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My needle cast would be to where to pretend to be afraid.

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To pretend to be afraid? We're actually lucky that we've even got any news subjects this week,

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she'll see, given that we didn't pay the newsman on time he was upset.

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Welcome to Game of Nodes, a weekly podcast from independent validated teams.

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Welcome to Game of Nodes, a weekly podcast on the Cosmos brought to you by independent validated

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teams. I nearly got away with it, I nearly managed to set it.

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We're actually, we're not just the Cosmos anymore, we changed a little bit that we're

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independent validated teams, Ditto. Very good impression of Dr. Frey.

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Hotel room's not messy enough.

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What, your hotel room's not messy enough?

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Well, I mean the phrase room is backdrops always quite messy.

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Yeah, you need to hang shit around the place, couple of guitar amps.

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I've got a load of conference maps all over my bed.

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You need some floor lighting. Can you just like ignite a nuclear fuse right next to your face?

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Just for the correct effect?

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No, the lighting in this hotel room doesn't allow me to do that.

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Yeah, so I'm live from Istanbul and Cosmos.

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Well, I know nothing that's gone on because I've basically been busy doing some like AI

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artwork. So you guys will have to tell me what's happened here. So for the viewers and the listeners,

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we're joined today with Bendy and Funky and Chilty and myself for the regular team.

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And we have Dr. Frey and Uncle Dad are on their way back to their respective places from the,

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were they smart, Colin?

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Yeah, they could smart car and over in Barcelona, right?

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Yeah, sounds nice. So it's been a week of conferences for everyone who can get to them,

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not anyone from over this side of the planet because they're too far away.

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So Chilty, what was your excuse?

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Well, I had Erdeman go to Istanbul. So if Erdeman's going to go, I don't want to go as well.

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That's I mean, and I just got back from my honeymoon. So flying right back like what,

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a week after I got, not even a week after I got back, that's unacceptable. Not working with that,

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no way. No, you'll just get in trouble for that type of malarkey. I'm going to say this last week,

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my partner's been trying to get us to go away on the weekend and I'm like, hold the phone. We just

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went elsewhere like for a week. So you're going to have to wait a month. There's no way that I am

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putting on weekend shit again for like at least a month.

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I've been, man, I've been exhausted. It has been about a week since I've been back.

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And I'm having a hard time recovering. I think it's like I just crested 31, right?

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Which means I think I no longer recover from jet lag as well. 30, you can still do it. 31,

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I think is when that turnover happens and I'm feeling it.

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Yeah, definitely. I think I've only really started to experience the jet lag like recently,

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like in the last five years or so. But I mean, jet lag is on a different level when you're Australian

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because you're on a plane for 17 hours that is going to get you exactly in the place you don't

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need to be for a time was. So it's always a big adjustment. Last time I came, when I came back

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from March when I was over there, it took me like a week to come back to normal. I was just

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shocked to shit. It was terrible.

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Yeah. I'm at the point where I'm still waking up at like four or five in the morning each night

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and it was only a nine hour changeover. Four or five hours.

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Oh man, I'm riding with it. That's a great time to wake up.

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Yeah, I was going to say four or five a.m. isn't too bad. So like, you know, I've been using the

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time to do work early because, you know, most of my team is either in central Europe or on the

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East Coast. So, you know, we are always way far off in time. So this has been good for like,

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are able to work together. But also like my wife wakes up then like five hours later and she's

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like, wow, like you've already been up like your entire day. And so then like, like 3 p.m. I'm like

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winding down and that's that's the tough bit right now. On the weekends, unless we have a plan to

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do something, I'm like getting up at four or five a.m. And then the missus gets up at like midday.

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I'm like half the fucking day is gone. Like, yeah, yeah, exactly. Yeah. But then I'll go to bed at

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like eight o'clock and she'll come to bed at like one a.m. Like what are you doing? It's night

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time. You can't do anything. Can't work. So yeah, I mean, because life is just working and sleeping,

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right? So exactly what I believe it is. So, Bendy has just come back from Cosmo versus

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to his hotel room. He was partying at an after party and he was telling us that he was going to

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get into his mini bar, but it looks like he's opted for the water. Probably already had a few

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Bruce keys. So hopefully he's like half charged for some hot takes while we roll through the news

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a little bit later on. Yeah. Whenever we hit your news corner, I'm ready with like under formed

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over opinionated views. The news corner does not exist in that form anymore. I've vetoed it.

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How was Cosmo versus empty as like the photo showed because a lot of people are talking

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about how Cosmo versus was like the keynote. There's only like half the seats full or fewer

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and a lot of people are talking about it not seeming very full. Was it was it actually that empty?

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It the auditorium was, but like we I've forgotten the exact number. I want to say it's 1300, 1400

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people were actually in attendance. But what it is is there's like all sorts of different rooms.

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So most people aren't bothering with the keynotes because they're going to workshops. There's like

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there was just like a load of food and drink out in the kind of Osmosis networking area.

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People are kind of like it's more like yeah, I don't know like it's kind of conference where

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people are in about eight, nine different rooms loads of hallways like everywhere you went it was

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chocked with people. Did that feel like a feature or a bug do you think? Do you think maybe they

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could have scheduled those other like you know other types of things like maybe if they broke

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out the keynotes into like a few hours here and a few hours there and then schedule those other

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things in between? I think that the kind of venue we were in was challenging because I think the

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ballroom that the main talk room was massive as if you were going to do the whole event in there.

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And then you also had the loads of these breakout rooms and the breakout rooms were probably the

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most successful things like we had so as there was an AES specific room we had Neutron and

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slide at the AA DAO at the hub and then we also had Noble in there despite the fact they're not

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quite in the AES yet. But like we had like some sort of giga-brain round table things in there

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with like 30, 40, 50 people and it's like and then everyone's trying to get into that because

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they suddenly hear that like oh, Jihan and Sunny and Spade and whoever are all having this kind of

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like really intense thing and you can't put that on stage it's not going to work in that way it's like

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this you know more organic thing. Like a controlled thing? Yeah so I think like what you really

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probably need is a venue with like breakout rooms that are a little bit closer to the main room and

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the main room to be able to be a bit more like to be sized down so that it always feels full

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because actually like you probably have four or five, six hundred people in there and it still

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feels quite empty because I like so I was moderating a panel by side chat whatever you want to call it

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with two of the tokenomics guys today and I was like oh there's not a lot of people here and then

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I kind of was like well actually there's like 50 rows of chairs however many people on each row

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there's quite a lot of people in this room but they're very spaced out it doesn't look great on

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camera I think there's kind of optics thing with that where if you can just do a better seating

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plan then it works a bit better but that was kind of yeah that was one of those where we

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that tokenomics panel was a fun one because it got moved in terms of its time to accommodate the

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stride news which I guess will come to at some point and we yeah we got moved for that and then

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CTO couldn't do it which was the original plan because he was having a prep for the stride stuff

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and so I had to do it and then I had to fill another 15-20 minutes of time because you know

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that was meant to be on in that time slot didn't happen and I was just kind of told could you

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just stall for a bit it's like yeah I can chat and then you know as you as you guys know I just

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talk a lot so it sounds like that the cameras looked kind of so-called empty was almost a feature

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in the sense that what people were doing is they were going and doing things that were more active

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and more they were less passive they're going to the keynote that's passive consumption right

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but if they're going to the side rooms it sounds like they're they're actively engaging and so

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while the appearance was at the throne room if you will was empty what that actually means is

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people were off doing things that like would actively better the situation the area the the

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conference I think so that's something I take my sense my sense of things as someone in one of

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those rules for most of the time because it was like it was pretty consistently busy a lot of

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people came up to me to kind of like just talk to me about what they're building how they can get

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money from me which you know is inevitable because I'm like one of the you know 10 people in the

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conference with actual cash but you know it was kind of cool because actually you had like it's

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much better to be doing that kind of whether it's yorping or shilling depending on which way you

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want to go you up up she'll down but it's better it's better that like the those people are doing

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that then they're just sitting there listening to a keynote right so I think that kind of what's

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happening and certainly my experience from having worked in a kind of conference in venue is that

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this has reached a period of maturity where the majority of work needs to be done at the bar or

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in the or you know over coffee and that the actual program of events is almost meaningless

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but really what people want to do is engage with individuals they want to have the conversations

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they want to have they want to do the workshops they want to do the hackathons they want to do all

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of that and then not very interested in being lectured to for 20 minutes half an hour were you

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at the previous uh cosmoverse or no no this is my first ever critco event this is my first time

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meeting people in real life ah that's cool awesome it is cool yeah i had a great time like i like um

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yeah and it's kind of it's kind of fun because um you know i hadn't met any of my colleagues from

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the doubt in real life so that was kind of awesome um we all went for dinners night and you know that

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was really nice it was really nice to have time with people and like actually kind of you know

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see how tall some people are right like but um but also like yeah i've worked really closely with

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uh some of the people involved in neutron uh some of the guys on stride and then we're in a room

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together and we're actually like able to just you know shoot the shit and uh kind of get a real

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sense of who people are and you know like yeah i mean it did nothing for my imposter syndrome

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where i've suddenly i'm like oh shit i'm at a thing where oh so yeah my my big imposter syndrome

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moment was um because the so the hub's the lead sponsor um beat through us and uh so there's the

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kind of like speakers and sponsors dinner on the first night which uh and they were like oh

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could someone from the dallas speak and you said was like oh bendy would do it he's good at talking

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and i was like i've now got to do like a three minute chat to like every single significant

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person in this ecosystem uh and like what the what do i who like i'm like i'm just you know

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community member pleb uh what do i what do i say so that was quite fun is this the drop chains moment

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yeah well i saw i saw a raw mug break you over the coals for it well i i mean like i i i i i

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put the video i was like imagine if i could say the word blockchain but yeah um my opening line

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in that was uh ladies and gentlemen we're welcome to the annual gathering of the cartel um perfect i

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was really interested to see uh what percentage of cosmos had a sense of humor how many people did

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because i imagine like that would be very divisive i would say 10 had a sense of humor

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okay yeah okay so yeah um but like by the end it was fine it was only three minutes it's fine

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um you know if a a down now doesn't get a second mandate it's basically because of me i think

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all these guys would be like don't talk about the cartel

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but that was quite fun but yeah like it did not like i was just like oh shit like i'm meant to

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present pretend that i'm like significant in fact all it is is that i'm english and therefore you

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know the one that's put up to speak so okay so you just say this is your

