:31:03.653
eight minutes I'll get you

00:31:03.673 --> 00:31:04.694
a fucking node I'm like

00:31:05.075 --> 00:31:08.396
like just so give me four

00:31:08.597 --> 00:31:10.538
fucking minutes like here it goes

00:31:11.487 --> 00:31:14.308
The other important data

00:31:14.348 --> 00:31:15.589
point is after an hour,

00:31:15.609 --> 00:31:18.573
I had to be in the pub for reasons.

00:31:18.813 --> 00:31:21.994
And so after diagnosing what it was,

00:31:22.015 --> 00:31:23.375
I just went to the pub.

00:31:25.397 --> 00:31:25.978
As one does.

00:31:26.637 --> 00:31:27.219
As one does.

00:31:27.618 --> 00:31:30.080
And at least one of the guys

00:31:30.121 --> 00:31:31.162
I was with is an ops

00:31:31.241 --> 00:31:33.363
engineer and was just, you know,

00:31:33.423 --> 00:31:34.223
obviously just giving me

00:31:34.284 --> 00:31:35.684
shit for the next three hours.

00:31:36.125 --> 00:31:36.306
Yeah.

00:31:37.205 --> 00:31:37.807
It was just like,

00:31:38.126 --> 00:31:40.288
I kept having to get my laptop out to...

00:31:41.288 --> 00:31:42.069
Basically,

00:31:42.450 --> 00:31:43.769
we needed a server to recover

00:31:43.790 --> 00:31:44.310
everything onto,

00:31:44.351 --> 00:31:45.912
so I was waiting for that to be arrived.

00:31:46.112 --> 00:31:48.452
I was kind of hoping that

00:31:48.492 --> 00:31:49.814
maybe when the technician

00:31:49.834 --> 00:31:50.513
went to the rack,

00:31:50.554 --> 00:31:51.515
they were going to be like, oh,

00:31:51.535 --> 00:31:52.515
just turn it on and off again.

00:31:53.655 --> 00:31:55.636
You could have stood up a $4

00:31:55.636 --> 00:31:58.157
fucking AWS box and been done.

00:31:58.959 --> 00:32:00.579
It doesn't matter.

00:32:00.599 --> 00:32:01.779
There's no traffic on there.

00:32:02.260 --> 00:32:02.760
You've done anything.

00:32:03.459 --> 00:32:04.339
yeah should have done that

00:32:04.420 --> 00:32:05.119
should have done that but

00:32:05.400 --> 00:32:09.041
anyway yeah um yeah did did

00:32:09.082 --> 00:32:10.163
manage to get hold of a box

00:32:10.182 --> 00:32:13.023
a couple hours later um all

00:32:13.064 --> 00:32:15.625
fun and games um and then

00:32:15.766 --> 00:32:16.926
spitefully unbonded the day

00:32:17.067 --> 00:32:19.468
after so or two days after

00:32:19.508 --> 00:32:22.169
or something like that with

00:32:22.209 --> 00:32:24.530
my new machine yeah exactly

00:32:24.570 --> 00:32:25.711
like this is a one month

00:32:25.750 --> 00:32:27.011
rental motherfuckers I do

00:32:27.051 --> 00:32:28.012
not intend to renew it

00:32:29.932 --> 00:32:31.491
Robert asked, did Null quit the pod?

00:32:31.592 --> 00:32:32.291
You would think so.

00:32:32.792 --> 00:32:32.992
Yes.

00:32:33.432 --> 00:32:34.053
You would think so.

00:32:34.313 --> 00:32:37.093
And do we have proof of life

00:32:37.133 --> 00:32:38.094
since I saw him in Austin?

00:32:38.134 --> 00:32:38.814
I think we do, right?

00:32:39.094 --> 00:32:39.894
We do have proof of life

00:32:40.314 --> 00:32:42.234
because he did make it back to Australia.

00:32:42.275 --> 00:32:42.974
Did he come on the show?

00:32:43.355 --> 00:32:43.815
He did not.

00:32:43.954 --> 00:32:45.015
No, it's been three weeks.

00:32:45.535 --> 00:32:45.734
Yeah.

00:32:47.496 --> 00:32:47.655
Yep.

00:32:49.056 --> 00:32:50.016
It's a poor effort.

00:32:50.115 --> 00:32:50.695
It's a poor effort.

00:32:50.756 --> 00:32:51.455
It's a poor effort.

00:32:51.875 --> 00:32:52.096
It is.

00:32:52.317 --> 00:32:53.916
Like, let's call it what it is.

00:32:54.156 --> 00:32:55.336
Absence has been noted.

00:32:55.576 --> 00:32:56.636
It's not looking good for

00:32:56.656 --> 00:32:57.377
when there's an actual

00:32:57.877 --> 00:32:58.597
little one in the house.

00:32:59.436 --> 00:32:59.636
Yeah.

00:32:59.997 --> 00:33:01.458
That's like, you know, you know,

00:33:01.498 --> 00:33:02.919
when you fuck up something,

00:33:02.959 --> 00:33:05.320
I can't make it, you know,

00:33:05.340 --> 00:33:06.521
when you fuck up something on a,

00:33:06.662 --> 00:33:08.202
on a Linux host and it says, or,

00:33:09.403 --> 00:33:10.183
or is it when you do

00:33:10.564 --> 00:33:12.025
incorrect pseudo attempts and it goes,

00:33:12.846 --> 00:33:14.467
it goes, somebody has been notified.

00:33:15.711 --> 00:33:16.271
You're like, it's me.

00:33:16.991 --> 00:33:17.613
Yeah, you're like,

00:33:17.712 --> 00:33:18.874
I'm the guy that's been notified.

00:33:19.094 --> 00:33:21.155
But I feel like that's what Nile's done.

00:33:21.517 --> 00:33:24.519
It's like an administrator

00:33:24.559 --> 00:33:25.421
has been notified.

00:33:25.941 --> 00:33:26.602
It's like, yeah,

00:33:26.622 --> 00:33:28.763
it's just going to Etsy who gives a shit.

00:33:28.923 --> 00:33:31.626
Like, Valib, nobody cares.

00:33:33.489 --> 00:33:36.151
So he has not quit the podcast.

00:33:36.652 --> 00:33:38.614
It has been some pretty bad timing overall,

00:33:38.834 --> 00:33:39.213
both with...

00:33:40.013 --> 00:33:41.194
consensus that's the reason

00:33:41.234 --> 00:33:42.536
both he actually well we

00:33:42.556 --> 00:33:43.395
took a break that week

00:33:43.455 --> 00:33:45.096
right the week after was

00:33:45.176 --> 00:33:45.998
him coming back which

00:33:46.057 --> 00:33:47.557
missed the week after that

00:33:47.679 --> 00:33:49.440
was vacation of some sort

00:33:49.900 --> 00:33:51.000
and the week after that is

00:33:51.060 --> 00:33:52.741
another trip so I told him

00:33:52.961 --> 00:33:53.781
like you can't miss four in

00:33:53.842 --> 00:33:54.762
a row if you miss four in a

00:33:54.782 --> 00:33:57.523
row you're gone I'm like

00:33:57.544 --> 00:33:58.404
we're replacing it with

00:33:58.444 --> 00:33:59.885
somebody else there's lots

00:34:00.006 --> 00:34:02.366
of australians that listen

00:34:02.406 --> 00:34:03.087
to this podcast we could

00:34:03.107 --> 00:34:04.167
pick one out of the out of

00:34:04.188 --> 00:34:05.128
the half australians a ton

00:34:05.169 --> 00:34:06.970
of penny I have there's like

00:34:08.597 --> 00:34:09.237
25 million of them.

00:34:09.297 --> 00:34:09.557
Yeah.

00:34:09.679 --> 00:34:12.639
Rama's on deck.

00:34:13.039 --> 00:34:14.800
You show up at 2100 UTC.

00:34:14.820 --> 00:34:15.139
That's all.

00:34:16.420 --> 00:34:16.641
Yeah.

00:34:17.740 --> 00:34:18.740
No, you should be back next week.

00:34:19.742 --> 00:34:19.942
Yeah.

00:34:20.161 --> 00:34:21.041
Should be back next week.

00:34:21.061 --> 00:34:22.742
You better rephrase that.

00:34:23.702 --> 00:34:24.963
I could better be back next week.

00:34:25.262 --> 00:34:28.704
Do we talk?

00:34:28.724 --> 00:34:31.284
I mean, the last couple of weeks,

00:34:31.465 --> 00:34:33.585
Jacob's been continuing to annoy chains.

00:34:34.085 --> 00:34:34.726
Yeah.

00:34:35.166 --> 00:34:36.427
It is creating some change, though.

00:34:37.025 --> 00:34:38.106
We've had, we've had, there's,

00:34:38.706 --> 00:34:39.947
my upgrade board is empty,

00:34:40.246 --> 00:34:42.847
but our hotfix oh shit board is full.

00:34:43.708 --> 00:34:44.768
So I think, I don't know,

00:34:44.889 --> 00:34:45.949
was Neutron halted because

00:34:45.969 --> 00:34:46.849
of that or that was something else?

00:34:48.070 --> 00:34:48.610
Do you know, Chelsea?

00:34:48.630 --> 00:34:49.791
I don't know if that, there was, like,

00:34:49.811 --> 00:34:50.831
TestNet got halted, but I don't think,

00:34:50.851 --> 00:34:51.913
I don't know if that was Jacob related.

00:34:51.932 --> 00:34:55.094
And then I thought MainNet had a patch,

00:34:55.135 --> 00:34:55.755
but I don't remember.

00:34:56.731 --> 00:34:56.851
I mean,

00:34:56.871 --> 00:34:57.552
there have been a lot of patches

00:34:57.572 --> 00:34:58.213
that came out, right?

00:34:58.353 --> 00:35:00.233
There's a lot of patches that came out.

00:35:00.474 --> 00:35:01.795
Osmosis went this morning.

00:35:02.054 --> 00:35:03.235
Yep.

00:35:03.315 --> 00:35:04.036
Stargaze is coming.

00:35:04.056 --> 00:35:06.277
I'm not sure if Jorge announced it,

00:35:06.297 --> 00:35:07.278
but we ran that.

00:35:08.438 --> 00:35:09.960
I think Say made some changes today.

00:35:12.461 --> 00:35:13.581
But that was really mempool-based,

00:35:13.601 --> 00:35:14.702
but I think somewhat

00:35:14.742 --> 00:35:15.443
related because they think

00:35:15.563 --> 00:35:16.884
there's some sort of traffic storm coming,

00:35:17.025 --> 00:35:17.284
whatever.

00:35:19.362 --> 00:35:20.663
Roman says just IBC channels.

00:35:20.702 --> 00:35:21.103
He's not doing it.

00:35:21.123 --> 00:35:21.563
Oh, that's true.

00:35:21.583 --> 00:35:22.864
He's just flooding IBC channels with,

00:35:23.043 --> 00:35:24.463
with transactions.

00:35:24.503 --> 00:35:25.844
And it is, I mean,

00:35:26.065 --> 00:35:27.985
that osmosis patch today helped a lot.

00:35:28.005 --> 00:35:30.925
Cause we had a shit load of, um,

00:35:31.726 --> 00:35:33.327
of memory issues on osmosis nodes.

00:35:33.387 --> 00:35:33.847
Like it was just,

00:35:33.887 --> 00:35:36.007
they were just sucking Ram

00:35:36.027 --> 00:35:38.847
down and same with, they were,

00:35:38.887 --> 00:35:40.429
they were just, they were miserable.

00:35:40.469 --> 00:35:41.128
Like we have a couple of

00:35:41.148 --> 00:35:42.509
machines that were like, Oh, I mean,

00:35:42.548 --> 00:35:43.148
and stuff like that.

00:35:43.168 --> 00:35:44.610
That was just stupid.

00:35:45.369 --> 00:35:45.949
Um, and we don't get,

00:35:45.989 --> 00:35:46.570
we don't get a ton of

00:35:46.590 --> 00:35:47.271
traffic on those either.

00:35:48.090 --> 00:35:48.670
So I don't know.

00:35:49.536 --> 00:35:50.817
Yeah, but some change is happening.

00:35:53.818 --> 00:35:54.079
I guess.

00:35:54.099 --> 00:35:54.798
I don't know.

00:35:59.000 --> 00:35:59.219
Yeah,

00:35:59.480 --> 00:36:01.041
Ben Davis in the chat says that

00:36:01.101 --> 00:36:02.121
Neutron was not Jacob.

00:36:02.460 --> 00:36:03.222
Yeah, I didn't think so either.

00:36:03.382 --> 00:36:05.543
I thought there was a hotfix

00:36:05.583 --> 00:36:07.003
patch that I think came out in mainnet,

00:36:07.023 --> 00:36:08.202
but I don't think mainnet halted,

00:36:08.322 --> 00:36:08.844
if I remember.

00:36:09.724 --> 00:36:10.603
And then testnet definitely

00:36:10.643 --> 00:36:13.144
halted for a while, but yeah.

00:36:13.945 --> 00:36:17.126
So yeah, I mean, whatever.

00:36:17.347 --> 00:36:17.907
Is it valuable?

00:36:17.927 --> 00:36:18.286
I don't know.

00:36:18.853 --> 00:36:19.954
It's for you guys to figure

00:36:19.974 --> 00:36:20.815
out if it's valuable or not.

00:36:21.414 --> 00:36:22.875
Million monkeys, million typewriters,

00:36:22.914 --> 00:36:23.074
right?

00:36:23.375 --> 00:36:27.775
I mean, I'm sure this isn't the only issue,

00:36:28.175 --> 00:36:29.137
but let's just beat this

00:36:29.217 --> 00:36:30.257
one in the fucking ground.

00:36:32.356 --> 00:36:34.257
Let's make a point over and over and over.

00:36:34.277 --> 00:36:37.239
I think the point that's being made is,

00:36:37.498 --> 00:36:39.378
I'm so smart, I'm so smart.

00:36:41.340 --> 00:36:42.940
DVD, DVD, I'm so smart.

00:36:43.500 --> 00:36:43.699
Right?

00:36:44.601 --> 00:36:45.621
No, I think it's...

00:36:46.672 --> 00:36:48.233
I think it's, uh, no,

00:36:48.253 --> 00:36:48.894
I don't think it's that.

00:36:48.954 --> 00:36:49.976
I don't think it's actually smart.

00:36:50.235 --> 00:36:52.858
I kind of view it as, um,

00:36:54.018 --> 00:36:56.260
I found an issue and

00:36:57.362 --> 00:36:58.563
they're not taking me seriously.

00:36:59.704 --> 00:37:00.764
This can't be a bigger thing

00:37:00.784 --> 00:37:02.025
that would halt your money

00:37:02.065 --> 00:37:02.766
making machines.

00:37:03.626 --> 00:37:04.668
So I'm going to do something

00:37:04.788 --> 00:37:06.670
to prove that it can be done.

00:37:07.590 --> 00:37:08.271
And instead of doing it in

00:37:08.351 --> 00:37:09.572
one chain and having it fixed,

00:37:09.592 --> 00:37:10.512
I'm just going to rotate on

00:37:10.572 --> 00:37:12.375
every single one and just

00:37:12.414 --> 00:37:14.936
keep pointing out how right I am, which

00:37:16.657 --> 00:37:20.860
okay like is it valid yeah

00:37:21.000 --> 00:37:22.221
fix it it's great I mean it

00:37:22.240 --> 00:37:24.581
might it might get you it

00:37:24.621 --> 00:37:26.101
might get you paid I guess

00:37:26.422 --> 00:37:27.282
which is no I don't I don't

00:37:27.302 --> 00:37:28.483
think I don't think yeah I

00:37:28.503 --> 00:37:29.023
don't think there's any of

00:37:29.043 --> 00:37:29.903
that though going on right

00:37:31.045 --> 00:37:32.844
there's nothing happening I

00:37:32.885 --> 00:37:34.545
think that that presumably

00:37:34.585 --> 00:37:35.626
is the expectation I

00:37:39.387 --> 00:37:40.369
haven't heard anything like that

00:37:41.728 --> 00:37:43.949
yeah but like not in public

00:37:44.088 --> 00:37:44.949
but it wouldn't surprise

00:37:44.969 --> 00:37:46.329
well whatever you know

00:37:46.369 --> 00:37:47.949
anyway what what leverage

00:37:47.969 --> 00:37:48.590
is there it's just

00:37:48.630 --> 00:37:50.289
basically it's basically

00:37:50.329 --> 00:37:52.411
just it's it's just doing

00:37:52.431 --> 00:37:53.650
this to point the issue out

00:37:53.771 --> 00:37:55.072
teams patch the issue yeah

00:37:55.092 --> 00:37:56.152
but you make a lot of noise

00:37:56.172 --> 00:37:58.032
look how valuable this was

00:37:58.112 --> 00:37:59.172
look how valuable this was

00:37:59.992 --> 00:38:02.052
right yeah sure and like

00:38:02.092 --> 00:38:04.094
that that is that's ego and

00:38:04.333 --> 00:38:05.434
wanting to be right and all

00:38:05.454 --> 00:38:05.934
that kind of good stuff

00:38:05.954 --> 00:38:08.014
like I like that's part of that but

00:38:09.157 --> 00:38:09.998
but it's not like behind the

00:38:10.018 --> 00:38:10.739
scenes where they're white

00:38:10.759 --> 00:38:12.219
hatting and like, Hey, this is a problem.

