1 00:00:00,000 --> 00:00:20,120 Well, hello everybody and welcome to Redeem Through His Blood. 2 00:00:20,120 --> 00:00:24,520 In this podcast, we discuss hope, healing and redemption through the Atonement of Jesus 3 00:00:24,520 --> 00:00:25,520 Christ. 4 00:00:25,520 --> 00:00:29,520 My name's Scott Durfey and it's my pleasure to introduce my partner in this project, our 5 00:00:29,520 --> 00:00:31,240 teacher, Brother David Durfey. 6 00:00:31,240 --> 00:00:32,240 Say hi, Dave. 7 00:00:32,240 --> 00:00:36,000 It's a good day to repent and be forgiven. 8 00:00:36,000 --> 00:00:37,760 Yeah, it is. 9 00:00:37,760 --> 00:00:40,360 And fill his spirit by doing so. 10 00:00:40,360 --> 00:00:43,640 That's definitely where we're headed today once again. 11 00:00:43,640 --> 00:00:48,960 Hey, gang, I just want to make sure that we extend our gratitude to each one of you, 12 00:00:48,960 --> 00:00:53,520 for those of you who have been communicating to us through emails. 13 00:00:53,520 --> 00:00:59,040 We've received some great emails lately, Dave, from members and non-members, those who have 14 00:00:59,040 --> 00:01:03,600 been listening to our podcasts and questions and comments. 15 00:01:03,600 --> 00:01:04,720 We want to encourage both. 16 00:01:04,720 --> 00:01:07,360 We try to incorporate your questions in our discussion. 17 00:01:07,360 --> 00:01:12,000 And again, we will deal with some of those directly in future podcasts. 18 00:01:12,000 --> 00:01:17,960 We also want to thank you for telling your friends about this and sharing this experience 19 00:01:17,960 --> 00:01:19,320 with them as well. 20 00:01:19,320 --> 00:01:23,800 That's our hope that we can take the good news of the Atonement, the power of our Lord 21 00:01:23,800 --> 00:01:30,280 and Savior Jesus Christ through His Atonement to those who feel lack or feel less or feel 22 00:01:30,280 --> 00:01:32,240 less loved, etc. 23 00:01:32,240 --> 00:01:38,640 We just are hoping and praying that this will extend and reach those who need that help. 24 00:01:38,640 --> 00:01:45,160 You can respond or send those emails to us here at heredeemsusatgmail.com. 25 00:01:45,160 --> 00:01:49,040 He redeemsusatgmail.com. 26 00:01:49,040 --> 00:01:54,360 Well Dave, before we jump into this week's topic, last week we extended an invitation 27 00:01:54,360 --> 00:01:56,040 to do a personal inventory. 28 00:01:56,040 --> 00:02:01,600 We talked about honesty, the importance of being completely honest in our lives, especially 29 00:02:01,600 --> 00:02:06,680 as it comes to our relationship with our Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ, our Lord and Savior. 30 00:02:06,680 --> 00:02:11,360 And you know, that inventory invitation that we sent out, I actually do that on a nightly 31 00:02:11,360 --> 00:02:16,000 basis as a step called step 10 in recovery. 32 00:02:16,000 --> 00:02:21,920 Step 10 says, I'm going to try and quote it, we continue to take personal inventory and 33 00:02:21,920 --> 00:02:24,120 when we're wrong, we promptly admit it. 34 00:02:24,120 --> 00:02:29,240 There's a process that I go through as part of my dailies in recovery that keep me on 35 00:02:29,240 --> 00:02:34,080 the track of recovery and in a relationship with my Heavenly Father. 36 00:02:34,080 --> 00:02:37,320 That list doesn't have to be long for me. 37 00:02:37,320 --> 00:02:39,120 This is how I do it. 38 00:02:39,120 --> 00:02:40,560 There's no pattern. 39 00:02:40,560 --> 00:02:41,920 There's no right way, no wrong way. 40 00:02:41,920 --> 00:02:43,440 You don't even have to do it. 41 00:02:43,440 --> 00:02:44,440 But here's how I do it. 42 00:02:44,440 --> 00:02:48,080 Each night I like to think of two or three things that I've been exceptionally grateful 43 00:02:48,080 --> 00:02:49,440 for that day. 44 00:02:49,440 --> 00:02:53,320 And when I write those two or three things down, it puts me in an attitude of gratitude 45 00:02:53,320 --> 00:02:57,560 where I can feel my Heavenly Father's spirit more fully, more completely, and then I pray 46 00:02:57,560 --> 00:02:59,800 to Him, where have I been wrong? 47 00:02:59,800 --> 00:03:01,600 Where could I have done better? 48 00:03:01,600 --> 00:03:03,880 And when I do that, I receive those answers. 49 00:03:03,880 --> 00:03:10,560 I get recollection of events during the day where maybe I was sharp with somebody at the 50 00:03:10,560 --> 00:03:15,040 fast food place because they didn't get my food fast enough to me, or maybe where I was 51 00:03:15,040 --> 00:03:20,880 pouting because something didn't go my way in my relationship with my wife, and a myriad 52 00:03:20,880 --> 00:03:21,880 of other things. 53 00:03:21,880 --> 00:03:27,880 So power behind inventory, great, great power behind inventory, especially when it comes 54 00:03:27,880 --> 00:03:33,800 to confessing and forsaking our sins, which brings us to our topic today, Dave. 55 00:03:33,800 --> 00:03:39,720 And maybe just to comment about last week and lead us into today. 56 00:03:39,720 --> 00:03:46,280 I love this scripture in 1 John, one of the epistles of John chapter one, verses seven 57 00:03:46,280 --> 00:03:54,160 through nine, where he says, if we say that we have no sin, we deceive ourselves, and 58 00:03:54,160 --> 00:03:57,520 the truth is not in us. 59 00:03:57,520 --> 00:03:59,720 I've always loved that. 60 00:03:59,720 --> 00:04:03,800 If we confess our sins, he is faithful. 61 00:04:03,800 --> 00:04:12,280 And just to forgive us our sins and to cleanse us from all unrighteousness. 62 00:04:12,280 --> 00:04:19,920 And I would add and to strengthen us, to cleanse us and to strengthen us from all unrighteousness. 63 00:04:19,920 --> 00:04:23,160 Now that doesn't mean that we won't continue to sit this in. 64 00:04:23,160 --> 00:04:26,760 You know, the prophets sin, they repent every day. 65 00:04:26,760 --> 00:04:33,440 They present Nelson, I think Scott has also encouraged us as members of the church, present 66 00:04:33,440 --> 00:04:40,640 Nelson has encouraged us to take a daily inventory and to make daily repentance a part of our 67 00:04:40,640 --> 00:04:42,140 life. 68 00:04:42,140 --> 00:04:47,240 Prophet Joseph Smith said that we should never trifle with daily repentance. 69 00:04:47,240 --> 00:04:54,960 It shouldn't become too rote or we shouldn't take that for granted or it shouldn't become 70 00:04:54,960 --> 00:04:57,600 trite or unimportant to us. 71 00:04:57,600 --> 00:05:02,760 We should do that as part of our, not just daily progression, but eternal progression. 72 00:05:02,760 --> 00:05:08,360 John talks about, after recognizing and being honest with ourselves, which we talked about 73 00:05:08,360 --> 00:05:12,600 last time, that we need to confess our sins. 74 00:05:12,600 --> 00:05:19,600 We read the scripture last week in Doctrine and Covenants 58, 42 and 43, that talks about 75 00:05:19,600 --> 00:05:23,280 the Lord will forgive us and remember our sins no more. 76 00:05:23,280 --> 00:05:31,240 And then he says, by this, or here's the manifestation or the evidence of your repentance, by this 77 00:05:31,240 --> 00:05:38,600 you may know if a man repenteth of his sins, behold, he will confess them and forsake them. 78 00:05:38,600 --> 00:05:44,160 Last time we introduced the three questions that we should answer today, which is why 79 00:05:44,160 --> 00:05:46,560 do we confess sins? 80 00:05:46,560 --> 00:05:50,040 Who should we confess our sins to? 81 00:05:50,040 --> 00:05:53,840 And what sins need to be confessed? 82 00:05:53,840 --> 00:05:57,640 So maybe let's touch on the why for just a minute. 83 00:05:57,640 --> 00:06:05,200 I think the why is, has to do with the assignment that you gave in regards to taking an inventory. 84 00:06:05,200 --> 00:06:11,240 And probably the first person we really need to confess to is to ourselves. 85 00:06:11,240 --> 00:06:14,540 We need to be honest with ourselves. 86 00:06:14,540 --> 00:06:21,360 If we cannot overcome self deception and if we can't become more honest with ourselves, 87 00:06:21,360 --> 00:06:28,560 we'll never be completely honest confessing to others or even to God. 88 00:06:28,560 --> 00:06:35,640 So taking that inventory and being honest with ourselves is a form of overcoming self 89 00:06:35,640 --> 00:06:38,400 deception and sin itself. 