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yeah you sound you're english therefore you sound so smart um so what what did you do previously

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so if you hadn't been to conference before how long have you been in the cosmos ecosystem

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because obviously you've been you know you've been in chats we've seen you for the longest time

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but it surprises me since cosmos has events in europe fairly frequently probably two or three

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a year right so i'm curious what why wasn't my job before uh yeah that's good okay so was a

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dive the first thing you do that did that brought you into like as a uh really i didn't know that

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yeah so so my background is um i got into crypto like so yeah like early like right like january

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21 right uh and then sort of was on coinbase and was like oh just look at some of these other

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things that aren't bitcoin because you know maybe bitcoin maybe there's other value elsewhere right

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you know other things are going to be a bit more risk but then i go up and i was kind of just

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reading like their little synopsis and i was like oh this cosmos thing is like kind of interesting

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because it talks about the fact that not one chain specifically is going to win and i was like well

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that makes sense to me like you know why in the history of like everything in the world nothing

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has ever had just like one winner you know in a kind of form of things getting advanced right

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there's always been like multiples and i was like okay this makes sense so i brought some atom and then

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i saw wolf um tweeting about uh make sure you get it off centralized exchanges put it in a thing

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nudge nudge wink wink right self custody and i was like oh i better do this because there's

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some sort of thing and people are talking about the word airdrop is being thrown around

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and so i got some june hoa and i got some osmosis because of doing that and i was kind of like oh

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and i like and i got progressively more interested in stuff and just like watch this show follow

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people on twitter that was the most air drop show that was a mistake yeah that was most

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airdrop i'll say was was a really great airdrop i remember i had i want to say like like 10

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atom staked and i am getting like 800 with the osmosis and that made me so excited to join the

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ecosystem um now i was in it before but go ahead no no all i was gonna say is like yeah i got over

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a thousand dollars the less than like i must have maybe i had a hundred in there like i don't

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i can't do the quadratic the quadratic curve thing was a good idea um with that yeah but yeah and

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then all that happened after that is that i continued to do kind of what i do in the chat on the show

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where i just talked at people and then eventually they recognize me allow me to talk at you yes

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well you're in public form i'm just gonna shout at you until you acknowledge my existence um

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and then one one day i got really pissed off with something in cosmos and uh dm zaki and just like

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i'm really pissed off about this is there any like my backgrounds in marketing and comms is there

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anything i can do to help and he was like oh weirdly i was just setting up a telegram group

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let me drop you into that and i was suddenly in this weird telegram group with like again a lot of

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serious players and it kind of was like oh and then like i did you know i tried to be helpful

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and what then came out of that eventually was when usuf was setting up the accelerator he was like

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i need a marketing comms person uh do you want to talk and i could do it on top of my day job

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because it's kind of part time role and i was like oh this is brilliant because now all the time that

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i already spend doing crypto stuff i actually get some money for and monetize your knowledge yeah

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like i you know i've i've i've got i've been working in marketing and comms for like 16 17 years

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i know you know i know my stuff to an extent as much as anyone does it's a it's a great story

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bennie it's very similar to mine like it's it's it's wonderful how on web3 you can jump in and if

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you just are a curious person you ask lots of questions you want to be helpful you provide

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value to others like somebody's going to offer you a job and it's only a matter of time so that's

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really cool hearing your backstory very similar to mine i think if you have like some personal

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motivation and just get involved there's a place for you somewhere like yeah and it's it's not all

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developers like there's you know bennie's marketing and there's any number of different jobs for

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different kinds of industries in this industry it's just a matter of being active hunting people

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down expressing your point of view you know getting in there i mean she'll see and you're

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validated too funky and i probably all you know you get nowhere in this industry if you don't ask

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the question and if you if you're not persistent and looking for the right connections and if you

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just and it's a it's definitely i think one of the one of the things in the validator space and

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sorry bendy i know you're not a validator is that i think some operators think that you know they

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this is a a mountain to conquer rather than like a better together thing so you know i know shilty

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and i um subscribe to the you know teamwork makes the dream work type situation we um you know there's

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a group of us that help each other out um in the in the stack and make sure that um you know we're

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all performing um and sometimes that's like you know giving other other people a reality check and

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saying hey look you're fucking up over here maybe have a look at that um yeah or even some encouragement

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oh you're doing a great job over there um how can we sort of do better like you and uh you know that

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that type of environment rather than like adding the cold by yourself behind the gates

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trying to just conquer everything by yourself i feel like i've had this conversation multiple

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times this week because um trying to work out why i can say i'm what i can't without kind of just

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being like saying that certain people are ourselves uh but basically um a lot of the hot topic here

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was what is the aec to do with like is it just the change that's uh on replicated security

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or is it anything that interacts with atom because obviously um uh yeah there's the

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osmosis one amount of liquidity uh but i had a conversation with um dean uh from agaric where he

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sort of saying you know ist is obviously in the act of the economic zone because it has

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atom as a you know thing that you can class from his ist with and like and he was getting more and

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more aggrieved about this i think because i think that he felt that the resistance to

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acknowledging that was people kind of wanting to be behind the gates um and he was like you know

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where where's the reciprocal nature and where's the cooperation and kind of that's a really

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interesting take though that's not one that i've really heard of the one i've i've always heard is

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you know you're in the atom economic zone if you are like ics but it makes sense that if you are

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directly relating like like stride pre ics like under under that definition you could argue was

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part of the atom economic zone and that also wouldn't be wrong but anyway continue so i

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so i've got a series of slightly uh wobbly thoughts that are definitely not helped by the beers but

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uh the the kind of the main thing with me was like my thought around this was just like it

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the reality is is that atom will do better if ist gets some adoption and ist you know will

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do better if atom does well like that there's a you know the the the alignment is there and if

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everyone just spends their time shouting each other and sort of whether that's on the ist side

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feeling like they're being neglected and therefore being annoyed about that or on the atom side of

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like putting up walls that's not actually going to help anyone and this you know if everyone gets

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defensive or or aggressive either way actually uh then it kind of doesn't help so what i was saying

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is look i think there's the reality is is that the chains that i consider to be in the atom

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economic zone are the ones that have some sort of social consensus that says they are and that

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means that they've passed a vote on governance so that at the moment is around replicated security

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but if that was around protocol and liquidity or um some sort of loan or some sort of other

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uh uh financially structured deal where you do a token swap you do something else i would argue

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that that is indicated that you're in the easy at the moment we're just so early in it that it has

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a narrow meaning and if we are rigid with that i think we just lose a lot of opportunity for

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everyone and that kind of was one of the things i was saying in my three minutes on stage at the

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very beginning of the conference where i was saying like one of the things people talk about at

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Cosmosverse is the good vibes but then like they just they just go away after like a month

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after the honeymoon period so can we keep them going for like two months instead and that would

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be like twice as twice as much value out of Cosmosverse as we currently get so further to the um

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you know the AEZ stuff i i think that if people understand that the AEZ is not an organization

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that you get inducted into it's just a term that people use to describe you know the the closely

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related entities that are working in the same direction as Adam then you know it becomes more

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evident then that you don't necessarily need to be in the ICS to be part of the AEZ you just need

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to be contributing to that ecosystem in a way or in in partnership in a way with that community

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to better both of your protocols and then you then you're like de facto part of the AEZ i mean it's

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not like a organization where you have to like gain membership or anything no it's like the

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AEZ is more of a feeling than a contract it's a vibe man it's a vibe it's those good vibes yep

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but it's like but i what i would say is that i really distinguish between um say so IST or USK

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where there's just some use for atom that people can choose to do or not do that is completely

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different from if the atom uh governance had a vote where it went okay we're going to give

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we're going to use a million atom to do this with them and they're going to do this with it and here's

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a kind of agreement because that is saying like it's not just because otherwise it's like the

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null zone and all this schultz zone where you've just chosen to do something as a user with your

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tokens with someone who gave you the option to do it so when that they've been chats there about

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like osmosis is obviously in the AEZ because it's the thing that's done all this stuff with atom

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liquidity it's like no that's all osmosis and osmosis chose to do that and osmo and people

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chose to do it on osmosis and that's fine like that i'm not dismissing what they've done they're

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brilliant protocol they are like they have been the biggest thing for IBC totally but does that

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make them part of the AEZ no it doesn't but if their proposal that's currently on the forum for like

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you know a bajillion uh atom for protocol and liquidity uh were to pass then i would say yeah

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i would for me that's what i would say is like enough of a signal that i would include them in

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an AEZ thing if i was organizing it as the marketer i think the other interesting thing about the

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AEZ is simply creating the term has created so much demand for having it people are like i want to

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be in because you've closed the club and like nine months ago no one wanted to touch out on

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with a shitty stick that's a really interesting point yeah like now that people now that it's

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become a thing people want to be part of the thing i mean in effect the and the imagining of it was

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Adam 2.0 but i'm 2.0 was not nearly as catchy as the AEZ right like it didn't have a good enough

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marketer apparently it's it's like they uh took the non-shitty bits of the uh Adam 2.0 and called

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it something else yeah i mean imagine it's imagine it's a good brain you have to be to do that let

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me ask you guys this what does this mean like with with the AEZ and obviously more chains starting to

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wanting like to like signal for ICS and wanting to make that transition what does this mean for

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mesh security because i think it's funny that like you know sonny had his little graphic with like

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osmosis being part of this AEZ but he was also the one kind of pitching mesh security at like the

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shared security summit back in Denver like is is mesh security starting to fall to the wayside and

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now more just pushing toward like the ICS idea i i think that mesh security is still definitely

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coming um okay the more so uh quite a topic so with the way we've currently seen ICS roll out

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you're gonna see us vote no on most chains that join in so for example composable is going to try

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and become ICS here soon and i guarantee you are voting no and the reason for that is there's so much

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reliance on individual team output on the performance of that addition and composable is

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wild land stable just wild land stable and it's not easy to keep track of what's happening with it

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it's not easy to like interact with in general um there's there's a variety of reasons for that

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but what that leads to is if they tried to become an ICS chain um that burden then falls on every

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single validator and that shouldn't happen with mesh security it's opt in and that's that i think

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is is the really big difference okay um yeah so uh we as a adow um have confunded some of the mesh

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mesh stuff because it's definitely part of the future picture um i think the other thing that's

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likely being slept on because um it's not really made a lot of progress is the opt in replicated

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security um as far as i know there have been some particular issues about how uh you solve