00:38:12.358 --> 00:38:13.559
And so pay me so I can give

00:38:13.579 --> 00:38:14.659
you this information.

00:38:14.719 --> 00:38:17.161
But I, I do think that like, this is, um,

00:38:18.782 --> 00:38:19.242
I mean, how do you,

00:38:19.262 --> 00:38:20.362
how do you collect money after this?

00:38:21.163 --> 00:38:22.664
It's just fucking pissing people off.

00:38:23.423 --> 00:38:24.664
It's not like it's awesome

00:38:24.684 --> 00:38:25.385
business development.

00:38:26.224 --> 00:38:27.005
I'm going to shit on your

00:38:27.045 --> 00:38:28.545
chain until you fix it.

00:38:28.626 --> 00:38:29.106
Now pay me.

00:38:30.947 --> 00:38:31.307
I mean,

00:38:31.628 --> 00:38:33.389
that's really what I'm doing with

00:38:33.409 --> 00:38:34.949
my PhD to be fair.

00:38:35.030 --> 00:38:35.809
So I mean,

00:38:36.771 --> 00:38:39.032
I've basically written the systematic,

00:38:39.373 --> 00:38:40.693
not a systematic takedown,

00:38:40.713 --> 00:38:42.994
but like a pretty, yeah, I think,

00:38:43.855 --> 00:38:46.336
you know what the thing is, the thing.

00:38:47.657 --> 00:38:47.858
Okay.

00:38:48.038 --> 00:38:49.278
So obviously just like a

00:38:49.318 --> 00:38:51.079
massive shit on proof of stake, right?

00:38:51.099 --> 00:38:52.420
That is one of the things I've done.

00:38:52.460 --> 00:38:52.661
Right.

00:38:53.481 --> 00:38:54.802
But the thing is,

00:38:55.021 --> 00:38:56.943
everybody knows proof of stake is fucked.

00:38:57.023 --> 00:38:57.983
Like everybody who actually

00:38:58.023 --> 00:38:59.505
seriously works with proof of stake is

00:39:00.565 --> 00:39:01.445
Except people who are

00:39:01.485 --> 00:39:02.806
delusional knows proof of

00:39:02.826 --> 00:39:04.007
stake is kind of fucked and

00:39:04.047 --> 00:39:06.106
knows that it's incredibly,

00:39:06.226 --> 00:39:10.967
incredibly dependent on

00:39:11.088 --> 00:39:12.728
factors that are exogenous

00:39:12.768 --> 00:39:14.188
to the blockchain itself.

00:39:14.349 --> 00:39:18.230
And like, this is the... Yeah.

00:39:18.489 --> 00:39:20.170
I mean, it's kind of back to like,

00:39:20.210 --> 00:39:21.650
why do I work on digital cash now?

00:39:21.809 --> 00:39:23.570
Like as a thing that I think

00:39:23.971 --> 00:39:25.570
blockchains need to work.

00:39:26.050 --> 00:39:27.472
It's because I have given up

00:39:27.751 --> 00:39:29.311
on the idea that...

00:39:31.010 --> 00:39:32.572
blockchain can be walled off

00:39:32.612 --> 00:39:33.693
from the rest of the world

00:39:33.753 --> 00:39:34.693
it can be its own little

00:39:34.793 --> 00:39:36.213
perfect platonic walled

00:39:36.253 --> 00:39:38.335
garden and work that was

00:39:38.396 --> 00:39:40.836
the dream for bitcoin it

00:39:40.956 --> 00:39:41.898
kind of worked because it

00:39:41.938 --> 00:39:42.998
was the first for some

00:39:43.097 --> 00:39:44.478
broken definition of work

00:39:44.838 --> 00:39:46.139
and now you know all these

00:39:46.159 --> 00:39:46.981
other changes that trying

00:39:47.001 --> 00:39:48.402
to secure value or stable

00:39:48.442 --> 00:39:51.342
tokens or create economic

00:39:51.382 --> 00:39:52.523
systems with with like a

00:39:52.583 --> 00:39:54.184
completely everything must

00:39:54.224 --> 00:39:55.246
be contained within the

00:39:55.306 --> 00:39:57.286
logic and the protocol and

00:39:57.447 --> 00:40:00.188
anything outside you know oh you know it

00:40:02.144 --> 00:40:02.545
you can't,

00:40:02.644 --> 00:40:05.606
you can't endogenously like

00:40:05.766 --> 00:40:06.907
contain all of that stuff

00:40:07.007 --> 00:40:07.847
and still have it work.

00:40:07.927 --> 00:40:08.367
It's like, no,

00:40:08.628 --> 00:40:10.208
some things like there has

00:40:10.248 --> 00:40:10.929
to be a knowledge of an

00:40:10.969 --> 00:40:11.789
outside world where there's

00:40:11.809 --> 00:40:12.630
an economy going on,

00:40:12.650 --> 00:40:13.610
where there's taxation,

00:40:13.670 --> 00:40:15.090
where there's work.

00:40:17.012 --> 00:40:17.152
Yeah.

00:40:17.192 --> 00:40:18.172
I mean, I mean,

00:40:18.192 --> 00:40:19.333
that's the logic of proof of work,

00:40:19.393 --> 00:40:19.813
I suppose.

00:40:19.833 --> 00:40:20.132
So, you know,

00:40:20.152 --> 00:40:21.173
that's maybe another reason

00:40:21.193 --> 00:40:22.153
why proof of work kind of

00:40:22.173 --> 00:40:24.335
still works for some definition of work.

00:40:25.496 --> 00:40:25.615
Um,

00:40:27.436 --> 00:40:28.596
Hey, whatever, man.

00:40:28.757 --> 00:40:29.197
Whatever.

00:40:29.217 --> 00:40:31.777
I was reading the Arbitrum

00:40:31.797 --> 00:40:33.858
docs the other day to look

00:40:33.898 --> 00:40:34.677
at where they're up to on

00:40:34.697 --> 00:40:37.539
their current roadmap for L2 stuff.

00:40:38.260 --> 00:40:41.481
And some of their docs, man,

00:40:41.501 --> 00:40:43.201
they just say the quiet bit out loud.

00:40:43.300 --> 00:40:44.300
It's fucking great.

00:40:44.320 --> 00:40:46.041
They just be like, blah, blah, blah, blah,

00:40:46.061 --> 00:40:46.362
blah.

00:40:46.581 --> 00:40:48.463
But we've all agreed that

00:40:48.483 --> 00:40:50.063
this just happens off-chain.

00:40:50.103 --> 00:40:51.403
And you're like, okay, awesome.

00:40:51.443 --> 00:40:52.503
So you're exploitable is

00:40:52.523 --> 00:40:52.943
what you're saying.

00:40:52.983 --> 00:40:54.364
They're like, yeah, but you know...

00:40:55.585 --> 00:40:57.266
If there's something to get rewritten,

00:40:57.545 --> 00:40:59.947
you'd need 50% of the validating power.

00:40:59.987 --> 00:41:01.226
That's like impossible.

00:41:01.266 --> 00:41:03.288
You're like, it's not fucking impossible.

00:41:03.327 --> 00:41:04.367
What's wrong with you people?

00:41:04.387 --> 00:41:05.347
They're like,

00:41:05.768 --> 00:41:07.449
we could secure our rollups

00:41:07.748 --> 00:41:09.070
with zero knowledge proofs,

00:41:09.170 --> 00:41:09.989
but we're going to use

00:41:10.190 --> 00:41:12.971
optimistic proofs because you know,

00:41:16.414 --> 00:41:18.275
it's much easier to have a

00:41:18.335 --> 00:41:19.416
general purpose smart

00:41:19.456 --> 00:41:20.777
contract VM that's fully

00:41:20.818 --> 00:41:23.079
compatible with Solidity.

00:41:23.119 --> 00:41:24.719
And you're like, oh, cool, right.

00:41:24.800 --> 00:41:26.641
So we just got no fucking security.

00:41:26.740 --> 00:41:27.400
Awesome.

00:41:28.300 --> 00:41:28.702
Well,

00:41:28.782 --> 00:41:30.541
it's not very cool to be pessimistic.

00:41:30.581 --> 00:41:32.302
You got to be optimistic these days.

00:41:33.143 --> 00:41:33.403
Yeah.

00:41:34.543 --> 00:41:35.704
There's definitely some bad

00:41:35.804 --> 00:41:36.766
ideas in that kind of

00:41:36.846 --> 00:41:38.186
architecture where you're like, hey, shit,

00:41:38.226 --> 00:41:38.867
I remember this.

00:41:38.907 --> 00:41:40.246
This is called ICS.

00:41:43.309 --> 00:41:43.588
Anyway.

00:41:44.577 --> 00:41:45.637
I love shitting on proof of stake.

00:41:45.679 --> 00:41:46.438
It's like so much fun.

00:41:47.179 --> 00:41:49.503
Ooh, it really, it really warms my heart,

00:41:49.523 --> 00:41:50.804
which I do need to warm myself.

00:41:50.864 --> 00:41:51.947
Cause it's fucking freezing

00:41:51.967 --> 00:41:52.768
in this country right now.

00:41:52.788 --> 00:41:53.768
Well, it's not freezing.

00:41:53.829 --> 00:41:54.650
It's not warm either.

00:41:54.670 --> 00:41:54.710
Um,

00:41:56.775 --> 00:41:57.355
So anyway,

00:41:57.375 --> 00:42:01.677
to continue shitting on proof of stake,

00:42:03.119 --> 00:42:04.739
Zaki had a great tweet this week.

00:42:04.800 --> 00:42:06.081
So I was on Cosmos Twitter.

00:42:06.101 --> 00:42:08.501
Don't at me.

00:42:09.682 --> 00:42:10.483
Zaki said,

00:42:10.983 --> 00:42:12.925
if you are a pre-launch Cosmos project,

00:42:13.284 --> 00:42:14.905
delaying launch to fork or

00:42:14.965 --> 00:42:16.306
replace the staking module

00:42:16.447 --> 00:42:18.248
is advised at this point or

00:42:18.327 --> 00:42:19.349
launch as a proof of

00:42:19.389 --> 00:42:21.250
governance slash authority

00:42:22.110 --> 00:42:24.371
and write a staking module later.

00:42:25.833 --> 00:42:27.094
So I saw that as well.

00:42:30.277 --> 00:42:33.420
What was the basis of that comment?

00:42:33.820 --> 00:42:34.661
So what we're going to do

00:42:34.721 --> 00:42:37.684
here is you get to guess

00:42:38.244 --> 00:42:40.746
what Zaki's key flaw was

00:42:40.806 --> 00:42:42.128
that he was identifying.

00:42:43.010 --> 00:42:44.869
So he has issues with the staking module,

00:42:44.909 --> 00:42:45.510
not governance.

00:42:46.190 --> 00:42:47.070
Governance is fucking perfect.

00:42:47.090 --> 00:42:47.251
He said,

00:42:47.291 --> 00:42:49.271
replace the staking module and

00:42:49.351 --> 00:42:50.710
rewrite it after launch.

00:42:50.791 --> 00:42:52.572
So that's the summary of

00:42:52.612 --> 00:42:57.233
the... So what were... What were,

00:42:57.253 --> 00:42:57.452
you know,

00:42:57.492 --> 00:42:58.972
game show music in the background?

00:42:59.572 --> 00:43:00.833
You've got 20 seconds to

00:43:00.893 --> 00:43:03.414
decide what you think Zaki

00:43:03.454 --> 00:43:04.634
identified as the key

00:43:04.693 --> 00:43:06.675
problems with the staking module, as is.

00:43:08.514 --> 00:43:08.574
Uh...

00:43:09.467 --> 00:43:11.608
The key problems with the staking module,

00:43:11.969 --> 00:43:13.590
not native liquid staking.

00:43:16.391 --> 00:43:16.952
Am I close?

00:43:17.012 --> 00:43:18.032
I should do it, didn't I?

00:43:22.047 --> 00:43:25.289
but then I just I couldn't

00:43:25.309 --> 00:43:27.492
keep a neutral fate yeah no

00:43:27.552 --> 00:43:30.112
built-in liquid staking no

00:43:30.152 --> 00:43:31.653
building I literally saw

00:43:31.673 --> 00:43:32.655
that I saw that and I

00:43:32.695 --> 00:43:33.394
thought of you because I

00:43:33.414 --> 00:43:34.755
like I was like I know a

00:43:34.795 --> 00:43:37.038
man on that statement yeah

00:43:37.217 --> 00:43:38.838
yeah yeah well it does seem

00:43:38.858 --> 00:43:40.119
a little bit ridiculous so

00:43:40.599 --> 00:43:41.721
so I mean I don't know if

00:43:41.740 --> 00:43:43.041
that would be enough to not

00:43:43.121 --> 00:43:44.041
launch with it I mean it

00:43:44.081 --> 00:43:45.503
seems like I don't know

00:43:46.121 --> 00:43:46.722
I'm surprised that the

00:43:46.762 --> 00:43:48.463
governance module is like totally, hey,

00:43:48.563 --> 00:43:49.224
it's fucking perfect.

00:43:49.244 --> 00:43:51.086
Go ahead.

00:43:51.266 --> 00:43:52.548
There were another couple of things.

00:43:52.708 --> 00:43:53.650
I am being a bit of a prick.

00:43:53.670 --> 00:43:54.530
There are a couple of things.

00:43:54.570 --> 00:43:56.494
So he identifies a locked

00:43:56.673 --> 00:43:58.956
vested tokens can stake and

00:43:58.976 --> 00:44:00.097
get unlocked rewards.

00:44:00.177 --> 00:44:01.719
That's definitely a problem

00:44:01.739 --> 00:44:03.342
for core teams and foundations.

00:44:03.802 --> 00:44:04.322
Slow it down.

00:44:04.704 --> 00:44:05.043
Locked.

00:44:05.965 --> 00:44:07.628
lock tokens so that are in a

00:44:07.668 --> 00:44:08.909
vesting contract, right?

00:44:09.771 --> 00:44:10.672
Can be staked.

00:44:10.771 --> 00:44:11.132
No, no, no.

00:44:11.152 --> 00:44:13.456
So core vesting as in the

00:44:13.496 --> 00:44:15.539
Janus file or vesting using

00:44:16.179 --> 00:44:17.101
the Cosmos SDK.

00:44:17.621 --> 00:44:19.664
So meaning that they're locked.

00:44:20.005 --> 00:44:21.085
They have a... What's the

00:44:21.126 --> 00:44:21.567
right word for it?

00:44:21.586 --> 00:44:21.947
But they have a...

00:44:24.271 --> 00:44:25.431
an unlock period that's

00:44:25.452 --> 00:44:27.472
associated to those tokens.

00:44:27.492 --> 00:44:28.052
Sure.

00:44:28.072 --> 00:44:29.273
Those can be staked.

00:44:29.913 --> 00:44:30.132
Yeah.

00:44:30.813 --> 00:44:31.833
And they can earn rewards on

00:44:31.873 --> 00:44:32.773
those even though they're

00:44:32.833 --> 00:44:34.034
locked for X number of years.

00:44:34.054 --> 00:44:35.273
And the staking rewards just

00:44:35.313 --> 00:44:36.635
become available straight away, right?

00:44:37.295 --> 00:44:38.215
Oh, so you just make money.

00:44:38.235 --> 00:44:41.155
So it's kind of like a dividend.

00:44:41.235 --> 00:44:41.376
Yeah,

00:44:41.436 --> 00:44:42.835
it's like the thing of when every

00:44:43.096 --> 00:44:44.835
core team is like, oh yeah,

00:44:44.856 --> 00:44:47.056
we have 1% of supply, but it's vested.

00:44:47.157 --> 00:44:47.896
And it's like, well...

00:44:48.780 --> 00:44:49.860
yeah but you're dumping

00:44:50.101 --> 00:44:51.240
you're dumping it you can

00:44:51.280 --> 00:44:52.422
make it so that it's a huge

00:44:52.481 --> 00:44:53.862
cliff so that you actually

00:44:53.882 --> 00:44:56.103
get almost all of it in the

00:44:56.143 --> 00:44:57.324
first six months if you

00:44:57.344 --> 00:44:59.704
wanted right but also you

00:44:59.744 --> 00:45:00.965
can just stake it anyway

00:45:01.146 --> 00:45:02.246
and then the staking

00:45:02.286 --> 00:45:04.327
rewards are going to during

00:45:04.347 --> 00:45:05.307
that bit where the price is

00:45:05.347 --> 00:45:06.608
going up just after launch

00:45:06.748 --> 00:45:09.769
you can sell them yeah and

00:45:10.050 --> 00:45:11.451
bonuses that they bonuses

00:45:11.471 --> 00:45:12.731
they stake it to their own validator too

00:45:13.717 --> 00:45:14.498
Well,

00:45:14.737 --> 00:45:17.820
or then require the validator teams

00:45:17.900 --> 00:45:19.141
to not sell their tokens.