90 00:06:38,400 --> 00:06:41,360 Any thoughts on who else should we confess to? 91 00:06:41,360 --> 00:06:44,480 It's important that we confess next to our Heavenly Father. 92 00:06:44,480 --> 00:06:48,200 You know, and there may be, that may be kind of one and the same except for our intent. 93 00:06:48,200 --> 00:06:53,600 You know, we need to place our intent also as we confess these sins or acknowledge our 94 00:06:53,600 --> 00:06:57,520 own wrongfulness or whatever, however we want to term that. 95 00:06:57,520 --> 00:07:01,280 But as we're making that acknowledgement, what we are is we are drawing closer to Him 96 00:07:01,280 --> 00:07:04,520 and as we're drawing closer to Him, I think that that's the beginning part. 97 00:07:04,520 --> 00:07:08,800 That's not the completion of, but that's the beginning part of our confession, confession 98 00:07:08,800 --> 00:07:10,600 also to our Heavenly Father. 99 00:07:10,600 --> 00:07:14,880 And I think that's the next important step in process and who that confession needs to 100 00:07:14,880 --> 00:07:15,880 be towards. 101 00:07:15,880 --> 00:07:23,600 Yeah, absolutely, and I think it can be helpful to not over generalize our sins to our Heavenly 102 00:07:23,600 --> 00:07:24,920 Father. 103 00:07:24,920 --> 00:07:32,720 I think it's helpful to hear ourselves and I actually recommend that if possible that 104 00:07:32,720 --> 00:07:36,120 we learn to pray out loud. 105 00:07:36,120 --> 00:07:42,280 We're commanded to do that in Dr. Incumbent in section 19 is to pray vocally. 106 00:07:42,280 --> 00:07:47,600 It's kind of interesting how Joseph Smith didn't receive the first vision until he prayed 107 00:07:47,600 --> 00:07:51,040 vocally and he said this was the first time he had made the attempt. 108 00:07:51,040 --> 00:07:56,720 I'm sure he probably prayed about which church to join before he went to the sacred grove 109 00:07:56,720 --> 00:07:59,000 where he prayed vocally. 110 00:07:59,000 --> 00:08:05,680 There's a power about vocal prayer and praying out loud and I encourage individuals when 111 00:08:05,680 --> 00:08:13,920 they are really serious about confessing their sins that they go somewhere in a closet or 112 00:08:13,920 --> 00:08:20,240 somewhere where they can be alone and where it can be private and that they pray out loud 113 00:08:20,240 --> 00:08:24,360 in confessing their sins. 114 00:08:24,360 --> 00:08:30,120 Satan knows that you've done it, so you're not telling him anything he doesn't know. 115 00:08:30,120 --> 00:08:34,840 Heavenly Father knows you've done it, not telling him anything he doesn't know. 116 00:08:34,840 --> 00:08:42,320 But I think it's helpful to do it out loud and to hear ourselves to say it to our Heavenly 117 00:08:42,320 --> 00:08:46,680 Father and confess it and acknowledge it before him. 118 00:08:46,680 --> 00:08:47,680 There's power in that. 119 00:08:47,680 --> 00:08:54,040 I have a really close friend actually who's a psychologist and he and I were having this 120 00:08:54,040 --> 00:09:00,600 discussion not that long ago about praying out loud and about the benefit of it. 121 00:09:00,600 --> 00:09:04,800 There's a huge spiritual benefit to it obviously and you've touched on that benefit. 122 00:09:04,800 --> 00:09:12,160 But there's also a physical benefit, a cognitive benefit according to him to praying out loud, 123 00:09:12,160 --> 00:09:19,280 to hear us utter, to hear our own words, to hear us say out loud the things that we must 124 00:09:19,280 --> 00:09:24,480 say in order to accomplish what we're talking about here, David, can be very helpful in 125 00:09:24,480 --> 00:09:30,280 driving home and sort of anchoring not just the facts but anchoring our commitment to 126 00:09:30,280 --> 00:09:35,600 being different and to allowing our Heavenly Father Spirit to change us. 127 00:09:35,600 --> 00:09:40,960 I think it is also evidence of our humility in doing that. 128 00:09:40,960 --> 00:09:50,200 I think as a general rule probably, maybe this is a self confession, is I think people 129 00:09:50,200 --> 00:09:54,760 like to pray silently and that most of our prayers, at least our personal prayers, are 130 00:09:54,760 --> 00:09:58,600 maybe silent ones, quiet ones. 131 00:09:58,600 --> 00:10:07,960 I think that it's just a really good habit to be able to pray out loud and where no one 132 00:10:07,960 --> 00:10:16,400 else can hear us but where we can hear our voice and we can hear ourselves cry out to 133 00:10:16,400 --> 00:10:18,480 our Heavenly Father. 134 00:10:18,480 --> 00:10:20,400 There really is a power about that. 135 00:10:20,400 --> 00:10:27,520 I think it's also really helpful, Scott, that we not take prayer too casually. 136 00:10:27,520 --> 00:10:34,360 And what I mean by that is maybe two parts, that we make some preparation, that we actually 137 00:10:34,360 --> 00:10:43,720 prepare in our hearts, our emotions, and in our minds what we're going to say to our 138 00:10:43,720 --> 00:10:44,720 Heavenly Father. 139 00:10:44,720 --> 00:10:45,720 Right, I do too. 140 00:10:45,720 --> 00:10:50,360 I think it will really increase the effectiveness of our prayers. 141 00:10:50,360 --> 00:10:51,720 It will just take a moment. 142 00:10:51,720 --> 00:10:53,520 It doesn't have to be too long. 143 00:10:53,520 --> 00:11:01,040 But where we pause before we kneel down and we just begin to speak and to call on Him, 144 00:11:01,040 --> 00:11:03,480 which is wonderful. 145 00:11:03,480 --> 00:11:12,160 But when we're really repenting, when we really want to express our gratitude and ask for 146 00:11:12,160 --> 00:11:20,360 His help and His forgiveness, I have found it's really a blessing to just take time and 147 00:11:20,360 --> 00:11:22,840 meditate and make some preparation. 148 00:11:22,840 --> 00:11:29,520 And then the second thing that can increase our effectiveness is to show great reverence, 149 00:11:29,520 --> 00:11:32,960 to just really show our reverence and respect for Him. 150 00:11:32,960 --> 00:11:36,520 And there's nothing wrong with praying in the car while you're driving. 151 00:11:36,520 --> 00:11:39,240 There's nothing wrong with praying when you're laying down. 152 00:11:39,240 --> 00:11:42,280 There's nothing wrong with any of those prayers. 153 00:11:42,280 --> 00:11:45,280 They're all wonderful and He loves to hear from us anytime. 154 00:11:45,280 --> 00:11:46,920 And in fact, those are important prayers. 155 00:11:46,920 --> 00:11:47,920 Yes. 156 00:11:47,920 --> 00:11:48,920 Those are important prayers too. 157 00:11:48,920 --> 00:11:49,920 Absolutely. 158 00:11:49,920 --> 00:11:50,920 And we should pray always. 159 00:11:50,920 --> 00:11:53,240 We should pray to pray always. 160 00:11:53,240 --> 00:12:01,760 But there is a power to kneeling down, I think, if we can, and to find a place where we're 161 00:12:01,760 --> 00:12:10,080 alone and where we can fold our arms and bow our heads and close our eyes and use sometimes, 162 00:12:10,080 --> 00:12:18,320 I think it's even important when we can to use the proper language of prayer and to just 163 00:12:18,320 --> 00:12:22,360 to really try to picture who we are talking to. 164 00:12:22,360 --> 00:12:31,560 The God of this universe, our heavenly Father, to really feel that and to see that. 165 00:12:31,560 --> 00:12:39,080 And anyway, preparation and great reverence will certainly increase this experience as 166 00:12:39,080 --> 00:12:42,360 we repent and confess to Him. 167 00:12:42,360 --> 00:12:46,640 You know, when we talk about that type of prayer, Dave, the word that comes to my mind 168 00:12:46,640 --> 00:12:49,320 sometimes is supplication. 169 00:12:49,320 --> 00:12:54,040 You know, if you supplicate, if I'm supplicating myself to my heavenly Father, I just looked 170 00:12:54,040 --> 00:12:55,040 it up. 171 00:12:55,040 --> 00:12:58,600 They're going to read this definition, the first definition that came up. 172 00:12:58,600 --> 00:13:01,920 And this is the question that says, what does the Bible mean about supplication? 173 00:13:01,920 --> 00:13:05,760 And of course, we can use this, you know, in all standard works, but what does it mean 174 00:13:05,760 --> 00:13:08,360 when we talk about supplication? 175 00:13:08,360 --> 00:13:10,200 And I think that this is a good definition. 