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the security problems of if only a certain number of people opt in how is that chain actually secure

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how does it reach consensus but i believe uh that one of the teams working on the tokenomics

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research for us um proposed the solution of around that to johan who is now going to kind of

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investigate it further but thinks there's the responsibility of solving that and that's kind

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of interesting because then you kind of you could do mesh and you could connect with loads of people

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but if you just want to get security from the hub and you can be convincing to particular validators

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then you can still get that security and that means that someone like lavender five don't have to

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secure composable if they think that that risk doesn't suit them but composable could still get

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hub security uh from people that are willing to take that choice and then becomes a market where

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for me as a delegator i can look at who are these chain supporting and do i want to be in

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receipt of those staking rewards and fees etc and i think that's kind of interesting because i think

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at the moment there's not a lot of ways to distinguish validators unless you're really deep

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in the game um so i think icsv2 is i i was i think the last time i spoke on here or maybe

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the time before that i was like i think this is pointless i've slightly been talked around into

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thinking it has has purpose but ultimately i think that mesh is probably going to be the future for a

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loss of cosmos and i think that item will be the primary beneficiary of mesh because it is the thing

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that most people want to connect to just purely because of this market um so yeah really like i

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think that's brilliant i also think that atom and because of stride uh will become super desirable

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like it will get we'll have skin in the game with a lot of tokens even if they're not meshing to it

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because of the way that liquid staking tokens will you know are so pervasive at the moment

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so i think that's kind of interesting too can you talk a little bit about the stride and atom

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um yeah i was curious image like is it i haven't looked too much at the proposal and i haven't seen

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to me talks about it i've just kind of like seen second hand people's thoughts is their idea to

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completely take down the chain and just push all of that to atom or is the idea to continue doing

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stride as a chain but move over to only using atom and basically burn all stride in favor of

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just using atom so i missed some of the talk so and i haven't read the proposal so i will be talking

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from a complete picture of ignorance other than a bit of a chat that i had with someone

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yesterday uh was because i needed to talk like when they wanted to take our slot i was like well

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you need to tell me why so uh which then give me like 24 hours where i was like i know the biggest

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news in the ecosystem and i literally can't tell anyone because they will know it's me

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so as i understand it it's to move to a tokenless chain which i think is better personally than

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moving it on to uh the hub uh you be okay so you mean because wow this is a lot to unpack

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like how would that work for people that are currently staking to governors right um you get

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you get more atom well whatever price that deal got structured you would your your your

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stride would become atoms interesting okay i think there's a lot that i i haven't got into

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the detail of it um uh i know that like riley and adin are like just like this is very early

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in conversation and we want to get as much feedback as possible and i think one of the

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problems with that is i think it's completely genuine knowing those guys but i also think

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that the community wants to be told something concrete so that they have something to work

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with and i think navigating this kind of like merger and acquisition stuff in a on-chain governed

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world is as far as i know breaking new ground and i think that makes it really hard to do it well

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and i've got a lot of sympathy and patience for everyone involved in it because i think that it's

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whatever you do people are going to be finding it difficult and i think that like how you negotiate

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a price for this kind of stuff is difficult um the the yeah i like i don't have a strong

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opinion yet other than i really really really love stride i think it's a phenomenal team that

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have done a great job they've had some of the best product market in the ecosystem i think they're

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one of the strongest teams best shippers and you know my asset bag is bigger than my stride bag so

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maybe an acquisition is good from my point of view because i get more exposure but so here's

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what i'll add to that stride is one of the few tokens that i've um really bought into because

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of basically what you said it's a really fantastic team such an amazing product market

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fits secret another one but there's so much secret difficulty i'm not gonna get into that

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well i'll continue stride uh i think that with stride moving to ics they devalued their stride

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token and i think that quote-unquote being bought out by adam and almost any vision it turns into

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would be a good thing i probably agree and i probably agree it's good on both sides i think

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the key thing that has to happen is that at the moment uh stride's biggest kind of customers

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are atom stakeholders and i don't see how that really works once you are owned by active as it were

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i think that there's some sort of weird circle stake thing going on uh that's even weird and then

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it is at the moment uh so i'm not quite sure how that works but i think that in reality

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i think there's one two significant chain launches coming up where i believe that stride

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are going to be involved very early i think there's going to be huge amounts of these tokens

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going to be liquid staked and i think that that's going to be super bullish for people that hold

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stride or stride is atom at that point i think there's genuine revenue to be made and revenue

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is like nothing makes revenue at the moment i guess my question right now would be so if they were

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bought out by adam would it then be that all of the stride tokens would then go straight to the

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validators and stakers like so there wouldn't be stride stakers anymore like governors i'm sure

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would go away because i don't think it would make too much sense for them not to go away

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does that mean that all atom holders would then effectively become i imagine stride is like an

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etf right you buy stride you stake stride and you get a bunch of other tokens so it's like it's

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an effect on etf so would that then make it as each atom staker and even larger etf holder in a sense

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if so i mean that just that's awesome that would be super cool so so at the moment i think it's 15%

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of stride's revenue goes to atom stakers i think i think it's that it might be 20 but i think it's

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15 and i think then what would happen is that 100% of revenue would go to atom stakers now i'm not

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super keen on that in that i think that some of the revenue should actually go directly to the team

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because i think that creates incentivization for the team to continue working i thought it was

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really dumb when the on stride when we voted to give 100% of revenue to stride stakers i thought

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that was stupid i thought no they like how do you grow your treasury how do you continue to fund

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future development uh i like i understand why stakers should be paid i'm not saying that but

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i also think like you could have taken you know 95% and still left the team you know the treasury

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growing and the foundation getting some incomes that you continue to fund it i think the this is

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a wider issue within the atom and therefore for stride and to an extent neutron uh is how do you

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pay developers and uh known from binary is working on some stuff as part of our type of economic stuff

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where you basically have a kind of allocated budget across the year and it's kind of topped up

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block by block and you kind of as as governance you decide where you want to allocate that to

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and that makes a lot of sense from my point of view but i think that the revenue models are kind

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of really interesting around that and again i think that uh as just a staker you need to take

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a kind of longer term vision because there is no point you extracting all the liquidity so that

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you can't fund teams for long term because the main value added that the stride has for atom

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is that phenomenal team now i'm barely certain that there will be people who will say well devs

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make loads of money at fine but they are also the future of that protocol so what you do and

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if you can't get the alignment of interest right then what we're actually going to do is buy stride

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these guys become multimillionaires and they walk away like that that's not great i guess it's a

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mic drop moment right there do you do you think that's part of the um motivation for that uh

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proposal is you know to monetize their holdings quickly to something that's pretty stable or

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stable i mean they still have a huge amount of stride right like most of the delegations right

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now are from the stride treasury so they're still getting a huge amount of income i so i

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can't imagine it's it's so one-sided as they are looking to get liquidity quickly as what

385
00:37:58,960 --> 00:38:06,160
happened a couple weeks ago so the thing with like the thing with the app chains seems to be

386
00:38:06,160 --> 00:38:14,320
seems to be that you know they have their day for a while and then it is to date like pretty uh

387
00:38:16,000 --> 00:38:21,920
like most of the chain and this is partly a function of the uh the bear market but you know

388
00:38:21,920 --> 00:38:28,960
after after their day is passed the the value of that token goes down a lot because at the end

389
00:38:28,960 --> 00:38:36,880
of the day like how much value is there in in most app chains if you know they got a lot of tokens

390
00:38:36,880 --> 00:38:42,640
they got a platforms that generate not much revenue so like at the end of the day what's that worth

391
00:38:42,640 --> 00:38:52,320
and in terms of stride well i i guess it's it's value to its holders is more or less based on the

392
00:38:52,320 --> 00:39:00,400
uh tokens of which they get revenue from right um in terms of like that little that little bit from

393
00:39:00,400 --> 00:39:07,520
the top when they do the um you know when they they take the the inflation from all the chains

394
00:39:07,520 --> 00:39:11,760
that they're running on and then they take their little bit of cream off the top and then distribute

395
00:39:11,760 --> 00:39:18,560
that to um the holders of the token and that's basically the revenue model but like how will

396
00:39:18,560 --> 00:39:23,280
that play out in the long term like for a chain that has i think i've saw somewhere that at the

397
00:39:23,280 --> 00:39:28,560
moment they've got a revenue of maybe 700 grand i think that was in some of the um comments on

398
00:39:28,560 --> 00:39:36,720
that Commonwealth Schultz so like you know that's trading at 10 times the the revenue at the moment

399
00:39:36,720 --> 00:39:46,320
that's probably not too unreasonable if that's coming out to the um stakers but you know given

400
00:39:46,320 --> 00:39:52,640
the long-term trends of most other app chains maybe i'm not saying it it's a cash grab but maybe it's a

401
00:39:52,640 --> 00:39:59,920
way to like solidify that value into something a little bit more stable that makes sense yeah sure

402
00:39:59,920 --> 00:40:04,720
i mean of all things in the cosmos adam has proven itself to be the most stable um the next best

403
00:40:04,720 --> 00:40:13,520
thing is probably osmosis and it's down 35 times from its all-time high whereas adam is down four

404
00:40:13,520 --> 00:40:23,280
maybe the reality is at go ahead about five five okay five um the reality is adam is

405
00:40:23,280 --> 00:40:31,600
adam is similar to like a lot of the other bigger l ones you know those top those top 50 l ones are

406
00:40:31,600 --> 00:40:37,680
like traded well actually the top 50 is not even all l ones but like the l ones within that top 50

407
00:40:37,680 --> 00:40:45,680
are all traded as if they are like more or less you know the cream of the l ones right which

408
00:40:46,320 --> 00:40:55,280
arguably most of them probably are um and i think that just i think they're traded like on on um

409
00:40:56,400 --> 00:41:02,960
you know on the basis of like signals and stuff rather than their actual worth as a as a chain

410
00:41:02,960 --> 00:41:09,200
if if that makes sense i think in my mind they're they're more they hold their value better because

411
00:41:09,200 --> 00:41:14,400
people are like signal trading from charts and stuff like that rather than saying well what's the

412
00:41:14,400 --> 00:41:20,480
revenue of this thing and what's the what's the um you know long-term value proposition for this

413
00:41:20,480 --> 00:41:27,040
they're like oh okay well we're getting down to like the 30 for again it's over five days of

414
00:41:27,040 --> 00:41:34,240
and it's in the in the green it's a buy line or it's gonna hit its defense whatever those traders