00:45:19.322 --> 00:45:20.664
There you go.

00:45:20.724 --> 00:45:22.525
That's also like a big brain move.

00:45:22.885 --> 00:45:24.146
It's very good.

00:45:24.527 --> 00:45:27.110
It's very important to say

00:45:27.150 --> 00:45:28.510
that these tokenomics,

00:45:28.670 --> 00:45:30.052
they're not a Ponzi scheme.

00:45:31.052 --> 00:45:32.733
They're actually a last sucker.

00:45:33.193 --> 00:45:34.552
They're our last sucker scheme.

00:45:35.094 --> 00:45:35.454
Anyway.

00:45:37.114 --> 00:45:38.014
The reverse funnel.

00:45:38.554 --> 00:45:39.255
All right.

00:45:39.315 --> 00:45:40.956
So both those are valid.

00:45:41.396 --> 00:45:42.056
I think the liquid staking

00:45:42.076 --> 00:45:42.936
thing I agree with.

00:45:43.257 --> 00:45:45.297
And that one around vested tokens,

00:45:45.556 --> 00:45:46.217
I totally agree with.

00:45:46.237 --> 00:45:48.038
Those are valid concerns, right?

00:45:48.117 --> 00:45:49.659
Yeah.

00:45:49.878 --> 00:45:50.659
So the other one,

00:45:51.420 --> 00:45:52.760
fixed unbonding period

00:45:52.800 --> 00:45:54.240
rather than a withdrawal queue.

00:45:54.260 --> 00:45:55.860
I would also agree with that.

00:45:56.501 --> 00:45:57.021
What does that mean?

00:45:57.481 --> 00:45:58.902
What's a withdrawal queue?

00:45:59.282 --> 00:46:00.043
I think it's exactly...

00:46:01.726 --> 00:46:02.987
it sounds like with ethereum

00:46:03.047 --> 00:46:04.688
how as more people trying

00:46:04.708 --> 00:46:06.190
to unbond it'll just like

00:46:06.791 --> 00:46:07.371
it'll take longer and

00:46:07.391 --> 00:46:08.271
longer to unbond until it

00:46:08.311 --> 00:46:09.193
gets to a full queue as

00:46:09.253 --> 00:46:10.173
opposed to just saying okay

00:46:10.193 --> 00:46:11.193
well you hit unbond you're

00:46:11.213 --> 00:46:12.355
three weeks out it's just

00:46:12.375 --> 00:46:14.277
like a really simple first

00:46:14.317 --> 00:46:15.478
in first out to stop a bank

00:46:15.577 --> 00:46:16.478
run I guess right right

00:46:16.518 --> 00:46:17.179
right right right right

00:46:17.219 --> 00:46:18.179
right because only certain

00:46:18.199 --> 00:46:19.300
because only certain amount

00:46:19.320 --> 00:46:21.322
can unbond in each epic

00:46:21.802 --> 00:46:22.963
right is that what it was I

00:46:22.983 --> 00:46:24.804
think or like in each time period

00:46:27.146 --> 00:46:28.108
Something like that.

00:46:28.128 --> 00:46:29.068
Yeah, that sounds right.

00:46:29.449 --> 00:46:29.929
Something like that.

00:46:30.271 --> 00:46:33.253
So you can't have not 40% of

00:46:34.034 --> 00:46:35.456
bonding tokens can unbond

00:46:35.617 --> 00:46:37.278
an all-coming due at 30 days, right?

00:46:37.318 --> 00:46:39.481
Because there has to be only

00:46:39.501 --> 00:46:40.302
a certain number can be

00:46:40.443 --> 00:46:42.585
unbonded over a period, right?

00:46:42.766 --> 00:46:43.266
Something like that.

00:46:43.407 --> 00:46:44.327
I think so, yeah.

00:46:45.963 --> 00:46:46.804
It's pretty fucking valid.

00:46:46.905 --> 00:46:47.085
Okay.

00:46:47.164 --> 00:46:47.846
What else?

00:46:48.447 --> 00:46:48.746
I like it.

00:46:48.887 --> 00:46:49.967
And then the cumulative

00:46:50.007 --> 00:46:51.851
effect of these is down

00:46:51.990 --> 00:46:53.391
only token dynamics.

00:46:53.431 --> 00:46:54.773
That's just a statement that

00:46:54.793 --> 00:46:56.255
he kind of ended it on.

00:46:56.315 --> 00:46:58.538
Well, I mean, honestly, I mean, okay.

00:47:01.007 --> 00:47:04.429
I mean, you can download fucking anything.

00:47:05.489 --> 00:47:06.391
Yeah, exactly.

00:47:07.791 --> 00:47:08.052
To be fair,

00:47:08.072 --> 00:47:09.012
there are actually a few more

00:47:09.032 --> 00:47:09.652
things than that.

00:47:10.213 --> 00:47:11.574
It's actually quite a good thread,

00:47:11.614 --> 00:47:12.956
despite having introduced

00:47:13.056 --> 00:47:17.838
it with a kind of... What's the word?

00:47:17.858 --> 00:47:20.061
I kind of introduced it very facetiously,

00:47:20.081 --> 00:47:21.981
but actually it's a good Twitter thread.

00:47:22.322 --> 00:47:23.242
Zaki makes some good points.

00:47:24.003 --> 00:47:26.025
Um... Uh...

00:47:27.166 --> 00:47:27.447
Yeah.

00:47:27.927 --> 00:47:31.351
I'm just like, yeah, basically.

00:47:31.592 --> 00:47:32.472
I'm so glad we figured this

00:47:32.512 --> 00:47:33.173
out three to four years

00:47:33.373 --> 00:47:34.876
after the extracted millions.

00:47:34.896 --> 00:47:35.657
I don't know if he meant to

00:47:35.677 --> 00:47:37.039
say he extracted millions

00:47:37.239 --> 00:47:38.521
or the extracted millions,

00:47:38.601 --> 00:47:40.023
but I think probably both.

00:47:40.043 --> 00:47:41.083
I think they're both accurate.

00:47:46.155 --> 00:47:46.255
Oh,

00:47:46.295 --> 00:47:48.016
you don't mean Rama has extracted

00:47:48.036 --> 00:47:48.315
millions.

00:47:48.356 --> 00:47:50.237
I said, well, Rama has a great lawn,

00:47:50.536 --> 00:47:51.356
but I don't know that his

00:47:51.416 --> 00:47:52.456
lawn costs millions.

00:47:53.077 --> 00:47:54.057
No, I mean Zaki.

00:47:54.297 --> 00:47:56.338
He's calling out Zaki

00:47:56.358 --> 00:47:57.079
specifically for calling

00:47:57.099 --> 00:47:58.480
that out when he extracted millions.

00:47:59.539 --> 00:48:03.902
But they, or them, or the,

00:48:04.202 --> 00:48:05.021
with a capital T,

00:48:05.181 --> 00:48:07.182
extracted millions is all valid, I think.

00:48:08.074 --> 00:48:09.416
yeah yeah I'm surprised but

00:48:09.456 --> 00:48:10.235
governance totally works

00:48:10.295 --> 00:48:12.056
like this idea of elected

00:48:12.097 --> 00:48:13.677
officials great don't worry

00:48:13.697 --> 00:48:15.018
about that it's totally

00:48:15.039 --> 00:48:20.561
fantastic um so yeah yeah

00:48:20.601 --> 00:48:22.041
that's that's awesome I

00:48:22.081 --> 00:48:23.222
mean those are those are

00:48:23.262 --> 00:48:24.884
good concerns so what's was

00:48:24.903 --> 00:48:25.824
there a solution in that

00:48:26.085 --> 00:48:26.864
twitter thread was there

00:48:26.885 --> 00:48:28.286
like hey this is how we're

00:48:28.306 --> 00:48:30.047
going to fix it I assume

00:48:30.086 --> 00:48:31.447
you don't use the cosmos

00:48:31.527 --> 00:48:32.447
sdk as the solution

00:48:33.811 --> 00:48:34.532
None of that's fixable.

00:48:34.791 --> 00:48:36.052
Well, liquid staking, it could be.

00:48:36.311 --> 00:48:37.612
I thought, isn't osmosis doing that?

00:48:38.413 --> 00:48:39.472
Well, there's that one.

00:48:39.512 --> 00:48:41.353
There's that general purpose one.

00:48:41.393 --> 00:48:43.233
There's that design for the hub,

00:48:43.313 --> 00:48:44.393
which never got used, right?

00:48:47.074 --> 00:48:47.494
Everything else,

00:48:47.574 --> 00:48:49.855
isn't everything else... I mean,

00:48:49.875 --> 00:48:50.795
the vested token things,

00:48:50.815 --> 00:48:52.755
that seems like that's totally changeable,

00:48:53.315 --> 00:48:53.474
right?

00:48:53.994 --> 00:48:54.315
Yeah,

00:48:54.474 --> 00:48:57.416
but it would require... It would

00:48:57.456 --> 00:48:58.376
require some cunt to

00:48:58.416 --> 00:49:00.376
understand how the Cosmos SDK works,

00:49:00.436 --> 00:49:00.655
right?

00:49:00.836 --> 00:49:02.396
And there's only like 10 people that do,

00:49:02.757 --> 00:49:03.317
and all of them...

00:49:04.186 --> 00:49:05.871
I pay too much money now to

00:49:06.532 --> 00:49:07.554
do that stuff because

00:49:07.574 --> 00:49:08.976
they've got dev teams that

00:49:08.996 --> 00:49:12.163
sort of do whatever, man.

00:49:12.184 --> 00:49:15.329
That seems a little bit pessimistic.

00:49:16.157 --> 00:49:16.338
No,

00:49:16.398 --> 00:49:18.940
but I genuinely like the cosmos SDK is

00:49:19.059 --> 00:49:19.981
like, so, so I made,

00:49:20.101 --> 00:49:21.242
I think I made this joke.

00:49:21.922 --> 00:49:22.983
I'm not hallucinating this.

00:49:23.003 --> 00:49:24.083
I think I made this joke on

00:49:24.123 --> 00:49:25.125
Twitter the other day when

00:49:25.164 --> 00:49:26.286
I was on cosmos Twitter,

00:49:26.326 --> 00:49:27.507
basically trolling for an hour.

00:49:28.106 --> 00:49:30.128
Um, yeah, I, I,

00:49:30.628 --> 00:49:31.550
I was waiting for my coffee

00:49:31.570 --> 00:49:32.351
to brew and then there was

00:49:32.391 --> 00:49:33.572
no coffee and I had to go

00:49:33.592 --> 00:49:34.271
out and get some.

00:49:34.311 --> 00:49:35.753
And before I went out and got some,

00:49:35.793 --> 00:49:37.173
I decided to sit down and

00:49:37.193 --> 00:49:39.315
be salty on cosmos Twitter for an hour.

00:49:39.335 --> 00:49:40.036
So that's what happened.

00:49:40.637 --> 00:49:41.338
Then I went out and got

00:49:41.378 --> 00:49:42.257
coffee and I was like,

00:49:42.277 --> 00:49:44.159
I shouldn't have been so salty anyway.

00:49:44.179 --> 00:49:44.219
Um,

00:49:46.094 --> 00:49:47.516
Cosmos SDK used to say,

00:49:47.536 --> 00:49:49.117
we're the Ruby on Rails to blockchains,

00:49:49.177 --> 00:49:49.376
right?

00:49:49.856 --> 00:49:51.378
And the whole fucking thing

00:49:51.438 --> 00:49:52.277
is that anybody who

00:49:52.577 --> 00:49:53.818
actually worked with Ruby

00:49:53.858 --> 00:49:55.360
on Rails could tell you

00:49:55.380 --> 00:49:56.920
that it was a fucking

00:49:57.019 --> 00:49:58.101
nightmare beyond a point

00:49:58.141 --> 00:49:59.782
because you would look at

00:49:59.822 --> 00:50:01.061
an application stack and you'd be like,

00:50:01.103 --> 00:50:01.762
yeah, okay, right.

00:50:02.242 --> 00:50:03.523
I am a Rails developer.

00:50:04.657 --> 00:50:06.496
I understand how this works

00:50:06.878 --> 00:50:08.657
and all of the fucking mad

00:50:08.757 --> 00:50:09.757
moving parts you have to

00:50:09.797 --> 00:50:11.458
make to speed up your

00:50:11.518 --> 00:50:12.599
development experience that

00:50:12.679 --> 00:50:13.559
actually end up making

00:50:13.619 --> 00:50:15.298
loads of decisions ahead of time for you.

00:50:15.719 --> 00:50:16.760
You spend all your time on

00:50:16.820 --> 00:50:17.880
picking the decisions that

00:50:17.900 --> 00:50:19.260
the framework makes by default.

00:50:19.639 --> 00:50:20.800
You end up re-implementing

00:50:20.840 --> 00:50:22.021
loads of core logic because

00:50:22.141 --> 00:50:23.780
it doesn't work for your use case.

00:50:24.141 --> 00:50:24.940
And then in the end,

00:50:25.101 --> 00:50:25.722
you end up hitting all

00:50:25.742 --> 00:50:27.882
these performance issues because again,

00:50:27.922 --> 00:50:28.722
it's making all these

00:50:28.742 --> 00:50:30.202
assumptions about what matters to you.

00:50:30.342 --> 00:50:31.523
And these things don't matter to you.

00:50:32.222 --> 00:50:33.202
doubly not in a production

00:50:33.282 --> 00:50:33.804
app and you end up

00:50:33.864 --> 00:50:35.204
rewriting these things and

00:50:35.324 --> 00:50:37.106
worst of all you quite

00:50:37.146 --> 00:50:38.088
often find out you can't

00:50:38.128 --> 00:50:38.947
rewrite them because the

00:50:39.007 --> 00:50:40.088
complexity of those things

00:50:40.128 --> 00:50:41.090
has got to a point they're

00:50:41.130 --> 00:50:42.331
basically unreadable code

00:50:42.351 --> 00:50:43.612
wise unless you are a

00:50:43.652 --> 00:50:44.753
maintainer and you you

00:50:44.793 --> 00:50:45.514
can't change them you look

00:50:45.534 --> 00:50:46.635
at something like oh I'm

00:50:46.675 --> 00:50:48.237
just gonna like I found a

00:50:48.317 --> 00:50:49.998
bug in the orm and rails

00:50:50.539 --> 00:50:51.699
like good luck with that

00:50:51.739 --> 00:50:52.641
like one of the best ruby

00:50:52.661 --> 00:50:54.463
developers I know like the

00:50:54.483 --> 00:50:55.262
only time I think he ever

00:50:55.302 --> 00:50:56.724
touched core rails was to do

00:50:57.554 --> 00:50:58.173
I think it was something

00:50:58.193 --> 00:51:00.255
like a two line fix in the ORM.

00:51:00.675 --> 00:51:02.534
And it like, I think by his account,

00:51:02.614 --> 00:51:03.835
it took him two days to

00:51:03.876 --> 00:51:05.516
work out what the shit was going on.

00:51:05.896 --> 00:51:07.556
And then write like a few lines of code.

00:51:07.576 --> 00:51:09.056
It was like, does that work?

00:51:09.476 --> 00:51:10.336
I'm going to write like a

00:51:10.456 --> 00:51:11.556
hundred fucking tests

00:51:11.617 --> 00:51:13.018
because I have no idea what

00:51:13.038 --> 00:51:13.737
this code does.

00:51:14.097 --> 00:51:16.278
And he was like, he was like a really,

00:51:16.318 --> 00:51:17.318
he spoke at a conference.

00:51:17.338 --> 00:51:18.818
He was a really good Ruby developer.

00:51:18.878 --> 00:51:19.498
And it was just like,

00:51:20.119 --> 00:51:20.820
what's going on here?

00:51:21.079 --> 00:51:21.300
And like,

00:51:22.059 --> 00:51:24.742
The Cosmos SDK is that plus a blockchain.

00:51:24.942 --> 00:51:26.003
But hey, don't worry.

00:51:27.364 --> 00:51:27.784
Don't worry,

00:51:27.804 --> 00:51:29.664
because this isn't like Ruby on Rails,

00:51:29.684 --> 00:51:31.085
where you're building an e-commerce site.

00:51:31.346 --> 00:51:32.766
We're not doing financial

00:51:32.806 --> 00:51:33.987
stuff with this blockchain.

00:51:34.027 --> 00:51:34.989
So don't worry about it.

00:51:35.608 --> 00:51:36.510
It's not like it'll have

00:51:36.570 --> 00:51:37.690
real-world consequences,

00:51:37.750 --> 00:51:40.572
like your vape from an

00:51:40.652 --> 00:51:42.494
online store won't make it to your house.

00:51:42.514 --> 00:51:42.813
Yeah.

00:51:43.755 --> 00:51:43.914
Yeah.