176 00:13:10,200 --> 00:13:15,680 It says, although it is a noun, supplication comes from the Latin verb, supplicare, or 177 00:13:15,680 --> 00:13:20,880 supplicare, I don't know how to say it exactly, which means to plead humbly. 178 00:13:20,880 --> 00:13:25,440 While supplication is often thought of as a religious prayer, as it is used 60 times 179 00:13:25,440 --> 00:13:32,240 in the Bible, it can logically be applied to any situation in which you must entreat 180 00:13:32,240 --> 00:13:34,960 the power of our heavenly Father for your favor. 181 00:13:34,960 --> 00:13:36,760 Well, I love that. 182 00:13:36,760 --> 00:13:38,720 That's inspired. 183 00:13:38,720 --> 00:13:39,720 Supplicate. 184 00:13:39,720 --> 00:13:45,360 I love the term in the scriptures, particularly I find it in the Book of Mormon. 185 00:13:45,360 --> 00:13:47,040 Cry out. 186 00:13:47,040 --> 00:13:50,720 Love Amulet's description of prayer in Alma 34. 187 00:13:50,720 --> 00:13:53,280 Cry out morning, noon, and night. 188 00:13:53,280 --> 00:13:54,600 Cry out in your closet. 189 00:13:54,600 --> 00:13:56,640 Cry out in your fields. 190 00:13:56,640 --> 00:13:58,440 Anyway, cry out. 191 00:13:58,440 --> 00:14:10,600 There's this energy and this humility and maybe emotion about crying out to God that 192 00:14:10,600 --> 00:14:14,400 can improve our effectiveness as we confess. 193 00:14:14,400 --> 00:14:18,640 So have we said enough about why we confess? 194 00:14:18,640 --> 00:14:30,880 Why so we feel ourselves taking full 100% accountability, responsibility, and being completely honest? 195 00:14:30,880 --> 00:14:40,600 That I think is a predictor and precursor to full and complete repentance. 196 00:14:40,600 --> 00:14:46,080 When we talk about crying out, we can move on with this, but it did remind me of a couple 197 00:14:46,080 --> 00:14:48,000 of episodes that we had. 198 00:14:48,000 --> 00:14:52,200 One was episode number 16 where we did an interview with the brother Nate Moller and 199 00:14:52,200 --> 00:14:57,360 then the next one was episode 19 where we did an interview with the brother Scott Harmon. 200 00:14:57,360 --> 00:15:01,840 In both of those cases, they talked about coming more fully into our heavenly Father 201 00:15:01,840 --> 00:15:06,760 through the Atonement of Jesus Christ after having gone through some really rough stuff 202 00:15:06,760 --> 00:15:07,760 in their lives. 203 00:15:07,760 --> 00:15:11,600 In both of those cases, they talked about crying unto the Lord. 204 00:15:11,600 --> 00:15:19,080 Scott talked about crying out from solitary confinement on a cement floor, right? 205 00:15:19,080 --> 00:15:23,840 He talked about that and how Heavenly Father reached down and picked him up and has since 206 00:15:23,840 --> 00:15:25,200 then kept him in his fold. 207 00:15:25,200 --> 00:15:26,520 And the same with brother Nate Moller. 208 00:15:26,520 --> 00:15:33,520 He talked about crying out as he was on his way to, in his mind, end his life at his own 209 00:15:33,520 --> 00:15:34,520 hand. 210 00:15:34,520 --> 00:15:39,320 And that changed because he, according to him, because he cried out. 211 00:15:39,320 --> 00:15:43,920 And you know, those types of crying outs can save all of us. 212 00:15:43,920 --> 00:15:46,560 And I think that's what we're talking about. 213 00:15:46,560 --> 00:15:51,280 And it's interesting that Enos uses the word wrestle when he describes his all day, all 214 00:15:51,280 --> 00:15:53,080 night experience in prayer. 215 00:15:53,080 --> 00:15:55,200 He uses the term wrestle. 216 00:15:55,200 --> 00:16:00,800 You know, prayer, I love the definition of prayer in the Bible dictionary where it says, 217 00:16:00,800 --> 00:16:02,760 prayer is work. 218 00:16:02,760 --> 00:16:03,760 Yeah. 219 00:16:03,760 --> 00:16:06,520 Well, it takes great energy. 220 00:16:06,520 --> 00:16:07,520 Prayer is work. 221 00:16:07,520 --> 00:16:11,560 I've said as many casual prayers as probably anybody. 222 00:16:11,560 --> 00:16:18,680 I love to pray wherever and sometimes they're just really sweet and casual. 223 00:16:18,680 --> 00:16:28,200 But when we confess our sins and we're intent on repenting, that can be a wrestle. 224 00:16:28,200 --> 00:16:32,240 That can be a crying out, a real supplication. 225 00:16:32,240 --> 00:16:36,680 There needs to be preparation and reverence for that. 226 00:16:36,680 --> 00:16:41,720 And I know that it's worth the time and worth the blessings and the promises that we'll 227 00:16:41,720 --> 00:16:44,440 receive as we do so. 228 00:16:44,440 --> 00:16:49,320 So let, besides, we've talked a little bit about why. 229 00:16:49,320 --> 00:16:53,600 Now let's, we've talked a little bit about who we confess to our heavenly father, we 230 00:16:53,600 --> 00:16:55,480 confess to ourselves. 231 00:16:55,480 --> 00:16:58,600 We confess to our heavenly father. 232 00:16:58,600 --> 00:17:06,480 Now let's talk about more about the role of the church and confessing to maybe a bishop 233 00:17:06,480 --> 00:17:10,840 or someone who has priesthood keys. 234 00:17:10,840 --> 00:17:15,440 The instruction that I have received, I think the instruction that's given in the church 235 00:17:15,440 --> 00:17:24,120 is that we should confess to either our bishop who is a common judge of Israel and has those 236 00:17:24,120 --> 00:17:29,120 keys or we can confess to our stake president. 237 00:17:29,120 --> 00:17:37,280 Sometimes we will confess to both in certain serious sins, but those are the two individuals 238 00:17:37,280 --> 00:17:40,840 that we should confess our sins to. 239 00:17:40,840 --> 00:17:44,240 We shouldn't confess to counselors. 240 00:17:44,240 --> 00:17:49,920 We shouldn't confess to elders, quorum presidents or at least society presidents or others. 241 00:17:49,920 --> 00:17:57,040 We should confess to those who have the direct responsibility to be a common judge in Israel. 242 00:17:57,040 --> 00:18:06,360 I think it's important that we be really careful that we don't confess generally to the church 243 00:18:06,360 --> 00:18:15,040 or to members, other members of the church, but we confess to the proper priesthood authority. 244 00:18:15,040 --> 00:18:19,840 And the role of the church is really important, which maybe we can talk more about as we get 245 00:18:19,840 --> 00:18:23,040 into this. 246 00:18:23,040 --> 00:18:27,960 Any thoughts or questions about confessing to the proper priesthood authority? 247 00:18:27,960 --> 00:18:31,080 Yeah, I think that this is one. 248 00:18:31,080 --> 00:18:35,560 So it's important for us to know that not all things, and I think you've said that, 249 00:18:35,560 --> 00:18:40,200 but let's reiterate, not all things need to be confessed to a priesthood authority. 250 00:18:40,200 --> 00:18:41,960 That's important for us to know. 251 00:18:41,960 --> 00:18:51,000 Oftentimes in our fervor and in our desires to come fully and quickly to him, we sometimes 252 00:18:51,000 --> 00:18:58,160 think that to beat ourselves up over things, I was going to say the little things, because 253 00:18:58,160 --> 00:19:01,840 sometimes the little things can feel like big things in our lives. 254 00:19:01,840 --> 00:19:05,680 But there are things, Dave, that should be confessed and things that probably are not 255 00:19:05,680 --> 00:19:11,000 necessarily most appropriate to confess for various reasons to those priesthood leaders 256 00:19:11,000 --> 00:19:12,000 as well. 257 00:19:12,000 --> 00:19:15,000 And I think that it'll be important for us to talk about that too. 258 00:19:15,000 --> 00:19:20,480 Well, I always go back to the statement by President Marion G. Romney when he was in the 259 00:19:20,480 --> 00:19:26,840 first presidency of the church with President Kimball, and the statement that he gives, 260 00:19:26,840 --> 00:19:31,160 which was kind of the direction given to us when I was the branch president of the Missionary 261 00:19:31,160 --> 00:19:33,160 Training Center. 