415
00:41:34,240 --> 00:41:44,880
do so i feel like a lot of that um resistance is from traders trading charts not like people's

416
00:41:44,880 --> 00:41:51,600
belief in those chains um as a contrary view to probably what other people might think

417
00:41:51,600 --> 00:41:58,000
i think the reason that after this has not gone down to nothing else is because of Ben you're

418
00:41:58,720 --> 00:42:02,880
it's really hard to hear you right now sorry yes i can bring it really close to my face i've had to

419
00:42:02,880 --> 00:42:08,080
kind of like put my phone in place okay um can you hear me okay it's still a bit you might have had

420
00:42:08,080 --> 00:42:14,240
your hand like over your microphone or something is that still the case yeah can you hear me all right

421
00:42:14,240 --> 00:42:19,040
yeah that's better for sure i can't believe you don't take a tripod for your to conferences for

422
00:42:19,040 --> 00:42:26,320
you for like um you know ad hoc fucking podcast the hotel stuff i think it was the only fans

423
00:42:30,000 --> 00:42:33,280
fill me your feet baby oh you have one i didn't realize you had no new fans

424
00:42:34,880 --> 00:42:45,520
thank you um so so that that was do we do we want to keep uh on this topic or do you want to

425
00:42:45,520 --> 00:42:50,960
change it up into some some news can i tell you one typically cosmos funny story

426
00:42:51,760 --> 00:43:00,320
sure yes just to derail things for a little bit so we had a um round table in the az room and uh it

427
00:43:00,320 --> 00:43:04,960
was meant to be kind of known talking about some of the work the binary are doing around

428
00:43:04,960 --> 00:43:12,880
tokenomics and it sort of was but also sonny came in there to uh talk smack about what the az is uh

429
00:43:12,880 --> 00:43:20,160
jihan uh was very robustly defending it in relation to ics uh spade was in there the duality guys were

430
00:43:20,160 --> 00:43:26,560
in there like loads of giga brains and at the end of the session this uh like completely random bloke

431
00:43:26,560 --> 00:43:32,320
put his hand up and was like can i just give an outsider's perspective um i run this company uh

432
00:43:32,320 --> 00:43:38,720
we're valued at like 11 billion dollars i own about 0.2 percent of all atom and here's what i think

433
00:43:38,720 --> 00:43:44,560
i'm just some thoughts right and literally everyone kind of goes oh okay interesting and nobody not

434
00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:48,560
one person at the end of this thing thought i'll just follow him out the room and have a chat with him

435
00:43:48,560 --> 00:43:56,800
i'll just like this guy is literally worth billions of dollars and atom is like the community that

436
00:43:56,800 --> 00:44:02,240
that everyone in that room is more concerned with having a row than like getting the giga whale

437
00:44:02,240 --> 00:44:08,640
jeez sorry he can't taste that do you have the room what atom or if you i would have slapped

438
00:44:08,640 --> 00:44:13,920
erdeman if he didn't go say hi them if he was in there like go get him get some staking man yeah

439
00:44:14,560 --> 00:44:20,800
absolutely yeah i mean like he yeah so that he owns not not 0.2 percent of all atom of adam

440
00:44:20,800 --> 00:44:28,320
now like but he also has an 11 billion dollar company okay yeah that's an instant go talk to the man

441
00:44:28,320 --> 00:44:34,080
yeah no doubt here he would have been like he would have been walking out with me like holding

442
00:44:34,080 --> 00:44:45,280
under his coat but no yeah like it's just i was like this is crazy this is so crazy like um i did

443
00:44:45,280 --> 00:44:50,240
eventually i did see some people like uh he ended up at the end of that i was at and like yeah people

444
00:44:50,240 --> 00:44:55,840
were trying to tap him up uh but you know he like when i introduced myself to him he was like i was

445
00:44:55,840 --> 00:44:59,680
like oh i'm benny from the atom mix other rate of you know grant program and he was like oh how

446
00:44:59,680 --> 00:45:03,360
much money can you give me i was like well i kind of wanted you to give me some really uh

447
00:45:05,280 --> 00:45:10,320
but um but i just like i just thought it typified cosmos i just thought it typified cosmos where

448
00:45:10,320 --> 00:45:17,920
it's more about the row than the money yeah i tend to like agree with that sentiment 100

449
00:45:17,920 --> 00:45:22,000
so anyway that i think i think that sums up everything from cosmoverse and we can move on

450
00:45:22,000 --> 00:45:29,520
to something else okay well all right shilty and i had the only ones with access to the news so you

451
00:45:29,520 --> 00:45:38,800
don't get the preview um hot i've got the spreadsheet i can put yeah yeah i got it sent it i got i've

452
00:45:38,800 --> 00:45:42,400
still got access to it rama doesn't let me though he complains i'm messing up with his business

453
00:45:42,400 --> 00:45:50,640
model when i delete his comments so well i mean the hot news for this week is uh the news researcher

454
00:45:50,640 --> 00:46:01,520
strike so um rama has put an on-chain transaction to our dow that says if you don't pay me within 24 hours

455
00:46:03,920 --> 00:46:12,080
we were on strike so really that's when you did that did actually says that i just voted yes oh

456
00:46:12,080 --> 00:46:21,760
my the memo on this transaction says you have 24 hours to pay your new release to pay your new

457
00:46:21,760 --> 00:46:30,400
researchers or we go on strike now i think i don't know how rama became multiple people can you form

458
00:46:30,400 --> 00:46:35,760
a union as a single person because it sounds like that's what's going on here he has formed the

459
00:46:35,760 --> 00:46:44,080
researchers union of cosmos single-handedly and probably the only person who cares about the

460
00:46:44,080 --> 00:46:54,560
outcome so this was made on the second of this month which is october now that i'm just looking

461
00:46:54,560 --> 00:47:03,040
um at 1851 i'm assuming that's my time zone so three days later still no pays

462
00:47:03,040 --> 00:47:09,360
shit i'm surprised he didn't delete the news wait hold on a second where is this at i can't see it

463
00:47:09,360 --> 00:47:15,680
on dow dow uh look at the while it's in the spreadsheet there's a link oh yeah yeah but it

464
00:47:15,680 --> 00:47:24,000
was sent to the dow dow address i don't know how we do research like a memo field yeah he sent us a

465
00:47:24,000 --> 00:47:33,440
ransom email in the memo field i think anyone reads their memo fields like you know like when

466
00:47:33,440 --> 00:47:41,280
the fuck is someone going to implement messaging in the wallets well leap wallet on has hey leap

467
00:47:41,280 --> 00:47:47,600
wallet has i believe leap wallet yeah yeah i think this is leap wallet i mean i like that

468
00:47:47,600 --> 00:47:52,160
i like their interface i've never used the wallet it's it's a great wallet is it popular should i

469
00:47:52,160 --> 00:48:00,320
be changing from uh keppelow yeah keppel is dead we have to leap san j even his team are incredible

470
00:48:00,320 --> 00:48:05,120
and leap is definitely the future oh the leap wallet team really kills it like they're really

471
00:48:05,120 --> 00:48:11,440
responsive to feedback they are very in tune with like what people want it it's a great team

472
00:48:11,440 --> 00:48:16,320
really enjoyable to work with but i think they haven't integrated and the hub is buying them out

473
00:48:16,320 --> 00:48:26,800
pretty soon i believe is that true i know that i'm just talking shit what is the fate then of

474
00:48:26,800 --> 00:48:34,000
that other snaps who's the snap mystic labs that's still going that's going strong they're doing

475
00:48:34,000 --> 00:48:39,120
all right but it's like but they're trying to achieve different things these guys right so

476
00:48:39,120 --> 00:48:46,560
um mystic labs is sort of the canonical metamask net from metamask's point of view

477
00:48:47,360 --> 00:48:52,480
whether that means that they will achieve you know market share or whether people do leap i

478
00:48:52,480 --> 00:49:00,720
don't know wow i mean leaps first to market right they all went at the same time oh so um

479
00:49:00,720 --> 00:49:07,440
are the other ones live the yeah yeah yeah yeah so i think it was go ahead and they're gone well i

480
00:49:07,440 --> 00:49:13,680
think that metamask like they whitelisted or like had a prep period and then everything was released

481
00:49:13,680 --> 00:49:18,000
at once right so like they all got ready and then they were all the floodgates were open

482
00:49:18,000 --> 00:49:24,560
effectively yeah leap leap uh while it's slightly front run the kind of end of the like the moment

483
00:49:24,560 --> 00:49:30,000
you could go in terms of their announcement and they got a lot of traction at that um i will say

484
00:49:30,000 --> 00:49:35,760
secret had it going over a year ago like they had a metamask working over a year ago i think what's

485
00:49:35,760 --> 00:49:38,960
what was interesting what's interesting certainly with the mystic labs one it's the one i know the

486
00:49:38,960 --> 00:49:44,000
most about is the fact that it is universal so that you whereas they you know they were like oh

487
00:49:44,000 --> 00:49:48,240
yeah there are other ones that are just on one chain but then you kind of it's what's the use of that

488
00:49:48,880 --> 00:49:53,680
like yeah it's cool if you if your chain has a very specific connection with like ethereum

489
00:49:53,680 --> 00:49:58,640
and you know that that's cool but if you're trying to bring some eth into cosmos and you don't want

490
00:49:58,640 --> 00:50:03,360
people to change metamask you want them to go and buy a bad kid then it needs to be one snap for

491
00:50:03,360 --> 00:50:12,640
everything makes sense um so moving oh actually this is uh this is conference related so the nomic

492
00:50:12,640 --> 00:50:20,800
founder got uh sim swapped and doxxed any uh can you from a man on the ground what so that was well

493
00:50:20,800 --> 00:50:24,240
i mean that had nothing really to do with the conference was it was just he got sim swapped

494
00:50:24,240 --> 00:50:31,040
which is yeah but it was a relief to see here in security that like sim passcode it was great to see

495
00:50:31,040 --> 00:50:35,520
him like live and while at the cos at the event though because i genuinely had this moment where

496
00:50:35,520 --> 00:50:39,920
i was like has he just been kidnapped you just don't know right like at the point that all of his

497
00:50:39,920 --> 00:50:48,320
id and stuff was just put out it's quite scary wow that's uh and then and then a particular validator

498
00:50:48,320 --> 00:50:54,800
decided to uh create take the that tweet and put it in a github reprocess so that it could stay there