00:51:43.934 --> 00:51:45.615
I mean, that would be a disaster.

00:51:46.757 --> 00:51:47.818
This is just a blockchain.

00:51:47.858 --> 00:51:48.518
Don't worry about it.

00:51:48.539 --> 00:51:49.338
Nothing can go wrong.

00:51:49.418 --> 00:51:49.639
It's fine.

00:51:49.659 --> 00:51:50.559
It's all make-believe shit.

00:51:50.579 --> 00:51:52.161
There's no funds on here.

00:51:52.382 --> 00:51:54.163
It's all make-believe shit.

00:51:54.322 --> 00:51:54.862
No funds.

00:51:55.364 --> 00:51:56.925
It's all just like whatever, man.

00:51:57.565 --> 00:51:58.266
Whatever, man.

00:51:59.447 --> 00:52:00.407
Well, that's good news.

00:52:00.788 --> 00:52:01.648
Making me feel better about this.

00:52:01.789 --> 00:52:02.349
So I think,

00:52:02.869 --> 00:52:03.769
which we've talked about before,

00:52:03.789 --> 00:52:06.291
the way to make real money

00:52:06.972 --> 00:52:09.213
in this ecosystem, launch a chain,

00:52:09.313 --> 00:52:09.875
launch a token.

00:52:11.416 --> 00:52:11.516
Yeah.

00:52:12.989 --> 00:52:14.210
It was back in the day, for sure.

00:52:14.731 --> 00:52:15.411
I think even today.

00:52:16.231 --> 00:52:16.592
You reckon?

00:52:17.112 --> 00:52:17.532
I think so.

00:52:18.554 --> 00:52:18.954
I don't know.

00:52:19.255 --> 00:52:21.155
Not in... Well, but yeah,

00:52:21.195 --> 00:52:23.137
but you can't... You'd have

00:52:23.157 --> 00:52:24.398
to actually put in a bit of effort.

00:52:24.458 --> 00:52:25.119
Like, I don't think... Oh,

00:52:25.159 --> 00:52:25.780
I'm not saying that.

00:52:25.940 --> 00:52:26.039
Yeah,

00:52:26.059 --> 00:52:27.260
I'm not saying... You can't chihuahua.

00:52:27.460 --> 00:52:27.760
No, I agree.

00:52:27.780 --> 00:52:28.461
You can't chihuahua.

00:52:28.481 --> 00:52:30.583
Like, you could... Jesus,

00:52:30.603 --> 00:52:31.764
was chihuahua three years ago?

00:52:31.784 --> 00:52:33.625
I bet you could chihuahua today.

00:52:36.106 --> 00:52:38.347
fuck off I bet you could no

00:52:39.168 --> 00:52:40.228
you can't you think if

00:52:40.268 --> 00:52:41.467
servers 2 launched today or

00:52:41.487 --> 00:52:42.329
there's another if they're

00:52:42.389 --> 00:52:43.608
another like another meme

00:52:43.668 --> 00:52:44.628
coin you think you think it

00:52:44.648 --> 00:52:45.568
would be a totally dead

00:52:46.389 --> 00:52:47.889
total wash yeah nobody's

00:52:47.949 --> 00:52:48.909
nobody's gonna be the best

00:52:49.010 --> 00:52:49.831
hundreds of thousands of

00:52:49.851 --> 00:52:51.050
dollars I don't think so

00:52:51.391 --> 00:52:56.291
cause with cause with I i

00:52:56.411 --> 00:52:57.353
think that's it I think

00:52:57.373 --> 00:52:58.733
there's plenty of dumb money out there

00:53:00.833 --> 00:53:02.914
don't think there is I i I

00:53:02.954 --> 00:53:03.715
think there's plenty of

00:53:03.775 --> 00:53:04.815
dumb money in this world

00:53:05.016 --> 00:53:05.956
but I don't think it's in

00:53:05.976 --> 00:53:07.976
cosmos not from like a vc

00:53:07.996 --> 00:53:09.016
perspective but from like

00:53:09.697 --> 00:53:10.597
yeah like a retail

00:53:10.617 --> 00:53:11.358
perspective yeah I know but

00:53:11.378 --> 00:53:12.557
you do you like that

00:53:12.597 --> 00:53:13.659
doesn't exist okay number

00:53:13.759 --> 00:53:14.599
one that doesn't exist in

00:53:14.639 --> 00:53:17.480
cosmos number two probably

00:53:18.219 --> 00:53:19.740
you know for the better in

00:53:19.800 --> 00:53:24.902
a lot of ways but yeah all right maybe

00:53:25.757 --> 00:53:27.378
Yeah, yeah.

00:53:27.418 --> 00:53:28.739
I don't think you could full

00:53:28.759 --> 00:53:31.699
send a meme coin like you could in 2020,

00:53:31.699 --> 00:53:33.581
whatever that was, 2021.

00:53:33.581 --> 00:53:34.802
Rama's getting quoted a lot

00:53:34.862 --> 00:53:35.661
in this episode.

00:53:35.722 --> 00:53:37.882
Rama says, launch a cartel NFT collection.

00:53:37.902 --> 00:53:39.643
Inclusion has made close to

00:53:39.684 --> 00:53:41.744
a million in royalties for sloths.

00:53:42.045 --> 00:53:43.666
Get the fuck out of here.

00:53:44.186 --> 00:53:46.228
Sloths were launched on Celestia?

00:53:48.349 --> 00:53:48.909
Was it Celestia?

00:53:49.309 --> 00:53:50.150
Or Kujira?

00:53:50.170 --> 00:53:51.650
It was Celestia.

00:53:51.911 --> 00:53:52.210
Celestia.

00:53:54.945 --> 00:53:57.208
that's fucking madness ben

00:53:57.248 --> 00:53:58.849
davis is more profitable

00:53:59.369 --> 00:54:00.791
than sommelier I mean that

00:54:00.831 --> 00:54:04.215
bar I mean that's true

00:54:04.695 --> 00:54:05.715
that's true that's true

00:54:06.097 --> 00:54:07.878
what was sommelier anyway

00:54:08.900 --> 00:54:10.840
uh in hindsight it's just a

00:54:10.880 --> 00:54:11.641
bridge wasn't it to

00:54:11.722 --> 00:54:16.606
ethereum no no no no no not

00:54:16.646 --> 00:54:17.527
exactly it's more like an

00:54:17.628 --> 00:54:19.630
aggregator of um

00:54:21.327 --> 00:54:23.110
Wasn't that creating pools

00:54:23.150 --> 00:54:26.153
between tokens outside the

00:54:26.173 --> 00:54:27.655
Cosmos and in Cosmos type of thing?

00:54:28.516 --> 00:54:30.280
Yeah, something like that.

00:54:30.300 --> 00:54:30.340
Oh,

00:54:30.360 --> 00:54:31.862
so it was bridging tokens in and then

00:54:31.902 --> 00:54:34.304
making a derivative?

00:54:35.969 --> 00:54:36.871
Ben Davis says you guys are

00:54:36.891 --> 00:54:37.711
annoyingly inaccurate.

00:54:38.211 --> 00:54:38.913
Fucking hell, dude.

00:54:39.172 --> 00:54:39.574
It's 117 in.

00:54:39.594 --> 00:54:41.876
Are you fucking new here?

00:54:43.478 --> 00:54:44.579
What the hell, Ben?

00:54:44.878 --> 00:54:45.940
If you have something to say,

00:54:45.960 --> 00:54:46.740
come join in here.

00:54:47.141 --> 00:54:48.543
Ben Davis shocked every week

00:54:48.583 --> 00:54:50.565
at how annoyingly inaccurate we are.

00:54:50.925 --> 00:54:57.373
This podcast could be renamed to 3 to 4...

00:54:57.373 --> 00:54:58.554
somewhat closeted,

00:54:58.594 --> 00:55:00.233
tired nerds try to work out

00:55:00.273 --> 00:55:01.155
what the fuck is on their

00:55:01.195 --> 00:55:02.574
screen at any given time.

00:55:02.695 --> 00:55:05.757
That is what this podcast is.

00:55:05.876 --> 00:55:07.297
This is a podcast of

00:55:07.376 --> 00:55:08.338
engineers and developers

00:55:08.358 --> 00:55:08.998
trying to figure out what

00:55:09.038 --> 00:55:10.278
the fuck you degens are doing.

00:55:10.418 --> 00:55:11.219
That's what this is about.

00:55:12.719 --> 00:55:14.541
i mean and we and what the

00:55:14.581 --> 00:55:15.981
heck we're doing half the

00:55:16.001 --> 00:55:17.382
time I know we're doing I

00:55:17.423 --> 00:55:18.403
just don't know what it's

00:55:18.443 --> 00:55:19.525
actually creating I don't

00:55:19.545 --> 00:55:20.545
know I just want to build

00:55:20.586 --> 00:55:21.807
tools and stuff like I

00:55:21.827 --> 00:55:23.389
don't care what you guys

00:55:23.469 --> 00:55:24.971
are doing I don't fucking

00:55:25.911 --> 00:55:26.871
uh I don't know what I want

00:55:26.891 --> 00:55:28.153
to do anymore I feel like

00:55:28.173 --> 00:55:29.175
you two have got a lot more

00:55:29.215 --> 00:55:30.735
soil than me this quote

00:55:30.815 --> 00:55:32.016
this quote is going on the

00:55:32.056 --> 00:55:33.898
home page which we haven't

00:55:33.918 --> 00:55:34.840
built yet but eventually

00:55:34.860 --> 00:55:35.641
it'll happen but yeah it's

00:55:35.681 --> 00:55:36.922
going on there it's amazing

00:55:37.255 --> 00:55:37.416
You know,

00:55:37.436 --> 00:55:38.777
I was boldly saying to an

00:55:38.836 --> 00:55:40.016
academic earlier today,

00:55:40.056 --> 00:55:41.358
they were talking about, like,

00:55:42.217 --> 00:55:43.679
making a website, or how, like,

00:55:44.039 --> 00:55:44.940
much hassle it was going to be,

00:55:44.960 --> 00:55:45.780
how long it was going to take.

00:55:45.880 --> 00:55:47.380
And I was like, that's a morning's work.

00:55:47.800 --> 00:55:49.001
And then I remembered that

00:55:49.121 --> 00:55:50.541
the Game of Notes website

00:55:50.601 --> 00:55:51.603
still doesn't exist.

00:55:51.682 --> 00:55:52.362
It doesn't exist.

00:55:52.382 --> 00:55:55.184
I was like, yeah,

00:55:55.284 --> 00:55:57.065
but it's still a morning's work.

00:55:58.945 --> 00:55:59.865
But, you know, there was, like,

00:55:59.885 --> 00:56:00.746
this whole thing where it was just,

00:56:00.766 --> 00:56:00.987
like...

00:56:01.750 --> 00:56:02.010
Oh yeah.

00:56:02.030 --> 00:56:02.530
Well, if we,

00:56:02.690 --> 00:56:04.050
if we did a website for this thing,

00:56:04.070 --> 00:56:04.831
it would have to be,

00:56:05.351 --> 00:56:06.331
have to be open source.

00:56:06.411 --> 00:56:07.052
And I was like, yeah,

00:56:07.072 --> 00:56:07.773
just stick it on GitHub.

00:56:07.793 --> 00:56:09.373
And they're like, well,

00:56:09.793 --> 00:56:10.534
it was owned by Microsoft.

00:56:10.554 --> 00:56:11.474
And I was like, look, dude,

00:56:12.175 --> 00:56:13.456
I also have a problem with Microsoft,

00:56:13.835 --> 00:56:15.036
but I really have a problem

00:56:15.056 --> 00:56:16.436
with my time being wasted.

00:56:16.958 --> 00:56:18.398
So for a static website,

00:56:18.958 --> 00:56:21.199
I put it on GitHub, which I've had a,

00:56:21.420 --> 00:56:21.659
you know,

00:56:21.679 --> 00:56:23.541
an account with for like 20

00:56:23.541 --> 00:56:24.882
years or something

00:56:24.942 --> 00:56:25.922
ridiculous at this point,

00:56:25.961 --> 00:56:26.922
however fucking long it is.

00:56:26.943 --> 00:56:28.063
And it's like,

00:56:28.163 --> 00:56:29.664
and then I move on with my life and

00:56:31.853 --> 00:56:33.353
I'm like Kaiser Soze at the

00:56:33.393 --> 00:56:34.655
end of the usual suspects.

00:56:34.735 --> 00:56:36.574
It's just like water for ducks back, baby.

00:56:37.594 --> 00:56:38.454
Your leg straightens out and

00:56:38.474 --> 00:56:38.934
you walk away.

00:56:39.434 --> 00:56:40.076
Exactly.

00:56:40.235 --> 00:56:40.695
I'm just like,

00:56:40.715 --> 00:56:41.715
I'm not fucking doing

00:56:41.735 --> 00:56:42.675
anything more complicated

00:56:42.695 --> 00:56:45.436
than get push origin, get hard pages,

00:56:46.237 --> 00:56:46.536
man.

00:56:46.797 --> 00:56:48.516
That's my website done.

00:56:48.896 --> 00:56:49.777
Move on with my life.

00:56:50.536 --> 00:56:53.777
Anyway, turns out I'm wrong.

00:56:54.077 --> 00:56:54.518
I'm wrong.

00:56:54.577 --> 00:56:56.338
And what we really need is

00:56:56.378 --> 00:56:58.278
to have a fucking web server that,

00:56:59.065 --> 00:57:00.204
With Apache on it,

00:57:00.824 --> 00:57:02.666
hosting a bunch of 80 HTML,

00:57:02.905 --> 00:57:06.286
like we're degenerate since fucking 2002.

00:57:06.286 --> 00:57:07.226
Somebody else, somebody else,

00:57:07.266 --> 00:57:08.527
like another student for this,

00:57:08.666 --> 00:57:09.867
for some other thing, like again,

00:57:10.266 --> 00:57:11.766
a project webpage was

00:57:11.786 --> 00:57:12.786
deploying a whole Django

00:57:12.927 --> 00:57:16.708
app on like in the UC data center.

00:57:17.128 --> 00:57:18.989
I was like a Django app for

00:57:19.009 --> 00:57:20.989
something that could be a static pile of,

00:57:21.168 --> 00:57:24.070
of literally Markdown getting template.

00:57:24.130 --> 00:57:25.210
You got it back down.

00:57:27.347 --> 00:57:28.907
I will use Django on anything.

00:57:29.047 --> 00:57:30.148
I need like a one little

00:57:30.387 --> 00:57:31.887
JSON response instead of syncing.

00:57:32.307 --> 00:57:33.889
I'll slap a bad boy.

00:57:33.909 --> 00:57:37.090
What are you doing with your life?

00:57:37.110 --> 00:57:37.329
Sure.

00:57:37.349 --> 00:57:38.230
See, I thought you were smart.

00:57:39.230 --> 00:57:42.891
It's because I know that's Lambda man.

00:57:43.050 --> 00:57:43.751
After he sunset and all

00:57:43.771 --> 00:57:45.132
those WordPress sites, he's like, dude,

00:57:45.152 --> 00:57:46.711
I'm in a hundred percent Django.

00:57:49.293 --> 00:57:50.472
Riddle me this hot shot.

00:57:50.773 --> 00:57:52.393
How many executions before

00:57:52.432 --> 00:57:54.373
you get charged by AWS for your Lambda?

00:57:56.960 --> 00:58:02.143
Ooh, I think it's a thousand, 1 million,

00:58:02.242 --> 00:58:03.063
unless they've changed

00:58:03.103 --> 00:58:05.164
their TOS 1 million, baby.

00:58:05.184 --> 00:58:08.706
So remind me again,

00:58:08.746 --> 00:58:12.789
why we're using Django because it's fun.

00:58:12.849 --> 00:58:14.630
The Django are ORM is so

00:58:14.730 --> 00:58:15.650
pleasant to work with.

00:58:16.050 --> 00:58:16.751
What's an ORM.

00:58:17.371 --> 00:58:21.112
You just completely the

00:58:21.152 --> 00:58:22.253
rails one and the Django

00:58:22.353 --> 00:58:24.675
one are cut of the same devilish cloth.

00:58:27.711 --> 00:58:29.452
If you've got an admin page.

00:58:31.052 --> 00:58:31.733
Yeah, six of one,

00:58:31.773 --> 00:58:32.652
half a dozen of the other.

00:58:33.492 --> 00:58:34.132
Test them both.

00:58:34.152 --> 00:58:36.934
Oh, man.

00:58:37.373 --> 00:58:39.594
So Zach is saying, I mean,

00:58:39.634 --> 00:58:40.534
not a total shit show.

00:58:41.255 --> 00:58:42.155
So to answer your question,

00:58:42.175 --> 00:58:43.474
you said an ORM is an

00:58:43.635 --> 00:58:45.076
object relational mapper,

00:58:45.576 --> 00:58:49.155
which is a it's a way of if

00:58:49.235 --> 00:58:51.277
you are an absolute object

00:58:51.336 --> 00:58:52.117
oriented programming

00:58:52.157 --> 00:58:54.077
diehard mapping your

00:58:54.117 --> 00:58:56.157
concepts onto a database table,

00:58:56.538 --> 00:58:56.958
even though

00:58:58.170 --> 00:58:58.331
I mean,

00:58:58.351 --> 00:59:00.190
they kind of squint and obviously

00:59:00.231 --> 00:59:09.653
they map, but you know, whatever.