262 00:19:33,160 --> 00:19:36,440 I have to paraphrase the quote because I don't have it here in front of me. 263 00:19:36,440 --> 00:19:43,360 But President Marion G. Romney basically said that we confess to the church and to the proper 264 00:19:43,360 --> 00:19:50,960 priesthood authority when there have been any criminal activity, when any serious laws 265 00:19:50,960 --> 00:19:55,160 – I'm not talking about speeding tickets or any of that – but when criminal activity 266 00:19:55,160 --> 00:20:02,840 could end up in some sort of an action in court or result in other consequences, all 267 00:20:02,840 --> 00:20:07,920 of those should be confessed to the proper priesthood authority, when any sins would 268 00:20:07,920 --> 00:20:15,320 affect our worthiness to participate in the ordinances of the gospel, since the role of 269 00:20:15,320 --> 00:20:22,600 the priesthood keys and authority is to protect the sacred nature of ordinances and protect 270 00:20:22,600 --> 00:20:31,200 individuals from partaking of ordinances unworthily, any of those sins need to be confessed, or 271 00:20:31,200 --> 00:20:38,840 any sins that would put our membership in the church in question should be confessed. 272 00:20:38,840 --> 00:20:49,080 So I have received lots of confessions, Scott, as a bishop and as a branch president at the 273 00:20:49,080 --> 00:20:50,560 Missionary Training Center. 274 00:20:50,560 --> 00:20:57,960 I've been in lots of disciplinary actions or membership councils, as we call them today. 275 00:20:57,960 --> 00:21:08,600 They're all sweet, especially sweet missionaries coming into the MTC, probably seven or eight 276 00:21:08,600 --> 00:21:09,600 out of ten. 277 00:21:09,600 --> 00:21:17,680 I feel like they've got to confess something, and some of them are really serious and they're 278 00:21:17,680 --> 00:21:18,680 hard. 279 00:21:18,680 --> 00:21:24,400 But I remember one sweet missionary who came into my office on the first Sunday that he 280 00:21:24,400 --> 00:21:29,680 was there, I was to interview all the new missionaries on the first Sunday, and he came 281 00:21:29,680 --> 00:21:32,560 in and I asked him about his worthiness. 282 00:21:32,560 --> 00:21:34,840 Are you worthy to be here, Elder? 283 00:21:34,840 --> 00:21:40,400 How are you feeling about your worthiness and your relationship with God, and are you 284 00:21:40,400 --> 00:21:43,000 feeling the spirit? 285 00:21:43,000 --> 00:21:49,480 And he started to cry, and he looked down at the floor. 286 00:21:49,480 --> 00:21:52,400 This was pretty normal. 287 00:21:52,400 --> 00:21:55,680 Most of them did this before they would confess. 288 00:21:55,680 --> 00:21:59,560 They would look down at the floor before they could look up at me. 289 00:21:59,560 --> 00:22:06,480 And he was crying, and I sat there and watched tears roll down his off the end of his nose 290 00:22:06,480 --> 00:22:09,160 with his face to the ground. 291 00:22:09,160 --> 00:22:10,160 So sweet. 292 00:22:10,160 --> 00:22:17,360 I had this sacred little spot on my orange carpet in the MTC many years ago, and I swear 293 00:22:17,360 --> 00:22:24,640 I could see a salt ring in my carpet from tears of missionaries confessing their sins, 294 00:22:24,640 --> 00:22:27,760 as they said in that chair. 295 00:22:27,760 --> 00:22:29,560 Kind of a sacred little place. 296 00:22:29,560 --> 00:22:31,640 Oh man, that's where I would kneel to pray. 297 00:22:31,640 --> 00:22:38,800 So every morning, Sunday morning when I was there at 5.30 in the morning to begin my day, 298 00:22:38,800 --> 00:22:44,000 I would kneel near that little spot of salt on the carpet. 299 00:22:44,000 --> 00:22:45,640 That's tender. 300 00:22:45,640 --> 00:22:53,680 And he begins to cry and takes him a minute, and he's not offering anything. 301 00:22:53,680 --> 00:22:59,720 And after a few minutes, I said, Elder, is it have to do with any moral issues? 302 00:22:59,720 --> 00:23:00,960 Do you have a girlfriend? 303 00:23:00,960 --> 00:23:03,360 And he looks up at me surprised. 304 00:23:03,360 --> 00:23:05,960 Oh no, no president. 305 00:23:05,960 --> 00:23:07,440 I don't have a girlfriend. 306 00:23:07,440 --> 00:23:10,000 I never even dated in high school. 307 00:23:10,000 --> 00:23:12,800 I said, okay, okay, good. 308 00:23:12,800 --> 00:23:16,360 Can you share with me what you're concerned about? 309 00:23:16,360 --> 00:23:23,640 And he says, well, you know, it's just come back into my mind since I've been here that 310 00:23:23,640 --> 00:23:31,240 when I was 13 years old, you know, so what's that, six years, I think he was 19. 311 00:23:31,240 --> 00:23:40,440 When I was 13 years old, one day I stole a piece of gum out of my mother's purse, and 312 00:23:40,440 --> 00:23:44,760 I didn't tell her about it. 313 00:23:44,760 --> 00:23:56,000 Oh man, anyway, sweet, you know, but Elder, I said, I think you've been forgiven of that. 314 00:23:56,000 --> 00:23:57,680 I think your mother's forgiven you. 315 00:23:57,680 --> 00:24:00,000 I think the Lord's forgiven you. 316 00:24:00,000 --> 00:24:01,280 I think you're good. 317 00:24:01,280 --> 00:24:02,280 Is there anything else? 318 00:24:02,280 --> 00:24:08,600 Oh no, he said that's the only, I thought, wow, I was worried about him because he was 319 00:24:08,600 --> 00:24:15,080 so good and so pure and he was kind of timid and I actually said to him, I think, you know, 320 00:24:15,080 --> 00:24:16,600 now where are you going again Elder? 321 00:24:16,600 --> 00:24:19,040 And he said, California. 322 00:24:19,040 --> 00:24:24,480 And I said, you're going to see a lot of sin, Elder in California. 323 00:24:24,480 --> 00:24:31,880 I hope that you're prepared for that and grateful that you're so worthy. 324 00:24:31,880 --> 00:24:36,920 I would have experiences like that every once in a while. 325 00:24:36,920 --> 00:24:38,960 He's confessing their sins. 326 00:24:38,960 --> 00:24:41,080 I had one sweet kind of farmer boy. 327 00:24:41,080 --> 00:24:49,280 He was a tough kid, tough, you could tell, built and came from a farm and spent his summer's 328 00:24:49,280 --> 00:24:50,280 hauling hay. 329 00:24:50,280 --> 00:24:58,240 Yeah, yeah, he was out in the Grantsville, Tawilla area and remember him. 330 00:24:58,240 --> 00:25:06,880 He was powerful and he came in and he started to cry and confess that his neighbors had 331 00:25:06,880 --> 00:25:13,240 gone on an extended vacation and he was to take care of their animals and the chores 332 00:25:13,240 --> 00:25:19,160 and kind of their farm and oversee things for them while they were gone on this extended 333 00:25:19,160 --> 00:25:20,660 vacation. 334 00:25:20,660 --> 00:25:26,480 And he said, but one day he said, they gave me a key to their house and I went into their 335 00:25:26,480 --> 00:25:34,800 house and I got a drink of water and I turned on their TV and then he didn't say anything 336 00:25:34,800 --> 00:25:38,560 for a long time and I said, and? 337 00:25:38,560 --> 00:25:39,640 Well that's all. 338 00:25:39,640 --> 00:25:43,480 I just feel like I kind of took advantage of the situation. 339 00:25:43,480 --> 00:25:45,600 Okay, yeah, yeah. 340 00:25:45,600 --> 00:25:53,960 I just feel like I wasn't, I didn't need to do that and wow, I remember thinking, oh my 341 00:25:53,960 --> 00:26:01,400 goodness, I was a little concerned about him being so good and so many of them are so pure 342 00:26:01,400 --> 00:26:07,480 but missionaries would confess many things and then you take the extreme of the missionary 343 00:26:07,480 --> 00:26:11,960 that I think I referred to a few weeks ago, you know, the missionary who came in and confessed 344 00:26:11,960 --> 00:26:15,640 and he just, he just came, well let's make this really short. 345 00:26:15,640 --> 00:26:18,080 I've done everything. 346 00:26:18,080 --> 00:26:23,800 And felt no, no more or no remorse or little remorse in his confession. 347 00:26:23,800 --> 00:26:32,600 So after hearing literally I think of thousands of confessions at the MTC, probably eight 348 00:26:32,600 --> 00:26:37,720 out of ten had something that they felt like they needed to just resolve and make sure that 349 00:26:37,720 --> 00:26:40,920 they were clean and ready to go. 350 00:26:40,920 --> 00:26:49,640 I've learned that we have kind of this guilt complex in some ways in the church, Scott. 351 00:26:49,640 --> 00:26:54,560 Confessions don't hear enough confessions from those who really need to confess and 352 00:26:54,560 --> 00:26:59,800 they probably hear too many confessions from those who are just beating themselves up, 353 00:26:59,800 --> 00:27:03,360 who have a guilt complex and who are shaming themselves. 