499
00:50:54,800 --> 00:51:03,760
forever would this be a validator that we all know because it kind of sounds like such a

500
00:51:03,760 --> 00:51:11,040
fucking jake of thing to do well i mean the man's also currently d dosing the uh the test net of

501
00:51:11,040 --> 00:51:17,120
asma believe oh that's what's happening right now i believe that's him yeah because he's trying to

502
00:51:17,120 --> 00:51:21,680
prove his point right i mean it's testing i think i suppose technically but whatever so

503
00:51:21,680 --> 00:51:28,000
so there's there's jake of news in the news is uh jake of goes on a roundabout max block size bug

504
00:51:28,000 --> 00:51:33,520
puts up a proposal to fix it by increasing hub blocks by five times the current block size

505
00:51:34,240 --> 00:51:38,800
sticks to his guns by saying that one meg blocks is better than 200 kilobyte blocks

506
00:51:38,800 --> 00:51:47,840
even after the advisory from amulet in binary builders yeah like oh there's so much i can't say

507
00:51:47,840 --> 00:51:52,560
because it's like reaching other no because it's other people's opinions and i can i'll tell you

508
00:51:52,560 --> 00:51:57,280
my opinion my opinion is that this is fucking ludicrous right but it's their entire business model

509
00:51:59,280 --> 00:52:04,640
yeah i mean but imagine winning this model as it turns out imagine being a

510
00:52:06,160 --> 00:52:11,440
it's better yeah doing better than being holistically wholesome doing better than most

511
00:52:11,440 --> 00:52:19,600
people right now i i just i don't know how long it lasts i feel like i feel like i mean i just

512
00:52:19,600 --> 00:52:25,360
cannot imagine a world in which that icf delegation stays for example can you speak to the icf

513
00:52:25,920 --> 00:52:31,360
president thing that happened so what exactly happened there so jake of wanted to be like the

514
00:52:31,360 --> 00:52:36,320
icf president right like we're going for council like well okay yeah that's why i need to explain

515
00:52:36,320 --> 00:52:42,800
because i say yeah i mean i'm sure jake would love to be the president of the icf but uh so

516
00:52:42,800 --> 00:52:48,000
brian crane is now the president of the icf he used to be one of the vice presidents i think

517
00:52:48,960 --> 00:52:55,520
and ethan is no longer the president but they have also decided to kind of create or expand

518
00:52:55,520 --> 00:53:01,280
this council and they've kind of publicly kind of opened for recruitment with that and there are

519
00:53:01,280 --> 00:53:08,000
a number of candidates ranging from the sort of sublime to the ridiculous uh you know uh

520
00:53:08,640 --> 00:53:14,480
rama is has put his hat in the ring um jake has put his hat in the ring jake one has put his

521
00:53:14,480 --> 00:53:19,920
hat in the ring jake quattens perhaps has been thrown back out of the ring uh i'm not quite so

522
00:53:19,920 --> 00:53:25,200
sure about the other two um but like so there's this range of people that kind of think that they

523
00:53:25,200 --> 00:53:32,960
they're going to save save the interchange um you know and and and i'm not entirely sure what that

524
00:53:32,960 --> 00:53:40,640
group of people do uh within the icf but then i'm yeah i'm not entirely sure what anyone does at the

525
00:53:40,640 --> 00:53:46,160
icf other than rob who is a f***ing legend and does the kind of twitter stuff he's great um but

526
00:53:46,160 --> 00:53:49,840
there's a lot of other people i don't know what they do there i did meet a very nice person who's

527
00:53:49,840 --> 00:53:55,760
like the new product manager for ibc she seemed really nice don't really know what that means

528
00:53:57,040 --> 00:54:00,800
i shouldn't have come on this part after having so many drinks but you're getting a lot of

529
00:54:03,680 --> 00:54:08,560
if i don't work in cosmos after anymore like then this is this i will know why the cartel have got

530
00:54:08,560 --> 00:54:16,000
me well now you can blame this instead of your three minute speech right i can 100 guarantee you

531
00:54:16,000 --> 00:54:27,040
that the cartel does not watch this nor does like any degrees of friends who know the cartel watch this

532
00:54:27,040 --> 00:54:32,160
so you probably i mean i'm the closest right yeah i mean unless unless you're gonna go and send them

533
00:54:32,160 --> 00:54:37,760
clips you're probably safe technically i'm now cto's boss so i think that definitely makes me like

534
00:54:37,760 --> 00:54:47,520
the head of the mafia that's scary that's uh it's an interesting take on a uh on a grant yeah well

535
00:54:47,520 --> 00:54:51,120
it's you know it basically is me that decides whether we continue paying him each month right

536
00:54:51,840 --> 00:55:00,000
yeah can you pay us like we do stuff we talk occasionally yeah sure i like genuinely i i

537
00:55:00,000 --> 00:55:05,520
mean i don't like yeah i think like i have personally i've had tremendous value out of this

538
00:55:05,520 --> 00:55:14,560
podcast uh oh i i met like seven other people who watch it i met i met one i met the other

539
00:55:14,560 --> 00:55:23,120
person from chat i met um uh less harm really um it doesn't look like that it really confused me

540
00:55:23,120 --> 00:55:29,840
oh that's a shame what did you say his name was less on yeah do less harm i think do

541
00:55:29,840 --> 00:55:37,280
do less harm yeah i'm like no i met yeah no call us harm make this thing yeah yeah

542
00:55:38,240 --> 00:55:45,840
cause no meditations yeah he's super nice he's he's awesome um yeah yeah so we tried

543
00:55:45,840 --> 00:55:49,600
to church for stickers um i don't know what i'll do with the stickers but i was delighted to give him

544
00:55:49,600 --> 00:55:57,760
a shirt uh but he he's yeah and um yeah uh he and i may meet in future for a beer which is very exciting

545
00:55:57,760 --> 00:56:03,840
oh he's local to you well local enough that's very yeah okay yeah local enough that we could

546
00:56:03,840 --> 00:56:09,600
consider meeting for a beer if we plan it we might even persuade um dr fray to join us for a beer

547
00:56:09,600 --> 00:56:14,320
that would be cool so here's what i'll say about dr fray speaking of people like meeting people in

548
00:56:14,320 --> 00:56:20,640
person i expected him to be way shorter than he is he's like he's like a hundred yeah he's like a

549
00:56:20,640 --> 00:56:29,440
goliath i might in my head he's six two he might be six two he might be i think he is like six two

550
00:56:30,080 --> 00:56:37,840
yeah maybe even a little bit tall so like he he sent us a like it was a self mile wasn't a selfie

551
00:56:37,840 --> 00:56:44,000
it was like a photo of him like holding the bean out in like the bush somewhere and he made the trees

552
00:56:44,000 --> 00:56:54,640
look small so yeah yeah but i think giant standing next to this pond that i think was a lake

553
00:56:56,160 --> 00:57:00,480
yeah you just expect him to like carrying a club dragging a club behind him as well for sure

554
00:57:02,560 --> 00:57:09,120
so just a kid by the scruff of the neck dragon and fucking club yeah exactly right so i think once

555
00:57:09,120 --> 00:57:13,760
we've got once we've kind of it'd be nice if we can try and get you know maybe there could be like

556
00:57:13,760 --> 00:57:18,400
a game of notes christmas party where we all kind of just run like meet our respective uh

557
00:57:19,680 --> 00:57:25,280
like like host or people from the chat that are near us and we kind of get together and then try

558
00:57:25,280 --> 00:57:30,160
and do one where we're all drunk that'd be kind of fun so that sounds like me and bandy at the pub

559
00:57:35,360 --> 00:57:42,240
and then me causeless harm dr fray that would work i'd have no idea if you have a local listener

560
00:57:42,240 --> 00:57:48,160
i mean not super local i would probably just head over to pittsburgh and dr uncle dad and i would

561
00:57:48,160 --> 00:57:57,600
have a beer um i wonder where neils and uh story two uh they said probably the state so i guess

562
00:57:57,600 --> 00:58:05,760
do we yeah we're sorry from so so we could meet me for a beer i'm literally taking a um

563
00:58:05,760 --> 00:58:09,520
it's some neutron stuff because he works for neutron so i'm literally taking him some neutron

564
00:58:09,520 --> 00:58:14,080
stuff back from the conference to give to him so i'm already an interesting story he works for

565
00:58:14,080 --> 00:58:18,880
neutron is that is that a similar story to yours just being active in the community and then yeah

566
00:58:19,680 --> 00:58:24,720
yeah yeah so i told his story on a on a space one day and he basically the same thing like was

567
00:58:24,720 --> 00:58:30,960
just super active in the community and then like i think spade reached out to him and and asked if

568
00:58:30,960 --> 00:58:36,720
he would get involved i heard his story on one of like the neutron uh x spaces or twitter spaces

569
00:58:36,720 --> 00:58:42,480
whatever probably some months ago very similar yeah just a community member highly involved

570
00:58:42,480 --> 00:58:49,280
pretty sure my first time i saw soy and this might be wrong because this is a lot of people

571
00:58:49,280 --> 00:58:56,720
um i'm pretty sure they were just shit talking my validator on twitter that sounds like soy

572
00:58:58,560 --> 00:59:04,160
which i say affectionately my first interaction with soy was all he was just shitting on polka

573
00:59:04,160 --> 00:59:09,600
dot and he's like all these guys these polka dot maxis going on about the nakamoto coefficient like

574
00:59:09,600 --> 00:59:14,480
and i was like and i just started like answering him i'm like i'm not the technical guy who can

575
00:59:14,480 --> 00:59:19,760
tell you these things but i was just like writing back and we kind of had a little tiff and then

576
00:59:19,760 --> 00:59:26,000
like i got i talked to him on a space and now like i feel like we're buddies but yeah he was uh i love

577
00:59:26,000 --> 00:59:31,600
soy he's he's he's always got a great take every time i talk to him on a space it happens like

578
00:59:31,600 --> 00:59:39,440
that a lot people are like you know aggressively fucking forcing their opinion in some fashion and

579
00:59:39,440 --> 00:59:46,160
then like you know some the person who's like you know the target of that sometimes you know

580
00:59:46,880 --> 00:59:53,200
engages with them you know on a more level thing like the ams or something and say hey man like

581
00:59:53,200 --> 00:59:58,400
you know this is this this is the deal and then i think a lot of friendships are born out of that

582
00:59:58,400 --> 01:00:08,000
initial like um aggression i know that a lot of mine are um i know that like when i and you know