00:59:10.313 --> 00:59:11.853
I gave up a long time ago.

00:59:11.893 --> 00:59:13.653
I, you know, I gave up on them.

00:59:14.235 --> 00:59:15.175
I used to, I used to have,

00:59:15.275 --> 00:59:16.795
I had stickers printed that

00:59:16.835 --> 00:59:18.295
said object oriented code

00:59:18.356 --> 00:59:19.155
is a code smell.

00:59:20.135 --> 00:59:20.835
When I worked to the,

00:59:21.096 --> 00:59:21.715
when I worked in an

00:59:21.775 --> 00:59:22.916
organization that primarily

00:59:22.956 --> 00:59:24.297
wrote object oriented code.

00:59:24.317 --> 00:59:24.597
So like,

00:59:25.538 --> 00:59:27.159
You know, I am as bad as Jacob.

00:59:27.418 --> 00:59:28.139
I am that guy.

00:59:28.159 --> 00:59:29.960
You know,

00:59:30.442 --> 00:59:32.282
I'm waiting to be proven right about bug,

00:59:32.382 --> 00:59:32.682
you know,

00:59:32.882 --> 00:59:34.625
nine months later and just be like, yeah,

00:59:34.844 --> 00:59:35.465
I think the problem was

00:59:35.525 --> 00:59:36.326
actually that you closed

00:59:36.385 --> 00:59:37.666
over state in an object.

00:59:37.726 --> 00:59:38.748
I think that was actually the problem.

00:59:38.768 --> 00:59:42.630
Oh, well, no, actually,

00:59:42.690 --> 00:59:43.471
it was that we didn't find

00:59:43.931 --> 00:59:44.791
product market fit.

00:59:45.132 --> 00:59:45.472
Yeah, no,

00:59:45.492 --> 00:59:46.313
it was probably that you used

00:59:46.393 --> 00:59:47.974
object-oriented programming languages.

00:59:48.034 --> 00:59:50.155
I think that was probably the problem,

00:59:50.235 --> 00:59:50.637
actually.

00:59:51.577 --> 00:59:52.918
Don't tell me about the business side.

00:59:52.958 --> 00:59:53.759
It was probably that you

00:59:53.778 --> 00:59:54.940
used the wrong programming language.

00:59:58.063 --> 00:59:58.784
I'll be in the kitchen

00:59:58.844 --> 00:59:59.644
making a coffee for when

00:59:59.684 --> 01:00:00.565
you want to come and grovel

01:00:01.324 --> 01:00:03.465
about how clever and shit I am.

01:00:04.686 --> 01:00:04.965
You know what?

01:00:05.005 --> 01:00:06.206
They never came and told me

01:00:06.246 --> 01:00:06.927
that it was the

01:00:07.086 --> 01:00:08.746
object-oriented programming language.

01:00:08.786 --> 01:00:09.126
So, you know,

01:00:09.146 --> 01:00:10.166
some people are very stubborn.

01:00:10.186 --> 01:00:13.507
They just won't admit when they're wrong.

01:00:15.369 --> 01:00:17.469
Every fucking POS conversation, eventually,

01:00:17.489 --> 01:00:18.289
when you get deep enough,

01:00:18.329 --> 01:00:19.730
you just end up going, whatever.

01:00:21.590 --> 01:00:22.630
It's like, whatever, man.

01:00:22.650 --> 01:00:23.110
Whatever, man.

01:00:25.168 --> 01:00:25.628
Oh, dear.

01:00:26.469 --> 01:00:27.548
So one piece of news we

01:00:27.568 --> 01:00:28.829
should talk about is I want to hear,

01:00:29.409 --> 01:00:30.710
we're not in this Val set,

01:00:31.610 --> 01:00:32.050
which I think is,

01:00:32.269 --> 01:00:33.250
I'm not sure if it's mainnet or not.

01:00:33.269 --> 01:00:34.391
It is mainnet, right?

01:00:34.891 --> 01:00:36.431
Is Henry at Penumbra.

01:00:37.210 --> 01:00:37.871
So what's going on?

01:00:38.291 --> 01:00:39.512
I know there's some sort of

01:00:39.532 --> 01:00:40.512
airdrop or something like that.

01:00:40.612 --> 01:00:41.012
Is that right?

01:00:41.992 --> 01:00:43.092
So first of all,

01:00:43.371 --> 01:00:44.472
there's no reason for you

01:00:44.512 --> 01:00:45.253
not to be in the mainnet

01:00:45.273 --> 01:00:47.032
because mainnet isn't selected.

01:00:47.492 --> 01:00:49.353
You get delegated into mainnet.

01:00:49.972 --> 01:00:52.673
So fix that for one.

01:00:53.331 --> 01:00:53.570
I will.

01:00:53.710 --> 01:00:54.652
Well, I mean, I, yeah.

01:00:54.931 --> 01:00:55.152
All right.

01:00:55.672 --> 01:00:56.411
Well, I asked you like,

01:00:56.431 --> 01:00:58.393
it must've been a few months ago.

01:00:58.572 --> 01:00:59.213
I was like, is it time?

01:00:59.253 --> 01:01:01.153
You're like, no, it's like,

01:01:01.193 --> 01:01:01.753
it's not time yet.

01:01:02.434 --> 01:01:03.614
Well, they announced it like a week ago.

01:01:03.635 --> 01:01:04.255
No, no.

01:01:04.295 --> 01:01:05.376
I remember, but it was like testing.

01:01:05.396 --> 01:01:06.255
I'm like, should I get involved?

01:01:06.275 --> 01:01:07.817
You're like, you're like, no, not yet.

01:01:09.016 --> 01:01:10.478
Which I, I could hear the pain in your,

01:01:10.657 --> 01:01:11.358
in your eyes.

01:01:12.661 --> 01:01:14.282
Well, yeah.

01:01:14.382 --> 01:01:15.943
So that was still a correct

01:01:15.963 --> 01:01:16.903
call because you don't get

01:01:16.923 --> 01:01:18.405
any delegation for being in test net.

01:01:18.706 --> 01:01:18.885
Yeah.

01:01:19.025 --> 01:01:20.527
So basically what happens is

01:01:20.907 --> 01:01:22.407
people get airdrops and

01:01:22.447 --> 01:01:23.427
then you can provide them

01:01:23.487 --> 01:01:24.929
your developer address basically.

01:01:25.028 --> 01:01:25.889
And then they can delegate

01:01:25.969 --> 01:01:26.769
that airdrop to you.

01:01:27.150 --> 01:01:28.110
And the guys with like the top,

01:01:28.210 --> 01:01:29.110
let's say the top a hundred

01:01:29.152 --> 01:01:30.811
validators with delegations

01:01:31.152 --> 01:01:31.773
go into main net.

01:01:32.132 --> 01:01:32.954
That's how it works.

01:01:33.253 --> 01:01:33.474
Okay.

01:01:35.454 --> 01:01:35.635
Cool.

01:01:35.815 --> 01:01:36.775
And that's all community?

01:01:36.795 --> 01:01:41.398
Uh, or VCs or whoever.

01:01:41.579 --> 01:01:42.099
Oh, I gotcha.

01:01:42.952 --> 01:01:45.052
So provide them to anyone that, uh,

01:01:45.253 --> 01:01:46.153
invested in Penumbra.

01:01:47.134 --> 01:01:50.295
So that, so, um, I mean,

01:01:50.335 --> 01:01:50.956
I don't think we have any

01:01:50.996 --> 01:01:51.956
question around the

01:01:52.056 --> 01:01:55.498
technical capability or

01:01:55.697 --> 01:01:59.920
delivery or execution of that team.

01:02:00.280 --> 01:02:00.460
Right.

01:02:00.561 --> 01:02:01.221
I don't think we have any

01:02:01.501 --> 01:02:02.202
question related to that.

01:02:02.242 --> 01:02:02.942
Like we,

01:02:03.001 --> 01:02:04.362
we know it's an extremely strong team.

01:02:04.922 --> 01:02:06.804
It's extremely strong product, right?

01:02:07.824 --> 01:02:10.985
Like, is it going to work?

01:02:13.327 --> 01:02:15.230
And like, you know what I mean?

01:02:15.369 --> 01:02:17.532
Like, is the market ready?

01:02:17.791 --> 01:02:18.893
Is the market ready for it?

01:02:19.112 --> 01:02:20.773
And is it going to be successful?

01:02:20.934 --> 01:02:21.835
Or is it like one of those

01:02:21.894 --> 01:02:23.135
beautiful ivory towers of

01:02:23.197 --> 01:02:24.958
technology that people say, yeah,

01:02:24.998 --> 01:02:25.978
totally solves these things,

01:02:26.079 --> 01:02:27.739
but it doesn't necessarily

01:02:27.780 --> 01:02:28.641
mean anybody uses it.

01:02:31.643 --> 01:02:35.967
So I think that there is a, I don't know,

01:02:36.068 --> 01:02:36.648
it's hard to say, um,

01:02:37.688 --> 01:02:39.891
like I'm a huge fan of.

01:02:40.677 --> 01:02:42.938
the shade product, which is on secret,

01:02:43.719 --> 01:02:44.639
the shade swap.

01:02:46.641 --> 01:02:49.385
And it doesn't get a ton of usage.

01:02:49.405 --> 01:02:50.445
It gets a decent amount of usage.

01:02:52.807 --> 01:02:54.469
But the amount of usage it

01:02:54.509 --> 01:02:55.989
gets implies a certain

01:02:56.030 --> 01:02:56.971
amount of people that are

01:02:57.010 --> 01:02:57.751
actually interested in

01:02:57.811 --> 01:02:59.213
privacy and understand what it means.

01:02:59.773 --> 01:03:01.914
And my fear is that that

01:03:01.934 --> 01:03:03.496
number isn't big enough for

01:03:04.688 --> 01:03:06.413
numbers existence I mean

01:03:06.512 --> 01:03:07.514
honestly people talk about

01:03:07.554 --> 01:03:08.478
privacy like in every

01:03:08.657 --> 01:03:09.780
aspect of things right they

01:03:09.940 --> 01:03:10.742
they talk about the idea

01:03:11.123 --> 01:03:13.469
but they they give that away all the time

01:03:14.481 --> 01:03:14.961
Well, yeah.

01:03:15.242 --> 01:03:17.224
And like Secret has viewing keys, right?

01:03:17.585 --> 01:03:19.266
So that you can actually view your product,

01:03:19.405 --> 01:03:20.266
your tokens.

01:03:20.907 --> 01:03:22.829
As soon as I've worked with,

01:03:22.929 --> 01:03:24.610
I worked with the Secret

01:03:24.650 --> 01:03:25.590
support team for a while.

01:03:26.092 --> 01:03:27.193
And as soon as viewing keys

01:03:27.273 --> 01:03:29.213
like came into perspective for people,

01:03:29.253 --> 01:03:30.815
they were like, fuck this.

01:03:30.896 --> 01:03:31.896
Can't do that extra one

01:03:31.936 --> 01:03:33.818
transaction to see my balances.

01:03:34.458 --> 01:03:35.699
You're like, well, then why?

01:03:36.380 --> 01:03:37.581
This is a privacy.

01:03:38.202 --> 01:03:38.362
Right.

01:03:38.461 --> 01:03:38.681
I mean,

01:03:38.882 --> 01:03:39.983
there's a communication thing there,

01:03:40.103 --> 01:03:40.804
obviously, but.

01:03:42.233 --> 01:03:43.213
Well, that's like,

01:03:43.393 --> 01:03:44.514
they don't want to give up that trade-off,

01:03:44.534 --> 01:03:45.775
right?

01:03:45.815 --> 01:03:46.336
Yeah.

01:03:46.496 --> 01:03:47.318
It's like what people are

01:03:47.358 --> 01:03:48.099
using the chain for.

01:03:48.139 --> 01:03:51.001
They want number go up, hold Bitcoin.

01:03:51.021 --> 01:03:53.262
They're not worried about

01:03:53.344 --> 01:03:54.525
like their entire financial

01:03:54.565 --> 01:03:55.626
history being leaked on

01:03:55.686 --> 01:03:57.126
chain because this isn't

01:03:57.146 --> 01:03:58.688
their entire financial history.

01:03:58.748 --> 01:04:00.590
It's just some fucking shit coins.

01:04:00.710 --> 01:04:00.931
Like,

01:04:02.945 --> 01:04:03.626
The irony, of course,

01:04:03.646 --> 01:04:05.510
being that we're using

01:04:05.530 --> 01:04:06.331
debit cards and credit

01:04:06.351 --> 01:04:07.632
cards and all the stuff

01:04:07.652 --> 01:04:08.594
that actually matters is

01:04:08.635 --> 01:04:10.016
going to Visa or MasterCard

01:04:10.036 --> 01:04:11.539
and your banking provider of choice,

01:04:11.579 --> 01:04:12.561
but whatever, Matt.

01:04:13.722 --> 01:04:14.403
It's not visible.

01:04:15.586 --> 01:04:16.588
Yeah, no, exactly.

01:04:16.608 --> 01:04:17.688
It's happening behind a closed door,

01:04:18.608 --> 01:04:20.389
and it's part of a

01:04:21.110 --> 01:04:22.510
degenerate cycle of a lot

01:04:22.530 --> 01:04:23.251
of different things that

01:04:23.331 --> 01:04:24.992
are eroding your personal rights,

01:04:25.012 --> 01:04:25.773
your financial rights,

01:04:25.793 --> 01:04:26.413
and your human rights,

01:04:26.492 --> 01:04:27.914
but it happens behind a closed door,

01:04:28.494 --> 01:04:31.615
and so people don't... It's

01:04:31.655 --> 01:04:32.496
back to like the, oh yeah,

01:04:32.516 --> 01:04:33.657
but does it really affect me?

01:04:33.677 --> 01:04:34.396
Does it really harm me?

01:04:34.436 --> 01:04:35.538
And it's like, yes,

01:04:35.637 --> 01:04:36.978
but I can't convince you of that.

01:04:37.518 --> 01:04:39.039
Right, because it's difficult to prove.

01:04:39.880 --> 01:04:40.681
Yeah, it's very,

01:04:40.721 --> 01:04:42.001
very difficult to prove how...

01:04:43.135 --> 01:04:44.516
aggregate large-scale

01:04:44.777 --> 01:04:47.219
violations of human rights

01:04:47.619 --> 01:04:50.123
are actually damaging your

01:04:50.163 --> 01:04:51.304
day-to-day life, right?

01:04:51.664 --> 01:04:51.925
But then

01:04:52.641 --> 01:04:53.922
People look out the door and they're like,

01:04:54.182 --> 01:04:55.403
oh, make Britain great again.

01:04:55.423 --> 01:04:56.865
Oh, this country's gone to dogs.

01:04:57.465 --> 01:04:58.146
Oh, what could it be?

01:04:58.226 --> 01:04:59.108
And it's like, well,

01:04:59.228 --> 01:04:59.989
maybe it's a fucking

01:05:00.088 --> 01:05:01.150
aggregate of all the things

01:05:01.170 --> 01:05:01.731
that you said.

01:05:02.150 --> 01:05:03.253
Oh, does that really affect me?

01:05:03.293 --> 01:05:03.773
It's like, yeah,

01:05:03.813 --> 01:05:05.054
they all fucking affect you

01:05:05.114 --> 01:05:05.994
because they're all about

01:05:06.056 --> 01:05:08.038
power getting redistributed

01:05:08.117 --> 01:05:08.878
and wealth getting

01:05:08.978 --> 01:05:11.001
redistributed to the same

01:05:11.240 --> 01:05:12.722
powerful group of people who

01:05:13.202 --> 01:05:14.443
Who are then going to use

01:05:14.483 --> 01:05:16.985
that negatively to impact you,

01:05:17.125 --> 01:05:18.525
your family and your children.

01:05:18.925 --> 01:05:19.686
And then you're like, Oh,

01:05:19.726 --> 01:05:20.786
it's probably some immigrants.

01:05:20.826 --> 01:05:21.306
And you're like, well,

01:05:21.565 --> 01:05:22.867
maybe you should fucking

01:05:22.887 --> 01:05:24.126
engage your brain first.

01:05:24.668 --> 01:05:25.248
Like maybe,

01:05:25.288 --> 01:05:27.248
maybe actually some people that

01:05:27.268 --> 01:05:28.449
are in a fucking rowboat

01:05:28.588 --> 01:05:30.110
across the channel or whatever,

01:05:30.170 --> 01:05:31.630
who can barely like bail

01:05:31.670 --> 01:05:32.990
the fucking water out of it.