354 00:27:03,360 --> 00:27:09,920 And I just think it's important that all of us understand what confessions need to be 355 00:27:09,920 --> 00:27:16,720 made and the spirit in which those confessions should be made. 356 00:27:16,720 --> 00:27:23,400 We don't need to confess certain things that are only affecting me or that I'm wrestling 357 00:27:23,400 --> 00:27:30,520 with that don't affect others or that would not affect my worthiness to participate in 358 00:27:30,520 --> 00:27:34,920 the ordinance of the church or threaten my church membership and where there's been no 359 00:27:34,920 --> 00:27:37,440 criminal activity. 360 00:27:37,440 --> 00:27:44,680 Those can be taken care of directly to our Heavenly Father through the Savior's atonement 361 00:27:44,680 --> 00:27:52,920 and in our taking full accountability for those we can confess and forsake them and move 362 00:27:52,920 --> 00:27:54,680 on. 363 00:27:54,680 --> 00:28:01,480 So I used to tell my students when it came, when they would ask questions, well do I 364 00:28:01,480 --> 00:28:06,160 need to confess this, do I need to confess this and this and this and this? 365 00:28:06,160 --> 00:28:11,760 And I would just say, well when in doubt, go check it out. 366 00:28:11,760 --> 00:28:18,760 But I think that those who commit serious sins, they know they should confess and they 367 00:28:18,760 --> 00:28:20,200 should confess. 368 00:28:20,200 --> 00:28:27,760 And those who don't commit serious sins, they should be understand and have the faith necessary 369 00:28:27,760 --> 00:28:30,360 to just take care of that with their Heavenly Father. 370 00:28:30,360 --> 00:28:34,600 The confession is still there but it's just with our Heavenly Father. 371 00:28:34,600 --> 00:28:39,080 So Dave we talk about the who and kind of for what so far. 372 00:28:39,080 --> 00:28:45,160 And I think that if we talk about these things, it's important for us to include why. 373 00:28:45,160 --> 00:28:47,000 Why is confession so important? 374 00:28:47,000 --> 00:28:51,440 How would you answer that question if somebody were to say, Dave, why do we need to confess 375 00:28:51,440 --> 00:28:52,440 at all? 376 00:28:52,440 --> 00:29:00,560 So I touched on that when saying that to accept full accountability, full responsibility in 377 00:29:00,560 --> 00:29:10,120 my complete honesty, I need to hear myself, to myself and to others, to my Heavenly Father 378 00:29:10,120 --> 00:29:16,880 especially and to others, take accountability and responsibility for my sins. 379 00:29:16,880 --> 00:29:22,880 And as we go further into this, let me just, there's one more group of people we need to 380 00:29:22,880 --> 00:29:24,200 confess to. 381 00:29:24,200 --> 00:29:33,040 If we have done anything in them, if we're married, and we've done anything to offend 382 00:29:33,040 --> 00:29:40,800 our sweetheart in secret or otherwise, that we should confess to her. 383 00:29:40,800 --> 00:29:48,880 If we have done anything to hurt others, we should ask for their forgiveness and confess 384 00:29:48,880 --> 00:29:54,600 our offense to others that we have hurt or sinned against. 385 00:29:54,600 --> 00:29:57,160 I think that's also really important, Scott. 386 00:29:57,160 --> 00:30:06,240 And that goes into the why so that we can maintain those sacred relationships of trust. 387 00:30:06,240 --> 00:30:07,240 Right. 388 00:30:07,240 --> 00:30:08,240 Right. 389 00:30:08,240 --> 00:30:14,360 Well, I think as we start talking about these sort of things, another potential part of 390 00:30:14,360 --> 00:30:17,920 the why is it's really there's a freedom that comes with it. 391 00:30:17,920 --> 00:30:20,240 There's a burden in carrying these secrets. 392 00:30:20,240 --> 00:30:25,200 You know, I think last episode I talked about how my sweetheart Deb always says that we're 393 00:30:25,200 --> 00:30:26,680 only as sick as our secrets. 394 00:30:26,680 --> 00:30:30,720 Well, those secrets are heavy and they weigh on us and they don't just, I mean, there's 395 00:30:30,720 --> 00:30:36,280 a physical weight that we sometimes feel from the, but there's always an emotional weight. 396 00:30:36,280 --> 00:30:41,160 There's always a spiritual weight that comes with having these secrets. 397 00:30:41,160 --> 00:30:46,280 And anybody who's experienced this, I have and, you know, perhaps most of us at some 398 00:30:46,280 --> 00:30:47,280 point have. 399 00:30:47,280 --> 00:30:48,280 And I haven't. 400 00:30:48,280 --> 00:30:55,200 Here's an invitation to engage in this process because the freedom and that comes from that 401 00:30:55,200 --> 00:30:58,800 confession is unmatched by anything else I've experienced in this life. 402 00:30:58,800 --> 00:31:04,920 I remember one time when, when I needed to put forth a confession and it was a big confession 403 00:31:04,920 --> 00:31:10,720 and that confession resulted in the lifting of my membership ultimately. 404 00:31:10,720 --> 00:31:14,040 And you know, and it was not a confession of one thing. 405 00:31:14,040 --> 00:31:18,840 It was a confession of an attitude that involved many things, but that those many things, which 406 00:31:18,840 --> 00:31:22,040 I at one point in my life was ready to go to my grave with Dave. 407 00:31:22,040 --> 00:31:26,280 I was, I was just really ready to just, you know, because of the fear and the pride and 408 00:31:26,280 --> 00:31:30,280 all those other things that we had talked about earlier in earlier episodes, because 409 00:31:30,280 --> 00:31:31,760 of all of those things. 410 00:31:31,760 --> 00:31:35,840 There was such a weight on me that my personality had even changed. 411 00:31:35,840 --> 00:31:40,800 Unbeknownst to me, it was unrecognizable in large degree by myself, but it had changed. 412 00:31:40,800 --> 00:31:42,240 I had become more morose. 413 00:31:42,240 --> 00:31:43,760 I had become more edgy. 414 00:31:43,760 --> 00:31:45,880 I had become more honoree. 415 00:31:45,880 --> 00:31:50,800 I had become more conflicted with anything that was spiritual. 416 00:31:50,800 --> 00:31:52,440 I became more defensive. 417 00:31:52,440 --> 00:31:56,560 I had a big chip on my shoulder most of the time. 418 00:31:56,560 --> 00:32:02,120 But when that confession took place on my part and when I was able to put in process 419 00:32:02,120 --> 00:32:06,920 a true repentance process, and these things were things that needed to be confessed. 420 00:32:06,920 --> 00:32:08,680 There were legal issues involved. 421 00:32:08,680 --> 00:32:13,480 There were other issues that, you know, had to do with morality and other things too that 422 00:32:13,480 --> 00:32:15,040 definitely needed to be confessed. 423 00:32:15,040 --> 00:32:18,640 These were not, I took bubblegum from my mom's purse scenarios. 424 00:32:18,640 --> 00:32:22,560 These were not, I took a $5 bill out of the till at the dry cleaners and went and bought 425 00:32:22,560 --> 00:32:24,320 a hamburger with it. 426 00:32:24,320 --> 00:32:26,720 You know, they weren't those types of things. 427 00:32:26,720 --> 00:32:28,680 They were heavy, heavy, heavy things. 428 00:32:28,680 --> 00:32:32,440 And through that confession, there was a huge weight. 429 00:32:32,440 --> 00:32:35,600 And we hear that, you know, I feel like a weight was lifted off me. 430 00:32:35,600 --> 00:32:36,720 Well, that's literal. 431 00:32:36,720 --> 00:32:41,760 You know, for those of us who have been through that process, that expression is not just 432 00:32:41,760 --> 00:32:48,600 an expression, it's a literal experience where we feel unweighted and we feel more freedom. 433 00:32:48,600 --> 00:32:53,240 And we actually feel freedom now to start moving in the direction where we have felt 434 00:32:53,240 --> 00:32:55,680 damned to do so prior to that. 435 00:32:55,680 --> 00:32:59,080 We just felt like we were stopped and couldn't keep moving in that direction. 436 00:32:59,080 --> 00:33:00,080 Yeah. 437 00:33:00,080 --> 00:33:04,880 And we can't sin in a bubble, Scott. 438 00:33:04,880 --> 00:33:12,680 All our, when we sin, as you described your sins affecting you personally and your emotions 439 00:33:12,680 --> 00:33:20,440 and your attitudes and your, you know, whenever we sin, it affects others around us. 440 00:33:20,440 --> 00:33:26,760 And it's so important that when we are negatively affecting others around us who are close to 441 00:33:26,760 --> 00:33:32,520 us, that we maybe confess to them. 442 00:33:32,520 --> 00:33:40,840 So children who teenagers, adolescents who go in and confess to a bishop will probably 443 00:33:40,840 --> 00:33:43,440 be encouraged to share it with their parents. 