583
01:00:08,000 --> 01:00:14,320
i've done this at the pub as well and sometimes people just don't like you and they you know

584
01:00:14,320 --> 01:00:22,320
don't like to cut of your jib for some reason and then and then if you just like i don't know i've

585
01:00:22,320 --> 01:00:28,880
i've i've spent like you know you clearly don't like me like why it is the jib they're like no your

586
01:00:28,880 --> 01:00:34,960
jib is just not pleasant your jib is fucking weird very strange i mean it's on one occasion

587
01:00:34,960 --> 01:00:40,720
this dude i was talking to and he so he he worked with my partner and and he just did not

588
01:00:40,720 --> 01:00:45,200
fucking like me and i was like well why don't you like me it's like i don't know and i'm like well

589
01:00:46,000 --> 01:00:50,240
can't really work for you now for a reason yeah and then we like uh you know we talk some more and

590
01:00:50,240 --> 01:00:56,640
then we sort of left on reasonable terms i guess so that was nice but um a good friend of mine the

591
01:00:56,640 --> 01:01:00,560
first time i met him i thought he was a complete asshole because he was being an asshole just

592
01:01:00,560 --> 01:01:05,920
turns out he was a bit drunk a bit more drunk than i was and actually when he like went like if you're

593
01:01:05,920 --> 01:01:11,360
the same amount of drunk or sober like it's fine but you know he was just being a bit of a dick

594
01:01:11,360 --> 01:01:15,120
that night by like i was just like i you know when like you meet someone through some friends i'm

595
01:01:15,120 --> 01:01:19,280
just like i don't get why your friends with this guy he's a dickhead and then it is like and then

596
01:01:19,280 --> 01:01:25,280
it turned out that actually he's really sad yeah so my best friend is actually the same story uh in

597
01:01:25,280 --> 01:01:29,920
college he and i like actively conflicted in almost every single class for the first two or three

598
01:01:29,920 --> 01:01:34,000
years of college and then seen your real your world around and we're like hey do you want to play games

599
01:01:34,000 --> 01:01:39,840
yeah all right and we've basically either lived together or seen each other on a regular basis

600
01:01:39,840 --> 01:01:46,800
since like he lives a five minute drive from me it's funny how that works out yeah yeah and you get

601
01:01:46,800 --> 01:01:50,800
this you get the same thing with romantic stuff as well right whereas sometimes it's just yeah

602
01:01:50,800 --> 01:02:00,960
some form of tension there so speaking of tension uh and i don't know how to say this but

603
01:02:00,960 --> 01:02:06,560
this word i'm pretty sure it's long yeah i'm pretty sure it's chango right chango goes after jack z

604
01:02:07,120 --> 01:02:14,000
in or jack xanpaulin in a video with all his collaborations in calling him a weed which

605
01:02:14,000 --> 01:02:21,760
has embedded his roots into the ecosystem and he needs to be pulled i that just makes me so angry

606
01:02:21,760 --> 01:02:30,240
like say what you all about jack and strangelove the one thing they're not is like a weed and

607
01:02:30,240 --> 01:02:36,080
the ecosystem they have done so much good and they're like they're like the one team that i've seen

608
01:02:36,080 --> 01:02:41,760
actively trying to push you know effective things forward in the ecosystem it's just i

609
01:02:41,760 --> 01:02:47,840
it's just i i don't know why jack's been like has received a decent amount of hate over the last

610
01:02:47,840 --> 01:02:56,160
couple months it just it really bugs me so i feel like yeah over the years like jack has been a net

611
01:02:56,160 --> 01:03:01,920
positive he's like a he's a nice figure for the ecosystem as well like he's well spoken and he's

612
01:03:01,920 --> 01:03:11,600
polite and um he seems to you know try to uh at least in a public forum like try to take on criticism

613
01:03:11,600 --> 01:03:18,640
and then provide like you know answers to that responses to that um other than that i don't

614
01:03:18,640 --> 01:03:23,680
really know the dude too much i don't know a lot of his like specific contributions i know that he

615
01:03:23,680 --> 01:03:31,600
gives a lot of contribution to i b c how much of that's like paid for i don't know um but i mean

616
01:03:31,600 --> 01:03:38,000
he seems to be a net positive contributor i haven't seen the video um so i don't i can't really

617
01:03:38,000 --> 01:03:43,360
comment on what's in it don't know if anyone else has i haven't seen the video either but

618
01:03:43,920 --> 01:03:47,520
i'm more of just speaking about on twitter in general like i've seen a lot of conflict

619
01:03:47,520 --> 01:03:52,880
and vitriol pointed towards jack not so much strange love just specifically jack and it just

620
01:03:54,640 --> 01:03:59,840
i have no place to like be his defender or whatever i'm just like peon number seven

621
01:03:59,840 --> 01:04:06,720
whereas jack is like a beacon in the ecosystem so like what am i really doing nothing sometimes

622
01:04:06,720 --> 01:04:12,480
people just like to shit on success to make themselves feel better like but it's there's more

623
01:04:12,480 --> 01:04:19,120
yeah i don't know but i you know if this was you know if you can infer that maybe this video was

624
01:04:20,320 --> 01:04:25,280
supported by you know maybe another contributor the ecosystem there's a bit of a hit piece or

625
01:04:25,280 --> 01:04:31,520
something like that then maybe you can see where that's coming from i guess um but you know you

626
01:04:31,520 --> 01:04:37,920
don't believe everything you watch on twitter know that a lot of people who say shit on twitter

627
01:04:37,920 --> 01:04:42,560
are paid to say shit on twitter because they've got a little number under their name so

628
01:04:45,120 --> 01:04:50,800
yeah because they have a number under their name what you know followers man followers

629
01:04:50,800 --> 01:04:56,960
followers okay got it i'm picking up what you're putting down yeah um i mean page

630
01:04:56,960 --> 01:05:03,440
shills are everywhere these day and age and you have to like really you know consider what you're

631
01:05:03,440 --> 01:05:10,320
taking to be gospel when you're when you're looking at things on the internet um that news story has

632
01:05:10,320 --> 01:05:16,640
been so hard for me because i've literally had it all my time and uh yeah like i so i saw jack

633
01:05:16,640 --> 01:05:23,840
after that video came out uh you know i don't like i think he knows where it's come from and i think

634
01:05:23,840 --> 01:05:29,040
he has a good idea about it i don't think he's actually bothered uh but it can't be nice to have

635
01:05:29,040 --> 01:05:35,280
what certainly he considers to be a paid hit piece put out about him you know and i think and i

636
01:05:35,280 --> 01:05:39,120
think it's a shame for the i just think it's a shame for the ecosystem that we can't like act a

637
01:05:39,120 --> 01:05:45,360
bit more adult than that that's what i was gonna say um there was a couple years back i had a couple

638
01:05:45,360 --> 01:05:50,400
developer friends that were looking to join the ecosystem and we were going to develop a product

639
01:05:50,400 --> 01:05:55,200
which jack actually knows about jack um he and i actually had a conversation around this and

640
01:05:55,840 --> 01:06:01,920
the after seeing like the twitter activity even back then there was so much angst and

641
01:06:01,920 --> 01:06:06,640
anger and conflict that they were like i'm i'm not going to be a part of this this is this

642
01:06:06,640 --> 01:06:13,440
isn't what i want to be a part of that so i just i don't know even more of it coming out and i feel

643
01:06:13,440 --> 01:06:17,680
like we should just be past this at this point like i know that all mature things will have some

644
01:06:17,680 --> 01:06:24,080
level of conflict but why does it have to be so public and also so i think condescending is really

645
01:06:24,080 --> 01:06:28,080
the word i want to choose here why does it have to be so condescending bear market but this was

646
01:06:28,080 --> 01:06:33,040
before the bear market it started before the bear market like we were deep in the bull market

647
01:06:33,040 --> 01:06:37,440
whenever i was trying to get some friends and okay and even then they were like no i'm out it just

648
01:06:37,440 --> 01:06:45,680
seems like it's bringing out the worst of everybody my this point my take broadly is that i think that

649
01:06:45,680 --> 01:06:53,760
first generation cosmos people have a lot of um for one to a better word trauma from that aib

650
01:06:53,760 --> 01:07:00,160
explosion and diaspora and unresolved issues towards each other and lack of trust and it's

651
01:07:00,160 --> 01:07:04,240
not just like a j versus ethan versus zaki thing i think it goes through all levels within that

652
01:07:04,240 --> 01:07:08,560
company i think that's part of it and i think that's infused the same culture i think they're a kind

653
01:07:08,560 --> 01:07:15,840
of second generation cosmos people that don't give off that energy and i think that over time that

654
01:07:15,840 --> 01:07:22,240
will permeate through um i think you know so if you look at the duality lads if you look at spade

655
01:07:22,240 --> 01:07:28,240
at neutron if you look at um uh the stride guys that these are the teams i know the most and you

656
01:07:28,240 --> 01:07:33,120
know closest to so just because i've worked with them or the guys at leak wallet like they're just

657
01:07:33,120 --> 01:07:36,880
not doing that and they're not interested in it and they're they're shipping good work and things

658
01:07:36,880 --> 01:07:41,600
are happening and ultimately they're going to be the ones who win um and they're going to be the one

659
01:07:41,600 --> 01:07:47,360
like and that but it makes me insanely bullish on the ecosystem as a whole because more people coming

660
01:07:47,360 --> 01:07:52,480
are that mentality and what will happen is the people you know those og's just get effectively

661
01:07:52,480 --> 01:07:58,960
diluted over time um so that's not to shit on some of those og's some of those are kind of like you

662
01:07:58,960 --> 01:08:04,160
know cosmos heroes and i feel like a total arpa when i'm in front of them like you know that's fine

663
01:08:04,160 --> 01:08:09,920
but i just mean that like there's a culture that they have because of what happened that these other

664
01:08:09,920 --> 01:08:14,560
people don't have and i think that that really helps i think there's still some stuff that

665
01:08:14,560 --> 01:08:18,480
needs to permeate through the community but i'm really hope but you know i think loads of that

666
01:08:18,480 --> 01:08:23,520
does happen i think it is maybe i'm just naive but i think it's getting better despite the bmr

667
01:08:24,640 --> 01:08:29,360
you know what i think that i would agree i think that it has gotten better um it doesn't see it

668
01:08:29,360 --> 01:08:35,120
seemed like like what drama was on twitter recently was one of our core components of this show