01:05:33.371 --> 01:05:35.811
And not the reason for multi-generational,

01:05:35.831 --> 01:05:35.871
uh,

01:05:36.311 --> 01:05:38.333
grabs at power and wealth in

01:05:38.353 --> 01:05:39.775
your country that have left

01:05:39.835 --> 01:05:41.476
you without job security, without,

01:05:42.257 --> 01:05:42.557
you know,

01:05:42.757 --> 01:05:45.380
without meaningful real wage growth and

01:05:46.726 --> 01:05:49.027
fuck you know man I just ah

01:05:50.568 --> 01:05:52.489
jesus christ like this was

01:05:52.510 --> 01:05:53.989
I i this is sorry this has

01:05:54.030 --> 01:05:55.050
been warming up all day

01:05:55.070 --> 01:05:56.791
because I had to do money

01:05:56.811 --> 01:05:58.132
laundering earlier today

01:05:58.152 --> 01:05:59.612
and I just got reminded

01:05:59.672 --> 01:06:00.532
again of how much like

01:06:00.652 --> 01:06:01.954
dirty russian money this

01:06:01.994 --> 01:06:03.313
was a conversation I was

01:06:03.353 --> 01:06:04.355
having in london right

01:06:04.715 --> 01:06:05.994
there is so much dirty

01:06:06.054 --> 01:06:07.315
russian money and saudi

01:06:07.356 --> 01:06:08.376
money and whatever in

01:06:08.436 --> 01:06:09.777
london just money laundered

01:06:09.797 --> 01:06:11.697
in plain sight and you were just like

01:06:12.693 --> 01:06:12.914
dude,

01:06:12.954 --> 01:06:14.614
why are we even fucking talking about

01:06:14.653 --> 01:06:15.394
money laundering?

01:06:15.614 --> 01:06:17.215
I just got so despondent.

01:06:17.235 --> 01:06:17.635
I was like,

01:06:17.695 --> 01:06:18.695
why are we even fucking talking

01:06:18.715 --> 01:06:19.356
about money laundering?

01:06:19.376 --> 01:06:20.215
Why is this even a thing?

01:06:20.735 --> 01:06:21.815
And then the academic,

01:06:21.876 --> 01:06:23.496
the person I was talking to was just like,

01:06:24.657 --> 01:06:25.597
no, exactly.

01:06:25.737 --> 01:06:26.556
It's madness, isn't it?

01:06:26.617 --> 01:06:29.677
But nevertheless, we work in digital cash,

01:06:29.757 --> 01:06:30.858
so we need to spend a lot

01:06:30.898 --> 01:06:32.418
of time thinking about these things.

01:06:32.818 --> 01:06:37.079
But we're bound to these design decisions.

01:06:37.099 --> 01:06:38.059
They're going to let people

01:06:38.159 --> 01:06:39.780
have like 5,000 pounds or

01:06:39.820 --> 01:06:41.101
whatever in digital cash or whatever,

01:06:41.141 --> 01:06:41.900
because otherwise, God,

01:06:41.920 --> 01:06:42.380
they might spend...

01:06:42.581 --> 01:06:43.621
might they might launder

01:06:43.641 --> 01:06:44.362
that money and you're like

01:06:45.463 --> 01:06:46.483
it's not five thousand

01:06:46.543 --> 01:06:47.864
pounds worth of money you

01:06:47.885 --> 01:06:49.166
need to worry about it's

01:06:49.306 --> 01:06:50.306
that house across the

01:06:50.327 --> 01:06:51.547
fucking street you need to

01:06:51.568 --> 01:06:53.309
worry about that's 14

01:06:53.309 --> 01:06:54.550
million pounds and I bet

01:06:54.570 --> 01:06:56.032
the owner's dodgy as fuck

01:06:56.952 --> 01:06:58.534
god damn he has 14 million

01:06:58.574 --> 01:06:59.655
pounds lying around that

01:06:59.695 --> 01:07:02.476
isn't up to no good like fuck

01:07:03.516 --> 01:07:04.577
That was a fucking soapbox.

01:07:05.297 --> 01:07:06.476
I was looking for a video of

01:07:06.516 --> 01:07:08.777
the queen saluting the flag or something.

01:07:08.797 --> 01:07:09.838
I needed something in there.

01:07:09.918 --> 01:07:14.280
It's pretty good.

01:07:14.780 --> 01:07:16.101
There's an old clip from an

01:07:16.222 --> 01:07:17.362
old British comedy show

01:07:17.442 --> 01:07:20.603
where it just goes, it'll be alright.

01:07:21.324 --> 01:07:22.324
It's okay.

01:07:23.045 --> 01:07:23.724
It's fine.

01:07:24.525 --> 01:07:27.447
That's not what I got out of that.

01:07:27.766 --> 01:07:29.027
It just has the Union flag

01:07:29.086 --> 01:07:30.307
fluttering in the background.

01:07:30.847 --> 01:07:31.688
And it has...

01:07:32.992 --> 01:07:35.134
Oh, Elgar's Enigma Variations, I think,

01:07:35.474 --> 01:07:36.434
playing in the background.

01:07:36.454 --> 01:07:38.436
So like a kind of stirring, gentle,

01:07:38.596 --> 01:07:39.916
pastoral piece of music.

01:07:39.996 --> 01:07:41.438
It's like, it's okay.

01:07:42.079 --> 01:07:42.898
It's fine.

01:07:43.539 --> 01:07:45.800
It's going to be all right.

01:07:47.161 --> 01:07:48.103
There's like this bit where

01:07:48.143 --> 01:07:49.083
a man's like walking down

01:07:49.103 --> 01:07:50.143
the street and he's got a

01:07:50.164 --> 01:07:51.585
cigarette and he's like, oh,

01:07:51.724 --> 01:07:52.585
I've got my lighter.

01:07:52.606 --> 01:07:53.527
And then these little kids

01:07:53.586 --> 01:07:55.407
run up to him and they offer him a light.

01:07:56.088 --> 01:07:56.228
It's...

01:07:58.458 --> 01:07:59.300
great I'll put it in the

01:07:59.320 --> 01:08:01.782
show it's all right it's

01:08:01.802 --> 01:08:03.963
okay it's going to be fine

01:08:04.505 --> 01:08:06.367
this is britain and it's

01:08:06.467 --> 01:08:10.971
going to be fine um yeah oh

01:08:11.050 --> 01:08:11.972
anyway the number is great

01:08:12.512 --> 01:08:14.074
um unfortunately it's a

01:08:14.114 --> 01:08:14.934
fantastic piece of

01:08:14.974 --> 01:08:17.296
technology for an ecosystem that is dead

01:08:21.738 --> 01:08:25.041
But I think the boilerplate

01:08:25.060 --> 01:08:25.761
of the approach they've

01:08:25.782 --> 01:08:27.002
taken on almost every

01:08:27.042 --> 01:08:28.163
technical decision that

01:08:28.283 --> 01:08:29.425
I've been able to see and

01:08:30.006 --> 01:08:31.006
that my monkey brain can

01:08:31.046 --> 01:08:33.529
understand seems really sensible.

01:08:33.548 --> 01:08:35.951
And I think it might be one

01:08:35.971 --> 01:08:36.671
of those projects that's

01:08:36.712 --> 01:08:37.573
bigger than Cosmos.

01:08:37.712 --> 01:08:40.114
If it finds product market fit,

01:08:41.076 --> 01:08:41.896
it might not matter.

01:08:42.037 --> 01:08:43.599
But it feels to me like the...

01:08:46.041 --> 01:08:47.261
It's too late to miss.

01:08:47.442 --> 01:08:48.922
It's too late for the big

01:08:48.983 --> 01:08:51.885
initial app chain winter bull run.

01:08:52.565 --> 01:08:54.207
And it's too early for mass

01:08:54.386 --> 01:08:55.988
adoption of privacy tools in the space.

01:08:58.170 --> 01:08:58.949
But the approach they've

01:08:58.970 --> 01:09:01.631
taken is really good.

01:09:01.652 --> 01:09:01.832
Yeah.

01:09:03.472 --> 01:09:04.173
And the use case they're

01:09:04.194 --> 01:09:05.095
going for is really good too.

01:09:05.755 --> 01:09:07.036
And I'm very needed and.

01:09:09.136 --> 01:09:09.317
Yeah.

01:09:09.358 --> 01:09:10.158
I hope it's successful.

01:09:11.279 --> 01:09:11.418
Yeah.

01:09:11.929 --> 01:09:15.350
And I hope it does bring the

01:09:15.390 --> 01:09:17.551
next X number of users in.

01:09:18.632 --> 01:09:20.734
It will be X, and X will be under 1,000.

01:09:21.994 --> 01:09:22.975
Yeah, yeah.

01:09:23.015 --> 01:09:26.877
But I do agree with your

01:09:26.917 --> 01:09:28.497
point around it being bigger than Cosmos.

01:09:28.838 --> 01:09:29.599
I totally agree with that.

01:09:32.220 --> 01:09:34.261
Well, in the comments, Rama said,

01:09:34.381 --> 01:09:36.082
I think Penumbra could save Cosmos.

01:09:36.203 --> 01:09:36.802
And by save,

01:09:36.922 --> 01:09:39.484
I mean allow people to dump anonymously.

01:09:42.216 --> 01:09:43.377
um that's what we need we

01:09:43.398 --> 01:09:44.979
need a validator specific

01:09:45.038 --> 01:09:46.340
changes to dump rewards

01:09:46.399 --> 01:09:47.860
without visibility that's

01:09:47.881 --> 01:09:50.202
what it is I mean I'm I

01:09:50.242 --> 01:09:51.103
mean maybe that's the game

01:09:51.122 --> 01:09:52.043
of notes maybe that's a

01:09:52.064 --> 01:09:52.783
game of notes change is

01:09:52.823 --> 01:09:54.645
this a privacy chain that

01:09:54.685 --> 01:09:56.025
allows any valve to be able

01:09:56.046 --> 01:09:57.487
to dump anonymously and or

01:09:57.546 --> 01:09:58.887
invest back in the chain

01:09:58.927 --> 01:10:01.550
without visibility yeah

01:10:01.569 --> 01:10:02.270
it's important it's

01:10:02.289 --> 01:10:03.270
important you might you

01:10:03.291 --> 01:10:04.412
might just be you might

01:10:04.431 --> 01:10:05.612
just be sending all of your

01:10:05.652 --> 01:10:07.934
rewards to penumbra in order to reinvest

01:10:09.092 --> 01:10:09.734
To reinvest.

01:10:10.094 --> 01:10:12.796
In a basket of tokens, maybe.

01:10:12.876 --> 01:10:14.917
Maybe the whole cosmos will benefit.

01:10:16.319 --> 01:10:16.920
Maybe not.

01:10:18.560 --> 01:10:20.002
I haven't sold shit in forever.

01:10:20.983 --> 01:10:21.984
These fucking prices, man.

01:10:22.003 --> 01:10:23.005
What is going on?

01:10:24.265 --> 01:10:25.185
Although this last day was a

01:10:25.206 --> 01:10:26.967
little bit better, but jeez, man.

01:10:27.627 --> 01:10:27.868
I mean,

01:10:27.889 --> 01:10:30.591
you're watching market fit in action.

01:10:31.471 --> 01:10:32.452
Brutal, brutal, brutal.

01:10:33.653 --> 01:10:34.753
Hey, look.

01:10:34.793 --> 01:10:37.315
We've all got a basket of highly...

01:10:38.270 --> 01:10:39.932
boutique highly artisanal

01:10:39.993 --> 01:10:45.518
cosmos coins who was it

01:10:45.557 --> 01:10:47.118
saying our business is like

01:10:47.158 --> 01:10:48.440
a mom and pop business and

01:10:48.501 --> 01:10:49.442
I was like are these

01:10:49.542 --> 01:10:52.864
artisanal shit coins even

01:10:52.904 --> 01:10:53.626
maybe even outside of

01:10:53.645 --> 01:10:55.067
cosmos it's all it's all

01:10:55.127 --> 01:10:55.988
feeling it right now but

01:10:57.109 --> 01:10:58.909
yeah yeah yeah I saw I saw

01:10:58.990 --> 01:11:01.993
aptos uh as well and was just like

01:11:04.328 --> 01:11:05.670
Yeah, the hub's at 691.

01:11:06.869 --> 01:11:07.489
Is that all?

01:11:07.510 --> 01:11:09.211
That seems like a one-year low.

01:11:10.011 --> 01:11:10.712
Under seven bucks.

01:11:10.731 --> 01:11:13.813
I think that's a low for a long time.

01:11:13.872 --> 01:11:14.292
More than one year.

01:11:14.313 --> 01:11:15.274
It seems like a long time.

01:11:15.293 --> 01:11:16.554
Juno at 14 cents.

01:11:16.573 --> 01:11:16.694
Hey-oh.

01:11:16.774 --> 01:11:17.494
Say at 36 cents.

01:11:17.515 --> 01:11:18.854
DYDX at $1.46.

01:11:18.895 --> 01:11:18.854
$1.46.

01:11:18.954 --> 01:11:21.615
I think that is down 50% from...

01:11:31.519 --> 01:11:34.380
from when it launched on V4.

01:11:35.000 --> 01:11:36.699
So what you're saying is

01:11:36.760 --> 01:11:37.881
it's time to warm up that

01:11:37.940 --> 01:11:38.980
McDonald's resume.

01:11:40.501 --> 01:11:41.442
Ethereum at $3,500.

01:11:41.601 --> 01:11:43.242
Bitcoin's down to under $65,000.

01:11:43.301 --> 01:11:46.682
So it's down 5% this week.

01:11:46.703 --> 01:11:47.662
It's actually holding on.

01:11:48.423 --> 01:11:50.323
Ethereum actually at $3,567.

01:11:50.564 --> 01:11:53.765
That's still down a bit, but whatever.

01:11:53.784 --> 01:11:55.506
All right, what else we got?

01:11:55.706 --> 01:11:56.985
Yeah, it's pretty brutal.

01:11:57.485 --> 01:11:58.706
I'm not sure what's... I don't know.

01:11:58.765 --> 01:12:00.466
Is anything driving this at a large scale?

01:12:00.506 --> 01:12:00.846
I don't even know.

01:12:01.835 --> 01:12:03.055
i think nothing's driving

01:12:03.155 --> 01:12:08.680
the the arrow up so so it's

01:12:08.699 --> 01:12:10.720
just a natural it's a

01:12:10.761 --> 01:12:12.242
natural down that's what

01:12:12.282 --> 01:12:13.923
you're saying well I think

01:12:13.944 --> 01:12:15.465
there is a neutral is minus

01:12:15.505 --> 01:12:16.444
five percent a week is that

01:12:16.465 --> 01:12:17.645
what it is but there's no

01:12:17.666 --> 01:12:19.627
there's no tickling the

01:12:19.667 --> 01:12:20.908
timbers so it's not going

01:12:21.048 --> 01:12:23.409
up uh yeah yeah that's how

01:12:23.470 --> 01:12:24.091
that's how it works

01:12:24.604 --> 01:12:26.306
Funky says the SEC news was

01:12:26.346 --> 01:12:27.268
positive on the price today.

01:12:27.307 --> 01:12:28.288
I think the SEC news that

01:12:28.309 --> 01:12:30.911
he's talking about is that

01:12:30.951 --> 01:12:34.555
the SEC has officially

01:12:34.635 --> 01:12:35.855
edited investigation into

01:12:35.895 --> 01:12:36.976
Ethereum and will not

01:12:37.016 --> 01:12:38.458
pursue charges that

01:12:38.559 --> 01:12:39.880
Ethereum is a security.

01:12:39.979 --> 01:12:40.621
So I'll put a link in the

01:12:40.640 --> 01:12:41.181
show notes to that.

01:12:41.761 --> 01:12:45.206
So the SEC put out a letter last night,

01:12:45.485 --> 01:12:47.868
I think, after close, just saying, hey,

01:12:49.009 --> 01:12:50.349
Uh, we're not going after this now,

01:12:50.628 --> 01:12:52.029
but of course I'm sure they say,

01:12:52.050 --> 01:12:52.649
I don't even read it,

01:12:52.670 --> 01:12:53.489
but I'm sure they say, Hey,

01:12:53.529 --> 01:12:54.409
we could do this in the future.

01:12:54.470 --> 01:12:57.791
However, it's not exonerating it for, for,

01:12:57.951 --> 01:13:00.992
uh, you're not exonerated for, for future,

01:13:01.032 --> 01:13:02.271
but at least, you know,

01:13:02.453 --> 01:13:03.052
at least for right now.

01:13:04.092 --> 01:13:05.432
So that's good news, I guess.

01:13:05.472 --> 01:13:06.233
But I guess what else,

01:13:06.293 --> 01:13:07.033
what other choices they have?

01:13:07.054 --> 01:13:07.654
There's not really anything

01:13:07.673 --> 01:13:08.173
surprising there.

01:13:13.354 --> 01:13:13.993
Huge dude.

01:13:14.354 --> 01:13:14.833
Huge news.

01:13:15.635 --> 01:13:16.215
Huge news.

01:13:21.195 --> 01:13:23.476
The Certik one is wild, isn't it?