444 00:33:43,440 --> 00:33:46,840 Now a bishop will keep it confidential. 445 00:33:46,840 --> 00:33:53,200 Bishops role is to not to call parents in, not to, you know, he needs to protect the 446 00:33:53,200 --> 00:33:58,760 confidentiality of those who confess to him. 447 00:33:58,760 --> 00:34:05,320 I'm not talking about child abuse or sexual abuse or those kinds of issues. 448 00:34:05,320 --> 00:34:14,680 I know that's in the news a lot these days about the exclusion of confidentiality in 449 00:34:14,680 --> 00:34:19,960 confessions to ecclesiastical leaders in the church. 450 00:34:19,960 --> 00:34:21,600 And there's two sides to that. 451 00:34:21,600 --> 00:34:25,360 And I recognize both of those opinions. 452 00:34:25,360 --> 00:34:32,080 That an adolescent who is having an issue, let's say with morality, it would be nice 453 00:34:32,080 --> 00:34:38,600 if that individual, that youth would be willing to share that with their parents so that the 454 00:34:38,600 --> 00:34:40,680 parents could help to strengthen them. 455 00:34:40,680 --> 00:34:49,520 So another reason why we confess is to seek assistance, to seek a little more strength, 456 00:34:49,520 --> 00:34:51,520 to get some help. 457 00:34:51,520 --> 00:34:53,840 That's another reason why we confess. 458 00:34:53,840 --> 00:34:58,840 Whether that's to our Heavenly Father or the bishop or to our parents or spouse or whoever 459 00:34:58,840 --> 00:35:01,640 that might be. 460 00:35:01,640 --> 00:35:06,760 We can't sin in a bubble, meaning that we can't sin without affecting others. 461 00:35:06,760 --> 00:35:13,280 And we should ask for the assistance and help of others to those who we trust who can really 462 00:35:13,280 --> 00:35:14,280 help us. 463 00:35:14,280 --> 00:35:18,600 I think it's sometimes not good to confess to parents because some parents can't handle 464 00:35:18,600 --> 00:35:24,920 it frankly and bishops and individuals need to be wise about the counsel they give in 465 00:35:24,920 --> 00:35:25,920 that regard. 466 00:35:25,920 --> 00:35:30,400 I've had some students who have told me about their confessing to parents and their parents 467 00:35:30,400 --> 00:35:35,800 beating them up, either physically or verbally. 468 00:35:35,800 --> 00:35:42,680 And that's just totally backfires. 469 00:35:42,680 --> 00:35:50,120 So there has to be some wisdom and spirit in who we confess to. 470 00:35:50,120 --> 00:35:55,120 And it's important that as we talk about confession, Scott, before we go into the role of the 471 00:35:55,120 --> 00:36:01,400 church in more detail, it's important that we identify that in this scripture in Doctrine 472 00:36:01,400 --> 00:36:09,920 Covenants 58 verse 42 and 43 where it says, By this, she may know if a man repenteth of 473 00:36:09,920 --> 00:36:14,360 his sins, behold, he will confess them and forsake them. 474 00:36:14,360 --> 00:36:17,680 It's interesting that these two are put together. 475 00:36:17,680 --> 00:36:26,120 These two, I don't want to call them steps, but these two choices are part of the repentance 476 00:36:26,120 --> 00:36:29,120 process and that they go together. 477 00:36:29,120 --> 00:36:32,800 Confessing and forsaking. 478 00:36:32,800 --> 00:36:43,080 The Lord is not pleased when we feel like we have to confess to everyone and their dog, 479 00:36:43,080 --> 00:36:44,720 so to speak. 480 00:36:44,720 --> 00:36:52,440 The Lord is not pleased when I know when teenagers are confessing serious sins to teenagers, 481 00:36:52,440 --> 00:36:54,240 to their friends. 482 00:36:54,240 --> 00:36:58,560 That does nothing but weaken both of them. 483 00:36:58,560 --> 00:37:04,520 We should not confess sins to individuals who can't handle it. 484 00:37:04,520 --> 00:37:11,680 When you confess a sin to a priesthood leader who has keys, and I've experienced this many 485 00:37:11,680 --> 00:37:15,840 times, it's like water off a duck's back. 486 00:37:15,840 --> 00:37:21,200 I would hear all these confessions at the MTC and I'd walk in to our sacrament meeting 487 00:37:21,200 --> 00:37:25,400 at four o'clock on a Sunday afternoon and I would look out at individuals and I would 488 00:37:25,400 --> 00:37:31,240 know, hey, I know they confess some things to me, but I couldn't really remember them. 489 00:37:31,240 --> 00:37:37,440 I thought that was one of the great miracles of that process was that I couldn't even remember 490 00:37:37,440 --> 00:37:38,920 their sins. 491 00:37:38,920 --> 00:37:44,040 It was so sweet to go in there and say, I can't remember what they confessed. 492 00:37:44,040 --> 00:37:51,560 But that may not be true when we're talking about confessing to friends, for example, 493 00:37:51,560 --> 00:37:59,040 of our moral transgression over the weekend, that would only damage our friend, make their 494 00:37:59,040 --> 00:38:02,080 weakness even greater. 495 00:38:02,080 --> 00:38:09,840 So we have to understand that when he says confess and forsake, forsaking means that 496 00:38:09,840 --> 00:38:15,840 we don't go around and continue to confess over and over and over again. 497 00:38:15,840 --> 00:38:20,480 I think in this regard Elder Anderson has a story about that when he was a mission president 498 00:38:20,480 --> 00:38:26,840 and a missionary in France confessing to him and it's a sin that he'd confessed to his 499 00:38:26,840 --> 00:38:28,560 bishop, confessed to his stake president. 500 00:38:28,560 --> 00:38:36,240 He continues to confess to President Anderson, Elder Anderson, who's a mission president 501 00:38:36,240 --> 00:38:44,280 there, and Elder Anderson finally asked, will you just put this behind you and move on? 502 00:38:44,280 --> 00:38:48,000 We need to confess and then forsake, let it go. 503 00:38:48,000 --> 00:38:49,000 We need to let it go. 504 00:38:49,000 --> 00:38:51,400 I know I had that problem as a missionary, right? 505 00:38:51,400 --> 00:38:54,280 I confessed to my bishop, I confessed to my stake president. 506 00:38:54,280 --> 00:38:56,520 I stood in the line, it was a long line. 507 00:38:56,520 --> 00:39:01,760 This was, I'm old and this was before we even had an MTC and there was still a missionary 508 00:39:01,760 --> 00:39:07,800 home in Salt Lake City in a converted old elementary school and I still remember the 509 00:39:07,800 --> 00:39:11,960 presence of the mission home, the name was President Byrd. 510 00:39:11,960 --> 00:39:18,360 And I stood in a line that went from his office down the hall, around the corner, down another 511 00:39:18,360 --> 00:39:22,720 hall and I got in the end of that line about 10 o'clock one night and stood in that line 512 00:39:22,720 --> 00:39:28,080 until about 1 a.m. in the morning so that I could just confess my sins just one more 513 00:39:28,080 --> 00:39:29,080 time. 514 00:39:29,080 --> 00:39:33,160 Then I go out on my mission, I feel like I got to confess and my mission president there 515 00:39:33,160 --> 00:39:34,880 and I'm writing. 516 00:39:34,880 --> 00:39:41,120 Anyway, we need to know that when we confess, then we forsake. 517 00:39:41,120 --> 00:39:47,840 If our confession is honest, full and complete, then we need to forsake it, Scott. 518 00:39:47,840 --> 00:39:51,240 We need to let it go and put it behind us. 519 00:39:51,240 --> 00:39:54,440 There's another component to this forsaking part, right? 520 00:39:54,440 --> 00:40:01,080 How often do we beat ourselves up because of our past sins and we use those as ways 521 00:40:01,080 --> 00:40:09,240 to flog ourselves even in front of others, even jokingly, even making light of, well, 522 00:40:09,240 --> 00:40:13,880 yeah, you know me, that's how, and on it goes. 523 00:40:13,880 --> 00:40:18,480 Forsaking our sins also means that we don't keep wearing those dirty clothes. 524 00:40:18,480 --> 00:40:20,280 We get rid of them, they're gone. 525 00:40:20,280 --> 00:40:23,480 Yeah, and it's important for us to remember where we came from. 526 00:40:23,480 --> 00:40:28,280 It's important for us to remember that some of those sins, and you know, we don't want 527 00:40:28,280 --> 00:40:32,760 them out in front of us, we don't want to be focusing on those, that's not forsaking. 