669
01:08:35,120 --> 01:08:39,200
for a long time like what's the new drama this week right that was easy to say and it's much

670
01:08:39,200 --> 01:08:44,800
more difficult to say now generally if there's drama happening like there's a few core players and

671
01:08:44,800 --> 01:08:49,440
we're like that's kind of played out i don't really want to talk about it so yeah i'm not

672
01:08:49,440 --> 01:08:58,560
to agree i'm so glad we can be you know a bit of hope here the beacon of hopeium that's right i should be

673
01:08:58,560 --> 01:09:03,360
that should be our new shield so we might have to drop the wholesome tag and become the beacon of

674
01:09:03,360 --> 01:09:14,160
hope it is pretty good um so all right let's let's let's fucking go to some other drama-ish type

675
01:09:14,160 --> 01:09:24,720
of shit um dps hey dps yeah more more dps someone had to explain that to me i was like what's dps

676
01:09:24,720 --> 01:09:30,320
my trauma per second i was like oh okay do you know who do you know who claims to court who coined that

677
01:09:30,320 --> 01:09:41,360
phrase no it's jack jack yeah it was definitely us he claims to have come up with it years ago because

678
01:09:41,360 --> 01:09:49,120
he did like uh lots of like uh rpg kind of stuff where you have the damage per second is a is a stat

679
01:09:49,120 --> 01:09:55,280
you just turned it but yeah that's he claims to have it but i first heard it on game i like that i

680
01:09:55,280 --> 01:10:02,480
coined a term a term shield so you have you coined a term uh i would say i have coined a term i coined

681
01:10:02,480 --> 01:10:09,360
djenn hawk rucks you did you did coin djenn hawk rucks and that is like the canonical calling of it

682
01:10:09,360 --> 01:10:17,280
now it proliferated i coined a term i'm quite proud although like you know my my system gets quite a

683
01:10:17,280 --> 01:10:24,800
lot of criticism there's a lot of warnings in that fucking guy

684
01:10:26,320 --> 01:10:30,480
there is there weren't that many warnings prior to that double sign on say and then they're like uh oh

685
01:10:32,640 --> 01:10:37,520
you've read my original guide that i wrote though right for djenn hawk rucks i don't know if i have

686
01:10:37,520 --> 01:10:44,480
on my github oh man it is fucking full of warnings you told us about it when we when we talked like

687
01:10:44,480 --> 01:10:48,640
when lucky friday when we had that meeting with you you were like djenn hawk rucks and you told us

688
01:10:48,640 --> 01:10:55,040
about like the get up and everything yeah yeah i just think the word djenn at the start of a like uh

689
01:10:56,960 --> 01:11:01,360
you know system it's like is it warning itself you really don't need much more than that right

690
01:11:01,360 --> 01:11:11,040
so that's a great point so we have we have another remaining item

691
01:11:11,040 --> 01:11:20,880
well too in the news so um okay i'm reading this because it's long uh the only dot dot

692
01:11:20,880 --> 01:11:28,720
dot dot user on cosmos was wrecked by the canonical dot due to composable bridge being down for maintenance

693
01:11:28,720 --> 01:11:35,680
for 10 days and people buying dot without the ability to orbit the composable team didn't inform

694
01:11:35,680 --> 01:11:42,720
the community their bridge was down let alone been uh minimum viable product in beta stage

695
01:11:43,840 --> 01:11:49,520
is that you funky are you the are you the user of dots on cosmos no well let me say this is

696
01:11:49,520 --> 01:11:55,600
interesting this is really interesting so if you guys saw we did something where like jessica

697
01:11:55,600 --> 01:12:00,000
cosmos you guys may know her she used to work for flip side she now works for us at lucky friday

698
01:12:00,000 --> 01:12:05,840
she's our senior software ninja so she and i basically wanted to do something where we were

699
01:12:05,840 --> 01:12:11,760
gonna for teddy dowell like we're gonna give to charity and so we we did a double thing she donated

700
01:12:11,760 --> 01:12:17,120
a bad kid i donated my one bad kid and we were gonna do it for charity so i even brought this to the

701
01:12:17,120 --> 01:12:23,280
attention of the composable labs team i'm like yo like there's a significant like problem between

702
01:12:23,280 --> 01:12:30,000
like if i try to switch to the cosmo dot instead of the axle dot like it's way off like a massive

703
01:12:30,000 --> 01:12:35,200
arbitrage opportunity so like i even pointed this out to them and and that's what i don't understand

704
01:12:35,200 --> 01:12:39,600
like then i started seeing this stuff about levana and how they like wanted to force people to use

705
01:12:39,600 --> 01:12:44,960
the cosmo dot or though i guess like i was told it's i bc dot for whatever reason instead of the

706
01:12:44,960 --> 01:12:50,640
axle dot which is much more liquid and i'm like why are they forcing people to use it and i didn't

707
01:12:50,640 --> 01:12:56,800
even know that the bridge was down until like i started seeing all the posts about on x so um no

708
01:12:56,800 --> 01:13:01,600
i admittedly i just used the stuff the axle dot from axelar because i can just like pour it right

709
01:13:01,600 --> 01:13:07,200
over to moonbeam and then i just bought i donated to the teddy uh that louis he ended up winning so

710
01:13:07,760 --> 01:13:13,600
i i probably would be the one person using dot in the ecosystem because i mean i'm not gonna lie as

711
01:13:13,600 --> 01:13:20,240
as a fan of both i would wouldn't mind like doing some kind of lp with adam and dot but yeah this

712
01:13:20,240 --> 01:13:27,120
whole like thing was a bad it was a black eye really i think on on the cl team to that they

713
01:13:27,120 --> 01:13:31,440
hadn't told anybody that the bridge was down and i've had friends who have tried to use it

714
01:13:32,080 --> 01:13:36,880
and said it's like 15 clicks and then this their shit just gets stuck like they don't

715
01:13:36,880 --> 01:13:43,760
know what to do so you know like as someone who want who just is i if i'm a maxi on anything

716
01:13:43,760 --> 01:13:48,400
that's an interoperability maxi like and i feel like that's where this is all heading right like

717
01:13:48,400 --> 01:13:52,960
to your point benny where you sang much earlier in the episode like not one pain is going to win i

718
01:13:52,960 --> 01:13:57,360
feel like it's just going to be a bunch of chains talking to each other and i don't care if it's i bc

719
01:13:57,360 --> 01:14:02,880
or whatever it is that connects us all i don't care like just make it happen and so that's why

720
01:14:02,880 --> 01:14:09,120
like i was personally still i guess kind of bullish but it's interesting seeing sort of the

721
01:14:09,120 --> 01:14:16,000
cosmos landscape become more leery about the composable team because the dot like side of the

722
01:14:16,000 --> 01:14:23,600
fence has always held them at like an arms length after all the zack xpt stuff and everything else

723
01:14:23,600 --> 01:14:29,280
and then now it seems like the few x spaces i've been on like i was did one with don

724
01:14:29,840 --> 01:14:35,760
kryptonium and we kind of like co-hosted it and asked a lot of tough questions of omar and

725
01:14:35,760 --> 01:14:42,160
everything else and so it's yeah this whole thing is just being it is really interesting right now

726
01:14:42,160 --> 01:14:48,720
for me as someone who likes both ecosystems but i'm curious what you guys like what's your take on

727
01:14:48,720 --> 01:14:53,840
all this and how this is played out and like what's your take on the bridge being down and not being

728
01:14:53,840 --> 01:14:59,120
able to do the arbitrage and everything else i mean so i don't think that the we knew too much

729
01:14:59,120 --> 01:15:05,280
about the composable team because like we're not part of the polka dot ecosystem right so all we

730
01:15:05,280 --> 01:15:11,600
knew was there was this team now granted like i kind of know the history of that bridge right that

731
01:15:11,600 --> 01:15:18,320
bridge started being written by sheldon from octopus and the composable team took into credit for it

732
01:15:18,320 --> 01:15:22,640
and so i was already kind of leery about it there is that sheldon who's now at lochland

733
01:15:24,000 --> 01:15:30,000
sheldon's like the big near guy he like octopus is somehow related to substrate like there's a kind

734
01:15:30,000 --> 01:15:34,320
of close connection or kinship with like some of this stuff that's been written on polka dot like

735
01:15:34,320 --> 01:15:40,640
i don't understand all the intricacies of it but yeah there's well so so octopus kind of turns

736
01:15:40,640 --> 01:15:48,240
near into polka dot in the sense that okay you can create substrate chains off of near like doing

737
01:15:48,240 --> 01:15:55,440
kind of using using polka dots kind of system of security and so sheldon had developed basically

738
01:15:55,440 --> 01:16:01,120
ibc for that to kind of the cosmos and then the composable team found it and then used it

739
01:16:01,680 --> 01:16:06,560
oh you don't know that but i don't think that it is sheldon that joint notional i'd be very surprised

740
01:16:06,560 --> 01:16:13,840
if that were the case they seem to have quite a few people now um but yeah i mean the the bridge

741
01:16:15,440 --> 01:16:22,320
the bridge being down is not like in my opinion such an issue because like all this well all the

742
01:16:22,320 --> 01:16:28,800
stuff that hopefully they should be communicating when stuff's like mvp and beta um but yeah i mean

743
01:16:28,800 --> 01:16:36,720
the the biggest issue i see there and that news is that they didn't communicate it to anyone um and it

744
01:16:36,720 --> 01:16:44,240
sounds like they didn't you know make an effort on the bridging site to make it known that it is down

745
01:16:44,240 --> 01:16:51,280
so like you know if i was the product manager for that um and your product was down i would have

746
01:16:52,160 --> 01:16:58,080
this flash page just blurred out with a sign on it that says the bridge is currently down for

747
01:16:58,080 --> 01:17:04,000
maintenance or whatever it is we'll we'll be back uh check again in like fucking three weeks yeah i

748
01:17:05,040 --> 01:17:11,200
like my view is that someone got wrecked because they're shit at that like basic customer care

749
01:17:11,840 --> 01:17:15,200
someone got someone someone's lost money because they haven't done their job properly

750
01:17:15,840 --> 01:17:21,120
and they you know like there was a really nice guy from the composable team doing the rounds kind of

751
01:17:21,120 --> 01:17:26,160
kind of you know see what the support was and kind of spoke to me not that my matter but he

752
01:17:26,160 --> 01:17:31,600
doesn't know that right he just walks in and under and the guy wrapping the hub uh but he was like oh