01:13:25.436 --> 01:13:25.637
Yeah.

01:13:25.658 --> 01:13:26.257
So we were talking about,

01:13:26.377 --> 01:13:28.078
I think when you and I were last week,

01:13:28.097 --> 01:13:28.778
we were talking a lot about

01:13:28.818 --> 01:13:29.559
like security firms.

01:13:31.798 --> 01:13:33.640
So I'll put a link from a

01:13:33.859 --> 01:13:35.439
Twitter post from Certik.

01:13:35.659 --> 01:13:39.480
So Certik, C-E-R-T-I, capital K. Amazing.

01:13:41.082 --> 01:13:41.381
Branding.

01:13:43.188 --> 01:13:44.809
They found a bunch of

01:13:45.048 --> 01:13:46.470
vulnerabilities in the

01:13:48.011 --> 01:13:49.591
Kraken FX exchange.

01:13:50.692 --> 01:13:50.853
Yeah.

01:13:51.132 --> 01:13:52.493
And there is a timeline here.

01:13:52.814 --> 01:13:56.876
So it looks like they basically pilfered,

01:13:57.917 --> 01:13:59.818
what, like a few million dollars?

01:14:00.238 --> 01:14:00.557
Yeah.

01:14:01.319 --> 01:14:02.118
Wait, from Kraken?

01:14:02.658 --> 01:14:03.220
Yeah.

01:14:03.880 --> 01:14:05.081
So the TLDR, right,

01:14:05.140 --> 01:14:06.202
is that you could fabricate

01:14:06.221 --> 01:14:07.502
a deposit where you say,

01:14:08.342 --> 01:14:10.404
I'm putting in $3 million,

01:14:10.743 --> 01:14:11.585
and their system just went,

01:14:12.381 --> 01:14:13.341
Yeah, right, okay, cool.

01:14:13.881 --> 01:14:15.543
And then you go, ah, you know what,

01:14:15.564 --> 01:14:15.863
actually,

01:14:15.963 --> 01:14:17.746
can I have that $3 million back?

01:14:17.926 --> 01:14:19.327
I'll have it in Ethereum, please.

01:14:19.766 --> 01:14:22.109
And they go, ah, yeah, sure, okay,

01:14:22.208 --> 01:14:22.590
here you go.

01:14:22.630 --> 01:14:23.430
But you don't...

01:14:24.304 --> 01:14:24.644
I don't know.

01:14:24.743 --> 01:14:26.564
Maybe this is an API thing.

01:14:26.585 --> 01:14:28.426
I'm trying to figure out.

01:14:28.525 --> 01:14:29.686
They just look for deposits

01:14:29.747 --> 01:14:31.908
based off of deposit addresses.

01:14:31.927 --> 01:14:32.868
So I'm trying to figure out

01:14:33.368 --> 01:14:36.310
how you tell them something's coming in.

01:14:36.470 --> 01:14:37.650
I think they must have been

01:14:37.690 --> 01:14:39.332
gaming the input.

01:14:39.351 --> 01:14:40.552
Well, I don't know.

01:14:40.733 --> 01:14:42.594
I only read their post on Twitter.

01:14:43.094 --> 01:14:44.654
My impression was it was

01:14:44.895 --> 01:14:46.336
potentially an API that was

01:14:46.416 --> 01:14:48.037
for dollar deposits rather than

01:14:49.113 --> 01:14:51.094
for crypto like I think you

01:14:51.213 --> 01:14:52.996
faked a deposit with cash

01:14:53.636 --> 01:14:54.997
that then didn't pass

01:14:55.037 --> 01:14:56.778
through a confirmation

01:14:56.818 --> 01:14:58.679
process correctly and the

01:14:58.738 --> 01:14:59.920
funds were then available

01:15:00.000 --> 01:15:00.760
for you to then just like

01:15:00.779 --> 01:15:01.701
withdraw withdraw into

01:15:01.740 --> 01:15:03.822
crypto yeah that was my

01:15:03.862 --> 01:15:04.603
understanding anyway I

01:15:04.643 --> 01:15:05.323
could I could be a little

01:15:05.342 --> 01:15:07.564
bit wrong on that but if so that is mad

01:15:10.572 --> 01:15:12.613
So it could be like a fake

01:15:12.634 --> 01:15:13.494
token or something else

01:15:13.515 --> 01:15:14.615
that they kind of viewed as

01:15:14.655 --> 01:15:16.557
being matching something else?

01:15:17.438 --> 01:15:18.359
Yeah, I'm not sure.

01:15:18.378 --> 01:15:18.618
I mean,

01:15:18.939 --> 01:15:20.001
maybe it's just one of those things

01:15:20.060 --> 01:15:20.720
where there was just

01:15:21.761 --> 01:15:22.743
somebody somewhere had

01:15:23.042 --> 01:15:24.845
written a case statement in

01:15:24.885 --> 01:15:26.166
Python and the default

01:15:26.466 --> 01:15:28.247
match was just like, yeah, YOLO.

01:15:28.268 --> 01:15:30.590
It just had like a comment above it, YOLO,

01:15:30.911 --> 01:15:31.270
whatever.

01:15:33.627 --> 01:15:36.887
And it turns out the default

01:15:36.908 --> 01:15:38.228
case was you get exploited

01:15:38.247 --> 01:15:39.229
for $3 million.

01:15:40.689 --> 01:15:40.868
Yeah,

01:15:40.889 --> 01:15:42.329
so I'll put a link in the show notes

01:15:42.350 --> 01:15:43.270
to this on Twitter.

01:15:43.289 --> 01:15:44.329
They have a little timeline here.

01:15:44.350 --> 01:15:45.631
It's pretty funny, actually.

01:15:45.650 --> 01:15:47.371
So they found the issue on June 5th.

01:15:47.411 --> 01:15:48.350
They do a deposit test.

01:15:48.390 --> 01:15:49.752
They do a withdrawal test on the 5th.

01:15:49.832 --> 01:15:51.051
And they try to get on the 7th.

01:15:51.112 --> 01:15:52.492
And they come back on June 9th.

01:15:53.653 --> 01:15:55.912
And then they do a Twitter

01:15:55.972 --> 01:15:57.213
contact email findings of

01:15:57.234 --> 01:15:58.173
the report on the 10th.

01:15:59.373 --> 01:16:01.095
And the vendor, I guess vendor being...

01:16:01.840 --> 01:16:03.402
Kraken says that they're working on a fix.

01:16:04.061 --> 01:16:05.502
Then they look at the 12th and say,

01:16:05.604 --> 01:16:06.043
oh shit,

01:16:06.363 --> 01:16:07.685
this is a huge vulnerability and

01:16:07.706 --> 01:16:08.246
they fixed it.

01:16:08.867 --> 01:16:09.747
And they do a video

01:16:09.787 --> 01:16:10.728
conference on the 13th and

01:16:10.747 --> 01:16:11.930
they do another one on the 18th.

01:16:11.989 --> 01:16:13.690
And the last one here is June 18th.

01:16:14.532 --> 01:16:15.632
Kraken threatened a Certic

01:16:15.672 --> 01:16:16.654
individual employee and

01:16:16.694 --> 01:16:17.734
requested to return a

01:16:17.774 --> 01:16:18.796
mismatched amount of assets

01:16:18.836 --> 01:16:20.377
in six hours without

01:16:20.417 --> 01:16:21.478
providing repayment addresses.

01:16:22.320 --> 01:16:23.060
And they start threatening

01:16:23.100 --> 01:16:24.542
him and give us his money back.

01:16:24.601 --> 01:16:26.023
So it looks like Sir Tech pulled.

01:16:26.422 --> 01:16:27.063
So they haven't done

01:16:27.082 --> 01:16:27.802
anything with that $3

01:16:27.802 --> 01:16:28.944
million that they actually pulled.

01:16:28.984 --> 01:16:29.144
Right.

01:16:29.823 --> 01:16:30.685
It's got to go on to it.

01:16:31.564 --> 01:16:31.805
I mean,

01:16:31.904 --> 01:16:33.546
that's a smart thing to do because

01:16:35.146 --> 01:16:36.806
Kraken presumably have

01:16:36.907 --> 01:16:37.787
quite a lot of money

01:16:37.807 --> 01:16:40.128
stashed away to sue you into Armageddon.

01:16:40.149 --> 01:16:41.548
I would think so.

01:16:41.569 --> 01:16:41.810
Yeah.

01:16:42.289 --> 01:16:42.390
Yeah.

01:16:42.409 --> 01:16:43.670
They should probably be more

01:16:43.710 --> 01:16:44.631
graceful about it,

01:16:44.690 --> 01:16:47.231
given that a lot of people

01:16:47.292 --> 01:16:49.033
will now be looking at Kraken being like,

01:16:49.993 --> 01:16:51.753
well, yeah.

01:16:54.318 --> 01:16:55.838
Irma says they sold to USDT

01:16:55.878 --> 01:16:57.078
and moved it through Tornado Cash.

01:16:57.458 --> 01:16:57.840
Amazing.

01:16:57.859 --> 01:17:01.541
Amazing.

01:17:04.462 --> 01:17:04.921
Sweet.

01:17:06.023 --> 01:17:06.363
So,

01:17:06.542 --> 01:17:09.885
so Certik did actually steal money from,

01:17:11.064 --> 01:17:11.744
from Kraken.

01:17:13.046 --> 01:17:14.527
That is what is being stated.

01:17:14.546 --> 01:17:14.726
Yeah.

01:17:16.606 --> 01:17:16.806
Yes.

01:17:16.867 --> 01:17:17.127
Sorry.

01:17:17.228 --> 01:17:20.248
Allegedly Certik stole money from Kraken.

01:17:21.564 --> 01:17:22.585
That's not my opinion.

01:17:23.246 --> 01:17:26.068
The voices of people in the chat, possibly,

01:17:26.087 --> 01:17:26.988
or wherever, man.

01:17:27.729 --> 01:17:30.511
This used to be a Cosmos chain, right?

01:17:31.811 --> 01:17:33.613
Didn't they run their own

01:17:33.654 --> 01:17:34.555
chain and have their own

01:17:34.574 --> 01:17:35.154
token and all that stuff?

01:17:35.194 --> 01:17:35.876
Is that still around?

01:17:35.916 --> 01:17:36.615
Does that still exist?

01:17:41.319 --> 01:17:42.940
I think technically it still exists, yeah.

01:17:43.362 --> 01:17:43.782
I don't know why.

01:17:44.481 --> 01:17:45.783
And why do they have their own token?

01:17:47.425 --> 01:17:50.186
Get paid in a non-taxable type structure?

01:17:55.065 --> 01:17:57.948
Number two on the most

01:17:58.109 --> 01:17:59.730
secure structure here on

01:17:59.751 --> 01:18:00.912
the CertiK website is Aptos.

01:18:01.032 --> 01:18:01.573
That's interesting.

01:18:04.756 --> 01:18:06.358
What's CertiK's

01:18:10.002 --> 01:18:12.564
qualification for doing security stuff?

01:18:12.965 --> 01:18:13.886
We don't talk about those things.

01:18:14.827 --> 01:18:14.947
OK.

01:18:15.775 --> 01:18:16.636
Because they were like, I mean,

01:18:16.655 --> 01:18:18.556
obviously they managed to exploit Kraken,

01:18:18.577 --> 01:18:19.237
so fair enough.

01:18:20.177 --> 01:18:22.118
Clearly they managed to find

01:18:22.478 --> 01:18:24.139
a security hole here, so like Fairfax.

01:18:25.158 --> 01:18:27.840
Assuming they actually did white hat it.

01:18:28.300 --> 01:18:29.341
It's like staking rewards.

01:18:29.761 --> 01:18:31.081
They're totally qualified to

01:18:31.100 --> 01:18:32.881
be able to judge validators

01:18:32.921 --> 01:18:33.542
and their security

01:18:33.561 --> 01:18:34.802
structures associated with that,

01:18:34.863 --> 01:18:36.582
even though their business

01:18:36.643 --> 01:18:38.404
is the exact opposite of that.

01:18:39.264 --> 01:18:39.944
It's totally fine.

01:18:40.524 --> 01:18:40.885
But they...

01:18:42.648 --> 01:18:42.807
Yeah,

01:18:42.828 --> 01:18:45.128
who knows what they fucking did with

01:18:45.149 --> 01:18:45.609
their chain.

01:18:47.368 --> 01:18:48.349
Who knows, man?

01:18:48.969 --> 01:18:49.810
The chain's obviously not...

01:18:49.829 --> 01:18:51.489
Maybe it wasn't profitable enough,

01:18:51.550 --> 01:18:52.930
so they pivoted into

01:18:52.970 --> 01:18:55.091
security like everybody does.

01:18:55.270 --> 01:18:57.990
No, it was literally built around that.

01:18:58.011 --> 01:19:00.072
I thought they were trying

01:19:00.091 --> 01:19:01.152
to build something that was

01:19:01.431 --> 01:19:03.131
related to the bug bounty

01:19:03.171 --> 01:19:04.353
structure that they had a

01:19:04.412 --> 01:19:06.432
token to be able to do.

01:19:06.493 --> 01:19:07.412
It was all kind of like a

01:19:07.453 --> 01:19:08.413
strategy around that.

01:19:08.573 --> 01:19:09.234
It wasn't like, hey,

01:19:09.394 --> 01:19:10.533
we rotate it or something like that.

01:19:11.365 --> 01:19:12.627
Oh, so it was like get coin,

01:19:12.667 --> 01:19:17.270
but for security bounties or something.

01:19:17.289 --> 01:19:17.970
Yeah, sure.

01:19:18.470 --> 01:19:21.431
Or like whatever, something like that.

01:19:21.452 --> 01:19:21.932
Something like that.

01:19:22.552 --> 01:19:24.533
Something like that.

01:19:24.573 --> 01:19:24.854
Cool.

01:19:25.055 --> 01:19:29.396
Well, you know, yeah, great.

01:19:30.278 --> 01:19:33.439
Um, you know, that's not big of a stick,

01:19:33.500 --> 01:19:33.680
right?

01:19:34.039 --> 01:19:34.439
Eh, whatever.

01:19:36.601 --> 01:19:38.382
You know, you know, the social network,

01:19:38.403 --> 01:19:40.184
you know, that movie when, um,

01:19:41.095 --> 01:19:42.435
when he tries to go back and

01:19:42.475 --> 01:19:43.695
talk to his ex-girlfriend

01:19:43.716 --> 01:19:44.396
and she's just like,

01:19:44.856 --> 01:19:46.518
she's just like fires back

01:19:46.597 --> 01:19:48.177
over her shoulder as he's retreating.

01:19:48.198 --> 01:19:48.998
Like, oh yeah,

01:19:49.259 --> 01:19:51.039
good luck with your video

01:19:51.100 --> 01:19:52.000
game or whatever.

01:19:52.020 --> 01:19:54.201
It's fine.

01:19:54.820 --> 01:19:57.703
And you're like, yeah, relatable.

01:19:58.203 --> 01:19:59.483
That is the correct thing.

01:20:00.644 --> 01:20:01.663
It's good luck with your

01:20:01.703 --> 01:20:04.185
like proof of stake or whatever.

01:20:06.025 --> 01:20:06.567
These certics,

01:20:06.987 --> 01:20:08.067
these certics scores are pretty,

01:20:08.207 --> 01:20:09.287
these dashboards are pretty amazing.

01:20:10.256 --> 01:20:11.876
Audit coverage, GitHub monitoring,

01:20:12.176 --> 01:20:13.756
the fundamentals and category score,

01:20:14.396 --> 01:20:17.618
KYC status, the active user geography,

01:20:17.637 --> 01:20:19.238
the number of total... It

01:20:19.278 --> 01:20:20.458
says that there's... In Cosmos Hub,

01:20:20.479 --> 01:20:21.958
it says there's 347 active

01:20:22.019 --> 01:20:24.460
users over seven days with

01:20:24.460 --> 01:20:25.800
778 total transactions.

01:20:26.760 --> 01:20:27.621
That seems a little bit wrong.

01:20:29.780 --> 01:20:30.661
I mean... It's pretty amazing.

01:20:31.542 --> 01:20:32.162
High or low?

01:20:34.600 --> 01:20:35.899
I don't know.

01:20:35.980 --> 01:20:36.240
Fucked?

01:20:37.140 --> 01:20:39.063
I honestly don't even know at this point.

01:20:39.082 --> 01:20:39.743
I don't even know.

01:20:40.503 --> 01:20:41.925
It seems incorrect.

01:20:43.405 --> 01:20:46.948
Did you go check out that film, Civil War,

01:20:47.109 --> 01:20:48.270
on your Plex server?

01:20:48.470 --> 01:20:49.751
I did watch Civil War.

01:20:52.032 --> 01:20:53.412
It was a bit fucked, yeah.

01:20:53.894 --> 01:20:55.234
It's really fucked up, isn't it?

01:20:55.274 --> 01:20:56.855
It's not the film, the trailer.

01:20:56.876 --> 01:20:58.697
It is fucked up.

01:20:59.018 --> 01:20:59.578
It's kind of fucked up.