528 00:40:32,760 --> 00:40:38,640 But forsaking also doesn't mean that we completely forget about them, we just don't keep relishing 529 00:40:38,640 --> 00:40:42,040 in them regardless of what that relish may look like. 530 00:40:42,040 --> 00:40:44,440 It's important for us to be able to look back. 531 00:40:44,440 --> 00:40:48,880 You know, I always say in recovery, it's important for us to remember where we've come from, 532 00:40:48,880 --> 00:40:54,840 otherwise we have a serious danger of maybe going back to where we came from. 533 00:40:54,840 --> 00:40:56,720 It's important for us to remember that. 534 00:40:56,720 --> 00:41:03,080 But in order for us to really forsake, we can't keep living even verbally in that type 535 00:41:03,080 --> 00:41:04,400 of life, Dave. 536 00:41:04,400 --> 00:41:07,840 Not even mentally or emotionally, for example. 537 00:41:07,840 --> 00:41:12,160 When I was a missionary, this is what we would teach about repentance, it was in part of 538 00:41:12,160 --> 00:41:14,840 the discussions we had to memorize. 539 00:41:14,840 --> 00:41:19,880 We would teach about the steps we used to call them then, which I don't like to call 540 00:41:19,880 --> 00:41:28,440 them now, but when it came to forsaking of sin, we would say, forsaking your sin means. 541 00:41:28,440 --> 00:41:33,880 You never repeat it, not even in your mind. 542 00:41:33,880 --> 00:41:34,880 Right. 543 00:41:34,880 --> 00:41:38,120 Well, I loved that then. 544 00:41:38,120 --> 00:41:43,000 That was a blessing to me then as I was trying to repent of my sins as a full-time missionary, 545 00:41:43,000 --> 00:41:46,120 and it continues to be a blessing to me now. 546 00:41:46,120 --> 00:41:53,480 And I know that it is a choice to keep confessing your sins mentally. 547 00:41:53,480 --> 00:41:59,440 Now it's true, Scott, we will not forget our sins, and that's a gift and a blessing, so 548 00:41:59,440 --> 00:42:01,400 we won't repeat them. 549 00:42:01,400 --> 00:42:09,880 But we can't relish and go through the process in our mind of sinning over and over and over 550 00:42:09,880 --> 00:42:16,680 again and ever put them behind us, forsake them, and feel forgiven. 551 00:42:16,680 --> 00:42:26,240 Forsaking means that we let them go, and that when we think of them, it's, oh no, not, okay, 552 00:42:26,240 --> 00:42:28,720 let me relive it. 553 00:42:28,720 --> 00:42:37,440 When we forsake sins, it means we do not repeat them even in our minds, and maybe especially 554 00:42:37,440 --> 00:42:43,760 in our hearts, that we let them go and that they're behind us. 555 00:42:43,760 --> 00:42:50,040 My wife, I love her little exercise that she has when she thinks of her past sins or she 556 00:42:50,040 --> 00:42:54,760 thinks of her little sins that she commits daily. 557 00:42:54,760 --> 00:43:03,400 She just speedily repents by bowing her head and saying, thank you, thank you. 558 00:43:03,400 --> 00:43:06,240 And she's thinking of the Atonement of Jesus Christ. 559 00:43:06,240 --> 00:43:13,040 I think that sometimes a little trigger like that when we think of our past sins, because 560 00:43:13,040 --> 00:43:16,120 Satan does not want us to let go of those sins. 561 00:43:16,120 --> 00:43:19,360 That's the one thing he doesn't want us to do is forsake them. 562 00:43:19,360 --> 00:43:24,720 He wants to hold them over our head, keep them in our minds and in our hearts, and he 563 00:43:24,720 --> 00:43:28,880 does so, and he has the power to do so. 564 00:43:28,880 --> 00:43:37,280 And he uses our own sins against us by confessing them to us, by not letting us let them go, 565 00:43:37,280 --> 00:43:40,040 over and over and over again, says, remember when? 566 00:43:40,040 --> 00:43:44,560 Remember, I think that he can put those thoughts into our mind, and when they come into our 567 00:43:44,560 --> 00:43:47,560 mind, we have a choice to make. 568 00:43:47,560 --> 00:43:54,200 To either relive them or to forsake them by thinking of the Atonement of Jesus Christ 569 00:43:54,200 --> 00:44:00,480 and about the power of the Atonement and exercising our faith in Christ and that through him that 570 00:44:00,480 --> 00:44:03,640 it's behind me, I've let it go. 571 00:44:03,640 --> 00:44:07,320 And we bow our heads and we say thank you and we move on. 572 00:44:07,320 --> 00:44:10,720 I think that is so wonderful that we have that opportunity. 573 00:44:10,720 --> 00:44:16,760 And there's where Heavenly Father takes again those weaknesses and makes them become strengths 574 00:44:16,760 --> 00:44:23,360 to us like talked about in Ether 1227 in the Book of Mormon, where we have those rememberings, 575 00:44:23,360 --> 00:44:24,360 right? 576 00:44:24,360 --> 00:44:28,960 But rather than beat ourselves up, we do as Chris does and say thank you. 577 00:44:28,960 --> 00:44:30,780 Thank you for redeeming me. 578 00:44:30,780 --> 00:44:33,360 Thank you for paying that price. 579 00:44:33,360 --> 00:44:39,160 Thank you for your merits being in place of my merits to bring me closer to you. 580 00:44:39,160 --> 00:44:41,520 And those in that way can be a real blessing. 581 00:44:41,520 --> 00:44:45,400 And that's where we see the Atonement of Jesus Christ really work in our lives. 582 00:44:45,400 --> 00:44:47,480 Absolutely. 583 00:44:47,480 --> 00:44:53,560 I love the quote that Elder Anderson used in his book, The Divine Gift of Forgiveness 584 00:44:53,560 --> 00:44:57,360 in the chapter called Confessing and Forsaking Sin. 585 00:44:57,360 --> 00:45:08,760 I love this quote that he uses by Elder Neil A. Maxwell, who says, Confessing aids forsaking. 586 00:45:08,760 --> 00:45:15,280 It's important to see how these two, as the Lord uses them in Doctrine and Cums 58, how 587 00:45:15,280 --> 00:45:19,080 these two go together. 588 00:45:19,080 --> 00:45:21,880 Confessing aids forsaking. 589 00:45:21,880 --> 00:45:30,640 We cannot expect to sin publicly and extensively and then expect to be rescued privately or 590 00:45:30,640 --> 00:45:32,280 quickly. 591 00:45:32,280 --> 00:45:39,960 When we face those we have heard, especially those we love, although it is a painful experience, 592 00:45:39,960 --> 00:45:47,320 there can be a great help in giving us the strength not to repeat the sins of the past. 593 00:45:47,320 --> 00:45:51,400 So Confessing aids forsaking. 594 00:45:51,400 --> 00:45:59,440 And forsaking means that we don't continue to confess our sins even to ourselves, that 595 00:45:59,440 --> 00:46:09,600 we don't continue to shame ourselves or to relive them in any way in relishing them or 596 00:46:09,600 --> 00:46:17,000 in the horror of them, that we just let them go and we quickly think of Christ and thank 597 00:46:17,000 --> 00:46:22,440 Christ for his redemption. 598 00:46:22,440 --> 00:46:25,600 That's how the process of repentance works. 599 00:46:25,600 --> 00:46:29,940 And it is something that does take work. 600 00:46:29,940 --> 00:46:31,600 It takes great effort. 601 00:46:31,600 --> 00:46:38,840 It takes great mental exertion to be able to put our sins behind us. 602 00:46:38,840 --> 00:46:47,320 It takes complete honesty to be able to be fully accountable and to become blameless. 603 00:46:47,320 --> 00:46:53,720 So I think that we have probably said enough about Confessing and Forsaking, such an important 604 00:46:53,720 --> 00:46:56,160 part of the process of repentance. 605 00:46:56,160 --> 00:46:57,960 And I think it's really helpful. 606 00:46:57,960 --> 00:47:06,280 I invite our listeners to think about how these two, I don't know what to call them 607 00:47:06,280 --> 00:47:07,280 attributes. 608 00:47:07,280 --> 00:47:08,280 What do we call them? 609 00:47:08,280 --> 00:47:16,760 These two exercises or these two choices, these two actions of our repentance, confessing 610 00:47:16,760 --> 00:47:22,400 and forsaking, how they are connected, how they go together. 611 00:47:22,400 --> 00:47:28,360 We need to confess what we need to confess to those who need to hear the confession. 612 00:47:28,360 --> 00:47:36,160 And we need to stop confessing over and over and over again sins that we should be forsaking. 613 00:47:36,160 --> 00:47:41,800 And we should not confess to anyone who the confession is going to weaken or hurt. 614 00:47:41,800 --> 00:47:47,520 I know it's true that in the young single adult population of the church, I had many 615 00:47:47,520 --> 00:47:53,680 tell me this, that they would go on dates. 