753
01:17:31,600 --> 01:17:36,800
are you you know supportive and like as a Brit it's really hard to just sort of pull you know i'm

754
01:17:36,800 --> 01:17:44,240
just basically want to politely say go away don't come back like please don't like i i i've been

755
01:17:44,240 --> 01:17:51,520
terrified of composable uh for a long time um i remember speaking i was on a call with um

756
01:17:51,520 --> 01:17:58,400
um Rama and someone else and we were like weird that jack's like willing to trust his baby with

757
01:17:58,400 --> 01:18:04,720
the with this team like and and like at the time i just thought oh well if jack thinks that this is

758
01:18:04,720 --> 01:18:09,120
a good idea he must be seeing something that i don't and he's you know must think they're great

759
01:18:09,120 --> 01:18:15,200
builders right like that's that's where i my head was at i'm less certain now and you know the and

760
01:18:15,200 --> 01:18:19,360
this isn't a dig at all but like the bridge is obviously that everyone's most interested in with

761
01:18:19,360 --> 01:18:24,160
ibc is the east stuff and we've got three teams working on that composable is one of them there

762
01:18:24,160 --> 01:18:34,080
are two others um an interesting thing with um with user experience in bridging is that um i'm

763
01:18:34,080 --> 01:18:44,480
pretty sure dydx is close to their v4 chain launch and i read somewhere hey really close so i read

764
01:18:44,480 --> 01:18:53,040
somewhere that um that they have like a bunch of ecosystems with like one click bridge um straight

765
01:18:53,040 --> 01:18:59,840
into their platform which i think is pretty cool and i don't know if that will like make them a

766
01:18:59,840 --> 01:19:06,880
bit of a hub for um you know bridging assets i don't know what bridges they're using but um yeah i

767
01:19:06,880 --> 01:19:10,400
mean if there's just like a one click bridge solution you click your button and it appears

768
01:19:10,400 --> 01:19:18,320
on on their chick because you know one one thing for dydx that's crucial is user experience and

769
01:19:18,320 --> 01:19:24,080
you don't want to materially change it from what people know and like at the moment and it's already

770
01:19:24,080 --> 01:19:29,760
going to be like a pill to swallow for people to know that they're sending their stuff away from

771
01:19:31,360 --> 01:19:37,600
you know the ethereum or wherever the fuck they've got it arbitram but the fact that i'm pretty sure

772
01:19:37,600 --> 01:19:42,880
and i could just be spouting bullshit now but i'm pretty sure they're integrated with a bunch of

773
01:19:42,880 --> 01:19:49,120
wallets and that you know you don't have to change your experience at all you just one click bridge

774
01:19:49,120 --> 01:19:55,040
over into the their ecosystem still just the way you do it now it's just that it's you know they've

775
01:19:55,040 --> 01:20:01,440
abstracted away the bridging yeah like i mean i'll just say this like squid router i think it does a

776
01:20:01,440 --> 01:20:07,120
fantastic job of being able to pull stuff from cosmos polka dot whatever like it just you might

777
01:20:07,120 --> 01:20:11,280
have to manipulate a little bit more like i'm going to go from this chain i want i'm using this asset

778
01:20:11,280 --> 01:20:17,760
to this chain and this asset you might have to wait for a few minutes but like this it seems as if

779
01:20:17,760 --> 01:20:23,440
these things are becoming more common in terms of how easy they they already use and it may be more

780
01:20:23,440 --> 01:20:28,160
than one click but like when you're actually like the one signature you're giving in your metamask

781
01:20:28,160 --> 01:20:34,560
or whatever it seems like it's becoming easier and easier by the day to to bridge over stuff to

782
01:20:34,560 --> 01:20:40,000
another ecosystem like that's what happened when luis won the thing for the bad kids to send them

783
01:20:40,000 --> 01:20:44,880
money like even though i couldn't use the cosmo dot and i use the axelar dot it was super easy

784
01:20:44,880 --> 01:20:48,640
like i was just like okay i'm coming from this chain i'm coming here and then just like i would

785
01:20:48,640 --> 01:20:53,120
drew it and it was right there and i could swap the glimmer and it was it was very easy so you

786
01:20:53,120 --> 01:20:58,480
know i i think that some of the apprehensions that we all have about bridges are eventually going

787
01:20:58,480 --> 01:21:05,760
to disappear especially if they become more ibc focused just with just knowing how that system

788
01:21:05,760 --> 01:21:14,160
is set up to be for the most part trustless so i don't know i i'm i'm very like hopeful i guess

789
01:21:14,160 --> 01:21:18,240
for lack of a better word about just some of these bridging solutions and the way that we'll be able

790
01:21:18,240 --> 01:21:26,240
to connect ecosystems together do do you know what i think is probably like some of the biggest

791
01:21:26,240 --> 01:21:37,600
untapped bridging uh liquidity is sexes like what if binance created a bridge that just natively

792
01:21:37,600 --> 01:21:43,520
like i mean you had one everywhere right they do because if they used to they brought it down like

793
01:21:43,520 --> 01:21:48,720
two years ago well i mean that that would make a lot of sense if they had like you know the ability

794
01:21:48,720 --> 01:21:56,160
in their api to do that somehow with different interfaces just send you fucking um like even

795
01:21:56,160 --> 01:22:01,840
if if they're using zero or something like that through a wallet and you can just send your your

796
01:22:03,200 --> 01:22:10,800
usdc from an ethereum wallet address to like a noble wallet address and it just appears there

797
01:22:10,800 --> 01:22:17,280
in a very short amount of time it was sweet it was really cool to use i wonder why that i guess

798
01:22:17,280 --> 01:22:21,840
they weren't making any money out of it yeah probably not i think i think people started using it for

799
01:22:21,840 --> 01:22:27,520
um the problem was people started using it using it as a way to get it off of their exchange and using

800
01:22:27,520 --> 01:22:35,680
decentralized uh oh yeah makers yeah so they're like yeah i bc right like they don't want i bc

801
01:22:36,400 --> 01:22:43,120
exactly yeah exactly isn't um binance smart change joining i bc so they can't be that far against it

802
01:22:43,120 --> 01:22:51,520
yeah which is going to be interesting because then there will be two uh native usdcs available

803
01:22:51,520 --> 01:22:56,080
on cosmos because there's a native dc on um binance smart chain

804
01:22:58,400 --> 01:23:04,960
we see wait this minus isn't the binance smart chain like fork of the cosmos chain like the sdk

805
01:23:04,960 --> 01:23:11,200
yeah it's built on the sdk like a very early version of it yeah i don't know if it's just

806
01:23:11,200 --> 01:23:17,520
fucking grinding gears here it's like working through this yeah i didn't know they were either

807
01:23:17,520 --> 01:23:21,920
i thought that they were like so far behind that it'd be really difficult for them to do and their

808
01:23:21,920 --> 01:23:34,400
developers my understanding aren't exactly um yeah thank you all right uh blog dot cosmos dot network

809
01:23:35,360 --> 01:23:44,880
um i bc is finally landing on bsc interesting okay i read it yeah i mean i suppose a blog isn't

810
01:23:44,880 --> 01:23:49,760
you know from the horse's mouth but it's as close as it's going to get well cosmos dot network that's

811
01:23:49,760 --> 01:23:55,440
like more or less official right bendy i think that might be the ic ad so you know who knows

812
01:23:55,440 --> 01:24:03,840
five days ago by toky so yeah i mean it seems right i'm not a member of of cosmos here's a comment

813
01:24:03,840 --> 01:24:10,960
about our work from jack zampolin trust a minimized interoperability across blockchain's ecosystem is

814
01:24:10,960 --> 01:24:18,400
greatly needed and i'm fucking nothing about the oh hang on uh so from jack which i'm greatly excited

815
01:24:18,400 --> 01:24:26,400
about the contributions from toky and data chain which are expanding i bc's reach to non-cosmos sdk

816
01:24:26,400 --> 01:24:32,960
chains such as ethereum and bsc i'm looking forward to seeing their ongoing contributions to i bc

817
01:24:33,520 --> 01:24:39,360
yeah the only thing is i think bsc was built on the sdk but like i said a very old version

818
01:24:39,360 --> 01:24:45,840
well so bsc and the binance chain are different bsc is a fork of ethereum so this is

819
01:24:47,680 --> 01:24:53,040
yeah so this is entirely different thing interesting interesting interesting okay okay yeah b and b

820
01:24:53,040 --> 01:25:00,560
smart chain but is this the um the guys that left composable i don't know i don't know who toky is

821
01:25:01,760 --> 01:25:07,760
i don't know if this is union i wonder if it is i'm not sure it says toky and data chain i don't

822
01:25:07,760 --> 01:25:15,840
know i don't know who data chains uh today toky is excited to announce that i bc is finally landing

823
01:25:15,840 --> 01:25:23,520
on bsc as many of you might know according to defy lama bsc is the third largest blockchain

824
01:25:24,080 --> 01:25:30,480
network in the world by tbl so this represents a significant milestone for i bc but yeah i mean

825
01:25:30,480 --> 01:25:37,280
the the thing is i'm pretty sure that you see let me let me look up the um usdc i'm so glad we've all

826
01:25:37,280 --> 01:25:42,000
got our finger on the pulse here that's good i know i'm kind of blown away and second that

827
01:25:42,000 --> 01:25:48,320
tron is apparently the second biggest chain for defy that seems like that's just because just

828
01:25:48,320 --> 01:25:56,320
ends like mint and fake shit that's what i was going to say that doesn't seem usd debacle yeah yeah

829
01:25:56,320 --> 01:26:02,320
yeah we'll only know that the bear market is over once that's it's you know unwound there's a lot

830
01:26:02,320 --> 01:26:09,440
more pain to come don't bendy don't be so british dammit well what do you want me to say no i expect

831
01:26:09,440 --> 01:26:18,320
you to say that just the the uber pessimists well look i mean i mean i mean i'm in a crazy little

832
01:26:18,320 --> 01:26:24,320
spot i have to basically say look boys will be boys but it's all going you know we're all f***lads

833
01:26:24,320 --> 01:26:36,400
so looking at this um so looking at the the circle uh multi-chain um listing of where they have

834
01:26:36,400 --> 01:26:49,280
native usdc it does not appear that bsc is on the list but i 100 percent um was on a centralized

835
01:26:49,280 --> 01:27:01,280
exchange the other day and saw it as an option for