01:20:59.597 --> 01:21:00.498
Were we talking about it last week?

01:21:00.559 --> 01:21:01.158
Did we talk about it?

01:21:01.319 --> 01:21:02.000
I don't think we talked

01:21:02.020 --> 01:21:02.380
about it last week.

01:21:02.399 --> 01:21:03.360
I was talking to somebody else about it.

01:21:05.055 --> 01:21:06.657
I think I recommended it a few weeks ago.

01:21:06.676 --> 01:21:08.719
I didn't remember to follow it up.

01:21:08.918 --> 01:21:09.878
I didn't put it in the spreadsheet.

01:21:10.439 --> 01:21:11.881
It's a bit close to home.

01:21:13.841 --> 01:21:17.783
They never talked about why

01:21:17.844 --> 01:21:20.345
that actual... What was the reason?

01:21:20.365 --> 01:21:21.386
They never actually had any

01:21:21.426 --> 01:21:22.046
backstory on it.

01:21:22.146 --> 01:21:22.846
It was just like,

01:21:23.648 --> 01:21:24.368
are you on the president's

01:21:24.408 --> 01:21:25.149
side or not on the

01:21:25.189 --> 01:21:26.430
president's side or something like that.

01:21:26.470 --> 01:21:29.171
There's no story around that, right?

01:21:29.292 --> 01:21:30.231
The thing they said was that

01:21:30.252 --> 01:21:31.573
the president changed the

01:21:31.613 --> 01:21:32.974
constitution to allow a third term.

01:21:34.283 --> 01:21:34.863
Oh, okay.

01:21:35.264 --> 01:21:35.965
It had to be more than that

01:21:36.024 --> 01:21:37.164
because that seems like not enough,

01:21:37.225 --> 01:21:37.945
but okay.

01:21:38.046 --> 01:21:39.445
That that's, that's what it was.

01:21:39.506 --> 01:21:40.646
And that was enough for Texas.

01:21:42.988 --> 01:21:43.148
Sure.

01:21:43.167 --> 01:21:44.729
Texas seceded from the union.

01:21:44.868 --> 01:21:46.609
And then California was like, yeah, okay.

01:21:46.889 --> 01:21:47.850
We're in, we're into that.

01:21:48.409 --> 01:21:49.631
Well, there was, there was the, yeah,

01:21:49.650 --> 01:21:50.310
the Western, right.

01:21:50.331 --> 01:21:51.671
Which was like California, Oregon,

01:21:51.690 --> 01:21:52.832
Washington or something like that,

01:21:52.872 --> 01:21:54.813
or a couple of Texas.

01:21:54.853 --> 01:21:54.932
Yeah.

01:21:54.953 --> 01:21:55.033
Well,

01:21:56.505 --> 01:21:57.405
Oh, were those two together?

01:21:57.605 --> 01:21:58.707
Oh, and then there was another one.

01:21:58.827 --> 01:22:00.247
Oh, Florida was another one, right?

01:22:00.287 --> 01:22:01.309
There's some South type show.

01:22:01.328 --> 01:22:01.649
Yeah,

01:22:01.788 --> 01:22:03.409
I think Florida was just like... Florida,

01:22:03.430 --> 01:22:04.131
Georgia or something.

01:22:04.511 --> 01:22:06.091
Yeah, all of the Florida,

01:22:06.212 --> 01:22:07.974
all the retirees were like,

01:22:08.134 --> 01:22:10.114
leave us out of this or

01:22:10.154 --> 01:22:10.716
something like that.

01:22:10.935 --> 01:22:13.137
Well, I mean, why wouldn't, you know?

01:22:14.458 --> 01:22:15.418
Yeah, it was a bit fucked.

01:22:15.899 --> 01:22:17.961
I thought, what's her name?

01:22:21.404 --> 01:22:22.083
Kirsten Dunst?

01:22:22.805 --> 01:22:23.364
She was great.

01:22:24.025 --> 01:22:24.145
Yeah.

01:22:24.983 --> 01:22:26.884
Like I thought she was very serious turn.

01:22:27.144 --> 01:22:27.524
Very good.

01:22:27.984 --> 01:22:28.324
Yeah.

01:22:28.364 --> 01:22:29.405
Like she was awesome in that.

01:22:29.426 --> 01:22:30.765
I thought it was actually quite good.

01:22:31.447 --> 01:22:33.547
So I, I think, you know, that, you know,

01:22:33.587 --> 01:22:35.988
that final sequence where

01:22:36.009 --> 01:22:38.591
it's like all steady cam following them.

01:22:39.390 --> 01:22:41.573
I think that is, yeah, I,

01:22:41.752 --> 01:22:42.972
I think that is the modern

01:22:43.012 --> 01:22:44.333
equivalent of like saving

01:22:44.373 --> 01:22:46.395
private Ryan opening for me.

01:22:46.534 --> 01:22:48.036
Like I was like, that is the one,

01:22:48.076 --> 01:22:49.737
the most intense action sequences.

01:22:50.438 --> 01:22:52.078
Like the stakes feel so high

01:22:52.179 --> 01:22:53.338
as they're going room to room.

01:22:53.378 --> 01:22:53.680
You're like,

01:22:54.960 --> 01:22:55.159
Oh, yeah.

01:22:55.180 --> 01:22:56.479
You mean when they're going

01:22:56.539 --> 01:22:57.560
into the White House and everything.

01:22:57.661 --> 01:22:57.900
Yes.

01:22:59.140 --> 01:23:02.042
That whole sequence was completely edgy.

01:23:02.141 --> 01:23:04.362
I was like, this is insane.

01:23:04.702 --> 01:23:06.443
This is fucking madness.

01:23:08.103 --> 01:23:09.403
I like the way that it's so

01:23:09.903 --> 01:23:11.304
it's like kind of got that

01:23:11.384 --> 01:23:12.923
weird like where it's super confused,

01:23:12.944 --> 01:23:14.184
but they're also like all

01:23:14.243 --> 01:23:15.203
the actors have obviously

01:23:15.224 --> 01:23:16.345
been they must have really

01:23:16.385 --> 01:23:17.625
good advisors on it, whatever.

01:23:17.944 --> 01:23:19.045
They're all super calmly

01:23:19.085 --> 01:23:20.046
talking to each other and

01:23:20.086 --> 01:23:20.865
like chatting the whole

01:23:20.905 --> 01:23:21.865
time and keeping like

01:23:22.485 --> 01:23:23.386
the flow going and stuff,

01:23:23.405 --> 01:23:24.947
but you're just like, what the fuck?

01:23:25.146 --> 01:23:26.488
This is chaos.

01:23:26.507 --> 01:23:27.347
It's bedlam.

01:23:27.768 --> 01:23:28.908
But they're just moving so

01:23:28.969 --> 01:23:30.788
purposefully around the camera.

01:23:31.550 --> 01:23:32.829
The whole way it was shot.

01:23:32.989 --> 01:23:33.990
It was pretty good.

01:23:35.511 --> 01:23:37.112
That's why you brought it up, right?

01:23:37.271 --> 01:23:37.952
Is that steady shot?

01:23:38.631 --> 01:23:38.992
Yeah.

01:23:39.672 --> 01:23:41.694
And also, it's almost like a Spielberg one,

01:23:41.734 --> 01:23:41.934
isn't it?

01:23:41.953 --> 01:23:43.793
I know there are a couple of cuts in it,

01:23:43.833 --> 01:23:44.835
but there aren't many cuts

01:23:44.875 --> 01:23:45.595
in that section.

01:23:47.235 --> 01:23:49.476
You've got to love long single shots.

01:23:49.856 --> 01:23:50.497
They're fucking great.

01:23:52.407 --> 01:23:53.387
it's a good film overall and

01:23:53.408 --> 01:23:54.368
there's some you know

01:23:54.408 --> 01:23:55.470
there's some great moments

01:23:55.510 --> 01:23:57.032
and stuff but that just

01:23:57.072 --> 01:23:58.313
that that ending sequence I

01:23:58.372 --> 01:23:59.715
didn't expect that to be

01:24:00.074 --> 01:24:01.095
the end of the film and

01:24:01.136 --> 01:24:02.557
like I don't want to say

01:24:02.578 --> 01:24:03.458
the payoff but like I

01:24:03.479 --> 01:24:04.619
didn't expect like a big

01:24:04.960 --> 01:24:05.841
because the whole film was

01:24:05.881 --> 01:24:08.885
like build like the yeah

01:24:09.985 --> 01:24:10.605
you know like all the

01:24:10.645 --> 01:24:11.426
trailers and stuff are like

01:24:11.447 --> 01:24:13.429
oh it's a big balls action film and then

01:24:14.170 --> 01:24:15.069
when you actually watch it

01:24:15.229 --> 01:24:16.610
and it's not that I was

01:24:16.631 --> 01:24:17.631
like okay fine that's cool

01:24:17.671 --> 01:24:18.310
this is a really really

01:24:18.350 --> 01:24:19.091
good film I'm really

01:24:19.131 --> 01:24:20.431
enjoying it but I didn't

01:24:20.492 --> 01:24:21.613
expect there to be like an

01:24:21.712 --> 01:24:23.073
act like an actual action

01:24:23.132 --> 01:24:24.413
scene in it because I

01:24:24.573 --> 01:24:25.194
didn't think it was that

01:24:25.213 --> 01:24:26.154
kind of film like from the

01:24:26.194 --> 01:24:27.534
first hour I was like okay

01:24:27.555 --> 01:24:28.454
this is not a film that's

01:24:28.475 --> 01:24:29.614
cool and then when they

01:24:29.635 --> 01:24:31.195
just go like oh by the way

01:24:31.235 --> 01:24:32.296
but here is an action scene

01:24:32.395 --> 01:24:33.497
by the way just just so you

01:24:33.537 --> 01:24:34.296
know that we can make a

01:24:34.396 --> 01:24:35.777
really good one we're going

01:24:35.796 --> 01:24:36.837
to do like a really really

01:24:36.877 --> 01:24:38.037
good one for you just

01:24:38.057 --> 01:24:39.359
because we know you came to

01:24:39.399 --> 01:24:40.418
the cinema you maybe wanted

01:24:40.439 --> 01:24:41.840
some explosions or

01:24:41.880 --> 01:24:42.880
something like whatever man

01:24:43.740 --> 01:24:45.904
It's great.

01:24:45.944 --> 01:24:50.149
What was the name of the dude?

01:24:50.368 --> 01:24:53.011
There's that guy in that

01:24:53.032 --> 01:24:55.274
movie where they're at the

01:24:55.354 --> 01:24:57.597
pit and he's the main dude

01:24:57.858 --> 01:24:58.738
at the pit with the red...

01:25:00.628 --> 01:25:01.628
that who that is that's is

01:25:01.649 --> 01:25:03.270
that jesse plummet yeah

01:25:03.930 --> 01:25:06.090
yeah with the pinks yeah

01:25:06.109 --> 01:25:07.570
yeah yeah because he was in

01:25:07.751 --> 01:25:08.551
he was in breaking bad

01:25:08.610 --> 01:25:10.532
right hell that was a good

01:25:10.591 --> 01:25:12.431
character yeah he was that

01:25:12.731 --> 01:25:14.832
guy did you watch him did

01:25:14.853 --> 01:25:15.752
you watch that film jesus

01:25:15.813 --> 01:25:18.293
and the black messiah uh

01:25:18.613 --> 01:25:19.554
jesus jesus and the black

01:25:19.573 --> 01:25:21.613
messiah the one with the

01:25:21.673 --> 01:25:22.675
keith stanfield I don't

01:25:22.694 --> 01:25:23.975
know actually I might have

01:25:25.224 --> 01:25:27.105
The one where Daniel Kaluuya won the,

01:25:27.185 --> 01:25:29.507
he won the best supporting actor Oscar,

01:25:29.547 --> 01:25:30.087
I think for it.

01:25:31.590 --> 01:25:33.150
But Jesse Plemons plays an

01:25:33.291 --> 01:25:34.372
FBI agent in that.

01:25:34.891 --> 01:25:36.514
And I mean,

01:25:37.033 --> 01:25:39.055
all of the supporting actors in

01:25:39.076 --> 01:25:40.737
that film are amazing.

01:25:41.177 --> 01:25:42.998
Like, yeah, well, I mean, honestly, yeah.

01:25:43.059 --> 01:25:44.340
Like even like that,

01:25:44.420 --> 01:25:45.100
those two roles are

01:25:45.121 --> 01:25:46.442
actually pretty similar in some,

01:25:46.822 --> 01:25:49.864
some areas, but like he's a, that was,

01:25:50.045 --> 01:25:51.105
he plays pretty powerful

01:25:51.166 --> 01:25:52.806
roles in those situations.

01:25:52.827 --> 01:25:53.828
Like it was fucked.

01:25:55.345 --> 01:25:57.905
Yeah, it was a good film.

01:25:57.926 --> 01:25:59.247
It was a good film.

01:25:59.606 --> 01:26:00.327
Yeah, football.

01:26:01.328 --> 01:26:01.568
Football.

01:26:03.229 --> 01:26:04.668
It is the Euros at the moment.

01:26:05.109 --> 01:26:06.369
So there's a lot of people

01:26:06.729 --> 01:26:07.930
unironically going around going,

01:26:07.951 --> 01:26:08.310
football.

01:26:08.430 --> 01:26:11.932
And I'm like, huh?

01:26:12.493 --> 01:26:13.533
And people that don't know

01:26:13.552 --> 01:26:15.373
you particularly well are like, oh,

01:26:15.394 --> 01:26:16.215
you must be really stoked

01:26:16.255 --> 01:26:17.074
because it's Euros.

01:26:17.095 --> 01:26:17.515
And I'm like,

01:26:17.654 --> 01:26:18.895
I actually don't like football.

01:26:21.229 --> 01:26:21.349
Oh,

01:26:21.368 --> 01:26:22.668
Chessies and Killers of the Flower Moon.

01:26:22.748 --> 01:26:24.149
That's on my list to watch too.

01:26:24.470 --> 01:26:25.670
That's on my list to watch as well.

01:26:26.050 --> 01:26:26.670
I haven't watched that.

01:26:26.869 --> 01:26:28.069
Oh,

01:26:28.350 --> 01:26:30.030
maybe we need to watch it and give our

01:26:30.051 --> 01:26:31.091
Game of Nodes verdict.

01:26:32.211 --> 01:26:32.871
That's what the Game of

01:26:32.911 --> 01:26:33.832
Nodes website should be.

01:26:33.851 --> 01:26:35.332
We should have like a Rotten Tomatoes,

01:26:35.452 --> 01:26:36.551
fresh or rotten,

01:26:37.112 --> 01:26:38.752
but like Game of Nodes approved.

01:26:40.432 --> 01:26:40.693
Juno?

01:26:40.712 --> 01:26:43.173
Yeah, Juno.

01:26:43.333 --> 01:26:44.453
Big smashed tomato.

01:26:45.444 --> 01:26:46.225
Civil War.

01:26:51.087 --> 01:26:52.408
Civil War is just a dramatic

01:26:52.448 --> 01:26:53.729
retelling of Prop 16.

01:26:53.729 --> 01:26:59.530
It's like Wolf Contract at the end.

01:26:59.951 --> 01:27:00.671
I need a quote.

01:27:00.832 --> 01:27:01.712
I need a quote.

01:27:02.533 --> 01:27:03.533
I need a quote, man.

01:27:03.552 --> 01:27:05.493
That'll do.

01:27:08.496 --> 01:27:08.916
God damn it.

01:27:09.076 --> 01:27:11.117
Who's holed up in that building, then?

01:27:11.997 --> 01:27:12.957
Wolf contract.

01:27:13.018 --> 01:27:14.037
Is it wolf contract holed up?

01:27:14.278 --> 01:27:14.939
Or is it Takumi?

01:27:15.019 --> 01:27:16.238
I don't even know.

01:27:16.259 --> 01:27:17.078
Oh, it might be Takumi.

01:27:17.238 --> 01:27:18.239
Yeah, good question.

01:27:19.500 --> 01:27:19.921
Takumi.

01:27:19.961 --> 01:27:20.940
I busted him out.

01:27:22.782 --> 01:27:23.462
Oh, man.

01:27:23.921 --> 01:27:24.181
Yeah.

01:27:26.042 --> 01:27:28.444
That was the distant past.

01:27:30.324 --> 01:27:30.604
Fuck.

01:27:31.805 --> 01:27:32.005
Yeah.

01:27:32.966 --> 01:27:33.246
Whatever.

01:27:38.057 --> 01:27:40.301
So, Schultz is just working.

01:27:40.502 --> 01:27:41.143
He's just been working.

01:27:41.222 --> 01:27:42.564
Yeah, I know.

01:27:43.827 --> 01:27:44.127
I know.

01:27:44.268 --> 01:27:44.728
I'm sorry.

01:27:44.747 --> 01:27:45.810
I probably should be doing better,

01:27:45.850 --> 01:27:46.331
but I'm not.

01:27:46.832 --> 01:27:47.192
He's just...