616 00:47:53,680 --> 00:48:00,400 And when they were dating and that individuals would ask them, have you ever done this? 617 00:48:00,400 --> 00:48:02,840 Have you ever done that? 618 00:48:02,840 --> 00:48:10,800 And this was a part of a conversation they were having, which was, I believe, totally 619 00:48:10,800 --> 00:48:16,880 used by Satan to manipulate individuals and to weaken individuals and to kind of see what 620 00:48:16,880 --> 00:48:22,680 individuals were willing to do or what they have done or what, oh man, I used to tell 621 00:48:22,680 --> 00:48:23,880 students who would tell me that. 622 00:48:23,880 --> 00:48:26,040 I would say, well, that's just evil. 623 00:48:26,040 --> 00:48:30,840 That's just evil to ask people about their past. 624 00:48:30,840 --> 00:48:34,280 You don't ask people about their past. 625 00:48:34,280 --> 00:48:37,160 There is nothing good that can come out of that. 626 00:48:37,160 --> 00:48:42,680 Now I have to pause because Elder Anderson, he and I had this conversation. 627 00:48:42,680 --> 00:48:48,240 I think when people are getting in a really serious relationship, Scott, when they are 628 00:48:48,240 --> 00:48:53,920 maybe becoming so serious that they might be engaged or they might be married, then 629 00:48:53,920 --> 00:48:56,520 that's a little bit different. 630 00:48:56,520 --> 00:49:03,920 And that an individual deserves to know, are there any sins of your past? 631 00:49:03,920 --> 00:49:11,160 Are there any addictions in your life that are going to affect our relationship? 632 00:49:11,160 --> 00:49:12,160 That's a different deal. 633 00:49:12,160 --> 00:49:13,960 I'm not talking about that. 634 00:49:13,960 --> 00:49:22,640 I'm just saying people who are not in a serious binding relationship should not be confessing 635 00:49:22,640 --> 00:49:24,680 their sins to each other. 636 00:49:24,680 --> 00:49:27,760 That is damaging and it's manipulative. 637 00:49:27,760 --> 00:49:28,760 Yeah. 638 00:49:28,760 --> 00:49:30,120 We could go on and on. 639 00:49:30,120 --> 00:49:31,760 This has been a great podcast. 640 00:49:31,760 --> 00:49:36,520 I think that I've got to take a lot of things for myself from this, Dave. 641 00:49:36,520 --> 00:49:42,960 I love what you read to us from the book about what Elder Maxwell had said about how confessing 642 00:49:42,960 --> 00:49:45,800 begins the forsaking process. 643 00:49:45,800 --> 00:49:47,000 It just strengthens it. 644 00:49:47,000 --> 00:49:51,000 It strengthens it, even the beginning of it in some ways. 645 00:49:51,000 --> 00:50:00,480 I want to reinforce to Scott the idea that shaming is damning and that shaming is definitely 646 00:50:00,480 --> 00:50:02,600 not forsaking. 647 00:50:02,600 --> 00:50:08,520 A person who has forsaken their sins as we are commanded to do, if we have confessed 648 00:50:08,520 --> 00:50:14,640 them to ourselves, to our Heavenly Father, and to proper priesthood authority and others 649 00:50:14,640 --> 00:50:16,880 who maybe we have hurt. 650 00:50:16,880 --> 00:50:25,080 Once we have done that, forgiven at this point or not, we need to forsake them. 651 00:50:25,080 --> 00:50:30,600 Forsaking means that we let them go and we don't continue to live them, repeat them, 652 00:50:30,600 --> 00:50:33,320 even in our minds. 653 00:50:33,320 --> 00:50:41,440 Shaming is the process of individuals who just cannot let it go, who keep reliving it, 654 00:50:41,440 --> 00:50:43,760 keep beating themselves up over it. 655 00:50:43,760 --> 00:50:49,680 And again, I know that Satan plays a role in that. 656 00:50:49,680 --> 00:50:54,040 That shaming is not repenting. 657 00:50:54,040 --> 00:50:57,080 It has no role in the repentance process. 658 00:50:57,080 --> 00:51:02,080 If we go back to episode number three, in episode number three, it's entitled, The Glimpse 659 00:51:02,080 --> 00:51:03,920 of Who We Are. 660 00:51:03,920 --> 00:51:10,480 And if we have that glimpse, if we even have a brief or a small understanding of who we 661 00:51:10,480 --> 00:51:14,880 really are, the shame is non-existent. 662 00:51:14,880 --> 00:51:16,120 Shaming is of the devil. 663 00:51:16,120 --> 00:51:20,920 There is no question that shame, let's just identify that real quickly. 664 00:51:20,920 --> 00:51:25,720 Shame means, and I've heard this said a lot, shame means that I'm a mess, that I'm a mistake, 665 00:51:25,720 --> 00:51:27,680 that I am a mistake. 666 00:51:27,680 --> 00:51:28,680 That's shame. 667 00:51:28,680 --> 00:51:29,680 That's not shame. 668 00:51:29,680 --> 00:51:31,200 I mean, we're not mistakes. 669 00:51:31,200 --> 00:51:38,440 We are children of our Heavenly Father who have a divine royalty waiting for us at some 670 00:51:38,440 --> 00:51:44,240 point as we become joint heirs in our progression with our Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ. 671 00:51:44,240 --> 00:51:46,040 Shame has nothing to do with that. 672 00:51:46,040 --> 00:51:52,800 Guilt on the other hand helps us to capitulate and to... we can use guilt down the road 673 00:51:52,800 --> 00:51:57,560 as sort of steering aids, helping us to stay on the track. 674 00:51:57,560 --> 00:51:59,080 Huge differences. 675 00:51:59,080 --> 00:52:03,880 Shame has no part in the gospel of Jesus Christ. 676 00:52:03,880 --> 00:52:14,120 Guilt is positive and it's of God to recognize, to truly recognize our sins. 677 00:52:14,120 --> 00:52:16,640 So guilt is a positive. 678 00:52:16,640 --> 00:52:18,560 But shame is of Satan. 679 00:52:18,560 --> 00:52:19,680 Guilt is of God. 680 00:52:19,680 --> 00:52:21,200 Shame is of Satan. 681 00:52:21,200 --> 00:52:25,080 And shaming is damning. 682 00:52:25,080 --> 00:52:30,640 So when we talk about confessing and forsaking, they go together. 683 00:52:30,640 --> 00:52:36,800 And once we've done the confessing, which aids the forsaking, we put it behind us and 684 00:52:36,800 --> 00:52:38,760 we let it go. 685 00:52:38,760 --> 00:52:44,640 And then next week we can talk about some of the other parts and choices that we need 686 00:52:44,640 --> 00:52:53,560 to make, some of the other work that we need to do in order to feel forgiven of the Lord 687 00:52:53,560 --> 00:52:59,680 and to complete the repentance process, which is an ongoing process, a daily process. 688 00:52:59,680 --> 00:53:07,560 So thankful to talk about these things and maybe just an invitation again, which is to 689 00:53:07,560 --> 00:53:17,640 begin now, to confess yourselves, to confess your sins to yourself, to come into the open, 690 00:53:17,640 --> 00:53:24,000 no more secrets, and to be able to confess to those who need to hear the confession 691 00:53:24,000 --> 00:53:29,960 and to know one else and then to put it behind us and to begin to forsake them. 692 00:53:29,960 --> 00:53:35,320 And as we do, we begin to live more fully the gospel of Jesus Christ, thereby allowing 693 00:53:35,320 --> 00:53:41,480 the spirit of our Heavenly Father to be with us, to always be constant in our lives, and 694 00:53:41,480 --> 00:53:46,280 thereby putting on the atonement of Jesus Christ and His power through that. 695 00:53:46,280 --> 00:53:48,040 Another great day, Dave. 696 00:53:48,040 --> 00:53:49,320 Grateful to be here with you. 697 00:53:49,320 --> 00:53:51,960 Do you have any final thoughts before we? 698 00:53:51,960 --> 00:53:57,680 We didn't get to the role of the church or to the membership councils, which I just wanted 699 00:53:57,680 --> 00:54:03,720 to touch on briefly, Scott, but we can maybe do that next week as well. 700 00:54:03,720 --> 00:54:04,720 Thank you, Scott. 701 00:54:04,720 --> 00:54:05,720 Thank you, everybody. 702 00:54:05,720 --> 00:54:06,720 Yeah, it's good to be here. 703 00:54:06,720 --> 00:54:08,200 Hey, gang, thanks for being with us. 704 00:54:08,200 --> 00:54:09,840 Remember that we love you. 705 00:54:09,840 --> 00:54:13,920 We hope you feel our Heavenly Father's love for you most importantly. 706 00:54:13,920 --> 00:54:17,040 And always remember that you have been redeemed through His blood. 707 00:54:17,040 --> 00:54:18,040 Thanks for being with us. 708 00:54:18,040 --> 00:54:20,640 We look forward to being with you again very soon. 709 00:54:20,640 --> 00:54:22,640 Take care.